So the apostles transform from illiterate fisherman who can't recognize miracles or understand simple parables to highly Greek literate rabbis engaged in a kind of think tank where they influence each other? How do you demonstrate any of these assertions? This hypothesis gets a big no.
Why is there an esteemed guest, but the visuals are from the interviewer? And how long into the interview did it take for the Q questions to stop? (they didn't, despite no buy in from the guest) Leading the witness? Jacob apparently despises Occam's razor. Also, there is a book by Edward Tufte called The Visual Display of Quantitative Information that might help.
See, the idea of having the diagram constructed in real time as the guest scholar thinks through possible connections and decisions is in my view a _feature_ here, not a bug
@@notanemoprog I believe the guest was being asked about models that weren't in his own presentation, and then when he clarified his own view the models he wasn't proposing were repeated in different forms - seemingly to satisfy the leanings of the interviewer. A "feature" I wouldn't expect to see at a moderated conference talk, for example. Also if a box is used to represent a hypothetical document, then maybe a cloud icon would be more appropriate for an oral tradition, to show that it's not the same thing.
@@eximusic I will only say this once and it should've been obvious, we were discussing the Synoptic Problem and the guest knew I was going to discuss the diagrams and ask him questions about them. The fact I had to tell you this, is sad.
@@History-Valley It was just an unfiltered observation I made immediately after watching it. You realize all reactions, positive or negative, have been shown to benefit youtube videos. It's also statistically improbable I'm the only one that had this reaction. And since we don't belong to any religions or cults, I assume you're not asking for unfettered approval and praise of everything you do. That would be sad.
@@eximusic "then when he clarified his own view the models he wasn't proposing were repeated in different forms" Actually, contrary to what you're claiming the models were continuously changed precisely to better reflect the ever more complex situation the guest was describing and were trying to as accurately as possible portray Chilton's ideas. It was great and I think Chilton liked it, and I hope HV does it every time Synoptic Problem is discussed, because we want as much clarity as possible on this topic from scholars, not hand-wavey invocations of general "X Source Document" diagrams. As for your remark about icon types, sure. That's constructive.
Great Interview I like the nuance of seeing the source material not as documents but as people. If mcdonalds q+papias was explained as such it would be a more cogent argument but it would weaken I think the literary dependence implications underlying the q+ hypothesis some bit.
I think each gospel writer had their own agenda. The desire to change or not use material contained in other gospels is quite intentional. I do not agree with Mark"s gospel's ties to the teachings of Peter and the 12 given it's far less complementary portrayal of the disciples
Sorry but I had to give up on this one. This guys continued claims that every person, and event or recorded statement of what some said, is historical is ludicrous.
Goodacre’s case against Q is a fascinating and compelling read. Pretty tough to argue against it.
Agreed, hope he'll be a guest again on here!
And Markus Vinzent’s idea that Luke’s Gospel comes first is fascinating too. These guys need to get together.
Chilton is excellent. Thanks for this guest.
So the apostles transform from illiterate fisherman who can't recognize miracles or understand simple parables to highly Greek literate rabbis engaged in a kind of think tank where they influence each other? How do you demonstrate any of these assertions? This hypothesis gets a big no.
I was not previously familiar with the suggestions of influence by Barnabas, James, etc. Interesting, thank you
Why is there an esteemed guest, but the visuals are from the interviewer? And how long into the interview did it take for the Q questions to stop? (they didn't, despite no buy in from the guest) Leading the witness? Jacob apparently despises Occam's razor. Also, there is a book by Edward Tufte called The Visual Display of Quantitative Information that might help.
See, the idea of having the diagram constructed in real time as the guest scholar thinks through possible connections and decisions is in my view a _feature_ here, not a bug
@@notanemoprog I believe the guest was being asked about models that weren't in his own presentation, and then when he clarified his own view the models he wasn't proposing were repeated in different forms - seemingly to satisfy the leanings of the interviewer. A "feature" I wouldn't expect to see at a moderated conference talk, for example. Also if a box is used to represent a hypothetical document, then maybe a cloud icon would be more appropriate for an oral tradition, to show that it's not the same thing.
@@eximusic I will only say this once and it should've been obvious, we were discussing the Synoptic Problem and the guest knew I was going to discuss the diagrams and ask him questions about them. The fact I had to tell you this, is sad.
@@History-Valley It was just an unfiltered observation I made immediately after watching it. You realize all reactions, positive or negative, have been shown to benefit youtube videos. It's also statistically improbable I'm the only one that had this reaction. And since we don't belong to any religions or cults, I assume you're not asking for unfettered approval and praise of everything you do. That would be sad.
@@eximusic "then when he clarified his own view the models he wasn't proposing were repeated in different forms" Actually, contrary to what you're claiming the models were continuously changed precisely to better reflect the ever more complex situation the guest was describing and were trying to as accurately as possible portray Chilton's ideas. It was great and I think Chilton liked it, and I hope HV does it every time Synoptic Problem is discussed, because we want as much clarity as possible on this topic from scholars, not hand-wavey invocations of general "X Source Document" diagrams. As for your remark about icon types, sure. That's constructive.
Great Interview
I like the nuance of seeing the source material not as documents but as people. If mcdonalds q+papias was explained as such it would be a more cogent argument but it would weaken I think the literary dependence implications underlying the q+ hypothesis some bit.
I think each gospel writer had their own agenda. The desire to change or not use material contained in other gospels is quite intentional.
I do not agree with Mark"s gospel's ties to the teachings of Peter and the 12 given it's far less complementary portrayal of the disciples
Sorry but I had to give up on this one. This guys continued claims that every person, and event or recorded statement of what some said, is historical is ludicrous.