Winds of Winter Delayed Again | Cersei Vs The Faith - Game of Thrones
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- Опубликовано: 20 сен 2024
- While recording a separate videos, Preston and I discuss the dropped plot of Cersei's crusade against the High Sparrow and the chaos that will be the Winds of Winter!
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Game of Thrones is an American fantasy drama television series created for HBO by David Benioff and D. B. Weiss. Based on the fantasy novel series, A Song of Ice and Fire by George R.R. Martin. A Game of Thrones is one of the most successful television series to ever made and continues to captivate audiences all over the world. The series is set on the fictional continents of Westeros and Essos, and interweaves several plot lines with a large ensemble cast. The first narrative arc follows a civil conflict among several noble houses for the Iron Throne of the Seven Kingdoms; the second covers the attempts to reclaim the throne by the exiled last scion of the realm's deposed ruling dynasty; the third chronicles the rising threat of the impending winter and the legendary creatures and fierce peoples of the North.
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#Gameofthrones #fireandblood #windsofwinter #HBO #podcast
LOL the books end with EVERYBODY dying from gray scale! :)
We never saw it coming...
LOL, the books end
Why would they? You can just scrape it off with a spoon...
@@onetwothreefourfive12345 ah I see you are a man of culture as well
The books end with A Dance of Dragons
Allar Deem and the Zealots are probably just hanging out with Cotter Pyke at Eastwatch
With Jhiqui?
@@OfficialRedTeamReview Jinqi for 999th Lord Commander!
If Winds of Winter comes out I'll read it because I do love ASOIAF but I'm no longer anticipating the next book because every time he gives a deadline he extends it, then I get frustrated.
I wish I had ur self control. I keep hoping and getting burned.
My advice? Stop waiting. My expectation is that he will die before he finishes them because he's been pushing back the release date on Winds of Winter for over a decade, strange considering that the first three were literally published in succession
Blowing up the Faith and the Tyrell's was by far the most flawed decision by D&D and a real indication that they were ignoring the source material, the history of the show and were just trying to wrap up the whole thing with spectacle and awe (but also keeping Cersei around to be the villain... because "she's good tv").
Cersei would never do anything so ridiculous, she may be going mad (even though the show never implies this) but she's also cunning, intelligent and knows exactly how to play the game. Blowing up the Sept is a fool's decision: the Tyrell's and the Reach are feeding King's Landing, protecting it with their troops and Olenna was not present. Once Cersei murdered Olenna's son and grandchildren (and without faith apparently disappeared) she would've had her troops march directly into Cersei's chambers and had her executed- the Lannister's were easily outmanned in KL, she would've withdrawn her support for the crown and let KL rot and starve while she returned to Highgarden, most likely to be fortified in fear of retribution: This is what would've happened if the show had followed the rules established, but instead they just wrote horrible fanfiction.
Logically following that, the Tyrells either go on the attack or they just cut the food to the city. Both Cersei's actions and lack of food would cause the people to revolt massively, the only possible outcome is chaos. Cersei trying to control the crowd would probably call in the Golden company earlier. Then if the chaos continue, they would start executing people turning this into something ressembling the French Revolution, Cersei would be either Mad Queen or Iron Queen. So you have Dany coming in as a clear savior at that point.
Will Olenna back Queen Daenerys against Cersei?
" she's also cunning, intelligent and knows exactly how to play the game."
Hahaha she got scammed with losing a fleet of ships to a bastard who only looks similar to Rhaegar.
“Blowing up the sept is a fool’s decision”
So is arming the faith militant to arrest loras and Margaery
Book Cersei is famously stupid. Come on now.
The Grey Scale pandemic could be fixed like the plague in London. With a great fire...maybe wildfire stored in King’s Landing?
Wasn't clash of kings realeased in 99 maybe Grrm wanted to have a little fun with people when it came to the end of the world plot. Because y2k was widely believed.
I dont see the connection
By this point the best thing to do is to just make your own head-canon ending and stick with that, because the odds of Martin finishing the series are very thin. the man is 70, he`s already made his life and is enjoying it, you can`t expect him to finish them or finish them AND be in good quality.
I still have hope for winds to release at some point and I hope to create my head canon from there. We are just so far off the ending that I can’t really think of an actual ending that Grrm would do.
1 minute in, talking about pandemics in ASOIAF, Oh no.
