May contain milk means that the facility uses milk in some products. By law these facilities have to be cleaned thoroughly in between products. If this makes them not vegan consider that unless you’re getting all your things from all vegan factories (almost impossible) you are not being consistent. To me what matters is the actual ingredients. We buy things from stores that sell non vegan things all the time, but we are vegan because we buy the vegan things.
May contain animal products doesnt mean its not vegan. "Any dishes that are to be labelled vegan must be prepared separately from non-vegan dishes. At a minimum, this means thoroughly washing surfaces and utensils before using for vegan cooking. We strongly recommend obtaining a separate set of cleaning utensils for this purpose. We ask for the awareness of the risk of cross-contamination from non-vegan sources in your kitchen or production line and that the Trademark holder takes all reasonable and practical steps to eliminate this."-vegan society trademark standards
I agree, but not true with the “cleaned throughly”, like I said in my comment, they tested these products in Sweden and was surprised to see how much more than just “traces” were actually in them, and chocolate is the worst.
They’re vegan… I usually agree with Ryan but this is kinda stupid. If you stop eating Oreo’s based on this video you’ll also have to stop eating a TONNE of other vegan products… Per the standard definition ‘as practicably possible’ ensuring 100% of cross contamination is avoided is near impossible in every factory that isn’t 100% vegan. Getting all your food from 100% vegan factories is not practicable for most people. Therefore oreos are by definition vegan.
This is what Gary Yurosky explained on this video regarding buying vegan things from non vegan companies. As the vegan definition says as "far as it is possible and practicable". When my kids go to birthday parties I'm not going to deny them the only accidental vegan snack (oreos) they usually find in omnis houses.
I dont think sugar filtered thru bone char is vegan. Animals are killed to make bone char to filter sugar. According to vegan society trademark standards" The manufacture and/or development of the product, and its ingredients, must not involve or have involved, the use of any animal product, by-product or derivative." Also other vegan certification organizations often require there is no sugar filtered thru bone char. I avoid Oreos in usa cuz idk if the sugar was filtered thru bone char and i don't want to contribute to animals being killed for bone char. I try to stick to vegan or organic sugar as i dont think its filtered thru bone char. They make vegan certified oreo alternatives.
Cross-contact still qualifies as vegan as per the Vegan Society, as it is not an actual deliberate ingredient but a possibility of an accidental particle or two. However it's good to have our eyes open for things like bone char in sugar and the ethics of sourcing.
Cross-Contamination for me is an issue for allergics. It doesn‘t make something non-vegan. Palm oil is an interesting topic. Can we consider something vegan that 100% destroys the natural habitat of so many wild animals?
Strangely I gave up/boycotted palm oil long before I went vegan. I was still blind to my own actions but having gone to school for Env. Sci I was well aware of Palm oils destruction.
I think it's INCREDIBLY dangerous for vegans to start knitpicking products for their ethical sourcing practices under the 'vegan label'. If you feel this way, that's okay, don't buy these products. But to put it under the 'vegan labeling' makes an incredibly mixed message and a very misleading set or outlining 'rules' to people that get into or researching the diet and lifestyle. I 100% disagree with your opinion of even the idea of labeling oreos as not vegan. But I will agree with you that they are not 100% ethically sourced. Keep 'vegan' ... vegan, and use the correct terminology of ethically sourced products. Don't muddy the waters.
Labelling something as "vegan" for something "ethically sourced" should actually be the default, because veganism is by definition a moral stance. While labelling something which is just plant-based (as Oreos) as "vegan" can be actually considered to "muddy the waters". In general, I find it irritating when companies (or restaurants) proudly advertise some of the products as "vegan" because that should indicate that they share the moral basis of veganism, but this is often contradicted by the fact that the same company (or restaurant) is also selling non-vegan products. It would be much more honest to just advertise the corresponding products as "suitable for vegans", "vegan-friendly" or simply as "plant-based". This has nothing to do with nitpicking, just about acknowledging the fact that there is a relevant difference between "vegan" and "plant-based".
did you totally not see me say that I'm not telling anyone what to do, and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos? I see your decision there and I'm totally fine with it.
@@stt7598 Being vegan does not have to be a "moral" stance. there are people who follow a vegan diet for the health benefits. There are too many people claiming to speak for all vegans and trying to define veganism. Not everyone is a food activist.
@@HappyHealthyVegan I did hear you say that. Sorry for the confusion as a whole and this comment wasn't directly pointed at you and or your view points. I was just try to add my thought and opinion on the topic. I am much like you in that I don't mind what people eat and don't let it effect me or my choice (including people who consume animal products). Much love and I have enjoyed your content for many many year. In fact you were one of the original RUclipsrs that i watched when transitioning to a vegan lifestyle 7 years ago.
@@MH-zg5yw I disagree. You cannot be vegan for health reasons, you can only be plant-based for health reasons. Veganism by definition is concerned about the avoidance of animal exploitation and has NOTHING to do with health. This is THE definition of veganism and if some people do not agree with this definition, I don't understand why they want to call themselves vegan. Btw., I became plant-based for health reasons and initially avoided the term vegan as I wasn't yet convinced by the moral arguments. Now I am proudly calling myself a vegan as I am fully convinced by the moral arguments leading to veganism as a lifestyle (where food is just one aspect of).
I'd say they are vegan, depending on where - in Europe, they don't use bone char for sugar. Even if they are vegan, this whole "traces of..." is not as innocent as it may sound. In Sweden, they took samples from these products and discovered that these "may contain" was in fact much higher than expected. It's obviously not labeled for the sake of vegans, but for people with lactose intolerance, so makes sense they don't care. Apparently chocolate has the highest amounts of milk in them. I remember one chocolate in particular, it had "may contain...", so us vegans bought em - but after a few years, that was removed and replaced with "contains X% milk". Again, "may contain" is vegan, but for someone who wants to avoid this, it's good to know.
