Glad the video is helpful. If I recall, I’d need the tempo changes to match in both projects in order for things to stay reliable…. Not the best situation, but workable :)
If you own Cubase Pro installed in Win10, it includes the SMPTEGenerator VST3 Effect plug-in in the Program Files\Steinberg\Cubase 13\VST3\Cubase Plug-in Set.vst3 folder. I copied that folder to Program Files\Steinberg\Dorico5\VSTAudioEngine\VST3 folder and after restarting Dorico, the SMPTEGenerator plugin shows up under "tools"
@@nicolasjchaanine In the video he talks about purchasing, installing and configuring the third party TXL 20 Timecode plugin to generate SMPTE Timecode that is then routed via a virtual MIDI connection from Dorico to Cubase in order to sync up the playback of both programs. Rather than purchasing the TXL 20 plugin, since Cubase Pro comes with its own SMPTE Timecode plugin as part of that product, then if we can somehow get Dorico to "see" the Cubase SMPTE VS3 plugin then why pay money for a third party (TXL 20) plugin that provides the same functionality? The challenge is that the Cubase SMPTE Timecode plugin is NOT installed into the regular VST3 folder that third party VST3 plugins are supposed to get installed to and where Dorico will search. Instead, it is "buried" in the Cubase Program Files folder hierarchy, at least in the Windows version because it is part of the Cubase "Factory" set of VST3 plugins. I found that by copying the "Cubase Plugin Set.vst3" folder into the correct location for Dorico's its built-in VST3 "Factory" plugins, once you restart Dorico, the Cubase SMPTE Timecode plugin then becomes available to Dorico to insert in place of the TXL 20 plugin as described in the video, so that it can send SMPTE Timecode to the virtual MIDI connection and then on to Cubase. In Dorico, you won't see a "Tools" category under FX Plugins until you copy the Cubase folder mentioned and then restart Dorico. Once you copy this "Cubase Plugin Set.vst3" folder over to Dorico, you will also see a lot of other VST3 plugins show up in Dorico that would not be otherwise available. These are the rest of the Cubase "Factory" VST3 plugins that come as part of Cubase Pro.
I was searching for some info on how the Dorico and Cubase(Nuendo) interchange worked - I had seen a video where that workflow was described. Your video came up - and I appreciate how clear your presentation on this was. It looks like some other software is needed to make it all work - but you did a great job in demonstrating and explaining this. I use Windows so I will have to research more on how this would be done - but your video shows it is possible and can become another piece in the toolbox. Great job.
Thanks! I was also searching for info on getting these 2 to work well together. Ultimately, all I needed was the TXL plugin. If you’re on Windows, perhaps loopMIDI from Tobias Erichsen would be the ticket for setting up a virtual MIDI port on Windows. Thanks for your comment and best of luck :)
Thank you so much for all your content. YOU seriously have put out some incredibly useful videos. I am shocked that some of them don't have thousands of views because Dorico expression maps, playing techniques, playback techniques. etc are WAY confusing.
So, glad you’re getting a lot out of my channel! I try to share tips and guides to make these things less confusing and its great to hear that they help :). I know I was really confused for a while when I first started with Dorico. Now, I’m very confident with it all, but it was a fairly long road and I can remember a lot of confusion early on.
Glad you liked the video! Learning how the import / export works is always a good investment of time, but I do like the workflow in this video when I want to work in both software simultaneously :-)
MIDI trigger regions was a great addition to Dorico 5! I love using it with any orchestral instrumentation (or traditional instruments) that have a natural home in notation. However, Cubase still seems like the natural home for textural 'instruments' like synths and things like Straylight or FM Lab.
Ignore what I wrote below. I dont know why it was so difficult but after many hours of trying different combinations I got Dorico Pro to work with Studio One. Still have not figured out Cubase either. Thank you so much! I have been looking for a way to do this since around Dorico 3 or 4!
Thanks so much for this!!! I only discovered this video now as I've been waiting for something like this for a long time. What bothered me is that most integration solutions talk about the transfer of a mockup in a DAW to a score or vice versa. While indeed it is a question of getting music that has need of notation in sync with played parts (in my case mostly audio parts) I really like to record a guitar part, write a piece of string quartet somewhere else, than add some percussion in the recording.... when the string arrangement is finished, I get the string players in the studio and I do not need to start then transferring the mockup to a notation program... i can just print it out and play... I'm sure Steinberg will come with a similar solution (hopefully with some more advanced features like sharing a tempo track or something...). Can't wait to try it out in my next project.
@@musicchefpro Hi, sorry for my questions. I got the sync working, but I'm having trouble setting up the audio bus in loopback & cubase. I saw you made some kind of an aggregate monitor... how did you do that? I'm working with a Steinberg UR816 soundcard and would like to keep using that as the audio driver (and keep as many of the physical inputs available). Not sure if that's possible though..
No trouble - I setup the aggregate in macOS's Audio MIDI Setup app. So, my example only applies to a Mac. You can aggregate the UR816 with internal busses if needed. Feel free to ask more questions - I don't always get alerts, but I try to keep on top of new questions. Good luck!
It’s great to find a channel providing helpful tips on Dorico. I thought I was following this one until you started talking about sending audio from Dorico to Cubase. If I understood Dorico’s baffling system of playback templates, I’d just use Dorico. I was hoping that this video might show me a way to use my DAW (actually Logic) to play back a Dorico project, sending MIDI from Dorico but not audio. Is that not possible?
