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@Southeastern777 U.S. public radio stations must raise $9 from supporters for every $1 that they receive in subsidy. NPR is not perfect, but it is the most fair and objective free news source that I'm aware of. Yes, they do ignore some perspectives, as do all modern news organizations, but they do a better job than most and infinitely better than some. Public media is one of the *most* independent sources of information in multiple nations today. As they are non-profit and not /as/ influenced by corporate sponsors as some commercial news organizations, public media has somewhat more freedom to pursue controversial or unpopular stories than some organizations. U.S. public radio and television has been losing revenue year after year for decades as fewer and fewer Americans want to support independent, grassroots-funded information and entertainment, but they are still doing their best and I love my public media stations more than any other. Americans once supported these stations as they knew that democracy would die without objective news sources, but today many Americans don't want to listen to any information that challenges what they already believe to be true; many Americans today /want/ an echo chamber and are uncomfortable with debate. Due to the loss of grassroots support, public media now relies upon large corporate donors more than ever and this indeed makes them less independent. However, that does *not* make them propaganda for some imaginary evil "government". The U.S. Government is *us*, not some evil organization bent on our destruction. If you received 10% of your budget from the Corporation for Public Broadcasting based upon your contribution to the public good and adherence to CPB guidelines, would that make you feel obliged to promote propaganda for the CPB? The vast majority of NPR's budget comes from local stations and the corporate, foundational, and individual donors who support those stations. For the past decade, funding for public media has been eliminated entirely in every single spending proposal introduced and then added back in during the compromise process. An overwhelming majority of Americans support that funding, but few understand that it represents only a small fraction of the budgets of public channels. The real irony will be when funding for the Corporation for Public Broadcasting *is* finally ended for good, as the people that demonize public radio and television will *still* be claiming that NPR is a propaganda machine for the "gubment" even when they stop receiving taxpayer dollars completely. When that happens, haters will invent brand new conspiracies for how "public" media is then controlled by the government. I'll guarantee that many will then claim that NPR is then receiving some sort of "secret" money as they *need* to have imagined enemies like NPR to maintain their political zeal. Without such enemies, how would anti-government politicians get us to contribute to their campaigns? With that said, I do not know why NPR is trying to stop Franken FM stations from broadcasting, but they probably have /some/ legitimate claims as it would be a waste of their resources to engage in a pointless battle; it's not believable to imagine that NPR is just trying to destroy stations for no reason at all. I'm not claiming that NPR is right in this case, however, as I simply don't know enough details. Perhaps they're wrong; that *still* doesn't make them evil propagandists. A lot of people seem to think that NPR is an "ultra-liberal" news source, but what they fail to understand is that actual liberals think NPR is a *conservative* news source, as they constantly promote Wall Street, corporate profit, and GDP growth; NPR even has an hour-long daily business show discussing such things. The main reason people think that news sources are liberal or conservative is because they, the *listeners*, are so far right or left that even the most moderate news agency in the world appears to be biased towards their opponents. The Taliban would consider OAN to be a left-wing propaganda cult. Listeners and viewers always accuse the news sources of bias, but they never seem to consider their *own* bias in this equation. I assure you that ultra-environmentalists and left-wing socialists find NPR to be a sickening propaganda machine for corporate America; people just don't hear about this because they probably don't even *know* any left-wing extremists. Everyone thinks that *they* are moderate and well-balanced. Yesterday morning, NPR did an hour story on the inventiveness of Jeff Bezos and how this made Amazon so successful. Do you think that ultra-liberals want to hear a "news" story praising Jeff Bezos or Amazon? No, they don't. They hate him and think his company is oppressive and monopolistic. The News *is* often biased, but *we* are far more biased. The traditional News agencies haven't changed all that much in the past 20 years. *We've* changed a lot, however, and most of us refuse to listen to any information that we don't already agree with. *We* are the problem.
@@AntennaMan -- I got mine via Amazon at a reasonable price, though the V115 is cheaper!!! now, and cheaper still via eBay. One can read all the reviews on Amazon then decide where to buy if it sounds like good toy to have 😊 Oh, I don't think China can slip any malevolent software into it as the V115 doesn't even have a clock other than a timer to turn it off when recording (say, after an hour).
87.7 MeTV FM in Chicago is also not some small, ethnic station, but does provide very unique programming compared to any other stations… It often is in the top 10 for ratings, which is hard to do in such a large market
I've known about 87.7 since I was a kid. Growing up in Tulsa my Mom used to listen to KOTV Channel 6 on a portable radio to hear her soap operas when she did housework away from the TV. Her cousin was a radio newsman and told her about it. I heard Vin Scully's famous call of "The Catch" in 1982 on KAUZ Channel 6 in Wichita Falls over 87.7 when I had guard duty in the military. It has always definitively been a useful "extra feature" of the FM band.
Many US radio stations appear to be in a death spiral. Buyouts by large corporations, with no interest in quality content, merely advertising revenues, don't help. Much easier to do an internet station, today.
The Internet has much to do with that. People can find streaming radio stations more appealing to their tastes without ads running all the time. There's only so much Top 40 one can take. And things such as MP3 players really had an impact since one could easily play a customized list of music.
I use to listen to WRGB CBS6 (The world's oldest TV Station from Schenectady, NY) on 87.7FM... Since they went digital, there is nothing on that 87.75MHz position anymore. It was kind of nice being able to hear the audio of the TV broadcast while driving around the Albany, NY area.
I may be Guadalupe radio TVs biggest promoter user. They are encouraging viewerd to go to Roku. NPR has two very powerful stations here in LA and Radio Guadalupe is extremely weak and would never work as digital.
HI SHANGO! I was just about to put your name down as a major " viewer" of Gtv. I watch it whenever you use/watch. I dont need an antenna that way! Big Fan of Shango!! Thanks for all the learning and laughs. You are one of the good guys.
I mean, technically he has a modulator and such... But I get what you're saying. Personally, I just use the hackrf with hacktv or gnuradio to broadcast atsc/ntsc.. works beautifully.
NPR has been a near constant problem for LPFM and other non comms. They were one of the main lobbies in the initial removal of the class D FM license and attempting to prevent LPFM stations this time around. There news content may be great but as an organization they are ruthless when it comes to competition for sponsorship dollars by attempting to prevent competition from being on the air.
Radio spectrum is extremely valuable real estate. npr is a 'nonprofit' but you can bet there is something in it for them, a whole lot of 'something'.. No one places this much effort or resources toward anything just for the heck of it. There is more to this npr story than meets the eye..
NPR does bill stations every month not too differently than how cable companies work. They're almost like Goodwill, being nonprofit for the fashion. Only, goodwill hasn't gone to court for overcharging the customers for years.
Funny how so many of these nonprofit organizations who pay their employees next to nothing or just have them volunteer for free have people at the helm that rake in a quarter million dollars a year.
You can bet that NPR has their eyes on that channel in a lot of places and they’re looking to get a hook in it. Even if they have to tear down any competition to get it.
Franken FM stations are very important for both TV and Radio for numerous purposes such as Preserving the technology's history, having an analog station for video and audio during emergency situations since this will work on pretty much any TV or Radio, and of course these stations often provide content that isn't necessarily available on other stations (both TV and Radio). In my opinion Channel 6 should have been a dedicated FM/Analog TV station everywhere and channels that broadcast on that channel digitally should have went somewhere else like most channels do.
If I remember right, WRGB (CBS 6 in Albany) had the same idea of running a vertically polarized analog/FM audio feed on 87.7 MHz right next to their digital feed on the rest of VHF channel 6 and went to the FCC with the proposal. The hope was that it would be like a digital wrapper around an analog core, similar to HD Radio's "In-Band On Channel" technology that analog FM stations use to run digital subchannels on their sidebands. They got permission to try it out with an experimental Special Temporary Authority, but... the FM feed on 87.75 caused serious interference issues to the digital TV feed and they had to stop. Later on, they tried running the FM feed on 87.9 MHz and that actually DID work, but... they weren't licensed for broadcasts on that, and the FCC said they had to cease, which they did. WITI-TV (Fox 6 in Milwaukee) saw what happened with WRGB's experiments, and decided to rent out a subchannel on WMIL-FM 106.1 (HD-3) for an audio simulcast in the area for a few years. WPVI (6abc in Philadelphia) also considered renting an HD Radio subchannel from an FM broadcaster but was concerned about potential broadcast rights/copyright issues from doing such a thing. It's a shame, too, since Channel 6 broadcasters in hurricane-prone areas were able to use this fact to their advantage: "stay tuned for up-to-date coverage on Channel 6 and 87.7 FM!". I personally think letting former VHF 6 television operators to run their analog FM feed on 87.9 should be allowed, to retain this type reception ability. I've been saying for a long time that the FCC should re-locate stations on VHF 5 and 6 and expand the FM band down to 76 MHz (where it starts in Japan). Such a move would add 12 MHz to the FM band and would significantly help with the horrible overcrowding on the FM band that we see today. So far, only two FM stations even operate on 87.9 FM (both LPFM stations in California)... anyone else operating on that frequency is almost certainly a pirate broadcaster. As for MeTV FM in Chicago... it's actually outperforming both powerhouse/legendary Chicago broadcasters WLS-FM 94.7 and WGN-AM 720 in the ratings, which I find absolutely hilarious! As a kid, I used to love listening to CIII-TV 6 from Paris, Ontario in the car as my family and I traveled to visit other family members in Toronto. We'd tune either the car stereo or a battery-powered one and listen to shows like The Simpsons that way.... those were fun times...
When you hear the list of 'Foundational' support for NPR, and recognize who/what those foundations are, you'll begin to understand what NPR has morphed into.
@Southeastern777 I agree with you 100 percent. I won't be listening to NPR classical music no more. I have data on my phone and don't need their garbage anymore. The government should remove funding from NPR and such like!
@@SayAhh and you sir, are being tactfully divided away from your fellow country man, as so is Southeastern777 from those like yourself. Pawns in an Agenda game. Thanks to this unfortunate fact. OUR future...GAME OVER!
@@THEMADPROFdj Nothing can be done. Maga is aligned with Trump. McConnell will block and obstruct everything. Romney and Cheney are too liberal for the GOP, apparently, and Bernie and Warren will never get a shot due to corporate lobbyists. But I have to at the very minimum vote for the one party that at least fully (at least publicly) acknowledge the existence of climate change and the SARS-CoV-2 virus before either one kills us all, in which case it doesn't matter who is dividing and conquering us. (Wall Street.)
Hey me also. I actually forgot all about this till just now in 2021. You gave me a flashback to remembering TV channels 17, 29 and 48 and watching Japanese animation like Speed Racer, Tobor the 8th man and Wee Willy Webber and Captain Noah.
I used to be able to do the same thing on the other side of the state in Johnstown. WJAC was also on channel 6, and could be picked up fairly clearly in the car on 87.7 FM for at least 15 miles in any direction from Johnstown, or if you're on top of one of the many mountains surrounding that area.
@@1L6E6VHF not necessarily true, I used to listen to WQED FM 89.3 on my TV when I was a teen. I did not have an FM radio at that time only AM. TV tuners were analog and wide band you can turn the fine tuning knob and pick up FM radio. I loved Classical music for the most part. Opera was not my favorites but piano and symphonies were. My mom didn't like the idea because she thought I may ruin my portable tv. I guess I could have just turned the brightness to dark. Well it's true you can listen to some FM on a analog tv.
From the content I’ve seen on npr, they push the radical left content. From what I’ve seen there’s no conservative content in their broadcasts. Their intent is probably to silence any conservative content on any stations broadcasting in contrast to their warped view. This might also include opposition to evangelical Christians that might use it in third world countries along with communist China who don’t want to allow the gospel of Jesus Christ to be spread and heard. The irony is that except for the United States there are probably very few digital transmitters in the rest of the world. Npr probably gets government funding in some form or other. The United States has always been a nation God established for Christians to be governed by Christians. And yet the democratic satanic left is trying to destroy what God established. I think they picked the wrong God to fight against.🪃🙌
That's what I used to do when I would visit my buddy in Johnstown. WJAC also broadcast on channel 6 .If it was late at night and I couldn't sleep, and I didn't want to piss him off by turning on the TV, I would just put on my headphones and turn my Walkman to 87.7 and listen to Jay Leno. 😂
87.7 in my area (ABC channel 6) went dark on Digital Doomsday 2009 and never returned. Nowadays, there isn’t a whole lot worth watching on TV, or even cable for that matter, sadly.
