A lot of the weapons in L4D were not just laying around, they had some kind of backstory: found a hunting rifle near a campfire and a sleeping bag with a trail of blood, a handgun near a dead body, hand grenades near military vehicles, and melee weapons to common places where they should belong e.g. fry pan in kitchens.
L4d is everything this game is trying to be but fails , i mean valve is freaking great at inserting logic in their games espicially in terms of the gameplay and the lore also what i liked about l4d is the zombies and the enemies are unpredecatable it's like you finish a horde you try to access the safe room or a dark space till you find some zombies hiding in the corner espicially the witch also i like how you just go follow your teamates then suddenly you find boomer next to you , i mean the l4d 1 and 2 are great espicially 2 .
Well the philosophy is different, its a game for a new generation of teens that prefer just shooting at stuff, getting covered in blood and buying progress with real money, so for the current generation its awesome 👌
@@LiewLmao I don't even feel like it's laziness, but extreme perfectionism plus the ability to financially recover from just straight up scrapping projects far into development and the freedom for staff to move to whatever project they want. There's no monetary pressure for them to have to pump out questionable quality games every year like some game devs, so instead they mull around with game projects for weeks/months/years that ultimately go nowhere as the individuals lose interest or get caught up on other projects. It's definitely a problem since I'm sure they've scrapped a ton of enjoyable games for trivial reasons, but I wouldn't conflate it with laziness.
@@faceless2302 i mean, when you have a literal money printing machine in your backroom, there's so incentive to do anything besides upkeep said printer. the steam deck at least looks really good and maybe make valve make a few little games specifically made for the deck
I think it's really all presentation. What made Left 4 Dead so special was the dinginess of it, especially the first game with it's film grain, creepy and unique music, and the consistent movie style presentation. What made Left 4 Dead special was that they had a consistent horror movie style in mind and everything in the game served to deliver that atmosphere. From the movie posters to the gritty characters, it felt like a real world and had an oddly cinematic experience. I'll never forget the the intro to No Mercy with the helicopter flying this dark and dingy cityscape, zooming in on the characters in a precarious situation.
See for me I think of the characters. If you were around for both at the hight of its popularity then you can name that characters. Each one of them had personaly.
Another misstep is giving the Ogre a visible health bar. You know exactly how close to death it is at all times whereas in Left 4 Dead you'd only have a general idea of how close the Tank was to dying after playing a few times.
@@ralphthefrog3086 Tank doesn't need a healthcare. He's not unstoppable, but he feels like it. Ogre is a little bitch compared to Tank. Is that tank low on health? I don't know - maybe.
@@cpt.lounatic I mean, it's a giant fucking monster. I'd expect it to be rather tanky. I just wish it was more interesting and fun to fight. You can literally just camp indoors until it goes away or dies.
I found some blackpills. It say's on the side that the game was designed for shareholders and that people that buy the game will feel really bad when it becomes f2p.
The biggest issue I have with B4B is the lack of character and style. What made the world and characters so engaging in Left 4 Dead is how they weren't constantly trying to be a quirky stereotype. Even the zombie designs are so boring and generic, unlike L4D infected which mutate based on the lifestyle the person had before becoming infected. That, along with level design, price, mods... Just play Left 4 Dead 2 instead.
It's like they tried to emulate what made L4D so good without looking at it. The trailers alone let you shower in the L4D charm. This game reeks of marketing department.
@IV CYAN sure you can like that style, disagree on that but its undeniable that l4d1's serious tone with moments of lighthearted goofing from characters was replaced with characters continously cracking jokes and throwing one liners like its a generic hollywood action movie
@@teratoma. I must agree, that L4D2 had much more comedy... however, I feel that it fits much more naturally, as well as not actually seeming forced for the most part. B4B just feels like cliche after cliche
Yeah this game just makes me wanna play left for dead even more 😂 it’s like eating a generic brand of food an getting mad, then when you finally get the brand name it’s so satisfying lol
Spoiler, they were. Valve essentially had to course correct L4D1 to make it good, and L4D2 which is made purely by valve is notably better in terms of level design, character design and writing.
@@genos876 I think l4d2 characters are good, but like it doesn't have the big emotional impact in the story like Bill sacrifice. but if you look a bit deeply to how they talk to each other in each level or if when every other characters die. like nick will say "Goddamn it, Coach, what'd you leave me with?" when he saw coach die. Or Ellis has a lot of stories about his friends, and it adds up to his non-stop talking personality.
kinda funny that we're so used to it being "big company takes all the glory from small studio" that we didn't even consider if valve themselves were the ones responsible of making l4d as memorable as it is
the fact they have announced mutiple DLC packs and are pushing 100$ versions, before release, shows where their priorities are Its exactly like Evolve all over again
Yup, it really does speak volumes. By comparison, look at Left 4 Dead - when Left 4 Dead 2 came out, a lot of us were fairly vocal about how we were disappointed that the new stuff hadn't simply been added to the first game. But look at what Valve did in the end - For FREE, they ported ALL of the first game's content to the second game. So now you have two games in one.
Yeah i think they are using the legacy they had with the L4D series so many people would buy B4B and then they can throw as many DLC packs that will cost a lot of money. I hope they really dont go that way with a lot of microtransactions with overpriced.
Not only is the special infected theme telling you that there's a special infected around, if you play with your friends you're trying to compete on which one of you can find and kill them first. That is what's so fun with L4D. Not only you're working together to survive, but also to compete.
@@40proofbleach81 I like tension building in L4D when the backsound for each special infected is on and it gives different characteristic and tone for each special infected. B4B doesn't have different backsound for each special ridden.
I only noticed the issue with infected on the hardest difficulty.. at that point snitches and armored zombies made a lot of appearances.. try it when the open beta is live on the 12th. You will notice a bigger variety in specials.
On my runs I only saw 3 tall boys and a lot a lot of spitters which half the time just shot me with something and I take damage and not get glued with her web
I might be boomer these days for thinking this but I like how in L4D2 there is no progression. Some cosmetic stuff would be nice in L4D2 but luckily there is no perks and upgrades.
And somehow L4D2 is far more enjoyable. It's probably the simplicity and the "straight forward" aspect that made me like L4D2 more but it's probably just me.
Workshop exist for a reason, why pay for skins when you can download them for free? hell, why not even download maps for free? instead of paying 30$ for a forgettable map pack.
@@hankerbanker6 yeah exactly. It's crazy what people in the community have made in Workshop while P2W cosmetics in a lot of video games these days looks the same and repetitive. It's either colorful rainbow skins or a dark/horror themed.
Yeah it's weird, I'm not averse to that kinda stuff in other games, but when I see a L4D-like come out and it has that stuff in it, for some reason it just immediately turns me off the game a bit. Could be just that I prefer L4D's get in and go nature. There's no builds to worry about. No loot to stop and inspect. etc etc. It's just 'alright lets go'.
My problem with the "lore" of b4b is: if they are a special team that does clean up, why not wait for backup for the campaign finale? At least in l4d you knew why they had to go alone through the hordes, to get to that evac in time, but b4b is just a team taking exaggerated risks when they could just wait for backup from their higher ups.
Not to mention when I think of cleaners, I expect them to be heavily armed, equipped properly, and are there purely for slaughtering zombies (I know they aren't zombies but you get my point.) similar to Killing Floor 2 cast. The B4B doesn't fit this at all and is in a weird middle-ground.
@@MemeSlayer The game is a 4 player game, this means no more players to act as backup. And the design oversights that the other guy mentioned still apply. Unless they change the game's lore and/or character design, it still won't make sense.
Fun fact: the versus in b4b is literally just versus survival in L4D2, which is an offshoot gamemode of the actual versus where you run through the campaign instead
LOL something on the back of my brain was telling me "Wait, didn't the original L4D have game modes called mutations or something like that?" but it's been so long that I kinda let it go thinking that my brain was making shit up, mandela effect style.
Campaign versus was very fun hopefully one day they will change their minds and add it in . Also I got rekt in nightmare mode if anyone wants to watch it
L4D had really good writing. You can still play it 12 years later and run into new dialog and funny situations. It was basically a comedy game, while B4B just feels like a tryhard generic military shooter.
The Keith stories that Ellis tells still crack me up. And the little touches like Coach saying “incenderary ammo”… there’s just no way these B4B characters can match that. They look like a character design student’s portfolio work; aesthetically pleasing, demonstrating understanding of technique, but lacking true art direction. Coupled with the card system, hit markers, and other small design details, it telegraphs a lack of true vision or identity.
Completely agree, every modern co-op game has to be a sweatfest where you know every mechanic even on the lower difficulties. While the co-op genre is perfect for sweatfest tactical games, it's numbing how every modern co-op game has become that. Left 4 Dead, even on Expert mode required significantly less brain power than B4B on it's normal mode. For some, it's good that it's super tactical and sweaty but I like to play games to have fun and have a realistic challenge to accomplish.
Gunplay is significantly better than L4D but the card system is just fucking stupid and seems like a cheap way to monetize the game. If they start selling rare card packs I'm fucking done.
This is true - and it's not just the writing. The basic nature of the game, while inherently horrific, is also inherently comedic, which is why it works so well as a coop game - any stress, any frustration, is countered by the inherent hilarity of it. I still remember with fondness playing the first L4D's demo, back before it released, and me and my friends laughing hysterically at the first time we got swarmed and kicked to the ground; there was something utterly over the top and ridiculous about our characters screaming while a horde of infected kicked and punched us relentlessly.
I absolutely agree with what you said about the character design in B4B. The simplistic attire of L4D characters added to the game's atmosphere, and it gave you this "I didn't sign up for this s**t" vibe. B4B's characters look like they expected a film crew to arrive so they can make a documentary about killing zombies in the zombie apocalypse, and picked an outfit that perfectly matches their personality to impress the audience.
i knew the game wasn't going to work for me when they described the crew as "instead of being average people in a crisis situation, these are competent and motivated mercenaries". so, unrelatable and self-promotional? no thanks, lemme just listen to francis tell me how much he hates vampires.
@@entropicflux8849 At the very least if they are gonna make the new crew a bunch of trained mercenaries they could have made them, you know, LOOK LIKE TRAINED MERCENARIES! Like, why do they look and talk like a bunch of zoomers who randomly found themselves in the middle of the apocalypse? Only that Mom character and the black dude who looks like he came straight out of Ghost Recon Wildlands somewhat look like "trained soldiers", everyone looks nothing like a professional.
I know right? That contrast between the characters straight from the outfits alone! Rochelle's jeans and depeche mode shirt to Nick's well off white suit in L4D 2 and Louis' work clothes to Zoey's pink jacket and jeans in L4D 1
Seriously. The devs couldn’t stop themselves from slapping the ‘FROM THE CREATORS OF LEFT 4 DEAD’ sticker on anything Back 4 Blood related, when in actuality, only 7 members from the original Left 4 Dead team actually worked on Back 4 Blood. The original Left 4 Dead team had, what? 60+ members? It’s obvious that the ‘creators of Left 4 Dead’ thing was just a marketing tool to ride on the success of an immensely better game.
One of the good things about the Left 4 dead series is how it feels like a group of normal survivors just barely trying to make it from one classic zombie outbreak situation to another it really adds a lot to the gameplay. The idea of a group going in intentionally to clean up just takes away some of the feeling of desperation and charm.
It's a cool idea, and I think it could be done really well because not only does it make sense, it also leads toward more potential ideas in how things turn out. Instead of fighting your way to an evac point, you have to, say, fight your way into the oncoming horde and tear up as many undead as you can before completing your objective, and THEN finding an alternate way to escape or have to continue on. I get why they tried to make that work, and to an extent I still think it's a cool idea, but it's like a balance that has to be made. It sadly seems like they missed said balance.
I really can't understand how these people are specialists intentionally going in. They are not dressed for combat in the slightest. Even in the most poor nations, when you have guys going into combat, they have rigs and clothes made to make shooting and the activity you will be doing easier. These guys look like California idiots going into a zombie amusement park and brought their best clothes for an instagram photo. I cannot see them as professionals. Even for zombie games, there are standards you have to abide by when it comes to surviving the hoard rather you are a professional military soldier or just some guy trying to escape after his office was overrun during his coffee break.
"Normal survivors" Able to use every single gun under the sun and a katana to a masters level... At least this cleaning squad of elite soldiers sounds better than "trust me there normal guys". And I don't think I've felt anything in left 4 dead in my entire life, kinda hard to feel anything when I'm sh*tposting with my friends in circus plagued by zombies. Not much room for a emotion in that scenario...
It feels a lot like Turtle Rock is trying to get back into things by remaking what made them in the first place - while not understanding how gaming has evolved or why L4D has the longevity it has.
In many aspects it also feels inferior to L4D, like the developers didn't quite understand what made L4D so simple yet so great. But I don't think anyone who worked on L4D is still there at Turtle Rock, so not a big surprise.
But like he said in the video, it doesn't even have the detailed presentation, AI quirks, or the horror/tension of L4D that made those games more than just generic zombie shooters.
Turtle rock is trying to ride off of their past accomplishments without making a good game again. It happened with Evolve, and it'll happen with back 4 blood
@@descendantofartorias2067 it's sad to watch your favourite game series get butchered one by one,it's like one of those slasher halloween movies where the victims get thrown in a meat grinder,I think we will never see peak gaming like the 2000 up until the 2010 era again
@@falco5148 oh trust me I'm a fallout fan I know. You're probably right but I'm still holding out hope that we will see an era like 2000-2010 again, most of 2011-2020 went from mediocre to bad but their were some gems like Doom, the continuation of my favorite franchise with DMC 5, the boomer shooter renaissance in the indie scene and the souls Bourne series.
16:53 - Small detail, but even putting a health-bar on a "mini boss" is a mistake. Because not having that with say the Tank in L4D really help keeping up the tension and suspense, as you didn't know when it would end. - Having too much info, even as little as knowing how close to the end a character is, removes that tension and will just make the players spam the last little bit so they could guarantee ending it right then and there. - I loved the times of uncertainty during very intense playthroughs in L4D, where sometimes you'd get a moment of quiet without any attacks, and you and your fellow survivors would take a breather and basically "Oh man, what should we do?", while lacking weapons, ammunition or health, while knowing, or even not know, what was still between you and the end. - It would just make it all the more satisfying to survive, which was the challenge, which means gameplay is effective.
That definitely adds to the quick aside mentioned in the video where he said minimal HUD is better than a cluttered HUD and I absolutely agree with it. Give the player as little as information as possible but give them the tools or subtle hints to figure out how to play the game. It's a much more rewarding and memorable experience. Metro Exodus is a good example of a recent game doing this.
*I REALLY hope Back 4 Blood gets the same amount of love mod-wise as Left 4 Dead, that workshop is frickin' glorious* (and almost *the* main reason why it's my favorite zombie game)
What made L4D unique is the special infected itself. Each of them have their own distinguishable sound, attacks and designs. Also the level is more open ended compared to B4B where it so cramp that having just two Tallboys at the same time can easily take away the Cleaners health easily.
There's also the issue of, if the specials in B4B have line of sight on you, they can wreck your whole team. There's that one part in the second last mission where you have to destroy nests in a house that is really just fucked up. You can hold out anywhere in that house, so we chose the second floor, right beside the stairs, because there's only like 2 ways the zombies can come in. I was standing on the edge of the stair rails, when one of those long arm boys come up under me, do their smash attack, and hit everyone (including the people sitting in the far end of me in a corner. There needs to be some kind of proper hit detection or something to make sure that stuff doesn't happen. That scenario, by the way, caused us to wipe despite us all having a decent amount of health, buffs, and gear by that point.
@@DudeMcGuybro Yea, it's quite ridiculous honestly. There were points during mandatory hordes to progress (or just at chokepoints) where specials would just spawn in groups or one after the other for straight minutes before we could even take a step forward. I think they need to really fine-tune their zombie spawning.
Versus mode in Left 4 Dead was always fun because of how the maps were designed. Special Infected could use their map knowledge to get to optimal spots for ambushing, Dark Carnival is still one of the most fun to play to this day
Yeah in the last level of No Mercy there were several places where you could insta-kill human players by running them or dragging them off a ledge. The noob players would facecheck these spots without thinking while good players would avoid them. Great players would pretend to run into those areas to bait the enemy infected into attacking them.
One small issue I have with B4B is I don’t like how when you kill “Ridden” or whatever they’re called you and your weapon get coated in Blood, it feels like a cheap way of selling the gore and how “brutal” it is. The reason L4D actually felt brutal was because you SAW the damage your weapons did to the infected. You could shoot a hole clean through an infected’s head with Sniper rounds, you could blow a zombies back out with the shotguns, hitting an infected in the stomach with an AK round could make their intestines leak out. The weapons not only sounded powerful, but through gore effects like that, you FELT the power of the weapons. In B4B being coated in blood felt like the game was saying “Hehe look how gory we are you get completely covered in blood huh it looks so cool right!?”
Left 4 Dead is great because of how simple it is. It's so mechanically clear-cut and easy to understand. Back 4 Blood feels like a whole bunch of numbers and stats for what is simply a four-player zombie shooting game. Furthermore, Left 4 Dead (especially L4D1) had a fun and unique art style that was memorable.
