That's how we got the tell "upset victory" as well. A horse named upset was entered into a race where it had low odds of winning and it trounced the competition.
As a not so fun fact this was the last tournament KishCubed ever entered before his death two months later, in a way it's kinda magical a term he coined all the way back then is still used today
As someone who has been part of the FGC for decades it's so weird to me how Smash has its own space with its own terms and language. It's like an alternate dimension of the fighting game community A good example is how in the Smash Community they call casual matches "friendlies" but in every other game we call them "casuals"
@@surfingraichu7594 I think its just because they were insulated from each other for a while. Since Street Fighter 6 came out with Modern Control scheme a lot of Smash players have been hanging out on our side of the fence. Which is great, I love having them here! Some of them have become quite formidable players.
I might he biased as a primarily smash player but I usually prefer smash terminology. 'friendlies' sounds better than 'casuals' and 'ditto' is shorter than 'mirror match'. the one thing I don't carry over is 'JV', I still say 'perfect' in other games.
This is where it came from, but I think most people today use it thinking it means junior varsity. Like a normal 4 stock is with 4 stocks, a JV 4 is with 3 stocks at 0%, and I've even heard people use the term "Freshman 4 stock" for 3 stock with under 20%
@@connorthornberg This is sort of correct, a freshman fourty is a win with under 40% taken and all stocks remaining. It is the "next best thing" to a jv5 (in melee, or a jv4 in ult)
@@henkiestudios5117it’s a term used for high school sports. Most of the time there is a freshman team for just 9th grade, a varsity team which is the best of 10-12 and a junior varsity team for the people not good enough for varsity, most of the time it would be 10-11th grade
Was checking the comments to see if someone ACTUALLY knew what JV meant. I went to weekly smashfests with Joe back between 2006 & 2008. Then once we stopped being able to smash at Justin's on Wednesdays because of what one of my dumbass friends did... I hosted the weekly fests for a bit. Ahh being part of the OG Michigan crew, still makes me happy to this day.
@@GyozaDevourerThat’s actually a rule and it might not seem believable initially (for a good reason too). They thought that fox’s lazer was so unavoidable, that if that’s all you were hit by, they would count it regardless. I think this was the story or there was another reason behind it, im not entirely certain.
I always thought that JV3 was for winning without losing a Stock, and JV4 was for winning without taking any damage at all (regardless of how many Stocks each player starts with).
To keep it simple, say you're about to 2 stock your opponent/friend, and are already ready to brag about it mentally, but they end up taking your stock. Then upon getting back in on your last stock, you immediately take their last stock and win the game, taking no damage. you can see how if playing with a friend you'd think to say, "I took no damage on my last stock, so while it wasn't a 2 stock liie iy should have been, it basically still was, essentially!" Although that would be a long winded way to say it, haha. You get it?
It's like doing an Ajax in overwatch (losing your lucio ult while casting it) because the pro player, Ajax, was notorious for losing his ultimates during tournament matches hahaha
Yeah, but stocks in other fighting games, like Mortal Kombat, are distinct from each other. This would be the equivalent of a double-flawless or double-perfect. Even then, it's not quite the same thing, because you're free to move around between rounds, and your opponent can hit you during the brief between-round invulnerability. As an addendum, the only classic fighting game I can think of that works similar to Smash Brothers in keeping your previous round's damage is Killer Instinct.
@@TaranAlvein MultiVersus, Rivals of Aether, Brawlhalla, and other fighting games similar to Smash (that typically use more than one stock per player per match).
There is this same concept except in overwatch and it's called C9 also named after a pro overwatch league. To explain it shortly, there is a gamemode where you have to push a payload whilst defending it from enemies and when a match timer is almost over you enter overtime where the attackers have to stay near the payload at all times (1 player is enough) whilst still defending it from the enemies. Stakes are high and sometimes because of ults like dva's nuke, everyone tries to run away to not die, that they forget about the payload and that's how you C9, by having team members that are alive yet none are touching the payload, so you lose.
