Fix these MISTAKES with your mana rocks & ramp in Commander

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  • Опубликовано: 20 авг 2024
  • #EDH #Commander #mtg
    Too many players make these SIMPLE mistakes when deck building for Commander - learn why you may not be using mana rocks and ramp correctly!
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Комментарии • 133

  • @daniescc9622
    @daniescc9622 Год назад +50

    My inner engineer is happy with the mathemartic approach you took with this land count explanations

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад +3

      A mechanic needs math, believe it or not! Stay tuned for next week's video on card draw!

  • @-Meatlorf
    @-Meatlorf Год назад +16

    4:30 For anyone who cares, with the 10 mana rocks setup you have exactly a 67.360374217 percent chance of drawing one in your first ten cards.

  • @anythingmasterz
    @anythingmasterz Год назад +19

    Would recommend hypergeometric calculations for finding the right ramp density/any card type density. They're made for this kind of issue

  • @WarrickRanger
    @WarrickRanger 11 месяцев назад +7

    My mono white deck runs no ramp spells other than Sol Ring, however it does run a bunch of “find Plains” cards because I never want to miss a land drop. It works because I have a very low curve - it’s Sram, Senior Edificer with a ton of 0-2 cmc equipment and auras.

  • @lancekosisky9946
    @lancekosisky9946 Год назад +7

    I think people running tons of cheap card draw is why they cut lands honestly. I run 35 lands in my decks with 10-15 ramp and 10-15 card draw.

  • @Bongus_Bubogus
    @Bongus_Bubogus Год назад +9

    Card draw replacing lands is a much better argument than replacing lands with mana rocks, for the reasons stated in the video. I run a few decks with so many cantrips or enough large amount of card draw that I naturally flood out even with 30-32 lands in said decks. They still have the normal amount of ramp. It helps even more with a low, low top end.

  • @CorZ1lla
    @CorZ1lla Год назад +6

    I've been brewing more and more with 40 lands especially after reading Bennie Smiths articles, 4-5 are mdfc, haven't looked back.

    • @LessonSmith
      @LessonSmith Год назад +1

      What is the name of the article?

  • @adamrobinson6951
    @adamrobinson6951 Год назад +3

    The only thing you should ever replace lands with is card draw, specifically draw that will draw you at least three cards. This works because you can reasonably expect that card to net you at least one land when played.
    However, this needs to be balanced as it's only effective if you can guarantee to play that card draw with the mana you expect to have when you first miss a land drop.
    Another point: You state that the player who spends the most mana usually wins. However it's worth highlighting that this should exclude mana spent on further mana generation. For instance, if I cast a Sol Ring, a Cluestone and a Thran Dynamo then I need to have cards in hand to cast and sufficient turns to cast them. I've spent 8 mana so far allowing me to generate 10 on turn 4 (6 from rocks, three from lands). However my opponent has feasibly spent 6 mana already on board and is ready to spend another 4 on their fourth turn - bringing them to a total of 10 (matching mine). Meanwhile I'm three cards down. If I don't use all of my 10 mana on turn 4, they're still ahead on board and on card advantage.
    Of course, my increased mana production should help me in the long game. However it's important to recognise the detrimental effects of taking turns out to ramp and thereby make informed decisions when deck building.

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад

      check out the following video in the series - available on the channel - about card draw specifically!

  • @canoli62
    @canoli62 Год назад +56

    I think you have to be careful here. There are different kinds of rocks. Fast mana is a whole other category.) 0 and 1 mana rocks break some of the precepts talked about here. This is why you see cEDH decks with lower land counts - they have the moxes and mana crypts that allow them to be playing all out turn 1 or 2. The other key variables are card draw - if you are drawing a lot of cards, your percentage of hitting changes - and commander. If you have a commander that can ramp or draw and have low cmc, it totally changes the probabilities.