@@jaynesixx2185 Wow, yea I’m not surprised.. It always annoys me when products are labelled vegan and there’s “may contain”, I always think it’s such a shame for people like you with a lactose intolerance. It should me animal free, period. For instances, the two biggest manufacturers of potato chips here, the regular ones with just oil and salt, the one has traces of and the other doesn’t!! 🤷♂️
@@2AMVegan Yeah is, so I can't have vego bar 😞 but, the spread I have no problem with. It should be as we are trying to avoid all those "may contain" thing bar some of us nuts and soy. Yeah, it's just make me want to make my own potato chips, but Pringle's as too good not to buy.
@@jaynesixx2185 OH, nooo the vego bar!! I feel for ya... I used to eat tons of them in the past, even got a big box special discount. But now, since reading about the milk protein and especially chocolate I've personally decided to cut it out, even if it's vegan. I have to repeat that part bc I don't want to sound like I'm saying it's not vegan. Ohh, yea Pringles too changed, I believe...? But these two brands I'm talking about, it's just silly, three ingredients and the one has milk.
if people are not going to eat oreos then they may as well stop eating out in vegan friendly restaurants! don't let the "perfect be the enemy of the good!" accidently consuming animal products don't stop you being vegan! if you held money then you've had all kinds of contaminants that you've consumed!
Cross contamination doesn’t count. The main ingredients do not contain dairy. So when you purchase a product made with no animal products, you are supporting plant based products.
Hi Ryan, that was a good video. Very informative; thank you. I am a homemaker. I use only vegan ingredients, it's so easy. I sweeten baked goods with organic maple syrup or org. Coconut sugar. I mostly use almond flour sometimes organic all purppse flour. I just made a delicious moist pumpkin chocolate chip loaf. It was a dream. I can easily swap out applesauce or Banana for oil, and otherwise I add organic unrefined coconut oil. I love seeing Angie do her recipes and love your vlogs! Take care🙂🌼🌈🧁
I don't understand the obsession. Oreos suck~ soooooo sickly sweet they hurt my teeth. Also, palm oil should not be considered vegan from an animal exploitation angle.
Right? We need to talk about palm-oil more. It needs to be represented properly… it’s a f”king scam. It’s in everything and we need to do something about it. It’s so hard to avoid when you aren’t being super careful.
I was eating them but now you reminded me about the palm oil which i forgot they have. So I think now Im just going to find another brand of cookies that are vegan without palm oil.
They’re vegan… I usually agree with Ryan but this is kinda stupid. If you stop eating Oreo’s based on this video you’ll also have to stop eating a TONNE of other vegan products…
I’ve been looking into more healthier items anyway. Oreos don’t say vegan on the package so the points made in this video are valid. There are so many other things that are more enjoyable to have.
I don’t eat them or very much processed food at all. But by Ryan’s definition I must not be vegan because I eat a ton of organic plants that are most likely fertilized with cow manure.
What you smokin the Ryan to come up with that logic?That’s an extreme take on the definition of being vegan. Vegan meals at restaurants will have a far greater chance of cross contamination than that from processed food manufacturers. We’re usually only talking ppm levels, and only the chance thereof, and labelled as such so that food manufacturers are not sued by hypersensitive individuals with allergies.
did you totally not see me say that I'm not telling anyone what to do, and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos? I see your decision there and I'm totally fine with it.
I don't buy oreos for myself but if friends or family gift them to me I take them happily because they tried to find something for me I can actually eat :)
I'm really sensitive to wheat, to the point that multiple times I've had a reaction to a product that I didn't think had wheat in it but it turned out it had a small amount in soy sauce used to flavor the product. Not enough that one would expect it to make a difference. And yet I've never had a reaction from products that said they were made in the same facilities that used wheat. I think they must wash the facilities between products. If my reaction were anaphylactic shock, I'd be more careful, but if it's just possible traces from other uses of machinery, I take it as okay. Same goes for milk. It's hard enough to find products that don't use things we don't want as ingredients. I'm not willing to cross the line into saying that anything that has ever touched wheat or milk can't touch ingredients I eat. Unless one is in life-threatening danger from the allergen, I don't see the purpose of being that nitpicky. Of course, Oreos are off my menu anyway, due to the wheat. If that were not the case, I think the palm oil issue is much more compelling than possible cross contamination from equipment.
If soy sauce upsets you then maybe it's also related to yeast? Most modern soy sauce is fermented using wheat yeast if ii remember correctly, so that could be setting it off. Have a cousin with Celiac's and his mom was telling me that there's so many things that set it off, sometimes even fresh food sometimes.
@@jmassagetherapist6773 Not sure. I haven't been able to afford the test for Celiac or allergies, but my observations are that small amounts of wheat (more than "made on the same equipment") cause a reaction. It's not just wheat gluten, it's wheat. I can eat nutritional yeast no problem - do people with Celiac's have trouble with that?
@@Cat_Woods not sure about everyone with celiacs, but my cousin specifically has an issue with gluten of quite a few kinds. Gluten is essentially how plants store sugar, and his sensitivity is to grains in particular(carrots are fine) but even just cutting vegetables on a cutting board that had bread on it and was rinsed since is enough to set him off. Admittedly not close to this cousin so ii don't know any more specific details or if it's changed since ii learned of it.
Finally! the content we have all been waiting for! Oreos are well received in our house, but as I started trying to loose weight I realized 2 cookies is like 70 calories, and for some reason eating just 1 or 2 is almost impossible. Eating all or none is way easier. Oreos have become a rare treat. As a family of 6 vegans it is nice to think of the Oreo as a guilt free cookie, way to ruin it Ryan! I will still consider them to reduce harm to the extent practical and therefore vegan.
Interesting, have recently been discovering and working through my less than a year old lactose intolerance problem myself. It's sensitive enough to be affected by a pastry with whey powder but Oreos never feel bad unless ii just eat too many. Have also heard that they use different ingredients in different locations so ii wonder if that's it? California has quite a few food and health safety laws that are pretty strict compared to the rest of the usa.
