Completely agree with your assessment; metal or anything modern sounding, I'd go for the condensers, vintage sound I would go for the ribbons. However, for rooms mics in general, loved the ribbons.
It's nice to see someone showing some love for the Schoeps microphones. When I was doing film location audio recording I had one of several Schoeps microphones on my boom pole almost all the time for recording dialog or location sound. They are so natural sounding it is unbelievable. Producers were consistently amazed by the quality of the audio. These days I'm using a pair of my Schoeps cmc641s as drum overheads --or-- a single AEA R88 stereo ribbon or a single Stager ribbon mic. Room mics vary between Soyuz Bomblet 23, Stager SR-2Ns or the AEA R88. You're absolutely correct Colt . . . get it right at the source!
Man, I have this internal battle all the time. I’ve been putting off buying anything other than cardioid as I’m rarely in nice rooms where I want the room on the recording and do most of my work in untreated spaces, just a few homemade broadband acoustic panels that’s it!
I LIKW THE RIBBNS ON THE ROOM AND THE CONDENSERS ON OVERHEAD. Sorry. "CAPS" lock was on. There's a reason too the Jon Bonham used the 4-mic method. It's the most natural to the ear. And it's what I do for live kits. Snare (57) overheads (2 C-47's) and room a U 87. I might add a kick with a D-12 if I need more attack. Also may use some samples for toms and snr.
Loved the condensers here, ribbons also worked in that room. Those "room" condensers are awesome, one of Joe Chiccarellis favourite, or at least clone of it, Sony C38
R88 is a killer. For everything. Used it even on single voice. But of course it's perfect for acoustic guitar, piano, drums. But the room needs to be isolated perfectly because it pics up every little detail.
Surprisingly, I preferred the ribbons to the condensers in both positions. I am a pop rock drummer. The style of music would not matter for my microphone choice but then I only record me and don't have clients to satisfy. I currently use condensers overhead and an R88 for my room/overall mic. Great comparison Colt.
Why would you choose a screw over a nail? The answer is more complicated than it seems, just like with microphones. But I see it as a pre-processing and production style choice. If you want organic, natural, spacious or just need to tame high frequencies, go ribbon. If you need to cut through a dense arrangement or want maximum presence, details and transients, go condenser.
SDC for overs because sound pretty natural not ''hyped'' the ribbons sounds much darker and boomy in that position but for rooms sounds more like been in the place, and more natural, so SDC for overs and Ribbons for rooms.
Okay, I paused the video where you wanted us to. These are my conclusions. The condensers for overheads sounded tighter or more controlled but I liked the sound of the ribbons better. As for room mikes, the ribbons seemed to capture more of the room. Not knowing which pattern selection Schoeps mikes they are limits my ability to explain the differences. The AEA's are obviously figure 8 and sound a bit more open and not as closed in sounding to me. The room mikes sound quite different as well. The LDC's sound closer and more directional while the ribbon seems to pick up more of the room. Again, that could be because of the cardioid pickup pattern on the Mojave's. If they were pointed away from the drums a bit the room sound would be quite different. All-in-all, I like them all but if it were me I would probably go with the ribbons unless there were multiple instruments being tracked in the same room at the same time. The condensers would likely get less bleed from other instruments. Okay. After watching the rest of the video I can see why particular genres would utilize the different mikes for the reasons I stated previously. Great video.
Wow is that a early 2000s custom shop gibson 63 reissue es335 back there? I have that exact same guitar. I don't ever see other ones, sometimes the more current, blonde ones. That is yellowish with the real deep flame and the old style tuners and block inlays. If my house was on fire, it's the thing I would run in and grab if I could only go in once.
I have the MA37, and it’s certainly got a bit of ribbon characteristics, it’s quite dark and needs a lot of gain to drive it. Would have liked to hear a c12 or 251 in comparison to the AEA for the room. My Ma37 lives on room and I use a single beyer m160 as a mono kit focus mic. I have a set of Royer R10s as underheads.
For the music that I play, I use LDC overheads (Roswell mini K47) and LDC for room because I don't own any ribbon mics. I feel like ribbon overheads on drums wouldn't cut through the wall of Marshall tone that I go for.... but as I said, I don't own any ribbons, so I could be totally wrong.
I was genuinely surprised at just how WIDE the stereo field was on the ribbon room mic compared to the condenser pair, but then I realized: it's capturing that figure 8 pattern, whereas the condensers are set up in an A-B configuration without much separation or a baffle between them. I'm curious how they would compare in an XY, Blumlein, or mid-side setup.
Overheads - Condensors seem to be a little more brighter , like its capturing the sharp attack a bit more -- The Ribbons seemed to be a bit duller or darker , less attack , more of a rounded sound which was actually nice to hear on the toms specifically , I feel the ribbons presented more of the body and less of the shimmer Rooms - similar to the overheads apart from the tone of the kick with the ribbons seemed more present , and the body of the toms came through real solid , I like the ribbon sound , however depending on what kind of music and is being played and how much the drums need to cut through the mix would determine what mics to use and where... Id say = Condensors on the overheads and Ribbons for the room ... in that room particularly would give us the best of both worlds .. a bit of high end shine attack and sizzle with the room ribbons thickening up the body ... great video btw my man
I think it could be useful to always record with both room mics. One can be more useful than the other depending on the drum mix (without the room mic).