ATSC 3.0 , only UHF and VHF-Hi. Same frequency as DVB-T, DVB-T2, and DTMB on UHF channels 14 - 53. UHF channel 14 uses 473 MHz for ATSC 3.0, DVB-T/T2 and DTMB, 473.143 MHz for ISDB-T also on Japan UHF channel 13 and 470.31 MHz for ATSC.
I long for the old days. We in Schenectady and the surrounding region used to be able to receive our local channel 6 (WRGB, Schenectady NY) on 87.7 FM. It was a comfort for many who had long commutes from work in the late afternoon and evening, as we could listen to the news on the radio. But then again, that was when the "news" was "news"... and when we had lives that were a standard of normal.
I think you just explained a situation that has always puzzled me. I live in North GA about 135 miles from Birmingham, AL and 45 Miles from Chattanooga. Back in the mid 90's while tuned to 88.1, Chattanooga I would occasionally receive audio from a Birmingham, Al TV station. This has always puzzled me until now. On a side note, A couple of years ago, while tuned to 95.5 FM my radio skipped in and out picking up 95.5 "Big Dog FM" in North Dakota. That's about 1,700 miles by line of sight.
I think it's called "E-skip". If the weather and atmospheric conditions are just right, you can pick up radio and television stations from hundreds of miles away. I've picked up Detroit, Flint, and Fort Wayne radio and TV stations in Northwestern Pennsylvania many times during these events. A couple of times, the broadcast signals from the Flint TV stations (12 and 66) would even be strong enough to override those of the local Erie stations on the same frequencies.
I have 2 NPR affiliates in my market. I appreciate what they do but I don’t get why they feel the need to go after the Franken FMs. Like you say, the franken FM stations often cater to niche markets that might not have their own stations otherwise. I wasn’t sure about 87.7 being an actual FM registrable station but as you clarified that it isn’t it doesn’t really make sense why anyone other than the FCC would care about it one way or the other
You may want to look at the other stations on your dial and who owns them. If it's like this area you'll find 1 major company owns 5 or more stations on the FM dial. In fact, you can walk into their building and see all 5 stations using the same building sharing the same coffee mess and restrooms. In most markets, NPR usually has 1 outlet. I hate to see this turn into an anti-NPR forum, but the fact is, SOMEONE needs to blow the whistle when we have a few giant corporations who OWN our FM dial. I don't even listen to NPR, and could care less about their motive. The fact remains the bandwidth that Ch 6 occupies could furnish 6 digital TV channels or 180 HD Radio channels. Frankin radio is just a massive waste of bandwidth by anyone's standards taking radio or television opportunities away from their local community. Forget NPR, look at this objectively and specifically look at who owns your FM dial now! I would love to see that channel used by many local broadcasters. The FCC should create subsidies for those who want to start LP stations to offset the cost of digital transmitters. I.E. give the bandwidth back to the people!
Big corporations have taken over our public airwaves so we need to maximize what's left so that it serves more individual owners. Frankin is simply a waseful use of frequency resources that could be used to provide MORE local opportunities. Here's a good book that describes how it used to be when stations were owned by average joe's. I grew up watching this station (WWLP) so it was interesting to learn about the struggles one man had with starting up his own UHF station back in the 50's before most people even knew what UHF was. For example, when the tower light gave out, he'd have to climb the stick in the middle of a snow storm to replace it himself! It's a facinating read named; "How We Survived in UHF Television" which showed a community based station that really served the community, unlike today when corporations elsewhere control what we hear. The book also describes a female pioneer (later his wife) who actually ran the station while he did the FCC and engineering work. She was one of the first women in broadcasting back then. I'm not against the individual ownership of Frankin FM. I'm simply against the poor use of our Ch 6 bandwidth when it could better used to allow MORE local people to enter the field of radio.
@@RickPaquin FrankenFM is indeed a waste of bandwidth when you consider it uses a NTSC TV channel, but once they're established there, this is like the condemnation battles over a small but respected business occupying a choice piece of real estate. It may be inefficient compared to what you could *imagine* there, but someone's already there and has an audience. And although NPR in most "markets" might have only a single outlet, at most locations you can tune in a profusion of NPR affiliates, frequently simulcasting, without difficulty. They really do seem to be striving for hegemony over the 88-92 band. While it's true that a lot of commercial stations in a given area are co-owned, at least they usually provide a semblance of varied programming between one station and another, rather than simulcasting or programming on a 1-hour delay between them.
@Erin Roberts I can hear a grand total of three in my area, but that doesn't count the three classical stations I get from NPR, which increases to four when one of my locals is off the air. So altogether, I can probably hear 6-7 at any given time. Just one of these is truly my local NPR. Yeah, 87.7 is unique in being a TV station and an FM station.
@@goodmaro It's not a waste of bandwidth, since they are required to put out a video signal as well. They can't just run the 87.75 FM frequency solely.
WMRE-LP is extremely popular in Chicago. I am unable to pick it up because I don’t have a 6 foot Low VHF element on my antenna setup. Hope it moves to a digital sub channel once the FCC pulls the plug on the Frankenstein FM.
@@PC4USE1 Weigel removes 23.3 for now, as it was a repeat of 23.1. 23.1 is the HD channel of MeTV, while WCIU 26.3 (which Weigel advertises) is the SD version of MeTV. Providing MeTV FM on either of their 3 TV stations wouldn't even need a megabyte of bandwidth.
Under the present allocation reqs, if analog channel 6 is operating 87.9 and 88.1 are not available. It's really time to open VHF TV, especially VHF low, to serve more people than broadcast television does. The packages MeTV on the Radio and Zoomer Radio are well executed and ingeniously micro-targeted to the demos still using radio outside a car. Especially condidering MeTV's success in Chicago and Boston, getting a pickup onto one of the 15 SportsTalk FMs in your market won't be an issue.
This is a repeat performance from NPR. During the last ten years, NPR has filed arguments with the FCC claiming that low-power FM allocations all across the FM spectrum would interfere with certain NPR stations around the country because of spurious or otherwise damaging radiation. This appears to be Goliath using its legal department to spew out a continuous battle against these small, otherwise non-threatening stations. Most of these tiny stations air what was once known as "block programming," typically with something such as neighborhood news one hour, a Polka music show another hour, and a local political discussion another hour. They are usually manned by volunteers who want to make a difference in their community. By the time the legal wranglings are over with, the station has been relegated to a frequency on the dial and geographic location where very few listeners can hear the signal or travel very far listening in a vehicle. An example is the 7 watt WRFN at 107.1 near Nashville, Tennessee. It has a main coverage lobe of about five miles. That's hardly near any NPR facility geographically or on the FM dial spectrum. However, NPR fought the allocation for this small station. As an update to this conundrum, I would like to point out that for the first time ever, NPR has stated on their 2020 financials that Podcasting sponsorships have surpassed their on-air radio revenues. This came from a report here: rainnews.com/podcast-revenue-surpasses-radio/ So what is the real argument? I'd say that NPR just wants to block any possible broadcast signal that threatens their audience count as reported in monthly Neilsen ratings. The 87.7 FM signals are few and far between around the country, however the FCC needs to count them as vital service to their communities and allow them to be converted to licenses of LP FM analog stations. Anyone residing within the listening area of these stations should write to the FCC in Washington and let their voice be heard by mentioning the local station. After all, the mission of the FCC is to allow TV and radio stations to serve the "public interest, convenience and necessity."
Im not from the states but looking up what NPR is my first impression maybe I got this wrong but it sounds like it could be used as an outlet for govt propaganda.
This sucks, when I was a kid in the 80s, my Uncle needed a TV to sleep. When on road trips, he used 87.7 on the radio for the TV audio when he would sleep. Also, NPR sold out years ago, they skew too much to one side politically these days. I stopped listening to them.
I usually save his videos for a day when I don't have much going on with how long they are, but I love watching his content, and when he goes off on a riff, I honestly don't know how he stands it out there in comifornia!!
I remember when I was young picking up radio on channel 6 on the old CRT with a gold old knob channel dialer. As a child I was thinking this is an issue but now I know better. Fun fact also when walkman players was a thing I owned one that had zero radio functionality but I was living close enough to our broadcasting tower in Montreal, QC, Canada. Once I did a bike ride to the broadcasting antenna at the top of Mont-Royal, I was literally under it like 20 feet away from the base, that's how close it was fenced in. I started picking up radio station over my tape that was actually on play mode, that thing freaking spooked me, like how strong is the signal there to overcome my tape on a device that is not even designed for radio. Blew my mind!!!
Also on 1994 Sony Trinitron NTSC CRT TV and it’s aftermarket Sony TV remote with Fine tuning button, so you can fine tune from 87.75 up to 93.25 MHz sound from FM radio.
Since there are NO AVAILABLE new licenses for radio stations in the U.S., and NPR has ceased all diversity in programming, niche audiences will have ZERO OPTIONS!
Yeah, I'm not too happy with PBS either. They took down my local over the air station WXEL which includes WPBT. All Port St. Lucie, FL local stations are south where WXEL's tower used to be but now they took down their tower and they expect us to get our signal from a north tower when all other local stations are south! So, for that reason, I can't get PBS over the air and I'm sure most people in my city can't get it either!
We are KNNN-LP in Redding CA on 87.7 FM... don't know how you missed us in your list...JK! :) We do provide a unique on-air programming for our market filling a gap between the NPR audience and the traditional FM's. If we were such a threat it would be iHeart coming after us , not NPR.
i think to qualify as harmful interference it would have to cause a medical device like a pacemaker to malfunction (like the mag safe and wireless chargers for the newer iphones does to pacemakers) or completely drown out emergency dispatchers to where a crime can happen without being reportable.
Tyler -- At the 8:30 mark you say something to the effect that NPR doesn't want listeners to go "a little bit left on the dial." In the United States, if you are listening to NPR you have gone as far left as you can on the dial Comrade.
I tried the small wireless fm transmitter in cars about 10 years ago I think that 87.7 was one of those channels this device would work on. The devices just sucked. I tried helping someone with his several years ago. They still sucked. And as far as PBS, I quit listening to them when Car Talk finally went out of reruns. Rest In Peace Tom, I think Ray is still kicking. Best radio show ever……….
Make no Mistake, the NAB and the large broadcasting companies do not want to see the three frequencies below 88 MHZ activated. These channels could be used for Low Power FM/community access radio.
I used to work at a college NPR affiliate, and I had a very brief discussion with the general manager and engineer about why plans of expanding coverage (I live 30 miles away from the college and could not receive their signal at my house) kept falling through. Long of the short, I was told that stations below 92MHz are power-limited and height-limited in order to protect TV channel 6, and as a result are coverage-limited. I could see potentially with all TV channels being completely digital, the FCC might consider lifting restrictions on ERP and HAAT for all the non-commercial affiliates below 92MHz, which would give them greater coverage. That's probably the real reason for NPR's vested interest in fighting the LPTV stations.
LPTV operators on Channel 6 are allowed to put Digital FM out in the marketplace, however they can't get the frequency to match up like the analog 87.75 did.
The franken radio really do not have a spectrum allocation. Your complaint is with the FCC and not a licensed radio service like NPR. I have a radio license and it is my experience that if you do not defend your license then your spectrum (band ) disappears. The FCC makes the call and NPR is part of the public providing testimony; like you could officially rather than back handed.
On VHF channel 6 using Multisystem PAL NTSC TV, Video frequency set to 83.25 MHz, System NTSC-M for 87.75 MHz, PAL-B/G for 88.75 MHz, 89.25 MHz for PAL-I and 89.75 MHz for PAL-D/K sound carrier. TV is on channel 6 but the sound frequency is 89.9 FM but automatic tune between 2 MHz. Using analog Cable TV here in the Philippines.
Your local drive-in theater likely should not be using either one of those frequencies really. 87.7 is technically channel 6 and 88.7 could belong to a local radio station.
