Appreciate this video very much as I'm attempting to switch over to Channel Numbers. Have always wondered how to deal with some of the OT libraries with tons of articulations. I have all the Berlin series but have yet to find a way to get them into Dorico but this video helps a lot.
Meanwhile I've had much bad luck with VEPRO. I've had it working in the past but a persistent problem is getting sound to come out into Dorico or Cubase. Everything looks good in VEPRO with the VU meters bouncing as they should when playing a track back from Cubase or VEPRO, but for the life of me, I cannot debug this so currently running without VEPRO.
VE Pro has worked well for me. But, I can’t say I’ve found it ‘rock solid’ as people claim. I’m using it on a single machine with my projects, so maybe that’s why I get crashes… Anyway, I like it but if it gave me trouble I’d drop it :)
@@musicchefpro I had thought it might be a network issues but even with Cubase/Dorico/VEPRO on the same machine still most of the time the audio doesn't come through. Ergo VEPRO is gathering dust.
Update: A Solution to my template madness was just posted on the Dorico forum. I have been saving each Endpoint for each instrument and then entering all these into a Template. When the template was run this resulted in identically named instruments all having the same VST as the first one. The SOLUTION is in Play Mode ->"VST and Midi" tab where there are 3 icons at the bottom of the VST list "Add", "Duplicate" and "Save Endpoint Configuration". This last button saves all them correctly as separate VST's. So my new template has only this one "consolidated" Endpont in it. IT WORKS--all VST's are separate. Still wondering what the individual Endpoints are used for.
Nice! Great find. I've developed a workflow where I actually created a single Dorico project for each instrument family. For example, I have a Dorico project called "Strings" and it contains all my string instruments. I save a group endpoint just like you're saying. So, my playback template contains about 8 endpoints... "Strings", "Brass", etc... Then whenever I want to add a new sample library to my rig I find the appropriate 'family endpoint' Dorico project and add it there, resave the group endpoint and get back to work. I'm glad you found this solution. Hopefully, there are brighter days ahead with a reliable playback template :)
One topic I'm hoping for a revisit relates to Dorico templates. I often make changes (especially to Playback techniques) and need to make sure these flow through up to the Template. The method I'm using now is to re-save the Endpoint Configuration and then in Playback Templates, increment the Version number. This seems to work well if I make any changes including Expression Maps, Playback Techniques, or Playing Techniques. Have had to make a lot of template changes as moving from Direction to Attribute--now that I've got the Line extensions working.
That’s a good approach. I wish that playback templates either stored the playing techniques or there was a way to easily import a library of playing techniques. The way it actually works is that playing techniques are saved in the project that they’re created in. If you click the ‘star’ to set the playing technique as a default in the Playing Techniques dialogue, then that playing technique will apply on future projects, but NOT past projects. The only way to get an old project to use updated playing techniques is to (1) create a new project, (2) import the flows from the old project…. A bit cumbersome. But, ultimately it works. I’m closing in on a set of playing techniques that is the best-all, end-all (for my purposes). I’m still trying to get to the point where I don’t need to update my Playing Techniques.
The CCs are set in my expression map. Before a playing technique can be specified with a CC in an expression map, it needs to be setup as a Playback Technique and then related to a Playing Technique. Then, I add it to my expression map and associate it there with a CC 70 value.
Yes, I’m using channels instead of key switches. But, I’ve had no problems exporting key switches to my DAW. The reason I use channels is because I don’t like having to do the ‘clean up’ of key switches (which sometimes cause unwanted note playback once I’m in the DAW).
I use a lot of custom playing techniques :). There is an option to ‘hide’ items in your score - I think its a setting in the properties panel, but I’ve had it programmed as a keyboard shortcut for so long that I don’t remember now…. Anyway, hiding that stuff returns my printed score to a much, much cleaner presentation.
I'm not using VEPRO so switching from key switching to channel switching/ CC articulation is an interesting task. I found out where to switch to channel switching in SINE, but not in Kontakt, Spitfire, Soundpaint, Engine, etc., yet.
In Kontakt, I create a multi with each one set to a different channel. For example, I've created a "Violin" multi in kontakt that contains 4 instances of my Kontakt violin library. They are set to channel 1-4, so each one gets only 1 channel. Then, they have each are preset to a single articulation (Staccato, Portato), etc. That's how I've settled on doing channel switching in Kontakt at the moment...
