saw a video...do not know be whome. But not long ago. He did the calculation ( think it might be a halo channel) about how strong macs are. And he calculated that the infinity macs where stronger as orbital macs. Installation00 has a video about it.
@@enzo-gg2sr unlikely the Covenant have seen Humans interact with Forerunner technology and they’ve only ever viewed it has humans Heresy. Example: Halo wars when professor Anders easily accessed a Forerunner map. The Infinty would be viewed as no different.
Nothing beats the good"ol big stick guns throwing sticks at .25 of light speed. It maybe primitive, but effective against these religious boogaloos thinking the rings are some sacred temple
@@mullerpotgieter i mean if moon sized rock hits religious boogaloos they will sure as hell take more damage than from those tungsten sticks right? Thus rock is still superior
I hated him so much. He was so incompetent that I wonder how he not only managed to survive the Human-Covenant War but how he became captain of the pride of the UNSC Navy. He was just there to add unnecessary drama until the game literally told you, "Yeah, he isn't in the story now."
@@yorecf9641 I think ONI chief Parangosky wanted him as captain since he was so unremarkable no one would really care if he “disappeared” in order to maintain the Infinitity’s secrecy but then have Lasky, someone who she actually appproves, ready to take over when sh$& got real.
@@WingsaberE3 sadly, that still came at the cost of having one of the most infuriating characters in the game series and it still meant that the ship was at risk if he wasn’t relieved or killed before things got real. Also, it’s not like ONI hasn’t faked the deaths of personnel for special projects before, like Kurt for the Spartan III program.
ONI working behind the curtain has always been used to explain away stuff but I like the idea that Del Rio was easy to manipulate and control. We see this in Hunt the truth but with how halo 5 turned out Hunt the truth might as well have never happened
If reach had the same number of orbital mac platforms that Earth had, (totaling around 300 or so) i think reach would have been fine with or without the infinity. Reach only had about 20 platforms in canon. If they'd had even just 100 platforms i think the covenant still may have lost
A much bigger fleet + orbital defence grid. Given that the fleet hat destroyed reach outnumbered the UNSC forces significantly, and it took several times the covenants fleet size to destroy a covenant ship, the fleet would have to number I'm the thousands to have a shot at defeating the covenant. But if the UNSC had access to that kind of fleet then they wouldn't have been pushed to this point in the first place.
@@hands6670 , I'm ignorant of Halo Lore... so I need to ask, how much did each of those platforms cost (price, material, and personal, and time to build)? How much defense did the planet deserve based on its importance to the war/USNC?
For starters more mac platforms like earth scale. Teams of Spartans IIs and IIIs guarding key facilities. Along with at least one army supporting each region. At minimum 100 times the ships. A fleet of pillar of autumn special Marathons. A hand full of infinity style capital ships. Basically due to the Cole protocol assists would have to be diverted to destroying crippled ships during the invasion. Hence why blue team never made landfall during the reach invasion. So with that said humanity could really only fight at 80-90% full strength. With reach being the last strong hold before earth. Everything depends on the Covies not finding earth and saving reach. Plus we are talking a whole planet. Covies could easily slip jump to any corner of the planet and continue a cat and dog fight against the humans as they poke and prod the MACs in orbit. The UNSC would be worn thin even with all their ships they had left. I don't think reach could ever not fall. Maybe if it was the first planet the Covies tried to glass. And humanity had every ship. But I doubt it.
@@aralornwolf3140 not sure the cost, but like someone said earlier reach only had maybe 20 platforms planet wide. Earth had 300 and the Covies still managed to make land fall on Earth. To answer your other question, I think Reach and Earth were the only planets to have MAC platforms. Earth being Earth it got the best of the best for defense. But Reach was the closet military fortress to Earth so it also had MACs. And at that I think Reach had older versions. Their power came from massive generators planet side. Where as Earth's seemed to be self sustaining. Orbital MACs seemed to be a new thing during the human Covie war. As Johnson said when he shipped out for basic the Orbital platforms were just barely getting to the drawing board. So my guess is Reach got the first generation (prototypes) of MACs then after they built those Earth got the newer, better versions with less flaws. Cuz if I remember correctly Reach's MACs took a while to reload. Maybe a minute or so. Where as In halo 2 we see the Earth MACs firing every 20 seconds or less. During the construction of Earth's I think is when the covenant first started to become a threat. Wiping out worlds. So the Earth Gov probably dumped most of it's funds into building as many Orbital MACs as it could. That's why Earth has 300 compared to Reach's 20 prototypes. And since Reach was Military based planet they probably moved all their funds to supporting the offensive war effort such as ships and Spartans and troops. Rather than its own Defense platforms. Granted this is all headcanon from reading the books. If anyone would like to correct me please do so
I think the Infinity could change the tide, with its 10 frigates (all of which are far stronger then those made during the war) it would be able to protect critical areas better and potentially prevent the orbital cannons from being disabled, which was the reason Reach fell, with those cannons still active reach would stand a much better chance. (lets be kind and add the UNSC Eternity to the mix assuming it has the same capabilities and a capable commander, then the Covenent would not stand a chance)
@@admiralwullfyularen6225 that got solved by the discovery of onyx and it’s hyrogok, now the unsc has basically forerunner construction machines to build the more complicated parts like the power plant/engines. They are how the infinity was able to get pinpoint slipspace capabilities.
In Halo: First Strike, it is mentioned that the last operational UNSC Supercarrier of the time- the UNSC Trafalgar, participated in and was destroyed at the Fall of Reach, without greatly affecting the outcome. Yes, it didn't have shields like the Infinity, but it still represented how the best of the UNSC fleet was already throwing itself at Reach's defense and yet still did little to even slow the advance. It is also stated in the FoR novel that the ODPs managed dozens of capital ship kills, while UNSC ships were desperately throwing themselves into plasma fire to defend those platforms, yet still, the Covenant armada eventually overran them all.
I'm sure the UNSC Trafalgar racked up some kills, or perhaps many. It's main armament consists of 2 super MAC guns (same ones as the ODP platforms), and it comes with thousands of anti-ship missiles/weaponry and has some ventral docked frigates/destroyers. And it's mobile unlike the ODPs. It probably was the MVP for most kills for the UNSC
@@jaredevans8263 That is my personal headcanon too. I enjoyed how they were the best the UNSC had to offer before utilizing forerunner and covenant technology. I wish they had a mention of it in battle, or other Punic class supercarriers. I hope we may see some in the future
@@BravoHalcyon that would be cool too. I'd love to see a list of confirmed kills for the Punic line of ships, seeing that their 2 super MACs can destroy CAS assault carriers and threaten CSO supercarriers. I'd also like some more info on their stats like weapons and ship design, like it's freaking 10 meters of Titanium A armor (twice that of UNSC Infinity's 4.9 meters of armor) and broadside mini-MACs. Trafalgar had to have taken quite the beating before going down
The Trafalgar was most likely not only smaller, but had much less weapons and didn't have a instantly deployable defensive fleet. Larger than the Epochs, but smaller than Infinity. Trafalgar most likely fought as hard as possible, and probably scored many kills against smaller CCS Battlecruisers, but was eventually overwhelmed by the CAS class Assault Carriers. Infinity I would think could manage to take on an entire fleet alone, but against many fleets, as did appear at Reach, Infinity and her escorts would be overwhelmed. If Infinity stayed at a distance and used purely it's MACs, it could most likely knock out all the CASs that appeared at the battle, including unfortunately the Shadow of Intent being included in that tally. In response more fleets, including possibly another CSO (at least 20 of the Covenant ships were much larger than the CAS class, so it's possible. I'm not including High Charity in this number because it's technically a mobile station, not a ship) to destroy the Infinity. I believe the Covenant would've stopped at nothing to glass Reach, even if they had to sacrifice the majority of their fleet to do it. Even if Infinity somehow managed to defeat the Covenant fleet above Reach AND the reinforcement CSO and escorts, the Covenant probably would've just been like: Fuck it we're going all in, and just jumped High Charity and it's fleet to the system to destroy the human ship wreaking havoc once and for all. The glassing of Reach would be even more merciless than previously (that's saying a lot), and Reach would probably end up like Meridian, completely destroyed, not a hint of human settlement left.
@@rebelgaming1.5.14 Trafalgar was 4 km long while Infinity was 5.7 km long, so it was a fair bit smaller. Trafalgar only has 2 super MACs versus Infinity's 4 super MACs, but Trafalgar still had broadside mini-MACs and 10,000+ archer missiles (not sure how many nukes though). Interestingly enough, Trafalgar had twice the amount of Titanium A armor than Infinity (10 meters vs Infinity's 4.9 meters), but Infinity's armor is likely more advanced/dense and has very powerful shields. Trafalgar has docking ports for 4 frigates/destroyers under its ventral side, but they don't dock inside the ship like Infinity's 10 frigates, but rather just on the outer surface In terms of Trafalgar's combat abilities, it should be an even match for a CAS assault carrier, mostly due to its 2 super MACs. It really depends on who shoots first. If Trafalgar can fire its MACs right away, then the CAS will go down by at least the second SMAC round, with the mini-MACs as a backup. But if the CAS catches the Trafalgar off guard or engages it from anywhere but the front, then the CAS will win since Trafalgar won't be able to turn its nose in time and all its only effective weapons at that point are its array of mini-MACs, which won't be enough against a fully shielded CAS assault carrier. It all comes down to whether Trafalgar can fire its super MAC guns. Infinity is so powerful that it can apparently take on 3-4 CAS assault carriers at once, or 1 CAS and a bunch of smaller ships at once. The only ship potentially being more powerful than Infinity is the CSO supercarrier
The Convenant really drop the hammer on Reach, like overkill levels. UNSC needed a fleet many multiple bigger to win. The Convenant would of tried to disable infinity before invasion, with a larger scout force.
This is a really good point. The covenant went all out with reach. I don't even think earth got hit quite so hard but the schism did play a role in that. I always remember Hood saying the fleet that destroyed reach was 50 times the size when regret rocked up by accident, and that fleet was enough to at least get planet side.
Reach had super Carriers and cruisers deployed, those are absurd by themselves let alone the dozens of CAS and CCS class at minimum ships the covenant just smashed reach with.
Honestly, even if the battle of reach was won, the unsc would’ve still lost reach. Truth had around 500 other ships already amassed to attack Earth. They could’ve been sent to reach after the first fleet lost. Or heck, the unsc would’ve probably abandoned reach and withdrawn all forces to earth, because they’d have recognized that the planet was no longer defensible long term.
The infinity if used correctly and not been revealed before their attack so that it wouldn’t be ambushed prob could have defeated the entire reach fleet overtime as they would either retreat or go down with the infinity, but it would just be a loss for both sides and the planet would have been destroyed regardless. No matter what is on the humans side unless it can wipe out the fleet almost instantly they almost always will lose reach regardless
That's true, even if they'd won Reach there would've been no First Strike then, which means that fleet likely gets diverted or makes it all the way to Earth. Basically the entirety of the Human Covenant war from the time the Battle of Reach starts up til the end of Halo 3 is humanity getting incredibly, insanely lucky over and over again until they win. Cortana just barely managed to get the coordinates to Halo good as Reach falls? Lucky as hell. Manages to make it to the Pillar of Autumn which JUST HAPPENS to be an experimentally refitted ship that's extremely hardy and has a new style of MAC gun that allows it to punch its way through to the ring when it gets there, AND happens to have "The Last" Spartan aboard? Lucky again. Chief survives all of the events of Halo and is able to get to the PoA and overload it, AND escape? Not to mention 343 living and creating the heretic faction, implied to be the final nail in Truth's trust in the Elites? Lucky yet again. Thel isn't killed for his failure, but instead made Arbiter against the wishes of most of the Prophets and Elites? Then goes on to become the figurehead for a massive retaliatory rebellion after Truth tries to have the elites ousted, leading to the biggest Civil War in 100,000 years? ULTRALUCKY. It's just one thing after another, and if you changed any one thing (including a VICTORY in most spots) it wouldn't have gone just as it did and humans would be toast, lol.
@@JB-xl2jc Funny enough, the Banished Grunt comms officer in Infinite mentions just how insanely lucky humans (and John in particular) are. It's almost as if there was some sort of cosmic force guiding them. Hmmm....
I've seen the argument before that the UNSC with the Infinity earlier would have had no problems with the Covenant, and any time I see that argument I'm quickly alerted to the other guy not getting how insane the Covenant are by comparison. There wasn't much the Covies couldn't obliterate. And if they didn't have constant political strife they'd be unstoppable. The Covies only lost because they played the whole game at 1% stability, to borrow from Hoi.
@@jacobrobinson787 "Politics... how tiresome." *johnson suddenly uncloaks from behind* *presses gun against back of the head* "You only say that now?!"
