I bought my new in the box Omega Seamaster 120 in 1971 for $63. It was my daily tool watch. I sent it Switzerland for factory service in 1988 that cost less than $200. I had independent watchmaker service since then. But about five years ago Omega stopped selling parts to anyone other than their authorized service centers. Last I checked a couple of years ago Omega wanted $1200 + parts to service my watch. I'm retired now so I can't afford that. My Seamaster is a display piece now. I wear Seiko and Casio now.
Thats a shame. Parts can be had if you have the right friends, but the behaviour of the swatch group and others regarding limiting right to repair is outrageous. Even in this video Jory keeps saying ‘their watches’ instead of our watches.
My Dad bought a Seamaster in Switzerland in 1965. As far as I know he never had it serviced. When it became unreliable around 1985 he just stopped wearing it and bought a quartz Tissot. He let me have it. A watchmaker cleaned it but said that it had run with insufficient lubrication for years and the jewels should be replaced, or words to that effect. It kept time poorly, I didn’t want to spend the money for a complete overhaul… eventually it was stolen. Now I wear thermocompensated quartz or atomic-clock-sync watches.
They are denying parts. This has to go against the right to repair. People beat up Apple about it but according to what you're saying, Omega and Rolex need to be next in line.
Supposedly from another video I saw, that is EXACTLY what they do (save the higher end true luxury brands). They have movements on the shelf ready to drop in on most of the mass produced movements. They drop it in, take your old one, send it to Indonesia where they refurbish it, send it back to the service centers and then it will go into another watch.
Another reason to not be all-in on in-house movements. While I don't have the ability to do a full service on a mechanical watch, I can (and do) replace movements and regulate them pretty reliably.
I have an AP royal oak offshore, purchased from AP in 2019. I have many watches and this piece was worn maybe once every 3 weeks, stored in good conditions in a safe. In 2022 before the warranty was up, the time keeping was just terrible, it kept losing time and naturally I took it back expecting AP to fix the issue for free. After considerable effort just to get an appointment at the service Center (in Singapore, where they literally have a boutique 5 min drive or 20 min walk from home - I had to go to another one because that branch wouldn’t even respond) AP assessed the watch and claimed it had received a significant impact and this was not what the warranty was for and asked for $2k (usd) to fix the watch. Now I can categorically tell you that this watch never ever received such an impact and was looked after very well (when I pay $25k for a watch I’m looking after it as this reflects a significant cost for me). Suitably pissed off with no other option I paid the money. But I can tell you I’ll never buy an AP again. A total fraud with terrible service, they should be ashamed of themselves for not recognising their own shoddy workmanship. For context I have watches from Patek, Rolex, Lange etc, and never an issue.
Step one should be maintenance when needed. If a watch is in a collection not being worn often, it doesn’t need servicing. If a watch is being worn, it’s less than 10 years since the last service and it is running OK it doesn’t need a service. Step two is definitely find a local independent if you’re a collector. They can work with you and your collection, doing just work that’s needed.
Been collecting watches for about 25 years and it that time. I only serviced 2 watches . Automatic watches are a lot more robust than some might think. My watch journey has been hassle free and I NEVER service through the brand. There's nothing magical about these movements that a independent watchmaker can't do. My watchmaker charges me $350 for a Rolex service.The only time I understand going to the brand. If the movement is a highly complicated movement but running to the brand to service a ETA or Selita? Not a chance
Easy way to keep maintenance costs down, is to wear watches, that use commonly available movements. Selita, ETA, Seiko, Seagull (not anymore right?) because independent watchmakers/repair shops can easily source parts for those, and work on them, as opposed to say a Patek perpetual calendar, which is 100% in house, and only they can source parts.
That's why I only have a few high-end / in-house movement pieces. The rest are mainly NH-35 and variants which I service myself... by just replacing the whole movement when the need arises. Last month I replaced a SW200-1 in my Sinn Pilot EZM9 after being quoted over 400 EUR for service - I know a guy that is starting a microbrand and he orders premium SW200-1s directly from Sellita and he sold me one for the price he gets them in bulk, which is just a bit over 100 EUR. 30 mins later and my Sinn is happily ticking with even better accuracy than when I bought it...
$100 for a movement makes me feel like a schlub when we pay over $1000 for the watch (of course, case, assembly, shipping, advertising, commissions, etc are part of the cost of doing business).
@@MegaThucydides Fair, should've used quotes around 'service' - when it comes to working on the movement(s) themselves my skills end at replacing the date wheel on a NH35 and a the rotor on several different movements😅 Still, straight replacing beats paying exuberant prices for servicing confection movements - I'd argue that, if you can get a new, good graded and well protected movement from the manufacturer, replacing the movement is better than servicing it from a point of reliability. The downside is that it's a bit wasteful...
@@zwerko You are still a thousand times more skilled with watches than I. Kudos to you sir! I agree on the waste, but economics being what it is. Look on the bright side, now you have a cheap throwaway movement to practice your watchmaking skills on
NH series movements are where it's at; 40 Canadian dollars to replace it myself? Yes please. You can spend more money on the rest of the watch and get quality specs like sapphire and ceramic pretty cheap as well. Automatic watches that can last a lifetime with a movement swap or two can be had for very little these days. The only real thing you're paying for with luxury brands is a somewhat better fit and finish (honestly, even the cheap brands or diy watch components are getting good at this these days). You also miss out on heritage and social cachet but those things can't really be measured objectively and are really just "x" factors, comparable to the "x" factor of assembling a watch yourself, or having something unique from a micro brand.
I have no dedicate watch retailers in my area. The only watchmaker I'm even aware of is at a pawn shop I frequent and he doesn't seem eager to take my money. I tried to get him to check one of my watches for magnetism, he just said if it's running it ain't magnetized. I bought a demagnetizer on aliexpress and took care of it myself. Works great now. Just last week I tried to get a quote on either servicing or swaping a movement in a different watch (an nh35). He wanted me to pay for a diagnostic first. I told him I didn't need that, just a quote for either service or swap w I th me providing the movement. He said $300 either way. Guess I'll be ordering a couple more tools.
We (the buyers) really have the upper hand on this. If the big brands want to only sell their proprietary tools and parts to "their" watchmakers then we simply don't need to buy their watches. There are more than enough smaller watch brands that offer insane value for the money who are more than willing to be nice to the people paying their bills (the customers) put them in that corner. Make them play nice.
Watchmaking is a good trade, more young people should get into it. It's always best to start out working for a big outfit if you can because they'll train you, but if you ever decide to set up your own shop, you don't need a lot of space and you're not using a bunch of nasty chemicals, so you could easily operate out of a spare bedroom.
I got a Breitling pretty cheap many years ago. I only paid $2,800 for it and I wore it all the time. I actually would use my dive watch while diving if you can believe it. It started to lose 5 minutes a month so I had it serviced in May 2023 for $1,800. That's stupid! It's a slightly modified ETA movement. Nothing special. I think retail back when I got it was like $4k and it cost almost half the retail price for a service? Oh yeah, it also took like two and a half months to get it back from Europe
My boss had an older 3 hand breitling. He got it wholesale for about $1k and then he had to service it like 3x in 10 years. Cost more to fix it than own it. He also had a BMW at the time which explains that logic lol. But we all love shiny things!
A service for $1,800 I hate to break it to ya but you been had and had badly. I only pay $350 at my Watchmaker to service my Rolex with the 3130 movement. I don't know why you go to the brand for servicing. I would never there's nothing magical about these movements that only the brand can do the work. These movements are standard. That any independent watchmaker could work on for alot less. I don't know if it's paranoia or what running to the brand. I would never want to rely on a brand like that
I service only what I plan on keeping, fun fact a Zeitwerk service can be close to $10k. My watchmaker is Metas 21 certified and a great friend one of the most skilled I have ever seen. Very picky about what he works on as he is employed full time for a MAJOR watch brand so side work is limited. Happy to have him work on my wrist clocks.
Over the last 20 years I’ve had to get a fair number of watches serviced. Like car dealerships, watch manufacturers are rather more expensive than independent places. Some are great like Chopard, some are dreadful like Corum and IWC which charged large and took months and months. My advice is buy a complicated big name watch only if you wish to be treated as though money meant little to you.