The best thing about L4D's simplicity is that it allows both for casual, easy to pick up gameplay, while also allowing for an extremely hig hskill cieling. L4D caters to both casual and competitive players due to the nature of it's simple design. it's like having a bunch of domino blocks - you could just set up a simple row and watch them fall over, or you could build an insane tower, it allows a much wider audience to enjoy the game.
Too many "alert the horde" mechanics that I've had griefers set off every single time. You really don't want to set these off on higher difficulties otherwise you'll end up with limited health and ammo before youre even half done with a stage.
If I had a dollar for everytime some sped opened a door with an alarm on it I’d be rich. This shit happens on every difficulty because the player base doesn’t pay attention they just see door and they open door.
Everything in B4B feels forced, like these new movie reboots that rely almost entirely on nostalgia. Behind the L4D facade there's just another boring mtx-friendly military shooter.
Left 4 Dead is far more a product of Valve than TurtleRock, TR is also mostly a different studio today. L4D2 is entirely the work of Valve and L4D1 had to be saved and put on life support by Valve to make it out of development hell. People give TurtleRock ENTIRELY too much credit..
Naw they’ve always been like this; remember Evolve? The whole reason why they broke off from valve is because valve was basically babysitting them and stopping them from making their shit ass ideas a reality.
The game just feels souless. Theres so much magic missing from this that you'd find in l4d or even more modern competitors like Vermintide. I think this is because Lal the soul has been stripped away to leave holes that can be monitized like "characters" and weapons.
Yeah even the characters in Vermintide, who I didn't expect to remember very well, actually ended up being likable and memorable. Back 4 Blood pales in comparison.
@@FazerGS B4B isn't even going to hit CoD zombies level of memorable characters, let alone L4D or Vermintide. Their banter just sucks here. Some of it is pretty cringe at times too. This game is somewhat beating killing floor in memorable characters but that's not saying much since all they use in that game are one liners. This game probably will fail. It's not bad but arguably, being bland and uninspired is worse than just being bad. A bad piece of media can at least be unintentionally funny. This is passable on every front but not a single thing really stands out. Especially asking $60+ for this.
To add to that "more human means more relatable" bit, I remember how with L4D2 at the start there's that one part in the elevator where all the characters learn eachothers names and personalities, all without a cutscene or anything. On top of that you spend the first few chapters hearing them refer to the special infected as things like, "Exploding guy" or "Smoking things" which just added to the whole "actual people in a survival world" sort of feel. Edit: And as for the pipe bomb bit, something about source engine will always have a way more satisfying feel no matter how old it is. It's definitely my favorite game engine even despite the clear spaghetti code it tends to come with.
I mean these folks in B4B are cleaners who already know each other and have been living in this world for awhile. It wouldn't make sense for them to do introductions now.
@@dashalexan1241 That's because of the setting difference, it's an entirely different world. In L4D you're random normal people trying to get to safety and nobody is prepared for or ready for this shit. In B4B people have grown up entirely post-apoc and you're part of a cleaner crew. Cleaners die all the time. It's a fact of life in that world. Holly lost her family and she has survivor syndrome PTSD, Hoffman is looking for his dad, Mom has seen more allies die than she can count, etc. These are not soft city folks used to a civilized world. They've seen some shit and are already jaded or damaged. They all signed up to be cleaners willingly, they know what that entails, and they've been doing it for awhile.
@@Ralathar44 and that sorta makes them less relatable. It feels like all the characters have already had their unique moments and now there all best buds. It’s sorta a basic concept of writing: always start the story in the most interesting part. Don’t tell me about these relationships, show me them forming. I don’t want to hear about how Evangelo is like a little brother to Holly, I want to see that bond form in real time. Hell, the little down time moments like coach praying for the food court to be ok and all the other characters join him in saying amen was really funny. Or how Ellis knew about the driver of the race car in dead center and talked about him from the perspective of a fan really made him feel grounded. B4B’s versions of those appear so very infrequently and are over just as quick. Like, I wanted Hoffman’s distrust of turtles to be a running gag throughout the forest level but it was never brought up again. Hell, I really wanted Hoffman to actually be right on something since that would add more depth to his character rather than his stereotypical personality of “conspiracy theorist”. I wanted walker to maybe talk about himself and discuss what he was doing before the apocalypse but he makes a point of it to never actually do that which makes him far less interesting. B4B feels like it’s so close to hitting that point yet falls short of that last hurdle. The characters are so close to being memorable but they constantly fall flat. I don’t care if the setting doesn’t call for it, I really want to see these people develop their relationships and grow. Maybe we could see Hoffman slowly connect with Holly throughout act 1 over both of them missing their parents. This game comes so close to having personality and yet, it trips and falls just before the finish line. There were so many moments where the game came close to making me fall in love with it and every time, it stops in its tracks. L4D’s sense of character growth throughout the campaign really tied everything together. This game is seemingly missing something that’s impossible to put into words. I hope that the launch version of the game has more of those character moments that left 4 dead had. If it doesn’t, then I will have wasted money.
@@deadinside8891 lol they are not all best buds, if that's the vibe you got you need to listen more. Some of the team like each other, some don't. For example Holly doesn't like Hoffman and its possible others don't either. But Mom seems totally fine with him, prolly because she's more pragmatic and has alot of experience out surviving everyone else and Hoffman is a pretty significant asset towards that goal even if he's a conspiracy nut. Also it's clear Hoffman is more than JUST a conspiracy nut as he's out there looking for his father. We've been able to listen to a tiny fragment of the overall game and even then 10 hours in I was still hearing new VO. I think judging now is way too pre-mature. People never top growing and changing and that's true with their relationships too. There is no such thing as "all their moments already happened" That's a very young person thing to say. Someone who's yet to live to see alot more moments happen later in life. The wild ride never stops hehe :).
When a game studio tries to use the fact that it has dev members from a previous successful title to market their new game as a crutch it's usually not a good sign, just look at Evolved. They're openly inviting direct comparisons and criticisms to the title that gave them the notoriety to begin with and sets the bar of expectation pretty high. If they complain about how the game isn't l4d then they shouldn't have mentioned it or called it the spiritual successor. Your comparisons are valid Gman don't be sorry to tell it how it is.
Yeah man even the name is almost the same. They just salty that their game looks, plays and feels worse than something released almost 15 years ago lol
Me: looks at how many times Stalker is mentioned when someone develops survival-horror-FPS. But on the other hand, various former Stalker devs DID deliver us Metro series and then Tarkov... it's just that we had to endure a dozen Survarium's before that:D
Gives me the same vibes as world war z. Forgettable characters in a forgettable game. One of nicest things of L4D was it's simplicity. You could just invite a buddy and his girlfriend and it was fun. All these "spiritual successors" try to innovate by adding unecessary complexity like this card deck mechanic. If i want to play with cards i play hearthstone or sth.
Card mechanic was not that bad all in all. It just made it that the longer you last out during campaigns the stronger you got. And that is not a bad thing, what makes it meh is that there is no punishment for dying, not to mention it is too hard TO die.
I hated stopping and reading all the cards thats on my screen and I just wanna go uga bunga with the zombies already. Although if I stopped and try to understand it maybe I'll get more use out of it but I just really want to get out and shoot some more and stop getting these menus every time.
@@ColdNorth0628 The bad thing is - there wasn't any real strategy when picking cards. And still isn't. You choose cards _before_ game chooses the bad ones to hinder you, you don't know what to go for andj ust go for whatever you would go for if there was no cards hindering you _or_ for an optimised deck or anything similiar to that deck which is another dumpster fire of it's own... And I can't help it but feel like the cards are gonna be monetised hard, after all those are creators of Evolve so microtransactions are to be expected.
The REAL successor to Left 4 Dead is Vermintide. The infected designs look cool and the shooting looks solid, but Back 4 Blood just looks like a retread and doesn't have any of the charm or character appeal that helped L4D stand out.
The only issue with Vermintide is the shooting mechanics outside of bows is so damn basic and bland. None of the guns feel like they hold any power and the absolute lack of design diversity makes weapon upgrades feel a bit weightless. Besides that, its melee combat is absurdly satisfying.
Vermintide sucks too its just clicking on an infinite horde with armor piercing wide sweep attacks. Any interesting builds got ruined by the screeching fanbase. Zero map variance gets old real fast too. Loots obnoxious too and just devolves to runs of the quickest lootiest map over and over again.
I really don’t get why people praise these Vermintide games. I’ve played both of them with randoms and with my friends and they’re worse than Back 4 Blood. They crash so much more, they’re not stable games, the gameplay is so much more mindless.
The part where they totally remove the sound que from the Special zombie is such a bummer also the Special doesn't really have distinct ability other then just damage, damage and more damage.
Special infected are honestly quite bullshit to go against. You get no warning, damage is instantenious, and that same damage might be jsut permament (with how rare it can be to find the station to remove the trauma). And how the game doesn't give any breathers outside of safe rooms. You open that door and 3 tall boys walk out with whole circus of other specials to curbstomp you. Oh yeah, there's no real limit on infected as well so you will see multiple of same special at the same time.
@@mrbruh4746 Especially third world people. I live in one and getting hands on a VR Set and PC that powerful is already a HUGE priviledge for most of us here. I know tons who play Half Life, but zero who played Alyx. I had to watch a streamer playthrough to go through the story and it seemed awesome though :))
It’s amazing to think that 12 years ago I thought games were going to be waaay better than what we had before. Now the only games I can find myself enjoying and coming back to are the games made 12 years ago. Good graphics don’t make a game fun people, gameplay does. Left 4 dead nails that aspect perfectly
Good graphics with no aesthetics are always dated and bad. Look at HL2 and L4D, both use the same engine but have wide difference between graphics. L4D Graphics quality wasnt as high as the design and aesthetics, No Mercy and Dark Carnival will always look good because they arent trying to look super realistic, Generic Woods and Generic Houses in B4B will soon enough look dated, because they dont have any original design
@@ALE199-ita many modern big title games don't focus on fun gameplay or interaction. They focus on flashy graphics. That's why many 10-15 year old games are still just so fundamentally good. They were designed to be fun. Whereas these flashy new titles get old in a week. Maybe a little bit is nostalgia, but design principles have greatly changed over the years
I remember MGS2, Red Faction, HL2, RE4, DMC 3 etc and thinking: Wow imagine games in 10 years! Well more then 10 years later and gamings never been worse, not even 2010 gray FPS war shooter era
I know right? 60 euros for the base fucking game,then an 80 euro middle pack and a 100 fucking euro full pack with all the shit included? dafuk is happening? am i saving up to buy a car or something? not only its just trash and a copy of a masterpiece they tried to cling onto the reputation of L4D and even tarnish it with MTs and paywalls and shit
I'm not gonna lie, of course L4D is great always but from more recently I really enjoy World war Z. Since trying on game pass I've been hooked I think that aftermath expansion (like adding 1st person mode) might swing me to it instead of this.
Your right guys, not only is the full game price a joke but its such an insult to L4D and on top of that there are other games that are better and cheaper. Its just getting so stupid now, can't even pay £60 now and get a full game, even that's a joke as full price used to be £50. Unfortunately it will probably make a lot of money and only keep encouraging this kind of behavior from games companies.
The first thing I would do is removing all the weapon attachments and cards from the game and focus only on the gameplay. It simply takes the focus away from the game and takes it somewhere in the menus where you constantly comparing, reading and choosing things you literally do not need.
The card system was really annoying to me because I, and presumably everyone else, played this game to have fun shooting zombies. I did not load this game up to play a freaking card game that has an incredibly cumbersome menu that you have to navigate through before each round. It makes it even worse when you actually start playing the game and it's just kind of meh and uninspiring. They definitely should have made sure they had a really solid base gameplay before they even started adding all those shiny bells and whistles. Oh well, Left 4 Dead will always be a timeless classic.
@@ToyokaX It's a beta for a game that comes out in 2 months lol. The game is 100% done at this point dude, trust me coming from game development experience, the game has been submitted to microsoft and sony and all the game stores. If anything they're working on a day 1 patch to fix some bugs
Not really, the polish definitely adds that final quality, but B4B unmistakingly misses the mark on even it's core mechanics. If you removed all of the map textures, sound design, and environment effects from a L4D PVP campaign and left yourself with a barebones dev stage level, it would still outshine B4B in every way. It's an insult that B4B mimics the L4D infected phenotypes. It's practically the ONLY thing it has going for it, and then doesn't even utilize them in any meaningful way.
Valve really do inject that secret sauce of heart and character into all of their games, so many companies try to replicate their games but rarely actually realise what makes them special.
I view Valve as a similar to a producer role, they have a hand in shaping the final version of the game and a big part of that is injecting character. Similar to how Devolver Digital publish games without much direct development but there’s still a running theme of big characters and off-kilter humour to a lot of their releases.
@@BlargTheEnderman turle rock is the developer for l4d yeah but valve also play a big role in the game development. i believe valve directed turtle rock's development for l4d and thats what makes l4d great. look at how turtle rock do their own thing without valve, their game "Evolve" was immediately dead
The best way I saw this game described was "Missing that valve magic" It sounds dumb, but i'm certain everyone familiar with l4d, who've played both understands it perfectly
Man I really wanted to like this game but visibility is really bad. You can't really differentiate the special infecteds, like in L4D they made the Hunter wear a hoodie and crawl, the Boomer fat, the Smoker tall and well, "smokes" , etc. All very different from each other PLUS the sound and music cues. Not to mention you could mod the game further with steam workshop and just straight up put Donkey Kong instead of the Tank
It feels like a Chinese knock-off version of Left 4 Dead, lacking all the soul, atmosphere and immersion of the original games and pushing a "next gen" narrative while regressing in almost every single aspect of game play. It doesn't even have a proper VS. mode.
I think they thought “okay, we have good graphics, it’s for the next generation, it’s a sequel to a legendary franchise and we can copy bits from world war z…this is gonna be easy! Let’s put no effort in, they’ll buy it anyway.” They had the ingredients but the food tastes shit
Absolutely shocked that they added so many mechanics and features, but didn't even get basic things right, like pacing. Turtle Rock should try playing the developer commentary for Left 4 Dead 1&2. They might learn a few things.
I don’t get why they decided to make a different game, claiming it wasn’t left 4 dead and literally named it back 4 dead and it’s about zombies and mutated zombies with 4 survivors. Idk if they’re trying to be idiots but why would you do that? I also don’t mind good graphics even though if not used correctly it doesn’t fit the zombie apocalypse atmosphere, but simply relying on good graphics is not good. Not to mention after seeing gameplays where weapons are in boxes and there are cards and perks? And idk if it’s just me but killing the zombies doesn’t feel as satisfying or impactful as killing the zombies in left 4 dead, talking about the animation and the way the zombie dies not the story
My biggest complaint may sound stupid to most people but, I hated not being able to see through the gun sites. Like, I couldn't see what I was aiming at. I just need crosshairs. Card system? No thanks.
The one thing I was PRAYING for in this game was the humorous safe room wall writings and I was just sad and disappointed and realized how soulless the game was when I saw it was either empty or just edgy apocalypse writing
There is a ton of saferoom messages and references … maybe you just didn’t get them? Every level in the first world has one.for example, the first level’s saferoom has a starship troopers quote on the wall. If someone is playing Alejandro, he makes a comment about something touching his leg in the submerged section of that same level which is basically directly quoted from Star Wars episode 4. I’ve pretty much laughed at every piece of graffiti, and commentary but if your not a pop culture buff I guess it’s possible that you wouldn’t notice all the jokes
"I saw one poop a foot!" "They eat feet!?" "I miss the internet." "Otis, Out of film. No Helicopter. Zombies are too fast. Not going to make it. - Frank West"
It feels like too much of a focal point already. Left 4 Dead didn't have that shit and it was leaps and bounds better than this. The problem with this game is the sheer massive quantity of guns that all feel generic and underpowered as hell, the lame special infected, the lack of gore and dismemberment, the underwhelming level design that isn't memorable and the dumb AI. Oh and the shitty protagonists.
It’s actually pretty fun. The “cards” are just buffs that are customizable for your preferred type of game play. If some cards scare you away from a game then… 🤷♂️ stick to CoD or something
@@st.salmonella9827 "You don't like farming entire days for passive buffs that will clearly be mandatory and will lead to a meta setup that you have to RNG your way through? Just stick to COD brub" The fuck are you talking about, it isn't fun, it's tedious as shit and will draw a massive line between players, it isn't about git gud, it's about how OP your build is. In l4d you didn't needed any of that garbage, you only needed your gun and a trustworthy team, it was all about how good you actually played.
When I was doing the post-game survey they ask, I was rating everything 3. It's such a middle of the road experience. Not terrible, but not really anything new.
eh, im with you. i think the pve is actually pretty great, but the pvp is rly bad. and that combined with the initial price and the passes and all in addition? is not good.
