For those who moan about other people spending $$.... I once spent $350 to get an Epiphone Les Paul that would have been worth $150 in mint condition into playable shape. It was my late brother's guitar. He left very little to my nephews when he passed. It was worth it to me to spend more than the guitar was worth to get it put back together.
My favorite guitar is an Epi LP100. It was my first guitar. I put new tuners, I replaced every plastic part with acrylic transparent parts (because I’m a 90’s kid), even the tulip tuning knobs, put EMGs, CTS pots, Switchcraft switch and jack, a gotoh bridge, stainless steel frets, white nácar inlays and a tusq nut. I have lost count of how much money I have spent on this guitar, and I don’t care. I enjoy working on it and no one has a guitar like mine. Leaving it to my kids when I die and will come back to pull their feet in their sleep every night if they sell it.
I just repaired an Epiphone A model mandolin for the same basic reason. Sadly his mom took it to someone else first and they did a horrible job. He works at my bank so I took the job. Make any money? Not really but I made a family a bit happier at the young man's life celebration. It's not always all about money. Sometimes you just have to do the right thing!
@@LosRockson I've got Epiphone LP-100 in my lap right now. I paid $100 for it off Craigslist a few years back and I'm never afraid to hand it to the children to let them play it. Those memories are priceless.
I have repaired 3 guitars with big bellies without bridge doctors. A torpedo level with a 5 pound weight + 3 months wait time. Add humidity to speed it up as you like.
WOW!! $1,200.00 for a guitar neck?!?! Do you get many customers? The most for a guitar neck (finish included) is $300.00 - $350.00 or $400.00 tops. I can make identical copies of just about anything but this guitar is a $79.00 pawn shop special! I'd fix the bridge and straighten the neck and hope for the best. Otherwise this is a lost cause.
He's booked out for the next 6 months at least. He doesn't charge 1200 for a neck, he said that's the amount of work needed to fix this guitar considering its unorthodox construction
I host a now-and-then friendly jam session in my home, and last time, the drummer shows up wearing one of your t-shirts. I ask him if he plays guitar, and he tells me he doesn't - he just really likes watching your videos. So do I!
Your definition of a loss is different than mine Ted. A loss is me standing in the back yard pissing on the smoldering ashes of a Japanese-made Epiphone.
I 'd like to say thanks Mr. Tedd. for repairing Japan made guitar. I always like to watch your video and I always respecting your skills and craftsmanship. have a lots of good days!! god bless you!!
@@DynamicRockers Good suggestion. I've got a Walabot Stud Finder that connects to cellphone and provides a visual representation of what lies below the surface of a few types of materials. It requires a flat surface, but something like it might actually work.
I like to go to Wristwatch Revival and watch him not lose little teeny screws that I would immediately drop onto the floor where they'd enter another dimension never to be found again. Here's his latest video - ruclips.net/video/ZHmRePXsI88/видео.html
And I love you. I had no idea about this till you set me on the internet trail (although I was vaguely aware there were 'corporate songs')! Presumably there are many real and equally crass 'hooray for our side' pep songs that predate the Simpsons. In the UK, it's more: 'We go in, we go out, get our wage is what it's all about'. Actually, I prefer that and feel better.
I did a cheater "neck reset" on a beater guitar by clamping it on a stout plank, pulling the neck down where I thought it should be, blocking off most of the cavity with a towel and blowing in steam from a clothing steamer until it seemed really hot, and letting it sit for a week before unclamping. Two years later, still good.
I had the same thought. Double lag bolt in the heel (like a banjo neck). I wonder if neodymium magnets would be able to detect them through the heel? The nut will be under those triangular neckblock braces.
Just a couple of tricks: 1. You can use small rare-earth magnets to locate steel rods and screws within the wood. 2. You can sometimes unscrew a bolt like the one under the acorn nut by using two thin nuts locked together. Thanks for sharing!
It seems impossible that he didn't solve that issue or that someone hasn't told him how those guitars were built. I thought about the 2 nut thing too. Why didn't he even consider it? I'm thinking he has enough on his plate as it is without stepping into a potentially liable situation. "Hey, I wrecked your guitar." I'm still curious about this. His explanation about how the companies treat the actual physicality of the guitar seems totally plausible. Wood comes in/ Guitars go out. Shame we left the question unanswered. Maybe it will surface again.
I wondered whether it would have been possible to drill into the heel to find the head of that screw and extract it. The extent of my knowledge on the subject, however, is pretty much what I've seen in your videos - so I figure there has to be a good reason why you didn't do that. Thank you for making these videos. I look forward to them every week.
I don't think that screw has a head. It's a stud with machine threads on one half of it and wood-screw threads on the other half. It's screwed into the heel and then bolted to the guitar body.
I used to work in electronics manufacturing (retired now) and we had a few X-Ray machines to look closely at defects and do inspections on process. This issue made me wonder if you had availability to an X-Ray machine would it help you to determine what is going on in those areas. And.. to those that don't know and think that you do... You can fully adjust continuous XRAY for depth, density and have control on contrast. You can even magnify the area you want to observe and adjust the angle on the fly. This isn't the simple film xrays of the 50's.
That would be so awesome... Maybe somebody at the hospital in Hamilton could sneak something in after hours? Or maybe there's a radiology lab that would want to cooperate? I would love to see what Terry could do if the guesswork is removed...
Apparently this sort of thing is occasionally done for very high end violin repairs. I suppose it makes sense in that case as the value of the instruments they're working on starts at five figures and climbs fast.
@@gramursowanfaborden5820 There is no danger of that. If it is a machine you are shielded by it and if its on a table then you just go behind the lead wall.
To me, a particular instrument's value is what I believe it to be, for me, personally. I have several 'bargain' guitars, that I have worked on, and made to play and sound well above their price point. Those are the one's I play, and not my Gibsons or Fenders. I'm not sure why - maybe sentimental reasons? That Epiphone is a very nice looking guitar - too bad it was kind of obstinate in the repair department.
