Not to be too rough on you but your card type math is off. Omniscience is an enchantment and Atraxa is a creature neither of which is normally accounted for. That means with your usual land + instant + sorcery you will basically always be at 4 if you are in a position that you actually want to activate woodland. Cutting the 8 artifact slots leaves you room for dedicated enablers and probably also a bit of flex for whatever you felt light on. I am also not in love with only 5 fetches if you want to use them for delirium. You could shave an island and a hedge maze or the basic forest to get up to 7.
I don't think it's unreasonable to be redundant on card types. Adding Baubles into the mix just means that you can get away with fetch + ponder OR brainstorm + bauble which is 3. Besides that, it's a literal 0 mana cycle so it means a virtual 56 card deck at its floor, and then it gives free information as yet a 3rd layer of value given. But, yes, it is not a *necessary* card/card type for the deck's functionality, it's just a small layer of redundancy.
@@fel_95Don't you always have Delirium anyways if Land, Instant, Sorcery are easy and you need a target like Omniscience in there as well for Woodland to do its thing...?
it has actually come up but if you have delirium you can shifting turn woodland into emrakul in response to emrakul's shuffle because dellirum is only required for the activation. basically what would happen is woodland becomes emrakul then your graveyard shuffles in then you have a 15/15 flyer annihilator 6 that can swing and turns back into shifting woodland at end of turn
i feel like this kind of deck would like to run Consider, Careful Study, Mental Note and/or Thought Scour in some combination. cantrips that load your graveyard are great, especially for 1 mana
I saw a Timeless version of this deck that used the Adventure from Fae of Wishes to set up an Approach of the Second Sun win. That was one of the weirdest decks I have ever seen, so let's see how this goes!
50:21 why did you not cast the emrakul? It can’t be countered right? Even if it gets karakas’d you just replay it and take another extra turn. They don’t untap so you get to swing at least once with it. Am I missing something? @thrabenU
yeah that was a missplay i think the vexing baublemade him tune out omniscience as a show target, and the karakas would bounce emrakul if he showed in emrakul. he should show and tell for omniscience even if his opponent puts in karn for show emrakul cast get cast trigger gets bounced by karrakas cast again 2nd cast trigger (= 2 extra turns) go to turn 2, then can swing annihilate 6, then move to 3rd turn, swing emrakul at face annihilate 6 and opponent is dead
@@WarbossMorgorTeefsmasha if the opponent plays correctly he would probably wait till the extra turn in beginning of combat to bounce the emrakul, but he would still get the 3rd extra turn to swing once before he has to pass the turn. At that point the opponent would only have 2 permanents left and would likely concede.
If you have instant, land, and sorcery in the yard, whatever thing you are copying provides the 4th type, whether it's creature or enchantment, so I don't think you need the baubles. (I play this deck in Timeless and it's fairly different but some of the same concepts apply)
Also Mystic Sanctuary is great in the timeless version of this deck, but also every land except Shifting Woodland (and fetches) is an island. Might be worth considering adding that to this deck, even if the manabase has to be reworked.
"You need a fourth cardtype" isn't quite accurate. The only time you're going to be activating Woddlands is to copy a permanent card in your graveyard, and copying a land doesn't accomplish anything here. So realistically, the fourth cardtype will be whatever the thing you need to copy - an enchantment or a creature. With that in mind, you could replace the Baubles with a card selection spell that can also put cards into your graveyard to enable Woodlands, like a Careful Study or some other looting spell.
would it be too cute to imagine a manabond, life of the loam, semi 8-mulch plan with the deck, where you just dump a bunch of lands turn 1 and turn 2 or 3 use the woodland to reanimate some big dumb creature from your graveyard? that doesnt go with the show and tell idea, but it's something cute I thought of.
My turbodepths experience with woodland tells me you probably want Lotus Petal in this deck to help enable it as well as power out show and tell. Hope you feel better soon :)
I am very curious why Lotus Petal did not get an inclusion in this build. Malevolent Rumble would enable and potentially ramp. Palantir of Orthanc also seems like an enabler / alternate win condition as well. Shifting Woodland is going to get a trial run as a 1 or 2 of in my Eureka / Show and Tell deck but I don't quite see it as a build around, especially if we don't get "Enters" triggers with it.
Nice! I JUST built a modern hybrid variant of the shift-omni like two days ago, finishing build #1 that I am comfortable with firing. I hadn’t considered Vantress Gargoyle, but I don’t think I am about that. Same thing with the Emrakul non-bo, but show and tell isn’t modern accessible anyway.