Thanks for posting - I’m glad the channel is helpful! Unfortunately, Dorico doesn’t really send out its MIDI in any format that other DAWs can use… at least not in real time. You can export MIDI, of course, but what I’m demonstrating in this video is trying to approximate a real time workflow. Using this TXL plug-in is as close as I’ve been able to find real time playback and Dorico. So, I don’t think it’s possible yet to do what you’re trying to do… unfortunately.
Thanks so much for sharing this tip! Do you need to buy txl product to use the timecode function? I only get 'TE DAW Reader' in the pull-down list of vst in Dorico...
Thanks for creating this! I hope that one day the two could more natively talk to each other. How great it could be to right click a selection of multiple regions in Cubase and have something like "open in Dorico" to do some more advanced score editing. Then you press play and they are synced together in real-time. Or even, it would be great to be able to start a project in Dorico for early writing stage, and have a menu option "Send to Cubase" to finesse all the automation, virtual instruments, and add recorded overdubs like guitars, hardware synths, vocals, etc. I'm thinking I might use your method for my own songwriting projects. I prefer to write in notation/Dorico because like you said I can see the verticality of music such as how rhythms and harmony are working together. However one of the biggest downsides of working with notation or Dorico is the inability to combine with recorded audio and more creative effects. If possible I would love to take a demo I've written in Dorico, and then start adding vocals and guitar parts in Cubase, but in real time without entirely leaving Dorico because I may want to continue editing the harmony and song structure. It might prove to be too convoluted for songwriting but I'd like to experiment to see what works. I just happen to write better music when I can see the vertical relationships of harmony and rhythm across all sections!
I totally agree! I’m definitely holding out hope that Steinberg will unite the two, one day :-) I’ll offer an interesting option for notating against audio… export an audio-only video file from Cubase and bring that into Dorico, as if I’m scoring to film. Then, I can write notation without any latency problems.
@@musicchefpro I've actually considered that as a way of transcribing music - literally convert music to a "video" file as a way to bring it in for playback, but I haven't tried this yet. I'll have to give it a go!
Wow, interesting! I like how easy it is to adjust the tempo track in Cubase. Do you know if it’s possible to slave the time code out of Cubase in to Dorico by chance? Can we go that direction?
I haven’t found an effective way to go out of Cubase into Dorico. but, I also haven’t looked into it a lot… mainly because I prefer to do my writing and Dorico. Unless there are some recent updates that I’m not aware of, Dorico has limited MIDI inputs for timecode and syncing. But, I’m not 100% sure and I would certainly encourage checking it out because they have a very active development team that’s updating the software all the time :-)
In any case, you would need to make tempo adjustments both in dorico and cubase, right? Should be easy though with the import / export tempo track in Dorico & Cubase.
Your work on this is great, but I still personally think that this sync issue between the two softwares should be managed by Steinberg. Both Costs a lot (I paid so much with the upgrades during these years) and both are used by professionals that need to cut time on deliveries. Still don't understand why they're not working on this, it's probably the major feature people have been asking since 2017.
Every time there’s an update, I look very carefully to see if there’s anything about this kind of feature. I know there are a lot of composers out there who would love to see this kind of integration between Cubase and Dorico :)
Thank you for this well thought out video! But I am afraid I can't get started, as I cannot locate "Show Midi Devices." I am using Cubase 12, may I ask please what version you are using in the tutorial? I tried every pull down. I googled it, and searched for it in the Cubase manual, and it brings up nothing. I can find, "midi device manager" but it doesn't look like what you are using. Can't wait to progress in this - can't believe this is not a commonly discussed thing! You are ahead of the game, thank you so much.
Question: the whole point of Dorico is that it is able to behave as a basic sequencer software too, when it comes to disconnecting how our music is notated and how it actually plays back (one can alter the piano roll data without affecting the notated score). So why bother connecting Cubase for the purpose you are describing here? Connecting Cubase with Sibelius via rewrire, I can understand. But Dorico is made so as to avoid the hassle of what you are describing. Unless I am overlooking a factor that makes all the difference, in which case I apologise in advance. You are creating wonderful content otherwise, thank you 🙏🏻
Thanks for your question - Dorico does keep my bases covered most of the time. But some instruments don’t really make sense to notate such as synthesizers or phrase-based instruments. In that case, it can be nice to use Dorico in combination with a DAW. But, there are so many great workflows at this point, too. I love living in the era of such advanced music technology :-)
@@musicchefpro - You raise a good point but you are missing something. Playback in a project can and usually is a part of the composition process. You want to hear what you are composing. Suppose your composition includes certain sound effects like Bird songs - think of Respighi 's Pines of Rome. That bird song could be an audio item on a Cubase track. You don't need to "score" the bird song in your project, but you do want to hear it with the overall score. There are a vast amount of Kontakt Instruments that you may want to incorporate into your Dorico project, but that you don't want to notate. BUT ...... the final film score may ultimately consist of a recording of real musicians playing from your written Dorico scare AND audio files created in Cubase. As Music Chef aptly terms it, a Hybrid Score. I have created a way to easily and quickly add any Kontakt Library to a Dorico Project if Hybrid scoring is your thing. Check out my RUclips: ruclips.net/video/ihuI8ys4NEQ/видео.htmlsi=-0dB4PTVcMBkoH-n
Is it possible to stem out the instruments used in Dorico to separate tracks in Cubase ? In your example, this means Horns, Timpany and Viola going to Cubase on separate tracks instead of one stereo track.
