How Do Turboprops Get Delivered To Far Away Customers?
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- Опубликовано: 27 апр 2024
- Turboprop aircraft are used all over the world, yet most are manufactured in Europe or North America. With their limited range, this can lead to some complex multi-leg delivery flights. This is, of course, the case with larger jets too, but these are much more straightforward deliveries with their increased range. Let’s take a look at how turboprops get delivered to customers a long way away.
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I used to work at ATR delivery center in Toulouse.
We delivered to air Vanuatu a company in the pacific. The whole ferry flight was planned to take 13 days with 9 stops.
Those deliveries were really important because the flight schedule is tight and we really had to deliver on time
Very interesting. Thank you for this information.
I would almost volunteer my holidays for a seat on one of those flights.
I thought planes were delivered on ships, but I watched a Ferry Flight docudrama that explained that many propeller planes had to fly around the world, and make 12 stops. :)
@@alunesh12345 Does spamming enough all over comment threads get YOU to heaven??? If so I don't bloody wanna go there.
I flew on an extremely long ferry flight on a shorts SD 360. We went....... Nashville, West Virginia, goosebay Canada, nasaseraq Greenland, Iceland, Belfast, Corsica, Crete, Luxor, Muscat Oman, Bombay, Calcutta, Bangkok, Kota Kinabalu Malaysia, Palau, Philippines, Saipan Micronesia. Took ten days, including a three day stop in Palau. Unpressurized, so mostly at or below ten thousand feet! Quite an experience.
Yet a Short Flight
@@sapede Yep, it is a much shorter flight, if you go west. It would be Nashville, Dallas, San Francisco, Hawaii, Saipan. But the shorts could not make California to Hawaii, even with ferry tanks. So we had to go the long way.
I think back to some of my C130 routes which were not quite as bad but RAF Lyneham which was 80 miles west of London UK to anywhere on the US/Canadian west coast was a 3 day trip. Lyneham to Gander or Goose or St Johns day 1, next stop Minneapolis then day 3 to draw a line from Calgary to San Diego, happy happy days.
@@Starman331 Pun-Pun Thought the plane was called 'Short 360'. :P
@@sapede Sorry I failed to pick up on your pun 👍
Just for those who don't know, turboprops are actually pretty fuel efficient, they are just better operating at lower altitudes and lower speeds, and thus are relegated to shorter flying distances.
I know it's true because I read it on the internet.
yes and no. The engine produces thrust using a propeller so most turboprops can only get to around 25,000ft. This is because a propeller has to have a minimum density of air to "grab" onto.
@@alexhinterreiter129 oh wow.... thanks for reinterpreting the point I made.
@@alunesh12345 no
I remember seeing an article on people who fly single-prop planes (Cessna like planes) across the Atlantic to buyers on either side. They have to go super low, obviously it's very risky and weather dependent
I’ve watched a pilot’s RUclips channel who flew a Cessna from the us to Europe taking a route through Canada - Greenland - Iceland.. must be quite an adventure.
When I worked in French Guyana, a company specialized in photogrammetry bought a second-hand Cessna 206, optimized for this kind of mission in Denmark. The ferry flight took two weeks and 17 steps via Iceland, Greenland, Canada, USA and Antilles. The pilot, a Danish, did it with his 16/17yo daughter. They spent only few hours in French Guyana, taking the first flight to Paris aboard an Air France A340.
Thanks for covering this.... Quite an important topic
When I was worked in French Guyana, my company shared its office with another one specialized in aerial photogrammetry. This company bought a new aircraft, a Cessna 206 in Denmark. The previous one was lost during a landing in a remote airfield in Guyana. The small aircraft did a long ferry flight in 17 steps : Denmark, Scotland, Iceland, Greenland, Canada, USA and Antilles.
