Small Shop BIG Dreams: Can You Turn a Profit in the Home Shop?
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- Опубликовано: 9 июл 2024
- Support My Work on Patreon: / herschtoolroom
Can you turn your hobby into a profitable business?
Watch as I make a replacement cross feed screw for a South Bend 9" lathe, and we discuss the question; "can you make money in the hobby shop?"
We will consider insights and strategies for capitalizing on our strengths as hobbyists and explore ways to blend passion with entrepreneurship.
Are you already monetizing, or thinking about monetizing your hobby shop?
If so, let me know in the comments below!
My Lathe: MSC / Prince 9517350 - 13x40 Manual Metal Lathe
My Milling Machine: Bridgeport Variable Speed Series 1 "J Head"
My other Milling Machine: Brown & Sharpe No. 2 Plain "light type" Universal Milling Machine
CREDITS:
Music and Sound Effects courtesy of www.epidemicsound.com
/ @hersch_tool
00:00 Intro
00:43 Presenting the project
01:20 To the Lathe!
01:35 I lost my job
02:13 Can You Make money in the home shop?
02:55 Example of a paying job
03:28 Size Constraints?
05:21 Do the Dirty Work
07:11 Don't Underestimate Yourself
07:52 Outro
I made a special connector for a hobby brewer that eliminated the need for 3 stock adapters. The part he needed was basically a stainless steel adapter with different thread than any commercially available adapter. Previously he had to combine 3 different commercially available adapters which ended up being about 3 inches long, I made a 1 inch part that had the fist and last threads and a hex body. Very small job but my first using Stainless steel which was challenging. I was not trying to make money since I an still a newbie but He paid for the job and even bought me extra materials.
That's awesome, and this is exactly the kind of thing that we can do that a lot of big "professional" shops wouldn't likely want to bother with. Great stuff.
My philosophy is to NOT try to make money 'doing what you love'. In my experience, whenever I did that, I grew to not love it anymore. It seemed that the pressure to make a profit sucks all of the joy out of it for me.
Now I do the work that pays the most that I can tolerate in order to fund the stuff I love. When the pay is good enough I have plenty to fund the things I derive joy from and that seems to be the formula that works for me.
However for me, machining is a side skill to help with the bigger passion projects. I don't like paying someone to do average work so I tend to bring every aspect of my passion 'in house' so to speak. Does this tank my productivity? Overall it is undeniable, but the satisfaction from making everything just the way I want it is immeasurable. I would rather just design in my head and snap my fingers to produce all of my parts, but it is what it is. When 3D printing is an economically viable metal working pursuit that idea will become more than imaginary.
The point there is be careful what we wish for. If one was to build a small job machine shop into a viable biz model with a sprinkling of YT success thrown in, one becomes a slave to that. Might be great, might not.
Yeah this is an absolutely fair point and worth considering. Thanks for the perspective.
I would think carefuliy showcasing a business on RUclips. It can be interpreted that the business lacks enough skills to survive without supplemental income.
@@machinists-shortcuts Fully agree. The landscape is littered with businesses that got the artificial bump by being featured in a reality tv show, and then the show is eventually cancelled. YT success is imo some version of that. However if someone can parlay the YT success into the actual business and transition away from the original then good for them. Just don't look to close at the long list of YT burnouts.
@@jameshisself9324 It does make you wonder why " successful " businesses need to leave themselves open to informed criticism on YT. We've all seen dreadful techniques described as " tutorials " flaunting a huge amount of hubris. Unfortunately any constructive criticisms are immediately blocked, preserving the channels apparent " master " skill level. Some are now having to repost old videos for more subsidy, if this continues RUclips will lose any credibility it has for promoting unique material.
Made a clutch alignment tool for a old John Deere tractor. Guy was so happy about it he gave me $100 more than what I told him I wanted to do it
That's fantastic. And I know it feels good when you work hard on something and completely exceed the expectations.
Good luck and best wishes. The only thing I'd like to add is from my personal experience. When making a part, such as this cross slide screw, don't make just one. When you have all your tools out and setups, go ahead and make an extra - throw it up on eBay. If it's a common machine, like with your customer, there is certainly someone else out there looking for that same part. The cost of the material is minimal and machine time isn't that much more when doing a second or third...
This really is excellent advice, thanks very much for that. And thank you for watching as well.
I am a sr it engineer and lost mine 3 months ago. I totally get it! File for unemployment asap! Then get the $ sent in cash or paypal style transfers only. This will keep you from interfering with the unemployment benefits. Take any machining work you can get. You got this!
