Which class will you play in Classic WoW? Also, timestamps are below! 00:02 - Introduction 00:20 - The 3 Segments of Classic WoW 00:57 - Our Scoring System 02:07 - Warrior 03:09 - Paladin 04:38 - Rogue 05:53 - Shaman 07:03 - Priest 08:40 - Mage 09:55 - Warlock 11:24 - Druid 13:25 - Hunter 15:14 - Class Comparison 16:30 - How to Pick your Class 17:49 - Conclusions and Interesting Links
Feral druid dps can keep up with rogue, mage, and warriors in dps, and even out damage then if you pop off enough and get all your elixers and farm their bis wep. You should look up shedo and reconsider their pve score
"Shadow is probably one of the best 1v1 specs" "Holy and Discipline are some of the best healers and dispellers on the battlefield" "In PvP, Priest can be extremely powerful" ... "We gave them a 7"
i think priests are 10 in the end game as healers in both pvp and pve. Shadows are like..3-5 in pve ( maybe even less) and 6-8 in pvp. And in leveling i think just cus of how boring and slow they are with their wand-spirit tap spec i would rate them... 2-3... maybe 4 just cus they can still heal in dungeons and find groups easier. So i think an overall 7-8 for the class is actually quite realistic. Priests true power is in the end game as healers but not really anywhere else...
@cody davis i didn't main a priest in vanila, meaning that i didn't raid with a priest in vanila.. but i did lvl up a priest up to 50+. It was a really boring experience... not hard, boring.
@@Corrupted 1v1 they are probably the best.. but who really cares about 1v1 in a game like classic? The classic has no mobility, no aoe and the biggest mana problems out of every Caster in the game..While it is also a very easy class to play in pvp. I just don't see why a shadow priest would be a better choice instead of a mage or a warlock in any type of group.. pvp or pve. Those classes will provide u with a lot more aoe damage, insanly good single target dmg, WAYYY more cc and a lot of other stuff like portals, food-water, health stones, summons.. While the true power of shadow priest is the fact that he can also off heal when needed, his enourmous mana problems doesn't allow him to do so. Sorry i just don't see how he is better overall :/ Same goes for ret pally.. i just don't see how he fits in the dps role instead of the god meeles like rogue and warrior.. and yet many people are so desperate to make him work..
@@akhsdenlew1861 People are making these work because they can, the content is an absolute joke and allows players to play specs you couldnt back then. And for the 1v1 part, there was a huge duelling tournament a few weeks ago. But you are right, most people care more about top dps than 1v1 abilities
You mark Priest down to 6 in PVE for only being able to fill one role (despite being the best at that role), but then give Rogue an 8 despite them not even being the best DPS? Logic?
@@qtherage7536 Fine, but he also gave Paladins a 6 for PVE. Also, there is usually 1 spot in every raid reserved for a shadow priest which means that they technically have 2 raid viable roles while Rogues only have 1, yet Rogues are still rated higher.
meh, I understand their rankings. I feel shaman PVE should be higher too, we are pretty good healers for the melee group, and the totems are quite useful. I'll be playing a shaman regardless.
I suggest you pick a class that you most identify with, that just clicks with you. I guarantee you'll have more fun than if you pick it from a worst-best comparison.
The number values are not very representative. Examples: Warlocks are insane pvp-ers end game, and levelers. They are a cake walk to level. It's unfair how easy their life is to 60. Priests are insane pvp-ers and top pve-ers (hello, best healer in the game????) Druids are definitely above average for pve because of their insane amount of utility (bres, off tanking, decursing, abolish poison, off heals, raid crit buffs, stats buffs). Utility is important in raids too. Warriors can level at a reasonable pace if you prepare before you go out (get food from a mage, bandages, and if you pull 2 mobs, you can reset the fight and try and pull one) Not to mention if you do get a good weapon for your level, which is not hard, you will be able to kill things quickly. Also, rogues as slow levelers made me chuckle a little bit. They're not the fastest, but for solo leveling they can get a lot done. If a new player is viewing this video, I recommend get some second and third opinions. This video is not very accurate. BUT, with that said the explanations given are quite useful. So I give this video a 5.
Paladin and warlock mounts aren't free. They cost hundred of gold in mats for you to turn the quests in. I don't think there's a bigger a myth than these mounts being supposedly for free.
This is very badly done... i.e with classes capable of healing you judge both healing AND DPS, whereas with DPS-only classes you solely judge DPS. I don't see how this can work - you can't subtract utility from a class designed primarily for healing because of its limited DPS output, when you don't subtract anything from a pure DPS class notwithstanding that it has zero healing output. It would perhaps be better to do it on a per spec basis.
Yepp, feels like the video is done by players that played very casually... Overestimating and underestimating on almost every single point. I mean for christ sake giving priest 5-7-6 when you would NEVER see a bg or raid without at least a 3-4 of them, and their leveling speed is actually alot higher than the average. i rate this video 3/10 and only applies for the complete beginners of classic :)
The damage classes with more options build wise will get higher points. Also there are more dps spots, meaning more people will want to role DPS on a large scale. All this is taken into consideration
@@_stefan7589 How can you count it against a class that doesn't physically even have the option to heal though? As in even if you wanted to heal on lets say a rogue. There is physically no way to do it. But with the healing classes even though they aren't great actually has an option for dps roles. So no they shouldn't be graded the same imo.
@@gahmivolka Because overall their utility in a raid is limited to one spec, whereas with a healing class this is not so, i.e priests can obviously heal but one shadow priest might also be taken for shadow weaving. If anything, the latter should be graded more highly because its role is more varied.
Classes weren’t balance in vanilla, they had different strengths and weaknesses. Some were stronger in PvP, others were stronger in PvE or solo content. Those classes who sucked more at soloing were more lucrative and sought after for group content. You had to make a choice when rolling your class if you wanted to play mostly solo or with groups. What I loved about Vanilla, however, was that every class was good at something, and had special qualities that nobody else possessed. In modern retain WoW when everyone can do everything, there are actually certain classes/speccs that are just plain terrible. In Vanilla WoW, there was also demand for every class in some areas of the game.
IF you rly go deep into the classes you will understand that the Mage is far superior than any other class in vanilla. Mages are good in groups and solo too, they have the best mobility with portals etc and they give tremendous utility for a dungeon grp, a raid or a premade.
its based on rock paper scissors. rogues are scissors warriors a rock hunters, paladins, priests, druids, mages, and shaman are paper warlocks are mushrooms paper beats rock scissors beat paper scissors also happen to beat rock, until rock hits 60 at which point rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that also beats paper, and it would beat scissors. but it cant find scissors, because scissors are invisible so scissors beat paper, and avoid rock, and that is called balance.
Seems like you don't know the trick there. There a trinket reward from class quest(done in the sunken temple), with which you can summon a voidwalker soul shard free. Have him stay then run untill it is dismissed and you are rewarded a free soul shard.
Yea trust me i (defcamp) wanted to rate them higher, but we wanted to show how most healing classes in Vanilla are relegated to healing. If u can heal, u will heal. That being said even though priests do have multiple specs than can be used within a raid, for the most part you will be holy with the occasional disc priest for PI. And since we voted pallies as a 6 because we think they are the most efficient healer in classic, but other specs are not viable. We also gave priests a 6 since they are (usually 2nd), but also dable in Disc, and occasionally shadow. The fact is even though mages may be limited in doing damage they can do it well in every spec (arcane frost, deep frost, fire, so on) and rouges can in 2 of theirs. That is why they scored higher than the healing classes. We probably could have explained that a bit better, but wanted to keep the vid relatively short.
@@DefcampMelderonTV 2nd on the meters? Priests will always top the healing meters all the way up until Naxx. They are by far without a doubt the most efficient healer in Vanilla pre Naxx. You should have clarified in your video 3 different classifications of PvE --- [PvE Healing, PvE Damage, PvE Tanking] as that would've been a better clarification for people in my opinion.
@@blakemcnary42 agreed. Trying to clump them all in 1 category doesn't work well especially when some classes don't even have the option to tank or heal.
@@blakemcnary42 when the paladin start getting good gear, which was around mid BWL wearing full cloth and leather, they were very close to the priest in heal meter in my guild. When we start AQ40 usually Pala was equal to priest. When I was fully AQ40 equipped and we started naxx I was always on top in heal meter as a Pala followed by other Paladins. In effective healing though, not counting aoe heal at full hp.
Warlock rated lower than warrior in pvp? Soul link warlock is literally the meta defining spec, the only way warriors shine in group pvp is if they have a pocket paladin for alliance or a pocket shaman + priest or faps and every engi gadget under the belt. But then you have to assume if the warrior has all the engi gadgets the othre classes have them as well + if warrior has faps then the other classes will have lips and other consumes to counter. Not to mention warlock is literally the safest class to level by far + the free mount. The only reason hunters are faster is because from 20-40 they have aspect of the cheetah.
Yea i think Warlocks def do have the potential to take over warrs in PVP, but we tried to look at this as a whole. Warlocks have a bit of a higher skill ceiling that warrs in pvp, at least in my experience. They def are very close and we I think the rank 14 list that we used is prob what gave the edge in putting warrs over them. Thanks for the comment!
@@DefcampMelderonTV Yea you can say what you want about the pvp thing that's kind of subjective I guess, but leveling with warlock is an EASY 9. Warlocks and hunters are really interchangeable for the top leveling spot. I prefer warlocks, some prefer hunters. Either way, lower than 9 just seems crazy. Hope I didn't come off douchey, video was great, just wanted to give my 2 cents.
Soul link is garbage if you play horde. You will just get dispelled constantly by large amounts of paladins alliance has. Horde warlocks almost exclusively roll deep destro.
Yea, some of the ratings were spot on but some of em were fuuuuuuckin awful. I suppose its an opinion piece, I just wish they hadnt place such an emphasis on which classes were "role limited", was a weird way to rate things given that classes like hunter have one role (technically) but can raid as MANY viable specs, as opposed to druids who will be limited to about 2-3 per raid, with 1 memeing feral as a sub par tank/dps and the other two being bottom tier healers.
@@Justaguyyoutubin Hunters have one viable spec "Tranquility shot" rest is irelevant as they are bottom tier dps but mandatory :P, no dots and mostly no pets for hunters in raids too
@@michalm.3372 You what???? Huuuuuuh????? Hunters have one viable spec "Tranquility shot" "Tranquility shot" isnt a spec HAHAHAHAHA~! Dummy. Hunters can raid early as deep BM due to lupos doing shadow damage. They can also go MM. They typically swap to a BM/MM build with points in survival for monster slaying when BWL drops. At different points in the xpac, hunters will play a variety of builds... They can even go melee with nightfall. "Mostly no pets for hunters in raids too". Only hunters ALWAYS use pets in raids, typically lupos when he still does shadow damage and then later they can swap to any wolf for buff OR wind serpent. No pets? Are you dense? Your opinion: "they are bottom tier dps" Reality: Second best gold farming class to mage. Best DPS in dungeons and offer a TON of 5man utility. Best tank (threat per second) from level 10-45. Best dps for tier 1. Best dps for tier 2 DURING progression, but not once the entire guild is geared from BWL. Best nightfall uptime. Only class to offer a tranq, a necessary mechanic in all raid content. Arguably the best aoe dps potential with explo trap+sapper+gear swapping to +fire dmg gear, but that is a mute point until we see how they operate within Classic. The potential for a hunter is limitless... Their spec options are MASSIVE. 9 classes, all can dps, hunters are #1 for 2/3rds of the content.
Warlocks are extremely efficient levelers. 7 doesn’t seem like a high enough rating for warlock leveling IMO. Drain tanking is awesome. You don’t need to drink, you don’t need to eat. And you can easily manage multiple targets with fear juggling and pet tanking. Soloing is a key feature of the warlock leveling experience. Healthstones, soulstones, VW sacrifice, Succubus seduction. You have so many tools at your disposal to survive. Go with engineering and you’ll become a demigod lol, but that’s besides the point. I feel like 8 or 9 is a more appropriate rating.
he def, did not, otherwise he would have kicked himself in the face after editing it. my bet, is hes using private servers to judge this... even tho, most if not all private server starting areas are actually 30-50% more difficult then i remember ( mobs did not cast full heals, and their heals usually was for at max, 35% of their health total, and they never casted until oom.... so yeah) as for leveling, i think most private servers npc have slightly more hp, then the retail vanilla version. also, the miss/hit/crit systems seems very... off from how i remember it granted with similar gear while leveling between retail and emu vanilla's. but we will see when classic is released soon enough. but i do know, that from 1-10, a solo character should be able to solo the entire starting area with little difficulty. where as in the private servers, this is def, not the case.
Idk man, I played a lot in vanilla, and played a fair amount on private servers later, and I agree with most of the stuff in this review. I think some of the ratings for PVP are a little funky, but the rest seems pretty accurate
Warlock leveling beats out hunters once you get improved soul drain/improved voidwalker and consume shadows. You literally never have to stop to drink and can take on multiple mobs at once letting your voidwalker heal up between pulls with consume shadows.
Well made video! I'm glad Defcamp tells things like druids are underestimated in PvP etc. In Vanilla we only had 3.2k (ex mages) to 5.2k (ex warriors/tanks) ish health, you can still be dead in seconds. A good player does not only know their gear, stats, and rotation but also positioning. I won't go in much on grenades. For PvP all can and should have them. This may be a little more towards premade (guild) PvP or playing with friends using some voice com but I would like to *ADD* something too to help out before chosing your Main: *WARRIOR:* If you play solo, can be most boring and irritating thing you can do. Play with a premade, healers backing you up. The opposit. Either 0-100 or 100-0. Unless you don't care and charge in as a solo que just to smash some heads, maybe kill one before you're dead. If you have fun doing this and love warriors in all/most regards, go for it! *PALADIN:* Very good and tanky support with bubble to save you, giving BoP to a spellcaster, remember they can still use their attacks, give it to a melee like warrior/rogue they can't attack. Being a warrior and have BoF from a paladin is a train on drugs. Not needing to use that FaP for mages root etc is huge. Just be careful as mages can still sheep you FaP/BoF or not. *ROGUE:* Warning! They are nasty with that burst dmg and a lot of CC utilities. But don't fool yourself thinking you will be this god-mode wrecking ball going with your team into the thick of things. Be ready for playing a lot alone. Defending flag in WsG/AB/AV or rotate stealing theirs. Very handy but if you are going to solo que for BGs, ganking in open world for PvP, go for it! *SHAMAN:* They are imho another underestimated PvP healer due to their aoe/chain heal and totems. Back in the day with just full tier 11 pvp set with TuF 2h mace I kinda 1-shotted mages. Press purge and WF crits = dead. They try sheep you? Toss down a grounding totem. It will not go away as the spell does no dmg and all they see it you being immune. *PRIEST:* Many tell this is the go-to healer, yes their raw healing power with their buff and shield speaks for itself but they only have one thing to escape when being hammered: fear and that is easily removed by warriors and other classes abilities. If you can stand and freecast heals, awesome but learn to positioning, you are a slow character and people will see you miles away and target you. But sure they are still considered best healer. Just be mindful about your low mobility. A friend of mine ditched his priest to druid for this. See druid section. *MAGE:* The glass cannon. Very good dmg, support and escape but be mindful if you play Alliance, shaman will purge you dry to even more squishy and they often have the lower health pool compared to some other classes. Having double ice block (talent) that removes ALL negative effects on you make mages health pool not too bad as they have no heals. Mind your hp. *WARLOCK:* Another cloth spellcaster, they lack the escape due to no blink or root but they can be quite tanky with sacrificing your tank pet (voidwalker). Succubus holding down one enemy for a while for you to CC or land a much safer fear. If you do this don't start dotting as that will remove the effect. Very good ranged class but remember they are a late bloomer due to how gear. *DRUID:* TIME FOR AN EYE OPENER. Priest/paladins good healers sure but for PvP they are VERY good. I dare say they are 2nd best. Why? Paladins can bubble and heal, but druids HoTs are very handy, being stealthed and open up with a big heal if needed meaning they can't target and open up on you like a priest. Plus you can escape A LOT easier. Root from a distance etc. Priest may be better for more raw healing power, but dead healer = no heals. Live longer, able to escape, who do you think will heal more over time? And don't forget combat rezz and innervate! Do you bring most druid healers? No but this is one reason I seldom hear what make them so strong and are underestimated as said because they are hybrids and not "best". *HUNTER:* VIPER STING ERA. They made a good overall breakdown. Strong early on but as things progress in late game, pvp and pve they do fall behind a bit. BUT, with good gear and buffs they can deal massive initial burst with aimed shot + multi shot (nelfs especially from shadowmeld with stealth cat). Their dmg is alright but they shine with their traps in key locations. WsG flag room as one example. Now someting I seldom hear. Viper sting is HUGE and not many can remove it. Example drain a mage and DON'T kill him (or last). Mage without mana = useless. _________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ If you're mostly playing solo or duo with a friend in a very casual way (which is fine!) you can discard most what I've said here and do what you want to have fun. Just be a tiny little bit prepared for people bully you for not caring what so ever and just farm kills/dmg as some might feel offended that they try win the games by doing objectives more then hunt for that epeen dps. The mindset is this, when you play PvE you don't see many who will just hit every mob left and right for some "dps fun" and wipe the group/raid and don't care about anything. You won't be popular. This is one reason PvP:ers tend to get the bad rep for being "aggressive" and what not as they feel you ruin their gameplay by not doing any objectives or try help your team, as you do in PvE. Even if you solo, it's a good and welcomed thing if you try do w/e you can do to help out the team. Play to win, not to be special.