Personally I don't worry about cross-contamination and usually not even sugar, unless I'm buying like, a whole bag of sugar. Then I'll look for organic or brands I know don't process through bone char. But for individual products, it would take way too much time and research, and many brands even change their process over time, so getting an answer at one point in time might not be accurate a year from now. But with palm oil, for both vegan and environmental reasons, I avoid it. It's unfortunately in an insane number of products that are technically vegan, so it does limit me, but I feel strongly about it. That's more of a personal choice in my mind though, not necessarily a vegan one.
I have several food allergies and I never kept myself from eating products that may contain x allergen and I never had issues. So I'm not worried about cross-contamination from wrapped products. From restaurants, it's another matter.
I think the usage of palm oil should have been considered here, more important than "may contain milk" or sugar. Palm oil is arguably one of the most unethically sourced non-animal products. I was hoping you would talk about that instead
You said you don't eat them because you don't like junk food, but do you think they're vegan? So many things are made in facilities or put on equipment that may contain cross contamination products. It's on almost every label. Even stuff you would never think would be together. I think the company came out and said that oreos aren't vegan, and I understand why. They don't want to cater to vegans because it's such a small market.
technically Oreos seem to fall under the definition of an accidentally vegan product. but did you not see me say that I'm not telling anyone what to do, and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos?
@@HappyHealthyVegan Pretty common to judge ourselves unfairly especially when it comes to hair. Thanks for all the effort you put in for your videos. I enjoy every one of them.
For people in the UK, there's a great company called The Vegan Bakery that make a totally vegan version of Oreos. You get the same amount of biscuits in a pack, its RSPO certified palm oil and the cocoa is fair-trade. To my mind, typical oreos aren't strictly vegan.
I have a dairy allergy and could die if I consume it, and have never had a reaction to Oreos. I do not see how cross contamination harms animals in any way and will continue to eat them. I think getting too overly picky like this could actually hurt the movement.
I agree, I was just about to comment this. Like honestly cross contamination is gonna happen regardless of the measures taken, and really I’d argue there’s no ethics involved here because in the end you’d be consuming what are scraps of what’s left of the machine was used. It’s no different than having cleaning standards, like it’s impossible to be perfect on that, however you do have standards to avoid the majority of health issues. The only people that this really matters to are the people that are allergic to said ingredients. Like I mentioned I hate that this is becoming an issue now, as this could just harm the movement going forward, and I don’t freaking like this pissing contest sort of thing if this is where it’s leaning towards
did you totally not see me say that I'm not telling anyone what to do, and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos? I see your decision there and I'm totally fine with it.
@@HappyHealthyVegan I personally am not saying you are. But the fact that its gotten to the point where you had to make a video about it, makes me think that there's something going on in the vegan community for such a thing to even be talked about. As plenty of vegans have already talked about this on RUclips years ago, and no one batted an eye then, but now it gets to the point where this is now an issue with people in the community. My critic is more so on what the community is doing to themselves if such this sets the stage for what were small things before to become a massive issue now.
Thanks, the various aspects are well examined and explained. I avoid junk food but once in a blue moon I do succumb to temptation though less and less as the years go by. If really really tempted or like for a birthday cake declared to be vegan (recently for my 64th birthday my sister baked me a delicious vegan chocolate cake but containing normal ordinary sugar, which I happily relished more so as it was my first birthday cake in decades) I would overlook the minuscule amount of animal product usage in producing the sugar. If buying sugar (which I wouldn't normally do since I'm Whole Food) I would search for a vegan brand. Oreos: I would have or buy them in a rare instance I suppose. Regarding the product being made in a facility also sometimes using milk or eggs, I feel this statement is to some extent a safety measure for legal reasons, they often mention soy, peanuts and tree nuts also. I would go ahead and buy the product though again usually I greatly avoid highly processed foods. I have bought dark chocolate with no vegan ingredients but with this sort of disclaimer statement. Interestingly, anti vegan people, themselves having kilograms of animal products including dairy milk, cheese, paneer, butter, eggs and various kinds of flesh seize on this to say accusingly to me that then I'm not vegan. I don't care what they say - to put it in non beep terms.
I don't consume anything that says may contains either but thats me, also i don't eat oreos for the fact they dont say if it uses bone char or not and oreos aren't organic either.
I thought it'd be a good idea to make cookies last night. Made chocolate chippers from scratch. Yes Poo bakes. Then I did stupid and ate 12...got the bloat. Feeling better now...
Make a youtube video having a convo with Chris cooney(the vegan zombie). Hes a really chill awesome vegan youtuber. He has 15.5k subscribers on his chris cooney channel, and 179k subscribers on his the vegan zombie channel.
They are not vegan. If you want to say to yourself that “they are vegan” so you can eat a definitively not vegan food and be happy ok, do you. But they are not vegan.
Apart from the ingredients I also look for allergy may contain: bold ingredient of concern. There are other flavor Oreos which may have animal products in them.
I'm disappointed by this video. Ryan usually makes the point that veganism is a philosophy about not exploiting animals as far as practicable and possible. How does cross contamination exploit animals? Even with the sugar, how is it practicable to avoid white sugar for the majority of people? (I know a lot of health-concious people will disagree) Also palm oil is technically vegan. I know there are issues in the way palm oil is produced but those are general issue with agricultural practices and not palm oil exclusive. So in my view, Oreos are 100% plant-based/ vegan-friendly
did you totally not see me say that I'm not telling anyone what to do, but and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos? I see your decision there and I'm totally fine with it.
@@HappyHealthyVegan this video sounds like it's even arguable if Oreos are not vegan but to me it's obvious they are free from animal ingredients. I think it undermines the vegan position if we make it seem like veganism is impossible to achieve because there is palm oil, sugar or non vegan money in everything.
