We somehow unintentionally managed to leave out the UX/UI segment for the Gaggia Accademia on this edit, so we've uploaded that section separately here instead: ruclips.net/video/zgybPrP1YJA/видео.html
Oh and the 55ml instead of 60, the machine adjusts it if you change the grind setting. Imo this machine is great price/quality, allthough mine was already replaced under warrantee & the display can give trouble if you keep machine on for long.
I would love to see a comparison of multiple Delonghi Bean To Cup, from the lowest end to the highest end, since the price range is quite large and they seem to use the same brewing mechanism.
My understanding is that all units from a specific series (ECAM, ESAM, etc) the internals are the same (brew unit, boiler, pump, etc). Only the offered features and user interface differ.
I have a Delonghi worked continuously in my small restaurant, I think the model is magnifica S. It is not a coffee restaurant per se but 30+ cups of coffee per day is for sure. 10 years, it has been making coffee, and still going strong.
Magnifica S is a legend. I have had it in most of the offices I worked in. Never disapoints, and the coffee is reasonably descent for such cheap machine.
The Siemens actually has a true dual grinder - not just dual hopper. So no mixture of coffee. The milk tank can go into the fridge and you can buy an milk package adapter if you want.
We use the eq9 with single grinder (s700 i think) and the McDonald's Espresso roast. We Love it. Surely not the best quality Coffee but we Love the Taste with the eq9. And what i think is the best Part on the Siemens. She is absolute easy to Handle and cleaning. All parts are ready to build Out and can be cleaned. Most parts in the dishwasher. The Machine can Show when the next cleaning process is expected. All process is with an step by step Manuel in the Machine and in the Manuel. It has an integrated water decalcer. I love this Machine. Its no real Espresso Machine but for us, she is quite perfect
@@robertof.5283 We have the same with the single grinder and I concur, coffee is great, lattes and espressos too, we use very dark roasts though. But the cleaning is so simple on this compared to other machines we've had before, couldn't quite believe how easy it was to clean both the brewing unit and the inside. It's also one of the most quiet machines we had. Heaven!!
I've been hard at bay finding a good machine under 1k that actually brews good coffee. Found none. I've just splurged and got the delonghi. For under 1k, just buy a Nespresso machine honestly... you'd be better off.
My aunt has Jura machines for years and loves a cappuccino, she actually considers not having a container a feature as she just sticks it in the container, closes it up and back into the fridge.
Completely agree. We've been using our Z5 for years and only used the milk container once at the very beginning. There is just no argument for filling a container as it needs to be emptied and cleaned afterwards. I'd say it's the right call to sell it separately because even those people using it can just keep one for any future machine.
Agreed. We use ours mainly for espresso and when we want to make some milk drink, we just take a carton of milk out of the fridge and make it. No need to clean anything afterwards :)
My Jura the same I used a screw top jam jar and just made hole in top for silicon tube as I rarely use auto cappuccino program and I can keep jar in fridge when I do between uses 🤣
Hi James, my father made one of his first trips to Italy in the early early 70s. He brought back his first espresso machine (no clue of what the name was). Seems like he kept going back and buying more machines. He always had one at home and one at his office. I got all of his hand me downs. So I have had espresso machines since probably 1973. I had 2 Quick Mills Super Automatic machines, with the filter basket of 7 g and an upgraded one with 9 g. Look them up. I have owned an assortment of single boiler machines heat exchangers since my early 20s. To name a few I have had multiples: Electra, Pavoni, Pasquini Livietta, Quick Mill Anita, and I am currently rocking a dual boiler, what you would call a Sage (Breville in the US). Freshly roasted double shot cappuccino first thing in the morning for 45 years! The funny thing is that in those early days I had almost no clue on how to get good reputable shots until guys like you came along and explained it all. Thank you for your contribution…
As a Jura owner, I am happy to see it got good results. I think folks who own a Jura understand that they are paying for well above average coffee that is still a notch below the traditional coffee shop machines in exchange for incredible convenience. I don't want to be a barista in my own house every morning when I'm rushing to work or having a dinner party -- it's an incredible feeling to be able to pull a great cup of coffee or cappuccino and have minimal setup / cleaning to do afterwards. I personally have found it to be worth every penny, even if it means I give up control over some of the knobs I would have to get the perfect extraction
You nailed the whole Superautomatic ownership experience and why Jura should still be considered the best at it. Only thing I'd add is that Jura are too pricey if your main focus is espresso. You can get as-good espresso with much cheaper Superautomatics. But what Jura does to simplify and automate the milk process, if that's what you want, is a thing of beauty and worth every cent. Also, I reckon these machines make better coffee than two-thirds to three-quarters of Baristas out there.
Yes those are my thoughts on Superauto machines too. Both my son and my son-in-law have more hands on types of coffee makers and although they will generally make a better espresso (it can go badly wrong some times) - its takes an absolute age to get there and then there's all the cleaning up after. By the time you've added some frothy milk though, there's not much difference in the quality of the coffee.
I was a happy Jura owner buying Jura E6 when on sale at Costco. Worked great for 6 months then started to not dispense coffee. Would grind and start the brew process but few drops would come out with liquid in the puck container. I ran clean cycle even though not prompted and not helpful. Changed the filter even though not needed. This helped for half a cup then problem returned. I was going to contact Jura but since bought at Costco just cleaned up the machine and returned to Costco. Thanks for the return policy Costco refunded my purchase price. I do not abuse Costco return policy but did not want to deal with sending the machine in for repair. I think 6 months to start failure was not good and I did do all the maintenance required and still have large number of Jura cleaning pucks and few of the filters. If I get the courage I may give them another shot.
Agreed. As someone who has owned espresso machines as well as fully automatic machines.. the ability to get 80% of the experience for 10% of the effort is worth it, especially when you are time limited.
I have the Delonghi Dinamica Plus and I really like it. For milk drinks, I do the cappucino mix, which does coffee first then milk, which mixes the beverage a lot better. Also, with the app you can actually easily increase the dosage and volume.
Yeah it is a nice machine! Technically Coffee first drinks are more traditionally that of a latte. Cappuccino's are milk first then espresso so that you can a "cap" of foam on top.
I've had my Jura Z6 for over a decade now and I am very pleased with my purchase. The Jura shop in my area asked if I wanted to "upgrade" my Jura for a new one. Turned down the offer as my older model apparently has a very good boiler where as newer ones coffee/espresso does not come out as hot.
We have a slightly cheaper Delonghi, similar style and built quality. Even after 4 years of daily use several times a day it produces tasty coffee - not proper espresso, but it does not claim it would. Thank you for your test and insight James!
I've got the Delonghi that's roughly half the price of the one he's reviewing and I'm certain it's exactly the same on the inside. Same touch-screen interface and everything. I love it, and to have him say he likes the coffee means I have not wasted my money. 😄
When my in-laws bought the exact delonghi as in the video they gave me and my wife older delonghi which is at least 7, more like 8 years old (it has over 20000 or so cups of coffee under its belt) . The pucks coming from the machine are as dry as they were when it was new and I was able to dial very tasty coffee from it. I am very impressed by delonghi. My in-laws gave it to us because it had electronic issues and when send to service they told them that to repair it it would cost like half a price of a new one. So they bought the new one. Given it was more or less working they gave it to us and turned out no problems so far occurred and we have it like 6 months. I suspect a solar power plant on my in-laws house is in fault as that might have created instability in the outlets. For final comparison my parents had a Bosh for like 8 years also and that was giving out wet slush instead of pucks for the last 2 years (and what was worse a tasteless brown water instead of coffee) so they (and that is total coincidance) bought the delonghi from the video as well.
Yes! as someone who restored a fair amount of delonghi's; ALL OF THEM HAVE THE SAME INTERNALS. the only main differences being having an extra heating element for automatic steaming models and different design with different recipes. The ecam 21.112b has being going strong with my parents for 5 years now. I recently refurbished it and it still works fine. Only downside to an semi-auto espresso machine is that superauto's get really dirty over time, and this is the case with all machines even if they say they are ''automatic cleaning''
I have the entry level delonghi etam 29.510.sb (what a mouthful) and the grinder knob looks identical to the delonghi machine featured. I love it, it has had daily use for 3 years and has never missed a beat. Only downside to me is it does waste a lot of water cleaning itself before and after making coffee but it's not the end of the world. Would recommend one for sure.
We've been using our Jura ENA9 since I got it for my husband several years ago. Big splurge but it ended up paying for itself easily - my husband stopped going to Starbucks daily. I've got to say that Jura's service center is the absolute best of any that I've ever experienced with any company, ever.
@@catguy64 I can only speak from my experience over many years. Jura has given me the best customer service I have ever received for any product, much less for a kitchen appliance. My cleaning service broke the Jura by shoving parts back all incorrectly which jammed the machine (not a simple jam when you forget the grounds hopper which is the typical jam and solved by a sequence of buttons over the phone). Sent it to Jura and the reconditioned it (for a fee that my cleaning service paid for) and fixed it and sent it back - I swear its better than it was new. I bought this about 10 years ago and still going strong!!
2nd - we've had Jura for 15+ years and I have been consistently impressed with their customer service. I've recommended Jura to friends + family and they also have not been disappointed. Would not buy any other machine.
Bosch Siemens actually has other newer models with milk pipe going into the carton as well and I think it's brilliant. No need to store a separate container in the fridge or clean and the milk never remains in the container and goes bad. I love my Bosch machine.
I coincidentally bought the Jura two weeks ago. So seeing your review is quite pleasing. The machine, once you figured out all it’s ins and outs, is fantastic. It’s summer in South Africa and the cold brew it delivers is something quite astonishing. The flat white is proper quality that is better than a lot of average “coffee shops”
I have owned a Jura Capressa E8 for 15 years and the cup I brewed this am is just as good as the first one I ever made with it. I use purifier water only and I use fresh beans, and not 'flavored' beans. Also, I go through the cleaning cycle with the Jura tablets when the machine prompts me to do so. I paid $1200 for it back then and it has been worth every cent!
I have the Delonghi in the comparison. I know the mobile apps were not part of the review but the app allows fine-tuning the output by ml. Very easy to adjust and save preferences. Also the container is quite easy to clean which was important to me. Thanks for the review.
I have a lower level of the Delonghi. Have to second your positive for the container with a plus that it fits in the fridge in the door. Also all the feeding of water, milk, emptying is done from the front which is a huge plus point on the usual kitchen counter where there is other stuff to the sides of the machine and cabinet above it. Have to give it high marks for ergonomics and mechanical useability.
We had an older Jura in the office that made about 30-60 shots every day. It was beat to hell but made excellent coffee with an outstanding crema for many years and I've been enamoured with Jura's ever since.
Agreed. My partner was always buying coffees, sometimes leaving home to go through the Maccas drive through (of all things) because he hated instant, and didn't want to faff about with espresso machines. So armed with just a couple hundred Australian dollarydoos I searched around and found a local appliance wholesaler that also did refurbs and factory seconds - where they had a used Jura ENA Micro 90, pretty banged up on the outside but they cleaned out and replaced the inner parts where necessary to freshen it up. Was previously in a small office lunch room. We've since had it for over 3 years, multiple cups a day and never once missed a beat. Every few weeks it goes through a self clean cycle with fancy little tablets (takes like 20 mins and is all automated), and swap out the water filter a few times a year + hand wash the removable parts.. saved us soooooo much money, I love it
@@MotoCat91 Yeah that's something that's impossible to test on a bench: how long will it keep making good coffee without breaking? That's where the price difference between the Delonghi and Jura will start to make sense, when the swiss made machine soldiers on 10 years after the other one has broken down.
I've had my jura for over 7 years. Never replaced anything. Has always worked and tasted great! I have always used the exact same coffee beans for 7 years *Lavazza* and I noticed it started to taste sour last year. So I watched a RUclips video on how to disassemble and clean it. It's basically a space ship on the inside and after extreme care of disassembling the very small parts and deep cleaning and soaking components, it's basically brand new again. It's not hard to work on these. Just very small and important parts in there. If anything were to break, parts are expensive and honestly I would maybe just buy a new machine.
@@coryh9731I have a jura z8. So after you cleaned it the coffee tasted better again? I spoke to jura and if you send it to them they do a total refurb of all internal parts that need replacing for around 400 aud$.