I personally like the idea, we could use more space. There are some quirks I should point out: Were this band to open, we would likely need to institute a Clear-channel plan for each frequency Thanks to consistent F2 and E-skip hops on the summer. However, adding 20 mhz of space will help to uncrowd the current band. We actually used this band before, see "Apex band (42 mhz)".
@@zgsrandomnesshub7561 Call it the Green band since it will cut power use. We can also get the old 1940's radios to play on the band that doesn't work today.
Channel 6 in Philadelphia was the home of the original Bandstand, WHICH in 1957 became American Bandstand. I listened everyday on 87.7 on our FM radio. It sounded so much better than WIBG 990 on AM.
I forgot to add that I also discovered, while DXing on the Philadelphia FM band, that WIBG simulcasted its AM programming on 94.1 then known as WIBG FM which would become WYSP when Storer Broadcasting, then the owners of WIBG sold the FM frequency to Infinity Broadcasting. Now 94.1 is Sports Radio WIP and there are zero independently owned radio stations in Philadelphia. The days of great radio programming in Philadelphia are gone.
my wife sometimes listens to wnyz 87.7 here in new york city. it's korean language and serves the metro area korean community quite well. i had no idea that it was a tv station! it comes in clearly and does not interfere with the nearby npr station wbgo. it would be a shame to lose it.
Do they use the audience commentary text scroll that the Indo-Caribbean service that leased it on weekends called the Shout Box? A bit wasteful that it took input via the WWW but output on a TV screen; still not a bad way to use snowy low-power video transmission.
NPR might be trying to dump a bunch of money into the FCC to get 87.7 put on the allowed use spectrum for radio use and then buy up all those frequencies. It's all about money. Any random issue like this that comes up is always about money.
True story: In the early 1970s at night, my large portable, set at around 92.7, could receive the audio of WGN-TV Ch. 9 Chicago. My family lived on the top floor of a two-flat that was about three-four miles from 2501 W. Bradley Place, the home of WGN-Television. It came in handy when the Blackhawks or Cubs were on during my bath times. Away hockey games were not broadcast on radio.
@@AntennaMan The LMS shows that KNNN-LP has a construction permit for flash cutting to digital operation on TV Channel 6; 3 kW ERP at 39.1 m AGL/1015 m AMSL. Not too shabby, but digital operation does not allow an analog aural carrier, on any frequency. Some Franken FMs have asked FCC for special permission to keep an analog aural carrier with frequency modulation in addition to the digital ATSC signal, calling it an "ancillary service" which the FCC rules do indeed allow, but I believe this means an ancillary service imbedded in the ATSC bit stream, not a completely distinct FM analog signal at 87.7 MHz. But, since the 7-13-2021 analog shutoff deadline is fast approaching, time will soon tell. So far no last minute pardon from the FCC as far as I am aware.
YUP! All the way to the Global Elite running the show on every channel, and into everyone's minds, on both "sides", aware or not. Dividing. Conquering.
I can NOT believe NPR’s massive hypocrisy. Especially considering NPR leans slightly left, they should want these unique stations serving underserved communities. But of course, money beats soul every time.
As much as I love the Idea of Public Broadcasting, NPR is really putting their heads up their asses here, pardon my crude language. I do like how you show both sides of the issues here.
Just wanted to point out that is actually a neat radio you featured at the beginning. @TVRadio1972 has it, and reviewed it. Anyways, it is sad to lose an important **local** element to television/FM
I remember my mother listening to our local ABC station on the radio while cooking dinner, but didn't realize they were still around, given the shift to digital formats. Gonna have to dig out an old radio, to see if I can still pick it up.
Many NPR stations give exposure to local music during the evening hours and is sometimes very niche. That may be the public service they’re referring to.
Not to defend NPR in any way, but they do broadcast some local college radio programs every once in awhile. Perhaps they are getting complaints from them that 87.7 is interfering. You know how colleges are now days...
As a Chicagoan, I don't see what NPR could have against MeTV 87.7, which plays nothing but classic pop songs no respectable Prairie Home Companion NPR station would touch. And yes, I listen to both.
I think they're convinced these Franken FMs are the only thing stopping the FM band from expanding - which they aren't. Full powered TV stations still use low VHF channel 6.
@@AntennaMan There are no "full-powered" TV stations anywhere in the U.S. VHF-Lo? Max ERP was 100KW Visual, VHF-Hi was 316 KW for Visual, and UHF was 5000KW fir Visual, RF is like a pipe. It doesn't care what you shove through it. When you chop the power, you cut the coverage. Simple as that.
@@AntennaMan Per the FCC, the WPVI ERP is only 30 KW. That's less than 1/4 the power from their old 100KW ERP when you're computing the difference in dB. As for WRGB, they're running 30.2 KW ERP. Roughly the same power cut, +/3 a few fractions of a dB. They also require three UHF translators to fill-in lost primary coverage areas. Including one in Schenectady itself to comply with the FCC rule requiring reception within the city of license. As for WKBS-TV, again 3.1 KW is an even longer way from 100KW. Yes, it's true that VHF-lo analog stations only hit 100 KW based on the density of the video signal being at peak white, 100 IRE units. But, I doubt they rarely went as low as 30KW. I get the feeling that the FCC used theoretical coverage for DTV stations instead of real world. The FCC lost credibility with me on TV when they had to freeze TV station construction for five years because TV signals weren't behaving the way the FCC said they were supposed to. Thus, there were nightmares built like: Channel 4 in New York and Washington, but also in Lancaster, PA; Channel 7 in D.C. and New York, but also in Wilmington, Delaware; And, let's go back to channel 4, with stations in Columbus, Oho and Detroit, but also in Cleveland! The FCC's technical competency continued into the ATSC era by allocating channel 9 as the "transition channel" to one of the Detroit stations, ignoring that south of the border, CBET was operating on channel 9 from Windsor, Ontario. I hope ATSC 3.0 corrects most of the shortcomings of ATSC 1.0. Especially the reduced coverage.
@@johnpinckney4979 FYI: In analog NTSC, 100kW was not peak white, rather infrablack (the sync bar/flyback retrace, was 100kW). I forgot the power of black level, suffice to say it was probably near 90kW.
There is an exception for analog LPTV stations to stay on the air in analog until the end of 2021 if they claim financial or technical hardship is preventing them from meeting the July deadline. WNYZ-LP in the NYC area has already filed such a claim asking to remain transmitting in analog until the end of the year. And NPR may be referring to the FCC spacing requirements preventing FM radio stations from transmitting on 87.9 or 88.1 MHz anywhere close to a TV station on channel 6. If the FrankenFMs went away, there could be new radio stations licensed on these frequencies, or existing stations on those frequencies could increase their power. However, that would only really happen on a national scale if all TV stations abandoned use of channel 6, not just the FrankenFMs.
No radio station could license on 87.9 as that is Ch6's allotted space (82-88Mhz). With new Full Service Emmission Masks and harmonic filters Channel 6's will not interfere with 88.1Mhz whether they are Franken FM's or not.
I worked for an NPR affiliate for 15 years and can vouch for the Channel 6 issue. The 88.1 through 91.9 subband is reserved for non-commercial educational stations and has been for many many years predating NPR affiliated stations. Channel 6 TV in any form makes it difficult or impossible to license the lower channels in the subband due to interference issues to and from the TV stations.If you listen to the subband in most areas, you'll find some college stations, some NPR formatted (news and music) stations and a lot of channels used by religious stations. The public radio translators were an attempt to have NPR programming available in the majority of the country. Please leave the politics of whether you think their national news coverage is slanted and just consider that all non-comms there have the same issues attempting to use the lowest channels. If they do get licensed, often its not at a class B power level. If you want to listen to TV audio, perhaps getting some manufacturers like Antenna man's sponsor to build radios that can pickup the audio from all TV stations like were available in the analog era.
Nah They make Full Service Emission Masks with tight shoulders for Ch6 Franken FM's that cause no interference at all. In fact the spatial difference of FM6 is about 1.5x further away from the lowest FM frequency than the FM frequencies are from each other. This is just a convenient argument NPR puts out there to preserve their being the lowest place on the FM dial. NPR made it political when they tried to throw the scent off. The engineering studies, field studies, and real life use does not support this harmful interference argument. Jampro is one of the biggest manufacturers of filters and antennas and they have mitigated all these problems with their combiners for Ch6/FM6
There is also an 87.7 FM station (analog channel 6) in my area. It is currently WEYS-LP, an affiliate of Spanish religious station called Almavision. Before then, it simulcasted analog full-power WTVJ (NBC) before switcing to digital on June 12th, 2009. Now that frequency may go off the air as well coming July 13th.
some of the downsides to franken fms is the audio is quieter than every other station on the fm radio dial and most radios don't allow you to tune into the exact tv channel 6 audio frequency permanently making the signal weaker and less clearer than what it should be. also its kind of unfair to other broadcasters in the same or not so distant area since most radios can only pick up channel 6 audio meaning only 1 station can broadcast on both tv and radio within a certain area. some also point out that some stations broadcast a single frame 24/7 and really only operate as radio stations as wasting space since tv stations are equivalent to 30 fm radio channels and 600 am radio channels. the major upside is that broadcasters can operate on both tv and radio without using up extra space for a separate fm radio transmitter on a different frequency. personally i like the idea of franken fms and will miss them like every other analog tv station but understand the anger people have about the stations really only acting as radio stations that i mentioned above.
Sad to see something unique go that was useful to some in areas where there was a channel 6. I don't know if I'd say NPR is as respected as they used to be. They seem to be more biased than in the past. I do see their point about that part of the FM band being for non commercial but there should be some room to find a compromise.
WMRE-LP in Chicago has a FCC CP to convert from low power analog to low power digital and maybe converted sometime prior to the July 13 cutoff date. I’m thinking it will be on RF channel 6 but instead of analog it will be digital which means I will probably have to switch to a channel master masterpiece model to pick it up.
Hopefully Weigel broadcasting and these other stations can fight this. I would contribute to my local NPR station but maybe I need to withhold from them now trying to pull a stunt like this. I live in Milwaukee but off the lake shore and can still pick up 87.7 here at times and Love MeTv radio.
The 87.7/Channel 6 station went off the air last year from the radio side and became a digital TV station. It started on radio as "Cleveland's Sound," an alternative station, before starting a long run as a Spanish music station as "La Mega." The group behind "La Mega" moved to online only and Channel 6 (WLFM) is now a shopping or jewelry station.
Our local TV station was on ch6 on the cable system and my dad used to have a 75 to 300 Ohm balun on the old console stereo in order to listen to the audio. It would be neat for the big cable operators to set aside that channel for analog audio service of some kind.
NPR has always been the nemesis of independent and low power radio. In 1978 they pushed and lobbied for harsher regulations against low power stations, demanding them to be "more professional" and "above 100 watts" in order to drive competition out of business. Pirate Radio USA covers this pretty well.
By maintaining the equipment, the transmitters would be able to be used in an emergency situation that could be received by multiple type of equipment without different transmitters.
Tyler NPR and the NAB worked like crazy to put a kibosh on low port community based FM stations they loaded the band with so called translators licensed to a church in New Jersey. look it up
unfortunately here in canada there is no hope for franken fms because licenses for new tv transmitters broadcasting in analog stopped being issued in january 2007 which means the regulators in canada have had their minds made up for quite some time on analog tv
I had been using 87.7 for my home light show (synchronized to music,) and found out that new radios in cars do not have it anymore. They only go down to 87.9 (which here is not usable, because it's adjacent to another station.)
I had no idea there was a low-powered TV station in the DC market until I setup the 2Max at my friend's apartment. He was using a small Mohu leaf that only picked up 14 out of the 68 stations in the DC and Baltimore markets although he is renting the basement floor of a house. I hope the stations are able to remain on the air as there is a large latino community here that benefits from La Nueva's programming.
In the Phippines, we also have 87.5 FM there. DWFO in Manila as FM1 (Government owned station and plays some Hit Musics), and DXFO 87.9 in Davao City as FM1. 87.5 also used for local government station in Davao City. Other Channel 6 stations including GMA channel 6 in Iloilo and IBC channel 6 in Baguio City.