Indeed. I have a late 1970's Yamaha 12 string that is in beautiful condition, but it needs a neck reset, and no one will do it. What a pity that during the period they (the manufacturers) decided to do things to the neck joint (including using some type of epoxy), that just wasn't the norm....or even necessary.
@@realjumper Epoxy on any wooden instrument should only be used for filling a gap, and never for bonding two surfaces. Titebond Original responds very well to heat and moisture. There is even a company video showing how to unglue using heat and moisture. Hide and fish glue are also fairly easy to un-bond. But epoxy is virtually impossible to break loose.
@@perihelion7798 I think you misread what I wrote. The instrument needs a neck reset, but this is virtually impossible because the neck was secured with epoxy from the Yamaha factory in the 1970's
@@realjumper I did read it correctly. I used repairs as an example of not what to do, and that goes double for epoxy bonding during construction as well.
"some days you get the bear, some days the bear gets you" that said, one thing i thought of is inspired by the first video i saw of a guy using the original stewmac soldering iron heat stick; he mounted the neck in the big padded clamp and did all the wiggling and pulling on the body itself. that provides a lot more leverage and would (i imagine) allow for pulling the body straight away from the neck with a lot more force compared to having it sitting loose on the bench
Here's a question for you, Ted. How would you go about billing the client for a job like this? Is there an upfront conversation about the possibility that despite your best efforts there's not much to be done, but you still need to be paid for your time? I guess what I'm asking is: Do you bill for the *labor*, or the *result*?
ahhh, mr. sparkle!! My uncle has a similair guitar, though not the exact same model. It belonged to a close friend who died, and so it has incredibly high sentimental value, but much of the bracing has come loose and we've brought it to a couple luthiers who won't touch it.
An online catalog of strange neck joint systems would be a fantastic resource. Also, by adding the guitar type to all your titles would stop those emails....maybe......probably not..... :)
We are having the same kind of week sir. Id do the 'lol" but we both know, it is not funny. carry on sir, thanks for your videos. very very helpful to my daily running shop in my store. respectfully, Vinny.
i used to work for a UPS sorting facility and before you start working you have to watch corperate safety videos, and the very last one was calisthenics "suggestions" to do evey morning,, a15 minute long syncronized richard simmons esqe work out video that was featuring official ups employees. thank god we werent actually required to do them that job was rough i wouldnt have been able to deal with jazzersize every morning
I would certainly pay more for repairs than guitar worth in situations. I have two guitars in my collection that I will never replace. Those two have aged well over the years and developed awesome sound. I would always choose to fix them over replacing them.
It' s an " It is what it is guitar" , it should be appreciated for How it sounds " as it is" and bearing the innate flaws, since it' s a cheap; anyway even that " barely better then it was" it' s a great result!👌🏼
A couple years ago I had to do some work on an early 70's Morris 12 string. It needed a new top, so I wanted to remove the neck first. I was hoping there might be a dovetail neck joint, but found no indications on a dovetail. To get a look at how the neck was joined, to the body, I decided to take the fretboard off the neck. That ended up telling me that the only option to remove this neck would have been to saw the neck off, which I did not do. I did manage to put a new top on that guitar, but it was not an easy task. I did learn that removing the fretboard from an old Japanese made guitar is a good first step. You get to see what you are dealing with, then you can go from there.
I think you need to make friends with a radiologist who could fluoroscope the neck joint. Then you could know fairly convincingly how a given neck is mounted to the body. On the other hand, perhaps that’s just too much work for a guitar like this. 🧐
I love Gibson's euphemism 'laminate' meaning plywood. Hofner archtops of the 50's and 60's that I've seen had spruce soundboards carved from solid like violins and were sadly underrated at the time.
I'm just a player but after binge watching your videos I have been able to do some minor work on my guitars... Always looking forward to your next video....keep up the great work!
I think if I were to really try and fix that with a time / cost no object approach, I'd drill into the front of that heel block looking for the head of that screw or bolt that had the acorn nut fitted onto it inside the guitar. But yeah the outcome would still be uncertain... I know what you need in your arsenal next, Ted: an X-ray machine! This video was truly intriguing. Not least because I have loads of '70s Japanese acoustics! Three Arias, a Suzuki, a Yamaki, a Tokai and K. Yairi. That's clearly too many! None of them need a neck reset, but I put a bridge doctor in the Suzuki
I'd consider using a dremel extension hose - cut the threaded shaft then drill that out You'd most likely have to do the same after cutting through the inner block higher up too
@@no1beatsj Yeah that could work too or a hole saw from the inside, picking up on your idea of working from inside... In any event it would entail some terrifying, expensive, time consuming surgery. No wonder Ted backed off. He's a smart one!
@@Iazzaboyce Yeah like Ted said the idea was get the guitars made and shipped who cares how they are put together. Not are they built using time honoured methods of luthiery! So built in clamp buried in the heel join? Why not eh? Mine all seem to be built conventionally, thankfully although one or two of them look outlandish!
I JUST FIXED AN EPIPHONE GUITAR OF MY NEIGHBOURS. AFTER WATCHING YOUR CHANNEL I KNEW HOW TO FIX THE HIGH ACTION, UNLESS SHE WANTED TO USE IT FOR BOW HUNTING. I HAVE BEEN DOING MY OWN WORK FOR A COUPLWE YEARS NOW BUT I LIKE YOUR TECHNICS THE BEST THANKS FOR THE VIDS AND INFO
Theoretically it’s possible to do a complete fingerboard replacement and insert a shim under the board to give it a better angle but you can imagine what insane amount of work and precision craftsmanship that would require on a 120$ guitar
I have heard of people removing the frets and sanding the fretboard down to correct the angle. The fretboard reduction in thickness at the nut is the same as the amount you want to raise the saddle. It isn't pretty, but it works from what I hear.
Valiant effort sir! I have the same situation with a beautiful Japanese Sigma Martin. Needs a neck reset, has already had the bridge shaved by the previous owner. Also, the truss rod extends THRU the forward-most brace (the brace just behind the sound hole). I haven't found anyone yet who has had sucess resetting a Sigma neck. No sentimental value so it's a corner hugger.
