Behringer Model D - Giant Killer or Cheap Imitation?
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- Опубликовано: 7 сен 2024
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Many purists think that Behringer did this illegally , but the moog patent was expired and they simply used it. fair and square. Its an exact copy of the original circuitry, so yes it sounds the same.
What I understood, some of the "ye olde" components used in the original are not even manufactured anymore. Either way, it's uncanny!
Yep, no different from any orchestra “ripping off” Bach, Mozart, and company. Or companies that print the classics. I love Moog but they are honestly at least a bit overpriced. (20-30%) sure, maybe they are worth a multiple of this clone stuff for their originality, quality, excellent packaging and manuals and sense of pride of ownership, but the stuff is damned expensive. :o love my dfam though, very cool panel and concept. And the sub37. It’s like the Strat of mono synths, to me.
EDub look into how Moog as a company operates and builds things and it’s clear why they charge a premium.
@@elissitdesign Yes, but too much premium, my friend, tooooo much. They got away with it in the beginning of the analog synth resurgence, but not now. I mean, lol, did you even read more than my first few words?! I do own Sub 37, DFAM. I like it - but I think they could probably pull in a nice profit at 20-30% less cost, also. Competition is only a good thing.
@@boothbuster I've been to the Moog manufacturing home in Asheville, NC. It's pure, handmade, American goodness. Still making them like they used to, just with a couple of PCBs now so stuff like the DFAM isn't over a grand. You're not wrong that their stuff is expensive, but it's also the best. Products like the Moog One are pretty much designed to go straight into pro studios and world-touring rigs.
They haven't changed too much since the good ole days and the company is still doing fine, so it's hard to say it's too much of a premium. It does suck for us pleebs that want a One though. It was never priced for us. They ARE the Rolls Royce of synths. But that's why stuff like the Mother 32 and DFAM is so epic; it puts Moog goodness in your hands at a very affordable price.
I've got 2 x Minimoogs... one from 1972 and a reissue. To me the Behringer sounds every inch as good even identical... still the real thing is just such a thing of beauty, great knobs, inspiring and its been working for almost 50 years!
It feels like a blessing, a mature comment from a Minimoog owner. Thank you for existing
@Aaron Foltz haha... I love them! They both sound different too...
though have to admit my fav is the Odyssey!
Same
This is the thing. I know it sounds good but I really can’t see the behringer still working after 50 years. That’s why the moog costs so much. There built to last forever:) I’m certainly not hating on the behringer though. I have a d and neutron:) haha.
Not being funny but plugins of the minimoog are more expensive than this; and this is analogue! Madness mate
It just sounds...great. So great. Especially with the RV-6 and Tape Echo. I wish every analog synth came with a basic delay and reverb. A proper thick analog synth with effects is one of the best sounds in the universe. Terrific playing and demo!
Moog is a company that puts so much hard work into their products that having one is a statement within itself. If I make large sums of money from music, then having Moog products is ideal because they are a company that I personally support. With that being said, I love that there are actual affordable ways to get Moog sounds, like the Behringer Model D, now. If you want a Moog, you will likely buy a Moog; Nothing will compare to the feel and aesthetic pleasure of owning one in my opinion. I bought a Mother 32 not too long ago and the packaging, presentation and feel of the synth was so special. I felt like they personally created it for me, which is something that I've never felt from purchasing any other synth. However, if you just simply want the sound of a Moog, you may just want something that's more affordable and this is a perfect option. Another plus is that people who play live shows could use this and not worry so much about it being stolen or someone dropping a beer on it!
but do new moogs even evoke that feel? im not so sure
I brought mine to my church gig this morning, in the lead guitar player.. I got some funny looks from the bassist LOL. I plan on using it for twinkly Steve Hillage type sequences, maybe some leads some time.
Love these guys for the total absence of pretense. Ben: let me twiddle some knobs and make a tone. Jack: I have no words for what you just did there, but let me improvise a badass riff that perfectly demonstrates that tone
My man, appreciate the kind comment Sir, thanks so much for tuning in X
So true! Just got one for Christmas and I am trawling RUclips. This is a good one. I got my piano and s few other things from these guys; they're genuine 👍🏿
*MAAAN!!!*
Dear Behringer, what happened?
