One Championship fighters must now protect their opponents instead of themselves
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- Опубликовано: 1 мар 2024
- Let's talk about the confusing aftermath of the slam
DQ in a recent One Championship title fight between
Jarred Brooks and Joshua Pacio.
The match ended in round one when Brooks did a basic mat return followed by ground and pound.
Referee Herb Dean initially stopped the contest as a TKO, but soon returned to inform Brooks that he had been disqualified because his opponent's head had impacted the floor during the mat return.
This is a rule unique to One Championship that does not exist in the UFC. This is not "spiking" (ie: piledriver) the head impact was, in fact, a failure of Pacio to intelligently defend himself at all times. But it seems that the onus to protect yourself in OneFC has been shifted to your opponent.
This is a slippery slope that leaves the rules open to broad interpretation and that will allow further corruption in the sport. Watch to learn why.
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Ramsey Dewey is a retired pro fighter, combat sports coach, referee, and fight commentator… and occasional musician based in Shanghai, China.
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This video features original music by Ramsey Dewey
Follow me on Instagram at: / ramseydewey
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I fought professionally in Mixed Martial arts, Sanda, Muay Thai, K1 and American kickboxing from 2004-2011 when I was forced to retire due to a broken skull and being blinded in one eye. I hold a brown belt in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, Black belts in multiple traditional martial arts, including Taekwondo and kyokushin karate. I also train in catch wrestling, sambo, taijiquan, judo, and boxing.
I currently coach at the Animal MMA gym, the Extreme Fight Lab, and the Mordor Fight Club, all in Shanghai, China. 
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Oh... then there were the multiple yellow cards, a RED CARD, the constant referee urging for 'action' every 3 seconds etc.
They even gave TangKai a yellow as he was stalking Than Le!
When you remember that they don't have to pay a certain amount of the purse when there is a yellow card, red card or DQ... it all starts to make sense. All is not well in the ONE kingdom.
Oh wow, I didn’t even think of that! It’s shocking how far a lot of fight promoters will go to avoid paying their fighters. I’ve seen this sort of thing firsthand more than once.
Rebel FC, for example just straight up stopped paying the fighters and employees when they were secretly broke, but kept doing shows collecting revenue and skipping town. And they still owe me 3000元 ! It’s not even that much money, they just won’t pay it on the principle of being the worst.
@@RamseyDewey yeah, I remember some guys saw the screw coming and blocked the promoter from leaving. When they came to Shanghai we low-key stood there and stared until our guy got paid.
@@robertsothmann8110 Yeah man, I was there! That happened after an event in Qingdao where I was judging fights. After the event, when we all got back the hotel, some of the fighters asked me if I had been paid. When I said no, they told me what was up, and everyone stormed the lobby where the promoter was. The fighters who could afford to stay in town kept the promoter hostage in the lobby for a couple days until the dude's dad bailed him out and paid them. Those of us who had to leave to catch our flights never got a dime.
They pulled stunts like that more than once and screwed over a lot of guys I respect tremendously who left their blood in the cage for that promoter.
@@RamseyDewey If you were in Pacio's position, would you be able to protect yourself?
@@RamseyDeweydid you become a champion in the field of MMA?
14:17
Oh man you live in China?
I thought your name was
Ramsey Dewey Hereinshanghaichina
He's spy working for the communist china.
My neck hurts after watching this video
"throws targeting the spine"
I think ... that what the person making that rule was trying to say was something like "throws attacking the spine at an angle, as to bend or crank it".
But even that would open a can of worms of arbitrary unpredictable judgement calls.
Let's take the basic hip throw. Normally, once you have your opponents balance broken and his weight riding your hip, you send his hips up and his upper body forward and down in a continuous spiralling motion. He will go forward and down with a lot of rotation, making it easy for him to absorb the impact by rolling. We do this to be nice. We want our partners to train their breakfall, rolling reflexes, and we want to get up and take turns throwing each other for the whole class. But that's not necessarily how you hip throw in a serious fight, with ill intent.
If you want to, you can change direction mid-throw, so that once your opponents lower body is going upwards, you drop your weight straight down and pull your opponents upper body into the ground just in front of your feet. If you do this in friendly sparring, you'll soon won't have any friends. It makes it much much harder to break the fall by rolling, it makes it much more likely that your opponent or partner will eat floor with his face, or just land straight down on one shoulder with his entire body weight coming down on top of it.
But how mean you make your hip throw is a continuum, right? it's not either nice or nasty, it's a scale with super friendly aikido rotation at one end, and almost spiking at the other. So where on that scale is One Championship judges going to draw the line of "targeting the spine"?
Pretty sus, as the kids say.
Cheers
Every fighter need a lawyer to help them read the rules now !
Stupid rules are our speciality
New job opportunity unlocked !
😅😂
Imagine to get a belt by a streak of wins by disqualification...
That’s potential ammo for da street fighters to criticise MMA for being unrealistic
It'll be a funny imaginary scenario, but it's never happened. Let's be realistic, it'll never happen too. A good funny joke to imagine though.
Did you even watch what happen? or just blabber without facts
@@Suckers4attention-sf7uc Ok, go on, give us some facts.
@@demoncore5342brooks murdered pacio with a slick slam and they Dq'd him and gave pacio the belt
I remember chatri saying he was banning suplexes on facebook after a specific fight then deleted it. He said “After careful video review of the fight under multiple angles, it has been deemed that an illegal suplex was utilized. At ONE Championship, all variations of suplexes are illegal and any attempt or intent results in an automatic disqualification. Robin Catalan will now be awarded the victory, and his win bonus. It will also be ruled a loss via DQ for Kritsada Kongsrichai and his official fight record”
I feel for the guys who get DQ’ed that doesn’t seem fair. Question coach ramsey, do they get paid win money if the fight was originally scored a tko then changed? If not that seems really unfair
That’s shady as all get up to make up new rules as you go along and change decisions after changing rules. That’s just evil.
@@RamseyDeweyone fc has some appealing thing abiut decisions they have revised many decisions in past few years
This is an excellent example of why I really cannot think of combat sports as being the same as real life. All the politics, drama, rule changes, and so on.
Well, if you're talking about using violence as self defense, the legal proceedings that follow in the courtroom to justify that violence get a lot more complicated.
