I agree with you 100% even more so about the indie /niche like how small of the audience to be indie crazy but yeah you are right bro glad you brough tit out cause as a noob in the fragrance world this stuff was confusing for me and the only reason i have knowledge of now is because youtubers like yourself who discuss and provide massive amoints of information across various platforms .. Starting ro feel i am being led astray like the sheepwith all this designer indie niche BS haha ✌ bruh
I actually like “indie” because some fragrances aren’t legally allowed to be sold in stores and are only allowed to be sold on websites like etsy. I’ve always thought “niche” meant non-designer. No more, no less. The problem is that we stereotype niche and designer fragrances. Some niche fragrances smell mainstream and conventional and some designer fragrances smell unique.
I think actually that the term "niche" comes from the french definition of it: A segment of a market where there is little competition and which allows a company to develop a new business niche. (The niche is often neglected by large companies for profitability reasons because this micro-market has a low potential of customers.)... so in that case it's really the fragrance house that is "niche", because it specialise in one particular product (niche) instead of multiple ones like "designer" brands do (clothes, bags, pens, jewelry, glass etc)... the difference with Indy is that by definition, the brand is independant, wich means it's not owned by a bigger compagnie that profits from it (exemple loreal, coty etc)... so I guess an indy brand is automatically niche, but not every niche brands are indy (cause they can be owned by bigger compagnies)... hope my french toughts made sense 😅
I agree with you 100%! I’m so sick of the niche snobbery. Niche does not mean quality! Very timely. Ugh, if I hear “niche quality” again I’m going to lose it haha. I have some damn good frags that are not niche, and the quality is amazing!
I'm just recently entered the intriguing world of fragrance , and I must say that you are making a fantastic point. I started calling everything niche and designer, but you are absolutely right; saying mainstream and boutique does really make much more sence (and is accurate) 😅 thanks for enlightening me.
I agree. Many “designer” fragrances are expensive and high quality. Some “niche” fragrances are unwearable and low value compared to their price. Can we just talk about all fragrances on quality, wearability, when and where to wear, performance, value, etc. Who cares if a “niche” house, a clothing, watch, pen, or car manufacturer has their name on it?
Nicely said, Dave! The next step is getting reviewers and audiences to use these terms. I hope it catches on. I want to use "boutique" and "mainstream" in my videos from now on.
Bless! Finally someone with a unique and well explained. In these times the quality and the price cannot be anymore be put in one group or the other. Because some so called niche are becoming more money/market savvy, and some so called designer are approaching customers with a more niche spirit. It is hard to define what is in constant change, though I believe our senses can still be the only judge that decide where to put one or another without being affected or biased by brand name, price, market presence and claims (i.e. all natural perfume, innovative formula lab, rarest material).
Agreed, of course. People (especially in my country) have always made "niche fragrances" look like they are the only fragrances with great quality in the world. I'm not mad because they're only buying expensive fragrances, I'm pissed because they tend to treat the so-called "designer" fragrances like a joke or something.
It's snobbery belying insecurity. Every hobby has a contingent of members who can spend exorbitant amounts of money, and trash those who can't. I refer to them as "Luxury Jerks".
@@chi-towncalifornia5916 true... I mean, just do whatever you want and buy fragrances you like, but if the reason for you to buy those fragrances were just because you think they're niche and "I don't like designer fragrances because they're not well-blended and doesn't have any quality"...... I'm sorry but that's just stupid. I'm just glad that I'm not the only one to feel the same way..
I just found the perfect counter when someone tells you cheap fragrances are trash and "niche" fragrances are amazing. Say to them: secretion magnifiques
Well done. I am a relative newbie to the “boutique “ fragrance journey but NOT to fragrances. I’ve been enamored with fragrances since I was a freshman in high school back in the late 70s. When I began this fragrance journey about a year ago, I found the Niche, Indie & Designer labels helpful. Clearly, I was exploring niche fragrances. Soon after, however, I began to question the labels and decided that at best they were inaccurate and, perhaps worse, they were pretentious. I like your thought on “Mainstream “ and am warming to “Boutique “. So, is FragranceX “Boutique “? Thanks for challenging us to think critically. Great video
Completely agree that the current designations are a bit too vague. The problem is that boutique brands are slowly becoming more mainstream. And many independent or online brands don't need or can't afford a physical boutique. I would've suggested a price or creativity class system a while ago, even a quality/price ratio but once again, there are too many variables. Prices go up and down, especially on the secondary market and how would we gauge quality anyway? Even if we designated niche+ as "artistic", that might pressume that no artistry goes into mainstream scents. Neither do the words "specialized" or "exclusive" work, since all products have a target audience. It's a conundrum for sure. In the end, I have no doubt that some sort of numerical system will eventually be implemented as everything goes on the blockchain. Price brackets (1-5) might become the new thing paired with a mass appeal factor (also 1-5). (1.5) might mean a cheap fragrance that's unoriginal but easy to like. (4.3) would designate a very expensive fragrance that's reasonably creative, but a bit more challenging. (5.1) would be an incredibly expensive fragrance that's impossibly challenging. Words like designer or niche would disappear in favour of digital approximations. But your guess is as good as mine. Ps, I am not a robot. 😂
I agree, I don't think they're perfect terms, but I think they are a lot better than what we use currently. I think there will be exceptions--particularly with a boutique fragrance becoming mainstream, but I think these are inevitable. Like when some fragrances were "designer" but now they are drug store fragrances. With boutique brands in other markets becoming more of a thing, and physical boutiques becoming more of a thing, I think these terms make more intuitive sense when speaking to a person with zero knowledge of fragcomm nomenclature.
Hello from Brazil, I subscribed in your channel to learn more about fragrances. There are many expensive niche fragrances that are not good. I don't want even free. Best regards.
Hmm... good point. When you put it that way it makes sense. I wish there were more boutiques out there so we could all enjoy going to them and discovering new fragrances. Yes I know you can buy samples but it doesn't replace going to a store and getting out from behind your house doors. I could see a boutique in every major city. That would be awesome.
I COMPLETELY AGREE WITH THIS. Ive been thinking about this ever since i started getting into fragrance. But can't think of a fitting name. Until now you upload this. Thanks
I agree in theory,, but it's hard enough explaining my hobby to regular folks ..it's gonna make it even harder to look and sound cool when I elaborate and inform them that I collect boutique fragrances lol.....you're still my favorite reviewer though. Keep the videos coming!!
Well look at it this way: these terms are a lot easier to explain to people. People can already deduce what the meaning is because it corresponds with already widely accepted terms in other markets. Then try to explain what “niche” and “designer” are, and you’re in the weeds.
Great video Dave! You make a lot of excellent points, I'm going to start using these new terms now. I hope to go to the Guerlain boutique in Vegas next year if my wife and I feel safe to go (covid) for our anniversary.
There was a time when niche meant quality and the audience and number of every batch of them were limited then people leaned more and more toward them because of the quality they sought. designers didn't want to drop back and started their exclusive lines with higher prices and the quality they had before in their usual lines of fragrance and with maybe a little bit more quality . many of niche brands couldn't keep up financially and were bought by parent companies. Number of their batches increased and quality was reduced in some cases to increase profits. And this is where we are stuck in now🤔😑 Agree with the naming you mentioned 👍🏻👍🏻
i really like your dissection of the terms thrown around in the community. I like boutique and mainstream, and also exclusive as someone mentioned below.
