As Sun Lu T'ang was always saying , "T'ai Chi, Pa Kua and Hsing-I are of the same school but each emphasises a different aspect of the teaching". In my day, we tended to specialise - I always loved Ba Gua (as we now write it) but I still had to put my time in with Tai Chi and Hsing-I. Only did half a dozen years each of the latter two, though - I knew what I liked!
Bagua typically disappears through it's movement of the center and positioning. Dissolving the center is not the typical strategy and certainly not the primary focus in how it uses the center..
Finally someone who seems to have a Spiritual Grasp on what is physically happening! Well done! Meeting and learning from you is Now on my List of Eventualities. Thank you for being....You!
hi mr clear - you seem like a straight up guy, great videos, very helpful; am learning taiji/bagua from a gentleman with no english - so most interesting viewing your demonstrations. thanks, a
These style have a lot in common but their are some distinct differences between them as well. Yes, you do melt in all 3 arts. That's a different thing than dissolving the center. Xing Yi for example uses that melting to fortify it's center. Xing Yi will certainly rotate it's center to dissipate incoming force and avoid meeting the opponents force directly but other than that rotation it doesn't really move the center much.
Sorry, we're a little behind on answering comments. No, Tai Chi doesn't crash an opponent the way Xing Yi dose. It certainly can let the opponent run in to you in a way that's bad for them but it's far more likely to evade, slip and dissipate until an opponent is so overextended that even a little force will do them in. Xing Yi will rotate the center and evade some, but for the most part it does so just enough to avoid meeting the opponent at their absolute strongest and then it crashes them.
Thank you for the kind invitation. 10 minutes at 6 hits per second is 3600 hits at full power. That is some amazing training. How do your longer term students develop that amount of stamina?
First off, wanted to say that i really enjoy your videos. The practical application is incredible. I am currently a brown belt in MCMAP(Marines) which is sort of a joke. When teaching some of my Marines we use body hardening and different exercises to keep up physical endurance. What I would like to know is in the situation that you cannot run because your brother depends on you how do you condition your students to maintain? Or do you have a condition program that follows with your training?
In all 3 I have the impression that the most important is to size the opportunity quickly. How to be efficient and quick in applying any method is the key and this has to do with the center. Not necessarily the center that's meant here, but what makes the center inside yourself, what makes you. Any action comes from inside. I mean not only muscles and tendons and nerves, but inside. If that inside is clear (no pun intended ! :) and flowing then the materialization of any action following any method will be quick and responsive. The other part also comes from the inside: assessement. There's no time to really assess. No time to think. But the response must be right. Training can help, although the real answer lies again deep inside and how the inside can stand still in the midst of turmoil. By not being full of oneself, it is easier to quickly 'see' in real-time what action needs to be done, without taking the time to think. In short this means that training is nice, but meditation (standing post, circulations, etc...) is also very important and is also a training on its own which complements internal arts.
Yes, a very important part of any method is learning to perceive what's going on around you a responding appropriately. Any decision making that happens in a situation is going to slow down your reaction time way to much.
Who do you think would win in a freestyle duel - Ip Man or Tyson? Joking. Great video. Was he holding to you with all his strength and was he really trying to follow you? He seemed staggered and unnatural. An attacker in the street would be much more determined not to lose grip on you, right? I would like to see these techniques being applied in a demonstration, similar to real situation as much as possible.
This is just a demonstration of how Xing Yi, Bagua, and Tai Chi differ in their approaches to escaping from grabs. We have many more videos showing this in more "street real" situations. If you're interested, you should subscribe and check out our stuff! To answer your other question, John is a big guy with a very strong grip, and he is really trying to hold on here. The more committed an opponent is to keeping their hold on you, the more easily these techniques work. Some attackers will sense that they are losing their grip and move to get a different grab on you, and you have to be prepared for that, too.
krautbeer100 Well, I haven't been doing for years, but I have been practicing Mantak Chia's method for a while now (laugh if you want). I've read many opinions in regards to the microcosmic orbit, ranging from it being totally useless to essential. I'm not trying to disagree with you, but I'll continue to practice it since it works for me atm. I'm also curious as to what kind of audible sensation you're supposed experience when receiving chi.
I was wondering if there's an answer for this. In the microcosmic orbit, is it optional to interlace fingers in a seated position? Does it serve a functional purpose?