I totally understand fixing stuff even tho it makes no financial sense. I love having things that I made memories with, that I have used for a long time, that have character from repairs, use and so on. That's worth it to me as it far surpasses the joy I get from having something new. Whilst it is exciting getting something new that feeling wears off really quickly, unlike the joy I get from things I that have history as this type of joy only grows with time.
I always enjoy your videos! Do you sometimes wish you could do a necropsy to figure out how the neck was set even if it's a one-way trip? And might the white cap on the heel be hiding something?
I wonder if that bolt could have been removed. Maybe it was just a length of threaded rod tapped into the heel. Or maybe there was a brass insert or something glued in there. I would have tried jamming two nuts on it and unwinding it from inside. Maybe also heating it. Not easy through the sound hole of course. (I also have larger than average hands).
Wouldn’t it be easier to remove the finger/fret board, make a new fret board that is thicker over the sound board and tapers down (thinner) towards the nut? Kind of wedge shaped. I don’t think it would be that noticeable because looking at a fret board from the side they appear thicker at the nut end because of the radius and the fact that they are narrower by the nut and wider by the sound hole. Seems like a lot less work than removing the neck the way you said and making a new one and all the work to install it correctly.
I'm going through this exact thing with a 90s estaban guitar. I replaced the neck with a martin 23" scale and swapped the drilled bridge for a classical. Nothing like the labor of love.
I had an 80's "Aria" as kid ad after a fall fro the bike due to a missed ice patch the guitar "developed" a very similar crack to the lower one showed here as well as a good amount of flaking between neck and body. Wish I still had it but it got stolen from my parents basement (and they didn't tell me so I could go looking in the local pawnshops etc)
I have a 1970s Kiso Suzuki D35 clone guitar, and it's very strangely made but sounds reaaally good. Mine has the 60s gibson style metal saddle but doesn't have those crazy neck bolts. Maybe you could have used those stud wall finder/detector to check if there was another bolt above. Great video! Thanks
One possible fix: remove the frets and plane the fingerboard so it slopes downwards from the highest fret to the nut, then deepen the fret slots, refret, and hopefully the fingerboard is thick enough to pull this trick off. Once upon a time, CF Martin used this procedure on guitars that needed a very slight neck reset. If feasible, this would allow you to raise the bridge saddle and get back some volume and tone, while keeping the action playable.
I'm in the middle of restoring my mothers Epi FT from that era. It's the guitar I started on. Thankfully the neck angle is still good but many braces have let go and I decided to pull the back off. The whole time im just thinking that I wouldn't bother if it was a customers...
This answers my questions about whether it would be worth it to try to fix the action on a mid-70's Suzuki dreadnought I've had for decades. At least it looks good hanging on the wall :(
Why not loosen the back off of the neck block and sides near the heel? Then you can pull the headstock back which will take the end of neck heel closer to the end block. This can get you the desired neck angle but you’ll have trim the back near the heel.Then re glue it and you should have the neck angle you want. I’ve tried it a few times and it works. It might be the only choice for guitars that need resets but aren’t designed to come apart.It would be less work and less of a bill for these Asian guitars. I explained to my luthier one time and he was not into the idea.
People rag on about Fender and Epiphone acoustics with bolt on necks but as you said, if you need a neck reset it's going to be a lot more economical for the user. Once again - Leo was right!
This may sound strange, but I deal with the same sh*T but RV owners. People that bring old pieces of crap into our shop with the intention of "living off the grid", because they watched some videos, are shocked when we ask "Are you willing to sign a blank check?" Normal is double the worth of the vehicle. I know what you're dealing with.
I have an epiphone of the exact same vintage. 1972 FT570-BL made in japan.I've had a few problems I've had to fix over the years, but thankfully, I never had to remove the neck!
My early 70's Ventura V6 is in that same category. I bought it for 125dollars in a "Head Shop" in Waterbury ct. I still have it. I did over 400 gigs , stage , r adio and lots of jam sessions. All the Martin guys kept watching me! Great to hear the comments from the community!🎶🎵🎶
I love your videos and I get that I'm not the customer and you tried what you could - but the area that you plugged on the fretboard - on a sentimental guitar - would have upset me
I checked on Ebay what Epiphone acoustic guitars are going for. I found many for as low as $29. Some as high as, get this! $129.00. Unless your repairs are worth less than $100 per hour, which I doubt. That guitar is a quick easy adjust to the action and gone.
I hope the postal service down here gets on the ball for you. I had a recent package go from philidelphia, to phoenix, then to virginia, before getting to me in tucson. All for the new higher shipping rates.
Musicians! Work hard. Work steady. Save a consistent amount of money from each check. After you get to the right amount of money double it and shop a proper acoustic guitar with around $5500.00 !
i've a 1970s Saxon 812 folk guitar ( looks like this Epi - an adjustable bridge). It sounds great but action is high and the strings follow a slightly weird path from the machine heads to the bridge, which seems incorrectly positioned. Could do with a neck job i reckon, but i'm reluctant to splash out cos it only cost a tenner from charity shop. Maybe a bridge doc would lower the action. Hey ho. What to do..
I wonder if you could convince someone in a medical facility, or somewhere else with the equipment, to x-ray a guitar like this to figure out what is going on. I'm not saying it's a good idea.... just wondering if it could be done.
I have a Sigma guitar from that time frame and the construction looks much the same. Mine needs a reset, but the cost over runs the value... bummer!! It was giving to me new, when I was fifty years younger and I am preparing to attempt the reset myself?? I double nutted the strange bolt and backed it out with a 10mm wrench (wood screw /threaded bolt combo). I have not yet gained the bravery to put heat and drill to the guitar, but I really don't need a wall hanger. My feeling is 6 to one, half dozen to the other!! Wish me luck!!!