@@JanbekOzturk Thank you. Played WoW since the open beta days along with 7 mmo's under my belt. First was Dark Age of Camelot in 2001, was around 25 when I played Vanilla. Turning 40 now with family & work. I want to help the community out best I can as I prefer not being some elitist jerk with my knowledge. EDIT: Honestly never played on any private server unlike many. So my info is unaltered and from what I remember. Does not mean I can't be wrong but feel to be sure in most.
A well spoken and thought out video. I hugely disagree with a lot of the numbers assigned, but as you said, it is all subjective. And if Blizzard will continually ballance in patches, as they have when classic was live, this list would be moot. But if official servers, like private servers, do not push flux-ballance patches, this list will be very helpful to people new to Classic WoW in selecting what class they would like to roll. Very nice, Gentlemen.
Great video, Def and Meld. I think balance is not the essence of the game. The last expansions have balancement and the classes don't have identity, so many times they are equals on your functions. The ausence of balancement don't make the experience of the game wrong if you enjoy the might of your class. Keep doing that great job.
great point! think this vid did a good job showing people who aren't too familiar with classic, that classic is probably more balanced than people think when looking at all 3 aspects. Then also at the same time saying that the main thing you should take into consideration is; what is it that you want to play and feel most connected with? Most people can relate to either one of those or even both!
Druids can battle rez, innervate, decurse, depoison, CC dragons, heal, tank and deal damage in the same fight. You quite underrated us in PvE. Also, AQ gear makes druids a good hybrid class, with both feral and resto viable without changing gear. Also, Druids can both tank and dps optimally without changing talents.
Good, comprehensive video, although I disagree with the choice to make judgements by spec limitations. What I loved most about Vanilla was that you weren't pigeonholed into a single spec; you created a build across all three. Granted, yes, you usually focused on one, but that wasn't always the case. And some classes that you listed as being spec limited really weren't because they had so many more possible talent builds that could serve for different purposes.
@@tannakaobi1 that does not makes sense something have to be at the bottom so you can make reference with scoring if worst is 5 you can as well shift entire ranking by 5 and evaluate 0-5
@@michalm.3372what I'm saying is you are getting hung up on the word average. It was meant as middle not average. The word could be removed completely. It's just a scale. 1 being poor 10 being great. There is no average, that was not the intent.
@@tannakaobi1 Waylander yes but "scale" is scaled to something thats the definiton of scale but yeah sure he can scale that to minesweeper as 1 buts its hardly relevant also im pretty sure there should be some 1s as a lot of specs were virtually useless in PvE
@@michalm.3372well, that's really a subjective opinion. I don't agree with many of these ratings. But I don't think any were that bad either. But then I jumped in just before BC so maybe things were different. I don't even recall what class I had first, although I suspect it was a warrior. I would not give a warrior a 1 for levelling.
Amazing video! Ever since classic was announced I was dead set on warlock. After watching this I’m def going mage. Thanks for the video, keep up the amazing work. Definitely subbing.
Warlock was my main and warrior was my alt. Sent high enchanted level one gear to warrior to help in lower levels. There's a point for warriors where you don't feel the levels drag, specially if you don't mind instances.
I'll say a few words about hunters: PvP - while they're similar to rogues in that they're very good in open world PvP, they don't dissapoint in BGs either. Viper Sting is a healer's doom and, while it can be dispelled, it's very fast and very good mana drain. ( Also, if you wanna be cheeky, you can put a Scorpid Poison on the target so the healers have to dispell that first ). Also, pets with fast attack speeds such as Brokentooth are gonna be casters' doom. Not to forget that you're the defacto flag defender. If you're a night elf you can even get a cat, get it to prowl and shadowmeld and you have THE ambush. Not only that but your dodge racial + Aspect of the Monkey gives you quite a bit of dodge. There are a lot more nuances, but hunters are really good and really fun in BGs as well. As such, I would give them a 6-7. PvE - while it is true that hunters do not scale well with gear, I wouldn't really place them at 3. At the beginning they're pretty good up until AQ / Naxx. In Naxx, even though mages and warriors absolutely destroy the charts, hunters have an ace up their sleeve. Picking the Lightning's Reflexes talent ( +15% agility from all sources ) makes up a bit for that poor scaling. Also, if you're a troll hunter, starting the pull with Berserking, Rapid Fire, Improved Aspect of the Hawk ( if you get it ) and, if you wanna be a mad man, Kiss of the Spider, is gonna turn you into a turret and assure you a top spot for the first 30 sec in the fight. ( Most fights aren't that long ). Even if you're not a troll, you'll still have @40-45% attack speed which is a lot for Vanilla and for hunters who mainly auto attack. It is true, eventually you'll lose that spot, but by the end you won't likely be at the bottom of the pack, I'd say at the middle. Which is why I would give them a 5-6.
@@TPGodlike in duels they're winners if they're the one starting them. In any case, I didn't wanna bump the score too much since the general score of the entire list was pretty low. Imo, I would have put hunters on a 7-8 for PvP and a 6-7 for PvE if you get really late into the game to benefit even more from the 15% agility
Role restriction is NOT a downside, it's literally the way the game was designed. If you think that it is you are just objectively wrong and probably didn't play in vanilla. For example, you can't give druids marks down in PVE because of their low damage output. They are not meant to be a pure damage class. Obviously they make great tanks and healers, but they are not tier 1 in any specific role by design.
The love based on parsed raid data pisses me off. 'Warriors do more damage in raids', well yeah you are the only ones allowed to hit for x seconds so threat doesn't get ripped off, that's pretty decent head start. 'The priest assigned to the MT healed more than the druid'. No shit sherlock I was decursing that tank and others non stop for 30 seconds so I was kinda busy. You need all of the classes to do all of the things they can do to achieve goals together, which means utility should be prized far more than it is but because you cannot just assign a single number for it, it just gets marked as 'role restriction' and the early tier sets don't help either. Want to be feral? Well not in this gear! As for PVP, that is so situational you could never rank it. World PVP rogues are lethal. BG rogues, not so much. Warrior in a premade? Lethal. Warrior solo in wpvp? Free HK
Daaaaang, this is one of the best noob videos I've ever seen! Really should help a lot of people!! Many probably don't realize how important choosing a class is in vanilla.
A point of contention that should be noted is that their cat and bear forms arent as bad as people thought. Bears actually have really good aggro even if it takes them a second or two longer then warriors to get, and if youre willing to farm for multiples of specific items, cat can do pretty decent dps. Druids were mainly used as healers back in vanilla because these things werent realized at the time. Its only their balance tree that really suffered throughout classic and you had to go miles to just make 'average' nevermind look good. Probably the best class that was a case of "Jack of All, Master of None". I would not say they are role limited in PvE. This would also in some cases put them higher valued for PvP, but something that should be noted there is back in classic stealth levels were a thing (how good you were at being hidden). Cat form at its base was VASTLY poorer to a rogue's stealth, even when that rogue hasnt put any points into it for the bonus.Their Feral instinct put them somewhere around a rogue with only a point or two in their stealth equivelent improving ability so it wasnt uncommon to be easy to pick a druid out from farther away. Especially if you were human or warlock with detect invisibility or hunter with track hidden.
Warrior getting only 1 point in leveling gimps the score. Warrior is the best class in the game and deserves a 23 or 24 score. Its really not difficult to level. I get that the score is holistic and factors in the leveling process, but a druid and warrior are no where near the level of importance and they got the same grade. That fact makes this grading method either laughably broken or the reviewers need to re evaluate their point allocation
heavily dependent on consumables, but i think leveling is pretty fast, charging around and pulling 2-3 mobs is doable. for example you can't do it as Paladin, but Paladins have heals
Actually Hunter is the best class in the game, so. I already made several youtube videos proving they are. If you want to question it, give me the discord info and get your microphone ready.
If you're new, Warriors will take a long time to level, but a good experienced Warrior will level faster than a good Paladin. If you know how to gear, how to use your toolkit, and most of all, limit your deaths, Warriors are pretty smooth levelers.
Druids definitely don't deserve a 4 in PvE. You should also take into consideration finding a raid spot and gearing, two major parts of PvE. Plus, while their healing based purely on the numbers is the lowest, their battle rez and innervate are extremely useful and often lacked in raids due to Druid scarcity. This should automatically bump Druid at least to a 6 and penalize Warriors, Rogues, and Mages 1 point.
Also, the value of healing isn't solely in output. If a HOT keeps someone with a DOT alive, then the GCD spent casting Renew or Rejuvenation is worth more than a FOL, even if the FOL is more "efficient." Druids are also the only viable alternatives to warriors as tanks in raids. This shouldn't be ignored.
Healing druid might be a 6, but druid as general is probably 2-4. U should take the other 2 specs into consideration also if u are talking about DRUID in general. if u are talking about healer druid only then yea... innervate battle ress and mark of the wild are enough to put them 5-6.. but no way any higher. Druid is the worst class in vanila and people already accepted and confirmed that years ago... no point talking about it here and now tbh.
@@akhsdenlew1861 Yeah, no. Feral druids were perfectly acceptable as OTs (and even occasionally MTs, such as on Ragnaros or Patchwerk), and were, in fact, the only alternative to warriors in that regard -- the lack of a taunt utterly crippling paladins, especially after their revamp patch (1.9?). Cat DPS suffered too much from lack of a proper weapon to be viable, though, and Balance couldn't get gear. They weren't the only class that did not have a viable DPS spec, though.
@@akhsdenlew1861 You said they were the worst class. Objectively, that's nonsense -- in PvE, they had two viable specs. There are classes that only had one, including the class that is often considered the best -- the mage (which could only play as Frost for a majority of vanilla, as everything was immune to Fire and Arcane wasn't a spec then).
I wish I could mix a few classes. Like a plate warrior that spreads diseases and uses minions. But not demons because locks have them, I guess undead would do. I want a DK
they either have no clue of the game or are just extremly biased. try bringing a rogue to a premade bg. youll get laughed at unless its for a very specific purpose.
@@brad4058 yea but don't cry if u find a skilled rogue that will reflect ur pyro with engineer trinket or vanish ur pyro. Rogues can do whatever they want...IF their skill cap allowes them to do so.
A good pvp shaman player could be almost unbeatable in 1v1 because they had answer to almost everything but it required to be able to use all those different skills without hesitation. Tremor totem, grounding totem, earthbind totem, searing totem, healing stream totem and so much more and those are only for the totems. It was so much fun. Now (and its been like this for a while), totem are almost non-existant and most skills were removed. There is no way to be very very good at our class. I've been playing a shaman since vanilla and almost nothing else, so I may be a bit biased :)
U're not wrong, shamans were actually beasts in 1v1. But since vanila is too much about gear i am not sure how it would play out against equal gears vs all the classes. Also which shaman spec are we talking about?
I've never understood why balancing PVE & PVP is so difficult. If the developers think in one dimension, sure, you change A and it affects B. Why not have split enabled function on abilities? In case A it does X and is case B it does Y... A represents PVE and B represents PVP. This way changes can be made to either side to balance in both encounters. Blizz I just gave a solution for years of problems you self created.
Warlock 7 as a leveler while priest gets 5, mage 6 and druid 8? Warlock is potentially as fast as a hunter to level, they've got insane efficiency literally grinding for hours at insane kill rates without drinking and a free mount at 40. What could they possibly be losing 3 points from? Also, the warlock is probably the second best 1v1 in the game, in my opinion better than SP, how are they losing 2 points compared to the mage? Comparing a mage and warlock in pvp, you've got about the same damage potential (ever heard of a one shot by SB?), while having far more control than a mage. The video could use a lot more explanation on what you're scoring points for and not for, as the numbers seem really random. The 4 score of druids seems to only care about the fact that they're a little weak in healing, the fact that they're viable melee dps, tanks and healers (or more supportish healers, sure) gives them a 4, could you provide a little more explanation on what's going on here?
agreed, 6? priests should always be at the top of the meters if you have a good core of priest players. not to mention dwarf priests have fear ward.. that's such a huge game changer.
Im with you here, people don t realise the importance of priests , all they rage about is pally buffs and heals but without a priest the raid is trash.
@@Krigfattig you realize this was a video about horde and alliance correct? And it still doesnt change the fact naxx is end game meaning you admit priest is the only healer on both factions that is always the best healer until a paladin gets naxx gear to compete.
Something I think you may have overlooked is druids effectiveness in pvp, you ranked them a 7 which is pretty high but I think they are on par with or better than rogue in lots of scenarios as a hybrid build watching people like stormx dominate in 1vX scenarios and not only live BUT he kills every one of the people hes fighting. Nonetheless great video and points!
