*UPDATE* Tesla no longer refurbishes their used cars in the ways I mentioned in this video. One detail I just realized that I forgot to mention in the video: All Model S produced before early June 2015 came equipped with a 3G cell radio (for Nav, web browsing, music streaming, etc.) and those produced after early June 2015 came equipped with a 4G LTE cell radio. If you have or are buying one of these older cars and want to upgrade the car to 4G LTE, this can be done by your local Tesla service center for something like US$500.
Alex Venz, does the "unlimited supercharging" (that used to come with the purchase of older model years) get conveyed to the next owners...or is it only for original owner?
Hi Alex great video. I found a 85 s but it is in a independent dealer in another state. Do you know any site where I can check the package the car has with the vin number. Car fax shows only 1 owner and only registration records. Is any way I can have like a service records? The car seems to be under the 50000 or 4 yrs warranty but is close to expire.... Can you give me any avise?
The free supercharging goes with the car. The free supercharging transfers with the car. If the car doesn't have supercharging enabled you can pay Tesla to enable it. Personally I rather buy from Tesla because supercharging will be enabled as well as all updates for the software. And if it has 3C cellular service and you'd rather have 4 G LTE Cellular service just tell your CPO Tesla guy and it will get taken care off. You have 2 options when buying used from Tesla, a previously used car or a Certified Pre Owned Tesla. The big advantage is Tesla will sell you a solid 70 point checked out mechanical inspection as well as a fully up to date computer system. And the paint job will look like it just came off the production line. The rwd models did have problems with the drive system but by this time Tesla more than likely has already replaced the drive system so it's not a problem. I highly recommend buying the optional warranty on the car as the drive system is warranted for 8 years unlimited mileage. The optional warranty covers the rest of the car excepting the battery and drive system. It is still a solid automobile, the battery degradation averages 3- 4 percent. Not a problem.
I just purchased another cpo Tesla model s and I can tell you they no longer recondition a car before delivery. I was surprised to find this out, but they are cutting costs as much as possible.
I've watched about all of the Tesla videos one person can handle and I can say this is the best informational video on buying a used tesla. The only thing I'd add is that the seats you're sitting on are the performance seats.
Yeah, I forgot the name for the seats while I was filming... to be fair, though, I wasn't really working from a script (just a rough outline to keep me on track) and Tesla has offered something like 5 different seats in the Model S since it started production in 2012. There's a lot to keep track of with these cars. lol
I bought a used 2015 Tesla Model S 85D from a Chevy dealer in northern VA. I got it 2 weeks ago. It had 32k miles on it. It also came with so many accessories. I took it to Tesla for the 3 year service as soon as I got it, because it’s 3 years old and it turned out the person who owned the Tesla before me purchased the extended bumper to bumper warranty and prepaid for service for the first 4 years. I got the car for $59,000. It has auto pilot version 1, a sunroof, wood trim, tan seats, the tech package, and the sub zero weather package. Such a sweet deal! I love this car!
Excellent. Definitely needed guidance for anyone wanting to buy used. You get range (200+ miles) plus free charging (Super & Destination possibly) to Travel for half or less than new. OK, you do not get Auto Pilot, but it's a great way to start with EVs.
It took me a minute to fall in love with your videos, having seen a few of them already. But I have come to the realization that you're a beast! Your info and details are second to none. Keep up the great work.
Great vid, Alex! You covered everything I would have thought to cover. I have a 9/14 P85+ that I still love everyday and I think I was lucky in that I missed most of the early problems that plagued the MS up through the summer of 14. I count myself as lucky! Love your channel!
A few corrections or clarifications to what I believe I heard during this video. 1) Tesla requires a $2500 deposit on any used car that is non-refundable, meaning you can't get your money back if you don't like the car at delivery but you will get credit towards another Tesla either used or new. 2) You will NOT have an opportunity to see the car or test drive it before buying it. The cars are held in storage by Manheim who are the ones that send you the pictures (from a Dropbox Account). They will not allow you to see the car (period) much less drive it. They will recommend that you go to one of their showrooms, drive a new one and suggest that it's the same for any car (BS). 3) While you may talk to an Sales Advisor (or whatever they call them), there is only one guy handling all of Tesla's used sales and his only job is to get you to pluck your $2500 bucks down and he's gone. Then the myriad of issues begins with getting your car (that you never seen or driven) on delivery date and it's largely a crap shoot from there. Tesla's used market sales process is clearly broken! The latest advice that I've been able to validate is that you really don't want an older Tesla, say, before mid-late 2015. The reason is because Tesla had the Model S to a fairly refined state beginning around early-mid 2014. Secondly, Autopilot 2.5 hardware is installed in all Tesla's from Oct 2016 on and Tesla is moving development off Autopilot 1.0 to the ones that only have the 2.5 hardware. "Sentry Mode" which monitors your car when parked and you're not around when released will only be supported on A2.5 cars that have the 360 cameras. Third, you should also only buy a car that comes with Unlimited Supercharging because Tesla is beginning to phase out the unlimited, possibly making it more of an option and limiting the time-frame of availability. So no more cars with lifetime, unlimited supercharging. Lastly, as of this writing I was told to wait until this fall (2019) when lease returns begin to come in as all those cars will have more consistency in terms of options making A1.0 cars virtually obsolete. One plausible theory is that Tesla had to get the hardware to where it needed to be so that they could grow by adding features through software. It's a part of Tesla's core and a very profitable model. Whether this is true or not will be seen. Other than the above I think this was a rather good production and I thank you for posting this information.
Thank you for your comment--I haven't made an updated version of this video yet, but you covered a lot of it. That said, you have to remember that this video was posted almost 2 years ago and a lot has changed since then. At the time, Tesla was running the used program entirely in-house, the cars in the used fleet were being kept as service loaners until sold, and despite there being communication problems (as always, it's still Tesla) Tesla generally went to significant lengths to refurbish the cars and deliver the best car possible. I had no reservations recommending Tesla's used program back then. The used program now is an absolute shitshow. A few important points regarding your post: October 2016 is when Hardware 2 was introduced, not Hardware 2.5. Hardware 2.5 showed up around September 2017 and is required for features like dashcam and sentry mode to work. Moreover, Tesla's core Autopilot software development moved away from Hardware 1 a long time ago. Transferable lifetime free Supercharging (free charging that follows the car & can be passed to future owners) ended around January of 2017. Any car produced after that which was granted unlimited free Supercharging restricted the perk to the first owner only (non-transferable). You will not be able to buy a used Hardware 2.5 car with free Supercharging and there are very few Hardware 2 cars with transferable free Supercharging.
@@AlexVenz Excellent points Alex and thank you for your those great, and more accurate details. My experience started just a few weeks ago and you're absolutely right that Tesla's process for used is nothing less than a disaster. Thanks again for a great video and intelligent dialogue and I think an update or companion to this video would be appreciated if you have the patience and time to do it. ;)
I have been on the fence for a few weeks about cancelling my Model 3 Reservation. I like the Model S CPO selection, and since I live in North Dakota it will be a long time before I would see any movement for the Model 3 reservation. This video (among your many others) has helped reassure me that I cannot go wrong with a CPO Model S. I may not be able to get Autopilot with a CPO, but at least I could get a Model S within the next month then wait a few years, and then see what Tesla will have to offer as the technology for all Tesla vehicles will grow. I enjoy your videos because they are very informative, and that you are willing to share your experiences (both good and bad) about the Tesla vehicles.