unsure if this is true but from what i know, the JV stock term became popular cause it was used to refer to an old crew battle rule where taking no damage on a fresh stock would let you get a stock back against the next guy
“Have you ever got beaten up in a game so badly that your opponent took no damage” Yep, it was my last game of For Honor As many people know, a huge part of For Honor is reading what your opponent’s next move will be, and responding accordingly with dodging, parrying, blocking or just hyper armour through their attacks Yeah, I got beat so bad, my opponent sent me a message “Should call you a kid’s book because that was an easy read” I couldn’t go back, the shame was too much
Oh just like a C9 in overwatch, when you dominate a fight but lose the game because you don't care about the objective... a thing that happend in overwatch Worldcup where the team Cloud9 did this, so everytime a team loses a match while Dominating a fight you call it a C9
In brawlhalla, we call it a 3 stock when you don't die, and a 0-to-death if you get a kill without taking damage. But I guess we don't have a term for when both of those happen at once, so that's cool
I mean EVERY fighting game with 3 lives as the standard calls it a 3 stock if you don’t die. The zero to death thing was already claimed by smash too, specifically the whole wobbling bullshit started it
I love learning this. Always thought it meant junior varsity, which makes sense, and also I relate to it having stayed stuck on the jv squad in basketball in highschool. But shouts to the legend JV, that's awesome.
Interesting. I always thought JV in smash meant junior varsity. Where the next higher stock count is the unspoken and unnamed varsity level of the stock count. It’s funny how that happened to be his name and also works perfectly well as junior varsity also.
Is pichu basically incapable of doing this? Because you have like, jab, dash, all throws except forward and maybe down (idk about that one, I forgot), neutral air, up air, and that's about it. Attack while grabbing uses electricity, forward throw uses electricity, back forward and down air use electricity, all specials, including recovery, use electricity, and anything that uses electricity damages pichu
Me and my bros just say 'might as well have {x} stocks' It funny we also considered it like having an extra stock despite never having heard of 'JV' until recently
0 to death is typically all in one combo, or all in one almost combo, but it can also be considered a 0 to death if you simply just take no damage while taking their stock, even if it takes a while. But you don't have to 0 to death someone on all their stocks to get atleast a JV 2 or 3^^ but for a 4 stock game and wanting a JV5, yes ofc.
Broooooooo I have been saying this to my friends since smash 4 3DS in school, didn’t know it was a term or that it actually existed so I just called it a “technical 2 Stock” hahaha I cannot believe this actually is real
Without reading the title, the context on the first clip was referencing me "have you ever been beaten in a game so badly that your opponent wend W S W S W S W S W S"
Thought it was junior varsity as a joke. Like a varsity 4 stock is having 4 stocjs a junior varsity is having 3 but not taking damage on it. This is why I immediately understood it when someone first used it near me
![Nuts [YTP] | A Moana parody](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/MnIRAGodAXA/mqdefault.jpg)
imagine beating your opponent so badly, the community names the winning circumstance after you
Marathon vibes
@@nixx7912this. running a whole 26 miles to save an entire civilization without stopping is the most badass thing someone has done in history
Imagine beating your opponent so badly that your opponent names the winning circumstance after you
That's how we got the tell "upset victory" as well. A horse named upset was entered into a race where it had low odds of winning and it trounced the competition.
@@agentdopkant neat, i didn’t know about that.
As a not so fun fact this was the last tournament KishCubed ever entered before his death two months later, in a way it's kinda magical a term he coined all the way back then is still used today
Rejected transplant I believe and they couldn't get him another heart in time
I’m glad his legacy can still live on in a way through the term of “JV” wins, even if people don’t know it
@@justinmadrid8712someone jv'd him irl
dude actually just sent chills through my body
🫡 Goodbye Kish
JV literally got immortalized by the game community in the best way of recognition possible
Unlike poor John
@@nolanj.3897 *No Johns*
Agreed
@@nolanj.3897who’s John?
@moeski17 John was a smash player who made excuses when he lost, so people called it "Johning" when you make excuses when you lose in smash
The irony of JV being the first guy to get officially JV 2 stocked.
Wait JV did that first to kishcube so it doesnt count as "official" until kishcube does it?
@@airsoft_cartmanI think it's because kishcube was the first one to actually call it a JV stock
Kind of wholesome that the first guy to get JV’d did it right back to the guy who thought of the idea, and thus coined the term
Oh god Falco has been isekai'd
😭😭😭
"I got JV'd Three times in a row so I killed myself and reincarnated as Falco" is the best anime ever
@@Aescalonasuch fates to be recairnated as the less popular clone
"Hands off my-" (gets flying to another dimension)
NOT TRUCK-KUN
The cell shaded models look cool
We love Animelee
This art style needs to be in the next Smash game.
