Is The HAM Loki Better Than The Tengu?? || EVE Online
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- Опубликовано: 5 окт 2024
- #captainbenzie #EVEEchoes #EVEOnline #newplayerguide #beginners
The Tech 3 Strategic Cruisers are some of the most amazing ships in EVE Online! Here's the HAM Loki I use for C3 ratting!
[Loki, C3 HAM]
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Large C5-L Compact Shield Booster
Pith C-Type Shield Boost Amplifier
Multispectrum Shield Hardener II
Caldari Navy Stasis Webifier
Dark Blood Cap Recharger
Thukker Large Cap Battery
Republic Fleet 10MN Afterburner
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
[Empty High slot]
Covert Ops Cloaking Device II
Sisters Expanded Probe Launcher
Medium Kinetic Shield Reinforcer II
Medium Thermal Shield Reinforcer II
Medium Bay Loading Accelerator I
Loki Core - Immobility Drivers
Loki Defensive - Covert Reconfiguration
Loki Offensive - Launcher Efficiency Configuration
Loki Propulsion - Wake Limiter
Hobgoblin II x8
Nova Rage Heavy Assault Missile x5369
Nova Javelin Heavy Assault Missile x4680
Sisters Core Scanner Probe x16
Sisters Combat Scanner Probe x16
Mobile Tractor Unit x1
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Great video, I'll share a tip back :
when in fitting, on the right side "defense" tab, you can select your tanking to get the real values.
There you have 7HP/s because you selected "passive shield" (probably default), if you select active shield then you'll see what your shield booster + sba will yield.
Awesome, thank you!!
I started a Minmater character just to play their cruisers eventually. Their cruiser designs are really cool. I'm still not a fan of the frigate designs but eh, maybe they'll grow on me. As an example, I HATED the Gallente Catalist, but I love that ship now.
Rifter, Slasher, Firetail and Probe/Cheetah. I love those designs 🚀
Loki is my personal favourite out of all T3 cruisers. For my ratting/DED running Loki, I use the augmented nuclear reactor instead of the immobility drivers that you show on your fit. That allows me to fit a damage control plus an additional ballistic control system. I also use heavy missiles instead of hams but those can be swapped easily according to playstyle. Ship is cap stable (1 large cap battery and 1 medium tech II cap rig) and dps is insane even with heavies. Basically you can keep a distance of 60km and kill stuff from there. Saves you the time of burning for ham range for each target and you can also keep alignment while shooting, in case you're worried something might show up. In my personal experience, the immobility drivers provide much more value when it comes to pvp as you can kite stuff at 30km and shoot them with rapid lights, heavies or even rage hams with the addition of a missile guidance computer with a range script.
The Augmented Reactor just looks so horrid 😅 otherwise, interesting fit! Thank you!
Mind posting fit?
@@Marcheva91 a good HM For most pve needs:
[Loki, Ratter]
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Missile Guidance Enhancer II
Damage Control II
Pith X-Type Large Shield Booster
Multispectrum Shield Hardener II
Gistum C-Type 10MN Afterburner
Republic Fleet Large Cap Battery
Missile Guidance Computer II, Missile Precision Script
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Covert Ops Cloaking Device II
Sisters Expanded Probe Launcher
[Empty High slot]
Medium Bay Loading Accelerator I
Medium Warhead Flare Catalyst II
Medium Warhead Flare Catalyst II
Loki Core - Augmented Nuclear Reactor
Loki Defensive - Covert Reconfiguration
Loki Offensive - Launcher Efficiency Configuration
Loki Propulsion - Wake Limiter
Hobgoblin II x5
Hornet EC-300 x3
Mid-grade Crystal Alpha
Mid-grade Crystal Beta
Mid-grade Crystal Gamma
Mid-grade Crystal Delta
Mid-grade Crystal Epsilon
Mid-grade Crystal Omega
Zainou 'Snapshot' Heavy Assault Missiles AM-703
Inherent Implants 'Squire' Capacitor Management EM-803
Zainou 'Deadeye' Target Navigation Prediction TN-903
Zainou 'Deadeye' Rapid Launch RL-1003
Synth Blue Pill Booster
Synth Crash Booster
Agency 'Pyrolancea' DB5 Dose II
Mjolnir Fury Heavy Missile x10000
Mjolnir Precision Heavy Missile x4000
Nanite Repair Paste x100
Agency 'Hardshell' TB5 Dose II x1
Synth Blue Pill Booster x1
Just started flying a loki yesterday. Also have a tengu. Using both for mission running, so far I feel more comfortable running the tengu in the missions where there is kinetic damage being flung at you and have been going to the loki with em heavy missions.
