The way I understand the dark side is this quote " Don't tempt me frodo understand that I would use this from a desire to do good but through me it would wield a power to great and terrible to imagine" Basically no matter who you are or what your intentions are if you use the dark side it will corrupt and destroy you every time
EXACTLY! The One Ring and what it does to people is the PERFECT way to comprehend the Dark Side. Also another good way to view the Dark Side is a drug addiction. It makes you feel good, or numbs the pain, of whatever effect you're after, for a brief moment. But then you're left chasing it over and over, and it takes over your life. Suddenly that brief high or relief each time you use it is gone, and you're left chasing down more and more just to feel it again.
@@alexielshadowangel that's because both come from the same place, Classical storytelling, Tolkien does it with English Catholic inspirirations while George Lucas used both western and Eastern spirituality, but both reach the same place.
@@ArgentWolf95 you're miss understanding the force again there is no ying and yang there is just the force the dark side is succumbing to selfish desires to force your will over others.
@@digitbit3180 I'm talking about George Lucas and Tolkien as writers, what their inspirations were, not the force itself. There's a *lot* of documentation that George used both western and eastern philosophies in creating Star Wars. Tolkien is well known for his good vs evil morality in Lord of the Rings for two reasons: He wanted to created a mythology for the Anglo-Saxon cultures of the English, and he was also Catholic, so his spiritual influences were Christian. This is why the core themes of Star Wars and Lord of the Rings are family and light vs darkness. Light being 'good', and 'dark' being evil.
Based on this perspective, that would mean that Anakin's purpose was to restore the force to its natural phase (balance) by destroying the source of its corruption (Sidious/himself) and allowing Luke to begin the process of getting things in order.
Yes, The Force is balanced as life persists and proliferates. That universal life force being abused and perverted corrupts it, that's why with always look deformed, they are being deformed. When they abuse the force they invite evil in and become more corrupted. The common threads in the belief systems Lucas has practiced and still at least partially identifies with (Metgodism and Buddhism) says that humans are imperfect with good and bad motivations and that discipline towards the good yields good results and fixation on the self, selfish desires and ego will make you sink and spiral and lead to greater evils until you finally see you must abandon them. The same is true of moral drift and addiction.
Yes George was adamant that one could not dabble in the dark without inevitably falling. The dark side is evil and even using it occasionally can ruin a person. Slippery slope kinda thing
@@Underworlddream Its a good way to describe it. The Darkside is part of us all, yet somehow wrong, and only proves itself evil some time after something started to head that way. We have to handle it, or it will handle us.
I think this misunderstanding partly comes from books like "Master and Apprentice". Consider this: "...It [balance in the force] would mean the darkness would be just as strong as the light. So it doesn’t matter what we do, because in the end, hey, it’s a tie! It doesn’t matter which side we choose.” ... “It matters,” Qui-Gon said quietly. “It matters which side we choose. Even if there will never be more light than darkness. Even if there can be no more joy in the galaxy than there is pain. For every action we undertake, for every word we speak, for every life we touch-it matters. I don’t turn toward the light because it means someday I’ll ‘win’ some sort of cosmic game. I turn toward it because it is the light." So I can see why people mistake the concept of balance if even Qui-Gon does not really clarify it.
Qui-Gon is a hypocrite. He's literally following Living Force at the same time as he believes in Cosmic Force prophecies. Which is it, does he focus on the present or is he concerned with the future?
Another way to think of it is considering one of the major steps to becoming a Jedi/Sith. For the Jedi, it means revisiting and later overcoming one's darkest past and worst fears. A good example is in the game, Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords (KOTOR II). When you have a high influence with your companions, you learn about their past, what challenges they have faced and where they are in the game. After speaking with them and helping them come to terms with what happened, you (the Jedi Exile, Meetra Surik) can convince them to become a Jedi. For the Sith, it means fully embracing and giving in to one's passions and emotions; particularly hatred and anger. Part of that means killing someone whom one deeply loves or has a strong attachment/feelings for. Such was the case for virtually every Sith be it Sidious, Vader, Bane, etc...
star wars is just a cheap😂 copy of Hindu religion. Every thing about force and star war Idea came from Hindu religion ☯️. In over religion story demon or devil are looking for a way to become immortal. Or full control over everything by force and fear . But when they do that. Karma comes back. the god takes a form for human body and destroy that evil. And bring peace and order in society. There are some humans in over religion who found a way to live long and become a god 🙏 after they disconnected them self from the world and found enlightenment. Does this sound familiar star wars is just a cheap copy of my religion
Fun story I think of whenever the Force comes up: `A young student challenges a master in a race up the mountain to their temple. At first the young man races forth, charging through foliage and leaping across streams. Vaulting rock after rock he races ahead. Eventually even the youth's strength gives out, and he sits for a moment to rest, only to see the master striding patiently past him. The student, unable to stand and amazed the ancient master had even kept up with him, begs an explanation; "You fight with the mountain, try and make it obedient to you. Yet the mountain is stronger than you are, and crushed you every step of the way. The mountain is stronger than I, so I surrender myself to all it has to offer. And with every step my friend carries me further to the top."`
This is the content we need. Honour to you, Team Geetsly's, for your efforts. Your series on the Jedi lightsabre philosophies is what made me realise there is more to you guys than mere nerding. May the Force be with you.
This puts a new spin on the Bendu. Not a grey being, but one who is psychologically incapable of either succumbing to their worst impulses fully, nor letting go and letting the force take the wheel. Even in his last appearance, the Bendu, while angry, is neither without control of himself, nor does he discriminate between rebel or imperial in his rage. Kind of interesting really.
@@jebkerman5422 they were the personification of the light and dark side of the force more or less the best and worse in theory. If you noticed the sister was kind, gentle, selfless and understanding. While the son was selfish, prideful, wrathful and arrogant. Thus was showing the absolute aspects of the two sides of the force. But remember mortis was also in another plane of existence so while what they experienced did happen think of it more like a spiritual journey
@@jebkerman5422 it does and doesn't at the same time. What it showed was the dark side would eventually lead you to ruin as you can not just use a little bit of dark side, it was showing end result of being fully one with the dark side of the force. It was also showing that everyone has darkness in them as shown with Ahsoka and Anakin when the son corrupted them. Anakin was already on path to the dark side as even as jedi he used force choke on living beings. The Bendu causes confusion as he says the jedi follows the ashla and the Sith follow the Bogan. Implying there is two sides but that's Disney changing the narrative, Disney is going more Taoism rather then Christianity.
My own brother once compared the Dark Side of the Force to a drug. It completely destroys you and yet you can't help but take more of it. And all because you want to feel a temporary high.
The Force doesn't completely control beings. It's as much reacting to people's actions and choice by nudging things to redress the imbalance, sometime that's on a cosmic level, sometimes it's much smaller
@Michael Andrei Palon, you're basically stating what Kreia in KOTOR 2 came to think about "the Force". That game was a great deconstruction and critique of everything Force related IMO.
The Star Wars franchise itself can't really figure out what the Force is. At least in Legends, the Force is very often portrayed as having a Yin and Yang dualism. The ancient Je'daii order saw the Force in this way, and their homeworld literally had light side and dark side moons. Then there were Darth Traya and Darth Caedus (ironically, Sith Lords) who tried looking at the unity of the Force beyond the light side-dark side dualism. And there were Jedi heretics who said the Force did not have any intrinsic light or dark side aspects; the Force only reflected the intentions and methods of those using it. Even Canon like the Prime Jedi is deep in Yin-Yang dualism.
Yes they say that alot. It's tell vs show. We have never been shown that including the dark side has improved anything. No one has been more balanced for allowing the dark to impact them. No one was ever shown to have been wrong to reject the dark in favor of the light. What we are shown overruled what they try to say. After all, Kreia and Caedus failed.
@@unigaming9921 The Je'daii order in Legends successfully balanced the light and dark sides for literally over 10,000 years. Daegen Lok's error was extremism, going full dark side with no balance, and he did not make that decision until after he became insane from terrifying force visions. For whatever reason, it's like the Force itself no longer balanced its dual nature, and all the Jedi and Sith battles were just a manifestation of the Force being sick.
@BeethovenIsGrumpyCat says who? We know nothing about them other than that they had a specific belief. And we know that because we are told so literally over 20 millenia after the fact. The fact that this highly mythologized group spoken about over 25000 after the fact has a belief that promptly NEVER works when we see it play out should be the red flag.
The original idea was rather vague and a very tamed down aspect. Yoda lifting Luke's X-wing out of the swamp was about as crazy as the force got in the original trilogy - that and the force lightning. It was a more sublime thing on the whole befitting knightly commando teams. Altgough I would argue that Taoism is poorly understood, as it is not rooted in dualism as conceived by the west. Yin and yang are not good and evil. Evil is something else in taoism. Yin and yang are the aspects of receiving and giving ... of being acted upon and acting. The purest essence of yang is a raw idea. The purest essence of yin is a formless mass that isn't even a formless mass (a bose-einstein condensate of a bose-einstein condensate). The idea - the energy and the receptive element work together and exchange roles to create what is - much as how pendulums or springs oscillate - the entire universe is in varying states of acting and being acted on. A taoist sage must be receptive to this exchange and work with it. Swim with the current to the edge of the river rather than against it. Foolish people expend great effort to barely accomplish something that could be had by working with the tao. Evil within taoism is effectively attempting to usurp authority over the tao. It's more nuanced, but it would be taking the example of the foolish person to a new level. The best example is how one goes about stilling a tub of water you are in. Generally speaking, the best way to still the water is to be still, yourself. A foolish person might try to counteract the waves with splashes and get overwhelmed... but the evil person will try to crush the waves - perhaps first with his hands, then with increasing means until he's made the pool of water into a container with water that can't have surface waves. The evil person does not accept the notion that things lay outside their control. A proper jedi should be more like a proper taoist sage - working with the force within its context. I think this video gives the force a bit too much personality/will... but the whole thing is fiction and largely subject to rule of cool, particularly in much of the expanded universe.
I remember learning the real difference between the two from one of *your* videos on why Grey Jedi don't actually work in universe. That's how good y'all are :D
@@yokaivegaurd8707 wrong you say both as if theres only 2 force sensitive groups. The jedi have been known to work with other orce users, even if they werent jedi. So no they dont fear or hate anyone that isnt a jedi. Jedi also dont want control, they serve the republic. There was a time where they were powerful but laws were made to counter that. Gray jedi dont exist
"You can't choose what you feel or how you feel it, but you can choose what to do with it." Such a great distinction. I'm a mental health therapist, & I work with so many people that seek to eliminate all "negative" or "dark side" feelings entirely; fear, anger, sadness, hate, jealousy, despair, etc, rather than choosing healthy responses to those emotions or balance them out with countering emotions such as gratitude, compassion, and feeling connected to others. The attempt to completely control or dominate (dealing in absolutes) all aspects of one's emotions, or to use those emotions to as a method of dominating, controlling, &/or hurting others, becomes deeply unhealthy, likely resulting in destructive behavior.
it's even an echo of the films. Yoda explicitly states 'you must learn to let go of that which you fear to lose'. he never once says fear of loss is bad. just that a Jedi must be able to let go and move forward. yes there is fear and pain but, you can't allow it to bog you down.
This may sound a tad oversimplified, but I think finding internal balance is better than seeking to impose external balance. Some Jedi seem to have overlooked that perspective.
This is why Grey Jedi aren't a thing, at least not as a force-users in balance between Jedi and Sith. By the way, a lot of that dualism in Legends is either a lore-ish explanation of a game mechanic (KOTOR), a direct manipulation (Vergere, Lumiya, Darth Traya) or a point-of-view/unreliable narration that fan sources took literally...
Good luck trying to explain things to people in the Star Wars community. You have to write a video essay for most to believe it lol my friend and I are still debating on ‘balance’ but now I’ve git his video to send to him too lmao
@@Alex.Hustad Sure, but your feelings dont override reality. I have no problem with his beliefs, it’s that he wants to pass it off as the absolute truth
This explanation is so good! The 'Light Side' really is how the Force is meant to be, and the 'Dark Side' is what selfish people want it to be for themselves. It's actually quite religious.
You know how Luke throws his lightsaber aside at the end of ep 6 and tells the Emperor "I'll never join you". And how he refuses to kill Vader. That is the most Christian thing I have ever seen in fiction. (If you don't get what I mean, think about Jesus yelling at his disciple when he draws a sword on the guys coming to kill Jesus).
It's coming from a lot of new starwars media that seek to have their cake and eat it too I think every "side" should have ups and downs the lightside is the hardest and not for everyone it takes sacrifice and dedication but in the end you'll receive an eternity of peace and understanding the grey Jedi are people who couldn't make that sacrifice but can still do good in the world and connect with the common man the way a Jedi who is abandoning everything for enlightenment can't the sith is for people who want the power to change fate and dominate but should be careful that they don't lose themselves to it most will fail and will spend an eternity reaping what they have sown
The only thing that really confuses me is the mortis arc and how that plays into this definition of the light side, as the father was portrayed as the balance of the two and the daughter was the full embodiment of the light.
Please remember that mortis ended with the dark killing all three. It isn't a story of balance between light and dark. Light followed the father. Dark rejects the father. The daughter is the living force in harmony with the cosmic force. Her nature brings balance when followed.the son is out of harmony, and its nature is to destroy it if carried out.
I was always confuse when trying to understand the light and dark side of the force, and now I understand why. Thank for this explication who was been able to make understand this !
Basically the nuances of the Force are SWTOR. You can be a Sith that taps into the dark side but still be loyal, love, and compassionate person, aka Lana Beniko & Revan.
They got it wrong. There is no Light Side, there is only the Force. The Dark Side is imbalance. George Lucas made the mistake of not sharing this clearly.