I agree 100% when it comes to the usage of „niche“ and „designer“. I think that this kind of separation is made to describe or separate fragrances in certain quality and price levels. Now the first mistake is to equalize quality and price, but sadly it’s often been done. However in my opinion most people prefer the mainstream because of the pricetag. I find the usage of mainstream not the best either, because mainstream focuses on trends and if Dior Sauvage will not be trendy in 10 years from now, is it still mainstream? I would rather separate both types of fragrances in something like „affordable“ and „luxury“ or I wouldn’t even make any separation at all...
Here in Italy we do not say Designer, but "commerciale" (that means commercial, meaning that is something easy to find in the mall or in the perfumery and beauty shop all around the city). So for instance, even in a small city there are at least 1 mall, 1 perfumery and 1 beauty shop which have the so called designer fragrances. Instead, niche fragrances are found in niche store (or as you said boutique) that are very rare. No small city has a boutique, and even not every big city has one.
I so completely agree with this that I feel like I’ve just eaten a perfectly satisfying meal or had a perfect nights sleep just by watching. Great Daver
Great video. Original, and well thought out. The lines between designer, niche, and indie can be very muddled and confusing. Not to mention arrogant and pretentious when some people in the community use those terms ( They probably just got triggered after reading that ). Mainstream and boutique sums it up nicely.
Really gives me a different outlook on the terms.🤔 I personally feel like niche is a higher quality, usually more expensive fragrances. Examples, like you mentioned, are Chanel, Tom Ford, and Dior private blends. I like your take on it.👍
I agree to a point, designer does mean nothing as does niche. You're right it's who buys them isn't it, ones mainstream and ones for the more specific clientèle altho even they overlap, Aventus? But yea they are kind of meaningless now. Indie... Is a tricky one, I suppose what we mean is small and yea independent normally self ran, so it is a little company on its own. Although the idea of things "smelling" indie niche or designer is weird, cos it means literally countless different things to whoever interprets it individually
I think there's 3 things we're mixing up in this discussion, not just the two of describing the fragrance or describing the audience. First, there are adjectives that describe the audience, for example, "mainstream" or "niche." These describe either the average person or the fragrance aficionado, or who the fragrance manufacturer is targeting. Then, there are adjectives describing the fragrance house. For example, "brand name" or "indie." And lastly, there are adjectives describing where the fragrance can be found, for example, "department store" or "boutique" fragrances. And we can use all these adjectives simultaneously to describe a fragrance: "Creed Aventus is a niche brand name boutique fragrance," "Dior Sauvage is a mainstream brand name department store fragrance," "Tauer L'Air Du Désert Marocain is a niche indie boutique fragrance,"
All great points but there was one part of your explanation that broke down for me and that is when you were defining mainstream. One of the points was that mainstream has copycats. "how many Sauvage copies are there..." How many Aventus copies are there? Is Aventus therefore mainstream? I get what you are saying... but this part just made my brain go "hey that doesn't make sense". Keep up the great work man. Love the reviews.
I agree with what you are saying, my understanding was niche is used for the companys that strictly produce fragrances nothing else, designer could be any other item other than fragrance and indie is just a small company starting out/growing who produce slightly different direction wise scents to what we are accustomed too.
Not a bad point. I always tossed out the term indie because kind of like as you point out, the only difference between indie and niche seems to be the size of the company. I don't necessarily like the term boutique, mostly that "designers" or mainstream as you call it, are also in boutiques. But I also agree on the subjectivity, the uselessness and silliness of these names. "Niche" though can be thought of as more of for a smaller group of people than any "regular" person who buys fragrances. I suppose that's why "mainstream" works, but if you are categorizing things more by smell and appeal, you would have splits in brands, probably. Like PdM has a boutique and they have "boutique" offerings, but they also have a lot of mainstream scent profiles.What to do in that situation? Perhaps all the labels are silly and we should just start talking about the fragrance, it's quality, it's smell, and so on.
i have almost no clue where to stand on the whole Niche vs Designer dilemma. 'Designers' have higher end "private" niche-like lines and 'Niche' brands meanwhile can have more easy going or generic offerings and lines sometimes. Some only sell in boutiques but some start completely by online order. Various brands distribute various amounts of their fragrances through varying distances and prices (try saying this sentence 4 times without messing up lol). On Fragrantica they can classify brands as "NICHE DESIGNER".... which can make sense but at the same time sounds like an oxymoron lol! Besides niche/designer, personally think "Indie" would be a good designator for a brand created by solely its own perfumer, like Andy Tauer/Pierre Guillaume/Josh Meyer/James Barry... Mizencir would be Alberto Morillas' independent brand.... Mancera/Montale would be Pierre Montale's independent brands (but there's weird controversy who he actually is apparently its bizarre)
Hmmm interesting points.. But I like the designer /niche classifications. I always thought designer fragrances come from houses who's main selling products are not fragrances, but products like chlotes, jewelry, cars.. Etc While niche fragrances are produced by companies who's focus and production are only oriented on fragrances. The term niche I was certain is about the fragrance industry, as they operate among a niche industry of perfumers, haven't thought its about us, the audience.
I do like the differentiation between mainstream and boutique. If I can buy it at Macy’s, it’s mainstream. I do think that there is an argument for indie, as there are perfumes that are mostly only available online from the perfumer.
Brilliant! I def agree with using BOUTIQUE and MAINSTREAM - so mush more useful in overall understanding and expectations. This said, I have to disagree with nixing INDIE. I think this is a very useful term, though we just need to define it better next to the other two categories. There are plenty of fragrances that are only sold on Etsy, direct from websites, street festivals (when we don't have a pandemic), etc. Often these are one-person passion projects that do generate some interesting and quality fragrances. They rarely, if ever, get picked up by a boutique, and if they do, it's often a smaller scale local shop without national recognition. To my mind, this is what qualifies as INDIE. Now, there comes a fuzzy line we could debate as an INDIE gets some serious recognition and suddenly finds itself in Lucky Scent. I think we can agree that Lucky Scent is a BOUTIQUE but if this is the only place outside of the perfumer's Etsy, social media, and/or privately run shop and they don't have full-time employees and they can only run very small batches (unlike B and M) then I would still call them INDIE. Meleg and Tsvga come to mind. And like most things in life, descriptive categories or rarely "This or that." Having a third category such as INDIE allows for a more realistic distinction between these, "little guys" and the big guns within the BOUTIQUE category. I've heard "ARTISAN" used to describe this third category as well. That works for me too (it at least conjures the image of an independent person working on a small scale to realize their craft and passion). What do you think?
Well said. I’ve also come to disdain the “unisex” wave in product and marketing. Comes off as lazy one fragrance fits. For me, niche is discovering actual masculine fragrances.