When Cersei blew up the Sept, the first thing I thought about was how Henry 8th seized all monasteries in England and there was a rebellion. I assume that, just as it was in real life, the faith provided the majority of comfort and charity to the masses in the realm. Running orphanages, soup kitchens, giving out money and goods, that kind of thing. Especially under this new regime that seems more about that sort of service. So, naturally, the small folk would be incredibly devoted to the faith.... and Cersei destroys them. They should be freaking out and tearing the Red Keep apart.
The rising of sparrow religious movement is continued in Brienne 1 in A Feast for Crows when Brienne and her party come across a religious group headed towards King’s Landing who make multiple references to the sparrow
He will never finish. That’s my expectation at this point. If TWOW is taking him over a decade, imagine how long the final book will take. The book that ties all of the loose ends, resolves the story. Not to mention that he is going to tweak the ending since the fans didn’t like the show ending, and he will also be further advanced in age for the entire writing of it, slowing his wits down. I just don’t expect the book series to ever be complete.
:'(
Why wouldn't a 70+ year old fat man not finish? Besides diabetes, cancer, obesity, and old age? 😜
Agree
It wasn't necessarily the ending of the show, it was HOW the show reached the ending that people had a problem with.
@@joemc7614 is he 70???
There's also the rise of Rholor in the riverlands and the problems this will cause to consider as well.
I saw the video title, thought, "Damn it!" Then I saw it was 3 years old and thought, "Damn it!" but cried a little
I forget the context but the dean dude getting tossed overboard is referenced again later implying that it happened.
So right now Martin should be arrested because he said himself that if he wouldn't have finshed the book by 2020 he'd gave formal permisssion to be arrested!!
Would be tragic that the Aegon cause is picking up steam only to be hampered/put to a halt by an infection in the camp. But from a story perspective it does give Danny some time to gethershit together andmatch Aegons pace. Things seemsto be going to well for Aegon, this is not that king of story...
Allar Deem is the fourth guy that stabbed Jon Snow.
I think Jon Con may use his greyscale as a bioweapon. He'll infect the enemy forces/allies to kill them off or make it look like killing them would be more humane as they're all infected/dying anyway.
I think George is either been paid and under contract to not finish the books as HBO has/had a lot of money to lose if finished them and it was different from what D&D sold. Or he has actually been overwhelmed and is now scared of finishing to the point that he has given up, but can’t come out and say it.
The reason why I thought Cersei and Qyburn's plot to assassinate Jon fell apart is because Cersei wanted Osney to be the one to kill Jon (or at least be the leader of the plotters sent to the wall). But once he was captured and tortured by the High Sparrow following his fake confession that obviously couldn't happen, and Cersei couldn't send a replacement because she was immediately captured. Maybe they could've sent some random people beforehand, but the impression that I got was that Cersei wanted a trusted crony to lead. I interpreted it as an intentionally failed Cersei plot, not necessarily a dropped plot by GRRM. I will admit it feels a little half-baked though.
The problems are going to be solved with lots and lots of people dying in the story.
That wolf-saver charity thing is nuts and incredible. I’d give a kidney to get my name in ASOIAF. My names weird AF tho so I’d probably be in essos or something.
The issue is, in my view, that George has no idea how organised religion really works and how prevalent it was in European feudal society. It seems to me from various interviews I've watched that George has a very surface level knowledge of English history without any of the understanding of the deeply rooted systems that caused those events. He will know that Henry VIII broke with the Church and established his own ergo the Church was all bark and no bite without really understanding that the reason Henry was able to get away with that was that everywhere in Europe was dealing with Protestant reformations, counter-reformations and on the precipice of a century of religious wars. Nevertheless, this still gave way to plenty of religious upheaval in Britain at the time and for centuries afterwards. The Faith of the Seven is very token in nature, with no backbone and barely any thought given to how its adherents would act. Instead, priority is given to the First Men's awesome sick pagan religion and George's cursory knowledge of Zoroastrianism in the Lord of Light. We see no Followers of the Seven so much as batting an eyelid to the fact that this foreign religion is converting people all across the Seven Kingdoms right beneath their noses, let alone any idea of and syncretism we might see emerge from this a la Manichæism and its eventual final manifestation in Catharism in France that George likes so much to rant about (another example of George knowing ABOUT something with no actual understanding of how or why it came to be).