When I think about balance in the force I remember some stories from legends about the precursor to the Jedi, the Je'daii. Tens of thousands of years BBY a force tradition developed on Tython where the goal was to be balanced between what we would perceive as Light and Dark. Anyone there that could not maintain that balance was banished to some sort of isolated temple where they would have to meditate until they could come back to the middle point. Very different from how users of the force are depicted in film and TV.
This is one perspective on the force (that of the Jedi), which is also the perspective of the films. Since Clone Wars was used as evidence, I take it as well, since there we have multiple perspectives. The most direct one is the representation of the Ones of Mortis with a light side, a dark side and a controlling element in the middle. Which is more representative of the ying-yang idea than the force vs its cancer. So I would argue that both interpretations are correct and valid points of view in SW.
The most fun thing I find about the Ones is Abeloth, the chaos. A regular woman brought along to act as a helping hand to the Father, she grew deeply connected with her family. She eventually grew old and was unable to stop their warring. She drank and bathed, using the two Force Nexuses on the planet to become powerful enough to stop them. This made her an impossibly powerful being, commonly known as The Mother. The Ones looked upon her with disgust, constructing a prison made of black holes for her, and relocating to Mortis. I find this interesting because it highlights a false belief in the yin-yang concept, that there's a fourth thing, chaos. Instead of chaos, though, there's just the succumbing to one specific side. Abeloth is unneeded and taints the ideas.
Both are true in their own senses. The long-term goal here, though, is to choose to walk the light path. The dark side is natural, it simply exists to remind practitioners what they are. We acknowledge it and strive to overcome it. It depends on the will of their users to choose their path. (I'm not referring to just the Jedi and Sith). The dark side always has the upper hand to control destiny. One chooses to accept that he/she is just a part of nature, and we have no control over everything (e.g. aging, sickness, death). That is a balanced and healthy mindset, resembling Buddhism. Regular people refuse such fundamental concepts and want to bend the universal rules to their selfish desires, hence they immerse in the dark side and create imbalance. The key difference here is that the Sith are not precisely the embodiment of the Dark Side. When we realize negative behaviors, we will attempt to fix them. The Dark Side always appears in every being, even the Jedi, so they have to go as far as possible to purge them. The Sith manipulates the Dark Side, only to their desires.
I think an interesting way to look at how the "balance" in the Force is supposed to be, is like an ecosystem. There's balance in a healthy ecosystem, however, if you pollute that ecosystem, exploit it, and/or introduce a foreign species in it, or even remove a keystone species, suddenly it goes out of whack! It's unbalanced! Only by eliminating what caused the unbalance, can you restore it. The Sith and the Dark Side are the oil spill, the deforestation, the unnatural ecological disaster that upsets the balance. THAT'S how in the end Anakin DID restore balance in the Force, he destroyed Sidious and in doing so himself, the last Sith in the galaxy. He destroyed the pollutant in the Force, thereby restoring balance, even if one of those pollutants was himself.
Well, any ecosystem can, and thus must be prunned and artificially controlled. Nature never chooses the optimal patch - it tend to cling to the first thing, that somehow worked. And returning to the force - true lightsider, like Jar-Jar, can be just as destructive as a sith lord.
What about natural disasters like asteroid, megavolcano/earthquakes etc.. that destroy all living creatures, but also create new life, like dinosaur and mammals story?
@@DarkImplement its in the name. Natural disasters are needed (forest fires help redwood seedlings, or errosion and constand changing for advent species), nature is never still, and natural disasters a part of it, they helped create diversity. Us, on the other hand, and all we do are far from natural, we make changes so fast, we implode ecosystems
@@vladcrow4225 also, youre just wrong. A fully functioning ecosystem is self functioning. No human needed, it was here well before us, and will be well after us. But nowadays, fully working ecosystems are rare, humanity left them mangled and in disarray, thats why a lot of them need constant supervision. They have fallen far from full functionality, even when on the surface, they seem fine and natural
@@vladcrow4225 That's for example why our intestines contain gut microbiota despite in evolution there could be developed a digestive system that doesn't need them
I KNEW IT!!!!! I've been thinking and saying this for quite some time now but I figured it was probably just my personal interpretation based on opinion. Finally, vindication. I was interpreting things correctly after all. Awesome. Thank you for making this video.
It would seem then the dark side would be easily tempted by new users of the force, but for those that had,had it for a longer time would find contentment, so I wonder how Lucas felt that anakin was driven to the dark if he had been trained to let his feelings go. It seems more like he never found the true path and had alway had that anger bubbling just below the surface, and the jedi masters should have recognized it or at least felt it and taken him away from temptation instead of throwing him headfirst into it.
I always view Yoda's jedi as monks who are at their best when away from conflict but when put into stressful situations like the clone wars then many of them fall
Anakin had formed an attachment to his mother and why they said he too old, he already had his own perception of the world around him. The Jedi never could severe that attachment, or change his perception of the world.
Separating children from their parents is unnatural The Jedi Order had fallen so much that they couldn't even see how much wrong that was. No wonder they were so blind.
The Jedi had their own failings and misconceptions. How can they help someone to find the true path if they don't know it themselves? The Jedi had no attachments, so no one was attached to them, so not only saw no one the need to defend them, they were easily swayed against them. @Third_Planet Why did you think Palpatine wanted the Jedi to be Generals of the Army of the Republic? The Jedi were forced to sacrifice sentient living beings. Either they treated them like Droids, which is not the way of the (Light Side) Force or they acknowledge what the Clones are and sooner or later die, because of the Jedi leading the charge to save as many of them as possible and sooner or later sacrificing themselves.
Funny that as a kid, I had a better understanding of it than I do now. I was so confused when I started hearing about a light side as it never really existed in the films. That is... until the mouse attacked.
@@autistinquisitor9441 honestly, it's a shame how EU writers turned an interesting mix between westen and eastern beliefs into another generic grey morality.
People also get the Mortis ARC wrong as well, as you've mentioned. The Son was never a master of the "Dark Side". The Son utilized the force, its more aggressive aspects at least, without succumbing to the Dark... UNTIL Anakin showed up, and the Son got too ambitious. Nightsisters made this aware as well, in their belief system. The Son helps them hunt, gives strength and passion, etc. All the natural stuff you need, but he wasn't immersed into the Dark till he lost his sister and then fell to the Dark after that.
Or more clearly said The Daughter and The Son were the representations of the lower-cases not the upper-cases. More an representation of the own feelings that every sentient being have than directly the Force.
About a year ago I made a comment as part of a response to a question posing what we would want our calling to be. This video reminded me of it: "I think there is a misconception about the Order and emotions. To be calm is not to be without feelings. Serenity merely helps prevent strong emotion from gaining control. To deny emotion is unhealthy and can lead to ruin. Recognize the negative ones, then let them go. Accept the positive, but do not let them overwhelm. Feel, but maintain your center. Heal the self, heal the other, heal the Order."
My impression of the Force was always that there is no Light or Dark side to the actual Force itself. The Force is simply a unifying power that permeates everything. It is the actions of those who use the force that then categorize it into Light or Dark. Which in many cases can be a very subjective thing.
What I think is interesting is how each trilogy defines what the Force is: The original trilogy set the force up as a mystical religion based in feeling and mind (a la meditation and a quest for inner peace); the prequels reinvented it as a science (the genetics of midichlorians), and the Disney set of films made it a choice or will; this also follows the cultural mindsets of Western thinking (70s and 80s saw a big shift to "nature" through yoga, spiritual awakening, and even the "darkside" of cults who rejected society; the 90s/early 00s saw a rejection of belief systems in favor of tech and science; and Disney... Well, they basically made the statement that the "Force is what we want it to be because we own this bitch now". 😂
You're on to something, but specifically the Disney films making it a choice or will is in line with the rampantly exagerating individualism we see today, where people are more and more like "screw tradition and social expectations, be whatever you want to be"
I really dislike new star wars it misunderstands the force that new philosophy tries to have it's cake and eat it too my stance is this if you wanna transcend your mortal body and reach an understanding of the universe be a conventional Jedi if you wanna help those around you and live a happy life be a grey Jedi but eternity should be lost to you and if you wanna dominate and gain power be a sith not the new starwars view that portrays a balence between light and dark as the correct choice
@@joriswegner8421 now I'll go against my position and say I actually DONT think George should be the definitive authority on starwars but my point stands that this reinterpretation of the force wasn't the original intention but in more recent years the middle road has been pushed more strongly as the "correct" path rather than one of many paths that lead to different conclusions which is what I personally believe the force should be
@@Alpha_Draconis20 indeed I think the best solution is them all to be true in their own way but he wrong in others and the fan to decide which interpretation is the best
2:26 Technically it gets referred to as "the good side" - such as when Luke is talking to Leia about redeeming Vader - which I always assumed came about because it was before specific terminology was fully established (similar to why Luke calls 3po and R2 "robots" instead of droids in ANH).
Theoretically, "the good side" Luke was referring to could've maybe been Vader's own, internal "good side": Anikan; not necessarily an external aspect of the Force.
@@ronn-ammon8975 If that was Luke's intention, he would've said "his good side" instead of " the good side". The latter phrase implies that Luke wanted turn Vader back to a point before he chose to reject what he was taught as a Jedi, not just being a "good" person.
I have been arguing this for years, it's wonderful to see others coming out and speaking to it. If you just take the movies and works of Lucas, you get a very different Force than what is often seen. I know that people like to point to things in the EU and say "But see they were treating it as a yin yan" but the fact is that much of the EU was just wrong in its depiction of things. Dark Horse and the EU authors generally did their own thing, and while much of it was signed on by LucasFilm, it doesn't mean that it all adhered correctly to Lucas' creation. I think that had people understood the reality of the Force, that the Darkside was a twisted, poisoning, corruption of the Force that would quickly dominate its users, not the other side of the coin, and that balance required the cleansing of the Force of that darkness, we might have gotten better SW media over the years.
This video has perfectly described how the force works, explaining it much better than I ever could. It also explains why the concept of a "Grey Jedi" isn't possible. It's so, so annoying when people say that Cal is going to be a Grey Jedi, when he's CLEARLY slowly falling to the dark side.
I would love to see more of the dark side, and the nuances of it. While it’s seen as the quick and easy path, I’d argue it seems quick and easy, but many of its rewards can be just as difficult to earn.
Not to plug content, but KotOR2 is hands down the single greatest examination of the dark and light sides through a more critical lens. They explore the nuances of the dark side in ways untouched by other content.
@@drumlessons833 yea, I LOVE Kotor 2, and especially Kreia. She gave a scolding hot dismantling of the Jedi Order, the Sith Order, and even the force itself! And that’s what got me into the Old Republic MMO. And I love it’s interpretation of the dark side and the sith through characters like Lana Beniko. But it’s always why I don’t like the idea of “the force is the light side, and the dark side is a perversion of it” and I’ve never really liked that because it’s boring to me
@@kanekikingstorm2113 I would argue that characters like Lana Beniko demonstrate for light & dark in a struggle within. What works long term is light, but all she knows is dark, and she is figureing things out by her intellect.
Fair, though the canon has really changed in how it portrays that. The Ones of Mortis are a particular case in which balance is portrayed as being between the Light and Dark, not just in the Light.
No it isn't. Remember the son kills the father. We have to remember the narrative in which they are shown. The daughter, when fulfilling her nature, serves the father. The son, following his nature, kills all three
The Dark Side is only dangerous when not balanced out by the light side just as the light without the dark will only blind you and give you an utopian view of the world
@@Dreamfox-df6bg It's never said the one's are light and dark. In fact, it makes little sense to say so since the son falls to the dark side during the arc. Remember Lucas was involved in that arc, and he is staunchly against light/dark balance. So the interpretation that the son represents the dark side is entirely fan theory. Most reasonably, he represents the passions, emotions, and driving forces which inflame and move us. Such as anger. But anger is not the dark side. Nor is the son. Most likely the father represents the light side, and they represent the duality which requires balanced to stay in the light, and the son's fall compromised the entire family.
I agree with you. One of the worst things about Star Wars as it’s progress and evolved over the years is that it really has perverted the nature of the force
This was very deep. It can be seen that people can learn in real life from this. I do want to see more stories showing the Dark Side and how it usually destroyed the people who abused the Force and gave into their desires for power. The ideas of balance kind of reminds me of the game series, Darksiders and their idea of balance and corruption, and also the ideas of balance from the game series, Destiny. All 3 have great stories about them in my opinion, but I will say, KOTOR 1 and 2 were the ones that taught me the important lessons that is similar to the stuff said in this video. I've read a lot of stories that do this style of balance as well. Anyways, great video. Here's to great many things in the future.
I used to be heavily in the camp of “Balance means Light = Dark” camp. It wasn’t until Disney started mucking with the lore that I really started to pay attention to Lucas’s original vision. I guess you could say that the effort to change the Jedi and the understanding of the Force under Disney’s reign is a manifestation of the Dark Side, and it woke me up to how my previous understanding of Balance doesn’t fit into this particular franchise.
@@mrsboat That's not what Mace does though. He channeled his negative emotions, and he was able to do so on such a lvl without being corrupted because he was completely in control of his own emotions. It was a testament to his emotional maturity.
@@happyslapsgiving5421he did, but when he killed Jedi, he didnt bring balance, he did in worse, after 20 years, he killed his dark master and himself to end the sith, which son and his father brought balance to the Force, only Light side remains
Please do a video on the Jedi's perspective on the Force. Including those Jedi that followed the will of the Force over the will of the Order. Like Qui-Gon.
I’m convinced that the reason people want balance in the force to mean that the light and dark must be equalized is all just one big rationalization for wanting to allow Jedi to get angry and use force lightning and choke people.
The way I understood the dark side is that it would be like sitting in a room with someone shooting heroin and just doing it discreetly. Then, by the time anyone's noticed, they're already an addict.
