@@EagleEyeShootingI hope this improves your groups. #1 Wear a shooting jacket #2 Weigh ALL of your ammo ( 22lr ) to select a pile that is identical #3 Rim your ammo ( sizing tool that measures the rims to exclude crappy rims, allows back bleeding of pressure ) #4 Throw your tripod in the pond and get a glove #5 Get a sling #6 Get a sling clamp #7 Drop your trigger pull to 3/4 of a pound #8 Fire 3 shots to warm your barrel #9 Develope zoom eye ( if you can't master zoom eye, you can forget making the Olympics) #10 Ear pods with ac/dc or anything old school #11 Now shoot same hole Leave out any one of these ( provided you began with a same hole gun ) and you will be able to count your shots on paper as they will not be in a single hole. I recommend using ammo from the 50's-60's, new 22 lr is sloppy manufactured. Once you have achieved same hole, grow a set and switch right to left or vise versa and start all over ( you MUST switch eyes ) again until you can do it both ways. The remark about the Olympics, if your over the age of 25, you can forget it. It's a contest of young eye sight. About the time you hit 26, your eyes are too fried for À DVANCED COMPETITION
REALLY good information. I am fairly new to this super accurate .22 game, and I like it. I have not heard the term cold bore shift before, and that is exactly what my CZ 455 has done since I bought it 7 years ago (new). I shoot silhouette matches, so I have always been able to shoot that cold shot at a swinger, and miss with no penalty. Ironically, I recently cleaned the bore very thoroughly, and then used JB compound, and my bore no longer has cold bore shift. That really helped. Wish I had done that years ago. I wish the techs at CZ that I have spoken to over the years would have mentioned it.
This Guy!!! Gonna be a builder's name above good builders names. Being on a fixed income and busted up makes it tight in these times, but I want one of Kenny's builds and I will figure out a way. Excellent content. Keep'em coming!
It’s nice to see somebody that is freaking over the top obsessive about what they do and the product they send out the door. You earned a new subscriber sir!
You are right on with everything you said in this video I have two cz457s and I might have been lucky but no cold bore problems and they will shoot one hole at 50 and at 100 I can shoot the little red spot out of a shoot and see target I know from this video that a person could not go wrong with one of your builds good job and keep up the good work it's people like you that helps the sport. Beagleman
Kenny well I just got treated so well by (I'm assuming)your wife over the computer with questions and more questions. She was wonderful and making the experience truly fantastic. I just ordered a full build, and she helped me throughout the process answering my many questions extremely fast. I also just got exposed to what you just stated by LETTING YOU DO YOUR JOB picking out a barrel for me. I was thinking the 3 B's Benchmark Brux Bartlien but like your wife stated let him do the picking. 😂 So now the wait begins. Looking forward to this build very much. I just found a group of people in my area and will be doing a multitude of different objectives. NRL BENCHREST AND PRS style shoots. So I can't wait. Thx Kenny
Haha thanks Brian. I much appreciate the opportunity. Yeah my wife helps a lot. She even is the one proofing out these rifles so shes seeing what barrels work. I try to explain to folks that Im not brand loyal. Im infact just chasing quality in the market. Sometimes certain manufacturers dip in this field regardless of the barrel maker. I have a little more pull to get "selected" barrels due to the quantity I order. Then my air gauge sorting takes over. Im excited you chosen me to build the rifle. Ill be in contact throughout the process. Your more than welcome to send us a email or call
@Eagle Eye Shooting thanks Kenny I have never been a patient guy as my excitement is off the charts. I chose the MDT ACC ELITE CHASSIS with 24" straight barrel of (of course) your stringent criteria choice of barrel maker. No tuner need apply... if any questions come up I will give a call. Maybe about trigger tech diamond with a straight shoe set at like 8 oz. :)
The Douglas barrel on my Chacon custom 10/22 and Bartlein barrel on my Vudoo shot great from the 1st group on so I agree with you on not having to break in a barrel on a 22LR. Great information, Kenny; love your videos!
It’s good to see a focused rifle smith dispelling some of the nonsense flying around in the competition Rimfire communities. We don’t need to reinvent the wheel, we just have to learn to drive better.
First I'd like to say that I thoroughly enjoy watching your videos. You are very meticulous in the testing, machining and building of these awesome rifles. If I could make a suggestion for the videos. It would be most helpful if you could provide a list of the the major firearm part/components that make up each firearm you are testing. I am very interested in most firearms and your videos provide a wealth of knowledge for the rimfire enthusiast. Will you be doing a video segment on a rifle chambered in the 17 HMR in the near future. Keep up the great work. Love your videos.
Enjoyed the video, sharing your experience and wisdom with Humility. Those look and shoot like Lottery Rifles(I can't afford them unless I win). Nice to see somebody taking pride in their work and striving to put out a top product.
That's crazy, I just thought you had to live with a cold bore shot. I didn't know it could be worked out. Thank you for the information. I'm assuming you're crazy busy but I'd like to talk to you about building a 22lr.
I’m just getting into precision 22 LR. Thanks for putting this info out there. I love it when experts share their knowledge. It makes us all better shooters.
Had an old guy telling me his stories a few days ago. Lighting and putting out matches at 75 yds, open sights, while his parents went to the store realy quick.
Speaking for myself..I like the long videos, I can cast one up on my TV while making dinner, and not have to worry about selecting another, with my hands full
Cold bore shift can often be the result of residual stress in a barrel, but with a cut rifled barrel there should be almost no residual stress to speak of. That's one of the advantages of the cut rifled barrel.