@@RamseyDewey Oh I know and agree 100%. I’m just saying that they are two totally different entities.
Man, I feel sorry for Brooks.. But he's lucky he has not killed Pacio.
That could have been a career ender for both.
Plenty of guys get slammed out cold they’re fine its a contact sport. Look at frank shamrock vs igor zinoviev that was way worse than this
@@Banished-rx4ol Dude, we have come along way, we didnt have these rules before. Have you ever been slammed before? When your neck gets cranked it could get you paralyzed. A Bjj student in Gracie academy got paralyzed for just a small amount of neck crank, not even slammed but his spine snapped.
@@triplex6038 No we still use the same rules for grappling, if there’s an arc its not a spike and a legal slam. I’ve been slammed directly on my head like this in wrestling its not that bad you wake up in little bit. Eventually you learn to roll with it or post and no neck cranks don’t break spines its when people flop on their backs or jump on submissions that causes serious injuries
@@Banished-rx4ol You are unbelievable! i cant waste my time on you.
I was recently supplexed onto my head. Concussed af right now. Doctor and coach say I can't train for a about 3 weeks. Shit is not fun. Don't suplex your training partners.
Suplexes are fine. What happened in the video was spiking, which risks paralysis. Greco wrestling is nothing, but suplexes but they rarely get injured from it because they're trained. You could suplex me on concrete and I would get right up.
What happened in this video was NOT spiking.
The video doesn't look like spiking to me.
Just looks like the guy landed badly. It happens. Its a contact sport ffs not a pillow fight.
@@RamseyDewey lets be honest. Its not an ordinary mat return that Brookes did. Can we just be honest for a sec. Have you heard of the fighter in Ireland who recently got paralysed. Slightly different situation but very similar. And this was in sparring
@@RamseyDewey just say you’re racist and move on
In judo, I think they actually had a problem with people purposefully landing on their heads to avoid an ippon.
It is very interesting how fighters will always learn to game the rules.
Yep. I remember seeing some of those matches.
In high school wrestling you must have a knee on the floor before you return your opponent to the floor. You can't do it from the feet. This would be illegal in HS wrestling, at least when I was doing it back in the day.
Good video , on point technicals .
You are right I am with you on this one man
That wasn't a mat return. In wrestling you have to control the fall or leave the other guys arm free on the side you're dropping him to, to catch himself. The thrower had his arm locked on that side and mat returning someone to their head is not a wrestling thing. Unless you want to see someone paralyzed in the ring this is a good rule.
Are you blind?? Dude was going for a kimura and didn't let go untill the last movement
That maybe technically true but by that logic certain throws or slams are off limits now because there's a chance the opponent can fall on the head or neck. So then my question is what throws or slams are legal now by your logic? The only reason this isn't a problem in wrestling is because there's no point to going for a kimura in wrestling.
@@allstarwoo4 This isn't a problem in folk style wrestling because there's a rule against it. You can pick someone up with their arm trapped to their side but if you drop them on the shoulder that's trapped and they get hurt it's a DQ. You drop them to the side with the free arm. Free style and Greco the bottom strategy is to stall for 15 seconds and you get stood up, so you put your hands straight out. It's not a chance that has this guy falling straight down on his head. The guy lifting has control of how he's going to fall. You can't hit a guy on top or back of the head because the amount of damage it causes is considered too much for a sport. Dropping them on the top or the back of their head should have a similar rule.
@@tharushafernando6688 He might have been trying for one but he didn't have it. He did have his left hand trapped to his body by the body lock when he want up. Also this guy intentionally over rotated and dropped his body weight on top of his opponent. A mat return is a straight pick up and a trip to his side.
@@TacTicMint believe it or not I don't think this was an intentional head drop. Most fighters know a head drop can be very deadly so they don't purposely do head drops. If it happens because they refuse to let go of a submission that should be on the defender.
Protect your opponent at all times. - One FC
Another great video coach! My best to you at what looks like about 7pm Saturday night, thanks for aother banger 💯 Also how did you cast the guy in the cat suit from Pulp Fiction to get tossed around?
Having never seen Pulp Fiction, I don’t know what you’re talking about. Glad you enjoyed the video though.
One thing I will say about One Championship aiming more for kickboxing emphasis, is watching them are more exciting for me than a lot of UFC matches (I always enjoyed the trading of blows more than the nuances of grappling)
And that’s completely fine.
Thanks Ramsey. Love the channel. I am curious if you have any opinions in terms of safety on the smaller gloves in more of a kickboxing context (some of these matches I have seen look like they were pure kickboxing rules but with the MMA size gloves). In UFC it seems like that kind of consistent head contact tends to be more sporadic, whereas here I do wonder what the effects of trading blows with lower ounce gloves like this would be for the fighters (it looks very exciting, but it also seems a little brutal at times-----I will have wincing moments watching UFC as well but I find I have more of them with this, though that may just be me not understanding the impact of the smaller gloves)@@RamseyDewey
Woke fight organizations make my balls itch. The socialist version of mma... your opponent is responsible to keep you safe.😅
It's my understanding heavier gloves are worse for CTE, in fact old school Bare Knuckle, while looking more brutal as cuts are common, is actually far safer long term that boxing with gloves.
This is my understanding too. But I am also wondering if the small amount of padding, nullifies the moderation you would expect with bare knuckle (where you have to hold back a bit so you don't damage your hand). I only ask because some of these small glove kick boxing matches look especially brutal. I have only boxed in 10-16 ounce gloves so I don't know what 4 ounce gloves translate into (assuming these are 4 ounce)
@@stevepalpatine2828
Can you go over any tips you have for hitting the body, specifically with punches, like I want to win the fight with just body shots?
Guess why some pro wrestling feds ask their performers to avoid spiking (that s why pile driver are banned kayfabe and out of kayfabe), even scripted and predetermined spiking can go wrong.
Oh Ramsey, I thought of you this Tuesday, the veterans association of my town asked me to play some cha cha cha tracks for their dance event.
Isn’t it only some wrestlers are allowed to do it because its so hard to do safely?
@@Banished-rx4ol ask promoters. as said, sometimes it s for kayfabe storyline reasons, sometimes it s for real safety reason. stone cold Steve Austin got his neck broken by Owen Hart, Owen had the reputation to be safe to work with... Austin got REALLY lucky.