We had a Jura ena 9 have had it for 14 years still going but recently up graded to Jura s8 because we got near new less than a year old been recently service. Anyway I’m in love it has so many features we didn’t have in the older model 🖤☕️
I have owned Jura machines for about 18 years now, first one was the original E8 I sold after 4 year, second one was the F9 which i ran until i needed new burrs after 10 years, 3rd is the new E8 which i absolutely love. I have tried Delonghi and Saeco early models, but those early models were very poor builds and brews which made me switch back to Jura and stay with them. the E8 is about half the price of the Z10, but has many of the UI but with manual grinder adjustment. The only alternative i have ever considered was the Oracle Touch, so i cant wait for that comparison
@@MrFizzarale Not sure about that, my friend has jura and i purchased Delonghi it is no comparison, Delonghi pores much better espresso then jura. I think is depends on what model you get.
@@rimasl.5645 With me having no experience with Delonghi products I cannot speak to their quality. So I cannot embrace this debate as much as I would like.
Idk, I tried several Juras (E8 and Z6) recently and really didn't like them. Milk wasn't hot enough and coffee shots were really small even after ajusting all the settings. I bought an Oracle Touch, and it's much, much better. It's not a super automatic though so you still have to rinse parts after.
James his review about "cean to cup machines", is by far the best that I have seen, the most other reviews on youtube don't tell anything about the coffee quality or with less details, James can tell in a very interesting way what to expect. James tells in a fascinating way, really took your attention, critical in pleasant way.
I have a Delonghi Eletta. It has various sizes, strengths, milk, and temperature options. It actually makes pucks, and is shockingly quite great considering it is all automatic.
I have the same, the setting for cappuccinos is all the way to the right instead of down the middle for adjusting milk foam. I wonder if that would've made a difference in James' assessment of milk quality, or using regular milk.
@@anthony64632 1000 is actually pretty reasonable. For a good espresso machine you need about 300, for a good grinder aprox 400, that makes 700. Add 300 for making it automatic and you have 1000. When I was low on budget and still wanted tasty coffee I used not-so-bad grinder and moccha pot. In my opinon is the best way to make espresso-like drink at low cost.
@@kuba6344, if I had £1000, then I would go for it . But I don't have it. So what the rock bottom proce for a good bean to cup machine. I have had delomgi manual expresso machine worth £200 ,broke down in 2 years.
Miele are known for having an unconventional user interface. It’s seen in many domestic devices. This coffee machine seems from the size and controls, more like an office machine that a technician will set up and the people at the office only need to press a button for making a cup of coffee. This also explains why it has such a flexibility in the grinding as well as the cup size. The automatic cup height adjustment tries to solve a problem that you see in many kitchen offices as the coffee area gets very dirty because people are too lazy to adjust the coffee outlet. Last remark - Miele devices are known for their durability and ease of service. This can something come on the expensive of compactness a build design.
I had one of those counter mounted Mieles, and I HATED it… it broke down FIVE TIMES in the two years I owned it and the shots it made were average at best… so we just kept using our old Jura instead.
As a former Miele employee this kind of pains me - one of the smaller and cheaper Miele coffee machines with much smaller footprint would have been nice as a comparison (we had one until Dec23, when we upgraded our 800€ Miele from 207 for an Ascaso Duo Steel PID and a Eureka Mignon Oro). FYI: The coffee machines are one of the few products Miele does not produce itself, but just does the engineering for to let others build it for them (same with their fridges, which are 1:1 Liebherr fridges). Also: Miele does more and more cost cutting, which also seems to impact product longevity. I am not really sure that this is the sustainable way forward for the company
I had a Delonghi for around 900€. After around 5 Years we changed the bewing group, At the end of its life after around 13 Years it brewed around 25.000 cups of coffee, you can check that in the internal menu. So 900€ for the machine and for 100€ you could get all important replacement parts. I always recommend a Delonghi. I think they have a pretty good value. And the same goes for all my friends and realtives that had a Delonghi. Everyone that had a Miele or Jura had quite a few problems and they were harder to repair.
We have a Delonghi Magnifica in the office. We've owned it fully 14 years and we flog it mercilessly without any thought for basic responsible maintenance. A few years back the main motor shorted so we replaced it DIY with used eBay parts DIY. Over the last year, rather than replacing seals or even checking them, we just kept pounding out coffees and ignoring minor leaks as they slowly escalated. Finally the boiler couldn't hold pressure and leaks abounded. We pulled a used boiler from a junk machine we found and it's back in business like new. Such a beast! I think our Delonghi will outlive me!
@@mdgow i hate them too...mine is 10 years old, made 10k coffees. It broke down a few months ago (linkswitch blew up). I spent 4 euros and 2 hours on researching and soldering. Works like a charm again... I WANT a new one, but i cant find a reason!
@@petervansan1054 maybe you want it, but most people don't. And that's what this video was about. I also use a profitec 500, but for everyone who just wants coffee, DeLonghi is my recommendation.
21:00 made me laugh so hard. It delicately prepares your drink with a delicate layer of foam on top... and then just angrily sputters and steams all over it
@@ianwilliams7740 Thanks to that machine I´m sleeping on my parents coach and had to take a second job at McDonald´s to pay for the alimony. For some reason I also have HIV now.
I bought a delonghi based on this review and we are very happy with it. Took a bit to dial in some custom settings, but I think that is par for the course. Thank you.
Hello, I'm interested in this machine as well and was wondering if you have had any issues over the time that you have owned it. I am being put off from purchasing it based on some reviews that said that it dies very quickly. Thank you!
We have a Jura E8 and love it. I maintain it and it works well. If I wasn't married, I would have a manual setup but I work from home and can't leave my desk to make my wife a flat white every time she wants one and she's unwilling to learn how to do it manually. I'm thankful for the super auto.
I keep a small (12 oz ) stainless milk frothing pitcher to hold the milk for my Jura machine. That way it can go in and out of the refrigerator as needed. I usually only make 3 or 4 café latte per day so that way the milk is protected from spoiling. I found that putting the milk tube directly into a bigger milk box or jug had the potential of spoiling the larger quantity of milk through cross-contamination. Also, my Jura machine ( Impressa A9) has been completely reliable for the 6 years that I've owned it. It's been serviced once but keeps chugging along.
Can’t speak for their coffee machines (and I wouldn’t buy a bean2cup machine) but their kitchen appliances are built like tanks and, in my experience, significantly outlast their cheaper equivalents making them far better value in the long term. Yes, I am a Miele snob 😂
I also can't speak for their coffee machines, but their vacuum cleaners are superb (and more reasonably priced than all their other product ranges). After years of Dysons I'm very glad I switched.
Thank you for your expert insight James - glad that the wait for your review wasn’t that long! Have been interested in automatic machines for daily use and a Hario or manual espresso for the weekend to cultivate my coffee experience.
I have the Melitta, and you are right about the buttons. It"s difficult to adjust the buttons but i usually use the personal buttons, so you don't need to adjust the buttons. Pretty decent machine for the money
I've owned the Jura Z10 for few months and I would definitely say, it's worth it. The consistency of the coffees and ease of use. I have found my best settings (grind/amount of milk/water/coffee strength) and save it. Then I use Siri to make the coffee! Worked perfect so far
I’ve enjoyed having a Jura bean to cup machine for over 20 yrs. My 13 yr old machine just broke. Since I don’t really drink cold brews, I just ordered the J8 (2022 model) that was recently released in the US. The grind is adjustable manually, but the program suggests the grind to set the machine for each type of coffee. It is 1K USD less than the Z10.
How is the voice assistant helpfull if you have to go to the kitchen anyway or there is an option to acquire an electromechanical cup dispenser that can speed up the coffee delivery process? Otherwise, I don't see any productivity gain if you still have to put a cup into the coffee machine yourself, so that you have a nice touchscreen in front of your mug, I mean face.
The mechanical brew group used in Gaggia, Philips, and Saeco machines are more or less the same (for the past 20 years), so the performance you get out of the Gaggia machine here is somewhat comparable to what you get out of those other brands and models. A lot of what you get from buying a different model from those 3 manufacturers is in added features (e.g. milk frothing, special water filtration) and UX/UI.
I've gotten to use a Jura S9, and with my experience with that and seeing other Jura machines, I think there's a fairly good case to be made that they're meant as premium office machines rather than creating the best possible at-home espresso. They're meant to be maintained by a core set of people while being able to pump out decent espresso on demand all day - hence the 'hidden' drink settings. Jim in the end cube isn't going to muck up everyone's coffee by putting it on some random setting that only he likes.
+1 … Our Jura Impressa S9 has been a workhorse for more than a decade or more. Great strength coffee. .. PS., we luv our Miele appliances D/W, Drier, Washer, Oven etc.
There's a reason every office uses a Jura. Everybody starts by buying a cheaper machine. Then another one when it breaks after 3 months of punishing use. Then, after the second unit also breaks, they understand that it makes more economic sense to get a heavy duty Jura machine that will be good for years.
My parents bought a DeLonghi Dinamica (the base model, not the Plus) about four years ago. That machine is what got me drinking coffee in the first place, and it's still going strong to this day. While I agree that the milk frothing on it isn't great and I sometimes miss my setup when I go home to visit, it makes nice coffee incredibly quickly and conveniently. We all love it! Edit: I meant Dinamica, not Dedica
What a fab review James. Really enjoyed it. I have owned Juras for 10+ years and now have an E8 and it serves me well but always wondered how the other brands were. So fabulous to see the comparison and as always with your reviews I love your structured approach to it all and honesty!!
Now I feel relief about owning a Jura Z10 after this review of automatics Bean To Cup coffee machines by James. I love the convenience of just pressing a button and getting a coffee without all the prep flow. One thing it wasn't mentioned is that with the Jura Z10 you can also do cold brews. I totally agree it does not beat a good grinder and Espresso machine. When I feel the urge for real espresso, I just fire up my E65s GbW grinder and VA EP1 to enjoy the best espresso shop experience.
I really like my DeLonghi Magnifica - it's an older style machine that is as bare-bones as it gets by todays standards. No display, no menus, just a few LEDs and buttons, two dials to set the amount of water and the aroma setting (grind time). It self-calibrates puck size and grind time and gets surprisingly consistent if you don't vary the grinder setting or type of beans too much. Most DeLongthis re-use parts from previous generations, so it's a continuing evolution, often just the same machine in a new case with a fancy menu screen added.
I used a comparable Jura at my previous office place. The milk system was kinda nice cause the milk pack could just stay in a little fridge and the process of refilling was simple for everyone to do
We have a Jura machine at work (a few of them) and a comment about the milk container. I believe it’s separate because it is also a fridge. It keeps the milk cold and has it’s own power supply and fan. So it’s more than just a container and probably why they don’t include it. My personal opinion is that they should just include it and bump the cost of the unit as a whole.
Its true that Jura has the Cooling Units for milk. in 0.6L and 1L sizes. but they also have a small glass alternative that you can put in the fridge, for like 1 or 2 servings. would be nice if that was included with a machine this price without upping the price. since the glass once aren't to expensive. I work in a shop where we sell Jura, and we often include one of these milk containers as a free gift on a purchase.
Popcorn!!! Popcorn!!! I need to relax on the couch with a bowl of popcorn and just soak this all in! I love these in depth comparison/reviews, and how James goes in depth, in ways I never imagined.
Great video as always. I'd like to see a comparison of lower end bean to cup machines. Delonghi Magnifica, Gaggia Brerra and a Melitta Cafe Solo etc. Keep up the excellent videos James.
I own the Melitta Barista TS, and I agree that the buttons are a bit frustrating because (being touch buttons) they do not really give any haptic feedback and they also are a bit unresponsive (sometimes for example it takes a few presses to actually get into the menu). But since you can have several user profiles which save all the settings for each of the drinks for each user, it is not AS bad as it sounds. You can dial in your preferences, and from then on you just press the big "I want this drink" buttons in the top row and do not have to fiddle with the settings anymore. Also, I like that Melitta has an online shop where you can buy all the separate parts of the machine if you ever need a replacement (milk lines, brew group, lids, whatever), so if ever something goes wrong, you do not have to either throw out the whole machine or send it to an expensive "official repair shop".