Anyway I've completely digressed from the point however I would just like to conclude by saying that George is very good at making his world seem a lot deeper than it is through sheer number of characters and he wants to have the same legacy of worldbuilding as JRRT much more than he wants to actually finish his story.
There are not people all across Westeros being converted. In fact, the seven gods have more followers each year in the north.
I feel like you haven't read the same books I have. That is the only way this post is not incredibly stupid.
@@janwouter5215
It's a very boastful and mean - spirited post.
would love to see a full ep of book dropped plots at some point
The show did a lot of stuff like this like getting rid of a lot of people cause they don't have to deal with them anymore. Like when Arya poisoned the Freys. Not only there should have been other Freys after this but her slitting Walder's throat was more than enough but no they had to poison everybody lol
But yea the biggest weakness of the post Season 6 was that after Cersei blew up the Sept, nothing happened. It should have been a revolt in the city. Hell you could even have certain characters doing things to make it worse like Varys hiring the Faceless men to create chaos. Olenna cut the food to King's Landing, etc...which would have turned the city into a revolution. So to control the people Cersei become ultra dictator and start executing people left and right and it turns into something similar to the French revolution or worse. So now the town, the people need a savior and boom Dany comes in as the obvious savior....but things would turn badly. This thing writes itself up. What we got instead was Dany and her gang going after Cersei and the Lannisters...even though post the Sept, Cersei was not that bad to her people. She didn't cut the good or over-punish them. She probably just sat at a window.
Don't forget George hates every time a fan brought up Winds to him. 3300 days since Dance of Dragons. He's called fans "entitled." We don't owe him anything and he's blatantly wrote other books instead of finishing. Very strong chance the story never gets finished. He doesn't want anyone else to finish. He more than likely got caught up with Woke Hollywood politics and the me-too era that happened. Got surrounded by people to only write strong perfect female characters. I'm sure HBO still wants a prequel to GoT and that WILL 100% be a distraction to George from writing. Hopefully he rewrote a lot because he's changing characters back to being flawed and with very compelling stories. My predictions Winds 2023 and Dream of Spring never being finished, or 2030+
Oooh so if Melisandre were to sacrifice Shireen, maybe that spreads Greyscale through the ashes? Awakening the stone dragons…
Wow, how am I just finding your RUclips videos and account? Love the content and subbed. Really good questions and unique perspectives on those questions
Allar deem lives on in our hearts :(
Who can sayyy where the roaaad goes
I had forgotten that Hot Pie line. I thought Lannisters would have their propaganda out. But what is left, Smallfolk, they can’t do anything
In the face of Martin not producing the sequel in almost a decade, how long can you keep this hypetrain going?
Exactly!!! Eventually people will move on and since there's new fantasy shows coming out that based off novels those shows may end up surpassing GOT because Lord of The Rings, A Wheel of Time, and The witcher novels are finished so the writers will have plenty to work with.
The hypetrain is dead. Yes there are hardcore people still following this work. But if you look at the asoif sub reddit is just sad compaired to what it was but so much of that is the ideas have been explored you can only spend so much time on a set of books. I'm sure you can find things to talk about but honestly the way the world is going its only a matter of time be GRRM is cancelled himself
@@sydnitheromantictaylor112 I am looking forward to The wheel of time, LOTR and witcher series but what made game of thrones so watchable is that it was marketed as an 'Anti-fantasy' show. Most people don't like High fantasy as a genre. No way these shows will become a cultural phenomenon, but they will attract a dedicated, albeit reasonable, fan base. Also GOT made possible for production companies to start betting onfantasy shows. So you have to give them credit...
I think the quasi breaking point for me was when George posted on his blog (very strongly) implying that winds would be done by Worldcon this year, and I got excited and reread the books. Then July comes around when Worldcon would have been held and now he’s saying “hopefully next year” yet again! I still don’t want to give up hope all together, but at this point I refuse to get hyped by any vague announcement again. Until he announces the release date down to what day of what month of what year I’m refusing to even touch the books again. The last 2 books are nothing but build up and cliffhangers with no payoff, and with the time investment involved reading them is too massive. A re-read of the series won’t be worth it for a long time.
@@darshaksanyal4755 true I didn't think about people not being into high fantasy, too bad D and D didn't truly care for the story more than they did because we may never get GRRM version of the ending and I do give the show credit for making it possible for production companies to start doing fantasy and that it was a cultural phenomenon.