Thanks for your question! I created a custom Playback Technique called ‘Blurred’. Then I created a custom Playing Technique, also called ‘Blurred’ that references the ‘Blurred’ Playback technique. Once I created the ‘Blurred’ Playing Technique, it shows up the right panel and I can also find it by using the Playing Techniques popover (Shift+P) in the score. I hope that helps :)
Templates are driving me crazy! Setup a template with Violin I, VIolin II, Viola, VIolincello, Double Bass. I create a new project with these same named instruments, then run the template and get Violin I, Violin I, VIola, Violincello, Double Bass. Just cannot get Violin II to appear. Tried deleting everything including Endpoints and starting over, but still no Violin II.
I don’t think you’re alone on this. I’d check these things out… First, is Violin II a solo player or section player in your endpoint? Does that match whether it’s a solo or section player in your project? Next, I’ve had issues with naming instruments manually. I find my playback templates work best when I let Dorico name all my instruments automatically…. I haven’t tracked down the reason why this makes a difference, but I’ve learned to never rename instruments manually that are part of a playback template. I hope one of those suggestions gets things moving in the right direction!
@@musicchefpro I have only section players. On the new project I selected Violin as the first entry and added violin again and Dorico renamed them to Violin I and Violin II as hoped for. Still when I run the template and look at the VST's I see two entries for Violin I and no VIolin II.😒 (Relieved to know I'm not alone with this problem. Tried it on several different computers with same result.)
@shubus, I’d suggest going into your endpoint and making sure it contains what you’re expecting. You can inspect a playback template (Play menu > Playback Template…), then select your playback template and click the pencil button to edit it. I think from there you can click through to see what instruments are in each endpoint. This is one of those features of Dorico that is so obscured that I’d expect most people get unexpected results. I’ve pulled chunks of my hair out chasing similar problems. But, the good news is that once you get the Playback template to work, it ALWAYS works (at least in my experience)…
![This bizarre experimental DAW is a sound designer's wet dream [blockhead]](/img/1.gif)
Appreciate this video very much as I'm attempting to switch over to Channel Numbers. Have always wondered how to deal with some of the OT libraries with tons of articulations. I have all the Berlin series but have yet to find a way to get them into Dorico but this video helps a lot.
Glad it was helpful!
Meanwhile I've had much bad luck with VEPRO. I've had it working in the past but a persistent problem is getting sound to come out into Dorico or Cubase. Everything looks good in VEPRO with the VU meters bouncing as they should when playing a track back from Cubase or VEPRO, but for the life of me, I cannot debug this so currently running without VEPRO.
VE Pro has worked well for me. But, I can’t say I’ve found it ‘rock solid’ as people claim. I’m using it on a single machine with my projects, so maybe that’s why I get crashes… Anyway, I like it but if it gave me trouble I’d drop it :)
@@musicchefpro I had thought it might be a network issues but even with Cubase/Dorico/VEPRO on the same machine still most of the time the audio doesn't come through. Ergo VEPRO is gathering dust.
Update: A Solution to my template madness was just posted on the Dorico forum. I have been saving each Endpoint for each instrument and then entering all these into a Template. When the template was run this resulted in identically named instruments all having the same VST as the first one. The SOLUTION is in Play Mode ->"VST and Midi" tab where there are 3 icons at the bottom of the VST list "Add", "Duplicate" and "Save Endpoint Configuration". This last button saves all them correctly as separate VST's. So my new template has only this one "consolidated" Endpont in it. IT WORKS--all VST's are separate. Still wondering what the individual Endpoints are used for.
Nice! Great find. I've developed a workflow where I actually created a single Dorico project for each instrument family. For example, I have a Dorico project called "Strings" and it contains all my string instruments. I save a group endpoint just like you're saying. So, my playback template contains about 8 endpoints... "Strings", "Brass", etc... Then whenever I want to add a new sample library to my rig I find the appropriate 'family endpoint' Dorico project and add it there, resave the group endpoint and get back to work. I'm glad you found this solution. Hopefully, there are brighter days ahead with a reliable playback template :)
One topic I'm hoping for a revisit relates to Dorico templates. I often make changes (especially to Playback techniques) and need to make sure these flow through up to the Template. The method I'm using now is to re-save the Endpoint Configuration and then in Playback Templates, increment the Version number. This seems to work well if I make any changes including Expression Maps, Playback Techniques, or Playing Techniques. Have had to make a lot of template changes as moving from Direction to Attribute--now that I've got the Line extensions working.