I'm a Rancilio Silvia guy but I've rarely had time or energy to make lattes with it for a long time. For this reason I bought the Melitta Barista TS a few months back and I love it. Yes, the usability aspect is a bit troublesome but tbh it's not a deal breaker in any way. You get used to the quirks of the machine pretty fast, just like with any machine. The ease of use when compared to a semi-automatic like Silvia is just from another planet. Now I finally have time to get a decent cup of coffee before work. And yes, obviously with a semi-automatic you get to make the exact kind of coffee you need, and you can get your milk scorching hot (which just doesn't happen with this Melitta) but the reality is that I'm now drinking more coffee drinks than ever before and the taste hasn't bothered me even once. The dual hopper system was one of the main reasons I wanted this Melitta and it works fantastically. I do shift work which means my working hours change weekly from day to night to evening. It's a must to be able to get decaf coffee easily and Melitta most certainly offers that. I'm sure there's still some residue coffee powder left in the grinder from the other hopper but if I really really really need to be sure I don't get any caffeine I just run one decaf espresso shot and throw it away. Yes, it's possible to use ground coffee as well and that works just fine but it's still much easier to use beans. Granted I only ever make milk drinks but I have no problems using beans that have been in the hoppers for a few days. The hopper lid is fairly well insulated which helps to keep the beans fresh enough, at least for me. I could've gotten a Jura 8 for cheaper than this Melitta and it's very well possible it would've been better in some ways BUT after watching Jura's product videos it became clear that cleaning the milk system would be a hassle compared to Melitta. Apparently you need to use Jura's own detergent daily to clean the milk system whereas with Melitta you only need to run the automatic steam cleaning everytime you use the milk function (which basically means just attaching the milk tube to the metal grill of the machine and pressing a button a few times), and you need to run the more thorough cleaning with detergent weekly. I also love how the Melitta looks.
Seconded this, the conveyor unit on mine started getting difficult to reinstall after cleaning, eventually wouldn't fit at all. My coffee supplier sold me a replacement part and that's working fine. Even the grinding unit can be replaced, although I shudder to think what the cost of that would be!
I have a Miele CM5500 which is also obsessed with rinsing. This is definitely frustrating at first, but after a couple of years and 1600+ coffees brewed I have come to see it as a virtue. With very little effort on my part my machine is spotlessly clean. This contrasts sharply with the two Delonghi machines I previously owned which I had to laboriously clean every few months since the brew unit would merrily fling ground coffee around the interior. The milk hose cleaning is also excellent, so the original hose looks as clean as it did the day the machine was delivered.
Shame about the build quality though. It should be FULL stainless steel, not an ounce of plastic on the exterior. The Breville Oracle Touch, while a slightly different coffee machine is full stainless steel with a plethora of better features. Heck, even a Rocket Apartmentto is cheaper and full stainless steel build. Miele kind of disappointed here to be honest, especially considering that their brand is supposed to be prestigious, hence the price point.
@@LaSombraa that would be nice. The CM5500 offers pretty much the same functionality and uses the same brew unit. I paid around £500 for it so I was perfectly happy with a plastic exterior.
Got myself a Jura S8 for those moments when I want a fast espresso or coffee with a push of a button. The best super automatic machine of all I used. I had a Delonghi, Melita, Philips, Saeco. None comes close to Jura. 😊
I am mechanical engineer and your descriptions of fail designed features made me laugh a lot. My top 5 of funniest points: 1. the moving thing (why?? 😂) 2. the violent steam finish (wtf!) 3. choice-buttons too tight at each other (oops, now I have to drink cappuccino instead of espresso 🤷🏻♂️😄) 4. noisy fans 5. the upstanding cover of bean hopper
I've had an older Jura machine (the Ena3) for about 14 years now and I've been impressed with it. Normally I hate UIs that are basically a single multi function button, but this one does it well, and seems to appreciate that its primary place in the world is to solve the first coffee problem, so just turning it on and slapping the big button will give you coffee. Accessing the other functions through The Button is handled by making it a jog dial with clear detents, and feedback on a simple single line LCD, which works well for me: no recall needed so it solves the normal problem with single button interfaces. It is also still easy to service occasionally with the local agents all these years later, and has survived being pulled off the kitchen counter onto it's face by an angry baboon with barely a scratch to show for it (I live in an interesting place). So for me, although cheaper machines have feature parity I've been happy I paid more for this one as I'd almost certainly have gone through at least two of the cheaper machines in this timeframe.
I have the Jura Z10 and it is fantastic. Especially with the optional milk refrigerator it is a perfect combo. Another thing is that Jura Z10 is the only machine that can produce a cold brew.
True cold brew takes 12 hours+ cold brew is a grossly underestimated and undervalued and perhaps not understood subject, maybe dare I say it, even by james...
@@revoltoff what is it, 12, 15, 20 or more hours? I think the point is that makes a pretty good cold press coffee. You can dislike the terminology, but as you stated yourself, the requirements on time are variable. Also, the definition of “brewed”means it was boiled or steeped in boiling liquid, so I think cold “brew” as a definition isn’t accurate as-is.
Since cross contamination is a known issue with a lot of grinders, would it be possible to use beans that have been dyed to visibly determine how bad a particular grinder is?
@@leagueaddict8357 that's completely untrue. The bean difference is very obvious even when fine grinded. I use bean to cup and when I change from darker to lighter roast, the small retained portion of darker beans are clearly visible on the top of the puck. So what he suggested is actually a way to go
I have a Jura E8 new one for about 18months and have loved it, and been to Italy for a week and had cappuccinos 3 times a day from different places, I realised I could dial in some sizes and strengths to actually copy what I was drinking in Italy from coffee shops, bought some Italian cups and made little cappuccinos in the Jura e8 and it’s indistinguishable from what I got in Italy, makes me happier to have purchased this machine. One thing that makes a difference is not using cows milk in the UK cos it’s garbage, use goats milk or something else
I have the Melitta that you reviewed here. Agreed on the button responsiveness, it's bad. The app makes life a lot easier but the key thing is that once you set it up, the personalisation options mean that I walk up, select me and the drink I've already programmed. For my partner, I select a different user and that drink. It means that you actually hardly ever use the buttons. As a result, button responsiveness is never an issue.
I can also confirm this - straightforward machine with enough configuration to make a good coffee, and easy to clean with reasonably priced occasional maintenance' bits such as seals. Having had a number of different machines over the years I am rather fond of this unassuming small footprint machine that does the job and isn't 'needy'.
Wow, this DeLonghi coffee machine costs around 540 GBP in Poland (converted to British pounds). A really great machine for the money, I personally own a slightly lower model and am very happy with it.
In general we have quite good prices for machines in Poland. To a degree where (although now with possible export fees may not be so clear-cut) buying one in PL and sending to UK might still end up cheaper than buying in the UK.
I purchased a semi automatic coffee machine 8 years ago. I went with the Deloghi magnifica S because it offered me control over the milk side and I figured that that would help me to get the best coffee from a relatively cheap machine. I like it, I get decent coffee
Recently purchased the DeLonghi Magnifica Evo with milk reservoir for €500 and I'm 100% satisfied with the machine. It's quite basic but does what it must do perfectly.
I actually own the Melitta for about 2yrs now and just saw this video. As a "user", yes the buttons as you said are miserable I mainly use the machine via the Bluetooth App, which is really good and user-friendly Considering the price point i really like it, as a "daily driver" for when I'm too lazy for making coffee by myself.
Miele, in my mind, exists mostly to sell their stuff to people that buy a whole kitchen at furniture stores. And that's why they get away with the prices they charge. My parents got all of their kitchen electronics built-in from them (bean-to-cup, fridge, microwave, ...) and they all have these weird issues that just make them incredibly frustrating to use. And I'm pretty sure that's why they do weird things like moving the spout up and down: it looks cool and stands out the first time a furniture salesman shows it to you, and that's how they get sales
miele genuinely makes real good washing machines, drying machines and dishwashers - that's what they're known for... their other products eh.... the super expensive built in coffe machines that cost over 3000 pounds have a reputation of being unable to deliver hot coffe
@@BitmapFrogs so its mostly like 90% of german coffee. I myself have a Miele vacuum and its great, but their coffee machine is probably made for the German market. And Germans drink the worst coffee in Europe. Mind you I’m not talking about specialty/minority run cafes, but the everyday germans place. The coffee there is usually so terrible that you’d rather just drink beer/wine
I've got the De'Longhi Dinamica (not plus) at home and the De'Longhi Magnifica (much cheaper) at work. Run both with supermarket Lavazza and am pleased enough with the coffee. But I'm a bit of a savage that just needs my caffeine and I haven't ascended to specialty coffee levels yet. For me, if you're looking for superauto, De'Longhi has kept me happy through 3 machines over 20 years.
I've had 3 Juras over the years and a Melitta. The Melitta was great but the home model couldn't keep up with production and eventually quit. The Juras are workhorses for the office and home. They produce great coffee and milk drinks and are easy to use. Worth the extra money.
I've got a Melitta Caffeo (higher end TSP rather than TS) and I get on fine with the UI. That said I could easily recommend some fixes to make it more usable. Upside of the haptic buttons is that they're easily cleaned, and there's a fairly good divider between the two bins (definitely a plus point for us, dark roast for morning, lighter for afternoon). The milk system is finicky, non dairy alternatives are hit and miss.
With the Gaggia you’re supposed to turn the milk thing immediately back towards the handle position and the steam is supposed to go to the handle towards the drip tray
I have owned and tried 3 of the above machines. The single best machine is the Phillips latte-go which generates an actual puck... best by far. Milk is best also
@@NimmiCat yes for me it’s fine but my partner says the same, could be warmer. The way the milk is made exposes it to a lot of room temp air which is the cause of this
@@seanismboi I purchased the EP5446 as it has a function where you can automatically make a (true) double shot drink with milk with a single button. Also option to make change the order of shots first or milk first.
The Miele is for the fan boys. They make excellent vacuum, dishwashers (even most hospitals use Miele machines for automated cleaning of the instruments) but absolutely no reason to pay this money for a Miele coffee machine.
This model is very much overkill. I have a 6150 for £900 - which is a far better value and I think that any Miele model higher than that is too much money
As someone who has sold appliances for over a decade, you're basically right with one exception. *this model* is for fanboys. Miele is a luxury brand, meaning their top end products cost more just to cost more, with a couple meme features to flex on your rich buddies. The automatic moving spout is basically 100% of what you're paying for over the $1750 model. I also get why it is so fiercely hands off with the settings, clients at the price point it is targeting care less about results and more about automation and convenience. I'd be much more interested in a breakdown of the entry level models from Jura, Miele, and Delonghi since they're all much closer in price.
@@deovontaymcslanga4380 yes, for me i want to drink a cappuccino not make a cappuccino- so the more hands off the better. And the automatic moving spout is just as you say. The lower end Mieles are ideally like Toyotas - not the fanciest or most customizable but hopefully reliable more easily serviceable and long-lasting with good self cleaning and maintenance regimes
I have had my Jura for 8 years. NO problems, easy to use and makes great drinks. The reason I splurged on a Jura, we came back from Italy, Spain, etc. I found Starbucks awful now and wanted to make coffee at home. I experienced different brands of coffee beans which made a difference as well.
My parents have a jura and swap milk types, keeping both in the fridge which works very well for them. Theyve had the same machine for a decade at least and its still going strong.
Spare parts for the Siemens are cheap which is good. We changed the whole brew unit 2 times already because its just 80€ and makes a huge difference after 3000 drinks. Cleaning is also super easy
@@TheMongooseOfDoom Yes, cleaning is a great feature. I love it. But on the other hand EQ9's brewing unit has (or had) a flaw that will break it after 1-2 years of use. I had to replace brewing unit in 2 machines (home and work), but other than that eq9 works fine.
Already 2 brew units after 3000 drinks!? That's quite wasteful. I had an EQ.9 and the brew unit had to be replaced after maybe a good 1000 drinks because of a design flaw. The machine was driving me nuts, especially how dirty it got all the time. After 1 week, the EQ.9 is dirtier than my delonghi after 3 months. Oh boy and you don't want to look inside a Jura after some time. After some moths you get a free penicillin shot as well! The cleanest machine of them all is the delonghi.
@@Schnubby in my sight, that's not a sign of quality, sorry. My first delonghi has about 15000 on the clock and there is still the first brew unit inside. I just regularly disassemble, clean and grease it.
Another outstanding video from James. I bought the Delonghi DP after spending hours reviewing Breville, Gaggia, Saeco, Miele, Phillips, Jura. I reviewed maintenance, taste, # of recipes and ability to create custom recipes with milk based drinks. I did not buy based on foaming milk substitute. James really should have said that most, if not all, bean to cup auto foamers will struggle w/ milk substitutes. However, a couple of highly respected sites like ECS Coffee, Seattle Coffee Gear, Whole Latte Love, have positively commented Delonghi's ability to foam and work with alternative creamers. I've personally tried almond, almond coconut, soy, oat and there's NO SUB for 1/2 & 1/2, Whole or Heavy cream Cow's milk. Sure those alternatives have some calorie savings, but in no way, do they offer taste that's within 80% of Cow's milk creamer. The aftertaste and blah, meh cream texture just doesn't cut it. So if he tried Cow's milk cream w/ the Delonghi he would have gotten microfoam, and various heights of cream, which their LatteCrema system offers that others don't. Lastly, I did buy it because of Brad Pitt's commercial!!! How could you not want to buy it after watching Perfetto from Brad? LOL.