@Justin Y. ... alot more rogue than Druid, how many more people rolled rogue than druid? a lot. Just because there are more rogue pvp videos than druid doesn't mean druid isn't insane? Not a lot of people realize the potential of the class because they just assume they can only heal, watch a stormx video and come back pls. Also I'M ROLLING A ROGUE ON LAUNCH, just stating that he may have underestimated druids in terms of pvp ability
Pallys should at least an 8 if not 9 or a 10 in pve. Rogues and mages get an 8 in pve and they only have one role. Sure the pallys roles might not be very viable, but they are there. Warriors out dps Rogues at all points in the game and mages only start doing the highest dps at the very end. Pallies also bring insane buffs that make you want to stack them unlike any other class, and are the strongest healers. Are you trying to say that that the second strongest dps, with only one role, that gives zero buffs, and are melee so extremely fight depended are an 8, but the best healing class in the game that has the best cleanse, bubble so they are the most survivable healer in game by far, insane debuffs of wisdom and light, and insane buffs. Pallys are the reason ally clears content far better than horde and they are only gets a 6 come on.... Rogues also don't even deserve a 10 in pvp tbh they are trash in group pvp if you are counting only 1v1 sure, but 99% of the pvp in endgame is bgs.
@Andrew Stevenson ** shuffles to the side to block view of first ever warrior toon back in Guild Wars named Diomedes.... ** To be fair, I was deep into a greek mythology class and also taking Greek as a foreign language that semester also. :D
I agree that paladins should have a higher PvE score, but would like to defend the mages score as yes they only start topping damage metres at AQ40-NAXX, but their damage is still good before then, but they also have utility in PvE like food/water, AI buff and amazing crowd control. I think that's enough to keep our 8:).
Top quality video once again! For those people in the comments that feel their class has not scored the points it deserves, plz see the end of the video. Choosing a class is a major investment in classic. Its not easy to reroll like in retail so these videos help a lot! Keep in mind that classic community is going to be about nostalgia as well so min/maxing efficiency wont matter for many guilds. Hybrids will shine and will take roles that they didnt dare to touch in vanilla. Meta is going to change and we ll have more info when (and IF) beta is released! PS. I would love to see a pvp wsg/AB guide for class composition/roles/specs and strategies. Also, we need a guide for the first steps in creating and lvling a character. A walkthrough with the best route for the first levels, alt/bank char creaation, bags/bank management, prof while lvling and flight paths/cities unlocking for some races! Still a lot of things to do before launch and a lot of info to spread to new ppl wanting to try classic!
Leveling should never be calculated. While the journey is a big part. Lvl 60 is where it matters. Who cares if you can get from 1-60 in 2 days if you deal shit damage and have no utility.
I've been playing on Elysium for a while. Finally made a priest. Mind blast then shadow word, shield, wand, allows me to move from mob to mob without having to stop for food/drink. Get the best wand you can, and stack spirit.
@@mortvald do you even know hunters have flare? Slows? Traps? Pets in aggresive sometimes would pull rogues outta stealth before the hunter could see them.....you didn't play classic. I once killed a full dreadnaught warrior on my hunter in mc gear
Also, problems with Rogues and Hunters were not their performance. Vanilla raid was 40 man group. DPS deficiency can be negated easily. But the problem was the population. So many rogues and hunters were there... Just so many. Getting invited to any group involves steep competition. Good thing is they can either do other jobs (ganking/small scale pvp/farming) very well.
are warrior really bad at leveling ? I leveled like 5 warriors to lvl 60 since 2004 and i dont find it that tedious ? But i never played any other classes so what do i know
@@thomasberthe6580 warriors just need a bit more gear than other while leveling. They also absolutely need first aid and tons of food to use after pulls. Its not as bad as everyone makes it out to be in my opinion but they are definately slower to level
You guys should have a rating for 'chance to get a group'. EG Rogs will be prolific, so your chance to get a group 5man or raid will be lower then for example Shaman.
@@TechnoBacon55 except pure dps classes are role limited and don't seem to be on the same scale as hybrid healers. they take points away for available specs that aren't viable when imo that's a positive(or at least shouldn't affect the points negatively) when compared to a class that can only dps. The fact that 2 pure dps classes got an 8 in pve and no healing classes got over a 6 is a problem. if they did this by spec(dps/tank/heals) it probably would have turned out much better.
I was pointing out the inconsistent ranking system, and don't really care what the ranks ended up being. Mages/Rogues being a 6 would be more consistent within their system the warlock(3rd place of the 4 pure dps), is rated a 6 and the best healers Priests/Palys are also rated a 6.
Sorry for the wall of text. For Raids, Druid is arguably the least role-limited class in the game. Restoration while not topping the healing meters is still a valuable Healer that can decurse and abolish poison and as you stated, with CombatRess, aswell as have the best 'Tank-is-about-to-Die Heal' in the game in the form of Natures Swiftness+Healing Touch max rank, and arguably the strongest "Oh Shit" AoE Healing in the form of Tranquility. Feral Druid is arguably the best OffTank, although a Fury Warrior and Protection Paladin can also be up there when it comes to what makes an optimal OffTank (I will get to Paladin after). The Feral Druid and Fury Warrior who duelwields, are the two best choices for a Tank on a Threat-race encounter where highest Threat needs to be applied quickly. Feral DPS is an optimal choice in Raid Setups, as has been proven by Shedo in his videos, even more so when thinking about the +12% increased crit chance output of the whole group's DPS. I remember one comment said that Powershifting means that the crit aura will not be up all the time. That isn't a problem if using a Powershift Macro, in which case, the shift out and in will barely be a split second. DPS-Test video: ruclips.net/video/YXdH-Km1XMU/видео.html Feral Druids in PvP can be great burst yes, but also incredibly good at Bleed damage. Bleeds from Tiger's Fury+Pounce and 1, 2 or 3 (depending on the class and crit) ComboPoints Rip and Moonfire (and often Insect Swarm on top of it, but not always and not necessarily the best choice), while running away or Rooting (the Root will have completed it's cast-time roughly at the moment the stun wears off) and running away to restealth or to blast with Starfire or Wrath, is a very powerful combo. And the beauty of it is that Feral Druid's base damage in Catform is so high when it comes to Bleeds or Shred+Powershift combo, that you can be in half Healing gear (do wear 5-6% melee hit though for the sake of Pounce, Bash and Feral Charge being unmissable) and still chip off over 50% of a warriors healthbar (I tested it) from that Bleeds-opener while running away from your target, or to then bear tank if desired or even burst out in a Powershift Cat combo. The damage of that weighed up against the survivability of being able to run away and restealth or harrass/lockdown other players, while doing so much damage on one player while controlling so much, is really significant. Paladin's are optimal for OffTank if you choose to have the extra Pally Buff in the Raid, Sanctuary, in which case you can have that Paladin be the main TrashTank (as Paladin is the best AoETank), and Boss-Adds Tank while putting the Fury Warriors/Feral Druids to DPS instead. And the Taunt of the Paladin, in the form of a Blessing of Protection macro, is unresistable. So all those many bosses that are immune to Taunt, the Paladin is able to Taunt in those encounters still. And for the rest of the time the Protection Paladin can be useful as Healer or Nightfall wielder depending on how much either is needed for the specific encounter. Paladin are sometimes stated as being the second best class for Nightfall Upkeep, however, the Paladin regardless of spec is only behind the Hunter in Nightfall Upkeep by 2-4%, and since the Nightfall wielding Paladin will be doing significantly more damage than the Hunter who spams Wingclip will, aswell as have significantly more utility, then the Paladin is hands down the best Nightfall wielder in the game. Another very interesting thing about Paladin and Nightfall Upkeep. Since Nightfall has such a slow Attack-Speed, Paladin Heals can be chained in between Auto Swing without loosing DPS from Auto-Attack, making the Paladin both keep close to maximum Nightfall Upkeep, do a useful amount of damage, at the same time as being a SpotHealer. The Raid's dedicated Holy Paladins can do this aswell, to help make the Raids go that much faster. And even if the player behind the Holy Paladin using this method isn't very good at rotating the Healing together with the Auto Attacks without losing swingtime seconds...like lets say the player only manages to have a 20% Nightfall Upkeep time, because of clipping off much of the Auto Attacks because of healing more intensively, it will still be significant, because you will have a dedikated healer who still also gives Nightfall and some smaller amount but still useful damage all while healing dedicatedly. To similar effect, you can have the Paladins who are Nightfall Upkeepers wear full Lawbringer, which means that their Auto-Attack combined with SoRighteousness and Proc-on-Hit Enchant/items, will mean a great chance of proccing the AoE Heal while Swinging, but at the expense of a significant amount of the personal DPS-output. Paladins have around 42-44% Nightfall Upkeep Time, so it will likely only be advantageous to use 3 Paladin's for Nightfall Upkeep, and have the rest either use a higher damage weapon with/without SpotHeal, or dedikated Tank or Cleanse Bott. And for dedicated DPS, a Retribution Paladin can be very viable choice for the Raid (although quite difficult to play to the highest level). As a Paladin with the potential to be top or near-top in DPS (as has been proven by Exodia in his videos), aswell as being one of the best TrashDPS (Because of the Paladin being High Burst aswell as having AoE damage, which is why good Retribution Paladins usually top the meters in Dungeons), combined with being able to Cleanse, Divine Intervention, aswell as put on Lawbringer for AoE-Healing while DPSing, or for an extra 44% Nightfall Upkeep, and a possible extra Blessing - makes a Retribution Paladin very viable in an optimised raid, as long as the Paladin enjoys playing a very complex rotation. DPS-Test video: ruclips.net/video/sg7t4Lwj4cg/видео.html So both Paladin and Druids are clearly not limited in optimal PvE roles and gameplay choices. For Enhancement Shamans: While Enhancement Shaman both is one of the lowest DPS overall aswell as seems to be the lowest Nightfall Upkeeper in the game, the Enhancement Shaman can still wield Nightfall, and the Enhancement Shaman has two other things going for them in the way of having Improved Windfury talent which increases the Windfury Totem's Attack Power buff by 30%, which the Restoration Shamans most likely wont have as it's a 2-point tier 20 talent, which means no Mana Tide Totem. Since the absolute most beneficial Raid Tactic for a Shaman seems to be TotemTwisting duty, so Both Grace of Air and Windfury can be had in the group at the same time, a Nightfall Upkeeping Enhancement Shaman who TotemTwists will very likely be very optimal, since the Shaman eventhough having likely the poorest personal DPS, and likely the poorest Nightfall Upkeep time, will still be doing some useful DPS aswell as be doing a massive DPS boost to the rest of the Group, and the Raid's Casters in the form of having a low but useful percentage of Nightfall Upkeep. Depending on how many Melee-DPS groups your Raid Setup has, Enhancement Shamans on Nightfall and TotemTwisting duty, can probably more or less fill out the whole Bossfight in Nightfall Upkeep or close to that. There is also the potential choice for Shaman, in the same way as I wrote above for the Paladin, in SpotHealing mixed in between each NightfallSwing, while still TotemTwisting. Although at the expense of a great amount of personal DPS, aswell as needing to compensate for the extra intensive mana spendage. But it should be possible for the Shaman who enjoys a complex rotation. About the fun factor of experimentation which may be a reason for a player to play one of either class... Just like Paladin, Shaman is afterall one of the classes that are least understood outside of the Healing spectrum, And because both Shaman and Paladin abilities work so differently from other classes, there is a lot of potential for odd gameplay choices and gear choices with potentially amazing results, if the players use their imagination. :-)
I dont get this list: if you are a healer you can never get past a 6? Why tho? Healing is in most cases more challenging and fun than playing mage or warlock just clicking one button. As a healer its easier being invited to raids and you still can farm for 2nd gear. Also there are always too many rogues on every server, so you wont get into raids easy. This list is pathetic
it's stupid. best healing is priest. by far. sure, paladin was good later, but that's an alliance only. as far as i remember, shaman were healer as well, but not that good, but they had a lot of utility to make up for it
Another guy who takes into consideration only the raiding part. What about leveling? Grinding? What about.. FUCKING PVP??????? Have u seen a pvp movie of a mage?( in vanila) i bet you have. have you seen a pvp movie of a healer( in vanila) i bet you haven't. And what about.. FUN? I mean the vast majority considers classes like mages and warlocks way more fun than healers... Not all of them... but MOST of them. And u can clearly see that in every mmo. A healer is really boring in vanila pvp ( healer in pvp gets fun after TBC cus of arena and better optimized gear) A healer is really bad at grinding compared to MOST classes. Also healing specs are not even viable for leveling. I can see why they get a 6. Doesn't mean that they are not important.. LOL But u can't really expect the mage class to have lower rank than a priest/paladin/druid in a video guide about "what class should u play" right? I mean mage is the master class -.- In raiding they are boring cus they spam frostbolt or later on, fireball/scorch but who cares? raiding is just the ULTIMATE tool to get ur gear in vanila, but it's not the GOAL. The Goal is to rekt everyone in the world.. in pvp or wherever you want. And who does that better than a mage ? ^_^
@@akhsdenlew1861 Dude, shadow priests were fucking beasts at PvP. And if we're talking about phase 2 being ganked by one of those bastards is worse than being ganked by rogue.
Interesting - did a similar exercise for myself (Horde only) a while ago however segmented it further into: - Leveling - PVE Dungeons - PVE Raids (but not based on strength, but on raid spot availability, neglecting any hybrid tax) - Farming (at lv60) - PVP Battleground - PVP Open World - overall Popularity (least popular = highest score) Result are slightly different, although Mage also on top and Warlock 3rd as well. Other classed got shifted around much more due to the PVP & PVE split into 2 sections, farming at lv60 and the Popularity assumption. 1. Mage 2. Hunter 3. Warlock 4. Shaman 5. Priest & Druid 7. Warrior 8. Rogue But... I played vanilla when it was retail (from launch). So maybe my memory is not to accurate, hence never published anything. Your ranking is probably more objective and relevant than mine. Still, felt like sharing. ;)
Hi. WoW newbie here. Is there a single spec I can use to enjoy both PvP and PvE content? I want one class and one spec which excels in both. And I don't want to heal either, no offense :P
I think this sort of classification is a good idea, though there'd be so many other factors. Rogues levelling would surely be more better than other classes on a PvP server where they have some ganking defenses
i liked this video, it was rather accurate, to the point, and ignores "fan-boating." Ignore the haters, all i would recommend is u omit the role-limited values next time because although i understand that dps characters are usually more productive overall in solo'ing speed, etc. some ppl just prefer certain roles and it doesn't matter to them that they r just limited to one role. Thereby, the Priest should have a higher value for PvE as they perform best at what they're offered. Although i'll admit i've only ever played retail wow.
I really want to go Rogue but ive always hated leveling one I started one in 2005 an i have never gotten it to max level during any expansion pack. As i write this its level 93 with cap being 120. Also im a clicker/keyboard turner so ill probably play a hunter for ease of use.
Outside of wsg druids are not desired in pvp at all. I'd rather have a paladin/priest/shaman any day in AB,AV, or world pvp. Very subjective numbers that most don't agree with tbh. Alliance warlock in pvp is like a 3 at most bc of all of the wotf.......
Well , hunter do close to same damage as mage in raids. Hunters er better in MC. And in BWL they are very close to do the same damage. In Naxx mages are king. You need to remember that mage needs to go frost. Fire mage are strong , but no use in MC and BWL. So giving mage 8 and hunters 3? Don’t make senses to me.
Thats not the Vanilla i remember. Sure that might be true in private servers but if my memory serves me right any decent guild picked hunters more or less because of tranq shot, NOT dps.
Warrior leveling: 1 True. With my lvl 9 UD warrior I simply couldn't beat the same level non-elite Scarlet Friar. It just outhealed itself even regenerating back it's mana.