Seeing Shifting Woodland reminded me that some people like The Professor from Tolarian Community College had it very high, if not 1st place for prediction of most impactful MH3 card. And I never saw it again until now^^. I guess modern is just too fast currently for an activated ability that costs 4 mana and requires setup
@@Sean.Thomas2 Aspiringspike had it rated very highly IIRC, and he certainly plays a lot of modern. He has since come up with some decks that utilize it, with okay results.
I think Mishra’s Bauble for delirium is irrelevant. Let me explain why: As you said, instant sorcery and land are mostly free, so we just need one more type, which mishra’s bauble does accomplish. However, what are you copying with shifting woodland? If its not a land that you’re copying, you need to already have your creature or enchantment in your graveyard to target, so you should have shifting woodland active whether or not bauble is present. I think if the plan is shifting woodland, you probably just want to intuition or maybe even thought scour yourself into milling a target? Not sure, but regardless, i think the bauble needs to go.
couldn't careful study work in that plan ? atraxa is good body but is it really what we would want to copy ? probably better in a midrange/control deck and reuse a oko or something ?
I'm curious about the choice of [[Vantress Gargoyle]] here... Wouldn't just any sort of two mana looter be just as good? You could run some combination of [[Merfolk Looter]], [[Jace, Vryn's Prodigy]], and [[Kitsa, Otterball Elite]] (at least once Bloomburrow happens for that last one).
50:15 why not show and tell omnicience and cast emrakul? emrakul gives another turn but most importantly, bauble cant counter it because emrakul is uncounterable
in around minute 15 when you could have counterd the frog, isnt pitching omniscience for force of will into shighting woodlands a winning play ? even if force of will is counterd you get attraxa right (ofc if that gets counterd it is over)
I don't think you need bad delirium enablers like mishras bauble and the gargoyle because counting instant, sorcery, land, and the permanent you want to copy from your graveyard is already 4 card types.
since the deck wants cards in hand with cantrips, but needs to put them in the grave for the woodlands, would something like careful study not make a lot of sense. On base it is a very bad cantrip, which is probably still better than gargoyle, and when it does the thing, you only really need to put one specific card you want to select in the grave, not mill over time.
I'm pretty sure omniscience+emrakul beats vexing bauble+karakas. Emrakul can't be countered by bauble, and if they bounce emrakul with karakas just recast her, and next turn karakas will be tapped.
Hi Phil! I sent you a dono deck and an email with the link to it last week - guessing it was missed because you were out of town helping with family matters - you mentioned to remind you if you missed anything important so post here. It was a BUG beans list with psychic frog. Drop me a quick reply to the email if you can so I know you got the money and the deck list - thanks! :)
I'd be interested in seeing a similar build with Urza's Saga as the delirium enabler over Shifting Woodlands. Woodlands only works in long games anyway so what if you remove all the Vantress Gargoyles and down to 1 Shifting Woodland, you can get 3-4 Urza's Saga, 1 Expedition Map, 1 Boseiju Who Endure/Otawara, and 1 Boseiju Who Shelters All if you want it.
Not to be too rough on you but your card type math is off. Omniscience is an enchantment and Atraxa is a creature neither of which is normally accounted for. That means with your usual land + instant + sorcery you will basically always be at 4 if you are in a position that you actually want to activate woodland. Cutting the 8 artifact slots leaves you room for dedicated enablers and probably also a bit of flex for whatever you felt light on. I am also not in love with only 5 fetches if you want to use them for delirium. You could shave an island and a hedge maze or the basic forest to get up to 7.
Exactly.
That was also first thing that came into my mind. Either you have delirium or you don't want to activate anyway.
I don't think it's unreasonable to be redundant on card types. Adding Baubles into the mix just means that you can get away with fetch + ponder OR brainstorm + bauble which is 3. Besides that, it's a literal 0 mana cycle so it means a virtual 56 card deck at its floor, and then it gives free information as yet a 3rd layer of value given.
But, yes, it is not a *necessary* card/card type for the deck's functionality, it's just a small layer of redundancy.
Malevolent Rumble is a much better enabler than the Gargoyle.
but it's not an Artifact or creature towards delirium
@@fel_95Don't you always have Delirium anyways if Land, Instant, Sorcery are easy and you need a target like Omniscience in there as well for Woodland to do its thing...?
