To answer a question that seems to be asked a lot: the BMW R1250RT-P bike is a Police / Deployment specification bike that is used by UK and EU government agencies in various applications. It is quite often heavily loaded with extra equipment and gear and can on occasion receive a fair amount of hard use. I believe this is why the RT-P version of the R1250 is being included in this recall. I Hope this extra information helps answer question about why its included. I doubt anyone takes this bike off-road.... smile
Had my bike updated while in the shop for my 6-6.5k service--about a month ago. And let me tell you, YOUR explanation of the issue and resolution was FAR more detailed than that given by my Service Writer! Frankly, I doubt he was even a tenth as informed as you. Thanks for telling it Just The Way It Is Carl!
Hi Ray, thank you for your compliment. I think each dealership is different in terms of knowledge and understanding. Some better than others. I have reached out the BMW Berlin and there technical team and asked them to provide more specific information… but unusually I have not received a reply yet. Normally they are happy to share more technical information with me. Once I know more I will post an update Best wishes Carl
Good afternoon Carl, about 2 weeks ago I acquired an R1250GS TRIPLE BLACK and I have been an attentive spectator of your videos. Thank you for the excellent work on the videos. A month without publishing news about the R1250GS... is a long time ehehehe Thank you and a big hug from Portugal
Hi Pedro, thank you for your feedback, currently working on the next few episodes and hope to have one ready by Easter. Congratulations on your new bike 👍
Hi Paul, thank you for your feedback. Bikes are never perfect so when a manufacturer does a recall it’s a 👍 from me. Yes the opinions on the forums are divided and that’s all fine. Best wishes Carl
I am in the U.S. and took my bike in to install the drain at the bottom of the FD. The software recall had been issued a couple of days earlier so the dealer installed the new software. The head of the service department had not been told what the effect of the software would be, 'something from Germany'. Thank you for the explanation. I was afraid it was going to be something to limit torque and reduce performance.
Great explanation. I heard about the recall from a friend and then found your video. It's demystified the issue for me in simple terms and very easy to understand.
Thanks Carl. As always, a really great and helpful video. Thank you for taking the time to inform us about this. I received the recall letter from BMW today.
Hi Max, that’s great news. I had a feeling that bmw would bring forward the start of the recall once us owners were aware of it. It’s great to hear your dealer has decided to start early ready for the start of the season. FYI, mine has now been done and I can’t tell any difference in terms of performance but… the quick shifter now operates much better. Best wishes Carl
As a potential buyer of a BMW and having worked in part of the industry that deals with issues, it is heartening to understand how they approached it and ultimately improved it. This manufacturing behavior will sit well in my mind as I decide what to buy next. TY BMW.
Hello TY and welcome to the channel, thank you for your feedback on this episode in the series. I know not everyone agrees but I, like you, think BMW are trying to address these issues and improve the bikes. I wish you happy hunting for whichever bike you finally decide on. Carl
Just purchased a 2019 Gsa 1250 with 5k miles. Had 50/50 tires. Got both recalls completed and really appreciated your videos to explain why…took tires to the next level and installed Michelin Road 6 tires… love them!
Thank you for the update. It's great to see BMW taking such extensive measures to correct a niche problem. Makes me like BMW Motorrad even more....and that you brought this to our attention and did all the research, like this channel more.
Thank you for making this video and explaining this recall so thoroughly. My local dealer - Desert Valley Powersports - notified me of the recall last week for my 2021 BMW R1250 GSA, and installed the software update (kudos to DVP for the great customer service). I don't do any ambitious off-roading with my GSA, so I'm not too concerned about an issue. However, with motocross/supercross racers you'll often see/hear them leave the throttle on while in the air while jumping for a couple of reasons, one of which is to minimize landing impact, as landing with the throttle off can be jarring and slower during a race. So for those GS/GSA riders jumping their bikes, keeping the throttle on helps smooth out the landing so it isn't so jarring. Kudos to BMW for addressing this.