@@WeallAreAdults regardless Tirisfal Glades is definitly a more difficult starting zone than the rest and the warrior class is certainly more difficult than anyother for leveling in the early stages.
@@ffarkasm its more rough then other classes but if you know how to level a warrior its not hard at all. You'll die more then other classes but in return you dominate at end level, keeping that in mind any death should put a smile on your face really ;)
@@alhca Paladins are pretty much the best healers in classic so a 6 there for PVE makes sense...Shaman same boat with healing and buffs make them pretty sought after for raids... Then again for priests healing....I am guessing they didn't give higher scores as they are role limited to pretty much just healer.
I realize you're probably just living up to your username, but stating your opinion as a fact is not an argument. The same goes for alhca down there just ROFL'ing at the numbers. To make a compelling argument, or even an argument at *ALL*, one must explain their reasoning, backing their conclusion with supporting, proposed counter-facts. I'm with Felix, until then: "Tell me why"...if not for me, then perhaps for the channel owners, who may read their comments. Put the "constructive" in "constructive criticism". Simple criticism doesn't usually cut it.
I didn't make an argument. I stated a fact based on 15 years of optimization. It isn't my job to teach you to play the game therefor no explanation was needed. These "Classic" videos are nothing but people regurgitating old obsolete meta from a decade ago trying to cash in on the "classic boom" before it launches. Almost none of it was accurate even for the time since no one knew what they were doing and were just copycatting whatever worked first.
Only change I would make is change Mages Leveling to an 8 The teleporting and free food/drink part of their kit is unbelievably valuable for fast leveling, being able to set your hearth to anywhere and still have a free way back to capital cities to use the AH, repairs, hand in quests, skip half of a FP time, get around for quests that have you going across the world. These spells literally save hours in the leveling process and make it so much faster.
Hey guys i want to play Paladin Tank I really like that i can put concentration down and aoe pull Can i tank in your raid? LOL NO Hey guys i really like the concept as being a bear i dont like chicken form or cat form i dont like healing can i be in your raid? LOL NO Hey guys i really like the concept of being a survival Melee dps hunter i do pretty good damage in dungeons can i be in your raid? LOL NO Hey guys i really like the concept of being a shadow Priest with dots and mind flay can i be in your raid? Lol NO Hey guys i really like the concept of being a fire mage and trowing giant fireballs at enemys can i be in your raid LOL no After BWL OK MAN NP LOL JUST PVP IF YOU DONT LIKE the raid rules Hey man i really like the concept of playing the spec that sounds cool can i play the game? Nah man just Deinstall if you dont like it Bruh Aw ok man
Yea dude..... are you just missing something? Your comments make you seem like you have never played vanilla wow before. If you don't understand you can just ask, we're here to help :).
Bear tanks are actually perfectly viable and in early tiers are generally better than warriors because they are not nearly as gear dependent, and do much more threat allowing your dps to go all out.
Klaital1 no dude, you're just wrong. Warriors do more threat, more avoidance, they're just better in every way. I'm sorry, but you seem like you have never raided in original vanilla....... no disrespect but anyone who played it knows you're wrong :(
@@bonsaw57 You might want to check out some of skarm tank videos in youtube talking about bear tanks, since you don't seem to understand how they work, and he can explain it in much greater detail than I can. But in short, warriors are nowhere near the threat of bears until the later raid tiers, and even there, they have to specifically gear for max threat to be able to compete. Warriors do have more avoidance yes, which is why they are better at tanking large groups of trash mobs, but on single target, bears are generally better because they have so much more armor and health, making them lot easier to heal. Lot of the belief people have about druids not being able to tank raids has to do with two things, first, throughout the first half of vanilla, druids did suck, but since classic is using the 1.12 patch data, where that is no longer the case, druids are fine, the second is that during actual vanilla, people in general didn't really have a clue of how to gear bears properly or what to focus on, nowadays, people obviously do.
Klaital1 I'm sorry dude, that's pure trash. Do a basic google search of vanilla warrior raiding metrics. LITERALLY GOOGLE THAT and look at the spreadsheets :/. I cannot say it any other way, YOU ARE WRONG :(
The only rankings here that make sense to me are the leveling ones. The pvp and pve areas are a bit more complex, and your numbers don’t seem that well thought out. For example, dps players are in so much more supply than healers, so just getting into a group is always easier as a healer than dps. Also, do you realize you listed every class as “role limited” except for warrior? It can’t be a weakness if it applies to 8/9 classes
My main was a orc hunter and I did allot of Alterac Valley in those days. My best score were 43-1 in kills vs deaths and i never ever went below 10 times more kills than deaths. Hunter bad in battlegrounds, yeah sure, just learn the right rotation and you can be to good use in PVE also ..
most classes are role limited when it comes to pvp or pve though. Paladins, shamans. and druids may have a ton of roles to play but when it comes to PVE they are limited in what is optimal. And Mages, rogues, locks, and hunters are limited in the fact they can only do damage. It was pretty clear to me that was what they were trying to say.
@@DefcampMelderonTV name 1 spec thats not viable in pvp in best in slot gear for that spec. Literally every spec is very much viable in pvp. Even prot warr gets sick with nax block values -> high shield slam dmg. Every spec is amazing in pvp LITERALLY, but you need gear.
@@DefcampMelderonTV its more optimal than in any other xpack really. Name 1 bad pvp spec in full gear in classic. I cannot think of 1 at all. Even prot war can one shot with block trinket. All specs in right gear are good. This is for pvp only.
Another thing you have to consider is the popularity of each class and how that factors into getting into raids and groups. Let's say you want to play a rogue or a mage and you want to raid in game. Although you are at the top of the charts and well wanted in raids, you might have a hard time finding a raid group with an open spot for you because there are just so many rogue and mage players competing with you for that spot. While on the other hand, if you choose a less popular class, such as paladin, you might have a better time at getting into a raid because paladins are in such a high demand for raids compared to the low number of people who actually play them.
Good video 😊 already decided to play druid, i have alot to learn tho. I will most likely heal end game and go feral for lvling . I Want to see how far i can get into raiding 😊
yea druids offer some really amazing things in pve, such as the biggest heals (nature swiftness max rank healing touch had saved soooooo many tanks asses) plus battle rez and innervate! another great thing is there are usually only about 2 druids per raid comp so gearing up is pretty easy! not having a regular rez sucks sometimes but it's funny when u watch all the priests and shamans having to rez every1 lol.
Another one of these based on private servers and stacked towards hardcore raiding. I wish someone would do one that was based on original vanilla and more aligned to how most players play the game. Which class to play if you want to do a bit of everything? How can you PvP as DPS but raid as heals? What class is best for soloing and 5-mans? What class is best if you don't ever expect to get raid gear? And I warn people after all these videos, private servers had warriors screwed up, they weren't that good at DPS or PvP, unless they were specced just for that. And their repair bill was ungodly. If you are rolling a warrior and you expect to own at everything at the same time, you are going to be very disappointed.
If you wanted to do a bit of everything, you play a shaman. Shaman were great at PvP and resto healing back then. Paladins were only good at healing. Best to solo anything would be hunter cuz of feign death. If anything went wrong you just used that skill and retry. Best class for shitty gear would probably be affliction locks. They just dot up everything and used their HP to convert to mana and keep going. Even better if you have a healer in party.
@@brad4058 Yeah I'm leaning towards a 0-26-25 Shaman without mana tide totem. I can heal in the melee pile raiding, with a full strength windfury totem and strength of earth totem, so they can forgive me not having the mana battery. I will be decent solo, be able to heal 5 mans fine, and in PvP I should be fairly unpleasant with big heals and windfury procs of my own. I can pass on tanking. If you want to do a bit of everything, I think druid. You don't actually have to go that deep into the healing tree to heal, and there is a spec 0-35-15, which lets you healing touch heal pretty effectively, and have everything you need to feral tank and do feral dps. I don't really want to tank, so was leaning towards a paladin, but I prefer the Horde, and I don't think the paladin has the spec that gives you enough dps. To heal effectively you have to go too deep into the holy talents, to then go deep enough into the Ret talents to be effective. If they made good tanks, then tank/dps or tank/Ret is viable , but with that you lose raiding. IMO if you don't want to raid, paladin is the way to go. DPS/Tank is nasty good in PvP, because you get pretty solid PvP heals as standard. And Paladins are fine 5 man tanks. Soloing and 5 mans, then hunter I think. You do at least have that epic quest for the bow/spear thing, which you can do. The starter item does drop from MC but does go on sale at the AH rarely. As far as shitty gear, I think I would say pyroblast mage. You can get two pretty good damage trinkets without raiding, and you get your 3 minute instakill, and still put out serious damage, plus you have sheep defense etc.
World record for levling a warrior in vanilla was like 5 days which is only a few hours more than the total world record of 4 days and 20 hours.. they are not terrible at leveling you just have to know how to play them well and move to next target while still attacking
i loved my pally tank in BC, i wish pallies were allowed to raid as tanks. that's the part that breaks my heart in vanilla/classic, that you can't actually do what you want because what you want might not be acceptable to the community and wow was all about community back then.
@@Johansen1000 I just don't agree that they are in the same league as rogues, warriors, and mages. Skill is of course important but you can't take skill into account when making these types of lists. I love played PvP on my Hunter but the raw potential really isn't there imo
@@DefcampMelderonTV maybe I'm biased because I actually play a hunter, but I would say Hunter is the best class overall, and probably has the most important skill in the game Viper Sting, sit down and drink every single class in the game with the exception of Rogue and warrior and maybe your occasional feral druid, sure a cute rogue might catch me with my trinket on cooldown but that's it. 2-3 hunter Flare's in the game and there is no place for you to hide little rogue, no ganking for you. the only obstacles in the game are Warriors and druids that runs around in Bear from.
I really liked the idea of adding leveling as a separate column to assess. It definitely helps with getting a good picture of what you're getting yourself into not only right now but in the future if you can make it to 60 if you're not familiar with the game. What I dont like is voting based on overall versatility of specs. I think going over each perceivable role (healing dps tank) and ranking them for pve/pvp is kind of necessary, as looking at this chart wholelistically can kind of be misleading. I get the idea behind being stuck in one spec lowers the playability of a certain class, but that same idea also kind of gets muddied in the way you went about describing it. For example, you said that priests or Paladins got a lower score in pve for only being able to heal despite them being the best healers. Yet at the same time, you give rogues an 8 for being amazing at dps but they are also only limited to dps. Overall I definitely enjoyed the video, but I think that was one notable flaw that I felt was embedded in the presentation.
Which class will you play in Classic WoW? Also, timestamps are below!
00:02 - Introduction
00:20 - The 3 Segments of Classic WoW
00:57 - Our Scoring System
02:07 - Warrior
03:09 - Paladin
04:38 - Rogue
05:53 - Shaman
07:03 - Priest
08:40 - Mage
09:55 - Warlock
11:24 - Druid
13:25 - Hunter
15:14 - Class Comparison
16:30 - How to Pick your Class
17:49 - Conclusions and Interesting Links
Warrior or Priest, if TBC is to come out then 100% Priest but I doubt we will know that until Classic Vanilla has been out for a while.
@Justin Y. The first part of their comment asks what class we want to play.
Hunter!
so rouge and mages are overpowered big surprise lol.
Feral druid dps can keep up with rogue, mage, and warriors in dps, and even out damage then if you pop off enough and get all your elixers and farm their bis wep. You should look up shedo and reconsider their pve score
"Shadow is probably one of the best 1v1 specs"
"Holy and Discipline are some of the best healers and dispellers on the battlefield"
"In PvP, Priest can be extremely powerful"
...
"We gave them a 7"
i think priests are 10 in the end game as healers in both pvp and pve.
Shadows are like..3-5 in pve ( maybe even less) and 6-8 in pvp.
And in leveling i think just cus of how boring and slow they are with their wand-spirit tap spec i would rate them... 2-3... maybe 4 just cus they can still heal in dungeons and find groups easier.
So i think an overall 7-8 for the class is actually quite realistic.
Priests true power is in the end game as healers but not really anywhere else...
@cody davis i didn't main a priest in vanila, meaning that i didn't raid with a priest in vanila.. but i did lvl up a priest up to 50+.
It was a really boring experience... not hard, boring.
@@akhsdenlew1861 shadows are god tier in 1v1s, good players play a way better spriests nowadays
@@Corrupted 1v1 they are probably the best.. but who really cares about 1v1 in a game like classic?
The classic has no mobility, no aoe and the biggest mana problems out of every Caster in the game..While it is also a very easy class to play in pvp.
I just don't see why a shadow priest would be a better choice instead of a mage or a warlock in any type of group.. pvp or pve.
Those classes will provide u with a lot more aoe damage, insanly good single target dmg, WAYYY more cc and a lot of other stuff like portals, food-water, health stones, summons..
While the true power of shadow priest is the fact that he can also off heal when needed, his enourmous mana problems doesn't allow him to do so.
Sorry i just don't see how he is better overall :/
Same goes for ret pally.. i just don't see how he fits in the dps role instead of the god meeles like rogue and warrior.. and yet many people are so desperate to make him work..
@@akhsdenlew1861 People are making these work because they can, the content is an absolute joke and allows players to play specs you couldnt back then.
And for the 1v1 part, there was a huge duelling tournament a few weeks ago. But you are right, most people care more about top dps than 1v1 abilities
You mark Priest down to 6 in PVE for only being able to fill one role (despite being the best at that role), but then give Rogue an 8 despite them not even being the best DPS?
Logic?
Because atheism.
Wanted to say the exact same thing. This is so ridiculous
Actually he clearly said pally are the best healer of you payed attention so priest are not the best at there role
@@qtherage7536 Fine, but he also gave Paladins a 6 for PVE. Also, there is usually 1 spot in every raid reserved for a shadow priest which means that they technically have 2 raid viable roles while Rogues only have 1, yet Rogues are still rated higher.
meh, I understand their rankings. I feel shaman PVE should be higher too, we are pretty good healers for the melee group, and the totems are quite useful. I'll be playing a shaman regardless.
I suggest you pick a class that you most identify with, that just clicks with you. I guarantee you'll have more fun than if you pick it from a worst-best comparison.
Pick a class to immerse yourself in the game.
The number values are not very representative.
Examples:
Warlocks are insane pvp-ers end game, and levelers. They are a cake walk to level. It's unfair how easy their life is to 60.
Priests are insane pvp-ers and top pve-ers (hello, best healer in the game????)
Druids are definitely above average for pve because of their insane amount of utility (bres, off tanking, decursing, abolish poison, off heals, raid crit buffs, stats buffs). Utility is important in raids too.
Warriors can level at a reasonable pace if you prepare before you go out (get food from a mage, bandages, and if you pull 2 mobs, you can reset the fight and try and pull one) Not to mention if you do get a good weapon for your level, which is not hard, you will be able to kill things quickly.
Also, rogues as slow levelers made me chuckle a little bit. They're not the fastest, but for solo leveling they can get a lot done.
If a new player is viewing this video, I recommend get some second and third opinions. This video is not very accurate.
BUT, with that said the explanations given are quite useful. So I give this video a 5.
But don't warlock gets owned by melee classes in pvp end game?
smoothness69 if a warlock is specced properly for pvp they can demon twist which will give them a chance against melee foes. Sacc is incredibly strong
Fail to mention Warlock and Paladin's easy mounts at 40? That's a pretty high selling point.