This is why I always liked Legends more: never really agreed with how George saw it. Yes he created it but I always felt there could be more to the Force (that and knowing how George has even retconned himself multiple times). Grey Jedi/Je'daii always interested me more than either Jedi or Sith. Much like Luke's Jedi Order in Legends.
@@christianrivera1708 So, you're saying that if I were to just randomly come up to you and punch you in the face, that would suddenly turn you into an angsty, emo edgelord antihero hellbent on killing me?
I wish this video had come 10 years ago when I had to fight with dozens of "grey" jedi and sith because people don't fucking understand the fundamental building blocks of Star Wars.
This is such a well-thought discussion. I find it strange that this discourse has not been explored in the films, they'd give a greater understanding on the force and the way it impacts its users.
@@dallin1056 the clone wars. The Jedi civil war lead by Revan and Malak During the events of the Jedi covenant and their force visions The Jedi purge done by Kriea, Sion, and Nihlus The Jedi Civil war led by Exar Kun and Dark Jedi Ulic Qel-Droma
I learned this in the Revenge of the Sith novelization, which did a great job of describing Obi-Wan as having perfected this state, of being able to just turn himself over to a zen state within the Force and allow it to direct his actions, like a leaf in a stream.
That’s still holds true in many of the Star Wars media is still coming out. Video games aside. Because yes, the force in itself is what their goal is and the Darkside of the force is basically well you imposing your will upon other people and not thinking of the greater good of being selfish. It’s like your quote from George Lucas said. It’s quick, easy, but it only gives you short term happiness. It makes you feel hollow at the end. Whereas, being compassionate, it’s hard, long, but at the end of the road, it’s very fulfilling.
People like to say "balancing the light and dark" like it's balancing a set of scales rather than balancing on the edge of a cliff facing the abyss while trying to dip your toes in as much as possible. (Aka not a good idea)
I am surprised no Sith ever made the "Jedi are slaves of the Light with no free wills" joke while they proclaimed themselves as the freest peoples in the galaxy who can do whatever they wanted with no regards, no laws and no consequences like at all. Also, I would like to hear how the Jedi in particular conceived the Force as well! So please, do a video about it!
@@thelvadam5269 Both Jedi and Sith are drunken on to something to keep themselves going. The Republic, the Empire, power, victory, the Force, knowledge and many more.
That take on the force makes a lot of sense. With the Sith showing things to the Jedi or put them into situations that would make them doubt the will of the force in order to make them rebel against it, aka fall to the dark side.
Well said. Makes me think of obi wan upping the badassery after qui gon dies. He's got these darkside emotions in him, bc theyre natural, but hes not giving into the dark side. He's just fighting with determination
I always hate when media tries to present the idea of a balance between Good and Evil. Morality was not a part of the original Concept of Yin and Yang, and the two are supposed to be complimentary opposites, not opposing extremes. Evil is what happens when things are out of balance, it's not a part of the balance itself. The idea that evil is somehow necessary is absurd.
Lucas thinks that hate is always a bad thing, but Chinese crullers were invented with hate in mind. Imagine voodoo dolls made of dough. That is the basic premise. This pastry born of hate is delicious to me.
I do think that painting the Jedi as strict stoicists and Sith as sadistic/uncaring hedonists makes me question the Jedi interpretation of the force, but certainly once "the light side" was introduced I think the concept of balance / a new force user / a middle path in the treatment for Duel of the Fates (note, fates plural) would really work
Good video! This is how I understand the Force to be as well. I think that many people misinterpret what the term "balance" is meant to convey. They seem to think, reasonably enough perhaps, that it must be between the light and the dark, but it has more to do with the balance of all living things so that they exist harmoniously. The darksider seeks to prey upon other beings in an unsustainable and even parasitic manner. They would make themselves individually very powerful at the expense all other living beings. The consequence is that the Force as a whole is lessened since it is generated from the harmony of all living things with each other. Thus the darkside weakened the universe and if left unchecked would destroy it completely. The restoration of balance that is spoken about is the elimination of these darkside parasites without and the dark emotions, thoughts, and habits within.
I don't think filone wanted this and it's unfair to call FanFiction(i personally like FanFiction and Saw alot of preaty good stories that i can recomend If You want and i thinking of trying It out since i have alot of ideas that want to wright for free) i feel like it's part of the fandom fault
It is a yin yang tho. The force is based on Taoism which uses the yin yang. It's about going with the flow of nature which is in balance like the yin yang symbol. A human dying of natural causes is part of that balance. A human being killed for no other reason disrupts the natural balance. Death in and of itself is apart of the force. Murder is not.
@@lilianemachadostigliano1727 someone elsewhere pointed out that the video games which made the force a morality slider didn’t help either. Remember in KOTOR the reward for being a grey Jedi was cool robes and access to all the force powers.
God damn thank you for pointing this out man!!! I've been talking with people for years and telling them that there is no light or dark, it's just what you make of it.
A video that most SW fans should watch. I've heard so many times that "grey" Jedi achieve balance through both the light and dark side, or by rejecting both, that there is a light side pull just like the pull to the dark side... all complete misconceptions. And if you play SWTOR you're gonna read these almost daily in chat, and it's no helped by the fact that the game has several story elements that spread those wrong ideas about the force.
@@unigaming9921 "False Lore" When you start declaring different bits of lore from _the same work_ to be "true" or "false" simply based on what you agree with, that's not "truth", that's headcanon. You claimed in another thread that we haven't seen anything to show that use of the Dark Side could lead to anything other than corruption and destruction. And while I will give you that, what you've shown me is that if we ever _were_ shown an example of where the Dark Side was used in a beneficial manner, you would reject it regardless.
@@VestedUTuber I haven't done that at all. Don't confuse interpreting statements so they align with what we are shown as cherrypicking. What we are shown is clear. The Dark Side is absolute evil. It isn't really a question, it has always harmed or destroyed those who touch it at all. Anakin brings balance to the Force by rejecting it and returning to the light. Any interpretation of the works that can't account for that is flawed. And given as these are Lucas' own interpretations, that makes sense. The effort of secondary authors to change it simply don't work.
I've been dying to find such a well made explanatory video such as this one on the force. You're so right in that SO MANY people absolutely do not understand the basic idea of Light being "listening to the force" VS Dark being "bending the force to their own will", leading to weird ideas and alternate means of using the force. More often than not, what people call "grey jedis" are light side users who are at odds with the specifics of the Jedi order itself, while Jedi order and Light Side are not the same thing. TLDR: I've been within the 1% and been frustrated for decades with the 99% when it comes to Star Wars based Roleplay and fictions which misunderstand and twist the concept of the Force itself, making it often basic and incoherent.
WEG west end games d6 dice pool system. character arch type concept. Then WotC 3e D&D/Star Wars, multiclassing character level build concept. Then mix in Whitewolf/World of Darkness (WoD) d10 dice pool system of Vampire, werewolf, mage and changeling. Got to add Rifts, Dune, not forgetting 1990's era Wicca. Anger issues with manic depression is rough to grow through as a teenager and young adult. But we loved our word math problem wargames. Math is logic to discipline emotions. Spock and Picard were role models. Some of Luke's students were so char coal grey they were in different shades of black. But they made an effort to do better each day they could. The novel, " I, .. Jedi " is a great read on a space cop turn rebel pilot, finding out he is a Jedi talent trying to rescue his girlfriend who his father put her father into prison for smuggling. Point is, we already seen how bad the writing of the EU novels were. But we already got to read how Luke's generation of Jedi raised their children into adults. Then we got the Prequel Jedi Order. Low level of the Force just makes you better than average at cheating in cards & dice. Or a racquetball/ tennis player.
It is interesting that this is a debate in-universe too. The orders that preceded the Jedi, the Dai Bendu & the Je'daii Order, both believed in the balance between Light & Dark. The Je'daii changed into the Jedi when they had fractured under the pressure of the Dark Side using Rakata. Their conflict with the Rakata & the subsequent Force Wars taught them that the Dark Side was a cancer to the Force, not something to be balanced out with a kind of Light Side. In that way the understanding of the Force is a kind of science: people will hold beliefs about what it is/how it works based on their best guesses until new, solid information is put onto the table & changes their understanding. In that way it's no different than understanding the Laws of Physics or the Law of Conservation, or other Scientific Laws & theories. It is an interesting thought though that maybe even the interpretation of the Force that we & the Jedi have MAY not be completely right either. After all, Newton's Laws of Motion & Gravity were the main believed factors of physics until Einstein made the general Theory of Relativity. Perhaps the true nature of the Force still isn't known. It's also worth noting the Celestials of Mortis represented the Yin-Yang belief of the Force, & surely such influential people would've had a better understanding of the Force than the Jedi. In the modern galaxy disparate sects of the old beliefs also still exist, like the Bendu of Star Wars Rebels. So perhaps the Ashla/Bogen dichotomy has some kind of real precedent, but we don't have the proper information available to know what it is. I still say that the Jedi's beliefs on the Force are closer to the truth than the others, but who can say for sure? Even though Disney doesn't really care all that much about this discussion & lean into the easy Yin-Yang interpretation, I gotta say the Nature of the Force is nonetheless a super interesting topic to discuss!
This is the first of your videos that I have watched, and I have to say, I am very pleasantly surprised. This was both inside full and concise as well as being a take on the Universe and the force itself that is accurate but often overlooked and or misrepresented buy a lot of fans who are taken in by the categorisation of the light side without actually taking the time to assess how that plays out in the films. I will be subscribing now so I can watch more of your content as the fact you have this inside and this knowledge and I willing to share it so reveley with people who may not understand this has won me over quite well. Well done, and I look forward to watching more of your content. Keep it up.
I believe the Force is uniform and does not have "sides", but the two sides of this conflict choose to describe it this way because one group thinks the magic should be used as they like and the other feels that the magic should one with strict limitations. The Force is like the unbiased terrain they fight over and they disagree over how it should be used.
Fantastic video. This is the explanation I’ve been searching about the Force. Based on Disneys recent content like the visions show, it is obvious they took the misconception of the force and ran with it. There is no light side to the force because naturally it is good, the dark side is unnatural and by existing the balance is thrown off.
How to the Sister, Brother, and Father fit into this rejection of the dichotomy? While i agree with the idea that the Dark Side is a perversion of the Force and there is no Light or Dark, the Clone Wars seems to contradict this in the Mortis Arc with embodiments of this dichotomy: the Sister for the Light, the Brother for the Dark, and the Father as the mediating balance between the two. So if the Force is just the Force as it should be and the Dark Side is the disturbance of the balance, how does the Sister fit into this? Or the Father? Or the entire point of the Celestial?
Exactly. 99% of us aren't wrong, he just created a false claim and cherrypicked evidence to back it up. The Mortis arc was quite explicit about what it means to have balance in the force.
It really doesn’t fit at all. This seems more like what George’s original vision was for the force rather than what it’s evolved into. Luke Skywalker and Mace Windu were perfect examples within the films themselves that contradicted this. They showed the balance of using the dark side as a tool almost letting it possess them for a few moments but without letting it consume them. Return of the Jedi literally proved that Yoda and Obi Wan and thus the old Jedi way was wrong just like the Sith way showing us that balance is the true path. Even the prequels seemed all about showing how the Jedi way led to arrogance, hypocrisy, and corruption so the only way to avoid repeating history was to learn from both sides to achieve balance just like the Je’daii.
My biggest issue with this idea is that i, a Jedi, would have to completely give in to the will of a mysterious, all-knowing being who's main goal i don't know. This being could not or would not stop the enslavement or total genocide of entire races or planets. It sounds very much like religious zealotry.
EXACTLY like relogious zealotry. it sounds like the cult i grew up in that said "trust in the will of God even if you dont understand and it hurts you". also no "having a will of your own (referred to as "dying to self" and "you dont exist only god in you") and looking after your own needs" (considered selfish). honestly the more i learn about "light side of the force" and how balance was originally intended to be understood the more it sounds like culty churches and triggers religious trauma 😖
If you wanna do a video on how the Jedi conceived the Force, you have my vote, on one condition: You talk about Luke’s Jedi Order in the same video, whatever’s worth bringing up and explaining, if anything like that is there
Thinking about that one time Anakin found out he was going to become Vader and was ready to give up being a force user. But then “The father” had his mind erased because it needed to happen…isn’t that the work of destiny?
You could make an argument that Keria wanted to kill the force cause it was corrupted by the Dark side and beyond saving like Ra's Al Ghul wanting to destroy Gothum because it was corrupted by rampant crime. This can be true from a certain point of view.
Thank you so much for this. I've tried telling people this for many years but they still think the dark side = emotions and "light side" = no emotions. It's only getting worse. The comments section here shows that they still don't get it.
~Canon~ I always saw balance as not "Balance between The Light Side and The Dark Side" but balancing ones own inner darkness and light. Being a decent (pardon the phrasing) human being and feeling your emotions without letting them control you. Without that inner dark side to show you what atrocities you can commit, your light has no value. Without your baser instincts, you would have nothing to rise above. To be balanced is to be disciplined and patient, but not letting yourself become unfeeling and detached. In the end, if you look at the Jedi and Sith for a philosophy on the force, it would be trying to understand morality by looking only at ISIS and The Satanic Temple and then making a decision. The two a e just too far from eachother to be comparable. They are the two ends, but the coin is much thicker and there is much more to see.
Ironically some of what you mentioned here is actually tocuehd upon in the Legacy era books. Specifically in one of the New Jedi Order books. In it the jedi Vergere interacts with Luke and teaches him a valuable lesson. She basically goes through his thought process. Which none of his emotions he experienced when he went to confront her were wrong. Afterwards Luke himself ponders for a bit and finally comes to a decision and where he defines what it means for the Jedi. Namely that actions that are selfless in origin are good and that actions which are selfish in nature are evil. It was a rather interesting conversation. If you are wondering, the book in question is Destiny's Way.