Thanks very helpful video. After a few hours I was able to synchronize everything. However, I have a problem. There is a latency between Dorico and Cubase. I was able to cancel it by acting on the TXL offset. But in order for cubase to record the audio from Dorico from the beginning, I have to start the music writing from measure 2 in Dorico, otherwise the first measure is cut off. Is it possible to overcome this problem?
I’m glad the video was helpful. I experience latency, too. But, its more like a fraction of a second - not a full measure. Do you experience significant audio latency under normal circumstances?
@@musicchefpro True, not a full measure, but I made sure it was. This way I can get the downbeat in the right place when recording in Cubase. Let's say it works well this way. I still don't know Dorico enough. For the sake of graphic correctness, I would like to change the measure number so as to start the numbering from measure 2 (and perhaps hide measure 1).
Great video! I agree 100% that the Cubase Score editor is horrible, but don't try saying that on the forum it aggravates a lot of "Software Woke" people with their bias! Is there a way to edit instruments between Dorico and Cubase in sync. Let's say i have 1st Violins in Dorico and the same in Cubase and i change a note in Dorico, is there a way to sync them together so the change also happens in Cubase?
Thanks for watching! I don’t think there’s a way to edit instruments between Dorico and Cubase, unfortunately…. This set up really only enable you to play back the two in sync. But only notes in Dorico will be played by Dorico and only notes in Cubase will be played by Cubase.
You might be intereswted in the "Create Trigger Region" capability in Dorico. It will playback the guitar patterns you select without having to enter them in notation wise.
Thanks for the tip! The trigger region was actually one of the main reasons that I upgraded to Dorico 5 and I liked it. However, it frustrates me that it only displays the key switch note name - when I’m reading that in my score it just isn’t intuitive to remember what that key switch means! So, I haven’t been using that feature as much as I hoped :(
Did you have issues with tempo changes and time signature changes in the scores when using this technique? I used Pro tools and Sibelius with rewire and it was nothing but trouble if you had anything more than on time signature and one tempo. I've since switched to Cubase and would love scoring software that can sync without issue.
Thanks for your question - sorry for my late reply. This setup is much more stable than Pro Tools and Sibelius in my experience. The key to solving this here is to (1) create a tempo map in Cubase, (2) export it and import it into Dorico and (3) then use the syncing method. Having a shared tempo map in both Dorico and Cubase is actually pretty straightforward and will solve any timing troubles with meter or tempo. BUT, if you modify your meter or tempo then do it in Cubase and export/import into Dorico as a tempo map. Here's my video on how to do this: ruclips.net/user/liveXtnrpDkPIEA
Interesting that you had that experience. I used to sync Pro Tools and Sibelius, using Rewire, and found the process very good. Changes of time signature were no problem, and I could mark up Pro Tools with changes of tempo, including ralls and accels, down to sub-divisions of a beat, so that it synced perfectly with Sibelius. I now do the same thing with Logic and Sibelius. Rewire is deprecated, but still works as I expect, at least for now, so long as I run everything under Rosetta. I can start and stop from either application, which I don't think will work here. I'm interested in the Dorico->DAW link because Dorico is looking like a useable replacement for Sibelius. But sync between DAW and scorewriter is an important part of my workflow, hence why I'm interested in this video.
Hello! I am very interested in the sync of Dorico 5.1.10 and Cubase 13... Thank you @Music Clef for your interesting video! Seems very interesting, but unfortunately I couldn't find out how to do the set up for Win11...Does anybody have a step-by-step instruction how to set up this sychronization (in Windows 11) with the "steinberg-intern" SMPTEGenerator plugin? Is there a video/ instruction available...? Thank you so much for your answers/ help!!
Thanks for your comment! I’m not familiar with the SMPTE generator plug-in in this context. I’m not sure it would achieve a similar result. if you’re on Windows, I would suggest loopMIDI as a reliable, virtual MIDI port. I hope that helps :)
In the past, we couldn't have Cubase follow tempo changes coming out of Dorico ... only the initial tempo made it to Cubase. Does your method support accelerando / ritardando?
That’s a great question! I’m not sure, but I think this will work :-) when you set accelerando in Dorico then you must also choose a “final tempo %” in the properties panel. Since this creates an actual tempo change, it should be transmitted through the MIDI timecode…
Hello community! I have a problem during the recording process in Dorico 5.1.40 Play-button: Dorico’s bar 1 is Bar 1 in VST-instrument! Perfectly sychronized! But: Record-button: When I would like to record in Dorico’s Bar 1, the VST-instrument (EZkeys2) starts always in bar 9… It seems, that this is a Dorico problem.. Would it be solveable with TXL Timecode Expert 2 like in the video above..? I am using Win 11...Thanks for any suggestions...
Hey, thanks for posting! Do you have other flows in your project? I’m wondering if you have an 8 bar flow obscured somehow. Dorico may send transport info to EZkeys to start on bar 9. If you have multiple flows in the project, got to the Setup mode and drag the flow with EZkeys to be first and see if that solves the problem? Let me know if not and I’ll see if I can suggest something else…
@@musicchefpro Hello! Thank you for your answer! No, there is no other flow... I've started a new project to test, but it's still start on bar 9... In the meantime I got an answer from Dorico-Support: "It’s a problem in Dorico, with a boring technical reason. There’s nothing you can do about this at the moment, I’m afraid - it requires some changes in the way the tempo and time signature synchronization features work. Would be nice if you could find a "workaround" with TXL if necessary...