From having low shelf quality products competing Monacor in german discount electronics retailers such as Conrad, evolving to THIS?
Since reading about plans on these clone synths, I could not help myself but being impressed.
Hearing it now got me droolin' all over!
Initially reading about those being manufactured in China, I was all ears, in contrary to most others commenting on that fact.
To me it was like:
Where else in this world would anyone still be able to built a fully analog reproduction of a vintage synth, since every other "high technology" nation wiped their expertise on manufacturing a dinosaur like this off the surface of the earth?
Hopefully the introduction of these to our markets will wake some heads for the better.
Alan Ladd seine Katze exactly!! I’m waiting so patiently for them to finish the EMS Synthi clone... I would go to China to help them solder it!
Model D is a cheap killer. Lookin forward to RD-808!) Thanks, Uli)
I bought my Model D from probably the first batch that Andertons received. It's a little monster of a synth. My only quibble is that the oscillators wander out of tune, so I always have to ensure that they are at concert pitch before I press the record button on my recorder, but otherwise, I think the Model D is a great synth for not too much money.
I've got one hooked up to a keystep - best monosynth for the money on the market in my opinion. With a solid reverb module or pedal you'll be in business.
I don't know that it has to sound identical to a Mini Moog, if not, it sure is close! The fact is, you can get a gritty desktop synth that doesn't take up a lot of space, an doesn't empty your wallet! Great sound, and lots of fun!
I got mine the day it arrived in Canada. The guy from the store called me and I went asap, he told me I was probably in the 5 or 10 first person in Canada to get one. (I figured out only 2 weeks later how to use it, because my midi keyboard is USB and I did not want to use my computer at the time, I was moving) at first I used it with my cellphone, acting as a usb midi device :P then the fun began. I just started in the last weeks to do something, like recording usable stuff and doing tracks, other than just "playing" with the machine (discovering how a "real" synth works) I really love it!!
I know its a difficult concept to grasp for some but this Behringer is not $3000 cheaper because its $3000 lesser in quality. Much as the purists want this to be the case, its simply not. The price is possible because of how economies of scale have changed. Electronic components and manufacturing has dropped in cost exponentially since the original began production, and when you're a large scale company with the facilities to produce large quantities, it just translates to a much much cheaper product, yet not necessarily a proportional drop in quality. Obviously the knobs and the cabinet are not up to par with the original which is hand assembled using high quality materials, but the circuit itself is a carbon copy with the same quality of electronic components printed on a PCB, theres no reason for it to fail prematurely if you take care of it, and theres no reason for it not to sound bang on. Hell, even if it does fail in 10 years, you can buy 7 of these for the price of one original.
well said!
Also I mean, there’s a limited number of Moog model D’s out there, but these are still in production so the more people that buy the less each one costs.
Just bought one new on sale for $208 USD!!!
I've got the Behringer and I fuckin' love it, but I'm still saving up for the Moog Grandmother! Can't wait to get it and patch the 2 together to see what kind of huge-sounding insanity I get out of both of them.
Mike Kiker did you do this? Thinking same but backwards: got the gm so looking at this one. Yeah the Moog made me broke lol
I play my Model D "Boog" side-by-side with the real Moog Minitaur (sometimes both controlled at the same time). It's beautiful.
Boog haha :)
"Shred it for me Jack."
This thing is awesome. Very nice sound. I want it in my life. Trying to get one at a good price here in Australia is nearly impossible. Our retail system isn't used to offering such things at a good price. So when the inexpensive gear comes into the country they seem to jack up the prices. Aussies just can't get a fair deal on this stuff. Retailers here want $600AUD for a Neutron or Boog model D. Should only be $500AUD at the most.
$225 USD at pro audio star!
Parramatta Guitar Factory. $479.
I feel you. 550-600 USD in Argentina.
Jack McCabe: I wish! It's $329 now. www.proaudiostar.com/behringer-model-d.html
You guys make great videos, convinced me to buy a Model D from someone selling one locally to me, but next time I make it to the UK I'd love to visit this shop of yours, sounds magical!