I liked the ribbons for the overheads and the condensers on the room. The (oh) ribbons seemed to catch the fullness of the kit better, while in the room they had less definition. The Schoeps were too clean for me, not enough life in comparison (although they sound great not in comparison), while the Mojaves in the room were more clean.
Man, SDCs have such excellent detail for overheads or spot mics on a kit. Colt, do you like the Schoeps over the KM184s? For the OHs in this scenario, I would prefer the SDC for prog rock, country, or anything that needs more detail. I’d try the ribbons for slower tempos or gritty tracks. I’ve always liked ribbons for rooms. The R88 is my fav, but Cole’s 4038s are excellent, too. It’s so easy to set up that R88, which is what wins for me. To my ear, the darker nature of a ribbon helps soften the high end, and compliments a LDC or SDC on OH’s.
I truly think these are the most natural and detailed small diaphragms I’ve ever used. 184s are awesome, but these crush them for what I’m always after.
bro is there anyway to get in contact i’ve asked so many engineers this question and nun could give me an answer i need your opinion cuz i know you’ll find this problem out fast 😂
My lord those Schoeps blew me away. The entire kit was represented beautifully.
My R88 lives as drum room mic in my studio. The stereo image and sound quality is just beautiful and on top of that it's SO easy to setup.
It feels weird seeing Cooper not playing a Pearl set. Haha
Completely agree with your assessment; metal or anything modern sounding, I'd go for the condensers, vintage sound I would go for the ribbons. However, for rooms mics in general, loved the ribbons.
I would use a mix of both in ANY drum/cabinet recording.
The lantern light on the mic stand is such a nice vibe
Ribbons for everything
It's nice to see someone showing some love for the Schoeps microphones. When I was doing film location audio recording I had one of several Schoeps microphones on my boom pole almost all the time for recording dialog or location sound. They are so natural sounding it is unbelievable. Producers were consistently amazed by the quality of the audio. These days I'm using a pair of my Schoeps cmc641s as drum overheads --or-- a single AEA R88 stereo ribbon or a single Stager ribbon mic. Room mics vary between Soyuz Bomblet 23, Stager SR-2Ns or the AEA R88. You're absolutely correct Colt . . . get it right at the source!
Honestly, a combination. The LDC in the room has a great annunciation of the kit where I feel like the ribbons really favor the sound of the room.
I am not a drummer but I would say that they all sound great super great playing ❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Your right!
Man, I have this internal battle all the time. I’ve been putting off buying anything other than cardioid as I’m rarely in nice rooms where I want the room on the recording and do most of my work in untreated spaces, just a few homemade broadband acoustic panels that’s it!
OK, I enjoy the darker sound of ribbons on rooms. It seemed to give the kit a more uniform cohesive glued sound.
I LIKW THE RIBBNS ON THE ROOM AND THE CONDENSERS ON OVERHEAD. Sorry. "CAPS" lock was on.
There's a reason too the Jon Bonham used the 4-mic method. It's the most natural to the ear. And it's what I do for live kits. Snare (57) overheads (2 C-47's) and room a U 87. I might add a kick with a D-12 if I need more attack. Also may use some samples for toms and snr.
Loved the condensers here, ribbons also worked in that room. Those "room" condensers are awesome, one of Joe Chiccarellis favourite, or at least clone of it, Sony C38
R88 is a killer. For everything. Used it even on single voice. But of course it's perfect for acoustic guitar, piano, drums. But the room needs to be isolated perfectly because it pics up every little detail.
I have a matched pair of R121s so awesome
That’s sound very good great information for our church
Surprisingly, I preferred the ribbons to the condensers in both positions. I am a pop rock drummer. The style of music would not matter for my microphone choice but then I only record me and don't have clients to satisfy. I currently use condensers overhead and an R88 for my room/overall mic. Great comparison Colt.
Why would you choose a screw over a nail? The answer is more complicated than it seems, just like with microphones. But I see it as a pre-processing and production style choice. If you want organic, natural, spacious or just need to tame high frequencies, go ribbon. If you need to cut through a dense arrangement or want maximum presence, details and transients, go condenser.
I would be happy with just the ribbon mics as room + kick mic. It would sound very vintage and less phase issues when you only have 3 mics.
Thank you so very much! Awesome video!
SDC for overs because sound pretty natural not ''hyped'' the ribbons sounds much darker and boomy in that position but for rooms sounds more like been in the place, and more natural, so SDC for overs and Ribbons for rooms.
Schepps mics, both LDC and SDC are fantastic-on everything.