Exactly. As impressive as Infinity is in relationship to the rest of humanities assets, she is only on par with or marginally better than one Covenant supercarrier. She just seems more impressive because of how totally outclassed humanity was during the war.
Covenant was doomed to lose because they would have unleashed the Flood no matter what happened. The Flood was the difference that crumbled the Convenant. The true turning point of the Human-Covenant war was in the latter part of Halo 2 when High Charity and the Covenant fleet was both killing itself and getting overrun by the Flood. You are right, though, that the politics exacerbated the situation. Still, the Flood would have eventually been unleashed no matter what happened in the war.
@@volbound1700 Honestly, I don't think the flood would have gotten the chance if the Covenant were unified. It only got to spread thanks to the chaos. The covenant was fully aware of the danger of the flood and was only ignoring it because of power grabs. Sure, there were the flood-embracing fanatics, but they still only could do much due to the chaos. Hell, if the fleet of particular justice didn't have to deal with their prophet's petty power moves, the Autumn would have been obliterated before it ever sat down on the ring. It only survived as long as it did because the prophet was stopping Thel from using his capital ship weapons for most of the fight.
@@Azakadune The infinity is basically Humanities version of a CSO plus an escort fleet, One on One I would say Infinity destroys the Long Night of Solace 9 times out of 10, the problem is the fleet that comes afterwards. Could the Infinity Survive getting glassed by a CSO, I would say yes but they would get banged up, could they survive a fleet of CSOs... hell no.
I mean even the grafton shot was incredible underwhelming in halo reach, i understand it served it's purpose as it destroyed the spire, but even at the lowest power level that mac round would've just pierce straight trough the spire and created a mini nuclear explosion wherever it landed behind it. Heck even Jorge was surprised they were willing to use mac rounds in atmosphere, but then after we get the lamest explosion i have ever seen.
Considering the covenant only had one "Supercruiser" with the long-range sniping capability to outgun the ODP's, I think the fact that the Infinity would have been there would have had a cascading effect. Naturally, they would have sent it after the Infinity first, being the biggest ship (as they sent it after the Trafalgar first in the novel, which was the biggest UNSC ship in Reach's fleet and the *only* complete Punic-class Supercarrier, but I am going off of memory here so correct me if I'm wrong). So already, in phase one, you have the UNSC Trafalgar, Musashi, Herodotus, and Minotaur all saved because the ship would have targeted the infinity and found a surprise in the Infinity's energy shields, which then would have gutted it with its Super-MACs. Now you have two warships (Infinity-class and Punic-class), both with mobile Super-MACs, in play. While the Trafalgar had nowhere near the capabilities of the Infinity, it was still one of the only UNSC warships capable of a straight-up brawl with covenant warships (it had Mini-MACs like the Infinity, albeit less advanced). It also could provide a lot of cover with its complement and with the Trafalgar and the Infinity you can cover a lot more of the ODP's than just with the Infinity alone. That's not enough to completely turn the tide in the battle, but with the Infinity and the Trafalgar, I think you're looking at a significant increase in the odds of the UNSC being able to fight off the first wave of Covenant Warships (the initial 314 warships). Worst comes to worst, they could have used the Trafalgar like the three Repair and Refit Platforms to create another molten cloud of vaporized Titanium-A, to shield the majority of their ships and get off another two waves of MAC rounds from most of their fleet before the Plasma Torpedos, Energy Projectors, etc. could all punch through and wipe out that 80% of the UNSC fleet. Hell they probably could have done that with its husk in the initial novel given enough time to maneuver over to hide behind it. But we knew none of that until after the fact, of course. However... you're right in that more warships arrived after the initial 314. Depending on how many came to reinforce, and the course of the initial battle, events would probably have thereafter played out as you predict. The UNSC now has to engage in a straight fight against a second force of warships, and loses, badly. The ODP's are destroyed. At best, the Infinity can perform guerilla warfare tactics and cover retreating or evacuating ships, civilian and military alike. The one thing I would definitively disagree on is the impact of the Spartan IV's. With more Spartan assets, I think the UNSC could have been able to assign and deploy forces armed with Tactical Nuclear warheads to destroy the covenant cruisers that moved in at low-altitude to glass the massive fusion reactors for the ODP's. They may have potentially been suicide missions, but they would have had the special operations assets to expend. That would have at least kept the ODP's in play for longer. Anything else boils down to what the Covenant are willing to commit to Reach's outright annihilation. Remember, the UNSC won phyrric space victories at Chi-Rho and New Constantinople, and the Covenant never returned (that we know of) to finish those planets off later. If the UNSC beat off the first wave and manage to keep the Covenant in a state of attrition after that with their remaining assets (Active ODP's, about 30 remaining warships, and the Infinity), the Covenant may simply decide they had done enough effective damage on a strategic scale, and can worry about the rest after the fact. And even then, if the Covenant kept up their assault, the UNSC probably could have made a ground engagement a living hell for the Covenant, even with significant portions of the planet undergoing glassing, making strategic strikes with the Infinity and using it to ferry supplies in to ground forces from their last major production center on Earth.
Dang bruh only 4 likes I like the explanation. Unfortunately for the UNSC that would have been the best case scenario. I get really depressed whenever I think of the battle of reach because so many lives and ships were lost- almost in a massacre not even in a battle. RIP you fictional heroes
I didnt want to complain, but I will admit I wasnt watching your videos as religiously since it was mostly just reaction videos. I get that these videos are harder to make but I'm glad youre planning on trying to put out more of them. Just dont over work yourself!
Infinity would win easy due to the MAC rounds. Larger than the others and more numerous. First shot would overwhelm the shields and second would go through the hull. Not to mention it can do pin point jumps, so the Super Carrier couldn’t dodge out of the way if the Infinity just shows up next to it.
Acient AUrora class vs Hive. One v One she would win easily, 2 v 1 on the other hand? Nope, hard pressed. 3v1 is insta over for the infinity, she would be outgunned by them easily. Those few CSO's that where wiped out where heavily luck based. Covenant got coocky and you saw that in Halo Reach CONSTANTLY.
Ceece. Personally I don't think the Infinity would win, CSO's are about 5 times longer than the Infinity and 10 times wider. We don't really have details as to what specific weapons and defenses they have but I think it's fair to assume that the bigger the ship, the more powerful the armament, armor and shielding it carries. They could also have overlapping shields for all we know and even if you punch through one section it's not like that's gonna cripple the rest of the ship. The CSO is just ridiculously larger, I think the Infinity would lose. (unless they rigged up another slip-space bomb, but that could be used against any ship really)
Admiral Cole would’ve been a better choice compared to Keyes. He’s probably the best UNSC commander during the Human-Covenant War and having the Infinity as his flagship and would’ve given him more a tactical and strategic advantage.
Keyes would have launched every nuke the Infinity had and then it would be ALL THE RAMMINGS after the EMP burned out the Covenant shields. God bless the Keyes Loop.
@@Vincent-S nah, captain keyes and preston cole would team up, keyes with the infinity and cole taking control of the trafalgar. keyes would ran circles around the covenant ships who chased but only get close enough to run into a nucelar mine field while cole pisses the covenant off only for the pursuing alien ships run straight into moon.
The battle of reach in space is so good in the book. The heroics of the humans to try to ever so desperately hold the line gives me chills. The people on the unarmed fit and repair stations sacrificing themselves to protect the ODS for an extra few moments is so sad. Also, yeah, look at all the resources they were ok with throwing at Six. He fought for three hours, plus however long you as the player last. Sending high ranking elites, in multiple waves to kill you. They were taking Reach. No matter the cost.
Yeah the slipstream drive could have led to great hit and run but I still think they would have lost Reach, just made it a lot more painful for the covenant.
If the infinity showed up as the “cav” and hit the covenant from behind or the flanks, it might have made a difference. If it was with the original defense, it would have been targeted and taken out early. Also depends on how the Spartans were deployed, ideally they would be used for VBSS ops to scuttle or capture covenant vessels.
@@kamilpotato3764 Yes, it could. Is it a good idea? It’s better than conventional engagement, it’s space warfare’s version of guerrilla tactics. Is it effective? Depends on how the Infinity attacks after precision jumps.
Havent watched yet, but, Considering the sheer scale of the defeat at reach, I can't see how one human ship, no matter how powerful, could have made a meaningful impact.
Maybe not one massive ship, but the Infinity does have those 10 strident frigates. So technically, that’s 11 ships, all of which are upgrades from reach/ce era ships. But i agree. There’s no way the Infinity, it’s frigates, and the 20-something other ships could take down an entire covenant fleet at around 10x their numbers. And that’s just the start, there’s around 750 covenant ships that are at reach by the time it falls. So that’s around 20x their numbers. That’s just impossible for 30-40 ships to take down. And keep in mind how underpowered the UNSC ships are compared to covenant vessels. So there’s definitely no way the Infinity could help take down that massive fleet.
@@geegeetomlinson2316 I disagree. The way reach lost because of a 'Sniper cruiser' which could hit the ODP's. It would target the infinity. Get blocked by shielding. And then BAP BAP BAP BAP. 4 super macs. Its gone. Leaves the trafalgar. Infinity and 2 other massive ships to protect the ODP's. In addition. The infinity could use its spartan IV's to attack the cruisers that attempt to glass the odp generators. With those dealt with. It's 90% of the ODP platforms. And the 3 largest ships at reach. alive. then its Turkey hunting season. Put Cole or keyes in charge of the infinity. And it's even better.
Listening to the video while typing this: Versus Ideas: 1) Could modern-day humanity destroy the Long Night Of Solace? 2) Master Chief Vs Kratos 3) Protoss VS the Flood 4) Thrawn transported to Poland 1939 to help right before the invasion 5) Thrawn transported to the Forerunner-Flood war
LNOS was 28 KM long. Not much is known about it. It boasted at least 1/10 a million of troops (at least), innumerable levels of shielding, thousands of strike craft and drop ships, insertion pods, armoured vehicles, and a huge glassing beam. Could they survive against it's ground force? Possibly with strategic use of bombers and aircraft, cruise missiles and nuclear warheads with infantry used as a buffer. The Covenant have no known guided AA missiles or MANPADS. Could they survive with the ground force and it's Arial assets? Maybe, the problem lies within the quantity of aircraft and munitions productions. Their only advantage is the overwhelming amount of humans that could be used to delay the Covenant advance, and with unrivalled air dominance their two advantages are largely mitigated. The only chance they have is using their huge numerical advantage and wage a kind of guerrilla war using captured weaponry and their competitors and their comparatively crap firearms. Their modern armour like Abrams and Amarta would be easy targets for all hostiles. Technicals with HMGs would work well with this method of fighting. Humanity would have it disregard it's care for individuality for the sake of it's existence by throwing themselfs at the enemy with no chance of survival. It would be very hard, but humanity might just be able to survive. If against LNOS? No chance, none of their weaponry could dent it. It would just sit in orbit and glass the planet, case closed. Humanity might be able to take down a smaller vessel such as an SDV corvette, a ADP escort, RCS cruiser (maybe) the police cutter shippy thing, or a CCS battlecruiser (maybe) by saturating it with nuclear warheads, but the fallout may cause problems later. The debris would cause tensions as their technology is attempted to be harnessed.
For what it’s worth I’m very glad you’re kinda going back to the content you used to make. I’ve been subscribed since almost the beginning 3 something years ago and your starship versus series were the highlight of my day. So yeah thank you eck
One problem with that, Reach was already attacked before the events of Halo: Combat Evolved (1) even occurred. Thus the events of Halo 3, which occur after the events of Halo 1 would have come after the battle of Reach.
Fleet battle between Grand admiral Thrawn vs. Ender Wiggin Each one has an equal sized fleet with equally capable subordinates, and since Ender is from a different universe each has equal understanding of the technology they’re using. They are in command of Star Wars vessels. Pick a famous fleet of your choosing I’d suggest death squadron.
Is Ender really that great? He kind of struck me as someone who read Sun Tzu's "Art of War" and thinks he's a tactical genius when really he's just going up against dumb opponents. Contrast to Thrawn, who's big thing is that he profiles his opponents and actually predicts what they're going to do, it's clear Thrawn would win. Now real battle: Thrawn vs. Joseph Jostar
That would be interesting as for ender their(there) is no valid reason to assume that the Star Wars universe doesn’t exist in the form of movies,cartoons,comics,Etc,Etc so ender would in my opinion if he watched and read them have an advantage. While it’s true that we technically never have a definitive answer on if earth could truly exist in the Star Wars universe so thrawn in terms of knowledge of his opponent would be at a disadvantage even ender doesn’t have knowledge of thrawn he still has knowledge of the technology. Both are known to be extremely capable military leaders, more specifically as admirals with very impressive tactical minds to say the least and very impressive victories. But I personally feel that ender would triumph. based on one thing thrawn had always to some degree knew his opponent and how his opponent would think in someway or form most often culturally through Art,teachings,Etc he had this knowledge because of how interconnected the Star Wars universe is. Ender never had this advantage he always had to rely on both himself and his subordinates never had prior knowledge, always on himself, not to mention winning an impossible battle that thrawn would never have won without a TON of ships(with dreadnoughts,star destroyers,Etc,Etc) and a lot of losses. Yes one could argue that ender knew about the pattern in how the drones fly and fight, but that is null and void with how out numbered ender was in most engagements(if I remember correctly). So in my PERSONAL opinion Andrew “Ender” Wiggin is the superior admiral and might I add he won all his victories as A CHILD with TONS of room to gain knowledge in the form of battle strategy,Tactics,Etc,Etc whereas thrawn was an adult for most of his military accomplishments. But this is one man’s opinion, other may differ and so be it, as long as you don’t behave like a child and yell at me, and give your reasons then so be it.