@@jeffmaesarI remember that scary stuff, happened in in MMA as well with PRIDE when bob sapp spiked nogueira on his head which gave him neck problems for life he was never the same.
@@Banished-rx4ol yeah but PFC promoters prioritized ''action'', as ground work was often reset on feet if ''nothing'' happened for a certain amount of second.
And yes, this Pride Dynamite 2's slam made me mark out at first when I watched it back in 2003.
Not a very good rule. Following the logic, if this was a video game speedrunners would be by now violently thrusting their crotch onto the opponents fist to win by DQ and I'm sure nobody wants to see that IRL.
That’s hilarious. But groin shots result in a warning and a five minute break, not a DQ.
A rule that prevents potential paralysis is a bad rule? 🤦🏻♂️🫵🏻🤡
@@RamseyDewey Maybe it could be a DQ if One FC randomly says so 🤔
Nahh thats a terrible equivalce. No fighter is going to be sticking their head out hoping to get spiked
@@cloudmaster182 It became a trend in Olympic judo, believe it or not. It happened!
I thought ONE was the evolved form of UFC rules since they allow knees to the head.
So what do you guys prefer? Knees to the head of a grounded opponent? Or suplexes?
Bruh you must gave forgot pride and its spiritual succesor rizin where elbows are now allowed and grounded knees and big slams and suplexes. Its not an either or problem
If by “evolved” you mean “bans techniques even the IBJJF allows” and “changes the rules and alters decisions after the fights”, then sure.
@@RamseyDeweythey are woke so they will make MMA for snowflakes. I stand with Dana White & Joe Rogan.
@@RamseyDewey to preface i dont follow the rules like that. Hinestly dont watch ONE besides Mighty Mouse. But what I meant waaassss... that I thought ONE was being more all encompassing with the knees. I didnt know about the whole suplex thing. Which is weirder than no knees and 12 to 6 elbows
@@Banished-rx4ol nah im just asking in a vacuum if you had to choose. What could you live without?
I'm watching this because it happened to my match last week in a town's competition. I'm so devastated for disqualification, I couldn't sleep properly. It's not my intention to do an illegal spiking. I was just expecting my opponent has the ability to react but he intentionally didn't protect himself. He instead reposition his body by twisting it so his head hit the ground because of his inaccurate movement. That was his own movement that result of his head hitting the ground.
Honest question, isn't it less harmful to your opponent to throw them down on the back rather than on the front?
The harm of a throw depends entirely on the landing.
He was literally on top of his head, but yes, landing on your back or even top of your shoulders/neck is 100000x safer.
I'm with you. Really good review. I feel sorry for jared.
And people wonder why I prefer Rizin.
Eyy lets gooo fellow rizin enjoyer
You were so mean to the dummy you were throwing around, I hope you hugged it out at the end. 😁
would a DDT be considered spiking? say your opponent comes rushing in for a double leg or even a single leg and you lock in a tight front head lock and use their forward momentum to slightly lift them up like a standing gullotine then fall back using their forhead/ head to break the fall. jake the sanke roberts used this move in wwf wrestling and if you did it with intent it is very dangerous. is that spiking???
Is it a piledriver?
A DDT in real life is pulling your opponent on top of you into side control and letting them Von Flue choke you for free.
this is the reason why I only play chessboard.
Same here
If you're gonna follow one's rule, should be an unintentional foul / no contest, not a dq loss in my opinion.
I think a granby roll tutorial would be welcomed
I have one. Ricky Lundell has one that is 100% applicable to this exact scenario.
makes sense because they're heavy on striking talent but don't really have good graoplers for the most part
Can we apply the logic to getting kicked on the head while being down..just protect yourself at all times.
But the elbow, 12 to 6, is also illegal..why not just protect yourself?
Precisely. It is actually really easy to intelligently defend yourself against head kicks while on the ground. That’s what a guard is for.
It is also extremely easy to intelligently defend yourself against 12 to 6 elbows. There are only a couple of positions where they even come into play. I wish they would abolish that rule.
@@RamseyDeweyWe can’t have that, man! We’re owned by Disney for God’s sake!
Ramsay, can you do a video testing the techniques in the book Hadaka-Jime by Moshe Feldenkrais the way you did with Jack Dempsey's book Learn to fight tough?
Not without a copy of the book I can’t.
@@RamseyDewey Actually, if you do an internet search on Feldenkrais Method in general, you might really dig it. I learned it as a physical therapist. It's all about movement coordination, kinesthesia, and proprioception. Not saying you should run right out and buy the recommended specific book, but there are plenty of Feldenkrais demonstrations and discussions online that you could look into should the mood strike you. It seems the kind of thing you'd enjoy thinking about based on some of your other areas of interest. Be well.
@@RamseyDewey does it have to be a physical copy or can it be an ebook version?
I cannot see how the thrown man was prevented from letting go of Brooks' arm and simply putting both hands out to catch himself. It looks simply as though he did not want to or did not think to do so in time.
I wonder why they made slams in mma a foul…
Allowing knees to a grounded opponent is a good rule compared to ufc
>S tier
Ice Hockey - it perfectly combines striking, grappling, and clothing manipulation into one. Also fighting on ice will give you unmatched footwork skill when you fight on solid ground. It's a hard counter for just about every martial arts that are out there. It's also the perfect martial arts for real fights and not just sports
>A tier
Krav Maga - it's technically the most deadliest and effective martial arts in modern times. Jews are the best when it comes to destroying things like western civilization or world peace, and destroying the human body is also no exception
>B tier
Aikido - this martial arts, when mastered, gives you complete control over your opponent's entire body the moment you make contact with him. Though it may take some long time mastering it, once properly used, it is virtually invincible
>C tier
Wing Chun/kung fu - this martial art gives you the power to control your inner chi energy. Throughout history, the greatest fighters ever were kung fu practitioners like Bruce Lee and Mao Zedong
>D tier
Tae Kwon Do - legs are the strongest part of the human body, and TKD is the best way to utilize the legs for attack. A TKD blackbelt can be deadly enough to even break wood boards, and we all know that wood is much harder to break than humans
>E tier
Systema - it's a Russian martial art used by their military. Though it once was the deadliest style at one point in time, with the fall of Soviet Union you could no longer channel communist energy into your attacks, which was a huge focus of the style
>F tier
Everything else
People really don’t watch my videos before writing their completely unrelated comments, do they. Is this AI generated? Are you a bot???