That’s a good approach. I wish that playback templates either stored the playing techniques or there was a way to easily import a library of playing techniques. The way it actually works is that playing techniques are saved in the project that they’re created in. If you click the ‘star’ to set the playing technique as a default in the Playing Techniques dialogue, then that playing technique will apply on future projects, but NOT past projects. The only way to get an old project to use updated playing techniques is to (1) create a new project, (2) import the flows from the old project…. A bit cumbersome. But, ultimately it works. I’m closing in on a set of playing techniques that is the best-all, end-all (for my purposes). I’m still trying to get to the point where I don’t need to update my Playing Techniques.
Are the cc's entered with a midi controller or through playing techniques?
The CCs are set in my expression map. Before a playing technique can be specified with a CC in an expression map, it needs to be setup as a Playback Technique and then related to a Playing Technique. Then, I add it to my expression map and associate it there with a CC 70 value.
So you are using channels instead of keyswitches because Dorico wont export the keyswitches to a DAW?
Yes, I’m using channels instead of key switches. But, I’ve had no problems exporting key switches to my DAW. The reason I use channels is because I don’t like having to do the ‘clean up’ of key switches (which sometimes cause unwanted note playback once I’m in the DAW).
I just bought Pro to try and get articulations working, but I agree they make for a messy looking manuscript.
I use a lot of custom playing techniques :). There is an option to ‘hide’ items in your score - I think its a setting in the properties panel, but I’ve had it programmed as a keyboard shortcut for so long that I don’t remember now…. Anyway, hiding that stuff returns my printed score to a much, much cleaner presentation.
Very informative, thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
I'm not using VEPRO so switching from key switching to channel switching/ CC articulation is an interesting task. I found out where to switch to channel switching in SINE, but not in Kontakt, Spitfire, Soundpaint, Engine, etc., yet.
In Kontakt, I create a multi with each one set to a different channel. For example, I've created a "Violin" multi in kontakt that contains 4 instances of my Kontakt violin library. They are set to channel 1-4, so each one gets only 1 channel. Then, they have each are preset to a single articulation (Staccato, Portato), etc. That's how I've settled on doing channel switching in Kontakt at the moment...
@@musicchefpro This is very helpful. I'll give this a try.
How do you put the add on in the score of Dorico? For instance blurred staccato instead of normal staccato?
Thanks for your question! I created a custom Playback Technique called ‘Blurred’. Then I created a custom Playing Technique, also called ‘Blurred’ that references the ‘Blurred’ Playback technique. Once I created the ‘Blurred’ Playing Technique, it shows up the right panel and I can also find it by using the Playing Techniques popover (Shift+P) in the score. I hope that helps :)
@@musicchefpro Thank you, its totally clear. You are a very good teacher by the way
Templates are driving me crazy! Setup a template with Violin I, VIolin II, Viola, VIolincello, Double Bass. I create a new project with these same named instruments, then run the template and get Violin I, Violin I, VIola, Violincello, Double Bass. Just cannot get Violin II to appear. Tried deleting everything including Endpoints and starting over, but still no Violin II.
I don’t think you’re alone on this. I’d check these things out… First, is Violin II a solo player or section player in your endpoint? Does that match whether it’s a solo or section player in your project? Next, I’ve had issues with naming instruments manually. I find my playback templates work best when I let Dorico name all my instruments automatically…. I haven’t tracked down the reason why this makes a difference, but I’ve learned to never rename instruments manually that are part of a playback template. I hope one of those suggestions gets things moving in the right direction!
@@musicchefpro I have only section players. On the new project I selected Violin as the first entry and added violin again and Dorico renamed them to Violin I and Violin II as hoped for. Still when I run the template and look at the VST's I see two entries for Violin I and no VIolin II.😒 (Relieved to know I'm not alone with this problem. Tried it on several different computers with same result.)
@shubus, I’d suggest going into your endpoint and making sure it contains what you’re expecting. You can inspect a playback template (Play menu > Playback Template…), then select your playback template and click the pencil button to edit it. I think from there you can click through to see what instruments are in each endpoint. This is one of those features of Dorico that is so obscured that I’d expect most people get unexpected results. I’ve pulled chunks of my hair out chasing similar problems. But, the good news is that once you get the Playback template to work, it ALWAYS works (at least in my experience)…