Don't think theirs that advantage with cut rifling vs Button. Almost all premium barrels are stressed relieved and I see issues in both types of barrel processes down range
my bergara b14r had a bad cold bore shift glad to know that is going to be fixed as soon as i get it back im going to send my cz 457 to you it has a cold bore shift too great job Kenny!
Tony Kidd doesn't care what slips by. I thought about buying one of your Rim-xs but I'm 76 years old. And it didn't make sense. Keep up the good work. Great videos and wonderful guns.
In the passed lead was used in gasoline to help lubricate the exhaust valves. So it's not going to put much wear on a barrel. Thanks for the video. Be Safe.
Oh WOW, that is BADASS. YOUR RIFLES ARE GREAT BUT OUT OF MY PRICE RANGE. I'll have to be happy with my BRNO #2 and Chinese copy of a Anschutz 54 with a hammer forged bull barrel. Keep up the good work. 😁👍
Got my Lilja barrel last week n installed it Friday evening. Haven’t had a chance to test it yet, but after watching your video I’m hoping it’s a keeper.
Very informative video, just like the others you produce. The quality of your work stands as a testament to your attention to detail. Well done and I trust that your reputation continues to grow. Now to see what you do with a Tikka T1x .....
Have you tested barrel indexing for accuracy? 6:00 firing pin location? Firing pin spring isolation? I know you tested barrel length, but what about length to contour relationships? Bore uniformity by measuring slugging force uniformity? Chamber finishing by various methods? I would also be interested in whether or not you subscribe to Bill Calfee's "parallel node' idea or not. I personally think that adaptive, or constructive harmonics should be possible. Allowing a slightly slower round to launch at a slightly higher bore angle later in the vibration cycle, resulting in the two different speeds landing in the same hole at a given range. This effect was originally noticed with the Enfield rifle in centerfire competitions. Varmint Al did a fairly in depth finite element animation analysis of the vibration patterns for various rifle configurations back in the day. I'm pretty sure that the forces at play haven't changed much since then. One other point that no one seemed to look at was the minimum deformation of the micro groove rifling. 12 or 16 very shallow land/groove rifling as opposed to 2, 4, or 6 much deeper lands.
From what I understand is after firing, the primer compound has an abrasive nature, and yes I've seen accuratecy increased around the 800-1000 round count in a Ruger American Rimfire, and a Savage.. with factory barrels.
With that amount of rounds, why not just start with a good custom hand lapped barrel??? Could have bought 2 of them.... So far, 1 case of ammo in, accuracy is exactly the same as it was in the first 15 shots with a good barrel
@@EagleEyeShooting Because I'm an average joe with an average rifle.. Can't afford a custom rig and don't have a need for one, I just have a factory setup with the heavier 16" barrel.. But yes about the first brick it was an ok shooter with CCI Std velocity, but around 800-1000 rounds it tightened up a good bit, granted I'm still shooting like a 6" group at 200 when I do get to shoot that distance, mostly it's 100 or less and with a 3-12x40 that's all I need to be doing. Love your work and the rifle, and a custom hand lapped barrel won't see any improvement with round count.. Do you clean the bore or no ? I just pull a bore snake trom time to time.
Thanks for the video. There is a lot of confusion regarding cleaning the bore of these 22LRs. You mention wax and lead it seems as a good thing. Have you done any videos on cleaning? What do you recommend? What bore cleaners do you use, recommend? Thanks.
20 years ago I had an anshutz 54ms rifle that was 40 years old then. I had 6" taken off the barrel and threaded for a silencer and also removed weights from the stock .it would shoot 1 hole groups at 100 yards with eley subsonics . It was the best . Cheapest rifle I had ever had. It was a real shame I gave up my licence (uk) and it was destroyed as the shop I gave it to to sell went out of business
Reminds me of another reason I'm glad I was brought to the US as a youngster. Dad, in the RAF, stayed in UK, so half my family is there - - and none are shooters.
As a beginner …I’m unable to afford those types of builds, I stick with factory CZ457 MTR, Tikka T1X, and Bergara BMR rifles. That said, after a barrel has been cleaned, how many rounds are needed to “season” the barrel? And, when switching ammo? Lastly, should a dry patch be used between switching to another ammo?
Top notch results come from top notch custom guns (and a good shooter of course) Kenny wont let a rifle go out if he thinks it does not meet his exacting standards for accuracy. So ,when you get your custom rifle from him it has been tested and IT WILL SHOOT as long as you can do your part.
You talking about cold bore shift and now I'm only a couple of minutes into the video, but I've seen a couple other videos where the guys took a straw and breathed some of their warm moist lung air into the barrel from the breech end and then fired a number of five round groups, NONE of which had Cold bore shift after letting the firearm sit for - I believe it was either 10 minutes or half an hour between groups, Then repeating the process without the "straw-effect" and then showing a cold bore shift, which makes me wonder if it is a matter of the fact that there is not the humidity to act as lubrication in the barrel for the first round - as there IS for every other following round - then how can any barrel shape or design eliminate the extra friction that is causing the bullet to stay in the bore just that much longer for the expanding gases to act upon it just that much more, causing a slightly higher velocity and therefore cold bore shift? Thank you.