Great points!
Plot twist : classic has tokens
what? how? 100g is no problem by level 40
Paladin and warlock mounts aren't free. They cost hundred of gold in mats for you to turn the quests in. I don't think there's a bigger a myth than these mounts being supposedly for free.
@@captain-pepper You seem to be getting confused with the level 60 mount. That one costs hundreds of gold, but not the level 40 one.
This is very badly done... i.e with classes capable of healing you judge both healing AND DPS, whereas with DPS-only classes you solely judge DPS. I don't see how this can work - you can't subtract utility from a class designed primarily for healing because of its limited DPS output, when you don't subtract anything from a pure DPS class notwithstanding that it has zero healing output.
It would perhaps be better to do it on a per spec basis.
Yepp, feels like the video is done by players that played very casually... Overestimating and underestimating on almost every single point. I mean for christ sake giving priest 5-7-6 when you would NEVER see a bg or raid without at least a 3-4 of them, and their leveling speed is actually alot higher than the average. i rate this video 3/10 and only applies for the complete beginners of classic :)
The damage classes with more options build wise will get higher points. Also there are more dps spots, meaning more people will want to role DPS on a large scale. All this is taken into consideration
@@DefcampMelderonTV Well, there's an inherent bias against healers using this formula then.
@@_stefan7589 How can you count it against a class that doesn't physically even have the option to heal though? As in even if you wanted to heal on lets say a rogue. There is physically no way to do it. But with the healing classes even though they aren't great actually has an option for dps roles. So no they shouldn't be graded the same imo.
@@gahmivolka Because overall their utility in a raid is limited to one spec, whereas with a healing class this is not so, i.e priests can obviously heal but one shadow priest might also be taken for shadow weaving. If anything, the latter should be graded more highly because its role is more varied.
Classes weren’t balance in vanilla, they had different strengths and weaknesses. Some were stronger in PvP, others were stronger in PvE or solo content. Those classes who sucked more at soloing were more lucrative and sought after for group content. You had to make a choice when rolling your class if you wanted to play mostly solo or with groups.
What I loved about Vanilla, however, was that every class was good at something, and had special qualities that nobody else possessed. In modern retain WoW when everyone can do everything, there are actually certain classes/speccs that are just plain terrible. In Vanilla WoW, there was also demand for every class in some areas of the game.
classes were balanced. specs were not.
IF you rly go deep into the classes you will understand that the Mage is far superior than any other class in vanilla. Mages are good in groups and solo too, they have the best mobility with portals etc and they give tremendous utility for a dungeon grp, a raid or a premade.
Defiler Yea but they wear bathrobes for armour, wield sticks for weapons, and can’t be dwarf. Screw mages.
@@miketython6554 son pls, they can be gnomes and as we all know gnomes rule the universe.
@@miketython6554 Let me know about your weapons and armor when I pom ap Pyro you with 1 shot. 😂
its based on rock paper scissors.
rogues are scissors
warriors a rock
hunters, paladins, priests, druids, mages, and shaman are paper
warlocks are mushrooms
paper beats rock
scissors beat paper
scissors also happen to beat rock, until rock hits 60 at which point rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that also beats paper, and it would beat scissors. but it cant find scissors, because scissors are invisible
so scissors beat paper, and avoid rock, and that is called balance.
Still best video on youtube.
god the roguecraft references
Mushrooms.?
@metalfaust19 guess people never played against a good warlock then, a good warlock beats all classes.
Mushrooms are strongest in 1v1 which is numerously proven by cdl
Values are incredibly arbitrary.
Biggest Warlock weakness? Soul Shard farming pre-raid.
Literally the only thing putting me off the class 😂
Seems like you don't know the trick there. There a trinket reward from class quest(done in the sunken temple), with which you can summon a voidwalker soul shard free. Have him stay then run untill it is dismissed and you are rewarded a free soul shard.
Was gona go for pally but they suck ass so I'm going for Warlock.
@@IWillSexU Sounds like that method would take longer than just... farming enemies
rogues ability to get out of combat if they take on to much and stop a long ass corpse run while leveling is underrated.
This needs a 10 hour reply to explain everything wrong with it.
yes, yes it does.
My thoughts exactly.
Priest get's a 6 for PVE raid healing? Uh, what?
Yea trust me i (defcamp) wanted to rate them higher, but we wanted to show how most healing classes in Vanilla are relegated to healing. If u can heal, u will heal. That being said even though priests do have multiple specs than can be used within a raid, for the most part you will be holy with the occasional disc priest for PI. And since we voted pallies as a 6 because we think they are the most efficient healer in classic, but other specs are not viable. We also gave priests a 6 since they are (usually 2nd), but also dable in Disc, and occasionally shadow. The fact is even though mages may be limited in doing damage they can do it well in every spec (arcane frost, deep frost, fire, so on) and rouges can in 2 of theirs. That is why they scored higher than the healing classes. We probably could have explained that a bit better, but wanted to keep the vid relatively short.
@@DefcampMelderonTV Yeah I'd say 7-8 for PVE healing and drop em to like 3-4 for leveling. Spell pushback, mana costs and little AoE is rough.
@@DefcampMelderonTV 2nd on the meters? Priests will always top the healing meters all the way up until Naxx. They are by far without a doubt the most efficient healer in Vanilla pre Naxx. You should have clarified in your video 3 different classifications of PvE --- [PvE Healing, PvE Damage, PvE Tanking] as that would've been a better clarification for people in my opinion.
@@blakemcnary42 agreed. Trying to clump them all in 1 category doesn't work well especially when some classes don't even have the option to tank or heal.
@@blakemcnary42 when the paladin start getting good gear, which was around mid BWL wearing full cloth and leather, they were very close to the priest in heal meter in my guild. When we start AQ40 usually Pala was equal to priest. When I was fully AQ40 equipped and we started naxx I was always on top in heal meter as a Pala followed by other Paladins. In effective healing though, not counting aoe heal at full hp.
Warlock rated lower than warrior in pvp? Soul link warlock is literally the meta defining spec, the only way warriors shine in group pvp is if they have a pocket paladin for alliance or a pocket shaman + priest or faps and every engi gadget under the belt. But then you have to assume if the warrior has all the engi gadgets the othre classes have them as well + if warrior has faps then the other classes will have lips and other consumes to counter.
Not to mention warlock is literally the safest class to level by far + the free mount. The only reason hunters are faster is because from 20-40 they have aspect of the cheetah.
Yea i think Warlocks def do have the potential to take over warrs in PVP, but we tried to look at this as a whole. Warlocks have a bit of a higher skill ceiling that warrs in pvp, at least in my experience. They def are very close and we I think the rank 14 list that we used is prob what gave the edge in putting warrs over them. Thanks for the comment!
@@DefcampMelderonTV Yea you can say what you want about the pvp thing that's kind of subjective I guess, but leveling with warlock is an EASY 9. Warlocks and hunters are really interchangeable for the top leveling spot. I prefer warlocks, some prefer hunters. Either way, lower than 9 just seems crazy. Hope I didn't come off douchey, video was great, just wanted to give my 2 cents.
Soul link is garbage if you play horde. You will just get dispelled constantly by large amounts of paladins alliance has. Horde warlocks almost exclusively roll deep destro.
@@Woodenlegjoe Paladin's can't offensively dispell...
@@Ruenkiller i was talking about the dots...
"Warrior PvE - 10" You're god damn right. Good video, quite helpful. Better than just looking at legacyplayers rankings.
Warrior PvE should have got an 11 or 12. That's what you'll be looking for every dungeon group.
Yea, some of the ratings were spot on but some of em were fuuuuuuckin awful. I suppose its an opinion piece, I just wish they hadnt place such an emphasis on which classes were "role limited", was a weird way to rate things given that classes like hunter have one role (technically) but can raid as MANY viable specs, as opposed to druids who will be limited to about 2-3 per raid, with 1 memeing feral as a sub par tank/dps and the other two being bottom tier healers.
@@Justaguyyoutubin Hunters have one viable spec "Tranquility shot" rest is irelevant as they are bottom tier dps but mandatory :P, no dots and mostly no pets for hunters in raids too
@@michalm.3372 You what???? Huuuuuuh?????
Hunters have one viable spec "Tranquility shot"
"Tranquility shot" isnt a spec HAHAHAHAHA~!
Dummy.
Hunters can raid early as deep BM due to lupos doing shadow damage. They can also go MM. They typically swap to a BM/MM build with points in survival for monster slaying when BWL drops. At different points in the xpac, hunters will play a variety of builds... They can even go melee with nightfall. "Mostly no pets for hunters in raids too". Only hunters ALWAYS use pets in raids, typically lupos when he still does shadow damage and then later they can swap to any wolf for buff OR wind serpent. No pets? Are you dense?
Your opinion: "they are bottom tier dps"
Reality: Second best gold farming class to mage. Best DPS in dungeons and offer a TON of 5man utility. Best tank (threat per second) from level 10-45. Best dps for tier 1. Best dps for tier 2 DURING progression, but not once the entire guild is geared from BWL. Best nightfall uptime. Only class to offer a tranq, a necessary mechanic in all raid content. Arguably the best aoe dps potential with explo trap+sapper+gear swapping to +fire dmg gear, but that is a mute point until we see how they operate within Classic. The potential for a hunter is limitless... Their spec options are MASSIVE.
9 classes, all can dps, hunters are #1 for 2/3rds of the content.
Warlocks are extremely efficient levelers. 7 doesn’t seem like a high enough rating for warlock leveling IMO. Drain tanking is awesome. You don’t need to drink, you don’t need to eat. And you can easily manage multiple targets with fear juggling and pet tanking. Soloing is a key feature of the warlock leveling experience. Healthstones, soulstones, VW sacrifice, Succubus seduction. You have so many tools at your disposal to survive. Go with engineering and you’ll become a demigod lol, but that’s besides the point. I feel like 8 or 9 is a more appropriate rating.
Lol did the person that made this video even play classic?
full answer: NO
Lol i was wondering the same thing
he def, did not, otherwise he would have kicked himself in the face after editing it. my bet, is hes using private servers to judge this... even tho, most if not all private server starting areas are actually 30-50% more difficult then i remember ( mobs did not cast full heals, and their heals usually was for at max, 35% of their health total, and they never casted until oom.... so yeah)
as for leveling, i think most private servers npc have slightly more hp, then the retail vanilla version. also, the miss/hit/crit systems seems very... off from how i remember it granted with similar gear while leveling between retail and emu vanilla's.
but we will see when classic is released soon enough. but i do know, that from 1-10, a solo character should be able to solo the entire starting area with little difficulty. where as in the private servers, this is def, not the case.
to add... hogger is a asshole in any version of vanilla, atleast everyone can agree thats correct.
Idk man, I played a lot in vanilla, and played a fair amount on private servers later, and I agree with most of the stuff in this review.
I think some of the ratings for PVP are a little funky, but the rest seems pretty accurate
Since when a simple "no" requires a 20 min video?
Warlock leveling beats out hunters once you get improved soul drain/improved voidwalker and consume shadows. You literally never have to stop to drink and can take on multiple mobs at once letting your voidwalker heal up between pulls with consume shadows.
All the pro levelers that min-maxed every class, have confirmed that hunter is the best leveling class.. followed by warlock.
Well made video! I'm glad Defcamp tells things like druids are underestimated in PvP etc. In Vanilla we only had 3.2k (ex mages) to 5.2k (ex warriors/tanks) ish health, you can still be dead in seconds. A good player does not only know their gear, stats, and rotation but also positioning. I won't go in much on grenades. For PvP all can and should have them.
This may be a little more towards premade (guild) PvP or playing with friends using some voice com but I would like to *ADD* something too to help out before chosing your Main:
*WARRIOR:* If you play solo, can be most boring and irritating thing you can do. Play with a premade, healers backing you up. The opposit. Either 0-100 or 100-0. Unless you don't care and charge in as a solo que just to smash some heads, maybe kill one before you're dead. If you have fun doing this and love warriors in all/most regards, go for it!
*PALADIN:* Very good and tanky support with bubble to save you, giving BoP to a spellcaster, remember they can still use their attacks, give it to a melee like warrior/rogue they can't attack. Being a warrior and have BoF from a paladin is a train on drugs. Not needing to use that FaP for mages root etc is huge. Just be careful as mages can still sheep you FaP/BoF or not.
*ROGUE:* Warning! They are nasty with that burst dmg and a lot of CC utilities. But don't fool yourself thinking you will be this god-mode wrecking ball going with your team into the thick of things. Be ready for playing a lot alone. Defending flag in WsG/AB/AV or rotate stealing theirs. Very handy but if you are going to solo que for BGs, ganking in open world for PvP, go for it!
*SHAMAN:* They are imho another underestimated PvP healer due to their aoe/chain heal and totems. Back in the day with just full tier 11 pvp set with TuF 2h mace I kinda 1-shotted mages. Press purge and WF crits = dead. They try sheep you? Toss down a grounding totem. It will not go away as the spell does no dmg and all they see it you being immune.
*PRIEST:* Many tell this is the go-to healer, yes their raw healing power with their buff and shield speaks for itself but they only have one thing to escape when being hammered: fear and that is easily removed by warriors and other classes abilities. If you can stand and freecast heals, awesome but learn to positioning, you are a slow character and people will see you miles away and target you. But sure they are still considered best healer. Just be mindful about your low mobility. A friend of mine ditched his priest to druid for this. See druid section.
*MAGE:* The glass cannon. Very good dmg, support and escape but be mindful if you play Alliance, shaman will purge you dry to even more squishy and they often have the lower health pool compared to some other classes. Having double ice block (talent) that removes ALL negative effects on you make mages health pool not too bad as they have no heals. Mind your hp.
*WARLOCK:* Another cloth spellcaster, they lack the escape due to no blink or root but they can be quite tanky with sacrificing your tank pet (voidwalker). Succubus holding down one enemy for a while for you to CC or land a much safer fear. If you do this don't start dotting as that will remove the effect. Very good ranged class but remember they are a late bloomer due to how gear.
*DRUID:* TIME FOR AN EYE OPENER. Priest/paladins good healers sure but for PvP they are VERY good. I dare say they are 2nd best. Why? Paladins can bubble and heal, but druids HoTs are very handy, being stealthed and open up with a big heal if needed meaning they can't target and open up on you like a priest. Plus you can escape A LOT easier. Root from a distance etc. Priest may be better for more raw healing power, but dead healer = no heals. Live longer, able to escape, who do you think will heal more over time? And don't forget combat rezz and innervate! Do you bring most druid healers? No but this is one reason I seldom hear what make them so strong and are underestimated as said because they are hybrids and not "best".
*HUNTER:* VIPER STING ERA. They made a good overall breakdown. Strong early on but as things progress in late game, pvp and pve they do fall behind a bit. BUT, with good gear and buffs they can deal massive initial burst with aimed shot + multi shot (nelfs especially from shadowmeld with stealth cat). Their dmg is alright but they shine with their traps in key locations. WsG flag room as one example. Now someting I seldom hear. Viper sting is HUGE and not many can remove it. Example drain a mage and DON'T kill him (or last). Mage without mana = useless.
