I just came across this topic of "making coffee water" and was a little skeptical, but I thought I would give it a try since I had everything on hand. I'm not a big fan of straight espresso, but I did a side by side taste test with regular water and the re-mineralized water and the difference was immediately noticeable. I'll be using this from now on!
Thank for the nice simple video. I have Zero TDS water for my Marine fish so will give this a go. After reading the comments on here I now have clarification on the RO/Distilled water issue and also corrosion in my Rocket. I needed to see the the waters are in fact the same and this wont effect my machine.
Hey secretspy, Thanks for the kind comment. I've had a little practice. Before getting into coffee about 15 years ago I did broadcast VO work for a couple decades. Marc
I've recently moved from Europe to th USA. Bought brand new Jura coffee machine (I have one in Europe) and gosh, the coffee was so bad. OK, black coffee was okey but cappuccino... tried this recipe for brew water and it's a day and night difference. I might try more sophisticated one later, but this one is easy to do and good enough :-)
Hi Marc, As usual, another terrific and helpful video. Just one thing: you might want to clear up the math on the written instructions, to wit: "Then add 185 milliliters of the alkalinity/buffer concentrate. Using my Rattleware shot glass I’m filling 3 times to the 60ml line and then another 15ml’s to get to 185." You guys are the best! Great service!
Hey Jim, Marc here from Whole Latte Love... Thanks for the kind comment and correcting my major addition failure - it's truly appreciated! Should be another 5ml.
Hi Mark thank you I’ve made your brew water recipe and have been using it for the last few months now . Water tastes great . I have a tds digital metre . Our rain water measures 35 ppm When I mix your brew water into bottles the small amount of concretes to the 1 L water it measures around 138 to 145 ppm Today I tested the water that comes out of the machine the hot water tap on our rocket R nine one and waited until it cooled down completely. When I tested that it measures about 800 ppm 😮 we haven’t had out machine for a year yet . Wondering why it’s so high when been in machine when the water goes in the water container at 137 to 145 ppm ? I’m worried about scale in the machine from this ? Thank you so much for all your wonderful videos
Oh and Marc sorry just another question on one of your other videos when you tested the Rocket R nine one you had a guy from a Rocket going through it with you . They said that these machines shouldn’t use a de scale solution? If the brew water may make some scale I’m a little worried 😟 we have only been using the new machine for 6 months thanks again for all your amazing videos very helpful 😊
Hi missm, You are welcome for the videos and thanks for the question. Minerals can accumulate in the service boiler if it's only ever used for producing steam and little or no hot water. The steam that comes out of the boiler is essentially distilled so minerals are left in the boiler and become more concentrated. A best practice that solves the issue is occasionally taking hot water from the boiler to reduce mineral concentration. A cup or two every couple of days (like if making Americanos) is all it takes. Or you can turn over the water completely 1x a week or so depending on use level. To do a full turnover of water in the boiler fully heat the machine, turn off the power and open the hot water tap and let it run out water until it stops. When you power up the machine again the boiler will refill. Marc
Thanks for the question. The best course of action is to use water that does not cause scale in the first place. Since this recipe uses primarily magnesium as the mineral in the water it's unlikely to cause scale. It's potentially high levels of calcium in tap, well or some bottled waters that are responsible for scale. For those with hard tap water softening the water with traditional sodium based softeners will do the trick. We prefer softening using magnesium to replace the calcium. Magnesium is equal to calcium as a mineral for flavor and beats sodium in tastes tests. Marc
@@Wholelattelovepagehi Marc Thank you so much for getting back to me so soon 😊 I will do all you suggest here only thing that we are not using is Distilled water I’m finding it hard to find here in Australia I don’t want to use the wrong one . I really thought our tap water/ filtered water at 35 ppm wasn’t too high to use in the brew water recipe . I will flush out the hot water as you suggested but it won’t drain with the power off as it a R nine one ? If I want to completely empty the hot water out of boiler I just worry about the warning of no water coming up as I don’t want the new water going in as I’m trying to empty it ? Sorry hope I make sense 😊thanks again for everything kind regards Leanne 😊
I'm very very new at all of this and trying to read and learn all that i can. I want to order a gaggia magenta prestige. Should i use this water? Or is tap water with the filter the best? Help!!! Lol
Hey l, The most convenient approach is to use tap water and filter. Filter use significantly extends the time between descaling maintenance. Filter also removes any chlorination from your tap water for better tasting coffee. When you get the Magenta be sure and use the included water hardness test strip on your tap water. Enter the results into machine during setup. Then, the machine will alert you when it's time to descale. Frequency depends your source water hardness. For typical water you'll need to descale every 800-1,200 brew cycles. It's easy to do. Just pour the descaler into the machine's reservoir and the machine does the rest guiding you through the process. Hope that helps! Marc
@Wholelattelovepage Marc... thank you so much for answering so quickly... what filter do I use? Does it come with it? Or is it a separate water pitcher that I filter out through? Thank you again so much! I overthink and over analyze everything!! Lol
@@lorirodriquez6100 My pleasure. I suggest using the filter that mounts in the reservoir. The machine does not come with one. Here's a link to the proper filter. You can bundle with the machine when you purchase if desired. Mavea Intenza Water Filter: www.wholelattelove.com/products/mavea-intenza-water-filter-for-gaggia-and-saeco Here's a link to our start up video for the machine. Takes you through process in detail including filter etc: ruclips.net/video/qL_rxqSKRbE/видео.htmlsi=qSXsRtiDubpc_Nb1 Hope that helps! Marc
I have a reverse osmosis system that has an alkaline remineralization filter that adds some minerals back to the water. Would this recipe still be beneficial for me to use?
This was very helpful thank you :) a couple of questions though, 1.Due to there being no calcium would this eliminate boiler scale? 2.Could one use potassium bicarb in place of sodium or even a mixture of both?
Hi B, You're welcome. Magnesium can still cause scale but is less likely to do so than calcium especially at the levels used here. Unfortunately I have no information on use of potassium bicarb.
@@Wholelattelovepage Awesome thank you, is SOME calcium ok or is it best to have none at all, around 10ppm? i have found bottled water where i live that is relatively soft and the alkalinity is slightly low but i could buffer it i guess, seems easier to me than sourcing demineralised water, hard to get in the UK EDIT: Just noticed the chart in the video which says 17mg is accepable so i think i'll be ok so longs as i follow the preventative measures in your other video
Hi KC, It shgould significantly reduce scale potential as compared to using hard tap water. Helps that much of the mineral content here comes from magnesium which is less prone to producing scale than calcium. Marc
My Reverse Osmosis (Homemaster Artesian) doesn’t get to 0 TDS.. it’s somewhere around 12-19 depending on the day. If i used a gallon of this RO water and then divided your solutions by 1/3, i should be ok; correct? I have a Linea Mini and don’t want to chance scaling it at all. I see you mentioned in another reply to a comment that this recipe could scale as it did to her machine after 3 years of using this recipe.
Hi M, that sounds like a reasonable approach. Another option is adding a remineralization cartridge to your RO's output. This one uses magnesium for remin which will not cause scale in your machine: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-bestmin-premium-m-filter-cartridge It's likely more expensive but more convenient.
By my measurement, 1/2 tsp of baking soda weighs 3.4grams...and the weight/measurement of the epsom salt is equally off. What am I missing?? Thanks - don't want to scale up my Synchronika!
Hi dm, I have not used calcium chloride. Main reason is the calcium is far more likely to cause scale in machines. Magnesium is an equally good flavor extractor and low to no scale risk.
Hey T, Thanks for the question. Filter is not necessary as you're starting with very pure water! I would still descale the machine as recommended by manufacturer. Marc
So if I use this in my Gaggia Classic Pro would it completely do away with the need to descale (and risk scale particles going into the solenoid valve)? Or would it just reduce the frequency required?
Hi c, I have not long term tested this water recipe in the Classic. On paper it should nearly, if not totally eliminate the need to descale as much of the mineral content is provided by magnesium which has very low scaling potential. If it were me, I would still descale to be sure but much less frequently.
Wow this is fantastic, thanks Mark! I have a reverse osmosis system at home, and while I love my home roast and brew already, I'm excited to taste the difference this will make.
Hi Orrent, please let us know how it works out for you. Do be aware that not all RO systems produce pure zero TDS water. If your RO system re-mineralizes you would need to account for that.
hi i have an olympia cremina sl and im trying to find out the best possible way to get good tasting water without scale, can you tell me what my best option or options would be for a machine like this?
Hi Adam, Thanks for the question. I like BWT water treatment options. Their Bestsave in reservoir pad filters are a good solution for those who go though less than a reservoir full of water a day as they require 12 hour soak time: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-bestsave-s-anti-scale-filter If you go through water faster or would appreciate a system to produce drinking water have a look at their Penguin Pitcher: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-penguin-2-7-l-water-pitcher Both BWT solutions do the typical carbon filtration for chlorine and other chemical removal. The real trick is calcium to magnesium ion-exchange. This leaves you with a mineral level needed for flavor that will not cause scale when used as directed. Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage the filter for me is a bit pricey and i dont think will fit in the cremina since the way to fill it is just a very small hole at the top, originally i was worried about the mixing sca basic brew water because barista hustle claims that recipe may cause corrosion in some machines however i have found the cremina has stainless steel boiler so will not have to be too concerned about that. i live in winnipeg so now im just wondering if i should be filtering my tap water or just mixing up your recipe for basic sca brew water. both will be fine options i assume for my machine so long as i descale every once and awhile. any opinions on those two options or other recommendations?