The way I think about it is all scent wise. Nothing else, not where you buy it, not what other products a company makes, just based purely off scent...example you ask 10 non fragrance enthusiast Niche = 1 or 2 of the 10 will think the scent smells good. Bc a niche scent is targeted to a specific audience Mass Appealing/Main Stream = 8 or more of the 10 will think the scent smells good 🤷🏾♂️
I agree with you. I have to say though that I'm totally mainstream fragrances fan. Out of my collection of 50 fragrances all of them are mainstream. I don't buy niche, I don't care about niche. They don't exist in my world. You see it's quite arrogant for one to say "I don't send to Greece, you can't test it, you have to blind buy it for an extraordinary price, etc and as a principle I don't like arrogant behavior. Well some, like Diptyque, I can go freely and test but it's a bright exception. So, I don't exist for them, they don't exist for me. In this world of mine the best fragrance of modern perfumery,for instance, is Dior Homme Parfum. I have to thank Dior for giving me Dior Homme Parfum and Dior Homme intense without being arrogant. That's really classy!
I think it makes more sense to divide scents by 'mainstream' and 'artisan'. Mugler Aura is quite artisan, even though it's widely available. Also Gucci Memoire d'un Odeure. Brave offerings are not always limited to boutiques, and some boutique offerings are actually quite mainstream, like Aventus and BR540 🙂
In either case I have both mainstream and boutique fragrances that smell rather repulsive but to others they smell great. It comes down to what best suits your nose and then purchasing those fragrances accordingly. So FragranceX is perfect for trying to determine what those fragrances are. Your collection would then be around what you like to wear and not what someone else thinks is good.
I always think about this. And I try to explain it like music, to people that are not into perfume. The music on the radio is mainstream and basically you’re forced to listen to Pop (mainstream) music which the corporations tell you what’s good even if it’s not. It may all sound similar because it’s made by computer, which is similar to a menu of popular aroma chemicals. Mainstream “designer” scents are the Pop Music of perfume. Now if you listen to “underground” music, music not on the radio such as House, Deep House, Tech House, Techno, Trance, Bass, Future Bass, etc, that would be the “niche” of the perfume world. Borrowed scent accords would be defined as samples in the music industry. For example going to the Tomorrowland music festival void of mainstream pop music would be like going to a perfume boutique in France. Or it’s like buying art from the artist and not buying art from...Wal-Mart! Yes I agree with you. -Razor
I really like this. I may have to use those terms. It's always been a large gray area for me to define but those terms you used make more sense. Designers don't always make clothes, and what is "niche" really.. if not the audience as opposed to the product. Thanks Daver, gonna have to change some video titles now😅👌🏼 would be nice if we can adopt newer, more accurate, terms as a community. Are there any other similar words(concepts) to boutiques.... 🤔
Maybe, maybe not. The thing about these terms is that you don't really need to explain them to people. Mention a "boutique" fragrance, and they already get it. Niche is not that way. I've been saying these for a while and literally zero people have asked me what I meant. Because of that, I think that it could be that people use both definitions for a while and people start asking themselves why they would use an unintuitive definition to start with.
IMO, "niche fragrance" is fragrance that has ingredient notes or combinations of notes not typically bought or chosen by a wide audience. Example is something like Bond No. 9 - New Haarlem which has maple syrup as a central note. IMO, that is going to have a specific audience and won't be generally selected by most people shopping for a fragrance.
Without reading too much into it, there are two main categories of fragrance producers: mainstream and niche. Mainstream brands are the ones with the inflated marketing budgets, who don't primarily make fragrances, and that tend to be available more or less globally; niche brands/sub-brands (Armani Prive/Private Blend) usually never or seldomly market their products, are priced out of reach of the casual fragrance buyer, and are available in select shops/boutiques. Simple and straightforward: mainstream and niche. No bearing on quality whatsoever, although most niche brands are of above average quality (excluding those that cater to the nouveau riche demographic e.g. Parfums de Marly). On a side note, Creed are a prime example of a niche brand that is starting to cross over into the mainstream whilst maintaining their inflated prices. This is the first such case in the fragrance industry, and as they scale production, with quality clearly suffering, we'll have to wait and see how this will pan out long-term.
yeah, it should be categorized by price point just like electronics. Entry Level, Mid Range and High End or Luxury. Having a special category for indie is fine for houses like Rogue Perfumery.
It's like Micro Brewery used to mean something till the big boys started buying them out to have a hip lines to coverup they are no longer "micro". Same thing with Natural American Spirit tobacco till Marlboro bought them out a decade or two ago. Now we have Creed and others selling out to the big boys in perfumery doing the same thing as niche tries to become indie until that is bought out too.
I discover yesterday that they are small companies making watches… almost 90% it’s handmade…they make at most 100 pieces per year…I say this because mainstream and boutique makes sense… mainstream = Calvin Klein,polo, nautical….boutique = Dior, Chanel, Versace, Tom Ford…niche= kilian,mfk,diptyque, parfum de Marley…Indy = any small company… yes l will used those frases ..
Agree. When designers licence their brand name to be used for fragrances by a clarins or loreal and the same is happening to jo Malone, Frederick malle and even Creed and Geurlain moving away from the world of family owned artisan production, it makes sense to look at the product segmentation that companies in the industry use. And even the most indie or mom & pop perfumers probably can't easily avoid the likes of IFF and Givaudan. :)
Not sure what to say about this one, Dave. I think you may be tilting at windmills. In my opinion, you are right about the terms Niche and Designer having been watered down over the years, but getting consensus to change these classifications would be very difficult. I am very comfortable with the terms Niche, Designer and Indie/Artisanal and don't see any need to change them.
I'm not telling people to change. I'm only telling people that the definitions they argue about don't make sense to start with. These terms are intuitive to anyone outside the fragrance community.
You have to ask why someone would buy something. With "designer" fragrances, people are buying because they want a connection to the designer brand, and the product is sold to them via the perceived pedigree of that brand. With "niche" there's no prevailing brand awareness to form the cultural tailwinds because the brand is entirely conceptual. Unlike a Chanel, where I can associate the perfume with the clothing and accessories (and commercial image), a Xerjoff stands alone with only the Xerjoff name and perfumes to speak for it. If I don't understand something specific about Xerjoff perfumes, like what kind of fragrances they make, and how those fragrances compare to everything else, I won't be inclined to bother buying anything. Thus I'm basing a purchase solely off what I know, rather than what I perceive. This makes the act of buying one of self stratification with niche, while buying "designer" is me adhering to commercial stratification; when I buy Xerjoff, I am distinguishing myself as someone who appreciates Xerjoff perfumes, whereas a Chanel purchase is Chanel successfully tagging me as a Chanel customer. The problem with your term "boutique" is that it's a distinction without a difference. Chanel boutiques are literally what they're called. So does that make Chanel's frags "boutique frags" when they're clearly just "mainstream" as you say? Creed boutique is another example. Creed's logo is a clothing tailor's scissors. They're not hiding the ball there, they're telling the world that they're designers. They just ended the clothing part and focus on the perfumes now. These terms "boutique" and "mainstream" don't really address what customers are buying because they negate why they're buying them. So basically let's just keep "niche" and "designer."