I think you will get a latency issue using Loopback. I use RME interface and it is smarter to route audio via this hardware, actually if you just play both apps play audio via the interface, no need for loopback.
I’ll check that out - I’m always down for less latency :). I definitely get latency with Loopback, but its ease of use has always been worth it. If RME solved both problems, I’d go with that for sure! Thanks for the recommendation.
There is any benefit of dorico pro vs elements for your workflow? I mean, i read the chart comparative but there isn’t any video comparing both, maybe you could do that if you want or have them
The main advantages for me in having Dorico pro is the chord symbol generating feature (a big deal for me), and a broader set of default instruments that come with the package.
I have tried this for hours and cannot get ir to work.Here is what I did. I bought the TXL20 software. It is instituted as a VSTR3 in Dorico and enabled. I created the MTC port in my audio midi set up on my MAC. Turned on the TXL20 app pop up, so it is set to MTC-Midi MTC which are lit up green. I then went to cCubase following your video and engaged external synch. I made MTC the midi input. That appearsds to be what you did but it does not work. When i hit Play on Dorico Cubase should follow but it does not start in plato play. What am i doing wrong? Not even addresing getting the audio from Dorico to play in Cubase. First things first! Help?
Thanks for posting! I’d suggest that you open the TXL window and check that you see the time advancing in TXL after you start playback in Dorico. Does the TXL clock start running?
I would appreciate some help. I loaded Loopback Audio + TXLT20 Timecode. Created an Aggregate within Audio Devices (Mac) which contains sub-devices of loopback audio and an external monitor. When I start Dorico both cursors synchronise with sound from Dorico but no sound from the DAW. When I toggle the monitor button on the instrument within the DAW I get audio. Thus, every time I start Dorico I have to toggle the instrument within the DAW to get Audio, otherwise no sound from the DAW. Perplexed. Thanks.
Thanks for posting! When you need to hit the monitor button, that would usually be the case if you’re playing a live instrument. But, do you still need to hit the monitor button if you’re playing back recorded audio/MIDIfrom Cubase?
Thanks for the quick response. What I mean is when I activate Dorico both cursors sync, and even if the monitor button is on or off, I have to toggle the button off to on a couple of times and only then I get audio from the DAW. However, there is no movement of Dorico's vertical audio signal bar which seems to indicate Dorico's audio is not being loop back through Cubase. If I leave the monitors on, without toggling the button, on both the audio and instrument tracks no sound emanates from the DAW.
This would be possible, but quite a different setup than what I'm doing in this video. I think setting it up that way could be really cumbersome... but possible.
Privet friends! Why do one need to slave Cubase with Dorico. I have Dorico 5.1. It this version's "Play" features not adequate enough to function as Dorico's built-in DAW? I mean Dorico can use all those effects, midi lanes, even virtual sound stages to play in a 3D stage environment. So, why put more/extra stress on my system?
Thanks for posting! Dorico 5.1 has got fantastic features that very well may be adequate, depending on what a composer needs to do. Cubase easily does some things Dorico can’t do, though (working with audio, bussing, robust plugins/FX for example). Working with phrase-based virtual instruments can be comparatively inconvenient in Dorico, too. Whether or not these features are needed or not really depends on what you’re doing.
Hi Chef, your tutorial is very helpful! I followed all your steps, and got stuck on looback part. I can't setup the Cubase aggregate under monitor tab like you do in the video. I only see some of my speakers showing up there. How do we set up Cubase aggregate monitor in loopback? Thank you in advance!
Yes, I am using mac. I kind of figured it out, but not sure whether it’s the right way. I connect the Dorico audio to the virtual channels in loopback (under output channels tab), but I didn’t link them to any block in monitor tab. Next, I need to create an aggregate which includes loopback and my interface, then I can find those loopback virtual channels in Cubase under Studio audio connection settings. At the end, I can add Dorico track in Cubase. Please feel free to let me know if there might be anything incorrect. Again, thank you very much for the fantastic content!@@musicchefpro
Thanks so much for the great video! How do you deal with tempo changes within pieces? Are you able to send midi tempo data from Dorico into Cubase?
Glad the video is helpful. If I recall, I’d need the tempo changes to match in both projects in order for things to stay reliable…. Not the best situation, but workable :)
If you own Cubase Pro installed in Win10, it includes the SMPTEGenerator VST3 Effect plug-in in the Program Files\Steinberg\Cubase 13\VST3\Cubase Plug-in Set.vst3 folder. I copied that folder to Program Files\Steinberg\Dorico5\VSTAudioEngine\VST3 folder and after restarting Dorico, the SMPTEGenerator plugin shows up under "tools"
That’s great to know, Thanks!
What does this plug in do and what relevance is it to this process? Also where under Tools did you mean? Thanks.