. Thx for the video With a little math, I came up with a slightly simpler version of the recipe Get a 2 liter bottle Fill with RO WATER … remove one cup Add 2.8 gm baking soda- 1 tsp Add 13.6 gm epsom salt. 1.5 tsp Mix Add 185 gm 3/4 cup of mixture to one gal RO water You should probably check my math though Or… just try it and taste this recipe side by side Cheers
Hi Ardy, You are welcome! Could work and yes would need to check the math. Need to be careful mixing together higher concentrations of baking soda and Epsom salts as they may precipitate material from the solution. Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage Marc.. .i did check the math several times… and there should be the same concentrations Later, I will do a side by side comparison My goal here was to reduce complexity. … not change the end concentrations One concentrate bottle, one concentrate measurement Anyway. .regardless of whether my calculations are ultimately correct, i prefer this simpler approach Anyway… thx again for the work of your WLL team
@@Wholelattelovepage Marc Fwiw, I re checked my math… and also tested the video recipe beside my revision… and they taste the same One further detail…. Most commercial ” drinking water also has some salt in it. James Hoffman says a little salt improves coffee Make of it what you will Ardy
Hi Neil, So long as you have other minerals like the magnesium in this recipe you're good to go! Perhaps confusion mistaking no calcium as meaning no minerals at all like in pure RO or distilled water. Totally mineral free water can cause corrosion of metals over time. Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage so no calcium at all is OKay (this recipe uses magnesium as the source for total hardness; not calcium) I've heard that you need a bit of calcium to protect the machine as well?
My water is slightly acidic (pH 6.6) as I use rainwater in my house since I live in the country and don't have access to town water. Does the use of these two buffers mean it will help adjust this closer to 7. I did chemistry a long time ago. I'm looking to purchase a new espresso machine since my current one died this morning and am a bit worried about water quality but I like this option of adding minerals to rain water even if it means I won't be plumbing the machine in.
Hi Meredith, pH 6.6 is within the 6.5-7.5 SCA spec for brew water. More info on that here: www.scaa.org/?d=water-standards&page=resources Slightly acidic water is less likely to cause scale in a machine but there are other variables like mineral hardness and alkalinity which play into that. The best approach is to test your rainwater, treat with minerals, test again and adjust dosing of supplements as needed. Marc
He's guys. Thanks for the video it's great. I'm curious though what do we do with the left over distilled water from the 2nd gallon of distilled water and the cup that we took out.
Taste isn't my biggest concern right now. I just purchased a Moccamaster and because of the copper element, we shouldn't use reverse osmosis water or distilled water. While researching this, I stumbled across a company called, Third Wave Water. They sell mineral packets that you add to distilled water to re-mineralize it. I checked the ingredients that they use and it's just magnesium sulfate, calcium citrate, and sodium chloride. I am wondering if I either buy from Third Wave Water, or make the water myself like in this video, will it make the water safe to use with Moccamaster's copper element. I've seen many people disregarding Moccamaster's suggestions, but I just spent a lot of money on that machine and want to properly take care of it.
Hi b, Yes this water will be safe to use with the copper element. So would the 3rd wave product which is rather expensive for what it is but that's the price of convenience. I agree 100% with Technivorm. One should not use pure RO or distilled water. Over time it can corrode metals and even though taste is not your big concern at the moment, ultra-pure water over-extracts coffee and produces flat flavor due to lack of minerals. Marc
I think there must be a typo in the gram to volume conversion of the Baking soda at the end of the video. 1/2 tsp weighs out to be alot more than 1.4g. Using a high-precision lab scale and a level tsp I get ~3.2g (results in a TDS of ~326). Checking online, I see wild variation depending on what conversion calculator you happen to use for baking soda. For comparison, your conversion for Epsom salt was close to accurate on my scale. Using 1.4g will keep you at the high end of the SCA standard's TDS range (results in a TDS ~240), so by volume, using 1/4 tsp of Baking soda would be more accurate to the SCA guidelines. That being said, ignoring their standard and using 1/2 tsp as you demonstrated here, still results in a tasty extraction, so it's personal preference.
Hi CP, I'm not familiar with exact chemical makeup of those but assume at their base it's sodium chloride - salt. There are limits to the amount of sodium/salt one wants in brew water and nothing there to support alkalinity so don't think this is a good idea. Marc
Wow this really works. I live in Phoenix and the tap water is disgusting and have been using RO water for my coffee for years. This is definitely a game changer! Can't wait to try it with higher quality coffee. Thxs Marc.
Hi Oscar, You are welcome. So were making coffee with pure RO water? Many RO systems have a bypass which adds back some untreated water or a way of remineralizing after treatment. Marc
!!Hi! please help me confirm this. this should be my last questions for awhile, but is very important. i notice in the chart it says add 50 ml and 17 ml to one liter but you also said to dump out whatever you are putting in, so in reality - would i pour out 67ml from my single liter (so adding in 50ml and 17 ml to 933ml of distilled water?) and also, if i would like to do 4 liters instead, can i just multiply everything by 4 and pour out 268ml (add in 268ml to 3732ml?)
Just ordered a Profitec Pro 600 from you guys. I had been using RO water in my BBE, but figured I oughta re-mineralize... Followed this recipe exactly with my RO water (which had a TDS of less than 5) and having been using it for the last week... today I discovered an odd almost goop-like jelly along the walls of the reservoir in my BBE... What could that be?
Hi AB, Thanks for the question. Not sure what the goop is. I've mixed up the water and kept for months in jug and never had anything like that. Strange things could happen if you mix the full strength concentrates together before adding to your RO water. Those should always be added to RO water individually and mix one in well before adding the other.
Hi Jay, Thanks for the question. Very hard to make a recommendation as mineral content is all over the place depending on vendor. You want water with some mineral content but not too much. So do not use pure reverse osmosis or distilled water. They have no minerals. Also, stay away from mineral water and some spring waters which are high in minerals. Marc
Hey Marc! I just tested my SCA water using this recipe and the hardness of my water using a water hardness test strip is showing purple. Went from green to purple. The distilled water is showing green. Any suggestions? I’m thinking purple means extremely hard.
Hi S2, Thanks for the question. Not sure which test strip you are using - would think the strip would have a reference for what the colors represent. But... distilled water is mineral free. The SCA brew water does have minerals - and you want some to support flavor and to protect your equipment from corrosion. Magnesium is the main mineral in the SCA brew water recipe and will show in a test for total water hardness. Compared to water with calcium as the main mineral, the SCA recipe is less likely to cause scale.
Can't wait for the more complicated version like many other viewers. Eta for the video? My poor espresso machine is waiting for the good stuff. Great videos as always. Keep up the great work!
Hi Mark, thanks for your great videos & for the Pro 600 you sold me. I've taken to heart your cautions about water for my Pro 600 and an greatly concerned about how much baking soda to use to be sure the water is safe. Your chart in this video says to use 0.5 tsp. (1.4 g) baking soda. I first researched baking soda on the web, and then my actual measurements indicate that 0.5 tsp. of baking soda actually weighs 2.835 g. Can you help me with this so my Pro 600 will be happy? Thanks much, Ralph
Hi Bryce, All depends on what type of regular filter or bottled water you are using. Vast majority of tap and pitcher filters do nothing to control minerals. Bottled waters can be all over the place in mineral level. Some add minerals to improve flavor. If your tap water is safe to drink and doesn't have edge case issues like unusually high chlorides then my favorite options are those using calcium to magnesium ion-exchange in addition to activated carbon for removing chlorination and other chemicals. I use the BWT Penguin Pitcher to feed non-plumbed machines in the studio. It has the ion-exchange tech: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-penguin-2-7-l-water-pitcher Used as directed it eliminates scale potential yet provides mineral level required for flavor and preventing over-extraction. BWT has in reservoir pad filters which do the same thing: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-bestsave-s-anti-scale-filter With those a soak time of ~12 hours is required. Marc
Hi Taylor, No problem being late. There can be but IMO not required. Might be opinions on this but I challenge anyone to accurately identify coffee/espresso brewed with water deriving hardness from magnesium vs. calcium in a blind taste test.
Thanks for the recipe and walk-through, Marc. I just made four gallons from the concentrates today, and plan to use this water in my new Profitec 600 that is scheduled to arrive in a few days. This recipe should prevent scaling and is safe to use in the machine, correct?
Hi MH, Thanks for the question. Maybe? Depends on what the actual mineral level is. Is it really low - like considered to be "soft"? Hard to be definite as "mineral water" and "low mineral content" are rather generic and subjective terms. Marc
Hello there, I would like to point out one problem with RO water. During the RO process we are removing the water treatment chemicals... I only realised this when I've noticed molding in my canisters and hoses to my coffee machine ( Astoria lever). Now i am thinking of adding chlorine dioxide. I would be most grateful for your view on this.
Hi bokicar1, Thanks for the question. I personally have never seen mold growing in RO water containers or transport tubing. Please understand the main purpose of RO is to create ultra-pure water. I'm not a biologist but I suspect mold spores would need to be present in an RO system and they would require some nutrients to grow/multiply. We run 2 RO systems here at the Whole Latte Love offices. One directly feeds a Dalla Corte Mina espresso machine. The other creates the base water for our in-office hydroponic garden. Both up and running for sometime and I've never observed mold. I've personally run a home RO system to provide the base water for my saltwater aquariums. My RO water is stored in a 50 gallon plastic drum in a basement. That system's been running for 6 years and never had a mold problem. I would not chlorinate water feeding an espresso machine. Chlorination is not good for flavor and under the right conditions can create an acid (very weak) in espresso machine boilers. I suspect your problem may be because of a problem in your RO system like a bad/old membrane or other maintenance issue. Marc
A) Because Himalayan pink salt is unethical overpriced salt for pretentious people. B) Because Epsom salt contains magnesium, pink salt contains sodium chloride.
Hi Marc, can the concentrates be stored in the cupboard at room temperature safely ? How long should they be kept or made fresh? I’m thinking of using magnesium chloride instead of epsom salt. How do I figure out the weight to add per litre of RO water?
Hi Jackson, Thanks for the question. Yes, concentrates can be stored safely at room temperature for a very long time. Epsom salts are 10% elemental magnesium while magnesium chloride is 25% so divide by 2.5 for same amount of magnesium. Marc
Baking soda absorbs moisture, which will change the weight per volume. I live in a high humidity part of the country and my baking soda weighed 3g/.5 tsp.