Hello, thanks for this comment. I'm actually very interested in this machine and I was wondering how long you've had it now and if you've had any issues. I've been put off from buying it due to reviews saying that it breaks very quickly. Thank you in advance for any help you can give me!
I can't speak for James, but most people I know who drink plant based milks are doing it because they're lactose intolerant, not for calorie saving reasons.
As someone who is repairing this kind of machines I can say that You should review some Jura lower down the price range like E8 or E6. They are smaller, a lot cheaper, have less things to potentially break, the same brewing mechanism. For me the best value for money. As for DeLonghi machines, I really don't like their milk carafes. They make a lot of problems a few months after buing and are very hard to clean properly, after only automatic cleaning two years from the purchase you can see horrifying scenes inside of them. For me the best automatic coffee machines are JURA E6, E8 or some simple DeLonghi Magnifica.
i'd have to say (hello from a fellow repairer) the Delonghis are much easier to clean than the Juras as they have removable brew units - whereas Juras don't, so you have to really keep up with the clean cycles. Plus those damn drain valves always wear out.
For the most part, my folks have had De'Longhi machines and for the most part they are very good machines. We had one with the milk attachment that never made scalding milk and eventually died, but it still brewed on.
I do have two melitta machines, the one above and the cafeo solo. Cafeo solo runs non stop for 6th year now averaging of 5 coffees a day. Regarding barista - buttons are not bad at all, coffee is consistent, and remote options to make a brew genuinely as you wish including the temperature of each layer - great option for every coffee amateur. Melitta does the job perfectly and these are just built not to fell apart like the other brands.
Jura Z10 is expensive mainly because of its cold brewing capability. It may actually make more sense to compare the E8 or S8 (which is probably 20-35% cheaper) with the rest.
I would completely agree. I have S8 and I think it makes great coffee and milk drinks. You can even adjust the milk foam which is nice touch plus a manual grind setting.
Thanks for the crisp, concise yet remarkably detailed review. The question remains whether the huge price markup for the Z10 is justified compared to De’Longhi’s value for money. How does the Eletta Explore brew compare to the Z10 considering it also features the cold brew option.
I've got a variant of the Siemens with two separate grinders. You can also choose whether it brews coffee or milk first. The other person is using robusta beans in one hopper and we each have our set of profiles for our coffees. It works really well. The additional option to use your own ground coffee helps when I want to make a decaf. I grind that separately.
As someone with the Miele machine in my office, you're spot on James. The UI is annoying, the machine is slow and the constant rinsing and cleaning makes it even more inconvenient for the office where people make 30 coffees a day (it literally cleans itself every time it's turned on, so almost every time someone makes a coffee)
It would have been interesting to see how one of the Miele CM5 series machines would have faired in this comparison. Similar fit & finish to the CM7 with a single hopper, manually adjustable head height and a simpler control panel at 1/2 - 2/3rds the price point may have been a bit more of what was expected for this group.
Came here to say the same thing. My understanding is the entire lineup uses the same brew group, grinder and milk frothing system. I have the cheapest one and it brews traditional medium dark espresso well enough, but I found it struggles with lighter roasts.
James, as someone who likes coffee but is nowhere near your levels of nerdiness (that's a compliment), I really hoped to see cheaper machines in this line-up. In addition, a blind taste test to start things off would have been perfect and particularly interesting with a mix of cheaper machines in there. As an average consumer, this video lost me once the line up was announced. I still watched it but I just can't relate to much of the commentary. Not saying you shouldn't cater to that audience (or your own interests!) -- but I would love to see you revisit this.
He already did a comparisson of espresso machines under £100 (ruclips.net/video/avM-XsaTBIc/видео.html) and under £500 (ruclips.net/video/7HIGdYy5of4/видео.html).
I'm not an espresso expert by any means but I do have a machine at home. Recently they put a jura in our workplace and I was really surprised by the quality. Not that it's fantastic but I never imagined coffee coming from these "Kaffeevollautomat"s, as they are called in German, would be drinkable. Good to see you that you found it decent in comparison to others as well.
Thanks James for another great review. I would have loved to hear more about how easy/difficult it is to clean the machines. I was leaning towards the Jura and I think you have confirmed my preference.
I have an old Jura Z5 that I bought in a poor state on ebay ("spares or repair") five years ago. After new seals, burrs, and a good clean and descale it's been working flawlessly (with a couple of seal replacements). Total shot count is now over 17500 and there are no signs of anything aging.
Love my Melitta connect. Been a couple of years since owning it now and it’s not let me down yet. As someone else has mentioned, the app is actually really good. Though I use my automated settings for daily espresso and the app for milk drinks on the weekend. I paid ~£800 so they must have gone up in price.
Probably due to length considerations not included but a very important aspect I find is missing is the maintenance and cleaning. I have used a few De Longhis and all the internal corners and crevices are a pain to clean, used coffee falls to the side, etc. The Jura has done this much better in my experience. I also prefer the tube directly into the milk over another container that needs regular cleaning. The removable vs self cleaning brewing unit might be a point of contention.
The maintenance aspect is a very big deal, in fact a deal breaker for me. It's more work not less. Maybe if we were making coffee 20 times a day it would look like a win, but not at 3 or 4.
jura is the worst lol, I recently restored one that "broke" because the owner couldn't clean it by hand and didn't want to pay 120 euros for a service package that makes someone from Jura come clean your machine at home. The delonghi als uses regular bolts which makes it extremely easy to take the covers off and clean it thoroughly every year or two. Jura has a special bolt which needs special tools.
Interesting to hear about this, our Jura was sold to us as "self-cleaning" using some tablets and it has worked well so far over 5+ish years ()family machine and not main user so now detailed idea. I do like the ability of the delonghi to open it up and clean inside, I have no idea how the Jura looks inside and dread to see it. But the cleaning experience of the delonghi was a pain with all the corners and holes...The main reason for me to have moved to pour over.
There is an aspect that I consider very important when comparing bean to cup machines which is not mentioned at all and it is maintenance. I believe that people who buy these machines look for the best cup of coffee they can get for their budget but with minimum hassle. Often these machines require you to follow complex maintenance/cleaning procedures which defeat the purpose of no-hassle.
This video has finally inspired me to get a new water filter and fresh coffee for Melitta that's been sitting unused for months. If you're considering this one, get familiar with the app, save your presets and use them. I like how easy it's to clean the brewing assembly, the pouring head and the milk system.
My dad has a Jura. It's been making coffee regularly for over 10 years & gone in for maintenance only once or twice- that fun fact alone is why I'd prefer a Jura.
Great review, I’m surprised you didn’t include the Philips Lattego bean to cup coffee machine, it’s definitely one of the most popular “low” budget bean to cup machines available. I’ve had a 4300 at home for a month now and I’m quite impressed with it
I have the Melitta Barista T-Smart (not the TS shown) and I must say that the app is a great 'companion' and really helps to get the machine dialled in. You can set up multiple (up to 4) profiles which then make all the drink buttons 'one touch' to retrieve your preferred recipes. It does a really good job in accurately re-creating what you've programmed, and an advantage in the milk containers and easy cleaning is that I bought a spare milk container for my other half as she is non-dairy. Looking forward to dialling in the dose and ratio when my next order of beans arrives. We got the machine on promotion and it is really great value for money!
I have had Jura machines for over 30 years. My current J9 is about 8 years old and works like a fine watch. It never has failed and always produces outstanding coffees. Wouldn’t exchange it for anything else.
This just makes me happy for my Breville Barista Express I got 5 years ago. I control it and adjust based on how stale my coffee has become and steam my own milk, saved $500 and better espresso for my work, which thanks to practice is fairly consistent and quick. I can pamper my loved ones and make them smile with some basic foam art too, which is missing here so it just depends on what you're looking for.
Coming from a cheaper machine that sounded like an airplane taking off while grinding and a milk frother that just came off the machine, and on top of that didn’t foam milk properly: the melitta is amazing! We agree with you: the buttons are terrible, you get used to it after a while and we can now make a coffee without to much anger issues! The coffee and milk drinks are so much better! We are very happy we upgraded.
Now let’s do a comparison of mold growth inside all those machines presented. Especially after one year of use. Jura, are you ready? ;) Side note - Miele, Melitta and Nivona use the same platform made by Eugster as did older Bosch and Siemens machines. So they all will give similar brews. Miele just adds few more gadgets like motorized spout or automatic descaling circuit. But it doesn’t justify the price. You pay for the badge. I am servicing superautos for over 10 yrs so I know all these machines inside out.
We somehow unintentionally managed to leave out the UX/UI segment for the Gaggia Accademia on this edit, so we've uploaded that section separately here instead: ruclips.net/video/zgybPrP1YJA/видео.html
Oh this is awesome I'm happy you testing my machine too or very similar, I got the melitta t-smart TS is just deluxe like.
Oh and the 55ml instead of 60, the machine adjusts it if you change the grind setting. Imo this machine is great price/quality, allthough mine was already replaced under warrantee & the display can give trouble if you keep machine on for long.
You managed also not to include the price in Euros.
Looks like you have a scammer pretending to be you giving away coffee machines
@@jg-uh5xq yeah... I just received one of those... surely it’s not for real!?
The perfect cup of coffee was brewed and enjoyed exactly 28 years ago on a Tuesday afternoon in a small cafe in Spain. Everyone else missed it.
That sounds like a sentence that would find itself in the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
But, perfect to whom?
The best you ever had is just a memory
@@brendboer6026 as each moment passes it becomes memmory
@@keco185 first thing I thought of too. what a great book.
I’m not even slightly in the market for these machines, yet, I still watch all your videos. Love them.
I would love to see a comparison of multiple Delonghi Bean To Cup, from the lowest end to the highest end, since the price range is quite large and they seem to use the same brewing mechanism.
seconded!
Thirded
q .... quadrupled? What is the correct word, guys?
err quintuppled?
My understanding is that all units from a specific series (ECAM, ESAM, etc) the internals are the same (brew unit, boiler, pump, etc). Only the offered features and user interface differ.
I have a Delonghi worked continuously in my small restaurant, I think the model is magnifica S. It is not a coffee restaurant per se but 30+ cups of coffee per day is for sure. 10 years, it has been making coffee, and still going strong.
My advice to you is sell more coffee, margins on a cup of coffee are much higher than on anything else in restaurant/gastronomic business
Magnifica S is a legend. I have had it in most of the offices I worked in. Never disapoints, and the coffee is reasonably descent for such cheap machine.
We have a refurbished magnifica S in our house, has made 2700 coffees in 4 years and still working great
in line with french fries @@KokkiePiet
The Siemens actually has a true dual grinder - not just dual hopper. So no mixture of coffee.
The milk tank can go into the fridge and you can buy an milk package adapter if you want.
seems like a rushed video.
@ 2:19 he states he's not going too much into detail on every machine. Stay Alert Stay Alive
I have a Siemens, makes way better coffee than most other brands that are 2-3x expensiver..
We use the eq9 with single grinder (s700 i think) and the McDonald's Espresso roast. We Love it. Surely not the best quality Coffee but we Love the Taste with the eq9. And what i think is the best Part on the Siemens. She is absolute easy to Handle and cleaning. All parts are ready to build Out and can be cleaned. Most parts in the dishwasher.
The Machine can Show when the next cleaning process is expected. All process is with an step by step Manuel in the Machine and in the Manuel. It has an integrated water decalcer.
I love this Machine.
Its no real Espresso Machine but for us, she is quite perfect
@@robertof.5283 We have the same with the single grinder and I concur, coffee is great, lattes and espressos too, we use very dark roasts though. But the cleaning is so simple on this compared to other machines we've had before, couldn't quite believe how easy it was to clean both the brewing unit and the inside. It's also one of the most quiet machines we had. Heaven!!
Now we need test for under 1k for the machines we can actually afford 🤣
This must be a scam! He wrote more comments like that and it seems like we both win the same machine.. I’d only trust a verified account
Yeah, us plebs are people too. 😉
@Flexo I second this!
Wonder if the Patreon supporters chose more expensive machines with the knowledge that they make a chance to win these machines.
I've been hard at bay finding a good machine under 1k that actually brews good coffee. Found none. I've just splurged and got the delonghi. For under 1k, just buy a Nespresso machine honestly... you'd be better off.
My aunt has Jura machines for years and loves a cappuccino, she actually considers not having a container a feature as she just sticks it in the container, closes it up and back into the fridge.