Gman: "Back 4 Blood's movement is very nice and snappy, Which is crucial to a game like this." Turtlerock: "So we heard what everyone said about the movement, And we've chosen to ignore all of the feedback and make it sluggish while also nerfing all of the mobility enhancements so we can get one over on speedrunners. K thx bai."
@@roadsidepeekneek7259 It has more to do with the art design being less and less original and it's a shame because we have the tech to do good looking things and here we are.
I'm pretty sure Valve wanted to port both L4D1 and L4D2 campaigns into Source 2 for Left 4 Dead 3, just like they did with L4D1 for L4D2, but that game never came out so...
The idea of blood spatters making you harder to spot is pretty cool. Like one of the debuff cards could be rain that washes it off and certain levels could take advantage
Yeah that's a really cool idea. Hope someone at Turtle Rock sees, tbh Be neat if getting drenched actually served a purpose instead of *just* being a cosmetic/because "haha V I O L E N C E" thing
What I loved about l4d was mainly the lore scattered throught the map, and the option to use user made content through workshop really made the game more enjoyable.
@@DeterminedTorres theres a japanese themed map called yama. That should satisfy your weeb fantasy for a bit. Its also pretty great but too bad nobody played it
This is the one thing I was genuinely worried about for this game: lack of personality. Which is ironic considering how hard they tried to overly design the characters and zombies, but in the end it just became more generic.
the thing that makes l4d replayable after all these years is that the characters have a legitimate and organic chemistry (especially in the first one). you literally never get tired of listening to francis and louis talk to each other.
@@theotv5522 the director AI is probably one of the reasons left 4 dead blew up. For those reading this that don’t know, the director AI changes throughout your playthrough what spawns and where it spawns depending on how well you’re doing. If you’re doing really bad, you’re more likely to find medkits and weaker zombies, if you’re doing really well, you’re more likely to find more special infected and less weapons. THATS AMAZING! It stops you from going “okay, last time I played, a tank spawned right around the corner” so you can’t prepare for it because it most likely won’t play out that way again, this game however, I feel like after a couple of play throughs you’d probably know the map and you’d have 0 fear when encountering zombies
@@entropicflux8849 Back in the day during L4D1 I used to LOVE using the vocalize commands to spark impromptu conversations and remarks between the characters at fitting moments. It was hilarious fun back then. The original 4 survivors just can't be beat man.
I used to love the sound cues in L4D, hearing the growl of the hunter, the cough of the smoker, the gurgle of the boomer, the laugh of the jockey, the cry of the witch, that yell of the charger! Also the looks of the infected depending what campaign, the bride witch, clown infected, the woman boomer. The overall atmosphere of L4D and level design is what drew me in. Hearing the specials but never knowing where they were until boom u getting smashed. Simple but yet kept you coming back for more and my favorite part is coach on stage singing “EVERY LADY CRAZY WHEN HER DADDY NOT AROUND DUNNAA NAANAA NA NA NAAA. GOT REACH FOR THE TOP STAY ON THE MOUNTAIN DUNNAA NAAANAAA NAA NAAAAA!”
My biggest gripe is that they totally went backwards when comparing the insane gore system they had for l4D 1&2 with entrails and the zombies stomachs opened up you seen all their internal organs, the zombies reacted accordingly to what type of bullets were hitting them, arms legs waists along with the heads were able to be sliced and diced, their faces when u shot them would react with damage etc. Well in this one I guess they felt gamers were dumb enough to totally remove that system and just give you giant splats of blood going all over the place, the blood comes from out of thin air right infront of the enemies it looks like, instead of actually coming out of them, but they put so much blood on screen that you have to be watching for it and you see it big time and it pisses me off!! Then on their clothes it don't even get any more blood on them despite that it's supposed to be coming out of their bodies but there's zero feedback on the clothing of the enemies and that's distracting as well!! They just took such a short cut with the lack of a full gore system!!! Especially with these powerful next gen consoles and there taking away from games!!??? To chince out on the gore system to me is one of the most important things to be in a game with zombies, it's gun, game play and GORE!!! Not just blood, there's organs in there somewhere too, I just know it!!! But it is what it is, a lazy cut corners game bc the high up executives want new yachts and remember, they all lost money during covid lockdowns and that's money they will never be able to recuperate so they have to get that money back in any way shape or form!! So it will come in the form of cut content cut corners etc bc that's cut time and time is money, you guys gettin it yet?
With improvements in all the hardware it seems less and less games and companies seem interested in reaching the bondaries of the capacity of the consoles, let alone push those boundaries. Optimization seems an thing from the past, OG real programmers and game developers seem to be a dying breed,
As someone who played some Killing floor. This customization system is Killing Floor meets Warframe. I think sometimes more doesn't mean better. I think characters having their own things are okay but this entire number crunching card system turns off the fun for me. L4D is a game you are supposed to pick up and play, not pick up, make a deck, calculate your odds, maybe play... I do understand this is part of Monster Hunter fun. And i find this FUN in Monster Hunter. But when i play L4D. i expect only 2 things. Pick up a character and play. B4B looks more realistic... realisitc doesn't mean better. L4D was exaggerated and cinematic, and that was the point, you were in a movie. Of course its gonna be spectacular. Why this game refuses to be visually spectacular, i don't know. lack of inspiration.
Something else about Killing Floor, or rather Killing Floor 2, is that it's also a game you're suppose to pick up and play. The perk system in it is very simple and you can easily switch perk sills in between waves, and the cosmetic system is only there to support the game's lifespan more and for you to have your own flare if you want. I won't go into detail on the absurd amount of DLC weapons there are in the game since that's more-so to do with how Tripwire market the game rather than the game's gameplay itself, and anyone who has the DLC is able to share it with anyone else in a match anyways. The point is that KF2 and L4D have this sort of "pick it up and play it with friends" sort of engagement to them. You're enjoying the music, dark, gritty atmosphere, zombie designs, gameplay, and quirky character personalities, not trying to bust your balls over a progression system that you HAVE to partake in.
Honestly idk how ppl keep playing in left 4 dead 2 I tried it several days ago and shooting not satisfying at all I got satisfied while I played in killing floor 2 but not in left 4 dead 2 so I played one game and did refund
I don't think B4B looks more realistic. I mean jeez, you reload a gun in 1 second flat and there's no enemy dismemberment, lots of systems are goofy. Left 4 Dead 2 was far... Far slower but more impactful as a result, every decision essentially mattered. I don't think it's fair to say that Back 4 Blood should have just had the EXACT same weapon tier system, with the exact same amount of weapons as Left 4 Dead 2, and the exact same style of characters, identical feeling movement and gunplay. No. Whatever they did, if it wasn't a fully licensed Left 4 Dead 3 that expounded on the lore of the universe and featured very similar gameplay, and even then, it would be frowned upon by fans. But as B4B is now, none of these things are a problem as much as the game feeling lazy and the poor execution of all of these things.
This comment sums up most about why people refuse to like this game, or fault it heavily: "In left 4 dead I had (insert experience here) and this doesn't feel like that" There is a very good reason for that... this ISNT Left 4 Dead! Yes its a game very much in the same vein but comparing this to Left 4 Dead is like comparing Metal Gear Solid to Sly Cooper... they are both stealth games after all.
@@geddybear9108 except I'd argue that one of these comparisons has more ground to stand on, since SUPPOSEDLY the developers that worked on L4D also worked on Back 4 Blood. When you hear this, you don't think "different games but same developers looking to recapture the first game's feel = not even related". Come on.
my biggest gripe with the game, is that it feels TOO eager to get into the action, you know? at least in the l4d's it tried to build up suspense right after you leave that safe room with the slow start but in b4b when i leave the safe room i get rushed by a bunch of zombies from the get go. i hope they put more love into the horror aspect of the game
That sounds a lot like they're just plain scared of 'boring' the player, and completely not understanding that the quiet between hordes is the perfect time for scavenging and building tension.
Idk man, that's more up to the RNG engine of the L4D games, because I've definitely had games where we get smacked by hordes immediately out of the safe room. Especially if you take extra time setting up before leaving.
@@jase276 The reason those are memorable is that they don't happen every single time. Most starts in L4D are quiet. I don't think I had a single start of round in B4B that was quiet, it was always rushed by zombies from the get go, not even 20m outside the safehouse.
GG, i've been watching you for hte better part of a decade. And while i basically always like and agree with your input. All you ever do is ruin things i'm excited about. You're like a white skinny version of dunkey.
Definitely don't take a boomer shooterer as the be all end all! I watch him for more entertainment and mentions of the little things Also props for delivering constructive criticism as nicely as possible 😂
i think what this game lacks is valve's magic in it that made L4D so special, afterall how would you call this a L4D spiritual successor if this game is built in the Unreal Engine 4 & not the Source engine
@PirateCat91 Borderlands, Bioshock, Rocket League, The modern Batman games, Tekken 7, The Ascent, Gears of War, The Chivalry, Ark Survival Evolved, Psychonauts 2, Atomic Heart, Bulletstorm, Sea of Thieves, Little Nightmares II, and Dead by Daylight Tell me those games are soulless and I’m sending you to a psych ward
My friend tried to convince me that Turtle Rock isn't trying to make Left 4 Dead again, but do their own thing with the formula. Bruh, the game is 'LITERALLY' called Back 4 Blood. It is trying so hard to appeal to fans of Left 4 Dead. The only thing that looks somewhat appealing to this compared to Left 4 Dead is probably the gunplay, but it also just feels so generic, and would probably be done better in other games anyway. It's like if the game design of Left 4 Dead and Call of Duty's Warzone had a very disappointing baby. Sure on the outset it looks like Left 4 Dead, but without any of the charm and memorability of Left 4 Dead, the characters are generic and annoying, the levels are too dark and too filled with clutter, that it, funnily enough, feels like it lacks detail. The UI looks very similar to Left 4 Dead's in a lot of ways, but unlike Left 4 Dead, they seem to not know when to tone things down; you have a stamina bar, a list of tasks, item and quest markers. Call me old fashioned, but the fact that I could tell where to go because of how the game and its levels were designed is a lot more engaging, not only that but the addition of a sprint feature basically waters down the experience to a run and gun shooter with little to no downtime because you're already sprinting to the next objective. The weapons you find have random loot attached to them like Warzone, but unlike Warzone you can't swap attachments and make a more unique weapon, or weapon that at least fits your playstyle more. It feels like they're trying too hard, and not at all at the same time.
Spiritual successor does not mean sequel, they are aloud to do their own thing with it. We can't know the charm of the characters because half of them werent in the beta (same with special infected). If you're so against the markers turn them off. the maps still are pretty clear on where to go. If you're sprinting to the next fight you're doing something wrong and not conserving your stamina. Also you can swap attachments but not remove them, which kinda sucks but my point stands regardless.
Dude the mental gymnastics are too real on this game. Everyones trying to rollback. On the B4B subreddit they even have people trying to convince that not having campaign maps for versus mode is a good idea. Its sad really. The game is trying to do too many things and failing at all of them.
I think what's important to know is that the original L4D developers no longer works in TRS, that and L4D have Valve's hands directly affecting the development heavily.
That is completely untrue, try researching before trying to shit on something. Phil Robb, the COFOUNDER of TRS and game director is still there. (im sure there are others but hes the most public)
@@spreadator8276 Most of the shitting on this game is completely uninformed or made up. It's fucking weird. It's got real and actual problems but people make shit up anyways. When did the internet become this?
This game feels like a cash grab, 12 years later and the games "atmosphere" is cheesy in a non enjoyable way and is a downstep from Left 4 Dead. Animations never upgraded after 12 years, its like a basic unreal engine 4 game. There is no tension to get to the safe house, you can just sneak walk through the whole game slowly killing zombies and be okay. This would be fine if they didn't market the game as a LFD2 spiritual successor. If your market it like that people expect a LFD3, don't be mad at us the consumer.. that's what we do, we consume what we want to consume. Would you rather eat a Little Caesars $5 pizza for a whole year or a 5 star rated mom and pop pizza instead? It's not our fault you marketed it like LFD3. Trying to sell us off of our nostalgia, keep the game simple and more fun instead of complicated and tedious. Edit: The thing is this game isn't being made by a small indie studio, its turtle rock, and these guys are funded by WB games, they got the cash to make a High Quality game.
If this game were as fun as L4D it could be recaptured, but the bad level design, bad weapons, shitty protagonists and lack of gore/dismemberment really make this game no where near on the same level of L4D.
I played keyboard and mouse with friends when L4D2 came out, I met awesome lifetime friends and played until we literally couldn't stay awake. 5-6 am. People from all over the world. Awesome community back then. Even if people think such games exist today, I honestly think they do not. It was like the best Halloween party you've ever been to every night. Loads of awesome gamers chatting on steam, having drinks, sharing music, connecting and meeting irl.
No game can. No anime can capture the feel of a classic either. You used to get the rare top tier game everyone played or anime everyone watched every year or two. Now you get like 6-12 a year of the same quality. Nothing will ever feel as special as ti once was because nothing can stand out as much anymore and that's a good thing because that's how much our selection of games and anime has improved. We went from riding individual games until we had completely exhausted them to having more good games than we could ever play.
I thought so after Evolve. Evolve had all the hallmarks of a company that had its priorities firmly on recurrent monetization without any of the excellent game design philosophy that made games like L4D great.
Something I find funny is that versus mode can start without a single person on the other team. This happened to me and after my team had completed the cleaner round, we were just running around as the special ridden.
Will probaly be forgoten and unplayble in a few years ,like Walking Dead or Evolve . And I like your profile picture reminds that Interpol music video.
@McDude -- that's actually pretty much what I envision for myself. If it's on a huge sale at one point (well over 50% off) I may pick it up, but otherwise I lack a drive to go for it
What he says about the fire is so true! Remember how scary that first mission was when you come out the elevator and the whole place is just torched visibility is hard because of the smoke and the infected running through the fire screaming was just so intense. Back 4 Blood has triple the budget but looks worse?
To the thing about people rage-quitting after getting their asses handed to them - maybe consider adding something like a "crushing defeat" where one team gets beaten so badly that they don't even get a rematch, and the other team just gets declared the winners flat out. Saves people the time of having to get stomped a second time while also removing the necessity of rage-quitting at the end of a round. The matches that are worth playing get played, while the stomps allow you to swiftly move on the the next match?
Addendum: make it an opt in thing for the players who lost, I imagine there's quite a few people for whom that'd be humiliating and offputting Lessen the blow to the ego so to speak
I had this experience when I tried versus mode as well. To the enemy team's credit, they stuck around for the whole session and accepted their loss, but it was an absolute 3-0 slaughter for us. After the first match was over, I found myself saying to my friends, "Wait, we have to do that to them 2 more times?"
Big problem with this - L4D2 is still very enjoyable, still has a vast array of custom maps, and is still really well balanced. And when that's not enough, Deep Rock Galactic exists. So Back 4 Blood is already doomed - it's openly trying to compete with the best coop shooters around. Also, it's always a bad sign when a game uses those CoD-style hit feedback crosshairs. If a game needs to give you HUD feedback on whether or not you've hit a target... the game itself is not giving enough basic visual feedback. You should know, at a glance, whether or not you hit something. Meanwhile, the different character stats... that's not gonna end well. L4D worked so well because a random group of players could be united by the game's ability to punish them for NOT working together. A game with different character stats? You're gonna get a lot of players blaming each other when things go wrong, or getting real toxic over character choices before the session even starts. Same problem with the different ammo types - what if everyone WANTS to use the shotgun? Suddenly you have teammates stealing ammo and turning on each other.
@@syli3694 Which shouldn't be needed. With proper animation, effect and sound feedback, you should always know when you've killed something. The gore system and sound feedback in L4D handles this perfectly.
@@spreadator8276 Your comment smells a little of someone who hasn't played on higher difficulties. And as I said: "And when that's not enough, Deep Rock Galactic".
@Nushia everyone here knows tr is the og creator of l4d, all tho i would say valve is a major reason why left 4 dead is so well crafted. not to mention most if not all original devs did not work on this game
Hey bro, you prob dont remember me, but I remember when you were such a small channel. You took advice with a grain of salt and didnt let your ego blind you to criticism. I can see how much youve grown as a channel, and Im super happy that you also give some of the most fair reviews while keeping your humor, along with not letting your own emotions overwhelm and take over your video into biased or off topic review. Thanks for still being my favorite video game reviewer bro, I hope you will stay successful! Lack of good reviewers nowadays that arent copy pasted af.
I had to turn off recoil recentering and hitmarkers before it started feeling okay. If you need to put hitmarkers in your zombie shooting game you need to rework your visual player feedback.
I hate how hitmarkers are a gaming trend, even halo infinite campaign has them. what happened to subtle design that gives feedback to the player when they are hitting something?
Damn, i couldn't agree more with a lot of things you said here. I want to like Back 4 Blood, and to be honest i kinda like how the mechanics, guns and such, but something about the game just doesn't click for me. I have not felt "the thing" i felt for L4D on any type of horde shooter ever, B4B feels much more fake and cartoony, L4D felt like the characters were actually going through something mostly believeable with amazing atmosphere and facing infected that could happen. B4B just.. looks generic, like a boring shooter with mediocre character design and soulless world design, especially in comparison to L4D, which is a game i honestly really loved for many reasons. This game is not terrible by any means, but i just don't know how to feel about it, especially considering they are going for the live service route, which i don't usually mind but it feels like it could really ruin a game like this.