Well I think that was the quickest reply I've ever received LOL no I watched several videos where they showed the Target down in the bottom right corner or upper right as they were firing, and I wasn't going to mention this until after your reply but I have tried it with my Ruger 10/22, Marlin 60, and my 1937 Winchester model 67 with a 27 inch barrel that's right that's not a typo twenty-SEVEN inch, and it made the greatest difference in the Winchester and the least difference in the Ruger but it did in fact help eliminate cold bore shift in all three. Now this isn't supposed to be some kind of a I'm right you're wrong or you don't know what you're talking about comment, not at all nor in any way, nothing but respect for what you're doing here, but if this issue is actually happening as I have seen it happen myself and others have shown it to happen, is it something you have not tried or if you have you have not found it to make a sufficient difference for you? Basically I'm just trying to understand what is and what isn't, and why. Thank you
I've tried it myself on factory CZ457 mtrs and some of my benrest builds... It made no difference down range. I managed to go about it developing my own barrels that are wire edm cut. 120+ builds with the new barrels, almost breaking records at the lapua test center each time and consistency in accuracy. O and no cold bore shift. A quality barrel speaks for itself and doesn't need spit
"doesn't need spit" 👍😎 and you can replace the p with an h! 😆 Yeah I totally respect what you're doing and what you're up against from temperature and humidity to wind to insects flying in the bullet path to how the barrel reacts to heat and then you've got the problem of all the different bullet and ammo manufacturers plus the different mixes of powder and primer yep you've got your work cut out for you. I totally relate as I'm a bit of an engineer and have actually a world record in My chosen field of competition, it's about 20 4 years old now and is yet to be beat, and I've engineered and designed some revolutionary things like antennas and extremely high output low frequency drivers, so it's refreshing when I see someone like you operating it's such a deep level of detail! I have a feeling that there may be some truth to the humidity relieving friction on the first round and possibly why you're seeing your best non-cold bore shift barrels probably burn out the quickest, cuz it seems like the best of everything in this life lasts for the least length of time. Anyway when I get the bucks together I can do more than sit here and let my lungs heal, I'll be contacting you for a whole new level of 22 fun. Appreciate your rapid responses! 🤙🤓
It took me a year to develop my barrels. Many hours spent with the best barrel smith's and balasticians including the infamous Brian Litz. Humidity was never a determing factor. I have ARA records set with rifles I built. One in Flordia and this particular client competes in NC often when it rains. Facts are what matters. I did not find ANY videos demostrating this theory. I'm open to continue testing and gave it a try an hour ago again with no changes
Love your vids man. Would love to see a video showing you air gauge the barrel and how u check the bore for the .020 arc. Also where do you get the mil target?
@@EagleEyeShooting You are correct I do remember seeing you show curvature on a barrel. What about those mil targets? That something you buy or you print those?
Good day Kenneth Great videos you're making - informative & interesting. I'd like to get advice on how to get my old Brno 22LR to shoot more accurate consistantly. The best grouping I get is about 1moa at 100m. 2-3 shots are close to each other with 1 or 2 flyers to give 1moa or larger. The rifle's info are as follows: 1976 Brno model 2 24.9" Barrel length. Barrel has 12 grooves. Action torqued to 30 inch Lb Action is drilled & tapped for a rear action screw. The screw on the barrel is removed. Bedding job done. Barrel free floated. 20moa picatinny rail added. Vortex PST GEN2 5-25x50 rifle scope. Ammo tested CCI std 40gr Eley sport 40gr SK std 40gr Fiocchi target 40gr American Eagle 38gr Aquilla super extra Regards
The lead bullet picks up spent priming compound which is slightly abrasive from the previous shots fired and that does polish the barrel to a slight degree.
As I own a Airgauge LLC tooling for the rifles I build. I tested this and can positively say thats false. Tested barrels that have 5K rounds vs new showed zero change in resolution of 5 hundred-thousands of an inch in bore diameter or chamber
@@EagleEyeShooting Very interesting. Do you think those people that have experienced an increase in accuracy after firing it a thousand or two rounds are getting the action/firing mechanism smoothed out or broken in?
Folks that are experiencing "better" accuracy are more than likely polishing out the chamber tooling marks by the combination of Brushes and aggressive cleaning will do that. Not the projectiles or fired rounds. Through my experience building 22lr precision rifles, these rifles I build will hold .3 or better accuracy within the first 15 shots. This is due to selection of the highest quality barrels and best machining practices.
@@EagleEyeShooting I am watching your part 2 now. I am impressed with the information you are putting out about this. Finally some answers which make sense and less mysterious.
Applaud your artistry and efforts and, look forward to more of your videos but, I have a 60 year old factory Stutzen stocked 22 that equals your Shilen barrels at 50mtrs, all day long. Interestingly, I also use SK.
I’m curious Kenny how was your experience with Krieger? I’m not a gun smith by any means. With that said I put together a couple AR builds 1-308 & 1-223. I chose to go with Krieger based on JRB’s AR-10 series. I’m very happy with both of those barrels I’ll probably continue buying them. Now I’m curious about picking up a 22lr barrel from them. So I figure why not ask how they preformed for you.
22 long rifle barrels of any size near the diameter of the ones you are shooting will never get warm enough to change the point of impact significantly. The reason they're printing differently after a "cold bore" is that the bore is now fouled, it has nothing at all to do with thermodynamics of the barrel as the barrel doesn't even get warm. It would have to get hot before it changes the point of impact, and a 22 long rifle just doesn't have the ability to do that firing 10 shots.
Nothing in this video talked about thermal dynamics. Having my own air gauge tooling and having built over 1600 22lr rifles of all types of shooting disiplines. Cold bore shift is due to tight spots in the bore.
I just bought a cz457 American. Ilove the look of a classic rifle. Unfortunately, I don't have a lot of money to spend. How can I make it more accurate, without switching the barrel and the stock? Is it possible?
great shooting, a good shooter is key IMO, what I mean by that is you are consistent, and good glass help to make up for your deficiencies, I pull a little to the right, and always have tried to figure out what I do it might be the way my hand is (it is normal) but some people shoot my rifles they shoot to the right, if you are on a budget like me, I take a new rifle and jag three patches one after the other whit chrome polish on them to smooth the barrel out
The second rifle you shot with the wood incorporated into the chassis looks quite impressive. Some old school mixed with new school. What type of chassis is that?