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
If you're mostly playing solo or duo with a friend in a very casual way (which is fine!) you can discard most what I've said here and do what you want to have fun. Just be a tiny little bit prepared for people bully you for not caring what so ever and just farm kills/dmg as some might feel offended that they try win the games by doing objectives more then hunt for that epeen dps.
The mindset is this, when you play PvE you don't see many who will just hit every mob left and right for some "dps fun" and wipe the group/raid and don't care about anything. You won't be popular. This is one reason PvP:ers tend to get the bad rep for being "aggressive" and what not as they feel you ruin their gameplay by not doing any objectives or try help your team, as you do in PvE. Even if you solo, it's a good and welcomed thing if you try do w/e you can do to help out the team. Play to win, not to be special.
much better review of classes from someone with actual insight and experience. Thank You.
@@JanbekOzturk Thank you. Played WoW since the open beta days along with 7 mmo's under my belt. First was Dark Age of Camelot in 2001, was around 25 when I played Vanilla. Turning 40 now with family & work. I want to help the community out best I can as I prefer not being some elitist jerk with my knowledge.
EDIT: Honestly never played on any private server unlike many. So my info is unaltered and from what I remember. Does not mean I can't be wrong but feel to be sure in most.
A well spoken and thought out video. I hugely disagree with a lot of the numbers assigned, but as you said, it is all subjective. And if Blizzard will continually ballance in patches, as they have when classic was live, this list would be moot. But if official servers, like private servers, do not push flux-ballance patches, this list will be very helpful to people new to Classic WoW in selecting what class they would like to roll.
Very nice, Gentlemen.
Thanks, Eric. Yeah there are many points here that we had to fill in the best we could but I hope it can help people
Great video, Def and Meld. I think balance is not the essence of the game. The last expansions have balancement and the classes don't have identity, so many times they are equals on your functions. The ausence of balancement don't make the experience of the game wrong if you enjoy the might of your class. Keep doing that great job.
great point! think this vid did a good job showing people who aren't too familiar with classic, that classic is probably more balanced than people think when looking at all 3 aspects. Then also at the same time saying that the main thing you should take into consideration is; what is it that you want to play and feel most connected with? Most people can relate to either one of those or even both!
Druids can battle rez, innervate, decurse, depoison, CC dragons, heal, tank and deal damage in the same fight. You quite underrated us in PvE. Also, AQ gear makes druids a good hybrid class, with both feral and resto viable without changing gear. Also, Druids can both tank and dps optimally without changing talents.
Druidz the best supporters in my eyes.
For Open pvp i always like a druid nearby.
@@Krigfattig guess you wre playing in Balance :Ð
lmao "keep keybinding and grinding" that's gold
this was a good laugh
mav seveneightnine agreed
Very good laugh. You can tell the classes they play/like. Not bias at all.
why dont you contribute something and tell us what you think instead of talking sht.
@@yixe2253 because nothing I say will change the video or their opinion.
@@kyeldorries8283 it will change mine and those that read this.
I would give rogues a 7 out of 10 for leveling because of how fun it is to do world pvp while lvling up.
Good, comprehensive video, although I disagree with the choice to make judgements by spec limitations. What I loved most about Vanilla was that you weren't pigeonholed into a single spec; you created a build across all three. Granted, yes, you usually focused on one, but that wasn't always the case. And some classes that you listed as being spec limited really weren't because they had so many more possible talent builds that could serve for different purposes.
How can 5/10 be the average in PVP if no classes has less than 5 ?
Because it's not an average rank of all the classes collectively. It's an individual score from one to ten. One being shit ten being great.
@@tannakaobi1 that does not makes sense something have to be at the bottom so you can make reference with scoring if worst is 5 you can as well shift entire ranking by 5 and evaluate 0-5
@@michalm.3372what I'm saying is you are getting hung up on the word average. It was meant as middle not average. The word could be removed completely. It's just a scale. 1 being poor 10 being great. There is no average, that was not the intent.
@@tannakaobi1 Waylander yes but "scale" is scaled to something thats the definiton of scale but yeah sure he can scale that to minesweeper as 1 buts its hardly relevant also im pretty sure there should be some 1s as a lot of specs were virtually useless in PvE
@@michalm.3372well, that's really a subjective opinion. I don't agree with many of these ratings. But I don't think any were that bad either. But then I jumped in just before BC so maybe things were different. I don't even recall what class I had first, although I suspect it was a warrior. I would not give a warrior a 1 for levelling.
Amazing video! Ever since classic was announced I was dead set on warlock. After watching this I’m def going mage. Thanks for the video, keep up the amazing work. Definitely subbing.
Josh Greenebaum I’d watch a few more videos before switching just based on this video. There are a lot of inaccuracies here.
Awesome video guys. I make those lists for myself aswell every now and then. Keep it comming!
Warlock was my main and warrior was my alt. Sent high enchanted level one gear to warrior to help in lower levels. There's a point for warriors where you don't feel the levels drag, specially if you don't mind instances.
I'll say a few words about hunters:
PvP - while they're similar to rogues in that they're very good in open world PvP, they don't dissapoint in BGs either. Viper Sting is a healer's doom and, while it can be dispelled, it's very fast and very good mana drain. ( Also, if you wanna be cheeky, you can put a Scorpid Poison on the target so the healers have to dispell that first ). Also, pets with fast attack speeds such as Brokentooth are gonna be casters' doom. Not to forget that you're the defacto flag defender. If you're a night elf you can even get a cat, get it to prowl and shadowmeld and you have THE ambush. Not only that but your dodge racial + Aspect of the Monkey gives you quite a bit of dodge. There are a lot more nuances, but hunters are really good and really fun in BGs as well. As such, I would give them a 6-7.
PvE - while it is true that hunters do not scale well with gear, I wouldn't really place them at 3. At the beginning they're pretty good up until AQ / Naxx. In Naxx, even though mages and warriors absolutely destroy the charts, hunters have an ace up their sleeve. Picking the Lightning's Reflexes talent ( +15% agility from all sources ) makes up a bit for that poor scaling. Also, if you're a troll hunter, starting the pull with Berserking, Rapid Fire, Improved Aspect of the Hawk ( if you get it ) and, if you wanna be a mad man, Kiss of the Spider, is gonna turn you into a turret and assure you a top spot for the first 30 sec in the fight. ( Most fights aren't that long ). Even if you're not a troll, you'll still have @40-45% attack speed which is a lot for Vanilla and for hunters who mainly auto attack. It is true, eventually you'll lose that spot, but by the end you won't likely be at the bottom of the pack, I'd say at the middle. Which is why I would give them a 5-6.
Don't forget about FD trinket swap macros for x2 trinket uptime. This will, of course, depend on how the core Classic will utilize.
@@MW-ty5zw Yeah, I just gave a few examples. There are a ton more nuances with hunter that, imo, you only meet with feral druids in PvE.
i think you underrated hunters in pvp. they are mediocre in duels. they are good to excellent in open world pvp, casual bgs and premade bgs.
@@TPGodlike in duels they're winners if they're the one starting them. In any case, I didn't wanna bump the score too much since the general score of the entire list was pretty low. Imo, I would have put hunters on a 7-8 for PvP and a 6-7 for PvE if you get really late into the game to benefit even more from the 15% agility
Role restriction is NOT a downside, it's literally the way the game was designed. If you think that it is you are just objectively wrong and probably didn't play in vanilla.
For example, you can't give druids marks down in PVE because of their low damage output. They are not meant to be a pure damage class. Obviously they make great tanks and healers, but they are not tier 1 in any specific role by design.
The love based on parsed raid data pisses me off. 'Warriors do more damage in raids', well yeah you are the only ones allowed to hit for x seconds so threat doesn't get ripped off, that's pretty decent head start. 'The priest assigned to the MT healed more than the druid'. No shit sherlock I was decursing that tank and others non stop for 30 seconds so I was kinda busy.
You need all of the classes to do all of the things they can do to achieve goals together, which means utility should be prized far more than it is but because you cannot just assign a single number for it, it just gets marked as 'role restriction' and the early tier sets don't help either. Want to be feral? Well not in this gear! As for PVP, that is so situational you could never rank it. World PVP rogues are lethal. BG rogues, not so much. Warrior in a premade? Lethal. Warrior solo in wpvp? Free HK
Daaaaang, this is one of the best noob videos I've ever seen! Really should help a lot of people!! Many probably don't realize how important choosing a class is in vanilla.
A point of contention that should be noted is that their cat and bear forms arent as bad as people thought. Bears actually have really good aggro even if it takes them a second or two longer then warriors to get, and if youre willing to farm for multiples of specific items, cat can do pretty decent dps. Druids were mainly used as healers back in vanilla because these things werent realized at the time. Its only their balance tree that really suffered throughout classic and you had to go miles to just make 'average' nevermind look good. Probably the best class that was a case of "Jack of All, Master of None". I would not say they are role limited in PvE. This would also in some cases put them higher valued for PvP, but something that should be noted there is back in classic stealth levels were a thing (how good you were at being hidden). Cat form at its base was VASTLY poorer to a rogue's stealth, even when that rogue hasnt put any points into it for the bonus.Their Feral instinct put them somewhere around a rogue with only a point or two in their stealth equivelent improving ability so it wasnt uncommon to be easy to pick a druid out from farther away. Especially if you were human or warlock with detect invisibility or hunter with track hidden.
Warrior getting only 1 point in leveling gimps the score. Warrior is the best class in the game and deserves a 23 or 24 score. Its really not difficult to level. I get that the score is holistic and factors in the leveling process, but a druid and warrior are no where near the level of importance and they got the same grade. That fact makes this grading method either laughably broken or the reviewers need to re evaluate their point allocation
I agree. Leveling should have been on a scale from 1-5 or something like that.
heavily dependent on consumables, but i think leveling is pretty fast, charging around and pulling 2-3 mobs is doable. for example you can't do it as Paladin, but Paladins have heals
then just remove the leveling part and warriors have one of the highest scores
Actually Hunter is the best class in the game, so. I already made several youtube videos proving they are. If you want to question it, give me the discord info and get your microphone ready.
If you're new, Warriors will take a long time to level, but a good experienced Warrior will level faster than a good Paladin. If you know how to gear, how to use your toolkit, and most of all, limit your deaths, Warriors are pretty smooth levelers.
If you can't limit your deaths as a warrior consider playing a night elf so you get back to your body 50% faster ;)
Druids definitely don't deserve a 4 in PvE. You should also take into consideration finding a raid spot and gearing, two major parts of PvE. Plus, while their healing based purely on the numbers is the lowest, their battle rez and innervate are extremely useful and often lacked in raids due to Druid scarcity. This should automatically bump Druid at least to a 6 and penalize Warriors, Rogues, and Mages 1 point.
Also, the value of healing isn't solely in output. If a HOT keeps someone with a DOT alive, then the GCD spent casting Renew or Rejuvenation is worth more than a FOL, even if the FOL is more "efficient."
Druids are also the only viable alternatives to warriors as tanks in raids. This shouldn't be ignored.
Healing druid might be a 6, but druid as general is probably 2-4.
U should take the other 2 specs into consideration also if u are talking about DRUID in general.
if u are talking about healer druid only then yea... innervate battle ress and mark of the wild are enough to put them 5-6.. but no way any higher.
Druid is the worst class in vanila and people already accepted and confirmed that years ago... no point talking about it here and now tbh.
@@akhsdenlew1861 Yeah, no. Feral druids were perfectly acceptable as OTs (and even occasionally MTs, such as on Ragnaros or Patchwerk), and were, in fact, the only alternative to warriors in that regard -- the lack of a taunt utterly crippling paladins, especially after their revamp patch (1.9?). Cat DPS suffered too much from lack of a proper weapon to be viable, though, and Balance couldn't get gear.
They weren't the only class that did not have a viable DPS spec, though.
@@lDanielHolm i didn't say they were the only ones.. i just gave a solid example
@@akhsdenlew1861 You said they were the worst class. Objectively, that's nonsense -- in PvE, they had two viable specs. There are classes that only had one, including the class that is often considered the best -- the mage (which could only play as Frost for a majority of vanilla, as everything was immune to Fire and Arcane wasn't a spec then).
I wish I could mix a few classes. Like a plate warrior that spreads diseases and uses minions. But not demons because locks have them, I guess undead would do. I want a DK
How does Rogue get a 10/10 in PvP but Priest gets a 7/10? Priests are crazy in a 1v1 and provide heals in BGs.
personally i always found rogues to be overrated in pvp.
@@instinctz1 My Human mage ate rogues. GG Perception + 1 shot macro button.
they either have no clue of the game or are just extremly biased. try bringing a rogue to a premade bg. youll get laughed at unless its for a very specific purpose.
@@brad4058 Kiting them rogues allllll day
@@brad4058 yea but don't cry if u find a skilled rogue that will reflect ur pyro with engineer trinket or vanish ur pyro.
Rogues can do whatever they want...IF their skill cap allowes them to do so.
A good pvp shaman player could be almost unbeatable in 1v1 because they had answer to almost everything but it required to be able to use all those different skills without hesitation. Tremor totem, grounding totem, earthbind totem, searing totem, healing stream totem and so much more and those are only for the totems. It was so much fun. Now (and its been like this for a while), totem are almost non-existant and most skills were removed. There is no way to be very very good at our class. I've been playing a shaman since vanilla and almost nothing else, so I may be a bit biased :)
U're not wrong, shamans were actually beasts in 1v1.
But since vanila is too much about gear i am not sure how it would play out against equal gears vs all the classes.
Also which shaman spec are we talking about?
akhs denlew enhancement for sure
I've never understood why balancing PVE & PVP is so difficult. If the developers think in one dimension, sure, you change A and it affects B. Why not have split enabled function on abilities? In case A it does X and is case B it does Y... A represents PVE and B represents PVP. This way changes can be made to either side to balance in both encounters. Blizz I just gave a solution for years of problems you self created.
Warlock 7 as a leveler while priest gets 5, mage 6 and druid 8? Warlock is potentially as fast as a hunter to level, they've got insane efficiency literally grinding for hours at insane kill rates without drinking and a free mount at 40. What could they possibly be losing 3 points from? Also, the warlock is probably the second best 1v1 in the game, in my opinion better than SP, how are they losing 2 points compared to the mage? Comparing a mage and warlock in pvp, you've got about the same damage potential (ever heard of a one shot by SB?), while having far more control than a mage.
The video could use a lot more explanation on what you're scoring points for and not for, as the numbers seem really random. The 4 score of druids seems to only care about the fact that they're a little weak in healing, the fact that they're viable melee dps, tanks and healers (or more supportish healers, sure) gives them a 4, could you provide a little more explanation on what's going on here?
Very good breakdown of all the classes
Priest should be a 9 for pve, they're the best healer.
agreed, 6? priests should always be at the top of the meters if you have a good core of priest players. not to mention dwarf priests have fear ward.. that's such a huge game changer.
Im with you here, people don t realise the importance of priests , all they rage about is pally buffs and heals but without a priest the raid is trash.
@@Krigfattig you realize horde didnt even have Paladin for a really long time right? And naxx is seriously late game
Fredrik Johansson my opinion is that if you reach the point of full naxx geared it won’t matter anymore because you cleared the whole content
@@Krigfattig you realize this was a video about horde and alliance correct? And it still doesnt change the fact naxx is end game meaning you admit priest is the only healer on both factions that is always the best healer until a paladin gets naxx gear to compete.