That's the worst part about Back 4 Blood to me as well. The game itself is pretty okay and can be fun, but the game world and characters feel so generic and uninspired. The player characters are incredibly boring and forgettable, with no personality at all, and the game world just feels... uninteresting and uninspired. It all just feels really generic, despite the gameplay being enjoyable. Not really a fan of the setting or art style much at all.
To me, the characters I've seen feels so flat and boring. Like generic young people designed by people who aren't. Where's Coach or Rochelle or Nick or Bill? The levels feels the same. Just generic dull dark urban and forest levels. Where's New Orleans or the swamp or the hospital? But hey, maybe that's coming in the full game.
Personally, I love the gunplay in B4B. It feels really smooth compared to L4D and other games in that genre. But I do agree, the art style is a bit questionable and doesn't have that same gritty feeling in some places (more specifically, the places with the "tentacles" and nests with the organs trailing from place to place). It feels out of place from the rest of the art in the game.
Speaking of horde shooters, I feel Deep Rock Galactic needs to be part of the conversation since it filled the void that wanting to play a modern L4D left in my heart. While it's not 1 to 1, as DRG has classes and another dimension to its gameplay of exploration, mining, and terrain traversal, I feel like horde shooters should have some degree of environmental manipulation like creating chokepoints, bunkering down somewhere, or creating traps in order to deal with ammo conservation in a player inventive way. Also the personality of the horde shooter, which DRG and L4D had in spades. Also weapon variety and enemy variety, not even just completely different enemies but variations on existing ones to make the endless stream of hordes more unique.
The L4D games were truly great games. So many ideosyncracies and details to the gameplay, that even years later you still find new ways to play, or notice interesting game design. This new game just looks like it completely missed the point of the originals.
Yikes. That's what I was afraid of, this being EVOLVE all over again. Turtle Rock really caught lightning in a bottle with L4D which to this day is still very enjoyable to play.
bro nobody is playing this game for the pvp lol. the pve experience was a ton of fun imo. It made everything feel really tense. Having limited continues in a run. Its a fun rogue like zombie shooter
@@thehumerus To be clear for full context here, I LOVED Evolve. Especially after the free to play gameplay changes relaunch. I think it's a shame Evolve wasn't closer to the Left 4 Dead formula with little swarms of aliens and campaigns etc because if it did, that game would still be successful today. I'm saying it's not Evolve because... It's not even close to being anything like Evolve. It's literally Left 4 Dead 3, but instead of campaign mode PvP there's static maps from the campaign mode PvP. That is basically functionally the biggest difference. Love it, hate it, whatever, comparing this to Evolve as a GAME is dumb. Wanna compare it to Evolve because of shitty dumb monetization plans and battle passes etc? Sure. Fine.,
@@MattAlbie Ahh, alright I see what you're saying. Yeah, Back 4 Blood is by no means a terrible game. I just hope they don't pull the classic micro-transaction bullshit that so many games do today, because that's just absolutely horrendous. I'm glad we can discuss this like normal people though. That's pretty rare for a RUclips comment section lmao.
The sad truth is A LOT of games are like this now. I'm not saying all! But you can tell when a game was made as a passion vs as a job. The little things actually add up and matter. You only care about the little things when you're creating something you love.
A game I can think of that isn't like this is Titanfall 2 which funnily enough was built on Source like L4D2 (which this game is being compared to) and not only does it have a unique aesthetic and dope ass mechs but also the devs knew how to make gunplay fun (as expected from MW1 and MW2's devs). Now obviously I'm not saying B4B should be a sci-fi shooter but it should try to find a way to make itself unique to appeal to an audience. Also a lot of games in general aren't really taking advantage of how far technology has come because they'd rather make a game look photorealstically pretty to appeal to casuals that could be dated in a few years easily instead of a unique artstyle or aesthetic that ages like fine wine. Also B4B will he drowned out by the fierce competition that is Halo Infinite and Battlefield 2042 in terms of more modern releases regardless of the quality of those games. So the devs are in a tight rut they made for themselves. Now since I don't have access to a beta I can't really properly judge how this game plays bit based on impressions the signs aren't good and I'm not curious enough to try this game out for $60 when my money is better spent elsewhere.
That’s why I’m hyped for the aliens game I can tell the devs really like the alien universe and have been working super hard on it even if know it won’t be perfect because it being a budget indi game I know I will have fun with it like World war Z that I still play aloooot till this day and can’t wait for the new patches and dlc
For me is the grinding Really dislike that from games , like I don't want to sit down for 2hrs and collect random stuffs so I can level up my knife , I prefer a hard game that you need to get better irl than getting better in game via leveling up
Yep; modern games have prohibited modding (community created content / free r & d) so the devs can nickel & dime customers. Sadly, this is why the industry is creatively bereft and circling the drain now. The crash can’t come soon enough.
@@TheKaoticSanity They aren't releasing with microtransactions... they did say they might consider them but what are they going to do, the supply points? They are so easy to get.
I played Left4Dead 2 first time ever after playing this beta for Back4Blood and Im really loving it. Its the little things, like shooting in the dark where the only source of light is your flashlight and the flash from your gun when firing bullets. Feels so great, zombies running at you in the dark of the empty mall, only visible to you in flashes of light, so atmospheric and immersive.
I preferred L4D, but both it and its sequel are masterpieces. L4D2 has some better objectives and weapons, but I fell in love with the atmosphere of the first game.
I'm personally just hyped for the first person mode that is officially coming to the World War Z, it looks cool as hell and the amount of content in that game is insane and constantly growing.
@@frank.e.wildcat yea man wait for the aftermath expansion. If I'm not mistaken it includes all DLC for the base game, as well as a ton other features it looks fantastic imo
@@thisismyname5657 there is 5 chapters 3 To 4 levels each add into 2 more with the aftermath patch will Make a total amount of 7 chapters countless new guns to try and use like 3 new classes with more coming with the aftermath patch and guns as well now there adding an FPV mode and fixing the melee combat the only thing lacking is horde atm that only has 1 level witch I’m Sure they will add more
they never fix this problem with patches, Back 4 Blood is a complete write off. Balance and bugs is all patches ever address these days. Blame overly streamlined game engine tool boxes and hiring too many depressed twitter addicted morons.
Doesn’t feel like L4D at all; as the guy above me said, it feels more like CoD zombies. People kept talking about how this was going to kill WWZ and be the best coop zombie game out there, but WWZ feels more L4D than this game (especially on insane difficulty). Can’t count the amount of times I’ve laughed at a friend getting caught by a Bull or exploded by a Bomber, or how a horde completely blind-sided me, or how I tried to be a badass by running ahead alone and got ambushed by a Lurker. But the special infected in this game are just so bland. The “zombies” in this game are bland. It tried copying the L4D aesthetic (and managed here and there) but nothing about it feels remotely similar or even superior.
Yeah because it was memorable like the specials,you knew shit is going to get real when you hear it so in the back of your head you always wanted to never hear them but at the same time you knew you will hear them any second
@@nutarchive9349 which is also a thing stolen from L4D2 the Blood Harvest campaign,when you enter the cornfield and the crows get scared and fly which triggers the horde,i swear the devs of B4B either copy and pasted content from L4D or tried to copy stuff from L4D in the laziest and trashiest way possible
@@SHAdow98V You read it in the description that TurtleRock claims to be the creators of the L4D series without crediting Valve. I believe it was Valve that made these games so good. How did they manage to create a worse version of L4D if they made the others? It's not original, it's generic. It's boring, and it's forgettable. Makes me wanna play Left 4 Dead 2.
@@nutarchive9349 Agree,slap some mods onto that bad boy and you get hundreds of time a better experience than having the 100 euros premium version of B4B,btw have i mentioned how much i hate the fact that this trash is sooo fucking expensive?
No end game: There doesn't need to be one look at L4D 1 & 2 Generic gun: Good most games the try to fix it up with lesser known guns end up with a bunch of guns people don't give a shit about and don't want to use. Guns don't feel like they have a roll like in L4D: I literally have no idea how you got to this conclusion. Shotguns = best horde clear, Snipers = best special killers, Assault weapons for middle ground, SMGs for the same kind of function the assault weapons have but with a different style and there's clearly different types of each...like what? Characters wear impractical clothing: Louis literally wears a tie in L4D which could easily get him killed. You mention he's all messy looking but not that. Like I'm not saying the game is perfect it easily has it's flaws and a good chunk of them but complaints like the ones above are just kind of foolish and honestly feel like you were just out looking for extra things to complain about just for the sake of complaining.
A lot of the weapons in L4D were not just laying around, they had some kind of backstory: found a hunting rifle near a campfire and a sleeping bag with a trail of blood, a handgun near a dead body, hand grenades near military vehicles, and melee weapons to common places where they should belong e.g. fry pan in kitchens.
L4d is everything this game is trying to be but fails , i mean valve is freaking great at inserting logic in their games espicially in terms of the gameplay and the lore also what i liked about l4d is the zombies and the enemies are unpredecatable it's like you finish a horde you try to access the safe room or a dark space till you find some zombies hiding in the corner espicially the witch also i like how you just go follow your teamates then suddenly you find boomer next to you , i mean the l4d 1 and 2 are great espicially 2 .
You mean you don’t find kalishnokovs on the trail when you’re taking a hike?
Man, must be boring where you live
And Sniper Rifle (G3SG1) beside dead paratrooper guy on swamp map i believe?
Well the philosophy is different, its a game for a new generation of teens that prefer just shooting at stuff, getting covered in blood and buying progress with real money, so for the current generation its awesome 👌
@@StoneCoolds "buying progress with real money"
Yeah that's the problem with the current gen
This game makes me think that Valve back in the day were EXTREMELY good at making a game fun to play
If you've seen Alyx they still are EXTREMELY good at making games, they just cancel most projects so we dont get many.
@@Freestyle80 They were, but steams success has made making games less appealing when they can just sit back and earn fat stacks
@@LiewLmao At least they haven't gotten lazy and released crappy games
@@LiewLmao I don't even feel like it's laziness, but extreme perfectionism plus the ability to financially recover from just straight up scrapping projects far into development and the freedom for staff to move to whatever project they want. There's no monetary pressure for them to have to pump out questionable quality games every year like some game devs, so instead they mull around with game projects for weeks/months/years that ultimately go nowhere as the individuals lose interest or get caught up on other projects. It's definitely a problem since I'm sure they've scrapped a ton of enjoyable games for trivial reasons, but I wouldn't conflate it with laziness.
@@faceless2302 i mean, when you have a literal money printing machine in your backroom, there's so incentive to do anything besides upkeep said printer. the steam deck at least looks really good and maybe make valve make a few little games specifically made for the deck
I think it's really all presentation. What made Left 4 Dead so special was the dinginess of it, especially the first game with it's film grain, creepy and unique music, and the consistent movie style presentation. What made Left 4 Dead special was that they had a consistent horror movie style in mind and everything in the game served to deliver that atmosphere. From the movie posters to the gritty characters, it felt like a real world and had an oddly cinematic experience. I'll never forget the the intro to No Mercy with the helicopter flying this dark and dingy cityscape, zooming in on the characters in a precarious situation.
Totally. Like some lost Grindhouse movies or something.
L4D 2 has a film grain slider you can have more, less or the same as L4D 1 not to mention you can play everything on L4D 2
See for me I think of the characters. If you were around for both at the hight of its popularity then you can name that characters. Each one of them had personaly.
Well...now I wanna play left 4 dead
Its definitely more than presentation.
Another misstep is giving the Ogre a visible health bar. You know exactly how close to death it is at all times whereas in Left 4 Dead you'd only have a general idea of how close the Tank was to dying after playing a few times.
The ogre can litteraly take like 30 minutes to kill though so I need the health bar
@@ralphthefrog3086 Tank doesn't need a healthcare. He's not unstoppable, but he feels like it. Ogre is a little bitch compared to Tank.
Is that tank low on health? I don't know - maybe.
I hate that they made the new tank the ogre take so long to kill, its completely unnecessary.
@@cpt.lounatic I mean, it's a giant fucking monster. I'd expect it to be rather tanky. I just wish it was more interesting and fun to fight. You can literally just camp indoors until it goes away or dies.
@@OrionDawn15 i heard you can run away from them, is that true?
*_"Pills here!"_*
[watches Gman's review of Back 4 Blood]
_"Boy, I hope they're antidepressants."_
"Grabbin pills"
@@stevenseagull4990 You're not the REAL Steven Seagull. You're an imposter 😮
I found some blackpills. It say's on the side that the game was designed for shareholders and that people that buy the game will feel really bad when it becomes f2p.
nice to see you here Indigo
"Grabbin' everything i can!" Starts to shits everywhere
In the portugese dub of the game, Goku's voice actor plays a character in the game, so hearing Goku swear is pretty amusing
That sounds hilarious
ruclips.net/video/vDC9S8_mNxY/видео.html
Chadku
wendel bezerra? YOOOOOOOOOOOOO 10/10 game, papa wendel is in it
His dubbed or subbed voice?
The biggest issue I have with B4B is the lack of character and style. What made the world and characters so engaging in Left 4 Dead is how they weren't constantly trying to be a quirky stereotype. Even the zombie designs are so boring and generic, unlike L4D infected which mutate based on the lifestyle the person had before becoming infected. That, along with level design, price, mods...
Just play Left 4 Dead 2 instead.
It's like they tried to emulate what made L4D so good without looking at it. The trailers alone let you shower in the L4D charm. This game reeks of marketing department.
not really, this only applies to l4d1
l4d2 definitely tried to be quirky all the time
its not as bad as here, but still bad
@IV CYAN sure you can like that style, disagree on that
but its undeniable that l4d1's serious tone with moments of lighthearted goofing from characters was replaced with characters continously cracking jokes and throwing one liners like its a generic hollywood action movie
@@teratoma. I must agree, that L4D2 had much more comedy... however, I feel that it fits much more naturally, as well as not actually seeming forced for the most part. B4B just feels like cliche after cliche
Yeah this game just makes me wanna play left for dead even more 😂 it’s like eating a generic brand of food an getting mad, then when you finally get the brand name it’s so satisfying lol
Going from Evolved to this… I’m starting to think that Valve was the one who did all the work on Left 4 Dead and Turtle Rock just took the glory
Apparently they were hugly involved in L4D1 and valve made L4D2 alone.
Spoiler, they were.
Valve essentially had to course correct L4D1 to make it good, and L4D2 which is made purely by valve is notably better in terms of level design, character design and writing.
@@carljohan9265 meh i think the characters in the first game is more memorable, but the gameplay of the second is such a leap forward.
@@genos876 I think l4d2 characters are good, but like it doesn't have the big emotional impact in the story like Bill sacrifice.
but if you look a bit deeply to how they talk to each other in each level or if when every other characters die.
like nick will say "Goddamn it, Coach, what'd you leave me with?" when he saw coach die.
Or Ellis has a lot of stories about his friends, and it adds up to his non-stop talking personality.
kinda funny that we're so used to it being "big company takes all the glory from small studio" that we didn't even consider if valve themselves were the ones responsible of making l4d as memorable as it is
the fact they have announced mutiple DLC packs and are pushing 100$ versions, before release, shows where their priorities are
Its exactly like Evolve all over again
I still have no clue why anyone has any faith in them after Evolve
FACTS
its weird that evolve got so many award before the game got released like lawbreakers. Maybe this game too?
Yup, it really does speak volumes. By comparison, look at Left 4 Dead - when Left 4 Dead 2 came out, a lot of us were fairly vocal about how we were disappointed that the new stuff hadn't simply been added to the first game. But look at what Valve did in the end -
For FREE, they ported ALL of the first game's content to the second game. So now you have two games in one.
Yeah i think they are using the legacy they had with the L4D series so many people would buy B4B and then they can throw as many DLC packs that will cost a lot of money. I hope they really dont go that way with a lot of microtransactions with overpriced.
Not only is the special infected theme telling you that there's a special infected around, if you play with your friends you're trying to compete on which one of you can find and kill them first. That is what's so fun with L4D. Not only you're working together to survive, but also to compete.
I liked the themes because they made it more accessible for some players
@@40proofbleach81 I like tension building in L4D when the backsound for each special infected is on and it gives different characteristic and tone for each special infected. B4B doesn't have different backsound for each special ridden.
I only noticed the issue with infected on the hardest difficulty.. at that point snitches and armored zombies made a lot of appearances.. try it when the open beta is live on the 12th. You will notice a bigger variety in specials.
Yes
On my runs I only saw 3 tall boys and a lot a lot of spitters which half the time just shot me with something and I take damage and not get glued with her web
I might be boomer these days for thinking this but I like how in L4D2 there is no progression. Some cosmetic stuff would be nice in L4D2 but luckily there is no perks and upgrades.
And somehow L4D2 is far more enjoyable. It's probably the simplicity and the "straight forward" aspect that made me like L4D2 more but it's probably just me.