I have a 1975 Fender F65, with snow frets. The action is a little high..its a great guitar, I just don't know how to fix it myself. I'll have to take it to a repair store
Somebody asked me to take a look at a similar guitar with the neck bolt. there was no movement in it at all . On researching the guitar it was suggested that the neck bolt was used to hold the neck in place as they glued it in . A no go job !!!!
I have a couple of the bolt on Norlin era Epis. One is a 6 string and plays and sounds fine. One is a 12 string basket case I bought cheap back when I was too young to know better. Somthing horrible has happened at the neck joint. I didn't pay much for it so I probably got my money's worth in tuners.
just a crazy question if you X Ray this guitars that are an unknown, can you get any usefull details from it? i know that screws will show clear as day but i dont know how mutch you can diferenciate from woods pieces
Yeah. You can find pictures of X-ray imaged acoustic guitars online. (Try "Great Guitar X-Ray Project".) You can see wood. You can make out bracing pretty easily, for instance. But with all the wood in the heel - well, they seem significantly less detailed.
I would bet the farm that that acorn nut is the whole answer. Back it off and tap it with a small hammer and bango, you got your neck off. Of course, all the glue lines would need to be addressed first. You have to think like a furniture builder. They bolt legs onto chairs. This is just a chair with strings. Nobody in the world knows the answer here? He doesn't have enough viewers, then. Let's pile on.
Seems to me that locking the bolt and pulling it out would have allowed access to lift the neck out of its joint. But the very least I'd say cut the neck to just under the finger board tail. Then the neck could be paired with whatever joint deemed appropriate. Bolt removed, your router would make easy work on the block area. Now I'm no guitar tech or luthier. Just a wood craftsman. I like your work. But work is work where I'm from and money is money. With a little set up it seems to me to be rather easy to perform. As far as doing things because i have better things to do. No not in this case. You could come away with a very good repair to achieve your desired repair quality but also add a new operation to your business and to your resume. But I'm the curious type. If a customer wants me to do a job and i say it's going to cost more than it's worth or to replace, i had one customer say this to me. " worth more to you or me " i thought about that for minute and said , your 100 percent right. My dad said never judge a man until you've walked a mile in his shoes. I have no idea what the sentiment was about but it sure wasn't worth money. It was way deeper than that. Never told me but i did the job, he thanked me for my fine work and gave me a tip. He didn't know it was more than one. Or maybe he did.
Years ago I had a Epiphone PR 3 80?? 12-string it sounded like shit and played like shit and it felt like shit sorry for the explicit events but it's the only way I can describe it I didn't have it very long and it had the same problem you did at the time when I had it many years ago I took it to my luthier to get the action down and to make it playable for me I have small hands and he could not do a neck reset it also didn't have very good tone quality and a very wide and flat neck
At 8:25 theres a low gurgling sound. It scared the shit out of me since this is one of my go to bed channels and im wearing earphones hahaha. (It sounded like the girl from The Grudge). Other than that I enjoyed the video. Well, i did enjoy the minor scare as well hahaha
I once tried to remove a Glarry bass finger board to experiment on truss rod replacement. Damaged at the factory. No amount of heat would release the glue. Was afraid it would burst into flames.
For those who moan about other people spending $$.... I once spent $350 to get an Epiphone Les Paul that would have been worth $150 in mint condition into playable shape. It was my late brother's guitar. He left very little to my nephews when he passed. It was worth it to me to spend more than the guitar was worth to get it put back together.
My favorite guitar is an Epi LP100. It was my first guitar. I put new tuners, I replaced every plastic part with acrylic transparent parts (because I’m a 90’s kid), even the tulip tuning knobs, put EMGs, CTS pots, Switchcraft switch and jack, a gotoh bridge, stainless steel frets, white nácar inlays and a tusq nut. I have lost count of how much money I have spent on this guitar, and I don’t care. I enjoy working on it and no one has a guitar like mine. Leaving it to my kids when I die and will come back to pull their feet in their sleep every night if they sell it.
I just repaired an Epiphone A model mandolin for the same basic reason. Sadly his mom took it to someone else first and they did a horrible job. He works at my bank so I took the job. Make any money? Not really but I made a family a bit happier at the young man's life celebration. It's not always all about money. Sometimes you just have to do the right thing!
Much respect to you, I would've definitely done the same thing, it's not about money it's about sentimental value
@@LosRockson I've got Epiphone LP-100 in my lap right now. I paid $100 for it off Craigslist a few years back and I'm never afraid to hand it to the children to let them play it. Those memories are priceless.
really doubt this was the case at all with this guitar lmao
I have repaired 3 guitars with big bellies without bridge doctors. A torpedo level with a 5 pound weight + 3 months wait time. Add humidity to speed it up as you like.
Luv you too Ted.
WOW!! $1,200.00 for a guitar neck?!?! Do you get many customers? The most for a guitar neck (finish included) is $300.00 - $350.00 or $400.00 tops. I can make identical copies of just about anything but this guitar is a $79.00 pawn shop special! I'd fix the bridge and straighten the neck and hope for the best. Otherwise this is a lost cause.
He's booked out for the next 6 months at least. He doesn't charge 1200 for a neck, he said that's the amount of work needed to fix this guitar considering its unorthodox construction
I host a now-and-then friendly jam session in my home, and last time, the drummer shows up wearing one of your t-shirts. I ask him if he plays guitar, and he tells me he doesn't - he just really likes watching your videos. So do I!
As a fellow drummer, I approve this message.
As a non-fellow drummer but a semi-fellow guitar player but not fellow, I approve of this message.
There was that one video where he modified a kick drum for someone.
Your definition of a loss is different than mine Ted. A loss is me standing in the back yard pissing on the smoldering ashes of a Japanese-made Epiphone.
I 'd like to say thanks Mr. Tedd. for repairing Japan made guitar.
I always like to watch your video and I always respecting your skills and craftsmanship. have a lots of good days!! god bless you!!
You need a home X-ray machine to fix a guitar like that.
Oh yeah, A wall stud finder could do the job I think.
Available from Stewmac…
@@DynamicRockers Good suggestion. I've got a Walabot Stud Finder that connects to cellphone and provides a visual representation of what lies below the surface of a few types of materials. It requires a flat surface, but something like it might actually work.