    • @wiggumsanchez7872
      @wiggumsanchez7872 Год назад +1

      Prime example... veyran cantrip. Turn 3 dead 21 mander unblockable

    • @bigdawg6471
      @bigdawg6471 Год назад +1

      thanks for commenting what i was going to 🙏

    • @moichamoy2274
      @moichamoy2274 Год назад +1

      Another things is not everyone has money to get a mana crypt or a jeweled lotus 💀

    • @wiggumsanchez7872
      @wiggumsanchez7872 Год назад

      @@moichamoy2274 i agree. Thats y you trade. Get rid of stupid expensive tutors and get good cards. Tutors r the worst

    • @bigdawg6471
      @bigdawg6471 Год назад +2

      @@moichamoy2274 PROXIESSS BABEEEY

  • @f2p_felix
    @f2p_felix Год назад +4

    I've found that, with the way I build my decks, I usually only need get to a certain amount of Mana and can generally work from there, rather than needing to hit my land drops every single turn.
    For instance, I have a Marisi, Breaker of the Coil deck filled with a bunch of cheap, evasive creatures to make my opponents whittle each other down through Goading. Since those creatures usually only clock in at around 2-3 mana, and the fact that it doesn't need to commit super hard to board (needing only 1 nigh-unblockable creatures per opponent, plus Commander), it can actually operate really well at around 4-5 Mana for a while until I draw one of my finishers, like Gisela, Blade of Goldnight.
    I also have a Xenagos Deck focused on stacking Damage Multipliers on large Trample creatures to do massive lethal damage that really only needs to hit 5-6 Mana to be able to cast most of what it needs. Most the Trample creatures and Multipliers fall on either 5 or 6, with some of those being instant one-shots on a player, like a Bloodthirster in a 4-player pod, or Godo searching out Embercleave.
    All that being said, I still like upping my consistency to avoid having to mulligan constantly, and still run around 35-36 lands and 12-14 Ramp, so I think your advice here is sound. Heck, my aforementioned Xenagos Deck does indeed run 20 Ramp spells (10 1-mana ramp, 10 3-mana), which felt... extremely validating when you got to that part!
    So yeah, great work you're doing here, and I love how clearly and concisely you lay out these things in these videos. Makes it real easy to understand!

  • @timledestructeur3586
    @timledestructeur3586 Год назад +5

    I disagree. You CAN cut lands for rocks IF your deck has enough draw to still ensure to hit your landdrop each turn.
    In general you want to draw a single land per turn, not zero, not two. This is why people reduce their land count in favor for ramp - because you can play multiple rocks per turn but normally you can only make a single land drop.
    Some people however make the mistake to forget that their deck doesn't draw enough cards for such a low land count.

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад +2

      we get into draw (and the card draw paradox) next week!

  • @johnkalina8895
    @johnkalina8895 7 месяцев назад +1

    duuuuuuude.
    Thank you!
    I've been playing mtg for about 3 years now and I am...average. But I've been trying to understand the math behind it for a while and no videos seems explain it. You've done a great job. Thank you! I now...semi understand what I'm doing 😂

  • @edjwise
    @edjwise Год назад +4

    Im a new player and this is exactly the type of content I need.

  • @dantemalick2872
    @dantemalick2872 Год назад +2

    I personally find my decks with 32 lands and 12 rocks/ramp cards works pretty well for me
    I also only run 2 cmc mana rocks unless the rock does something else
    Like basalt monument because it's part of a combo win
    Or coveted jewel witch is -3 mana for 1 turn but draws 3

  • @tkdarton
    @tkdarton Год назад +8

    Definitely my favourite type of video you produce!

  • @alanburns8616
    @alanburns8616 Год назад +2

    Love the maths, personally I want to customize my ramp to the deck itself also my sons use the inter webs I’m old school pen and paper and maths to make my mana base. But let’s compare K’rik to Chulane for instance totally different ideas for ramp here. I use dorks in chulane and rituals and K’rik himself in K’rik.

  • @pyrotempestwing
    @pyrotempestwing Год назад +2

    My main commmander deck has 36 lands and 8 or 9 rocks. Plus an Ashnod’s Altar. It is a token deck after all. I can usually afford to sac a creature for 2 mana.