@@RamseyDeweyBeep boop
Hockey players are more dangerous than boxers. Got it.
how does one land properly/safely from this? i havent done much grappling
By learning grappling
By learning how to fall by relaxing, letting your shoulders or feet take the fall, and rolling with the force.
You could do the easiest thing and stick your hands out and land on all fours in par terre position, or be fancy and granby roll into a better position.
@@RamseyDewey I see thanks! grappling isnt a strong suit for Filipinos, we mostly do boxing/MT here
Oh wow..!! What a topic..!! I do believe spiking is a legit safety concern.. This example was a judgement call mistake in my opinion.. I know in the US wrestling it is now your responsibility in how to land your opponent safely without malicious intent..!! Usually this can be accomplished but not always..!! There are also hands to face rules, which I do not agree with..!! Everything is being geared towards safety today..!! I personally never intentionally tried to land anyone with intent to harm..!!! I did, however, always want them to see that flash of light from a hard head crack on the deck simply to use for explosive transitioning,..!! Very interesting topic indeed..!! Keep up the great work Ramsey..!! This is really deep stuff dude..!! LOL..!!
Thanks so much for the comment! I’m glad it was thought provoking.
i stopped watching One Fc when they started pushing muay thai into the front. Their mma pool is garbage now and this show proved it very well. After that throw being illegal and a bunch of low lvl boring striking (in mma) i just think i'm done with one...
You can tell from his rotation and attempt to float around the back right upon landing that Brooks was fully expecting (and intended) for Pacio to land on all fours. Brooks may have even went for the mat return to avoid DQ instead of the suplex which he could have done from that position.
Seeing it the first time I thought that it looked like Pacio "understood" the rule a little too well and purposely didn't post at all to try to draw the DQ. But after a couple times I can see his other hand was still trapped by Brooks so I don't think this is the case.
Man, I do like watching ONE FC, but this is another case of it way too often being One Fighter's Confusion. If it's not clear even to the ref, then it's not clear at all. This is not MMA by any standards.
Pacio’s other hand was trapped by himself. He’s the one holding onto the arm attempting a Kimura.
@@RamseyDewey In the beginning yeah, but by the end he couldn't have let go if he wanted to with that hand. Still doesn't change that yes he shoulda let go way before that. Like you said, his wrestling is pretty damn sus LOL
that is a DQ in high school wrestling! you can't throw from a standing position. you have to have a knee or hip on the mat before they land. does spiking include sprawling someone's face into the mat with a quarter nelson?
No, many “illegal” throws in wrestling are perfectly legal in MMA. This isn’t new the promoter of ONE FC for a period of time banned any and all suplexes but they recently changed the rules. A suplex can be used in highschool wrestling when done safely but was banned completely for a few years.
Looking panicked when he started to come off the ground it happens sometimes with guys who are not familiar with wrestling or being thrown he was in midair and he panicked and that's all it was
how do all? think the general is incorporating similar injury resultive techniques i.e. crusher tackles - n.r.l. etc..
diving before official clearance - heel hitting vertebra . all rely toward duty of care, [ why i prefer judoca due to strength of my punches, [ when cutting with a chainsaw all day 1000 t. plus saw per week docking and felling. my 64kg grip strength could cave a mans face in similar to your head trauma ramsey. the broader sense definitives. cheers, taztez.
that sucks , from allowing head stomps, knees to grounded opponents and headkicks to whatever this is
Head stomps, where?
They still allow those lol
@@cloudmaster182 they absolutely do not allow head stomps or kicks to the head of a downed opponent.
@@SgawCules yea they do, it literally says so before every mma fight. Global mma rules. Look it up lmao I just watched yesterday
@@cloudmaster182 you're fucking retarded, kicks to a downed opponent has been banned from one for a while now. Grounded knee strikes are still very legal. Stop talking out your ass when you don't know shit 🤡
Thats could have easily paralyzed him for life. Illegal move as it should be. Good call by ref for the DQ.
That landing wouldn’t have paralyzed anyone. The move is not illegal in One championship, the result of the fall due to the way Pacio held into his grip was illegal. I know that sounds nonsensical, because it is. One rules are heavily flawed. The call was not made by the ref, it was made by the promoter and later explained by the ref. That is a very slippery slope for combat sports.
rules is rules to follow both fighter and teams
Rules are rules when they are actually objectively observable. What we have here is a case of subjectivity in the interpretation of a wonky rule set.
Under this ruleset would the famous Demetrious Johnson suplex into armbar have gotten him disqualified in One?
That wasn’t a suplex. DJ lifted his opponent up, and dropped him straight down, catching him with an underhook on the way. It’s shockingly easy to do. I have a tutorial on my channel on the fighting techniques playlist.
From the look of it, the ONE promoter decides who to DQ and who not to DQ based on their match making agenda. It’s a clever way to save money at the fighter’s expense since a DQ results in docking a fighter’s purse.
He got robbed cuz he was dominating. I hate to say this but, He is American and on a roll. Can't have that.
Head neck spine?...Thats most of the Human!!😭
The problem was not that he threw it over his head, what I think was a problem is that he kept punching after the opponent was practically knocked out, although there are many loopholes and doubts about these rules the organization somehow and the judge must protect their fighters in critical situations like this because he could have broken his neck after that throw and being hit after this aggravates the whole situation significantly.
Well, what you think is a problem is legal under all rule sets… even this janky one. The fight continues until the referee stops it.
@@RamseyDewey this is true and the rules needs a real specific changes
@@zeropunki which specific changes are you proposing?
My question is, does the fighters aware of this rules or not
If they are not aware then you are right my friend
I don't think it's that dramatic. The wording of the rule sounds pretty clear to me and most certainly refers to "headfirst to the mat" type of throws/slams. The argument that it can be easily abused doesn't really hold any water IMO. The same could be said about the "grounded opponent" or "back of the head" rules. If that's the promotion's rules and they stick to it, that's fine. The more obvious problem here is that Chatri Sityodtong apparently was able to turn the outcome from TKO from DC.