While I love dichotomy, I always hated it within a fantasy/space opera setting because dark always meant "evil" and light always meant "good". I do believe there is a yin-yang concept within Star Wars but not within the Force itself. Rather the yin-yang concept is within an individual. A good person will always have their vices and an evil will have a virtue or two. Rebels showed that one of the Light Side can still have close personal bonds yet still serve the greater good. Though I am curious as to know what is the Force. Is it sentient?
Interesting video. I always thought of it as the yin-yang thing. How does bendu, the mortis gods, and the je'daii fit into this though? The existence and explanation of those things seem to be counter to your point.
The Bendu is hardly a good counterpoint, in my opinion. For all his preaching about being "in the middle", his refusal to actively protect life (which would be a way of contributing to the Light Side of the equation by his definition of balance) rather reflects the attitude of an apathetic spectator. Unlike what he wants to believe, there is no "middle" in the "petty battles of Jedi and Sith", as he dismissively calls them. The many Sith Empires that have risen over the millennia are irrefutably forces for evil created through deception, war and murder, and operate on opression, slavery, and authoritarniasm. While the Rebellion and the Jedi fight for peace, harmony and freedom. Even Kanan calls the Bendu out on his moral fence-sitting, and challenges his delusions of being "beyond their petty conflicts" by rightfully pointing out that the Bendu contributes nothing with his inaction and indifference. And instead of explaining his stance, offering alternative solutions, or even showing compassion for other lifeforms, Bendu gets as angry, arrogant and petty as a grumpy old neighbor who wants everyone to get off his lawn for hurting his ego. Ultimately, he's little more than a delusional charlatan convinced that he has the moral high ground just because he chooses to not believe in anything for the sake of not having to fight for it, and to let everything and everyone burn around him despite having the power to make a difference. If anything, he's allowing the Dark Side to spread its corruption and, ultimately, upset the balance of the Force by doing nothing to keep it in check.
@@CouncilCape897 You make a good point about Bendu, and after hearing it, I agree. However, my points about the Mortis gods and the Je'daii still stand. The Mortis gods are a type of conduit in the force, or perhaps a personification of the force. The way that they are portrayed leads me to believe that the nature of the force is not as Geetsly's describes it. Furthermore, the Je'daii, being literally created by the force, were only able to find balance in the middle. Whenever the Je'daii order strayed too far from the middle, Tython would become unstable. Given that Tython had an intense connection in the force, this violent planetary demonstration could prove that the force is meant to be more of a yin-yang rather than Geetsly's hypothesis. I think it is very probable that in the old canon, Geetsly's hypothesis is true, but in the current canon it is not. If you or anyone can refute my arguments, I would be interested to hear it.
"Light & dark are linked, without the one, there is no balance!" Not a very well remembered quote, but I think that is about right. The Clone Wars bought forward this idea.
The quote as best as I can remember is from one of the many Star Wars books published (before dismal Disney.) It is quite along time ago. (The New Jedi order or maybe the jedi academy series?)
Doesn't Luke say in ROTJ when referring to Darth Vader "I can save him! I can bring him back... to the good side." ? Are we not to interpret the good side as the Light Side?
@ty-ty-20 well no, we are shown (regardless of what we are told) that the dark side ALWAYS creates problems. Luke wins by rejecting it in the end. He is failing by giving into it at all up to that point.
@@unigaming9921i think that there is only 2 sides, Good side and Dark Side, no Light Side, Good side with Jedi, Good Force users and neutral force users are balance, while Dark Side with Sith and evil Force users are unbalance and Corruption, that can lead whole world into their tyranny
Thank you! I’ve been obsessed with the idea that basically all Star Wars fans don’t know Star Wars theology and morality and it doesn’t necessarily break down along OT/PT/ST/EU lines, tho it’s caused in part by the EU. This feeds into the idea that the Prequel Jedi Order were bad, that Order 66 was good, the Jedi treated Anakin badly, etc. caused by misconceptions, sometimes George’s utilitarian writing or poor acting but often the result of straight up lies too! The plotholes and bad writing are not meant to be taken as signs of the Order’s faults and deep immorality, it’s just a plothole
This was a very interesting Video and it explained some of the more obscured Nuances of the Force very well. I do however disagree with one Concept in this Video, namely the Idea the being selfish equates to being evil. Being selfish is not evil but a necessary part of a healthy and well adjusted human being. There is nothing more pitiable than a truly selfless Person because a truly selfless Person has no sense of self and defines itself purely on the worth it’s life can bring others and that is no way to live because you need to live your life first and foremost for yourself. If you want to use your Life to help other that’s great but being selfish is not evil but something everyone needs to an extent.
The term "selfish" implies that a person is focused entirely on what the self wants and doesn't concern themselves with the well being of others, so yes, it is inherently bad. While taking care of one's self is inherently, operating under the worldview that the self matters more than anybody does nothing to serve a greater good.
I’d really like a video on the misconception of Grey Jedi. Particularly how people want to label Ahsoka and Qui hon as Grey because they didn’t see eye-to-eye with the council and the order. The reason Ahsoka and Qui-gon questioned the order was because the order itself was becoming corrupted. they were more morally in-line with the light and the Jedi of say the high Republic than that of the Fall of the Republic; Ahsoka and Qui-Gon weren’t Grey for disagreeing with the order, they were just more Light because the order was loosing touch.
The "Light Side" terminology led to the Kotor morality slider and together spawned the "Grey Side" BS, so I think overall it has indeed damaged fans' understanding of the force.
Yet the problem with this is that stories in KOTOR are 10 times better written than in the films. So it's easy to understand why fans liked the concept so much.
Also Jolee is supposed to be a grey jedi but he lectures you if you do anything selfish, immoral or cruel, and praises you for doing good. I think he was trying to be edgy tbh
I've always thought of the force as the light and the dark side as corruption. Luke asks Yoda if the dark side was stronger. He said no its easier. Meaning, the dark side takes the force by the users will. instead of letting it fill you. I was a kid back in the 80s when I watched Yoda tell him that
Yes, Light Side/Light or just Goodness is the Balance of the Force, while Evil or Darkness/Dark Side is just corruption For me, there is only Force, no light or dark, only there is good and evil, evil force users abused Force to make tyranny, while neutral and good force users used the Force in right way and eliminating evil ones
"Fandom Menace never undestand Star Wars" you mean! Just because you don't like a movie doesn't mean that the people who made the movie are assholes! Just the fact that you wrote this, shows that you are a toxic person who doesn't respect anything or anyone! Just because you have a lot of likes doesn't mean you are right! It just means that other people as toxic as you like to badmouth J.J. Abrams!
@@minicle426 I didn't know that there was a rebel Stormtrooper in the original trilogy! I didn't know who had a Casino and cracker story in the original trilogy! I didn't know who had a story about a ship running out of gas in the original trilogy. Help me identify these scenes in the original trilogy because I can't see them at all! You should know, right?
Hot take incoming!!! Star War is a retelling of the Arthurian Legends. You have Luke as Arthur, obviously, while Yoda and Obi are playing Merlin/Nimuë. Lea was meant to be Guinevere and Han Solo was Lancelot, funny how these two names actually sound alike, as Arthur loved and married her while she fell in love with Luke's best friend, Han Solo. Darth Vader being a version of the Dark night. Although I'd argue that the character is closer to a Mordred accompanied by his mother Morgause, even if the blood link is inversed. Mordred is Arthur's enemy but they're blood linked, father/son relationship like Luke and Anakin. Arthur tried to mend it with Mordred and as a result had to sacrifice himself for the greater good, while Darth tried to mend it with his son and sacrificed himself for the greater good. See, it's the same but George wanted the Arthurian Cycle to have an optimistic ending, as opposed to the death of Arthur followed by the destruction of his kingdom, despite his sacrifice, by Saxon invasions. That's why George didn't want to make a sequel, the optimistic ending was the perfect ending in his mind and nothing would have changed that. Instead, he went with prequels to safeguard the ending of episode 3(6).
This subject is how one can tell who has studied Jung and who hasn't. Yes, the darkness is a disruption of the natural order, but it is also part of a greater natural order. There is darkness in every heart, and it must be recognized, confronted, and _integrated_ in order for a person to fully realize their potential. This is the story of Luke.
Unfortunately, stuff like Persona is beyond the understanding of the average SW fan. It's like how the titular Dark Souls of Dark Souls refers to the souls of humans. Human nature is dark, but unfortunately, many religions, like Christianity, consider that a bad thing.
@@DarkAdonisVyers In the occult, we refer to these things as the right-hand path and the left-hand path. The right-hand path is about upholding and submitting to the natural order of life, whereas the left-hand path is more chaotic and focused on distorting and changing the order, often as a response to pain and trauma. Many times, those who follow the natural order end up closing themselves off to greater truths. Dark emotions can help awaken one to a greater consciousness, but it's possible to close oneself off to the light in the process. The true master has two hands.
@@unigaming9921 The funny thing is that the only way that Mace and Obi-wan defeated Sidious and Vader respectively was by using dark side saber techniques.
@DarkAdonisVyers mace used vaapaad. He stayed entirely within the Light, and simply channeled the opponents darkness in an arc back against them. And obiwan didn't use the dark side during their fight
Its all about balance...what people dont know about yin and yang is there is 3 parts, the light, the dark and the circle the two parts create when joined...interesting video and aggravating thinking, like it
The way I understand the dark side is this quote
" Don't tempt me frodo understand that I would use this from a desire to do good but through me it would wield a power to great and terrible to imagine"
Basically no matter who you are or what your intentions are if you use the dark side it will corrupt and destroy you every time
EXACTLY! The One Ring and what it does to people is the PERFECT way to comprehend the Dark Side. Also another good way to view the Dark Side is a drug addiction. It makes you feel good, or numbs the pain, of whatever effect you're after, for a brief moment. But then you're left chasing it over and over, and it takes over your life. Suddenly that brief high or relief each time you use it is gone, and you're left chasing down more and more just to feel it again.
@@alexielshadowangel that's because both come from the same place, Classical storytelling, Tolkien does it with English Catholic inspirirations while George Lucas used both western and Eastern spirituality, but both reach the same place.
Exactly
@@ArgentWolf95 you're miss understanding the force again there is no ying and yang there is just the force the dark side is succumbing to selfish desires to force your will over others.
@@digitbit3180 I'm talking about George Lucas and Tolkien as writers, what their inspirations were, not the force itself. There's a *lot* of documentation that George used both western and eastern philosophies in creating Star Wars.
Tolkien is well known for his good vs evil morality in Lord of the Rings for two reasons: He wanted to created a mythology for the Anglo-Saxon cultures of the English, and he was also Catholic, so his spiritual influences were Christian.
This is why the core themes of Star Wars and Lord of the Rings are family and light vs darkness. Light being 'good', and 'dark' being evil.
Based on this perspective, that would mean that Anakin's purpose was to restore the force to its natural phase (balance) by destroying the source of its corruption (Sidious/himself) and allowing Luke to begin the process of getting things in order.
I actually believe the old orders method is emotional suppression (an unnatural matter) over emotional mastery did more to unbalance the force.
Yes, The Force is balanced as life persists and proliferates. That universal life force being abused and perverted corrupts it, that's why with always look deformed, they are being deformed. When they abuse the force they invite evil in and become more corrupted. The common threads in the belief systems Lucas has practiced and still at least partially identifies with (Metgodism and Buddhism) says that humans are imperfect with good and bad motivations and that discipline towards the good yields good results and fixation on the self, selfish desires and ego will make you sink and spiral and lead to greater evils until you finally see you must abandon them. The same is true of moral drift and addiction.
@@unigaming9921 I believe you are correct
The Jedi Order had fallen so much that they saw nothing wrong with separating children from their parents 😢
@LiorVolf I agree. The forget that the force is intertwined with life. Yet they live such an unnatural life with a complete lack of emotional balance
@@BranBal Sometimes even downright kidnapping them against the parents' will. Gotta fill up them Agricultural corps.
I remember that George once said the dark side was like a cancer. Not sure where and may be remembering wrong.
I also saw that interview! U are correct
He did I think it was in a video interview when explaining the force but also a written one as well
He also had it in a few book. One he mention how he wanted for his setting a religion that is true with a actual pure good and pure evil.
Yes George was adamant that one could not dabble in the dark without inevitably falling. The dark side is evil and even using it occasionally can ruin a person. Slippery slope kinda thing
@@Underworlddream Its a good way to describe it. The Darkside is part of us all, yet somehow wrong, and only proves itself evil some time after something started to head that way. We have to handle it, or it will handle us.
I think this misunderstanding partly comes from books like "Master and Apprentice". Consider this:
"...It [balance in the force] would mean the darkness would be just as strong as the light. So it doesn’t matter what we do, because in the end, hey, it’s a tie! It doesn’t matter which side we choose.”
...
“It matters,” Qui-Gon said quietly. “It matters which side we choose. Even if there will never be more light than darkness. Even if there can be no more joy in the galaxy than there is pain. For every action we undertake, for every word we speak, for every life we touch-it matters. I don’t turn toward the light because it means someday I’ll ‘win’ some sort of cosmic game. I turn toward it because it is the light."
So I can see why people mistake the concept of balance if even Qui-Gon does not really clarify it.
Qui-Gon is a hypocrite. He's literally following Living Force at the same time as he believes in Cosmic Force prophecies. Which is it, does he focus on the present or is he concerned with the future?
Another way to think of it is considering one of the major steps to becoming a Jedi/Sith.