Just bought one of these, having owned a 1972 Minimoog for the past 41 years. The audio from the BMD is indistiguishable from my Minimoog.
My old Moog lives at home - I feed the osc card new caps and a hairdryer now and again just out of lurve. I wouldn't transport it anywhere however... the the Uli re-creation is just a tad stunning at the price point.
And no, I don't work for Behringer. :-)
P.S. Excellent review IMHO.
Love what you were doing from 17:12
Would be interesting to see a comparison between this and the real thing and a free vst plugin.
Giant. I bought it yesterday. It’s fantastic. Deep&rich
I love mine, and my neutron !
Bring on the rd 808/909 et al.
Is the rd 808 coming before Christmas??...?
Uli YAY!
I'd love to see you guys review the Neutron and, in particular, talk about how it and the D do and don't overlap (i.e. is there a need for both)?
@neverfox Neutron is two oscillators with cloned CEM3340 IC chips. These were used in vintage synths like the Prophet and some Rolands. So quite a different sound than a Moog oscillator, though the original chips they were used in the MemoryMoog. Though that was something of an odd diversion from typical Moogs. The Neutron has an original filter design, and several more patch points and patching possibilities than the D clone here. So there isn't much overlap save for the form factor, vendor, and their being current mono synths at a very attractive price point. So if you're keen on getting more than one mono synth, yeah they are appreciable different in a bunch of ways. Though they would be a complementary pairing as the D has a minimum of patch points to do things with the units in tandem operation.
Behringer is on the right way.... I have got some of their synhts including model D. They are all good, guys!
I'm waiting for Behringer's Moog One !!!!!!!!!!
LOL!
see you in 50 years
Deep mind 12 gets pretty close
@@AllenSmithe luckily I will ony be in my 70s.
The Behrg Zero.
I think this is fantastic & all credit to behringer finally giving people the synth they all want! (at such a good value!). Unfortunately for me I think they took the cloning too far- no memories was a deal breaker ( so I bought the Roland) BUT now they’ve developed this I’m hoping for bigger and better things using same basic oscillators/ filters.
Pizza Gogo no
Really digging my Model D. The circuit design I suppose defines it as a clone. I mean, really, nearly every synth out there that is analog or VA is modeled after the original OSC, VCF, VCO standard. The OSC and the Filters on this animal sound great. No two Mini's sound identical, so if you want a good sounding synth, the Model D will not disappoint. Nice work with the pedal additions. I run my Model D with a slight amount of OSC pitch or filter mod, then thru some sonic space from a delay or reverb unit and the thing really opens up. Straight up bass can work without effects, but I agree that most mono synths (even poly synths when it comes down to it) can benefit from some delay or reverb. This unit is a great inexpensive unit to pair with a Minitaur. There is something about the component design that specializes in the frequency generated by bass timbre that can't be duplicated even on a Mini. The OSC are designed to lock their frequency start sync so it always has the same initial punch no matter what note is played. The Model D bass is on par with a regulation Mini, but the Minitaur is still top notch for the musical foundation. At the prices you can find them, grab them both and some effects and take flight!!!
Heard these can be a pain to tune/calibrate ... but Ben makes it sing!
No. Not at all. At least no more than the actual Minimoog. I've owned both.
Mark Burgh Saw this and thought ... nah!
ruclips.net/video/yAq3eekKVGY/видео.html @ 2:15
And then there is this... ruclips.net/video/nrZdzyMyr6I/видео.html
I have never had to open up an analog synth to calibrate/tune it ... all the way back to a Pro One and Juno 6.
No wonder it is so cheap!
@@valdiskrebs566 never had to tune mine. no need to spread FUD :)
Markus Koivisto You are lucky... but obviously several well-known RUclipsrs have had to tune/calibrate theirs... even Behringer put out a special video on it... so it is not a rare occurrence and not FUD.