Completely agree. We've been using our Z5 for years and only used the milk container once at the very beginning. There is just no argument for filling a container as it needs to be emptied and cleaned afterwards. I'd say it's the right call to sell it separately because even those people using it can just keep one for any future machine.
Agreed. We use ours mainly for espresso and when we want to make some milk drink, we just take a carton of milk out of the fridge and make it. No need to clean anything afterwards :)
My Jura the same I used a screw top jam jar and just made hole in top for silicon tube as I rarely use auto cappuccino program and I can keep jar in fridge when I do between uses 🤣
Agree too. Good not to have to wash another container. Just a little hose.
I agree as well. I’d guess James is thinking of the expense = luxury but most people in this market are busy and the fewer dishes the better.
Hi James, my father made one of his first trips to Italy in the early early 70s. He brought back his first espresso machine (no clue of what the name was). Seems like he kept going back and buying more machines. He always had one at home and one at his office. I got all of his hand me downs. So I have had espresso machines since probably 1973. I had 2 Quick Mills Super Automatic machines, with the filter basket of 7 g and an upgraded one with 9 g. Look them up. I have owned an assortment of single boiler machines heat exchangers since my early 20s. To name a few I have had multiples: Electra, Pavoni, Pasquini Livietta, Quick Mill Anita, and I am currently rocking a dual boiler, what you would call a Sage (Breville in the US). Freshly roasted double shot cappuccino first thing in the morning for 45 years! The funny thing is that in those early days I had almost no clue on how to get good reputable shots until guys like you came along and explained it all. Thank you for your contribution…
As a Jura owner, I am happy to see it got good results. I think folks who own a Jura understand that they are paying for well above average coffee that is still a notch below the traditional coffee shop machines in exchange for incredible convenience. I don't want to be a barista in my own house every morning when I'm rushing to work or having a dinner party -- it's an incredible feeling to be able to pull a great cup of coffee or cappuccino and have minimal setup / cleaning to do afterwards. I personally have found it to be worth every penny, even if it means I give up control over some of the knobs I would have to get the perfect extraction
You nailed the whole Superautomatic ownership experience and why Jura should still be considered the best at it. Only thing I'd add is that Jura are too pricey if your main focus is espresso. You can get as-good espresso with much cheaper Superautomatics. But what Jura does to simplify and automate the milk process, if that's what you want, is a thing of beauty and worth every cent. Also, I reckon these machines make better coffee than two-thirds to three-quarters of Baristas out there.
Yes those are my thoughts on Superauto machines too. Both my son and my son-in-law have more hands on types of coffee makers and although they will generally make a better espresso (it can go badly wrong some times) - its takes an absolute age to get there and then there's all the cleaning up after. By the time you've added some frothy milk though, there's not much difference in the quality of the coffee.
@@Roulandus-le-Fartere Any opinion on where Jura stands vs semi-autos?
I was a happy Jura owner buying Jura E6 when on sale at Costco. Worked great for 6 months then started to not dispense coffee. Would grind and start the brew process but few drops would come out with liquid in the puck container. I ran clean cycle even though not prompted and not helpful. Changed the filter even though not needed. This helped for half a cup then problem returned. I was going to contact Jura but since bought at Costco just cleaned up the machine and returned to Costco. Thanks for the return policy Costco refunded my purchase price. I do not abuse Costco return policy but did not want to deal with sending the machine in for repair. I think 6 months to start failure was not good and I did do all the maintenance required and still have large number of Jura cleaning pucks and few of the filters. If I get the courage I may give them another shot.
Agreed. As someone who has owned espresso machines as well as fully automatic machines.. the ability to get 80% of the experience for 10% of the effort is worth it, especially when you are time limited.
I have the Delonghi Dinamica Plus and I really like it. For milk drinks, I do the cappucino mix, which does coffee first then milk, which mixes the beverage a lot better. Also, with the app you can actually easily increase the dosage and volume.
what kind of? 85 or 95 please?
Yeah it is a nice machine! Technically Coffee first drinks are more traditionally that of a latte. Cappuccino's are milk first then espresso so that you can a "cap" of foam on top.
I've had my Jura Z6 for over a decade now and I am very pleased with my purchase. The Jura shop in my area asked if I wanted to "upgrade" my Jura for a new one. Turned down the offer as my older model apparently has a very good boiler where as newer ones coffee/espresso does not come out as hot.
We have a slightly cheaper Delonghi, similar style and built quality. Even after 4 years of daily use several times a day it produces tasty coffee - not proper espresso, but it does not claim it would. Thank you for your test and insight James!
I've got the Delonghi that's roughly half the price of the one he's reviewing and I'm certain it's exactly the same on the inside. Same touch-screen interface and everything. I love it, and to have him say he likes the coffee means I have not wasted my money. 😄
When my in-laws bought the exact delonghi as in the video they gave me and my wife older delonghi which is at least 7, more like 8 years old (it has over 20000 or so cups of coffee under its belt) . The pucks coming from the machine are as dry as they were when it was new and I was able to dial very tasty coffee from it. I am very impressed by delonghi.
My in-laws gave it to us because it had electronic issues and when send to service they told them that to repair it it would cost like half a price of a new one. So they bought the new one.
Given it was more or less working they gave it to us and turned out no problems so far occurred and we have it like 6 months. I suspect a solar power plant on my in-laws house is in fault as that might have created instability in the outlets.
For final comparison my parents had a Bosh for like 8 years also and that was giving out wet slush instead of pucks for the last 2 years (and what was worse a tasteless brown water instead of coffee) so they (and that is total coincidance) bought the delonghi from the video as well.
Yes! as someone who restored a fair amount of delonghi's; ALL OF THEM HAVE THE SAME INTERNALS. the only main differences being having an extra heating element for automatic steaming models and different design with different recipes. The ecam 21.112b has being going strong with my parents for 5 years now. I recently refurbished it and it still works fine. Only downside to an semi-auto espresso machine is that superauto's get really dirty over time, and this is the case with all machines even if they say they are ''automatic cleaning''
Model?
I have the entry level delonghi etam 29.510.sb (what a mouthful) and the grinder knob looks identical to the delonghi machine featured. I love it, it has had daily use for 3 years and has never missed a beat. Only downside to me is it does waste a lot of water cleaning itself before and after making coffee but it's not the end of the world. Would recommend one for sure.
We've been using our Jura ENA9 since I got it for my husband several years ago. Big splurge but it ended up paying for itself easily - my husband stopped going to Starbucks daily. I've got to say that Jura's service center is the absolute best of any that I've ever experienced with any company, ever.
I can buy any espresso machine. Can't buy the customer service dept. Thank you for sharing the good about this company. May look into Jura.
I keep reading the exact opposite on multiple sites. 🤔 Bad customer service is a deal breaker for me.
@@catguy64 I can only speak from my experience over many years. Jura has given me the best customer service I have ever received for any product, much less for a kitchen appliance. My cleaning service broke the Jura by shoving parts back all incorrectly which jammed the machine (not a simple jam when you forget the grounds hopper which is the typical jam and solved by a sequence of buttons over the phone). Sent it to Jura and the reconditioned it (for a fee that my cleaning service paid for) and fixed it and sent it back - I swear its better than it was new. I bought this about 10 years ago and still going strong!!
2nd - we've had Jura for 15+ years and I have been consistently impressed with their customer service. I've recommended Jura to friends + family and they also have not been disappointed. Would not buy any other machine.
Bosch Siemens actually has other newer models with milk pipe going into the carton as well and I think it's brilliant. No need to store a separate container in the fridge or clean and the milk never remains in the container and goes bad. I love my Bosch machine.
I coincidentally bought the Jura two weeks ago. So seeing your review is quite pleasing.
The machine, once you figured out all it’s ins and outs, is fantastic.
It’s summer in South Africa and the cold brew it delivers is something quite astonishing.
The flat white is proper quality that is better than a lot of average “coffee shops”
I have owned a Jura Capressa E8 for 15 years and the cup I brewed this am is just as good as the first one I ever made with it. I use purifier water only and I use fresh beans, and not 'flavored' beans. Also, I go through the cleaning cycle with the Jura tablets when the machine prompts me to do so. I paid $1200 for it back then and it has been worth every cent!
Not as good as going to Starbucks though where the professionals make them
When mine finally died it had over 37,000 brew cycles over 17 years.
@@thedigitalemotion "professionals"
I have the Delonghi in the comparison. I know the mobile apps were not part of the review but the app allows fine-tuning the output by ml. Very easy to adjust and save preferences. Also the container is quite easy to clean which was important to me. Thanks for the review.
I have a lower level of the Delonghi. Have to second your positive for the container with a plus that it fits in the fridge in the door. Also all the feeding of water, milk, emptying is done from the front which is a huge plus point on the usual kitchen counter where there is other stuff to the sides of the machine and cabinet above it. Have to give it high marks for ergonomics and mechanical useability.
Pppp
@@PadyEos I also have the delonghi, once I got it dialled using the app it makes very good coffee.
"milk was ... fine. Unspectacular but kind of decent" James provides some of the best and most honest descriptions you'll find.
We had an older Jura in the office that made about 30-60 shots every day. It was beat to hell but made excellent coffee with an outstanding crema for many years and I've been enamoured with Jura's ever since.
Agreed. My partner was always buying coffees, sometimes leaving home to go through the Maccas drive through (of all things) because he hated instant, and didn't want to faff about with espresso machines.
So armed with just a couple hundred Australian dollarydoos I searched around and found a local appliance wholesaler that also did refurbs and factory seconds - where they had a used Jura ENA Micro 90, pretty banged up on the outside but they cleaned out and replaced the inner parts where necessary to freshen it up. Was previously in a small office lunch room.
We've since had it for over 3 years, multiple cups a day and never once missed a beat.
Every few weeks it goes through a self clean cycle with fancy little tablets (takes like 20 mins and is all automated), and swap out the water filter a few times a year + hand wash the removable parts.. saved us soooooo much money, I love it
@@MotoCat91 Yeah that's something that's impossible to test on a bench: how long will it keep making good coffee without breaking? That's where the price difference between the Delonghi and Jura will start to make sense, when the swiss made machine soldiers on 10 years after the other one has broken down.
I've had my jura for over 7 years. Never replaced anything. Has always worked and tasted great! I have always used the exact same coffee beans for 7 years *Lavazza* and I noticed it started to taste sour last year. So I watched a RUclips video on how to disassemble and clean it. It's basically a space ship on the inside and after extreme care of disassembling the very small parts and deep cleaning and soaking components, it's basically brand new again. It's not hard to work on these. Just very small and important parts in there. If anything were to break, parts are expensive and honestly I would maybe just buy a new machine.
@@coryh9731I have a jura z8. So after you cleaned it the coffee tasted better again? I spoke to jura and if you send it to them they do a total refurb of all internal parts that need replacing for around 400 aud$.
We had a Jura ena 9 have had it for 14 years still going but recently up graded to Jura s8 because we got near new less than a year old been recently service. Anyway I’m in love it has so many features we didn’t have in the older model 🖤☕️
I have owned Jura machines for about 18 years now, first one was the original E8 I sold after 4 year, second one was the F9 which i ran until i needed new burrs after 10 years, 3rd is the new E8 which i absolutely love. I have tried Delonghi and Saeco early models, but those early models were very poor builds and brews which made me switch back to Jura and stay with them. the E8 is about half the price of the Z10, but has many of the UI but with manual grinder adjustment. The only alternative i have ever considered was the Oracle Touch, so i cant wait for that comparison
Once you go to a machine like a Jura you can never go back.
@@MrFizzarale Not sure about that, my friend has jura and i purchased Delonghi it is no comparison, Delonghi pores much better espresso then jura. I think is depends on what model you get.
@@rimasl.5645 With me having no experience with Delonghi products I cannot speak to their quality. So I cannot embrace this debate as much as I would like.
And how do you cope with unremovable brew unit? From a maintenance perspective it can cost a fortune…
Idk, I tried several Juras (E8 and Z6) recently and really didn't like them. Milk wasn't hot enough and coffee shots were really small even after ajusting all the settings. I bought an Oracle Touch, and it's much, much better. It's not a super automatic though so you still have to rinse parts after.
James his review about "cean to cup machines", is by far the best that I have seen, the most other reviews on youtube don't tell anything about the coffee quality or with less details, James can tell in a very interesting way what to expect. James tells in a fascinating way, really took your attention, critical in pleasant way.
I have a Delonghi Eletta. It has various sizes, strengths, milk, and temperature options. It actually makes pucks, and is shockingly quite great considering it is all automatic.
£1000 plus is too much. What is best price for a reasonable bean to cup machine ? £300 or more ?