It is not "bad" to study the three at once, but in my experience it is better to study one at a time. Hit the level of proficiency you want for the time being before moving on to the next, and in this way you will make rapid progress while still seeing the places where the three intersect. My Street Kung Fu program is laid out this way, and that is how I teach the students in the Maryvillle, Tennessee school.
Any self defense system must assume the attackers will be bigger, stronger, faster and have much better endurance. So it has to be effective in a bad situation when you are old, out of shape and all those factors are stacked against you. That being said all of our longer term students train to maintain at least 6 (most can do more) hits per second with full body power in every hit for at least 10 min.
I've never heard of these styles being so rigidly different. I'm not saying what you're teaching here is incorrect. Yes taiji melts, or sinks, release. Yes Bagua rotates, and Xingyi is directional, very angular. But you also melt in Xingyi, you also move over your opponent in taiji and you do fortify the center with Bagua.
Bagua certainly fortifies the center to a point but the focus is on being able to move the center very very well. and so it puts a whole lot more work into being able to move the center all over the place. Tai Chi can fortify the center and it moves the center a lot, especially at the beginning and intermediate levels but it's goal is to completely dissolve the center so that moving it or fortifying it becomes unnecessary.
So my comment appears to be missing. Are you saying that in Taiji you don't run over your opponent and fortifying the center, and in Xingyi you don't subdue, melt away and rotate the center, and in Bagua you don't melt away similarly disappear?
Hi, interested in seeing a video of one of your longer term students demonstrating 6 hits per second with full body power in every hit for 10 minutes. Thank You.
I've met/visited Mr. Clear. He's a good egg (not his fault he looks just like a film star! ha!). There is some good meat in this video for beginners to chew on.. I hope his students pay strict attention.. they have got a good resource there in Maryville that can help them build skill that's useful for fighting, not just the usual health or cultivation side we see more commonly. Props to Mr. Clear!
I was in the marine corps as well 0351 assaultman... the body hardening in MCMAP is a joke in tai ji the goal is to relax and let go the same goes for taking strikes the more you're able to relax and let go the less the strikes will have an impact on you the conditioning is learning how to correctly yield at least in the shu family system very similar to what he does in the grabbing just applied to strikes and all other forms of the training
lest say i have 6 to 8 hs a day... im not interested in becoming a master any soon just to learn as much as i can in the time i have with the work i can do... not trying to push myself too much... my actual question was about that diferences... (like someone who practice box will have some problems learning some wing tsun punches because of the diference between styles...)
I can certainly admire your sophisticated skill level in the arts , way better than I am for sure. However: The statistics of street attacks look a little different. Right hand punch to the head / and usually thugs try to use the blind spot as well . And in the Tai Chi version at around 4: 20 , The guy is turning his back towards the attacker's left arm. Consequence: Vital targets like the neck , spinal cord and kidneys are unprotected. Would scare the heck out of me. Greetings, have a good one !
+Bengun67 This isn't how a Tai Chi fighter would deal with someone throwing a right hand punch to the head, it's one of the ways Tai Chi fighters have of dealing with being grabbed. And he's showing the mechanics here, not how that would look in combination with other tactics and considerations in a live situation. All three of the internal arts depicted also make use of blind spots as part of their striking strategy, so what you're saying isn't something that a competent practitioner wouldn't already know
Microcosmic orbit is a basic preparation or beginner's exercise to lead onward. Even the Macro orbit is not the answer. If you meditate a lot (I did for many years) you will find it less and less helpful pertaining to martial arts applications. Personally I have met dozens upon dozens of so called "masters". Alas none of them was ever able to transfer their "Chi" into my body causing any audible sensation. From what I learned, meditation is most likely nothing but a mild form of self hypnosis.
Xing Yi - Fortify the Center.
Ba Gua - Center constantly moves.
Tai Ji - What Center?
IMO, Tai Ji always has the best answer to the problem.
As Sun Lu T'ang was always saying , "T'ai Chi, Pa Kua and Hsing-I are of the same school but each emphasises a different aspect of the teaching". In my day, we tended to specialise - I always loved Ba Gua (as we now write it) but I still had to put my time in with Tai Chi and Hsing-I. Only did half a dozen years each of the latter two, though - I knew what I liked!
Bagua typically disappears through it's movement of the center and positioning. Dissolving the center is not the typical strategy and certainly not the primary focus in how it uses the center..
Almost like the three states of matter: solid, liquid, gas (though apparently plasma is a fourth state now).