Here in Philippines there are many independent watchmakers. However finding the competent ones whom I can is the difficult task. Facebook groups helped me a lot
The asking price to service my 1976 Tissot PR-516 here in Switzerland was well over $1'500 🤪. It is an automatic watch with a date function (and yep, the exact same model that Roger Moore wore in "Live and Let Die"). Tissot do not service watches that are more than 15 years old I was told in their "boutique" here in Zürich. But they provided me with an address where I could have had it serviced for the amount mentioned above. I passed this offer (for which they wanted $75, which I refused to pay) and ended with another watchmaker who serviced the watch for $550 (still a lot for a watch that is worth $ 1'000 at best 😩). Anyway, while I understand that more and more watch brands e.g. Rolex want to have full control over their business (production, sale, service), they shot themselves in the foot with this strategy. How on earth are Rolex going to service the more than 1'000 000 watches they produce every year? Without independent watch makers, whom they have tried to drive out of business for a long time, this is impossible. So they have resorted to the tactic of making in-house servicing so expensive and time consuming that it frightens away customers, not that they were cheap in the last 40 years or so, though.
That was great. Short and you hit the main points. I’m older was thinking of sponsoring 3 people and sending them to watchmaker school. They should never be unemployed.
50 odd years ago I was seriously injured in a car crash. So badly that I could not continue in my profession. The UK’s disability laws in the ‘70s meant that I could retrain for any job I chose - one I was physically capable of, naturally. After aptitude tests it was recommended that I train as a watchmaker. The training was expensive but the government would cover the cost of tuition and living expenses for my wife and myself for the duration of the training. I thought the digital revolution would kill the watch trade and so I chose a different path. Somewhere along the line I became deeply fascinated by mechanical watches and became a collector in a small way. How I wish I had the foresight at 25 years old to have taken the opportunity to train as a watchmaker.
This is a good argument for buying mechanicals with workhorse movements suchs as Seiko NH35 & Miyota 8215, etc. You can enjoy the mechanical watch experience & never worry about servicing. If something goes wrong, a new movement is like $50 - $100.
I went to a Rolex shop they wouldn't let me in there was only 1 person in the shop the woman told me i would have to make a appointment, i was wearing shorts and t, shirt, then i showed her my dad's sudmariner on my wrist and walked away, she came running after please sir please sir come back i didn't, i have now sold the watch and bought many other watches to replace that rolex. I would never buy a Rolex customer service is terrible.
I don’t buy this story. You can walk in with a platinum Daytona and $40K cash in your hand and they aren’t chasing you down the street to come into their store. Very unlikely they even have the watch you want in the store.
@@FINAL-B0SS if you weren't there please don't comment and it will be on a security camera as it was in a mall in Bangkok. And yes I have just walked into a Rolex shop with no problems in the past but I was wearing a suit.
@@jersaunders3538 no Rolex sales person chased you down the street, when they suddenly had the realization that you could afford a watch. This isn’t the movie “Pretty Woman”. Didn’t happen as you described, especially if it was in the last 4 years.
@@FINAL-B0SS hay sorry final-boss my bad Yeap made it all up because I have so much time to waste, you are obviously a Rolex lover and maybe you weren't there yet you don't believe me. Maybe change your name to KAREN.
@@jersaunders3538this sort of thing does go on. Remember a couple of years ago a black lady was refused service in jewellers in Switzerland, the staff claiming that the items were out of her budget. The black lady's name was Oprah Winfrey!
Paying $1K+ for a Rolex service is insane. A super simple movement made completely via automation isn't any harder to service than an ETA 2892 but their customers are suckers anyway so hey why not? They already paid $10K+ for a watch that human hands didn't even touch lol what's another grand?
I have a 2004 Rolex date just. Serviced it in 2008 for $500 (pretty absurd back then considering I paid $4,800 for the watch new). I went to the local Rolex AD in my area and they want $900 plus any replacement parts. Went to independent and he quoted the same. I asked him why I would go with him if he is just as expensive as the AD? No good answer. Anyway, I’m not sure what to do. Watch runs fine. Very accurate. Have worn it every day since purchase. I’ve certainly gotten my money’s worth but I’d probably not buy another expensive watch again.
I’ve never went to an independent always brand servicing but thanks for the idea. I bought myself a Tag 4000 in 1987 and always had Tag service it (with 1yr guarantee) however it was last serviced in Oct 2004 and stopped running Dec 2005 🤦🏻♂️ I boxed it but been thinking about getting it sorted so will look out for a good independent 👍🏼
My solution is, I have an Invicta Pro Diver. Seiko movement, screw-in crown, 200 meters, and looks fantastic. If it needs an expensive cleaning, I can just buy another one for 75-80 bucks.
As an ex watchmaker I can tell you that it is impossible to get work outside the actual manufacturers. If they will not give you after market parts then there is no point openeing the watch to see whats wrong or just to service it. They want their cake and eat it. Most watchmakers now leave school and become skilled sales men who change batteries. As for when to service it, if it runs its always better to wait. A service is always a full strip, clean and re assemble. It has to be for us to garante that the watch is in fully working order. You may not do this to all your watches. Maybe just adjust the rate but then you sell it as checked, runs ok and does not need a serve at this moment.
It only takes about 3 years to become a watchmaker. So unless you're in your late 90's you probably aren't too old unless your hands shake or you can't see well enough using a loupe.
@@sophiasocal68I think he could be suffering from any of those if he said he's too old. I completely agree with what you say. I've seen people buy Invictas just to source an ETA movement. It is getting sad. These are our watches and these conglomerates still want ultimate control over them. True greed.
Great video topic. I have been researching the top watch making schools in the US and have noticed that there are only a handful and fewer are next to major cities from what I've been able to find. It's a very niche profession and will probably only get harder to find in the near future.
Just another example of these high end watch companies gouging the customer. Plus, they will devalue your watch by replacing a slightly patinaed dial for instance with a new one. Buy a $1000 watch and when it starts to play up, throw it away and buy a new one. Don't buy into the rollercoaster ride that is so called "luxury watches". After all, nobody NEEDS a watch these days anyway, the correct time is displayed everywhere.
The way I dealt with this problem was to enroll in a reputable watch repair school. (Compared with most I’m probably ahead of the game as I am already a clockmaker so I am very familiar with pinions, bushings, arbors and escapements, etc). The challenge that I am met with is keeping my 250 watches serviced without going broke. At an average of 700.00 each just for a cleaning that money adds up. So for me learning how to service my own watches makes the most sense.
Always enjoy your videos. Just a note - don't use cars as an example of service costs. 99.9% of cars are functional tools. A mechanical watch ceased to be a "tool" when quartz was introduced. Let's be honest, a mechanical watch is a symbol, and symbols don't have logic and reason as a foundation.
I had my Longines Avigation serviced about a year ago: about 500€, and a couple of months for shipping/return & work. I asked for an estimate for a service on my Breguet type XX recently: 6 weeks waiting time after sending in the watch to get a quote, then another 6 months before I get it back. I haven't sent it yet, but it should be somewhere in the 2-3k€ range according to the jewellery shop employee. It does have a flyback chrono so it requires more work. Also, Breguet apparently doesn't sell parts, maintenance has to be done in house...
Price of a coffee has gone up: Recently had a vintage 2824 serviced due to the watch stem having excess play in its tube (danger of water infiltration in movement mechanism). Very complex job which cost $500+ maintenance. Now: one has to remember that the cost of living in general has gone up so the cost of labour has also gone up as the parts also have increased in pricing. ETA lack of distribution of parts has made price skyrocketed! Recently read that even China chronograph movements ST 1901 are being uniquely sold to Chinese made watches mfgrs. thus servicing these will get extremely complicated & expensive $$$. 😢😢😢 The present economic crisis has change the the price of coffee everywhere!
Watches are disposable. Doesn’t matter how expensive they are. Wear your watch until it wears out, then buy a new one. Don’t bother with servicing unless it’s just to clean and oil the movement or replace gaskets.
I had my 1982 Seiko chronograph serviced by a vintage Seiko specialist. Full dissassembly, all parts cleaned in ultrasonic tank, reassembly and lubrication, new pusher grommets, bezel and caseback seals, new saphire crystal and adjusted and pressure tested for $599 AUD. Vintage Time Australia. He had a long waiting list. I sent the watch in November. In March I sent a message to ask how it was going and he said he was just starting to get onto November jobs.The watch is like new now and should be good for another 40 years.