Nice 👍 for J-Space, neither of those are considerations, fortunately, so both do really well! I love both ships ❤️🚀
There is normally a repair system on some stations in most systems. Anyway thanks, I took a lot from this upload and if it wasn't for uploads like this I wouldn't know half of what I am learning, many thanx.
Glad it helped! As for repairs, yep, but if you're wormholing, you may be several systems down chain of any station you'd dock at.
@@captainbenzie Understood.
Still adding that drone dps to the total dps in your head I see ;) Great video otherwise! Looking forward to the overall ranking!
Yes. I wish he would be better with the fitting window. Learn how it presents DPS and the option to change and show the different tanking options. It will show you what your shield rep repairs per second.
I like the guy. If you want to take on the role as a teacher, give correct info. Trying to be nice and not a bitter vet.
Yeah this was pointed out to me after the Proteus video. Every video between now and basically the end of May has already been recorded and uploaded.
@Captain Benzie OK, cool. I thought that might be the case. I knew you said somewhere you were busy this month. Just wanted to be sure you understood my concern 😁
I just recently came back to eve and was really wanting to do some wormhole content. I ended up deciding on a loki, and this is almost exactly the fit I came up with lol.
I'm using a semiconductor memory cell II instead of the bay accelerator though, and using a second multispectrum hardener instead of a cap recharger... You don't lose too much dps since you're already stacking BCSs, and you are much more cap stable with a beefier tank. I saved a little bit on the afterburner and just got a republic fleet one, then traded up to a domination LSB + dread guristas amplifier.
I've just been playing solo and hunting down quiet c3's to run, but I'm making like 250m in a couple hours including scanning things down/setup before I dip and call it a day... My character was created in 2006 and I was active for a couple years, and back then even deep 0.0 ratting in alliance territory I didn't make anywhere near this money.
Nice! I'm really glad you're enjoying it!
I have changed the fit a little since this (though I mainly use Autos now) and your suggestions sound great!
Any T3 cruiser is good, Loki is allrounder, Tengu has highest dps but is kinetic damage locked and has EM hole in shields. Proeteus is buffed Ishtar in some ways, but worst in other. Legion, well, needs some love.
But with good skills in T3 there is no need to skill BC's or BS's, unless you are going for Marauder (and I prefer Vargur).
Another good thing about good skills in cruisers you open yourself on using ships like HAC (I love Vagabond and Ishtar). I am using Vaga for Besieged Lab sites in FW atm.
And cruisers are still cheap and good option for PVP if you like to try it.
Basically I use cruisers for Belt ratting, DED sites and anomalies, some lvl 4 missions (other option is Marauder), scanning, T3 WH and so on.
Basically the same set up as me! In my first T3C video (Why You Should Fly One) I say exactly that, they provide an excellent basis for pretty much every other cruiser. Glad you're enjoying! I'm training the Golem as we speak on main, and the Vargur on an alt.
What about something like this? EHP rep should be about the same, EHP buffer is bigger, Rigor II rig gives better application in both explo velocity and sig radius (see Eve University's missile mechanics entry). Slightly cheaper price tag, and another cap battery gives you more neut resist. I went for a Cap recharge rig I & II in this one since you seem to like cap stability, but I personally would go double Rigor II.
[Loki, **C3 HAM Benzie Double CapBatt]
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Pith C-Type Large Shield Booster
Multispectrum Shield Hardener II
Multispectrum Shield Hardener II
Caldari Navy Stasis Webifier
Medium Cap Battery II
Thukker Large Cap Battery
10MN Y-S8 Compact Afterburner
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
[Empty High slot]
Covert Ops Cloaking Device II
Sisters Expanded Probe Launcher
Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II
Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Loki Core - Immobility Drivers
Loki Defensive - Covert Reconfiguration
Loki Offensive - Launcher Efficiency Configuration
Loki Propulsion - Wake Limiter
Hobgoblin II x8
Nova Rage Heavy Assault Missile x6029
Nova Javelin Heavy Assault Missile x4680
Sisters Core Scanner Probe x16
Sisters Combat Scanner Probe x16
Mobile Tractor Unit x1
Could work but I worry about the lower resists. I'll give it a try, thank you!
@@captainbenzie Absolutely, but I think that's really just a sacrifice in the name of your love for the ewar. The "mainstream" fit I think is the augmented nuclear reactor with built in energy warfare resist and better cap stability. That makes double Rigor II an easy choice + lets you fit more BCS and a DCII for the undiminished extra shield resist (I'm oldschool, okay). Two extra BCS instead of one is obviously possible and not entirely pointless.