@@Wholelattelovepage Hi Marc - I was following the instructions in the video, but when I weighed my .5 tsp of baking soda I found that it weighed considerably more than 1.4g, so I started doing some research. Thank YOU for the mountains of great info you make available for all of us.
Hi Adam, Thanks for the question. Yes, this works for espresso machines. Still recommend descaling from time to time. This water is less likely to cause scaling as bulk of mineral hardness comes from magnesium which is less likely to cause scale deposits than calcium rich water. Marc
add a bit of potasium chloride and bit of calcium carbonate and you’ll get ur perfect drinking and brewing water at the same time! I do this and get 155ppm! not bad or far away from 150ppm!
If i use this water in my espresso machine do i still use the machine's water filter and will i still have to descale as before? I love this side of coffee making, i though it was all about the beans lol
Hi LL, Thanks for the question. It's unlikely scale will form using this water. I'd still descale - but less frequently. There are other factors like concentration of minerals in steam or HX boiler main sections if only used for steam and not hot water.
Hi Mark. I just purchased from WLL a new Gaggia Classic Pro. I have a RO system and followed your video on making my own re-mineralizing I tested my water prior to demineralization and it was 25 ppm. After demineralization it increased to 125 ppm. Is 125 ppm sufficient for re-mineralization. If it is how often should I descale my machine if I average 2 espressos a day. Thanks again for your expert advice and enthusiasm.
Hi 10, Thanks for your patronage and question. 125ppm should be sufficient for re-min. TDS measurements do not tell the whole story of water hardness but starting with RO at 25ppm (guessing your RO has some bypass remin built in? Or maybe not using DI treatment after RO?) and upping minerals as shown in video should leave you with water that's not going to cause a lot of scale. At your use level I recommend descaling you machine 2-3 times per year. You may have little to no scale formation but better safe than sorry. Marc
Hi Yazid, Thanks for the question. I do not. Strongly suggest making a concentrate of each additive then dosing into the 5 gallon bottle. Just do a little math and increase dosage to make the 5 gallons. Marc
Hi BB, Thanks for the question. At the SCA spec ratios described in the video you are unlikely to form excess scale in a machine. In large part because the mineral level is predominately from magnesium and not calcium. Personally I would still descale a machine just to be safe.
@@Wholelattelovepage So if the scale buildup is reduced, how often would it be recommended to descale? Also, I've noticed Mark talking about descaling solution but then at the same time mentioning descaling DB should be done by pros. Is there a procedure for descaling DB machines?
Hey stan, lol think you'd be more pooped than pissed! Anyway, yes at much higher concentrations it can be used as a laxative but believe me you are not even remotely close to the amount needed to produce that effect!
So...if I buy my filtered RO water by the 5 gallon jug...I can just add 1.4g of baking soda and 3.3g of epsom salt directly to my jug and that should be good to go instead of messing with concentrates? I get that concentrate makes sense if you're making your coffee brew water a liter or a gallon at a time...but I'll be making mine 5 gallons at a time.
@@Wholelattelovepage Do those amounts look right? I measured (weighed) them out and it's really a tiny amount of stuff that doesn't seem like would have much effect on 5 gallons of water.
I just purchased a Jura E8 and am concerned about scaling. Coming from the world of cheap drip machines that I just threw away when they got scaled this is now a big concern as this machine cost a chunk of change. In your experience is the claims of not needing to descale if using the jura filter true? Would you recommend using the BWT filter pad in addition to the factory filter? Thanks.
Hi Jerry, I was a little skeptical of their no descaling claim initially. I have asked Jura about this many times and they assure me with proper filter use descaling of Jura machines is not required. Your E8 has the Intelligent Water System with RFID tags in the filter which makes it easy to stay on top of filter maintenance.
if the main mineral for coffee extraction were magnesium and calcium, where does the calcium coming from though? this is a really great solution rather to buy some filter or aquacode, but if the water itself has zero minerals, how do I add the calcium and magnesium into it?
Will using this instead of tap water reduce scaling or completely avoid it in an espresso machine? I'm not worried about taste just avoiding scale, just ordered a barista express from breville
Hi w, Thanks for the question. It should reduce scale but cannot say it avoids completely. I would still descale the machine on a regular basis as recommended by the manufacturer.
Thanks for the guide! Wish there was a part where the math was done or it was tested on the video. Was this tested? Is this recipe gotten from somewhere?
How could this be applied to espresso? I understand FloJets can be use to supply prepared water like this, but it possible to apply magnesium and sodium bicarbonate to a reverse osmosis filter? Changing out 5 gal bottles and dosing them with minerals seems like a hassle. I ask this in the context of a commercial setup. Thanks!
Hi SL, Thanks for the question. There are remineralizing setups for RO water in bothe commercial and home setups. In fact that's what's done in every high-end cafe in my area. Water is RO treated and then minerals are added back in after treatment. Here's a remineralization filter for that purpose: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-bestmin-premium-m-filter-cartridge Marc
Hi B74, This prep is more suited to general coffee brewing. It would be okay for espresso brewing but a higher mineral level may be of benefit. I'll be getting into other preps using the same concentrates including those more suited for espresso brewing. It's actually fairly straightforward. A good start for espresso is to keep the Alk/Buffer level the same and 2x the Mg level. The mix made in the video will not produce scale (or corrosion) according the the Langelier Saturation Index. I'll get into LSI in a future video as well.
Awesome vid Marc. there's silica in the water where i live which can result in boiler scale, so i wanted to do something like this for a long time. Normal softeners and filtration will not remove the silica. Will the espresso recipe of 2x Mg level possibly result in scaling my espresso machine boiler? What's the hardness of the basic recipe and of the 2x Mg recipe? Thanks!
Well, after testing my water its pretty bad even after the gravity filter .. so Until we can soften with a whole house system, would you recommend this as a short term solution to go with our upcoming new double boiler ?
Hi! Just got my rocket R 58 machine. Is this a safe recipe for my machine? Or would you recommend some filtration? I will be using the water tank. Thanks!!
Hi Sarah, This recipe is safe to us in an R58 but overtime may produce some scaling. Since dual boiler machines are difficult to descale I'd recommend using water filtration. Best available are those from BWT which use patented ion-exchange technology which replaces scale causing calcium with magnesium. You get water with the minerals needed to prevent over-extraction and support flavor without causing scale in the machine. Two BWT options are there BestSave pad filters which you drop in the reservoir: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-bestsave-m-anti-scale-filter Or their Penguin Pitcher: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-penguin-2-7-l-water-pitcher Hope that helps! Marc
Is there any water you can buy that is already up to SCA standards that doesn't need to be remineralized? What options are there (if any)? This would be for home use French press and espresso in a Profitec Pro 500.
Hi Brett, I have from time to time read of some commercially available bottled waters as falling within SCA specs. Not something I've tested or tried however. I've also read that some national water brands have variations in mineral levels depending on the region in which they are purchased as they may have a number of bottling facilities with water coming from different sources.
Hi MH, Thanks for the question. Pure RO water is essentially the same as distilled water so yes you can. Do be aware many RO system have some way of re-mineralizing after RO treatment. In that case it's not pure RO water. Marc
Hi Marc Thank you for the prompt feedback. Thank you for the valuable information. Do you have any idea to verify that my system is not re-mineralizing the water? How can I verify it.
Hi Bill, Thanks for the comment. You could use this one in espresso machine with little risk of scale formation. Some prefer a slightly higher mineral content for espresso use but I'm guessing 99% would have a tough time telling a difference in a blind taste test. Marc
So what would the measurements be if I didn't want to make a concentrate, and just wanted to mix up one gallon at a time? I do have a scale that does grains, so I can measure small.
Also curious about this. I believe you could add .063 * 10.1g of Epsom Salt first. That's 636mg. Then you could add .185 * 1.4g of Sodium Bicarbonate. That's 259mg. This should be suitable for a gallon. WLL, Marc, any confirmation on this?
Marc, if I make the water mix and use it for my espresso machine do I still need to add the scale reduction filter pouch in my water reservoir? I use the Bilt Osmotic Scale Reduction filter.
Hi Max, Thanks for the question. I have not used the Bilt but it's my understanding it uses calcium to magnesium ion exchange. The SCA mix uses magnesium for the bulk of the hardness so you're already doing what the Bilt would do. The SCA recipe is unlikely to cause scale build-up. Personally I would do prophylactic descaling. Marc
Thank you for the cool video. But I do not understand the last step...when I finished making the concentrates, what do I have to do to get 1l brew water: mix a cup of destilled water with 50ml buffer and 17ml Hardness +1l of destilled water OR is it only one cup of destilled water+50ml Buffer+17ml Hardness? Thank you :)
Hi Marc, thanks for the great video. Improving my brew water is the next stage for me and this is a great resource. Are you able to provide the alkalinity, calcium (I think 0), pH, and TDS (I think I saw 150ppm below) for this brew water? The only other brew water recipes I have seen were on the Barista Hustle website and it looks like there is a big difference between your recipe and theirs for the Hardness solution (your recipe has approx 5x the epsom salts). What is the impact of this on an espresso machine? I am assuming that either way any of these recipes will be a big improvement over the tap water I am using. Thanks again!
Hi MP, You are welcome for the video. Unfortunately I made this video a few years back and no longer have the data easily available for those parameters. Not sure my magnesium was 5x the other or it could be they are adding other minerals to up the calcium while I'm using mostly magnesium. Calcium is the enemy in espresso machines as it causes scale. But other variables like pH and alkalinity play a role in combination with calcium level. When magnesium is the predominate mineral in the water scale is less likely to form. Marc
I was looking at the math and comparing it to BaristaHustle as well, and yes following this recipe is different to BH's listed SCA water profile, but from what I see the Epsom Salts are correct - it's the baking soda that could be off in the mixed 1 Gal of coffee water. For clarity, you were commenting on the Hardness solution, but that's just a concentrate - it doesn't matter what the Epsom salt amount is in it, it only matters what the total weight of Epsom salts are in the mixed 1Gal of SCA water. The only problem with WholeLatteLove's recipe is that 1/2 tsp of baking soda doesn't weigh 1.4g, it' more like 3g, so if you prepare this as written by teaspoon you'll be wayyy off (TDS ~314ppm). However, If you prepare the concentrate by weight (using 1.4g) then both recipes would be close to each other, and have a TDS around 240ppm. The SCA actually revised their water standard and now lists a fairly broad range for TDS (75-250ppm), so this recipe is fine as long as you use 1.4g Baking soda for the concentrate (or 1/4 tsp).
