remember: good players obsess over thought process. weak players obsess over “THEY WOULD NEVER FOLD/CALL THIS HAND IN MY GAME.” if they’ll never fold/call/raise when we have x hand, we know what to do when we have y hand. that’s the point. don’t miss the forest for the trees.
Who is this video for? Like what's your target audience? Because I think most people watching this are low stakes players hoping to pick up something new. And in this video you have the villain folding AJ with triple Aces - something that would almost never happen in low-stakes poker. So when people are saying "they'll never fold this in my game", I don't think they're saying it because they're weak players and they're stuck in a bad mindset. They're saying it because what's happening in this video does not reflect the reality of what they face and they feel disconnected. This might not matter to you depending on who you're targeting this video at. But if you're targeting it towards people who play low-stakes then perhaps you would want to make the villain play like a low-stakes player. Low-stakes poker and high-stakes poker require different strategies after all. In low-stakes, people make a lot of wild calls so you have to take less risks. Bluffs like that 8,4H would not have worked. Seeing it work here makes a lot of us think "wtf", you know? It's not even a case of "oh that probably wouldn't have worked", it's more a case of 99.99% of the time, they would have called that or gone all-in. A fold is such a crazy move that nobody believes the video. That's how disconnected it feels. Just my thoughts. I hope I didn't upset you by giving my unsolicited opinions.
@hungryhorsepoker would you have folded those hands if you had them??? No i don't think so. Really weird this, i mean i get what you are saying but, who folds those hands??? Especially when the second he didn't even go all in!!
Great post 👍, as this was my initial thought on hand 1.. "low stakes would be more sticky & call w nut flush", esp. given hero bet sm & checked to river, making sets into boats less likely?, but not all low stakes vils will even think to hand read us like that. That said, huge big boy overbets are more rare in low stakes and you've def shown them to work more than we tend to assume! 1/2 players should note that stack sizes less often allow for this 3x + overbet river play. I'm experimenting with turn sizing while noting SPRs vs equity & player types. As always, please correct me where I'm wrong.
I really like how you contrasted the mindsets of a low-stakes grinder and a high-stakes crusher, effectively showcasing how nuanced decision-making and theoretical understanding can elevate poker play. Well done, Goone!
This HAS TO BE the best type of content you have on your channel! I love hearing the thought process behind the actions and comparisons between different skill levels.
Bro. Yesterday I played $1/$3 first time in a year. I've been listening to your channel for 3 months now. I started with $200. I ended with $800. It was all because of you. That "this should be banned at low stakes" video is 10000000%. Ty bro. I'll be getting a membership to your service. I cant thank you enough. 🎉
I love that you've dragged Corey Eyring into this haha if anyone needs your course, it's him (I think his style and your guidance would be a match made in heaven for him and his natural style of play.)
I love the videos and seeing the diversity of approaches. As for the results I think it would be more fair to include a cooler or suckout since Corey plays a bit more defensively and getting picked off can have a big impact on BBs. Again thanks for making these, I'm learning a lot.
I think for next episode you have to add more hands where they run into the nuts or the villain just has something really good so you can see if they’re able to get away from it for a lot of money or for a little money
I think a lot of that is based on their personal experiences in their own games (stakes). Corey’s opps are rarely bluffing, have narrower ranges when betting and especially when raising, and have much worse hand-reading skills. Therefore playing more ABC poker against them is probably a better strategy. Charlie needs to be more creative against opponents that can hand-read better, and this also allows him to do “crazy” things like 3-bet bluff rivers.
This is peak content. Recently found this channel and love it. To have a “average” thought processes that I can resonate with compared to a high end through process is perfect. I find my self agreeing making the same conclusion. Seeing a whole new way of thinking, for me, really bridges gaps. I guess more “concrete” than conceptual to see it this way for me. Great content, would love to see more of this.
Absolutely brilliant format/content, honeslty my favorite video I've seen and I watch a lot of poker videos. My one ask: you should have included 1-2 hands where villain had the functional nuts b/c with the hands selected simply spamming overbet bluffs was rewarded (and never punished).
13:24 the day someone in low stakes fold a set of aces with a J as a kicker sky will open and god will return to earth. THEY WILL CALL 1000% OF THE TIMES.