I have the same, the setting for cappuccinos is all the way to the right instead of down the middle for adjusting milk foam. I wonder if that would've made a difference in James' assessment of milk quality, or using regular milk.
@@anthony64632 1000 is actually pretty reasonable. For a good espresso machine you need about 300, for a good grinder aprox 400, that makes 700. Add 300 for making it automatic and you have 1000. When I was low on budget and still wanted tasty coffee I used not-so-bad grinder and moccha pot. In my opinon is the best way to make espresso-like drink at low cost.
@@kuba6344, if I had £1000, then I would go for it . But I don't have it. So what the rock bottom proce for a good bean to cup machine. I have had delomgi manual expresso machine worth £200 ,broke down in 2 years.
@@anthony64632 Which gives the Beko bean to cup a good write up. At £250 ..
Beko CEG5301X
Miele are known for having an unconventional user interface. It’s seen in many domestic devices.
This coffee machine seems from the size and controls, more like an office machine that a technician will set up and the people at the office only need to press a button for making a cup of coffee. This also explains why it has such a flexibility in the grinding as well as the cup size.
The automatic cup height adjustment tries to solve a problem that you see in many kitchen offices as the coffee area gets very dirty because people are too lazy to adjust the coffee outlet.
Last remark - Miele devices are known for their durability and ease of service. This can something come on the expensive of compactness a build design.
Yep the issue with bulk reviews, is the glossing over the target demographic and brand philosophy.
I had one of those counter mounted Mieles, and I HATED it… it broke down FIVE TIMES in the two years I owned it and the shots it made were average at best… so we just kept using our old Jura instead.
We had a Miele built in and it sucked. got rid of it in a remodel, and now using a manual setup with joy.@@ElZamo92
As a former Miele employee this kind of pains me - one of the smaller and cheaper Miele coffee machines with much smaller footprint would have been nice as a comparison (we had one until Dec23, when we upgraded our 800€ Miele from 207 for an Ascaso Duo Steel PID and a Eureka Mignon Oro).
FYI: The coffee machines are one of the few products Miele does not produce itself, but just does the engineering for to let others build it for them (same with their fridges, which are 1:1 Liebherr fridges).
Also: Miele does more and more cost cutting, which also seems to impact product longevity. I am not really sure that this is the sustainable way forward for the company
These reviews and coffee advice are awesome.
No bias (from what I can tell) & just nice clear advice on how to have nicer coffee. Thanks! 😊
I had a Delonghi for around 900€. After around 5 Years we changed the bewing group, At the end of its life after around 13 Years it brewed around 25.000 cups of coffee, you can check that in the internal menu. So 900€ for the machine and for 100€ you could get all important replacement parts. I always recommend a Delonghi. I think they have a pretty good value.
And the same goes for all my friends and realtives that had a Delonghi. Everyone that had a Miele or Jura had quite a few problems and they were harder to repair.
We have a Delonghi Magnifica in the office. We've owned it fully 14 years and we flog it mercilessly without any thought for basic responsible maintenance.
A few years back the main motor shorted so we replaced it DIY with used eBay parts DIY.
Over the last year, rather than replacing seals or even checking them, we just kept pounding out coffees and ignoring minor leaks as they slowly escalated. Finally the boiler couldn't hold pressure and leaks abounded. We pulled a used boiler from a junk machine we found and it's back in business like new. Such a beast!
I think our Delonghi will outlive me!
@@mdgow i hate them too...mine is 10 years old, made 10k coffees. It broke down a few months ago (linkswitch blew up). I spent 4 euros and 2 hours on researching and soldering. Works like a charm again... I WANT a new one, but i cant find a reason!
I would rather take semi auto machine. Feels better to make your own better coffee
@@petervansan1054 maybe you want it, but most people don't. And that's what this video was about.
I also use a profitec 500, but for everyone who just wants coffee, DeLonghi is my recommendation.
@@mdgowmodel?
I’m so glad you’re viewing these options too, so awesome to get a huge variations of all machines, great 👍
21:00 made me laugh so hard. It delicately prepares your drink with a delicate layer of foam on top... and then just angrily sputters and steams all over it
it also kicks sand in your face and makes moves on your girlfriend
@@ianwilliams7740 Thanks to that machine I´m sleeping on my parents coach and had to take a second job at McDonald´s to pay for the alimony. For some reason I also have HIV now.
the steam causing that little bit of spill over the side of the cup just added to the comedy, haha. poor little delicate cup of coffee.
I bought a delonghi based on this review and we are very happy with it. Took a bit to dial in some custom settings, but I think that is par for the course. Thank you.
Hello, I'm interested in this machine as well and was wondering if you have had any issues over the time that you have owned it. I am being put off from purchasing it based on some reviews that said that it dies very quickly. Thank you!
We have a Jura E8 and love it. I maintain it and it works well. If I wasn't married, I would have a manual setup but I work from home and can't leave my desk to make my wife a flat white every time she wants one and she's unwilling to learn how to do it manually. I'm thankful for the super auto.
I keep a small (12 oz ) stainless milk frothing pitcher to hold the milk for my Jura machine. That way it can go in and out of the refrigerator as needed. I usually only make 3 or 4 café latte per day so that way the milk is protected from spoiling. I found that putting the milk tube directly into a bigger milk box or jug had the potential of spoiling the larger quantity of milk through cross-contamination. Also, my Jura machine ( Impressa A9) has been completely reliable for the 6 years that I've owned it. It's been serviced once but keeps chugging along.
The miele cm6350 is a very good machine and much smaller, and by the looks of it, pulls a better shot than the massive Miele.
@Lily Princess worth it
Can’t speak for their coffee machines (and I wouldn’t buy a bean2cup machine) but their kitchen appliances are built like tanks and, in my experience, significantly outlast their cheaper equivalents making them far better value in the long term. Yes, I am a Miele snob 😂
I also can't speak for their coffee machines, but their vacuum cleaners are superb (and more reasonably priced than all their other product ranges). After years of Dysons I'm very glad I switched.
Thank you for your expert insight James - glad that the wait for your review wasn’t that long! Have been interested in automatic machines for daily use and a Hario or manual espresso for the weekend to cultivate my coffee experience.
We need another video for 2024
Notably Phillips is missing and everyone has a Phillips.
@@polakatlphilips fumbled when they moved production to Romania
I have the Melitta, and you are right about the buttons. It"s difficult to adjust the buttons but i usually use the personal buttons, so you don't need to adjust the buttons. Pretty decent machine for the money
I've owned the Jura Z10 for few months and I would definitely say, it's worth it. The consistency of the coffees and ease of use. I have found my best settings (grind/amount of milk/water/coffee strength) and save it. Then I use Siri to make the coffee! Worked perfect so far
Wait... did you say Siri can make the coffee?! I didn't know that! I would love to see that!
@@oceanaxim yup , you can save custom settings to a Siri action
Can you please share your settings, Ive just purchased. Z10, havent set it up yet, we drink lattes & caps. thank you :)
I’ve enjoyed having a Jura bean to cup machine for over 20 yrs. My 13 yr old machine just broke. Since I don’t really drink cold brews, I just ordered the J8 (2022 model) that was recently released in the US. The grind is adjustable manually, but the program suggests the grind to set the machine for each type of coffee. It is 1K USD less than the Z10.
How is the voice assistant helpfull if you have to go to the kitchen anyway or there is an option to acquire an electromechanical cup dispenser that can speed up the coffee delivery process?
Otherwise, I don't see any productivity gain if you still have to put a cup into the coffee machine yourself, so that you have a nice touchscreen in front of your mug, I mean face.
The mechanical brew group used in Gaggia, Philips, and Saeco machines are more or less the same (for the past 20 years), so the performance you get out of the Gaggia machine here is somewhat comparable to what you get out of those other brands and models. A lot of what you get from buying a different model from those 3 manufacturers is in added features (e.g. milk frothing, special water filtration) and UX/UI.
same counts for the delonghi models. Same counts also for most Jura's.
I was wondering that, seems like kind of a rip off.
That €1k+ gaggia uses an identical brew group as my €350 Philips coffee machine
I've gotten to use a Jura S9, and with my experience with that and seeing other Jura machines, I think there's a fairly good case to be made that they're meant as premium office machines rather than creating the best possible at-home espresso. They're meant to be maintained by a core set of people while being able to pump out decent espresso on demand all day - hence the 'hidden' drink settings. Jim in the end cube isn't going to muck up everyone's coffee by putting it on some random setting that only he likes.
+1 … Our Jura Impressa S9 has been a workhorse for more than a decade or more. Great strength coffee. .. PS., we luv our Miele appliances D/W, Drier, Washer, Oven etc.
Jim always mucks stuff up.
Yes, the cleaning requirements for Juras when using milk drinks really put me off the brand as a home machine.
@@robinisathakur The Meile is worst by far.
There's a reason every office uses a Jura. Everybody starts by buying a cheaper machine. Then another one when it breaks after 3 months of punishing use. Then, after the second unit also breaks, they understand that it makes more economic sense to get a heavy duty Jura machine that will be good for years.
My parents bought a DeLonghi Dinamica (the base model, not the Plus) about four years ago. That machine is what got me drinking coffee in the first place, and it's still going strong to this day. While I agree that the milk frothing on it isn't great and I sometimes miss my setup when I go home to visit, it makes nice coffee incredibly quickly and conveniently. We all love it!
Edit: I meant Dinamica, not Dedica
What a fab review James. Really enjoyed it. I have owned Juras for 10+ years and now have an E8 and it serves me well but always wondered how the other brands were. So fabulous to see the comparison and as always with your reviews I love your structured approach to it all and honesty!!
Now I feel relief about owning a Jura Z10 after this review of automatics Bean To Cup coffee machines by James. I love the convenience of just pressing a button and getting a coffee without all the prep flow. One thing it wasn't mentioned is that with the Jura Z10 you can also do cold brews. I totally agree it does not beat a good grinder and Espresso machine. When I feel the urge for real espresso, I just fire up my E65s GbW grinder and VA EP1 to enjoy the best espresso shop experience.
I really like my DeLonghi Magnifica - it's an older style machine that is as bare-bones as it gets by todays standards. No display, no menus, just a few LEDs and buttons, two dials to set the amount of water and the aroma setting (grind time). It self-calibrates puck size and grind time and gets surprisingly consistent if you don't vary the grinder setting or type of beans too much. Most DeLongthis re-use parts from previous generations, so it's a continuing evolution, often just the same machine in a new case with a fancy menu screen added.
I used a comparable Jura at my previous office place. The milk system was kinda nice cause the milk pack could just stay in a little fridge and the process of refilling was simple for everyone to do
I sell many Juras in my shop in it is interesting that many customers hate the click in milk carafe that so many machines use.
Did you get an opportunity to fiddle with the dose/strength/temp settings and compare it against semi-autos?
We have a Jura machine at work (a few of them) and a comment about the milk container. I believe it’s separate because it is also a fridge. It keeps the milk cold and has it’s own power supply and fan. So it’s more than just a container and probably why they don’t include it. My personal opinion is that they should just include it and bump the cost of the unit as a whole.
Its true that Jura has the Cooling Units for milk. in 0.6L and 1L sizes. but they also have a small glass alternative that you can put in the fridge, for like 1 or 2 servings. would be nice if that was included with a machine this price without upping the price. since the glass once aren't to expensive. I work in a shop where we sell Jura, and we often include one of these milk containers as a free gift on a purchase.
Popcorn!!! Popcorn!!! I need to relax on the couch with a bowl of popcorn and just soak this all in! I love these in depth comparison/reviews, and how James goes in depth, in ways I never imagined.
Great video as always.
I'd like to see a comparison of lower end bean to cup machines. Delonghi Magnifica, Gaggia Brerra and a Melitta Cafe Solo etc.
Keep up the excellent videos James.
I own the Melitta Barista TS, and I agree that the buttons are a bit frustrating because (being touch buttons) they do not really give any haptic feedback and they also are a bit unresponsive (sometimes for example it takes a few presses to actually get into the menu). But since you can have several user profiles which save all the settings for each of the drinks for each user, it is not AS bad as it sounds. You can dial in your preferences, and from then on you just press the big "I want this drink" buttons in the top row and do not have to fiddle with the settings anymore. Also, I like that Melitta has an online shop where you can buy all the separate parts of the machine if you ever need a replacement (milk lines, brew group, lids, whatever), so if ever something goes wrong, you do not have to either throw out the whole machine or send it to an expensive "official repair shop".