Will Gregory If you buy a 2015-16 and up model S autopilot 1 is built in as it should be equipped with the autopilot hardware. And you have the option of buying a CPO model X as your other option. The autopilot one version has fewer problems compared to autopilot 2. Also specify the 19 inch wheels as they have a higher sidewall and are less likely to get wheel damage and will get better efficiency versus the 21 inch wheels. Also Michelin Primacy tires wear far better than the stock tires averaging well over 40,000 miles versus 20,000 or less. If you get the autopilot equipped cars you also get the parking sensors for automatic parking.
That old circular info display is I think the first thing that caught my eye about the Model S, other than the obvious engineering "wow" factor. Would love the option to enable the old circular display on the newer cars instead of the autopilot display. Awesome vid as always - cheers!
My 2015 MS 85 has the executive seating option. I'm still waiting for delivery but was well aware of this *rare* option before I bought it. Personally I wont be using the back seats on a regular basis (maybe for the dogs) but to be fair it does fix two problems that people love to complain about in the MS...two more cup holders and better view out the back window!
Great video, Alex! I've never seen such a complete analysis about how to select a used Tesla Model S! It's March 25, 2019, but this video was in my suggested to watch inbox, but it seemed brand new to me.
I dunno, I think the 5.4 second 0-60 pretty well speaks for itself--that's on-par with my old BMW M Roadster, assuming perfect shifts and a high RPM clutch dump... and the S is a huge family sedan! That said, compared to the P85, P85+, P85D, and newer non-performance D cars that I was talking about, the S85 does feel quite tame. I think a lot of people would probably feel more comfortable with how the S85 accelerates vs. the other Model S, which is why I took the time to talk about it. I do appreciate the feedback, though.
Good comparison would be to see the difference in performance numbers of older S 85 vs very popular 70D model. Actual performance is similar and around 5.2 sec 0-60mph. However, 70D has more torque (406 lb-ft) vs 85 (325 lb-ft). So, initially 70D will pull harder, but at peak acceleration S 85 will be going faster as it has more power (362 hp) vs 70D (329 hp). So, at higher speaks, 85 will be pulling away from 70D, but from stop light to around 40 or 50 mph, 70D will be a little bit ahead. In any case, older S 85 is no slouch.
Blocked charges is a growing problem ... people on trips are finding it hard to find an open charger while away from home. This problem will grow and may start to sway people away from the EV. I suggest you start a campaign where your EV owners petition their state legislator for a $25 fine for blocking each charger where half the fine goes to local police.
Alex! This is brilliant. I didnt know about a couple of the things.... Thanks for sharing... This video will impact many people in a positive way... If u look at some of the 85s on the site..... They read 253 miles range... I wonder if that was an epa thing... Or if it is in fact a degradation representation. Hmmmm.. i wonder.... Thanks again for sharing this info!
Really? None of the ones that I have looked at stated anything other than original EPA range... I'll have to do some more looking! Weird. I did forget a few other details, like the old TPMS system not relaying individual tire pressure info to the car (but this can be retrofitted), very early cars not having power folding mirrors, and stuff like that.
My 2013 didn't come with parking sensors. That was an optional feature that was not included with the tech package. It being such a huge car I was kinda bummed to find this out after I got it.
This is a great resource for anyone thinking of buying a Tesla Model S. Lots of good things and less than good things to consider. I've always wished Honda would buy Tesla and add their unmatched refinement to what Tesla has created. Fingers crossed Honda brings their sport EV concept to fruition in the US sooner than later!
Amazing hearing all this "history", as my company had been installing High Power Wall Connectors sometime before spring 2014 and I still consider all of the cars I encountered state-of-the-art with new owners brimming with pride. I guess a few years have passed and now they're not so new.
I was shopping for a Tesla earlier this year (I actually added a comment 9 months ago) and was debating between a used Model S or new Model 3. My budget, under $45K. I can understand why most people would choose a new car but after lots of thinking, I chose a used Model S. I wanted Dual Motors (AWD) and at least 270 mile range. Doing an existing inventory search for Long Range, AWD Model 3 was close to $54K. The M3 would not have heated steering wheel, and no free supercharging (sadly no longer available on a CPO)! In its defense, the M3 has much better Battery and AP technology (FSD), as well as Sentry mode! So why did I chose a used Model S. First, I’m a big guy, and the S is a much roomier car. Road trips on the S are definitely more pleasant, as it is much quieter than the M3. Also, price, for mid $40K I found a used 2015 Model S85D with only 12,004 miles. It has the Tech Package with AP1, Premium Sound, SubZero Package, NextGen Seats, panoramic sunroof, and free supercharging. I also like the 2 displays vs. the 15 inch single display on the M3. Bought directly from Tesla, it came with a 4 year/50K miles warranty (from my delivery date). Here are some photos of my dream car! 1drv.ms/f/s!AoAsGTbf5o9KhZl0XNizcC76qCZHMg
Great Video. I am currently looking to purchase a used S in the next few days and this video was very helpful and brought things to mind that i did not think about before.
I'm glad you found it helpful. Keep in mind that Tesla changed their stance on cosmetic refurbishing of their used cars within the past week, so be sure to request lots of photos from your Tesla rep in order to verify the condition of the cars you're considering (if you're buying from Tesla).
Alex Venz yes I am aware of the change. It has been hard to get photos in time. Twice the car i was looking at was sold. I dont feel comfortable putting the $1,000 down for something i never seen
Here's a pretty good list of the changes the Model S has gone though so far (up to 2017) in its production life: sites.google.com/site/teslamotorsclubwiki/home/model-s/options-by-year
Current used offerings from Tesla aren't as "refurbished" as they used to be. Nowadays they don't do much work before handing the cars over to customers. See Rich rebuilds video on his used Model X.
Awesome review on the Tesla. I just brought a used 2014 p85+ with 41k miles on it and I’m still learning how to get the best use out of my car. Anymore tips or advice will greatly be appreciated thanks and best regards
The thing with these cars is It's going to lose virtually no value as long as you take care of it, and the technology in it is 5 years old, but it was so ahead of it's time it's basically the same quality as a brand new car from another car manufacturer today
Great video! Do all of the used 2014 model S cars on the Tesla website get retrofitted with auto pilot hardware? Or, if they were not made with auto pilot hardware you're just going to be out of luck?
+bryan carter As I recall, the Hardware 1 Autopilot sensor suite was introduced in late 2014 (end of September?), so all of the cars manufactured after that point should have the hardware regardless of whether it was paid for as part of the options list and you should be able to activate it for a fee if the original owner didn't do so. Cars manufactured before that point don't have the hardware and there's no reasonable retrofit (one hacker, wk057, did the conversion on his own car, but the parts cost alone was nuts).
How do you know that the battery has not been charged full every time and in 1000km will just die? Replacements batteries cost almost as much as a used car. On top of that, you have a computer that is saving to much information so that the drives burn out, and Tesla only sells the whole computer for $5k.
Great video! Thanks. A couple of questions? Are the web prices pretty solid? Or do they negotiate? If the car is in your area, will they arrange for an inspection? We are interested in purchasing a Model S and there are some 85D and even a few 90D’s under D50k! We’ve never driven one so would like to try it before putting in the $2,500. Thanks in advance. Ralph
Alex - great video. On the pre-AP car, how bad is the front parking sensors - I really like the security of having clear picture of the size of the car as in the UK roads are a little smaller than in the UK! Any insight would be welcomed. Thanks again, great video.
It's not that they're bad, but they are a little slow to respond and the older cars lack much in the way of resolution from the sensors (you just get fixed arcs which move closer to the car, as shown briefly in this video). The ultrasonic sensors in the AP1 and later cars, however, attempt to kinda map out the shape of the obstacles they detect and display that information to the driver.