@@battlesheep2552 lol you clearly never saw or read the books and movie while I admit I don’t remember much from the book(s) I do know that more often then not ender was and is a humble kid, and he actually on multiple occasions proved his tactical mind I mean I try not to be biased, but come on your extremely biased and saying how he came off as and not from an actual overview/comparison, sort of like I did from what I know and remember from both universes.
Take into account that the commander of the Reach Invasion was Thel Vadam too. If nothing else, he'd personally ensure the destruction of the Infinity with superior strategy, at least on par with humanity's best tacticians. And this is during a time that humans expected the Covenant to be limited by dogma, when Thel had no such limits.
Very up for this, I miss you covering non Star Wars/Halo stuff as well. I understand you have a kid and it's easy to fall back on what you know but it really breaks up the content by changing things up. Plus the channel is "Star Wars, Halo and More" and I think the "AND MORE" stuff has been absent a while now
"The Infinity is basically a mobile orbital platform". I wonder if they started shielding the orbital platforms and their reactors after Infinitiy's completion.
Galactic Versus is one of the best series on youtube. Most channels that have long form videos that I'm subscribed to, pad their uploads with shorter and easier to make videos. I think you would see more retention if you were able to do something similar. I love your content, keep up the great work!
Ship vs. unsc pillar of autumn Vs nx-01 enterprise. I think it would be interesting because they are both human ships, unshielded and both helped save humanity.
It'd probably depend on the relative speed and maneuverability of the two ships. While the NX-01 Enterprise has a handful of energy weapons and can use the transporter to send over boarding parties, the Pillar of Autumn has a lot more weapons and a MAC, so the Enterprise would have to do a lot of dodging while it wears down the Pillar of Autumn.
Pillar of Autumn no doubt, it's got the NX-01 beat many times over just by sheer tonnage. Let's not forget that Star Trek ships have terrible range, so the Autumn could easily snipe it from a safe distance with it's MAC
@@battlesheep2552 the NX classes impulse is from memory about 20% of the speed of light, since Mac's are only around 4% of the speed of light, the enterprise could be difficult to hit. But maybe with cortana they could.
EVERY Spartan IS several hundred. There's probably 2-3 dozen of active Spartan IIs and a handful of Spartan IIIs left alive. And Spartan IV is a relatively new program with maybe several hundred. So yeah, there's probably not more than 1000 active Spartans currently
Just do a rehash/updates series about the entire history of halo universe, starting from earlier. Call it a revisited, something that incorporates new books/lore and then at the end of each episode give your impression of the themes/thoughts of the authors and why the story is how it is. Boom, 30+ hours of content
Glad to see old Eck back! On the video itself: Reach was so stacked against the UNSC that would have been a risk to deploy the Infinity. If present the only achievement would have been having even a greater proportion of the Covenant fleet being deployed there to deal with her
Nice to see a return to these Versus episodes XD For a Faction Versus suggestion: The Zerg Swarm (Starcraft) vs. the Yuzhan Vong (Star Wars). Battle of the organitech armies!
The one issue is that the Zerg would win in the end because of the extreme ease that they can evolve and adapt to what is needed. A few bits of organic material is all that's needed to provoke an evolution, and a few tens or hundreds of dead Yuzhan Vong would be the end. The ammount of Zerglings alone that would be sacrificed would be HUGE, but totally worth it to any of the leaders the Zerg had. The only real difference would be if the OG Overmind, Kerrigan, or Zegara was in charge to set a time scale for the inevitable win. If you put Kerrigan in charge, then even the organic weapons and other organitech stuff would fall pretty easy as she knows the value more so then the other 2 that any tech has a value and purpose. And her psionic powers are scary af in the lore( not game play wise as that had to be toned down for balance).
@@x0Tassadar0x So, I agree that the Zerg definitely come out on top in a drawn out war, but I think this would still make for an interesting match-up. For one, we know that the Vong have gotten pretty adept at subjugating other species and incorporating them into their army. The big question is, Could they figure out a way to subjugate the Zerg before they are overwhelmed? Again, I don't think they could reasonably DO this, but I do think there could be a lot of interesting stuff going on in a conflict like this. Like imagine if some of the Vong start outright DEFECTING to the Zerg? Seeing them as a kind of ideal existence.
I’m gonna point out that in one of the halo books, the infinity popping out above sanghelios scared the shit out of sangheli rebels. That’s how big it is. These elites have been seeing big shit for a while, but it was so big it was scary
I’m super here for the roots, good to have it back lol. As for the video I never truly knew just how huge the fight for reach really was, and damn I completely agree that you’d need 10 infinities to really even it out and even then it’s still a Herculean effort for those ships. Even with 10, you’re just one tactical misstep away from losing the whole planet
Thanks for your analyst. My memory has me believing that Reach was caught with their pants down and Reach could have push the convent back. It made reach a trajected story.
Coming back to this after Halo Infinite is pretty crazy, considering we saw the most powerful ship ever made by the UNSC get destroyed in a cutscene by a fleet that we dont even know about.
@@horrificpleasantry9474 Well the fandom was bitching for years about how the Infinity didn't make sense and didn't fit the tone of Halo, I'm not really surprised that 343 decided to blow it up. And of course, the fans still whine when they get exactly what they want. Sad little Halo fans.
@@horrificpleasantry9474 I don't know what parts of the fandom you been hangin out in, but I couldn't find a single chatroom that wasn't full of crybabies whining "Halo's not supposed to be like this! The UNSC is supposed to be struggling to survive, not flying around in super ships with armies of Spartans! I want to Infinity destroyed! I want all the new Spartan's dead! I want the UNSC to burn to the ground! WAAAAAAHHHH!!!!!"
Also to you @EckhartsLadder at 1:00 you mentioned the trade off of more quality content which I am SO HAPPY you went with the choice for. Your growth has been amazing, and while I AM STILL FOR SOME REASON NOT SUBSCRIBED I have been watching your videos since 2019 which is far now just wow. Anyways I wanted to say thank you/congrats on your choice. I hope your battle against the OrangePeople or whoever they are goes well, because your videos do have a special place in my heart.
I think that the infinity would've been handy had chief been leading those spartan 4s into the fight, gotten creative and started boarding tactics like they did in reach that one time, maybe turn the tide a little bit, honestly the real power of the infinity isn't just the mac guns, though they're quite a nice "hi how you doin" the spartans are the real life o' the party ;)
Good to hear the channel is returning to its roots. I've watched since Galactica v Imperial Star Destroyer and was honestly finding myself skipping alot of vids lately.
Once the covenant found reach the planet was doomed. Even if the infinity fought off wave after wave of ships, the Prophets would have sent that massive Fleet escorting high charity that we saw during the mission regret in Halo 2. The turning point of the war was when the elites switched sides. Humanity was going to lose the war till then.
As terrifying as that thought is, that wouldn't have happened. The Prophets were paranoid to extreme degrees; even when Ripa Mora'mee declared he'd take "what we have" when he was speaking with Regret about the war, Regret immediately shot the idea down because by doing so it would've left them defenseless. After all, there was still the Flood out there and all it would take was one flood spore to end centuries of work. No, they'd just send more ships...but they would not send High Charity's fleet after Reach.
@@jacobrobinson787 then why did they plan to send it to earth after they found out it was humanity's home? Reach would have fallen regardless, 10 infinitys could not halt the covenants momentum.
Hey, Justin. Don’t blame yourself for lack of channels views because of lack of lore, versus and legends content. Star Wars lately has been active with The Bad Batch, Visions and more news content, not to mention Halo Infinite news to the point you won’t focus on the true heart of the channels content. So we are now glad to see this channel going back to normal, until next month of course with Visions.
He's basically already done this with I think Delta squad from commandoes vs Noble. Commandoes and the bad batch just can't match up to a spartan, physically, mentally, experience, or any way. Noble team wins.
@@ADR1fley That's why I wonder about The Batch. They don't have as much genetic changes as a Spartan, sure, but they have such specific mutations that also compliment each other, along with cutting edge armor and weapons, similar to Noble Team
@@Luchmun3 The Bad batch aren't much better than commandos, that can even be seen with the episode with Scorch. They're not good enough to go up against Spartans is my point, it would be a waste in my opinion, to make that video
The problem of the infinity is the constant incompetence of the captain XD first mission, it crashed on requiem, second mission, destroyed in 4 minutes. Why was Lasky still there?
Lasky wasn't the capt of the ship until the last mission of halo 4. It was CAPT Del Rio. The ship was pulled into the planet just like how all the ships at the beginning of the game. Yea it was nuts that they did what they did to it. i hope they have some DLC that they relese that we get to see the ship again because you cant just kill it like that never to be seen again right
IN SUMMARY, Del Rio erred on the side of following prior orders and not taking unknown strategic risks. His choices were correct when seen from a certain perspective, but he could've done better if he had been willing to reinterpret his mission. ✔️ Sending out recon was not ill advised, that's like criticizing the US for having military operations in Mexico and the middle east at the same time. Infinity is huge, with tens of thousands of personnel. The fighting was only in one place and not affecting most of the ship. Doesn't make sense to ground the entire Navy because there's action in one location ✔️ Not having done a terrain assessment of the route to the door lock (I forget what they call it) is reasonable since the conditions have changed. Now infinity isn't grounded and anybody who's out can be left behind, so all hands need to be on board because they're not waiting to leave, lest it risk the infinity getting trapped again. ✔️ Wanting to leave quickly is following orders you report back. Remember the planet is preventing long distance communication so they need to leave or no one's going to know what's happening. If they then take on the Didact and lose, humanity will be unprotected and unaware of the danger 🚫 He could've sent a frigate to report back and kept the infinity to support the chief. This was really his only error, and results from his rigid rule following and inability to adapt ✔️ he was correct that cortana was a risk. However, she can't affect chiefs suit directly to shut him down, just the shield afaik, so there was less risk in letting her be with chief. A conciliatory response would be to order chief to turn cortana over after getting back to earth whereafter she could be fixed by Halsey perhaps. He could not have foreseen that cortana would be the one to stop the Didact. But he wasn't required to be conciliatory. These regulations about ai are not arbitrary. 🚫 Really besides the lack of adaptivity, his temper is really the only thing against him, which doesn't in and of itself make him a bad leader as far as leadership decisions go. Morale, yes. In summary, he did nothing wrong, but could've done better, if he had been less rigid about following orders to the letter.
@@horrificpleasantry9474 all this is fax. didnt get why chief asked for the terrain assessment. he doesnt seem like a guy that lets little stuff bother him i mean unno like teleporting right next to keyes. maybe you could explain what that is?
@@horrificpleasantry9474 so if Keyes is captured theoretically he would be guarded right? Probably not the best example but yeah he usually just charges in or plans beforehand ie truth and reconciliation not last second.
I think the Infinity would’ve helped in some defense, but the ship would’ve been overwhelmed by sheer numbers. Even Lord Hood stated the fleet that attack Reach was much larger than the fleet that attacked Earth with the defense force having a tough time holding back the smaller armada.
The Fall of Reach felt like going against a Master in chess who always let you get away with tactics, until you get cocky, provoking them to actually try. Leaving you defeated with nothing but an empty board.
I don’t know if you’ll ever see this but to be honest I haven’t been watching for a long time for the reasons you listed so to hear your going to return to your previous works and that it’s your decision and not views or what not makes me very happy. Don’t worry about upload times, if you make something you like, we will too
Thel Vadamee and Rtas Vadum with the Fleet of Particular Justice vs. Anakin and Ahsoka with the 501. The tip of the spear for both factions, who would come out on top???
Correction! The Covenant ship that the Infinity rammed in Halo 4 is an RCS Armored Cruiser. It is slightly larger than the CCS-class Battlecruiser, but is somewhat outdated according to the Covenant standards. Overall, it's a great video and I am really happy to see you cover Halo content again, Eck! Anyway, I hope you have a great day. Remember to stay safe and healthy, buddy!