Many watches become heirlooms denoting significant milestones or events important to the watch owner. Watches can be an emotional attachment to a lost loved one, something tangible you can hold in your hand making an eternal connection. How much would you "pay" for an experience like that?
Funny you did this video. I was talking about this with someone the other day. Both watches and servicing has gone up dramatically. So much that I plan to drastically reduce my vintage collection from servicing costs. I stopped buying anything Swatchgroup from their Eta supply fixing and doing unserviceable/disposable movements.
I paid the listed service price of JPY 138,000 for my seamaster chronograph. Took me a couple of years saving spare change for it, and finally pulling the trigger was tough, but still worth the money paid. It used to be really grainy to wind but is now smooth as butter. The case and bracelet are pretty much as good as new, too. One thing I was disappointed about was that I had heard other people going for official omega services got a travel case back. I did not. Oh well.
Found a Casio Digital on the road, cars run over it. Repaired, battery, diy. +27sec in 3,5 monthes. New ~20$. Just for fun! Lacking accuracy of my Seiko 5 I adjusted by diy, too. Watch services are normally bad and expensive. My IWC Ingenieur stopped working, I checked prices.....so much for a simple watch repair? Same with Montblanc, but that's off topic, no watch. No quality for a heap of cash.
I had my 2005 Baume Et Mercier Capeland S (Model No.65390) serviced in Oct 2023, it was sent to Switzerland as they now class it as vintage for under £500 previously it was done at their UK service partner for about £300
Corporations LOVE to wax poetic about “supply & demand” ……until THEY might have to PAY & COMPETE for good, reputable, Watch Makers. You , YOU corporations want us to pay small fortunes (anything > $5K imho) but will not employ the necessary skilled labor to maintain your very expensive hobby items. Really time for a less expensive hobby. I hear flying light air craft is fun……can’t be THAT expensive 😭🤮☠️. 💰😵💫. 😑
Ps All Eta2824, Sellita 200, PT5000 are best not over hand wound just a couple turns or shakes to get going. This avoids the main issue of teeth breaking under strain on winding gear a known issue. This also applies to some Tudor, Breitling and main other manufacturers who basically rename the Sellita 200
My GMT Master II is at the local Rolex dealer right now. $850 for complete service plus $125 for new crown and tube. This includes a new main spring and any other parts that are worn or broken and complete polish and refinishing. As to being the service person, no way. I could never be chained to a workbench, hunched over and looking at very small parts through an eye loop day after day after day. My two cents - If you can't afford the service, don't buy the watch.
It's not about money, I'll admit that it is definitely not in my budget, but you're being overcharged but apparently you like it. You think the movement even costs $500? You have a Rolex so more than likely a machine made it. Since Rolex is greedy and you don't take your own watch apart, what's to stop them from just dropping in a new movement? You wouldn't know anyway. If I was as greedy as they are that's exactly what I'd do to someone like you.
Interesting that some Certina and some Tissot models are offered in two versions, one quartz (sometimes thermocompensated) and one with an automatic movement, namely a Powermatic 80. The automatic version is more expensive. I’ve heard claims that service of a Powermatic 80 movement consists of replacing it. True?
Supposedly yes, as there are plastic gears / components that are just not servicable. They basically mass produce them, keep them on shelf, drop it in when you need to 'service" it, but in reality its an all new movement. The entry level pieces, too much labor $ is involved to service so they just replace. It's the same with almost all appliances and other consumer goods at this point.
@@paulbonaventura4969 My 2003 Citizen Eco-drive Tough chuggs on - never been serviced. My Seiko 300m 'Tuna' needed its 5-year battery changed after 8 years, no service required. I'm expecting more of the same from my SNE573
I only have one watch in my collection that I will bother getting serviced and thats my Sinn UX (battery and oil change). The rest of the Selita/ETA stuff will just have to keep running till it quits.
Nope, the truth is that I won't accept a 3000 chf salary in Switzerland, not for a 40h/week ! I'm a certified watchmaker in Switzerland, specialised in restoration and complications, I have a rent to pay and food to buy, so I want to get paid what I'm worth. That's simple as it get.
My grandfather said never service your watch only repair it If necessary. If it ain't broke don't fix it..just like anything else once you take it apart it will never be the same
Watch movement's were made to be taken apart for. maintenance .So this comment really doesn't make sense. No watch movement will run indefinitely without ever needing a service
As a watchmaker, this just isn't true. While at a shallow look this might make sense, services are to prevent further wear on your watch. During a service you replace worn down parts, and if you don't it will put more stress on the watch and even more parts will wear down faster. So instead of having 2 services at say $1000 each. You might have a repair at $2500-$3000 because sourcing parts can be very difficult and expensive depending on the brand. Just like with your car. If you drive it until it breaks down it will be way more expensive than just having it serviced regularly
Based on my conversations with a few watchmakers, many nowadays that graduate from watchmaking schools are skilled in assembling watches more than anything else. That's what many independents are suffering from. They simply can't find enough watchmakers that are skilled enough to even work on finishing. Also makes sense why so much of the manufacturing and development process is increasingly getting outsourced to Asia. The skilled manpower is simply not enough.
I recently bought some used mechanical watches that I had always wanted. Two of them had problems. I live in South Florida and IF you can find a watchmaker here, he will only want to fix Rolexes. I couldn't find anybody to work on them. I tried online watch repair and they wanted to rip me off. I finally changed my philosophy on watches. I buy nothing that costs more that 100 dollars. I wear it until it goes bad, then I toss it into the trash and buy another one. You can get some really nice watches for 100 bucks these days..!!! 😊
Correct. And it's why cheaper (actually most) mechanical watches are a poor buy. If you buy a Rolex today for (say) $10,000 it will be worth at least $10,000 in ten years time when it almost certainly needs a service costing $1,000. That's a plausible proposition. If you buy a Grand Seiko (or whatever) today for $10,000 it's worth 40% less the moment you exit the store. In ten years time it'll be minimally saleable, and it will almost certainly need a $1,000 service. That latter proposition makes nil sense to me. I own (from new) an excellent 1974 Seiko 'Jumbo' chronograph watch that's worth about $300. It would cost at least $300 (probably $600) to service it. So, it'll remain in the drawer, loved but unused, because it's losing 5 minutes a day. For clarity - I own two mechanical watches, one an expensive daily beater, and one very expensive dress watch. Both are worth the costs of servicing. My other watches are quartz, which will require very little servicing, beyond a battery. The lesson is ..........When buying, at least also consider retained value in relation to servicing costs. Cheap mechanical watches are effectively throw-aways once they need a major service. That applies particularly to Chinese replicas.
Something contributing to high service costs as well that I feel like you didn't really mention is tools. A watchmaker will have tools with a combined value of several hundred thousand dollars. Maybe upwards of a million dollars for authorized service centers for these brands. And you need those expensive high quality tools to do quality work. Tool upkeep and getting back what you spent on those tools is definitely a factor in the price as well
Obviously with Eta 2824 and its clones Seiko and Citizen it’s easier to learn how to replace the movement your self. This covers about 90% of Auto watches.
Cartier charge about 340UK pounds. They turn it around real quick and Polish it for free. My constellation service is 880 uk pounds but only needs service every 8 years minimum.
The drive for longer and longer power reserves does not help your watch, it just means parts wear out much faster. You don't leave your car engine running when not in use so why do it with a watch?
Lol I haven't raised my prices in five years. Still 50 bucks for the whole shebang. I use my own cleaning solutions and lubricants to keep cost down. I will say however, as a horologist of 9 years and a watchmaker of 3, you get what you pay for lmao.
I live in Bali Indonesia, to get my Omega Seamaster Planet Ocean 600m or my Breitling Superocean II full overhaul serviced by a very experienced horologist here is about US$230.
This is what's stopping me from purchasing a luxury brand; one day my kids will inherit a problem rather than an heirloom (I know first hand, i inherited a Rolex I can't afford to fix and now do not want to flip into other luxury watches). Instead I'm looking at watches with dirt cheap movements (seiko nh series mostly) but otherwise good specs (well finished 316L, sapphire, ceramic etc) so that my kids can inherit a well loved watch that can have the movement changed like you would change a battery.