  • @marioortizveliz5221
    @marioortizveliz5221 Год назад +1

    Greetings , for me, mana dorks, some 2 mana ramp and 2 mana rocks are the only ramp I need in my casual EDH decks ,( excluding those cedh rocks) ahahahaha , thxs for this informative video Man

  • @NotANameist
    @NotANameist Год назад +3

    I run 38 lands plus 10+ ramp. I don’t know how people do it otherwise unless they’re playing fast mana. Even with a low curve, I want to ramp to play 2-3+ spells a turn.

    • @yurisimp4life
      @yurisimp4life Год назад +1

      What do you call a low curve though? That's different for everyone, in a low curve you don't run 38 lands

  • @Hand_of_Kwll
    @Hand_of_Kwll Год назад +1

    I'm here for the Kitties, and the content.

  • @ericsalisbury3583
    @ericsalisbury3583 Год назад +2

    Land count is really depend on the decks them selve. My decks range from 29 lands in my yuriko deck to 40 in my landfall deck.

  • @rhozpogi
    @rhozpogi Год назад +6

    lol those people who say 30 lands because they have lots of mana rocks is not a misinformation. i been playing 30-32 lands and i dont get mana screwed often, actually i ramp more and cast more spells. but this always depends on ur mana curve. dont expect to run 30 land and some ramp with a 5 mana curve decks.

  • @rileypowell5354
    @rileypowell5354 Год назад +3

    i think its fine to take out lands for certain rocks. if the rock is free like chrome mox or mana crypt then you can use them interchangeably. often its better to draw chrome mox or mana crypt than it is to draw a land because it means you can use them in tandem with dropping your land so you've effectively played two lands that turn

  • @ThePencilWizard
    @ThePencilWizard Год назад +1

    For me it’s more the average cmc or what I’d like to be doing with the mana. Tetsuko for instance I run more mana dorks in than land cause when I don’t need the mana I can push them through for damage.

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад +1

      "not needing the mana" is because of your average CMC tho! it's all connected!

  • @Sogeking444
    @Sogeking444 Год назад +2

    As an Aesi player I laugh in lands, ramps and card draw

  • @nablexd2633
    @nablexd2633 Год назад +1

    I usually do now days 35-33 lands and 15 ramp cards only like 8 or less Mana rocks/dorks with 2 or 3 Mana cost the rest are cheap ramp spells that are 3 or less to cast. Alot better then what I use to do like 40 lands with almost 3 or 5 ramps 🤣🤣🤣 I never could get anything done bc everyone is ahead of me but glad I seen my bad errors of my ways a year ago

  • @chairborne33
    @chairborne33 Год назад +4

    Do you consider cost reduction as ramp/mana rocks? The problem I have with many mana reduction cards is that they are conditional. Urza's Incubator is only for creatures, so it doesn't help with a significant portion of the deck.

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад +4

      it depends on exactly that - how much of the deck does it provide a discount for? The medallions in a mono color deck? Yes I'd count it towards ramp. Urza's Incubator in a deck with 15 tribal creatures? probably not.

    • @blaze556922
      @blaze556922 Год назад

      Why wouldn't the significant portion of your dad can be creatures is the real question?

  • @omarmuniz1497
    @omarmuniz1497 Год назад

    I agree, I run a 5 color deck in commander. I run a 35 lands an 10 mana rock, with 3 ramp spells, I got mana screw but ended up winning still because I had an equipment that made treasure tokens to help cover any unfortunate card draws. At the end, I only played 6 lands at the end with no mana rocks or ramp.

    • @jonathanblaqk
      @jonathanblaqk Год назад

      I'd say that is pretty low. I'd go with 38+ lands on three or more colors. The rocks could be less too, 6 or 7 is just fine and the 3 ramp is good too.
      Treasure creation is key of course, but should not be a replacement for lands.

    • @omarmuniz1497
      @omarmuniz1497 Год назад

      @@jonathanblaqk sounds like a good idea, only thing is Domain is also part of the lands, ramp spells I have is land type rather than basic land card. Otherwise all my basic forests would be played too soon. With that said, should I add more cards on names, or just Land that taps for multiple mana, but can't search it normally?