I'm a simple man. I see a pj video and I watch it.
So if A Dream of Spring will never be written by GRRM, maybe someone else will be up to the task? Elio and Linda? Steven King? It would probably be very difficult for someone else to get GRRM's blessing to make the official ADoS, but perhaps someone like Preston could try to make an unofficial one?
@RedTeamReview This has nothing to do with this video, but I am curious who you guys think loves Jamie for a kindness he never did. And what is that kindness? Thoughts?
It would be cool if the biggest (or at least a serious) problem for Melisandre and the queensmen on the wall will be those zealots of the seven when she tries to resurrect Jon (if it'll go this way)
By the way bros where's the fire and blood podcast thaw was promised?
Okay so I recently noticed that the Some of the Tullys during the dance of the dragons are named after Sesame Street characters e.g Elmo , kermit, and I just need someone to talk about it like right now
‘Why would you do it?’ To curry favour with the Hand, there is loads of reason to do it!
Grayscale Pandemic?? More insane Preston stuff lol....
If the House of the Undying ‘visions’ were sent by the Shrouded Lord then the stony pandemic makes sense. The SL is revealing his plan
Dragonstone and the Dragonmount volcano maybe for that house of the undying thing?
What if kings landing gets burned to scour away grayscale?
The series obviously wont be finished we know that much i just hope he lives long enough to finish TWOW
Imagine if his plan all along was to release the last two books at the same time. That’s my hope anyway
The Dug
A man can dream
@@HerrMisterTheo Dream of spring
I don’t think the faith needs to be resolved just suppressed. The way George writes mirrors real life in many ways so fundamentalism is just a sad reality of life as we know it
the Pale Mare is also sort of a precedent in the story for a pandemic.
lol As soon as I heard the name Allar Deem I was like where have I heard that name before. As soon as he mentioned he was slynts guy I was like ahh I remember
Aren't the Zealots and Allar Deem just some acorns that didn't grow to oaks. I mean GRRM considers himself a Gardener
For the bittersweet I feel for the end some "villainous" characters will live by the end as it would be too cliche to get rid of them all but I'm not sure who would survive.
Little finger would be a big guess since he is smarter than a lot of the cast and I'm sure he wouldn't care for the white walkers.
My guess for cersie is she won't get that death in Jaime's arms she wants but just be alive and in a brothel as that's what she is best at with no possible way to gain power if she doesn't implode as fast.
Varys not sure on him with trying to be the hidden power behind aegon
The people don’t know Cersei blew up the Sept. The people have probably been led to believe that it’s Gods will. The High Sparrow went up against the anointed of the 7 (the crown) and that caused holy retribution.
Yeah that would be a nice plot point, but a)cercei never was anointed anything, if anything wouldn't the smallfolk think it's punishment for her sins? She already had to do a walk of shame. We SAW public opinion turning against her then and with the conflict with the high sparrow.
b) other characters in the series (I think hot pie for example) say that cercei did it. Not even just conspiratorially, it just seems to be public knowledge.
Marledame public opinion Of Lannister’s changed after the first book, many hate them and preach in the streets of their sin. A lot of the population believe the war and suffering is a result of the usurping of the mad king
@@jazzyb3424 Well aren't the people right? Robert's Rebellion started this whole thing?
Jon Con wears a glove so how would he infect King's Landing? Would Queen Daenerys have 2 burn the Red Keep 2 stop the spread?
The religious zealots sent to the wall. This was when the river lands was a war, and the path to the north was blocked by the iron born?
In the books, Allar Deem will be the one to kill the Night King- redemption!
Why do you assume there’s only two years left?
My dad sadly never made it to WoW.
Which podcast were the end world conspiracy guys talked about in?
Re murdering the sparrow, night work is not Knight work...
I pray that Daenerys Targaryen doesn't burn down King's Landing unless it's full of Greyscale.
Didn’t Shireen have grayscale? It was in Westeros before, no?
yes and no. After her birth somebody intentionally put a doll in her crib that contained the disease.
Im still not reading the 3rd book . Not until winds of winter comes out
Dude..Read the 3rd book.. it’s my favorite. You’re not helping yourself by holding out for TWOW.
We might not get winds
Big mistake. Such a great book.