This channel being called ‘long haul’ makes it so much better
As an interesting historical example of this sort of thing, by 1944-45 the US Military had worked things out where any 2 engine aircraft in their inventory could “self ferry” to any point in the Pacific (that wasn’t Japanese controlled at the moment), From Los Angeles or San Diego, without needing to be carried by ship.
At the start of 1942 the B-26 had to be assembled in Hawaii, while the B-25 could be flown all the way to Australia.
"The crew even made a short video about it" And then they don't even put a link to said video.
@ me if you find that video
@@sidv4615 ruclips.net/video/nO5Z_lhgyvQ/видео.html
@@Sky-uc5zh Thank you so much!
Interesting. I always assumed it was delivered via Amazon Prime.
I was doing an IT project for British Airways at their maintenance base at Heathrow. From time to time, you would see aircraft from other carriers. Anyway, one day an Aeromexico Boeing 737 turned up and I asked the engineer how it got there and he said (logically when you think about it) "The same way all other 737's make it to Europe". Apparently, it had flown from Mexico across the US, refuelled and then did the run to somewhere like Shannon before finally the short hop to Heathrow. Never found out why it was in the UK.
Not sure when this was but newer model 737's are capable of going direct from Mexico City to Heathrow when ferrying.
I once saw an Aerolineas Argentinas 737 at my home airport Nagpur, central india. Till this date i don’t have a clue what it was doing here
@@vivpro1951 maybe Aerolineas Argentinas sold it and it was resprayed?
@@janvanbunningen6468 thats a possibility
This has always been a big question of mine. Thanks for this.
I remember Air Caledonie had one of their ATR 72-600s stopover in my local general aviation airport on its delivery flight from France. One of just 8 stops the aircraft made. What about crew? Are there two crews used to deliver such turboprops?
There is usually just one crew flying the plane, resting along the way in hotels. The crew is being flown in/out of the origin/destination airport on normal airline flights.
what a conincidence, the aircraft from my company (Pilatus Porter) was delivered from Swiss to Indonesia not long ago, and had to make sseveral stops in europe, middle east, south asia and finally landing in Indonesia not too long ago. took about more than week for the trip
Cheers from a fellow Pilatus employee.
I was wondering this, and now i know.
U have a new subscriber
I’ve got a fondness for the Dash 8. Love them! :)
Kudos to the crews flying these ferry flights, as it is quite challenging to plan and execute one
I thank the RUclips algorithm for recommending a video to me that I find so interesting because turboprop are my favourite types of planes and have a documentary video about them is amazing
You also gained a new subscriber
My dad flew his bonanza from Paris to Melbourne which took 2 weeks
Was it the 1940s-1970s V-tail model?
@@thatguyalex2835 nope it’s a Beechcraft bonanza a36 registered F-GAPZ
@@Nathan-zi3bl So, a normal tail. Cool. :) Does he still own the Bonanza?
@@thatguyalex2835 yes normal tail and he still owns it
@@Nathan-zi3bl Nice. Does he allow you to fly it? If so, maybe you can fly to your favorite city. Also, what is the climb rate, and top speed? Does it have modern avionics? I don't own or fly any airplanes, but aviation technology is fascinating stuff.
Wow...one ATR72 made history for ULH...man that's unbelievable! I wonder if that's the longest ATR flight in the world
Thank you so much for making this video! I actually didn't properly know this until today, learnt something new today! 😊
The ferry flights sound epic.
I started thinking of this when I was playing airline manager 4
Didn't you already make a video of this on simply flying, apart from that, thanks for taking the time to tlak about turboprops
very interesing !!!. Thanks.
Nice to see Manchester get mentioned
I was always curious how an ATR ended up in Bora Bora
Air New Zealand have said a delivery flight of an ATR72 will travel by way of seven countries on route to New Zealand. It must be noted also that Air New Zealand have one of the largest fleets of DH Dash 8 aircraft outside of Canada
Those dash 8 were ferried across the pacific, using fuel tanks in fuselage
Some years ago i was about to take off in a C182 from Toluca, Mexico and i was surprised to look a Qantas Dash8 psrked on the ramp wondering if it was on the way from Canada to Australia to be delivered via to south america the across south pacific...