I'd still say it depends on how it's used and how it coordinates with other forces. Aside from it's 10 frigates it's also taking a ton of pressure off other UNSC ships which gives them openings to exploit. Even if it goes down you can bet most of the UNSC fleet and orbital platforms will still be intact and it's ground forces are quite substantial. IMO, with 1 Infinity it's about 20% chance of victory. 5% is just not accounting for the increased effectiveness of other units. 3 or 4 Infinities would probably actually mean there's an expectation of victory. 4 Infinities means 40 Strident frigates and enough ground forces to make a Covie ground victory very unlikely which means fighting each orbital platform head on.
If for instance the Infinity arrived during the Covenant's attack on the orbital defenses by itself, they may not have known if it was friend or foe since they may have identified it as Forerunner. If they did do so, and it started firing at them and then too up a position alongside the human fleet, it may have caused the Covenant to fall back and regroup so they could figure out why a Forerunner ship had chosen to take sides with the Humans. If they come to the conclusion that Humans were piloting the craft, they would then have to wrestle with why the Forerunners provided them with what appears to be a brand new ship.
I'm glad you're going back to galactic versus. That is what got me subscribed several tears ago. I've missed your coverage of other Scofield universes. This is great news
Been ridin aboard Eckhart's Cruiser for about 4 years now, seen all sorts come and go. Twileks, the Flood, Clone Troopers, a poor bastard eternally tortured by the ultimate intelligence, some other freaky stuff I don't mention in polite company and a whole helluva lot of insight and analysis about other ships or the battles they fought in. All along I can't say there's a video I've ever disliked, not that there weren't things I might disagree with (Halbreds > Victory SDs), but every time I've watched somethin I enjoyed it. Whatever makes you happy man makes me happy, just keep it coming for as long as you're willing and know that even after I'll still be comin back to settle disputes, find answers, or research for my writing.
The shift in focus for the channel sounds good. These kinds of videos are your strength, and if the cost is a few reaction videos, so be it. And I 100% agree with you in this video. The Infinity would have pushed the price for the Covenant MUCH higher, but Reach was dead.
Upvoting for more long-form of these type! I used to watch everything often and repeatedly. Pretty much stopped about a year and a half ago with all the reaction stuff. This vid was an unexpected joy ^.^
The redirecting of your videos back to what you used to do will be rather nice. When it comes to comparing/contrasting factions/characters/ships in Star Wars and other media I think your extensive knowledge of lesser known EU Legends material will really help you stand out from other RUclipsrs. Like adding lesser known factions like from the Black Fleet Crisis as an example, to your factions vs videos could really freshen things up. :)
*SPOILER DO NOT READ IF YOU HAVE NOT PLAYED OR SEEN HALO INFINITE GAMEPLAY* the infinity crumbled againts 3 banished warships it lasted a total of 4 minutes and i cant believe, they did the exact same tactic that the infinity did with that CCS cruiser by ramming it oh well
Eck first of all fantastic video per usual. Second whatever kind of content you create whether it’s news and reactions or your classic starship versus, galaxy versus or lore, I’m here for it man keep up the amazing work and I’ll keep watching it.
"its still just one ship" what about the 10 smaller frigates it has ready to launch? (those are post war ships so probably better then what reach had) oh and depending on when you take it, the Infinity may have some Anlace-class frigates on board instead. (Electronic warfare frigates which can literally jam an entire planets signals)
I think in that case, you could say "it's still just 10 or so ships". The covenant fleet at reach was big enough, and each individual ship is superior enough to human ships, that ultimately I still don't think it would make a big enough difference.
@@tamaranck5558 The infinity and it frigates were better made then any covi ships, they had a brand new armor and forerunner shielding whish are a lot stronger then covenant shield.
@@angerskarin9222 We only ever see the Infinity fight, well, crash into a single COV ship, which itself was massively outdated and religated to border patrol. The CRS was smaller than a Paris, Stalwart or Charon for crying out loud
@@HexAyed Well, we also have the Infinity's shields tanking a supernova at the end of Halo 4 Spartan Ops. The calculations from that are, frankly, insane. I definitely wouldn't advocate using that scene for anything other than extremely high-end and not-serious-at-all calcs for Infinity's shields though, as taking them at face value would pretty much make the ship invincible and cause a host of other problems plot and lore-wise bad enough to break the entire narrative setting.
@@wallend4013 Ah I never finished Spartan Ops, Still, I feel that Infinity wouldn't have done *that* much, As soon as they discovered the LNofS they would have pulled Infinity back to Earth imo
The covenant almost never changed there tactics though. And when they did it was for a certain goal. Having never faced or known about infinity they would have stuck with brute force or still tried to sneak past. This would have been the first time they would have come up against something better then there's and they would attack as if it wasn't. I think the battle would swing in the UNSC favor until infinity ran out of Mac shells. Even then they could ram ships of the shields held. Not to mention the huragok the infinity had on board to repair. The kilo book series goes into it a little.
Actually, they were. Tactically speaking that is why ONI wanted Thel'Vadam dead. He was a prodigy and even the bloody prophets feared him and his fleets were known for inflicting staggering losses even by covenant standards. Thel was there for Reach and that is the other wild card. Infinity would not have gone noticed. Unlike many of the elites, he respected humanity and was not arrogant about what they could do. I would suspect he would suspend landing operations and call in his reserves and crush the current era unsc ships and infinity plus its supports could be facing a fight where they are outnumbered by more than 20 to 1. Infinity would get ground down and her support ships would not last long under that kind of firepower.
@@kamilpotato3764 Again it comes down to resources. Infinity is not the only ship that can pinpoint jump. There is also likely a massive power drain from the point that and eventually, if you have to pull off a hundred or two hundred of these the ship is going to run into issues. It is an X factor but it is not a finger of god and eventually, regardless Infinity will run out of ammo. At that point, it can bunny hop all it wants. Reach will still be gone. The UNSC will be left with 1 ship that has any hope of holding the covenant at bay and eventually it will be forced into holding Earth. At that point, it does not matter. At that point, you have basically lost your entire military-industrial complex. You have lost most of the navy chain of command. And you are running out of resources in the Sol system. You only have so many bullets left to shoot. Infinity is not going to fix that. too many people have the hero/savior complex from watching too much TV and playing too many games. One person nor a ship does not win a war. Even Chief was not self-made. He was not one person fighting the whole war. Hundred to thousands of spartan 2's and 3's were lost. Millions of service personnel were lost. To frankly eke out a pyrrhic victory. Infinity is not changing that nor is a dozen Infinities. The reality is humanity won this by plot armor because "humans win". The reality is Reach the level of strategic victory was so high Infinity did not matter. The battle of Earth the same thing was happening. Humanity had like a dozen ships by Halo hiding (I think) in the Jovian system. Twelve more is not stopping that be they Infinities class or not.
I honestly think the Covenant only kept tactics because they worked. Humanity was not a peer opponent in anyway, and the covenant was basically left to do away with human colonies as they saw fit, and in fact reading silent storm, a silent shadow made a deal with the insurrectionists. To have them help find covenant worlds certainly deviating from covenant tactics, and these same rebels gave him a havok. To which he said would be inspected to help their ships be better prepared. In this same book the II's are apart of a stealth flotilla having boarded a covenant ship and it self-destructed. Know what the fleetmaster did when glassing Biko? They adopted a tighter knit formation with fighters patrolling among the fleet. Seemingly aware of the dangerous boarding tactics of the humans.
@@OpticBeatz Covenant were slow to adapt. I still think if humans had few more years and their ability to retrofit covenant and forerunner technology(shields etc) would stand better chance. Maybe more Nova bombs sneaked into covenant worlds, flotillas?
Definitely agree with your analysis Eck. Video content hasn’t been bad lately, I found myself loving the Bad Batch vids, however I do find myself going back 2 or 3 years on your channels just to learn more about Star Wars lore. I would love a combination of both these types of content personally
I very much appreciate you trying to stick with your roots. A lot of people think their channel's survival depends on changing but it seems to me that, that leads to losing large amounts of loyal viewer base for a small amount of one time viewers.
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Drop a like for better videos lol
how does this get better?!?!
So you are saying if I drop the like, I would be expecting to see some more Fallout New Vegas content?
saw a video...do not know be whome. But not long ago. He did the calculation ( think it might be a halo channel) about how strong macs are. And he calculated that the infinity macs where stronger as orbital macs.
Installation00 has a video about it.
I want to see Halo vs Mass Effect. :) For example, What would it take to Indoctrinate a Grave Mind and turn it into a husk?
I like this move for your channel, hopefully it dose well with the algorithm
Seeing the infinity on human side, the covenant would mistakenly think that forerunners are on human side
more accurately, they would think humanity had a forerunner destroyer, and would collectively wet there pants in terror
@@electrohalo8798 Shipmaster: Then it is an even fig… wait where are you all going?
@@enhanceddeath Ship Master, it seems we're royally fucked
Their entire religious beliefs would crumble, seeing humans and forerunners fighting together
@@enzo-gg2sr unlikely the Covenant have seen Humans interact with Forerunner technology and they’ve only ever viewed it has humans Heresy. Example: Halo wars when professor Anders easily accessed a Forerunner map. The Infinty would be viewed as no different.
Nothing beats the good"ol big stick guns throwing sticks at .25 of light speed. It maybe primitive, but effective against these religious boogaloos thinking the rings are some sacred temple
All contemporary weapons are an evolution upon the first true weapon: rock
@@mullerpotgieter i mean if moon sized rock hits religious boogaloos they will sure as hell take more damage than from those tungsten sticks right? Thus rock is still superior
It's very kind of the Unsc to help them out in their quest to meet God sooner like they want.
@@harryforrest6347 yeah, basically
Given a choice between kinetic vs. energy, I’ll take kinetic all day long!
Infinity at the beginning of Halo 4 would have been a detriment to Reach's defense. Del Rio was still Captain at that time
I hated him so much. He was so incompetent that I wonder how he not only managed to survive the Human-Covenant War but how he became captain of the pride of the UNSC Navy. He was just there to add unnecessary drama until the game literally told you, "Yeah, he isn't in the story now."
Hahahahaha
@@yorecf9641 I think ONI chief Parangosky wanted him as captain since he was so unremarkable no one would really care if he “disappeared” in order to maintain the Infinitity’s secrecy but then have Lasky, someone who she actually appproves, ready to take over when sh$& got real.
@@WingsaberE3 sadly, that still came at the cost of having one of the most infuriating characters in the game series and it still meant that the ship was at risk if he wasn’t relieved or killed before things got real. Also, it’s not like ONI hasn’t faked the deaths of personnel for special projects before, like Kurt for the Spartan III program.
ONI working behind the curtain has always been used to explain away stuff but I like the idea that Del Rio was easy to manipulate and control. We see this in Hunt the truth but with how halo 5 turned out Hunt the truth might as well have never happened
SO....that all being said, now let's ask the REAL question: what would it have took to realistically defend Reach?
If reach had the same number of orbital mac platforms that Earth had, (totaling around 300 or so) i think reach would have been fine with or without the infinity. Reach only had about 20 platforms in canon. If they'd had even just 100 platforms i think the covenant still may have lost
A much bigger fleet + orbital defence grid. Given that the fleet hat destroyed reach outnumbered the UNSC forces significantly, and it took several times the covenants fleet size to destroy a covenant ship, the fleet would have to number I'm the thousands to have a shot at defeating the covenant. But if the UNSC had access to that kind of fleet then they wouldn't have been pushed to this point in the first place.
@@hands6670 ,
I'm ignorant of Halo Lore... so I need to ask, how much did each of those platforms cost (price, material, and personal, and time to build)? How much defense did the planet deserve based on its importance to the war/USNC?
For starters more mac platforms like earth scale. Teams of Spartans IIs and IIIs guarding key facilities. Along with at least one army supporting each region. At minimum 100 times the ships. A fleet of pillar of autumn special Marathons. A hand full of infinity style capital ships.
Basically due to the Cole protocol assists would have to be diverted to destroying crippled ships during the invasion. Hence why blue team never made landfall during the reach invasion. So with that said humanity could really only fight at 80-90% full strength. With reach being the last strong hold before earth. Everything depends on the Covies not finding earth and saving reach.
Plus we are talking a whole planet. Covies could easily slip jump to any corner of the planet and continue a cat and dog fight against the humans as they poke and prod the MACs in orbit. The UNSC would be worn thin even with all their ships they had left. I don't think reach could ever not fall. Maybe if it was the first planet the Covies tried to glass. And humanity had every ship. But I doubt it.
@@aralornwolf3140 not sure the cost, but like someone said earlier reach only had maybe 20 platforms planet wide. Earth had 300 and the Covies still managed to make land fall on Earth.
To answer your other question, I think Reach and Earth were the only planets to have MAC platforms. Earth being Earth it got the best of the best for defense. But Reach was the closet military fortress to Earth so it also had MACs. And at that I think Reach had older versions. Their power came from massive generators planet side. Where as Earth's seemed to be self sustaining.