@@jcmmmbrains2718 I agree with this, 1/4t is preferred if you are not weighing the ingredients. I've been making this for a couple of years now and poked around the SCA site and others for their recipes back then and found 1/4t (1.4g) to be the preferred amount. So this yields great neutral tasting water, but the bonus is that none of my equipment has yet built up any scale. Thanks to WLL (Marc) for introducing me to making my own water! Kudos! BTW, distilled water is now up to $1.50/g . :(
Hi Alric, Thank you for the comment. Yes there is! We like this BWT filtration system which uses ion-exchange technology to replace calcium with magnesium. The technique produces brew water with a proper mineral level for good flavor yet does not cause scale build-up in brewing equipment. Check it out here: www.wholelattelove.com/bwt-bestmax-premium-filter-package-w-besthead-flex Marc
Hi XJ, (is XJ a Jeep Cherokee reference?) Water is safe to use. I cannot say with 100% certainty it will prevent all scale build up. But, it's far less likely to cause scale than moderately hard tap water. Marc
Hey Marc, me again. I just made some of the water and tested it for hardness and TDS. I got a reading of 6 grains hardness and 105 TDS. DOES THAT SOUND ABOUT RIGHT? sorry for the caps (cap lock). The water from my tap (I have well water) is less than 2 grains hardness and only 24 TDS. Am I correct in assuming my water is too soft and lack the minerals needed for a good extraction? This stuff keeps me up at night. Lol. Thanks in advance for your reply. Take care.
Late to the party, but my searches for coffee/water quality led me here. I couldn't help but check your calculations and they look perfect. Wondering though, is there any advantage to using separate stock solutions for hardness and alkalinity? I used 1 tsp of baking soda and 1.5 tsp Epsom salt and filled with 500 g of RO water. Adding 47 g of concentrate to a gallon of water should get me pretty close to the target values.
Hi Jeff, Thanks for the question and apologies for a delayed response. Been a little hectic here in NY as we adjust to deal with current events. I use separate solutions as you cannot combine concentrates or they will precipitate. It may be possible to combine the BS and ES at lower concentration without causing precipitates. Hope that helps! Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage, thank you for taking the time during the craziness. Hope you and your families are staying healthy. Completely, missed the precipitation issue - makes perfect sense.
Hey Marc, I don't know if you'll see this comment. But I have a question about the kind of epsom salt used. I bought a bag of epsom salt recently. It's pure magnesium sulfate but it also says do not ingest. The package says it's used for baths and as fertilizer. Do we need to buy food grade epsom salt? It's a lot more expensive than the price you mentioned in the video. Hope you see this comment. Thanks.
Hi Ricky, You're probably thinking I didn't see your question - I did! Sorry been on vacation for a week and was off line. Know for the future I do respond to all original comments on the videos. Some times delayed a bit. I'm using "Top Care Epsom Salt" It's a store brand sold at my local Wegmans Super Market in the pharmacy isle. It's labeled as Magnesium Sulfate U.S.P. Epsom Salt is commonly used as a laxative dosed at rate of 10 to 30 grams/day. So don't worry about it making you poop in the concentrations used in the brew water recipe :) Directions for making at laxative strength are on the bag I use so it's definitely okay for human consumption. It's likely (but I'm not certain) different grades of Epsom Slat are available. I'd look at a pharmacy to be on safe side. Marc
I found this video because a comment on pure calcium chloride said they used it with baking soda and epsom salt to make coffee water. if you were going to use the calcium chloride as well, how much should you add?
Hi AHC, Thanks for the question. I don't have a solid recipe for using calcium chloride. A couple of things... Calcium is the main culprit in causing scale deposits. An important consideration for those using espresso machines. The magnesium does essentially the same thing as calcium would. It supports a mineral level for flavor and prevention of over-extraction but has far lower risk of scale formation.
Hi , I have a question regarding quantities. I measured .5tsp of baking soda and then I weighted it just to make sure I had 1.4g as the video says but instead it weights 5g which is a big difference. Same thing with the epsom salt. 2.5tsp gives me 14.1g instead of 10.1g. I double checked everything on a second scale and I had the same results. Should I measure by weight or with the tea spoons ? Thanks
Hey guys!! Big fan. I know this doesn't really have anything to do with this exact video, but seeing as how this is your most recent one, I'll post here. I just bought the Bonavita BV1900TS drip machine on your suggestion! And I love it so much! But I had a question I had hopped you could answer. The machine has the function option to wet the grounds prior to brew for offgassing. I grind my own beans each time, and was wondering if this would be something good to do each time? Pros and cons for it compared to just brewing regularly??
Hi Chase, Thanks for the comment and question. If you are using beans that are within a week or two of roast then off-gassing will provide benefits. The pre-wetting allows CO2 present in fresh-roasted beans to off-gas so subsequent brew water can more fully saturate the coffee. For beans beyond a few weeks from roast most of the CO2 has already off-gassed naturally so pre-wetting may not be of much use. But every coffee is different so not a hard rule.
I just came across this topic of "making coffee water" and was a little skeptical, but I thought I would give it a try since I had everything on hand. I'm not a big fan of straight espresso, but I did a side by side taste test with regular water and the re-mineralized water and the difference was immediately noticeable. I'll be using this from now on!
Hi Steve, Good water makes great coffee. Thanks for the feedback!
Marc
Thank for the nice simple video. I have Zero TDS water for my Marine fish so will give this a go. After reading the comments on here I now have clarification on the RO/Distilled water issue and also corrosion in my Rocket. I needed to see the the waters are in fact the same and this wont effect my machine.
this is like an advanced coffee class, i love it!
Hi v74, Thanks for the comment and stay tuned! We'll be going much deeper into custom water and other advanced topics.
Mark has a pro grade Broadcast Journalism Voice.
Hey secretspy, Thanks for the kind comment. I've had a little practice. Before getting into coffee about 15 years ago I did broadcast VO work for a couple decades.
Marc
100% agreed 🤌
Great thanks for this, just what I need as my tap water is HARD! Even using the low mineral spring water makes a HUGE difference, thanks again.
Hi Steve, You are so welcome - and thanks for the comment!
Marc
Didn’t realize that the stuff I’ve been pumping into patients veins make for good water for coffee brewing. 😂😂😂😂
I've recently moved from Europe to th USA. Bought brand new Jura coffee machine (I have one in Europe) and gosh, the coffee was so bad. OK, black coffee was okey but cappuccino... tried this recipe for brew water and it's a day and night difference. I might try more sophisticated one later, but this one is easy to do and good enough :-)
Thanks for the comment!
Great! Cannot wait for the more complicated version
WastelandAssassin Thanks. It'll be coming soon.
Hey Marc! Any word on the more complicated version? :)
@@Wholelattelovepage any update in the future? Would love the additional info!
Whole Latte Love is the second video out yet?
Hi Marc, As usual, another terrific and helpful video. Just one thing: you might want to clear up the math on the written instructions, to wit: "Then add 185 milliliters of the alkalinity/buffer concentrate. Using my Rattleware shot glass I’m filling 3 times to the 60ml line and then another 15ml’s to get to 185."
You guys are the best! Great service!
Hey Jim, Marc here from Whole Latte Love... Thanks for the kind comment and correcting my major addition failure - it's truly appreciated! Should be another 5ml.
With the Rattleware shot glass not denoting a 5ml mark you'd have to half the 10ml to use the following, 3 * 60 = 180 + 5 = 185, no?
The video says to fill to 50 ml three times, then add another 35 ml. That gives you 185. I don't see a problem.
I’m about to make some this will NOT scale my Classika PID right???
Hi aw, since the majority of minerals come from magnesium the recipe should not cause scale.
Ok thanks for the reply
One of the only channels that adress water for brewing coffe n a competent manner. 👍👍.
Hi Foe, Thanks for the 2 thumbs up!
Marc
Hi Mark thank you I’ve made your brew water recipe and have been using it for the last few months now . Water tastes great .
I have a tds digital metre . Our rain water measures 35 ppm
When I mix your brew water into bottles the small amount of concretes to the 1 L water it measures around 138 to 145 ppm
Today I tested the water that comes out of the machine the hot water tap on our rocket R nine one and waited until it cooled down completely. When I tested that it measures about 800 ppm 😮 we haven’t had out machine for a year yet . Wondering why it’s so high when been in machine when the water goes in the water container at 137 to 145 ppm ?
I’m worried about scale in the machine from this ?
Thank you so much for all your wonderful videos
Oh and Marc sorry just another question on one of your other videos when you tested the Rocket R nine one you had a guy from a Rocket going through it with you . They said that these machines shouldn’t use a de scale solution?
If the brew water may make some scale I’m a little worried 😟 we have only been using the new machine for 6 months thanks again for all your amazing videos very helpful 😊
Hi missm, You are welcome for the videos and thanks for the question. Minerals can accumulate in the service boiler if it's only ever used for producing steam and little or no hot water. The steam that comes out of the boiler is essentially distilled so minerals are left in the boiler and become more concentrated. A best practice that solves the issue is occasionally taking hot water from the boiler to reduce mineral concentration. A cup or two every couple of days (like if making Americanos) is all it takes. Or you can turn over the water completely 1x a week or so depending on use level. To do a full turnover of water in the boiler fully heat the machine, turn off the power and open the hot water tap and let it run out water until it stops. When you power up the machine again the boiler will refill.