I'm hooked! Very informative video. Wish I had found you before I did my first ever build. Is Part 2 out there? I also have a CZ 457 Varmint MTR the suffers from cold bore shift. It is the stock barrel/receiver. Is there anything I can do at home or do I have to send it to you for a new barrel.
I looked on Eagle Eye website to see if there is a place to get a barrel for a CZ457 22lr. Nothing available there. Is there another link to get one from you and how much?
Can you build something that shoots HV ammo well? I know a lot of 100 yard competition guys only run subsonic. For 3-400 yards would it make any sense to run HV ammo?
Staying subsonic actually is more accurate at longer distances. The 22lr projectile is very prone to destabilization when passing through the transonic velocity barriers. Brian litz has publications that can explain better than I can in this. Infact Todd Hodnett has been teaching classes show casing 308 subsonic to be far affective in accuracy at longer ranges
Great information thanks I'm just getting into the 22lr game of hunting. I'm currently Waiting on my new Tikka T1x mtr 22lr with a 2x7x33 Leupold Scope. It was about $900 with this set up...Any suggestions or advice on this weapon would be appreciated. I'm mostly just shooting at an indoor range of 50 yards and smacking squirrels and small game with it
Good info, my RimX I had built with a Lilja MTU 1in16 @18in is a tack driver. I need to do more cold bore testing, but it looks to be minimal, if any at all. Thanks again for the video!
How do you “pick the flyers” ? I am always frustrated with SK match giving the odd flyer. Always ruins my benchrest scores. Centre X is no better regardless of cost. Using an Anschultz 1710.
If it chambers rough. Or have a feedramp that has tendencies to deform the bullet, don't send it down range. Lead shavings or heavy wax build up is a good indicator of this issue.
When you are switching ammo you don’t need to worry if it’s the same lube but when it’s different lube do you need to clean or just “shoot out” the old lube (how many rounds for that on average?) Also how important is or should lot testing be? I’d like to try several different ammos to see if my barrel is “saveable” but don’t want to test 10 lots of each lol.
I typically shoot 10 rounds (while still testing for accuracy) before I determine the barrel is "normalized" for that particular ammo's lubricant. Results vary of course. Lower grade barrels may have more tooling marks which result in needing more fouling shots. As for lot testing, you want to be around the 1060-1080 mark with high end ammo. Lapua Center-X/Midas +, SK Long Range/Rifle. Try Eley if your barrel is 22" or longer. If it doesn't shoot consistent within .100" average I personally would consider looking into another barrel or other accuracy issues
Very informative. I'm new to rimfire, not a competitive shooter, mostly small game and some target shooting to 100 yards. Can you recommend a good barrel? I've looked at KIDD and Volquartsen.
This was a great video Kenny! I am glad you are showcasing what separates you from everyone else as a premium rifle builder. 👍🏼
Wouldn't know any of what to look for without your guidance in this!
@@EagleEyeShootingI hope this improves your groups. #1 Wear a shooting jacket #2 Weigh ALL of your ammo ( 22lr ) to select a pile that is identical #3 Rim your ammo ( sizing tool that measures the rims to exclude crappy rims, allows back bleeding of pressure ) #4 Throw your tripod in the pond and get a glove #5 Get a sling #6 Get a sling clamp #7 Drop your trigger pull to 3/4 of a pound #8 Fire 3 shots to warm your barrel #9 Develope zoom eye ( if you can't master zoom eye, you can forget making the Olympics) #10 Ear pods with ac/dc or anything old school #11 Now shoot same hole
Leave out any one of these ( provided you began with a same hole gun ) and you will be able to count your shots on paper as they will not be in a single hole. I recommend using ammo from the 50's-60's, new 22 lr is sloppy manufactured. Once you have achieved same hole, grow a set and switch right to left or vise versa and start all over ( you MUST switch eyes ) again until you can do it both ways. The remark about the Olympics, if your over the age of 25, you can forget it. It's a contest of young eye sight. About the time you hit 26, your eyes are too fried for À DVANCED COMPETITION
Another great video Kenny . Thanks for the straight talk about twist rates !!!!!!!
Thanks! Gotta give it straight just like you do
REALLY good information. I am fairly new to this super accurate .22 game, and I like it. I have not heard the term cold bore shift before, and that is exactly what my CZ 455 has done since I bought it 7 years ago (new). I shoot silhouette matches, so I have always been able to shoot that cold shot at a swinger, and miss with no penalty. Ironically, I recently cleaned the bore very thoroughly, and then used JB compound, and my bore no longer has cold bore shift. That really helped. Wish I had done that years ago. I wish the techs at CZ that I have spoken to over the years would have mentioned it.
Thank you for busting a lot of myth, information is the key to success. Thank you for passing it along I greatly appreciate it
This Guy!!!
Gonna be a builder's name above good builders names. Being on a fixed income and busted up makes it tight in these times, but I want one of Kenny's builds and I will figure out a way.
Excellent content.
Keep'em coming!
Love to see builders put this amount of effort in on a job.
Excellent information about so many variables.
It’s nice to see somebody that is freaking over the top obsessive about what they do and the product they send out the door. You earned a new subscriber sir!
I'm liking the fusion of wood and modern chassis that's really cool
Your integrity will take you a long way. Thanks for sharing your expert opinons.