  • @sir_quirkus7206
    @sir_quirkus7206 Год назад +1

    i run arpund 12-15 ramp spells and 33-35 lands. that has been my sweet spot

    • @andrewp979
      @andrewp979 Год назад

      I am similar, often with another 3-5 cards that aren't necessarily traditional early ramp spells, but do help with mana production, like crucible of worlds or Oracle of mul daya for example.

  • @jordillatser5897
    @jordillatser5897 Год назад +2

    Anyone will talk about the 6 pips in the back of the cards?

  • @trents.3149
    @trents.3149 Год назад

    Some players watching this might be sighing because they're wprking on a deck with a companion like Keruga and know that ramping sooner than turn 3 is not feasible...except that it is. Just run a bunch of lands that net more than 1 mana each time they tap and you'll be shocked how fast the deck runs. There's a ton of options in mono green and keruga is a Simic creature. Choosing a commander for him that also ramps and/or fixes mana is also a huge help.

  • @LoneSkag
    @LoneSkag 11 месяцев назад

    Ramp spells are superior mana rocks… bc most pods don’t like mass land removal. But vandalblasting all the mana rocks is no problem

  • @blaze556922
    @blaze556922 Год назад +1

    Great video! Thanks for the breakdown

  • @David-mx1os
    @David-mx1os 11 месяцев назад

    My rule of thumb is 38 lands and 10 or more ramp - I basically want half the deck to be mana

  • @danielgoldberg2129
    @danielgoldberg2129 Год назад +1

    The trap I fall into is that my opening hand only has 2 mana, but I have a Sol Ring or Signet, so I keep the hand. Then I miss my turn 3 land drop and maybe even 4 and 5. Game over.😢

  • @Belena711
    @Belena711 Год назад +1

    Well this was a fantastic video. Love it.

  • @JSBozick
    @JSBozick Год назад +1

    So if I’m running 40 lands, 20 ramp spells/rocks, 10 sources of draw, 10 removal spells, and a few tutors, that leaves about 15 cards to synergize with my commander. Obviously this is an exaggeration, but it doesn’t seem too far off from what you’re suggesting here. Am I missing something? This way of deck building seems like a good way to spend the entire game durdling and not actually doing anything fun.

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад +1

      It's all dependent on what your deck does. The emphasis on what your deck NEEDS to do is important here - I just want people to ensure they have statistics in mind when deck building. "don't drive a car on flat tires"

    • @Bongus_Bubogus
      @Bongus_Bubogus Год назад +2

      That is a bit of a sentiment I have too. I usually only build a deck when that synergy I so crave *is* part of the utility I need. Tribal deck? I’m running some tribal-based card draw and boardwipes. Artifacts? Mana rocks, need I say more? But yes, sadly not every strategy allows for this, so personally when I build a deck who’s synergy doesn’t help with the “vegetables” I should have in a deck, I usually suck it up and call the deck janky, because otherwise I make something in cookie cutter fashion, and I want to avoid that in commander. It really isn’t that bad though, because all levels of play are pretty good, plus you never know if your deck gets proper support printed in the future. That’s my take, anyways.

  • @jonathancarlisle7898
    @jonathancarlisle7898 Год назад +2

    I have a tendency to run a lower land count, but my decks tend to cover that. Raggadragga running 33 lands but 25 mana dorks has been fine. Malcolm/Kediss running about 35 lands but producing 3+ treasures a turn, also fine. Brewing a landfall deck tho, and planning 40ish lands

  • @Kristjan0209
    @Kristjan0209 Год назад +1

    This video is indeed good info for the normal commder deck but since commander is very diverse format this won't work with every deck. Like my deck is more than fine with 30 lands (I often actually end up flooding) and the critical turn things doesn't really work since my deck has a lot of cards on the more expensive side but I'm not planning to hard cast them

    • @mrstizzle9049
      @mrstizzle9049 Год назад

      He says your critical turn is when you start to do synergistic things in your deck. So if that's cheating out big spells, it would just be what turn is that and how much mana will it require