Yep, 100% agree. However, I think we must be careful to not take boutique equals high quality and mainstream equals safe but not so good for granted. Mainstream can be high quality and innovative in their own way, boutique can be bad, and vice versa. Like movies. Spielberg is a mainstream director and Goddard is a high art director. Both of them have hits (high quality movies) and misses (bad movies).
that's absolutely right. I don't think we should just consider boutique as better. I think this is one reason why the term "niche" is so bad. It isn't understood at face value, and so people began to make their own meanings and associations with the word. The biggest misconception of "niche" (or boutique, if you will) is that they are better just because. There are many that are not good. 🙂
Thank you for this video, I’ve been made to feel like a dork for getting a designer fragrance like savage. Hey it smells good and so what , I smell good and that’s what is important if you happen to have it I’m sure you smell good too period.
Isn't quality the main objective. There are "great ones" and "scrubbers on both sides of this subject. I have a small collection, but I don't consider myself a collector.The fragrances I purchase are to be worn often. Not displayed. If that is your thing fine. I looked at some stats a couple of years ago that related that approx. 80% of men do not wear fragrances on a regular basis. Break that down further , how many concern themselves with niche vs, designer? I have a hard time trying to figure out what circles some of the reviewers frequent when they say things like everyone is wear Roja, Clive Christian, etc. They continually look for something different. I don't believe you have to work that hard. Some are like addicts looking for that "next great high". LOL. Keep cranking them out Dave I really enjoy your content..
I think we need to split these 2 terms into like 6-8 other terms with fragrances sometimes falling into multiple categories just to hopefully maintain some sort of "accuracy" or whatever
Hey, Mr. Daver! I don't mean to make this public by any means, but I sent you an email a few weeks ago with an idea for your Basics segment regarding how to determine from watching a reviewer's fragrance review if a fragrance could be for you or not. Sorry if you don't find my idea valuable. I hope you have a wonderful day!!!
I have no opinion on this, I really don’t think it matters. Indy perfumer Chris Rusak gave a very good set of criteria of what he considers an Indy brand.
There is nothing wrong with people who prefer designer fragrances or niche fragrances. If I’m going to spend $150 on a fragrance I expect some quality and longevity. I don’t want to spend that kind of money on something I have to re spray four hours later. And to say the quality of niche is no different than designer just isn’t true. Houses like Amouage and Argos use very high quality ingredients and it shows in the finished product. I have more designer fragrances than niche, but there’s a difference. But it all comes down personal preference.
Although I don't mind the Niche and Designer labels, because it helped me when I first started out. But Mainstream could work in your example, but generally when I think of "Mainstream" I think something more affordable and readily available and everyone loves. For examples in shopping malls, Suvauge, Bleu De Chanels etc,. But I also feel that in your example Mainstream would apply to Creed, however I would say Creed and Frags over 300 are more Luxury. So how about we just say classify everything by Tiers based on price, so Tier 1 = $1-100 Tier 2 = $101-200, Tier 3 $201- up or Luxury tier. It doesn't say anything about quality, or fandom or anything else just based off retail price. So even if something is discontinued it will always be in its Tier it started with and never Luxury, no matter how much people want to sell it for (Ultra Zest). Or just keep it all loosely Niche and Designer at least that does have some kind of separation, because as we know through time words have been known to change meaning.
I think even though Creed is popular among fragrance enthusiasts, I would never consider Creed the mainstream among the broader audience. My terms aren't perfect, so there are some exceptions. But what I like about them is that they are already intuitively understood by the person you speak with, unlike niche/designer. If we make up new terms whole cloth, that would be even more confusing, imo.
I think that when RUclips fragrance reviewers started using these categories to make top 10 lists, they would often associate creativity, quality and exclusivity with niche fragrances which also gave rise to adjectives like "niche-quality". In contrast, most designers have more mass-appeal and a lower price compared to niche, thus "designer-quality" got popular too. These adjectives largely influenced how these terms are used. Designer brands target mainstream audience, whereas niche and indie brands mostly target fragheads. I agree that designers should be called mainstream because not all fragrances would classify as a designer. However, niche is an easier word to describe something exclusive because not every brand would have a boutique. To give an example, brands like Tom Ford and Guerlain offer mainstream fragrances, AND niche fragrances at their boutiques.
While it is true that some brands have overlap with their higher end lines, the term "boutique" carries a lot more understood meaning because of how we use it in other markets already. This is why I think it is a much better term. There won't ever be a word that perfectly defines all fragrances. There will be some exceptions to any term. But "boutique" is a lot more intuitive than "niche".
@@FragranceBros When I think of boutique, it instantly creates the picture of an exclusive luxury fragrance store. Though this term is more suitable, just saying that it would take a very long time for people to get used to it. Your idea of getting rid of the word is quite commendable. Nobody really gave it much thought.
So I was totally against this at the beginning of the video. By the end I do mostly agree with this. I think there should be categories that are descriptive of quality.
Do you agree or disagree?
Disagree because I think boutique is such an ugly word! :3
I only have one word for you, Jake: moist.
@@jakeRemains beautique then
I agree with you 100% even more so about the indie /niche like how small of the audience to be indie crazy but yeah you are right bro glad you brough tit out cause as a noob in the fragrance world this stuff was confusing for me and the only reason i have knowledge of now is because youtubers like yourself who discuss and provide massive amoints of information across various platforms .. Starting ro feel i am being led astray like the sheepwith all this designer indie niche BS haha ✌ bruh
Agree
THANK GOD SOMEONE FINALLY SAID THIS.
Unfortunately, none of these frag-heads are listening though.
I actually like “indie” because some fragrances aren’t legally allowed to be sold in stores and are only allowed to be sold on websites like etsy. I’ve always thought “niche” meant non-designer. No more, no less. The problem is that we stereotype niche and designer fragrances. Some niche fragrances smell mainstream and conventional and some designer fragrances smell unique.
I think actually that the term "niche" comes from the french definition of it: A segment of a market where there is little competition and which allows a company to develop a new business niche. (The niche is often neglected by large companies for profitability reasons because this micro-market has a low potential of customers.)... so in that case it's really the fragrance house that is "niche", because it specialise in one particular product (niche) instead of multiple ones like "designer" brands do (clothes, bags, pens, jewelry, glass etc)... the difference with Indy is that by definition, the brand is independant, wich means it's not owned by a bigger compagnie that profits from it (exemple loreal, coty etc)... so I guess an indy brand is automatically niche, but not every niche brands are indy (cause they can be owned by bigger compagnies)... hope my french toughts made sense 😅
👏👏👏👏👏👏
Thank god. I’m so glad you said this. It’s utterly ridiculous. It doesn’t make any sense whatsoever. Excellent video.
Thank you!
I agree with you 100%! I’m so sick of the niche snobbery. Niche does not mean quality! Very timely. Ugh, if I hear “niche quality” again I’m going to lose it haha. I have some damn good frags that are not niche, and the quality is amazing!
I'm just recently entered the intriguing world of fragrance , and I must say that you are making a fantastic point. I started calling everything niche and designer, but you are absolutely right; saying mainstream and boutique does really make much more sence (and is accurate) 😅 thanks for enlightening me.