@@arisaga822 I have a pre swatch group Lindbergh hour angle. This watch has sentimental value for me . I decided that swatch group service center was the best and safest option. In the service center I was treated as a lesser customer and felt like they wanted me to leave . After about 1+ full year I got the watch back from Switzerland and the watch was dirty and the service of 1200€ seemed to my , like I gave my watch to a local jeweller ... dirty and still with serious issues that should had been solved at Switzerland. So I had to send the watch back and I am still waiting 2 years for the watch to be properly serviced and arguing about the basics with customer service. I would like someday to make a video about it as there are many things I didn't describe here.
I had a not great experience with a 10 year old Omega that needed service. The price and timeframe were fine but they initially tried to claim that the crown threads were stripped and that I'd have to pay extra for it. They recanted after I began to get irate since the threads were perfectly fine when I had dropped it off for service. The case also came back polished poorly but I didn't want to risk taking it back to them again. So, it may be a Swatch group thing. I had a good experience with Tudor and UN, and slightly less than satisfactory experience with B&R.
I would love to learn how to work on watches but there isnt exactly somewhere most people can do that unless they're already very well off or mahbe live in Switzerland or japan already
thing is if you watch cost less than 500$ and got some small prob just thow it away ,, in some way it look like the better option is to buy watchers under 500 , and have them as disposable , just like what they make with swatch , buy one for 50-200 euro , when it stop working just thow it away ,, i have old orient , watch repair guy tell yee they don t make parts anymore ,, and servicing it will cost around 100 ,,, well i pay 20 for it ,, at some point i may get a chinise movment , and install it my serf
Honestly just have your watch serviced when in no longer works, they will charge you the same regardless if there is no issue or the whole movement is to be replaced. Lets be honest, 90% of us have a basic ETA or variant in all our automatic watches and they still charge you $400 plus which is the cost of a brand new top level 2824 or 2892. The only difference is rotor logo and maybe shock absorber. Really never send your watch to the actual manufacture unless it's under warranty. Find a trustworthy watchmaker. They will save you a whole lot. Also if your watch is slow or fast consider buying a $15 de-magnetic device....usually fixes that common issue.
In 2017 I serviced my Explorer 2 and twotoneDatejust for Aussie$3158,full service after over 10 years of wearing them nothing wrong just thought to service them so fully expected to pay premium at Rolex.It's a pittance compared to servicing my Mercedes(at a specialist NOT a dealer)."luxury "items you will pay luxury prices.Really you would'nt take it to jus anybody
Sold the Exp at the height of the hype for over 200% what I paid for it,kept the DJ,have to have a Rolex in the collection besides the fact it has some sentimental value
Servicing my cheap watch wouldnt make sense. I'd just buy a new movement for it lol. Ive had it for about 4 yrs... wear it literally constantly. Only take it off when I shower. And it keeps good enough time. Probably looses 3 minuets over the course of a week. If ever the movement gets so bad it's a problem, I'll buy a new one if there's something available.
I have heard many videos about servicing a watch every 5 or so years or not. I feel now if it’s not broken then don’t fix it. If I service my watch in 15 years versus every 5 years I have saved at least 2 thousand dollars. I am not purchasing to buy any more Rolexes. Give me a watch with a Sellita or ETA movement that can be serviced inexpensively or change out the movement. I am as happy with my 1000.00 Christopher Ward as I am my more expensive Rolex. As consumers we are allowing the more expensive watch makers dictate our wallets. Maybe we all should stop bowing down to the watch makers that are ripping us off with servicing fees
You buy a mechanical watch only if you know it is a limited series that might go up in value ...this is why I love my Citizen eco drive watches. Basically no service for 20 years and counting. They never break and are more accurate than an automatic watch !...also better quality materials than their competitors...
I would not service a watch unless it shows symptoms of needing a service. The chances are that I would be charged for a full service anyway, so why have the watch serviced if it is functioning well.
Many years of experience has shown me never to service a watch until it actually needs something. Not every x number of years or any other artificial criteria. If it’s broken or running poorly, then get it serviced…otherwise just keep wearing it.
That depends on the person. Some poeple buy Ferrari's with pocket money and take it the dealer for service and are living within their means. Some people finance Ferrari's whilst stretching their finances to make the payment then they bitch that an oil changes costs several thousand dollars as if they couldn't see it coming.
Meanwhile people crap on Seiko that on average can last 20+ years without a service. 😂 I received a Seiko from my father which was from my grandfather from the 50’s. When I started using it about 10+ years ago, 60+ years from its release…. It was running at +25sec p/day. - and my local watchmaker charged me $100 USD to get it cleaned and lubed.
People are very much the same as decades ago. They waite until a issue arises or a decade passes before servicing and become disappointed because of the high cost of repair. Millions globally were more than happy to switch to quartz causing the Quartz Crises in Switzerland. High-end mechanical always has been picey to buy and repair. Today those few watchmakers that have parts accounts commonly will not accept any work less than a full service.
Beards getting bushy man! And this’ what I like about my Grand Seiko 9F. 50 year service interval. But that doesn’t change for the rest of my watches 😅
We need right to repair in watchmaking. This is happening in every industry, electronics, cars, no parts available for independent watchmakers. In 2001 I bought my first citizen eco-drive watch, very accurate and never opened after more than 20 years. Ant there is my casio mudmaster gwg-1000-1a3er I appreciate mechanical watches, but I will never pay 2000 usd, for a service. I have an orient defender automatic watch, when it dies, that's it, it will go to the recycle bin.
It didn’t help that until 2010 watchmakers were the worst paid in the jewellery trade While the manufacturers have been reducing their training so that staff can only do part of the job, like oil the train
Parts from tbe manufacturer and labour scarcity I dont buy as reasons. They either have them or they dont. Offer some kid half what it costs to service a Rolex as a daily wage and there would be no shortage of applicants to learn how to service watches. I also disagree about routine maintenance. Its not an old Ferrari, it doesnt need new timing belt every 2 years. If its not broke dont fix it. If it needs an oil change it will run slow. Cheers
I bought my new in the box Omega Seamaster 120 in 1971 for $63. It was my daily tool watch. I sent it Switzerland for factory service in 1988 that cost less than $200. I had independent watchmaker service since then. But about five years ago Omega stopped selling parts to anyone other than their authorized service centers. Last I checked a couple of years ago Omega wanted $1200 + parts to service my watch. I'm retired now so I can't afford that. My Seamaster is a display piece now. I wear Seiko and Casio now.
Thats a shame. Parts can be had if you have the right friends, but the behaviour of the swatch group and others regarding limiting right to repair is outrageous. Even in this video Jory keeps saying ‘their watches’ instead of our watches.
My Dad bought a Seamaster in Switzerland in 1965. As far as I know he never had it serviced. When it became unreliable around 1985 he just stopped wearing it and bought a quartz Tissot. He let me have it. A watchmaker cleaned it but said that it had run with insufficient lubrication for years and the jewels should be replaced, or words to that effect. It kept time poorly, I didn’t want to spend the money for a complete overhaul… eventually it was stolen.
Now I wear thermocompensated quartz or atomic-clock-sync watches.
I'm so sorry for your Oméga...
...i think they prefer selling watches than repairing them !
Maybe asking to a independant watch service ?
They are denying parts. This has to go against the right to repair. People beat up Apple about it but according to what you're saying, Omega and Rolex need to be next in line.
Yep that sounds like the lame activities of the Swatch group
Some watch companies don't seem to want customers, let alone employees.
sums up swatch group
(Cough noise) Rolex. 🫢
Had my orient tri star since high school and haven’t serviced it in 13 years. Still keeps time well.
For many brands it must now be cheaper to simply replace movements rather than servicing them.
was thinking the same thing
Supposedly from another video I saw, that is EXACTLY what they do (save the higher end true luxury brands). They have movements on the shelf ready to drop in on most of the mass produced movements. They drop it in, take your old one, send it to Indonesia where they refurbish it, send it back to the service centers and then it will go into another watch.
Another reason to not be all-in on in-house movements. While I don't have the ability to do a full service on a mechanical watch, I can (and do) replace movements and regulate them pretty reliably.
I would totally agree with you. They do not have the time to service the watches and the movements are made of materials of lesser quality.