Thank you for this amazing content again! Both players' thought process are very educational. I would like to request to include a hand which folding ends a better move than bluffing. Creating such a scenario maybe tricky but I would think that would make players to think in depth more.
Liked the video, one thing I think you should include are spots where they're either running into nuts/effective nuts and hands where they have air vs a player who might be a bit sticky with good top pair/overpairs. This only showed maximizing gains (obviously important), but I'd like to see how both sides would play a hand that they're unable to win by just bluffing or with their value
Great video! Im curious to know what Charlie’s choices would be if the table stake were lower. Your example is a 20/40 game where it seems you can buy up to 6000 (150bb). What if it was a 5/5 game and max buy in was 500(100bb). Do you think it will change things, particularly for the hands he bluffed?
Good video and nice to include Corey. I think it would have been nice to include some hands where villain has nuts or would hero call with top pair to see some differences there. Every hand shown here was winnable with a bluff
I watch a lot of poker videos, and the contrast in though process is amazing. I've been grinding 1/3 for years with varied success. Honestly a great video because it made me e realize how narrow minded I have been. I honestly oaly like the reg 1/3 guy in the video. Always hated Charlie Carrel when I used to watch him in the Big Game via PokerStars. Dude is pretty cerebral and better than I thought. Hate realizing that I have a ton to learn...yet strangely excited... yeah I 'm a degen....
Best poker content on YT. I try some of these lines in online cash and end up getting owned a lot 😂. But in live cash you run people over when they are capped! Another awesome video.
Yo hungry horse, next time you do one of these videos can you do a separate video where I get to see what options I would’ve done and with a time clock?
Very nice video! Some feedback though, I think they should play first and explain off the clock after each turn, that way they don't have to rush their explainations.
Really cool video! And very interesting to see the differences in thought processes! I definitely agree that plays like what Charlie was going for here do tend to generate more EV long term, but I'd also imagine they greatly increase variance - some percentage of the time the villain will snap call your massive bluff, after all, haha I was wondering to what extent you think it's worth potentially not maximising EV to reduce variance, especially if someone's the sort of player who perhaps has a limited bankroll, or struggles with the swings of the game more than most? Would you still say that maximising the EV and taking the higher variance route is worthwhile, as it definitely would be the long run, or would you say that it's perhaps more worthwhile for some to take the EV loss for those sorts of factors?
I think the biggest takeaway for me in this vid is that even though the “low stakes pro” says he would do this and do that, it’s not reasonable to believe that the plays would be executed in real life. For instance, I don’t believe the low stakes pro would play KTs in the manner that he said which is overbet turn and overbet jam the river if he was actually playing in a 20/40 game. I think it would be more realistic for the video’s sake for the low stakes pro to play a standard low stakes game which is 1/3 with a $300 cap as opposed to the 20/40 game with $10k effective stacks. I think the hero’s and villain’s plays would be much different if the effective stack sizes were $300 instead of $10k in a “low stakes” game. People play differently when they have $300 in front of them as opposed to $10k for obvious reasons so the “red-lining” would work a lot less in standard low stake 1/2 and 1/3 games
Gotta adjust to SPRs and player types. Not as many 1/2 are thinking and can be stickier. That said, the recent HH $100/hr series has shown big overbets to work often.
I like this video series, but I’m not a fan of shortening their time to less than a minute. The interesting part is listening to their analysis, and shortening their time is contrary to that goal.