    • @Kristjan0209
      @Kristjan0209 Год назад

      @@mrstizzle9049 I meant the part about the average mana curve

  • @andrewp979
    @andrewp979 Год назад

    I still disagree in most circumstances. If I play a ramp spell on turn 2 and 3, but then I miss my 6th land drop and those ramp spells are not 'just lands I had to pay mana for' because I got to use them and be ahead of the curve for a period of time, too.
    When the 'lose case' for running less lands and more rocks is '6 mana on turn 4, 5 and 6' and the 'lose case' for running too many lands is 4,5,6 mana but 3 dead cards in my hand...
    I'd rather have the chance for explosiveness and higher card quality, but miss a land drop sometimes in the mid-late game than hit all my land drops, but be slower or flood more frequently.
    I am interested to see your take including card draw, but i think it's key here. I also often find low cost card draw to be controversial, surprisingly

  • @rootfish2671
    @rootfish2671 4 месяца назад

    I love that people run low lands and rely on artifact mana ramps so their deck gets crippled against my land/artifact destruction deck.

  • @henrysantana7112
    @henrysantana7112 Год назад +1

    hey, thank you! this helps tons.

  • @NotAllWhoWanderAreLost641
    @NotAllWhoWanderAreLost641 Год назад +1

    This is an instant favorite

  • @BuppGuy
    @BuppGuy Год назад

    I'll sub two rocks for one land only if the deck has artifact synergy. Only at the 2:1 ratio.

  • @dreddbolt
    @dreddbolt Год назад +1

    I can't really argue here lol. Like the narrator in Darkest Dungeon says--- "Overconfidence is a slow and insidious killer."
    I don't usually play many, but I tend to run specific rocks, some of which are sacrificed for deck-thinning, be it for draw or land tutoring, and Sol Ring is one of those more-bang-for-your-buck rocks, so I can supplement my addiction to jank strategies.
    I think of it like I'm a reckless motorcycle stunt driver. I'm here for a good time, not a long time, but I do supplement my brews with about 6 to 8 big mana value bombs, which can include some boardwipes and ways to capitalize on them.
    I have definitely played for goober-town levels of greed and fun interactions, like when (in my Lulu//Veteran Soldier vehicles brew) I run The Weatherlight, Board the Weatherlight, Bennie Bracks, Sram, Ellyn Harbreeze, Skullclamp, and other fun bits of repeatable draw, ramp, and synergy.
    I like playing mind-games with my opponents, and I'll build to let my cards do the bamboozling for me. I enjoy being the class clown at the table.

  • @SaintAnix.
    @SaintAnix. Год назад +4

    OK bro. Play your 40 lands 20 rocks deck.
    Mana generation is mana generation. Card advantage is card advantage.
    Lands and rocks don't win on their own spells abilities and creatures do.
    The player who spends the most mana generally wins not the player who plays the most lands.
    The question then is how to spend the most on relevant spells.
    Assuming card draw is equal in your scenario you average 4 land hand with at least 1 rock,
    So 2 spells or creatures in hand.
    You may be less mana screwed overall but this is the recipe to run out of gas in more games than not.
    You may have optimized the mana but I bet you'd win less games overall using this kinda strategy

  • @ToadimusPrime
    @ToadimusPrime Год назад

    I run 36 or 37 lands + 8 rock/ramp cards. And my deck is high mana cost, but I haven't been having mana issues since most of my cards hit big. My commander (Kaalia) is low cmc but everything else is chonky.

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад +2

      it also helps that your commander cheats cards into play so you typically don't have to cast them! >_

    • @ToadimusPrime
      @ToadimusPrime Год назад

      @@CommanderMechanic Of course. But she often dies before I get to attack unless I got haste on the same turn. But if she stays, that's 2 big drops per turn.

  • @joshrobinson2409
    @joshrobinson2409 Год назад

    I only play 30 lands cause of the deck I play I play meren combo and my mana curve is low it also seems to work pretty well for my deck cause I win consistently

  • @ricardoalves1642
    @ricardoalves1642 Год назад

    turn 6 most of the games are already over, I still rather have rocks/ramps/dorks with low cost instead of more lands

  • @aklepatzky
    @aklepatzky Год назад +1

    Im building a reanimator deck and im having issues determining the correct amount of lands and ramp. I believe reaniamtor is a very unique deck in the sense that 1) the average mana cost is not "real" cause it considers the cost of several fatties you dont wanna ever cast 2) it loots significantly so it sees more cards than the average deck....anyone can help?