Something I think you may have overlooked is druids effectiveness in pvp, you ranked them a 7 which is pretty high but I think they are on par with or better than rogue in lots of scenarios as a hybrid build watching people like stormx dominate in 1vX scenarios and not only live BUT he kills every one of the people hes fighting. Nonetheless great video and points!
@Justin Y. ... alot more rogue than Druid, how many more people rolled rogue than druid? a lot. Just because there are more rogue pvp videos than druid doesn't mean druid isn't insane? Not a lot of people realize the potential of the class because they just assume they can only heal, watch a stormx video and come back pls. Also I'M ROLLING A ROGUE ON LAUNCH, just stating that he may have underestimated druids in terms of pvp ability
Pallys should at least an 8 if not 9 or a 10 in pve. Rogues and mages get an 8 in pve and they only have one role. Sure the pallys roles might not be very viable, but they are there. Warriors out dps Rogues at all points in the game and mages only start doing the highest dps at the very end. Pallies also bring insane buffs that make you want to stack them unlike any other class, and are the strongest healers. Are you trying to say that that the second strongest dps, with only one role, that gives zero buffs, and are melee so extremely fight depended are an 8, but the best healing class in the game that has the best cleanse, bubble so they are the most survivable healer in game by far, insane debuffs of wisdom and light, and insane buffs. Pallys are the reason ally clears content far better than horde and they are only gets a 6 come on.... Rogues also don't even deserve a 10 in pvp tbh they are trash in group pvp if you are counting only 1v1 sure, but 99% of the pvp in endgame is bgs.
@Andrew Stevenson ** shuffles to the side to block view of first ever warrior toon back in Guild Wars named Diomedes.... ** To be fair, I was deep into a greek mythology class and also taking Greek as a foreign language that semester also. :D
go Paladins
@Andrew Stevenson shaman who wishes he had the utilities of a paladin spotted
I agree that paladins should have a higher PvE score, but would like to defend the mages score as yes they only start topping damage metres at AQ40-NAXX, but their damage is still good before then, but they also have utility in PvE like food/water, AI buff and amazing crowd control. I think that's enough to keep our 8:).
@@andrewporter2933 I'm a mage and 100% agree with this. I'm think rogue should be a 7 and Pallys should be a 9 personally.
Top quality video once again!
For those people in the comments that feel their class has not scored the points it deserves, plz see the end of the video.
Choosing a class is a major investment in classic. Its not easy to reroll like in retail so these videos help a lot!
Keep in mind that classic community is going to be about nostalgia as well so min/maxing efficiency wont matter for many guilds. Hybrids will shine and will take roles that they didnt dare to touch in vanilla. Meta is going to change and we ll have more info when (and IF) beta is released!
PS. I would love to see a pvp wsg/AB guide for class composition/roles/specs and strategies.
Also, we need a guide for the first steps in creating and lvling a character. A walkthrough with the best route for the first levels, alt/bank char creaation, bags/bank management, prof while lvling and flight paths/cities unlocking for some races!
Still a lot of things to do before launch and a lot of info to spread to new ppl wanting to try classic!
*gives all the healing classes a 5*
“See, vanilla wow was pretty balanced, everybody had pretty close scores”
Leveling should never be calculated. While the journey is a big part. Lvl 60 is where it matters. Who cares if you can get from 1-60 in 2 days if you deal shit damage and have no utility.
Wouldn't it better, to watch at different specs as classes?
I've been playing on Elysium for a while. Finally made a priest. Mind blast then shadow word, shield, wand, allows me to move from mob to mob without having to stop for food/drink. Get the best wand you can, and stack spirit.
Hunter PvP a 5!? I like your approach here but you clearly lacking a lot of information.
A deadzoned hunter is a dead hunter
@@mortvald a good hunter rarely is a deadzoned hunter tho
@@Froopih Until he meets a rogue
@@mortvald oh I don't think so :D
@@mortvald do you even know hunters have flare? Slows? Traps? Pets in aggresive sometimes would pull rogues outta stealth before the hunter could see them.....you didn't play classic. I once killed a full dreadnaught warrior on my hunter in mc gear
Also, problems with Rogues and Hunters were not their performance. Vanilla raid was 40 man group. DPS deficiency can be negated easily.
But the problem was the population. So many rogues and hunters were there... Just so many. Getting invited to any group involves steep competition. Good thing is they can either do other jobs (ganking/small scale pvp/farming) very well.
Removed pve and pvp sections. Still chose warrior=1.
are warrior really bad at leveling ? I leveled like 5 warriors to lvl 60 since 2004 and i dont find it that tedious ? But i never played any other classes so what do i know
@@thomasberthe6580 warriors just need a bit more gear than other while leveling. They also absolutely need first aid and tons of food to use after pulls. Its not as bad as everyone makes it out to be in my opinion but they are definately slower to level
@@ianneilson8684 In other words, they are really hard to level. You said it.
You guys should have a rating for 'chance to get a group'. EG Rogs will be prolific, so your chance to get a group 5man or raid will be lower then for example Shaman.
All the healer classes but 6 or lower in PVE...? I'm guessing it's from the lack of usefulness outside of healing?
Yes. They stated that they'd give a lower score to role-limited classes.
@@TechnoBacon55 except pure dps classes are role limited and don't seem to be on the same scale as hybrid healers. they take points away for available specs that aren't viable when imo that's a positive(or at least shouldn't affect the points negatively) when compared to a class that can only dps. The fact that 2 pure dps classes got an 8 in pve and no healing classes got over a 6 is a problem. if they did this by spec(dps/tank/heals) it probably would have turned out much better.
pls don't take this list to heart, Healers are far more demanded than DPS
@@irgong6875 yea.. but who gives mage a 6 in vanila? even if he is a limited-dps only class.
People will just laugh and immediatly close the video.
I was pointing out the inconsistent ranking system, and don't really care what the ranks ended up being.
Mages/Rogues being a 6 would be more consistent within their system
the warlock(3rd place of the 4 pure dps), is rated a 6 and the best healers Priests/Palys are also rated a 6.
Sorry for the wall of text.
For Raids, Druid is arguably the least role-limited class in the game. Restoration while not topping the healing meters is still a valuable Healer that can decurse and abolish poison and as you stated, with CombatRess, aswell as have the best 'Tank-is-about-to-Die Heal' in the game in the form of Natures Swiftness+Healing Touch max rank, and arguably the strongest "Oh Shit" AoE Healing in the form of Tranquility.
Feral Druid is arguably the best OffTank, although a Fury Warrior and Protection Paladin can also be up there when it comes to what makes an optimal OffTank (I will get to Paladin after). The Feral Druid and Fury Warrior who duelwields, are the two best choices for a Tank on a Threat-race encounter where highest Threat needs to be applied quickly.
Feral DPS is an optimal choice in Raid Setups, as has been proven by Shedo in his videos, even more so when thinking about the +12% increased crit chance output of the whole group's DPS. I remember one comment said that Powershifting means that the crit aura will not be up all the time. That isn't a problem if using a Powershift Macro, in which case, the shift out and in will barely be a split second.
DPS-Test video: ruclips.net/video/YXdH-Km1XMU/видео.html
Feral Druids in PvP can be great burst yes, but also incredibly good at Bleed damage. Bleeds from Tiger's Fury+Pounce and 1, 2 or 3 (depending on the class and crit) ComboPoints Rip and Moonfire (and often Insect Swarm on top of it, but not always and not necessarily the best choice), while running away or Rooting (the Root will have completed it's cast-time roughly at the moment the stun wears off) and running away to restealth or to blast with Starfire or Wrath, is a very powerful combo. And the beauty of it is that Feral Druid's base damage in Catform is so high when it comes to Bleeds or Shred+Powershift combo, that you can be in half Healing gear (do wear 5-6% melee hit though for the sake of Pounce, Bash and Feral Charge being unmissable) and still chip off over 50% of a warriors healthbar (I tested it) from that Bleeds-opener while running away from your target, or to then bear tank if desired or even burst out in a Powershift Cat combo. The damage of that weighed up against the survivability of being able to run away and restealth or harrass/lockdown other players, while doing so much damage on one player while controlling so much, is really significant.
Paladin's are optimal for OffTank if you choose to have the extra Pally Buff in the Raid, Sanctuary, in which case you can have that Paladin be the main TrashTank (as Paladin is the best AoETank), and Boss-Adds Tank while putting the Fury Warriors/Feral Druids to DPS instead.
And the Taunt of the Paladin, in the form of a Blessing of Protection macro, is unresistable. So all those many bosses that are immune to Taunt, the Paladin is able to Taunt in those encounters still.
And for the rest of the time the Protection Paladin can be useful as Healer or Nightfall wielder depending on how much either is needed for the specific encounter. Paladin are sometimes stated as being the second best class for Nightfall Upkeep, however, the Paladin regardless of spec is only behind the Hunter in Nightfall Upkeep by 2-4%, and since the Nightfall wielding Paladin will be doing significantly more damage than the Hunter who spams Wingclip will, aswell as have significantly more utility, then the Paladin is hands down the best Nightfall wielder in the game.
Another very interesting thing about Paladin and Nightfall Upkeep. Since Nightfall has such a slow Attack-Speed, Paladin Heals can be chained in between Auto Swing without loosing DPS from Auto-Attack, making the Paladin both keep close to maximum Nightfall Upkeep, do a useful amount of damage, at the same time as being a SpotHealer. The Raid's dedicated Holy Paladins can do this aswell, to help make the Raids go that much faster.
And even if the player behind the Holy Paladin using this method isn't very good at rotating the Healing together with the Auto Attacks without losing swingtime seconds...like lets say the player only manages to have a 20% Nightfall Upkeep time, because of clipping off much of the Auto Attacks because of healing more intensively, it will still be significant, because you will have a dedikated healer who still also gives Nightfall and some smaller amount but still useful damage all while healing dedicatedly.
To similar effect, you can have the Paladins who are Nightfall Upkeepers wear full Lawbringer, which means that their Auto-Attack combined with SoRighteousness and Proc-on-Hit Enchant/items, will mean a great chance of proccing the AoE Heal while Swinging, but at the expense of a significant amount of the personal DPS-output.
Paladins have around 42-44% Nightfall Upkeep Time, so it will likely only be advantageous to use 3 Paladin's for Nightfall Upkeep, and have the rest either use a higher damage weapon with/without SpotHeal, or dedikated Tank or Cleanse Bott.
And for dedicated DPS, a Retribution Paladin can be very viable choice for the Raid (although quite difficult to play to the highest level). As a Paladin with the potential to be top or near-top in DPS (as has been proven by Exodia in his videos), aswell as being one of the best TrashDPS (Because of the Paladin being High Burst aswell as having AoE damage, which is why good Retribution Paladins usually top the meters in Dungeons), combined with being able to Cleanse, Divine Intervention, aswell as put on Lawbringer for AoE-Healing while DPSing, or for an extra 44% Nightfall Upkeep, and a possible extra Blessing - makes a Retribution Paladin very viable in an optimised raid, as long as the Paladin enjoys playing a very complex rotation.
DPS-Test video: ruclips.net/video/sg7t4Lwj4cg/видео.html
So both Paladin and Druids are clearly not limited in optimal PvE roles and gameplay choices.
For Enhancement Shamans: While Enhancement Shaman both is one of the lowest DPS overall aswell as seems to be the lowest Nightfall Upkeeper in the game, the Enhancement Shaman can still wield Nightfall, and the Enhancement Shaman has two other things going for them in the way of having Improved Windfury talent which increases the Windfury Totem's Attack Power buff by 30%, which the Restoration Shamans most likely wont have as it's a 2-point tier 20 talent, which means no Mana Tide Totem.
Since the absolute most beneficial Raid Tactic for a Shaman seems to be TotemTwisting duty, so Both Grace of Air and Windfury can be had in the group at the same time, a Nightfall Upkeeping Enhancement Shaman who TotemTwists will very likely be very optimal, since the Shaman eventhough having likely the poorest personal DPS, and likely the poorest Nightfall Upkeep time, will still be doing some useful DPS aswell as be doing a massive DPS boost to the rest of the Group, and the Raid's Casters in the form of having a low but useful percentage of Nightfall Upkeep. Depending on how many Melee-DPS groups your Raid Setup has, Enhancement Shamans on Nightfall and TotemTwisting duty, can probably more or less fill out the whole Bossfight in Nightfall Upkeep or close to that.
There is also the potential choice for Shaman, in the same way as I wrote above for the Paladin, in SpotHealing mixed in between each NightfallSwing, while still TotemTwisting. Although at the expense of a great amount of personal DPS, aswell as needing to compensate for the extra intensive mana spendage. But it should be possible for the Shaman who enjoys a complex rotation.
About the fun factor of experimentation which may be a reason for a player to play one of either class... Just like Paladin, Shaman is afterall one of the classes that are least understood outside of the Healing spectrum, And because both Shaman and Paladin abilities work so differently from other classes, there is a lot of potential for odd gameplay choices and gear choices with potentially amazing results, if the players use their imagination. :-)
I dont get this list: if you are a healer you can never get past a 6? Why tho? Healing is in most cases more challenging and fun than playing mage or warlock just clicking one button. As a healer its easier being invited to raids and you still can farm for 2nd gear. Also there are always too many rogues on every server, so you wont get into raids easy. This list is pathetic
it's stupid. best healing is priest. by far. sure, paladin was good later, but that's an alliance only. as far as i remember, shaman were healer as well, but not that good, but they had a lot of utility to make up for it
Another guy who takes into consideration only the raiding part.
What about leveling?
Grinding?
What about.. FUCKING PVP???????
Have u seen a pvp movie of a mage?( in vanila) i bet you have.
have you seen a pvp movie of a healer( in vanila) i bet you haven't.
And what about.. FUN?
I mean the vast majority considers classes like mages and warlocks way more fun than healers...
Not all of them... but MOST of them.
And u can clearly see that in every mmo.
A healer is really boring in vanila pvp ( healer in pvp gets fun after TBC cus of arena and better optimized gear)
A healer is really bad at grinding compared to MOST classes.
Also healing specs are not even viable for leveling.
I can see why they get a 6.
Doesn't mean that they are not important.. LOL
But u can't really expect the mage class to have lower rank than a priest/paladin/druid in a video guide about "what class should u play" right?
I mean mage is the master class -.-
In raiding they are boring cus they spam frostbolt or later on, fireball/scorch but who cares? raiding is just the ULTIMATE tool to get ur gear in vanila, but it's not the GOAL.
The Goal is to rekt everyone in the world.. in pvp or wherever you want.
And who does that better than a mage ? ^_^
@@akhsdenlew1861 Dude, shadow priests were fucking beasts at PvP. And if we're talking about phase 2 being ganked by one of those bastards is worse than being ganked by rogue.
@@Voknerech10Z Dunno what to answer here... that comment is completly irrelevant to mine.
Interesting - did a similar exercise for myself (Horde only) a while ago however segmented it further into:
- Leveling
- PVE Dungeons
- PVE Raids (but not based on strength, but on raid spot availability, neglecting any hybrid tax)
- Farming (at lv60)
- PVP Battleground
- PVP Open World
- overall Popularity (least popular = highest score)
Result are slightly different, although Mage also on top and Warlock 3rd as well. Other classed got shifted around much more due to the PVP & PVE split into 2 sections, farming at lv60 and the Popularity assumption.