but one of them is not a winning poker player lol I mean Coreys whole channel is about how he goes into massive debt and has to get sponsorships or sell parts of his channel to make money to try to get out of debt
I'M BACK...WE DID IT...OMG WE MISSED U SO MUCH...OMG BLESS U ! ! OMG U BIG LARGE BOY ! LARRY!!! HAPPY BIRTHDAY!! ITS LARRYS LUNCHTIME LENTILS ARE SOMETHING ! ! ! TUBBYTIME TUPPERWARE ! QUAINT CUTIE ! MY FAVORITE CHAPERONE ! I'M BAD AT SHIPPING ! SENEGALESE SNACKS I HAVE BECOME A SHERPA O WOW TIMOTHY HORTON ! I AM MORE PLUMP THAN THE AVERAGE HUMAN BOY ! EAT UR LITTLE TURKEY BITES ! ! NIBBLE ON MY TURTLES NECK ! I'M A ROFLER ! TUMULTUOUS TURKEY ! QUIBBLES ! LAST LITTLE NIBBLE ! 123 ROAST BEEF ! I WILL BATHE U IN SPINACH ! POKER HAAAAARRRRDDD ♠️ ♠️ ♠️
these are all great but what about you redo these but in each scenario the fish flops a two pair like queen 4 offsuit and then calls 100% of your bets regardless of the size. In my games they would always get there on the river too. Like you get king flush on river, they get ace flush or get full house etc.
coming up with an answer and then finding ways to support that is the surest way to be losing at everything you do. it's basically religion. the answer is god, and you're searching for the questions and reasons. And Charlie's grandmother was still right. GO NOT try to fold a fish off of two pair. I have seen them call with A2 on a trip A board. Patience, young padawan. Wait till you have something better than top pair and they have top pair, which is going to happen once a session anyway instead of punting off your stack to top pair, let alone top trips. To think they would fold improved trip A if they called a 2.5x bet with top pair on the turn is insanity
The raise just looks super strong and this spot is never raised by a lot of these players in these stakes, so they cant imagine raising with a flush and could often find a hero fold
it doesn’t matter. arguing about pedantic stuff like this misses the point. if you truly believe they’re never folding a flush, you know what to do here every time you have the qc or boat. that’s the point. not to get wrapped up in pointless will they or won’t they. thought process is the point.
remember: good players obsess over thought process. weak players obsess over “THEY WOULD NEVER FOLD/CALL THIS HAND IN MY GAME.”
if they’ll never fold/call/raise when we have x hand, we know what to do when we have y hand.
that’s the point. don’t miss the forest for the trees.
Who is this video for? Like what's your target audience?
Because I think most people watching this are low stakes players hoping to pick up something new. And in this video you have the villain folding AJ with triple Aces - something that would almost never happen in low-stakes poker.
So when people are saying "they'll never fold this in my game", I don't think they're saying it because they're weak players and they're stuck in a bad mindset. They're saying it because what's happening in this video does not reflect the reality of what they face and they feel disconnected.
This might not matter to you depending on who you're targeting this video at. But if you're targeting it towards people who play low-stakes then perhaps you would want to make the villain play like a low-stakes player.
Low-stakes poker and high-stakes poker require different strategies after all. In low-stakes, people make a lot of wild calls so you have to take less risks. Bluffs like that 8,4H would not have worked. Seeing it work here makes a lot of us think "wtf", you know?
It's not even a case of "oh that probably wouldn't have worked", it's more a case of 99.99% of the time, they would have called that or gone all-in. A fold is such a crazy move that nobody believes the video. That's how disconnected it feels.
Just my thoughts. I hope I didn't upset you by giving my unsolicited opinions.
Why does your opponent fold?? I wouldn't do that!!
@bakersmileyface I agree, when i play they never fold that, even if i go all in. Crazy folds here the first two hands.
@hungryhorsepoker would you have folded those hands if you had them??? No i don't think so. Really weird this, i mean i get what you are saying but, who folds those hands???
Especially when the second he didn't even go all in!!
Great post 👍, as this was my initial thought on hand 1.. "low stakes would be more sticky & call w nut flush", esp. given hero bet sm & checked to river, making sets into boats less likely?, but not all low stakes vils will even think to hand read us like that. That said, huge big boy overbets are more rare in low stakes and you've def shown them to work more than we tend to assume!
1/2 players should note that stack sizes less often allow for this 3x + overbet river play. I'm experimenting with turn sizing while noting SPRs vs equity & player types. As always, please correct me where I'm wrong.
I really like how you contrasted the mindsets of a low-stakes grinder and a high-stakes crusher, effectively showcasing how nuanced decision-making and theoretical understanding can elevate poker play. Well done, Goone!