You are right on with everything you said in this video I have two cz457s and I might have been lucky but no cold bore problems and they will shoot one hole at 50 and at 100 I can shoot the little red spot out of a shoot and see target I know from this video that a person could not go wrong with one of your builds good job and keep up the good work it's people like you that helps the sport.
Beagleman
Great video. Thank you for sharing your experience
Kenny well I just got treated so well by (I'm assuming)your wife over the computer with questions and more questions. She was wonderful and making the experience truly fantastic. I just ordered a full build, and she helped me throughout the process answering my many questions extremely fast. I also just got exposed to what you just stated by LETTING YOU DO YOUR JOB picking out a barrel for me. I was thinking the 3 B's Benchmark Brux Bartlien but like your wife stated let him do the picking. 😂
So now the wait begins. Looking forward to this build very much. I just found a group of people in my area and will be doing a multitude of different objectives. NRL BENCHREST AND PRS style shoots. So I can't wait. Thx Kenny
Haha thanks Brian. I much appreciate the opportunity. Yeah my wife helps a lot. She even is the one proofing out these rifles so shes seeing what barrels work. I try to explain to folks that Im not brand loyal. Im infact just chasing quality in the market. Sometimes certain manufacturers dip in this field regardless of the barrel maker. I have a little more pull to get "selected" barrels due to the quantity I order. Then my air gauge sorting takes over. Im excited you chosen me to build the rifle. Ill be in contact throughout the process. Your more than welcome to send us a email or call
@Eagle Eye Shooting thanks Kenny I have never been a patient guy as my excitement is off the charts. I chose the MDT ACC ELITE CHASSIS with 24" straight barrel of (of course) your stringent criteria choice of barrel maker. No tuner need apply... if any questions come up I will give a call. Maybe about trigger tech diamond with a straight shoe set at like 8 oz. :)
The Douglas barrel on my Chacon custom 10/22 and Bartlein barrel on my Vudoo shot great from the 1st group on so I agree with you on not having to break in a barrel on a 22LR.
Great information, Kenny; love your videos!
I find bad eggs sometimes on each barrel manufacturer. I find less of those eggs with Krieger barrels over the others, ill state that lol
Thank you for great post. 👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
These kinds of videos have been missed by me in my absence. Good one Kenny.
Did this channel drop out of your feed too?
You explained that very well Kenny and I could Definetly see the difference in those two rifles. Good job👍🏻🎯
Thanks brother!
It’s good to see a focused rifle smith dispelling some of the nonsense flying around in the competition Rimfire communities. We don’t need to reinvent the wheel, we just have to learn to drive better.
Excellent info here Kenny! I definitely look forward to drops on your channel. Thanks!!
First I'd like to say that I thoroughly enjoy watching your videos. You are very meticulous in the testing, machining and building of these awesome rifles. If I could make a suggestion for the videos. It would be most helpful if you could provide a list of the the major firearm part/components that make up each firearm you are testing. I am very interested in most firearms and your videos provide a wealth of knowledge for the rimfire enthusiast. Will you be doing a video segment on a rifle chambered in the 17 HMR in the near future. Keep up the great work. Love your videos.
Enjoyed the video, sharing your experience and wisdom with Humility. Those look and shoot like Lottery Rifles(I can't afford them unless I win). Nice to see somebody taking pride in their work and striving to put out a top product.
That's crazy, I just thought you had to live with a cold bore shot. I didn't know it could be worked out. Thank you for the information. I'm assuming you're crazy busy but I'd like to talk to you about building a 22lr.
Amazing. The knowledge on display here is beautiful.
I’m just getting into precision 22 LR. Thanks for putting this info out there. I love it when experts share their knowledge. It makes us all better shooters.
Had an old guy telling me his stories a few days ago. Lighting and putting out matches at 75 yds, open sights, while his parents went to the store realy quick.
Great video so much info thanks for sharing your knowledge
This is a great video. Thank you Kenny.
Great video. If that Woox Rim-X was built for my buddy, I'm in trouble...on a weekly basis. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and workmanship with us.
😆😉 Working on a MPA one right now
You're the best. Great fun being part of your community.
@@kevinlane3533 you just have to have Kenny build you a better rifle than your friends. 😎
Youre doing awesome things here, Kenny. Great work and good shooting. Crazy to see the difference between the barrels!
Speaking for myself..I like the long videos, I can cast one up on my TV while making dinner, and not have to worry about selecting another, with my hands full
Thanks for another great video!
Cold bore shift can often be the result of residual stress in a barrel, but with a cut rifled barrel there should be almost no residual stress to speak of. That's one of the advantages of the cut rifled barrel.
Don't think theirs that advantage with cut rifling vs Button. Almost all premium barrels are stressed relieved and I see issues in both types of barrel processes down range
my bergara b14r had a bad cold bore shift glad to know that is going to be fixed as soon as i get it back im going to send my cz 457 to you it has a cold bore shift too great job Kenny!
Good video and a new ride. Thanks for sharing.
Moma's whip. Truck is down for a engine rebuild...
Tony Kidd doesn't care what slips by. I thought about buying one of your Rim-xs but I'm 76 years old. And it didn't make sense. Keep up the good work. Great videos and wonderful guns.
In the passed lead was used in gasoline to help lubricate the exhaust valves. So it's not going to put much wear on a barrel. Thanks for the video. Be Safe.
Ha... todays woke nation have zero clue of this I bet... let alone know how to drive a stick shift. (Good anti vehicle theft btw)
Oh WOW, that is BADASS. YOUR RIFLES ARE GREAT BUT OUT OF MY PRICE RANGE. I'll have to be happy with my BRNO #2 and Chinese copy of a Anschutz 54 with a hammer forged bull barrel. Keep up the good work. 😁👍
Another great video. Thx
Got my Lilja barrel last week n installed it Friday evening. Haven’t had a chance to test it yet, but after watching your video I’m hoping it’s a keeper.