@@nicolasjchaanine In the video he talks about purchasing, installing and configuring the third party TXL 20 Timecode plugin to generate SMPTE Timecode that is then routed via a virtual MIDI connection from Dorico to Cubase in order to sync up the playback of both programs. Rather than purchasing the TXL 20 plugin, since Cubase Pro comes with its own SMPTE Timecode plugin as part of that product, then if we can somehow get Dorico to "see" the Cubase SMPTE VS3 plugin then why pay money for a third party (TXL 20) plugin that provides the same functionality? The challenge is that the Cubase SMPTE Timecode plugin is NOT installed into the regular VST3 folder that third party VST3 plugins are supposed to get installed to and where Dorico will search. Instead, it is "buried" in the Cubase Program Files folder hierarchy, at least in the Windows version because it is part of the Cubase "Factory" set of VST3 plugins. I found that by copying the "Cubase Plugin Set.vst3" folder into the correct location for Dorico's its built-in VST3 "Factory" plugins, once you restart Dorico, the Cubase SMPTE Timecode plugin then becomes available to Dorico to insert in place of the TXL 20 plugin as described in the video, so that it can send SMPTE Timecode to the virtual MIDI connection and then on to Cubase. In Dorico, you won't see a "Tools" category under FX Plugins until you copy the Cubase folder mentioned and then restart Dorico. Once you copy this "Cubase Plugin Set.vst3" folder over to Dorico, you will also see a lot of other VST3 plugins show up in Dorico that would not be otherwise available. These are the rest of the Cubase "Factory" VST3 plugins that come as part of Cubase Pro.
@@rawl747 Hi, Thank you very much for that! What virtual MIDI connection do you use? CHEERS MAN!
@@konradhoroszko255 loopMIDI By Tobias Erichsen
I was searching for some info on how the Dorico and Cubase(Nuendo) interchange worked - I had seen a video where that workflow was described. Your video came up - and I appreciate how clear your presentation on this was. It looks like some other software is needed to make it all work - but you did a great job in demonstrating and explaining this. I use Windows so I will have to research more on how this would be done - but your video shows it is possible and can become another piece in the toolbox. Great job.
Thanks! I was also searching for info on getting these 2 to work well together. Ultimately, all I needed was the TXL plugin. If you’re on Windows, perhaps loopMIDI from Tobias Erichsen would be the ticket for setting up a virtual MIDI port on Windows. Thanks for your comment and best of luck :)
Thank you so much for all your content. YOU seriously have put out some incredibly useful videos. I am shocked that some of them don't have thousands of views because Dorico expression maps, playing techniques, playback techniques. etc are WAY confusing.
So, glad you’re getting a lot out of my channel! I try to share tips and guides to make these things less confusing and its great to hear that they help :). I know I was really confused for a while when I first started with Dorico. Now, I’m very confident with it all, but it was a fairly long road and I can remember a lot of confusion early on.
WOW! This is a great idea - Thanks. Yeah, I've been transferring XML files back and forth just to get familiar with the existing process.
Glad you liked the video! Learning how the import / export works is always a good investment of time, but I do like the workflow in this video when I want to work in both software simultaneously :-)
You could also use a midi trigger region in Dorico to trigger the picked nylon guitar plugin too, without having to run it in Cubase?
MIDI trigger regions was a great addition to Dorico 5! I love using it with any orchestral instrumentation (or traditional instruments) that have a natural home in notation. However, Cubase still seems like the natural home for textural 'instruments' like synths and things like Straylight or FM Lab.
Wow, thank you so much! I gave up working on a proper solution for this, but I will give it another try now. Great work, thanks 🙏
I can relate :). One of these days, I hope Steinberg builds this kind of integration into both products. Until then, this works really well!
Ignore what I wrote below. I dont know why it was so difficult but after many hours of trying different combinations I got Dorico Pro to work with Studio One. Still have not figured out Cubase either. Thank you so much! I have been looking for a way to do this since around Dorico 3 or 4!
Glad you got working with Studio One :)
Thanks so much for this!!! I only discovered this video now as I've been waiting for something like this for a long time. What bothered me is that most integration solutions talk about the transfer of a mockup in a DAW to a score or vice versa. While indeed it is a question of getting music that has need of notation in sync with played parts (in my case mostly audio parts) I really like to record a guitar part, write a piece of string quartet somewhere else, than add some percussion in the recording.... when the string arrangement is finished, I get the string players in the studio and I do not need to start then transferring the mockup to a notation program... i can just print it out and play... I'm sure Steinberg will come with a similar solution (hopefully with some more advanced features like sharing a tempo track or something...).
Can't wait to try it out in my next project.
So glad it helped! I look forward to a native solution from Steinberg, but this has really helped my workflow :)
@@musicchefpro Hi, sorry for my questions. I got the sync working, but I'm having trouble setting up the audio bus in loopback & cubase. I saw you made some kind of an aggregate monitor... how did you do that? I'm working with a Steinberg UR816 soundcard and would like to keep using that as the audio driver (and keep as many of the physical inputs available). Not sure if that's possible though..
No trouble - I setup the aggregate in macOS's Audio MIDI Setup app. So, my example only applies to a Mac. You can aggregate the UR816 with internal busses if needed. Feel free to ask more questions - I don't always get alerts, but I try to keep on top of new questions. Good luck!
@@musicchefpro ok great thanks!! I'm on mac also and got it working!
It’s great to find a channel providing helpful tips on Dorico. I thought I was following this one until you started talking about sending audio from Dorico to Cubase. If I understood Dorico’s baffling system of playback templates, I’d just use Dorico. I was hoping that this video might show me a way to use my DAW (actually Logic) to play back a Dorico project, sending MIDI from Dorico but not audio. Is that not possible?