Were you "off shored" as well? They had me training my own replacements lol. TLDR, they were awful, and completely incompetent. But not my problem anymore! And thanks bro, so do YOU!
Afew years ago when I first got a lathe, I stopped at the local big truck repair shops to purchase a steel plate to mount my lathe to. As I was talking and explaining what I was doing with the steel plate, I found out I was talking with the owner. Now this shop has five large stalls and the rest of the building is for parts storage. You could have another 6 to 7 stalls. They work on anything, buses, county snow plow trucks, semi's, mobile homes. anyway, the owner told me that if I ever wanted to start doing small jobs, that I should give him a call. He said that he gets asked to do a lot of small job that are just too small for his shop. Just kind of throwing that out there.
Oh wow, that's really good info. I'll certainly have to look around and maybe shop my services to some of the shops in the area. Great information, thanks for the tip!
I’ve missed the machining videos
Thanks for the cool video! You have great talent , yes you can make money and the customer will find you I'm retired now for 4 years and have been building up my shop for a few years don't know how the customer finds me word of mouth I guess but have more work than I can do sometimes
Thanks very much, I really appreciate that! And I believe, I have faith that if I work hard and stay honest that it will all work out for the best.
@@hersch_tool it will good things happen to good people
Only advice I can offer is don't undervalue your time and product like I always do.
Haha yeah that's solid advice. If you are humble by nature, I think it's easy to both underestimate and undervalue yourself.
Yep. I have a friend that owns/runs a machine shop. Other than time management he definitely undervalues his skill. Everything he touches turns to gold and he changes peanuts. Remember if you can’t take care of yourself and your shop you won’t be able to help anyone.
@@aaronfritz7234 Amen to that. A good lesson that I think extends into life in general.
The machining skill is adaptable to many industries, and I was successful following trends, for example in the 1980s there was hydraulics work from new regulations regarding machinery leaking oil on government lands, In the 90s, the hydraulics machining moved more toward the equipment dealerships, only Caterpillar has a machine shop, there is still work there now with Case IH and the others, go ask.
Mid 1990s, people were spending money on powersports. I was doing work for all types of RVs from snowmobiles to Harleys. At that time I moved into a commercial location, at an extra cost of thousands a month, and did not have the money in my pocket and worked twice as hard for the next 13yrs. But, became a business shark to survive in the process and ended up with some nice equipment. I just like making things now.
Thanks Don, this is great advice. So basically, be adaptable, identify opportunities, and work hard to pursue those opportunities. And it also sounds like maybe a bit of, "be careful what you wish for". Seems like growing too big into a commercial space can have its downsides as well. Thanks very much for taking the time to share your experience.
some of the tooling you used to make that screw was very interesting to me. I especially liked the acme insert/holder. I have use for one but have been unable to find such a thing. most of the tools you used oare unlike mine. you should do one on the tooling, referencing this one.
Thanks very much, and that is a great idea. I've gotten comments on my tools often actually, I'll have to add that to the idea list. Thanks again!
Made money a bunch of times. this morning I used a tool I bought out of shop funds that finally paid for itself. since I bought the big JET mill. The shop has been self funding. Minus my time. I buy remake and sell equipment, make tools and parts. That money goes to tooling and materials.
The goal for 2025 will be to make sure every tool pays for itself. The lathe owes the shop about 7k. much of the tooling has yet to be used. The mill paid for itself long ago.
The shop fund paid for my wedding, 4k. bought me a bunch of beer and regularly pays for my own projects. currently making a killer creeper from scratch-wheels. I also make tools for my boys at work and give them out freely. All paid by the shop.
Yeah that's awesome, I've actually fixed up and sold quite a few machines as well. That's how I've been able to upgrade my machines from starting out with a Chinese lathe and bench mill, to having the tools I have now. I never could have afforded to outright buy all the machines I currently have in the shop. Keep killing it, sounds like you have a winning formula!
Nice machining work. I currently have no desire to make money on my hobby shop. I've done a few jobs for people, but I've never asked for money, but have never turned it down either. Hope things work out either in or out of the shop.