Many have luck. Only sharing my expirence I've had with Lilja. Our doesn't use them right now
I know no one would have a problem with ordering a gun from you with your ethics.
Very informative video, just like the others you produce. The quality of your work stands as a testament to your attention to detail. Well done and I trust that your reputation continues to grow.
Now to see what you do with a Tikka T1x .....
thanks for sharing your groups. I wouldn't be so brave considering my .25" groups at 100 yards
excellent work! thank you
Outstanding video. You have me convinced.
Have you tested barrel indexing for accuracy? 6:00 firing pin location? Firing pin spring isolation? I know you tested barrel length, but what about length to contour relationships? Bore uniformity by measuring slugging force uniformity? Chamber finishing by various methods?
I would also be interested in whether or not you subscribe to Bill Calfee's "parallel node' idea or not. I personally think that adaptive, or constructive harmonics should be possible. Allowing a slightly slower round to launch at a slightly higher bore angle later in the vibration cycle, resulting in the two different speeds landing in the same hole at a given range. This effect was originally noticed with the Enfield rifle in centerfire competitions. Varmint Al did a fairly in depth finite element animation analysis of the vibration patterns for various rifle configurations back in the day. I'm pretty sure that the forces at play haven't changed much since then.
One other point that no one seemed to look at was the minimum deformation of the micro groove rifling. 12 or 16 very shallow land/groove rifling as opposed to 2, 4, or 6 much deeper lands.
Nice builds Kenny!
Good work Kenny !
Fantastic video. Excellent work and absolutely invaluable information.
Nice. Video! Now to build my 10/22…
From what I understand is after firing, the primer compound has an abrasive nature, and yes I've seen accuratecy increased around the 800-1000 round count in a Ruger American Rimfire, and a Savage.. with factory barrels.
With that amount of rounds, why not just start with a good custom hand lapped barrel??? Could have bought 2 of them.... So far, 1 case of ammo in, accuracy is exactly the same as it was in the first 15 shots with a good barrel
@@EagleEyeShooting
Because I'm an average joe with an average rifle.. Can't afford a custom rig and don't have a need for one, I just have a factory setup with the heavier 16" barrel..
But yes about the first brick it was an ok shooter with CCI Std velocity, but around 800-1000 rounds it tightened up a good bit, granted I'm still shooting like a 6" group at 200 when I do get to shoot that distance, mostly it's 100 or less and with a 3-12x40 that's all I need to be doing.
Love your work and the rifle, and a custom hand lapped barrel won't see any improvement with round count..
Do you clean the bore or no ? I just pull a bore snake trom time to time.
Very cool saving up for a rifle
Saving my pennies to have you build me a rifle…don’t tell my wife!😆
Thanks for the video and information.
Mighty fine shootin sir!
Great examples on your Builds. Is there a Barrel that will improve the BergaraB14R. If so I will send you my Bergara
I offer that upgrade service. Check out the website DPGunworks.com under build your rifle
Damn I wish we had a gunsmith like you in Australia
Shame you are not closer to my home location. I bet we both could make some killer rifles. Very nice attention to detail Sir.
Great Information!!
Thanks for the video. There is a lot of confusion regarding cleaning the bore of these 22LRs. You mention wax and lead it seems as a good thing. Have you done any videos on cleaning? What do you recommend? What bore cleaners do you use, recommend? Thanks.
20 years ago I had an anshutz 54ms rifle that was 40 years old then. I had 6" taken off the barrel and threaded for a silencer and also removed weights from the stock .it would shoot 1 hole groups at 100 yards with eley subsonics . It was the best . Cheapest rifle I had ever had. It was a real shame I gave up my licence (uk) and it was destroyed as the shop I gave it to to sell went out of business
Reminds me of another reason I'm glad I was brought to the US as a youngster. Dad, in the RAF, stayed in UK, so half my family is there - - and none are shooters.
Really good stuff really enjoyed the video
the crown of the rifle can be something to monitor on your barrels….the .22LR shooting i’ve been doing lately is sensitive to the concentricity….
As a beginner …I’m unable to afford those types of builds, I stick with factory CZ457 MTR, Tikka T1X, and Bergara BMR rifles. That said, after a barrel has been cleaned, how many rounds are needed to “season” the barrel? And, when switching ammo? Lastly, should a dry patch be used between switching to another ammo?
Top notch results come from top notch custom guns (and a good shooter of course)
Kenny wont let a rifle go out if he thinks it does not meet his exacting standards for accuracy. So ,when you get your custom rifle from him it has been tested and IT WILL SHOOT as long as you can do your part.
You talking about cold bore shift and now I'm only a couple of minutes into the video, but I've seen a couple other videos where the guys took a straw and breathed some of their warm moist lung air into the barrel from the breech end and then fired a number of five round groups, NONE of which had Cold bore shift after letting the firearm sit for - I believe it was either 10 minutes or half an hour between groups,
Then repeating the process without the "straw-effect" and then showing a cold bore shift, which makes me wonder if it is a matter of the fact that there is not the humidity to act as lubrication in the barrel for the first round - as there IS for every other following round - then how can any barrel shape or design eliminate the extra friction that is causing the bullet to stay in the bore just that much longer for the expanding gases to act upon it just that much more,
causing a slightly higher velocity and therefore cold bore shift?
Thank you.