I agree. Many “designer” fragrances are expensive and high quality. Some “niche” fragrances are unwearable and low value compared to their price. Can we just talk about all fragrances on quality, wearability, when and where to wear, performance, value, etc. Who cares if a “niche” house, a clothing, watch, pen, or car manufacturer has their name on it?
But how will I make fun of other people's fragrance choices?
That's a niche joke (?)
Nicely said, Dave! The next step is getting reviewers and audiences to use these terms. I hope it catches on. I want to use "boutique" and "mainstream" in my videos from now on.
Go for it!
Bless! Finally someone with a unique and well explained.
In these times the quality and the price cannot be anymore be put in one group or the other.
Because some so called niche are becoming more money/market savvy, and some so called designer are approaching customers with a more niche spirit.
It is hard to define what is in constant change, though I believe our senses can still be the only judge that decide where to put one or another without being affected or biased by brand name, price, market presence and claims (i.e. all natural perfume, innovative formula lab, rarest material).
Agreed, of course.
People (especially in my country) have always made "niche fragrances" look like they are the only fragrances with great quality in the world.
I'm not mad because they're only buying expensive fragrances, I'm pissed because they tend to treat the so-called "designer" fragrances like a joke or something.
It's snobbery belying insecurity. Every hobby has a contingent of members who can spend exorbitant amounts of money, and trash those who can't. I refer to them as "Luxury Jerks".
@@chi-towncalifornia5916 true... I mean, just do whatever you want and buy fragrances you like, but if the reason for you to buy those fragrances were just because you think they're niche and "I don't like designer fragrances because they're not well-blended and doesn't have any quality"...... I'm sorry but that's just stupid.
I'm just glad that I'm not the only one to feel the same way..
Well said!
I just found the perfect counter when someone tells you cheap fragrances are trash and "niche" fragrances are amazing. Say to them: secretion magnifiques
Well done. I am a relative newbie to the “boutique “ fragrance journey but NOT to fragrances. I’ve been enamored with fragrances since I was a freshman in high school back in the late 70s. When I began this fragrance journey about a year ago, I found the Niche, Indie & Designer labels helpful. Clearly, I was exploring niche fragrances. Soon after, however, I began to question the labels and decided that at best they were inaccurate and, perhaps worse, they were pretentious. I like your thought on “Mainstream “ and am warming to “Boutique “. So, is FragranceX “Boutique “? Thanks for challenging us to think critically. Great video
FragranceX is just a reseller. (One that I recommend). When I think "boutique", I think Osswald, LuckyScent, Min New York, and Perfumology.
I agree with this. I like to categorize fragrances in three categories defined by audience: mass-market, niche, and luxury 🌹
thanks for watching, Sam!
Completely agree that the current designations are a bit too vague. The problem is that boutique brands are slowly becoming more mainstream. And many independent or online brands don't need or can't afford a physical boutique. I would've suggested a price or creativity class system a while ago, even a quality/price ratio but once again, there are too many variables. Prices go up and down, especially on the secondary market and how would we gauge quality anyway? Even if we designated niche+ as "artistic", that might pressume that no artistry goes into mainstream scents. Neither do the words "specialized" or "exclusive" work, since all products have a target audience. It's a conundrum for sure. In the end, I have no doubt that some sort of numerical system will eventually be implemented as everything goes on the blockchain. Price brackets (1-5) might become the new thing paired with a mass appeal factor (also 1-5). (1.5) might mean a cheap fragrance that's unoriginal but easy to like. (4.3) would designate a very expensive fragrance that's reasonably creative, but a bit more challenging. (5.1) would be an incredibly expensive fragrance that's impossibly challenging. Words like designer or niche would disappear in favour of digital approximations. But your guess is as good as mine. Ps, I am not a robot. 😂
I agree, I don't think they're perfect terms, but I think they are a lot better than what we use currently. I think there will be exceptions--particularly with a boutique fragrance becoming mainstream, but I think these are inevitable. Like when some fragrances were "designer" but now they are drug store fragrances. With boutique brands in other markets becoming more of a thing, and physical boutiques becoming more of a thing, I think these terms make more intuitive sense when speaking to a person with zero knowledge of fragcomm nomenclature.
Hello from Brazil, I subscribed in your channel to learn more about fragrances. There are many expensive niche fragrances that are not good. I don't want even free. Best regards.
Hmm... good point. When you put it that way it makes sense. I wish there were more boutiques out there so we could all enjoy going to them and discovering new fragrances. Yes I know you can buy samples but it doesn't replace going to a store and getting out from behind your house doors. I could see a boutique in every major city. That would be awesome.
Just as a side note, I've never cared what they were called. I either like it, or I don't. Am willing to pay a particular price for it, or I'm not.
I COMPLETELY AGREE WITH THIS.
Ive been thinking about this ever since i started getting into fragrance. But can't think of a fitting name. Until now you upload this. Thanks
I agree in theory,, but it's hard enough explaining my hobby to regular folks ..it's gonna make it even harder to look and sound cool when I elaborate and inform them that I collect boutique fragrances lol.....you're still my favorite reviewer though. Keep the videos coming!!
Well look at it this way: these terms are a lot easier to explain to people. People can already deduce what the meaning is because it corresponds with already widely accepted terms in other markets. Then try to explain what “niche” and “designer” are, and you’re in the weeds.
You are right... unfortunately I doubt these terms are going anywhere.
Great video Dave! You make a lot of excellent points, I'm going to start using these new terms now. I hope to go to the Guerlain boutique in Vegas next year if my wife and I feel safe to go (covid) for our anniversary.
awesome! happy anniversary!
There was a time when niche meant quality and the audience and number of every batch of them were limited then people leaned more and more toward them because of the quality they sought. designers didn't want to drop back and started their exclusive lines with higher prices and the quality they had before in their usual lines of fragrance and with maybe a little bit more quality . many of niche brands couldn't keep up financially and were bought by parent companies. Number of their batches increased and quality was reduced in some cases to increase profits. And this is where we are stuck in now🤔😑
Agree with the naming you mentioned 👍🏻👍🏻
I do actually agree with you, it truly does make sense. Great video!! 👍
i really like your dissection of the terms thrown around in the community. I like boutique and mainstream, and also exclusive as someone mentioned below.
Thank you! I think "exclusive" is a pretty good term too.
I agree 100% when it comes to the usage of „niche“ and „designer“. I think that this kind of separation is made to describe or separate fragrances in certain quality and price levels. Now the first mistake is to equalize quality and price, but sadly it’s often been done. However in my opinion most people prefer the mainstream because of the pricetag. I find the usage of mainstream not the best either, because mainstream focuses on trends and if Dior Sauvage will not be trendy in 10 years from now, is it still mainstream? I would rather separate both types of fragrances in something like „affordable“ and „luxury“ or I wouldn’t even make any separation at all...
Here in Italy we do not say Designer, but "commerciale" (that means commercial, meaning that is something easy to find in the mall or in the perfumery and beauty shop all around the city). So for instance, even in a small city there are at least 1 mall, 1 perfumery and 1 beauty shop which have the so called designer fragrances. Instead, niche fragrances are found in niche store (or as you said boutique) that are very rare. No small city has a boutique, and even not every big city has one.