Orbital MACs seemed to be a new thing during the human Covie war. As Johnson said when he shipped out for basic the Orbital platforms were just barely getting to the drawing board.
So my guess is Reach got the first generation (prototypes) of MACs then after they built those Earth got the newer, better versions with less flaws. Cuz if I remember correctly Reach's MACs took a while to reload. Maybe a minute or so. Where as In halo 2 we see the Earth MACs firing every 20 seconds or less.
During the construction of Earth's I think is when the covenant first started to become a threat. Wiping out worlds. So the Earth Gov probably dumped most of it's funds into building as many Orbital MACs as it could. That's why Earth has 300 compared to Reach's 20 prototypes. And since Reach was Military based planet they probably moved all their funds to supporting the offensive war effort such as ships and Spartans and troops. Rather than its own Defense platforms.
Granted this is all headcanon from reading the books. If anyone would like to correct me please do so
10 Infinity class carriers would also combined bring a fleet of 100 Strident class frigates. That is a serious amount of firepower
That is out of the realm of possibility, since there are less than 5 Infinity-class carriers in the established lore.
I think the Infinity could change the tide, with its 10 frigates (all of which are far stronger then those made during the war) it would be able to protect critical areas better and potentially prevent the orbital cannons from being disabled, which was the reason Reach fell, with those cannons still active reach would stand a much better chance. (lets be kind and add the UNSC Eternity to the mix assuming it has the same capabilities and a capable commander, then the Covenent would not stand a chance)
@@admiralwullfyularen6225 my point stands.
@@admiralwullfyularen6225 the minute the UNSC truly tested and found out how op the infinity was you bet your ass they started building more than 2.
@@admiralwullfyularen6225 that got solved by the discovery of onyx and it’s hyrogok, now the unsc has basically forerunner construction machines to build the more complicated parts like the power plant/engines. They are how the infinity was able to get pinpoint slipspace capabilities.
In Halo: First Strike, it is mentioned that the last operational UNSC Supercarrier of the time- the UNSC Trafalgar, participated in and was destroyed at the Fall of Reach, without greatly affecting the outcome. Yes, it didn't have shields like the Infinity, but it still represented how the best of the UNSC fleet was already throwing itself at Reach's defense and yet still did little to even slow the advance. It is also stated in the FoR novel that the ODPs managed dozens of capital ship kills, while UNSC ships were desperately throwing themselves into plasma fire to defend those platforms, yet still, the Covenant armada eventually overran them all.
I'm sure the UNSC Trafalgar racked up some kills, or perhaps many. It's main armament consists of 2 super MAC guns (same ones as the ODP platforms), and it comes with thousands of anti-ship missiles/weaponry and has some ventral docked frigates/destroyers. And it's mobile unlike the ODPs. It probably was the MVP for most kills for the UNSC
@@jaredevans8263 That is my personal headcanon too. I enjoyed how they were the best the UNSC had to offer before utilizing forerunner and covenant technology. I wish they had a mention of it in battle, or other Punic class supercarriers. I hope we may see some in the future
@@BravoHalcyon that would be cool too. I'd love to see a list of confirmed kills for the Punic line of ships, seeing that their 2 super MACs can destroy CAS assault carriers and threaten CSO supercarriers. I'd also like some more info on their stats like weapons and ship design, like it's freaking 10 meters of Titanium A armor (twice that of UNSC Infinity's 4.9 meters of armor) and broadside mini-MACs. Trafalgar had to have taken quite the beating before going down
The Trafalgar was most likely not only smaller, but had much less weapons and didn't have a instantly deployable defensive fleet. Larger than the Epochs, but smaller than Infinity. Trafalgar most likely fought as hard as possible, and probably scored many kills against smaller CCS Battlecruisers, but was eventually overwhelmed by the CAS class Assault Carriers. Infinity I would think could manage to take on an entire fleet alone, but against many fleets, as did appear at Reach, Infinity and her escorts would be overwhelmed. If Infinity stayed at a distance and used purely it's MACs, it could most likely knock out all the CASs that appeared at the battle, including unfortunately the Shadow of Intent being included in that tally. In response more fleets, including possibly another CSO (at least 20 of the Covenant ships were much larger than the CAS class, so it's possible. I'm not including High Charity in this number because it's technically a mobile station, not a ship) to destroy the Infinity. I believe the Covenant would've stopped at nothing to glass Reach, even if they had to sacrifice the majority of their fleet to do it. Even if Infinity somehow managed to defeat the Covenant fleet above Reach AND the reinforcement CSO and escorts, the Covenant probably would've just been like: Fuck it we're going all in, and just jumped High Charity and it's fleet to the system to destroy the human ship wreaking havoc once and for all. The glassing of Reach would be even more merciless than previously (that's saying a lot), and Reach would probably end up like Meridian, completely destroyed, not a hint of human settlement left.
@@rebelgaming1.5.14 Trafalgar was 4 km long while Infinity was 5.7 km long, so it was a fair bit smaller. Trafalgar only has 2 super MACs versus Infinity's 4 super MACs, but Trafalgar still had broadside mini-MACs and 10,000+ archer missiles (not sure how many nukes though). Interestingly enough, Trafalgar had twice the amount of Titanium A armor than Infinity (10 meters vs Infinity's 4.9 meters), but Infinity's armor is likely more advanced/dense and has very powerful shields. Trafalgar has docking ports for 4 frigates/destroyers under its ventral side, but they don't dock inside the ship like Infinity's 10 frigates, but rather just on the outer surface
In terms of Trafalgar's combat abilities, it should be an even match for a CAS assault carrier, mostly due to its 2 super MACs. It really depends on who shoots first. If Trafalgar can fire its MACs right away, then the CAS will go down by at least the second SMAC round, with the mini-MACs as a backup. But if the CAS catches the Trafalgar off guard or engages it from anywhere but the front, then the CAS will win since Trafalgar won't be able to turn its nose in time and all its only effective weapons at that point are its array of mini-MACs, which won't be enough against a fully shielded CAS assault carrier. It all comes down to whether Trafalgar can fire its super MAC guns.
Infinity is so powerful that it can apparently take on 3-4 CAS assault carriers at once, or 1 CAS and a bunch of smaller ships at once. The only ship potentially being more powerful than Infinity is the CSO supercarrier
The Convenant really drop the hammer on Reach, like overkill levels. UNSC needed a fleet many multiple bigger to win. The Convenant would of tried to disable infinity before invasion, with a larger scout force.
This is a really good point. The covenant went all out with reach. I don't even think earth got hit quite so hard but the schism did play a role in that. I always remember Hood saying the fleet that destroyed reach was 50 times the size when regret rocked up by accident, and that fleet was enough to at least get planet side.
Reach had super Carriers and cruisers deployed, those are absurd by themselves let alone the dozens of CAS and CCS class at minimum ships the covenant just smashed reach with.
The Unsc still managed to give them a hard time even though they were outnumber and managed to wipe out a entire CSO super carrier with a nova bomb
@@RalseiSmokerOfBlunts it was a slipspace drive converted into a bomb.
@@Blockhead2 exactly
The Scariest thing about this fleet is that the fleet that defends High Charity is multiple times bigger that even this one.
And yet all it took to destroy was a small flood spore. 😂😂
@@joshualighttime604 Well not really since the great schism did the heavy lifting there.
@Isaiah yeah true, but even with that the flood just spreads so quickly.
@@joshualighttime604The flood only got on board because the grave mind teleported past the fleet directly into High Charity.
@@Kclanks gravemind is the flood so
Honestly, even if the battle of reach was won, the unsc would’ve still lost reach. Truth had around 500 other ships already amassed to attack Earth. They could’ve been sent to reach after the first fleet lost. Or heck, the unsc would’ve probably abandoned reach and withdrawn all forces to earth, because they’d have recognized that the planet was no longer defensible long term.
The infinity if used correctly and not been revealed before their attack so that it wouldn’t be ambushed prob could have defeated the entire reach fleet overtime as they would either retreat or go down with the infinity, but it would just be a loss for both sides and the planet would have been destroyed regardless. No matter what is on the humans side unless it can wipe out the fleet almost instantly they almost always will lose reach regardless
That's true, even if they'd won Reach there would've been no First Strike then, which means that fleet likely gets diverted or makes it all the way to Earth.
Basically the entirety of the Human Covenant war from the time the Battle of Reach starts up til the end of Halo 3 is humanity getting incredibly, insanely lucky over and over again until they win. Cortana just barely managed to get the coordinates to Halo good as Reach falls? Lucky as hell. Manages to make it to the Pillar of Autumn which JUST HAPPENS to be an experimentally refitted ship that's extremely hardy and has a new style of MAC gun that allows it to punch its way through to the ring when it gets there, AND happens to have "The Last" Spartan aboard? Lucky again. Chief survives all of the events of Halo and is able to get to the PoA and overload it, AND escape? Not to mention 343 living and creating the heretic faction, implied to be the final nail in Truth's trust in the Elites? Lucky yet again. Thel isn't killed for his failure, but instead made Arbiter against the wishes of most of the Prophets and Elites? Then goes on to become the figurehead for a massive retaliatory rebellion after Truth tries to have the elites ousted, leading to the biggest Civil War in 100,000 years? ULTRALUCKY. It's just one thing after another, and if you changed any one thing (including a VICTORY in most spots) it wouldn't have gone just as it did and humans would be toast, lol.
@@JB-xl2jc Funny enough, the Banished Grunt comms officer in Infinite mentions just how insanely lucky humans (and John in particular) are. It's almost as if there was some sort of cosmic force guiding them. Hmmm....
@@ladygrey7425 Cortana: "May the force be with you."
Chief:"What?"
Cortana: "What?"
I thought the Covenant didn't know about Earth? In Halo 2, didn't they stumble on it by complete accident not knowing it was humanity's home?
I've seen the argument before that the UNSC with the Infinity earlier would have had no problems with the Covenant, and any time I see that argument I'm quickly alerted to the other guy not getting how insane the Covenant are by comparison.
There wasn't much the Covies couldn't obliterate. And if they didn't have constant political strife they'd be unstoppable. The Covies only lost because they played the whole game at 1% stability, to borrow from Hoi.
True enough. Had the Prophets not decided to play politics, Humanity would've been a goner.
@@jacobrobinson787 "Politics... how tiresome."
*johnson suddenly uncloaks from behind*
*presses gun against back of the head*
"You only say that now?!"
Exactly. As impressive as Infinity is in relationship to the rest of humanities assets, she is only on par with or marginally better than one Covenant supercarrier. She just seems more impressive because of how totally outclassed humanity was during the war.
Covenant was doomed to lose because they would have unleashed the Flood no matter what happened. The Flood was the difference that crumbled the Convenant. The true turning point of the Human-Covenant war was in the latter part of Halo 2 when High Charity and the Covenant fleet was both killing itself and getting overrun by the Flood. You are right, though, that the politics exacerbated the situation. Still, the Flood would have eventually been unleashed no matter what happened in the war.
@@volbound1700 Honestly, I don't think the flood would have gotten the chance if the Covenant were unified. It only got to spread thanks to the chaos. The covenant was fully aware of the danger of the flood and was only ignoring it because of power grabs. Sure, there were the flood-embracing fanatics, but they still only could do much due to the chaos.
Hell, if the fleet of particular justice didn't have to deal with their prophet's petty power moves, the Autumn would have been obliterated before it ever sat down on the ring. It only survived as long as it did because the prophet was stopping Thel from using his capital ship weapons for most of the fight.
Imagine if it hadn’t been the Grafton, but instead the Infinity who destroyed the spire with her Mac guns.
The infinity would get glassed by the CSO
@@lukevolbrecht6799 it had shielding tho
@@JACKAL747 if that massive weapon couldn’t get through the infinity’s shield I want it destroyed in halo infinite. That’s just broken.
@@Azakadune The infinity is basically Humanities version of a CSO plus an escort fleet, One on One I would say Infinity destroys the Long Night of Solace 9 times out of 10, the problem is the fleet that comes afterwards. Could the Infinity Survive getting glassed by a CSO, I would say yes but they would get banged up, could they survive a fleet of CSOs... hell no.
I mean even the grafton shot was incredible underwhelming in halo reach, i understand it served it's purpose as it destroyed the spire, but even at the lowest power level that mac round would've just pierce straight trough the spire and created a mini nuclear explosion wherever it landed behind it. Heck even Jorge was surprised they were willing to use mac rounds in atmosphere, but then after we get the lamest explosion i have ever seen.
Finally I've missed these galactic versus so much
I dunno man, you’d probably have to have infinite energy to time travel, might be a bit of a reach
Why
I see what you did there...
The door is that way
badum TTTSSSS
go home Einstein
Kat:"You didn't answer my question." Carter:"You want to know if we're losing?"