You mean the video where they never showed the target? Just the velocity numbers? Right......lol
Well I think that was the quickest reply I've ever received LOL no I watched several videos where they showed the Target down in the bottom right corner or upper right as they were firing, and I wasn't going to mention this until after your reply but I have tried it with my Ruger 10/22, Marlin 60, and my 1937 Winchester model 67 with a 27 inch barrel that's right that's not a typo twenty-SEVEN inch, and it made the greatest difference in the Winchester and the least difference in the Ruger but it did in fact help eliminate cold bore shift in all three.
Now this isn't supposed to be some kind of a I'm right you're wrong or you don't know what you're talking about comment, not at all nor in any way, nothing but respect for what you're doing here, but if this issue is actually happening as I have seen it happen myself and others have shown it to happen, is it something you have not tried or if you have you have not found it to make a sufficient difference for you? Basically I'm just trying to understand what is and what isn't, and why.
Thank you
I've tried it myself on factory CZ457 mtrs and some of my benrest builds... It made no difference down range. I managed to go about it developing my own barrels that are wire edm cut. 120+ builds with the new barrels, almost breaking records at the lapua test center each time and consistency in accuracy. O and no cold bore shift. A quality barrel speaks for itself and doesn't need spit
"doesn't need spit" 👍😎 and you can replace the p with an h! 😆
Yeah I totally respect what you're doing and what you're up against from temperature and humidity to wind to insects flying in the bullet path to how the barrel reacts to heat and then you've got the problem of all the different bullet and ammo manufacturers plus the different mixes of powder and primer yep you've got your work cut out for you. I totally relate as I'm a bit of an engineer and have actually a world record in My chosen field of competition, it's about 20 4 years old now and is yet to be beat, and I've engineered and designed some revolutionary things like antennas and extremely high output low frequency drivers, so it's refreshing when I see someone like you operating it's such a deep level of detail! I have a feeling that there may be some truth to the humidity relieving friction on the first round and possibly why you're seeing your best non-cold bore shift barrels probably burn out the quickest, cuz it seems like the best of everything in this life lasts for the least length of time. Anyway when I get the bucks together I can do more than sit here and let my lungs heal, I'll be contacting you for a whole new level of 22 fun. Appreciate your rapid responses!
🤙🤓
It took me a year to develop my barrels. Many hours spent with the best barrel smith's and balasticians including the infamous Brian Litz. Humidity was never a determing factor. I have ARA records set with rifles I built. One in Flordia and this particular client competes in NC often when it rains.
Facts are what matters. I did not find ANY videos demostrating this theory. I'm open to continue testing and gave it a try an hour ago again with no changes
Love your vids man. Would love to see a video showing you air gauge the barrel and how u check the bore for the .020 arc. Also where do you get the mil target?
Some of my barrel building videos shows how I find the curvature and time the bores. As for the air gauge, I may hold off on sharing that
@@EagleEyeShooting You are correct I do remember seeing you show curvature on a barrel. What about those mil targets? That something you buy or you print those?
@@1clnsdime1 yeah absolutely. Hit up the fella on IG called outdoorproductsplus. Let him know I referred ya
Good day Kenneth
Great videos you're making - informative & interesting.
I'd like to get advice on how to get my old Brno 22LR to shoot more accurate consistantly.
The best grouping I get is about 1moa at 100m. 2-3 shots are close to each other with 1 or 2 flyers to give 1moa or larger.
The rifle's info are as follows:
1976 Brno model 2
24.9" Barrel length.
Barrel has 12 grooves.
Action torqued to 30 inch Lb
Action is drilled & tapped for a rear action screw. The screw on the barrel is removed.
Bedding job done.
Barrel free floated.
20moa picatinny rail added.
Vortex PST GEN2 5-25x50 rifle scope.
Ammo tested
CCI std 40gr
Eley sport 40gr
SK std 40gr
Fiocchi target 40gr
American Eagle 38gr
Aquilla super extra
Regards
The lead bullet picks up spent priming compound which is slightly abrasive from the previous shots fired and that does polish the barrel to a slight degree.
As I own a Airgauge LLC tooling for the rifles I build. I tested this and can positively say thats false. Tested barrels that have 5K rounds vs new showed zero change in resolution of 5 hundred-thousands of an inch in bore diameter or chamber
@@EagleEyeShooting Very interesting. Do you think those people that have experienced an increase in accuracy after firing it a thousand or two rounds are getting the action/firing mechanism smoothed out or broken in?
Folks that are experiencing "better" accuracy are more than likely polishing out the chamber tooling marks by the combination of Brushes and aggressive cleaning will do that. Not the projectiles or fired rounds. Through my experience building 22lr precision rifles, these rifles I build will hold .3 or better accuracy within the first 15 shots. This is due to selection of the highest quality barrels and best machining practices.
@@EagleEyeShooting I am watching your part 2 now. I am impressed with the information you are putting out about this. Finally some answers which make sense and less mysterious.
I am very interested in the next video. Flyers are always a pain in the butt.
2:25
"One Who Walks Like Smoke " . . .
This is a new question on an old video. What kind of price range to build a rifle?
If you've never tried Fedderson barrels I highly recommend them!!
Wow. Tac driver
Applaud your artistry and efforts and, look forward to more of your videos but, I have a 60 year old factory Stutzen stocked 22 that equals your Shilen barrels at 50mtrs, all day long. Interestingly, I also use SK.
I’m curious Kenny how was your experience with Krieger? I’m not a gun smith by any means. With that said I put together a couple AR builds 1-308 & 1-223. I chose to go with Krieger based on JRB’s AR-10 series. I’m very happy with both of those barrels I’ll probably continue buying them. Now I’m curious about picking up a 22lr barrel from them. So I figure why not ask how they preformed for you.