Interesting! I think "commercial" is another good term that makes sense!
I prefere to use the word "Execlusive" rather than niche or boutiqe.
I think that works too!
“Exclusive” sounds way better than “boutique” which are the little retail stores .
Excellently put there Daver!!
I so completely agree with this that I feel like I’ve just eaten a perfectly satisfying meal or had a perfect nights sleep just by watching. Great Daver
haha thank you!
I like this, and I would love this conversation to continue!
Great video. Original, and well thought out. The lines between designer, niche, and indie can be very muddled and confusing. Not to mention arrogant and pretentious when some people in the community use those terms ( They probably just got triggered after reading that ). Mainstream and boutique sums it up nicely.
Had thoughts for a long time that "niche" doesn't mean anything. This video expresses those thoughts
Really gives me a different outlook on the terms.🤔 I personally feel like niche is a higher quality, usually more expensive fragrances. Examples, like you mentioned, are Chanel, Tom Ford, and Dior private blends. I like your take on it.👍
I agree to a point, designer does mean nothing as does niche. You're right it's who buys them isn't it, ones mainstream and ones for the more specific clientèle altho even they overlap, Aventus? But yea they are kind of meaningless now. Indie... Is a tricky one, I suppose what we mean is small and yea independent normally self ran, so it is a little company on its own. Although the idea of things "smelling" indie niche or designer is weird, cos it means literally countless different things to whoever interprets it individually
I think there's 3 things we're mixing up in this discussion, not just the two of describing the fragrance or describing the audience. First, there are adjectives that describe the audience, for example, "mainstream" or "niche." These describe either the average person or the fragrance aficionado, or who the fragrance manufacturer is targeting. Then, there are adjectives describing the fragrance house. For example, "brand name" or "indie." And lastly, there are adjectives describing where the fragrance can be found, for example, "department store" or "boutique" fragrances. And we can use all these adjectives simultaneously to describe a fragrance: "Creed Aventus is a niche brand name boutique fragrance," "Dior Sauvage is a mainstream brand name department store fragrance," "Tauer L'Air Du Désert Marocain is a niche indie boutique fragrance,"
All great points but there was one part of your explanation that broke down for me and that is when you were defining mainstream. One of the points was that mainstream has copycats. "how many Sauvage copies are there..." How many Aventus copies are there? Is Aventus therefore mainstream? I get what you are saying... but this part just made my brain go "hey that doesn't make sense". Keep up the great work man. Love the reviews.
I do think Aventus is mainstream.
I’m in! 🙌🏻. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
I agree with what you are saying, my understanding was niche is used for the companys that strictly produce fragrances nothing else, designer could be any other item other than fragrance and indie is just a small company starting out/growing who produce slightly different direction wise scents to what we are accustomed too.
Great video. This is a really interesting debate and really divides opinion!!
Not a bad point. I always tossed out the term indie because kind of like as you point out, the only difference between indie and niche seems to be the size of the company. I don't necessarily like the term boutique, mostly that "designers" or mainstream as you call it, are also in boutiques. But I also agree on the subjectivity, the uselessness and silliness of these names.
"Niche" though can be thought of as more of for a smaller group of people than any "regular" person who buys fragrances. I suppose that's why "mainstream" works, but if you are categorizing things more by smell and appeal, you would have splits in brands, probably. Like PdM has a boutique and they have "boutique" offerings, but they also have a lot of mainstream scent profiles.What to do in that situation?
Perhaps all the labels are silly and we should just start talking about the fragrance, it's quality, it's smell, and so on.
The reason I think "boutique" works best is because it's already used in other markets to signify the distinction we are making with fragrances.
i have almost no clue where to stand on the whole Niche vs Designer dilemma. 'Designers' have higher end "private" niche-like lines and 'Niche' brands meanwhile can have more easy going or generic offerings and lines sometimes. Some only sell in boutiques but some start completely by online order. Various brands distribute various amounts of their fragrances through varying distances and prices (try saying this sentence 4 times without messing up lol). On Fragrantica they can classify brands as "NICHE DESIGNER".... which can make sense but at the same time sounds like an oxymoron lol!
Besides niche/designer, personally think "Indie" would be a good designator for a brand created by solely its own perfumer, like Andy Tauer/Pierre Guillaume/Josh Meyer/James Barry...
Mizencir would be Alberto Morillas' independent brand.... Mancera/Montale would be Pierre Montale's independent brands (but there's weird controversy who he actually is apparently its bizarre)
Hmmm interesting points.. But I like the designer /niche classifications.
I always thought designer fragrances come from houses who's main selling products are not fragrances, but products like chlotes, jewelry, cars.. Etc
While niche fragrances are produced by companies who's focus and production are only oriented on fragrances.
The term niche I was certain is about the fragrance industry, as they operate among a niche industry of perfumers, haven't thought its about us, the audience.
Somehow I agree. You're giving reasons!
It's something to consider.
thank you!
Great video and I enjoyed it and i agree with you a 1000 percent have a blessed day
Thank you! You too!
You welcome keep up the good work and thank you very much
I do like the differentiation between mainstream and boutique. If I can buy it at Macy’s, it’s mainstream. I do think that there is an argument for indie, as there are perfumes that are mostly only available online from the perfumer.
Brilliant! I def agree with using BOUTIQUE and MAINSTREAM - so mush more useful in overall understanding and expectations. This said, I have to disagree with nixing INDIE. I think this is a very useful term, though we just need to define it better next to the other two categories. There are plenty of fragrances that are only sold on Etsy, direct from websites, street festivals (when we don't have a pandemic), etc. Often these are one-person passion projects that do generate some interesting and quality fragrances. They rarely, if ever, get picked up by a boutique, and if they do, it's often a smaller scale local shop without national recognition. To my mind, this is what qualifies as INDIE. Now, there comes a fuzzy line we could debate as an INDIE gets some serious recognition and suddenly finds itself in Lucky Scent. I think we can agree that Lucky Scent is a BOUTIQUE but if this is the only place outside of the perfumer's Etsy, social media, and/or privately run shop and they don't have full-time employees and they can only run very small batches (unlike B and M) then I would still call them INDIE. Meleg and Tsvga come to mind. And like most things in life, descriptive categories or rarely "This or that." Having a third category such as INDIE allows for a more realistic distinction between these, "little guys" and the big guns within the BOUTIQUE category. I've heard "ARTISAN" used to describe this third category as well. That works for me too (it at least conjures the image of an independent person working on a small scale to realize their craft and passion). What do you think?
fair points! Thank you!
Well said. I’ve also come to disdain the “unisex” wave in product and marketing. Comes off as lazy one fragrance fits. For me, niche is discovering actual masculine fragrances.