I messed up and bought a 2014 Tesla that did not have autopilot and I’m SICK. Wish I would’ve saw this before. Just got it today and my dream car has become a nightmares. I don’t even know that they made 2014 models without autopilot so here I am with a $30,000 loan on a damn car with no tech package and no autopilot. I’m so fucking sad 😢
+T Jam From what Tesla has stated so far, free Supercharging should follow the car, not the owner. Tesla's used site does indicate whether a car includes free Supercharging, though.
You're not the first person I've heard that from, which is why I definitely recommend getting in touch with a Tesla sales rep if you're serious about getting a used Tesla. Tesla's website and EV-CPO are still good places to start, though, especially if you aren't really sure what you want.
Awesome video, I'm currently a Chevrolet volt owner and previous 3x Prius owner. But my next car will probably be a Tesla. I have noticed the crashing price of the Chevrolet bolts already. But that car is hideous
Hi Alex, thank you for great video with a lot of usefull information. Two questions: 1) about cruise control this Model S can not brake to prevent crashes, right? Like some form of adaptive CC... 2) was there not extended drive trein and battery varanty? Over here in the Netherlands 8 year unlimited milage for an 85 kWh battery pack and 8 year/125000 miles for an 60 kWh battery pack
1) Correct, the pre-Autopilot cars do not have any collision avoidance, automatic emergency braking features, or traffic aware cruise control. The cruise control system is a traditional "continue at set speed" system. 2) Yes, the 8 year/unlimited mile battery and drivetrain warranty follows the car and the new owner gets whatever remains of that warranty. I just didn't focus on that in this video, as most people seem more concerned about what sort of bumper-to-bumper warranty is offered with the used Model S.
Unless you need the extra space, my vote would go to the Model 3. The 3 handles better, should charge faster (even with the smaller battery), has the latest Autopilot hardware (which can always be activated later), new car warranty, should fare better from a maintenance and repairs standpoint, costs less to insure, the 3 seems generally better built than the older S, and has an ever expanding list of tech features via its much faster/smoother interface screen. The pre-Autopilot cars haven't been getting much OTA update love lately and software v9 has caused the old MCUs to drag a bit.
Not quite: - Teslas produced before September 2014 don't have any Autopilot hardware. - Teslas produced in late 2014 (after September, I think) through September/October 2016 are all equipped with Tesla's Autopilot Hardware 1. These cars, if the Autopilot software is paid for and enabled, provide traffic aware cruise control, lane keeping via Autosteer, auto lane change upon signaling, summon, parallel and perpendicular autopark, as well as the usual safety features. - Teslas produced after October 2016 all have Tesla's Autopilot Hardware 2 (or better). If the Enhanced Autopilot software is enabled, these cars provide much of the same functionality as the Hardware 1 cars (the software is still improving) as well as features like Navigate on Autopilot, dash cam (Hardware 2.5+ only), and whatever additional functionality future software updates bring. The exact transition points for major hardware changes are a little fuzzy, though, because it can come down the the specific week of production, but the dates above should serve as a reasonable starting point.
@@AlexVenz So the 2016 90D used vs New Model 3 ? I am assuming both have the auto pilot which I need because of the travel I do on daily basis. Thoughts?
Tesla didn't introduce Autopilot Hardware 2 until October of 2016, so the bulk of the cars produced in 2016 are going to be Hardware 1 cars--Hardware 1 cars won't be able to do the things that Hardware 2/2.5/3 cars can. Moreover, you won't actually get feature parity with the Model 3 until you start looking at Model S produced after August 2017 (prior to that production date, you'll be lacking compatibility with features like sentry mode). Every new Model 3 coming off the assembly line today includes Autopilot Hardware 3, which should be capable of some pretty impressive things once Tesla gets the software figured out (provided that you pay for the FSD package). That said, if all you're looking for is really good traffic aware cruise control and lane keeping via Autosteer, then Autopilot Hardware 1 will still get the job done. It just won't get the fancy features that cars with the newer hardware will (like navigate on Autopilot, no confirmation lane changing, advanced summon, etc.).
I appreciate your info. In your opinion, of the 4 models you speak of, what is the best bang for the buck? Or would you spend the extra bucks for auto pilot? Thanks
+Salvador Lopez The standard rear wheel drive Model S 85 is likely to be the best value if you're looking at a blend of range, performance, and price. If the majority of your driving is highway driving (either in traffic or otherwise), then you may want to consider tracking down a Hardware 1 (AP1) car because the traffic aware cruise control is absolutely fantastic... but that does mean a significant increase in price. If you're mostly driving around town, then you'll rarely use AP1 since it's really a highway only system.
It's sad to see what a chaotic mess Tesla's used car program has become, especially since they stopped refurbishing the cars. That said, Rich's situation sucks but I'm pretty sure I've seen worse posted in the Tesla Motors Club forum. To put it nicely, Tesla still has a lot of room for improvement when it comes to service and communication.
Depends on which options, how much you value said options, and the build month of the cars in question. Generally speaking, the 2014 cars have fewer reliability issues than the 2013s and, if we're taking about a 2014 car built in late September or after, you can even find Hardware 1 Autopilot equipped 2014s. If the 2013 car was built before August, then it likely wouldn't even have parking sensors (I think that's when the option became available... I should probably watch my own video to double check).
You discussed early model (at least pre-2015) issues with the drive train, battery, and handles, and you seem to deduce that those issues have been mostly resolved. What about the computer, display, and tech components? How frequently do those malfunction and require servicing or replacement? What are the most pertinent considerations for buying a Tesla soon to be out of warranty? When still under warranty, all of these issues are just minor annoyances, but out of warranty, especially with Tesla's dealer-centric proprietorship, these could be considerable expenses. The first Tesla owners are only now experiencing ownership outside of the warranty period and I've heard some disgruntled chatter regarding material issues post-warranty. I plan to purchase a used model S in the next few months, just trying to be as informed as possible and mitigate as much risk as possible.
In terms of failures unique to Teslas, the main screen in early cars (generally pre-2015) can delaminate (looks like bubbles in the screen) and ooze glue out of the bezel into the yacht floor/center console. This doesn't typically recur after replacement and the replacement procedure has simplified over the years. The current repair process involves replacing the screen itself (not the computer assembly it's built into) and costs around $1k, though it's still sometimes performed as a good will repair (no cost). Another failure state of the main screen/computer assembly (commonly referred to as the MCU) is that it'll just quit working due to excessive writes wearing out the eMMC storage. Unfortunately, the eMMC is soldered to the board, so complete replacement of the MCU is the only solution and that costs about $3k. Tesla made changes to their vehicle software several years ago to address the excessive write issue and extend the life of the eMMC storage, but those early MCUs are still likely to end up with a shorter service life than those not subjected to excessive writes. Those are the two main issues that come to mind. On rare occasion, you'll hear of chargers or DC-DC converters going out but those parts tend to be pretty solid overall.
Alex Venz Thank you so much for the follow-up! Given all you know and have divulged, do you have a favorite year/model version of the S that would be your top pick if you’re shopping used? And conversely, is there any model version you’d stay away from (I know you mentioned those without tech package, and generally newer is better...)?
If budget allows, my top pick would probably be a 2015 Model S 85D. You lose the enormous front trunk space of the RWD cars, but you gain not having to deal with the old large rear drive unit (issues mentioned in the video), quicker acceleration, a little more range, Hardware 1 Autopilot, a better parking sensor setup than the pre-Autopilot cars, and a build that's late enough to end up with a pretty well sorted car. As for versions to avoid? Hmm... I don't have much love for the original Model S 60. The smaller pack size means more battery cycles for equivalent mileage (compared to an 85), it Supercharges much slower than the 85, and it has quite a bit less range to start with.