I have an AP royal oak offshore, purchased from AP in 2019. I have many watches and this piece was worn maybe once every 3 weeks, stored in good conditions in a safe. In 2022 before the warranty was up, the time keeping was just terrible, it kept losing time and naturally I took it back expecting AP to fix the issue for free. After considerable effort just to get an appointment at the service Center (in Singapore, where they literally have a boutique 5 min drive or 20 min walk from home - I had to go to another one because that branch wouldn’t even respond) AP assessed the watch and claimed it had received a significant impact and this was not what the warranty was for and asked for $2k (usd) to fix the watch. Now I can categorically tell you that this watch never ever received such an impact and was looked after very well (when I pay $25k for a watch I’m looking after it as this reflects a significant cost for me). Suitably pissed off with no other option I paid the money. But I can tell you I’ll never buy an AP again. A total fraud with terrible service, they should be ashamed of themselves for not recognising their own shoddy workmanship. For context I have watches from Patek, Rolex, Lange etc, and never an issue.
Step one should be maintenance when needed. If a watch is in a collection not being worn often, it doesn’t need servicing. If a watch is being worn, it’s less than 10 years since the last service and it is running OK it doesn’t need a service. Step two is definitely find a local independent if you’re a collector. They can work with you and your collection, doing just work that’s needed.
I am a professional watchmaker of 37 years! The cost has gone up because there are fewer of us and equipment costs have gone sky high!
Professionally trained watchmaker for 37 years! Try buying tools an equipment these days
Been collecting watches for about 25 years and it that time. I only serviced 2 watches . Automatic watches are a lot more robust than some might think. My watch journey has been hassle free and I NEVER service through the brand. There's nothing magical about these movements that a independent watchmaker can't do. My watchmaker charges me $350 for a Rolex service.The only time I understand going to the brand. If the movement is a highly complicated movement but running to the brand to service a ETA or Selita? Not a chance
Rolex are making it harder for independents to get their watch parts so you may be forced to use them in the future.
@@garyboyle695As the saying goes. I'll cross that bridge when I get to it. As of right now my watchmaker has no issues getting parts for the 3130
@@garyboyle695As the saying goes. I'll cross that bridge when I get to it. As of right now my Watchmaker has no issues getting parts
Easy way to keep maintenance costs down, is to wear watches, that use commonly available movements. Selita, ETA, Seiko, Seagull (not anymore right?) because independent watchmakers/repair shops can easily source parts for those, and work on them, as opposed to say a Patek perpetual calendar, which is 100% in house, and only they can source parts.
Let's be real if you can afford pateks you should be able to afford their servicing fees
@@Dazulolwarrior also very true.
@@FoAmY99 U have to send the watch away, if the watch reaches the place or not....same vice versa. Watches r "lost" easily...
That's why I only have a few high-end / in-house movement pieces. The rest are mainly NH-35 and variants which I service myself... by just replacing the whole movement when the need arises. Last month I replaced a SW200-1 in my Sinn Pilot EZM9 after being quoted over 400 EUR for service - I know a guy that is starting a microbrand and he orders premium SW200-1s directly from Sellita and he sold me one for the price he gets them in bulk, which is just a bit over 100 EUR. 30 mins later and my Sinn is happily ticking with even better accuracy than when I bought it...
$100 for a movement makes me feel like a schlub when we pay over $1000 for the watch (of course, case, assembly, shipping, advertising, commissions, etc are part of the cost of doing business).
Semantics: just swapping out the movement hardly counts as being able to service yourself
@@MegaThucydides Fair, should've used quotes around 'service' - when it comes to working on the movement(s) themselves my skills end at replacing the date wheel on a NH35 and a the rotor on several different movements😅 Still, straight replacing beats paying exuberant prices for servicing confection movements - I'd argue that, if you can get a new, good graded and well protected movement from the manufacturer, replacing the movement is better than servicing it from a point of reliability. The downside is that it's a bit wasteful...
@@zwerko You are still a thousand times more skilled with watches than I. Kudos to you sir!
I agree on the waste, but economics being what it is. Look on the bright side, now you have a cheap throwaway movement to practice your watchmaking skills on
NH series movements are where it's at; 40 Canadian dollars to replace it myself? Yes please.
You can spend more money on the rest of the watch and get quality specs like sapphire and ceramic pretty cheap as well. Automatic watches that can last a lifetime with a movement swap or two can be had for very little these days. The only real thing you're paying for with luxury brands is a somewhat better fit and finish (honestly, even the cheap brands or diy watch components are getting good at this these days).
You also miss out on heritage and social cachet but those things can't really be measured objectively and are really just "x" factors, comparable to the "x" factor of assembling a watch yourself, or having something unique from a micro brand.
I have no dedicate watch retailers in my area. The only watchmaker I'm even aware of is at a pawn shop I frequent and he doesn't seem eager to take my money. I tried to get him to check one of my watches for magnetism, he just said if it's running it ain't magnetized. I bought a demagnetizer on aliexpress and took care of it myself. Works great now.
Just last week I tried to get a quote on either servicing or swaping a movement in a different watch (an nh35). He wanted me to pay for a diagnostic first. I told him I didn't need that, just a quote for either service or swap w I th me providing the movement. He said $300 either way. Guess I'll be ordering a couple more tools.
Let another watchmaker come to town - bet he’ll start jumpin’…
We (the buyers) really have the upper hand on this. If the big brands want to only sell their proprietary tools and parts to "their" watchmakers then we simply don't need to buy their watches. There are more than enough smaller watch brands that offer insane value for the money who are more than willing to be nice to the people paying their bills (the customers) put them in that corner. Make them play nice.
Watchmaking is a good trade, more young people should get into it. It's always best to start out working for a big outfit if you can because they'll train you, but if you ever decide to set up your own shop, you don't need a lot of space and you're not using a bunch of nasty chemicals, so you could easily operate out of a spare bedroom.
I would like to be a watchmaker. My eyes won't like it though.
It's a dying trade that's for sure.
Wages are low, so nobody want to be one.
I got a Breitling pretty cheap many years ago. I only paid $2,800 for it and I wore it all the time. I actually would use my dive watch while diving if you can believe it. It started to lose 5 minutes a month so I had it serviced in May 2023 for $1,800. That's stupid! It's a slightly modified ETA movement. Nothing special. I think retail back when I got it was like $4k and it cost almost half the retail price for a service? Oh yeah, it also took like two and a half months to get it back from Europe
My boss had an older 3 hand breitling. He got it wholesale for about $1k and then he had to service it like 3x in 10 years. Cost more to fix it than own it. He also had a BMW at the time which explains that logic lol.
But we all love shiny things!
A service for $1,800 I hate to break it to ya but you been had and had badly. I only pay $350 at my Watchmaker to service my Rolex with the 3130 movement. I don't know why you go to the brand for servicing. I would never there's nothing magical about these movements that only the brand can do the work. These movements are standard. That any independent watchmaker could work on for alot less. I don't know if it's paranoia or what running to the brand. I would never want to rely on a brand like that
I service only what I plan on keeping, fun fact a Zeitwerk service can be close to $10k. My watchmaker is Metas 21 certified and a great friend one of the most skilled I have ever seen. Very picky about what he works on as he is employed full time for a MAJOR watch brand so side work is limited. Happy to have him work on my wrist clocks.
Over the last 20 years I’ve had to get a fair number of watches serviced. Like car dealerships, watch manufacturers are rather more expensive than independent places. Some are great like Chopard, some are dreadful like Corum and IWC which charged large and took months and months. My advice is buy a complicated big name watch only if you wish to be treated as though money meant little to you.
Here in Philippines there are many independent watchmakers. However finding the competent ones whom I can is the difficult task. Facebook groups helped me a lot
The asking price to service my 1976 Tissot PR-516 here in Switzerland was well over $1'500 🤪. It is an automatic watch with a date function (and yep, the exact same model that Roger Moore wore in "Live and Let Die"). Tissot do not service watches that are more than 15 years old I was told in their "boutique" here in Zürich. But they provided me with an address where I could have had it serviced for the amount mentioned above. I passed this offer (for which they wanted $75, which I refused to pay) and ended with another watchmaker who serviced the watch for $550 (still a lot for a watch that is worth $ 1'000 at best 😩). Anyway, while I understand that more and more watch brands e.g. Rolex want to have full control over their business (production, sale, service), they shot themselves in the foot with this strategy. How on earth are Rolex going to service the more than 1'000 000 watches they produce every year? Without independent watch makers, whom they have tried to drive out of business for a long time, this is impossible. So they have resorted to the tactic of making in-house servicing so expensive and time consuming that it frightens away customers, not that they were cheap in the last 40 years or so, though.