Here in Orlando we had WKMG Channel 6. Back in the 1980's and early 1990's I was a delivery driver. EVERY other driver I knew listened to "Star Trek The Next Generation" at 4pm. It was like a radio drama. If you had ever seen the show you could picture the scenes in your head just by the sounds. They went off of 87.7 when all of the stations here converted to digital. I made sure to be listening at midnight when they did their final sign off. Very sad. I was unaware that any stations were still operating analog on 87.7
I actually know of a radio station that's at 88.3 FM and it's called wzrd in chicago. It's one of those funky strange freeform college radio stations. I like the 877 MeTV because it's on the way down and people will stop at 88.3 fm. They hear some funky programming when they're tuning in or tuning out of 87.7 fm. And NPR is just being stupid right now. I thought it was going to be one of those big cell phone companies or something. But NPR they're just being a bunch of big dumb bullies.
It was much easier and cheaper for colleges and etc. to receive license for LPTV then the outrages FM Broadcast license. An FM license is ridiculously expensive and the content on the radio dial now is redundant -> enter pirate radio.
I didn't know it explicitly, but I've always noted that the stations at the "bottom" of the dial always tend to be the ones that are broadcasting oldies, classical, religious or college stations. I thought it was a power issue (ie, the lower stations are limited in their transmitting power) but glad to see there is a technical reason!
@@mikehemeon2473 Channel 201 (since 1-200 had already been allocated from 88.1 to 107.9 when this extra channel was added), but I wouldn't've called it a waste of bandwidth at the time. It's no more a waste than the FrankenFMs are.
What about 89.7 in my area I noticed a lot of people use this frequency for things like running the audio for Christmas light displays in front of their houses. These are people who use very low powered FM transmitters that only transmit out as far as 200 ft. I'm not sure if 89.7 is reserved for that purpose but if not I feel that the FCC should reserve a small portion of the FM band solely for these very low powered micro stations I did notice a few of them that pop up in my area in different parts of town every now and then and like I say it's usually someone transmitting from their house.
If a local frequency is empty, then people are allowed to broadcast "Part 15" devices. In my town, someone used 107.7 for their lights display last year which could be heard for about a mile in any direction for well over a month. The most common Part 15er is actually someone transmitting to their car. Also, I love that idea of a micro-FM band. I hear New Zealand has something like this.
@@zgsrandomnesshub7561 I do like that part 15 allows us to broadcast via micro transmitters. Here I love there are a few open frequencies that can be used the only reason why I feel that the FCC should reserve a portion for a microbend is because in some areas mostly larger cities or metropolitan areas they may not be any available frequencies to use. The one thing about these micro stations is they cannot broadcast over another station. That's very interesting that you say someone's Christmas audio could be heard for one mile Park 15 only allows about 200 ft at the most. I have yet to set up a Christmas light show in my house but I do use a microtransmitter for an in-house radio station I have several radios in each room and I can even transmit out into my yard. There's a local pawn shop that's a block away from me that also uses a micro transmitter set to a specific frequency inside the store and they use that for their own microstation Plus they run their own advertisements in the store if you're parked outside and you tune into that frequency you can hear the advertisements from your car but as soon as you drive off the parking lot you will lose the signal.
@@bluetech7753 The FCC rules are quite tight, in my example the owners probably were using more wattage than allowed. Most home-based transmitters already exceed the limit before hitting the shelves, and then the modifications hit. In my area, the truly open frequencies are few, so I would love to see some sort of expansion for just in-house Broadcasting.
There is a 4 MHz gap between channels 4 and 5. Does it now serve any purpose? Perhaps at the time of the transition, they should have had 5 and 6 shift frequencies to open up 4 MHz at the bottom of the FM band. Better yet, they should have just kept 2-6 analog.
72-76 MHz is used for various purposes, a few land-mobile channels, model aircraft control, diathermy equipment for pain relief. What should be done: Move all VHF lowband DTV stations to channels 2, 3, and 4, but allow them to use enough power to get over the noise floor of a typical home. Then allocate 76-88 MHz to FM radio, and mandate coverage of the new wider FM band in receivers.
@@1L6E6VHF Thank you for the clarification. I believe the way TV channels were first allocated, they had a one-channel gap between VHFs. Philadelphia had 3, 6, 10, and 12. New York City had 2, 4, 5, 7, 9, 11, and 13 They were able to have 4 and 5 because of the 72-76 MHz band.
@@josephklapatch9576 Channel 1 was reallocated in the very early days of television. Some other countries using a different television standard actually have Channel 1s.
@@nathandebartolo8330 I received a Channel 1 station in 1979. It was BBC1 from the Crystal Palace Transmitting Tower south of London. It wasn't the same frequencies as US Channel 1. US Channel 1 was 45.25v/49.75a, whereas BBC1 was 45.00p/41.50a. I only heard the sound, because BBC video was positive modulation, and American sets used negative video modulation. This can't happen again. My 1979 catch was at the peak of sunspot cycle 21, sunspot numbers subsided, and BBC closed their 405-line transmitters in the early eighties.
@@1L6E6VHF Gerald Pulice and others did get that during that sunspot peak, usually getting the complement of what you were seeing: video only. Since the UK's channel 1 was very close to the i.f. of standard NTSC receivers, if you bypassed the tuner you could get the 405-line BBC broadcast as a negative, i.e. black for white. I got to see some of it he recorded, although a trip to his QTH on Staten Island at the best time for such reception (F2 was a lot more predictable than sporadic E) came up dry that day.
My college radio station ran low-power on 90.7 but we would get complaints from the commercial 92.3 station if our transmitter was too hot or pointing too much in their direction, so I'm not at all surprised that this could be a problem in a very dense market like we have in New England, with a whole bunch of stations trying to operate on closely neighboring frequencies.
@@larrysoule1418 Certainly possible. I never got to see the transmitter room in person -- maybe just a couple photos once. It was on the roof of the next building and I think it was maintained mostly by an alumnus who worked for some of the local commercial stations. I think they were also deliberately trying to push the limits for more range?
This only means to me that if 87.7 fm local to me goes off the air due to NPR , the station is no longer in use and since I am the only pirate fm station currently set at hijacking 102.5 fm, I can switch to 87.7 fm which would be a clearer station since there is a station broadcasting at 102.3 fm one notch before my station.
The problem with Audio on channel 6 is that the FCC rules state that if there is a Channel 6 TV station in a market, 88.1 and 88.3 and in some cases 88.5 cannot be used in the same TV market. Removing the Channel 6 analog Franken broadcast makes room for many more radio stations than the few low power TV stations operating illegally as commercial radio stations that need to be shut down. The FCC gave out these low power TV stations that were inexpensive to set up but never were able to make money as TV stations. Commercial FM stations are selling for millions of dollars and the band is full in most large cities. Commercial Ethnic broadcasters need some relief from the FCC but Franken FMs are not an efficient way to do it.
Three things. First, this is something that was supposed to happen years ago--complaining about it now is like the complaints from analog TV owners even after years of postponement of that conversion. Second, NPR is a membership organization rather than any kind of autonomous force. It wouldn't submit that petition unless actual member stations told it to. Third, it's just a petition, of the sort organizations file with the FCC all the time....the FCC can pay attention or not. But really the first thing is key--this isn't the first deadline, it's a long-postponed one that just demonstrated that government is incapable of making a perfectly legal plan and stick to it.
There were/are multiple business interests who stand to gain from getting rid of this RF loophole, but the biggest is government, through monopoly of information. The least amount of independent voices the better, as far as governments are concerned.
Antennas used to be antennas .. large, bulky and endless aluminum elements. Now, they are decorative plastic covered VHF dipoles or hidden UHF loops with a tiny amp .. we used to stack massive 24 element beams at 40 ft to reach 40 miles, now the advertisers claim that range from a TV top unit that looks like a minimalist bookend. ... great discussion, thanks for telling the truth.
When you said 88 to 92 Mhz is mostly for non-commercial stations...I had to laugh a little. Two NPR stations in my area air beyond that line-up...WNYC 93.9...which has two digital subchannels including their longstanding AM sister at 820 and classical outlet WQXR, which after years of being commercial on 96.3, went non-commercial at 105.9. Also out of Chicago is WFMT 98.7 and at 101.9 Detroit's WDET.
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@Southeastern777 U.S. public radio stations must raise $9 from supporters for every $1 that they receive in subsidy. NPR is not perfect, but it is the most fair and objective free news source that I'm aware of. Yes, they do ignore some perspectives, as do all modern news organizations, but they do a better job than most and infinitely better than some.
Public media is one of the *most* independent sources of information in multiple nations today. As they are non-profit and not /as/ influenced by corporate sponsors as some commercial news organizations, public media has somewhat more freedom to pursue controversial or unpopular stories than some organizations.
U.S. public radio and television has been losing revenue year after year for decades as fewer and fewer Americans want to support independent, grassroots-funded information and entertainment, but they are still doing their best and I love my public media stations more than any other.
Americans once supported these stations as they knew that democracy would die without objective news sources, but today many Americans don't want to listen to any information that challenges what they already believe to be true; many Americans today /want/ an echo chamber and are uncomfortable with debate.
Due to the loss of grassroots support, public media now relies upon large corporate donors more than ever and this indeed makes them less independent. However, that does *not* make them propaganda for some imaginary evil "government". The U.S. Government is *us*, not some evil organization bent on our destruction.
If you received 10% of your budget from the Corporation for Public Broadcasting based upon your contribution to the public good and adherence to CPB guidelines, would that make you feel obliged to promote propaganda for the CPB? The vast majority of NPR's budget comes from local stations and the corporate, foundational, and individual donors who support those stations.
For the past decade, funding for public media has been eliminated entirely in every single spending proposal introduced and then added back in during the compromise process. An overwhelming majority of Americans support that funding, but few understand that it represents only a small fraction of the budgets of public channels.
The real irony will be when funding for the Corporation for Public Broadcasting *is* finally ended for good, as the people that demonize public radio and television will *still* be claiming that NPR is a propaganda machine for the "gubment" even when they stop receiving taxpayer dollars completely.
When that happens, haters will invent brand new conspiracies for how "public" media is then controlled by the government. I'll guarantee that many will then claim that NPR is then receiving some sort of "secret" money as they *need* to have imagined enemies like NPR to maintain their political zeal. Without such enemies, how would anti-government politicians get us to contribute to their campaigns?
With that said, I do not know why NPR is trying to stop Franken FM stations from broadcasting, but they probably have /some/ legitimate claims as it would be a waste of their resources to engage in a pointless battle; it's not believable to imagine that NPR is just trying to destroy stations for no reason at all.
I'm not claiming that NPR is right in this case, however, as I simply don't know enough details. Perhaps they're wrong; that *still* doesn't make them evil propagandists.
A lot of people seem to think that NPR is an "ultra-liberal" news source, but what they fail to understand is that actual liberals think NPR is a *conservative* news source, as they constantly promote Wall Street, corporate profit, and GDP growth; NPR even has an hour-long daily business show discussing such things.
The main reason people think that news sources are liberal or conservative is because they, the *listeners*, are so far right or left that even the most moderate news agency in the world appears to be biased towards their opponents. The Taliban would consider OAN to be a left-wing propaganda cult.
Listeners and viewers always accuse the news sources of bias, but they never seem to consider their *own* bias in this equation. I assure you that ultra-environmentalists and left-wing socialists find NPR to be a sickening propaganda machine for corporate America; people just don't hear about this because they probably don't even *know* any left-wing extremists. Everyone thinks that *they* are moderate and well-balanced.
Yesterday morning, NPR did an hour story on the inventiveness of Jeff Bezos and how this made Amazon so successful. Do you think that ultra-liberals want to hear a "news" story praising Jeff Bezos or Amazon? No, they don't. They hate him and think his company is oppressive and monopolistic.
The News *is* often biased, but *we* are far more biased. The traditional News agencies haven't changed all that much in the past 20 years. *We've* changed a lot, however, and most of us refuse to listen to any information that we don't already agree with.
*We* are the problem.
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@@AntennaMan How good is the AM reception?