Alex Venz Okay, thank you! The price points on the 2013-2014 editions are so attractive, but I like the upgrades of 2015+ models and the extra time under warranty. Any noteworthy benefit to going through Tesla’s website for used vs local dealer or private party?
Unless you need the extra cargo space and the hatch that the Model S has, my vote goes to the Model 3. Newer Autopilot hardware, more range, faster charging, drives & handles much better, I find the 3's seats to be more comfortable than the Model S gen. 1/1.5/next gen seats, Tesla did a better job with the 3's suspension tuning (simultaneously sportier and more comfortable than the coil-equipped Model S and doesn't have the annoying floaty feeling of the old Model S air suspension), and it'll probably hold up better over time. That said, my preferences won't be the same as everyone's, so I'd recommend giving them both a try before making a decision.
Vehicle information (like Autopilot features, data connectivity, etc.) can be found in vehicle settings. I don't recall if free supercharging is also listed in the vehicle information page... I'd check for you but my wife just took off with the Model S for the week.
Alex Venz on the tesla website I should have clarified. It must of figured out my location based on my ip address which is Colorado because I didn't tell it anything
+amclymon I edit on Adobe Premiere Pro (CS6 right now, I may upgrade to CC at some point). Congrats on deciding to go with a CPO Tesla, by the way... definitely a better value than buying new. I've heard from some that the CPO buying process through Tesla can take a while so, yeah, that may make for a pretty good video series.
Alex Venz hey thanks for checking out my video. It’s my first talking video how was it? Lol I️ didn’t feel like recording it again lol. My challenger is wrapped by a local shop Tatedesign he has wrapped all my cars
It was pretty good for your first try. It takes time to become comfortable speaking to that soulless glass eye as though it were a person--I certainly don't have it down yet.
+Mahmoud Emara Cheapest Model S on Tesla's used car site right now is $46.5k, according to EV-CPO. Tesla's site is kinda horrible to search through, so you pretty much have to use a site EV-CPO to filter the search and find what you're looking for.
+Bigdaddy078 I wouldn't say that... Though, due to the quality improvements (2012 and early 2013 cars can be a bit rough) and changes in features, I'd suggest aiming for a late 2013 or early 2014 (late 2014 gets you Hardware 1 Autopilot, but there's a significant price jump that goes along with it).
+Bigdaddy078 Quickest way is to check the build date sticker that's located on the driver's door jamb. Unfortunately, Tesla doesn't list build date on their used inventory site, so the easiest tell will be whether or not the car has Autopilot hardware. All Model S built after the introduction of Autopilot (and a couple weeks prior, as I recall) included the hardware, activation of the hardware was an option. Granted, that approach will only tell you if the car was built in the last ~3 months of 2014.
I knew my 2012 Leaf pretty well, but I don't have quite the same knowledge/experience with the small changes that have been made to the Leaf over the years. I mean, I could look things up but it's not quite the same as having hands-on experience.
The video is about pre-Autopilot cars and describing Teslas by year isn't granular enough to mean much, since they change things constantly. Accordingly, the focus of this video is cars with build dates ranging from August 2012 to early September 2014--Tesla doesn't use the model year convention and doesn't even do clean month breaks for major feature changes.
I found this S60. www.tesla.com/used/5YJSA1S12EFP42653 I don't need the range so its fine. It's this or a brand new cheapest possible Model 3. I will be a first time EV owner, so what do you think I should get? I'm leaning more towards the S as I like the HUD and vertical screen a bit better than the Model 3, but then again it doesn't have much warranty. I'm not sure what I want and was wondering what you could tell me.
I generally shy away from the old S60 since it's the slowest Supercharging S ever made. In a choice between an older Model S and a new Model 3, my recommendation is almost always going to be the Model 3 unless you need the extra cargo space that the Model S offers. The Model 3 will charge faster, the UI will perform better due to having newer hardware (also means that newer software features like dashcam & sentry mode will work), Model 3 is now shipping with Autopilot Hardware 3 (of course, you have to pay for the FSD package if you want to have access to the toys), the Model 3 handles better, will probably be more reliable, etc.
+cinema writer To be fair to the original commenter, the interior shown is the same as the interior of the then "top of the range" P85+... and aside from seat changes, the addition of a center console, and a few other details, the basic design of the interior hasn't changed much since then.
*UPDATE* Tesla no longer refurbishes their used cars in the ways I mentioned in this video.
One detail I just realized that I forgot to mention in the video: All Model S produced before early June 2015 came equipped with a 3G cell radio (for Nav, web browsing, music streaming, etc.) and those produced after early June 2015 came equipped with a 4G LTE cell radio. If you have or are buying one of these older cars and want to upgrade the car to 4G LTE, this can be done by your local Tesla service center for something like US$500.
Alex Venz, does the "unlimited supercharging" (that used to come with the purchase of older model years) get conveyed to the next owners...or is it only for original owner?
Hi Alex great video. I found a 85 s but it is in a independent dealer in another state. Do you know any site where I can check the package the car has with the vin number. Car fax shows only 1 owner and only registration records. Is any way I can have like a service records? The car seems to be under the 50000 or 4 yrs warranty but is close to expire.... Can you give me any avise?
Thanx!!
The free supercharging goes with the car. The free supercharging transfers with the car. If the car doesn't have supercharging enabled you can pay Tesla to enable it.
Personally I rather buy from Tesla because supercharging will be enabled as well as all updates for the software. And if it has 3C cellular service and you'd rather have 4 G LTE Cellular service just tell your CPO Tesla guy and it will get taken care off. You have 2 options when buying used from Tesla, a previously used car or a Certified Pre Owned Tesla. The big advantage is Tesla will sell you a solid 70 point checked out mechanical inspection as well as a fully up to date computer system. And the paint job will look like it just came off the production line.
The rwd models did have problems with the drive system but by this time Tesla more than likely has already replaced the drive system so it's not a problem. I highly recommend buying the optional warranty on the car as the drive system is warranted for 8 years unlimited mileage. The optional warranty covers the rest of the car excepting the battery and drive system.
It is still a solid automobile, the battery degradation averages 3- 4 percent. Not a problem.
I just purchased another cpo Tesla model s and I can tell you they no longer recondition a car before delivery. I was surprised to find this out, but they are cutting costs as much as possible.
I've watched about all of the Tesla videos one person can handle and I can say this is the best informational video on buying a used tesla. The only thing I'd add is that the seats you're sitting on are the performance seats.
Yeah, I forgot the name for the seats while I was filming... to be fair, though, I wasn't really working from a script (just a rough outline to keep me on track) and Tesla has offered something like 5 different seats in the Model S since it started production in 2012. There's a lot to keep track of with these cars. lol
I bought a used 2015 Tesla Model S 85D from a Chevy dealer in northern VA. I got it 2 weeks ago. It had 32k miles on it. It also came with so many accessories. I took it to Tesla for the 3 year service as soon as I got it, because it’s 3 years old and it turned out the person who owned the Tesla before me purchased the extended bumper to bumper warranty and prepaid for service for the first 4 years. I got the car for $59,000. It has auto pilot version 1, a sunroof, wood trim, tan seats, the tech package, and the sub zero weather package. Such a sweet deal! I love this car!
Daniel Mikhail wonder if there is a way to find out if a used Tesla from a dealership has extended warranty before you buy it?
quick question. when you charge at the superchargers is it free?