I was about to suggest this as well. Probably the better way to "examine" that area in this case before doing anything physical to it.
Any time I feel my anxiety level creeping up, I come here and watch Ted fix a guitar.
Me too!
It's total therapy!
I like to go to Wristwatch Revival and watch him not lose little teeny screws that I would immediately drop onto the floor where they'd enter another dimension never to be found again. Here's his latest video - ruclips.net/video/ZHmRePXsI88/видео.html
A wise old Tedian saying ......."Human life is exceptionally brief and there are other things to do"........ Words to live by my friend.
"Knife goes in, guts come out: that's what Osaka Seafood Concern is all about". I love you too, Ted.
Came here to say this!
And I love you. I had no idea about this till you set me on the internet trail (although I was vaguely aware there were 'corporate songs')! Presumably there are many real and equally crass 'hooray for our side' pep songs that predate the Simpsons. In the UK, it's more: 'We go in, we go out, get our wage is what it's all about'. Actually, I prefer that and feel better.
I did a cheater "neck reset" on a beater guitar by clamping it on a stout plank, pulling the neck down where I thought it should be, blocking off most of the cavity with a towel and blowing in steam from a clothing steamer until it seemed really hot, and letting it sit for a week before unclamping. Two years later, still good.
I agree, a heated reset of the neck makes the most sense in this case, but it can also sometimes introduce warping, even when clamped tight.
You just rolled the dice there bro and got really lucky..😁
Maybe it was lucky, but there wasn't much to loose on a guitar that was unplayable and not worth fixing properly.
About 3/4 the way through, I'm guessing there's another screw under that triangular block
That's exactly what I was thinking, a big bolt underneath a glued block
I had the same thought. Double lag bolt in the heel (like a banjo neck). I wonder if neodymium magnets would be able to detect them through the heel? The nut will be under those triangular neckblock braces.
Just a couple of tricks: 1. You can use small rare-earth magnets to locate steel rods and screws within the wood. 2. You can sometimes unscrew a bolt like the one under the acorn nut by using two thin nuts locked together. Thanks for sharing!
It seems impossible that he didn't solve that issue or that someone hasn't told him how those guitars were built. I thought about the 2 nut thing too. Why didn't he even consider it? I'm thinking he has enough on his plate as it is without stepping into a potentially liable situation. "Hey, I wrecked your guitar."
I'm still curious about this. His explanation about how the companies treat the actual physicality of the guitar seems totally plausible. Wood comes in/ Guitars go out.
Shame we left the question unanswered. Maybe it will surface again.
I wondered whether it would have been possible to drill into the heel to find the head of that screw and extract it. The extent of my knowledge on the subject, however, is pretty much what I've seen in your videos - so I figure there has to be a good reason why you didn't do that.
Thank you for making these videos. I look forward to them every week.
Great suggestion. Or then Could then drill the head and attach two nuts on the inside and screw it through the body
I don't think that screw has a head. It's a stud with machine threads on one half of it and wood-screw threads on the other half. It's screwed into the heel and then bolted to the guitar body.
I used to work in electronics manufacturing (retired now) and we had a few X-Ray machines to look closely at defects and do inspections on process. This issue made me wonder if you had availability to an X-Ray machine would it help you to determine what is going on in those areas.
And.. to those that don't know and think that you do... You can fully adjust continuous XRAY for depth, density and have control on contrast. You can even magnify the area you want to observe and adjust the angle on the fly. This isn't the simple film xrays of the 50's.
i expect with a guitar and most other inanimate objects, you don't need to worry so much about radiation dosage either.
That would be so awesome... Maybe somebody at the hospital in Hamilton could sneak something in after hours? Or maybe there's a radiology lab that would want to cooperate? I would love to see what Terry could do if the guesswork is removed...
Apparently this sort of thing is occasionally done for very high end violin repairs. I suppose it makes sense in that case as the value of the instruments they're working on starts at five figures and climbs fast.
@@gramursowanfaborden5820 There is no danger of that. If it is a machine you are shielded by it and if its on a table then you just go behind the lead wall.
Polishing, polishing, polishing. I said it for you.
To me, a particular instrument's value is what I believe it to be, for me, personally. I have several 'bargain' guitars, that I have worked on, and made to play and sound well above their price point. Those are the one's I play, and not my Gibsons or Fenders. I'm not sure why - maybe sentimental reasons?
That Epiphone is a very nice looking guitar - too bad it was kind of obstinate in the repair department.
Indeed. I have a late 1970's Yamaha 12 string that is in beautiful condition, but it needs a neck reset, and no one will do it. What a pity that during the period they (the manufacturers) decided to do things to the neck joint (including using some type of epoxy), that just wasn't the norm....or even necessary.
@@realjumper Epoxy on any wooden instrument should only be used for filling a gap, and never for bonding two surfaces. Titebond Original responds very well to heat and moisture. There is even a company video showing how to unglue using heat and moisture.
Hide and fish glue are also fairly easy to un-bond. But epoxy is virtually impossible to break loose.
@@perihelion7798 I think you misread what I wrote. The instrument needs a neck reset, but this is virtually impossible because the neck was secured with epoxy from the Yamaha factory in the 1970's
@@realjumper I did read it correctly. I used repairs as an example of not what to do, and that goes double for epoxy bonding during construction as well.
@@perihelion7798 uh huh...ok then
"some days you get the bear, some days the bear gets you"
that said, one thing i thought of is inspired by the first video i saw of a guy using the original stewmac soldering iron heat stick; he mounted the neck in the big padded clamp and did all the wiggling and pulling on the body itself. that provides a lot more leverage and would (i imagine) allow for pulling the body straight away from the neck with a lot more force compared to having it sitting loose on the bench
*Is that a polite way of saying, in China?*
Dealing with a guitar that refuses to be repaired right now, so this is inspiring!