87.7 MeTV FM in Chicago is also not some small, ethnic station, but does provide very unique programming compared to any other stations… It often is in the top 10 for ratings, which is hard to do in such a large market
At one time, 87.7 had THREE TIMES the radio ratings as the legendary Chicago 50kW blowtorch WLS.
@@1L6E6VHF which I find is fascinating.
YES..just 2 stations on my radio pre-sets....87.7 and 105.9 for traffic.....
@@1L6E6VHF WLS is still on the air?
@@earlostrohs3543 WLS radio still exists. But it is now mostly conservative talk radio.
I've known about 87.7 since I was a kid. Growing up in Tulsa my Mom used to listen to KOTV Channel 6 on a portable radio to hear her soap operas when she did housework away from the TV. Her cousin was a radio newsman and told her about it. I heard Vin Scully's famous call of "The Catch" in 1982 on KAUZ Channel 6 in Wichita Falls over 87.7 when I had guard duty in the military. It has always definitively been a useful "extra feature" of the FM band.
Philadelphia's WPVI / 6-ABC used to be heard at 87.75MHz. ... 1:59 ;)
Many US radio stations appear to be in a death spiral. Buyouts by large corporations, with no interest in quality content, merely advertising revenues, don't help. Much easier to do an internet station, today.
Yeah, AM radio is already in the graveyard. FM should be good for another decade or two.
The Internet has much to do with that. People can find streaming radio stations more appealing to their tastes without ads running all the time. There's only so much Top 40 one can take. And things such as MP3 players really had an impact since one could easily play a customized list of music.
@@writerpatrick I live stream Me-TV FM out if Milwaukee. Great station!
I use to listen to WRGB CBS6 (The world's oldest TV Station from Schenectady, NY) on 87.7FM... Since they went digital, there is nothing on that 87.75MHz position anymore. It was kind of nice being able to hear the audio of the TV broadcast while driving around the Albany, NY area.
I may be Guadalupe radio TVs biggest promoter user. They are encouraging viewerd to go to Roku. NPR has two very powerful stations here in LA and Radio Guadalupe is extremely weak and would never work as digital.
Hey, I watch your channel all the time. Longtime subscriber
I don't even repair TVs/radios but I love your channel. I find it relaxing for some reason. Thanks for doing what you do.
HI SHANGO! I was just about to put your name down as a major " viewer" of Gtv. I watch it whenever you use/watch. I dont need an antenna that way! Big Fan of Shango!! Thanks for all the learning and laughs. You are one of the good guys.
Yep, its the only way you can test analog tuners on the equipment you work on.
I mean, technically he has a modulator and such... But I get what you're saying.
Personally, I just use the hackrf with hacktv or gnuradio to broadcast atsc/ntsc.. works beautifully.
NPR has been a near constant problem for LPFM and other non comms. They were one of the main lobbies in the initial removal of the class D FM license and attempting to prevent LPFM stations this time around. There news content may be great but as an organization they are ruthless when it comes to competition for sponsorship dollars by attempting to prevent competition from being on the air.
I consider NPR and MSM as AMERICAN radio and TV versions of TASS during the Soviet era.
The pirate radio movement became so powerful in the 1990s that the fcc had no choice but to throw them a bone.
"There (sic) news content may be great" - I'd say in your humble opinion.
Radio spectrum is extremely valuable real estate. npr is a 'nonprofit' but you can bet there is something in it for them, a whole lot of 'something'..
No one places this much effort or resources toward anything just for the heck of it. There is more to this npr story than meets the eye..
NPR does bill stations every month not too differently than how cable companies work. They're almost like Goodwill, being nonprofit for the fashion. Only, goodwill hasn't gone to court for overcharging the customers for years.
Funny how so many of these nonprofit organizations
who pay their employees next to nothing or just have them volunteer for free
have people at the helm that rake in a quarter million dollars a year.
@@valvenator A quarter of a million? Try eight times that for Goodwill alone. Just another money racket that has everyone fooled.
You can bet that NPR has their eyes on that channel in a lot of places and they’re looking to get a hook in it. Even if they have to tear down any competition to get it.
@@r.heddins5276 Darn straight.. I smell a den of rats..
Franken FM stations are very important for both TV and Radio for numerous purposes such as Preserving the technology's history, having an analog station for video and audio during emergency situations since this will work on pretty much any TV or Radio, and of course these stations often provide content that isn't necessarily available on other stations (both TV and Radio). In my opinion Channel 6 should have been a dedicated FM/Analog TV station everywhere and channels that broadcast on that channel digitally should have went somewhere else like most channels do.
If I remember right, WRGB (CBS 6 in Albany) had the same idea of running a vertically polarized analog/FM audio feed on 87.7 MHz right next to their digital feed on the rest of VHF channel 6 and went to the FCC with the proposal. The hope was that it would be like a digital wrapper around an analog core, similar to HD Radio's "In-Band On Channel" technology that analog FM stations use to run digital subchannels on their sidebands. They got permission to try it out with an experimental Special Temporary Authority, but... the FM feed on 87.75 caused serious interference issues to the digital TV feed and they had to stop. Later on, they tried running the FM feed on 87.9 MHz and that actually DID work, but... they weren't licensed for broadcasts on that, and the FCC said they had to cease, which they did. WITI-TV (Fox 6 in Milwaukee) saw what happened with WRGB's experiments, and decided to rent out a subchannel on WMIL-FM 106.1 (HD-3) for an audio simulcast in the area for a few years. WPVI (6abc in Philadelphia) also considered renting an HD Radio subchannel from an FM broadcaster but was concerned about potential broadcast rights/copyright issues from doing such a thing. It's a shame, too, since Channel 6 broadcasters in hurricane-prone areas were able to use this fact to their advantage: "stay tuned for up-to-date coverage on Channel 6 and 87.7 FM!". I personally think letting former VHF 6 television operators to run their analog FM feed on 87.9 should be allowed, to retain this type reception ability.
I've been saying for a long time that the FCC should re-locate stations on VHF 5 and 6 and expand the FM band down to 76 MHz (where it starts in Japan). Such a move would add 12 MHz to the FM band and would significantly help with the horrible overcrowding on the FM band that we see today. So far, only two FM stations even operate on 87.9 FM (both LPFM stations in California)... anyone else operating on that frequency is almost certainly a pirate broadcaster. As for MeTV FM in Chicago... it's actually outperforming both powerhouse/legendary Chicago broadcasters WLS-FM 94.7 and WGN-AM 720 in the ratings, which I find absolutely hilarious!
As a kid, I used to love listening to CIII-TV 6 from Paris, Ontario in the car as my family and I traveled to visit other family members in Toronto. We'd tune either the car stereo or a battery-powered one and listen to shows like The Simpsons that way.... those were fun times...
When you hear the list of 'Foundational' support for NPR, and recognize who/what those foundations are, you'll begin to understand what NPR has morphed into.
Propaganda.
Feels like someone up in NPR has a bug up their butt. I should suggest a story idea to them on these many local stations. Would be interesting.
@Southeastern777 Fox News Australian propaganda machine and OANN and Newsmax propaganda machines are melting your brains.
@Southeastern777 I hope you don't read Breitbart and RT (Russia Today) content, either.
@Southeastern777 I agree with you 100 percent. I won't be listening to NPR classical music no more. I have data on my phone and don't need their garbage anymore. The government should remove funding from NPR and such like!
@@SayAhh and you sir, are being tactfully divided away from your fellow country man, as so is Southeastern777 from those like yourself. Pawns in an Agenda game. Thanks to this unfortunate fact. OUR future...GAME OVER!
@@THEMADPROFdj Nothing can be done. Maga is aligned with Trump. McConnell will block and obstruct everything. Romney and Cheney are too liberal for the GOP, apparently, and Bernie and Warren will never get a shot due to corporate lobbyists. But I have to at the very minimum vote for the one party that at least fully (at least publicly) acknowledge the existence of climate change and the SARS-CoV-2 virus before either one kills us all, in which case it doesn't matter who is dividing and conquering us. (Wall Street.)
I used to listen to the WPVI news on channel 6 when I was driving through Philadelphia.
Was actually, at least at one point, whatever was on tv( ch 6 phila) was on the radio. Audio only obviously but yeah true.
Always listened on the way to work
In Pocatello, Idaho we had a KPVI on channel 6. I didn't know there was a WPVI back east. Wow!
Hey me also. I actually forgot all about this till just now in 2021. You gave me a flashback to remembering TV channels 17, 29 and 48 and watching Japanese animation like Speed Racer, Tobor the 8th man and Wee Willy Webber and Captain Noah.
I used to be able to do the same thing on the other side of the state in Johnstown. WJAC was also on channel 6, and could be picked up fairly clearly in the car on 87.7 FM for at least 15 miles in any direction from Johnstown, or if you're on top of one of the many mountains surrounding that area.
You know what’s ironic there is no channel 6 radio station in my area but I can hear my local NPR on the channel 6
Yeah It's ironic NPR is against Franken FM Radio even though they have KPBS radio on radio. Pretty pathetic.
You're likely listening to an NPR station on 88.1 or 88.3.
@@1L6E6VHF not necessarily true, I used to listen to WQED FM 89.3 on my TV when I was a teen.
I did not have an FM radio at that time only AM. TV tuners were analog and wide band you can turn the fine tuning knob and pick up FM radio. I loved Classical music for the most part. Opera was not my favorites but piano and symphonies were. My mom didn't like the idea because she thought I may ruin my portable tv. I guess I could have just turned the brightness to dark. Well it's true you can listen to some FM on a analog tv.
I will boycott NPR and listen to the classical music on my phone since now I have data. There are other reasons for me to not listen to NPR as well.
From the content I’ve seen on npr, they push the radical left content. From what I’ve seen there’s no conservative content in their broadcasts. Their intent is probably to silence any conservative content on any stations broadcasting in contrast to their warped view. This might also include opposition to evangelical Christians that might use it in third world countries along with communist China who don’t want to allow the gospel of Jesus Christ to be spread and heard. The irony is that except for the United States there are probably very few digital transmitters in the rest of the world. Npr probably gets government funding in some form or other. The United States has always been a nation God established for Christians to be governed by Christians. And yet the democratic satanic left is trying to destroy what God established. I think they picked the wrong God to fight against.🪃🙌
It was great when WPVI was on 87.7. You could go pick up a pizza without having to miss any of Jeopardy.
That's what I used to do when I would visit my buddy in Johnstown. WJAC also broadcast on channel 6 .If it was late at night and I couldn't sleep, and I didn't want to piss him off by turning on the TV, I would just put on my headphones and turn my Walkman to 87.7 and listen to Jay Leno. 😂
87.7 in my area (ABC channel 6) went dark on Digital Doomsday 2009 and never returned. Nowadays, there isn’t a whole lot worth watching on TV, or even cable for that matter, sadly.
Very interesting story. I had no idea this was an issue.
The 87.7 station in my area already went off the air back in February. They are supposedly transitioning to ATSC 3.0
ATSC 3.0 , only UHF and VHF-Hi. Same frequency as DVB-T, DVB-T2, and DTMB on UHF channels 14 - 53. UHF channel 14 uses 473 MHz for ATSC 3.0, DVB-T/T2 and DTMB, 473.143 MHz for ISDB-T also on Japan UHF channel 13 and 470.31 MHz for ATSC.
I long for the old days. We in Schenectady and the surrounding region used to be able to receive our local channel 6 (WRGB, Schenectady NY) on 87.7 FM. It was a comfort for many who had long commutes from work in the late afternoon and evening, as we could listen to the news on the radio. But then again, that was when the "news" was "news"... and when we had lives that were a standard of normal.
I think you just explained a situation that has always puzzled me. I live in North GA about 135 miles from Birmingham, AL and 45 Miles from Chattanooga. Back in the mid 90's while tuned to 88.1, Chattanooga I would occasionally receive audio from a Birmingham, Al TV station. This has always puzzled me until now.
On a side note, A couple of years ago, while tuned to 95.5 FM my radio skipped in and out picking up 95.5 "Big Dog FM" in North Dakota. That's about 1,700 miles by line of sight.