🥰🥰🥰
So glad this is back! And Corey makes videos everywhere except his channel haha
😂😂
Brilliant format and, as always, by far the best YT content.
omg
This HAS TO BE the best type of content you have on your channel! I love hearing the thought process behind the actions and comparisons between different skill levels.
omg ty ty
Bro. Yesterday I played $1/$3 first time in a year. I've been listening to your channel for 3 months now. I started with $200. I ended with $800. It was all because of you. That "this should be banned at low stakes" video is 10000000%. Ty bro. I'll be getting a membership to your service. I cant thank you enough. 🎉
whats the video ur referring to ?
boom!
@@PAIN-qk4qh They all have similar ideas and themes, but I think the quote is the title of the video that you can search.
I've been waiting for you and Charlie to work together. Can't stand his singing, but you're both amazing at poker.
the plays charlie and mark make I feel like I never see people make plays like these, even from people that I feel are great players
I love that you've dragged Corey Eyring into this haha if anyone needs your course, it's him (I think his style and your guidance would be a match made in heaven for him and his natural style of play.)
Awesome video. Nice to see Corey and Charlie making an appearance 🔥
I love the videos and seeing the diversity of approaches. As for the results I think it would be more fair to include a cooler or suckout since Corey plays a bit more defensively and getting picked off can have a big impact on BBs. Again thanks for making these, I'm learning a lot.
I think for next episode you have to add more hands where they run into the nuts or the villain just has something really good so you can see if they’re able to get away from it for a lot of money or for a little money
Agree, good idea
Yeah, the clear answer that he wants in all of these spots is to just to blast all in and get folds from marginal holdings.
Charlie is the British version of you 😂😂
Charlies plays are 10x as aggro
I think a lot of that is based on their personal experiences in their own games (stakes). Corey’s opps are rarely bluffing, have narrower ranges when betting and especially when raising, and have much worse hand-reading skills. Therefore playing more ABC poker against them is probably a better strategy. Charlie needs to be more creative against opponents that can hand-read better, and this also allows him to do “crazy” things like 3-bet bluff rivers.
@@JorKal4Mark literally runs people over in 5-5 with the same lines as Charlie. You have to have a big heart to win low stakes!
wow, the order of operations here from show and tell to, describe and learn was fantastic great video as always!
love these videos with good players and different perspectives, keep up the great content thank-you for all your hard work!
🥰🥰🥰
This is peak content. Recently found this channel and love it. To have a “average” thought processes that I can resonate with compared to a high end through process is perfect. I find my self agreeing making the same conclusion. Seeing a whole new way of thinking, for me, really bridges gaps. I guess more “concrete” than conceptual to see it this way for me. Great content, would love to see more of this.
🥰🥰🥰🥰
Absolutely brilliant format/content, honeslty my favorite video I've seen and I watch a lot of poker videos. My one ask: you should have included 1-2 hands where villain had the functional nuts b/c with the hands selected simply spamming overbet bluffs was rewarded (and never punished).
Good to see another of these. This is a gr8 concept. Unique on you tube v other poker vids.
13:24 the day someone in low stakes fold a set of aces with a J as a kicker sky will open and god will return to earth. THEY WILL CALL 1000% OF THE TIMES.
what do u mean “return to earth”? marc goone is already here.
@@hungryhorsepoker kkkkkkkkkk
Great video! You and Charlie are my two favorite poker youtubers
Love the collab. Also love the proof of life from Corey 😂
These thought breakdowns are my absolute favorite
Thank you for this amazing content again! Both players' thought process are very educational. I would like to request to include a hand which folding ends a better move than bluffing. Creating such a scenario maybe tricky but I would think that would make players to think in depth more.
22:10 I guess I’m all in 😂😂😂
Best content out there! Was both fun and instructive to watch!
🥰🥰🥰
Content is off the charts bud… most original poker channel out here fun to watch easy to learn … I love it say “beginner” above Corey lulz
he doesn’t mind 😂😂 he did great imo
Love all your videos, especially the $100/hour challenge, but this might be my favorite yet!
I don't see anybody folding three aces on a board like that I think that would have got called and you'd have lost a lot.
This is some of your best content.