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад +1

      Look at the deck w/o reanimate on targets in versus with them in then take the average. That’s what you should be basing your counts on. You won’t always need to hard cast reanimated targets but you need the ability to eventually

    • @aklepatzky
      @aklepatzky Год назад

      @@CommanderMechanic i just calculated the average and the average mana value without lands is 1.9 so lets say its 2 to be on the safe side. So my critical turn is 4 so I wanna ramp between turns 1-2 so I can double spell on turn 3. Correct?
      Another question regarding the number of lands: im running 35 but because this deck loots so much would you suggest going to 34?

  • @0nCoolDown
    @0nCoolDown Год назад +1

    Here for the kitties! 🐱

  • @egoish6762
    @egoish6762 Год назад +1

    0 mana rocks are mostly equal to land, in a low cmc deck rocks do allow you to play 30 or less lands but it is really about cmc and top end.
    However is this super important for a casual deck? I tend to worry about hitting my land drops (35-37ish land) along side a handful of rocks (8-12) to accellerate my gameplan in casual, if my ave cmc is 3-4 this is normally fine.

  • @adamcappella8088
    @adamcappella8088 Год назад

    I got my own lil formula
    1 color deck: 33-35 lands
    2 color deck: 34-36 lands
    3 color: 35-37
    4 color: 36-38
    5 color: 37-39
    Ramp ranges anywhere from 6-18, it's highly dependent on the decks CMC, commanders CMC, and what the purpose of the deck is. (My yuriko deck has 34 land and 6 ramp, cause the CMC is super low and operates fine at 4 mana)
    I'll go outside my land count depending on the purpose of the deck aswell, but that's rare. Landfall is a good example or if my CMC is super low.

  • @Smo-G
    @Smo-G 11 месяцев назад

    Meh. In causal edh I guess this makes sense. But for competitive all that matters is how much Mana can you produce on turn 1 or 2. Most competitive decks can tap for 4-6 Mana on turn 2 on aversge with 28-32 lands

  • @evilnitewing
    @evilnitewing Год назад

    Can I ask how much ramp/lands for a 9 commander cost in mono green? I’m running mana vault , crypt, mox opal as well

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад

      if you're running fast mana you should be well on your way, but I wouldn't stop short of 38 lands. In green you can run all the best land ramp too - but if your commander is your core game plan you need to make sure you get there as fast as possible.

  • @tylertesla3678
    @tylertesla3678 3 месяца назад

    I know I'm way late to this video but is running tons of mana rocks inherently wrong? I have a Ur Dragon deck with about 34 lands and a ton of those dragon specific rocks plus the usual rocks you most commonly see as well as a diamond lotus and chromatic Lantern.

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  3 месяца назад

      34 lands?!

    • @tylertesla3678
      @tylertesla3678 3 месяца назад

      @@CommanderMechanic 35*
      For rocks I have Arcane Signet, Carnelian Orb of Dragonkind, Chromatic Lantern,Commander Sphere, Dragon Hoard, Everflowing Chalice, Glittering Stockpile, Jade Orb of Dragonkind, Jeweled Lotus, Lapis Orb of Dragonkind Manalith, Orb of Dragonkind and Sol Ring. I also have Rivaz of the Claw which gives me mana. The deck also contains many ways to cheat things out such as Tamiyo's Journal, Dragon Arch, several of the Planeswalkers, Maelstrom Nexus, Sunbird Invocation and even Ur Dragon himself. Plus some enchantment that make me more mana like Bounty of Luxa combined with all the treasures I make. Plus all my token generation allows me to establish a strong board state early on.

    • @brugernavnhvaderdet
      @brugernavnhvaderdet 3 месяца назад

      @@tylertesla3678
      What is your average mana value, and how many dragons are affected by urdragons discount?