I think it's called "E-skip". If the weather and atmospheric conditions are just right, you can pick up radio and television stations from hundreds of miles away. I've picked up Detroit, Flint, and Fort Wayne radio and TV stations in Northwestern Pennsylvania many times during these events. A couple of times, the broadcast signals from the Flint TV stations (12 and 66) would even be strong enough to override those of the local Erie stations on the same frequencies.
I have 2 NPR affiliates in my market. I appreciate what they do but I don’t get why they feel the need to go after the Franken FMs. Like you say, the franken FM stations often cater to niche markets that might not have their own stations otherwise. I wasn’t sure about 87.7 being an actual FM registrable station but as you clarified that it isn’t it doesn’t really make sense why anyone other than the FCC would care about it one way or the other
You may want to look at the other stations on your dial and who owns them. If it's like this area you'll find 1 major company owns 5 or more stations on the FM dial. In fact, you can walk into their building and see all 5 stations using the same building sharing the same coffee mess and restrooms. In most markets, NPR usually has 1 outlet. I hate to see this turn into an anti-NPR forum, but the fact is, SOMEONE needs to blow the whistle when we have a few giant corporations who OWN our FM dial. I don't even listen to NPR, and could care less about their motive. The fact remains the bandwidth that Ch 6 occupies could furnish 6 digital TV channels or 180 HD Radio channels. Frankin radio is just a massive waste of bandwidth by anyone's standards taking radio or television opportunities away from their local community. Forget NPR, look at this objectively and specifically look at who owns your FM dial now! I would love to see that channel used by many local broadcasters. The FCC should create subsidies for those who want to start LP stations to offset the cost of digital transmitters. I.E. give the bandwidth back to the people!
Big corporations have taken over our public airwaves so we need to maximize what's left so that it serves more individual owners. Frankin is simply a waseful use of frequency resources that could be used to provide MORE local opportunities.
Here's a good book that describes how it used to be when stations were owned by average joe's. I grew up watching this station (WWLP) so it was interesting to learn about the struggles one man had with starting up his own UHF station back in the 50's before most people even knew what UHF was. For example, when the tower light gave out, he'd have to climb the stick in the middle of a snow storm to replace it himself! It's a facinating read named; "How We Survived in UHF Television" which showed a community based station that really served the community, unlike today when corporations elsewhere control what we hear. The book also describes a female pioneer (later his wife) who actually ran the station while he did the FCC and engineering work. She was one of the first women in broadcasting back then.
I'm not against the individual ownership of Frankin FM. I'm simply against the poor use of our Ch 6 bandwidth when it could better used to allow MORE local people to enter the field of radio.
@@RickPaquin FrankenFM is indeed a waste of bandwidth when you consider it uses a NTSC TV channel, but once they're established there, this is like the condemnation battles over a small but respected business occupying a choice piece of real estate. It may be inefficient compared to what you could *imagine* there, but someone's already there and has an audience.
And although NPR in most "markets" might have only a single outlet, at most locations you can tune in a profusion of NPR affiliates, frequently simulcasting, without difficulty. They really do seem to be striving for hegemony over the 88-92 band.
While it's true that a lot of commercial stations in a given area are co-owned, at least they usually provide a semblance of varied programming between one station and another, rather than simulcasting or programming on a 1-hour delay between them.
@Erin Roberts I can hear a grand total of three in my area, but that doesn't count the three classical stations I get from NPR, which increases to four when one of my locals is off the air. So altogether, I can probably hear 6-7 at any given time. Just one of these is truly my local NPR. Yeah, 87.7 is unique in being a TV station and an FM station.
@@goodmaro It's not a waste of bandwidth, since they are required to put out a video signal as well. They can't just run the 87.75 FM frequency solely.
WMRE-LP is extremely popular in Chicago. I am unable to pick it up because I don’t have a 6 foot Low VHF element on my antenna setup. Hope it moves to a digital sub channel once the FCC pulls the plug on the Frankenstein FM.
I'm not sure why Weigel doesn't carry it as a subchannel on one of the TV stations they own in Chicago.
@@AntennaMan Weigel has space on one of the 23.1 and 23.3 channels (which duplicate each other-perhaps one of them will be utilized for that).
@@PC4USE1 Weigel removes 23.3 for now, as it was a repeat of 23.1. 23.1 is the HD channel of MeTV, while WCIU 26.3 (which Weigel advertises) is the SD version of MeTV. Providing MeTV FM on either of their 3 TV stations wouldn't even need a megabyte of bandwidth.
Under the present allocation reqs, if analog channel 6 is operating 87.9 and 88.1 are not available. It's really time to open VHF TV, especially VHF low, to serve more people than broadcast television does.
The packages MeTV on the Radio and Zoomer Radio are well executed and ingeniously micro-targeted to the demos still using radio outside a car. Especially condidering MeTV's success in Chicago and Boston, getting a pickup onto one of the 15 SportsTalk FMs in your market won't be an issue.
I vividly remembered when WPVI-TV's audio was on 87.7 FM.
This is a repeat performance from NPR. During the last ten years, NPR has filed arguments with the FCC claiming that low-power FM allocations all across the FM spectrum would interfere with certain NPR stations around the country because of spurious or otherwise damaging radiation. This appears to be Goliath using its legal department to spew out a continuous battle against these small, otherwise non-threatening stations. Most of these tiny stations air what was once known as "block programming," typically with something such as neighborhood news one hour, a Polka music show another hour, and a local political discussion another hour. They are usually manned by volunteers who want to make a difference in their community. By the time the legal wranglings are over with, the station has been relegated to a frequency on the dial and geographic location where very few listeners can hear the signal or travel very far listening in a vehicle. An example is the 7 watt WRFN at 107.1 near Nashville, Tennessee. It has a main coverage lobe of about five miles. That's hardly near any NPR facility geographically or on the FM dial spectrum. However, NPR fought the allocation for this small station. As an update to this conundrum, I would like to point out that for the first time ever, NPR has stated on their 2020 financials that Podcasting sponsorships have surpassed their on-air radio revenues. This came from a report here: rainnews.com/podcast-revenue-surpasses-radio/ So what is the real argument? I'd say that NPR just wants to block any possible broadcast signal that threatens their audience count as reported in monthly Neilsen ratings. The 87.7 FM signals are few and far between around the country, however the FCC needs to count them as vital service to their communities and allow them to be converted to licenses of LP FM analog stations. Anyone residing within the listening area of these stations should write to the FCC in Washington and let their voice be heard by mentioning the local station. After all, the mission of the FCC is to allow TV and radio stations to serve the "public interest, convenience and necessity."
I stopped listening to NPR (and watching PBS) years ago. Too much bias, and not acting in the public interest.....
"They don't want someone to go a little bit left to the dial and hear something cool and then realize that NPR is actually kinda boring" LOL
Yeah I spoke my mind there!
Im not from the states but looking up what NPR is my first impression maybe I got this wrong but it sounds like it could be used as an outlet for govt propaganda.
@@P7777-u7r I think it is
@@P7777-u7r that's EXACTLY what it is. It's heavily biased to one political party.
"NPR is actually kinda boring" is the understatement of the year.
You're being waaaaaaaaay to kind to the National Propaganda Radio.
This sucks, when I was a kid in the 80s, my Uncle needed a TV to sleep. When on road trips, he used 87.7 on the radio for the TV audio when he would sleep. Also, NPR sold out years ago, they skew too much to one side politically these days. I stopped listening to them.
Shango066 repairs old TV's and uses the Franken FM (Guadalupe Radio) Channel 6 in Los Angeles to show how well the TV is working.
Shango066 is the man! Love his videos
But it is very, very weak, snowy picture.
And Jordan Pier also Bandersontv
I love how many Shango fans I run into. Shango is legend.
I usually save his videos for a day when I don't have much going on with how long they are, but I love watching his content, and when he goes off on a riff, I honestly don't know how he stands it out there in comifornia!!
I remember when I was young picking up radio on channel 6 on the old CRT with a gold old knob channel dialer. As a child I was thinking this is an issue but now I know better. Fun fact also when walkman players was a thing I owned one that had zero radio functionality but I was living close enough to our broadcasting tower in Montreal, QC, Canada. Once I did a bike ride to the broadcasting antenna at the top of Mont-Royal, I was literally under it like 20 feet away from the base, that's how close it was fenced in. I started picking up radio station over my tape that was actually on play mode, that thing freaking spooked me, like how strong is the signal there to overcome my tape on a device that is not even designed for radio. Blew my mind!!!
Also on 1994 Sony Trinitron NTSC CRT TV and it’s aftermarket Sony TV remote with Fine tuning button, so you can fine tune from 87.75 up to 93.25 MHz sound from FM radio.
Since there are NO AVAILABLE new licenses for radio stations in the U.S., and NPR has ceased all diversity in programming, niche audiences will have ZERO OPTIONS!
Yeah, I'm not too happy with PBS either. They took down my local over the air station WXEL which includes WPBT. All Port St. Lucie, FL local stations are south where WXEL's tower used to be but now they took down their tower and they expect us to get our signal from a north tower when all other local stations are south! So, for that reason, I can't get PBS over the air and I'm sure most people in my city can't get it either!
We are KNNN-LP in Redding CA on 87.7 FM... don't know how you missed us in your list...JK! :) We do provide a unique on-air programming for our market filling a gap between the NPR audience and the traditional FM's. If we were such a threat it would be iHeart coming after us , not NPR.
It’s all about the money. NPR has been under fire for not opening their books to how much money they canvass from the public listeners.
Why should they? They don't need public support. Just listeners. Followers. Corporate funding from the Global Elite.
@@THEMADPROFdj Don't they get government funding too or is that PBS?
i think to qualify as harmful interference it would have to cause a medical device like a pacemaker to malfunction (like the mag safe and wireless chargers for the newer iphones does to pacemakers) or completely drown out emergency dispatchers to where a crime can happen without being reportable.
All broadcasters use this term. T-Mobile serves broadcasters harmful interference notices all the time.
NPR is no longer a "respected" radio station. NPR needs to lose its funding.
NPR should have lost all funding when they started to give out opinions
NPR is not a radio staiton.
NPR does not have good intentions.
Tyler -- At the 8:30 mark you say something to the effect that NPR doesn't want listeners to go "a little bit left on the dial." In the United States, if you are listening to NPR you have gone as far left as you can on the dial Comrade.
National Propaganda Radio
I see what you did there....
I tried the small wireless fm transmitter in cars about 10 years ago I think that 87.7 was one of those channels this device would work on. The devices just sucked. I tried helping someone with his several years ago. They still sucked. And as far as PBS, I quit listening to them when Car Talk finally went out of reruns. Rest In Peace Tom, I think Ray is still kicking. Best radio show ever……….
All markets are different
"NPR being a well respected news organization" LOL
Make no Mistake, the NAB and the large broadcasting companies do not want to see the three frequencies below 88 MHZ activated. These channels could be used for Low Power FM/community access radio.
I used to work at a college NPR affiliate, and I had a very brief discussion with the general manager and engineer about why plans of expanding coverage (I live 30 miles away from the college and could not receive their signal at my house) kept falling through. Long of the short, I was told that stations below 92MHz are power-limited and height-limited in order to protect TV channel 6, and as a result are coverage-limited. I could see potentially with all TV channels being completely digital, the FCC might consider lifting restrictions on ERP and HAAT for all the non-commercial affiliates below 92MHz, which would give them greater coverage. That's probably the real reason for NPR's vested interest in fighting the LPTV stations.
LPTV operators on Channel 6 are allowed to put Digital FM out in the marketplace, however they can't get the frequency to match up like the analog 87.75 did.
The franken radio really do not have a spectrum allocation. Your complaint is with the FCC and not a licensed radio service like NPR. I have a radio license and it is my experience that if you do not defend your license then your spectrum (band ) disappears. The FCC makes the call and NPR is part of the public providing testimony; like you could officially rather than back handed.
Huh...our local drive-in theater moved from 87.7 to 88.7 to escape some such interference. Interesting. Not a big deal, but interesting.
On VHF channel 6 using Multisystem PAL NTSC TV, Video frequency set to 83.25 MHz, System NTSC-M for 87.75 MHz, PAL-B/G for 88.75 MHz, 89.25 MHz for PAL-I and 89.75 MHz for PAL-D/K sound carrier. TV is on channel 6 but the sound frequency is 89.9 FM but automatic tune between 2 MHz. Using analog Cable TV here in the Philippines.