Thanks for posting - I’m glad the channel is helpful! Unfortunately, Dorico doesn’t really send out its MIDI in any format that other DAWs can use… at least not in real time. You can export MIDI, of course, but what I’m demonstrating in this video is trying to approximate a real time workflow. Using this TXL plug-in is as close as I’ve been able to find real time playback and Dorico. So, I don’t think it’s possible yet to do what you’re trying to do… unfortunately.
holy moly this works.
:)
Thanks so much for sharing this tip! Do you need to buy txl product to use the timecode function? I only get 'TE DAW Reader' in the pull-down list of vst in Dorico...
Yes, I had to buy a plug-in for about $30.
Thanks for creating this! I hope that one day the two could more natively talk to each other. How great it could be to right click a selection of multiple regions in Cubase and have something like "open in Dorico" to do some more advanced score editing. Then you press play and they are synced together in real-time. Or even, it would be great to be able to start a project in Dorico for early writing stage, and have a menu option "Send to Cubase" to finesse all the automation, virtual instruments, and add recorded overdubs like guitars, hardware synths, vocals, etc.
I'm thinking I might use your method for my own songwriting projects. I prefer to write in notation/Dorico because like you said I can see the verticality of music such as how rhythms and harmony are working together. However one of the biggest downsides of working with notation or Dorico is the inability to combine with recorded audio and more creative effects. If possible I would love to take a demo I've written in Dorico, and then start adding vocals and guitar parts in Cubase, but in real time without entirely leaving Dorico because I may want to continue editing the harmony and song structure. It might prove to be too convoluted for songwriting but I'd like to experiment to see what works. I just happen to write better music when I can see the vertical relationships of harmony and rhythm across all sections!
I totally agree! I’m definitely holding out hope that Steinberg will unite the two, one day :-) I’ll offer an interesting option for notating against audio… export an audio-only video file from Cubase and bring that into Dorico, as if I’m scoring to film. Then, I can write notation without any latency problems.
@@musicchefpro I've actually considered that as a way of transcribing music - literally convert music to a "video" file as a way to bring it in for playback, but I haven't tried this yet. I'll have to give it a go!
Yeah! That would be a great way to transcribe, too.
Wow, interesting! I like how easy it is to adjust the tempo track in Cubase. Do you know if it’s possible to slave the time code out of Cubase in to Dorico by chance? Can we go that direction?
I haven’t found an effective way to go out of Cubase into Dorico. but, I also haven’t looked into it a lot… mainly because I prefer to do my writing and Dorico. Unless there are some recent updates that I’m not aware of, Dorico has limited MIDI inputs for timecode and syncing. But, I’m not 100% sure and I would certainly encourage checking it out because they have a very active development team that’s updating the software all the time :-)
In any case, you would need to make tempo adjustments both in dorico and cubase, right? Should be easy though with the import / export tempo track in Dorico & Cubase.
Your work on this is great, but I still personally think that this sync issue between the two softwares should be managed by Steinberg. Both Costs a lot (I paid so much with the upgrades during these years) and both are used by professionals that need to cut time on deliveries. Still don't understand why they're not working on this, it's probably the major feature people have been asking since 2017.
Every time there’s an update, I look very carefully to see if there’s anything about this kind of feature. I know there are a lot of composers out there who would love to see this kind of integration between Cubase and Dorico :)
Thank you for this well thought out video! But I am afraid I can't get started, as I cannot locate "Show Midi Devices." I am using Cubase 12, may I ask please what version you are using in the tutorial? I tried every pull down. I googled it, and searched for it in the Cubase manual, and it brings up nothing. I can find, "midi device manager" but it doesn't look like what you are using. Can't wait to progress in this - can't believe this is not a commonly discussed thing! You are ahead of the game, thank you so much.
Thanks for watching! I am using Cubase 12 Pro. Do you have the TXL MIDI device setup in Dorico already?
Question: the whole point of Dorico is that it is able to behave as a basic sequencer software too, when it comes to disconnecting how our music is notated and how it actually plays back (one can alter the piano roll data without affecting the notated score). So why bother connecting Cubase for the purpose you are describing here? Connecting Cubase with Sibelius via rewrire, I can understand. But Dorico is made so as to avoid the hassle of what you are describing. Unless I am overlooking a factor that makes all the difference, in which case I apologise in advance. You are creating wonderful content otherwise, thank you 🙏🏻
Thanks for your question - Dorico does keep my bases covered most of the time. But some instruments don’t really make sense to notate such as synthesizers or phrase-based instruments. In that case, it can be nice to use Dorico in combination with a DAW. But, there are so many great workflows at this point, too. I love living in the era of such advanced music technology :-)
@@musicchefpro - You raise a good point but you are missing something. Playback in a project can and usually is a part of the composition process. You want to hear what you are composing. Suppose your composition includes certain sound effects like Bird songs - think of Respighi 's Pines of Rome. That bird song could be an audio item on a Cubase track. You don't need to "score" the bird song in your project, but you do want to hear it with the overall score. There are a vast amount of Kontakt Instruments that you may want to incorporate into your Dorico project, but that you don't want to notate. BUT ...... the final film score may ultimately consist of a recording of real musicians playing from your written Dorico scare AND audio files created in Cubase. As Music Chef aptly terms it, a Hybrid Score.
I have created a way to easily and quickly add any Kontakt Library to a Dorico Project if Hybrid scoring is your thing.
Check out my RUclips: ruclips.net/video/ihuI8ys4NEQ/видео.htmlsi=-0dB4PTVcMBkoH-n
Is it possible to stem out the instruments used in Dorico to separate tracks in Cubase ? In your example, this means Horns, Timpany and Viola going to Cubase on separate tracks instead of one stereo track.