Marc
Thanks for the question. The best course of action is to use water that does not cause scale in the first place. Since this recipe uses primarily magnesium as the mineral in the water it's unlikely to cause scale. It's potentially high levels of calcium in tap, well or some bottled waters that are responsible for scale. For those with hard tap water softening the water with traditional sodium based softeners will do the trick. We prefer softening using magnesium to replace the calcium. Magnesium is equal to calcium as a mineral for flavor and beats sodium in tastes tests.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepagehi Marc
Thank you so much for getting back to me so soon 😊 I will do all you suggest here only thing that we are not using is Distilled water I’m finding it hard to find here in Australia I don’t want to use the wrong one .
I really thought our tap water/ filtered water at 35 ppm wasn’t too high to use in the brew water recipe .
I will flush out the hot water as you suggested but it won’t drain with the power off as it a R nine one ?
If I want to completely empty the hot water out of boiler I just worry about the warning of no water coming up as I don’t want the new water going in as I’m trying to empty it ? Sorry hope I make sense 😊thanks again for everything kind regards Leanne 😊
I'm very very new at all of this and trying to read and learn all that i can. I want to order a gaggia magenta prestige. Should i use this water? Or is tap water with the filter the best? Help!!! Lol
Hey l, The most convenient approach is to use tap water and filter. Filter use significantly extends the time between descaling maintenance. Filter also removes any chlorination from your tap water for better tasting coffee. When you get the Magenta be sure and use the included water hardness test strip on your tap water. Enter the results into machine during setup. Then, the machine will alert you when it's time to descale. Frequency depends your source water hardness. For typical water you'll need to descale every 800-1,200 brew cycles. It's easy to do. Just pour the descaler into the machine's reservoir and the machine does the rest guiding you through the process. Hope that helps!
Marc
@Wholelattelovepage Marc... thank you so much for answering so quickly... what filter do I use? Does it come with it? Or is it a separate water pitcher that I filter out through? Thank you again so much! I overthink and over analyze everything!! Lol
@@lorirodriquez6100 My pleasure. I suggest using the filter that mounts in the reservoir. The machine does not come with one. Here's a link to the proper filter. You can bundle with the machine when you purchase if desired. Mavea Intenza Water Filter: www.wholelattelove.com/products/mavea-intenza-water-filter-for-gaggia-and-saeco
Here's a link to our start up video for the machine. Takes you through process in detail including filter etc: ruclips.net/video/qL_rxqSKRbE/видео.htmlsi=qSXsRtiDubpc_Nb1
Hope that helps!
Marc
Your videos give me the same fix that I get from a good cup of coffee, thanks.
Hi SH, Your are welcome and thanks for the comment!
I have a reverse osmosis system that has an alkaline remineralization filter that adds some minerals back to the water. Would this recipe still be beneficial for me to use?
Hi a, Thanks for the question. You do not need this recipe if your RO system has remineralization.
Marc
This was very helpful thank you :) a couple of questions though,
1.Due to there being no calcium would this eliminate boiler scale?
2.Could one use potassium bicarb in place of sodium or even a mixture of both?
Hi B, You're welcome. Magnesium can still cause scale but is less likely to do so than calcium especially at the levels used here. Unfortunately I have no information on use of potassium bicarb.
@@Wholelattelovepage Awesome thank you, is SOME calcium ok or is it best to have none at all, around 10ppm? i have found bottled water where i live that is relatively soft and the alkalinity is slightly low but i could buffer it i guess, seems easier to me than sourcing demineralised water, hard to get in the UK
EDIT: Just noticed the chart in the video which says 17mg is accepable so i think i'll be ok so longs as i follow the preventative measures in your other video
Will doing this reduce if not, prevent scaling in espresso machines?
Hi KC, It shgould significantly reduce scale potential as compared to using hard tap water. Helps that much of the mineral content here comes from magnesium which is less prone to producing scale than calcium.
Marc
My Reverse Osmosis (Homemaster Artesian) doesn’t get to 0 TDS.. it’s somewhere around 12-19 depending on the day. If i used a gallon of this RO water and then divided your solutions by 1/3, i should be ok; correct? I have a Linea Mini and don’t want to chance scaling it at all. I see you mentioned in another reply to a comment that this recipe could scale as it did to her machine after 3 years of using this recipe.
Hi M, that sounds like a reasonable approach. Another option is adding a remineralization cartridge to your RO's output. This one uses magnesium for remin which will not cause scale in your machine: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-bestmin-premium-m-filter-cartridge
It's likely more expensive but more convenient.
By my measurement, 1/2 tsp of baking soda weighs 3.4grams...and the weight/measurement of the epsom salt is equally off. What am I missing?? Thanks - don't want to scale up my Synchronika!
Will this cause corrosion on espresso machines such as Rocket Appartamento?
No it will not. Corrosion (as opposed to scaling) is a risk when there are no minerals present like in pure RO or distilled water.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage awesome thanks a lot Marc! As always your videos and comments are always very helpful and to the point :)
What about mixing in calcium chloride?
Hi dm, I have not used calcium chloride. Main reason is the calcium is far more likely to cause scale in machines. Magnesium is an equally good flavor extractor and low to no scale risk.
Do you still use a filter in your water tank after this? Doesn't make sense to IMO what do you think?
Hey T, Thanks for the question. Filter is not necessary as you're starting with very pure water! I would still descale the machine as recommended by manufacturer.
Marc
So if I use this in my Gaggia Classic Pro would it completely do away with the need to descale (and risk scale particles going into the solenoid valve)? Or would it just reduce the frequency required?
Hi c, I have not long term tested this water recipe in the Classic. On paper it should nearly, if not totally eliminate the need to descale as much of the mineral content is provided by magnesium which has very low scaling potential. If it were me, I would still descale to be sure but much less frequently.
Wow this is fantastic, thanks Mark!
I have a reverse osmosis system at home, and while I love my home roast and brew already, I'm excited to taste the difference this will make.
Hi Orrent, please let us know how it works out for you. Do be aware that not all RO systems produce pure zero TDS water. If your RO system re-mineralizes you would need to account for that.
hi i have an olympia cremina sl and im trying to find out the best possible way to get good tasting water without scale, can you tell me what my best option or options would be for a machine like this?
Hi Adam, Thanks for the question. I like BWT water treatment options. Their Bestsave in reservoir pad filters are a good solution for those who go though less than a reservoir full of water a day as they require 12 hour soak time: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-bestsave-s-anti-scale-filter If you go through water faster or would appreciate a system to produce drinking water have a look at their Penguin Pitcher: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-penguin-2-7-l-water-pitcher
Both BWT solutions do the typical carbon filtration for chlorine and other chemical removal. The real trick is calcium to magnesium ion-exchange. This leaves you with a mineral level needed for flavor that will not cause scale when used as directed.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage the filter for me is a bit pricey and i dont think will fit in the cremina since the way to fill it is just a very small hole at the top, originally i was worried about the mixing sca basic brew water because barista hustle claims that recipe may cause corrosion in some machines however i have found the cremina has stainless steel boiler so will not have to be too concerned about that. i live in winnipeg so now im just wondering if i should be filtering my tap water or just mixing up your recipe for basic sca brew water. both will be fine options i assume for my machine so long as i descale every once and awhile. any opinions on those two options or other recommendations?
is this the same as the third wave water formula product?
. Thx for the video
With a little math, I came up with a slightly simpler version of the recipe
Get a 2 liter bottle
Fill with RO WATER … remove one cup
Add 2.8 gm baking soda- 1 tsp
Add 13.6 gm epsom salt. 1.5 tsp
Mix
Add 185 gm 3/4 cup of mixture to one gal RO water
You should probably check my math though
Or… just try it and taste this recipe side by side
Cheers
Hi Ardy, You are welcome! Could work and yes would need to check the math. Need to be careful mixing together higher concentrations of baking soda and Epsom salts as they may precipitate material from the solution.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage
Marc..
.i did check the math several times… and there should be the same concentrations
Later, I will do a side by side comparison
My goal here was to reduce complexity. … not change the end concentrations
One concentrate bottle, one concentrate measurement
Anyway.
.regardless of whether my calculations are ultimately correct, i prefer this simpler approach
Anyway… thx again for the work of your WLL team
@@Wholelattelovepage
Marc
Fwiw, I re checked my math… and also tested the video recipe beside my revision… and they taste the same
One further detail…. Most commercial ” drinking water also has some salt in it. James Hoffman says a little salt improves coffee
Make of it what you will
Ardy
Could I also use magnesium chloride hexahydrate instead of Epsom Salt?
Hi Mark
This is great. Ive been making my water but ive heard that no calcium at all can cause damage to the machine over time?
Hi Neil, So long as you have other minerals like the magnesium in this recipe you're good to go! Perhaps confusion mistaking no calcium as meaning no minerals at all like in pure RO or distilled water. Totally mineral free water can cause corrosion of metals over time.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage so no calcium at all is OKay (this recipe uses magnesium as the source for total hardness; not calcium) I've heard that you need a bit of calcium to protect the machine as well?
My water is slightly acidic (pH 6.6) as I use rainwater in my house since I live in the country and don't have access to town water. Does the use of these two buffers mean it will help adjust this closer to 7. I did chemistry a long time ago. I'm looking to purchase a new espresso machine since my current one died this morning and am a bit worried about water quality but I like this option of adding minerals to rain water even if it means I won't be plumbing the machine in.
Hi Meredith, pH 6.6 is within the 6.5-7.5 SCA spec for brew water. More info on that here: www.scaa.org/?d=water-standards&page=resources
Slightly acidic water is less likely to cause scale in a machine but there are other variables like mineral hardness and alkalinity which play into that. The best approach is to test your rainwater, treat with minerals, test again and adjust dosing of supplements as needed.
Marc
I have breville barista express..
Do I have to put the Water Filter in the tank when using this formula?
He's guys. Thanks for the video it's great. I'm curious though what do we do with the left over distilled water from the 2nd gallon of distilled water and the cup that we took out.