Your local drive-in theater likely should not be using either one of those frequencies really. 87.7 is technically channel 6 and 88.7 could belong to a local radio station.
I think the FCC should move all the stuff on 30 - 50 MHz and make that a second FM broadcast band. It would create jobs and add choices
I personally like the idea, we could use more space. There are some quirks I should point out:
Were this band to open, we would likely need to institute a Clear-channel plan for each frequency Thanks to consistent F2 and E-skip hops on the summer. However, adding 20 mhz of space will help to uncrowd the current band.
We actually used this band before, see "Apex band (42 mhz)".
@@zgsrandomnesshub7561 Call it the Green band since it will cut power use. We can also get the old 1940's radios to play on the band that doesn't work today.
@@antilogism Love it!
Channel 6 in Philadelphia was the home of the original Bandstand, WHICH in 1957 became American Bandstand. I listened everyday on 87.7 on our FM radio. It sounded so much better than WIBG 990 on AM.
I forgot to add that I also discovered, while DXing on the Philadelphia FM band, that WIBG simulcasted its AM programming on 94.1 then known as WIBG FM which would become WYSP when Storer Broadcasting, then the owners of WIBG sold the FM frequency to Infinity Broadcasting. Now 94.1 is Sports Radio WIP and there are zero independently owned radio stations in Philadelphia. The days of great radio programming in Philadelphia are gone.
I remember I used to pick up the audio portion of CBC Montreal on 87.7.
Same with CBWT channel 6, CBC TV in Winnipeg. So cool and convenient being able to listen to Hockey Night in Canada in the car come playoff time.
CBC Cable TV channel 6 in Toronto, but Channel 5 for over the air until 2011. Now on DTV 20 (ATSC).
Also Global TV channel 6 in Hamilton
my wife sometimes listens to wnyz 87.7 here in new york city. it's korean language and serves the metro area korean community quite well. i had no idea that it was a tv station! it comes in clearly and does not interfere with the nearby npr station wbgo. it would be a shame to lose it.
Yeah it's a TV station. They'll likely be gone after July.
Do they use the audience commentary text scroll that the Indo-Caribbean service that leased it on weekends called the Shout Box? A bit wasteful that it took input via the WWW but output on a TV screen; still not a bad way to use snowy low-power video transmission.
@@goodmaro i don't know. we just pick it up on our tivoli in the kitchen. i've never seen it on tv.
NPR might be trying to dump a bunch of money into the FCC to get 87.7 put on the allowed use spectrum for radio use and then buy up all those frequencies. It's all about money. Any random issue like this that comes up is always about money.
Yep I also remember listening to Fox 5 on Radio before they switched to Digital. It was cool listening to NFL games and other sports.
I live in Gaithersburg MD, I can sometimes pick up La Nueva late at night
"well respected news station" have you listened to any of their content in the last 4 years?
I have. Regardless of their views on 87.7 MHz, NPR is not the insane dumpster fire of BS that Fox News is. Do you get your news from the BBC?
True story: In the early 1970s at night, my large portable, set at around 92.7, could receive the audio of WGN-TV Ch. 9 Chicago. My family lived on the top floor of a two-flat that was about three-four miles from 2501 W. Bradley Place, the home of WGN-Television. It came in handy when the Blackhawks or Cubs were on during my bath times. Away hockey games were not broadcast on radio.
I actually have a TV channel 6/87.7 FM station where I live in Redding, California. Callsign is KNNN-LP. They're branded as "Hella 87.7"
They will likely be gone in July
@@AntennaMan The LMS shows that KNNN-LP has a construction permit for flash cutting to digital operation on TV Channel 6; 3 kW ERP at 39.1 m AGL/1015 m AMSL. Not too shabby, but digital operation does not allow an analog aural carrier, on any frequency. Some Franken FMs have asked FCC for special permission to keep an analog aural carrier with frequency modulation in addition to the digital ATSC signal, calling it an "ancillary service" which the FCC rules do indeed allow, but I believe this means an ancillary service imbedded in the ATSC bit stream, not a completely distinct FM analog signal at 87.7 MHz. But, since the 7-13-2021 analog shutoff deadline is fast approaching, time will soon tell. So far no last minute pardon from the FCC as far as I am aware.
Yes I would completely believe that NPR is trying to shut them down. This rabbit hole goes deep!
YUP! All the way to the Global Elite running the show on every channel, and into everyone's minds, on both "sides", aware or not. Dividing. Conquering.
I can NOT believe NPR’s massive hypocrisy. Especially considering NPR leans slightly left, they should want these unique stations serving underserved communities. But of course, money beats soul every time.
Where I grew up 87.7 was the audio of our PBS station. What a lark!
As much as I love the Idea of Public Broadcasting, NPR is really putting their heads up their asses here, pardon my crude language. I do like how you show both sides of the issues here.
Just wanted to point out that is actually a neat radio you featured at the beginning. @TVRadio1972 has it, and reviewed it.
Anyways, it is sad to lose an important **local** element to television/FM
I remember my mother listening to our local ABC station on the radio while cooking dinner, but didn't realize they were still around, given the shift to digital formats. Gonna have to dig out an old radio, to see if I can still pick it up.
"NPR being a respected news source"
Thank you for that. I needed the laugh.
Many NPR stations give exposure to local music during the evening hours and is sometimes very niche. That may be the public service they’re referring to.
Not to defend NPR in any way, but they do broadcast some local college radio programs every once in awhile. Perhaps they are getting complaints from them that 87.7 is interfering. You know how colleges are now days...
As a Chicagoan, I don't see what NPR could have against MeTV 87.7, which plays nothing but classic pop songs no respectable Prairie Home Companion NPR station would touch. And yes, I listen to both.
I think they're convinced these Franken FMs are the only thing stopping the FM band from expanding - which they aren't. Full powered TV stations still use low VHF channel 6.
@@AntennaMan There are no "full-powered" TV stations anywhere in the U.S. VHF-Lo? Max ERP was 100KW Visual, VHF-Hi was 316 KW for Visual, and UHF was 5000KW fir Visual, RF is like a pipe. It doesn't care what you shove through it. When you chop the power, you cut the coverage. Simple as that.
@@johnpinckney4979 Yes there are. Google WPVI, WRGB, and WKBS. The power limits were cut for digital tv.
@@AntennaMan Per the FCC, the WPVI ERP is only 30 KW. That's less than 1/4 the power from their old 100KW ERP when you're computing the difference in dB. As for WRGB, they're running 30.2 KW ERP. Roughly the same power cut, +/3 a few fractions of a dB. They also require three UHF translators to fill-in lost primary coverage areas. Including one in Schenectady itself to comply with the FCC rule requiring reception within the city of license. As for WKBS-TV, again 3.1 KW is an even longer way from 100KW. Yes, it's true that VHF-lo analog stations only hit 100 KW based on the density of the video signal being at peak white, 100 IRE units. But, I doubt they rarely went as low as 30KW. I get the feeling that the FCC used theoretical coverage for DTV stations instead of real world. The FCC lost credibility with me on TV when they had to freeze TV station construction for five years because TV signals weren't behaving the way the FCC said they were supposed to. Thus, there were nightmares built like: Channel 4 in New York and Washington, but also in Lancaster, PA; Channel 7 in D.C. and New York, but also in Wilmington, Delaware; And, let's go back to channel 4, with stations in Columbus, Oho and Detroit, but also in Cleveland! The FCC's technical competency continued into the ATSC era by allocating channel 9 as the "transition channel" to one of the Detroit stations, ignoring that south of the border, CBET was operating on channel 9 from Windsor, Ontario. I hope ATSC 3.0 corrects most of the shortcomings of ATSC 1.0. Especially the reduced coverage.
@@johnpinckney4979
FYI: In analog NTSC, 100kW was not peak white, rather infrablack (the sync bar/flyback retrace, was 100kW).
I forgot the power of black level, suffice to say it was probably near 90kW.
There is an exception for analog LPTV stations to stay on the air in analog until the end of 2021 if they claim financial or technical hardship is preventing them from meeting the July deadline. WNYZ-LP in the NYC area has already filed such a claim asking to remain transmitting in analog until the end of the year.
And NPR may be referring to the FCC spacing requirements preventing FM radio stations from transmitting on 87.9 or 88.1 MHz anywhere close to a TV station on channel 6. If the FrankenFMs went away, there could be new radio stations licensed on these frequencies, or existing stations on those frequencies could increase their power. However, that would only really happen on a national scale if all TV stations abandoned use of channel 6, not just the FrankenFMs.
No radio station could license on 87.9 as that is Ch6's allotted space (82-88Mhz). With new Full Service Emmission Masks and harmonic filters Channel 6's will not interfere with 88.1Mhz whether they are Franken FM's or not.
I worked for an NPR affiliate for 15 years and can vouch for the Channel 6 issue. The 88.1 through 91.9 subband is reserved for non-commercial educational stations and has been for many many years predating NPR affiliated stations. Channel 6 TV in any form makes it difficult or impossible to license the lower channels in the subband due to interference issues to and from the TV stations.If you listen to the subband in most areas, you'll find some college stations, some NPR formatted (news and music) stations and a lot of channels used by religious stations. The public radio translators were an attempt to have NPR programming available in the majority of the country. Please leave the politics of whether you think their national news coverage is slanted and just consider that all non-comms there have the same issues attempting to use the lowest channels. If they do get licensed, often its not at a class B power level. If you want to listen to TV audio, perhaps getting some manufacturers like Antenna man's sponsor to build radios that can pickup the audio from all TV stations like were available in the analog era.
Nah They make Full Service Emission Masks with tight shoulders for Ch6 Franken FM's that cause no interference at all. In fact the spatial difference of FM6 is about 1.5x further away from the lowest FM frequency than the FM frequencies are from each other. This is just a convenient argument NPR puts out there to preserve their being the lowest place on the FM dial. NPR made it political when they tried to throw the scent off. The engineering studies, field studies, and real life use does not support this harmful interference argument. Jampro is one of the biggest manufacturers of filters and antennas and they have mitigated all these problems with their combiners for Ch6/FM6
There is also an 87.7 FM station (analog channel 6) in my area. It is currently WEYS-LP, an affiliate of Spanish religious station called Almavision. Before then, it simulcasted analog full-power WTVJ (NBC) before switcing to digital on June 12th, 2009. Now that frequency may go off the air as well coming July 13th.
Joke’s on the FCC I’m about to get an RF amplifier and create my own low power analog TV station in late July
@@joedonalson7801 all I need as an amplifier. I have the modulator and signal converters, DVD player, VCR, and other things needed
some of the downsides to franken fms is the audio is quieter than every other station on the fm radio dial and most radios don't allow you to tune into the exact tv channel 6 audio frequency permanently making the signal weaker and less clearer than what it should be. also its kind of unfair to other broadcasters in the same or not so distant area since most radios can only pick up channel 6 audio meaning only 1 station can broadcast on both tv and radio within a certain area. some also point out that some stations broadcast a single frame 24/7 and really only operate as radio stations as wasting space since tv stations are equivalent to 30 fm radio channels and 600 am radio channels. the major upside is that broadcasters can operate on both tv and radio without using up extra space for a separate fm radio transmitter on a different frequency. personally i like the idea of franken fms and will miss them like every other analog tv station but understand the anger people have about the stations really only acting as radio stations that i mentioned above.
Sad to see something unique go that was useful to some in areas where there was a channel 6.
I don't know if I'd say NPR is as respected as they used to be. They seem to be more biased than in the past. I do see their point about that part of the FM band being for non commercial but there should be some room to find a compromise.
WMRE-LP in Chicago has a FCC CP to convert from low power analog to low power digital and maybe converted sometime prior to the July 13 cutoff date. I’m thinking it will be on RF channel 6 but instead of analog it will be digital which means I will probably have to switch to a channel master masterpiece model to pick it up.
Hopefully Weigel broadcasting and these other stations can fight this. I would contribute to my local NPR station but maybe I need to withhold from them now trying to pull a stunt like this. I live in Milwaukee but off the lake shore and can still pick up 87.7 here at times and Love MeTv radio.