[Loki, **C3 HAM Benzie Double CapBatt NoWeb :(]
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Damage Control II
Pith C-Type Large Shield Booster
Multispectrum Shield Hardener II
Multispectrum Shield Hardener II
10MN Y-S8 Compact Afterburner
Thukker Large Cap Battery
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II
[Empty High slot]
Covert Ops Cloaking Device II
Sisters Expanded Probe Launcher
Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Loki Core - Augmented Nuclear Reactor
Loki Defensive - Covert Reconfiguration
Loki Offensive - Launcher Efficiency Configuration
Loki Propulsion - Wake Limiter
Hobgoblin II x8
Nova Rage Heavy Assault Missile x5699
Nova Javelin Heavy Assault Missile x4680
Sisters Core Scanner Probe x16
Sisters Combat Scanner Probe x16
Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile x330
Mobile Tractor Unit x1
Loki and solo Pvp.. ahh the good old days.. miss it.
☺️
Is there a video on the ranking yet? Would like to know what the best ship you found is regardless of ship class etc.
Not yet! Working on it 😬
Been looking for a different c3 fit for me loki. And one with a cloak awesome no more need for a depo more cargo for missiles
Enjoy!!
Have you tested this in DED sites? Really a pity the power grid is so tight, would be amazing if blinged.
put a remote small armor rep to repair the damaged drones on the fly
With that many high slots, and bonuses to webs, do you think it would ever be feasable to put on 2 webs? I never flew T3 stragi cruisers in EO. I mostly stuck to frigates and dessies. But my favourite fit, and the one I had the most success with in pvp, was a dual tank, dual web hookbill. I could scram kite any frigate that tried to brawl me with the dual web and AB on the hookbill. And if it was a kiter, I would load javellins, and I usually had missile range rigs on the hookbill. I'd beaten dozens of slicers that way that thought they could kite me to death.
Dual web fits are certainly possible and fairly popular. It's not used here because in PvE the single web is more than sufficient, but for PvP it's a really good fit!
@@captainbenzie Sorry, i meant with that many mid slots, as you'd have plenty of room for 2 webs.
Also would you use HAM's in pvp? I wonder if the damage application on the Loki, along with a dual web fit, would make it effective vs smaller ships.
I have not watched video yet, but I can already say that for L4 missions ham loki is often better than tengu :) small drones + application bonus means that you can actually those pesky frigates.
And now I have to check rigs, but I get 30km range on rages with my fit... and more dps than you. I just don't apply as well.
2 hydraulic bay thrusters.
and I am slower by 5m/s... I use the other prop subsystem xD
There is one big downside to my fit though: expensive cap battery (storyline, I'm looking for some way to change it to faction as I don't like using cap battery that costs 300M isk)
Controversial, I prefer Auto Loki best of all 😂
You always say how you try to squeeze every ounce of power grid out. Which modules do you prioritize when doing a fit so you can swap other modules for power grid efficiency ones
Great question and depends on the situation. I tend to Stimulate the fit, reach the minimum benchmarks, and then look at where it can best be improved.
If the tank is borderline, push that up. If, like with the Proteus, the cap is a little low, that's where is push so I can handle more Neuts. If one web is fine but two is an issue, buff the prop. Otherwise, DPS.
Hey returning player and new to T3s, I can copy your fit in this ship but dont have HAM 5 atm, Im currently using republic fleet HAMs. Is this alright? Im sitting at ~500 dps. (HAM 5 is training as we speak, and mostly got the launchers from FW so not a huge bank bust)
It'll work, just slower to kill stuff ☺️
I love ham
Lmao me too
HAML MAO :)@@captainbenzie
Wait.. A shield tank that can use drones?? Am I seeing that right benzie??
Yup
Loki is really good for ratting, I think it also requires a little less isk investment versus something like the Legion but it's good. However, I think having the capacitor core and the Adaptive Defense node defense is a bit better. It will make things a lot more AFK in terms of damage since you get an extra 2.5% rep power power level of Minmatar Defensive Subsystems. Having the extra cap resistance is also good against sleepers. The webs are a good idea for application but since the lower class WH sites are so easy that I think the extra time is fine to take. Preferably it'd be smart to take a mobile depot and then change out your covert ops cloak rig for the travel to the site and then swapping it out for Adaptive Defense Node when you have reached the system you are doing sites in the WH you want. I still think T3Cs are too much isk for the risk they pose unless you have alts sitting on entrance holes/good tank that can survive until you get a backup fleet, but they do work. I'd recommend looking into a C3 ratting Cerberus as an interesting video. It requires pretty high fitting skills, and can only safely run FFS unless you have some bling both in your pod and on the ship, but it applies like crazy and can run these really fast. If you get lucky and get a system with a bunch of FFS sites it's great isk with pretty low investment.