When I was working at LET, we would fit a large fuel tank into the cabin of the L-410, which the airline would ship back to us after the delivery. In the more recent years, a lot of Russian customers requested delivering the aircraft on a truck, so we covered it in foil and packed it on it.
The Dash-8 is the only turboprop I’ve flown in, usually with Air Canada Express/Jazz Air
Depends on if it’s easier to add more tanks or to remove the wings for shipping
Recently Olympic Airlines - (OA), part of the Aegean Airlines (A3) group - leased ATR-72s & ATR-42s from Virgin Australia to replace Q400s on its fleet. Took a 3 days ferry flight to come in Greece
Sky Express ATR 600 flew from Athens to Dublin about 1700 miles
As an example, Fokker 50 VH-FNI was delivered to Australia in March, after
flying from Amsterdam via Athens, Cairo, Bahrain, Karachi, Calcutta, Bangkok, Seletar, Denpasar, Darwin, Alice Springs and Melbourne. Interesting trip.
I’m guessing that was c1988
@@TheHsan22 Well Done! The full record reads:
Built in February 1988, the one below was delivered to Australia in March, after flying from Amsterdam via Athens, Cairo, Bahrain, Karachi, Calcutta, Bangkok, Seletar, Denpasar, Darwin, Alice Springs and Melbourne.
SkyWest (Australia) was the third owner of this plane, and SkyWest has been acquired by Virgin Airlines.
It looks nice, climbing out from Perth on Christmas Eve, 2015.
(Sorry, can't attach the pic.)
An in-law of mine ferried some F-27s back in the day
i like the arkia ATR72 :)
Fabulous Video!! Thank you so much!!
Hmm, so that’s how Firefly 2:57 and Malindo in Malaysia has these ATRs in Subang Airport
You guys missed the ATR's and Dash-8's that were ferried to Hawaii from the Mainland.
Transpacific flights to Australia? I assume the Dash 8s of QF came via Hawaii and possibly other Pacific islands. A friend once ferried a light twin from the US via this way.
If you look at that Fiji delivery they did in the video one of the stops is Australia and they did it by flying the long way around, Europe to the Middle East onto South Asia.
Or they came via the Atlantic route over Asia. Whole lotta Ocean between Hawaii and anything else.
Q. How Do Turboprops Get Delivered To Far Away Customers?
A. They stop to re-fuel.
thanks for coming to my ted talk.
I like the dash 8
do lower range jets like the CRJ have similar routes?
Yeah but they can fly a bit longer
WORKING AS A TRUCK. DELIVERY DRIVE AWAY DRIVER, I FIND THIS QUITE INTERESTING!!
2:10 how do you get this visualisation of range
7:24 - One mistake , they stop at Subang Airport (WMSA) and not KLIA main (WMKK)
Because they never proofread anything
Wish y you had shown the route to New Zealand
Toulouse, Luxor, Muscat, Colombo, Singapore, Darwin, Brisbane, Christchurch
Went there and back with my old man when Air New Zealand swapped out for newer models of ATR-72
3 week trip
jet stream answers my question on why my flights back to visit family takes 2 and a half hours and the flight back home only takes 2 hours it might also explain why there is more turbulence flying west
How do they get around the ETOPS certification?
Don't carry paying passengers I'm sure effects some requirements. Same reason 737 Max could fly shuttle flights even while grounded.
7:38 flying INTO HEADWIND increases range? i would have thought once at altitude you'd want a tailwind? i'm not in anyway educated about flying by the way.. i know that tking off and and landing is into headwind. but my brain can't figure out how that would increase range at altitude. thanks for any explanations. :)
I think he said the range would be DEcreased into a headwind (not 'increased'). You mis-heard him. The rest of your comment is correct.