  • @corkimus
    @corkimus Год назад

    How do you determine how much mana you NEED to be ahead by on which turn? For example, the latest deck I built has an average mana cost of 3.3. By your formula my critical turn is the turn I can generate 6 plus mana, which theoretically is turn 6. Do I need to scale ramp/lands to be at the critical turn on turn 5? Turn 4? That's the determination I don't understand (to simplify, I have 39 lands 37 excluding MDFCs and 7 ramp/rock spells)

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад

      that's up to you to determine based on the cards in your deck, your commander, and what your strategy is. I cover critical turns a bit more in last week's video about lands!

    • @ivanespinosa2216
      @ivanespinosa2216 Год назад

      That depends on the powerlevel you need to achieve. Do you want to cast a 6 cmc commander on turn 3? Or is it ok to cast him on turn 5? Is your commander the engine of the deck and expensive ala Brudiclad? Or is he how you win ala Thromok? Is casting your 4 cmc commander on turn 3 ok? Or is the table too quick and you need to be faster?
      That’s how you know what your critical turns are.

  • @charmingfox2603
    @charmingfox2603 Год назад

    Ok so if i wanna play 5 mana commander on turn 4, i need 10 ramps spells, under 4 mana. And if i want the commander on turn 3, i need 20 ramps. Is that right?

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад

      and/or the average mana value or your rocks has to come down, yes.

  • @geneclark3600
    @geneclark3600 3 месяца назад

    arbor elf...learn it, love it.

  • @johanandersson8252
    @johanandersson8252 Год назад

    Why subtract when you can add.

  • @angelfury8182
    @angelfury8182 Год назад +1

    I never play less than 38 lands in Commander. No exceptions.

    • @stevo8908
      @stevo8908 Год назад +1

      I usually run 36. Thinking I might add another one or two to my decks. Though I definitely see some exceptions like elves and slivers. How did 38 do?

    • @angelfury8182
      @angelfury8182 Год назад

      @@stevo8908 38 with several mana rocks works great. I wind up running 39 lands in a lot of my decks. It just depends on how many mana rocks you feel like you need. I also usually add black to most of my commander decks because tutors are so important in the format.

  • @borislibaque1558
    @borislibaque1558 4 месяца назад

    I like to start with 14 ramp pieces or 14 of any effect I want to see in my opening hand because that's a 1/7 chance. I like to start with 40 lands in any deck but have gone a little higher in green. People tell me that's high, but I don't think so, a lot of really good lands enter tapped and you can't count on them, some of them have effects you'd rather use instead of its land side, and fetch lands don't add mana so they are also not really lands, and colorless lands often bring problems. So 40 isn't all that high if you properly assume these cards aren't helping you get your gameplan online. Also, realistically I want to play a land for every turn of the 10/12 turns of the game. I do think ramp is over rated though and not every deck needs to go a turn or two faster. The card slots you use for ramp are often better used for more threats rather than better threats in a proactive aggro deck, more card draw and interaction in control decks, or more tutors and higher variance tools in combo decks. I like ramping out for decks where most of my cards land on a certain spot on the curve or in decks with powerful commanders that are going to be targeted down. Other than that, more basics and redundant game pieces are the way I like to go. Related to the point in this video, I see players treat draw spells the way they treat ramp, thinking they can cut lands to play a 2mana draw spell, but the argument against that is even dodgier that a mana rock; instead of playing a 0 mana add 1 mana using 1 card slot, you're paying 2 mana to 'maybe' play a land across 2 or 3 card slots, and the 'maybe' caveat makes it strictly worse than a mana rock. When designing a ramp package, I like the suggestion to consider why you're ramping. Sometimes what you're looking for is to go from 5 to 10 mana and you might consider a mana dounbler over a signet. Or 4 to 7 where you might want a suite or 14 signet style ramp slots and 8 thran dynamo style ramp pieces. Or maybe its really about casting more 2 mana spells more often, in which case your ramp package should probably be cost reduction cards and ramp pieces you can trade to draw a card later. This is a great topic, thanks for putting it out there

  • @seanwhite1104
    @seanwhite1104 Год назад

    But who actually says "ramp spells are *better* than lands"? Ramp spells GET you lands, that's why they're often preferable to mana rocks.