Meh yeah I gotta draw the line somewhere. No mention of milk, eggs, or honey in the ingredients list (not at the "may contain" part) = vegan for me. I prefer to buy vegan protein bars for snacks on the way but sometimes I just ran out and have to buy something. Oreos or peanuts are great for this.
I don't like palm oil and buy palm oil free, I have never had them too since being and vegan and who needs them when you can find the vegan version at a local Cafe or vegan supermarket or online store 🤫 and they taste better.
I understand that you're not judging people, but do you personally avoid products made in a facility that also makes products with animal ingredients or is it just the bone char and palm oil that give you extra reason to avoid oreos?
actually I had not known that vegnews thing until after I filmed this. I came up with the idea on a recent livestream when someone asked me if Oreos are vegan.
Considering the fact that vegetable farmers routinely kill wildlife for their crops and wildlife lands are taken to grow it, I think it’s a bit disingenuous to proselytize on the evils of palm oil. It sucks and I wish farmers would adopt veganic farming methods but since we currently live in a non-vegan world it is what it is. It can be argued, using the same logic, that organic fruits and vegetables are not vegan since they depend on manure from the flesh and dairy industry. Cross contamination is a legal notice. If one chooses to exempt anything plantbased solely because of the possibility of cross contamination, then I hope you get your food at only vegan grocery stores because cross contamination could happen at a non vegan grocery store too. The only red flag for me is bone char. I choose to avoid products that don’t specify cane sugar as the ingredient as opposed to just sugar. But I agree, bone char is a decision left up to each vegan’s feeling on it.
@ Scruffy Good point re: Palm Oil. While Paul Oil may have many issues, most if not all growing of vegetables causes harm and annoyance to animals. As we know, monocropping in general causes harm to animals. That fructose is definitely the result of some harm to animals. Plants and animals are inter-linked in nature, and its hard to produce one without affecting the other.
The words may contain are just to cover their butts if it's not in the ingredients list I don't worry I pet my dog a lot I'm sure a few molecules of the dog dander or hair have been ingested by me I'm still vegan When eating at a restaurant you might drink from a glass that at 1 time contained alcohol but if you're an alcoholic it's not gonna trigger a relapse in you that 1 molecule of alcohol was in that cleaned out glass Maybe it's different for other people but I find being super super hyper hyper OCD about your veganism is not healthy If I cut myself I put anti bacterial ointment on it so it will kill the bugs And I don't feel guilty Having said all that it's not like I really ever eat oreos I mean they're not a whole food But every once in a while I do have a little bit of vegan junk food
Wish the manufacturer, who is it Nabisco? Well, anyway I wish they'd change their production process and not be lazy and make it so there's no cross-contamination lol
Allergy friendly facilities that exclusively dont produce anything with animal products in them are often more exspesnive than using a shared facility, especially when you sell products that contain animal products and or arnt specifically trying to cater to just vegans or people with allergies. may contain animal products, often just means it was produced on the same equipment animal products were on, and the equipment is often cleaned in-between but theres a small chance it might contain small amounts of animal products, and its an allergy warning, it doesnt mean its not vegan. Basically any restaurant or kitchen that has non vegan items is the same situation. "Any dishes that are to be labelled vegan must be prepared separately from non-vegan dishes. At a minimum, this means thoroughly washing surfaces and utensils before using for vegan cooking. We strongly recommend obtaining a separate set of cleaning utensils for this purpose. We ask for the awareness of the risk of cross-contamination from non-vegan sources in your kitchen or production line and that the Trademark holder takes all reasonable and practical steps to eliminate this."-vegan society trademark standards They make vegan certified oreo alternatives.
May contain milk means that the facility uses milk in some products. By law these facilities have to be cleaned thoroughly in between products. If this makes them not vegan consider that unless you’re getting all your things from all vegan factories (almost impossible) you are not being consistent. To me what matters is the actual ingredients. We buy things from stores that sell non vegan things all the time, but we are vegan because we buy the vegan things.
May contain animal products doesnt mean its not vegan.
"Any dishes that are to be labelled vegan must be prepared separately from non-vegan dishes. At a minimum, this means thoroughly washing surfaces and utensils before using for vegan cooking. We strongly recommend obtaining a separate set of cleaning utensils for this purpose.
We ask for the awareness of the risk of cross-contamination from non-vegan sources in your kitchen or production line and that the Trademark holder takes all reasonable and practical steps to eliminate this."-vegan society trademark standards
@@bvegannow1936 yes that’s what I said. May contain is just a legal disclaimer.
I agree, but not true with the “cleaned throughly”, like I said in my comment, they tested these products in Sweden and was surprised to see how much more than just “traces” were actually in them, and chocolate is the worst.
@@2AMVegan Oof, really? Do you have a link to that article handy? I'd be curious to read it. Thanks
I agree. I think they mostly have to state this for people with allergies who may be sensitive to even trace amounts.
So many red flags on that ingredients list. Not just from a vegan standpoint, but also from a health standpoint.
They’re vegan… I usually agree with Ryan but this is kinda stupid.
If you stop eating Oreo’s based on this video you’ll also have to stop eating a TONNE of other vegan products…
Per the standard definition ‘as practicably possible’ ensuring 100% of cross contamination is avoided is near impossible in every factory that isn’t 100% vegan. Getting all your food from 100% vegan factories is not practicable for most people.
Therefore oreos are by definition vegan.
This is what Gary Yurosky explained on this video regarding buying vegan things from non vegan companies. As the vegan definition says as "far as it is possible and practicable". When my kids go to birthday parties I'm not going to deny them the only accidental vegan snack (oreos) they usually find in omnis houses.
I dont think sugar filtered thru bone char is vegan. Animals are killed to make bone char to filter sugar.
According to vegan society trademark standards" The manufacture and/or development of the product, and its ingredients, must not involve or have involved, the use of any animal product, by-product or derivative."
Also other vegan certification organizations often require there is no sugar filtered thru bone char.