Finally someone who seems to have a Spiritual Grasp on what is physically happening!
Well done! Meeting and learning from you is Now on my List of Eventualities.
Thank you for being....You!
Wow, that was a great demo on what the essence of each style is about.
Thank you, glad you enjoyed the video.
Excellent!!!!!!!!!!! display and explanation of the differences of three internal arts core shen fa. Nice job!!!
I appreciate the videos. Keep them coming.
hi mr clear - you seem like a straight up guy, great videos, very helpful; am learning taiji/bagua from a gentleman with no english - so most interesting viewing your demonstrations. thanks, a
These style have a lot in common but their are some distinct differences between them as well.
Yes, you do melt in all 3 arts. That's a different thing than dissolving the center. Xing Yi for example uses that melting to fortify it's center. Xing Yi will certainly rotate it's center to dissipate incoming force and avoid meeting the opponents force directly but other than that rotation it doesn't really move the center much.
Sorry, we're a little behind on answering comments.
No, Tai Chi doesn't crash an opponent the way Xing Yi dose. It certainly can let the opponent run in to you in a way that's bad for them but it's far more likely to evade, slip and dissipate until an opponent is so overextended that even a little force will do them in.
Xing Yi will rotate the center and evade some, but for the most part it does so just enough to avoid meeting the opponent at their absolute strongest and then it crashes them.
Thank you for the kind invitation. 10 minutes at 6 hits per second is 3600 hits at full power. That is some amazing training. How do your longer term students develop that amount of stamina?
Thank you for your generosity, I enjoy and carefully watch all of your videos...
AWSOMMMMMMME!!! MERCIIIIIIII
images : sphere (all directions ),animals,water,wind, earth: elements= LIFE
THANK YOU and KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK.
First off, wanted to say that i really enjoy your videos. The practical application is incredible. I am currently a brown belt in MCMAP(Marines) which is sort of a joke. When teaching some of my Marines we use body hardening and different exercises to keep up physical endurance. What I would like to know is in the situation that you cannot run because your brother depends on you how do you condition your students to maintain? Or do you have a condition program that follows with your training?
Great lesson man. Love it.
Thanks again, have set my calendar to come visit and observe your class sometime after first of year. I live in Dawsonville, Georgia.
Awesome, master!
In all 3 I have the impression that the most important is to size the opportunity quickly. How to be efficient and quick in applying any method is the key and this has to do with the center. Not necessarily the center that's meant here, but what makes the center inside yourself, what makes you. Any action comes from inside. I mean not only muscles and tendons and nerves, but inside. If that inside is clear (no pun intended ! :) and flowing then the materialization of any action following any method will be quick and responsive. The other part also comes from the inside: assessement. There's no time to really assess. No time to think. But the response must be right. Training can help, although the real answer lies again deep inside and how the inside can stand still in the midst of turmoil. By not being full of oneself, it is easier to quickly 'see' in real-time what action needs to be done, without taking the time to think. In short this means that training is nice, but meditation (standing post, circulations, etc...) is also very important and is also a training on its own which complements internal arts.
Yes, a very important part of any method is learning to perceive what's going on around you a responding appropriately. Any decision making that happens in a situation is going to slow down your reaction time way to much.
Dude are you related to Kevin Bacon?
Who do you think would win in a freestyle duel - Ip Man or Tyson? Joking. Great video. Was he holding to you with all his strength and was he really trying to follow you? He seemed staggered and unnatural. An attacker in the street would be much more determined not to lose grip on you, right? I would like to see these techniques being applied in a demonstration, similar to real situation as much as possible.
This is just a demonstration of how Xing Yi, Bagua, and Tai Chi differ in their approaches to escaping from grabs. We have many more videos showing this in more "street real" situations. If you're interested, you should subscribe and check out our stuff! To answer your other question, John is a big guy with a very strong grip, and he is really trying to hold on here. The more committed an opponent is to keeping their hold on you, the more easily these techniques work. Some attackers will sense that they are losing their grip and move to get a different grab on you, and you have to be prepared for that, too.
krautbeer100 Well, I haven't been doing for years, but I have been practicing Mantak Chia's method for a while now (laugh if you want). I've read many opinions in regards to the microcosmic orbit, ranging from it being totally useless to essential. I'm not trying to disagree with you, but I'll continue to practice it since it works for me atm. I'm also curious as to what kind of audible sensation you're supposed experience when receiving chi.