Kat:"I know were losing! ...I want to know if we've lost."
Considering the covenant only had one "Supercruiser" with the long-range sniping capability to outgun the ODP's, I think the fact that the Infinity would have been there would have had a cascading effect. Naturally, they would have sent it after the Infinity first, being the biggest ship (as they sent it after the Trafalgar first in the novel, which was the biggest UNSC ship in Reach's fleet and the *only* complete Punic-class Supercarrier, but I am going off of memory here so correct me if I'm wrong).
So already, in phase one, you have the UNSC Trafalgar, Musashi, Herodotus, and Minotaur all saved because the ship would have targeted the infinity and found a surprise in the Infinity's energy shields, which then would have gutted it with its Super-MACs.
Now you have two warships (Infinity-class and Punic-class), both with mobile Super-MACs, in play. While the Trafalgar had nowhere near the capabilities of the Infinity, it was still one of the only UNSC warships capable of a straight-up brawl with covenant warships (it had Mini-MACs like the Infinity, albeit less advanced). It also could provide a lot of cover with its complement and with the Trafalgar and the Infinity you can cover a lot more of the ODP's than just with the Infinity alone.
That's not enough to completely turn the tide in the battle, but with the Infinity and the Trafalgar, I think you're looking at a significant increase in the odds of the UNSC being able to fight off the first wave of Covenant Warships (the initial 314 warships). Worst comes to worst, they could have used the Trafalgar like the three Repair and Refit Platforms to create another molten cloud of vaporized Titanium-A, to shield the majority of their ships and get off another two waves of MAC rounds from most of their fleet before the Plasma Torpedos, Energy Projectors, etc. could all punch through and wipe out that 80% of the UNSC fleet. Hell they probably could have done that with its husk in the initial novel given enough time to maneuver over to hide behind it. But we knew none of that until after the fact, of course.
However... you're right in that more warships arrived after the initial 314. Depending on how many came to reinforce, and the course of the initial battle, events would probably have thereafter played out as you predict. The UNSC now has to engage in a straight fight against a second force of warships, and loses, badly. The ODP's are destroyed. At best, the Infinity can perform guerilla warfare tactics and cover retreating or evacuating ships, civilian and military alike.
The one thing I would definitively disagree on is the impact of the Spartan IV's. With more Spartan assets, I think the UNSC could have been able to assign and deploy forces armed with Tactical Nuclear warheads to destroy the covenant cruisers that moved in at low-altitude to glass the massive fusion reactors for the ODP's. They may have potentially been suicide missions, but they would have had the special operations assets to expend. That would have at least kept the ODP's in play for longer.
Anything else boils down to what the Covenant are willing to commit to Reach's outright annihilation. Remember, the UNSC won phyrric space victories at Chi-Rho and New Constantinople, and the Covenant never returned (that we know of) to finish those planets off later. If the UNSC beat off the first wave and manage to keep the Covenant in a state of attrition after that with their remaining assets (Active ODP's, about 30 remaining warships, and the Infinity), the Covenant may simply decide they had done enough effective damage on a strategic scale, and can worry about the rest after the fact. And even then, if the Covenant kept up their assault, the UNSC probably could have made a ground engagement a living hell for the Covenant, even with significant portions of the planet undergoing glassing, making strategic strikes with the Infinity and using it to ferry supplies in to ground forces from their last major production center on Earth.
Dang bruh only 4 likes I like the explanation. Unfortunately for the UNSC that would have been the best case scenario. I get really depressed whenever I think of the battle of reach because so many lives and ships were lost- almost in a massacre not even in a battle. RIP you fictional heroes
I didnt want to complain, but I will admit I wasnt watching your videos as religiously since it was mostly just reaction videos. I get that these videos are harder to make but I'm glad youre planning on trying to put out more of them. Just dont over work yourself!
"Flet commander they out number us 3 to 1."
Keys- then it is an even fight.
The elite shipmaster said that not Keys
Im just imagining the Infinity going at it with the CSO Super Carrier
That would be fantastic to watch
Infinity would win easy due to the MAC rounds. Larger than the others and more numerous. First shot would overwhelm the shields and second would go through the hull. Not to mention it can do pin point jumps, so the Super Carrier couldn’t dodge out of the way if the Infinity just shows up next to it.
Acient AUrora class vs Hive. One v One she would win easily, 2 v 1 on the other hand? Nope, hard pressed. 3v1 is insta over for the infinity, she would be outgunned by them easily. Those few CSO's that where wiped out where heavily luck based. Covenant got coocky and you saw that in Halo Reach CONSTANTLY.
I could probably win a 1v1, but any more targets and it's probably dead.
Ceece. Personally I don't think the Infinity would win, CSO's are about 5 times longer than the Infinity and 10 times wider. We don't really have details as to what specific weapons and defenses they have but I think it's fair to assume that the bigger the ship, the more powerful the armament, armor and shielding it carries. They could also have overlapping shields for all we know and even if you punch through one section it's not like that's gonna cripple the rest of the ship. The CSO is just ridiculously larger, I think the Infinity would lose. (unless they rigged up another slip-space bomb, but that could be used against any ship really)
When the Covenant starts treating entire warships lile grunts, you know you're in for a bad time.
Captain Keyes would have won if he were in the Infinity
He would make an "emergency landing" on reach, and then they would have to blow it up to get rid of the enemy
Admiral Cole would’ve been a better choice compared to Keyes. He’s probably the best UNSC commander during the Human-Covenant War and having the Infinity as his flagship and would’ve given him more a tactical and strategic advantage.
Keyes would have launched every nuke the Infinity had and then it would be ALL THE RAMMINGS after the EMP burned out the Covenant shields.
God bless the Keyes Loop.
@@Vincent-S nah, captain keyes and preston cole would team up, keyes with the infinity and cole taking control of the trafalgar. keyes would ran circles around the covenant ships who chased but only get close enough to run into a nucelar mine field while cole pisses the covenant off only for the pursuing alien ships run straight into moon.
“You could not have saved them, anyways”
- Olivia Pierce
Even if Reach was 'saved', it would only be temporary. Still had High Charity and the Unyielding Hierophant.
The battle of reach in space is so good in the book. The heroics of the humans to try to ever so desperately hold the line gives me chills. The people on the unarmed fit and repair stations sacrificing themselves to protect the ODS for an extra few moments is so sad.
Also, yeah, look at all the resources they were ok with throwing at Six. He fought for three hours, plus however long you as the player last. Sending high ranking elites, in multiple waves to kill you. They were taking Reach. No matter the cost.
I feel like the Infinity could potentially make jumps behind Covenant groups and pick off larger ships while avoiding heavy Covenant fire.
Yeah the slipstream drive could have led to great hit and run but I still think they would have lost Reach, just made it a lot more painful for the covenant.
I inmagine its gonna be like USS discovery blinking and spamming shots every 2 second nonstop lol crazy, except its a ship thats around 5km big
If the infinity showed up as the “cav” and hit the covenant from behind or the flanks, it might have made a difference. If it was with the original defense, it would have been targeted and taken out early.
Also depends on how the Spartans were deployed, ideally they would be used for VBSS ops to scuttle or capture covenant vessels.
Could Infinity decimate Covenant by pinpoint slipspace jumps with hit and run tactic? It does have Forerunner based slispace engine.
@@kamilpotato3764 Yes, it could. Is it a good idea? It’s better than conventional engagement, it’s space warfare’s version of guerrilla tactics. Is it effective? Depends on how the Infinity attacks after precision jumps.
Havent watched yet, but, Considering the sheer scale of the defeat at reach, I can't see how one human ship, no matter how powerful, could have made a meaningful impact.
Maybe not one massive ship, but the Infinity does have those 10 strident frigates. So technically, that’s 11 ships, all of which are upgrades from reach/ce era ships. But i agree. There’s no way the Infinity, it’s frigates, and the 20-something other ships could take down an entire covenant fleet at around 10x their numbers. And that’s just the start, there’s around 750 covenant ships that are at reach by the time it falls. So that’s around 20x their numbers. That’s just impossible for 30-40 ships to take down. And keep in mind how underpowered the UNSC ships are compared to covenant vessels. So there’s definitely no way the Infinity could help take down that massive fleet.
Agreed, Eckharts really just took 14 minutes to adress something that could be summed up by one word;
"No." @chasetoyama8184
@@geegeetomlinson2316 I disagree. The way reach lost because of a 'Sniper cruiser' which could hit the ODP's. It would target the infinity. Get blocked by shielding. And then BAP BAP BAP BAP. 4 super macs. Its gone. Leaves the trafalgar. Infinity and 2 other massive ships to protect the ODP's. In addition. The infinity could use its spartan IV's to attack the cruisers that attempt to glass the odp generators. With those dealt with. It's 90% of the ODP platforms. And the 3 largest ships at reach. alive. then its Turkey hunting season. Put Cole or keyes in charge of the infinity. And it's even better.
Glad you’re returning to roots, I kinda jumped off for a while so I’m glad it’s back to what I joined for, like the new content tho :)
Listening to the video while typing this:
Versus Ideas:
1) Could modern-day humanity destroy the Long Night Of Solace?
2) Master Chief Vs Kratos
3) Protoss VS the Flood
4) Thrawn transported to Poland 1939 to help right before the invasion
5) Thrawn transported to the Forerunner-Flood war
Number 4 is the real shit
LNOS was 28 KM long. Not much is known about it. It boasted at least 1/10 a million of troops (at least), innumerable levels of shielding, thousands of strike craft and drop ships, insertion pods, armoured vehicles, and a huge glassing beam. Could they survive against it's ground force? Possibly with strategic use of bombers and aircraft, cruise missiles and nuclear warheads with infantry used as a buffer. The Covenant have no known guided AA missiles or MANPADS. Could they survive with the ground force and it's Arial assets? Maybe, the problem lies within the quantity of aircraft and munitions productions. Their only advantage is the overwhelming amount of humans that could be used to delay the Covenant advance, and with unrivalled air dominance their two advantages are largely mitigated. The only chance they have is using their huge numerical advantage and wage a kind of guerrilla war using captured weaponry and their competitors and their comparatively crap firearms. Their modern armour like Abrams and Amarta would be easy targets for all hostiles. Technicals with HMGs would work well with this method of fighting. Humanity would have it disregard it's care for individuality for the sake of it's existence by throwing themselfs at the enemy with no chance of survival. It would be very hard, but humanity might just be able to survive. If against LNOS? No chance, none of their weaponry could dent it. It would just sit in orbit and glass the planet, case closed. Humanity might be able to take down a smaller vessel such as an SDV corvette, a ADP escort, RCS cruiser (maybe) the police cutter shippy thing, or a CCS battlecruiser (maybe) by saturating it with nuclear warheads, but the fallout may cause problems later. The debris would cause tensions as their technology is attempted to be harnessed.
@@cit5184 agreed
2. Kratos killed a titan the size of a mountain.
Thrawn would get shoot for not being Human lol
I love this series, glad to see you’re planning on bringing back more of these types videos, I missed them.
For what it’s worth I’m very glad you’re kinda going back to the content you used to make. I’ve been subscribed since almost the beginning 3 something years ago and your starship versus series were the highlight of my day. So yeah thank you eck
Spartans never die, they are just missing in action
I always enjoyed humanity being underpowered vs the covenant. It made the stories so much more tragic and enjoyable to read or play.
Reach: *billions of civilians facing genocide*
MC: wake me when you need me lololol
LOL
One problem with that, Reach was already attacked before the events of Halo: Combat Evolved (1) even occurred. Thus the events of Halo 3, which occur after the events of Halo 1 would have come after the battle of Reach.
@@brianlance8263 Yeah but that's not funny
😂😂
Also MC: I’m gonna chase my SD card girlfriend onto a planet while humankind gets molested
Fleet battle between
Grand admiral Thrawn vs. Ender Wiggin
Each one has an equal sized fleet with equally capable subordinates, and since Ender is from a different universe each has equal understanding of the technology they’re using. They are in command of Star Wars vessels. Pick a famous fleet of your choosing I’d suggest death squadron.
Ender is really underrated as an admiral
Is Ender really that great? He kind of struck me as someone who read Sun Tzu's "Art of War" and thinks he's a tactical genius when really he's just going up against dumb opponents. Contrast to Thrawn, who's big thing is that he profiles his opponents and actually predicts what they're going to do, it's clear Thrawn would win.
Now real battle: Thrawn vs. Joseph Jostar
That would be interesting as for ender their(there) is no valid reason to assume that the Star Wars universe doesn’t exist in the form of movies,cartoons,comics,Etc,Etc so ender would in my opinion if he watched and read them have an advantage.
While it’s true that we technically never have a definitive answer on if earth could truly exist in the Star Wars universe so thrawn in terms of knowledge of his opponent would be at a disadvantage even ender doesn’t have knowledge of thrawn he still has knowledge of the technology.