Excellent. Definitely needed guidance for anyone wanting to buy used. You get range (200+ miles) plus free charging (Super & Destination possibly) to
Travel for half or less than new. OK, you do not get Auto Pilot, but it's a great way to start with EVs.
It took me a minute to fall in love with your videos, having seen a few of them already. But I have come to the realization that you're a beast! Your info and details are second to none. Keep up the great work.
This is the most helpful and informative video on RUclips, you have have no idea how much this has helped me! Thanks man.
Great vid, Alex! You covered everything I would have thought to cover. I have a 9/14 P85+ that I still love everyday and I think I was lucky in that I missed most of the early problems that plagued the MS up through the summer of 14. I count myself as lucky!
Love your channel!
Thank you for the info. I am waiting on my 2013 Model S 85 to be delivered next week.
+ozstever Congrats!
I own a Used Tesla. I Love it
A few corrections or clarifications to what I believe I heard during this video. 1) Tesla requires a $2500 deposit on any used car that is non-refundable, meaning you can't get your money back if you don't like the car at delivery but you will get credit towards another Tesla either used or new. 2) You will NOT have an opportunity to see the car or test drive it before buying it. The cars are held in storage by Manheim who are the ones that send you the pictures (from a Dropbox Account). They will not allow you to see the car (period) much less drive it. They will recommend that you go to one of their showrooms, drive a new one and suggest that it's the same for any car (BS). 3) While you may talk to an Sales Advisor (or whatever they call them), there is only one guy handling all of Tesla's used sales and his only job is to get you to pluck your $2500 bucks down and he's gone. Then the myriad of issues begins with getting your car (that you never seen or driven) on delivery date and it's largely a crap shoot from there. Tesla's used market sales process is clearly broken!
The latest advice that I've been able to validate is that you really don't want an older Tesla, say, before mid-late 2015. The reason is because Tesla had the Model S to a fairly refined state beginning around early-mid 2014. Secondly, Autopilot 2.5 hardware is installed in all Tesla's from Oct 2016 on and Tesla is moving development off Autopilot 1.0 to the ones that only have the 2.5 hardware. "Sentry Mode" which monitors your car when parked and you're not around when released will only be supported on A2.5 cars that have the 360 cameras. Third, you should also only buy a car that comes with Unlimited Supercharging because Tesla is beginning to phase out the unlimited, possibly making it more of an option and limiting the time-frame of availability. So no more cars with lifetime, unlimited supercharging. Lastly, as of this writing I was told to wait until this fall (2019) when lease returns begin to come in as all those cars will have more consistency in terms of options making A1.0 cars virtually obsolete. One plausible theory is that Tesla had to get the hardware to where it needed to be so that they could grow by adding features through software. It's a part of Tesla's core and a very profitable model. Whether this is true or not will be seen.
Other than the above I think this was a rather good production and I thank you for posting this information.
Thank you for your comment--I haven't made an updated version of this video yet, but you covered a lot of it. That said, you have to remember that this video was posted almost 2 years ago and a lot has changed since then. At the time, Tesla was running the used program entirely in-house, the cars in the used fleet were being kept as service loaners until sold, and despite there being communication problems (as always, it's still Tesla) Tesla generally went to significant lengths to refurbish the cars and deliver the best car possible. I had no reservations recommending Tesla's used program back then. The used program now is an absolute shitshow.
A few important points regarding your post:
October 2016 is when Hardware 2 was introduced, not Hardware 2.5. Hardware 2.5 showed up around September 2017 and is required for features like dashcam and sentry mode to work. Moreover, Tesla's core Autopilot software development moved away from Hardware 1 a long time ago.
Transferable lifetime free Supercharging (free charging that follows the car & can be passed to future owners) ended around January of 2017. Any car produced after that which was granted unlimited free Supercharging restricted the perk to the first owner only (non-transferable). You will not be able to buy a used Hardware 2.5 car with free Supercharging and there are very few Hardware 2 cars with transferable free Supercharging.
@@AlexVenz Excellent points Alex and thank you for your those great, and more accurate details. My experience started just a few weeks ago and you're absolutely right that Tesla's process for used is nothing less than a disaster. Thanks again for a great video and intelligent dialogue and I think an update or companion to this video would be appreciated if you have the patience and time to do it. ;)
I have been on the fence for a few weeks about cancelling my Model 3 Reservation. I like the Model S CPO selection, and since I live in North Dakota it will be a long time before I would see any movement for the Model 3 reservation. This video (among your many others) has helped reassure me that I cannot go wrong with a CPO Model S. I may not be able to get Autopilot with a CPO, but at least I could get a Model S within the next month then wait a few years, and then see what Tesla will have to offer as the technology for all Tesla vehicles will grow. I enjoy your videos because they are very informative, and that you are willing to share your experiences (both good and bad) about the Tesla vehicles.
Will Gregory
If you buy a 2015-16 and up model S autopilot 1 is built in as it should be equipped with the autopilot hardware. And you have the option of buying a CPO model X as your other option. The autopilot one version has fewer problems compared to autopilot 2. Also specify the 19 inch wheels as they have a higher sidewall and are less likely to get wheel damage and will get better efficiency versus the 21 inch wheels. Also Michelin Primacy tires wear far better than the stock tires averaging well over 40,000 miles versus 20,000 or less. If you get the autopilot equipped cars you also get the parking sensors for automatic parking.
OMG thanks man! This is an old video, but soooooooo helpful! Im shopping for 14 S85
That old circular info display is I think the first thing that caught my eye about the Model S, other than the obvious engineering "wow" factor. Would love the option to enable the old circular display on the newer cars instead of the autopilot display. Awesome vid as always - cheers!
Love coming back to this video periodically. Still loving my founders model s p85
Best used tesla video out there, great work!
Such a good video Alex, you really have opened up my eyes to the history of the pre-2015 Tesla!
Thumbs up for using a pizza box as a measurement tool. Great information to boot.
I think this is the best video out there! Thank you very much for the excellent info!
My 2015 MS 85 has the executive seating option. I'm still waiting for delivery but was well aware of this *rare* option before I bought it. Personally I wont be using the back seats on a regular basis (maybe for the dogs) but to be fair it does fix two problems that people love to complain about in the MS...two more cup holders and better view out the back window!
So weird to see a Model S without glass roof
Very informative and comprehensive. Thanks for this video!
Great video, Alex! I've never seen such a complete analysis about how to select a used Tesla Model S! It's March 25, 2019, but this video was in my suggested to watch inbox, but it seemed brand new to me.
I own a 2013 S85 and I think you're underselling it's performance. It's still much quicker than most cars.
I dunno, I think the 5.4 second 0-60 pretty well speaks for itself--that's on-par with my old BMW M Roadster, assuming perfect shifts and a high RPM clutch dump... and the S is a huge family sedan! That said, compared to the P85, P85+, P85D, and newer non-performance D cars that I was talking about, the S85 does feel quite tame. I think a lot of people would probably feel more comfortable with how the S85 accelerates vs. the other Model S, which is why I took the time to talk about it. I do appreciate the feedback, though.
Good comparison would be to see the difference in performance numbers of older S 85 vs very popular 70D model. Actual performance is similar and around 5.2 sec 0-60mph. However, 70D has more torque (406 lb-ft) vs 85 (325 lb-ft). So, initially 70D will pull harder, but at peak acceleration S 85 will be going faster as it has more power (362 hp) vs 70D (329 hp). So, at higher speaks, 85 will be pulling away from 70D, but from stop light to around 40 or 50 mph, 70D will be a little bit ahead. In any case, older S 85 is no slouch.