Workshop exist for a reason, why pay for skins when you can download them for free? hell, why not even download maps for free? instead of paying 30$ for a forgettable map pack.
@@hankerbanker6 yeah exactly. It's crazy what people in the community have made in Workshop while P2W cosmetics in a lot of video games these days looks the same and repetitive. It's either colorful rainbow skins or a dark/horror themed.
Boomer pride worldwide.
Yeah it's weird, I'm not averse to that kinda stuff in other games, but when I see a L4D-like come out and it has that stuff in it, for some reason it just immediately turns me off the game a bit. Could be just that I prefer L4D's get in and go nature. There's no builds to worry about. No loot to stop and inspect. etc etc. It's just 'alright lets go'.
My problem with the "lore" of b4b is: if they are a special team that does clean up, why not wait for backup for the campaign finale? At least in l4d you knew why they had to go alone through the hordes, to get to that evac in time, but b4b is just a team taking exaggerated risks when they could just wait for backup from their higher ups.
Not to mention when I think of cleaners, I expect them to be heavily armed, equipped properly, and are there purely for slaughtering zombies (I know they aren't zombies but you get my point.) similar to Killing Floor 2 cast. The B4B doesn't fit this at all and is in a weird middle-ground.
That wasn’t the campaign finale, it was the finale of Act 1 in a BETA, we’re not gonna have the full thing yet
@@MemeSlayer I didn't say that the end of the beta was THE end, but it still applies, why go alone and face a finale-like scenario?
@@damianpalavecino3061 the game isn’t out yet, we’ll have to wait and see the bigger picture
@@MemeSlayer The game is a 4 player game, this means no more players to act as backup. And the design oversights that the other guy mentioned still apply. Unless they change the game's lore and/or character design, it still won't make sense.
Fun fact: the versus in b4b is literally just versus survival in L4D2, which is an offshoot gamemode of the actual versus where you run through the campaign instead
Its somehow worse than that, they copied the least played L4D2 mode instead of the popular one people asked for (campaign versus)
What a shame
LOL something on the back of my brain was telling me "Wait, didn't the original L4D have game modes called mutations or something like that?" but it's been so long that I kinda let it go thinking that my brain was making shit up, mandela effect style.
Hell even scavenger mode seems more fun than this
@@chc2650 They can always add that mode in. But the campaign mode looks good, and I'm hearing good stuff about the campaign from other reviewers
Campaign versus was very fun hopefully one day they will change their minds and add it in .
Also I got rekt in nightmare mode if anyone wants to watch it
L4D had really good writing. You can still play it 12 years later and run into new dialog and funny situations. It was basically a comedy game, while B4B just feels like a tryhard generic military shooter.
The Keith stories that Ellis tells still crack me up. And the little touches like Coach saying “incenderary ammo”… there’s just no way these B4B characters can match that. They look like a character design student’s portfolio work; aesthetically pleasing, demonstrating understanding of technique, but lacking true art direction. Coupled with the card system, hit markers, and other small design details, it telegraphs a lack of true vision or identity.
Completely agree, every modern co-op game has to be a sweatfest where you know every mechanic even on the lower difficulties. While the co-op genre is perfect for sweatfest tactical games, it's numbing how every modern co-op game has become that. Left 4 Dead, even on Expert mode required significantly less brain power than B4B on it's normal mode. For some, it's good that it's super tactical and sweaty but I like to play games to have fun and have a realistic challenge to accomplish.
L4D1 was very much a horror comedy, whilst L4D2 was a Dead Rising-esque Zombie Action Comedy.
Both of them feel so much better than B4B.
Gunplay is significantly better than L4D but the card system is just fucking stupid and seems like a cheap way to monetize the game. If they start selling rare card packs I'm fucking done.
This is true - and it's not just the writing. The basic nature of the game, while inherently horrific, is also inherently comedic, which is why it works so well as a coop game - any stress, any frustration, is countered by the inherent hilarity of it.
I still remember with fondness playing the first L4D's demo, back before it released, and me and my friends laughing hysterically at the first time we got swarmed and kicked to the ground; there was something utterly over the top and ridiculous about our characters screaming while a horde of infected kicked and punched us relentlessly.
I absolutely agree with what you said about the character design in B4B. The simplistic attire of L4D characters added to the game's atmosphere, and it gave you this "I didn't sign up for this s**t" vibe. B4B's characters look like they expected a film crew to arrive so they can make a documentary about killing zombies in the zombie apocalypse, and picked an outfit that perfectly matches their personality to impress the audience.
i knew the game wasn't going to work for me when they described the crew as "instead of being average people in a crisis situation, these are competent and motivated mercenaries". so, unrelatable and self-promotional? no thanks, lemme just listen to francis tell me how much he hates vampires.
@@entropicflux8849 I hate overdesigned characters
@@entropicflux8849 At the very least if they are gonna make the new crew a bunch of trained mercenaries they could have made them, you know, LOOK LIKE TRAINED MERCENARIES! Like, why do they look and talk like a bunch of zoomers who randomly found themselves in the middle of the apocalypse? Only that Mom character and the black dude who looks like he came straight out of Ghost Recon Wildlands somewhat look like "trained soldiers", everyone looks nothing like a professional.
I know right? That contrast between the characters straight from the outfits alone!
Rochelle's jeans and depeche mode shirt to Nick's well off white suit in L4D 2 and Louis' work clothes to Zoey's pink jacket and jeans in L4D 1
@@entropicflux8849 then keep playing some outdated game and save your money because this game is awesome lol
They don't deserve to be called "creators of left 4 dead", just "creators of Evolve". Like how crowbcat ended it with.
Seriously. The devs couldn’t stop themselves from slapping the ‘FROM THE CREATORS OF LEFT 4 DEAD’ sticker on anything Back 4 Blood related, when in actuality, only 7 members from the original Left 4 Dead team actually worked on Back 4 Blood. The original Left 4 Dead team had, what? 60+ members? It’s obvious that the ‘creators of Left 4 Dead’ thing was just a marketing tool to ride on the success of an immensely better game.
One of the good things about the Left 4 dead series is how it feels like a group of normal survivors just barely trying to make it from one classic zombie outbreak situation to another it really adds a lot to the gameplay. The idea of a group going in intentionally to clean up just takes away some of the feeling of desperation and charm.
It's like classic Resident Evil compared to RE6.
It's a cool idea, and I think it could be done really well because not only does it make sense, it also leads toward more potential ideas in how things turn out. Instead of fighting your way to an evac point, you have to, say, fight your way into the oncoming horde and tear up as many undead as you can before completing your objective, and THEN finding an alternate way to escape or have to continue on. I get why they tried to make that work, and to an extent I still think it's a cool idea, but it's like a balance that has to be made. It sadly seems like they missed said balance.
Na. I still felt overwhelmed every run when I was getting bombarded by the hoards. Despite the lore telling me to feel otherwise.
I really can't understand how these people are specialists intentionally going in. They are not dressed for combat in the slightest. Even in the most poor nations, when you have guys going into combat, they have rigs and clothes made to make shooting and the activity you will be doing easier. These guys look like California idiots going into a zombie amusement park and brought their best clothes for an instagram photo. I cannot see them as professionals. Even for zombie games, there are standards you have to abide by when it comes to surviving the hoard rather you are a professional military soldier or just some guy trying to escape after his office was overrun during his coffee break.
"Normal survivors"
Able to use every single gun under the sun and a katana to a masters level... At least this cleaning squad of elite soldiers sounds better than "trust me there normal guys". And I don't think I've felt anything in left 4 dead in my entire life, kinda hard to feel anything when I'm sh*tposting with my friends in circus plagued by zombies. Not much room for a emotion in that scenario...
It feels a lot like Turtle Rock is trying to get back into things by remaking what made them in the first place - while not understanding how gaming has evolved or why L4D has the longevity it has.
*cough* mod support *cough*
In many aspects it also feels inferior to L4D, like the developers didn't quite understand what made L4D so simple yet so great.
But I don't think anyone who worked on L4D is still there at Turtle Rock, so not a big surprise.
But like he said in the video, it doesn't even have the detailed presentation, AI quirks, or the horror/tension of L4D that made those games more than just generic zombie shooters.
I pretty much expected this after evolve I'm not sure why anyone would trust them to make a quality product after that
Turtle rock is trying to ride off of their past accomplishments without making a good game again. It happened with Evolve, and it'll happen with back 4 blood
Coach: "I thought they were supposed to make this game the amazing successor to ours!"
Nick: "Looks like there's been a change of plans..."
Coach: "This used to be a respectable gaming company."
@@descendantofartorias2067 it's sad to watch your favourite game series get butchered one by one,it's like one of those slasher halloween movies where the victims get thrown in a meat grinder,I think we will never see peak gaming like the 2000 up until the 2010 era again
@@falco5148 well not all the lfd developers are there some left
@@falco5148 oh trust me I'm a fallout fan I know. You're probably right but I'm still holding out hope that we will see an era like 2000-2010 again, most of 2011-2020 went from mediocre to bad but their were some gems like Doom, the continuation of my favorite franchise with DMC 5, the boomer shooter renaissance in the indie scene and the souls Bourne series.
@@falco5148 How is l4d getting butchered? Spiritual succesor does not mean sequel, so back 4 blood should not tarnish l4d.
16:53 - Small detail, but even putting a health-bar on a "mini boss" is a mistake. Because not having that with say the Tank in L4D really help keeping up the tension and suspense, as you didn't know when it would end. - Having too much info, even as little as knowing how close to the end a character is, removes that tension and will just make the players spam the last little bit so they could guarantee ending it right then and there. - I loved the times of uncertainty during very intense playthroughs in L4D, where sometimes you'd get a moment of quiet without any attacks, and you and your fellow survivors would take a breather and basically "Oh man, what should we do?", while lacking weapons, ammunition or health, while knowing, or even not know, what was still between you and the end. - It would just make it all the more satisfying to survive, which was the challenge, which means gameplay is effective.
This is an absolutely GREAT point that I haven't seen people talking about. nice comment
Very well said
Same with Monster Hunter
That definitely adds to the quick aside mentioned in the video where he said minimal HUD is better than a cluttered HUD and I absolutely agree with it. Give the player as little as information as possible but give them the tools or subtle hints to figure out how to play the game. It's a much more rewarding and memorable experience. Metro Exodus is a good example of a recent game doing this.
100% agreed. If you're playing a game like this, you don't want your handheld by the devs.
One good thing that comes out of Back 4 Blood in my opinion is how it’ll give new inspiration and content for the Left 4 Dead 2 modding scene
I'm expecting modders to port the B4B maps into L4D2, and I guarantee they will be infinitely better lol
@@nutarchive9349 i guess, but tbh l4d modders make better maps already, i don't see why anyone would wanna play the b4b maps in l4d
Why copy B4B when they could do better?
*I REALLY hope Back 4 Blood gets the same amount of love mod-wise as Left 4 Dead, that workshop is frickin' glorious* (and almost *the* main reason why it's my favorite zombie game)
Unfortunately for you my friend B4B mod scene died from the start, the devs aren't allowing open access for the files to be modded and played with.
What made L4D unique is the special infected itself. Each of them have their own distinguishable sound, attacks and designs. Also the level is more open ended compared to B4B where it so cramp that having just two Tallboys at the same time can easily take away the Cleaners health easily.
They have their own sounds in b4b too
I'll never forget how bruiser sounds
Ever
There's also the issue of, if the specials in B4B have line of sight on you, they can wreck your whole team. There's that one part in the second last mission where you have to destroy nests in a house that is really just fucked up. You can hold out anywhere in that house, so we chose the second floor, right beside the stairs, because there's only like 2 ways the zombies can come in. I was standing on the edge of the stair rails, when one of those long arm boys come up under me, do their smash attack, and hit everyone (including the people sitting in the far end of me in a corner. There needs to be some kind of proper hit detection or something to make sure that stuff doesn't happen. That scenario, by the way, caused us to wipe despite us all having a decent amount of health, buffs, and gear by that point.
@@DudeMcGuybro Yea, it's quite ridiculous honestly. There were points during mandatory hordes to progress (or just at chokepoints) where specials would just spawn in groups or one after the other for straight minutes before we could even take a step forward. I think they need to really fine-tune their zombie spawning.
also weapon variety was great in l4d2
@@DudeMcGuybro Good tips, thanks!
Versus mode in Left 4 Dead was always fun because of how the maps were designed. Special Infected could use their map knowledge to get to optimal spots for ambushing, Dark Carnival is still one of the most fun to play to this day
Yeah in the last level of No Mercy there were several places where you could insta-kill human players by running them or dragging them off a ledge. The noob players would facecheck these spots without thinking while good players would avoid them. Great players would pretend to run into those areas to bait the enemy infected into attacking them.
One small issue I have with B4B is I don’t like how when you kill “Ridden” or whatever they’re called you and your weapon get coated in Blood, it feels like a cheap way of selling the gore and how “brutal” it is. The reason L4D actually felt brutal was because you SAW the damage your weapons did to the infected. You could shoot a hole clean through an infected’s head with Sniper rounds, you could blow a zombies back out with the shotguns, hitting an infected in the stomach with an AK round could make their intestines leak out. The weapons not only sounded powerful, but through gore effects like that, you FELT the power of the weapons. In B4B being coated in blood felt like the game was saying “Hehe look how gory we are you get completely covered in blood huh it looks so cool right!?”
Left 4 Dead is great because of how simple it is. It's so mechanically clear-cut and easy to understand. Back 4 Blood feels like a whole bunch of numbers and stats for what is simply a four-player zombie shooting game.
Furthermore, Left 4 Dead (especially L4D1) had a fun and unique art style that was memorable.
Yes, well said
Preach
The best thing about L4D's simplicity is that it allows both for casual, easy to pick up gameplay, while also allowing for an extremely hig hskill cieling. L4D caters to both casual and competitive players due to the nature of it's simple design.
it's like having a bunch of domino blocks - you could just set up a simple row and watch them fall over, or you could build an insane tower, it allows a much wider audience to enjoy the game.
yeah dude, the ""art style"" for B4B looks like a really bad Killing floor 2 clone
Too many "alert the horde" mechanics that I've had griefers set off every single time. You really don't want to set these off on higher difficulties otherwise you'll end up with limited health and ammo before youre even half done with a stage.
@Quantum Cheats that was actually pretty funny
Watched as my friend walked up to some birds, ammo beneath them. Had to trigger the horde for ammo :)
If I had a dollar for everytime some sped opened a door with an alarm on it I’d be rich. This shit happens on every difficulty because the player base doesn’t pay attention they just see door and they open door.
@@YouGot2BeKitten Are the doors with alarms even in the correct places, or is it just a random door with a conveniently-placed alarm on it?
Make a premade group.
Everything in B4B feels forced, like these new movie reboots that rely almost entirely on nostalgia.
Behind the L4D facade there's just another boring mtx-friendly military shooter.
AKA every Disney movie in the past decade
Yep. The last good Disney movie was Toy Story 3
What's mtx?
@@tadpolegaming4510 was 4 really that bad?
dont indie games rely on nostalgia?
It's interesting how the same developers managed to make a game that looks like a shameless ripoff of their own game.
Took some notes out of Activisions playbook
Left 4 Dead is far more a product of Valve than TurtleRock, TR is also mostly a different studio today.
L4D2 is entirely the work of Valve and L4D1 had to be saved and put on life support by Valve to make it out of development hell. People give TurtleRock ENTIRELY too much credit..
Naw they’ve always been like this; remember Evolve? The whole reason why they broke off from valve is because valve was basically babysitting them and stopping them from making their shit ass ideas a reality.
Valve wasnt in on it. This company has just turbed shit wothout valve
Not even their own game tbh. Cuz alot of people worked on l4d (about 50+) and only 5 people from tutlerock helped.
The game just feels souless. Theres so much magic missing from this that you'd find in l4d or even more modern competitors like Vermintide. I think this is because Lal the soul has been stripped away to leave holes that can be monitized like "characters" and weapons.
That game is under-rated af
Vermintide is fun asf
Yeah even the characters in Vermintide, who I didn't expect to remember very well, actually ended up being likable and memorable. Back 4 Blood pales in comparison.
T h i s
@@FazerGS B4B isn't even going to hit CoD zombies level of memorable characters, let alone L4D or Vermintide. Their banter just sucks here. Some of it is pretty cringe at times too. This game is somewhat beating killing floor in memorable characters but that's not saying much since all they use in that game are one liners. This game probably will fail. It's not bad but arguably, being bland and uninspired is worse than just being bad. A bad piece of media can at least be unintentionally funny. This is passable on every front but not a single thing really stands out. Especially asking $60+ for this.
To add to that "more human means more relatable" bit, I remember how with L4D2 at the start there's that one part in the elevator where all the characters learn eachothers names and personalities, all without a cutscene or anything. On top of that you spend the first few chapters hearing them refer to the special infected as things like, "Exploding guy" or "Smoking things" which just added to the whole "actual people in a survival world" sort of feel.