That was great. Short and you hit the main points. I’m older was thinking of sponsoring 3 people and sending them to watchmaker school. They should never be unemployed.
50 odd years ago I was seriously injured in a car crash. So badly that I could not continue in my profession. The UK’s disability laws in the ‘70s meant that I could retrain for any job I chose - one I was physically capable of, naturally. After aptitude tests it was recommended that I train as a watchmaker. The training was expensive but the government would cover the cost of tuition and living expenses for my wife and myself for the duration of the training.
I thought the digital revolution would kill the watch trade and so I chose a different path. Somewhere along the line I became deeply fascinated by mechanical watches and became a collector in a small way. How I wish I had the foresight at 25 years old to have taken the opportunity to train as a watchmaker.
This is a good argument for buying mechanicals with workhorse movements suchs as Seiko NH35 & Miyota 8215, etc. You can enjoy the mechanical watch experience & never worry about servicing. If something goes wrong, a new movement is like $50 - $100.
I went to a Rolex shop they wouldn't let me in there was only 1 person in the shop the woman told me i would have to make a appointment, i was wearing shorts and t, shirt, then i showed her my dad's sudmariner on my wrist and walked away, she came running after please sir please sir come back i didn't, i have now sold the watch and bought many other watches to replace that rolex. I would never buy a Rolex customer service is terrible.
I don’t buy this story. You can walk in with a platinum Daytona and $40K cash in your hand and they aren’t chasing you down the street to come into their store. Very unlikely they even have the watch you want in the store.
@@FINAL-B0SS if you weren't there please don't comment and it will be on a security camera as it was in a mall in Bangkok. And yes I have just walked into a Rolex shop with no problems in the past but I was wearing a suit.
@@jersaunders3538 no Rolex sales person chased you down the street, when they suddenly had the realization that you could afford a watch. This isn’t the movie “Pretty Woman”. Didn’t happen as you described, especially if it was in the last 4 years.
@@FINAL-B0SS hay sorry final-boss my bad Yeap made it all up because I have so much time to waste, you are obviously a Rolex lover and maybe you weren't there yet you don't believe me. Maybe change your name to KAREN.
@@jersaunders3538this sort of thing does go on. Remember a couple of years ago a black lady was refused service in jewellers in Switzerland, the staff claiming that the items were out of her budget. The black lady's name was Oprah Winfrey!
Paying $1K+ for a Rolex service is insane. A super simple movement made completely via automation isn't any harder to service than an ETA 2892 but their customers are suckers anyway so hey why not? They already paid $10K+ for a watch that human hands didn't even touch lol what's another grand?
My independent watchmaker charges $350 for a service on a 3130 movement. I would NEVER service it at Rolex
@@lonewolfemcquade8133 - $350 is a deal. Or just buy a Casio digital and never service it. Casio is $30.
I have a 2004 Rolex date just. Serviced it in 2008 for $500 (pretty absurd back then considering I paid $4,800 for the watch new).
I went to the local Rolex AD in my area and they want $900 plus any replacement parts.
Went to independent and he quoted the same. I asked him why I would go with him if he is just as expensive as the AD?
No good answer.
Anyway, I’m not sure what to do. Watch runs fine. Very accurate. Have worn it every day since purchase. I’ve certainly gotten my money’s worth but I’d probably not buy another expensive watch again.
I’ve never went to an independent always brand servicing but thanks for the idea. I bought myself a Tag 4000 in 1987 and always had Tag service it (with 1yr guarantee) however it was last serviced in Oct 2004 and stopped running Dec 2005 🤦🏻♂️ I boxed it but been thinking about getting it sorted so will look out for a good independent 👍🏼
My solution is, I have an Invicta Pro Diver. Seiko movement, screw-in crown, 200 meters, and looks fantastic. If it needs an expensive cleaning, I can just buy another one for 75-80 bucks.
As an ex watchmaker I can tell you that it is impossible to get work outside the actual manufacturers. If they will not give you after market parts then there is no point openeing the watch to see whats wrong or just to service it. They want their cake and eat it. Most watchmakers now leave school and become skilled sales men who change batteries. As for when to service it, if it runs its always better to wait. A service is always a full strip, clean and re assemble. It has to be for us to garante that the watch is in fully working order. You may not do this to all your watches. Maybe just adjust the rate but then you sell it as checked, runs ok and does not need a serve at this moment.
If I had it to do over again I would definitely check out a watchmaking or servicing school. I'm way too old now.
It only takes about 3 years to become a watchmaker. So unless you're in your late 90's you probably aren't too old unless your hands shake or you can't see well enough using a loupe.
@@sophiasocal68I think he could be suffering from any of those if he said he's too old. I completely agree with what you say. I've seen people buy Invictas just to source an ETA movement. It is getting sad. These are our watches and these conglomerates still want ultimate control over them. True greed.
Get yourself a watch with a 7750, that shit is a tank.
Great video topic. I have been researching the top watch making schools in the US and have noticed that there are only a handful and fewer are next to major cities from what I've been able to find. It's a very niche profession and will probably only get harder to find in the near future.
Just another example of these high end watch companies gouging the customer. Plus, they will devalue your watch by replacing a slightly patinaed dial for instance with a new one. Buy a $1000 watch and when it starts to play up, throw it away and buy a new one. Don't buy into the rollercoaster ride that is so called "luxury watches". After all, nobody NEEDS a watch these days anyway, the correct time is displayed everywhere.
Sign me in for watchmaker school. I would move to Switzerland.
The way I dealt with this problem was to enroll in a reputable watch repair school. (Compared with most I’m probably ahead of the game as I am already a clockmaker so I am very familiar with pinions, bushings, arbors and escapements, etc). The challenge that I am met with is keeping my 250 watches serviced without going broke. At an average of 700.00 each just for a cleaning that money adds up. So for me learning how to service my own watches makes the most sense.
Always enjoy your videos. Just a note - don't use cars as an example of service costs. 99.9% of cars are functional tools. A mechanical watch ceased to be a "tool" when quartz was introduced. Let's be honest, a mechanical watch is a symbol, and symbols don't have logic and reason as a foundation.
Good to see you’re back!
I had my Longines Avigation serviced about a year ago: about 500€, and a couple of months for shipping/return & work.
I asked for an estimate for a service on my Breguet type XX recently: 6 weeks waiting time after sending in the watch to get a quote, then another 6 months before I get it back. I haven't sent it yet, but it should be somewhere in the 2-3k€ range according to the jewellery shop employee. It does have a flyback chrono so it requires more work. Also, Breguet apparently doesn't sell parts, maintenance has to be done in house...
Price of a coffee has gone up:
Recently had a vintage 2824 serviced due to the watch stem having excess play in its tube (danger of water infiltration in movement mechanism). Very complex job which cost $500+ maintenance. Now: one has to remember that the cost of living in general has gone up so the cost of labour has also gone up as the parts also have increased in pricing. ETA lack of distribution of parts has made price skyrocketed! Recently read that even China chronograph movements ST 1901 are being uniquely sold to Chinese made watches mfgrs. thus servicing these will get extremely complicated & expensive $$$. 😢😢😢 The present economic crisis has change the the price of coffee everywhere!
Watches are disposable. Doesn’t matter how expensive they are. Wear your watch until it wears out, then buy a new one. Don’t bother with servicing unless it’s just to clean and oil the movement or replace gaskets.
I had my 1982 Seiko chronograph serviced by a vintage Seiko specialist. Full dissassembly, all parts cleaned in ultrasonic tank, reassembly and lubrication, new pusher grommets, bezel and caseback seals, new saphire crystal and adjusted and pressure tested for $599 AUD. Vintage Time Australia. He had a long waiting list. I sent the watch in November. In March I sent a message to ask how it was going and he said he was just starting to get onto November jobs.The watch is like new now and should be good for another 40 years.
Many watches become heirlooms denoting significant milestones or events important to the watch owner. Watches can be an emotional attachment to a lost loved one, something tangible you can hold in your hand making an eternal connection. How much would you "pay" for an experience like that?
$800...even if I was swimming in money, I won't give them what is equivalent to a nice watch just to service a watch. I just can't.
Time Teller lies. The pun WAS intended.