Thanks very much. and I completely understand and appreciate that perspective btw. And thanks, I'm sure they will. I believe that it's all going to work out for the best in the end. 🙂
The loss of a job is often ranked in the top 5 life stressors so I would never minimize it. I’m sorry that you’re having this experience. As a retired IT executive who has lost a job or two I can offer that your best chance for resumed income is to stay in the field in a similar position. As you know network management skills transfer well between industries so if you are essentially happy with doing the work your situation should be temporary. A harsh reality is that IT technical candidates seem to have a half-life so I wouldn’t let my hobby shop activity slow the search for that day job. Best wishes for success finding the new position and for the channel going forward.
Thanks very much. And I definitely know that if updated my resume that I could find another job, chained to another keyboard, and miss hardly more than a beat... That's part of the reason I haven't done that yet. I spent several years in silicon valley, that was enough to pour cold water on my passion for technology. I did well out there, but left for my own well being.
@@hersch_tool Of oourse. I get it. I think a risk is that you might drain the enjoyment from an awesome pastime. Not too many of us are lucky enough to have the hobby interest and the livelihood coincide. Best of luck in any event!
@@Dogfather66227 yeah I definitely hear what you’re saying. I have the channel, the shop, some other plans and ideas, hopefully I can make it work between all those things and stay passionate and motivated. I think it’s worth a shot at least, or hope anyway. But if I find I’m no longer loving what I’m doing then I’ll certainly reassess. Thanks for your input, i do appreciate it.
Good video! I love your optimism.
Thank you very much! I really appreciate it. And you only live once right? Make the most of it and love every minute!
Starting a mobile machine shop in a van, just small stuff. I build and repair machines for my sapphire mine already, so its just a low overhead, one worker setup, cant go out of business, it's just me messing around and having fun. I own all the lathe/mill+tools and welding tig/mig and plazma +fixture tables already, its been in the works for a couple of years. Gone from nothing and watching YT to 5um DRO setups and tig welding in 3 years, RUclips University 👍👌🇦🇺
Heck yeah man, that’s what I’m talking about. Hard work, nose down, get it done. 💪
So you want my two cents worth, the abridged version.
So really nothing wrong with the concept but don’t expect to make a profit or a living from a small hobby shop just because you have tools and are a good craftsman.
The guy who taught me the trade had a 13” Jet, C3 mill and a lot of other tools and etc.
He built machines mostly and was the only shop for 25 miles in any direction but barely paid his bills.
If you want to take on work for beer or tooling money go for it.
If you want to make a living at at it is much much harder and there is a lot more that goes into the equation than it looks like on the surface.
One of the most important is while the best machinist I have ever known did it as a hobby none of the home hobbyists can turn out a part fast enough to keep a customer happy. Most of them spend too mch time fiddling around unnecessary setups and the machines are way too light to compete (I normally rough at .250-.3)
Most of the shops I have worked in were not well equipped, had worn out machines and lousy tooling.
Attracting enough work to keep a steady income is much harder than it sounds.
You need much bigger equipment, I wouldn’t try and run a shop with less than a 16x60 lathe and a 10x50 mill.
You need to be able to weld as well.
A 6000# forklift is a must.
Not to say a shop can’t find a niche but that takes time and special circumstances (if you ever find them) Gunsmithing is probably your best bet if you want to deal with that can of worms.
Long story short.
I have been a machinist and owned machine tools since jr high (31 years) and while I have built a few parts for lawn mowers we gave up on trying to run a shop and got 9-5 jobs.
I don’t regret it.
Good honest perspective. Thanks for taking the time to share your experience.
It was a bit off subject
I have a 18X32 lathe, a 3HP Bridgeport clone and a surface grinder. I have work scheduled solid till September, My very little shop is VERY well tooled (that took a long time), I started my shop about 10 years ago and I was profitable the first year, had the shop tools and infrastructure paid off in 3 years. I profited $173,000.00 last year. You can totally make a living and a good one at that with a small shop. Just because one person couldn't get traction doesn't mean you can't. Try it, you will be surprised at what you can make.
What stops me from making money in the shop is the paper work and all sorts of taxes. Becaus I'm unable to do the official part myself, I have to pay someone to do that for me. This means the end of the dream even before it begins...
That is indeed a real problem. I am gong to do my best not to launch into a rant about government overreach, the beurocratic state, and theft of livelihood, and just say that I agree with you completely that it is an unnecessarily complicated trap.
Couldn't agree more....
@@hersch_tool Even though you didn't rant here, I suspect you have ranted in other venues on these subject. The issues are extremely complex. My recommendation is to blindly accept what you can't change and focus on productivity. Otherwise you'll just be constantly cursing under your breath while trying to figure out why this in ONLY happening to you. This is not worth your energy. Politicians from both sides could improve these issues, but they would rather spend their time foaming up division and hatred of the 'other' side. Hope that helps 😕
@@joell439 amen to that
I hope you are making something from your shop, because you put out regular videos and have a healthy number of subs for this kind of subject.