Edit: And as for the pipe bomb bit, something about source engine will always have a way more satisfying feel no matter how old it is. It's definitely my favorite game engine even despite the clear spaghetti code it tends to come with.
I mean these folks in B4B are cleaners who already know each other and have been living in this world for awhile. It wouldn't make sense for them to do introductions now.
@@Ralathar44 When they die It's like a, oh no, they abandoned me.
In L4D had some meaning, feeling sad, affection between them
@@dashalexan1241 That's because of the setting difference, it's an entirely different world. In L4D you're random normal people trying to get to safety and nobody is prepared for or ready for this shit. In B4B people have grown up entirely post-apoc and you're part of a cleaner crew. Cleaners die all the time. It's a fact of life in that world. Holly lost her family and she has survivor syndrome PTSD, Hoffman is looking for his dad, Mom has seen more allies die than she can count, etc. These are not soft city folks used to a civilized world. They've seen some shit and are already jaded or damaged. They all signed up to be cleaners willingly, they know what that entails, and they've been doing it for awhile.
@@Ralathar44 and that sorta makes them less relatable. It feels like all the characters have already had their unique moments and now there all best buds. It’s sorta a basic concept of writing: always start the story in the most interesting part. Don’t tell me about these relationships, show me them forming. I don’t want to hear about how Evangelo is like a little brother to Holly, I want to see that bond form in real time.
Hell, the little down time moments like coach praying for the food court to be ok and all the other characters join him in saying amen was really funny. Or how Ellis knew about the driver of the race car in dead center and talked about him from the perspective of a fan really made him feel grounded. B4B’s versions of those appear so very infrequently and are over just as quick. Like, I wanted Hoffman’s distrust of turtles to be a running gag throughout the forest level but it was never brought up again. Hell, I really wanted Hoffman to actually be right on something since that would add more depth to his character rather than his stereotypical personality of “conspiracy theorist”. I wanted walker to maybe talk about himself and discuss what he was doing before the apocalypse but he makes a point of it to never actually do that which makes him far less interesting.
B4B feels like it’s so close to hitting that point yet falls short of that last hurdle. The characters are so close to being memorable but they constantly fall flat. I don’t care if the setting doesn’t call for it, I really want to see these people develop their relationships and grow. Maybe we could see Hoffman slowly connect with Holly throughout act 1 over both of them missing their parents. This game comes so close to having personality and yet, it trips and falls just before the finish line. There were so many moments where the game came close to making me fall in love with it and every time, it stops in its tracks.
L4D’s sense of character growth throughout the campaign really tied everything together. This game is seemingly missing something that’s impossible to put into words. I hope that the launch version of the game has more of those character moments that left 4 dead had. If it doesn’t, then I will have wasted money.
@@deadinside8891 lol they are not all best buds, if that's the vibe you got you need to listen more. Some of the team like each other, some don't. For example Holly doesn't like Hoffman and its possible others don't either. But Mom seems totally fine with him, prolly because she's more pragmatic and has alot of experience out surviving everyone else and Hoffman is a pretty significant asset towards that goal even if he's a conspiracy nut. Also it's clear Hoffman is more than JUST a conspiracy nut as he's out there looking for his father.
We've been able to listen to a tiny fragment of the overall game and even then 10 hours in I was still hearing new VO. I think judging now is way too pre-mature.
People never top growing and changing and that's true with their relationships too. There is no such thing as "all their moments already happened" That's a very young person thing to say. Someone who's yet to live to see alot more moments happen later in life. The wild ride never stops hehe :).
When a game studio tries to use the fact that it has dev members from a previous successful title to market their new game as a crutch it's usually not a good sign, just look at Evolved. They're openly inviting direct comparisons and criticisms to the title that gave them the notoriety to begin with and sets the bar of expectation pretty high. If they complain about how the game isn't l4d then they shouldn't have mentioned it or called it the spiritual successor. Your comparisons are valid Gman don't be sorry to tell it how it is.
Yeah man even the name is almost the same. They just salty that their game looks, plays and feels worse than something released almost 15 years ago lol
This. Compare as they market as such, I say! +1
Me: looks at how many times Stalker is mentioned when someone develops survival-horror-FPS.
But on the other hand, various former Stalker devs DID deliver us Metro series and then Tarkov... it's just that we had to endure a dozen Survarium's before that:D
Wait a sec... didn't this same team make Evolve?
@@LuvzToLol21 yup. Devolve was made by them aswell. 😷
Gives me the same vibes as world war z. Forgettable characters in a forgettable game.
One of nicest things of L4D was it's simplicity. You could just invite a buddy and his girlfriend and it was fun.
All these "spiritual successors" try to innovate by adding unecessary complexity like this card deck mechanic. If i want to play with cards i play hearthstone or sth.
Card mechanic was not that bad all in all.
It just made it that the longer you last out during campaigns the stronger you got.
And that is not a bad thing, what makes it meh is that there is no punishment for dying, not to mention it is too hard TO die.
I hated stopping and reading all the cards thats on my screen and I just wanna go uga bunga with the zombies already. Although if I stopped and try to understand it maybe I'll get more use out of it but I just really want to get out and shoot some more and stop getting these menus every time.
WWZ is actually fun with friends and the class system was a neat addition.
Now all buddy's are gay
@@ColdNorth0628 The bad thing is - there wasn't any real strategy when picking cards. And still isn't. You choose cards _before_ game chooses the bad ones to hinder you, you don't know what to go for andj ust go for whatever you would go for if there was no cards hindering you _or_ for an optimised deck or anything similiar to that deck which is another dumpster fire of it's own...
And I can't help it but feel like the cards are gonna be monetised hard, after all those are creators of Evolve so microtransactions are to be expected.
Ah yes, the spiritual regressor.
Lol Back 4 Blood in a nutshell =)))))))))))))
Perfectly describes what I feel about it.
I see ps1 Malfoy.
The REAL successor to Left 4 Dead is Vermintide.
The infected designs look cool and the shooting looks solid, but Back 4 Blood just looks like a retread and doesn't have any of the charm or character appeal that helped L4D stand out.
vermintide 1/2 and world war z are really fun
Man war hammer vermintide 2 is so much fun
The only issue with Vermintide is the shooting mechanics outside of bows is so damn basic and bland. None of the guns feel like they hold any power and the absolute lack of design diversity makes weapon upgrades feel a bit weightless.
Besides that, its melee combat is absurdly satisfying.
Vermintide sucks too its just clicking on an infinite horde with armor piercing wide sweep attacks. Any interesting builds got ruined by the screeching fanbase. Zero map variance gets old real fast too. Loots obnoxious too and just devolves to runs of the quickest lootiest map over and over again.
I really don’t get why people praise these Vermintide games. I’ve played both of them with randoms and with my friends and they’re worse than Back 4 Blood. They crash so much more, they’re not stable games, the gameplay is so much more mindless.
dumbest thing about versus is that the game dosent even end when the other team leaves you just sit in purgatory waiting
The part where they totally remove the sound que from the Special zombie is such a bummer also the Special doesn't really have distinct ability other then just damage, damage and more damage.
Special infected are honestly quite bullshit to go against.
You get no warning, damage is instantenious, and that same damage might be jsut permament (with how rare it can be to find the station to remove the trauma).
And how the game doesn't give any breathers outside of safe rooms.
You open that door and 3 tall boys walk out with whole circus of other specials to curbstomp you. Oh yeah, there's no real limit on infected as well so you will see multiple of same special at the same time.
It’s a damn shame Valve is no longer interested in making games anymore. I miss the Half Life and L4D series’s.
they literally released a game last year, what are you talking about?
@@wiskymo9687 yes they did but most ppl will not play that game .most of gaming community cant afford a high end pc and 1000$ in vr setup
@@mrbruh4746 Especially third world people. I live in one and getting hands on a VR Set and PC that powerful is already a HUGE priviledge for most of us here. I know tons who play Half Life, but zero who played Alyx. I had to watch a streamer playthrough to go through the story and it seemed awesome though :))
I agree, but maybe it's a good thing. If they don't make another game, they can't really ruin it
@@wiskymo9687 Most people (like me) can't afford a VR setup. I live in Africa btw so things aren't exactly cheap.
It’s amazing to think that 12 years ago I thought games were going to be waaay better than what we had before. Now the only games I can find myself enjoying and coming back to are the games made 12 years ago. Good graphics don’t make a game fun people, gameplay does. Left 4 dead nails that aspect perfectly
Good graphics with no aesthetics are always dated and bad.
Look at HL2 and L4D, both use the same engine but have wide difference between graphics. L4D Graphics quality wasnt as high as the design and aesthetics, No Mercy and Dark Carnival will always look good because they arent trying to look super realistic, Generic Woods and Generic Houses in B4B will soon enough look dated, because they dont have any original design
It's true, been playing Cruelty Squad and it's been a blast.
@@ALE199-ita many modern big title games don't focus on fun gameplay or interaction. They focus on flashy graphics. That's why many 10-15 year old games are still just so fundamentally good. They were designed to be fun. Whereas these flashy new titles get old in a week. Maybe a little bit is nostalgia, but design principles have greatly changed over the years
I remember MGS2, Red Faction, HL2, RE4, DMC 3 etc and thinking: Wow imagine games in 10 years! Well more then 10 years later and gamings never been worse, not even 2010 gray FPS war shooter era
@@Grandmaster-Kush 2010 gray war fps shooters lmao you're not wrong though.
The price is insane and the apparent micro transactions look like a joke so even if it was a great game I'd pass.
I know right? 60 euros for the base fucking game,then an 80 euro middle pack and a 100 fucking euro full pack with all the shit included? dafuk is happening? am i saving up to buy a car or something? not only its just trash and a copy of a masterpiece they tried to cling onto the reputation of L4D and even tarnish it with MTs and paywalls and shit
That is huge disrespect to left 4 dead. But sadly they're putting that crap into almost every game these days
I'm not gonna lie, of course L4D is great always but from more recently I really enjoy World war Z. Since trying on game pass I've been hooked I think that aftermath expansion (like adding 1st person mode) might swing me to it instead of this.
I honestly refuse to buy any game that costs money and has microtransactions.
Your right guys, not only is the full game price a joke but its such an insult to L4D and on top of that there are other games that are better and cheaper. Its just getting so stupid now, can't even pay £60 now and get a full game, even that's a joke as full price used to be £50. Unfortunately it will probably make a lot of money and only keep encouraging this kind of behavior from games companies.
The first thing I would do is removing all the weapon attachments and cards from the game and focus only on the gameplay. It simply takes the focus away from the game and takes it somewhere in the menus where you constantly comparing, reading and choosing things you literally do not need.
But it's creative!
That would be even more boring just saying
@@sarastagnitto3159 but reading spreadsheet and slog your gameplay down just to see what gun is better is not boring?
The card system was really annoying to me because I, and presumably everyone else, played this game to have fun shooting zombies. I did not load this game up to play a freaking card game that has an incredibly cumbersome menu that you have to navigate through before each round. It makes it even worse when you actually start playing the game and it's just kind of meh and uninspiring. They definitely should have made sure they had a really solid base gameplay before they even started adding all those shiny bells and whistles. Oh well, Left 4 Dead will always be a timeless classic.
Why do games lately follow the trend of forcing cards in one way or another...
It really just lacks that extra valve quality and polish that makes their games so memorable
I mean, it *is* a beta. I wouldn't expect the game to have a complete overhaul but hopefully it at least improves with feedback.
@@ToyokaX It's a beta for a game that comes out in 2 months lol. The game is 100% done at this point dude, trust me coming from game development experience, the game has been submitted to microsoft and sony and all the game stores. If anything they're working on a day 1 patch to fix some bugs
@@TBContent24 pretty much
@@ToyokaX modern beta are just demo now. This is how it gonna launch.
Not really, the polish definitely adds that final quality, but B4B unmistakingly misses the mark on even it's core mechanics. If you removed all of the map textures, sound design, and environment effects from a L4D PVP campaign and left yourself with a barebones dev stage level, it would still outshine B4B in every way. It's an insult that B4B mimics the L4D infected phenotypes. It's practically the ONLY thing it has going for it, and then doesn't even utilize them in any meaningful way.
Valve really do inject that secret sauce of heart and character into all of their games, so many companies try to replicate their games but rarely actually realise what makes them special.
Valve is the publisher for l4d
Not the developer, turtle rock were the developers of l4d
@@BlargTheEnderman Valve had their hands on while developing the game tho..
I view Valve as a similar to a producer role, they have a hand in shaping the final version of the game and a big part of that is injecting character.
Similar to how Devolver Digital publish games without much direct development but there’s still a running theme of big characters and off-kilter humour to a lot of their releases.
@@BlargTheEnderman turle rock is the developer for l4d yeah but valve also play a big role in the game development. i believe valve directed turtle rock's development for l4d and thats what makes l4d great. look at how turtle rock do their own thing without valve, their game "Evolve" was immediately dead
The best way I saw this game described was
"Missing that valve magic"
It sounds dumb, but i'm certain everyone familiar with l4d, who've played both understands it perfectly
Damn unlucky, I don't think I've ever played a valve game other than a little bit of L4D2, never really got into it unfortunately
the source engine's spookiness?
@@BelowAverageBeing massive L
@@T3noir idk man I'm chillin 😎
@@T3noir what should I get into that wouldn't feel boring or outdated, I'm extremely uncultured 😔
Man I really wanted to like this game but visibility is really bad. You can't really differentiate the special infecteds, like in L4D they made the Hunter wear a hoodie and crawl, the Boomer fat, the Smoker tall and well, "smokes" , etc. All very different from each other PLUS the sound and music cues. Not to mention you could mod the game further with steam workshop and just straight up put Donkey Kong instead of the Tank
or drink white monsters instead of chugging pills, or shooting a floppy AK, or play as Dark Souls knights
It feels like a Chinese knock-off version of Left 4 Dead, lacking all the soul, atmosphere and immersion of the original games and pushing a "next gen" narrative while regressing in almost every single aspect of game play. It doesn't even have a proper VS. mode.
I think they thought “okay, we have good graphics, it’s for the next generation, it’s a sequel to a legendary franchise and we can copy bits from world war z…this is gonna be easy! Let’s put no effort in, they’ll buy it anyway.”
They had the ingredients but the food tastes shit
Well said man
Absolutely shocked that they added so many mechanics and features, but didn't even get basic things right, like pacing. Turtle Rock should try playing the developer commentary for Left 4 Dead 1&2. They might learn a few things.
I don’t get why they decided to make a different game, claiming it wasn’t left 4 dead and literally named it back 4 dead and it’s about zombies and mutated zombies with 4 survivors. Idk if they’re trying to be idiots but why would you do that? I also don’t mind good graphics even though if not used correctly it doesn’t fit the zombie apocalypse atmosphere, but simply relying on good graphics is not good. Not to mention after seeing gameplays where weapons are in boxes and there are cards and perks? And idk if it’s just me but killing the zombies doesn’t feel as satisfying or impactful as killing the zombies in left 4 dead, talking about the animation and the way the zombie dies not the story
My biggest complaint may sound stupid to most people but, I hated not being able to see through the gun sites. Like, I couldn't see what I was aiming at. I just need crosshairs. Card system? No thanks.
The Developers: *markets their game as the spiritual successor to L4D*
Also, the Developers: "Zombies in Call of Duty are pretty sweet, eh?"
Modern Warfare 2019 zombie mode, or the spiritual successor of Black ops 2 zombies.
I mean, zombies in the first 2 black ops are pretty sweet
@@isainepto I would much rather play any black ops zombies than Back 4 blood, at least Black ops is cool for a few hours, and some maps are great.
@@cantstandurbs876 Most of the maps are awesome, and the gameplay is fun cause its simple shame they went crazy with the newer games
Call of duty zombies from black ops to black ops 3 are amazing
L4D but without the charm and fun.
Honestly, this game just feels like a cash grab on the fact that Valve can't count to 3
It just looks like they 'genericised' L4D to look and act like every other FPS.
if the characters upset you now, wait for gun dlc, skins, and new dlc characters
Jesus Christ I hate this generation of games
the amount of micro transactions is more than the amount of blood you have on your gun
"From creators of Left 4 Dead"
More like
"From creators of Evolve"
The one thing I was PRAYING for in this game was the humorous safe room wall writings and I was just sad and disappointed and realized how soulless the game was when I saw it was either empty or just edgy apocalypse writing
Are you daft? theres plenty of great safe room writings.
There is a ton of saferoom messages and references … maybe you just didn’t get them? Every level in the first world has one.for example, the first level’s saferoom has a starship troopers quote on the wall. If someone is playing Alejandro, he makes a comment about something touching his leg in the submerged section of that same level which is basically directly quoted from Star Wars episode 4. I’ve pretty much laughed at every piece of graffiti, and commentary but if your not a pop culture buff I guess it’s possible that you wouldn’t notice all the jokes
@@spreadator8276 I miss the memes :(
"I saw one poop a foot!"
"They eat feet!?"
"I miss the internet."
"Otis, Out of film. No Helicopter. Zombies are too fast. Not going to make it. - Frank West"
Yeah, this only proves you're not reading too many of them lol. There are tons of references and jokes and easter eggs and etc.
think ima pass on this one, "deck building" has got to be one of my least favorite things when it's not the main focal point of the game.