Here's a question for you, Ted. How would you go about billing the client for a job like this? Is there an upfront conversation about the possibility that despite your best efforts there's not much to be done, but you still need to be paid for your time? I guess what I'm asking is: Do you bill for the *labor*, or the *result*?
Did you try to put two nuts on the rod, tense them up against each other and turn out the rod?
Ah yes, my weekly source of amazing craftsmanship and Simpsons deep cuts... Goes down smooth
ahhh, mr. sparkle!! My uncle has a similair guitar, though not the exact same model. It belonged to a close friend who died, and so it has incredibly high sentimental value, but much of the bracing has come loose and we've brought it to a couple luthiers who won't touch it.
An online catalog of strange neck joint systems would be a fantastic resource. Also, by adding the guitar type to all your titles would stop those emails....maybe......probably not..... :)
We are having the same kind of week sir. Id do the 'lol" but we both know, it is not funny. carry on sir, thanks for your videos. very very helpful to my daily running shop in my store. respectfully, Vinny.
i used to work for a UPS sorting facility and before you start working you have to watch corperate safety videos, and the very last one was calisthenics "suggestions" to do evey morning,, a15 minute long syncronized richard simmons esqe work out video that was featuring official ups employees. thank god we werent actually required to do them that job was rough i wouldnt have been able to deal with jazzersize every morning
I would certainly pay more for repairs than guitar worth in situations. I have two guitars in my collection that I will never replace. Those two have aged well over the years and developed awesome sound. I would always choose to fix them over replacing them.
0:37 That's not how I remembered it. Love you too!
It' s an " It is what it is guitar" , it should be appreciated for How it sounds " as it is" and bearing the innate flaws, since it' s a cheap; anyway even that " barely better then it was" it' s a great result!👌🏼
Cheap isn't cheap if the price is right. Buy what you like! I have a free guitar!
Hard to appreciate something for how it sounds if it's unplayable
A couple years ago I had to do some work on an early 70's Morris 12 string. It needed a new top, so I wanted to remove the neck first. I was hoping there might be a dovetail neck joint, but found no indications on a dovetail. To get a look at how the neck was joined, to the body, I decided to take the fretboard off the neck. That ended up telling me that the only option to remove this neck would have been to saw the neck off, which I did not do. I did manage to put a new top on that guitar, but it was not an easy task. I did learn that removing the fretboard from an old Japanese made guitar is a good first step. You get to see what you are dealing with, then you can go from there.
Well, hey there gang! Good to see you!
My stupid head told you to give it a wack with a hammer and a piece of wood near the sound hole
I think you need to make friends with a radiologist who could fluoroscope the neck joint. Then you could know fairly convincingly how a given neck is mounted to the body. On the other hand, perhaps that’s just too much work for a guitar like this. 🧐
I love Gibson's euphemism 'laminate' meaning plywood. Hofner archtops of the 50's and 60's that I've seen had spruce soundboards carved from solid like violins and were sadly underrated at the time.
As did many Harmony f-hole guitars. The neck were glunky, the tuners were poor, but the tops were solid spruce, albeit on the thick side.
7:00 an X-ray device is needed.
Last resort fix: replace the fingerboard with a new one that is tapered and thicker where needed for lower action. 🧐
Or just make a long, tapered shim to run between fingerboard and neck.
I'm just a player but after binge watching your videos I have been able to do some minor work on my guitars... Always looking forward to your next video....keep up the great work!
It's good to see I haven't been the only lutheir stymied by a 1970s Japanese guitar. Thank you for this video, you've made my day.
Thanks for sharing one that didn't go as planned.
I think if I were to really try and fix that with a time / cost no object approach, I'd drill into the front of that heel block looking for the head of that screw or bolt that had the acorn nut fitted onto it inside the guitar. But yeah the outcome would still be uncertain... I know what you need in your arsenal next, Ted: an X-ray machine! This video was truly intriguing. Not least because I have loads of '70s Japanese acoustics! Three Arias, a Suzuki, a Yamaki, a Tokai and K. Yairi. That's clearly too many! None of them need a neck reset, but I put a bridge doctor in the Suzuki
I'd consider using a dremel extension hose - cut the threaded shaft then drill that out
You'd most likely have to do the same after cutting through the inner block higher up too
My guess is that nut just acted as a clamp to hold the neck tight into the heel block mortice while the glue set.
@@Iazzaboyce Yeah - mine too
@@no1beatsj Yeah that could work too or a hole saw from the inside, picking up on your idea of working from inside... In any event it would entail some terrifying, expensive, time consuming surgery. No wonder Ted backed off. He's a smart one!
@@Iazzaboyce Yeah like Ted said the idea was get the guitars made and shipped who cares how they are put together. Not are they built using time honoured methods of luthiery! So built in clamp buried in the heel join? Why not eh? Mine all seem to be built conventionally, thankfully although one or two of them look outlandish!
I JUST FIXED AN EPIPHONE GUITAR OF MY NEIGHBOURS. AFTER WATCHING YOUR CHANNEL I KNEW HOW TO FIX THE HIGH ACTION, UNLESS SHE WANTED TO USE IT FOR BOW HUNTING. I HAVE BEEN DOING MY OWN WORK FOR A COUPLWE YEARS NOW BUT I LIKE YOUR TECHNICS THE BEST THANKS FOR THE VIDS AND INFO
Just ran into this on an old Sigma today. Makes me feel better that I'm not alone. Really love all your work, Thanks!
I’ve owned two instruments made in the Matsumoku factory and they’re both quite good.
Would it be possible to remove the fingerboard, and then make a wedge to go beneath, to fudge the angle?
Theoretically it’s possible to do a complete fingerboard replacement and insert a shim under the board to give it a better angle but you can imagine what insane amount of work and precision craftsmanship that would require on a 120$ guitar
I have heard of people removing the frets and sanding the fretboard down to correct the angle. The fretboard reduction in thickness at the nut is the same as the amount you want to raise the saddle. It isn't pretty, but it works from what I hear.
@@melodicdreamer72 That's a better approach, especially on such a low $ guitar.
Valiant effort sir!