Yes, it is. I'm using loopback (by rogue ameoba) to route audio on my mac. You can create multiple 'busses' in loopback and achieve this stemming...
Thats wonderful presentation. thank u so much
You are most welcome, thanks for watching!
Thanks very helpful video. After a few hours I was able to synchronize everything. However, I have a problem. There is a latency between Dorico and Cubase. I was able to cancel it by acting on the TXL offset. But in order for cubase to record the audio from Dorico from the beginning, I have to start the music writing from measure 2 in Dorico, otherwise the first measure is cut off. Is it possible to overcome this problem?
I’m glad the video was helpful. I experience latency, too. But, its more like a fraction of a second - not a full measure. Do you experience significant audio latency under normal circumstances?
@@musicchefpro True, not a full measure, but I made sure it was. This way I can get the downbeat in the right place when recording in Cubase. Let's say it works well this way. I still don't know Dorico enough. For the sake of graphic correctness, I would like to change the measure number so as to start the numbering from measure 2 (and perhaps hide measure 1).
Great video! I agree 100% that the Cubase Score editor is horrible, but don't try saying that on the forum it aggravates a lot of "Software Woke" people with their bias! Is there a way to edit instruments between Dorico and Cubase in sync. Let's say i have 1st Violins in Dorico and the same in Cubase and i change a note in Dorico, is there a way to sync them together so the change also happens in Cubase?
Thanks for watching! I don’t think there’s a way to edit instruments between Dorico and Cubase, unfortunately…. This set up really only enable you to play back the two in sync. But only notes in Dorico will be played by Dorico and only notes in Cubase will be played by Cubase.
You might be intereswted in the "Create Trigger Region" capability in Dorico. It will playback the guitar patterns you select without having to enter them in notation wise.
Thanks for the tip! The trigger region was actually one of the main reasons that I upgraded to Dorico 5 and I liked it. However, it frustrates me that it only displays the key switch note name - when I’m reading that in my score it just isn’t intuitive to remember what that key switch means! So, I haven’t been using that feature as much as I hoped :(
Did you have issues with tempo changes and time signature changes in the scores when using this technique? I used Pro tools and Sibelius with rewire and it was nothing but trouble if you had anything more than on time signature and one tempo. I've since switched to Cubase and would love scoring software that can sync without issue.
Thanks for your question - sorry for my late reply. This setup is much more stable than Pro Tools and Sibelius in my experience. The key to solving this here is to (1) create a tempo map in Cubase, (2) export it and import it into Dorico and (3) then use the syncing method. Having a shared tempo map in both Dorico and Cubase is actually pretty straightforward and will solve any timing troubles with meter or tempo. BUT, if you modify your meter or tempo then do it in Cubase and export/import into Dorico as a tempo map.
Here's my video on how to do this: ruclips.net/user/liveXtnrpDkPIEA
@@musicchefpro Thanks for the info
Interesting that you had that experience. I used to sync Pro Tools and Sibelius, using Rewire, and found the process very good. Changes of time signature were no problem, and I could mark up Pro Tools with changes of tempo, including ralls and accels, down to sub-divisions of a beat, so that it synced perfectly with Sibelius. I now do the same thing with Logic and Sibelius. Rewire is deprecated, but still works as I expect, at least for now, so long as I run everything under Rosetta. I can start and stop from either application, which I don't think will work here.
I'm interested in the Dorico->DAW link because Dorico is looking like a useable replacement for Sibelius. But sync between DAW and scorewriter is an important part of my workflow, hence why I'm interested in this video.
Hello! I am very interested in the sync of Dorico 5.1.10 and Cubase 13... Thank you @Music Clef for your interesting video! Seems very interesting, but unfortunately I couldn't find out how to do the set up for Win11...Does anybody have a step-by-step instruction how to set up this sychronization (in Windows 11) with the "steinberg-intern" SMPTEGenerator plugin? Is there a video/ instruction available...? Thank you so much for your answers/ help!!
Thanks for your comment! I’m not familiar with the SMPTE generator plug-in in this context. I’m not sure it would achieve a similar result. if you’re on Windows, I would suggest loopMIDI as a reliable, virtual MIDI port. I hope that helps :)
In the past, we couldn't have Cubase follow tempo changes coming out of Dorico ... only the initial tempo made it to Cubase. Does your method support accelerando / ritardando?
That’s a great question! I’m not sure, but I think this will work :-) when you set accelerando in Dorico then you must also choose a “final tempo %” in the properties panel. Since this creates an actual tempo change, it should be transmitted through the MIDI timecode…
Hello community!
I have a problem during the recording process in Dorico 5.1.40
Play-button: Dorico’s bar 1 is Bar 1 in VST-instrument! Perfectly sychronized!
But:
Record-button: When I would like to record in Dorico’s Bar 1, the VST-instrument (EZkeys2) starts always in bar 9…
It seems, that this is a Dorico problem.. Would it be solveable with TXL Timecode Expert 2 like in the video above..? I am using Win 11...Thanks for any suggestions...