Well, why get invested in something that might not get finished? he`s right, i would wait not only for TWOW but for the last one as well.
2 metres distance please.
What’s a ‘metre’ knave?
I think I know the reason why they couldn’t kill off the Sparrows earlier on in season 6 and had to keep the High Sparrow until the end. And it has nothing to do with the people and his popularity and has all to do with the writers and their plans for Cersei and House Tyrell.
Let’s play this out: Jaime and Kings Guard kill the Sparrows. What’s next? This would mean Margaery doesn’t have to pretend to be pious and Loras is free. Margaery and Tommen can resume their marriage as sole king and queen and Cersei’s crazy ass is finally sent to Casterly Rock (bcuz that’s what Tommen and the Tyrells we’re planning to do!)
That sounds awesome, but the writers wouldn’t know whee to go from here! So they HAVE to make Cersei the evil queen stereotype, and they wrote a convoluted scheme of her blowing up the Sept (with all the Sparrows and most of House Tyrell) with absolutely no repercussions.
It’s pretty dumb writing.
The thing is, it wasn't season 6 fault for that, since Winds of Winter was the last episode of that season. It would've been fascinating seeing Cersei facing the consequences of her actions. Instead, season 7 gave her (and other characters) ridiculous plot armor. She blowing up a sacred place and having more enemies is truly fitting for her story.
Allar Deem King!
So the religious plots in the books are all over the place, yet you expect perfection from Dan and Dave. I wouldn’t want to be around the Sparrows myself. They were a problem in Maeghar’s time. Blood Raven had one hang one in Dunk and Egg and Dany might have to “burn them all” in Kings Landing😁 Preston hurry up with Taeana okay and stop jawing with Carmine. Thanks for the video guys❤️
What was that about, ‘qadam?’
Right after that loot train all downhill from there
"It would not be taken amiss if that one were to be swept overboard" is an unspoken command. One doesn't let their good lord just utter out "Kill that man." it's so unchivalrous. Now, if Tyrian didn't care about Allar Deen one fig, he'd have not mentioned him at all, but he did mention him, and not only mention him, but mentioned a fate for him. A clever one would know how to read that unspoken command.
The winds of winter is never coming out lets just face that now
I have😢
Stonemen vs icemen
Lol... Alardeen( forgive spelling. I’m a lazy audiobook guy
Dislike. Doesn't understand Qanon, yet completely trashes it.
I find the name of the guy with grey scale, Conningham too 'normal'.and boring for the book. Like he was sent from our dimension.
This book is not coming out. I watched a video before where a guy broke down the logistics of the story and the size per manuscript of the plots. Mathematically george needs two books to cover TWOW alone.
He wont get it done. Its 9 years since the last book. And realistically taking into all his other commitments George has probably only done about a solid years work on the book itself or at 40 hours per week he has covered about 2000 hours of writing and reviewing in 9 years. I think twow would take about 8000 actual hours. Imagine it's about 8 hours per published page in terms of drafting, writing and reviewing for about 1,000 published pages so currently george has about 250 publishable pages
At this stage he probably should release it as two or three smaller books if he has it done sequentially
LOVE YOU CARMINE!
Whoo more content
❤️ this
Oh hey everyone, if you see Kay tell her I said hi.
F U C K teller I said hi.
nice vid
ya thats the problem with hbo got season 6 and 8 so many plot holes
More more more!!!
JonCon isn't starting a pandemic... No offense. You're the first I've heard of it mentioned
Can you do a video on avatar The Last Airbender Game of Thrones is cool and all but as a content creator I would like to see you do a video on avatar The Last Airbender if you're a fan and talk about the new live-action Series in casting
#NotMyPope
Yeah its crazy how there was no consequences for Cersei blowing up the Sept of Baelor. She is already hated by the common people and the noble lords of Westeros there's no way Cersei should've been able to be crowned Queen of the 7 Kingdoms because she was practically surrounded by enemies. Everyone would've been plotting to take Cersei down, even the Westerlands would've turned on her because she killed Kevan Lannister who had to be the active Lord of Casterly Rock after Tywin died since Jaime was in the Kings guard and Tyrion being with Daenerys.
Carmine, can you and Preston do an episode trashing GRRM for pushing back TWoW yet another year?
Wtf is “ASOIAF” or whatever people are writing?