For the Jedi, it means revisiting and later overcoming one's darkest past and worst fears. A good example is in the game, Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords (KOTOR II). When you have a high influence with your companions, you learn about their past, what challenges they have faced and where they are in the game. After speaking with them and helping them come to terms with what happened, you (the Jedi Exile, Meetra Surik) can convince them to become a Jedi.
For the Sith, it means fully embracing and giving in to one's passions and emotions; particularly hatred and anger. Part of that means killing someone whom one deeply loves or has a strong attachment/feelings for. Such was the case for virtually every Sith be it Sidious, Vader, Bane, etc...
Strangely even Darth Nihilus.
Kotor I and kotor II were great games
Except sidious was the avatar of darkness. He held no one but himself dear at any point in his life
star wars is just a cheap😂 copy of Hindu religion. Every thing about force and star war Idea came from Hindu religion ☯️.
In over religion story demon or devil are looking for a way to become immortal. Or full control over everything by force and fear .
But when they do that.
Karma comes back. the god takes a form for human body and destroy that evil. And bring peace and order in society.
There are some humans in over religion who found a way to live long and become a god 🙏 after they disconnected them self from the world and found enlightenment.
Does this sound familiar star wars is just a cheap copy of my religion
Whoever made this thumbnail is a genius and I appreciate your work
i saw big words with an arrow pointing at boobs, the sole reason this video got my attention 💀
@@Snek_Animation a man of culture indeed
So I'm not the only one
I was searching for this comment
Fun story I think of whenever the Force comes up:
`A young student challenges a master in a race up the mountain to their temple.
At first the young man races forth, charging through foliage and leaping across streams. Vaulting rock after rock he races ahead.
Eventually even the youth's strength gives out, and he sits for a moment to rest, only to see the master striding patiently past him. The student, unable to stand and amazed the ancient master had even kept up with him, begs an explanation;
"You fight with the mountain, try and make it obedient to you. Yet the mountain is stronger than you are, and crushed you every step of the way.
The mountain is stronger than I, so I surrender myself to all it has to offer. And with every step my friend carries me further to the top."`
This is the content we need. Honour to you, Team Geetsly's, for your efforts. Your series on the Jedi lightsabre philosophies is what made me realise there is more to you guys than mere nerding. May the Force be with you.
This puts a new spin on the Bendu. Not a grey being, but one who is psychologically incapable of either succumbing to their worst impulses fully, nor letting go and letting the force take the wheel. Even in his last appearance, the Bendu, while angry, is neither without control of himself, nor does he discriminate between rebel or imperial in his rage. Kind of interesting really.
The bend is based on tom bombidil the beingnbeyond good and evil more of a force of nature
But what about the mortis arc with the son and the daughter? They are presented as equals and more or less two sides of the same coin.
@@jebkerman5422 they were the personification of the light and dark side of the force more or less the best and worse in theory. If you noticed the sister was kind, gentle, selfless and understanding. While the son was selfish, prideful, wrathful and arrogant. Thus was showing the absolute aspects of the two sides of the force. But remember mortis was also in another plane of existence so while what they experienced did happen think of it more like a spiritual journey
@@sykune yeah but mortis kinda doesn't fit the whole:
"The light side is THE force, while the dark is just a corruption of it" idea.
@@jebkerman5422 it does and doesn't at the same time. What it showed was the dark side would eventually lead you to ruin as you can not just use a little bit of dark side, it was showing end result of being fully one with the dark side of the force. It was also showing that everyone has darkness in them as shown with Ahsoka and Anakin when the son corrupted them. Anakin was already on path to the dark side as even as jedi he used force choke on living beings. The Bendu causes confusion as he says the jedi follows the ashla and the Sith follow the Bogan. Implying there is two sides but that's Disney changing the narrative, Disney is going more Taoism rather then Christianity.
My own brother once compared the Dark Side of the Force to a drug. It completely destroys you and yet you can't help but take more of it. And all because you want to feel a temporary high.
This is a great comparaison! I agreed with your brother! I never thought of it that way!
@@SuperPlacido1---I never did either. Until he mentioned it. Thanks for responding.
@@brokenbridge6316 With pleasure! Thanks to you for sharing this with us! Have a great week-end! ♥
@@SuperPlacido1---Your welcome 😊👍
The dark side - not even once!
Anyway it goes, the Force appears to love messing the opposing sides up, up to its whimsical glee... assuming it's secretly sentient.
You misunderstand. The 'Lightside' is life. The Darkside is death. At the ultimate scale it is certainly not a concept of mortality.
The Force doesn't completely control beings. It's as much reacting to people's actions and choice by nudging things to redress the imbalance, sometime that's on a cosmic level, sometimes it's much smaller
@Michael Andrei Palon, you're basically stating what Kreia in KOTOR 2 came to think about "the Force". That game was a great deconstruction and critique of everything Force related IMO.
"You will find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view"
- Obi-Wan Kenobi, Return of the Jedi.
The great tyrant the Force
The Star Wars franchise itself can't really figure out what the Force is. At least in Legends, the Force is very often portrayed as having a Yin and Yang dualism. The ancient Je'daii order saw the Force in this way, and their homeworld literally had light side and dark side moons. Then there were Darth Traya and Darth Caedus (ironically, Sith Lords) who tried looking at the unity of the Force beyond the light side-dark side dualism. And there were Jedi heretics who said the Force did not have any intrinsic light or dark side aspects; the Force only reflected the intentions and methods of those using it. Even Canon like the Prime Jedi is deep in Yin-Yang dualism.
They act like we haven’t seen the EU or aren’t in that 1% when majority of these folks enjoy the trash Disney is putting out and the agenda behind it.
Yes they say that alot. It's tell vs show. We have never been shown that including the dark side has improved anything. No one has been more balanced for allowing the dark to impact them. No one was ever shown to have been wrong to reject the dark in favor of the light.
What we are shown overruled what they try to say.
After all, Kreia and Caedus failed.
@@unigaming9921
The Je'daii order in Legends successfully balanced the light and dark sides for literally over 10,000 years. Daegen Lok's error was extremism, going full dark side with no balance, and he did not make that decision until after he became insane from terrifying force visions. For whatever reason, it's like the Force itself no longer balanced its dual nature, and all the Jedi and Sith battles were just a manifestation of the Force being sick.
@BeethovenIsGrumpyCat says who? We know nothing about them other than that they had a specific belief. And we know that because we are told so literally over 20 millenia after the fact.
The fact that this highly mythologized group spoken about over 25000 after the fact has a belief that promptly NEVER works when we see it play out should be the red flag.
The original idea was rather vague and a very tamed down aspect. Yoda lifting Luke's X-wing out of the swamp was about as crazy as the force got in the original trilogy - that and the force lightning. It was a more sublime thing on the whole befitting knightly commando teams.
Altgough I would argue that Taoism is poorly understood, as it is not rooted in dualism as conceived by the west. Yin and yang are not good and evil. Evil is something else in taoism. Yin and yang are the aspects of receiving and giving ... of being acted upon and acting. The purest essence of yang is a raw idea. The purest essence of yin is a formless mass that isn't even a formless mass (a bose-einstein condensate of a bose-einstein condensate). The idea - the energy and the receptive element work together and exchange roles to create what is - much as how pendulums or springs oscillate - the entire universe is in varying states of acting and being acted on.
A taoist sage must be receptive to this exchange and work with it. Swim with the current to the edge of the river rather than against it. Foolish people expend great effort to barely accomplish something that could be had by working with the tao.
Evil within taoism is effectively attempting to usurp authority over the tao. It's more nuanced, but it would be taking the example of the foolish person to a new level.
The best example is how one goes about stilling a tub of water you are in. Generally speaking, the best way to still the water is to be still, yourself. A foolish person might try to counteract the waves with splashes and get overwhelmed... but the evil person will try to crush the waves - perhaps first with his hands, then with increasing means until he's made the pool of water into a container with water that can't have surface waves. The evil person does not accept the notion that things lay outside their control.
A proper jedi should be more like a proper taoist sage - working with the force within its context.
I think this video gives the force a bit too much personality/will... but the whole thing is fiction and largely subject to rule of cool, particularly in much of the expanded universe.
I remember learning the real difference between the two from one of *your* videos on why Grey Jedi don't actually work in universe. That's how good y'all are :D
Yes!
nope his intretation is wrong
@@Toto-95 how lol the man cited evidence XD
@@christianrivera1708 because they fear them both Jedi and sith hates them they both fear the grey. Both sides mostly Jedi and sith wants control
@@yokaivegaurd8707 wrong you say both as if theres only 2 force sensitive groups. The jedi have been known to work with other orce users, even if they werent jedi. So no they dont fear or hate anyone that isnt a jedi. Jedi also dont want control, they serve the republic. There was a time where they were powerful but laws were made to counter that. Gray jedi dont exist
"You can't choose what you feel or how you feel it, but you can choose what to do with it." Such a great distinction. I'm a mental health therapist, & I work with so many people that seek to eliminate all "negative" or "dark side" feelings entirely; fear, anger, sadness, hate, jealousy, despair, etc, rather than choosing healthy responses to those emotions or balance them out with countering emotions such as gratitude, compassion, and feeling connected to others. The attempt to completely control or dominate (dealing in absolutes) all aspects of one's emotions, or to use those emotions to as a method of dominating, controlling, &/or hurting others, becomes deeply unhealthy, likely resulting in destructive behavior.
it's even an echo of the films. Yoda explicitly states 'you must learn to let go of that which you fear to lose'. he never once says fear of loss is bad. just that a Jedi must be able to let go and move forward. yes there is fear and pain but, you can't allow it to bog you down.
This may sound a tad oversimplified, but I think finding internal balance is better than seeking to impose external balance. Some Jedi seem to have overlooked that perspective.
This is why Grey Jedi aren't a thing, at least not as a force-users in balance between Jedi and Sith.
By the way, a lot of that dualism in Legends is either a lore-ish explanation of a game mechanic (KOTOR), a direct manipulation (Vergere, Lumiya, Darth Traya) or a point-of-view/unreliable narration that fan sources took literally...
This is THE MOST BRILLIANT explanation of the concepts of the Force that I have been trying to explain to folks for YEARS!
Good luck trying to explain things to people in the Star Wars community. You have to write a video essay for most to believe it lol my friend and I are still debating on ‘balance’ but now I’ve git his video to send to him too lmao
@@blackblack1167 well everyone can have their own perception.
@@Alex.Hustad Sure, but your feelings dont override reality. I have no problem with his beliefs, it’s that he wants to pass it off as the absolute truth
Good to know I'm not alone.
This explanation is so good! The 'Light Side' really is how the Force is meant to be, and the 'Dark Side' is what selfish people want it to be for themselves. It's actually quite religious.
It has been said that StarWars is religion of atheist-nerds. Seems legit.
You know how Luke throws his lightsaber aside at the end of ep 6 and tells the Emperor "I'll never join you". And how he refuses to kill Vader.
That is the most Christian thing I have ever seen in fiction. (If you don't get what I mean, think about Jesus yelling at his disciple when he draws a sword on the guys coming to kill Jesus).
It's coming from a lot of new starwars media that seek to have their cake and eat it too I think every "side" should have ups and downs the lightside is the hardest and not for everyone it takes sacrifice and dedication but in the end you'll receive an eternity of peace and understanding the grey Jedi are people who couldn't make that sacrifice but can still do good in the world and connect with the common man the way a Jedi who is abandoning everything for enlightenment can't the sith is for people who want the power to change fate and dominate but should be careful that they don't lose themselves to it most will fail and will spend an eternity reaping what they have sown
its in the jedi code, "There is only the force." doesnt mention anthing about the light
@@viperstriker4728Or Islamic, or Jewish. Any religion really, but Abrahamic especially.
The only thing that really confuses me is the mortis arc and how that plays into this definition of the light side, as the father was portrayed as the balance of the two and the daughter was the full embodiment of the light.
@@ty-ty-20 they "touched" the dark by acknowledging it but rejecting it and staying within the light.
Please remember that mortis ended with the dark killing all three. It isn't a story of balance between light and dark. Light followed the father. Dark rejects the father. The daughter is the living force in harmony with the cosmic force. Her nature brings balance when followed.the son is out of harmony, and its nature is to destroy it if carried out.
That was made by a jackass pretender who didn't ever actually understand what Lucas said.
The explanation is that those three are just powerful force users.
Filoni did a little trolling. Not the first time, probably not the last either.
This actually helps a lot in real life too, similar to a stoic philosophy compared to someone who rides high emotional waves
I was always confuse when trying to understand the light and dark side of the force, and now I understand why. Thank for this explication who was been able to make understand this !
Basically the nuances of the Force are SWTOR. You can be a Sith that taps into the dark side but still be loyal, love, and compassionate person, aka Lana Beniko & Revan.
Exept swtor literaly has a meter that says the force is in balance when the light side and dark side are just as powerfull on the galaxy map
They got it wrong. There is no Light Side, there is only the Force. The Dark Side is imbalance. George Lucas made the mistake of not sharing this clearly.
@@Alpha_Draconis20 That is an game machanic. Compare the Dark side of the force to an addiction and then you have a more clear picture.
When I think about balance in the force I remember some stories from legends about the precursor to the Jedi, the Je'daii. Tens of thousands of years BBY a force tradition developed on Tython where the goal was to be balanced between what we would perceive as Light and Dark. Anyone there that could not maintain that balance was banished to some sort of isolated temple where they would have to meditate until they could come back to the middle point. Very different from how users of the force are depicted in film and TV.
We need more people to understand this. I really hope more people see this video.
This is one perspective on the force (that of the Jedi), which is also the perspective of the films.
Since Clone Wars was used as evidence, I take it as well, since there we have multiple perspectives.
The most direct one is the representation of the Ones of Mortis with a light side, a dark side and a controlling element in the middle. Which is more representative of the ying-yang idea than the force vs its cancer.