@@erickmaverick3128 its the art-style for rivals of aether 2
As someone who has been part of the FGC for decades it's so weird to me how Smash has its own space with its own terms and language. It's like an alternate dimension of the fighting game community
A good example is how in the Smash Community they call casual matches "friendlies" but in every other game we call them "casuals"
Probably because casuals also would refer to casual players, whom there are way fewer of in traditional fighting games.
@@surfingraichu7594 I think its just because they were insulated from each other for a while. Since Street Fighter 6 came out with Modern Control scheme a lot of Smash players have been hanging out on our side of the fence. Which is great, I love having them here! Some of them have become quite formidable players.
Don't forget dittos vs mirror matches. It's something I have to keep in kind as both a Smash and FGC player lol
I might he biased as a primarily smash player but I usually prefer smash terminology. 'friendlies' sounds better than 'casuals' and 'ditto' is shorter than 'mirror match'. the one thing I don't carry over is 'JV', I still say 'perfect' in other games.
Friendlys makes more sense honestly and dounds more fun.
Oh that’s why in ult with 3 stocks you JV4 them but in melee with 4 stocks you JV5 then
I just had this same thought bc I heard it first in Smash 4 with the old 2 stock rule. So JV3.
This is where it came from, but I think most people today use it thinking it means junior varsity. Like a normal 4 stock is with 4 stocks, a JV 4 is with 3 stocks at 0%, and I've even heard people use the term "Freshman 4 stock" for 3 stock with under 20%
@@connorthornberg what does “junior varsity” mean?
@@connorthornberg This is sort of correct, a freshman fourty is a win with under 40% taken and all stocks remaining. It is the "next best thing" to a jv5 (in melee, or a jv4 in ult)
@@henkiestudios5117it’s a term used for high school sports. Most of the time there is a freshman team for just 9th grade, a varsity team which is the best of 10-12 and a junior varsity team for the people not good enough for varsity, most of the time it would be 10-11th grade
It actually is an acronym, his username comes from his initials, Joe Versical
Was checking the comments to see if someone ACTUALLY knew what JV meant. I went to weekly smashfests with Joe back between 2006 & 2008. Then once we stopped being able to smash at Justin's on Wednesdays because of what one of my dumbass friends did... I hosted the weekly fests for a bit. Ahh being part of the OG Michigan crew, still makes me happy to this day.
Every time I hear Kish mentioned I immediately become sad. R.I.P KishCubed
It's so funny that this got coined in the same way that jons did.
Fun fact
If you take exclusively laser damage it also counts as a JV
...no
@@GyozaDevourerThat’s actually a rule and it might not seem believable initially (for a good reason too). They thought that fox’s lazer was so unavoidable, that if that’s all you were hit by, they would count it regardless. I think this was the story or there was another reason behind it, im not entirely certain.
Laser damage is practically guaranteed
@@THG467 mmmmm...no
the "nuh uh" is carrying @@GyozaDevourer
the p5 layer cake riff is so catchy
True
I always thought that JV3 was for winning without losing a Stock, and JV4 was for winning without taking any damage at all (regardless of how many Stocks each player starts with).
It's called a : flawless Victory
Or PERFECT
melee isn't fgc though so we have our own lingo for stuff.
It's not flawless though because you can still take damage and lose stocks. You just have to win with 0% damage on your current stock.
The friendliest of friendly matches.
Most of these things I've known for a while but seeing them presented like this to wider audiences and doing good is nice
Falco got isekai'd💀
Good editing 👍
Fun history lesson, but in what way is winning with 0% similar to gaining an extra stock?
To keep it simple, say you're about to 2 stock your opponent/friend, and are already ready to brag about it mentally, but they end up taking your stock. Then upon getting back in on your last stock, you immediately take their last stock and win the game, taking no damage. you can see how if playing with a friend you'd think to say, "I took no damage on my last stock, so while it wasn't a 2 stock liie iy should have been, it basically still was, essentially!" Although that would be a long winded way to say it, haha. You get it?
Oh so that's what it means...
I was always confused why it was an extra stock but now I get it 😲
Song is ost from persona 5. It’s called layer cake
One of my favorite trivia bits of all time is this one, that its not an acronym but someone's name
If you ever throw hard enough as a pro, you'll be named after it, like a c9
Or Insec in league
what's a c9?
Imagine losing so bad that your opponent gets a term named after them and a quantum stock
D A M N. that outline effect looks SO GOOD with meelee models. wow.