The way I think about it is all scent wise. Nothing else, not where you buy it, not what other products a company makes, just based purely off scent...example you ask 10 non fragrance enthusiast
Niche = 1 or 2 of the 10 will think the scent smells good. Bc a niche scent is targeted to a specific audience
Mass Appealing/Main Stream = 8 or more of the 10 will think the scent smells good
🤷🏾♂️
I agree with you. I have to say though that I'm totally mainstream fragrances fan. Out of my collection of 50 fragrances all of them are mainstream. I don't buy niche, I don't care about niche. They don't exist in my world. You see it's quite arrogant for one to say "I don't send to Greece, you can't test it, you have to blind buy it for an extraordinary price, etc and as a principle I don't like arrogant behavior. Well some, like Diptyque, I can go freely and test but it's a bright exception. So, I don't exist for them, they don't exist for me. In this world of mine the best fragrance of modern perfumery,for instance, is Dior Homme Parfum. I have to thank Dior for giving me Dior Homme Parfum and Dior Homme intense without being arrogant. That's really classy!
Great subject mate and well explained 👌
Much appreciated!
I am so on board with that. That's l what I've been saying. It says nothing about the quality of the fragrance but just it's brand.
I think it makes more sense to divide scents by 'mainstream' and 'artisan'. Mugler Aura is quite artisan, even though it's widely available. Also Gucci Memoire d'un Odeure. Brave offerings are not always limited to boutiques, and some boutique offerings are actually quite mainstream, like Aventus and BR540 🙂
Artisan is another great descriptor
That is a well thought out argument.
It’s taken a long time to think things through. 😁
I agree niche means only a small group will like it , once its popular itz no longer niche & its mainstream/mass appealing
I've heard people call Guerlain both designer and niche even though usually good throughout the line.
Its because they were just a fragrance house originally then were sold and branched out into other avenues of the beauty industry
This actually makes so much sense!
thank you 😊
Makes sense! Yes!
In either case I have both mainstream and boutique fragrances that smell rather repulsive but to others they smell great. It comes down to what best suits your nose and then purchasing those fragrances accordingly. So FragranceX is perfect for trying to determine what those fragrances are. Your collection would then be around what you like to wear and not what someone else thinks is good.
I always think about this. And I try to explain it like music, to people that are not into perfume. The music on the radio is mainstream and basically you’re forced to listen to Pop (mainstream) music which the corporations tell you what’s good even if it’s not. It may all sound similar because it’s made by computer, which is similar to a menu of popular aroma chemicals. Mainstream “designer” scents are the Pop Music of perfume.
Now if you listen to “underground” music, music not on the radio such as House, Deep House, Tech House, Techno, Trance, Bass, Future Bass, etc, that would be the “niche” of the perfume world.
Borrowed scent accords would be defined as samples in the music industry.
For example going to the Tomorrowland music festival void of mainstream pop music would be like going to a perfume boutique in France.
Or it’s like buying art from the artist and not buying art from...Wal-Mart! Yes I agree with you. -Razor
I really like this. I may have to use those terms. It's always been a large gray area for me to define but those terms you used make more sense. Designers don't always make clothes, and what is "niche" really.. if not the audience as opposed to the product.
Thanks Daver, gonna have to change some video titles now😅👌🏼 would be nice if we can adopt newer, more accurate, terms as a community. Are there any other similar words(concepts) to boutiques.... 🤔
Interesting and I’m inclined to agree. Don’t think the current terms are going anywhere, though, for better or worse. Interesting take 👍🏼
Maybe, maybe not. The thing about these terms is that you don't really need to explain them to people. Mention a "boutique" fragrance, and they already get it. Niche is not that way. I've been saying these for a while and literally zero people have asked me what I meant. Because of that, I think that it could be that people use both definitions for a while and people start asking themselves why they would use an unintuitive definition to start with.
Fragrance Bros. Hope it catches on 👍🏼
IMO, "niche fragrance" is fragrance that has ingredient notes or combinations of notes not typically bought or chosen by a wide audience. Example is something like Bond No. 9 - New Haarlem which has maple syrup as a central note. IMO, that is going to have a specific audience and won't be generally selected by most people shopping for a fragrance.
Without reading too much into it, there are two main categories of fragrance producers: mainstream and niche. Mainstream brands are the ones with the inflated marketing budgets, who don't primarily make fragrances, and that tend to be available more or less globally; niche brands/sub-brands (Armani Prive/Private Blend) usually never or seldomly market their products, are priced out of reach of the casual fragrance buyer, and are available in select shops/boutiques. Simple and straightforward: mainstream and niche. No bearing on quality whatsoever, although most niche brands are of above average quality (excluding those that cater to the nouveau riche demographic e.g. Parfums de Marly). On a side note, Creed are a prime example of a niche brand that is starting to cross over into the mainstream whilst maintaining their inflated prices. This is the first such case in the fragrance industry, and as they scale production, with quality clearly suffering, we'll have to wait and see how this will pan out long-term.
yeah, it should be categorized by price point just like electronics. Entry Level, Mid Range and High End or Luxury. Having a special category for indie is fine for houses like Rogue Perfumery.
I think that's okay too. But perfumes are often discounted so deeply, I think it would create issues with identifying which is which based on price.
Thank you for explaining. Agree !
It's like Micro Brewery used to mean something till the big boys started buying them out to have a hip lines to coverup they are no longer "micro". Same thing with Natural American Spirit tobacco till Marlboro bought them out a decade or two ago. Now we have Creed and others selling out to the big boys in perfumery doing the same thing as niche tries to become indie until that is bought out too.
Like this point of view. Redefining the frag comm terminology 👍
I discover yesterday that they are small companies making watches… almost 90% it’s handmade…they make at most 100 pieces per year…I say this because mainstream and boutique makes sense… mainstream = Calvin Klein,polo, nautical….boutique = Dior, Chanel, Versace, Tom Ford…niche= kilian,mfk,diptyque, parfum de Marley…Indy = any small company… yes l will used those frases ..
Agree. When designers licence their brand name to be used for fragrances by a clarins or loreal and the same is happening to jo Malone, Frederick malle and even Creed and Geurlain moving away from the world of family owned artisan production, it makes sense to look at the product segmentation that companies in the industry use.
And even the most indie or mom & pop perfumers probably can't easily avoid the likes of IFF and Givaudan. :)
Couldn't agree more
I do like boutique and main stream, but does celebrity fragrances then move to main stream? Or do they stay in their own category? LOL!
we can just make a new "garbage" category for them. 😜😜
@@FragranceBros 😂
Not sure what to say about this one, Dave. I think you may be tilting at windmills. In my opinion, you are right about the terms Niche and Designer having been watered down over the years, but getting consensus to change these classifications would be very difficult. I am very comfortable with the terms Niche, Designer and Indie/Artisanal and don't see any need to change them.
I'm not telling people to change. I'm only telling people that the definitions they argue about don't make sense to start with. These terms are intuitive to anyone outside the fragrance community.
Almost forgot what would we give those brands that are neither mainstream or boutique? Armaf, Parfum Vintage etc.