I avoid Oreos in usa cuz idk if the sugar was filtered thru bone char and i don't want to contribute to animals being killed for bone char. I try to stick to vegan or organic sugar as i dont think its filtered thru bone char.
They make vegan certified oreo alternatives.
indeed. I'm not telling anyone what to do, and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos.
@Jules Comment makes no sense as to what I wrote. Seems like a bot. Enjoy the 1 cent the meat industry has deposited into your account 😃
Being on a vegan diet, I am ok with a little contamination.
Cross-contact still qualifies as vegan as per the Vegan Society, as it is not an actual deliberate ingredient but a possibility of an accidental particle or two. However it's good to have our eyes open for things like bone char in sugar and the ethics of sourcing.
indeed. I'm not telling anyone what to do, and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos.
This could be a whole series.
Vegan enough for me
Cross-Contamination for me is an issue for allergics. It doesn‘t make something non-vegan.
Palm oil is an interesting topic. Can we consider something vegan that 100% destroys the natural habitat of so many wild animals?
Strangely I gave up/boycotted palm oil long before I went vegan. I was still blind to my own actions but having gone to school for Env. Sci I was well aware of Palm oils destruction.
I think it's INCREDIBLY dangerous for vegans to start knitpicking products for their ethical sourcing practices under the 'vegan label'.
If you feel this way, that's okay, don't buy these products. But to put it under the 'vegan labeling' makes an incredibly mixed message and a very misleading set or outlining 'rules' to people that get into or researching the diet and lifestyle.
I 100% disagree with your opinion of even the idea of labeling oreos as not vegan. But I will agree with you that they are not 100% ethically sourced.
Keep 'vegan' ... vegan, and use the correct terminology of ethically sourced products. Don't muddy the waters.
Labelling something as "vegan" for something "ethically sourced" should actually be the default, because veganism is by definition a moral stance. While labelling something which is just plant-based (as Oreos) as "vegan" can be actually considered to "muddy the waters". In general, I find it irritating when companies (or restaurants) proudly advertise some of the products as "vegan" because that should indicate that they share the moral basis of veganism, but this is often contradicted by the fact that the same company (or restaurant) is also selling non-vegan products. It would be much more honest to just advertise the corresponding products as "suitable for vegans", "vegan-friendly" or simply as "plant-based". This has nothing to do with nitpicking, just about acknowledging the fact that there is a relevant difference between "vegan" and "plant-based".
did you totally not see me say that I'm not telling anyone what to do, and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos? I see your decision there and I'm totally fine with it.
@@stt7598 Being vegan does not have to be a "moral" stance. there are people who follow a vegan diet for the health benefits. There are too many people claiming to speak for all vegans and trying to define veganism. Not everyone is a food activist.
@@HappyHealthyVegan I did hear you say that. Sorry for the confusion as a whole and this comment wasn't directly pointed at you and or your view points.
I was just try to add my thought and opinion on the topic. I am much like you in that I don't mind what people eat and don't let it effect me or my choice (including people who consume animal products).
Much love and I have enjoyed your content for many many year. In fact you were one of the original RUclipsrs that i watched when transitioning to a vegan lifestyle 7 years ago.
@@MH-zg5yw I disagree. You cannot be vegan for health reasons, you can only be plant-based for health reasons. Veganism by definition is concerned about the avoidance of animal exploitation and has NOTHING to do with health. This is THE definition of veganism and if some people do not agree with this definition, I don't understand why they want to call themselves vegan. Btw., I became plant-based for health reasons and initially avoided the term vegan as I wasn't yet convinced by the moral arguments. Now I am proudly calling myself a vegan as I am fully convinced by the moral arguments leading to veganism as a lifestyle (where food is just one aspect of).
Veganism is rising and thriving while carnism is trying and dying!
I think it’s accurate to say they’re vegan but not healthy or good for the environment
It's so tough because you get mixed info when I try to look stuff up..
I'd say they are vegan, depending on where - in Europe, they don't use bone char for sugar. Even if they are vegan, this whole "traces of..." is not as innocent as it may sound. In Sweden, they took samples from these products and discovered that these "may contain" was in fact much higher than expected. It's obviously not labeled for the sake of vegans, but for people with lactose intolerance, so makes sense they don't care. Apparently chocolate has the highest amounts of milk in them. I remember one chocolate in particular, it had "may contain...", so us vegans bought em - but after a few years, that was removed and replaced with "contains X% milk". Again, "may contain" is vegan, but for someone who wants to avoid this, it's good to know.
I'm vegan and lactose intolerant and have trouble with the first Vego because of this reason.
@@jaynesixx2185 Wow, yea I’m not surprised.. It always annoys me when products are labelled vegan and there’s “may contain”, I always think it’s such a shame for people like you with a lactose intolerance. It should me animal free, period. For instances, the two biggest manufacturers of potato chips here, the regular ones with just oil and salt, the one has traces of and the other doesn’t!! 🤷♂️
@@2AMVegan Yeah is, so I can't have vego bar 😞 but, the spread I have no problem with. It should be as we are trying to avoid all those "may contain" thing bar some of us nuts and soy. Yeah, it's just make me want to make my own potato chips, but Pringle's as too good not to buy.
@@jaynesixx2185 OH, nooo the vego bar!! I feel for ya... I used to eat tons of them in the past, even got a big box special discount. But now, since reading about the milk protein and especially chocolate I've personally decided to cut it out, even if it's vegan. I have to repeat that part bc I don't want to sound like I'm saying it's not vegan.
Ohh, yea Pringles too changed, I believe...? But these two brands I'm talking about, it's just silly, three ingredients and the one has milk.
Thanks for sharing . Every day we learn something. I didn't know about sugar..
Isn't it possible that the flavoring could contain animal products?
if people are not going to eat oreos then they may as well stop eating out in vegan friendly restaurants! don't let the "perfect be the enemy of the good!" accidently consuming animal products don't stop you being vegan! if you held money then you've had all kinds of contaminants that you've consumed!