1. Mage
2. Hunter
3. Warlock
4. Shaman
5. Priest & Druid
7. Warrior
8. Rogue
But... I played vanilla when it was retail (from launch). So maybe my memory is not to accurate, hence never published anything. Your ranking is probably more objective and relevant than mine. Still, felt like sharing. ;)
Hi. WoW newbie here. Is there a single spec I can use to enjoy both PvP and PvE content? I want one class and one spec which excels in both. And I don't want to heal either, no offense :P
Frost mage, combat rogue
@@DefcampMelderonTV Thanks dude! I love your videos.
I think this sort of classification is a good idea, though there'd be so many other factors. Rogues levelling would surely be more better than other classes on a PvP server where they have some ganking defenses
very nice video, passion behind every sentence
i liked this video, it was rather accurate, to the point, and ignores "fan-boating." Ignore the haters, all i would recommend is u omit the role-limited values next time because although i understand that dps characters are usually more productive overall in solo'ing speed, etc. some ppl just prefer certain roles and it doesn't matter to them that they r just limited to one role. Thereby, the Priest should have a higher value for PvE as they perform best at what they're offered. Although i'll admit i've only ever played retail wow.
Damn you guys really really hate healing.
tarantules lmfao i’m not sure about that. These two absolutely love healing. Its their favorite aspect of the game.
So does the majority.. that's why people are taking ages to find a healer.
I really want to go Rogue but ive always hated leveling one I started one in 2005 an i have never gotten it to max level during any expansion pack. As i write this its level 93 with cap being 120. Also im a clicker/keyboard turner so ill probably play a hunter for ease of use.
It's a multiplayer game. Get people together that enjoy your company. It won't matter which class you play.
unless if u roll a feral druid and u realise that all your gear is intelligence and spellpower and spirit.. cus why not.
Great video guys! Really love seeing your commitment to classic wow and this in-depth explanation
amazing videos bros per usual :D
hmmmm i havent got to the end of the video, but they must give hunters a 30
@@therealloose hell to the no ;)
Kargoz! Love your content dude. One of my top Vanilla wow youtubers.
Kargoz Nice clout comment for ur friend 👌
Clout chaser
Outside of wsg druids are not desired in pvp at all. I'd rather have a paladin/priest/shaman any day in AB,AV, or world pvp. Very subjective numbers that most don't agree with tbh. Alliance warlock in pvp is like a 3 at most bc of all of the wotf.......
Well , hunter do close to same damage as mage in raids. Hunters er better in MC. And in BWL they are very close to do the same damage. In Naxx mages are king.
You need to remember that mage needs to go frost.
Fire mage are strong , but no use in MC and BWL.
So giving mage 8 and hunters 3? Don’t make senses to me.
Thats not the Vanilla i remember. Sure that might be true in private servers but if my memory serves me right any decent guild picked hunters more or less because of tranq shot, NOT dps.
Warrior leveling: 1
True. With my lvl 9 UD warrior I simply couldn't beat the same level non-elite Scarlet Friar. It just outhealed itself even regenerating back it's mana.
on private servers sure, not in vanilla.
@@WeallAreAdults regardless Tirisfal Glades is definitly a more difficult starting zone than the rest and the warrior class is certainly more difficult than anyother for leveling in the early stages.
@@ffarkasm its more rough then other classes but if you know how to level a warrior its not hard at all. You'll die more then other classes but in return you dominate at end level, keeping that in mind any death should put a smile on your face really ;)
Holy hell this is almost 100% wrong.
tell me why
@@Godswead Hunter pvp 5 ROFL // Mage leveling 6 ROFL // Paladin Pve 6 ROFL // Shaman Pve 5 ROFL // Priest pve 6 ROFL ...
@@alhca Paladins are pretty much the best healers in classic so a 6 there for PVE makes sense...Shaman same boat with healing and buffs make them pretty sought after for raids... Then again for priests healing....I am guessing they didn't give higher scores as they are role limited to pretty much just healer.
I realize you're probably just living up to your username, but stating your opinion as a fact is not an argument. The same goes for alhca down there just ROFL'ing at the numbers.
To make a compelling argument, or even an argument at *ALL*, one must explain their reasoning, backing their conclusion with supporting, proposed counter-facts.
I'm with Felix, until then: "Tell me why"...if not for me, then perhaps for the channel owners, who may read their comments. Put the "constructive" in "constructive criticism". Simple criticism doesn't usually cut it.
I didn't make an argument. I stated a fact based on 15 years of optimization. It isn't my job to teach you to play the game therefor no explanation was needed.
These "Classic" videos are nothing but people regurgitating old obsolete meta from a decade ago trying to cash in on the "classic boom" before it launches. Almost none of it was accurate even for the time since no one knew what they were doing and were just copycatting whatever worked first.
Only change I would make is change Mages Leveling to an 8
The teleporting and free food/drink part of their kit is unbelievably valuable for fast leveling, being able to set your hearth to anywhere and still have a free way back to capital cities to use the AH, repairs, hand in quests, skip half of a FP time, get around for quests that have you going across the world. These spells literally save hours in the leveling process and make it so much faster.
Hey guys i want to play Paladin Tank I really like that i can put concentration down and aoe pull Can i tank in your raid?
LOL NO
Hey guys i really like the concept as being a bear i dont like chicken form or cat form i dont like healing can i be in your raid?
LOL NO
Hey guys i really like the concept of being a survival Melee dps hunter i do pretty good damage in dungeons can i be in your raid?
LOL NO
Hey guys i really like the concept of being a shadow Priest with dots and mind flay can i be in your raid?
Lol NO
Hey guys i really like the concept of being a fire mage and trowing giant fireballs at enemys can i be in your raid
LOL no
After BWL
OK MAN NP
LOL JUST PVP IF YOU DONT LIKE the raid rules
Hey man i really like the concept of playing the spec that sounds cool can i play the game?
Nah man just Deinstall if you dont like it Bruh
Aw ok man
Yea dude..... are you just missing something? Your comments make you seem like you have never played vanilla wow before. If you don't understand you can just ask, we're here to help :).
Bear tanks are actually perfectly viable and in early tiers are generally better than warriors because they are not nearly as gear dependent, and do much more threat allowing your dps to go all out.
Klaital1 no dude, you're just wrong. Warriors do more threat, more avoidance, they're just better in every way. I'm sorry, but you seem like you have never raided in original vanilla....... no disrespect but anyone who played it knows you're wrong :(
@@bonsaw57 You might want to check out some of skarm tank videos in youtube talking about bear tanks, since you don't seem to understand how they work, and he can explain it in much greater detail than I can. But in short, warriors are nowhere near the threat of bears until the later raid tiers, and even there, they have to specifically gear for max threat to be able to compete. Warriors do have more avoidance yes, which is why they are better at tanking large groups of trash mobs, but on single target, bears are generally better because they have so much more armor and health, making them lot easier to heal.
Lot of the belief people have about druids not being able to tank raids has to do with two things, first, throughout the first half of vanilla, druids did suck, but since classic is using the 1.12 patch data, where that is no longer the case, druids are fine, the second is that during actual vanilla, people in general didn't really have a clue of how to gear bears properly or what to focus on, nowadays, people obviously do.
Klaital1 I'm sorry dude, that's pure trash. Do a basic google search of vanilla warrior raiding metrics. LITERALLY GOOGLE THAT and look at the spreadsheets :/. I cannot say it any other way, YOU ARE WRONG :(
I believe this would have changed slightly based on how classic went
Paladin is probably the most boring class in Vanilla.
The only rankings here that make sense to me are the leveling ones. The pvp and pve areas are a bit more complex, and your numbers don’t seem that well thought out. For example, dps players are in so much more supply than healers, so just getting into a group is always easier as a healer than dps. Also, do you realize you listed every class as “role limited” except for warrior? It can’t be a weakness if it applies to 8/9 classes
Extreme is "seven out of ten"? Find a dictionary.
My main was a orc hunter and I did allot of Alterac Valley in those days. My best score were 43-1 in kills vs deaths and i never ever went below 10 times more kills than deaths. Hunter bad in battlegrounds, yeah sure, just learn the right rotation and you can be to good use in PVE also ..
Great video
Very good video. I like the chart. As a veteran I think it speaks the truth for all of the classes. Keep it up!
priest and lock lower than warrior in pvp xD you have no idea what ure saying dude... shadow and soul link lock are 2 best pvp classes in the game
This class comparison looks pretty correct dudes, well done !
it didnt seem odd to you that every class except warriors is "role limited"?
no, not at all. That's Classic. Also, its role limited in either PvP, PvE, or both
most classes are role limited when it comes to pvp or pve though. Paladins, shamans. and druids may have a ton of roles to play but when it comes to PVE they are limited in what is optimal. And Mages, rogues, locks, and hunters are limited in the fact they can only do damage. It was pretty clear to me that was what they were trying to say.
@@DefcampMelderonTV name 1 spec thats not viable in pvp in best in slot gear for that spec.
Literally every spec is very much viable in pvp. Even prot warr gets sick with nax block values -> high shield slam dmg. Every spec is amazing in pvp LITERALLY, but you need gear.
@@hhhgggds viable /= optimal
@@DefcampMelderonTV its more optimal than in any other xpack really. Name 1 bad pvp spec in full gear in classic. I cannot think of 1 at all. Even prot war can one shot with block trinket. All specs in right gear are good. This is for pvp only.
Another thing you have to consider is the popularity of each class and how that factors into getting into raids and groups. Let's say you want to play a rogue or a mage and you want to raid in game. Although you are at the top of the charts and well wanted in raids, you might have a hard time finding a raid group with an open spot for you because there are just so many rogue and mage players competing with you for that spot. While on the other hand, if you choose a less popular class, such as paladin, you might have a better time at getting into a raid because paladins are in such a high demand for raids compared to the low number of people who actually play them.
Good video 😊 already decided to play druid, i have alot to learn tho. I will most likely heal end game and go feral for lvling . I Want to see how far i can get into raiding 😊
Raiding as resto druid is totally viable through all of classic. Did it myself back in the day.
yea druids offer some really amazing things in pve, such as the biggest heals (nature swiftness max rank healing touch had saved soooooo many tanks asses) plus battle rez and innervate! another great thing is there are usually only about 2 druids per raid comp so gearing up is pretty easy! not having a regular rez sucks sometimes but it's funny when u watch all the priests and shamans having to rez every1 lol.
Another one of these based on private servers and stacked towards hardcore raiding. I wish someone would do one that was based on original vanilla and more aligned to how most players play the game.
Which class to play if you want to do a bit of everything?
How can you PvP as DPS but raid as heals?
What class is best for soloing and 5-mans?
What class is best if you don't ever expect to get raid gear?
And I warn people after all these videos, private servers had warriors screwed up, they weren't that good at DPS or PvP, unless they were specced just for that. And their repair bill was ungodly. If you are rolling a warrior and you expect to own at everything at the same time, you are going to be very disappointed.
finallyyyyyy
If you wanted to do a bit of everything, you play a shaman.
Shaman were great at PvP and resto healing back then. Paladins were only good at healing.
Best to solo anything would be hunter cuz of feign death. If anything went wrong you just used that skill and retry.
Best class for shitty gear would probably be affliction locks. They just dot up everything and used their HP to convert to mana and keep going. Even better if you have a healer in party.
@@brad4058 Yeah I'm leaning towards a 0-26-25 Shaman without mana tide totem. I can heal in the melee pile raiding, with a full strength windfury totem and strength of earth totem, so they can forgive me not having the mana battery. I will be decent solo, be able to heal 5 mans fine, and in PvP I should be fairly unpleasant with big heals and windfury procs of my own. I can pass on tanking.
If you want to do a bit of everything, I think druid. You don't actually have to go that deep into the healing tree to heal, and there is a spec 0-35-15, which lets you healing touch heal pretty effectively, and have everything you need to feral tank and do feral dps.
I don't really want to tank, so was leaning towards a paladin, but I prefer the Horde, and I don't think the paladin has the spec that gives you enough dps. To heal effectively you have to go too deep into the holy talents, to then go deep enough into the Ret talents to be effective. If they made good tanks, then tank/dps or tank/Ret is viable , but with that you lose raiding. IMO if you don't want to raid, paladin is the way to go. DPS/Tank is nasty good in PvP, because you get pretty solid PvP heals as standard. And Paladins are fine 5 man tanks.
Soloing and 5 mans, then hunter I think. You do at least have that epic quest for the bow/spear thing, which you can do. The starter item does drop from MC but does go on sale at the AH rarely.
As far as shitty gear, I think I would say pyroblast mage. You can get two pretty good damage trinkets without raiding, and you get your 3 minute instakill, and still put out serious damage, plus you have sheep defense etc.
nice. you proved how imbalanced the game is.
They shouldn't be balanced
Forgot to mention that hunters have a dead zone in pvp. You also need a ammo/arrow pouch that you need to stock up.
Another great video!
World record for levling a warrior in vanilla was like 5 days which is only a few hours more than the total world record of 4 days and 20 hours.. they are not terrible at leveling you just have to know how to play them well and move to next target while still attacking
Great vid guys!
i loved my pally tank in BC, i wish pallies were allowed to raid as tanks. that's the part that breaks my heart in vanilla/classic, that you can't actually do what you want because what you want might not be acceptable to the community and wow was all about community back then.
Hunter a 5 in PvP wtf are you smoking, it's one of the best Classes in the game if you know how to play the Class.
they are very beatable
@@DefcampMelderonTV of course you can beat them, but that's not how you play a hunter in BG's just face first straight into a warrior.
@@Johansen1000 I just don't agree that they are in the same league as rogues, warriors, and mages. Skill is of course important but you can't take skill into account when making these types of lists. I love played PvP on my Hunter but the raw potential really isn't there imo
any class can be the best if you know how to play. I agree hunters are overall average in PVP for MOST people that play them.
@@DefcampMelderonTV maybe I'm biased because I actually play a hunter, but I would say Hunter is the best class overall, and probably has the most important skill in the game Viper Sting, sit down and drink every single class in the game with the exception of Rogue and warrior and maybe your occasional feral druid, sure a cute rogue might catch me with my trinket on cooldown but that's it. 2-3 hunter Flare's in the game and there is no place for you to hide little rogue, no ganking for you. the only obstacles in the game are Warriors and druids that runs around in Bear from.
I really liked the idea of adding leveling as a separate column to assess. It definitely helps with getting a good picture of what you're getting yourself into not only right now but in the future if you can make it to 60 if you're not familiar with the game.
What I dont like is voting based on overall versatility of specs. I think going over each perceivable role (healing dps tank) and ranking them for pve/pvp is kind of necessary, as looking at this chart wholelistically can kind of be misleading. I get the idea behind being stuck in one spec lowers the playability of a certain class, but that same idea also kind of gets muddied in the way you went about describing it.
For example, you said that priests or Paladins got a lower score in pve for only being able to heal despite them being the best healers. Yet at the same time, you give rogues an 8 for being amazing at dps but they are also only limited to dps.
Overall I definitely enjoyed the video, but I think that was one notable flaw that I felt was embedded in the presentation.
is chuck norris a class
As a shaman player from vanilla, I am not sure I wanna go through all these again. It was like A SM session. Even at end game.
Shit no its not balanced, its OG WoW!!
What makes the game beautiful,is when we all get togather as a team =-p
Thats the only balance