Liked the video, one thing I think you should include are spots where they're either running into nuts/effective nuts and hands where they have air vs a player who might be a bit sticky with good top pair/overpairs. This only showed maximizing gains (obviously important), but I'd like to see how both sides would play a hand that they're unable to win by just bluffing or with their value
Great to have Charlie on
🥰🥰🥰
I love this collab!!
I love this format... time to settle down and get a late night sleep...
The biggest boy returns again!
Great video! Im curious to know what Charlie’s choices would be if the table stake were lower. Your example is a 20/40 game where it seems you can buy up to 6000 (150bb). What if it was a 5/5 game and max buy in was 500(100bb). Do you think it will change things, particularly for the hands he bluffed?
yes of course. money talks.
Sick sick content, learnt a lot from both of you guys
Don't like decreasing shot clock, want to hear thoughts
They gave their thoughts after saying their play.
Good video and nice to include Corey. I think it would have been nice to include some hands where villain has nuts or would hero call with top pair to see some differences there. Every hand shown here was winnable with a bluff
The meet up game is off, boys. Cal scruby intro was removed.
Very very interesting and educational. Thanks to all involved!
🥰🥰🥰
I watch a lot of poker videos, and the contrast in though process is amazing. I've been grinding 1/3 for years with varied success. Honestly a great video because it made me e realize how narrow minded I have been. I honestly oaly like the reg 1/3 guy in the video. Always hated Charlie Carrel when I used to watch him in the Big Game via PokerStars. Dude is pretty cerebral and better than I thought. Hate realizing that I have a ton to learn...yet strangely excited... yeah I 'm a degen....
respect to Corey he did well. Another great vid!
rlly fw this format
What was the verdict on the range check Strat. Never managed to catch it
Did they not do a debate video on that?
i think we got charlie to see the light a bit 🥰
@@hungryhorsepoker great to hear, been implementing it myself and had been working nicely
Best poker content on YT. I try some of these lines in online cash and end up getting owned a lot 😂. But in live cash you run people over when they are capped! Another awesome video.
We are all here because Charlie recently rated you s tier.
Yo hungry horse, next time you do one of these videos can you do a separate video where I get to see what options I would’ve done and with a time clock?
i would never see a food from an ace in my 1/3 or 2/5 games at 13:20
Thank god for this upload, I didn't feel like working.
Very nice video! Some feedback though, I think they should play first and explain off the clock after each turn, that way they don't have to rush their explainations.
Fantastic vid!
Really cool video! And very interesting to see the differences in thought processes!
I definitely agree that plays like what Charlie was going for here do tend to generate more EV long term, but I'd also imagine they greatly increase variance - some percentage of the time the villain will snap call your massive bluff, after all, haha
I was wondering to what extent you think it's worth potentially not maximising EV to reduce variance, especially if someone's the sort of player who perhaps has a limited bankroll, or struggles with the swings of the game more than most? Would you still say that maximising the EV and taking the higher variance route is worthwhile, as it definitely would be the long run, or would you say that it's perhaps more worthwhile for some to take the EV loss for those sorts of factors?
good question - i made a 40 min video about this topic 2-3 weeks ago. check it out.
Great video
I think the biggest takeaway for me in this vid is that even though the “low stakes pro” says he would do this and do that, it’s not reasonable to believe that the plays would be executed in real life. For instance, I don’t believe the low stakes pro would play KTs in the manner that he said which is overbet turn and overbet jam the river if he was actually playing in a 20/40 game. I think it would be more realistic for the video’s sake for the low stakes pro to play a standard low stakes game which is 1/3 with a $300 cap as opposed to the 20/40 game with $10k effective stacks. I think the hero’s and villain’s plays would be much different if the effective stack sizes were $300 instead of $10k in a “low stakes” game. People play differently when they have $300 in front of them as opposed to $10k for obvious reasons so the “red-lining” would work a lot less in standard low stake 1/2 and 1/3 games
Corey is the where's waldo of the poker world. Just randomly shows up on someone elses channel.
my fatal flaw is copying this shit in online micros and getting snap called by fourth pair
This was awesome
Wait…. 13:26…. So the AJ is putting you on…. What? AK? AQ? A5? QQ?
What is the villain putting the hero on to fold the AJ?