I'm just going to write Moog Model D and TB 303 and TR 606 on my Behringers with a marker because it's funny. lol
Deffo want one. Its just as beautiful as original but has several sockets to connect to your modular & is more compact. Ideally I'd later add a couple of AJH modules because there are some features on latter that it hasn't got. Admittedly though, you'd only get one module for the price of the entire Behringer. Am hoping they go ahead with their system 100M modules too. I don't know how they do it & make enough profit!
Killer! Absolutely killer !
classic sounds
Hi guys .. Very informative videos always. Keep 'em coming .. 👍
I would like to know if the lack of Note Priority on Behringer Model D is a deal breaker. Some people have flagged this issue on other channels.
Thanks 😊
Got one . It’s a killer .😍
What is the tape loop pedal you used? Great idea to add to my Model D
The only difference is less low end on the behringer unit and a little less rich with higher end harmonics. A little eq and it sounds really close. Still amazing though. I would hate to have to sell mine.
I do like the enthusiasm on this channel, but if everything is great all of the time, it undermines the credibility of a review, and becomes more an advert for the product. Small example - I noticed an ugly little click when some settings were being changed (2 mins 55 secs). Not the end of the world, and you could say for 300 quid what do you expect? But just pretending its not there makes this not a review, and more of an advert.
Nice, masters at work :) And Model D is also in my studio ...
I think this could be the gateway drug to Modular Synthesis.
Not a chance. The Minibrute 2s did that for me.
@@erwickdsouza Mine was the DFAM :)
Behringer are planing a Roland 100M clone.
How long before someone builds this into a larger case with larger knobs -- a bit of desoldering of the original pots, bit of wiring... nothing too complicated. Make an end to all the "small knobs" whining...
I just bought one for a couple hundred bucks on Ebay
Who else is Berenger coming for? I'm feeling a dave smith coming soon... Yikes!!!
Behringer is legendarily inconsistent. Sometimes you hit a gold rush, sometimes you just want to hurl their products in to the sun
Take their small mixing consoles = complete shite. But their large consoles were really really great 👍
18:57 BEES!
Can this work in a software daw/ hardware combo where one can extract certain synth sounds from the software daw and further sculpt shape manipulate the sound on the hardware model d?
Yes, you can have ANY audio source plugged into the "Ext" input mini jack on the Model D (located right after the "D" itself) and have it available on the mixer, either by itself or combined with the onboard oscillators/noise signals. From there you can manipulate it with the onboard Filter and Envelopes and get the result back to your DAW thru the "Main" output minijack at the top right of the panel 🙂
Good job!! 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼😁
what a great video!
Plug in effects that cost more than synth then make weird noises?
What's the DI box for? Splitting the signal and sending to efx or some other reason?
You need to use the di for converting the synths line level into the instrument level that the pedals are designed for.
Just got mine :D
“Classic sauce affair with three different widths.” Go home cc, you’re drunk.
I am waiting for somebody to get and idea and built full size controller/ knobs with KB and real wood cabinet with behringer guts. things will get interesting :)
Poly D is coming....
Is it true about the oscillators going out of tune after 5 min?
artilect 99 Not any more than a typical analog synth. I’ve had mine stay in tune for a 3 hour gig without much drift, once it warmed up. A little tuning is always expected with analogs though, so unless it’s drastic and obviously broken, it doesn’t bother me at all.
Hasn't been a problem at all with mine.
Hey INTERNET! help... I want a synth with some crazy bass sounds. New Tame sounds, growling, or plucky or Sine-wave 808ish stuff, Im thinking Subsequent 37? Behringer D, Behringer Poly D? I'm lost, please help!
Forgive my total ignorance here…
I often plug my midi keyboard into my laptop just using one usb cable (drawing power from the computer)
Could I similarly plug the midi keyboard into this model D via usb? Or do I have to use a midi cable and power the keyboard separately?
Just use a MIDI cable. They work much better
No, the USB connection is meant to plug the Model D into the computer for configuration, software updates or making your DAW "play" the Model D via MIDI files.-
I went for the poly d instead 😀
@@wibblewabblewoo6249 nice !!!!
I think people are missing the point of Behringer products. They aren’t trying to make a sound alike, they are trying to make a cheap synth with similar features.
Which is the same thing is it not?
funny ive got the same little 49 note keyboard
Me too.