I have the same situation with a beautiful Japanese Sigma Martin. Needs a neck reset, has already had the bridge shaved by the previous owner. Also, the truss rod extends THRU the forward-most brace (the brace just behind the sound hole). I haven't found anyone yet who has had sucess resetting a Sigma neck. No sentimental value so it's a corner hugger.
There's your answer, Fishbulb.
Those were intended to be played awhile then thrown on the burn pile.
I totally understand fixing stuff even tho it makes no financial sense. I love having things that I made memories with, that I have used for a long time, that have character from repairs, use and so on. That's worth it to me as it far surpasses the joy I get from having something new. Whilst it is exciting getting something new that feeling wears off really quickly, unlike the joy I get from things I that have history as this type of joy only grows with time.
I always enjoy your videos! Do you sometimes wish you could do a necropsy to figure out how the neck was set even if it's a one-way trip? And might the white cap on the heel be hiding something?
I wonder if that bolt could have been removed. Maybe it was just a length of threaded rod tapped into the heel. Or maybe there was a brass insert or something glued in there. I would have tried jamming two nuts on it and unwinding it from inside. Maybe also heating it. Not easy through the sound hole of course. (I also have larger than average hands).
And some boots were made for walkin
I don’t know how you do it, but thank god great craftsmen such as yourself still exist.
Wouldn’t it be easier to remove the finger/fret board, make a new fret board that is thicker over the sound board and tapers down (thinner) towards the nut? Kind of wedge shaped. I don’t think it would be that noticeable because looking at a fret board from the side they appear thicker at the nut end because of the radius and the fact that they are narrower by the nut and wider by the sound hole. Seems like a lot less work than removing the neck the way you said and making a new one and all the work to install it correctly.
I'm going through this exact thing with a 90s estaban guitar. I replaced the neck with a martin 23" scale and swapped the drilled bridge for a classical. Nothing like the labor of love.
I had an 80's "Aria" as kid ad after a fall fro the bike due to a missed ice patch the guitar "developed" a very similar crack to the lower one showed here as well as a good amount of flaking between neck and body. Wish I still had it but it got stolen from my parents basement (and they didn't tell me so I could go looking in the local pawnshops etc)
Would have been interesting to get an XRAY image of that neck joint to see what that screw was all about.
They frown on it when I show up in the emergency room with my little wooden buddies.
@@twoodfrd Haha!! If I were running the emergency room, I would have prioritized you, bud. Love your videos!
I have a 1970s Kiso Suzuki D35 clone guitar, and it's very strangely made but sounds reaaally good. Mine has the 60s gibson style metal saddle but doesn't have those crazy neck bolts. Maybe you could have used those stud wall finder/detector to check if there was another bolt above. Great video! Thanks
One possible fix: remove the frets and plane the fingerboard so it slopes downwards from the highest fret to the nut, then deepen the fret slots, refret, and hopefully the fingerboard is thick enough to pull this trick off. Once upon a time, CF Martin used this procedure on guitars that needed a very slight neck reset. If feasible, this would allow you to raise the bridge saddle and get back some volume and tone, while keeping the action playable.
I'm in the middle of restoring my mothers Epi FT from that era. It's the guitar I started on. Thankfully the neck angle is still good but many braces have let go and I decided to pull the back off. The whole time im just thinking that I wouldn't bother if it was a customers...
This answers my questions about whether it would be worth it to try to fix the action on a mid-70's Suzuki dreadnought I've had for decades. At least it looks good hanging on the wall :(
It depends. They're not all like this!
Knife goes in, guts come out
Why not loosen the back off of the neck block and sides near the heel? Then you can pull the headstock back which will take the end of neck heel closer to the end block. This can get you the desired neck angle but you’ll have trim the back near the heel.Then re glue it and you should have the neck angle you want.
I’ve tried it a few times and it works. It might be the only choice for guitars that need resets but aren’t designed to come apart.It would be less work and less of a bill for these Asian guitars.
I explained to my luthier one time and he was not into the idea.
Love your vids, keep it up. Very professional
I have a question as a non luthier. Could an alternative to neck resets be changing the frets out with some appropriately larger frets?
If fret 1 was the lowest, and they got progressively higher to fret 20, that might work. Except it probably wouldn't!
In the best case scenario, it lowers the action about 1/64" (0.39mm). If it's time for a reset, that usually isn't enough to make a difference.
I've seen it tried with super-tall Jumbo wire. It's... not advised...
Some guitars weren’t made for fixing yeah baby
I weren’t born for fixing you
Hey it almost works…
People rag on about Fender and Epiphone acoustics with bolt on necks but as you said, if you need a neck reset it's going to be a lot more economical for the user. Once again - Leo was right!
Epiphone FT-147
1975-1976
Square-shoulder dreadnought body style
Body:
Laminated spruce top
Mahogany back & sides
Neck:
Set mahogany neck
Rosewood fingerboard with dot inlays
25.5" scale
Binding:
Multi-ply top binding
Single-ply back binding
Multi-ply 3-ring rosette
Hardware:
Adjustable rosewood bridge with dot inlays
Plate-mounted tuners with round buttons
Tortoise pickguard
This may sound strange, but I deal with the same sh*T but RV owners. People that bring old pieces of crap into our shop with the intention of "living off the grid", because they watched some videos, are shocked when we ask "Are you willing to sign a blank check?" Normal is double the worth of the vehicle. I know what you're dealing with.
You are way too versed in non essential trivia. I love your inside jokes. Keep them coming!
I have an epiphone of the exact same vintage. 1972 FT570-BL made in japan.I've had a few problems I've had to fix over the years, but thankfully, I never had to remove the neck!