It feels like too much of a focal point already. Left 4 Dead didn't have that shit and it was leaps and bounds better than this. The problem with this game is the sheer massive quantity of guns that all feel generic and underpowered as hell, the lame special infected, the lack of gore and dismemberment, the underwhelming level design that isn't memorable and the dumb AI. Oh and the shitty protagonists.
It’s actually pretty fun. The “cards” are just buffs that are customizable for your preferred type of game play. If some cards scare you away from a game then… 🤷♂️ stick to CoD or something
@@st.salmonella9827 feel like you just described the perk system from COD
@@st.salmonella9827 "You don't like farming entire days for passive buffs that will clearly be mandatory and will lead to a meta setup that you have to RNG your way through? Just stick to COD brub"
The fuck are you talking about, it isn't fun, it's tedious as shit and will draw a massive line between players, it isn't about git gud, it's about how OP your build is.
In l4d you didn't needed any of that garbage, you only needed your gun and a trustworthy team, it was all about how good you actually played.
@@cantstandurbs876 okay to stick to l4d
When I was doing the post-game survey they ask, I was rating everything 3. It's such a middle of the road experience. Not terrible, but not really anything new.
a solid 3.6 roentgen
@@the-mush “Not great, not terrible.”
He's delusional, send him to infirmary.
eh, im with you. i think the pve is actually pretty great, but the pvp is rly bad. and that combined with the initial price and the passes and all in addition? is not good.
It will age into a 3, but being boring is basically a 2 for a modern game.
Gman: "Back 4 Blood's movement is very nice and snappy, Which is crucial to a game like this."
Turtlerock: "So we heard what everyone said about the movement, And we've chosen to ignore all of the feedback and make it sluggish while also nerfing all of the mobility enhancements so we can get one over on speedrunners. K thx bai."
Feel old remembering Evolve, a game from 7 years ago yet looks like it came out last week
Lol no it doesn't
Graphical leaps get smaller and smaller as time goes on and technology progresses
Yet it died in two months
@@roadsidepeekneek7259 It has more to do with the art design being less and less original and it's a shame because we have the tech to do good looking things and here we are.
It was made in cryengine 3, so looking good is just par for the course
A remaster of L4D 2 on a new engine would outsell this game in a heart beat.
I'm pretty sure Valve wanted to port both L4D1 and L4D2 campaigns into Source 2 for Left 4 Dead 3, just like they did with L4D1 for L4D2, but that game never came out so...
No thanks, l4d3 or nothing.
would rather have lfd3 instead of a remaster
@@fjfjawdwafjfjawdwa but what would be more likely? a remaster or a sequal? we all know valve's track record.
A Remaster of L4D2? Man the game never felt outdated, why would you want a remake? L4D3 or nothing.
I think L4D and L4D2’s greatest aspect was its simplicity which really allowed the game and its level design to speak for themselves.
The idea of blood spatters making you harder to spot is pretty cool.
Like one of the debuff cards could be rain that washes it off and certain levels could take advantage
Yeah that's a really cool idea. Hope someone at Turtle Rock sees, tbh
Be neat if getting drenched actually served a purpose instead of *just* being a cosmetic/because "haha V I O L E N C E" thing
@@ThatGenericPyro it would be VERY cool
Hope this gets hearted or pinned so more people can see it
What I loved about l4d was mainly the lore scattered throught the map, and the option to use user made content through workshop really made the game more enjoyable.
Yeah one can play with RE characters while the other one in the same game is living his/her weeb dream...
Dreaming about how Akiyama from the Yakuza franchise would be in L4D2…
I looked for it and no one made one yet :(
The City 17 mod with that ending at the metro station (Vortal Combat included) was amazing.
You can literally do a crash bandicoot campaign in left 4 dead
@@DeterminedTorres theres a japanese themed map called yama. That should satisfy your weeb fantasy for a bit. Its also pretty great but too bad nobody played it
This is the one thing I was genuinely worried about for this game: lack of personality.
Which is ironic considering how hard they tried to overly design the characters and zombies, but in the end it just became more generic.
the thing that makes l4d replayable after all these years is that the characters have a legitimate and organic chemistry (especially in the first one). you literally never get tired of listening to francis and louis talk to each other.
@@entropicflux8849 i think you overlooked the director AI. That was the biggest factor contributing to replay value
@@entropicflux8849 Ellis never gets old. "My buddy Keith.."
@@theotv5522 the director AI is probably one of the reasons left 4 dead blew up. For those reading this that don’t know, the director AI changes throughout your playthrough what spawns and where it spawns depending on how well you’re doing. If you’re doing really bad, you’re more likely to find medkits and weaker zombies, if you’re doing really well, you’re more likely to find more special infected and less weapons. THATS AMAZING!
It stops you from going “okay, last time I played, a tank spawned right around the corner” so you can’t prepare for it because it most likely won’t play out that way again, this game however, I feel like after a couple of play throughs you’d probably know the map and you’d have 0 fear when encountering zombies
@@entropicflux8849 Back in the day during L4D1 I used to LOVE using the vocalize commands to spark impromptu conversations and remarks between the characters at fitting moments. It was hilarious fun back then. The original 4 survivors just can't be beat man.
I used to love the sound cues in L4D, hearing the growl of the hunter, the cough of the smoker, the gurgle of the boomer, the laugh of the jockey, the cry of the witch, that yell of the charger! Also the looks of the infected depending what campaign, the bride witch, clown infected, the woman boomer. The overall atmosphere of L4D and level design is what drew me in. Hearing the specials but never knowing where they were until boom u getting smashed. Simple but yet kept you coming back for more and my favorite part is coach on stage singing “EVERY LADY CRAZY WHEN HER DADDY NOT AROUND DUNNAA NAANAA NA NA NAAA. GOT REACH FOR THE TOP STAY ON THE MOUNTAIN DUNNAA NAAANAAA NAA NAAAAA!”
My biggest gripe is that they totally went backwards when comparing the insane gore system they had for l4D 1&2 with entrails and the zombies stomachs opened up you seen all their internal organs, the zombies reacted accordingly to what type of bullets were hitting them, arms legs waists along with the heads were able to be sliced and diced, their faces when u shot them would react with damage etc. Well in this one I guess they felt gamers were dumb enough to totally remove that system and just give you giant splats of blood going all over the place, the blood comes from out of thin air right infront of the enemies it looks like, instead of actually coming out of them, but they put so much blood on screen that you have to be watching for it and you see it big time and it pisses me off!! Then on their clothes it don't even get any more blood on them despite that it's supposed to be coming out of their bodies but there's zero feedback on the clothing of the enemies and that's distracting as well!! They just took such a short cut with the lack of a full gore system!!! Especially with these powerful next gen consoles and there taking away from games!!??? To chince out on the gore system to me is one of the most important things to be in a game with zombies, it's gun, game play and GORE!!! Not just blood, there's organs in there somewhere too, I just know it!!! But it is what it is, a lazy cut corners game bc the high up executives want new yachts and remember, they all lost money during covid lockdowns and that's money they will never be able to recuperate so they have to get that money back in any way shape or form!! So it will come in the form of cut content cut corners etc bc that's cut time and time is money, you guys gettin it yet?
that's because turtle rock studios did like 5% of the work for both of the l4d games
With improvements in all the hardware it seems less and less games and companies seem interested in reaching the bondaries of the capacity of the consoles, let alone push those boundaries. Optimization seems an thing from the past, OG real programmers and game developers seem to be a dying breed,
Autism
As someone who played some Killing floor.
This customization system is Killing Floor meets Warframe. I think sometimes more doesn't mean better. I think characters having their own things are okay but this entire number crunching card system turns off the fun for me. L4D is a game you are supposed to pick up and play, not pick up, make a deck, calculate your odds, maybe play... I do understand this is part of Monster Hunter fun. And i find this FUN in Monster Hunter.
But when i play L4D. i expect only 2 things. Pick up a character and play.
B4B looks more realistic... realisitc doesn't mean better. L4D was exaggerated and cinematic, and that was the point, you were in a movie. Of course its gonna be spectacular. Why this game refuses to be visually spectacular, i don't know. lack of inspiration.
Something else about Killing Floor, or rather Killing Floor 2, is that it's also a game you're suppose to pick up and play. The perk system in it is very simple and you can easily switch perk sills in between waves, and the cosmetic system is only there to support the game's lifespan more and for you to have your own flare if you want. I won't go into detail on the absurd amount of DLC weapons there are in the game since that's more-so to do with how Tripwire market the game rather than the game's gameplay itself, and anyone who has the DLC is able to share it with anyone else in a match anyways. The point is that KF2 and L4D have this sort of "pick it up and play it with friends" sort of engagement to them. You're enjoying the music, dark, gritty atmosphere, zombie designs, gameplay, and quirky character personalities, not trying to bust your balls over a progression system that you HAVE to partake in.
Honestly idk how ppl keep playing in left 4 dead 2 I tried it several days ago and shooting not satisfying at all I got satisfied while I played in killing floor 2 but not in left 4 dead 2 so I played one game and did refund
I don't think B4B looks more realistic. I mean jeez, you reload a gun in 1 second flat and there's no enemy dismemberment, lots of systems are goofy. Left 4 Dead 2 was far... Far slower but more impactful as a result, every decision essentially mattered.
I don't think it's fair to say that Back 4 Blood should have just had the EXACT same weapon tier system, with the exact same amount of weapons as Left 4 Dead 2, and the exact same style of characters, identical feeling movement and gunplay. No.
Whatever they did, if it wasn't a fully licensed Left 4 Dead 3 that expounded on the lore of the universe and featured very similar gameplay, and even then, it would be frowned upon by fans. But as B4B is now, none of these things are a problem as much as the game feeling lazy and the poor execution of all of these things.
This comment sums up most about why people refuse to like this game, or fault it heavily: "In left 4 dead I had (insert experience here) and this doesn't feel like that"
There is a very good reason for that... this ISNT Left 4 Dead! Yes its a game very much in the same vein but comparing this to Left 4 Dead is like comparing Metal Gear Solid to Sly Cooper... they are both stealth games after all.
@@geddybear9108 except I'd argue that one of these comparisons has more ground to stand on, since SUPPOSEDLY the developers that worked on L4D also worked on Back 4 Blood. When you hear this, you don't think "different games but same developers looking to recapture the first game's feel = not even related".
Come on.
my biggest gripe with the game, is that it feels TOO eager to get into the action, you know?
at least in the l4d's it tried to build up suspense right after you leave that safe room with the slow start but in b4b when i leave the safe room i get rushed by a bunch of zombies from the get go. i hope they put more love into the horror aspect of the game
Thats the magic of the game director, you are walking through the map like nothing and them BAM, you hear that horde music and get blasting
That sounds a lot like they're just plain scared of 'boring' the player, and completely not understanding that the quiet between hordes is the perfect time for scavenging and building tension.
Idk man, that's more up to the RNG engine of the L4D games, because I've definitely had games where we get smacked by hordes immediately out of the safe room. Especially if you take extra time setting up before leaving.
@@jase276 oh yeah no theres defiantly times it goes balls to the walls from the start but it cant be denied that its mostly slow at the start
@@jase276 The reason those are memorable is that they don't happen every single time.
Most starts in L4D are quiet.
I don't think I had a single start of round in B4B that was quiet, it was always rushed by zombies from the get go, not even 20m outside the safehouse.
GG, i've been watching you for hte better part of a decade. And while i basically always like and agree with your input. All you ever do is ruin things i'm excited about. You're like a white skinny version of dunkey.
I’m not skinny.
@@Gggmanlives Probably because you've devoured so many of my hopes and dreams!
@@H3Vtux 😂
Definitely don't take a boomer shooterer as the be all end all! I watch him for more entertainment and mentions of the little things
Also props for delivering constructive criticism as nicely as possible 😂
@@Richard-yh2nf have you seen him irl? Jfc
"Out of touch", that's the impression I have with these comic book characters. They seem way cheery
i think what this game lacks is valve's magic in it that made L4D so special, afterall how would you call this a L4D spiritual successor if this game is built in the Unreal Engine 4 & not the Source engine
@PirateCat91 Borderlands, Bioshock, Rocket League, The modern Batman games, Tekken 7, The Ascent, Gears of War, The Chivalry, Ark Survival Evolved, Psychonauts 2, Atomic Heart, Bulletstorm, Sea of Thieves, Little Nightmares II, and Dead by Daylight
Tell me those games are soulless and I’m sending you to a psych ward
Y’all do realize it has nothing to do with the engine it’s just art style itself
@PirateCat91 What the hell is that even mean? So blaming the tool instead of the user makes more sense apparently?
5 of the ganes you listed are just well designed. Most unreal 4 games I wouldn't hold my breath over
Engines really don't have a lot to do with it. You can make literally anything with unreal if you put in the effort.
It's crazy how L4D2 was released 12 years ago and no one could improve it's genre since then
My friend tried to convince me that Turtle Rock isn't trying to make Left 4 Dead again, but do their own thing with the formula. Bruh, the game is 'LITERALLY' called Back 4 Blood. It is trying so hard to appeal to fans of Left 4 Dead. The only thing that looks somewhat appealing to this compared to Left 4 Dead is probably the gunplay, but it also just feels so generic, and would probably be done better in other games anyway. It's like if the game design of Left 4 Dead and Call of Duty's Warzone had a very disappointing baby. Sure on the outset it looks like Left 4 Dead, but without any of the charm and memorability of Left 4 Dead, the characters are generic and annoying, the levels are too dark and too filled with clutter, that it, funnily enough, feels like it lacks detail. The UI looks very similar to Left 4 Dead's in a lot of ways, but unlike Left 4 Dead, they seem to not know when to tone things down; you have a stamina bar, a list of tasks, item and quest markers. Call me old fashioned, but the fact that I could tell where to go because of how the game and its levels were designed is a lot more engaging, not only that but the addition of a sprint feature basically waters down the experience to a run and gun shooter with little to no downtime because you're already sprinting to the next objective. The weapons you find have random loot attached to them like Warzone, but unlike Warzone you can't swap attachments and make a more unique weapon, or weapon that at least fits your playstyle more. It feels like they're trying too hard, and not at all at the same time.
Spiritual successor does not mean sequel, they are aloud to do their own thing with it. We can't know the charm of the characters because half of them werent in the beta (same with special infected). If you're so against the markers turn them off. the maps still are pretty clear on where to go. If you're sprinting to the next fight you're doing something wrong and not conserving your stamina. Also you can swap attachments but not remove them, which kinda sucks but my point stands regardless.
Dude the mental gymnastics are too real on this game. Everyones trying to rollback. On the B4B subreddit they even have people trying to convince that not having campaign maps for versus mode is a good idea. Its sad really. The game is trying to do too many things and failing at all of them.
I wish it was this calm in Australia when we come out of stage 4 lockdown... :D
By the time u come out the kangaroos are gonna kick ur ass
@@PoloMoney They do that now already :P They're not animals you'd want to mess with!
Y'all are gonna have to fight the emu war 2
"It's like going to a mechanic while he's servicing your car and asking why the bonnet is up." My new favourite Gman quote.
I think what's important to know is that the original L4D developers no longer works in TRS, that and L4D have Valve's hands directly affecting the development heavily.
That is completely untrue, try researching before trying to shit on something. Phil Robb, the COFOUNDER of TRS and game director is still there. (im sure there are others but hes the most public)
@@spreadator8276 Most of the shitting on this game is completely uninformed or made up. It's fucking weird. It's got real and actual problems but people make shit up anyways. When did the internet become this?
@@spreadator8276 2 people still there, STUDIO IS SAVED
People doesn't give Valve enough credit in its involvement on L4D development. A big deal of L4D memorable aspects were suggested by Valve.
@@stolasthegreatprince4166 Valve´s magic at its finest
This game feels like a cash grab, 12 years later and the games "atmosphere" is cheesy in a non enjoyable way and is a downstep from Left 4 Dead. Animations never upgraded after 12 years, its like a basic unreal engine 4 game. There is no tension to get to the safe house, you can just sneak walk through the whole game slowly killing zombies and be okay. This would be fine if they didn't market the game as a LFD2 spiritual successor. If your market it like that people expect a LFD3, don't be mad at us the consumer.. that's what we do, we consume what we want to consume. Would you rather eat a Little Caesars $5 pizza for a whole year or a 5 star rated mom and pop pizza instead? It's not our fault you marketed it like LFD3. Trying to sell us off of our nostalgia, keep the game simple and more fun instead of complicated and tedious.
Edit: The thing is this game isn't being made by a small indie studio, its turtle rock, and these guys are funded by WB games, they got the cash to make a High Quality game.
Truer words have never been spoken
Warner? Seriously? Can put 100 million in single rollercoasters but not into their games?
I like Little Caesar's *BUT* I don't like the Ilitch family that owns it. Blight lords. So yeah, Ma and Pah.
Which part of the beta let you crawl around without tension? I played the nightmare setting and its anything but lack of tension. It's insanity.