Biggest problem I see making parts being sold to "the public" is business insurance. Depending on what you produce, you need to cover yourself against claims.
I just finished up a job making some aluminium trinkets for a colleague who is going to Burning Man, it's going to be a while until my home built CNC pays for itself, but it'll get there one day...
I've got a vague goal to dial back the day job and do more machining for money, but I think I'm going to need more of a business plan and niche before I can look at that more seriously. A mix of light job-shop work plus interesting gubbins on Etsy seems to be where I'm aiming, with the view that the CNC can be making the Etsy bits while I'm running the lathe and mill for other things.
For not having plan, sounds like you have the makings of a solid plan... Lol. Good luck!
@@hersch_tool Thanks, I think this video and it's comments have helped give me a direction 🙂 I would love to hear more about how you get on, and also how you source and price work
@@matthewgreen8454 I'm glad to hear it brother, that was kinda the hope I had for the video, that it would inspire conversations and give people ideas and confidence. I'll certainly try to give an update and maybe do a video in the future about pricing work. Thanks again, and thank you for watching
@@hersch_tool Please only post a video on pricing work if you have vast experience on the subject. Otherwise folk will make the same early expensive mistakes you will learn along the way. Leave this niche subject to experienced engineering shop owners and estimators.
@@marley589 Have you got any links to videos where people talk about the early expensive mistakes people make?
Very interesting. Yeah I thought about making parts like a small machine shop do. Good work sir.
Thanks very much!
Interesting subject, I hope you find a way to make it work.
I my experience, the more of your different skills you can use at the same time, the bigger the chance that you can find your own niche.
In my own case, I have a background as a mechanic and I have a technicians degree in machine design, where I also learned to keep accounts and do bookkeeping.
And as a technician I worked a lot with computers.
Almost by coincidense, in 2008 I bought some welders from a neighbor country, that I sold on and made a little profit, shortly after I decided to try to import wlders and stuff like that from China, this was in 2009 and I still live off my own company that way, with import and selling in my own webshops.
I realized that by change I had the skills to import, make my own webshops, do my own bookkeeping but also had that knowlegde about welding and materials, that I could sell this stuff, and advice the customers what to buy.
My point is, every person have different skills, where each skill can be useful and maybe get you a job, but if you can combine your skills, you can better find your own niche, where you maybe not need to sell your time hour by hour.
Importing from China is probably not going to last in the long run the way the world are changing these years, so I will probably at some point have to do something else, if and when that happens, I will again try to combine as many of my skills as possible, to find my own niche, I would probably try to produce my own products, in areas where I have more than average knowledge, and in areas where big scale production is not cost effective, that is where the small workshop have its advantage, maybe even be open to customizing my own products for the customer, something big scale production can never do.
Thanks for sharing your experience. This is a great example of recognizing opportunities when they arise, and applying hard work to take advantage of them. I think this is definitely something that is key to making it work as a small entrepreneur. Thanks again!
Couple things come to mind, most people are too scared to charge a realistc hourly rate for what they do or are frightened customers will say no, which many will. There is a lot of work out there that is way beyond the scope of the larger engineering shops.
This is a really good point. I was talking with a retired machinist not too long ago about this exact thing. I was showing him some of my work, and what I would charge for it, and his reaction was basically, "double it. double your rate." I think this goes hand in hand with what I mentioned in the video about underestimating, we also tend to undervalue ourselves.
@@hersch_tool The one that gets me is the 3d printer, laser and the CNC guys who leave their machines running unattended and therefore assume there's no hourly rate. Lets take 3d printers, here, if it takes 3 hours to print one small part, to me thats £105 + costs at sensible hourly rates, this is for something they'd sell or charge £5 for. If a machine shop in your area charge $100 an hour, you can get $50!
@@siukcnc yep, you have money invested in that machine, tooling, programming, power to run it, space to keep it, the list goes on. Even if it's able to run unattended it's definitely not running for free
Don't consider it unless you have served a formal apprenticeship and have several years of varied Good experience. If you don't have these you will quickly find out that you don't know anywhere near as much as you think.