I'm a Rancilio Silvia guy but I've rarely had time or energy to make lattes with it for a long time. For this reason I bought the Melitta Barista TS a few months back and I love it. Yes, the usability aspect is a bit troublesome but tbh it's not a deal breaker in any way. You get used to the quirks of the machine pretty fast, just like with any machine. The ease of use when compared to a semi-automatic like Silvia is just from another planet. Now I finally have time to get a decent cup of coffee before work. And yes, obviously with a semi-automatic you get to make the exact kind of coffee you need, and you can get your milk scorching hot (which just doesn't happen with this Melitta) but the reality is that I'm now drinking more coffee drinks than ever before and the taste hasn't bothered me even once.
The dual hopper system was one of the main reasons I wanted this Melitta and it works fantastically. I do shift work which means my working hours change weekly from day to night to evening. It's a must to be able to get decaf coffee easily and Melitta most certainly offers that. I'm sure there's still some residue coffee powder left in the grinder from the other hopper but if I really really really need to be sure I don't get any caffeine I just run one decaf espresso shot and throw it away. Yes, it's possible to use ground coffee as well and that works just fine but it's still much easier to use beans. Granted I only ever make milk drinks but I have no problems using beans that have been in the hoppers for a few days. The hopper lid is fairly well insulated which helps to keep the beans fresh enough, at least for me.
I could've gotten a Jura 8 for cheaper than this Melitta and it's very well possible it would've been better in some ways BUT after watching Jura's product videos it became clear that cleaning the milk system would be a hassle compared to Melitta. Apparently you need to use Jura's own detergent daily to clean the milk system whereas with Melitta you only need to run the automatic steam cleaning everytime you use the milk function (which basically means just attaching the milk tube to the metal grill of the machine and pressing a button a few times), and you need to run the more thorough cleaning with detergent weekly.
I also love how the Melitta looks.
Seconded this, the conveyor unit on mine started getting difficult to reinstall after cleaning, eventually wouldn't fit at all. My coffee supplier sold me a replacement part and that's working fine. Even the grinding unit can be replaced, although I shudder to think what the cost of that would be!
I have a Miele CM5500 which is also obsessed with rinsing. This is definitely frustrating at first, but after a couple of years and 1600+ coffees brewed I have come to see it as a virtue. With very little effort on my part my machine is spotlessly clean. This contrasts sharply with the two Delonghi machines I previously owned which I had to laboriously clean every few months since the brew unit would merrily fling ground coffee around the interior. The milk hose cleaning is also excellent, so the original hose looks as clean as it did the day the machine was delivered.
Shame about the build quality though. It should be FULL stainless steel, not an ounce of plastic on the exterior. The Breville Oracle Touch, while a slightly different coffee machine is full stainless steel with a plethora of better features. Heck, even a Rocket Apartmentto is cheaper and full stainless steel build. Miele kind of disappointed here to be honest, especially considering that their brand is supposed to be prestigious, hence the price point.
@@LaSombraa that would be nice. The CM5500 offers pretty much the same functionality and uses the same brew unit. I paid around £500 for it so I was perfectly happy with a plastic exterior.
Got myself a Jura S8 for those moments when I want a fast espresso or coffee with a push of a button. The best super automatic machine of all I used. I had a Delonghi, Melita, Philips, Saeco. None comes close to Jura. 😊
The price difference is of course also massive, so no wonder the experience matches that
I am mechanical engineer and your descriptions of fail designed features made me laugh a lot.
My top 5 of funniest points:
1. the moving thing (why?? 😂)
2. the violent steam finish (wtf!)
3. choice-buttons too tight at each other (oops, now I have to drink cappuccino instead of espresso 🤷🏻♂️😄)
4. noisy fans
5. the upstanding cover of bean hopper
violent steam finish !🤣
James: “It’s monstrous, it’s huge, it’s two and a half thousand pounds!”
Me: “It doesn’t look like it weighs that much 🤔” ……”oh!” 😄
I own the Delonghi, there is an app with it which allows you to control the water and everything else. Thanks for the review
I've had an older Jura machine (the Ena3) for about 14 years now and I've been impressed with it. Normally I hate UIs that are basically a single multi function button, but this one does it well, and seems to appreciate that its primary place in the world is to solve the first coffee problem, so just turning it on and slapping the big button will give you coffee. Accessing the other functions through The Button is handled by making it a jog dial with clear detents, and feedback on a simple single line LCD, which works well for me: no recall needed so it solves the normal problem with single button interfaces. It is also still easy to service occasionally with the local agents all these years later, and has survived being pulled off the kitchen counter onto it's face by an angry baboon with barely a scratch to show for it (I live in an interesting place). So for me, although cheaper machines have feature parity I've been happy I paid more for this one as I'd almost certainly have gone through at least two of the cheaper machines in this timeframe.
I'm so glad someone finally reviewed the Miele! I've only seen the cheaper variants and we have this exact one! Thanks for the vid
I have the Jura Z10 and it is fantastic. Especially with the optional milk refrigerator it is a perfect combo. Another thing is that Jura Z10 is the only machine that can produce a cold brew.
True cold brew takes 12 hours+ cold brew is a grossly underestimated and undervalued and perhaps not understood subject, maybe dare I say it, even by james...
@@revoltoff what is it, 12, 15, 20 or more hours? I think the point is that makes a pretty good cold press coffee. You can dislike the terminology, but as you stated yourself, the requirements on time are variable. Also, the definition of “brewed”means it was boiled or steeped in boiling liquid, so I think cold “brew” as a definition isn’t accurate as-is.
I have the Delonghi Magnifica xs, it has been a pretty solid machine. (IMO) I've owned it for about 5 years and it has been working great.
Since cross contamination is a known issue with a lot of grinders, would it be possible to use beans that have been dyed to visibly determine how bad a particular grinder is?
Id imagine you’d have to somehow dye the entirety of the bean to properly see it (aka the inside of the bean), which seems basically impossible
Maybe you can test it with a different bean or seed, such as a navy bean, so the colour is different throughout
Or may be between a very dark roast and very light roast
@@ghostoutofthebox Not much difference between the grounds and how they look it's primarily smell and flavor that differ
@@leagueaddict8357 that's completely untrue. The bean difference is very obvious even when fine grinded. I use bean to cup and when I change from darker to lighter roast, the small retained portion of darker beans are clearly visible on the top of the puck. So what he suggested is actually a way to go
I have a Jura E8 new one for about 18months and have loved it, and been to Italy for a week and had cappuccinos 3 times a day from different places, I realised I could dial in some sizes and strengths to actually copy what I was drinking in Italy from coffee shops, bought some Italian cups and made little cappuccinos in the Jura e8 and it’s indistinguishable from what I got in Italy, makes me happier to have purchased this machine. One thing that makes a difference is not using cows milk in the UK cos it’s garbage, use goats milk or something else
I have the Melitta that you reviewed here. Agreed on the button responsiveness, it's bad. The app makes life a lot easier but the key thing is that once you set it up, the personalisation options mean that I walk up, select me and the drink I've already programmed. For my partner, I select a different user and that drink. It means that you actually hardly ever use the buttons. As a result, button responsiveness is never an issue.
I can confirm that. I use saved coffee setups and never the sliders or +- buttons. With the app it's easy to program.
I can also confirm this - straightforward machine with enough configuration to make a good coffee, and easy to clean with reasonably priced occasional maintenance' bits such as seals. Having had a number of different machines over the years I am rather fond of this unassuming small footprint machine that does the job and isn't 'needy'.
Wow, this DeLonghi coffee machine costs around 540 GBP in Poland (converted to British pounds). A really great machine for the money, I personally own a slightly lower model and am very happy with it.
In general we have quite good prices for machines in Poland. To a degree where (although now with possible export fees may not be so clear-cut) buying one in PL and sending to UK might still end up cheaper than buying in the UK.
I purchased a semi automatic coffee machine 8 years ago. I went with the Deloghi magnifica S because it offered me control over the milk side and I figured that that would help me to get the best coffee from a relatively cheap machine. I like it, I get decent coffee
Recently purchased the DeLonghi Magnifica Evo with milk reservoir for €500 and I'm 100% satisfied with the machine. It's quite basic but does what it must do perfectly.
I actually own the Melitta for about 2yrs now and just saw this video.
As a "user", yes the buttons as you said are miserable
I mainly use the machine via the Bluetooth App, which is really good and user-friendly
Considering the price point i really like it, as a "daily driver" for when I'm too lazy for making coffee by myself.
Miele, in my mind, exists mostly to sell their stuff to people that buy a whole kitchen at furniture stores. And that's why they get away with the prices they charge. My parents got all of their kitchen electronics built-in from them (bean-to-cup, fridge, microwave, ...) and they all have these weird issues that just make them incredibly frustrating to use.
And I'm pretty sure that's why they do weird things like moving the spout up and down: it looks cool and stands out the first time a furniture salesman shows it to you, and that's how they get sales
miele genuinely makes real good washing machines, drying machines and dishwashers - that's what they're known for... their other products eh.... the super expensive built in coffe machines that cost over 3000 pounds have a reputation of being unable to deliver hot coffe
@@BitmapFrogs so its mostly like 90% of german coffee. I myself have a Miele vacuum and its great, but their coffee machine is probably made for the German market. And Germans drink the worst coffee in Europe. Mind you I’m not talking about specialty/minority run cafes, but the everyday germans place. The coffee there is usually so terrible that you’d rather just drink beer/wine
I've got the De'Longhi Dinamica (not plus) at home and the De'Longhi Magnifica (much cheaper) at work. Run both with supermarket Lavazza and am pleased enough with the coffee. But I'm a bit of a savage that just needs my caffeine and I haven't ascended to specialty coffee levels yet. For me, if you're looking for superauto, De'Longhi has kept me happy through 3 machines over 20 years.
I've had 3 Juras over the years and a Melitta. The Melitta was great but the home model couldn't keep up with production and eventually quit. The Juras are workhorses for the office and home. They produce great coffee and milk drinks and are easy to use. Worth the extra money.
I've got a Melitta Caffeo (higher end TSP rather than TS) and I get on fine with the UI. That said I could easily recommend some fixes to make it more usable. Upside of the haptic buttons is that they're easily cleaned, and there's a fairly good divider between the two bins (definitely a plus point for us, dark roast for morning, lighter for afternoon). The milk system is finicky, non dairy alternatives are hit and miss.
With the Gaggia you’re supposed to turn the milk thing immediately back towards the handle position and the steam is supposed to go to the handle towards the drip tray
I have owned and tried 3 of the above machines. The single best machine is the Phillips latte-go which generates an actual puck... best by far. Milk is best also
I have one too. Love it, but the foam can be a bit much.
@@NimmiCat yes for me it’s fine but my partner says the same, could be warmer. The way the milk is made exposes it to a lot of room temp air which is the cause of this
Which model is that? 2200?
@@seanismboi I purchased the EP5446 as it has a function where you can automatically make a (true) double shot drink with milk with a single button. Also option to make change the order of shots first or milk first.
Lattego was decent but the coffee was always lukewarm for me.
The Miele is for the fan boys. They make excellent vacuum, dishwashers (even most hospitals use Miele machines for automated cleaning of the instruments) but absolutely no reason to pay this money for a Miele coffee machine.
To be clear, "fan boys" refers here to "people who like the sound of fans."
This model is very much overkill. I have a 6150 for £900 - which is a far better value and I think that any Miele model higher than that is too much money
As someone who has sold appliances for over a decade, you're basically right with one exception. *this model* is for fanboys. Miele is a luxury brand, meaning their top end products cost more just to cost more, with a couple meme features to flex on your rich buddies. The automatic moving spout is basically 100% of what you're paying for over the $1750 model. I also get why it is so fiercely hands off with the settings, clients at the price point it is targeting care less about results and more about automation and convenience. I'd be much more interested in a breakdown of the entry level models from Jura, Miele, and Delonghi since they're all much closer in price.
@@deovontaymcslanga4380 yes, for me i want to drink a cappuccino not make a cappuccino- so the more hands off the better. And the automatic moving spout is just as you say. The lower end Mieles are ideally like Toyotas - not the fanciest or most customizable but hopefully reliable more easily serviceable and long-lasting with good self cleaning and maintenance regimes
@@vigilantcosmicpenguin8721 absolutely:)
Would have hoped to see a cheaper option as well, like the gaggia brera which can be had for a comparatively paltry $300 refurbished
Is it a good machine?
Tchibo is selling one for
I have had my Jura for 8 years. NO problems, easy to use and makes great drinks. The reason I splurged on a Jura, we came back from Italy, Spain, etc. I found Starbucks awful now and wanted to make coffee at home. I experienced different brands of coffee beans which made a difference as well.
My parents have a jura and swap milk types, keeping both in the fridge which works very well for them. Theyve had the same machine for a decade at least and its still going strong.