Funny you did this video. I was talking about this with someone the other day. Both watches and servicing has gone up dramatically. So much that I plan to drastically reduce my vintage collection from servicing costs. I stopped buying anything Swatchgroup from their Eta supply fixing and doing unserviceable/disposable movements.
I paid the listed service price of JPY 138,000 for my seamaster chronograph. Took me a couple of years saving spare change for it, and finally pulling the trigger was tough, but still worth the money paid. It used to be really grainy to wind but is now smooth as butter. The case and bracelet are pretty much as good as new, too.
One thing I was disappointed about was that I had heard other people going for official omega services got a travel case back. I did not. Oh well.
Found a Casio Digital on the road, cars run over it. Repaired, battery, diy. +27sec in 3,5 monthes. New ~20$. Just for fun! Lacking accuracy of my Seiko 5 I adjusted by diy, too. Watch services are normally bad and expensive. My IWC Ingenieur stopped working, I checked prices.....so much for a simple watch repair? Same with Montblanc, but that's off topic, no watch. No quality for a heap of cash.
I had my 2005 Baume Et Mercier Capeland S (Model No.65390) serviced in Oct 2023, it was sent to Switzerland as they now class it as vintage for under £500 previously it was done at their UK service partner for about £300
Awesome video as always! Great advice and true advice 👍🏻
🤝👍
Bought my Speedmaster in 2007, never had it serviced, runs fine.
Corporations LOVE to wax poetic about “supply & demand” ……until THEY might have to PAY & COMPETE for good, reputable, Watch Makers. You , YOU corporations want us to pay small fortunes (anything > $5K imho) but will not employ the necessary skilled labor to maintain your very expensive hobby items. Really time for a less expensive hobby. I hear flying light air craft is fun……can’t be THAT expensive 😭🤮☠️. 💰😵💫. 😑
Ps All Eta2824, Sellita 200, PT5000 are best not over hand wound just a couple turns or shakes to get going. This avoids the main issue of teeth breaking under strain on winding gear a known issue. This also applies to some Tudor, Breitling and main other manufacturers who basically rename the Sellita 200
My GMT Master II is at the local Rolex dealer right now. $850 for complete service plus $125 for new crown and tube. This includes a new main spring and any other parts that are worn or broken and complete polish and refinishing. As to being the service person, no way. I could never be chained to a workbench, hunched over and looking at very small parts through an eye loop day after day after day. My two cents - If you can't afford the service, don't buy the watch.
It's not about money, I'll admit that it is definitely not in my budget, but you're being overcharged but apparently you like it. You think the movement even costs $500? You have a Rolex so more than likely a machine made it. Since Rolex is greedy and you don't take your own watch apart, what's to stop them from just dropping in a new movement? You wouldn't know anyway. If I was as greedy as they are that's exactly what I'd do to someone like you.
Interesting that some Certina and some Tissot models are offered in two versions, one quartz (sometimes thermocompensated) and one with an automatic movement, namely a Powermatic 80. The automatic version is more expensive.
I’ve heard claims that service of a Powermatic 80 movement consists of replacing it. True?
Supposedly yes, as there are plastic gears / components that are just not servicable. They basically mass produce them, keep them on shelf, drop it in when you need to 'service" it, but in reality its an all new movement.
The entry level pieces, too much labor $ is involved to service so they just replace.
It's the same with almost all appliances and other consumer goods at this point.
Buy seiko then. You don't need to service them
Stainless steel solar quartz has its positives!
Especially if it's got a perpetual calendar! Downside is that capacitor can die after 10 years.
You can get some of those replaced. Or it is time to buy a new watch. 😂
@@paulbonaventura4969 My 2003 Citizen Eco-drive Tough chuggs on - never been serviced. My Seiko 300m 'Tuna' needed its 5-year battery changed after 8 years, no service required. I'm expecting more of the same from my SNE573
I only have one watch in my collection that I will bother getting serviced and thats my Sinn UX (battery and oil change). The rest of the Selita/ETA stuff will just have to keep running till it quits.
One way to insulate yourself from this is to only own a small handful of watches. Large collections are always going to be a massive resource sink.
Nope, the truth is that I won't accept a 3000 chf salary in Switzerland, not for a 40h/week ! I'm a certified watchmaker in Switzerland, specialised in restoration and complications, I have a rent to pay and food to buy, so I want to get paid what I'm worth. That's simple as it get.
My grandfather said never service your watch only repair it If necessary. If it ain't broke don't fix it..just like anything else once you take it apart it will never be the same
Great idea. Just wait until something breaks then replace a bunch of parts. Got it.
Watch movement's were made to be taken apart for. maintenance .So this comment really doesn't make sense. No watch movement will run indefinitely without ever needing a service
Makes no sense when it comes to a mechanical watch.
thats absolutely right. same as any car bike scooter engine
As a watchmaker, this just isn't true. While at a shallow look this might make sense, services are to prevent further wear on your watch. During a service you replace worn down parts, and if you don't it will put more stress on the watch and even more parts will wear down faster. So instead of having 2 services at say $1000 each. You might have a repair at $2500-$3000 because sourcing parts can be very difficult and expensive depending on the brand. Just like with your car. If you drive it until it breaks down it will be way more expensive than just having it serviced regularly
Based on my conversations with a few watchmakers, many nowadays that graduate from watchmaking schools are skilled in assembling watches more than anything else. That's what many independents are suffering from. They simply can't find enough watchmakers that are skilled enough to even work on finishing. Also makes sense why so much of the manufacturing and development process is increasingly getting outsourced to Asia. The skilled manpower is simply not enough.
That's why i don't mind having a PRX. I know the movement is completely tossed away and replaced and the case/bracelet polished ( if requested).
I recently bought some used mechanical watches that I had always wanted. Two of them had problems. I live in South Florida and IF you can find a watchmaker here, he will only want to fix Rolexes. I couldn't find anybody to work on them. I tried online watch repair and they wanted to rip me off. I finally changed my philosophy on watches. I buy nothing that costs more that 100 dollars. I wear it until it goes bad, then I toss it into the trash and buy another one. You can get some really nice watches for 100 bucks these days..!!! 😊
Tudor date day 36 mm, service at Rolex AD, $500 service, two gold rolled links $200, new glass $100 , total cost $800.00.
Correct. And it's why cheaper (actually most) mechanical watches are a poor buy.
If you buy a Rolex today for (say) $10,000 it will be worth at least $10,000 in ten years time when it almost certainly needs a service costing $1,000. That's a plausible proposition. If you buy a Grand Seiko (or whatever) today for $10,000 it's worth 40% less the moment you exit the store. In ten years time it'll be minimally saleable, and it will almost certainly need a $1,000 service. That latter proposition makes nil sense to me.
I own (from new) an excellent 1974 Seiko 'Jumbo' chronograph watch that's worth about $300. It would cost at least $300 (probably $600) to service it. So, it'll remain in the drawer, loved but unused, because it's losing 5 minutes a day.
For clarity - I own two mechanical watches, one an expensive daily beater, and one very expensive dress watch. Both are worth the costs of servicing. My other watches are quartz, which will require very little servicing, beyond a battery.
The lesson is ..........When buying, at least also consider retained value in relation to servicing costs. Cheap mechanical watches are effectively throw-aways once they need a major service. That applies particularly to Chinese replicas.
Something contributing to high service costs as well that I feel like you didn't really mention is tools. A watchmaker will have tools with a combined value of several hundred thousand dollars. Maybe upwards of a million dollars for authorized service centers for these brands. And you need those expensive high quality tools to do quality work. Tool upkeep and getting back what you spent on those tools is definitely a factor in the price as well
Obviously with Eta 2824 and its clones Seiko and Citizen it’s easier to learn how to replace the movement your self. This covers about 90% of Auto watches.
Cartier charge about 340UK pounds. They turn it around real quick and Polish it for free. My constellation service is 880 uk pounds but only needs service every 8 years minimum.
I love my Citizen eco drives! Almost maintenance free
The drive for longer and longer power reserves does not help your watch, it just means parts wear out much faster. You don't leave your car engine running when not in use so why do it with a watch?
Lol I haven't raised my prices in five years. Still 50 bucks for the whole shebang. I use my own cleaning solutions and lubricants to keep cost down. I will say however, as a horologist of 9 years and a watchmaker of 3, you get what you pay for lmao.