Do not donate to NPR!! NPR sends the local affiliate a bill every month for their programming, donating just lines their pockets more.
The 87.7/Channel 6 station went off the air last year from the radio side and became a digital TV station. It started on radio as "Cleveland's Sound," an alternative station, before starting a long run as a Spanish music station as "La Mega."
The group behind "La Mega" moved to online only and Channel 6 (WLFM) is now a shopping or jewelry station.
Seeing the classic TV still brings nostalgia.
Our local TV station was on ch6 on the cable system and my dad used to have a 75 to 300 Ohm balun on the old console stereo in order to listen to the audio. It would be neat for the big cable operators to set aside that channel for analog audio service of some kind.
NPR has always been the nemesis of independent and low power radio. In 1978 they pushed and lobbied for harsher regulations against low power stations, demanding them to be "more professional" and "above 100 watts" in order to drive competition out of business. Pirate Radio USA covers this pretty well.
By maintaining the equipment, the transmitters would be able to be used in an emergency situation that could be received by multiple type of equipment without different transmitters.
Tyler NPR and the NAB worked like crazy to put a kibosh on low port community based FM stations they loaded the band with so called translators licensed to a church in New Jersey. look it up
One of them, in Providence, is now on 87.9 FM.
unfortunately here in canada there is no hope for franken fms because licenses for new tv transmitters broadcasting in analog stopped being issued in january 2007 which means the regulators in canada have had their minds made up for quite some time on analog tv
I used to broadcast my lpfm station on 87.7, great fun, riding around, listening to my station in the car, I even had a few loyal listeners 🙂
I had been using 87.7 for my home light show (synchronized to music,) and found out that new radios in cars do not have it anymore. They only go down to 87.9 (which here is not usable, because it's adjacent to another station.)
Yeah my new car stereo only goes down to 87.9 as well.
I had no idea there was a low-powered TV station in the DC market until I setup the 2Max at my friend's apartment. He was using a small Mohu leaf that only picked up 14 out of the 68 stations in the DC and Baltimore markets although he is renting the basement floor of a house.
I hope the stations are able to remain on the air as there is a large latino community here that benefits from La Nueva's programming.
You made one incorrect statement in this video, you stated that NPR is a respectable news outlet. They used to be but those days are long gone.
In the Phippines, we also have 87.5 FM there. DWFO in Manila as FM1 (Government owned station and plays some Hit Musics), and DXFO 87.9 in Davao City as FM1. 87.5 also used for local government station in Davao City.
Other Channel 6 stations including GMA channel 6 in Iloilo and IBC channel 6 in Baguio City.
Here in Orlando we had WKMG Channel 6. Back in the 1980's and early 1990's I was a delivery driver. EVERY other driver I knew listened to "Star Trek The Next Generation" at 4pm. It was like a radio drama. If you had ever seen the show you could picture the scenes in your head just by the sounds. They went off of 87.7 when all of the stations here converted to digital. I made sure to be listening at midnight when they did their final sign off. Very sad. I was unaware that any stations were still operating analog on 87.7
I actually know of a radio station that's at 88.3 FM and it's called wzrd in chicago. It's one of those funky strange freeform college radio stations. I like the 877 MeTV because it's on the way down and people will stop at 88.3 fm. They hear some funky programming when they're tuning in or tuning out of 87.7 fm. And NPR is just being stupid right now. I thought it was going to be one of those big cell phone companies or something. But NPR they're just being a bunch of big dumb bullies.
It was much easier and cheaper for colleges and etc. to receive license for LPTV then the outrages FM Broadcast license. An FM license is ridiculously expensive and the content on the radio dial now is redundant -> enter pirate radio.
I never realized that 87.7 through 92 Mhz is reserved for college and public radio non-commercial stations! Fascinating
I didn't know it explicitly, but I've always noted that the stations at the "bottom" of the dial always tend to be the ones that are broadcasting oldies, classical, religious or college stations. I thought it was a power issue (ie, the lower stations are limited in their transmitting power) but glad to see there is a technical reason!
Legally for non-commercial stations, it starts from 88.1 to 91.9, 87.7 is not included in regular broadcasting
@@ko6jay681 87.9 is actually the first channel on the FM band. The FCC parked a couple of translators on it. A waste of BW.
@@mikehemeon2473 Channel 201 (since 1-200 had already been allocated from 88.1 to 107.9 when this extra channel was added), but I wouldn't've called it a waste of bandwidth at the time. It's no more a waste than the FrankenFMs are.
Meanwhile HMU radio station is at 105.4
What about 89.7 in my area I noticed a lot of people use this frequency for things like running the audio for Christmas light displays in front of their houses. These are people who use very low powered FM transmitters that only transmit out as far as 200 ft. I'm not sure if 89.7 is reserved for that purpose but if not I feel that the FCC should reserve a small portion of the FM band solely for these very low powered micro stations I did notice a few of them that pop up in my area in different parts of town every now and then and like I say it's usually someone transmitting from their house.
If a local frequency is empty, then people are allowed to broadcast "Part 15" devices. In my town, someone used 107.7 for their lights display last year which could be heard for about a mile in any direction for well over a month. The most common Part 15er is actually someone transmitting to their car.
Also, I love that idea of a micro-FM band. I hear New Zealand has something like this.
@@zgsrandomnesshub7561 I do like that part 15 allows us to broadcast via micro transmitters. Here I love there are a few open frequencies that can be used the only reason why I feel that the FCC should reserve a portion for a microbend is because in some areas mostly larger cities or metropolitan areas they may not be any available frequencies to use. The one thing about these micro stations is they cannot broadcast over another station. That's very interesting that you say someone's Christmas audio could be heard for one mile Park 15 only allows about 200 ft at the most. I have yet to set up a Christmas light show in my house but I do use a microtransmitter for an in-house radio station I have several radios in each room and I can even transmit out into my yard. There's a local pawn shop that's a block away from me that also uses a micro transmitter set to a specific frequency inside the store and they use that for their own microstation Plus they run their own advertisements in the store if you're parked outside and you tune into that frequency you can hear the advertisements from your car but as soon as you drive off the parking lot you will lose the signal.
@@bluetech7753 The FCC rules are quite tight, in my example the owners probably were using more wattage than allowed. Most home-based transmitters already exceed the limit before hitting the shelves, and then the modifications hit.
In my area, the truly open frequencies are few, so I would love to see some sort of expansion for just in-house Broadcasting.
@@zgsrandomnesshub7561 yes definitely.
I remember these TV stations that are channel 6...
WRTV (ABC) Indianapolis, Indiana
WLNS (CBS) Lansing, Michigan
KUAT (PBS) Tucson, Arizona
I miss being able to listen to my market's Channel 6 on 87.7 FM. Had no clue that some markets still got to do that.
Yes if the TV station on channel 6 was low powered they can continue broadcasting in analog until July.
There is a 4 MHz gap between channels 4 and 5. Does it now serve any purpose?
Perhaps at the time of the transition, they should have had 5 and 6 shift frequencies to open up 4 MHz at the bottom of the FM band.
Better yet, they should have just kept 2-6 analog.
72-76 MHz is used for various purposes, a few land-mobile channels, model aircraft control, diathermy equipment for pain relief.
What should be done:
Move all VHF lowband DTV stations to channels 2, 3, and 4, but allow them to use enough power to get over the noise floor of a typical home.
Then allocate 76-88 MHz to FM radio, and mandate coverage of the new wider FM band in receivers.
@@1L6E6VHF Thank you for the clarification.
I believe the way TV channels were first allocated, they had a one-channel gap between VHFs.
Philadelphia had 3, 6, 10, and 12.
New York City had 2, 4, 5, 7, 9, 11, and 13
They were able to have 4 and 5 because of the 72-76 MHz band.
@@josephklapatch9576 Channel 1 was reallocated in the very early days of television. Some other countries using a different television standard actually have Channel 1s.
@@nathandebartolo8330
I received a Channel 1 station in 1979. It was BBC1 from the Crystal Palace Transmitting Tower south of London.
It wasn't the same frequencies as US Channel 1. US Channel 1 was 45.25v/49.75a, whereas BBC1 was 45.00p/41.50a.
I only heard the sound, because BBC video was positive modulation, and American sets used negative video modulation.
This can't happen again. My 1979 catch was at the peak of sunspot cycle 21, sunspot numbers subsided, and BBC closed their 405-line transmitters in the early eighties.
@@1L6E6VHF Gerald Pulice and others did get that during that sunspot peak, usually getting the complement of what you were seeing: video only. Since the UK's channel 1 was very close to the i.f. of standard NTSC receivers, if you bypassed the tuner you could get the 405-line BBC broadcast as a negative, i.e. black for white. I got to see some of it he recorded, although a trip to his QTH on Staten Island at the best time for such reception (F2 was a lot more predictable than sporadic E) came up dry that day.
My college radio station ran low-power on 90.7 but we would get complaints from the commercial 92.3 station if our transmitter was too hot or pointing too much in their direction, so I'm not at all surprised that this could be a problem in a very dense market like we have in New England, with a whole bunch of stations trying to operate on closely neighboring frequencies.
Then your engineer did not have a good mask filter nor a harmonic filter on the output stage of your transmitter.
@@larrysoule1418 Certainly possible. I never got to see the transmitter room in person -- maybe just a couple photos once. It was on the roof of the next building and I think it was maintained mostly by an alumnus who worked for some of the local commercial stations. I think they were also deliberately trying to push the limits for more range?
This only means to me that if 87.7 fm local to me goes off the air due to NPR , the station is no longer in use and since I am the only pirate fm station currently set at hijacking 102.5 fm, I can switch to 87.7 fm which would be a clearer station since there is a station broadcasting at 102.3 fm one notch before my station.
Great informational video, Antenna Man...be safe out there!
I think Tyler said audio on 87.7 FM is analog tv. ReScanning your HD to 6 is good if your digital set displays from analog sources too.
HD RADIO on Sparc and Sangean HD RADIOS. Set to Region C on 50 kHz tuning step for FM and tune in to 87.75 MHz.
The problem with Audio on channel 6 is that the FCC rules state that if there is a Channel 6 TV station in a market, 88.1 and 88.3 and in some cases 88.5 cannot be used in the same TV market. Removing the Channel 6 analog Franken broadcast makes room for many more radio stations than the few low power TV stations operating illegally as commercial radio stations that need to be shut down. The FCC gave out these low power TV stations that were inexpensive to set up but never were able to make money as TV stations. Commercial FM stations are selling for millions of dollars and the band is full in most large cities. Commercial Ethnic broadcasters need some relief from the FCC but Franken FMs are not an efficient way to do it.
With new Full-Service Emission Masks this is no longer a problem
Three things. First, this is something that was supposed to happen years ago--complaining about it now is like the complaints from analog TV owners even after years of postponement of that conversion. Second, NPR is a membership organization rather than any kind of autonomous force. It wouldn't submit that petition unless actual member stations told it to. Third, it's just a petition, of the sort organizations file with the FCC all the time....the FCC can pay attention or not. But really the first thing is key--this isn't the first deadline, it's a long-postponed one that just demonstrated that government is incapable of making a perfectly legal plan and stick to it.
Spot on
There were/are multiple business interests who stand to gain from getting rid of this RF loophole, but the biggest is government, through monopoly of information. The least amount of independent voices the better, as far as governments are concerned.
Antennas used to be antennas .. large, bulky and endless aluminum elements. Now, they are decorative plastic covered VHF dipoles or hidden UHF loops with a tiny amp .. we used to stack massive 24 element beams at 40 ft to reach 40 miles, now the advertisers claim that range from a TV top unit that looks like a minimalist bookend. ... great discussion, thanks for telling the truth.
When you said 88 to 92 Mhz is mostly for non-commercial stations...I had to laugh a little. Two NPR stations in my area air beyond that line-up...WNYC 93.9...which has two digital subchannels including their longstanding AM sister at 820 and classical outlet WQXR, which after years of being commercial on 96.3, went non-commercial at 105.9. Also out of Chicago is WFMT 98.7 and at 101.9 Detroit's WDET.