So I would argue that both interpretations are correct and valid points of view in SW.
The most fun thing I find about the Ones is Abeloth, the chaos.
A regular woman brought along to act as a helping hand to the Father, she grew deeply connected with her family. She eventually grew old and was unable to stop their warring. She drank and bathed, using the two Force Nexuses on the planet to become powerful enough to stop them. This made her an impossibly powerful being, commonly known as The Mother. The Ones looked upon her with disgust, constructing a prison made of black holes for her, and relocating to Mortis.
I find this interesting because it highlights a false belief in the yin-yang concept, that there's a fourth thing, chaos. Instead of chaos, though, there's just the succumbing to one specific side. Abeloth is unneeded and taints the ideas.
Both are true in their own senses. The long-term goal here, though, is to choose to walk the light path. The dark side is natural, it simply exists to remind practitioners what they are. We acknowledge it and strive to overcome it.
It depends on the will of their users to choose their path. (I'm not referring to just the Jedi and Sith). The dark side always has the upper hand to control destiny. One chooses to accept that he/she is just a part of nature, and we have no control over everything (e.g. aging, sickness, death). That is a balanced and healthy mindset, resembling Buddhism. Regular people refuse such fundamental concepts and want to bend the universal rules to their selfish desires, hence they immerse in the dark side and create imbalance.
The key difference here is that the Sith are not precisely the embodiment of the Dark Side. When we realize negative behaviors, we will attempt to fix them. The Dark Side always appears in every being, even the Jedi, so they have to go as far as possible to purge them. The Sith manipulates the Dark Side, only to their desires.
I think an interesting way to look at how the "balance" in the Force is supposed to be, is like an ecosystem. There's balance in a healthy ecosystem, however, if you pollute that ecosystem, exploit it, and/or introduce a foreign species in it, or even remove a keystone species, suddenly it goes out of whack! It's unbalanced! Only by eliminating what caused the unbalance, can you restore it.
The Sith and the Dark Side are the oil spill, the deforestation, the unnatural ecological disaster that upsets the balance. THAT'S how in the end Anakin DID restore balance in the Force, he destroyed Sidious and in doing so himself, the last Sith in the galaxy. He destroyed the pollutant in the Force, thereby restoring balance, even if one of those pollutants was himself.
Well, any ecosystem can, and thus must be prunned and artificially controlled. Nature never chooses the optimal patch - it tend to cling to the first thing, that somehow worked.
And returning to the force - true lightsider, like Jar-Jar, can be just as destructive as a sith lord.
What about natural disasters like asteroid, megavolcano/earthquakes etc.. that destroy all living creatures, but also create new life, like dinosaur and mammals story?
@@DarkImplement its in the name. Natural disasters are needed (forest fires help redwood seedlings, or errosion and constand changing for advent species), nature is never still, and natural disasters a part of it, they helped create diversity.
Us, on the other hand, and all we do are far from natural, we make changes so fast, we implode ecosystems
@@vladcrow4225 also, youre just wrong. A fully functioning ecosystem is self functioning. No human needed, it was here well before us, and will be well after us. But nowadays, fully working ecosystems are rare, humanity left them mangled and in disarray, thats why a lot of them need constant supervision. They have fallen far from full functionality, even when on the surface, they seem fine and natural
@@vladcrow4225 That's for example why our intestines contain gut microbiota despite in evolution there could be developed a digestive system that doesn't need them
I KNEW IT!!!!! I've been thinking and saying this for quite some time now but I figured it was probably just my personal interpretation based on opinion. Finally, vindication. I was interpreting things correctly after all. Awesome. Thank you for making this video.
Nothing is right or wrong in this
It would seem then the dark side would be easily tempted by new users of the force, but for those that had,had it for a longer time would find contentment, so I wonder how Lucas felt that anakin was driven to the dark if he had been trained to let his feelings go. It seems more like he never found the true path and had alway had that anger bubbling just below the surface, and the jedi masters should have recognized it or at least felt it and taken him away from temptation instead of throwing him headfirst into it.
Exactly. If quigon was alive that's exactly what he would have done. The jedi failed anakin
I always view Yoda's jedi as monks who are at their best when away from conflict but when put into stressful situations like the clone wars then many of them fall
Anakin had formed an attachment to his mother and why they said he too old, he already had his own perception of the world around him. The Jedi never could severe that attachment, or change his perception of the world.
Separating children from their parents is unnatural
The Jedi Order had fallen so much that they couldn't even see how much wrong that was. No wonder they were so blind.
The Jedi had their own failings and misconceptions. How can they help someone to find the true path if they don't know it themselves?
The Jedi had no attachments, so no one was attached to them, so not only saw no one the need to defend them, they were easily swayed against them.
@Third_Planet Why did you think Palpatine wanted the Jedi to be Generals of the Army of the Republic? The Jedi were forced to sacrifice sentient living beings. Either they treated them like Droids, which is not the way of the (Light Side) Force or they acknowledge what the Clones are and sooner or later die, because of the Jedi leading the charge to save as many of them as possible and sooner or later sacrificing themselves.
Funny that as a kid, I had a better understanding of it than I do now. I was so confused when I started hearing about a light side as it never really existed in the films. That is... until the mouse attacked.
It was there in Legends too.
@@autistinquisitor9441 honestly, it's a shame how EU writers turned an interesting mix between westen and eastern beliefs into another generic grey morality.
@@kindlingkingOne of many of the EU's flaws. Lots of good stories, a ton of confusing/contradictory lore.
People also get the Mortis ARC wrong as well, as you've mentioned. The Son was never a master of the "Dark Side". The Son utilized the force, its more aggressive aspects at least, without succumbing to the Dark... UNTIL Anakin showed up, and the Son got too ambitious.
Nightsisters made this aware as well, in their belief system. The Son helps them hunt, gives strength and passion, etc. All the natural stuff you need, but he wasn't immersed into the Dark till he lost his sister and then fell to the Dark after that.
Or more clearly said The Daughter and The Son were the representations of the lower-cases not the upper-cases. More an representation of the own feelings that every sentient being have than directly the Force.
About a year ago I made a comment as part of a response to a question posing what we would want our calling to be. This video reminded me of it: "I think there is a misconception about the Order and emotions. To be calm is not to be without feelings. Serenity merely helps prevent strong emotion from gaining control. To deny emotion is unhealthy and can lead to ruin. Recognize the negative ones, then let them go. Accept the positive, but do not let them overwhelm. Feel, but maintain your center. Heal the self, heal the other, heal the Order."
personally i never liked that the light side was benevolent. I like to see the force more as a apathetic concept.
The Force is the consciousness of every living being, The Force wants to improve the lives, making it inherently benevolent.
My impression of the Force was always that there is no Light or Dark side to the actual Force itself. The Force is simply a unifying power that permeates everything. It is the actions of those who use the force that then categorize it into Light or Dark. Which in many cases can be a very subjective thing.
What I think is interesting is how each trilogy defines what the Force is: The original trilogy set the force up as a mystical religion based in feeling and mind (a la meditation and a quest for inner peace); the prequels reinvented it as a science (the genetics of midichlorians), and the Disney set of films made it a choice or will; this also follows the cultural mindsets of Western thinking (70s and 80s saw a big shift to "nature" through yoga, spiritual awakening, and even the "darkside" of cults who rejected society; the 90s/early 00s saw a rejection of belief systems in favor of tech and science; and Disney... Well, they basically made the statement that the "Force is what we want it to be because we own this bitch now". 😂
You're on to something, but specifically the Disney films making it a choice or will is in line with the rampantly exagerating individualism we see today, where people are more and more like "screw tradition and social expectations, be whatever you want to be"
@@Clumsy-vp3ifIndeed
The force is the force. It is one's own self that must be brought into balance. That is what Bendu did for Kanan.
I really dislike new star wars it misunderstands the force that new philosophy tries to have it's cake and eat it too my stance is this if you wanna transcend your mortal body and reach an understanding of the universe be a conventional Jedi if you wanna help those around you and live a happy life be a grey Jedi but eternity should be lost to you and if you wanna dominate and gain power be a sith not the new starwars view that portrays a balence between light and dark as the correct choice
@@Thanatos562It's not NEW it's litteraly how the force is portrayed in the EU if anything it's the OLD way coming back
@@joriswegner8421 it's not in the OT and definitely not George's vision while new is subjective sure oldest work I can think of is Kotor
@@joriswegner8421 now I'll go against my position and say I actually DONT think George should be the definitive authority on starwars but my point stands that this reinterpretation of the force wasn't the original intention but in more recent years the middle road has been pushed more strongly as the "correct" path rather than one of many paths that lead to different conclusions which is what I personally believe the force should be
@@Alpha_Draconis20 indeed I think the best solution is them all to be true in their own way but he wrong in others and the fan to decide which interpretation is the best
2:26 Technically it gets referred to as "the good side" - such as when Luke is talking to Leia about redeeming Vader - which I always assumed came about because it was before specific terminology was fully established (similar to why Luke calls 3po and R2 "robots" instead of droids in ANH).
Theoretically, "the good side" Luke was referring to could've maybe been Vader's own, internal "good side": Anikan; not necessarily an external aspect of the Force.
@@ronn-ammon8975 If that was Luke's intention, he would've said "his good side" instead of " the good side". The latter phrase implies that Luke wanted turn Vader back to a point before he chose to reject what he was taught as a Jedi, not just being a "good" person.
I have been arguing this for years, it's wonderful to see others coming out and speaking to it. If you just take the movies and works of Lucas, you get a very different Force than what is often seen. I know that people like to point to things in the EU and say "But see they were treating it as a yin yan" but the fact is that much of the EU was just wrong in its depiction of things. Dark Horse and the EU authors generally did their own thing, and while much of it was signed on by LucasFilm, it doesn't mean that it all adhered correctly to Lucas' creation. I think that had people understood the reality of the Force, that the Darkside was a twisted, poisoning, corruption of the Force that would quickly dominate its users, not the other side of the coin, and that balance required the cleansing of the Force of that darkness, we might have gotten better SW media over the years.
EU was always a different universe/continuity!
*raises hand*
Yes, please, I'd enjoy a further video on this matter. I enjoy your Force philosophy videos.
This video has perfectly described how the force works, explaining it much better than I ever could.
It also explains why the concept of a "Grey Jedi" isn't possible. It's so, so annoying when people say that Cal is going to be a Grey Jedi, when he's CLEARLY slowly falling to the dark side.
I would love to see more of the dark side, and the nuances of it. While it’s seen as the quick and easy path, I’d argue it seems quick and easy, but many of its rewards can be just as difficult to earn.
Not to plug content, but KotOR2 is hands down the single greatest examination of the dark and light sides through a more critical lens. They explore the nuances of the dark side in ways untouched by other content.
@@drumlessons833 yea, I LOVE Kotor 2, and especially Kreia. She gave a scolding hot dismantling of the Jedi Order, the Sith Order, and even the force itself! And that’s what got me into the Old Republic MMO. And I love it’s interpretation of the dark side and the sith through characters like Lana Beniko. But it’s always why I don’t like the idea of “the force is the light side, and the dark side is a perversion of it” and I’ve never really liked that because it’s boring to me
@@drumlessons833 like Nihilus’ endless hunger, and Sion’s refusal to die by holding his body together through sheer force of will.
@@kanekikingstorm2113 sions unending pain was his sacrifice for his reward of painful immortality
@@kanekikingstorm2113 I would argue that characters like Lana Beniko demonstrate for light & dark in a struggle within. What works long term is light, but all she knows is dark, and she is figureing things out by her intellect.
Fair, though the canon has really changed in how it portrays that. The Ones of Mortis are a particular case in which balance is portrayed as being between the Light and Dark, not just in the Light.
No it isn't. Remember the son kills the father. We have to remember the narrative in which they are shown. The daughter, when fulfilling her nature, serves the father. The son, following his nature, kills all three
@ty-ty-20 no one said we was irredeemable (other than some jedi).
The Dark Side is only dangerous when not balanced out by the light side just as the light without the dark will only blind you and give you an utopian view of the world
Question, how do we know that the Ones of Mortis were right? Or could it be that despite everything they were lost in their own point of view?
@@Dreamfox-df6bg It's never said the one's are light and dark. In fact, it makes little sense to say so since the son falls to the dark side during the arc. Remember Lucas was involved in that arc, and he is staunchly against light/dark balance. So the interpretation that the son represents the dark side is entirely fan theory. Most reasonably, he represents the passions, emotions, and driving forces which inflame and move us. Such as anger. But anger is not the dark side. Nor is the son. Most likely the father represents the light side, and they represent the duality which requires balanced to stay in the light, and the son's fall compromised the entire family.
I agree with you. One of the worst things about Star Wars as it’s progress and evolved over the years is that it really has perverted the nature of the force
This was very deep. It can be seen that people can learn in real life from this. I do want to see more stories showing the Dark Side and how it usually destroyed the people who abused the Force and gave into their desires for power. The ideas of balance kind of reminds me of the game series, Darksiders and their idea of balance and corruption, and also the ideas of balance from the game series, Destiny. All 3 have great stories about them in my opinion, but I will say, KOTOR 1 and 2 were the ones that taught me the important lessons that is similar to the stuff said in this video. I've read a lot of stories that do this style of balance as well. Anyways, great video. Here's to great many things in the future.
I used to be heavily in the camp of “Balance means Light = Dark” camp. It wasn’t until Disney started mucking with the lore that I really started to pay attention to Lucas’s original vision. I guess you could say that the effort to change the Jedi and the understanding of the Force under Disney’s reign is a manifestation of the Dark Side, and it woke me up to how my previous understanding of Balance doesn’t fit into this particular franchise.