Both are known to be extremely capable military leaders, more specifically as admirals with very impressive tactical minds to say the least and very impressive victories.
But I personally feel that ender would triumph.
based on one thing thrawn had always to some degree knew his opponent and how his opponent would think in someway or form most often culturally through Art,teachings,Etc he had this knowledge because of how interconnected the Star Wars universe is.
Ender never had this advantage he always had to rely on both himself and his subordinates never had prior knowledge, always on himself, not to mention winning an impossible battle that thrawn would never have won without a TON of ships(with dreadnoughts,star destroyers,Etc,Etc) and a lot of losses. Yes one could argue that ender knew about the pattern in how the drones fly and fight, but that is null and void with how out numbered ender was in most engagements(if I remember correctly).
So in my PERSONAL opinion Andrew “Ender” Wiggin is the superior admiral and might I add he won all his victories as A CHILD with TONS of room to gain knowledge in the form of battle strategy,Tactics,Etc,Etc whereas thrawn was an adult for most of his military accomplishments.
But this is one man’s opinion, other may differ and so be it, as long as you don’t behave like a child and yell at me, and give your reasons then so be it.
YES YES YES YES YES YES YES PLEASE
@@battlesheep2552 lol you clearly never saw or read the books and movie while I admit I don’t remember much from the book(s) I do know that more often then not ender was and is a humble kid, and he actually on multiple occasions proved his tactical mind I mean I try not to be biased, but come on your extremely biased and saying how he came off as and not from an actual overview/comparison, sort of like I did from what I know and remember from both universes.
Take into account that the commander of the Reach Invasion was Thel Vadam too. If nothing else, he'd personally ensure the destruction of the Infinity with superior strategy, at least on par with humanity's best tacticians. And this is during a time that humans expected the Covenant to be limited by dogma, when Thel had no such limits.
you're assuming Thel Vadam's strategys would protect him from a series-8 mac round to the pinch fusion reactor
Glad to hear that galactic verses might be coming back! It's was one of the things I initially subscribed to this channel for!
This man stopped himself from changing too much. He did what other youtubers couldn’t. I respect this man.
Quality over quantity , every time. I'd rather have one of these videos a week then a few reaction/other videos per week!
I’ve been rewatching your old galactic versus for years. Feels so good to have new ones coming out, keep it up eck!
Very up for this, I miss you covering non Star Wars/Halo stuff as well. I understand you have a kid and it's easy to fall back on what you know but it really breaks up the content by changing things up. Plus the channel is "Star Wars, Halo and More" and I think the "AND MORE" stuff has been absent a while now
"The Infinity is basically a mobile orbital platform". I wonder if they started shielding the orbital platforms and their reactors after Infinitiy's completion.
Galactic Versus is one of the best series on youtube. Most channels that have long form videos that I'm subscribed to, pad their uploads with shorter and easier to make videos. I think you would see more retention if you were able to do something similar. I love your content, keep up the great work!
Ship vs. unsc pillar of autumn Vs nx-01 enterprise. I think it would be interesting because they are both human ships, unshielded and both helped save humanity.
It'd probably depend on the relative speed and maneuverability of the two ships. While the NX-01 Enterprise has a handful of energy weapons and can use the transporter to send over boarding parties, the Pillar of Autumn has a lot more weapons and a MAC, so the Enterprise would have to do a lot of dodging while it wears down the Pillar of Autumn.
Pillar of Autumn no doubt, it's got the NX-01 beat many times over just by sheer tonnage. Let's not forget that Star Trek ships have terrible range, so the Autumn could easily snipe it from a safe distance with it's MAC
@@florenceb1031 I don't know if boarding would be an effective strategy given the small crew size of the NX class
Maybe boarding the bridge directly
@@battlesheep2552 the NX classes impulse is from memory about 20% of the speed of light, since Mac's are only around 4% of the speed of light, the enterprise could be difficult to hit. But maybe with cortana they could.
“Several hundred Spartans” bud, the infinity is the command center for the entire Spartan branch. EVERY Spartan (not deployed) is on the infinity.
EVERY Spartan IS several hundred. There's probably 2-3 dozen of active Spartan IIs and a handful of Spartan IIIs left alive. And Spartan IV is a relatively new program with maybe several hundred. So yeah, there's probably not more than 1000 active Spartans currently
Just do a rehash/updates series about the entire history of halo universe, starting from earlier. Call it a revisited, something that incorporates new books/lore and then at the end of each episode give your impression of the themes/thoughts of the authors and why the story is how it is. Boom, 30+ hours of content
Glad to see old Eck back!
On the video itself: Reach was so stacked against the UNSC that would have been a risk to deploy the Infinity. If present the only achievement would have been having even a greater proportion of the Covenant fleet being deployed there to deal with her
I will be very glad to see you return to form, I've actually found myself watching less and less of your uploads the past year.
All up for going back to the roots... I love the idea of learning more about lore and ships!
Pretty sure that ship that sniped reactor cores to one-shot UNSC ships would have gotten alot of messages saying "THAT STILL ONLY COUNTS AS ONE!!!"
Nice to see a return to these Versus episodes XD For a Faction Versus suggestion: The Zerg Swarm (Starcraft) vs. the Yuzhan Vong (Star Wars). Battle of the organitech armies!
The one issue is that the Zerg would win in the end because of the extreme ease that they can evolve and adapt to what is needed. A few bits of organic material is all that's needed to provoke an evolution, and a few tens or hundreds of dead Yuzhan Vong would be the end. The ammount of Zerglings alone that would be sacrificed would be HUGE, but totally worth it to any of the leaders the Zerg had. The only real difference would be if the OG Overmind, Kerrigan, or Zegara was in charge to set a time scale for the inevitable win. If you put Kerrigan in charge, then even the organic weapons and other organitech stuff would fall pretty easy as she knows the value more so then the other 2 that any tech has a value and purpose. And her psionic powers are scary af in the lore( not game play wise as that had to be toned down for balance).
@@x0Tassadar0x So, I agree that the Zerg definitely come out on top in a drawn out war, but I think this would still make for an interesting match-up. For one, we know that the Vong have gotten pretty adept at subjugating other species and incorporating them into their army. The big question is, Could they figure out a way to subjugate the Zerg before they are overwhelmed? Again, I don't think they could reasonably DO this, but I do think there could be a lot of interesting stuff going on in a conflict like this. Like imagine if some of the Vong start outright DEFECTING to the Zerg? Seeing them as a kind of ideal existence.
this REALLY hits different after halo infinite.....
Yeah it got nerfed hard, I get the it was to make the banished look scary but 4 minutes is silly. The pillar of autumn lasted longer.
I’m gonna point out that in one of the halo books, the infinity popping out above sanghelios scared the shit out of sangheli rebels. That’s how big it is. These elites have been seeing big shit for a while, but it was so big it was scary
Thats utterly ridiculous because a CSO supercarrier is nearly 5x the size of the infinity. It's still tiny.
@@sunburst8810 it's probably because it was a human ship
scary because it was big compared to what they have. they didnt have CAS assault carriers or CSO supercarriers
Eck!!! Thanks so much for this galactic versus!!!! I love Galatic versus!!! You are soooo good at them! Thanks!
Reads title, watches the Halo Infinite intro sequence. "No, no she could not."
I’m super here for the roots, good to have it back lol.
As for the video I never truly knew just how huge the fight for reach really was, and damn I completely agree that you’d need 10 infinities to really even it out and even then it’s still a Herculean effort for those ships. Even with 10, you’re just one tactical misstep away from losing the whole planet
The two sources fit perfectly, so long as you treat Reach as a planet and not a city/country like most other sci fi settings.
Were returning back to what made this channel what it is, nice
So to sum up “Infinity vs Arbiter’s fleet”
Arbiter: Were it so easy.
Thanks for your analyst. My memory has me believing that Reach was caught with their pants down and Reach could have push the convent back. It made reach a trajected story.
Coming back to this after Halo Infinite is pretty crazy, considering we saw the most powerful ship ever made by the UNSC get destroyed in a cutscene by a fleet that we dont even know about.
That's called bad writing and plot holes
@@horrificpleasantry9474 Well the fandom was bitching for years about how the Infinity didn't make sense and didn't fit the tone of Halo, I'm not really surprised that 343 decided to blow it up.
And of course, the fans still whine when they get exactly what they want. Sad little Halo fans.
@@addisonwelsh that wasn't what I wanted and I don't know anyone else who wanted that. That sounds like a made up excuse
@@horrificpleasantry9474 I don't know what parts of the fandom you been hangin out in, but I couldn't find a single chatroom that wasn't full of crybabies whining "Halo's not supposed to be like this! The UNSC is supposed to be struggling to survive, not flying around in super ships with armies of Spartans! I want to Infinity destroyed! I want all the new Spartan's dead! I want the UNSC to burn to the ground! WAAAAAAHHHH!!!!!"
@@addisonwelsh i don't recognize those as fans. Never encountered a single one on RUclips. Must be toxic Reddit or Twitter agitators
Also to you @EckhartsLadder at 1:00 you mentioned the trade off of more quality content which I am SO HAPPY you went with the choice for. Your growth has been amazing, and while I AM STILL FOR SOME REASON NOT SUBSCRIBED I have been watching your videos since 2019 which is far now just wow. Anyways I wanted to say thank you/congrats on your choice. I hope your battle against the OrangePeople or whoever they are goes well, because your videos do have a special place in my heart.
I think that the infinity would've been handy had chief been leading those spartan 4s into the fight, gotten creative and started boarding tactics like they did in reach that one time, maybe turn the tide a little bit, honestly the real power of the infinity isn't just the mac guns, though they're quite a nice "hi how you doin" the spartans are the real life o' the party ;)
Cringe
I love how you really dissect Halo battles to make these kind of what ifs
Who would win?
Humanity's largest most powerful flagship?
Or
Some strong monkes.
Reject UNSC, return to monke
I know that these videos take more reasearch, which is why i love that you do them. it saves me the time researching it on my own.
Seeing this after it got absolutely demolished in halo infinite
Good to hear the channel is returning to its roots. I've watched since Galactica v Imperial Star Destroyer and was honestly finding myself skipping alot of vids lately.
Once the covenant found reach the planet was doomed. Even if the infinity fought off wave after wave of ships, the Prophets would have sent that massive Fleet escorting high charity that we saw during the mission regret in Halo 2.
The turning point of the war was when the elites switched sides. Humanity was going to lose the war till then.
As terrifying as that thought is, that wouldn't have happened. The Prophets were paranoid to extreme degrees; even when Ripa Mora'mee declared he'd take "what we have" when he was speaking with Regret about the war, Regret immediately shot the idea down because by doing so it would've left them defenseless. After all, there was still the Flood out there and all it would take was one flood spore to end centuries of work. No, they'd just send more ships...but they would not send High Charity's fleet after Reach.
@@jacobrobinson787 then why did they plan to send it to earth after they found out it was humanity's home? Reach would have fallen regardless, 10 infinitys could not halt the covenants momentum.
Hey, Justin. Don’t blame yourself for lack of channels views because of lack of lore, versus and legends content. Star Wars lately has been active with The Bad Batch, Visions and more news content, not to mention Halo Infinite news to the point you won’t focus on the true heart of the channels content. So we are now glad to see this channel going back to normal, until next month of course with Visions.
I just thought of something: Who would win between The Bad Batch, including Crosshair, versus Noble Team?
He's basically already done this with I think Delta squad from commandoes vs Noble. Commandoes and the bad batch just can't match up to a spartan, physically, mentally, experience, or any way. Noble team wins.
@@ADR1fley That's why I wonder about The Batch. They don't have as much genetic changes as a Spartan, sure, but they have such specific mutations that also compliment each other, along with cutting edge armor and weapons, similar to Noble Team
@@Luchmun3 The Bad batch aren't much better than commandos, that can even be seen with the episode with Scorch. They're not good enough to go up against Spartans is my point, it would be a waste in my opinion, to make that video
@@ADR1fley Fair point. The more I think about it, the more I realize it's just lopsided
I just randomly remembered this channel after a year, and don't regret it. Nice work👍
The problem of the infinity is the constant incompetence of the captain XD first mission, it crashed on requiem, second mission, destroyed in 4 minutes. Why was Lasky still there?
Lasky wasn't the capt of the ship until the last mission of halo 4. It was CAPT Del Rio. The ship was pulled into the planet just like how all the ships at the beginning of the game. Yea it was nuts that they did what they did to it. i hope they have some DLC that they relese that we get to see the ship again because you cant just kill it like that never to be seen again right
IN SUMMARY, Del Rio erred on the side of following prior orders and not taking unknown strategic risks. His choices were correct when seen from a certain perspective, but he could've done better if he had been willing to reinterpret his mission.