Works great.
Wait till you hear the neutron😂...its wild!
But which do you prefer?
@@agedefiant-heteromundane-s6943 I love the neutron but is a bit scary lol
@@agedefiant-heteromundane-s6943 los dos son buenos diferentes entre si,uno es un clon y el otro es origunal de ellos y muy bueno,tengo el deepmind,model d,y neutron y un subsequent,aparte de un virus ti,korg radias y roland-vsynth,no me desago de ninguno,cada uno tiene su caracter,vivan los sintes hardwareeeee,saludoss
Noisy Nois Daba dingy potuccioni maldoriosa pablanos maldollego pon Dillards, pobo chubo bon kogi no? Albidorsimo! Pan chinga!
Once you come out of the damn box and stop always making comparisons,you can get the Model D,and let it shine under it's own.There's no reason to be stuck on a brand,and as long as it works,thats what matters.Intelligence brings us to what something CAN do,not what it cannot..This is a great piece of gear,for almost nothing,compared to the 'purist' items..
There is heft
Mucho heft !
This one or the pro 1?
Both. Obviously ;)
Behringer is a gift to humanity! F the haters..
whats the build quality? will it be totally "effff'd" in 5 years?
I swear this video is already on RUclips?
yep - convinced I have watched this before
James Hanington
No, this is just a clone of the video. Brought to you by Behringer😀
Gary Crosby
😁!
They are different sounding buuuut that’s ok
Different?Nah,they're indentical.
Buy the se02. It sounds the same. Don’t be fooled by labels! 🕶
It can do similar sounds and is definitely interesting, you won't be disappointed, but it does sound slightly different. Less earth shattering low end for one.
+Neutron
Quack!
Giant killer AND cheap imitation.
The narration is too loud compared to the synth audio, and they're talking at the same time as the synth is playing, all making it hard to hear . Not hating, just constructive criticism.
Good shout Jgk, we're trying to keep the talking over playing down to a minimum that's for sure and hopefully we'll get better at weaving the chat around the sounds. Thanks for watching and the heads up. Jack x
DUDES wake up!!!! the old thingies were made allmost on the same place!!!!!!! so ..... behringer is makin it exces.... for all of us....so thanx uli!
Much improved video presentation, keep refining. I only cringed a few times! =p
i, and many others, cringed when reading your comment
Is this a good beginners synth? I mean at that price I'm ready to bite hands off. When I say beginner, I mean a man with next to no knowledge who can't play, but is ready to buy and learn.
Please tell me yes so I can go out and buy.
yes it is the model d is not v complicated at all
Definitely! Relatively simple, but it sounds amazing!
How is your Journey going 2 years down the line?
@@superkipzonderkop well, I didn't end up buying this in the end. I didn't buy anything for a while, but ended up getting my hands on a microfreak in the end. Maybe not the best beginners synth, but I've learnt a lot from it. Very digital sounding which sometimes I love and sometimes I hate when compared to analogue. Maybe a deepmind 12 next.....but who knows, I change my mind so often and the market is deep with good affordable kit these days.
Price wise:
MOOG Model D = Subaru BRZ
Behringer Model D = Scion FR-S
Purity wise:
MOOG model D = AE86 Corolla Trueno
Behringer Model D = Toyota GT86
I like your analogy.
you should have shown some patching. Pitty
First!
SEcond! What do we win?
A digital fist bump in the form of an emoji?!.........🤜
I'll take that gladly. I was hoping for a free Moog One but hey let's enjoy the 'little' things ;) Have a great day!
why is there a keyboard connected to it if there is no fu..king playing on it.
Because it doesn't have any keys at all, as the Moog Mother 32 does.
Cheap man’s Moog.
Everyman's Moog more like it.
J R Everyman’s Moog and Cheap man’s Moog means exactly the same thing. No need to double post but thanks for confirming.
@@epicon6 No, one is often used as put down, and one isn't.
Ballcap bro contributes absolutely nothing to the video.