Cross contamination doesn’t count. The main ingredients do not contain dairy. So when you purchase a product made with no animal products, you are supporting plant based products.
yes, as I said, I'm not telling anyone what to do, but and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos.
Hi Ryan, that was a good video. Very informative; thank you. I am a homemaker. I use only vegan ingredients, it's so easy. I sweeten baked goods with organic maple syrup or org. Coconut sugar. I mostly use almond flour sometimes organic all purppse flour. I just made a delicious moist pumpkin chocolate chip loaf. It was a dream. I can easily swap out applesauce or Banana for oil, and otherwise I add organic unrefined coconut oil. I love seeing Angie do her recipes and love your vlogs! Take care🙂🌼🌈🧁
I don't understand the obsession. Oreos suck~ soooooo sickly sweet they hurt my teeth. Also, palm oil should not be considered vegan from an animal exploitation angle.
Right? We need to talk about palm-oil more. It needs to be represented properly… it’s a f”king scam. It’s in everything and we need to do something about it. It’s so hard to avoid when you aren’t being super careful.
I was eating them but now you reminded me about the palm oil which i forgot they have. So I think now Im just going to find another brand of cookies that are vegan without palm oil.
This really has opened my eyes! Thank you so much! Since I’m a vegan I will be ditching them!
They’re vegan… I usually agree with Ryan but this is kinda stupid.
If you stop eating Oreo’s based on this video you’ll also have to stop eating a TONNE of other vegan products…
no need to do that. technically Oreos seem to fall under the definition of an accidentally vegan product.
I’ve been looking into more healthier items anyway. Oreos don’t say vegan on the package so the points made in this video are valid. There are so many other things that are more enjoyable to have.
I don’t eat them or very much processed food at all. But by Ryan’s definition I must not be vegan because I eat a ton of organic plants that are most likely fertilized with cow manure.
Thank you for the info. Love your chanel
What you smokin the Ryan to come up with that logic?That’s an extreme take on the definition of being vegan. Vegan meals at restaurants will have a far greater chance of cross contamination than that from processed food manufacturers. We’re usually only talking ppm levels, and only the chance thereof, and labelled as such so that food manufacturers are not sued by hypersensitive individuals with allergies.
did you totally not see me say that I'm not telling anyone what to do, and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos? I see your decision there and I'm totally fine with it.
I don't buy oreos for myself but if friends or family gift them to me I take them happily because they tried to find something for me I can actually eat :)
Love your channel. Thank you😊
Ah, yes. Pressing issues
My country doesn't have vegan oreos. They spell it out "bovine fat" on the ingredients list
I had no idea that white sugar was not vegan, its insane how many things are contaminated with animal products.
There r ways to make white sugar with out bone char, but i think most white sugar in usa is probably filtered thru bone char with some exseptions.
Cars are not vegan, streets and sidewalks are not vegan. Everybody is more non-vegan than vegan.
I'm really sensitive to wheat, to the point that multiple times I've had a reaction to a product that I didn't think had wheat in it but it turned out it had a small amount in soy sauce used to flavor the product. Not enough that one would expect it to make a difference. And yet I've never had a reaction from products that said they were made in the same facilities that used wheat. I think they must wash the facilities between products. If my reaction were anaphylactic shock, I'd be more careful, but if it's just possible traces from other uses of machinery, I take it as okay. Same goes for milk. It's hard enough to find products that don't use things we don't want as ingredients. I'm not willing to cross the line into saying that anything that has ever touched wheat or milk can't touch ingredients I eat. Unless one is in life-threatening danger from the allergen, I don't see the purpose of being that nitpicky.
Of course, Oreos are off my menu anyway, due to the wheat. If that were not the case, I think the palm oil issue is much more compelling than possible cross contamination from equipment.
If soy sauce upsets you then maybe it's also related to yeast? Most modern soy sauce is fermented using wheat yeast if ii remember correctly, so that could be setting it off.
Have a cousin with Celiac's and his mom was telling me that there's so many things that set it off, sometimes even fresh food sometimes.
@@jmassagetherapist6773 Not sure. I haven't been able to afford the test for Celiac or allergies, but my observations are that small amounts of wheat (more than "made on the same equipment") cause a reaction. It's not just wheat gluten, it's wheat. I can eat nutritional yeast no problem - do people with Celiac's have trouble with that?
@@Cat_Woods not sure about everyone with celiacs, but my cousin specifically has an issue with gluten of quite a few kinds. Gluten is essentially how plants store sugar, and his sensitivity is to grains in particular(carrots are fine) but even just cutting vegetables on a cutting board that had bread on it and was rinsed since is enough to set him off.
Admittedly not close to this cousin so ii don't know any more specific details or if it's changed since ii learned of it.
@@jmassagetherapist6773 Thanks for sharing what you do recall.
Finally! the content we have all been waiting for! Oreos are well received in our house, but as I started trying to loose weight I realized 2 cookies is like 70 calories, and for some reason eating just 1 or 2 is almost impossible. Eating all or none is way easier. Oreos have become a rare treat. As a family of 6 vegans it is nice to think of the Oreo as a guilt free cookie, way to ruin it Ryan! I will still consider them to reduce harm to the extent practical and therefore vegan.
I think they are not vegan because I am vegan and I’m highly lactose intolerance and everytime I’ve had one in the past it makes my stomach hurt
Well the makers themselves say they are not vegan. Plus they are really unhealthy.
Interesting, have recently been discovering and working through my less than a year old lactose intolerance problem myself. It's sensitive enough to be affected by a pastry with whey powder but Oreos never feel bad unless ii just eat too many.
Have also heard that they use different ingredients in different locations so ii wonder if that's it? California has quite a few food and health safety laws that are pretty strict compared to the rest of the usa.
