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Providing Power on Passage - Review of the Watt and Sea Cruising 600 Hydrogenerator
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- Опубликовано: 13 авг 2024
- This episode as well as the accompanying article on our website, link below, focuses on power requirements and generation on passage as well as how we addressed our own demands by installing a Watt and Sea Cruising 600 on Gargoyle. If you are interested in a more in-depth video on the installation process of the Watt and Sea or if you have any questions as well, let us know in the comments below.
www.svgargoyle.com/review-wattsea-cruising-600
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Great info, love those creature comforts 🍺 🍺
Yes, must have that beer box.
Wow, this was a great video. Lots of useful info. Thanks guys! ~Dave & Sara
Thanks glad you enjoyed. We have a number of upcoming topics in mind but if you any ideas let us know.
Great analysis. Thank you!
Thanks, glad you found it helpful
Can you drop and raise the watt and sea when sailing? I read conflicting opinions on this, some (maybe outdated) comments that watt and sea needs close to stand still when being dropped and raised.
We do point up and "stall" the boat to raise and lower but it's not a big deal. Takes a minute or less when you get the hang of it.
If money was no object, would putting two Watt and Sea’s on be an option for extra generation or is that just overkill / stupid? Would the drag factor be too much or the extra load on the boat be too much?
Definitely two is a great option. There was a 55'+ Lagoon in Panama that had two of CR 600s. We could have also installed two but one meets our need while sailing. Load shouldn't be an issue unless you're a racer. Also look at a large Lithium battery bank and larger solar array as an option. The Vendee boats have been going that direction.
Switch to a thick carbon plate AGM and the cycle times will increase exponentially
We were going that route last time but our schedule was tight and we're in Costa Rica with our departure window closing for a run to The Marquesas. Definitely an option next round.
Why did you choose the watt and sea versus switching to higher capacity lithium batteries?
We had considered that as an alternative however our house bank of AGMs still has another 3 years of life or so left in them. The cost of replacement plus the environmental impact of making a change earlier just didn't make sense to us. That said, they would be a viable option. FYI, we did write an accompanying article that's posted on our website that contains more information, such as the battery discussion.
www.svgargoyle.com/extras
Hi guys - what a wonderful informative video - I have the same problem - we need night time powering - trying to convince the Admiral we need a W+S 600 - and she is finding reports that they do not work. So thanks. It seems installation is critical - did you install along the midline oif your vessel..
We installed it just off the midline. That way you're out of the rudder flow. Works great though definitely need speed to generate power. Anything less than five knots of boat speed and you're better off pulling it up.
@@SailingGargoyle Thanks for the tip.. Will keep in communication and let you know how we go.
Shouldnt you be charging to 80% and discharging to 40%?
Actually, with AGMs it's recommended to keep them above 70% and charge to full to maximize life of batteries. Discharging below 50% has a serious impact on battery life as does only charging to 80%. Apparently AGMs that aren't fully charged may become unable to charge above that lower charge point in the future. We have Lifeline AGMs and I would recommend you check out their website for more details. As it costs us approximately $3,000 for a new house bank, we like to get as much service out of them as possible.
@@SailingGargoyle oh sorry about that, wrong video, i thought you had lithium phospates....ooops
no worries! There so much going on with battery technologies that it is confusing.
What controllers are u using for the watt&sea?
We use the included charge controller from Watt and Sea. It's the original model, not the newer Bluetooth enabled version.
We just gave it a significant workout on a 30 day passage to French Polynesia and it worked wonders. In our week of cruising in the trade winds power output was extremely high. On low wind nights and during the day we pulled it to reduce drag and let our solar panels do the work during daylight hours.
Only challenge we should have thought of was the few nights we had a strong 3 knot current on our stern. That effectively negated the Watt and Sea but can't complain about a 3 knot push.
From the comments, it seems like you're well aware of how much of an impact you'd get from converting to Lithium. At 25% utilization, your 4x250Ah AGMs are giving you just 125% the capacity that a single 206Ah 12V SOK lithium bank (1060$ a pop). You'd almost double your usable capacity for 2000$ with two (2) of them, and your round-trip efficiency from all charging sources would be massively better. I'm just saying this to put the cost into perspective: about 2000$.
Lithium is an interesting topic and isn't as simple for us in our situation as stated here. Cost is actually considerably higher when one factors in changes to other systems, a seperate BMS as well as the costs/risks (shipping, timing, parts availability, duty, etc) in attempting such an update in a 3rd world country. Add in the remaining life we did have in our AGM bank and it was an option that we considered but rejected at the time.
We do appreciate the feedback as we had the same thoughts initially.
@@SailingGargoyle sounds good and you're right that the costs also include other things. These batteries have built in BMS, so that end is covered. But you'd also need to change your charge sources to fit the lithium charge profile. MPPTs and inverter/chargers nowadays can do this, but the big hiccup is the alternator: you often need to change it to an externally controlled one (Balmar makes a good one) or you add a battery-to-battery charger between the alternator and your batteries (varies in price but 100-300$ depending on amperage/brand), which limits your charging to a couple dozen amps instead of hundreds.
You have a battery problem not a generator problem.
With 1000ah or 12k wh with 25% utilization that's 250ah or 3k wh
Your solar has max peak of 1500 watts guestimating the 33% rule average 0.5k wh over 12 hour's that's 6k wh.
You can't store the power you generat.
Guessing your drain is about 0.4k wh so you need at least 12 hour's worth 4.8k wh (400ah) sound like a minimum.
Note when you look at a battery never look at max capacity only look at usable range the rest is just market Bull s"blib". If you are only going to use 25% then you need 1600 battery minimum just t last one night on batterys
All good points and the ideal solution would be a lithium battery upgrade however now it becomes a money issue. On our recent 30 day run from Costa Rica to Nuku Hiva we didn't have any issues with the batteries as the solar and hydro generation kept them well fed under a full energy load with two deep freezes and all electronics up and running.
That said it's always a balancing act when making long passages.
@@SailingGargoyle money always a problem.
And yes lithium is King.
But you can double your kilo wh just at "0 cost" by allowing the utalazation to be the recommended 50%.
Ofc it will reduce batteries life time. But there is also cost in using the hydro (speed/maintaice) or specially using dísel.
Don't get me wrong i think the hydro is really cool idea.
@@viltur83 we just a money generator! Thanks for great comments.
50' boat full of garbage AGM batteries? Lithium is cheaper than AGM now.
When we had to replace our house batteries in 2021 we were in Costa Rica and the supply chain was still impacted by COVID. We made the decision to go with Lifeline AGMs that have powered us across the Pacific, down from Scotland to where we sit anchored in Greece. We'll expect at least another five years out of them so they've been a fantastic investment. When we did the math on the cost of a conversion to Lithium (Gargoyle is a 2011) and added in the costs of getting the components to Costa Rica at that time, we could have invested the difference in a dividend stock and paid for each subsequent replacement with the proceeds. Will we replace next time with Lithium? Yes, if it makes financial sense at the time.