I appreciate your perspective, but I respectfully disagree. I don't personally have any misconceptions about being highly skilled, or knowledgeable, watch my channel and you'll see how frequently I state that I have no idea what I'm doing. But to say that we can't use what we do have at our disposal to better ourselves if we work hard and remain honest in our capabilities seems short sighted and perhaps even a little defeatist. My dad always told me, "don't be a nay sayer!" whenever I'd say something's impossible and want to give up. That advice has served me well so far at least. But to your point, I definitely see where it's important to know your limitations and not get ahead of yourself. Remain honest, with yourself and with anyone you agree to work for. I'm not looking to launch a full time machining career and haul dozer parts into my 2 car garage, just looking for odd jobs and exploring ways to generate a little income that don't require chaining myself to another cubicle that can be ripped away and sent overseas at any moment.
@@hersch_tool I guess it is how you promote yourself. Anyone arriving at your door can only assume that you are fully skilled. Also those who sacrificed their time and money to learn the trade properly won't appreciate being undercut. My advise is to get the qualifications in your own time and offer yourself as a trainee at a local company. Then you will be in a position to offer in depth advise and use efficient methods for a fair price.
I’m retired now so I’m not looking to earn money. However, I do some small jobs as a favour to others. Others have done many favours for me in return.
Yeah, that's a great way to go about it. And you end up "making money" in the money that you save trading favors that way. And it's the neighborly thing to do ;)
Sorry to hear about your old job but after 75 years of dealing with those kinds of events that what seems to be a negative ends up being a positive because it forces you to do something you were reluctant to take on before. I haven't worked my way through all of your videos yet and somewhere in there might be the answer to this question. If you don't mind sharing, what was your fulltime former occupation and what is your first name? I'd just like to refer to you as something other than "Hersh". Another great video, thanks for posting.
I absolutely agree with you there. The things that really shake us up are often our biggest opportunities. I was working in technology as a network administrator, and my name is David. Thanks very much for the positive perspective!
@@hersch_tool You are very welcome and thanks for teaching me so great new skills.
For me, the real hard part about making money with my shop (if I chose to do that) is actually finding someone who wants to give me money. It seems like there's some secret well of limitless small jobs out there that everybody but me knows about. I have considered xometry but I would much rather do more local stuff, I just have no idea how to find someone with a need that I am capable of filling.
Yeah I think that’s one of the big challenges, you’re not alone in that. And for xometry I think you need cnc exclusively.
Firstly commiserations on losing your job. I've been through this experience twice in my working life and it does turn your world upside down.. If you can make a living out of jobbing work, then I would say go for it. You've nothing to lose by giving it a go, and everything to gain if the venture is successful. I retired recently and looking back on my working life, I would have been much more enthusiastic about earning a living if I had spent more time doing what I liked, rather than putting up with a job I didn't particularly like, simply for the sake of money. Very best wishes, whatever you decide to do
Thanks very much, I appreciate it. And this is exactly the realization that I'm coming to now. I figure there are ways to prosper and be happy, instead of selling our time to a corporate overlord and living in a world of time cards, performance reviews, quarterly goals, and all the constant stress that comes along with. If we're gonna be stressed, why not at least new stressed on our own behalf? Lol
Best of luck if you decide to go full time machining! Please make sure you sort out health insurance. ❤
Thanks! But I'm not looking to do anything drastic, just exploring ways to generate a little income out of my shop. I have the channel, odd jobs, etc. We'll see where it all goes, but I'm optimistic and still believe in the value of hard work, even if that's a little naive in this day and age... Lol
What did you charge for the part?
If you’re unemployed it’s not about making money as much as making a living. That’s the real question, can you make enough to support your family and your futures. Don’t forget about all those business expenses. Wishing you the best.
Facts, that's exactly right. And thank you very much.
just as an observation, a lathe is not a tool that you will find "even in the most modestly tooled hobby shops", not to mention the mill used for cutting the keyway
you used 5k$ in tools to make a 50$ profit part
Thanks for your comment, but a lathe is really the first, and often only, machine tool in a hobby machine shop. This entire project can be done on the lathe. I used the mill because I have one, but you can definitely do the whole project on the lathe.
Just a counter observation. A hobby machine shop without a lathe is not a hobby machine shop. Also a mill may cost $5k fully kitted out but you don’t toss it in the trash after doing a job. It will take time but eventually it gets paid off and you turn a true profit.
My suggestion, keep as hobby make some beer money. Look for job with government. or utility like power company. One that pays pension.
Fair suggestion. Thanks for your perspective, and thank you for watching!
excellent video thank you.
Thanks for watching!