I'm looking at both the Sacrilege and Cerberus currently. Ultimately, you are right that the Adaptive Defense Node is better during the site for AFK, but that now also means you're carrying a Mobile Depot and extra fittings. More cost when destroyed.
As such, I tend to stick to one for, run what I can with that, then done. You can make it "more afk" but I don't think that's a good thing in J-Space 😉
Tengu seems cheapest, with Loki second, Proteus close behind, and Legion way higher for sure. Praxis is a good option for C3s, as is a Gila.
why do you need the web? and 10s Align. Isn't that a big no no for solo WH? Just curious...
With judicious D-Scan, 10s align is fine (especially since you're manually piloting anyways and can be aimed close to something and moving at speed anyways. 10s is only from a full stop.
@@captainbenzie Ok just for kicks, so let's see a practical example, you are happy chipping away at the rat manually piolioting and maintaing transversal, You just killed the last rat and are appraoching your MTU to scoop.
Suddenly, a wild hungry Hostile Loki Dcloaks - the problem here, you are likely not aligned to anything, and most likely going to warp to a safe, it will take approx 10s to do that and by then yr already locked.
Do you see this happening differently? How would you escape?
Ps. Any chance you could do more T3 fits. They are definately the best ships :)
@@floyd1411 that Loki will have been on D-Scan at some point. If I missed it, that's on me. Equally, I'm in a wormhole corp so I have friends in system with me.
@@floyd1411 that Loki will have been on D-Scan at some point. If I missed it, that's on me. Equally, I'm in a wormhole corp so I have friends in system with me.
@@captainbenzie Yup yup.. I hear you.. If i am going to resub, i am definately joining your corp :)
That's a pretty low EHP though. My Tengu sitting at 40k EHP
Loki is smaller and faster so takes less damage though. They each have their unique attributes. I love my Tengu too though!
Is this the standard skin? i just 3d printed this and need to paint it haha
Oh nice!! Send pictures when done!
No, this is the Hazard Control skin.
I will, but can i ask, why when i search the loki ingame the ship i am seeing looks like a diffrent ship?@@captainbenzie
@@japreet_kah when you search in-game you see the default ship with the base four Subsystems. In the viewing window you can change the Subsystems to the one in the fit and it'll visually match 😊
I've been running a Proteus in the Guri Murikan siites and while it is more fun, due to it requiring more play (Tengu is nothing but pop in, target and push F1.), any Tengu or Loki can steal the boss whenever they want. I have to get close to it before I apply damage. The Tengu hits at full damage at 21km, where the Proteus can only do decent damage at about 5K.. I get about 11K damage by overheating my Tengu missiles, and about 900 by overheating the Proteus. I could do better with a lot less tank, but the tank effectiveness is about the same between the two. It is more fun to fly, but I'm losing bosses because of its limitations. The Proteus needs an extra lower slot. I didn't even think about using one, but I saw one warp in, and leave the site as soon as he could clear the small stuff, so I wanted to see if it would work.
I've done a video on the Proteus recently where I had good application out to over 60km. I really don't like Blasters for PvE as it's so hard to keep ranges and results in so much slowboating.
@@captainbenzie Much more fun than sitting in one spot and spamming F1 though...lol. i have application to 12K, though reduced, but still one-shotting most frigates at 10K. The missile boats like to sit at 15 K though and I have to go get them...that and the invaders when I knock out the first two waves....
670 Mil? That price has got to be wrong, or have the prices fallen a lot?
Nope, that's correct!
@@captainbenzie amm any chance you could post something about loki pvp for hunting ratters?
Is the legion any good
I did a video on the HAM Legion here: ruclips.net/video/qjc0H-e8NvY/видео.html
I've yet to properly test it with Energy Turrets but I don't see why it wouldn't be as good!
Very good, imo 😉
Loki is completely flexible. Tengu is limited to kinetic and HAM. It does nothing else useful. Loki is just better in every way. They may as well delete Tengu. The hate is real on the dev board. Did you see the drone cap[ability on TENGU? It's on a t1 level. Lmfao.
Tengu has bigger shields, longer range built in, and overall higher damage, just locked. I love my Loki to bits, but it doesn't replace the Tengu. They're just different ships
@@captainbenzie Nah I play enough to know the HATE on Tengu is real. Shields are bigger? Not by much. Devs basically made sure LOKI was the new META and insured that TENGU would phase out. Look at the features on Loki vs Tengu, it's embarrassing. Loki does replace Tengu my friend. Why do you think everyone is switching over? Me and all my friends too.
@@relaxationparadise7645 then if you shoot the outpost with loki in under 10 minutes then I will switch from tengu
@@relaxationparadise7645I know this is a year later but clarification is needed. Tengu is kin locked but jspace rats have Omni resists so damage selection doesn’t matter.