ATR 72...They TAS at roughly 260kts burning around 700kgs/hr and have 5000kgs of fuel = roughly 1800nm (so nearer the 2000nn not 700nm figures given).
What about reserve fuel required on commercial flights? And, non-optimal speed/altitude, and climb out file rate...
Ack! 11:02 Papeete is *not* 'Papeet', it's roughly 'Papay-eytay' (every 'e' sounded separately)
Is Hawaii the most isolated large archipelago in the World in terms of flight planning for smaller aircraft?
What happens to the delivery aircrews following the long delivery flight?
They fly back commercially.
@@vondahe The ticket prices are most likely covered by the ferry flight company the deliver air crews work for. :)
A neighbour and I saw this a got to talking about it.Consensus was on a Cybertruck.😳
If Dash-8 doesn't have an enhanced ETOPS rate.....
Let us discuss Q400 with external fuel tank to carry additional 4.5T of fuel for ferrying special mission modified by Marshall Aerospace giving it endurance to 12hrs.....🛫🤓
Seeing a dash 8 taxi looks so strange because the fuselage looks like it doesn’t have enough support from the gear
4:28 self pushback :)
Turbo props with their 20k+ flight levels are easy compared to piston engines flying at 3k to 7k feet without radar or good meteorology that got ugly often with the addition of radial piston engines often breaking.
8:00 I didn't know Etihad had turboprops.
Yup Liat ATR 42-600's Still operates in the Liat Network I hope they'll reach the Jet Age Series soon.
Ah yes, leave island any time airways. ; )
Argyle international (TVSA) @5:37
Aaaaaahhhhh! I forgot to like and subscribe!!!
Random idea: Alternate history in which efficient long-range jets were never developed, so commercial trans-oceanic air travel depends on civilian aircraft carriers for mid-ocean refueling.
Cool idea but if long range jets were never developed than we would probably see short ranged jet power flying boat that us small flying boat bases built on island to cross oceans and there would probably still be a large market for ocean liners.
Transatlantic propeller operators used to fly via Gander and Iceland for this very reason.
@@allangibson2408 And even in 1965 when I had the pleasure to cross the North Atlantic for the first time in a then fairly new Jet aircraft operated by KLM we flew from Amsterdam to Shannon, on to Gander and then New York. If that was dictated by fuel range, navigation or radio range or passenger demand I don‘t know. Or maybe it was just the old „oil-trace“ that the former prop-airplanes had to follow.
@@berndheiden7630 The early jets were even more range limited than the propeller aircraft. It was high bypass turbofans that made one stop transatlantic flights possible (but they still routed over these airports as emergencies were not unknown).
Piston engine airliners were know to lose engines regularly on transatlantic routes (literally - they fell off the planes on about 10% of the transatlantic flights).
@@allangibson2408 Thanks for the info! I was 17 y/o and the 3rd time out of my native Germany (after one weekend trip to te Netherlands and another to London!). This opened the door to the big wide world for me.
PLZ make new video on turboprop in 2020
I have seen turbo prop ferry flight. But the worst I think is whirly bird ferry flight. Even shorter range and lesser altitude.
Sixth! This video is great.
I delivered 2 dash 8s to Bangladesh. Stopped in Abu Dhabi and India, not Oman, like manufacturers
Did we talk about ATR s in cold climate yet!
You miss firefly airlines, they have 12 fleets of ATR
They definitely go on boats sometimes too
Yep. The safest way to deliver a plane is by ship, IMO. No dealing with flying airplanes to their maximum range, with engines running on fumes. :) Lol...
Its sad that liat retired the atr 72..
Read Ernest K. Gann’s “Fate Is The Hunter” in which he writes about his WWII flying experiences, as well as commercial aviation.
How are extra fuel tanks in the cabin connected to the normal fuel tanks and piping to extend the flight?
Ahh the Liat ATR-72-600
Let's go LIAT
Air to air refuelling?