You have to ask why someone would buy something. With "designer" fragrances, people are buying because they want a connection to the designer brand, and the product is sold to them via the perceived pedigree of that brand. With "niche" there's no prevailing brand awareness to form the cultural tailwinds because the brand is entirely conceptual. Unlike a Chanel, where I can associate the perfume with the clothing and accessories (and commercial image), a Xerjoff stands alone with only the Xerjoff name and perfumes to speak for it. If I don't understand something specific about Xerjoff perfumes, like what kind of fragrances they make, and how those fragrances compare to everything else, I won't be inclined to bother buying anything. Thus I'm basing a purchase solely off what I know, rather than what I perceive. This makes the act of buying one of self stratification with niche, while buying "designer" is me adhering to commercial stratification; when I buy Xerjoff, I am distinguishing myself as someone who appreciates Xerjoff perfumes, whereas a Chanel purchase is Chanel successfully tagging me as a Chanel customer. The problem with your term "boutique" is that it's a distinction without a difference. Chanel boutiques are literally what they're called. So does that make Chanel's frags "boutique frags" when they're clearly just "mainstream" as you say? Creed boutique is another example. Creed's logo is a clothing tailor's scissors. They're not hiding the ball there, they're telling the world that they're designers. They just ended the clothing part and focus on the perfumes now. These terms "boutique" and "mainstream" don't really address what customers are buying because they negate why they're buying them. So basically let's just keep "niche" and "designer."
I like it. Well thought out and articulated.
I Agree on mainstream. Niche is still referring to a scent specific to a small group of people/buyers
Yep, 100% agree. However, I think we must be careful to not take boutique equals high quality and mainstream equals safe but not so good for granted. Mainstream can be high quality and innovative in their own way, boutique can be bad, and vice versa. Like movies. Spielberg is a mainstream director and Goddard is a high art director. Both of them have hits (high quality movies) and misses (bad movies).
that's absolutely right. I don't think we should just consider boutique as better. I think this is one reason why the term "niche" is so bad. It isn't understood at face value, and so people began to make their own meanings and associations with the word. The biggest misconception of "niche" (or boutique, if you will) is that they are better just because. There are many that are not good. 🙂
Thank you for this video, I’ve been made to feel like a dork for getting a designer fragrance like savage. Hey it smells good and so what , I smell good and that’s what is important if you happen to have it I’m sure you smell good too period.
Isn't quality the main objective. There are "great ones" and "scrubbers on both sides of this subject. I have a small collection, but I don't consider myself a collector.The fragrances I purchase are to be worn often. Not displayed. If that is your thing fine. I looked at some stats a couple of years ago that related that approx. 80% of men do not wear fragrances on a regular basis. Break that down further , how many concern themselves with niche vs, designer? I have a hard time trying to figure out what circles some of the reviewers frequent when they say things like everyone is wear Roja, Clive Christian, etc. They continually look for something different. I don't believe you have to work that hard. Some are like addicts looking for that "next great high". LOL. Keep cranking them out Dave
I really enjoy your content..
I think we need to split these 2 terms into like 6-8 other terms with fragrances sometimes falling into multiple categories just to hopefully maintain some sort of "accuracy" or whatever
Well explained with logic 👍
Hey, Mr. Daver! I don't mean to make this public by any means, but I sent you an email a few weeks ago with an idea for your Basics segment regarding how to determine from watching a reviewer's fragrance review if a fragrance could be for you or not. Sorry if you don't find my idea valuable. I hope you have a wonderful day!!!
I have no opinion on this, I really don’t think it matters. Indy perfumer Chris Rusak gave a very good set of criteria of what he considers an Indy brand.
I totally agree with you Daver 👍 War Eagle
🦅🦅🦅
There is nothing wrong with people who prefer designer fragrances or niche fragrances. If I’m going to spend $150 on a fragrance I expect some quality and longevity. I don’t want to spend that kind of money on something I have to re spray four hours later. And to say the quality of niche is no different than designer just isn’t true. Houses like Amouage and Argos use very high quality ingredients and it shows in the finished product. I have more designer fragrances than niche, but there’s a difference. But it all comes down personal preference.
Why dont you make more videos lol I like your channel, you seem smarter than most other channels and you go into more detail like Ash.
This year has been a wacky year for my video schedule. I'm trying to make more, though.
Nailed it. Couldn't agree more.
I agree with you here. Thank you for thy righteousness that hath brought an enlightenment to thy frag community.
I think "boutique" and "mainstream" are perfect designations.
But I do like Indie. How else would you describe something like Rogue Perfumery?
Although I don't mind the Niche and Designer labels, because it helped me when I first started out. But Mainstream could work in your example, but generally when I think of "Mainstream" I think something more affordable and readily available and everyone loves. For examples in shopping malls, Suvauge, Bleu De Chanels etc,. But I also feel that in your example Mainstream would apply to Creed, however I would say Creed and Frags over 300 are more Luxury.
So how about we just say classify everything by Tiers based on price, so Tier 1 = $1-100 Tier 2 = $101-200, Tier 3 $201- up or Luxury tier. It doesn't say anything about quality, or fandom or anything else just based off retail price. So even if something is discontinued it will always be in its Tier it started with and never Luxury, no matter how much people want to sell it for (Ultra Zest). Or just keep it all loosely Niche and Designer at least that does have some kind of separation, because as we know through time words have been known to change meaning.
I think even though Creed is popular among fragrance enthusiasts, I would never consider Creed the mainstream among the broader audience. My terms aren't perfect, so there are some exceptions. But what I like about them is that they are already intuitively understood by the person you speak with, unlike niche/designer. If we make up new terms whole cloth, that would be even more confusing, imo.
I thought “niche” just meant a brand that only makes and sells fragrances, whereas a designer originally sells other items like clothes.
Great video, Daver 👍 So then for me Aventus is a mainstream scent 🤣🤣
😂😂😂😂
Bloody well said my man.
thank you!
GLOL - that winnie the pooh meme at 3:31
😂😂😂 always thankful for my meme fans
Thank you for clearing things up yes I agree with you
Thanks for watching!
Agreed been thinking that for a long while now
Brilliant. Totally agree. LIKE!
I think that when RUclips fragrance reviewers started using these categories to make top 10 lists, they would often associate creativity, quality and exclusivity with niche fragrances which also gave rise to adjectives like "niche-quality". In contrast, most designers have more mass-appeal and a lower price compared to niche, thus "designer-quality" got popular too. These adjectives largely influenced how these terms are used. Designer brands target mainstream audience, whereas niche and indie brands mostly target fragheads. I agree that designers should be called mainstream because not all fragrances would classify as a designer. However, niche is an easier word to describe something exclusive because not every brand would have a boutique. To give an example, brands like Tom Ford and Guerlain offer mainstream fragrances, AND niche fragrances at their boutiques.
While it is true that some brands have overlap with their higher end lines, the term "boutique" carries a lot more understood meaning because of how we use it in other markets already. This is why I think it is a much better term. There won't ever be a word that perfectly defines all fragrances. There will be some exceptions to any term. But "boutique" is a lot more intuitive than "niche".
@@FragranceBros When I think of boutique, it instantly creates the picture of an exclusive luxury fragrance store. Though this term is more suitable, just saying that it would take a very long time for people to get used to it. Your idea of getting rid of the word is quite commendable. Nobody really gave it much thought.
@@scentinal8846 You may be right. I'm not necessarily trying to change the world. I'm just suggesting a better way to say things.
Great POV 👏👏👏👏
So I was totally against this at the beginning of the video. By the end I do mostly agree with this. I think there should be categories that are descriptive of quality.
thank you for watching! 🙂