The Jared Brooks fight was bs. I watched that live and I was furious lol
What were you furious about specifically?
Man I miss Pride those were the days
Thank you for explaining this, Ramsey. The way that guy landed on his head was violent and disturbing for sure. His neck bent at a 90 degree angle. Ouch! It did look pretty horrifying, I have to admit. But, yeah... I have always thought that the referee was the authority to call the shots in a pro fight. Not the promoter. Seems pretty sketchy to me. I am a fan of ONF Championship, but this is not a good look for the organization.
13:11 sus indeed
Freakin Next time put the head and spine to say I WIN thru DQ!!! Deliberately with the option of crippling myself????? USE YOUR BRAIN KETCHUP!!!!!!
Im not expert in ufc rules but your not supposed to throw your opponent with a locked hand/s...you can only throw your opponent with a free hand to protect themselves though...am i right? This is the case why he was disqualified
Wrong. That’s not a rule in Mixed Martial Arts.
One Fc doesnt appreciate the beauty of throws. Every time I see a good throw in MMA I have to rewind multiple times to see the nuances of how it was set up etc, Islam is very good at throwing people almost effortlessly and his set ups are amazing; are you telling me he would be DQ’d in one fc? (Yes) .
What a shame 🤦♂️ let MMA be truly MMA.
Great vid coach.
reminder that their bitch owner decided to ban clinching from muay thai
The IBJJF has a similar rule which requires the suplex to be controlled in a way that the opponent lands on their side.
They don’t even allow suplexes in One Championship.
They do allow mat returns in IBJJF.
No the rule changed from "no suplex" to "no spiking" it was a subtle change a few months back
@@bubblewhip382 its not spiking
hello ramseyistn t ussally ONE Ch-sship is ahead of the game? Wish ya nothing but the best,cool clip and the famous Ramsey-DEwey-Humor on Top.What a way to start the day with Ramseey and Coffeee..
Ahead of the game in what way?
@@RamseyDewey I terms of diversitie in Entertainment..The got KICK BOXING, THAY Boxing and my favorite Mixed-MMA( no joke i am serios..)One Round Thai-Boxing, Second MMA..E.g.ROTANG vs Mighty Mouse). Thats what i meant; Do i have a valid argument, or just prooving that I know nothing? Love and Greetings to Ramsey from Austria
Thank you coach. I appreciate someone speaking some sense. I saw a bunch of cry baby casuals in the comments thanking One FC for stopping neck breaks?
One of the greatest moments in MMA history is Emilianenko Vs. Randleman. The slam shook the world and Fedor still got back up and beat Kevin.
The rule is a disgrace and the way the rule was managed was also a complete disgrace. He also posted the arm before he landed on his head, but did so poorly from a framing perspective.
This org has single handedly killed every form of suplex and slam, because as you alluded to, you can't slam somebody onto their legs.
Maybe they could just provide better insurance to their fighters as this rule is clearly to save money on hospital bills.
And do you know why Fedor wasn’t fazed by that suplex? Because he trained to tuck his chin, round his back, take a fall on his shoulders and granby roll to dissipate the impact instead of sticking his head out like a noob.
A high amplitude throw is 100% survivable. Check out our friends Nik and Si Collier who have videos on their channel of suplexing each other on concrete without a scratch on them. It’s all technique.
Cry baby casuals will ruin MMA if Promotions don't stand up to them.
You can see them even claiming stuff like knee stomps should be banned claiming it could end careers, even though most career ending injuries are caused by far more common attacks such us...yeah, guessed it, punches and kicks to the head.
If they have their way, we'll end up with point light contact MMA where action is reset after every takedown.
@@RamseyDewey Oh precisely so, even with the more vicious intent, proper defense of the technique mitigated the damage.
That's why I appreciate your video on this topic particularly. It shouldn't be the responsibility of your opponent to ensure you land in the safest manner possible. It's a preposterous suggestion.
Thanks also for shining a light on ONE dictating the decisions of fights over the actual referee's.
@@MrAlepedroza I did indeed see a comment asking if foot stomps were illegal and calling them "Dirty". How truly pathetic of a suggestion. Fighting with intelligence and attempting to wear down an opponent is now considered dirty?
Don't call this goof "Coach." He has no clue what he's talking about. Zero understanding of the rules. Zero common sense. You can watch the guy get slammed headfirst in slow motion and this goof is like "Nah, that's not spiking."🤦🏻♂️ Fucking hell.
I haven't finished watching, when starting to write this. I am somewhere between 10 and 11 minutes into the video. And I have to say OneFC is making itself ridiculous.
these throwing rules in ONE are weird in general, but especially since they allow kneeing the head of a downed opponent. i feel like if you´re not allowed to use throws that *could* land an opponent on their head, back or spine if *they* fail to protect themselves, then grappling into position to specifically knee a head of a downed opponent should also be illegal? (imo both should be legal, but one being legal and one illegal doesnt make sense to me)
then again, allowing knees on the ground forces fighters to get up from bad positions quicker and forces action in grappling exchanges, so if they want to have kickboxing matches with little grappling, it makes sense from that perspective
One audience is primarily striking fans so they dont really get much from selling mma shows these days.
I once landed on my face in a wrestling match, it was an accident and my neck was really never the same after...I have slammed to get out of a submission once...the bjj guys I roll with always say "American audiences are bored by grappling they want to see people get punched in the face" may have to do with the 1fc being "glorified kickboxing"?
If spiked,and your opponent is DQed you can raise your àrm in victory all the way to the hospital
So the reason to ban spiking is that "once you're lifted like that you can't do anything about getting hurt"? And punches are ok because you could have dodged or blocked? Couldn't you have done something to not get lifted up for a spike?
The reason for every one of the unified rules of MMA (UFC rules, not ONE rules… which they seem to be making up on the spot now) is because a boxing commission (The New Jersey Athletic Control Board) decided on it back in the year 2000. They imported boxing traditions into a sport where boxing traditions didn’t belong.
To be fair a proper piledriver is a much higher risk maneuver than a punch in the face. Even in a suplex the opponent is supposed to land on their back or shoulders, sure it can happen that they land on the head but that's not its intention. The intention of Spiking is slamming an opponent on their head with a high risk of breaking their neck. I think it's totally fine that that particular type of throw is banned due to it's high risk of long term injury from just a single instance. What Brooks did was a totally fine move however.