Blocked charges is a growing problem ... people on trips are finding it
hard to find an open charger while away from home. This problem will
grow and may start to sway people away from the EV. I suggest you start
a campaign where your EV owners petition their state legislator for a
$25 fine for blocking each charger where half the fine goes to local police.
Thanks, found your video very comprehensive, just what I needed looking for a used S.
Alex! This is brilliant. I didnt know about a couple of the things.... Thanks for sharing... This video will impact many people in a positive way... If u look at some of the 85s on the site..... They read 253 miles range... I wonder if that was an epa thing... Or if it is in fact a degradation representation. Hmmmm.. i wonder.... Thanks again for sharing this info!
Really? None of the ones that I have looked at stated anything other than original EPA range... I'll have to do some more looking! Weird. I did forget a few other details, like the old TPMS system not relaying individual tire pressure info to the car (but this can be retrofitted), very early cars not having power folding mirrors, and stuff like that.
My 2013 didn't come with parking sensors. That was an optional feature that was not included with the tech package. It being such a huge car I was kinda bummed to find this out after I got it.
14:45
Thank you this was exactly the video I was looking for. Model 3 with options seems to be the better choice unless you need more space.
This is a great resource for anyone thinking of buying a Tesla Model S. Lots of good things and less than good things to consider. I've always wished Honda would buy Tesla and add their unmatched refinement to what Tesla has created. Fingers crossed Honda brings their sport EV concept to fruition in the US sooner than later!
Amazing hearing all this "history", as my company had been installing High Power Wall Connectors sometime before spring 2014 and I still consider all of the cars I encountered state-of-the-art with new owners brimming with pride. I guess a few years have passed and now they're not so new.
I was shopping for a Tesla earlier this year (I actually added a comment 9 months ago) and was debating between a used Model S or new Model 3. My budget, under $45K. I can understand why most people would choose a new car but after lots of thinking, I chose a used Model S.
I wanted Dual Motors (AWD) and at least 270 mile range. Doing an existing inventory search for Long Range, AWD Model 3 was close to $54K. The M3 would not have heated steering wheel, and no free supercharging (sadly no longer available on a CPO)! In its defense, the M3 has much better Battery and AP technology (FSD), as well as Sentry mode!
So why did I chose a used Model S. First, I’m a big guy, and the S is a much roomier car. Road trips on the S are definitely more pleasant, as it is much quieter than the M3. Also, price, for mid $40K I found a used 2015 Model S85D with only 12,004 miles. It has the Tech Package with AP1, Premium Sound, SubZero Package, NextGen Seats, panoramic sunroof, and free supercharging. I also like the 2 displays vs. the 15 inch single display on the M3. Bought directly from Tesla, it came with a 4 year/50K miles warranty (from my delivery date).
Here are some photos of my dream car! 1drv.ms/f/s!AoAsGTbf5o9KhZl0XNizcC76qCZHMg
great video, saved me a ton of money and time
great video, i learned a lot. Exactly what i was looking for
Yea me too
Nice, really good info in this video, thanks!
Thanks for the video. This is exactly what I was looking for.
Great Video. I am currently looking to purchase a used S in the next few days and this video was very helpful and brought things to mind that i did not think about before.
I'm glad you found it helpful. Keep in mind that Tesla changed their stance on cosmetic refurbishing of their used cars within the past week, so be sure to request lots of photos from your Tesla rep in order to verify the condition of the cars you're considering (if you're buying from Tesla).
Alex Venz yes I am aware of the change. It has been hard to get photos in time. Twice the car i was looking at was sold. I dont feel comfortable putting the $1,000 down for something i never seen
Is there a link or something you someone can share about the differences/be aware of items comparing the 2014 S vs 2015 S?
Here's a pretty good list of the changes the Model S has gone though so far (up to 2017) in its production life: sites.google.com/site/teslamotorsclubwiki/home/model-s/options-by-year
Thank you. Great video. I’m looking to getting a 2016 Model S
Me too, did you buy yours? I've been so nervous.
@alex if you are ever in WA hit me up, we have a executive seat S85D.
At 8:00 i was using my phone and the google now just open and started to type what you was saying. it was funny
Current used offerings from Tesla aren't as "refurbished" as they used to be. Nowadays they don't do much work before handing the cars over to customers. See Rich rebuilds video on his used Model X.
Correct, Tesla stopped refurbishing their used cars a while ago. This video is old. There sould be a pinned comment covering this.
Good job! Very informative!
I can't thank you enough for the tip with EV-CPO Hunter!
Awesome review on the Tesla. I just brought a used 2014 p85+ with 41k miles on it and I’m still learning how to get the best use out of my car. Anymore tips or advice will greatly be appreciated thanks and best regards
Alex, great video. =)
Alex, excellent job.
Great video. Can you do an update for the very early facelift Model S?
It's on my to do list, but may be a little while before I get to it.
The thing with these cars is It's going to lose virtually no value as long as you take care of it, and the technology in it is 5 years old, but it was so ahead of it's time it's basically the same quality as a brand new car from another car manufacturer today
The oldest Model S are coming up on 7 years old & their interface is still better than most new cars... it's pretty crazy.
Really great
Why does 0-60 time matter if you’re not racing?
Jay Songz it’s fun to stomp it sometimes
Great video! Do all of the used 2014 model S cars on the Tesla website get retrofitted with auto pilot hardware? Or, if they were not made with auto pilot hardware you're just going to be out of luck?
+bryan carter As I recall, the Hardware 1 Autopilot sensor suite was introduced in late 2014 (end of September?), so all of the cars manufactured after that point should have the hardware regardless of whether it was paid for as part of the options list and you should be able to activate it for a fee if the original owner didn't do so. Cars manufactured before that point don't have the hardware and there's no reasonable retrofit (one hacker, wk057, did the conversion on his own car, but the parts cost alone was nuts).
Thanks... Very Informative....
Thanks Alex
great video!
it it just me or does he sound like Shaggy from Scooby Doo, but great vid
Kermit
How do you know that the battery has not been charged full every time and in 1000km will just die? Replacements batteries cost almost as much as a used car. On top of that, you have a computer that is saving to much information so that the drives burn out, and Tesla only sells the whole computer for $5k.
Great video! Thanks. A couple of questions? Are the web prices pretty solid? Or do they negotiate? If the car is in your area, will they arrange for an inspection? We are interested in purchasing a Model S and there are some 85D and even a few 90D’s under D50k! We’ve never driven one so would like to try it before putting in the $2,500. Thanks in advance. Ralph
Alex - great video. On the pre-AP car, how bad is the front parking sensors - I really like the security of having clear picture of the size of the car as in the UK roads are a little smaller than in the UK! Any insight would be welcomed. Thanks again, great video.
It's not that they're bad, but they are a little slow to respond and the older cars lack much in the way of resolution from the sensors (you just get fixed arcs which move closer to the car, as shown briefly in this video). The ultrasonic sensors in the AP1 and later cars, however, attempt to kinda map out the shape of the obstacles they detect and display that information to the driver.
I messed up and bought a 2014 Tesla that did not have autopilot and I’m SICK. Wish I would’ve saw this before. Just got it today and my dream car has become a nightmares. I don’t even know that they made 2014 models without autopilot so here I am with a $30,000 loan on a damn car with no tech package and no autopilot.
I’m so fucking sad 😢
Cool video, big like 👍.
Is the "lifetime free supercharging" transferred to the next owner, or is it something that the original owner can only take advantage-of?
+T Jam From what Tesla has stated so far, free Supercharging should follow the car, not the owner. Tesla's used site does indicate whether a car includes free Supercharging, though.
Or go to the tesla inventory site :)
All the different levels of autopilot with different names/terms and which models have which levels is confusing. Have you done a video on that?