Taste isn't my biggest concern right now. I just purchased a Moccamaster and because of the copper element, we shouldn't use reverse osmosis water or distilled water. While researching this, I stumbled across a company called, Third Wave Water. They sell mineral packets that you add to distilled water to re-mineralize it. I checked the ingredients that they use and it's just magnesium sulfate, calcium citrate, and sodium chloride. I am wondering if I either buy from Third Wave Water, or make the water myself like in this video, will it make the water safe to use with Moccamaster's copper element. I've seen many people disregarding Moccamaster's suggestions, but I just spent a lot of money on that machine and want to properly take care of it.
Hi b, Yes this water will be safe to use with the copper element. So would the 3rd wave product which is rather expensive for what it is but that's the price of convenience. I agree 100% with Technivorm. One should not use pure RO or distilled water. Over time it can corrode metals and even though taste is not your big concern at the moment, ultra-pure water over-extracts coffee and produces flat flavor due to lack of minerals.
Marc
I think there must be a typo in the gram to volume conversion of the Baking soda at the end of the video. 1/2 tsp weighs out to be alot more than 1.4g. Using a high-precision lab scale and a level tsp I get ~3.2g (results in a TDS of ~326). Checking online, I see wild variation depending on what conversion calculator you happen to use for baking soda. For comparison, your conversion for Epsom salt was close to accurate on my scale. Using 1.4g will keep you at the high end of the SCA standard's TDS range (results in a TDS ~240), so by volume, using 1/4 tsp of Baking soda would be more accurate to the SCA guidelines. That being said, ignoring their standard and using 1/2 tsp as you demonstrated here, still results in a tasty extraction, so it's personal preference.
Hi JC, thanks for the info!
Would remineralizing with rock, sea or Himalayan work as well!
Hi CP, I'm not familiar with exact chemical makeup of those but assume at their base it's sodium chloride - salt. There are limits to the amount of sodium/salt one wants in brew water and nothing there to support alkalinity so don't think this is a good idea.
Marc
Thanks for this. I have a water distiller and was just using a ph checker with a particulate checker to guess my ratios.
Won’t have any problems now.
Hi Ronald, You are welcome! Definitely dose your pure distilled water. Gotta have some minerals in there!
Marc
Wow this really works. I live in Phoenix and the tap water is disgusting and have been using RO water for my coffee for years. This is definitely a game changer! Can't wait to try it with higher quality coffee. Thxs Marc.
Hi Oscar, You are welcome. So were making coffee with pure RO water? Many RO systems have a bypass which adds back some untreated water or a way of remineralizing after treatment.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage Do I use the same formula in your video if I am starting with RO water instead of distilled water?
@@markhenderson9704 Yes. Distilled/RO/"Zero"
!!Hi! please help me confirm this. this should be my last questions for awhile, but is very important. i notice in the chart it says add 50 ml and 17 ml to one liter but you also said to dump out whatever you are putting in, so in reality - would i pour out 67ml from my single liter (so adding in 50ml and 17 ml to 933ml of distilled water?) and also, if i would like to do 4 liters instead, can i just multiply everything by 4 and pour out 268ml (add in 268ml to 3732ml?)
Descaling isn't needed with this recipe?
Correct as the majority of mineral content comes from the magnesium which does not result in scale at the levels used.
may i know what is the TDS/PPm of the water after mixing?
Hi DT, TDS will be ~150ppm.
Just ordered a Profitec Pro 600 from you guys. I had been using RO water in my BBE, but figured I oughta re-mineralize... Followed this recipe exactly with my RO water (which had a TDS of less than 5) and having been using it for the last week... today I discovered an odd almost goop-like jelly along the walls of the reservoir in my BBE... What could that be?
Hi AB, Thanks for the question. Not sure what the goop is. I've mixed up the water and kept for months in jug and never had anything like that. Strange things could happen if you mix the full strength concentrates together before adding to your RO water. Those should always be added to RO water individually and mix one in well before adding the other.
I have breville 870.
1. Is that the same method for espresso machine?
2. Should I add my current breville filter too?
What over the counter water can you buy that is good for Pour Overs. Available in the US please.
Hi Jay, Thanks for the question. Very hard to make a recommendation as mineral content is all over the place depending on vendor. You want water with some mineral content but not too much. So do not use pure reverse osmosis or distilled water. They have no minerals. Also, stay away from mineral water and some spring waters which are high in minerals.
Marc
Hey Marc! I just tested my SCA water using this recipe and the hardness of my water using a water hardness test strip is showing purple. Went from green to purple. The distilled water is showing green. Any suggestions? I’m thinking purple means extremely hard.
Hi S2, Thanks for the question. Not sure which test strip you are using - would think the strip would have a reference for what the colors represent. But... distilled water is mineral free. The SCA brew water does have minerals - and you want some to support flavor and to protect your equipment from corrosion. Magnesium is the main mineral in the SCA brew water recipe and will show in a test for total water hardness. Compared to water with calcium as the main mineral, the SCA recipe is less likely to cause scale.
Can't wait for the more complicated version like many other viewers. Eta for the video? My poor espresso machine is waiting for the good stuff. Great videos as always. Keep up the great work!
Hi DrJ, Thanks for the comment! Should have a deeper look at custom water for various situations/coffees in the next couple of weeks.
Hi Mark, thanks for your great videos & for the Pro 600 you sold me. I've taken to heart your cautions about water for my Pro 600 and an greatly concerned about how much baking soda to use to be sure the water is safe. Your chart in this video says to use 0.5 tsp. (1.4 g) baking soda. I first researched baking soda on the web, and then my actual measurements indicate that 0.5 tsp. of baking soda actually weighs 2.835 g. Can you help me with this so my Pro 600 will be happy? Thanks much, Ralph
So about to get my gaggia classic pro. Would this be the best way to make my water instead of using regular filter or buying bottled water?
Hi Bryce, All depends on what type of regular filter or bottled water you are using. Vast majority of tap and pitcher filters do nothing to control minerals. Bottled waters can be all over the place in mineral level. Some add minerals to improve flavor. If your tap water is safe to drink and doesn't have edge case issues like unusually high chlorides then my favorite options are those using calcium to magnesium ion-exchange in addition to activated carbon for removing chlorination and other chemicals. I use the BWT Penguin Pitcher to feed non-plumbed machines in the studio. It has the ion-exchange tech: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-penguin-2-7-l-water-pitcher Used as directed it eliminates scale potential yet provides mineral level required for flavor and preventing over-extraction. BWT has in reservoir pad filters which do the same thing: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-bestsave-s-anti-scale-filter With those a soak time of ~12 hours is required.
Marc
I have a double boiler espresso machine for coffee caterings. We are going to use a 5gallon as water reserve. Can i use this recipe for my water??
Hi Harold, Thanks for the question. Yes you can!
Marc
arent there calcium ions in the ideal brew water as well?
sorry im so late to the party, but i would love the answer!
Hi Taylor, No problem being late. There can be but IMO not required. Might be opinions on this but I challenge anyone to accurately identify coffee/espresso brewed with water deriving hardness from magnesium vs. calcium in a blind taste test.
Thanks for the recipe and walk-through, Marc. I just made four gallons from the concentrates today, and plan to use this water in my new Profitec 600 that is scheduled to arrive in a few days. This recipe should prevent scaling and is safe to use in the machine, correct?
Hi DO, Congrats on the Pro 600! This water should prevent scale as the bulk of the mineral content comes from magnesium.
Marc
Can you use low mineral content Mineral water for proconsumer espresso machine like Linea Mini?
Hi MH, Thanks for the question. Maybe? Depends on what the actual mineral level is. Is it really low - like considered to be "soft"? Hard to be definite as "mineral water" and "low mineral content" are rather generic and subjective terms.
Marc
Hello there,
I would like to point out one problem with RO water. During the RO process we are removing the water treatment chemicals...
I only realised this when I've noticed molding in my canisters and hoses to my coffee machine ( Astoria lever).
Now i am thinking of adding chlorine dioxide.
I would be most grateful for your view on this.
Hi bokicar1, Thanks for the question. I personally have never seen mold growing in RO water containers or transport tubing. Please understand the main purpose of RO is to create ultra-pure water. I'm not a biologist but I suspect mold spores would need to be present in an RO system and they would require some nutrients to grow/multiply. We run 2 RO systems here at the Whole Latte Love offices. One directly feeds a Dalla Corte Mina espresso machine. The other creates the base water for our in-office hydroponic garden. Both up and running for sometime and I've never observed mold. I've personally run a home RO system to provide the base water for my saltwater aquariums. My RO water is stored in a 50 gallon plastic drum in a basement. That system's been running for 6 years and never had a mold problem.
I would not chlorinate water feeding an espresso machine. Chlorination is not good for flavor and under the right conditions can create an acid (very weak) in espresso machine boilers.
I suspect your problem may be because of a problem in your RO system like a bad/old membrane or other maintenance issue.
Marc
Whole Latte Love many thanks Marc for your replay
Can you add Himalayan pink salt instead of Epsom salt?? thanks
No.
@@Mob1bo why???
A) Because Himalayan pink salt is unethical overpriced salt for pretentious people.
B) Because Epsom salt contains magnesium, pink salt contains sodium chloride.
Hi Marc, can the concentrates be stored in the cupboard at room temperature safely ? How long should they be kept or made fresh? I’m thinking of using magnesium chloride instead of epsom salt. How do I figure out the weight to add per litre of RO water?
Hi Jackson, Thanks for the question. Yes, concentrates can be stored safely at room temperature for a very long time. Epsom salts are 10% elemental magnesium while magnesium chloride is 25% so divide by 2.5 for same amount of magnesium.
Marc
Baking soda absorbs moisture, which will change the weight per volume. I live in a high humidity part of the country and my baking soda weighed 3g/.5 tsp.
Hi Chris, Thanks for the info!
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage Hi Marc - I was following the instructions in the video, but when I weighed my .5 tsp of baking soda I found that it weighed considerably more than 1.4g, so I started doing some research.