Bro got whooped, then did the same back, named it after his opponent since he did it first, and then passed away. RIP KishCubed
It slotting in with the normal thought process of "Junior varcity" absolutely makes it stick
It's like doing an Ajax in overwatch (losing your lucio ult while casting it) because the pro player, Ajax, was notorious for losing his ultimates during tournament matches hahaha
Dude the visuals are great. Really well put together video. You gained a sub 🙏🏻
In mortal kombat, this is called a flawless victory
I was thinking about this exactly.
It is a FV from MK.
Yeah, or a Perfect KO in most fighting games
Yeah, but stocks in other fighting games, like Mortal Kombat, are distinct from each other. This would be the equivalent of a double-flawless or double-perfect. Even then, it's not quite the same thing, because you're free to move around between rounds, and your opponent can hit you during the brief between-round invulnerability.
As an addendum, the only classic fighting game I can think of that works similar to Smash Brothers in keeping your previous round's damage is Killer Instinct.
@@TaranAlvein MultiVersus, Rivals of Aether, Brawlhalla, and other fighting games similar to Smash (that typically use more than one stock per player per match).
Those are platform fighters like Smash, Kille Instinct is a lot closer to Mortal Kombat
It’s cool that Kish used the name as well when getting back at JV
Great video, it's always fun to see accurate historical videos where research was clearly done. Thanks for sharing!
Ive been following the smash scene since like 2008 and I never knew where JV came from. Thanks for the video😊
this editing is crazy good
Falco being hit by a car in the last frame was crazy....
The JV thing was popularized by JV yes, but there's been multiple times that theres been wins without getting hit prior to it
The first question "are you that bad?" Not "have you beat someone that bad?"
There is this same concept except in overwatch and it's called C9 also named after a pro overwatch league.
To explain it shortly, there is a gamemode where you have to push a payload whilst defending it from enemies and when a match timer is almost over you enter overtime where the attackers have to stay near the payload at all times (1 player is enough) whilst still defending it from the enemies.
Stakes are high and sometimes because of ults like dva's nuke, everyone tries to run away to not die, that they forget about the payload and that's how you C9, by having team members that are alive yet none are touching the payload, so you lose.
The Isekai Truck strikes again
Love seeing PP’s lil hop of joy.
unsure if this is true but from what i know, the JV stock term became popular cause it was used to refer to an old crew battle rule where taking no damage on a fresh stock would let you get a stock back against the next guy
“Have you ever got beaten up in a game so badly that your opponent took no damage”
Yep, it was my last game of For Honor
As many people know, a huge part of For Honor is reading what your opponent’s next move will be, and responding accordingly with dodging, parrying, blocking or just hyper armour through their attacks
Yeah, I got beat so bad, my opponent sent me a message
“Should call you a kid’s book because that was an easy read”
I couldn’t go back, the shame was too much
I’ve gotten one JV 4 stock before that I can remember. That was a different kind of pop off
I always thought it stood for Junior Varsity, because thats the team just below varsity and a JV is just below winning with that many stocks
Same
I think that's what most people think it is now, especially since I've heard people say "freshman x stock" for getting the win with under 20%
Yeah it’s a misconception, it just comes from his username which comes from his initials, Joe Versical.
But it works out in that way too, Joe likely was aware of the double meaning himself :)
Oh just like a C9 in overwatch, when you dominate a fight but lose the game because you don't care about the objective... a thing that happend in overwatch Worldcup where the team Cloud9 did this, so everytime a team loses a match while Dominating a fight you call it a C9
Otherwise known as your average Casual game
Apparently Yoshi F-smash can do 47% uncharged from the evidence in this video. Thank you, very cool!
In brawlhalla, we call it a 3 stock when you don't die, and a 0-to-death if you get a kill without taking damage. But I guess we don't have a term for when both of those happen at once, so that's cool
I mean EVERY fighting game with 3 lives as the standard calls it a 3 stock if you don’t die.
The zero to death thing was already claimed by smash too, specifically the whole wobbling bullshit started it
my brother and i would call this an “honorary 2/3/4” stock when we played online, without knowing it was an actual thing :)
I always assumed it was like “Junior Varsity”, so like 1-step below Varsity, or actually doing the X-stock
Imagine getting beat up so bad by a bird then the bird gets hit by a truck
I love learning this. Always thought it meant junior varsity, which makes sense, and also I relate to it having stayed stuck on the jv squad in basketball in highschool. But shouts to the legend JV, that's awesome.