Not yet, but I'm planning to make a video covering that in 3 weeks or so.
Holy smokes I forgot how large the model S frunk was compared to a model 3.
Yeah, the old RWD Model S frunk was enormous. It shrunk substantially with the introduction of the dual motor S, and further with the refresh.
Ah, thank you for the good info 👍
Anyone watching this should go watch rich rebuilds trying to buy a used model x
Which year would you say is the best year. In terms of they have all the bugs worked out?
awesome vid
When I was looking for my used Tesla, none of the cheapest vehicles my Tesla Sales Advisor sent me were listed on teslainventory nor tesla-cpo
You're not the first person I've heard that from, which is why I definitely recommend getting in touch with a Tesla sales rep if you're serious about getting a used Tesla. Tesla's website and EV-CPO are still good places to start, though, especially if you aren't really sure what you want.
so as far as tech, and quality of build, would you say stay around 2014 s85 no plus or d
Alex, I see that Tesla made some modifications in Oct 2016. How far back did they start installing the self driving capability hardware for model S?
October 2016 is when Autopilot Hardware 2 was introduced
Awesome video, I'm currently a Chevrolet volt owner and previous 3x Prius owner. But my next car will probably be a Tesla. I have noticed the crashing price of the Chevrolet bolts already. But that car is hideous
Have the Tesla for 2 weeks and have not run it to 20 miles left. Always recharge when 85 miles left. lol
What about the Dual battery chargers option?
Hi Alex, thank you for great video with a lot of usefull information. Two questions:
1) about cruise control this Model S can not brake to prevent crashes, right? Like some form of adaptive CC...
2) was there not extended drive trein and battery varanty? Over here in the Netherlands 8 year unlimited milage for an 85 kWh battery pack and 8 year/125000 miles for an 60 kWh battery pack
1) Correct, the pre-Autopilot cars do not have any collision avoidance, automatic emergency braking features, or traffic aware cruise control. The cruise control system is a traditional "continue at set speed" system.
2) Yes, the 8 year/unlimited mile battery and drivetrain warranty follows the car and the new owner gets whatever remains of that warranty. I just didn't focus on that in this video, as most people seem more concerned about what sort of bumper-to-bumper warranty is offered with the used Model S.
Wondering if one should just buy a Model 3 Standard Plus over an older Model S 85 pre autopilot?
Unless you need the extra space, my vote would go to the Model 3. The 3 handles better, should charge faster (even with the smaller battery), has the latest Autopilot hardware (which can always be activated later), new car warranty, should fare better from a maintenance and repairs standpoint, costs less to insure, the 3 seems generally better built than the older S, and has an ever expanding list of tech features via its much faster/smoother interface screen. The pre-Autopilot cars haven't been getting much OTA update love lately and software v9 has caused the old MCUs to drag a bit.
Does all Teslas come AP capable?
Not quite:
- Teslas produced before September 2014 don't have any Autopilot hardware.
- Teslas produced in late 2014 (after September, I think) through September/October 2016 are all equipped with Tesla's Autopilot Hardware 1. These cars, if the Autopilot software is paid for and enabled, provide traffic aware cruise control, lane keeping via Autosteer, auto lane change upon signaling, summon, parallel and perpendicular autopark, as well as the usual safety features.
- Teslas produced after October 2016 all have Tesla's Autopilot Hardware 2 (or better). If the Enhanced Autopilot software is enabled, these cars provide much of the same functionality as the Hardware 1 cars (the software is still improving) as well as features like Navigate on Autopilot, dash cam (Hardware 2.5+ only), and whatever additional functionality future software updates bring.
The exact transition points for major hardware changes are a little fuzzy, though, because it can come down the the specific week of production, but the dates above should serve as a reasonable starting point.
Where do you usually get maintenance done with Tesla?
Ether at a Tesla owned service center or via Tesla's mobile technicians, who come to you.
@@AlexVenz So the 2016 90D used vs New Model 3 ? I am assuming both have the auto pilot which I need because of the travel I do on daily basis. Thoughts?
Tesla didn't introduce Autopilot Hardware 2 until October of 2016, so the bulk of the cars produced in 2016 are going to be Hardware 1 cars--Hardware 1 cars won't be able to do the things that Hardware 2/2.5/3 cars can. Moreover, you won't actually get feature parity with the Model 3 until you start looking at Model S produced after August 2017 (prior to that production date, you'll be lacking compatibility with features like sentry mode). Every new Model 3 coming off the assembly line today includes Autopilot Hardware 3, which should be capable of some pretty impressive things once Tesla gets the software figured out (provided that you pay for the FSD package).
That said, if all you're looking for is really good traffic aware cruise control and lane keeping via Autosteer, then Autopilot Hardware 1 will still get the job done. It just won't get the fancy features that cars with the newer hardware will (like navigate on Autopilot, no confirmation lane changing, advanced summon, etc.).
@@AlexVenz Thank you Alex! You answered exactly what I was look for.
I appreciate your info. In your opinion, of the 4 models you speak of, what is the best bang for the buck? Or would you spend the extra bucks for auto pilot? Thanks
+Salvador Lopez The standard rear wheel drive Model S 85 is likely to be the best value if you're looking at a blend of range, performance, and price. If the majority of your driving is highway driving (either in traffic or otherwise), then you may want to consider tracking down a Hardware 1 (AP1) car because the traffic aware cruise control is absolutely fantastic... but that does mean a significant increase in price. If you're mostly driving around town, then you'll rarely use AP1 since it's really a highway only system.
Is self park and summon only available in AP vehicles?
+Salvador Lopez Yes, the auto park and summon features are part of the Autopilot package. Pre-AP cars don't have these features.
Rich Rebuilds had the worst experience yet ....
It's sad to see what a chaotic mess Tesla's used car program has become, especially since they stopped refurbishing the cars. That said, Rich's situation sucks but I'm pretty sure I've seen worse posted in the Tesla Motors Club forum. To put it nicely, Tesla still has a lot of room for improvement when it comes to service and communication.
found a model S 85 2013 all options vs 2014 S85 some options. both same price. Which would you go with?
Depends on which options, how much you value said options, and the build month of the cars in question. Generally speaking, the 2014 cars have fewer reliability issues than the 2013s and, if we're taking about a 2014 car built in late September or after, you can even find Hardware 1 Autopilot equipped 2014s. If the 2013 car was built before August, then it likely wouldn't even have parking sensors (I think that's when the option became available... I should probably watch my own video to double check).
You discussed early model (at least pre-2015) issues with the drive train, battery, and handles, and you seem to deduce that those issues have been mostly resolved. What about the computer, display, and tech components? How frequently do those malfunction and require servicing or replacement? What are the most pertinent considerations for buying a Tesla soon to be out of warranty?
When still under warranty, all of these issues are just minor annoyances, but out of warranty, especially with Tesla's dealer-centric proprietorship, these could be considerable expenses. The first Tesla owners are only now experiencing ownership outside of the warranty period and I've heard some disgruntled chatter regarding material issues post-warranty.
I plan to purchase a used model S in the next few months, just trying to be as informed as possible and mitigate as much risk as possible.
In terms of failures unique to Teslas, the main screen in early cars (generally pre-2015) can delaminate (looks like bubbles in the screen) and ooze glue out of the bezel into the yacht floor/center console. This doesn't typically recur after replacement and the replacement procedure has simplified over the years. The current repair process involves replacing the screen itself (not the computer assembly it's built into) and costs around $1k, though it's still sometimes performed as a good will repair (no cost).