I find bad eggs sometimes on each barrel manufacturer. I find less of those eggs with Krieger barrels over the others, ill state that lol
Testing. So great.
22 long rifle barrels of any size near the diameter of the ones you are shooting will never get warm enough to change the point of impact significantly. The reason they're printing differently after a "cold bore" is that the bore is now fouled, it has nothing at all to do with thermodynamics of the barrel as the barrel doesn't even get warm. It would have to get hot before it changes the point of impact, and a 22 long rifle just doesn't have the ability to do that firing 10 shots.
Nothing in this video talked about thermal dynamics. Having my own air gauge tooling and having built over 1600 22lr rifles of all types of shooting disiplines. Cold bore shift is due to tight spots in the bore.
Pretty good shooting, I use a stock Ruger 10/22 heavy barrel and definitely don't shoot quite like that.
I just bought a cz457 American. Ilove the look of a classic rifle. Unfortunately, I don't have a lot of money to spend. How can I make it more accurate, without switching the barrel and the stock? Is it possible?
great shooting, a good shooter is key IMO, what I mean by that is you are consistent, and good glass help to make up for your deficiencies, I pull a little to the right, and always have tried to figure out what I do it might be the way my hand is (it is normal) but some people shoot my rifles they shoot to the right, if you are on a budget like me, I take a new rifle and jag three patches one after the other whit chrome polish on them to smooth the barrel out
Looks like the magazine slipped out a couple times
The second rifle you shot with the wood incorporated into the chassis looks quite impressive. Some old school mixed with new school. What type of chassis is that?
I'm hooked! Very informative video. Wish I had found you before I did my first ever build. Is Part 2 out there? I also have a CZ 457 Varmint MTR the suffers from cold bore shift. It is the stock barrel/receiver. Is there anything I can do at home or do I have to send it to you for a new barrel.
Working on the video right now. Ill show case some things you can see for your self and help save some headache and time
So a ‘’cold shift barrel’’ can be cured with a polish?
When are those Shillens for the 457 going to be ready?
👍🏻🎯👍🏻✌🏻
I looked on Eagle Eye website to see if there is a place to get a barrel for a CZ457 22lr. Nothing available there. Is there another link to get one from you and how much?
where are you located ? How can someone get you to get the right barrel for them ?
Can you build something that shoots HV ammo well? I know a lot of 100 yard competition guys only run subsonic. For 3-400 yards would it make any sense to run HV ammo?
Staying subsonic actually is more accurate at longer distances. The 22lr projectile is very prone to destabilization when passing through the transonic velocity barriers. Brian litz has publications that can explain better than I can in this. Infact Todd Hodnett has been teaching classes show casing 308 subsonic to be far affective in accuracy at longer ranges
Great information thanks
I'm just getting into the 22lr game of hunting. I'm currently Waiting on my new Tikka T1x mtr 22lr with a 2x7x33 Leupold Scope. It was about $900 with this set up...Any suggestions or advice on this weapon would be appreciated. I'm mostly just shooting at an indoor range of 50 yards and smacking squirrels and small game with it
You will not regret that purchase. Excellent rifle and accurate out of the box for sure.
WOW THAT IS PRETTY COOL. I'M SURE YOU AREN'T CHEAP BUT IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS WORTH IT WITH THOSE RESULTS.😯😉👍😂
Good info, my RimX I had built with a Lilja MTU 1in16 @18in is a tack driver.
I need to do more cold bore testing, but it looks to be minimal, if any at all.
Thanks again for the video!
Many have outstanding results with lilja. This was just an example. Ive had to rebarrel rifles with various manufacturers. Some more than others.
@@EagleEyeShooting Thanks for the reply, I agree. You have some very nice builds btw!
Do you shot with winds flags?
If not how do you distinguish what is a "COLD BORE SHIFT" or maybe just a change in the wind?
Simple.. test the rifle in no wind...
I really need to get my b14R, tuned up.
How do you “pick the flyers” ? I am always frustrated with SK match giving the odd flyer. Always ruins my benchrest scores. Centre X is no better regardless of cost. Using an Anschultz 1710.
If it chambers rough. Or have a feedramp that has tendencies to deform the bullet, don't send it down range. Lead shavings or heavy wax build up is a good indicator of this issue.
When you are switching ammo you don’t need to worry if it’s the same lube but when it’s different lube do you need to clean or just “shoot out” the old lube (how many rounds for that on average?)
Also how important is or should lot testing be? I’d like to try several different ammos to see if my barrel is “saveable” but don’t want to test 10 lots of each lol.
I typically shoot 10 rounds (while still testing for accuracy) before I determine the barrel is "normalized" for that particular ammo's lubricant. Results vary of course. Lower grade barrels may have more tooling marks which result in needing more fouling shots. As for lot testing, you want to be around the 1060-1080 mark with high end ammo. Lapua Center-X/Midas +, SK Long Range/Rifle. Try Eley if your barrel is 22" or longer. If it doesn't shoot consistent within .100" average I personally would consider looking into another barrel or other accuracy issues
After enjoying 10 + of your videos in the last month I hear you say pandemic, wow, I can really trust your ability to process data and science.
I’m a BR shooter, I can’t imagine trying to start a match, with a cold barrel
Very informative. I'm new to rimfire, not a competitive shooter, mostly small game and some target shooting to 100 yards. Can you recommend a good barrel? I've looked at KIDD and Volquartsen.
I guess I should mention I'm running a Ruger 10/22.
Very interesting video. Are you using the grub screws to hold the barrel in place OR using 601 to hold them in place.