I love Orioles. But nutritional wise I would choose fruit
Personally I don't worry about cross-contamination and usually not even sugar, unless I'm buying like, a whole bag of sugar. Then I'll look for organic or brands I know don't process through bone char. But for individual products, it would take way too much time and research, and many brands even change their process over time, so getting an answer at one point in time might not be accurate a year from now. But with palm oil, for both vegan and environmental reasons, I avoid it. It's unfortunately in an insane number of products that are technically vegan, so it does limit me, but I feel strongly about it. That's more of a personal choice in my mind though, not necessarily a vegan one.
I have several food allergies and I never kept myself from eating products that may contain x allergen and I never had issues. So I'm not worried about cross-contamination from wrapped products. From restaurants, it's another matter.
Over here in the UK they are marked as vegetarian, here bone char sugar is not viewed as vegetarian. I don’t know about other counties
I think the usage of palm oil should have been considered here, more important than "may contain milk" or sugar. Palm oil is arguably one of the most unethically sourced non-animal products. I was hoping you would talk about that instead
Palm oil is a deal breaker. Then the sugar.
Hhmmmm…….. not vegan. 😕
You said you don't eat them because you don't like junk food, but do you think they're vegan? So many things are made in facilities or put on equipment that may contain cross contamination products. It's on almost every label. Even stuff you would never think would be together. I think the company came out and said that oreos aren't vegan, and I understand why. They don't want to cater to vegans because it's such a small market.
technically Oreos seem to fall under the definition of an accidentally vegan product. but did you not see me say that I'm not telling anyone what to do, and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos?
@@HappyHealthyVegan Yes, I did see that part.
😨
Wow lol! Had no idea Oreos are vegan.
There’s dairy in the flavoring
Really liking your hairstyle buddy.
Hey, thanks. I thought it didn't look so great the day I filmed this though.
@@HappyHealthyVegan Pretty common to judge ourselves unfairly especially when it comes to hair. Thanks for all the effort you put in for your videos. I enjoy every one of them.
I want to know what junk food is "better than Oreos"?
how about a dairy free cherry Garcia?
@@HappyHealthyVegan Thanks! I will try it.
on the sugar part, that's just the sugar from canes and not beets.
I may finally take a trip to Cali, some sane people there
For people in the UK, there's a great company called The Vegan Bakery that make a totally vegan version of Oreos. You get the same amount of biscuits in a pack, its RSPO certified palm oil and the cocoa is fair-trade.
To my mind, typical oreos aren't strictly vegan.
Not sure if I’m with you on this one Ryan :/
totally fine. however, this was not really an opinion piece. I presented the facts and am letting each vegan decide if they are okay with Oreos.
I have a dairy allergy and could die if I consume it, and have never had a reaction to Oreos. I do not see how cross contamination harms animals in any way and will continue to eat them. I think getting too overly picky like this could actually hurt the movement.
I agree, I was just about to comment this. Like honestly cross contamination is gonna happen regardless of the measures taken, and really I’d argue there’s no ethics involved here because in the end you’d be consuming what are scraps of what’s left of the machine was used. It’s no different than having cleaning standards, like it’s impossible to be perfect on that, however you do have standards to avoid the majority of health issues. The only people that this really matters to are the people that are allergic to said ingredients. Like I mentioned I hate that this is becoming an issue now, as this could just harm the movement going forward, and I don’t freaking like this pissing contest sort of thing if this is where it’s leaning towards
did you totally not see me say that I'm not telling anyone what to do, and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos? I see your decision there and I'm totally fine with it.
@@HappyHealthyVegan I personally am not saying you are. But the fact that its gotten to the point where you had to make a video about it, makes me think that there's something going on in the vegan community for such a thing to even be talked about. As plenty of vegans have already talked about this on RUclips years ago, and no one batted an eye then, but now it gets to the point where this is now an issue with people in the community. My critic is more so on what the community is doing to themselves if such this sets the stage for what were small things before to become a massive issue now.
@@HappyHealthyVegan I know you said that but others in the comments have said they'll give them up which I don't personally understand.
Thanks, the various aspects are well examined and explained. I avoid junk food but once in a blue moon I do succumb to temptation though less and less as the years go by. If really really tempted or like for a birthday cake declared to be vegan (recently for my 64th birthday my sister baked me a delicious vegan chocolate cake but containing normal ordinary sugar, which I happily relished more so as it was my first birthday cake in decades) I would overlook the minuscule amount of animal product usage in producing the sugar. If buying sugar (which I wouldn't normally do since I'm Whole Food) I would search for a vegan brand. Oreos: I would have or buy them in a rare instance I suppose.
Regarding the product being made in a facility also sometimes using milk or eggs, I feel this statement is to some extent a safety measure for legal reasons, they often mention soy, peanuts and tree nuts also. I would go ahead and buy the product though again usually I greatly avoid highly processed foods. I have bought dark chocolate with no vegan ingredients but with this sort of disclaimer statement.
Interestingly, anti vegan people, themselves having kilograms of animal products including dairy milk, cheese, paneer, butter, eggs and various kinds of flesh seize on this to say accusingly to me that then I'm not vegan. I don't care what they say - to put it in non beep terms.
I want this to blow up and be your most popular video
@Jules yep it’s what the ppl care about
I don't consume anything that says may contains either but thats me, also i don't eat oreos for the fact they dont say if it uses bone char or not and oreos aren't organic either.
If a bag of rice or beans says may contain traces of eggs or dairy, you wouldn't eat it?
I remember eating a whole pack a few years ago & regretting it
I’d guess restaurants don’t separate vegan and meat dishes in the kitchen
I thought it'd be a good idea to make cookies last night. Made chocolate chippers from scratch. Yes Poo bakes. Then I did stupid and ate 12...got the bloat. Feeling better now...
Make a youtube video having a convo with Chris cooney(the vegan zombie). Hes a really chill awesome vegan youtuber. He has 15.5k subscribers on his chris cooney channel, and 179k subscribers on his the vegan zombie channel.
yeah we had him over a few years back and filmed a video with him.