Thank YOU for the mountains of great info you make available for all of us.
Chris Branscome you’re welcome and thanks for the kind comment
I didn’t understand what you said at the end about making water for boilers but this water will be fine for a boiler machine right?
Hi Adam, Thanks for the question. Yes, this works for espresso machines. Still recommend descaling from time to time. This water is less likely to cause scaling as bulk of mineral hardness comes from magnesium which is less likely to cause scale deposits than calcium rich water.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage in terms of taste will this water still taste good? Or will it be all noticeably salty and weird from the baking soda/Espon salt
Hello. Is this recipe good for French Press coffee/ medium roast extraction?
Hi Henry, Yes it is!
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage thanks alot.❤️❤️
How would I bring the TDS higher? I tried this recipe and only got 100ppm, wondering how I could make it 150ppm.
Hi Adam, For higher TDS just increase each concentrate. In you case 50% more of each should do it.
Marc
add a bit of potasium chloride and bit of calcium carbonate and you’ll get ur perfect drinking and brewing water at the same time! I do this and get 155ppm! not bad or far away from 150ppm!
If i use this water in my espresso machine do i still use the machine's water filter and will i still have to descale as before?
I love this side of coffee making, i though it was all about the beans lol
Hi LL, Thanks for the question. It's unlikely scale will form using this water. I'd still descale - but less frequently. There are other factors like concentration of minerals in steam or HX boiler main sections if only used for steam and not hot water.
Hi Mark. I just purchased from WLL a new Gaggia Classic Pro. I have a RO system and followed your video on making my own re-mineralizing I tested my water prior to demineralization and it was 25 ppm. After demineralization it increased to 125 ppm. Is 125 ppm sufficient for re-mineralization. If it is how often should I descale my machine if I average 2 espressos a day. Thanks again for your expert advice and enthusiasm.
Hi 10, Thanks for your patronage and question. 125ppm should be sufficient for re-min. TDS measurements do not tell the whole story of water hardness but starting with RO at 25ppm (guessing your RO has some bypass remin built in? Or maybe not using DI treatment after RO?) and upping minerals as shown in video should leave you with water that's not going to cause a lot of scale. At your use level I recommend descaling you machine 2-3 times per year. You may have little to no scale formation but better safe than sorry.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage Thanks Marc responding so quickly to my question. Appreciate the additional information and guidance.
Hello. Do you have the measurement for directly pouring epsom salt and sodium bicarbonate directly to a 5 gallon bottle?
Hi Yazid, Thanks for the question. I do not. Strongly suggest making a concentrate of each additive then dosing into the 5 gallon bottle. Just do a little math and increase dosage to make the 5 gallons.
Marc
Whole Latte Love thanks for the reply! 😁
So does this method prevent scale buildup in the DB machines as well as get the better coffee flavor?
Hi BB, Thanks for the question. At the SCA spec ratios described in the video you are unlikely to form excess scale in a machine. In large part because the mineral level is predominately from magnesium and not calcium. Personally I would still descale a machine just to be safe.
@@Wholelattelovepage
So if the scale buildup is reduced, how often would it be recommended to descale? Also, I've noticed Mark talking about descaling solution but then at the same time mentioning descaling DB should be done by pros. Is there a procedure for descaling DB machines?
After mixing here with RO, my TDS is in the 250ppm. Does this sound right?
Hi p, sounds about right!
@@Wholelattelovepage Thanks. What's an acceptable range for ppms? I have read conflicting info re: what this should be.
Going to try this. It says saline laxative on the bag. If I get the squirts I'm going to be pissed.
Hey stan, lol think you'd be more pooped than pissed! Anyway, yes at much higher concentrations it can be used as a laxative but believe me you are not even remotely close to the amount needed to produce that effect!
@@Wholelattelovepage Okay. 👍
So...if I buy my filtered RO water by the 5 gallon jug...I can just add 1.4g of baking soda and 3.3g of epsom salt directly to my jug and that should be good to go instead of messing with concentrates? I get that concentrate makes sense if you're making your coffee brew water a liter or a gallon at a time...but I'll be making mine 5 gallons at a time.
Hi Chad, Yes you can do that. Fully mix in one additive before the other. If added at the same time you may get a precipitate.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage Do those amounts look right? I measured (weighed) them out and it's really a tiny amount of stuff that doesn't seem like would have much effect on 5 gallons of water.
I just tested and the 5 gallons has a TDS of 95 after adding 1.4g baking soda and 3.4g epsom salt. No difference in taste.
10g seems like a lot of epsom in the concentrate, barista hustle who were one of the main people doing this put like 2.45g
Hi TS, Not sure how much of the concentrate they're mixing in - maybe that's the difference?
I just purchased a Jura E8 and am concerned about scaling. Coming from the world of cheap drip machines that I just threw away when they got scaled this is now a big concern as this machine cost a chunk of change. In your experience is the claims of not needing to descale if using the jura filter true? Would you recommend using the BWT filter pad in addition to the factory filter? Thanks.
Hi Jerry, I was a little skeptical of their no descaling claim initially. I have asked Jura about this many times and they assure me with proper filter use descaling of Jura machines is not required. Your E8 has the Intelligent Water System with RFID tags in the filter which makes it easy to stay on top of filter maintenance.
if the main mineral for coffee extraction were magnesium and calcium, where does the calcium coming from though? this is a really great solution rather to buy some filter or aquacode, but if the water itself has zero minerals, how do I add the calcium and magnesium into it?
Hi BO, Magnesium comes from the Epsom salt. It replaces the need for calcium. Coffee doesn't care if the mineral is magnesium or calcium.
Will using this instead of tap water reduce scaling or completely avoid it in an espresso machine? I'm not worried about taste just avoiding scale, just ordered a barista express from breville
Hi w, Thanks for the question. It should reduce scale but cannot say it avoids completely. I would still descale the machine on a regular basis as recommended by the manufacturer.
Thanks for the guide! Wish there was a part where the math was done or it was tested on the video. Was this tested? Is this recipe gotten from somewhere?
Thanks for the intro. Are you still planning to post additional, more complicated recipes?
Hi MC, You are welcome! We do plan on doing more custom recipes building off the base of SCA standard brew water. Stay tuned!
How could this be applied to espresso? I understand FloJets can be use to supply prepared water like this, but it possible to apply magnesium and sodium bicarbonate to a reverse osmosis filter? Changing out 5 gal bottles and dosing them with minerals seems like a hassle.
I ask this in the context of a commercial setup. Thanks!
Hi SL, Thanks for the question. There are remineralizing setups for RO water in bothe commercial and home setups. In fact that's what's done in every high-end cafe in my area. Water is RO treated and then minerals are added back in after treatment. Here's a remineralization filter for that purpose: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-bestmin-premium-m-filter-cartridge
Marc
WOW awesome, so how does it taste on a espresso shot? Will this eliminate the need to descale?
Hi B74, This prep is more suited to general coffee brewing. It would be okay for espresso brewing but a higher mineral level may be of benefit. I'll be getting into other preps using the same concentrates including those more suited for espresso brewing. It's actually fairly straightforward. A good start for espresso is to keep the Alk/Buffer level the same and 2x the Mg level. The mix made in the video will not produce scale (or corrosion) according the the Langelier Saturation Index. I'll get into LSI in a future video as well.
Awesome vid Marc. there's silica in the water where i live which can result in boiler scale, so i wanted to do something like this for a long time. Normal softeners and filtration will not remove the silica. Will the espresso recipe of 2x Mg level possibly result in scaling my espresso machine boiler? What's the hardness of the basic recipe and of the 2x Mg recipe? Thanks!
Well, after testing my water its pretty bad even after the gravity filter .. so
Until we can soften with a whole house system, would you recommend this as a short term solution to go with our upcoming new double boiler ?
Hi Matthew, Yes this is a reasonable solution for your new dual boiler!
Marc
Hi! Just got my rocket R 58 machine. Is this a safe recipe for my machine? Or would you recommend some filtration? I will be using the water tank. Thanks!!
Hi Sarah, This recipe is safe to us in an R58 but overtime may produce some scaling. Since dual boiler machines are difficult to descale I'd recommend using water filtration. Best available are those from BWT which use patented ion-exchange technology which replaces scale causing calcium with magnesium. You get water with the minerals needed to prevent over-extraction and support flavor without causing scale in the machine. Two BWT options are there BestSave pad filters which you drop in the reservoir: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-bestsave-m-anti-scale-filter
Or their Penguin Pitcher: www.wholelattelove.com/products/bwt-penguin-2-7-l-water-pitcher
Hope that helps!
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage thanks for taking the time to reply!!
I made this at home but it tested hard with a water hardnes strip (Hach Sofcheck) what could it be?
One more question about distilled water ... Some brands of distilled water isn't pH 7. is that a huge problem?
The acceptable pH range for coffee brewing is 6-8. The additives will change the pH. Check after mixing for pH range of 6-8.
Is there any water you can buy that is already up to SCA standards that doesn't need to be remineralized? What options are there (if any)? This would be for home use French press and espresso in a Profitec Pro 500.
Hi Brett, I have from time to time read of some commercially available bottled waters as falling within SCA specs. Not something I've tested or tried however. I've also read that some national water brands have variations in mineral levels depending on the region in which they are purchased as they may have a number of bottling facilities with water coming from different sources.
Thx - WLL!
Do this receipt create soft water as the outcome, in order to reduce descaling frequency?
Hi M, Thanks for the question. Yes this recipe creates a water with a mineral level to support coffee flavor and reduce descaling.
Can I drink this water regularly? Without coffe? Does it tastes good?
It tastes ok. I think it's very vaguely salty.
Can we use RO water instead of Distilled water?
Hi MH, Thanks for the question. Pure RO water is essentially the same as distilled water so yes you can. Do be aware many RO system have some way of re-mineralizing after RO treatment. In that case it's not pure RO water.
Marc
Hi Marc
Thank you for the prompt feedback.
Thank you for the valuable information. Do you have any idea to verify that my system is not re-mineralizing the water? How can I verify it.