  • @gilliganallmighty3
    @gilliganallmighty3 Год назад

    thos checks out.

  • @altromonte15
    @altromonte15 Год назад

    I'm not convinced that playing fast and on curve is actually a good thing, outside of cedh or a very tuned deck
    If you're not able to close the game right away you're just putting a target on your back and getting focused

  • @QuixoticCowboy
    @QuixoticCowboy Год назад

    I could not pay attention, because i got distracted by the card backs shown in this video. What is that?

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад

      That is the legally distinct, content usable card back image that must be used

  • @skullkrusher-dx4kg
    @skullkrusher-dx4kg Год назад

    i feel like 30 lands is fine with decks that have extremely low cmv.

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад

      yes, you should check out my video dedicated to lands - on the channel from just last week

  • @Derpingmuffin
    @Derpingmuffin 4 месяца назад

    Theres three pop ups in the video to subscribe, two before it's even halfway done! I liked the content of the video, but that's just obnoxious. Yes, I know I can subscribe and like.

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  4 месяца назад

      But did you?

    • @Derpingmuffin
      @Derpingmuffin 4 месяца назад

      @@CommanderMechanic Don't worry, I clicked the buttons twice for the first two!
      In all seriousness, though, I left a like but didn't subscribble. I enjoyed the video, but I probably wouldn't look at new uploads, and I'd rather be an active subscriber.

  • @andresmarquez5241
    @andresmarquez5241 9 месяцев назад

    10? Laughs in 22 ramp/mana rocks/ treasure token makers each attack

  • @amenrob3038
    @amenrob3038 Год назад

    I run 30 lands, average cmc is 1.8. Combo heavy, mana crypt, mox amber, talismans signets. I honestly dont care about lands at all in that deck. Even if i fall behind bad. Everything is still castable and i probably have the game in the bag by turn 5

  • @blaze556922
    @blaze556922 Год назад

    The 2 rules my group like to break in Commander are having more than 100 card decks and not playing with lands that aren't for utility. Manabases are among the most expensive parts of deck building. If you eliminate that it allows you to put all the cards you actually want in your deck that do something. Lands don't do anything really. In Landless you draw 2 less cards and discard at 9 instead of eight since you aren't making land drops every turn. This provides every Deck with more gas, no flooding, no mana screws, and you simply use a die for the mana color of your choice when you would make a land drop. You can still ramp and track everything normally. We've been doing this for a few years now and that is exclusively how we build decks at this point. It's so much more fun :)

  • @swiftmic8402
    @swiftmic8402 Год назад

    ..... It isn't an excuse for running less lands. No that's wrong. Heavy disagree in cedh deck listsm

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад

      Hmm I wonder what the critical turn for a cEDH deck with an average mana value of 1 is 🤔

  • @tatsuhirosatou5513
    @tatsuhirosatou5513 Год назад

    You absolutely can cut lands my cedh deck runs 26 lands and its the most consistent deck I own.

  • @KaladinStormBlessed190
    @KaladinStormBlessed190 Год назад

    can somebody tell me what game is this?

  • @MageSkeleton
    @MageSkeleton Год назад

    i'm sorry i lost interest halfway through the video. you don't mention fetch lands and why people don't run Evolving Wilds/Terramorphic Expanse and would maybe run Fabled Passage but would run Prismatic Vista or any of the well known "fetch lands" they get you "ramp" and one less potential "dead draw".

    • @CommanderMechanic
      @CommanderMechanic  Год назад

      "deck thinning" as people call it, of the magnitude of a fetch or two or evolving wilds, makes no appreciable impact on probability as you still run the same probability of drawing any of those specific lands as you do any card in your library.
      Next week's video is card draw, which may hold your interest.

  • @geneclark3600
    @geneclark3600 3 месяца назад

    you act ike eveyoe has a 200 dollar mana crypt...thats adorable

  • @Squee_666_9
    @Squee_666_9 Год назад

    Personally I both agree and disagree. There's a balance between the two. If ramp didn't at least kind of replace lands I wouldn't be able to win a game without having any lands in play but I can and I have.