Thank you for the share, appreciate the video a lot.
I was wondering if there's an answer for this. In the microcosmic orbit, is it optional to interlace fingers in a seated position? Does it serve a functional purpose?
is it bad to learn all three arts at the same time?
It is not "bad" to study the three at once, but in my experience it is better to study one at a time. Hit the level of proficiency you want for the time being before moving on to the next, and in this way you will make rapid progress while still seeing the places where the three intersect. My Street Kung Fu program is laid out this way, and that is how I teach the students in the Maryvillle, Tennessee school.
Excellent! We look forward to meeting you.
Any self defense system must assume the attackers will be bigger, stronger, faster and have much better endurance. So it has to be effective in a bad situation when you are old, out of shape and all those factors are stacked against you.
That being said all of our longer term students train to maintain at least 6 (most can do more) hits per second with full body power in every hit for at least 10 min.
I've never heard of these styles being so rigidly different. I'm not saying what you're teaching here is incorrect. Yes taiji melts, or sinks, release. Yes Bagua rotates, and Xingyi is directional, very angular.
But you also melt in Xingyi, you also move over your opponent in taiji and you do fortify the center with Bagua.
Bagua certainly fortifies the center to a point but the focus is on being able to move the center very very well. and so it puts a whole lot more work into being able to move the center all over the place.
Tai Chi can fortify the center and it moves the center a lot, especially at the beginning and intermediate levels but it's goal is to completely dissolve the center so that moving it or fortifying it becomes unnecessary.
you rock clear.
Thank you.
That depends on the student. Their previous experience, how much work they're willing to do and how much time they have.
So my comment appears to be missing. Are you saying that in Taiji you don't run over your opponent and fortifying the center, and in Xingyi you don't subdue, melt away and rotate the center, and in Bagua you don't melt away similarly disappear?
Hi, interested in seeing a video of one of your longer term students demonstrating 6 hits per second with full body power in every hit for 10 minutes. Thank You.
You're welcome to come visit & see live.
I've met/visited Mr. Clear. He's a good egg (not his fault he looks just like a film star! ha!). There is some good meat in this video for beginners to chew on.. I hope his students pay strict attention.. they have got a good resource there in Maryville that can help them build skill that's useful for fighting, not just the usual health or cultivation side we see more commonly. Props to Mr. Clear!
Simple... lots of practice. ;) Though developing good technique is just as important as building stamina.
I was in the marine corps as well 0351 assaultman... the body hardening in MCMAP is a joke in tai ji the goal is to relax and let go the same goes for taking strikes the more you're able to relax and let go the less the strikes will have an impact on you the conditioning is learning how to correctly yield at least in the shu family system very similar to what he does in the grabbing just applied to strikes and all other forms of the training
Tai Chi, Xing Yi, and Ba Gua are all diferent styles... do you think its possible to learn them all at the same time?
lest say i have 6 to 8 hs a day... im not interested in becoming a master any soon just to learn as much as i can in the time i have with the work i can do... not trying to push myself too much... my actual question was about that diferences... (like someone who practice box will have some problems learning some wing tsun punches because of the diference between styles...)
I can certainly admire your sophisticated skill level in the arts , way better than I am for sure. However: The statistics of street attacks look a little different. Right hand punch to the head / and usually thugs try to use the blind spot as well . And in the Tai Chi version at around 4: 20 , The guy is turning his back towards the attacker's left arm. Consequence: Vital targets like the neck , spinal cord and kidneys are unprotected. Would scare the heck out of me. Greetings, have a good one !
+Bengun67 This isn't how a Tai Chi fighter would deal with someone throwing a right hand punch to the head, it's one of the ways Tai Chi fighters have of dealing with being grabbed. And he's showing the mechanics here, not how that would look in combination with other tactics and considerations in a live situation. All three of the internal arts depicted also make use of blind spots as part of their striking strategy, so what you're saying isn't something that a competent practitioner wouldn't already know
Totally agree!!!
Microcosmic orbit is a basic preparation or beginner's exercise to lead onward. Even the Macro orbit is not the answer. If you meditate a lot (I did for many years) you will find it less and less helpful pertaining to martial arts applications. Personally I have met dozens upon dozens of so called "masters". Alas none of them was ever able to transfer their "Chi" into my body causing any audible sensation. From what I learned, meditation is most likely nothing but a mild form of self hypnosis.
xing yi looks like the wing chun!