My early 70's Ventura V6 is in that same category. I bought it for 125dollars in a "Head Shop" in Waterbury ct. I still have it. I did over 400 gigs , stage , r adio and lots of jam sessions. All the Martin guys kept watching me! Great to hear the comments from the community!🎶🎵🎶
That’s not the Matsumoku work song……it was a veritable ARIA (geddit?) :)
🎶Knife goes in, guts come out 🎶
🎶That's what Osaka Seafood Concern is all about🎶
I love your videos and I get that I'm not the customer and you tried what you could - but the area that you plugged on the fretboard - on a sentimental guitar - would have upset me
Sometimes you’re the windshield and sometimes you’re the bug 🤷♂️
I checked on Ebay what Epiphone acoustic guitars are going for. I found many for as low as $29. Some as high as, get this! $129.00. Unless your repairs are worth less than $100 per hour, which I doubt. That guitar is a quick easy adjust to the action and gone.
I hope the postal service down here gets on the ball for you. I had a recent package go from philidelphia, to phoenix, then to virginia, before getting to me in tucson. All for the new higher shipping rates.
I'd swear that the press ad you showed said this model had a 'nut fret', implying a zero fret... so.... ?
ruclips.net/video/gDqh5WHri3o/видео.html
Musicians!
Work hard. Work steady. Save a consistent amount of money from each check. After you get to the right amount of money double it and shop a proper acoustic guitar with around $5500.00 !
Only 1200 to cut off and make a new neck?? I was thinking double, maybe a 2k to make a new neck, new fingerboard, new frets, setup and + finish.
i've a 1970s Saxon 812 folk guitar ( looks like this Epi - an adjustable bridge). It sounds great but action is high and the strings follow a slightly weird path from the machine heads to the bridge, which seems incorrectly positioned. Could do with a neck job i reckon, but i'm reluctant to splash out cos it only cost a tenner from charity shop. Maybe a bridge doc would lower the action. Hey ho. What to do..
I wonder if you could convince someone in a medical facility, or somewhere else with the equipment, to x-ray a guitar like this to figure out what is going on. I'm not saying it's a good idea.... just wondering if it could be done.
I think it's like he said: any job can be done; it's just a question of time and money.
I have a Sigma guitar from that time frame and the construction looks much the same. Mine needs a reset, but the cost over runs the value... bummer!! It was giving to me new, when I was fifty years younger and I am preparing to attempt the reset myself?? I double nutted the strange bolt and backed it out with a 10mm wrench (wood screw /threaded bolt combo). I have not yet gained the bravery to put heat and drill to the guitar, but I really don't need a wall hanger. My feeling is 6 to one, half dozen to the other!! Wish me luck!!!
I have a 1975 Fender F65, with snow frets. The action is a little high..its a great guitar, I just don't know how to fix it myself. I'll have to take it to a repair store
Somebody asked me to take a look at a similar guitar with the neck bolt. there was no movement in it at all . On researching the guitar it was suggested that the neck bolt was used to hold the neck in place as they glued it in . A no go job !!!!
I have a couple of the bolt on Norlin era Epis.
One is a 6 string and plays and sounds fine.
One is a 12 string basket case I bought cheap back when I was too young to know better.
Somthing horrible has happened at the neck joint.
I didn't pay much for it so I probably got my money's worth in tuners.
just a crazy question if you X Ray this guitars that are an unknown, can you get any usefull details from it? i know that screws will show clear as day but i dont know how mutch you can diferenciate from woods pieces
Yeah. You can find pictures of X-ray imaged acoustic guitars online. (Try "Great Guitar X-Ray Project".) You can see wood. You can make out bracing pretty easily, for instance. But with all the wood in the heel - well, they seem significantly less detailed.
Unless my mom gave me that thing on her deathbed, I would not spend 1200 to fix it......
I would bet the farm that that acorn nut is the whole answer. Back it off and tap it with a small hammer and bango, you got your neck off. Of course, all the glue lines would need to be addressed first. You have to think like a furniture builder. They bolt legs onto chairs. This is just a chair with strings.
Nobody in the world knows the answer here? He doesn't have enough viewers, then. Let's pile on.
sentiment is a beautiful thing. if someone ransomed my $500 squire strat. i would easily pay $5,000 to get it back
Seems to me that locking the bolt and pulling it out would have allowed access to lift the neck out of its joint. But the very least I'd say cut the neck to just under the finger board tail. Then the neck could be paired with whatever joint deemed appropriate. Bolt removed, your router would make easy work on the block area. Now I'm no guitar tech or luthier. Just a wood craftsman. I like your work. But work is work where I'm from and money is money. With a little set up it seems to me to be rather easy to perform. As far as doing things because i have better things to do. No not in this case. You could come away with a very good repair to achieve your desired repair quality but also add a new operation to your business and to your resume. But I'm the curious type. If a customer wants me to do a job and i say it's going to cost more than it's worth or to replace, i had one customer say this to me. " worth more to you or me " i thought about that for minute and said , your 100 percent right. My dad said never judge a man until you've walked a mile in his shoes. I have no idea what the sentiment was about but it sure wasn't worth money. It was way deeper than that. Never told me but i did the job, he thanked me for my fine work and gave me a tip. He didn't know it was more than one. Or maybe he did.
Time to make friends with your x-ray technician guitarists!!
Was that Gung Ho with Michael Keetan? Song sure did sound oddly familiar
I wonder what the music that introduces your video's is ? Gipsy Jazz - but who and what piece ?
Years ago I had a Epiphone PR 3 80?? 12-string it sounded like shit and played like shit and it felt like shit sorry for the explicit events but it's the only way I can describe it I didn't have it very long and it had the same problem you did at the time when I had it many years ago I took it to my luthier to get the action down and to make it playable for me I have small hands and he could not do a neck reset it also didn't have very good tone quality and a very wide and flat neck
You got to know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em. Good lesson.
At 8:25 theres a low gurgling sound. It scared the shit out of me since this is one of my go to bed channels and im wearing earphones hahaha. (It sounded like the girl from The Grudge).
Other than that I enjoyed the video.
Well, i did enjoy the minor scare as well hahaha
I'm way into cameras. There's nobody who wants to fix my Zorki-1. :C
I once tried to remove a Glarry bass finger board to experiment on truss rod replacement. Damaged at the factory. No amount of heat would release the glue. Was afraid it would burst into flames.