✔️ Sending out recon was not ill advised, that's like criticizing the US for having military operations in Mexico and the middle east at the same time. Infinity is huge, with tens of thousands of personnel. The fighting was only in one place and not affecting most of the ship. Doesn't make sense to ground the entire Navy because there's action in one location
✔️ Not having done a terrain assessment of the route to the door lock (I forget what they call it) is reasonable since the conditions have changed. Now infinity isn't grounded and anybody who's out can be left behind, so all hands need to be on board because they're not waiting to leave, lest it risk the infinity getting trapped again.
✔️ Wanting to leave quickly is following orders you report back. Remember the planet is preventing long distance communication so they need to leave or no one's going to know what's happening. If they then take on the Didact and lose, humanity will be unprotected and unaware of the danger
🚫 He could've sent a frigate to report back and kept the infinity to support the chief. This was really his only error, and results from his rigid rule following and inability to adapt
✔️ he was correct that cortana was a risk. However, she can't affect chiefs suit directly to shut him down, just the shield afaik, so there was less risk in letting her be with chief. A conciliatory response would be to order chief to turn cortana over after getting back to earth whereafter she could be fixed by Halsey perhaps. He could not have foreseen that cortana would be the one to stop the Didact. But he wasn't required to be conciliatory. These regulations about ai are not arbitrary.
🚫 Really besides the lack of adaptivity, his temper is really the only thing against him, which doesn't in and of itself make him a bad leader as far as leadership decisions go. Morale, yes.
In summary, he did nothing wrong, but could've done better, if he had been less rigid about following orders to the letter.
@@horrificpleasantry9474 all this is fax. didnt get why chief asked for the terrain assessment. he doesnt seem like a guy that lets little stuff bother him i mean unno like teleporting right next to keyes. maybe you could explain what that is?
@@Wasted117. not sure I understood 'teleporting next to keyes' in order to answer your question right
@@horrificpleasantry9474 so if Keyes is captured theoretically he would be guarded right? Probably not the best example but yeah he usually just charges in or plans beforehand ie truth and reconciliation not last second.
I think the Infinity would’ve helped in some defense, but the ship would’ve been overwhelmed by sheer numbers. Even Lord Hood stated the fleet that attack Reach was much larger than the fleet that attacked Earth with the defense force having a tough time holding back the smaller armada.
The Fall of Reach felt like going against a Master in chess who always let you get away with tactics, until you get cocky, provoking them to actually try. Leaving you defeated with nothing but an empty board.
I don’t know if you’ll ever see this but to be honest I haven’t been watching for a long time for the reasons you listed so to hear your going to return to your previous works and that it’s your decision and not views or what not makes me very happy. Don’t worry about upload times, if you make something you like, we will too
Thel Vadamee and Rtas Vadum with the Fleet of Particular Justice vs. Anakin and Ahsoka with the 501. The tip of the spear for both factions, who would come out on top???
@Faceless King magic and glowsticks
Correction! The Covenant ship that the Infinity rammed in Halo 4 is an RCS Armored Cruiser. It is slightly larger than the CCS-class Battlecruiser, but is somewhat outdated according to the Covenant standards. Overall, it's a great video and I am really happy to see you cover Halo content again, Eck!
Anyway, I hope you have a great day. Remember to stay safe and healthy, buddy!
I'd still say it depends on how it's used and how it coordinates with other forces. Aside from it's 10 frigates it's also taking a ton of pressure off other UNSC ships which gives them openings to exploit. Even if it goes down you can bet most of the UNSC fleet and orbital platforms will still be intact and it's ground forces are quite substantial.
IMO, with 1 Infinity it's about 20% chance of victory. 5% is just not accounting for the increased effectiveness of other units. 3 or 4 Infinities would probably actually mean there's an expectation of victory. 4 Infinities means 40 Strident frigates and enough ground forces to make a Covie ground victory very unlikely which means fighting each orbital platform head on.
If for instance the Infinity arrived during the Covenant's attack on the orbital defenses by itself, they may not have known if it was friend or foe since they may have identified it as Forerunner. If they did do so, and it started firing at them and then too up a position alongside the human fleet, it may have caused the Covenant to fall back and regroup so they could figure out why a Forerunner ship had chosen to take sides with the Humans.
If they come to the conclusion that Humans were piloting the craft, they would then have to wrestle with why the Forerunners provided them with what appears to be a brand new ship.
Could Infinity decimate Covenant by pinpoint slipspace jumps with hit and run tactic? It does have Forerunner based slispace engine.
I'm glad you're going back to galactic versus. That is what got me subscribed several tears ago. I've missed your coverage of other Scofield universes. This is great news
Hey Eck can you make a video that talks about the difference between the reach video game and the novils
These types of vids are what got me into your channel. Glad you’re bringing them back!
And then Atriox took Infinity down in 4 minutes 🥲
Been ridin aboard Eckhart's Cruiser for about 4 years now, seen all sorts come and go. Twileks, the Flood, Clone Troopers, a poor bastard eternally tortured by the ultimate intelligence, some other freaky stuff I don't mention in polite company and a whole helluva lot of insight and analysis about other ships or the battles they fought in. All along I can't say there's a video I've ever disliked, not that there weren't things I might disagree with (Halbreds > Victory SDs), but every time I've watched somethin I enjoyed it. Whatever makes you happy man makes me happy, just keep it coming for as long as you're willing and know that even after I'll still be comin back to settle disputes, find answers, or research for my writing.
The Infinity could’ve been used to destroy the streaming forces that were coming through the hole from the destroyed ODPs
The shift in focus for the channel sounds good.
These kinds of videos are your strength, and if the cost is a few reaction videos, so be it.
And I 100% agree with you in this video. The Infinity would have pushed the price for the Covenant MUCH higher, but Reach was dead.
It would have been sniped by an energy projector going by the fall of reach book imo
Right, the Covenant Super-cruiser that the Autumn went up against.
Infinity would kill that ship pretty easily. Autumn was able to get through it's shields. Just imagine it getting both barrels from Infinity.
Upvoting for more long-form of these type! I used to watch everything often and repeatedly. Pretty much stopped about a year and a half ago with all the reaction stuff. This vid was an unexpected joy ^.^
Soooooooooooo about that...
The redirecting of your videos back to what you used to do will be rather nice. When it comes to comparing/contrasting factions/characters/ships in Star Wars and other media I think your extensive knowledge of lesser known EU Legends material will really help you stand out from other RUclipsrs.
Like adding lesser known factions like from the Black Fleet Crisis as an example, to your factions vs videos could really freshen things up. :)
*SPOILER DO NOT READ IF YOU HAVE NOT PLAYED OR SEEN HALO INFINITE GAMEPLAY*
the infinity crumbled againts 3 banished warships it lasted a total of 4 minutes and i cant believe, they did the exact same tactic that the infinity did with that CCS cruiser by ramming it oh well
Eck first of all fantastic video per usual. Second whatever kind of content you create whether it’s news and reactions or your classic starship versus, galaxy versus or lore, I’m here for it man keep up the amazing work and I’ll keep watching it.
"its still just one ship"
what about the 10 smaller frigates it has ready to launch? (those are post war ships so probably better then what reach had)
oh and depending on when you take it, the Infinity may have some Anlace-class frigates on board instead. (Electronic warfare frigates which can literally jam an entire planets signals)
I think in that case, you could say "it's still just 10 or so ships". The covenant fleet at reach was big enough, and each individual ship is superior enough to human ships, that ultimately I still don't think it would make a big enough difference.
@@tamaranck5558 The infinity and it frigates were better made then any covi ships, they had a brand new armor and forerunner shielding whish are a lot stronger then covenant shield.
@@angerskarin9222 We only ever see the Infinity fight, well, crash into a single COV ship, which itself was massively outdated and religated to border patrol. The CRS was smaller than a Paris, Stalwart or Charon for crying out loud
@@HexAyed Well, we also have the Infinity's shields tanking a supernova at the end of Halo 4 Spartan Ops. The calculations from that are, frankly, insane. I definitely wouldn't advocate using that scene for anything other than extremely high-end and not-serious-at-all calcs for Infinity's shields though, as taking them at face value would pretty much make the ship invincible and cause a host of other problems plot and lore-wise bad enough to break the entire narrative setting.
@@wallend4013 Ah I never finished Spartan Ops, Still, I feel that Infinity wouldn't have done *that* much, As soon as they discovered the LNofS they would have pulled Infinity back to Earth imo
when you come back to the video to see if people comment about the newest information that was required
"Saved Reach"? Guess I'll have to watch to find out what "Reach" is.
Edit: oh, it's a place.... huh....
Eidt 2: wait, this isn't star wars!
Tell me your joking.
Lmao this must have been a video full of surprises
@@twojacksandanace3847 nope, I actually didn't know, I don't play halo or watch gameplay of halo.
@@Ganonsmork The video game is amazing, 10/10 on the feels too. Remember Reach, remember where it all began.
@@twojacksandanace3847 wait, I actually have played through halo 4. I ran into a nasty scene and got demotivated to play again.
Glad to hear you're going back to the longer-form videos! I like all your stuff, but the older lore-heavy videos were my favorite.
The covenant almost never changed there tactics though. And when they did it was for a certain goal. Having never faced or known about infinity they would have stuck with brute force or still tried to sneak past. This would have been the first time they would have come up against something better then there's and they would attack as if it wasn't. I think the battle would swing in the UNSC favor until infinity ran out of Mac shells. Even then they could ram ships of the shields held. Not to mention the huragok the infinity had on board to repair. The kilo book series goes into it a little.
Actually, they were. Tactically speaking that is why ONI wanted Thel'Vadam dead. He was a prodigy and even the bloody prophets feared him and his fleets were known for inflicting staggering losses even by covenant standards. Thel was there for Reach and that is the other wild card. Infinity would not have gone noticed. Unlike many of the elites, he respected humanity and was not arrogant about what they could do. I would suspect he would suspend landing operations and call in his reserves and crush the current era unsc ships and infinity plus its supports could be facing a fight where they are outnumbered by more than 20 to 1. Infinity would get ground down and her support ships would not last long under that kind of firepower.
Could Infinity decimate Covenant by pinpoint slipspace jumps with hit and run tactic? It does have Forerunner based slispace engine.
@@kamilpotato3764 Again it comes down to resources. Infinity is not the only ship that can pinpoint jump. There is also likely a massive power drain from the point that and eventually, if you have to pull off a hundred or two hundred of these the ship is going to run into issues. It is an X factor but it is not a finger of god and eventually, regardless Infinity will run out of ammo. At that point, it can bunny hop all it wants. Reach will still be gone. The UNSC will be left with 1 ship that has any hope of holding the covenant at bay and eventually it will be forced into holding Earth. At that point, it does not matter.
At that point, you have basically lost your entire military-industrial complex. You have lost most of the navy chain of command. And you are running out of resources in the Sol system. You only have so many bullets left to shoot. Infinity is not going to fix that. too many people have the hero/savior complex from watching too much TV and playing too many games. One person nor a ship does not win a war. Even Chief was not self-made. He was not one person fighting the whole war. Hundred to thousands of spartan 2's and 3's were lost. Millions of service personnel were lost. To frankly eke out a pyrrhic victory. Infinity is not changing that nor is a dozen Infinities.
The reality is humanity won this by plot armor because "humans win". The reality is Reach the level of strategic victory was so high Infinity did not matter. The battle of Earth the same thing was happening. Humanity had like a dozen ships by Halo hiding (I think) in the Jovian system. Twelve more is not stopping that be they Infinities class or not.
I honestly think the Covenant only kept tactics because they worked. Humanity was not a peer opponent in anyway, and the covenant was basically left to do away with human colonies as they saw fit, and in fact reading silent storm, a silent shadow made a deal with the insurrectionists. To have them help find covenant worlds certainly deviating from covenant tactics, and these same rebels gave him a havok. To which he said would be inspected to help their ships be better prepared. In this same book the II's are apart of a stealth flotilla having boarded a covenant ship and it self-destructed. Know what the fleetmaster did when glassing Biko? They adopted a tighter knit formation with fighters patrolling among the fleet. Seemingly aware of the dangerous boarding tactics of the humans.
@@OpticBeatz Covenant were slow to adapt. I still think if humans had few more years and their ability to retrofit covenant and forerunner technology(shields etc) would stand better chance. Maybe more Nova bombs sneaked into covenant worlds, flotillas?
Definitely agree with your analysis Eck. Video content hasn’t been bad lately, I found myself loving the Bad Batch vids, however I do find myself going back 2 or 3 years on your channels just to learn more about Star Wars lore. I would love a combination of both these types of content personally
4 minutes
Ouch
funny that it can fall that fast but the sof messed them up
I very much appreciate you trying to stick with your roots. A lot of people think their channel's survival depends on changing but it seems to me that, that leads to losing large amounts of loyal viewer base for a small amount of one time viewers.