They are not vegan. If you want to say to yourself that “they are vegan” so you can eat a definitively not vegan food and be happy ok, do you. But they are not vegan.
Apart from the ingredients I also look for allergy may contain: bold ingredient of concern.
There are other flavor Oreos which may have animal products in them.
Better stop eating at non-vegan restaurants then. Risk of cross-contamination.
as I clearly said, that is for each vegan to decide.
I'm disappointed by this video. Ryan usually makes the point that veganism is a philosophy about not exploiting animals as far as practicable and possible.
How does cross contamination exploit animals?
Even with the sugar, how is it practicable to avoid white sugar for the majority of people? (I know a lot of health-concious people will disagree)
Also palm oil is technically vegan. I know there are issues in the way palm oil is produced but those are general issue with agricultural practices and not palm oil exclusive.
So in my view, Oreos are 100% plant-based/ vegan-friendly
did you totally not see me say that I'm not telling anyone what to do, but and instead encouraging each person to decide if they are okay with Oreos? I see your decision there and I'm totally fine with it.
@@HappyHealthyVegan this video sounds like it's even arguable if Oreos are not vegan but to me it's obvious they are free from animal ingredients.
I think it undermines the vegan position if we make it seem like veganism is impossible to achieve because there is palm oil, sugar or non vegan money in everything.
Meh yeah I gotta draw the line somewhere. No mention of milk, eggs, or honey in the ingredients list (not at the "may contain" part) = vegan for me. I prefer to buy vegan protein bars for snacks on the way but sometimes I just ran out and have to buy something. Oreos or peanuts are great for this.
You going live tonight? Live tonight?
Vegan Two Times
Never liked Oreo cookies anyway.
yeah, they are at best just very alright.
I don't like palm oil and buy palm oil free, I have never had them too since being and vegan and who needs them when you can find the vegan version at a local Cafe or vegan supermarket or online store 🤫 and they taste better.
I understand that you're not judging people, but do you personally avoid products made in a facility that also makes products with animal ingredients or is it just the bone char and palm oil that give you extra reason to avoid oreos?
Next Myth Or Fact: Are Reeses Puffs Really Vegan?
He also only did the video because Oreo's were voted in as the Best Accidentally Vegan snack on VegNews.
actually I had not known that vegnews thing until after I filmed this. I came up with the idea on a recent livestream when someone asked me if Oreos are vegan.
3:45 aniamls harmes in evry singel vegan food Ryan.
Pringles chips aren't vegan anymore either
Original still is
Yay you actually made the video you remembered 💙
yes, was that you who planted the idea of this video in my had on Friday's livestream?
Considering the fact that vegetable farmers routinely kill wildlife for their crops and wildlife lands are taken to grow it, I think it’s a bit disingenuous to proselytize on the evils of palm oil. It sucks and I wish farmers would adopt veganic farming methods but since we currently live in a non-vegan world it is what it is.
It can be argued, using the same logic, that organic fruits and vegetables are not vegan since they depend on manure from the flesh and dairy industry.
Cross contamination is a legal notice. If one chooses to exempt anything plantbased solely because of the possibility of cross contamination, then I hope you get your food at only vegan grocery stores because cross contamination could happen at a non vegan grocery store too.
The only red flag for me is bone char. I choose to avoid products that don’t specify cane sugar as the ingredient as opposed to just sugar. But I agree, bone char is a decision left up to each vegan’s feeling on it.
@ Scruffy Good point re: Palm Oil. While Paul Oil may have many issues, most if not all growing of vegetables causes harm and annoyance to animals. As we know, monocropping in general causes harm to animals. That fructose is definitely the result of some harm to animals. Plants and animals are inter-linked in nature, and its hard to produce one without affecting the other.
This is very disappointing news.
The words may contain are just to cover their butts
if it's not in the ingredients list I don't worry
I pet my dog a lot I'm sure a few molecules of the dog dander or hair have been ingested by me
I'm still vegan
When eating at a restaurant you might drink from a glass that at 1 time contained alcohol but if you're an alcoholic it's not gonna trigger a relapse in you that 1 molecule of alcohol was in that cleaned out glass
Maybe it's different for other people but I find being super super hyper hyper OCD about your veganism is not healthy
If I cut myself I put anti bacterial ointment on it so it will kill the bugs
And I don't feel guilty
Having said all that it's not like I really ever eat oreos I mean they're not a whole food
But every once in a while I do have a little bit of vegan junk food
💯💯💯💯💯🔥🔥🔥
Wish the manufacturer, who is it Nabisco? Well, anyway I wish they'd change their production process and not be lazy and make it so there's no cross-contamination lol
Allergy friendly facilities that exclusively dont produce anything with animal products in them are often more exspesnive than using a shared facility, especially when you sell products that contain animal products and or arnt specifically trying to cater to just vegans or people with allergies.
may contain animal products, often just means it was produced on the same equipment animal products were on, and the equipment is often cleaned in-between but theres a small chance it might contain small amounts of animal products, and its an allergy warning, it doesnt mean its not vegan. Basically any restaurant or kitchen that has non vegan items is the same situation.
"Any dishes that are to be labelled vegan must be prepared separately from non-vegan dishes. At a minimum, this means thoroughly washing surfaces and utensils before using for vegan cooking. We strongly recommend obtaining a separate set of cleaning utensils for this purpose.
We ask for the awareness of the risk of cross-contamination from non-vegan sources in your kitchen or production line and that the Trademark holder takes all reasonable and practical steps to eliminate this."-vegan society trademark standards
They make vegan certified oreo alternatives.
Oreos are NOT vegan!! :) Thank you. (Now talk about impossible foods because that's not vegan, either.)
oh come on impossible has to be vegan.
Haha oreo go brRrrRrrr
Sh**. Bye bye oreos!!!!!
no need to do that. technically Oreos seem to fall under the definition of an accidentally vegan product.
is any substance designed to be consumed addictively and that is harmful to animal health "vegan"?