@@DankAudioStash24 Phil talked about the delirium issue at the end of the video
@@fel_95 He didn't go into my comment (which others have made as well).
it has actually come up but if you have delirium you can shifting turn woodland into emrakul in response to emrakul's shuffle because dellirum is only required for the activation. basically what would happen is woodland becomes emrakul then your graveyard shuffles in then you have a 15/15 flyer annihilator 6 that can swing and turns back into shifting woodland at end of turn
i feel like this kind of deck would like to run Consider, Careful Study, Mental Note and/or Thought Scour in some combination. cantrips that load your graveyard are great, especially for 1 mana
I saw a Timeless version of this deck that used the Adventure from Fae of Wishes to set up an Approach of the Second Sun win. That was one of the weirdest decks I have ever seen, so let's see how this goes!
Its pretty good in timeless where there is no Force of will and BO1. I have it built its pretty decent and consistent
LegenVd?
50:21 why did you not cast the emrakul? It can’t be countered right? Even if it gets karakas’d you just replay it and take another extra turn. They don’t untap so you get to swing at least once with it. Am I missing something? @thrabenU
yeah that was a missplay i think the vexing baublemade him tune out omniscience as a show target, and the karakas would bounce emrakul if he showed in emrakul.
he should show and tell for omniscience even if his opponent puts in karn for show emrakul cast get cast trigger gets bounced by karrakas cast again 2nd cast trigger (= 2 extra turns) go to turn 2, then can swing annihilate 6, then move to 3rd turn, swing emrakul at face annihilate 6 and opponent is dead
@@WarbossMorgorTeefsmasha if the opponent plays correctly he would probably wait till the extra turn in beginning of combat to bounce the emrakul, but he would still get the 3rd extra turn to swing once before he has to pass the turn. At that point the opponent would only have 2 permanents left and would likely concede.
@@notkingofnidoking7229 yeah the oppent had no out there, i just chalk it up to thraben forgetting an important line of text on emrakul
At first I read that as “Shit and Tell”, my brain is rotten to the core
I feel like lotus petal was a missed opportunity! Speeds up your show n tell lines, and feeds delirium
EMRAKUL CANT BE COUNTERED MY GUY 50:00
sitting in my chair yelling at the screen.
If you have instant, land, and sorcery in the yard, whatever thing you are copying provides the 4th type, whether it's creature or enchantment, so I don't think you need the baubles. (I play this deck in Timeless and it's fairly different but some of the same concepts apply)
Also Mystic Sanctuary is great in the timeless version of this deck, but also every land except Shifting Woodland (and fetches) is an island. Might be worth considering adding that to this deck, even if the manabase has to be reworked.
"You need a fourth cardtype" isn't quite accurate. The only time you're going to be activating Woddlands is to copy a permanent card in your graveyard, and copying a land doesn't accomplish anything here. So realistically, the fourth cardtype will be whatever the thing you need to copy - an enchantment or a creature. With that in mind, you could replace the Baubles with a card selection spell that can also put cards into your graveyard to enable Woodlands, like a Careful Study or some other looting spell.
would it be too cute to imagine a manabond, life of the loam, semi 8-mulch plan with the deck, where you just dump a bunch of lands turn 1 and turn 2 or 3 use the woodland to reanimate some big dumb creature from your graveyard? that doesnt go with the show and tell idea, but it's something cute I thought of.
Dropping the show and tell means that the deck folds to gy hate, with UB scam beeing the top deck that seems like a bad place to be
Dies to leyline of the void and FoV adds another piece that needs to align, so I wouldn't play it
@@ekrotte8714 yes I agree the metagame is completely wrong for the card in general I think
@@gabrote42 I wouldn't play it either tbh 😅 Maybe Woodland should stay in modern.
My turbodepths experience with woodland tells me you probably want Lotus Petal in this deck to help enable it as well as power out show and tell.
Hope you feel better soon :)
I am very curious why Lotus Petal did not get an inclusion in this build. Malevolent Rumble would enable and potentially ramp. Palantir of Orthanc also seems like an enabler / alternate win condition as well. Shifting Woodland is going to get a trial run as a 1 or 2 of in my Eureka / Show and Tell deck but I don't quite see it as a build around, especially if we don't get "Enters" triggers with it.
Nice!
I JUST built a modern hybrid variant of the shift-omni like two days ago, finishing build #1 that I am comfortable with firing.
I hadn’t considered Vantress Gargoyle, but I don’t think I am about that. Same thing with the Emrakul non-bo, but show and tell isn’t modern accessible anyway.
Seeing Shifting Woodland reminded me that some people like The Professor from Tolarian Community College had it very high, if not 1st place for prediction of most impactful MH3 card. And I never saw it again until now^^. I guess modern is just too fast currently for an activated ability that costs 4 mana and requires setup
those people dont actually play modern, and their takes make it clear
@@Sean.Thomas2 Aspiringspike had it rated very highly IIRC, and he certainly plays a lot of modern. He has since come up with some decks that utilize it, with okay results.