Not possible in commercial aircraft
These are jets for the most part. Most commercial airlines are almost always a jet of some kind
What !!!
Nader Nowzadi from what I understand they are jets and many jets are turboprops.
Nader Nowzadi it seems there is a jet behind the turbo prop from what I seen but I think I can see if I can see it online
Nader Nowzadi but most unless it’s like the Boeing 707 inside the engine cage has a turbo prop inside of there.
But yes many times on most in use commercial airliners that are turbos are jets. They have jet engines on them
Nader Nowzadi anyways sorry I am posting so much. It seems under the piston engine there is a jet engine if you see there is usually a intake there
I LOVVVVVVVVVEEEEEEEEEE AERO PLANES👍👍✌✌👍👍
At 8:35 that Azul plane looks like it's bending in the middle! After very careful study, it's actually just the paint scheme that gives that illusion. But really, if it fooled me, it can fool other people (cough nervous passengers cough) - they really shouldn't have painted it like that!
7:02 French Polynesia's capital, Papeete is pronounced -- Papa-yeti I know because I've been there.
1:58 you forgot Porter
The Dash 8’s are built within a few kms of Billy Bishop, Porters base
Just put it one or two on the hull of a 777. Like the 747 carriers the space shuttle. Voila
7:16 -my dumb ass thought they flew this direct smh
Interesting, Arab, Canada
Ummmm sir.....liat isn't really based in Antigua.....it's also based in Barbados
And dont forget - the crew then has to get back home again somehow.....
Why don't Bombardier and ATR (Airbus) build factories in South America, and Asia, or perhaps Embraer in Brazil and Comac in China could build these aircraft under license to spare on these risky delivery flights?
Not economically viable. It will cost billions
Put airplane into shipping container??? Ok?, yes? No?....lol lol
Google "Island Hopping to the Land Down Under "
And all this time I thought you just place an order with Amazon Prime.
Amazon operates a bunch of 747 freighters, I believe. Maybe they could just tow a dash-8 or ATR on a trans oceanic route similar to how gliders get a tow up to a good updraft, from a single engine propeller airplane. You could get a notification on your Amazon app that your small airliner was just delivered to your chosen airport and a little photo to help you see where they put it.
@@julianbrelsford ahahaha thats brilliant. What would be the icing on the cake is if they put a doormat on top of the plane and mention it’s underneath doormat in the delivery note
I don't have 11 minutes. Is the answer "they stop for fuel like everyone else"?
Damn they still use Athens abandoned airport
air new zealand has dash-8s
Indonesian usually call turboprop as ATR since most turboprop here are ATR
Also, ATR = Aku Tak mau Ribet a.k.a. I don't want to bother
A FEW KILOMETRES AT A TIME. ACROSS THE ATLANTIC THEY FLY A NORTHERLY ROUTE, ALONG WITH SMALLER SINGLE ENGINE AIRCRAFT.
I assumed this video are not for the reasonably well informed pilots, those who have heard of companies like Turtle Pak (Au) rubber fuel cells. What are you talking about adding extra tanks will be challenging and require modification??!! On a larger turbo prop, no passengers remember, the modification consist of removing enough seats at the C of G and strap a fuel cell there, and add the necessary fuel pumps and lines. It is only challenging if your mechanic is drunk. On a ferry flight, with a ferry permit, the FAA allow the airplane to be loaded up to 50% over the regular gross weight, runway allow. The Atlantic is now a joke to cross, if you island hop, some of the longer range planes will not even need extra gas. The sole challenge remain the Pacific, but in the 70s they used to deliver planes like the Mooney M20 and 172s etc to Australia, The longest leg can be over 14 hours to Hawaii. It only stopped because of the non availability of av gas They did not even have GPS then, but we have it now, and I can tell where eg Howland Island is to within 10 ft. instead of guessing like Earhart had to do.
The pandemic crippled LIAT's fleet. The caribbean flying bus
The country of Antigua is pronounced Anteega
Fifth. Great video btw