I agree that it should have been a ko rather than a DQ I hope they fix this but it doesn't spoil the organization for me. I find myself watching more ONE than UFC these days simply for the striking maybe because I'm a former boxer and I'm bias.
It will end up looking like the NBA, with guys flopping on their faces after every contact.
I'm reminded of a parody movie with a boxing scene, but both fighters had been paid to lose, so they both collapse to the mat, "unconscious," from the force of touching gloves.
The Sgt Bilko movie that Steve Martin starred in.
That is the slippery slope this sets up.
@@bejammin2000 Thanks! I was thinking it was a Mel Brooks movie, but I couldn't remember a boxing scene in any of them.
I just rewatched that scene, and it's a fun one.
Why is you saying “sus” so funny to me 😂
I think it’s just a way to fix fights, maybe someone owes money to some serious people 🥶
It's been a rule forever. "fIXiNg FiGhTs🥴"
@@josephreese6502 it’s obviously a bad rule that can easily be selectively enforced and that entails or at least opens the door to corruption
Fix the fight?
The fck are you on? Lol
Another blabber who didn't watch the fight but he thinks his opinion matters
@@josephreese6502 No it hasn’t, ONE has been changing its slam rule repeatedly it used to be suplexes were banned but people got mad when some fighters got penalized over others.
Rules is rulse, period 😅
?
Pee noy crybaby
Ok in mma the complexity of take downs makes it hard or impossible to create a clear rule against the obvious danger of neck breaking/concussion, so what? Should we compromise the set of legal combat technics, or the safety of a guy who has family and is there to make a living?
I don’t believe you are correct. Can you defend your argument that it is har for impossible to create a clear rule against the obvious danger of neck breaking/concussions in MMA? There has never been a broken neck in the UFC, let alone from a takedown. The rules of the UFC are very clear. OneFC, on the other hand has subjective unclear rules when it comes to takedowns, and consequently, they are the ones experiencing most of the takedown related injuries.
@@RamseyDeweyNo I can t, if these are facts then you are right, you very probably are, Namajuna failed to protect herself at all moments so did the guy we just saw, but so will others no doubt, and it still looks f... dangerous,
We know thr tombstone is spiking. But what about the Pedigree? (Triple H finishing move)
Is it a piledriver? Then it’s spiking. Is it not a piledriver? Then it’s not spiking.
I had to look up the pedigree. It looks like both wrestlers land on their knees and no contact with the head to the mat is actually made at all, but the illusion of such is given. This one is purely for show.
@@RamseyDewey
Of course it does not land on face first. But imagine if you deliver a pedigree that does land your opponent face on ground first, how would it be ruled in UFC or One?
That would be the goofiest looking sprawl ever.
@@RamseyDewey haha yeah. I was asking as a joke😅 but in your opinion. If it had to be real. Would you consider it a piledriver? Or something else?
Couldn't agree more coach,and let's not forget that the Greeks pile driver each other to condition their necks😂
Yeah, man! What's about hitting at the back of the opponent's head? Downward elbows to the spine? Crushing opponents' finger bones? Stumbling on feet? Hey! you should protect yourself at all time. Why have all these rules then?
Organizations just ask their fighters not to do those things, just to make the sport safer. Fighters love their lives and well being as well. This is the reason.
By the way, kneeing on grounded opponents is legal in ONE FC, but not in UFC. Is this rule made UFC irrelevant?
Come on, they have their own ways to make the sport fun and safe as much as possible. Their ways may differ in many ways, but both of them are serious MMA organizations.
This is not a discussion about making combat sports more or less dangerous.
We discussed (1) what spiking is and isn’t (2) the slippery slope introduced by the ambiguity of One’s rules governing throws (3) the problem of allowing the promoter to change a call made by the referee ex post facto.
@@RamseyDeweyI mentioned about the safety due to that it's the reason behind many MMA rules.
Seeing that ONE forbids the throws landing on the opponent's head, neck, or spine doesn't mean that now fighters have to protect their opponents instead of themselve as mentioned in your video's title. That's why I cited about other rules.
There are lots and lots of rules forbiding many things, most of them for the safety reason. Even with those rules, fighters still fight each other as usual. To have these kind of rules is very normal in my opinion.
Replying to point 2: This rule is explained quite clear so that the fight commentators could tell you immediately that the throw was illegal. If the commentators knew it, so should the fighters. This answers if the rule expression ambiguous or not.
Even Jarred Brooks showed a clear reaction that he knew it was illegal when he saw the replay. It's normal that a fighter commits a foul by a mistake, but it's not that they don't understand the rule.
It seems that every participants understands the scope of this rule, so it's clear, not ambiguous. Clear enough for everyone around it to understand.
@@RamseyDeweyReplying to point 1: The definition of spiking you explained is your version, or maybe UFC's version. ONE might have another version of their own. However, it's normal that people have different opinions on the same thing. No big deal here.
Replying to point 3: ONE is rather a new organization, they learn as they go. Maybe they did something unfavorable to fans, they will fix it later.
Sometime they give bonuses afterwards, sometime they changes a call made by the referee in the match. The latter rarely occurs though. They know that it's not good to do that, and they fixed it.
Actually, that is exactly what it means. Any throw can result in the fighter being thrown hitting his head on the floor depending on his skill. If the fighter performing the throw is penalized for the incompetence of his opponent, that 100% puts the burden of responsibility on the thrower to protect his opponent.
ONE isn’t new. They’ve been around long enough to get their act together. That’s not an excuse. ONE has been in its present form since 2011, and was previously known as Martial Combat when I fought for them in 2009. They’re not new. They were doing goofy stuff back then, and they’re still doing goofy stuff today.
thats not an ordinary mat return
It sure is.
@@RamseyDeweythat's your opinion
so you are saying what brooks did to pacio is Legal????
Listen to yourself very carefully. Every time someone says “so you’re saying” what follows is almost always a straw man argument.
No. That is not what was said.
The problem with ONE rules is that instead of banning specific techniques, they ban specific outcomes. This shifts the onus of responsibility to intelligently defend oneself on one’s opponent. The internal logic of that rule is broken beyond belief and incredibly easy to abuse.