I'm happen to be a big ribbon fan. I have a few
What polar pattern capsule those schoeps have? if not figure 8 this test was only for polar pattern difference not microphone difference.
Okay, I paused the video where you wanted us to. These are my conclusions.
The condensers for overheads sounded tighter or more controlled but I liked the sound of the ribbons better. As for room mikes, the ribbons seemed to capture more of the room. Not knowing which pattern selection Schoeps mikes they are limits my ability to explain the differences. The AEA's are obviously figure 8 and sound a bit more open and not as closed in sounding to me.
The room mikes sound quite different as well. The LDC's sound closer and more directional while the ribbon seems to pick up more of the room. Again, that could be because of the cardioid pickup pattern on the Mojave's. If they were pointed away from the drums a bit the room sound would be quite different.
All-in-all, I like them all but if it were me I would probably go with the ribbons unless there were multiple instruments being tracked in the same room at the same time. The condensers would likely get less bleed from other instruments.
Okay. After watching the rest of the video I can see why particular genres would utilize the different mikes for the reasons I stated previously.
Great video.
Wow is that a early 2000s custom shop gibson 63 reissue es335 back there? I have that exact same guitar. I don't ever see other ones, sometimes the more current, blonde ones. That is yellowish with the real deep flame and the old style tuners and block inlays. If my house was on fire, it's the thing I would run in and grab if I could only go in once.
I have the MA37, and it’s certainly got a bit of ribbon characteristics, it’s quite dark and needs a lot of gain to drive it. Would have liked to hear a c12 or 251 in comparison to the AEA for the room. My Ma37 lives on room and I use a single beyer m160 as a mono kit focus mic. I have a set of Royer R10s as underheads.
Love ribbons for overheads! Use a pair of Beyerdynamic M160s and their hypercardioid polar pattern helps massively in an untreated garage.
Ribbons for days!!!
Sdc for overheads seems to bring more clarity and kit picture.
Ribbons for rooms- seems to being a liveliness and body not in the sdc
For the music that I play, I use LDC overheads (Roswell mini K47) and LDC for room because I don't own any ribbon mics.
I feel like ribbon overheads on drums wouldn't cut through the wall of Marshall tone that I go for.... but as I said, I don't own any ribbons, so I could be totally wrong.
I was genuinely surprised at just how WIDE the stereo field was on the ribbon room mic compared to the condenser pair, but then I realized: it's capturing that figure 8 pattern, whereas the condensers are set up in an A-B configuration without much separation or a baffle between them. I'm curious how they would compare in an XY, Blumlein, or mid-side setup.
Overheads - Condensors seem to be a little more brighter , like its capturing the sharp attack a bit more -- The Ribbons seemed to be a bit duller or darker , less attack , more of a rounded sound which was actually nice to hear on the toms specifically , I feel the ribbons presented more of the body and less of the shimmer
Rooms - similar to the overheads apart from the tone of the kick with the ribbons seemed more present , and the body of the toms came through real solid , I like the ribbon sound , however depending on what kind of music and is being played and how much the drums need to cut through the mix would determine what mics to use and where... Id say = Condensors on the overheads and Ribbons for the room ... in that room particularly would give us the best of both worlds .. a bit of high end shine attack and sizzle with the room ribbons thickening up the body ... great video btw my man
What are your thoughts on ported vs sealed monitors?
I think it could be useful to always record with both room mics. One can be more useful than the other depending on the drum mix (without the room mic).
I liked the ribbons for the overheads and the condensers on the room. The (oh) ribbons seemed to catch the fullness of the kit better, while in the room they had less definition. The Schoeps were too clean for me, not enough life in comparison (although they sound great not in comparison), while the Mojaves in the room were more clean.
Great video, Colt! Could you please explain what you mean when you say a microphone "takes EQ well"?
SDC for overheads cause they’re up there to catch the cymbals, ribbons for the room cause they pick up less cymbal and more room…
Did you have the LDC’s in figure 8?
Which capsule were you using on the Schoeps?
Yello!
Oh yeah!
Man, SDCs have such excellent detail for overheads or spot mics on a kit. Colt, do you like the Schoeps over the KM184s?
For the OHs in this scenario, I would prefer the SDC for prog rock, country, or anything that needs more detail. I’d try the ribbons for slower tempos or gritty tracks.
I’ve always liked ribbons for rooms. The R88 is my fav, but Cole’s 4038s are excellent, too. It’s so easy to set up that R88, which is what wins for me. To my ear, the darker nature of a ribbon helps soften the high end, and compliments a LDC or SDC on OH’s.
I truly think these are the most natural and detailed small diaphragms I’ve ever used. 184s are awesome, but these crush them for what I’m always after.
bro is there anyway to get in contact i’ve asked so many engineers this question and nun could give me an answer i need your opinion cuz i know you’ll find this problem out fast 😂
Ribbon Room Mics Yummy!!!!!!!!
💔 P R O M O S M
Overheads of choice = Schoeps mixed in with ribbons on room them blend them all together with condenser. That's just my 10c