Sooooo... Anakin did *NOT* bring balance to the Force? 😂
@@mrsboat That's not what Mace does though. He channeled his negative emotions, and he was able to do so on such a lvl without being corrupted because he was completely in control of his own emotions. It was a testament to his emotional maturity.
@@happyslapsgiving5421he did, but when he killed Jedi, he didnt bring balance, he did in worse, after 20 years, he killed his dark master and himself to end the sith, which son and his father brought balance to the Force, only Light side remains
Please do a video on the Jedi's perspective on the Force. Including those Jedi that followed the will of the Force over the will of the Order. Like Qui-Gon.
I always found more sense in the Living Force and the will of such. The Force isn't good nor evil, but the intent of which it's being used.
WHY IS THE ARROW IN THAT THUMBNAIL POINTING THERE GEESTLYS???
I’m convinced that the reason people want balance in the force to mean that the light and dark must be equalized is all just one big rationalization for wanting to allow Jedi to get angry and use force lightning and choke people.
The way I understood the dark side is that it would be like sitting in a room with someone shooting heroin and just doing it discreetly. Then, by the time anyone's noticed, they're already an addict.
This is why I always liked Legends more: never really agreed with how George saw it. Yes he created it but I always felt there could be more to the Force (that and knowing how George has even retconned himself multiple times). Grey Jedi/Je'daii always interested me more than either Jedi or Sith. Much like Luke's Jedi Order in Legends.
how do the Grey Jedi interest you? becayse you wanna use edgy darkside powers while still being a good guy antihero?
@@christianrivera1708 Why do people keep saying it's edgy, I'm a 100% sure you don't need to be edgy to use both.
@@DromusTH you need to channel rage,hatred,pain,sorrow to use the dark side powers. It's pretty edgy
@@christianrivera1708
So, you're saying that if I were to just randomly come up to you and punch you in the face, that would suddenly turn you into an angsty, emo edgelord antihero hellbent on killing me?
@@christianrivera1708fr, i guess anti heroes doesnt use a dark abilities, its either light and core abilities or just core abilities
Thank you for confirming the belief I already had in the Force. It is a huge misconception that a number of people just don't seem to understand.
I wish this video had come 10 years ago when I had to fight with dozens of "grey" jedi and sith because people don't fucking understand the fundamental building blocks of Star Wars.
This is such a well-thought discussion. I find it strange that this discourse has not been explored in the films, they'd give a greater understanding on the force and the way it impacts its users.
According to the force: genocide is fine when I do it
I'm confused, what is this referring to?
@@dallin1056 the definition of Balance in the force.
@@AncestorEmpire1 when did the force do genocide tho?
@@dallin1056 the clone wars.
The Jedi civil war lead by Revan and Malak
During the events of the Jedi covenant and their force visions
The Jedi purge done by Kriea, Sion, and Nihlus
The Jedi Civil war led by Exar Kun and Dark Jedi Ulic Qel-Droma
@@AncestorEmpire1 That's the jedi tho, the jedi =/= the force
I learned this in the Revenge of the Sith novelization, which did a great job of describing Obi-Wan as having perfected this state, of being able to just turn himself over to a zen state within the Force and allow it to direct his actions, like a leaf in a stream.
That’s still holds true in many of the Star Wars media is still coming out. Video games aside. Because yes, the force in itself is what their goal is and the Darkside of the force is basically well you imposing your will upon other people and not thinking of the greater good of being selfish. It’s like your quote from George Lucas said. It’s quick, easy, but it only gives you short term happiness. It makes you feel hollow at the end. Whereas, being compassionate, it’s hard, long, but at the end of the road, it’s very fulfilling.
People like to say "balancing the light and dark" like it's balancing a set of scales rather than balancing on the edge of a cliff facing the abyss while trying to dip your toes in as much as possible. (Aka not a good idea)
I am surprised no Sith ever made the "Jedi are slaves of the Light with no free wills" joke while they proclaimed themselves as the freest peoples in the galaxy who can do whatever they wanted with no regards, no laws and no consequences like at all.
Also, I would like to hear how the Jedi in particular conceived the Force as well! So please, do a video about it!
@@thelvadam5269 Both Jedi and Sith are drunken on to something to keep themselves going. The Republic, the Empire, power, victory, the Force, knowledge and many more.
This vide made a good case for that. Is like a creepy cultist talking about their great god and how you do their biding.
That take on the force makes a lot of sense.
With the Sith showing things to the Jedi or put them into situations that would make them doubt the will of the force in order to make them rebel against it, aka fall to the dark side.
Well said. Makes me think of obi wan upping the badassery after qui gon dies. He's got these darkside emotions in him, bc theyre natural, but hes not giving into the dark side. He's just fighting with determination
I always hate when media tries to present the idea of a balance between Good and Evil. Morality was not a part of the original Concept of Yin and Yang, and the two are supposed to be complimentary opposites, not opposing extremes. Evil is what happens when things are out of balance, it's not a part of the balance itself. The idea that evil is somehow necessary is absurd.
I Love your videos so much I always wanted to know more about the light side of the force thank you so much for making a video of this
*[gobbles down an entire box of donuts with gusto]* Guess I'm a Sith, and i shall be known as..... Darth... Diabetus
Lucas thinks that hate is always a bad thing, but Chinese crullers were invented with hate in mind. Imagine voodoo dolls made of dough. That is the basic premise. This pastry born of hate is delicious to me.
I do think that painting the Jedi as strict stoicists and Sith as sadistic/uncaring hedonists makes me question the Jedi interpretation of the force, but certainly once "the light side" was introduced I think the concept of balance / a new force user / a middle path in the treatment for Duel of the Fates (note, fates plural) would really work
Good video! This is how I understand the Force to be as well. I think that many people misinterpret what the term "balance" is meant to convey. They seem to think, reasonably enough perhaps, that it must be between the light and the dark, but it has more to do with the balance of all living things so that they exist harmoniously. The darksider seeks to prey upon other beings in an unsustainable and even parasitic manner. They would make themselves individually very powerful at the expense all other living beings. The consequence is that the Force as a whole is lessened since it is generated from the harmony of all living things with each other. Thus the darkside weakened the universe and if left unchecked would destroy it completely. The restoration of balance that is spoken about is the elimination of these darkside parasites without and the dark emotions, thoughts, and habits within.
This may be the original idea but the fedora guy and his fanfiction kids shows made it a yin yang
I don't think filone wanted this and it's unfair to call FanFiction(i personally like FanFiction and Saw alot of preaty good stories that i can recomend If You want and i thinking of trying It out since i have alot of ideas that want to wright for free) i feel like it's part of the fandom fault
It is a yin yang tho. The force is based on Taoism which uses the yin yang. It's about going with the flow of nature which is in balance like the yin yang symbol. A human dying of natural causes is part of that balance. A human being killed for no other reason disrupts the natural balance.
Death in and of itself is apart of the force.
Murder is not.
@@lilianemachadostigliano1727 someone elsewhere pointed out that the video games which made the force a morality slider didn’t help either. Remember in KOTOR the reward for being a grey Jedi was cool robes and access to all the force powers.
God damn thank you for pointing this out man!!! I've been talking with people for years and telling them that there is no light or dark, it's just what you make of it.
A video that most SW fans should watch. I've heard so many times that "grey" Jedi achieve balance through both the light and dark side, or by rejecting both, that there is a light side pull just like the pull to the dark side... all complete misconceptions. And if you play SWTOR you're gonna read these almost daily in chat, and it's no helped by the fact that the game has several story elements that spread those wrong ideas about the force.
Yes, kotor is a video game. It compromises lore to create a fun game experience. Video games are bottom tier canon for exactly that reason.
@@unigaming9921 Kotor 1 & 2 don't have that issue too much. The main offender is Swtor.
@kathleendelcourt8136 true. We just have to accept that the dark/gray paths include false lore to validate gameplay, and only the light path is true.
@@unigaming9921
"False Lore"
When you start declaring different bits of lore from _the same work_ to be "true" or "false" simply based on what you agree with, that's not "truth", that's headcanon.
You claimed in another thread that we haven't seen anything to show that use of the Dark Side could lead to anything other than corruption and destruction. And while I will give you that, what you've shown me is that if we ever _were_ shown an example of where the Dark Side was used in a beneficial manner, you would reject it regardless.
@@VestedUTuber I haven't done that at all. Don't confuse interpreting statements so they align with what we are shown as cherrypicking. What we are shown is clear. The Dark Side is absolute evil. It isn't really a question, it has always harmed or destroyed those who touch it at all. Anakin brings balance to the Force by rejecting it and returning to the light.
Any interpretation of the works that can't account for that is flawed. And given as these are Lucas' own interpretations, that makes sense. The effort of secondary authors to change it simply don't work.
I've been dying to find such a well made explanatory video such as this one on the force. You're so right in that SO MANY people absolutely do not understand the basic idea of Light being "listening to the force" VS Dark being "bending the force to their own will", leading to weird ideas and alternate means of using the force. More often than not, what people call "grey jedis" are light side users who are at odds with the specifics of the Jedi order itself, while Jedi order and Light Side are not the same thing.
TLDR: I've been within the 1% and been frustrated for decades with the 99% when it comes to Star Wars based Roleplay and fictions which misunderstand and twist the concept of the Force itself, making it often basic and incoherent.
WEG west end games d6 dice pool system. character arch type concept.
Then WotC 3e D&D/Star Wars, multiclassing character level build concept.
Then mix in Whitewolf/World of Darkness (WoD) d10 dice pool system of Vampire, werewolf, mage and changeling.
Got to add Rifts, Dune, not forgetting 1990's era Wicca.
Anger issues with manic depression is rough to grow through as a teenager and young adult. But we loved our word math problem wargames. Math is logic to discipline emotions. Spock and Picard were role models.
Some of Luke's students were so char coal grey they were in different shades of black. But they made an effort to do better each day they could. The novel, " I, .. Jedi " is a great read on a space cop turn rebel pilot, finding out he is a Jedi talent trying to rescue his girlfriend who his father put her father into prison for smuggling.
Point is, we already seen how bad the writing of the EU novels were. But we already got to read how Luke's generation of Jedi raised their children into adults. Then we got the Prequel Jedi Order.
Low level of the Force just makes you better than average at cheating in cards & dice.
Or a racquetball/ tennis player.
Honestly I feel like the movies would’ve benefited from a much more in-depth analysis on the force instead of generic movie cliches 😭. Great vid
Thank you Geetsly. For being the only fucking person that understands this shit.
It is interesting that this is a debate in-universe too. The orders that preceded the Jedi, the Dai Bendu & the Je'daii Order, both believed in the balance between Light & Dark. The Je'daii changed into the Jedi when they had fractured under the pressure of the Dark Side using Rakata. Their conflict with the Rakata & the subsequent Force Wars taught them that the Dark Side was a cancer to the Force, not something to be balanced out with a kind of Light Side.
In that way the understanding of the Force is a kind of science: people will hold beliefs about what it is/how it works based on their best guesses until new, solid information is put onto the table & changes their understanding. In that way it's no different than understanding the Laws of Physics or the Law of Conservation, or other Scientific Laws & theories.
It is an interesting thought though that maybe even the interpretation of the Force that we & the Jedi have MAY not be completely right either. After all, Newton's Laws of Motion & Gravity were the main believed factors of physics until Einstein made the general Theory of Relativity. Perhaps the true nature of the Force still isn't known.
It's also worth noting the Celestials of Mortis represented the Yin-Yang belief of the Force, & surely such influential people would've had a better understanding of the Force than the Jedi. In the modern galaxy disparate sects of the old beliefs also still exist, like the Bendu of Star Wars Rebels. So perhaps the Ashla/Bogen dichotomy has some kind of real precedent, but we don't have the proper information available to know what it is. I still say that the Jedi's beliefs on the Force are closer to the truth than the others, but who can say for sure?
Even though Disney doesn't really care all that much about this discussion & lean into the easy Yin-Yang interpretation, I gotta say the Nature of the Force is nonetheless a super interesting topic to discuss!
This is the first of your videos that I have watched, and I have to say, I am very pleasantly surprised. This was both inside full and concise as well as being a take on the Universe and the force itself that is accurate but often overlooked and or misrepresented buy a lot of fans who are taken in by the categorisation of the light side without actually taking the time to assess how that plays out in the films. I will be subscribing now so I can watch more of your content as the fact you have this inside and this knowledge and I willing to share it so reveley with people who may not understand this has won me over quite well. Well done, and I look forward to watching more of your content. Keep it up.
I believe the Force is uniform and does not have "sides", but the two sides of this conflict choose to describe it this way because one group thinks the magic should be used as they like and the other feels that the magic should one with strict limitations. The Force is like the unbiased terrain they fight over and they disagree over how it should be used.
except thats not how the force works
Fantastic video. This is the explanation I’ve been searching about the Force. Based on Disneys recent content like the visions show, it is obvious they took the misconception of the force and ran with it. There is no light side to the force because naturally it is good, the dark side is unnatural and by existing the balance is thrown off.
How to the Sister, Brother, and Father fit into this rejection of the dichotomy? While i agree with the idea that the Dark Side is a perversion of the Force and there is no Light or Dark, the Clone Wars seems to contradict this in the Mortis Arc with embodiments of this dichotomy: the Sister for the Light, the Brother for the Dark, and the Father as the mediating balance between the two.
So if the Force is just the Force as it should be and the Dark Side is the disturbance of the balance, how does the Sister fit into this? Or the Father? Or the entire point of the Celestial?
Exactly. 99% of us aren't wrong, he just created a false claim and cherrypicked evidence to back it up. The Mortis arc was quite explicit about what it means to have balance in the force.
@@zakarymcleod1850 "99% of us" 😂 keep dreaming
@@ImpendingApotheosis That's what he said in the title. His claim, not mine.