Recently a fighter here in Ireland got suplexed on his head in sparring and has been left paralysed. Its a huge tragedy that couldve been avoided. I think its stupid to throw someone on their head because thats what were dealing with at the end of the day. Its a potentially life altering or ending foul. Knees to a grounded opponent are way more tame than throwing someone on their head and thats fact. 12 to 6 elbows also way more tame and shouldnt be banned. And yet all I see is a bunch of UFC fanboys trying to argue about this shit. This is a bad take by Ramsey and thats okay. Its alright to be wrong. At the end of the day people agree to the rules they fight under and those rules should protect from immediate death and paralysis as well as immediate loss of vision and loss of reproductive function. Thats why we dont strike to the groin and use eye pokes. I cant see anyone arguing with that
You are arguing different points than the ones I made in this video.
@@RamseyDewey Partially true because I was very much criticizing the comment section and not just yourself. I think its pretty clear though that me and you disagree on the fighters should protect themselves shtick because its not something you would say when someone eye pokes or hits to the groin. You're so focused on the technicality of the term spiking that you dont seem to realise that you can intentionally slam someone on their head without spiking. The real issue is that the athlete chose to not just drop but actually slam someone on their head which is extremely dangerous. Yes Pacio couldve defended but Daniel Cormier could've defended Jones' eye pokes. Doesnt mean that Jones gets a pass because it's on Daniel to protect himself. Doesnt mean Pacio is to be held liable for Brooks breaking the rules. Like your arguments actually make no sense in any practical way. The most valid argument that you've made is about the written rules but even then they are enforced in regard to throws landing on the head. They dont DQ people for using judo throws even if the phrasing of the rules is vague.
That's the thing about rules is that they give you a false illusion of safety. A lot more people get injured and crippled from legal punches and kicks to the head than slams.
Rules do not protect you!
Only you can protect you!
@@hanzkidz rules are largely security theater to protect the feelings of the audience and make them feel better about consuming consuming violence.
@@RamseyDewey Not true. If you were to take away all the rules the fighters would not be better off. They may not be perfect but they 100% serve a function. I find it interesting that you said I didnt argue against any of your points and that when I did you chose to just not comment on any of the points I made. I get that in fairness you probably are super busy with teaching and running the channel but it seems a little contradictory to me
One championship is a shady organization even by MMA standards that is quite impressive, honestly .
ya, ONE has issues. rulesets, matchups, and weight classes all need to be figured out. they have a good stable of stars, but their fights are mostly mismatches and tiny weight categories. they have the chance to be pride part 2, but it's kind of falling apart for them. they also need to get amazon in line, cuz the last card i couldn't even watch because amazon was borked. it's pretty rough when your fans come to check you out and all they get is a black screen. hey coach, when you're doing your mat return, try touching them with your knee on their thigh while they're in the air to tilt them. don't twist them to the side with your arms, that doesn't work against guys that can wrestle. they just put both feet back on the mat and keep wrestling. you need to get them sideways before you drop them. just give em a little boop with your knee, and that moveset will open up for you.
That should be a 100% legal throw (and may even be legal under the One rules as written, but I guess that doesn't matter), but man, if there was a way to ban dropping a dude on his head like that without just banning slams entirely...
I can't fault the guy, because he clearly didn't intend to do that, it's just how he fell (which is why banning it without banning slams entirely is probably impossible), but ouch. I hope the dude's alright.
He’s fine.
bottom line is fighters who know all the details of the rules and how to take advantage of the details of the rules and how they're actually enforced will have a big advantage in a fight
Yep. If you want to win consistently, you must be well versed in all the rules of the sport.
RIZIN approaches the rules in a completely different way. It's a shame that they seem to ignore the western market.
"All strikes, throws and chokes are permitted, with the exception of headbutts and strikes to the back of the head, medulla oblongata, spinal cord or genitals. Soccer kicks, knees and stomps to grounded opponents are also permitted. However, if there is a weight discrepancy of 15 kg (33 lb) or more, the lighter fighter is allowed to choose if such ground attacks are permitted. Unlike Pride, Rizin allows the use of elbow strikes, including the 12-6 elbow."
Just don't spike the punch.
Maybe if Pacio tucked his chin, he'd have landed on his shoulders. Like Emelianenko when he got suplexed by Randleman.
An expert wrestler can granby roll out of that, a compete novice can stick his hands out and land on all fours.
Although those rules are really complicated and make little sense still is WAY more pleasing t watch One Championship than the UFC recently. Specially when the Thais are fighting.
The thai’s aren’t fighting MMA lmao thats comparing apples to oranges. Just watch muay thai then but it is not MMA.
@@Banished-rx4ol Still different form MMA as well, though. I'll give you that that MAYBE it's just what kickboxing maybe "should" look like, to an extent. But kickboxing theses days just don't look like it. Kickboxing looks like... kickboxing! a sport f its own. You can't even seem MT in kickboxing rules theses days. Much of the cool things of MT aren't allowed like catching kicks, elbows, clinch work. It ALSO doesn't look like kickboxing with throws. That is Sanda. It also looks completely different (and it's amazing). When I say the Thais is because they are way better fighters than most strikes at UFC ae with rare exceptions like Wonderboy. That's just a fact. It's a way more exciting fight to watch than most of UFC theses days EVEN when both of fighters are keeping at striking. No comparison.
@@Banished-rx4ol UFC fighters theses days are generally quite bad at striking. They are barely competent in a lot of areas and therefore mostly lack in each of them. For instance, most UFC fighters wouldn't fare well in a boxing match because their boxing are just not that good. Same in a Muay Thai/bokator/Lethwei fight. They probably be fine in kickboxing rules though. By comparison there are more fighters that would be fine in a wrestling and BJJJ match. It feels like it was created this MMA way of striking, that COMES from ll those striking styles but most are just good enough at the basics, almost none exccell at then.
@@JohnnyLynnLee Then watch kard chuek the bare knuckle muay thai with ropes, lethwei, etc but you can’t compare it to MMA because its a different sport. Also the Former UFC heavyweight francis ngannou champion almost beat a current heavyweight champion in tyson fury, israel adesanya and alex periera came from glory kickboxing, Viacheslav Borshchev is one of the better unranked strikers at lightweight, etc what are you on about? They signed a silved medalist taekwondo fighter at heavyweight.