Spare parts for the Siemens are cheap which is good. We changed the whole brew unit 2 times already because its just 80€ and makes a huge difference after 3000 drinks. Cleaning is also super easy
This deserves more focus. Siemens has been great with cleaning for a long time, which is a huge factor after the first month of ownership.
@@TheMongooseOfDoom Yes, cleaning is a great feature. I love it. But on the other hand EQ9's brewing unit has (or had) a flaw that will break it after 1-2 years of use. I had to replace brewing unit in 2 machines (home and work), but other than that eq9 works fine.
Already 2 brew units after 3000 drinks!? That's quite wasteful. I had an EQ.9 and the brew unit had to be replaced after maybe a good 1000 drinks because of a design flaw. The machine was driving me nuts, especially how dirty it got all the time. After 1 week, the EQ.9 is dirtier than my delonghi after 3 months. Oh boy and you don't want to look inside a Jura after some time. After some moths you get a free penicillin shot as well!
The cleanest machine of them all is the delonghi.
@@spedi6721 first replacement after 3500 drinks and another after about 7000.
@@Schnubby in my sight, that's not a sign of quality, sorry. My first delonghi has about 15000 on the clock and there is still the first brew unit inside. I just regularly disassemble, clean and grease it.
Another outstanding video from James. I bought the Delonghi DP after spending hours reviewing Breville, Gaggia, Saeco, Miele, Phillips, Jura. I reviewed maintenance, taste, # of recipes and ability to create custom recipes with milk based drinks. I did not buy based on foaming milk substitute. James really should have said that most, if not all, bean to cup auto foamers will struggle w/ milk substitutes. However, a couple of highly respected sites like ECS Coffee, Seattle Coffee Gear, Whole Latte Love, have positively commented Delonghi's ability to foam and work with alternative creamers.
I've personally tried almond, almond coconut, soy, oat and there's NO SUB for 1/2 & 1/2, Whole or Heavy cream Cow's milk. Sure those alternatives have some calorie savings, but in no way, do they offer taste that's within 80% of Cow's milk creamer. The aftertaste and blah, meh cream texture just doesn't cut it. So if he tried Cow's milk cream w/ the Delonghi he would have gotten microfoam, and various heights of cream, which their LatteCrema system offers that others don't.
Lastly, I did buy it because of Brad Pitt's commercial!!! How could you not want to buy it after watching Perfetto from Brad? LOL.
Hello, thanks for this comment. I'm actually very interested in this machine and I was wondering how long you've had it now and if you've had any issues. I've been put off from buying it due to reviews saying that it breaks very quickly. Thank you in advance for any help you can give me!
I can't speak for James, but most people I know who drink plant based milks are doing it because they're lactose intolerant, not for calorie saving reasons.
As someone who is repairing this kind of machines I can say that You should review some Jura lower down the price range like E8 or E6. They are smaller, a lot cheaper, have less things to potentially break, the same brewing mechanism. For me the best value for money. As for DeLonghi machines, I really don't like their milk carafes. They make a lot of problems a few months after buing and are very hard to clean properly, after only automatic cleaning two years from the purchase you can see horrifying scenes inside of them. For me the best automatic coffee machines are JURA E6, E8 or some simple DeLonghi Magnifica.
i'd have to say (hello from a fellow repairer) the Delonghis are much easier to clean than the Juras as they have removable brew units - whereas Juras don't, so you have to really keep up with the clean cycles. Plus those damn drain valves always wear out.
For the most part, my folks have had De'Longhi machines and for the most part they are very good machines. We had one with the milk attachment that never made scalding milk and eventually died, but it still brewed on.
I do have two melitta machines, the one above and the cafeo solo. Cafeo solo runs non stop for 6th year now averaging of 5 coffees a day. Regarding barista - buttons are not bad at all, coffee is consistent, and remote options to make a brew genuinely as you wish including the temperature of each layer - great option for every coffee amateur. Melitta does the job perfectly and these are just built not to fell apart like the other brands.
Jura Z10 is expensive mainly because of its cold brewing capability. It may actually make more sense to compare the E8 or S8 (which is probably 20-35% cheaper) with the rest.
I would completely agree. I have S8 and I think it makes great coffee and milk drinks. You can even adjust the milk foam which is nice touch plus a manual grind setting.
Thanks for the crisp, concise yet remarkably detailed review. The question remains whether the huge price markup for the Z10 is justified compared to De’Longhi’s value for money. How does the Eletta Explore brew compare to the Z10 considering it also features the cold brew option.
The Jura Z10 can also pour cold brew, so this is why the grind size is programmable. Cold brew requires a larger grind size than standard expresso
Espresso. Yes I'm a jerk. Sorry 🤷♂️
EXPRESSO?!?!?!!!
@@pb2959 No, expresso. Bean to cup machines don't do espresso.
@@remnant24 Ahahahaha! Ok. You win. 🤣🤣
@@remnant24 Correct, I was going to correct what I wrote, but am leaving it the way it is. No superautomatics can pull a proper espresso shot.
I've got a variant of the Siemens with two separate grinders. You can also choose whether it brews coffee or milk first. The other person is using robusta beans in one hopper and we each have our set of profiles for our coffees. It works really well. The additional option to use your own ground coffee helps when I want to make a decaf. I grind that separately.
As someone with the Miele machine in my office, you're spot on James. The UI is annoying, the machine is slow and the constant rinsing and cleaning makes it even more inconvenient for the office where people make 30 coffees a day (it literally cleans itself every time it's turned on, so almost every time someone makes a coffee)
In my office I have one 20 years old Saeco. Still makes perfect drink. All it needs is regular cleaning and decalc
Agreed! I have this machine at home. It is a rinsing and cleaning maniac!
It would have been interesting to see how one of the Miele CM5 series machines would have faired in this comparison. Similar fit & finish to the CM7 with a single hopper, manually adjustable head height and a simpler control panel at 1/2 - 2/3rds the price point may have been a bit more of what was expected for this group.
I have the 5300 and it looks like the UI on it is way better than the one in the video, I paid €800 for mine.
Yeah my CM5500 does love to rinse, but doesn't share any of the other frustrations he mentioned.
I bought my 6150 for £900 - nearly 2/3 less than this CM7. I agree fully with this comment
@@somefreshbread and im ok with the rinsing enthusiasm too
Came here to say the same thing. My understanding is the entire lineup uses the same brew group, grinder and milk frothing system.
I have the cheapest one and it brews traditional medium dark espresso well enough, but I found it struggles with lighter roasts.
James, as someone who likes coffee but is nowhere near your levels of nerdiness (that's a compliment), I really hoped to see cheaper machines in this line-up. In addition, a blind taste test to start things off would have been perfect and particularly interesting with a mix of cheaper machines in there. As an average consumer, this video lost me once the line up was announced. I still watched it but I just can't relate to much of the commentary. Not saying you shouldn't cater to that audience (or your own interests!) -- but I would love to see you revisit this.
He already did a comparisson of espresso machines under £100 (ruclips.net/video/avM-XsaTBIc/видео.html) and under £500 (ruclips.net/video/7HIGdYy5of4/видео.html).
I'm not an espresso expert by any means but I do have a machine at home. Recently they put a jura in our workplace and I was really surprised by the quality. Not that it's fantastic but I never imagined coffee coming from these "Kaffeevollautomat"s, as they are called in German, would be drinkable. Good to see you that you found it decent in comparison to others as well.
Thanks James for another great review. I would have loved to hear more about how easy/difficult it is to clean the machines. I was leaning towards the Jura and I think you have confirmed my preference.
I have an old Jura Z5 that I bought in a poor state on ebay ("spares or repair") five years ago. After new seals, burrs, and a good clean and descale it's been working flawlessly (with a couple of seal replacements). Total shot count is now over 17500 and there are no signs of anything aging.
Love my Melitta connect. Been a couple of years since owning it now and it’s not let me down yet. As someone else has mentioned, the app is actually really good. Though I use my automated settings for daily espresso and the app for milk drinks on the weekend. I paid ~£800 so they must have gone up in price.
Probably due to length considerations not included but a very important aspect I find is missing is the maintenance and cleaning. I have used a few De Longhis and all the internal corners and crevices are a pain to clean, used coffee falls to the side, etc. The Jura has done this much better in my experience.
I also prefer the tube directly into the milk over another container that needs regular cleaning. The removable vs self cleaning brewing unit might be a point of contention.
The maintenance aspect is a very big deal, in fact a deal breaker for me. It's more work not less. Maybe if we were making coffee 20 times a day it would look like a win, but not at 3 or 4.
jura is the worst lol, I recently restored one that "broke" because the owner couldn't clean it by hand and didn't want to pay 120 euros for a service package that makes someone from Jura come clean your machine at home. The delonghi als uses regular bolts which makes it extremely easy to take the covers off and clean it thoroughly every year or two. Jura has a special bolt which needs special tools.
Interesting to hear about this, our Jura was sold to us as "self-cleaning" using some tablets and it has worked well so far over 5+ish years ()family machine and not main user so now detailed idea. I do like the ability of the delonghi to open it up and clean inside, I have no idea how the Jura looks inside and dread to see it. But the cleaning experience of the delonghi was a pain with all the corners and holes...The main reason for me to have moved to pour over.
There is an aspect that I consider very important when comparing bean to cup machines which is not mentioned at all and it is maintenance. I believe that people who buy these machines look for the best cup of coffee they can get for their budget but with minimum hassle. Often these machines require you to follow complex maintenance/cleaning procedures which defeat the purpose of no-hassle.
Indeed. My mother-in-law's S9 hasn't made a milk drink in years because no one ever wants to deal with the constant sanitization it would require.
This video has finally inspired me to get a new water filter and fresh coffee for Melitta that's been sitting unused for months. If you're considering this one, get familiar with the app, save your presets and use them. I like how easy it's to clean the brewing assembly, the pouring head and the milk system.
My dad has a Jura. It's been making coffee regularly for over 10 years & gone in for maintenance only once or twice- that fun fact alone is why I'd prefer a Jura.
Great review, I’m surprised you didn’t include the Philips Lattego bean to cup coffee machine, it’s definitely one of the most popular “low” budget bean to cup machines available. I’ve had a 4300 at home for a month now and I’m quite impressed with it
Definitely!
Do you enjoy cleaning it? I couldn't stand the hassle of dealing with the mess in the mechanism on a Philips 3200.
Surprised me too! But it does look suspiciously similar to the deLonghi.
Lattego does lousy shots. Its call to fame is the new milk frother - it does a really good job, simple and easy to clean.
I'd expect him to go for the 3200 Classic since he prefers to steam his own with a milk wand. And it's even cheaper for the same basic internals.
I have the Melitta Barista T-Smart (not the TS shown) and I must say that the app is a great 'companion' and really helps to get the machine dialled in. You can set up multiple (up to 4) profiles which then make all the drink buttons 'one touch' to retrieve your preferred recipes. It does a really good job in accurately re-creating what you've programmed, and an advantage in the milk containers and easy cleaning is that I bought a spare milk container for my other half as she is non-dairy.
Looking forward to dialling in the dose and ratio when my next order of beans arrives. We got the machine on promotion and it is really great value for money!
“Why did that move!” - really got a chuckle out of that one
I have had Jura machines for over 30 years. My current J9 is about 8 years old and works like a fine watch. It never has failed and always produces outstanding coffees. Wouldn’t exchange it for anything else.
This just makes me happy for my Breville Barista Express I got 5 years ago. I control it and adjust based on how stale my coffee has become and steam my own milk, saved $500 and better espresso for my work, which thanks to practice is fairly consistent and quick. I can pamper my loved ones and make them smile with some basic foam art too, which is missing here so it just depends on what you're looking for.
Coming from a cheaper machine that sounded like an airplane taking off while grinding and a milk frother that just came off the machine, and on top of that didn’t foam milk properly: the melitta is amazing!
We agree with you: the buttons are terrible, you get used to it after a while and we can now make a coffee without to much anger issues!
The coffee and milk drinks are so much better! We are very happy we upgraded.
If you want a really silent one, i would recommend the Siemens. Even the grinding doesn't really sound like grinding because it's so silent.
Now let’s do a comparison of mold growth inside all those machines presented. Especially after one year of use. Jura, are you ready? ;)
Side note - Miele, Melitta and Nivona use the same platform made by Eugster as did older Bosch and Siemens machines. So they all will give similar brews.
Miele just adds few more gadgets like motorized spout or automatic descaling circuit. But it doesn’t justify the price. You pay for the badge.
I am servicing superautos for over 10 yrs so I know all these machines inside out.