It really doesn’t fit at all. This seems more like what George’s original vision was for the force rather than what it’s evolved into. Luke Skywalker and Mace Windu were perfect examples within the films themselves that contradicted this. They showed the balance of using the dark side as a tool almost letting it possess them for a few moments but without letting it consume them. Return of the Jedi literally proved that Yoda and Obi Wan and thus the old Jedi way was wrong just like the Sith way showing us that balance is the true path. Even the prequels seemed all about showing how the Jedi way led to arrogance, hypocrisy, and corruption so the only way to avoid repeating history was to learn from both sides to achieve balance just like the Je’daii.
They don't. Geetlsy is rejecting anything outside of GL's original vision.
My biggest issue with this idea is that i, a Jedi, would have to completely give in to the will of a mysterious, all-knowing being who's main goal i don't know. This being could not or would not stop the enslavement or total genocide of entire races or planets. It sounds very much like religious zealotry.
EXACTLY like relogious zealotry. it sounds like the cult i grew up in that said "trust in the will of God even if you dont understand and it hurts you". also no "having a will of your own (referred to as "dying to self" and "you dont exist only god in you") and looking after your own needs" (considered selfish). honestly the more i learn about "light side of the force" and how balance was originally intended to be understood the more it sounds like culty churches and triggers religious trauma 😖
If you wanna do a video on how the Jedi conceived the Force, you have my vote, on one condition: You talk about Luke’s Jedi Order in the same video, whatever’s worth bringing up and explaining, if anything like that is there
The things worth explaining like how it was intended to teach both light and dark?
Luke mentions "The Good Side" in Return of the Jedi.
GREY. JEDI. ARENT. A THING.
when will people actually understand this?
Thinking about that one time Anakin found out he was going to become Vader and was ready to give up being a force user. But then “The father” had his mind erased because it needed to happen…isn’t that the work of destiny?
You could make an argument that Keria wanted to kill the force cause it was corrupted by the Dark side and beyond saving like Ra's Al Ghul wanting to destroy Gothum because it was corrupted by rampant crime. This can be true from a certain point of view.
Thank you so much for this. I've tried telling people this for many years but they still think the dark side = emotions and "light side" = no emotions. It's only getting worse. The comments section here shows that they still don't get it.
~Canon~
I always saw balance as not "Balance between The Light Side and The Dark Side" but balancing ones own inner darkness and light. Being a decent (pardon the phrasing) human being and feeling your emotions without letting them control you. Without that inner dark side to show you what atrocities you can commit, your light has no value. Without your baser instincts, you would have nothing to rise above. To be balanced is to be disciplined and patient, but not letting yourself become unfeeling and detached. In the end, if you look at the Jedi and Sith for a philosophy on the force, it would be trying to understand morality by looking only at ISIS and The Satanic Temple and then making a decision. The two a e just too far from eachother to be comparable. They are the two ends, but the coin is much thicker and there is much more to see.
Ironically some of what you mentioned here is actually tocuehd upon in the Legacy era books. Specifically in one of the New Jedi Order books. In it the jedi Vergere interacts with Luke and teaches him a valuable lesson. She basically goes through his thought process. Which none of his emotions he experienced when he went to confront her were wrong. Afterwards Luke himself ponders for a bit and finally comes to a decision and where he defines what it means for the Jedi. Namely that actions that are selfless in origin are good and that actions which are selfish in nature are evil. It was a rather interesting conversation. If you are wondering, the book in question is Destiny's Way.
While I love dichotomy, I always hated it within a fantasy/space opera setting because dark always meant "evil" and light always meant "good".
I do believe there is a yin-yang concept within Star Wars but not within the Force itself. Rather the yin-yang concept is within an individual. A good person will always have their vices and an evil will have a virtue or two.
Rebels showed that one of the Light Side can still have close personal bonds yet still serve the greater good.
Though I am curious as to know what is the Force. Is it sentient?
Funily enough, alot of times in japanese media there is a inversion of that, with dark being good and light being evil.
Interesting video. I always thought of it as the yin-yang thing.
How does bendu, the mortis gods, and the je'daii fit into this though? The existence and explanation of those things seem to be counter to your point.
The Bendu is hardly a good counterpoint, in my opinion. For all his preaching about being "in the middle", his refusal to actively protect life (which would be a way of contributing to the Light Side of the equation by his definition of balance) rather reflects the attitude of an apathetic spectator.
Unlike what he wants to believe, there is no "middle" in the "petty battles of Jedi and Sith", as he dismissively calls them. The many Sith Empires that have risen over the millennia are irrefutably forces for evil created through deception, war and murder, and operate on opression, slavery, and authoritarniasm. While the Rebellion and the Jedi fight for peace, harmony and freedom.
Even Kanan calls the Bendu out on his moral fence-sitting, and challenges his delusions of being "beyond their petty conflicts" by rightfully pointing out that the Bendu contributes nothing with his inaction and indifference. And instead of explaining his stance, offering alternative solutions, or even showing compassion for other lifeforms, Bendu gets as angry, arrogant and petty as a grumpy old neighbor who wants everyone to get off his lawn for hurting his ego.
Ultimately, he's little more than a delusional charlatan convinced that he has the moral high ground just because he chooses to not believe in anything for the sake of not having to fight for it, and to let everything and everyone burn around him despite having the power to make a difference. If anything, he's allowing the Dark Side to spread its corruption and, ultimately, upset the balance of the Force by doing nothing to keep it in check.
@@CouncilCape897 You make a good point about Bendu, and after hearing it, I agree.
However, my points about the Mortis gods and the Je'daii still stand. The Mortis gods are a type of conduit in the force, or perhaps a personification of the force. The way that they are portrayed leads me to believe that the nature of the force is not as Geetsly's describes it.
Furthermore, the Je'daii, being literally created by the force, were only able to find balance in the middle. Whenever the Je'daii order strayed too far from the middle, Tython would become unstable. Given that Tython had an intense connection in the force, this violent planetary demonstration could prove that the force is meant to be more of a yin-yang rather than Geetsly's hypothesis.
I think it is very probable that in the old canon, Geetsly's hypothesis is true, but in the current canon it is not. If you or anyone can refute my arguments, I would be interested to hear it.
"Light & dark are linked, without the one, there is no balance!" Not a very well remembered quote, but I think that is about right. The Clone Wars bought forward this idea.
Where's this quote from?
The quote as best as I can remember is from one of the many Star Wars books published (before dismal Disney.) It is quite along time ago. (The New Jedi order or maybe the jedi academy series?)
I've thought that Luke, in legends, was more in a Grey zone once the Vong invaded.
Doesn't Luke say in ROTJ when referring to Darth Vader "I can save him! I can bring him back... to the good side." ? Are we not to interpret the good side as the Light Side?
@ty-ty-20 well no, we are shown (regardless of what we are told) that the dark side ALWAYS creates problems. Luke wins by rejecting it in the end. He is failing by giving into it at all up to that point.
@@unigaming9921i think that there is only 2 sides, Good side and Dark Side, no Light Side, Good side with Jedi, Good Force users and neutral force users are balance, while Dark Side with Sith and evil Force users are unbalance and Corruption, that can lead whole world into their tyranny
Thank you! I’ve been obsessed with the idea that basically all Star Wars fans don’t know Star Wars theology and morality and it doesn’t necessarily break down along OT/PT/ST/EU lines, tho it’s caused in part by the EU. This feeds into the idea that the Prequel Jedi Order were bad, that Order 66 was good, the Jedi treated Anakin badly, etc. caused by misconceptions, sometimes George’s utilitarian writing or poor acting but often the result of straight up lies too! The plotholes and bad writing are not meant to be taken as signs of the Order’s faults and deep immorality, it’s just a plothole
This was a very interesting Video and it explained some of the more obscured Nuances of the Force very well. I do however disagree with one Concept in this Video, namely the Idea the being selfish equates to being evil. Being selfish is not evil but a necessary part of a healthy and well adjusted human being. There is nothing more pitiable than a truly selfless Person because a truly selfless Person has no sense of self and defines itself purely on the worth it’s life can bring others and that is no way to live because you need to live your life first and foremost for yourself. If you want to use your Life to help other that’s great but being selfish is not evil but something everyone needs to an extent.
self care isnt selfish..being selfish is selfish, taking care of yourself will never be selfish
@@Alpha_Draconis20 if i swore an oath to help others it doesnt matter how i feel
The term "selfish" implies that a person is focused entirely on what the self wants and doesn't concern themselves with the well being of others, so yes, it is inherently bad. While taking care of one's self is inherently, operating under the worldview that the self matters more than anybody does nothing to serve a greater good.
I’d really like a video on the misconception of Grey Jedi.
Particularly how people want to label Ahsoka and Qui hon as Grey because they didn’t see eye-to-eye with the council and the order.
The reason Ahsoka and Qui-gon questioned the order was because the order itself was becoming corrupted. they were more morally in-line with the light and the Jedi of say the high Republic than that of the Fall of the Republic;
Ahsoka and Qui-Gon weren’t Grey for disagreeing with the order, they were just more Light because the order was loosing touch.
The "Light Side" terminology led to the Kotor morality slider and together spawned the "Grey Side" BS, so I think overall it has indeed damaged fans' understanding of the force.
The fact that the very video gamey reward for grey balance means “you get all the force powers” doesn’t help either.
So that's where the word "grey" comes from... It's the middle of slider between blue and red, not white and black!
Yet the problem with this is that stories in KOTOR are 10 times better written than in the films. So it's easy to understand why fans liked the concept so much.
Also Jolee is supposed to be a grey jedi but he lectures you if you do anything selfish, immoral or cruel, and praises you for doing good. I think he was trying to be edgy tbh
I've always thought of the force as the light and the dark side as corruption. Luke asks Yoda if the dark side was stronger. He said no its easier. Meaning, the dark side takes the force by the users will. instead of letting it fill you. I was a kid back in the 80s when I watched Yoda tell him that
Yes, Light Side/Light or just Goodness is the Balance of the Force, while Evil or Darkness/Dark Side is just corruption
For me, there is only Force, no light or dark, only there is good and evil, evil force users abused Force to make tyranny, while neutral and good force users used the Force in right way and eliminating evil ones
Back in the OT days everybody got this, but the Clone Wars generation is unable to accept it apparently.
"you can't choose what you feel or how you feel it, but you CAN choose what to do with it."
JJ Abrams never understood Star Wars, what can you expect from someone who hated most of the films.
"Fandom Menace never undestand Star Wars" you mean! Just because you don't like a movie doesn't mean that the people who made the movie are assholes! Just the fact that you wrote this, shows that you are a toxic person who doesn't respect anything or anyone! Just because you have a lot of likes doesn't mean you are right! It just means that other people as toxic as you like to badmouth J.J. Abrams!
He didn't like the Prequels. Hence why he tried to ignore them and just copied stuff from the OT. 🤷♂️
@@minicle426 I didn't know that there was a rebel Stormtrooper in the original trilogy! I didn't know who had a Casino and cracker story in the original trilogy! I didn't know who had a story about a ship running out of gas in the original trilogy. Help me identify these scenes in the original trilogy because I can't see them at all! You should know, right?
@@minicle426 he also hated Return of the Jedi.
@@minicle426 May I know where you got this from? Could you give me the link to the article that J.J. Abrams said that?
Hot take incoming!!!
Star War is a retelling of the Arthurian Legends.
You have Luke as Arthur, obviously, while Yoda and Obi are playing Merlin/Nimuë.
Lea was meant to be Guinevere and Han Solo was Lancelot, funny how these two names actually sound alike, as Arthur loved and married her while she fell in love with Luke's best friend, Han Solo.
Darth Vader being a version of the Dark night. Although I'd argue that the character is closer to a Mordred accompanied by his mother Morgause, even if the blood link is inversed.
Mordred is Arthur's enemy but they're blood linked, father/son relationship like Luke and Anakin.
Arthur tried to mend it with Mordred and as a result had to sacrifice himself for the greater good, while Darth tried to mend it with his son and sacrificed himself for the greater good.
See, it's the same but George wanted the Arthurian Cycle to have an optimistic ending, as opposed to the death of Arthur followed by the destruction of his kingdom, despite his sacrifice, by Saxon invasions.
That's why George didn't want to make a sequel, the optimistic ending was the perfect ending in his mind and nothing would have changed that.
Instead, he went with prequels to safeguard the ending of episode 3(6).
This subject is how one can tell who has studied Jung and who hasn't. Yes, the darkness is a disruption of the natural order, but it is also part of a greater natural order. There is darkness in every heart, and it must be recognized, confronted, and _integrated_ in order for a person to fully realize their potential. This is the story of Luke.
Unfortunately, stuff like Persona is beyond the understanding of the average SW fan. It's like how the titular Dark Souls of Dark Souls refers to the souls of humans. Human nature is dark, but unfortunately, many religions, like Christianity, consider that a bad thing.
@@DarkAdonisVyers In the occult, we refer to these things as the right-hand path and the left-hand path. The right-hand path is about upholding and submitting to the natural order of life, whereas the left-hand path is more chaotic and focused on distorting and changing the order, often as a response to pain and trauma.
Many times, those who follow the natural order end up closing themselves off to greater truths. Dark emotions can help awaken one to a greater consciousness, but it's possible to close oneself off to the light in the process. The true master has two hands.
It is not a part of Luke's story. Rejecting the dark is. Saying no.
@@unigaming9921 The funny thing is that the only way that Mace and Obi-wan defeated Sidious and Vader respectively was by using dark side saber techniques.
@DarkAdonisVyers mace used vaapaad. He stayed entirely within the Light, and simply channeled the opponents darkness in an arc back against them. And obiwan didn't use the dark side during their fight
Its all about balance...what people dont know about yin and yang is there is 3 parts, the light, the dark and the circle the two parts create when joined...interesting video and aggravating thinking, like it