I live in Bali Indonesia, to get my Omega Seamaster Planet Ocean 600m or my Breitling Superocean II full overhaul serviced by a very experienced horologist here is about US$230.
I have just had my tag carrera at a cost £395 but took 8weeks.
This is what's stopping me from purchasing a luxury brand; one day my kids will inherit a problem rather than an heirloom (I know first hand, i inherited a Rolex I can't afford to fix and now do not want to flip into other luxury watches).
Instead I'm looking at watches with dirt cheap movements (seiko nh series mostly) but otherwise good specs (well finished 316L, sapphire, ceramic etc) so that my kids can inherit a well loved watch that can have the movement changed like you would change a battery.
An old watchmaker I knew for many years told me...if it's running, no need for a service!
RIP, John.
nicely done
I have a Rolex Explorer which needs a repair/service, and am worried about the cost.
$900 starting if you send to Rolex.
My watchmaker charges me $350 for a service on my EXP1 114270 and 14060m Submariner both have the 3130 movement.
I serviced my Longines watch at an authorized service center and it was the worst possible treatment for the watch and for myself...
Do tell, why was that? I have a hydroquest in the rotation so I’m curious.
Could you elaborate? I got a Legend Diver that will need to go in soon, so quite curious what your experience was.
@@arisaga822 I have a pre swatch group Lindbergh hour angle. This watch has sentimental value for me . I decided that swatch group service center was the best and safest option. In the service center I was treated as a lesser customer and felt like they wanted me to leave . After about 1+ full year I got the watch back from Switzerland and the watch was dirty and the service of 1200€ seemed to my , like I gave my watch to a local jeweller ... dirty and still with serious issues that should had been solved at Switzerland. So I had to send the watch back and I am still waiting 2 years for the watch to be properly serviced and arguing about the basics with customer service. I would like someday to make a video about it as there are many things I didn't describe here.
Would love to hear the details. I have a hydroconquest that is 8 years old and needs to go in soon. Also planning on getting a legend diver next month
I had a not great experience with a 10 year old Omega that needed service. The price and timeframe were fine but they initially tried to claim that the crown threads were stripped and that I'd have to pay extra for it. They recanted after I began to get irate since the threads were perfectly fine when I had dropped it off for service. The case also came back polished poorly but I didn't want to risk taking it back to them again. So, it may be a Swatch group thing.
I had a good experience with Tudor and UN, and slightly less than satisfactory experience with B&R.
I would love to learn how to work on watches but there isnt exactly somewhere most people can do that unless they're already very well off or mahbe live in Switzerland or japan already
You can do it online. Just look up learn watchmaking
thing is if you watch cost less than 500$ and got some small prob just thow it away ,, in some way it look like the better option is to buy watchers under 500 , and have them as disposable , just like what they make with swatch , buy one for 50-200 euro , when it stop working just thow it away ,, i have old orient , watch repair guy tell yee they don t make parts anymore ,, and servicing it will cost around 100 ,,, well i pay 20 for it ,, at some point i may get a chinise movment , and install it my serf
Honestly just have your watch serviced when in no longer works, they will charge you the same regardless if there is no issue or the whole movement is to be replaced. Lets be honest, 90% of us have a basic ETA or variant in all our automatic watches and they still charge you $400 plus which is the cost of a brand new top level 2824 or 2892. The only difference is rotor logo and maybe shock absorber. Really never send your watch to the actual manufacture unless it's under warranty. Find a trustworthy watchmaker. They will save you a whole lot. Also if your watch is slow or fast consider buying a $15 de-magnetic device....usually fixes that common issue.
When I went to watchmaking school in the 1980’s the average age of a watchmaker was 63 years old. I am now 62.
In 2017 I serviced my Explorer 2 and twotoneDatejust for Aussie$3158,full service after over 10 years of wearing them nothing wrong just thought to service them so fully expected to pay premium at Rolex.It's a pittance compared to servicing my Mercedes(at a specialist NOT a dealer)."luxury "items you will pay luxury prices.Really you would'nt take it to jus anybody
The Rolex movement is not anymore complicated than a high grade ETA, you are paying a huge premium when you get it serviced.
Sold the Exp at the height of the hype for over 200% what I paid for it,kept the DJ,have to have a Rolex in the collection besides the fact it has some sentimental value
Servicing my cheap watch wouldnt make sense. I'd just buy a new movement for it lol.
Ive had it for about 4 yrs... wear it literally constantly. Only take it off when I shower.
And it keeps good enough time. Probably looses 3 minuets over the course of a week.
If ever the movement gets so bad it's a problem, I'll buy a new one if there's something available.
I have heard many videos about servicing a watch every 5 or so years or not. I feel now if it’s not broken then don’t fix it. If I service my watch in 15 years versus every 5 years I have saved at least 2 thousand dollars. I am not purchasing to buy any more Rolexes. Give me a watch with a Sellita or ETA movement that can be serviced inexpensively or change out the movement. I am as happy with my 1000.00 Christopher Ward as I am my more expensive Rolex. As consumers we are allowing the more expensive watch makers dictate our wallets. Maybe we all should stop bowing down to the watch makers that are ripping us off with servicing fees
The only solution is the one and only F-91W. A service job consists of simply buying another watch for $10 😂
You buy a mechanical watch only if you know it is a limited series that might go up in value ...this is why I love my Citizen eco drive watches. Basically no service for 20 years and counting. They never break and are more accurate than an automatic watch !...also better quality materials than their competitors...
Hey do you think you could share your watchmakers contact info?
They are linked in the bio of this episode!
I would not service a watch unless it shows symptoms of needing a service. The chances are that I would be charged for a full service anyway, so why have the watch serviced if it is functioning well.
Many years of experience has shown me never to service a watch until it actually needs something. Not every x number of years or any other artificial criteria. If it’s broken or running poorly, then get it serviced…otherwise just keep wearing it.
Over the years I have owned a nuber of "luxury" watches, loved them and paid for service both routine and necessary . Today the answer is quartz .
Just guessing if you have enough money to buy a 50K+ watch, the service cost every 10 years is imperceptible/pocket money.
That depends on the person. Some poeple buy Ferrari's with pocket money and take it the dealer for service and are living within their means. Some people finance Ferrari's whilst stretching their finances to make the payment then they bitch that an oil changes costs several thousand dollars as if they couldn't see it coming.
Meanwhile people crap on Seiko that on average can last 20+ years without a service. 😂
I received a Seiko from my father which was from my grandfather from the 50’s. When I started using it about 10+ years ago, 60+ years from its release…. It was running at +25sec p/day. - and my local watchmaker charged me $100 USD to get it cleaned and lubed.
People are very much the same as decades ago. They waite until a issue arises or a decade passes before servicing and become disappointed because of the high cost of repair. Millions globally were more than happy to switch to quartz causing the Quartz Crises in Switzerland.
High-end mechanical always has been picey to buy and repair. Today those few watchmakers that have parts accounts commonly will not accept any work less than a full service.
Cost me $965 and 8 months to service and polish my dad's Omega Flight master (1969)
Beards getting bushy man! And this’ what I like about my Grand Seiko 9F. 50 year service interval. But that doesn’t change for the rest of my watches 😅
We need right to repair in watchmaking. This is happening in every industry, electronics, cars, no parts available for independent watchmakers. In 2001 I bought my first citizen eco-drive watch, very accurate and never opened after more than 20 years. Ant there is my casio mudmaster gwg-1000-1a3er I appreciate mechanical watches, but I will never pay 2000 usd, for a service. I have an orient defender automatic watch, when it dies, that's it, it will go to the recycle bin.
It didn’t help that until 2010 watchmakers were the worst paid in the jewellery trade
While the manufacturers have been reducing their training so that staff can only do part of the job, like oil the train
Parts from tbe manufacturer and labour scarcity I dont buy as reasons. They either have them or they dont. Offer some kid half what it costs to service a Rolex as a daily wage and there would be no shortage of applicants to learn how to service watches. I also disagree about routine maintenance. Its not an old Ferrari, it doesnt need new timing belt every 2 years. If its not broke dont fix it. If it needs an oil change it will run slow. Cheers
That $20 Timex looks like the best choice. Better yet, just use your cellphone to tell time.
Everytime I send my watch in it comes back worst! Never will send another watch in 🤬
Had my Rolex for 22 years before I needed service it stopped price $800 service