For all the people out there saying that this sounds as good as a real moog please stop smoking weed while you compare. No way this cheap knock comes even close to the depth and warmth of the real thing. Behringer for the most part is junk that has been better the last few years but anyone looking for true quality and depth go to the real stuff. Moog has Patents on so many things that other company just can’t reproduce and when you hear them in person its pretty easy to tell. Save your money and buy the real thing. A behringer won’t last you 50 years. A moog will.
Nobody is smoking weed,while making assumptions here.It's just hard for some people to accept that Behringer can make indentical synth to the iconic MiniMoog.The truth is most of musicians are after the sound,and the Behri delivers with the Model D in spades.And the build quality is really good.I really never liked the original design of the MiniMoog,i think it looks like a worn out furniture, a huge desk,a mad scientist closet, filled with knobs and ugly keyborad, with even uglier modulation and pitch wheels.So the conclusion is THE SOUND is spot on with the Boog.And most of us are not fanatic about the 100% tactile feel of the Boog to the Moog.Most of us don't care.What we care is the SOUND.And the sound is THERE with the Boog.How do you know a Moog will last you 50 years only because an MiniMoog happend to survive that long and that's probably a isolated case.Even expensive electronics can fail on you.I have three Moog synths and the Boog and I don't see a reason,with good care the Boog to last you for years and years to come.And even if it fails on you,you still can buy 10 more at the price of a vintage MiniMoog.Just don't fall into tha trap of snobbery people's mentality.Some snobs are eating themselves right now,because the legendary MiniMoog sound is available to the masses,whereas not long ago it was the sound of the ellite.Well, guess what,not anymore.Times changed,so should some people too.Just get along with it.
Terrible introduction
ruclips.net/video/eibk3ASNpEw/видео.html Sci-fi
behringer does not pay curtis materials, it is not a pioneer, it is not from 1970, behringer cloned the circuits used by curtis to have them in their possession, behringer does not pay for other components or third-party labor, so an original one would cost 10,000 on ebay and the behringer 300 and there is no more history, and it does not mean that the behringer model D, made of bad materials, can be even better in a 2020 Poly D version with 4 oscillators and 4 polyphonic notes with sequencer and cost only 2000 if we put it oak wood.
My minimoog has died after many years of original component repairs and changes. It is a lie that the minimoogs do not break, and from the use and the heat of summer they fade with the volume of the sound, until they stop giving their sound, due to overheating and the passage of years.
Some Chinese engineer breathing a sigh of relief... just spent a month designing the cheapest possible plastic switch that sounds and feels like one that costs 20x as much to make, and looks like he got it right! You fell for it!
Not saying that I don't believe it's good or anything, it may well last. Or not. My point being that you can't tell quality from the "feeling" or "weightyness" or how the swithches sound, because these are precisely the things they engineer the products for, other than low cost and expected life greater than the warranty period.
You have to strip it apart and look under the bonnet BOLTR-style to be able to tell!
Least favorite gear channel on youtube
Why would you write that instead of just not watching and keeping it to yourself?
@@TheSunlight74 because he wants attention
Cheap Imitation.... it won’t last 2 years before it’s breaks down...let alone 48
What exactly would you say would lead it to break down?
@@neverfoxI suspect he doesn't know, and believes the only way a cheaper version of the original is possible is purely through lowering quality. In reality, this has to do with a change in economies of scale. Manufacturing has changed drastically since the original was produced. The circuit uses the same quality of components on a PCB.. The cabinet and knobs and aesthetic are obviously cheaper, but if you don't bash the shit out of your gear it should last a very long time. None of the electronics are being strained, the circuit is a carbon copy. The entire unit is cheaper because its not hand assembled by a small team and wrapped in wood.
Funnier still, he doesn't seem to realize that Moog themselves use surface mount construction on many of their products, and while they assemble them in the US, some of their boards also come from China.
I wish the Moog fanboys actually restored an old model D like I had. The Pratt-Reed keyboard is finicky. Moog used several pots that were not sealed and had plastic shafts. The overload lamp on mine was burnt out and needed to be replaced. The transformer made a very noticeable humming sound. It's built better than an ARP Odyssey of the same vintage, but not thousands better than the Behringer.
Good review but the dude with the hat talks way too much.