Maybe on easy you can just sneak to the safe room but I call bs on vet and nightmare.
The fun of L4D was couch co-op with friends.
Those days are long gone and I’m not sure any game could re-capture the magic of that moment in time.
nailed it
If this game were as fun as L4D it could be recaptured, but the bad level design, bad weapons, shitty protagonists and lack of gore/dismemberment really make this game no where near on the same level of L4D.
I played keyboard and mouse with friends when L4D2 came out, I met awesome lifetime friends and played until we literally couldn't stay awake. 5-6 am. People from all over the world. Awesome community back then. Even if people think such games exist today, I honestly think they do not. It was like the best Halloween party you've ever been to every night. Loads of awesome gamers chatting on steam, having drinks, sharing music, connecting and meeting irl.
No game can. No anime can capture the feel of a classic either. You used to get the rare top tier game everyone played or anime everyone watched every year or two. Now you get like 6-12 a year of the same quality. Nothing will ever feel as special as ti once was because nothing can stand out as much anymore and that's a good thing because that's how much our selection of games and anime has improved. We went from riding individual games until we had completely exhausted them to having more good games than we could ever play.
Now everything is online even the console
Safe to say Turtle Rock is now a name to avoid and no longer a selling point
I thought so after Evolve. Evolve had all the hallmarks of a company that had its priorities firmly on recurrent monetization without any of the excellent game design philosophy that made games like L4D great.
@@12ealDealOfficial evolve is great tho, the company just left it in the dust
Something I find funny is that versus mode can start without a single person on the other team. This happened to me and after my team had completed the cleaner round, we were just running around as the special ridden.
This looks like the kind of game you pick up a few years after launch when it's on sale
Will probaly be forgoten and unplayble in a few years ,like Walking Dead or Evolve .
And I like your profile picture reminds that Interpol music video.
@McDude -- that's actually pretty much what I envision for myself. If it's on a huge sale at one point (well over 50% off) I may pick it up, but otherwise I lack a drive to go for it
What he says about the fire is so true! Remember how scary that first mission was when you come out the elevator and the whole place is just torched visibility is hard because of the smoke and the infected running through the fire screaming was just so intense. Back 4 Blood has triple the budget but looks worse?
At least we still have Left 4 dead.
With tons of map mods, I got far more play out of it than I thought possible.
To the thing about people rage-quitting after getting their asses handed to them - maybe consider adding something like a "crushing defeat" where one team gets beaten so badly that they don't even get a rematch, and the other team just gets declared the winners flat out. Saves people the time of having to get stomped a second time while also removing the necessity of rage-quitting at the end of a round. The matches that are worth playing get played, while the stomps allow you to swiftly move on the the next match?
Addendum: make it an opt in thing for the players who lost, I imagine there's quite a few people for whom that'd be humiliating and offputting
Lessen the blow to the ego so to speak
Wow, just like my Iron Banner matches!
I had this experience when I tried versus mode as well. To the enemy team's credit, they stuck around for the whole session and accepted their loss, but it was an absolute 3-0 slaughter for us. After the first match was over, I found myself saying to my friends, "Wait, we have to do that to them 2 more times?"
Big problem with this - L4D2 is still very enjoyable, still has a vast array of custom maps, and is still really well balanced.
And when that's not enough, Deep Rock Galactic exists.
So Back 4 Blood is already doomed - it's openly trying to compete with the best coop shooters around.
Also, it's always a bad sign when a game uses those CoD-style hit feedback crosshairs. If a game needs to give you HUD feedback on whether or not you've hit a target... the game itself is not giving enough basic visual feedback. You should know, at a glance, whether or not you hit something.
Meanwhile, the different character stats... that's not gonna end well. L4D worked so well because a random group of players could be united by the game's ability to punish them for NOT working together. A game with different character stats? You're gonna get a lot of players blaming each other when things go wrong, or getting real toxic over character choices before the session even starts.
Same problem with the different ammo types - what if everyone WANTS to use the shotgun? Suddenly you have teammates stealing ammo and turning on each other.
The hitmakers are for knowing when you've killed something more than if you hit if
Oh yes and l4d's style of literally never running out of ammo is so much better
@@syli3694 Which shouldn't be needed. With proper animation, effect and sound feedback, you should always know when you've killed something. The gore system and sound feedback in L4D handles this perfectly.
@@spreadator8276 Your comment smells a little of someone who hasn't played on higher difficulties.
And as I said:
"And when that's not enough, Deep Rock Galactic".
@Nushia everyone here knows tr is the og creator of l4d, all tho i would say valve is a major reason why left 4 dead is so well crafted. not to mention most if not all original devs did not work on this game
Hey bro, you prob dont remember me, but I remember when you were such a small channel. You took advice with a grain of salt and didnt let your ego blind you to criticism.
I can see how much youve grown as a channel, and Im super happy that you also give some of the most fair reviews while keeping your humor, along with not letting your own emotions overwhelm and take over your video into biased or off topic review.
Thanks for still being my favorite video game reviewer bro, I hope you will stay successful! Lack of good reviewers nowadays that arent copy pasted af.
I had to turn off recoil recentering and hitmarkers before it started feeling okay. If you need to put hitmarkers in your zombie shooting game you need to rework your visual player feedback.
1000% agree. Playing with the hitmarkers off really highlights the feedback problem
I hate how hitmarkers are a gaming trend, even halo infinite campaign has them. what happened to subtle design that gives feedback to the player when they are hitting something?
Hitmarker in Apex is awful too, it obstructs view way too much. Turning it off made so much more sense.
Whine over the smallest things
L4D2 is timeless, Back 4 Blood will feel dated in a couple years from release.
It feels dated now AI is crap for enemy and player bots
You'll probably see Back 4 Blood in humble bundles a few months after release.
I give it a year, tops untill another multiplayer game comes out, perhaps another COD.
you'll see the game commonly on discounts, but not for good reasons.
Years? I'll give it till the end of this video.
Damn, i couldn't agree more with a lot of things you said here.
I want to like Back 4 Blood, and to be honest i kinda like how the mechanics, guns and such, but something about the game just doesn't click for me.
I have not felt "the thing" i felt for L4D on any type of horde shooter ever, B4B feels much more fake and cartoony, L4D felt like the characters were actually going through something mostly believeable with amazing atmosphere and facing infected that could happen.
B4B just.. looks generic, like a boring shooter with mediocre character design and soulless world design, especially in comparison to L4D, which is a game i honestly really loved for many reasons.
This game is not terrible by any means, but i just don't know how to feel about it, especially considering they are going for the live service route, which i don't usually mind but it feels like it could really ruin a game like this.
That's the worst part about Back 4 Blood to me as well. The game itself is pretty okay and can be fun, but the game world and characters feel so generic and uninspired. The player characters are incredibly boring and forgettable, with no personality at all, and the game world just feels... uninteresting and uninspired. It all just feels really generic, despite the gameplay being enjoyable. Not really a fan of the setting or art style much at all.
@@BlindxSide Yeah same, it was my first impression from the second i saw the game, it seems confused in what it wants to do.
To me, the characters I've seen feels so flat and boring. Like generic young people designed by people who aren't. Where's Coach or Rochelle or Nick or Bill? The levels feels the same. Just generic dull dark urban and forest levels. Where's New Orleans or the swamp or the hospital? But hey, maybe that's coming in the full game.
Personally, I love the gunplay in B4B. It feels really smooth compared to L4D and other games in that genre. But I do agree, the art style is a bit questionable and doesn't have that same gritty feeling in some places (more specifically, the places with the "tentacles" and nests with the organs trailing from place to place). It feels out of place from the rest of the art in the game.
Speaking of horde shooters, I feel Deep Rock Galactic needs to be part of the conversation since it filled the void that wanting to play a modern L4D left in my heart. While it's not 1 to 1, as DRG has classes and another dimension to its gameplay of exploration, mining, and terrain traversal, I feel like horde shooters should have some degree of environmental manipulation like creating chokepoints, bunkering down somewhere, or creating traps in order to deal with ammo conservation in a player inventive way. Also the personality of the horde shooter, which DRG and L4D had in spades.
Also weapon variety and enemy variety, not even just completely different enemies but variations on existing ones to make the endless stream of hordes more unique.
The L4D games were truly great games. So many ideosyncracies and details to the gameplay, that even years later you still find new ways to play, or notice interesting game design. This new game just looks like it completely missed the point of the originals.
I still keep finding more and more details to this day, and I owned the game ever since making my Steam account which is now 5 years.
Yikes. That's what I was afraid of, this being EVOLVE all over again.
Turtle Rock really caught lightning in a bottle with L4D which to this day is still very enjoyable to play.
It’s not evolve
@@MattAlbie It might as well be
bro nobody is playing this game for the pvp lol. the pve experience was a ton of fun imo. It made everything feel really tense. Having limited continues in a run. Its a fun rogue like zombie shooter
@@thehumerus To be clear for full context here, I LOVED Evolve. Especially after the free to play gameplay changes relaunch. I think it's a shame Evolve wasn't closer to the Left 4 Dead formula with little swarms of aliens and campaigns etc because if it did, that game would still be successful today. I'm saying it's not Evolve because... It's not even close to being anything like Evolve. It's literally Left 4 Dead 3, but instead of campaign mode PvP there's static maps from the campaign mode PvP. That is basically functionally the biggest difference. Love it, hate it, whatever, comparing this to Evolve as a GAME is dumb. Wanna compare it to Evolve because of shitty dumb monetization plans and battle passes etc? Sure. Fine.,
@@MattAlbie Ahh, alright I see what you're saying. Yeah, Back 4 Blood is by no means a terrible game. I just hope they don't pull the classic micro-transaction bullshit that so many games do today, because that's just absolutely horrendous. I'm glad we can discuss this like normal people though. That's pretty rare for a RUclips comment section lmao.
The sad truth is A LOT of games are like this now. I'm not saying all! But you can tell when a game was made as a passion vs as a job. The little things actually add up and matter. You only care about the little things when you're creating something you love.
Nice spawn profile
A game I can think of that isn't like this is Titanfall 2 which funnily enough was built on Source like L4D2 (which this game is being compared to) and not only does it have a unique aesthetic and dope ass mechs but also the devs knew how to make gunplay fun (as expected from MW1 and MW2's devs). Now obviously I'm not saying B4B should be a sci-fi shooter but it should try to find a way to make itself unique to appeal to an audience. Also a lot of games in general aren't really taking advantage of how far technology has come because they'd rather make a game look photorealstically pretty to appeal to casuals that could be dated in a few years easily instead of a unique artstyle or aesthetic that ages like fine wine. Also B4B will he drowned out by the fierce competition that is Halo Infinite and Battlefield 2042 in terms of more modern releases regardless of the quality of those games. So the devs are in a tight rut they made for themselves. Now since I don't have access to a beta I can't really properly judge how this game plays bit based on impressions the signs aren't good and I'm not curious enough to try this game out for $60 when my money is better spent elsewhere.
Couldn't have phrased it better man, I agree 100%. Nearly every big game used to be a labor of love and passion.
That’s why I’m hyped for the aliens game I can tell the devs really like the alien universe and have been working super hard on it even if know it won’t be perfect because it being a budget indi game I know I will have fun with it like World war Z that I still play aloooot till this day and can’t wait for the new patches and dlc
For me is the grinding
Really dislike that from games , like I don't want to sit down for 2hrs and collect random stuffs so I can level up my knife , I prefer a hard game that you need to get better irl than getting better in game via leveling up
Hopefully, this game gets modding support once it comes out
Update: turns out this game won't have modding support
Heavily monetized games never allow this sadly
Yep; modern games have prohibited modding (community created content / free r & d) so the devs can nickel & dime customers. Sadly, this is why the industry is creatively bereft and circling the drain now. The crash can’t come soon enough.
@@TheKaoticSanity They aren't releasing with microtransactions... they did say they might consider them but what are they going to do, the supply points? They are so easy to get.
Looks like I’ll continue to just mod L4D2. This video just makes me wish I was watching Left 4 Dead gameplay instead.
You know for people who are professionals you would expect the characters would be absolutely strapped like in WWZ but nah
I played Left4Dead 2 first time ever after playing this beta for Back4Blood and Im really loving it.
Its the little things, like shooting in the dark where the only source of light is your flashlight and the flash from your gun when firing bullets. Feels so great, zombies running at you in the dark of the empty mall, only visible to you in flashes of light, so atmospheric and immersive.
I preferred L4D, but both it and its sequel are masterpieces. L4D2 has some better objectives and weapons, but I fell in love with the atmosphere of the first game.
"Seeing who friendly fired the most which was almost always me" sigma male grindset
The one silver lining about all of this is that L4D2 will probably have a nice uptick in players when people inevitably drop this game.
True. There’s probably some kids who have never played l4d2 but they might like back 4 blood so they will go and check out the OG games
L4D is timeless, as the graphics comparisons show. It's cartoony artwork, and the physics and gameplay are pure fun.
I agree with the final conclusion.
After playing it all I thought was "Huh, this kind of sucks I want to go play l4d 1-2 again"
I'm personally just hyped for the first person mode that is officially coming to the World War Z, it looks cool as hell and the amount of content in that game is insane and constantly growing.
Wtff I was heavily considering it as it's only 20$ at Walmart, definitely copping now
I don't remember there being that much content when I played and that was just a few months ago.
@@frank.e.wildcat yea man wait for the aftermath expansion. If I'm not mistaken it includes all DLC for the base game, as well as a ton other features it looks fantastic imo
@@thisismyname5657 there is 5 chapters 3 To 4 levels each add into 2 more with the aftermath patch will Make a total amount of 7 chapters countless new guns to try and use like 3 new classes with more coming with the aftermath patch and guns as well now there adding an FPV mode and fixing the melee combat the only thing lacking is horde atm that only has 1 level witch I’m
Sure they will add more
It’s a great fun game
The little touches would go a long way to improving people's reaction to how the game feels
they never fix this problem with patches, Back 4 Blood is a complete write off. Balance and bugs is all patches ever address these days.
Blame overly streamlined game engine tool boxes and hiring too many depressed twitter addicted morons.
I found out today that the different piano noises are a different zombie. They still made sounds to make them unique.
The beta gave me and my friends a, "wait for a sale when more content is available" vibe
It gives off the Evolve vibe to me of "Wait till game gets patched into being decent but instead get 200$ worth of microtransactions and DLCs"
It just feels like the LFD games but with too much, what made LFd so good is the simplicity
It's like left 4 dead jumped on the cod zombies style of zombie game mode
Doesn’t feel like L4D at all; as the guy above me said, it feels more like CoD zombies. People kept talking about how this was going to kill WWZ and be the best coop zombie game out there, but WWZ feels more L4D than this game (especially on insane difficulty). Can’t count the amount of times I’ve laughed at a friend getting caught by a Bull or exploded by a Bomber, or how a horde completely blind-sided me, or how I tried to be a badass by running ahead alone and got ambushed by a Lurker. But the special infected in this game are just so bland. The “zombies” in this game are bland.
It tried copying the L4D aesthetic (and managed here and there) but nothing about it feels remotely similar or even superior.
Ah yes that radio beeping sound in L4D when you completed a mission, just flawless, I hope TR think of something for final build
God I loved the car alarm mechanic in left for dead. Everyone just starts to panic and curse out the person that set it off 🤣
Yeah because it was memorable like the specials,you knew shit is going to get real when you hear it so in the back of your head you always wanted to never hear them but at the same time you knew you will hear them any second
Totally agree. Now it's birds that trigger a horde if you get too close to them :)
@@nutarchive9349 which is also a thing stolen from L4D2 the Blood Harvest campaign,when you enter the cornfield and the crows get scared and fly which triggers the horde,i swear the devs of B4B either copy and pasted content from L4D or tried to copy stuff from L4D in the laziest and trashiest way possible
@@SHAdow98V You read it in the description that TurtleRock claims to be the creators of the L4D series without crediting Valve. I believe it was Valve that made these games so good. How did they manage to create a worse version of L4D if they made the others? It's not original, it's generic. It's boring, and it's forgettable. Makes me wanna play Left 4 Dead 2.
@@nutarchive9349 Agree,slap some mods onto that bad boy and you get hundreds of time a better experience than having the 100 euros premium version of B4B,btw have i mentioned how much i hate the fact that this trash is sooo fucking expensive?
No end game: There doesn't need to be one look at L4D 1 & 2
Generic gun: Good most games the try to fix it up with lesser known guns end up with a bunch of guns people don't give a shit about and don't want to use.
Guns don't feel like they have a roll like in L4D: I literally have no idea how you got to this conclusion. Shotguns = best horde clear, Snipers = best special killers, Assault weapons for middle ground, SMGs for the same kind of function the assault weapons have but with a different style and there's clearly different types of each...like what?
Characters wear impractical clothing: Louis literally wears a tie in L4D which could easily get him killed. You mention he's all messy looking but not that.
Like I'm not saying the game is perfect it easily has it's flaws and a good chunk of them but complaints like the ones above are just kind of foolish and honestly feel like you were just out looking for extra things to complain about just for the sake of complaining.