@@Banished-rx4ol And what you've mentioned are ALSO different sports. Most people in UFC theses days are just BAD at striking. Funny you cited Adesangna. His fight with Anderson silva would NEVER be possible in UFC today. Adesangna HIMSELF couldn't perform like that today. THAT was an amazing striking fight inUFC. I don't care for the ones who Came form glory. glory is pretty much unbearable to watch. Like I said, is kickboxing. And kickboxinbg in current kickboxing rules is pretty boring. Again, most striking matches at UF are BORING, they are half-baked. They do looping punches, overreach, a lot of them couldn't even perform a proper uppercut even if their life depended on it.
Elbows are nowhere to be found, most just knee in the clinch or launching form afar. The wrestlers in UFC today are way better wrestlers than the strikers are for example.
herb knew for sure that that match was a tko. sad
Dude,both camp knows the rules about do’s and don’t,Just fallow and play clean
I disagree. Joshua is in defense that time. Its just like exposing the back of your head to avoid punch because its illegal. Its not that pacio dont know how to defend it but its brooks who didnt think the rules.
Well obviously he didn't do yhe may throw well he slam his opponent head like a nail while it should be forwarded not backwards slam
This is why BJJ guy pull guard...
The ultimate martial art with the ultimate rule set . Oh wait ... what rules???? 😆
This is specifically a discussion about rules.
One fc has the same problem that karate combat has since they changed president , and that is an identidy crisis one fc sell them self as an mma promotion but 90% of their roster are muay thai fighters and their rules favor them , karate combat has the same problem its started as a legit karate league basically wkf karate but in a full contact setting but now is just mma but without the ground holds
There's too many grappling arts being watered down as it is to fit modern rule standards, and it's a darn shame. This sort of thing does happen. This makes me think of Fedor vs Kevin in Pride. May Kevin rest in peace. He was well respected by Fedor, and a great example of hard work overcoming his skill in striking, as Crocop learnt. I mean that in no disrespect, it was an amazing feat. It's rare, and usually skill prevails, but the odd time, that terrible punch, if hard enough can knock a pro to the ground and defeat him with forearm strikes after. Amazing power. Forearm strikes are really neglected, aswell as stepping in elbows. Mentioned a buddy that started using stepping strikes, both short and long, and has done good with them. It really does compliment his judo. The stepping and spearing strikes mimicking bajiquan without him knowing it, which also happened to be Paul Pheonix"s style in tekken, which everyone always jusy said judo, but left out the bajiquan for some reason. They compliment each other really well in some cases, iv experienced it. I'm going way off here. I'd like to see a fight promotion that some how can sneak in bare handed fighting, like old Vale Tudo, or something similar to the catch as can nhb days, just without rules that would be a janitors nightmare after a match. Combat jiu jitsu almost had it, but only allow open hands on the ground. Than we do habe rhe bare knuckle fight league, but we don't habe anything that represents the early ufc. If I'm wrong and there's a fight league out there, that allows full spectrum ufc style rules but is bare handed, allowing any kind of strike, please let me know. I'd love to see something like that again. It's a hard truth that we would probably see more grappling and kicking in it, and see more hand strikes while on the ground. It'd be interesting to see the percentages in it compared to other leagues. Also, it's never really seen, but a unique variation of a mat return that's more of a slam done in a sacrifice throw variation is what I'm often a target for, since I'm a fairly large and heavy guy. Pretty rare for someone to have Randlemans strength and just toss around a 230 lbs guy. Im unfortunately a bit more than 230 ATM. However, there is still a throw that works, that can mimick a slam. Nothing fancy wwe style or judo. It might actually be something in judo. Not really oshiro goshi, but something similar. I don't know if its the scandahoovian in me, but I rarely slip on ice, and have always maintained good balance, and also enjoy judo counters, so judo has never been much of a worry to me when people are offe sive with it towards me. Against a judo champ, well ofcourse I'm.going down, but a good wrestler will always take someone down if done right. So as mentioned it's not easy picking me up, but guys can still do it, so, the one technique went like so. You'd take the man's arms around the waist in whatever Chosen grip works the best, and before he can focus on breaking it, ypu habe to get the lift in. And to get his mind off of your hands, you need to begin to tilt him slightly to a side, even if it's just at 45 degrees or so. Doesn't matter which side, but some prefer tilting them towards their stronger side. Everyone has one. Usually. Than from there it's just a simple sacrifice throw of leaning back and Turning to the side of their upper body. A way to make the slam alot more effective is ofcourse by stepping forward with the right foot if it's the heavy side while preparing to fall, and than pushing off with then tilting towards the left and pushing off as you begin to fall. It doesn't look like it does much, but getting your head bounced off the mat doesn't feel good regardless of how high or how much force is behind it. Some decent positions can be obtained to from it aswell even though the kanding seems super awkward. Always best to try and just habe their legs over you in the finish. What does look like pro wrestling is doing a roll up pin with their legs ans than attacking the side they try roll out of, or letting them straighten out a bit, or not, and lacing your leg through, while pulling up and dragging their leg into anything from there. That's the bonus of free hands. Better grips for better control. A guy can only dream.
If their is an industry, there is a knockoff or corrupt version of it in China.
One FC sucks for MMA. Their kickboxing is good. Their sub grappling superfights are fine enough. But their MMA is wonky. I also took lots of issue with their yellow cards for passivity on this same event. Its strategic to feel out your opponent and not bum eush them. But if you try to feel your opponent out they will yellow are or even red card (disqualify) you
One FC is using Arcade street fighter 2 house rules, but they disqualify you instead of making you allow one free throw. Next rule change will be that you have to stop attacking your fazed opoonent util the birds go away.
😂till the birds go away! Mwahahahaha!!! Awesome!
Sooo...Alexander Karelin's signature move?
No. The Karelin lift is essentially a belly to back suplex starting prone on the floor, throwing the prone fighter onto his back. A mat return is lifting a fighter up (in this case standing) and then putting back down into par terre position (hands and feet) or a prone position.
@@RamseyDewey You're right. I don't know the rules well enough. Thanks for the heads up.