Great video! Thank you Marc. Anything on water recipes for espresso machines? Or, do I just use this one and tweak it as needed?
Hi Bill, Thanks for the comment. You could use this one in espresso machine with little risk of scale formation. Some prefer a slightly higher mineral content for espresso use but I'm guessing 99% would have a tough time telling a difference in a blind taste test.
Marc
@@WholelattelovepageThank you Marc.
So what would the measurements be if I didn't want to make a concentrate, and just wanted to mix up one gallon at a time? I do have a scale that does grains, so I can measure small.
Curious about the answer for this one too! Any feedback WLL? Or would it mean that I'n need to get a scale with more than just 1 decimal?
Also curious about this. I believe you could add .063 * 10.1g of Epsom Salt first. That's 636mg. Then you could add .185 * 1.4g of Sodium Bicarbonate. That's 259mg. This should be suitable for a gallon.
WLL, Marc, any confirmation on this?
@@gravityUTube I think that's about 10x too much of each. I've been using .75g Epsom Salt, .26g Baking soda for per gallon distilled. About 130 TDS.
Oh sorry, basic math/decmal points off... you are close, correct.
Marc, if I make the water mix and use it for my espresso machine do I still need to add the scale reduction filter pouch in my water reservoir? I use the Bilt Osmotic Scale Reduction filter.
Hi Max, Thanks for the question. I have not used the Bilt but it's my understanding it uses calcium to magnesium ion exchange. The SCA mix uses magnesium for the bulk of the hardness so you're already doing what the Bilt would do. The SCA recipe is unlikely to cause scale build-up. Personally I would do prophylactic descaling.
Marc
Thank you for the cool video. But I do not understand the last step...when I finished making the concentrates, what do I have to do to get 1l brew water: mix a cup of destilled water with 50ml buffer and 17ml Hardness +1l of destilled water OR is it only one cup of destilled water+50ml Buffer+17ml Hardness? Thank you :)
Hi Anna, Sorry for the confusion. Mix with 1L distilled water.
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage nothing to be sorry for! Thank you :)
Hi Marc, thanks for the great video. Improving my brew water is the next stage for me and this is a great resource. Are you able to provide the alkalinity, calcium (I think 0), pH, and TDS (I think I saw 150ppm below) for this brew water? The only other brew water recipes I have seen were on the Barista Hustle website and it looks like there is a big difference between your recipe and theirs for the Hardness solution (your recipe has approx 5x the epsom salts). What is the impact of this on an espresso machine? I am assuming that either way any of these recipes will be a big improvement over the tap water I am using. Thanks again!
Hi MP, You are welcome for the video. Unfortunately I made this video a few years back and no longer have the data easily available for those parameters. Not sure my magnesium was 5x the other or it could be they are adding other minerals to up the calcium while I'm using mostly magnesium. Calcium is the enemy in espresso machines as it causes scale. But other variables like pH and alkalinity play a role in combination with calcium level. When magnesium is the predominate mineral in the water scale is less likely to form.
Marc
I was looking at the math and comparing it to BaristaHustle as well, and yes following this recipe is different to BH's listed SCA water profile, but from what I see the Epsom Salts are correct - it's the baking soda that could be off in the mixed 1 Gal of coffee water. For clarity, you were commenting on the Hardness solution, but that's just a concentrate - it doesn't matter what the Epsom salt amount is in it, it only matters what the total weight of Epsom salts are in the mixed 1Gal of SCA water. The only problem with WholeLatteLove's recipe is that 1/2 tsp of baking soda doesn't weigh 1.4g, it' more like 3g, so if you prepare this as written by teaspoon you'll be wayyy off (TDS ~314ppm). However, If you prepare the concentrate by weight (using 1.4g) then both recipes would be close to each other, and have a TDS around 240ppm. The SCA actually revised their water standard and now lists a fairly broad range for TDS (75-250ppm), so this recipe is fine as long as you use 1.4g Baking soda for the concentrate (or 1/4 tsp).
@@jcmmmbrains2718 I agree with this, 1/4t is preferred if you are not weighing the ingredients. I've been making this for a couple of years now and poked around the SCA site and others for their recipes back then and found 1/4t (1.4g) to be the preferred amount. So this yields great neutral tasting water, but the bonus is that none of my equipment has yet built up any scale. Thanks to WLL (Marc) for introducing me to making my own water! Kudos! BTW, distilled water is now up to $1.50/g . :(
Great video. Thanks.
Is there a filtration system that produces water like this?
Hi Alric, Thank you for the comment. Yes there is! We like this BWT filtration system which uses ion-exchange technology to replace calcium with magnesium. The technique produces brew water with a proper mineral level for good flavor yet does not cause scale build-up in brewing equipment. Check it out here: www.wholelattelove.com/bwt-bestmax-premium-filter-package-w-besthead-flex
Marc
HI Mark, is this water safe to use and prevent scale buildup in my Rocket Mazzafiato type r?
Hi XJ, (is XJ a Jeep Cherokee reference?) Water is safe to use. I cannot say with 100% certainty it will prevent all scale build up. But, it's far less likely to cause scale than moderately hard tap water.
Marc
Hey Marc, me again. I just made some of the water and tested it for hardness and TDS. I got a reading of 6 grains hardness and 105 TDS. DOES THAT SOUND ABOUT RIGHT? sorry for the caps (cap lock). The water from my tap (I have well water) is less than 2 grains hardness and only 24 TDS. Am I correct in assuming my water is too soft and lack the minerals needed for a good extraction? This stuff keeps me up at night. Lol. Thanks in advance for your reply. Take care.
Great video! thanks for Sharing
You are welcome and thanks for watching!
Marc
Super helpful, thanks Mark!
Hi Matthew, You are welcome and thanks for the comment.
Wait, did you combine your own hydrogen and oxygen as well to make the water?
Lol, First I split the water then recombined!
Late to the party, but my searches for coffee/water quality led me here. I couldn't help but check your calculations and they look perfect. Wondering though, is there any advantage to using separate stock solutions for hardness and alkalinity? I used 1 tsp of baking soda and 1.5 tsp Epsom salt and filled with 500 g of RO water. Adding 47 g of concentrate to a gallon of water should get me pretty close to the target values.
Hi Jeff, Thanks for the question and apologies for a delayed response. Been a little hectic here in NY as we adjust to deal with current events. I use separate solutions as you cannot combine concentrates or they will precipitate. It may be possible to combine the BS and ES at lower concentration without causing precipitates. Hope that helps!
Marc
@@Wholelattelovepage, thank you for taking the time during the craziness. Hope you and your families are staying healthy. Completely, missed the precipitation issue - makes perfect sense.
I would be a little concerned about using Epsom Salt for its Mg content as it releases sulphates which can alter the taste of the water as well.
Is this brew water hard enough that it won't cause corrosion if left in a stainless steel vessel?
Hi David, Yes it is.
Marc
Hey Marc, I don't know if you'll see this comment. But I have a question about the kind of epsom salt used. I bought a bag of epsom salt recently. It's pure magnesium sulfate but it also says do not ingest. The package says it's used for baths and as fertilizer.
Do we need to buy food grade epsom salt? It's a lot more expensive than the price you mentioned in the video.
Hope you see this comment. Thanks.
Hi Ricky, You're probably thinking I didn't see your question - I did! Sorry been on vacation for a week and was off line. Know for the future I do respond to all original comments on the videos. Some times delayed a bit.
I'm using "Top Care Epsom Salt" It's a store brand sold at my local Wegmans Super Market in the pharmacy isle. It's labeled as Magnesium Sulfate U.S.P.
Epsom Salt is commonly used as a laxative dosed at rate of 10 to 30 grams/day. So don't worry about it making you poop in the concentrations used in the brew water recipe :)
Directions for making at laxative strength are on the bag I use so it's definitely okay for human consumption. It's likely (but I'm not certain) different grades of Epsom Slat are available. I'd look at a pharmacy to be on safe side.
Marc
I found this video because a comment on pure calcium chloride said they used it with baking soda and epsom salt to make coffee water. if you were going to use the calcium chloride as well, how much should you add?
Hi AHC, Thanks for the question. I don't have a solid recipe for using calcium chloride. A couple of things... Calcium is the main culprit in causing scale deposits. An important consideration for those using espresso machines. The magnesium does essentially the same thing as calcium would. It supports a mineral level for flavor and prevention of over-extraction but has far lower risk of scale formation.
Hi ,
I have a question regarding quantities. I measured .5tsp of baking soda and then I weighted it just to make sure I had 1.4g as the video says but instead it weights 5g which is a big difference. Same thing with the epsom salt. 2.5tsp gives me 14.1g instead of 10.1g. I double checked everything on a second scale and I had the same results.
Should I measure by weight or with the tea spoons ?
Thanks
Hi MR, If you have accurate scales, weighing is more accurate.
Had the same issue, probably because I bought my Sodium Bicarbonate from a pharmacy and not a grocery, and it's grounded more finely.
Hey guys!! Big fan. I know this doesn't really have anything to do with this exact video, but seeing as how this is your most recent one, I'll post here. I just bought the Bonavita BV1900TS drip machine on your suggestion! And I love it so much! But I had a question I had hopped you could answer. The machine has the function option to wet the grounds prior to brew for offgassing. I grind my own beans each time, and was wondering if this would be something good to do each time? Pros and cons for it compared to just brewing regularly??
Hi Chase, Thanks for the comment and question. If you are using beans that are within a week or two of roast then off-gassing will provide benefits. The pre-wetting allows CO2 present in fresh-roasted beans to off-gas so subsequent brew water can more fully saturate the coffee. For beans beyond a few weeks from roast most of the CO2 has already off-gassed naturally so pre-wetting may not be of much use. But every coffee is different so not a hard rule.
Whole Latte Love thank you so much! Love you guys.
Our pleasure!
THIS IS AWESOME!!
Would you mind if I do a Chinese translation for a wider audience?
Hi S, Go for it!