I’d unironically be down for a smash game in this style (I guess 3DS kinda did this but like a bit more amped up)
I got beaten like that by minecraft player statefarm jake. Players like him are truly on another level
if you play a 8 stock game, (I don't know why anyone would do that), and you "JV" them, it would be a JV9, which would be the answer to JV3X3
Another term for it (at least when playing with 3 stocks) is a 4-stock 😎
I was JV 5ed by a pink Luigi on slippi my first week of playing melee and I still think about it whenever I play against a Luigi
I feel so proud that I know what a JV stock is because my brother and his friends are into Smash. It's finally sticking 😭
Ah, I remember my first JV
bros solving my existential crisis
Cell chaded meele is the coolets thing I didint know I needed in my life
I have always called it a technical 2 stock with the example of where it came from.
The 90s term is called "Skunking"
Interesting. I always thought JV in smash meant junior varsity. Where the next higher stock count is the unspoken and unnamed varsity level of the stock count. It’s funny how that happened to be his name and also works perfectly well as junior varsity also.
I always thought it stood for “Just victory”
I always wondered about this. This makes so much sense now
This happens a decent bit at all levels in Guilty Gear
The fact that he said Midwest i was half expecting my state to be mentioned
Is pichu basically incapable of doing this? Because you have like, jab, dash, all throws except forward and maybe down (idk about that one, I forgot), neutral air, up air, and that's about it. Attack while grabbing uses electricity, forward throw uses electricity, back forward and down air use electricity, all specials, including recovery, use electricity, and anything that uses electricity damages pichu
for pichu I'd count it as a JV if the opponent's "damage dealt" stat says 0%
My brother and I call a JV2 a "poor man's 2 stock"
I call those, a Flawless Victory
Thank you, 2 videos below this is Middy's video titled "Enjoy this JV4" and now I know what that is. Came back to say this.
I thought it meant “junior varsity”, like you’re technically not on the team, but you’re kind of on the team.
Great editing
they gotta add this black outline cartoon art style for the next smash game or just make a if a toggle setting
Me and my bros just say 'might as well have {x} stocks'
It funny we also considered it like having an extra stock despite never having heard of 'JV' until recently
A wise man once said...... Don't let it be you
Average Yomi hustle match be like:
I’ve done that in rivals of aether multiple times (only to NPCs)
I thought that's called a zero to death...
It’s zero-to-deathing them on all of their stocks, not just one
Honestly, it should've been called "Flawless Victory"
0 to death is typically all in one combo, or all in one almost combo, but it can also be considered a 0 to death if you simply just take no damage while taking their stock, even if it takes a while. But you don't have to 0 to death someone on all their stocks to get atleast a JV 2 or 3^^ but for a 4 stock game and wanting a JV5, yes ofc.
Amazing editing
Me and friends called it "true 3 stock" if you had 2 without damage
I’ve only ever got a JV 4 against one of my friends in Ultimate.
I don't understand how having 0% at 1 stock means you won with two
It is not literally an extra stock, it’s just comparable to having an extra one - what matters is the number of stocks apart you are.
Think a little more
the thing is that wii fit trainer heals you so even if you take damage if your using wii fit trainer you can still do a jv
Lmao, imagine popularizing a term by beating the person its named after
I always thought it was J-B standing for “just born”
I always wondered where that term came from xD thank you so much 🙌
Did this to a friend by accident 💀
"oh sorry I didn't mean to perfect you"
I remember in like 2011 thinking these were called xstocks
In mortal kombat we call that a flawless victory
Ima say "STFU, I JVED YOU. YOU CAN BE TALKING." to my friends when they say they're better.
So what is it called if you don’t take any hits during the entire match?
I would like to call it Career Smasher
Broooooooo I have been saying this to my friends since smash 4 3DS in school, didn’t know it was a term or that it actually existed so I just called it a “technical 2 Stock” hahaha I cannot believe this actually is real
The funny thing is I do this with kazuya every time
POV me every single time trying to beat the dry bowser spirit
Without reading the title, the context on the first clip was referencing me "have you ever been beaten in a game so badly that your opponent wend W S W S W S W S W S"
Thought it was junior varsity as a joke. Like a varsity 4 stock is having 4 stocjs a junior varsity is having 3 but not taking damage on it. This is why I immediately understood it when someone first used it near me
A cel-shaded smash bros game would be dope