Thanks Mr Horse 😊
Terrific video
🥰🥰🥰
Bro picked the most losing low stakes player 💀
Cory is the Zoro of Poker
🐐 channel
Balance bots lickin their chops when these guys sit. This is why GTO is king.
I tried this at my local 1/2 and lost £10000 in one session
Gotta adjust to SPRs and player types. Not as many 1/2 are thinking and can be stickier. That said, the recent HH $100/hr series has shown big overbets to work often.
On the first hand what could the hero likely have to beat the nut flush?
Set into rivered boat
I like this video series, but I’m not a fan of shortening their time to less than a minute. The interesting part is listening to their analysis, and shortening their time is contrary to that goal.
I would have check over etc with the set of 888
Tell Corey to upload
calling corey a low stakes pro is extremely generous, he's not even a winning player at 1/3 lol
84 is just a give up.
TELL CHARLIE TO TURN HIS GAIN DOWN!!!
i know right!
but one of them is not a winning poker player lol
I mean Coreys whole channel is about how he goes into massive debt and has to get sponsorships or sell parts of his channel to make money to try to get out of debt
Bada bing bada boom! 👻
I'M BACK...WE DID IT...OMG WE MISSED U SO MUCH...OMG BLESS U ! ! OMG U BIG LARGE BOY ! LARRY!!! HAPPY BIRTHDAY!! ITS LARRYS LUNCHTIME LENTILS ARE SOMETHING ! ! ! TUBBYTIME TUPPERWARE ! QUAINT CUTIE ! MY FAVORITE CHAPERONE ! I'M BAD AT SHIPPING ! SENEGALESE SNACKS I HAVE BECOME A SHERPA O WOW TIMOTHY HORTON ! I AM MORE PLUMP THAN THE AVERAGE HUMAN BOY ! EAT UR LITTLE TURKEY BITES ! ! NIBBLE ON MY TURTLES NECK ! I'M A ROFLER ! TUMULTUOUS TURKEY ! QUIBBLES ! LAST LITTLE NIBBLE ! 123 ROAST BEEF ! I WILL BATHE U IN SPINACH ! POKER HAAAAARRRRDDD ♠️ ♠️ ♠️
patches!
these are all great but what about you redo these but in each scenario the fish flops a two pair like queen 4 offsuit and then calls 100% of your bets regardless of the size. In my games they would always get there on the river too. Like you get king flush on river, they get ace flush or get full house etc.
coming up with an answer and then finding ways to support that is the surest way to be losing at everything you do. it's basically religion. the answer is god, and you're searching for the questions and reasons. And Charlie's grandmother was still right. GO NOT try to fold a fish off of two pair. I have seen them call with A2 on a trip A board. Patience, young padawan. Wait till you have something better than top pair and they have top pair, which is going to happen once a session anyway instead of punting off your stack to top pair, let alone top trips. To think they would fold improved trip A if they called a 2.5x bet with top pair on the turn is insanity
Charlieeeeee 🐐
Nuts that anyone would fold AJ there.
I could never imagine it happening in low stakes poker. Never.
Doesn't matter what you bet, they'll have called it without thinking.
Corey ❤️❤️ you are too cute
i agree
#levels
Why would they fold if they have a Q high flush on the first example?
The raise just looks super strong and this spot is never raised by a lot of these players in these stakes, so they cant imagine raising with a flush and could often find a hero fold
Yeah... I only play online and I can say only about those games. In Poker Stars I can GUARANTEE you that none of those hands would fold
@@helmamut3970I know the raise is repping a full house but I don't think most would fold with a Q high flush when A and K are on the board.
@@CaquiNews Lol nobody is folding these in online poker for real 😂
it doesn’t matter. arguing about pedantic stuff like this misses the point. if you truly believe they’re never folding a flush, you know what to do here every time you have the qc or boat. that’s the point. not to get wrapped up in pointless will they or won’t they. thought process is the point.
👍👍👍👍👍👊
Hand 4 was most bullshit hand ever. With image of you and charlie I am snapcalling even that im 1/3 player (with a 9 in my hand ofcourse)
So none of these examples have a live player making a marginal river call? Lol not realistic
last
i hope not
First
omg