I think Mishra’s Bauble for delirium is irrelevant. Let me explain why:
As you said, instant sorcery and land are mostly free, so we just need one more type, which mishra’s bauble does accomplish.
However, what are you copying with shifting woodland? If its not a land that you’re copying, you need to already have your creature or enchantment in your graveyard to target, so you should have shifting woodland active whether or not bauble is present.
I think if the plan is shifting woodland, you probably just want to intuition or maybe even thought scour yourself into milling a target? Not sure, but regardless, i think the bauble needs to go.
couldn't careful study work in that plan ?
atraxa is good body but is it really what we would want to copy ?
probably better in a midrange/control deck and reuse a oko or something ?
I'm curious about the choice of [[Vantress Gargoyle]] here... Wouldn't just any sort of two mana looter be just as good? You could run some combination of [[Merfolk Looter]], [[Jace, Vryn's Prodigy]], and [[Kitsa, Otterball Elite]] (at least once Bloomburrow happens for that last one).
50:15 why not show and tell omnicience and cast emrakul? emrakul gives another turn but most importantly, bauble cant counter it because emrakul is uncounterable
Emrakul can't be countered. Vexing Bauble doesn't stop free flying spaghetti monsters.
in around minute 15 when you could have counterd the frog, isnt pitching omniscience for force of will into shighting woodlands a winning play ? even if force of will is counterd you get attraxa right (ofc if that gets counterd it is over)
I don't think you need bad delirium enablers like mishras bauble and the gargoyle because counting instant, sorcery, land, and the permanent you want to copy from your graveyard is already 4 card types.
Phil, do you believe any of the new Spaghetti Monsters are good enough for Sneak/Show and Tell type decks, or is Aeons Torn too good to be replaced?
since the deck wants cards in hand with cantrips, but needs to put them in the grave for the woodlands, would something like careful study not make a lot of sense. On base it is a very bad cantrip, which is probably still better than gargoyle, and when it does the thing, you only really need to put one specific card you want to select in the grave, not mill over time.
I wonder if there's a deck (maybe in a different format) where you just use Shifting Woodland as a manland of Nulldrifter.
isn't Griselbrand way better than Atraxa with shifting woodland?
34:04 Finally. Deck should be Show and Tell Plus.
Maybe Wood Sage is better than Vantress Gargoyle? You can dig 4 deep for Atraxa if you want it in your hand, or mill 4 every turn.
Is there a version for this wants Mox Diamond, Can get itself or a land to the yard and pushes you to the four mana for copying omni
Consecrate Land: "AFTER 10000 YEARS IM MARGINALLY RELEVANT!!!L
Why not run the free street wraith for delirium
I hope he does the thing.
I feel Atraxa isn’t the best choice to go with shifting woodland, since her best ability is an etb. It really seems like Griselbrand makes more sense.
That's what I was thinking. Atraxa is pretty irrelevant with Shifting Woodland. It's just a big creature with no card drawing.
I feel like frantic search would fit well in this list, or even fit the deck to be temur and run faithless looting
Frantic Search is banned unfortunately.
I'm pretty sure omniscience+emrakul beats vexing bauble+karakas.
Emrakul can't be countered by bauble, and if they bounce emrakul with karakas just recast her, and next turn karakas will be tapped.
Obligatory algorithmic contribution
Why not Uro?
Hi Phil! I sent you a dono deck and an email with the link to it last week - guessing it was missed because you were out of town helping with family matters - you mentioned to remind you if you missed anything important so post here. It was a BUG beans list with psychic frog. Drop me a quick reply to the email if you can so I know you got the money and the deck list - thanks! :)
I just updated the queue today with a ton of lists. I remember seeing that. You're good!
Just seen it's been added to the queue! No need to email me back! Can't wait for the video :)
I feel like the baubles are honestly completely irrelevant. If you have an Ominiscience in the yard to copy, you already have Enchantment.
And obviously the same goes for creatures
I'd be interested in seeing a similar build with Urza's Saga as the delirium enabler over Shifting Woodlands. Woodlands only works in long games anyway so what if you remove all the Vantress Gargoyles and down to 1 Shifting Woodland, you can get 3-4 Urza's Saga, 1 Expedition Map, 1 Boseiju Who Endure/Otawara, and 1 Boseiju Who Shelters All if you want it.
Then why emrakul?
It's still necessary for the Omniscience side of the deck.
Needs more Attunement.
First! also phil i love you