Another failure state of the main screen/computer assembly (commonly referred to as the MCU) is that it'll just quit working due to excessive writes wearing out the eMMC storage. Unfortunately, the eMMC is soldered to the board, so complete replacement of the MCU is the only solution and that costs about $3k. Tesla made changes to their vehicle software several years ago to address the excessive write issue and extend the life of the eMMC storage, but those early MCUs are still likely to end up with a shorter service life than those not subjected to excessive writes.
Those are the two main issues that come to mind. On rare occasion, you'll hear of chargers or DC-DC converters going out but those parts tend to be pretty solid overall.
Alex Venz Thank you so much for the follow-up! Given all you know and have divulged, do you have a favorite year/model version of the S that would be your top pick if you’re shopping used?
And conversely, is there any model version you’d stay away from (I know you mentioned those without tech package, and generally newer is better...)?
If budget allows, my top pick would probably be a 2015 Model S 85D. You lose the enormous front trunk space of the RWD cars, but you gain not having to deal with the old large rear drive unit (issues mentioned in the video), quicker acceleration, a little more range, Hardware 1 Autopilot, a better parking sensor setup than the pre-Autopilot cars, and a build that's late enough to end up with a pretty well sorted car.
As for versions to avoid? Hmm... I don't have much love for the original Model S 60. The smaller pack size means more battery cycles for equivalent mileage (compared to an 85), it Supercharges much slower than the 85, and it has quite a bit less range to start with.
Alex Venz Okay, thank you! The price points on the 2013-2014 editions are so attractive, but I like the upgrades of 2015+ models and the extra time under warranty. Any noteworthy benefit to going through Tesla’s website for used vs local dealer or private party?
The main benefit of going through Tesla is that many of the cars will have a 4 year/50k mile pre-owned bumper-to-bumper warranty.
You look like that Pharma bro guy
Alex now than you have both 3 and S. Do you recomend a used S or a new 3??
Unless you need the extra cargo space and the hatch that the Model S has, my vote goes to the Model 3. Newer Autopilot hardware, more range, faster charging, drives & handles much better, I find the 3's seats to be more comfortable than the Model S gen. 1/1.5/next gen seats, Tesla did a better job with the 3's suspension tuning (simultaneously sportier and more comfortable than the coil-equipped Model S and doesn't have the annoying floaty feeling of the old Model S air suspension), and it'll probably hold up better over time.
That said, my preferences won't be the same as everyone's, so I'd recommend giving them both a try before making a decision.
Charging while driving is the answer. I don't know why people keep avoiding this obvious conclusion?
How do you know if it has free supercharger and autopilot?
Vehicle information (like Autopilot features, data connectivity, etc.) can be found in vehicle settings. I don't recall if free supercharging is also listed in the vehicle information page... I'd check for you but my wife just took off with the Model S for the week.
a pizza box is a perfectly acceptable unit of measure
My number 1 tip... don’t buy an executive package accidentally and end up with only a 4 seater
I looked at their inventory today and it says they only have 3 used model s cars and one model x. I didn't put any location data either.
+Seth Harris Odd, EV-CPO is showing 196 used Model S listed in Tesla's US inventory right now
Alex Venz on the tesla website I should have clarified. It must of figured out my location based on my ip address which is Colorado because I didn't tell it anything
I’m going to start recording my CPO buying process do you mind telling me what video editing program you use? Thank you
+amclymon I edit on Adobe Premiere Pro (CS6 right now, I may upgrade to CC at some point). Congrats on deciding to go with a CPO Tesla, by the way... definitely a better value than buying new. I've heard from some that the CPO buying process through Tesla can take a while so, yeah, that may make for a pretty good video series.
Alex Venz I just put my deposit down, I️ uploaded my first video. Feel free to watch. Took about 2 months of searching. Thanks for the reply
Nice score with that P85--they do go quick once they're listed. Also, the wrap on your Challenger is really wild.
Alex Venz hey thanks for checking out my video. It’s my first talking video how was it? Lol I️ didn’t feel like recording it again lol. My challenger is wrapped by a local shop Tatedesign he has wrapped all my cars
It was pretty good for your first try. It takes time to become comfortable speaking to that soulless glass eye as though it were a person--I certainly don't have it down yet.
How are they that cheap on the website?? When I search on the used page the cheapest ones are 58k!
+Mahmoud Emara Cheapest Model S on Tesla's used car site right now is $46.5k, according to EV-CPO. Tesla's site is kinda horrible to search through, so you pretty much have to use a site EV-CPO to filter the search and find what you're looking for.
Alright, thank you!
So is it not recommended to buy a 2013 or 2014? They are more in my price range
+Bigdaddy078 I wouldn't say that... Though, due to the quality improvements (2012 and early 2013 cars can be a bit rough) and changes in features, I'd suggest aiming for a late 2013 or early 2014 (late 2014 gets you Hardware 1 Autopilot, but there's a significant price jump that goes along with it).
Alex Venz the 2013 do not have autopilot? So look for 2014 and newer for that feature?
+Bigdaddy078 Correct, Hardware 1 Autopilot was introduced in late September 2014.
Alex Venz so how can you tell if its a late or early 2014 model?
+Bigdaddy078 Quickest way is to check the build date sticker that's located on the driver's door jamb. Unfortunately, Tesla doesn't list build date on their used inventory site, so the easiest tell will be whether or not the car has Autopilot hardware. All Model S built after the introduction of Autopilot (and a couple weeks prior, as I recall) included the hardware, activation of the hardware was an option. Granted, that approach will only tell you if the car was built in the last ~3 months of 2014.
like Wow Alex. You're a regular Tesla encyclopedia. Do you know that much about the Leaf?
I knew my 2012 Leaf pretty well, but I don't have quite the same knowledge/experience with the small changes that have been made to the Leaf over the years. I mean, I could look things up but it's not quite the same as having hands-on experience.
You should define the earlier Model S....year range.
The video is about pre-Autopilot cars and describing Teslas by year isn't granular enough to mean much, since they change things constantly. Accordingly, the focus of this video is cars with build dates ranging from August 2012 to early September 2014--Tesla doesn't use the model year convention and doesn't even do clean month breaks for major feature changes.
I found this S60. www.tesla.com/used/5YJSA1S12EFP42653
I don't need the range so its fine. It's this or a brand new cheapest possible Model 3. I will be a first time EV owner, so what do you think I should get? I'm leaning more towards the S as I like the HUD and vertical screen a bit better than the Model 3, but then again it doesn't have much warranty. I'm not sure what I want and was wondering what you could tell me.
I generally shy away from the old S60 since it's the slowest Supercharging S ever made. In a choice between an older Model S and a new Model 3, my recommendation is almost always going to be the Model 3 unless you need the extra cargo space that the Model S offers. The Model 3 will charge faster, the UI will perform better due to having newer hardware (also means that newer software features like dashcam & sentry mode will work), Model 3 is now shipping with Autopilot Hardware 3 (of course, you have to pay for the FSD package if you want to have access to the toys), the Model 3 handles better, will probably be more reliable, etc.
Verdict, just find a way to buy a brand new Tesla, lol
God, the interiors of these expensive Teslas look so crude compared with BMW, AUDI, JAGUAR and Rover to name but few.
+cinema writer To be fair to the original commenter, the interior shown is the same as the interior of the then "top of the range" P85+... and aside from seat changes, the addition of a center console, and a few other details, the basic design of the interior hasn't changed much since then.
how much % of ppl will buy discounted expensive used car without seeing it?
Ying D a lot.
Is 21 minutes a quick video? :D
This video re-affirmed why tesla suck
It used not new
Early
I wouldn't buy a used car without prior test drive, especially when spending 50k+.