Hey, thanks for posting! Do you have other flows in your project? I’m wondering if you have an 8 bar flow obscured somehow. Dorico may send transport info to EZkeys to start on bar 9. If you have multiple flows in the project, got to the Setup mode and drag the flow with EZkeys to be first and see if that solves the problem? Let me know if not and I’ll see if I can suggest something else…
@@musicchefpro Hello! Thank you for your answer! No, there is no other flow... I've started a new project to test, but it's still start on bar 9... In the meantime I got an answer from Dorico-Support:
"It’s a problem in Dorico, with a boring technical reason. There’s nothing you can do about this at the moment, I’m afraid - it requires some changes in the way the tempo and time signature synchronization features work.
Would be nice if you could find a "workaround" with TXL if necessary...
That’s too bad, hopefully they’ll get a fix soon if they know about it. Thanks for posting your update!
Hi there, very interesting that this is possible! Would you be so kind to send a Link or tell me the exact name for the Loopback you're using?
Loopback is a mac-only software made by a company called Rogue Ameoba. If you google it, you’ll see the link. I’ve been really happy with it :)
I think you will get a latency issue using Loopback. I use RME interface and it is smarter to route audio via this hardware, actually if you just play both apps play audio via the interface, no need for loopback.
I’ll check that out - I’m always down for less latency :). I definitely get latency with Loopback, but its ease of use has always been worth it. If RME solved both problems, I’d go with that for sure! Thanks for the recommendation.
@@musicchefpro The latency will be way less not zero. a few mili seconds.
The latency will be closer to zero as will your bank account.
There is any benefit of dorico pro vs elements for your workflow? I mean, i read the chart comparative but there isn’t any video comparing both, maybe you could do that if you want or have them
The main advantages for me in having Dorico pro is the chord symbol generating feature (a big deal for me), and a broader set of default instruments that come with the package.
Here’s a link to a comparison, chart for features: www.steinberg.net/dorico/compare-editions/
I have tried this for hours and cannot get ir to work.Here is what I did. I bought the TXL20 software. It is instituted as a VSTR3 in Dorico and enabled. I created the MTC port in my audio midi set up on my MAC. Turned on the TXL20 app pop up, so it is set to MTC-Midi MTC which are lit up green. I then went to cCubase following your video and engaged external synch. I made MTC the midi input. That appearsds to be what you did but it does not work. When i hit Play on Dorico Cubase should follow but it does not start in plato play. What am i doing wrong? Not even addresing getting the audio from Dorico to play in Cubase. First things first! Help?
Thanks for posting! I’d suggest that you open the TXL window and check that you see the time advancing in TXL after you start playback in Dorico. Does the TXL clock start running?
I would appreciate some help. I loaded Loopback Audio + TXLT20 Timecode. Created an Aggregate within Audio Devices (Mac) which contains sub-devices of loopback audio and an external monitor. When I start Dorico both cursors synchronise with sound from Dorico but no sound from the DAW. When I toggle the monitor button on the instrument within the DAW I get audio. Thus, every time I start Dorico I have to toggle the instrument within the DAW to get Audio, otherwise no sound from the DAW. Perplexed. Thanks.
Thanks for posting! When you need to hit the monitor button, that would usually be the case if you’re playing a live instrument. But, do you still need to hit the monitor button if you’re playing back recorded audio/MIDIfrom Cubase?
Thanks for the quick response. What I mean is when I activate Dorico both cursors sync, and even if the monitor button is on or off, I have to toggle the button off to on a couple of times and only then I get audio from the DAW. However, there is no movement of Dorico's vertical audio signal bar which seems to indicate Dorico's audio is not being loop back through Cubase. If I leave the monitors on, without toggling the button, on both the audio and instrument tracks no sound emanates from the DAW.
Would it be possible to WRITE music coming from Cubase into Dorico just by hitting play after setting Dorico in record mode?
This would be possible, but quite a different setup than what I'm doing in this video. I think setting it up that way could be really cumbersome... but possible.
Privet friends! Why do one need to slave Cubase with Dorico. I have Dorico 5.1. It this version's "Play" features not adequate enough to function as Dorico's built-in DAW? I mean Dorico can use all those effects, midi lanes, even virtual sound stages to play in a 3D stage environment. So, why put more/extra stress on my system?
Thanks for posting! Dorico 5.1 has got fantastic features that very well may be adequate, depending on what a composer needs to do. Cubase easily does some things Dorico can’t do, though (working with audio, bussing, robust plugins/FX for example). Working with phrase-based virtual instruments can be comparatively inconvenient in Dorico, too. Whether or not these features are needed or not really depends on what you’re doing.
Hi Chef, your tutorial is very helpful! I followed all your steps, and got stuck on looback part. I can't setup the Cubase aggregate under monitor tab like you do in the video. I only see some of my speakers showing up there. How do we set up Cubase aggregate monitor in loopback? Thank you in advance!
Thanks for asking! My Cubase Aggregate is created in Audio MIDI Setup, which is only available on a Mac. Are you using a Mac?
Yes, I am using mac. I kind of figured it out, but not sure whether it’s the right way. I connect the Dorico audio to the virtual channels in loopback (under output channels tab), but I didn’t link them to any block in monitor tab. Next, I need to create an aggregate which includes loopback and my interface, then I can find those loopback virtual channels in Cubase under Studio audio connection settings. At the end, I can add Dorico track in Cubase. Please feel free to let me know if there might be anything incorrect. Again, thank you very much for the fantastic content!@@musicchefpro
Sounds like you got it! Glad to help and thanks for watching.
200 dollars in software.. Steinberg needs to figure this out.
I’m sure they will figure it out eventually - i’m very much looking forward to that!