Hi Jeff, thankyou for sharing this information, we all can learn from it, although I personally have and would never take my GS jumping off-road. Nice to hear your dealer DVP has sorted things for you. carl
Good information Jeff, I want to add that in motocross when you jump, you use the throttle to maintain the inertia and control the bike on the air, so if BMW will not allow to control the bike with the throttle and cut the engine, it will induce a nose dive and potentially cause an accident; in my humble opinion, thanks
Thank you sire for making this video. Watching the regular review of these bike are common but the information you shared gave quite a bit of inside curve to a buying decision for my next GSA.
Hello Raskar and welcome to the channel I’m pleased you are enjoying the series and the extra insight provided. I wish you lots of fun choosing your options and accessories. Let me know which model and spec you go for. Best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis Indeed you efforts are commendable. I just put in my deposit for a triple black GSA. Within a month, I shall have me own Tractor to shred the streets.
An experienced rider would land with power on. However, if the bike bike may not handle it that is a whole other issue. Thanks for the video and nice work.
Many thanks for that Carl, highly appreciated. Now I know the full background on why I wasn't allowed to take delivery of the bike. With a bit of luck it will be done by the weekend. Keep fingers crossed 🙂
Wow!!!! Thank you for the detailed explanation. I thought the recall would reduce power/torque. It’s actually managing the bike in specific scenarios. I applaud BMW. My 2022 R1250GS 40th has been stellar!!!
Great info and video. Thank you! Nice to see BMW taking responsibility for this. Wish they were this forward thinking about all the final drive failures in the past. Looking forward to this software update and the drive shaft corrosion check for my GS and GSA.
Hi Moto, I feel things are changing, BMW is aware that more and more customers view online content, just like this episode, and have realized that things have to change. I know BMW watch some of my videos and perhaps they don't approve of everything but in my case they do go out of there way to help / assist and answer questions, and they do have a great technical support team.. So from my small perspective things are getting better. Best wishes Carl
I am not every air born I am thinking of doing a short road trip to get jt close to 6k service and drop it out. Appreciate the explanation . Now I do not have worry during my spring road trip
Hi thanks bikes booked in for tomorrow. Spoken with my local dealership in York UK they’re gonna plug it in and see if the software update works on my bike due to the fact that it does go off road and I do sometimes get up in the air. Much appreciated.👍🤘
Thanks for the Well informed information, called at my local dealer they said bring it in today (Tuesday 31st) sorted couldn’t ask for a better service
Hi Graham that’s great news. Thank you for sharing. Mine is currently with BMW and the bike should be delivered back next week. Will report more once it’s back and I’ve been out for good road test, Carl
Hi Russ, thank you for feedback and welcome to the channel. Yes the program or software engineers are certainly kept busy with our modern motorbikes. Best wishes Carl
Hi Creed, thankyou, the update time varies depending on the bikes current software version. The older bikes can take up to 4-5 hours to update, whereas a newer bike might only take 1-2 hours or less. Regards Carl
My theory is that the difference in speed between the rear wheel rotation speed and the engine speed is actually not that the rear wheel has spun up while in the air and is rotating too fast at landing but rather that the bike's software perceived the spin up and decided to apply the rear brake thinking that was an appropriate intervention. It's the application of the rear brake that causes the driveline such stress. The software fix now accounts for the fact that the bike is in a air.
Hi Michael and thank you for sharing this viewpoint. In BMW technical report I didn’t see mention of this but what you described seems possible. But I’m not going jumping my bike to find out… smile. Regards Carl
I’d be pretty certain that braking pressure to the calliper can only be taken away not added therefore unless you are on the brake the management system cannot brake the rear wheel independent of the rider
Thanks Carl, another very informative video. By chance I was at my dealer's earlier today booking my 2021 GSA in for a service. I'd heard the rumours of a recall but before I could ask about it the service manager brought it up and offered to carry out the update when the bike goes in. Like the indicator update I had done before the bike will have to be hooked up to a computer for about 5 hours.
Did my update two days ago. Took them approximately one hour. No changes in power or torque that I can notice, as much people were concern. The engine seams perky and quick shifter has smooth click changing gears. Love how BMW pay attention to details.
Hi Oliver a few owners have mentioned the quick shifter being better after this software update so perhaps they have included a tweak to that too which would be great 👍 Carl
@Just The Way happy new year to you Carl hope you are well.. we ate heading back down through Germany to Austria end of May beging of June ..Gona be great to get back to touring Europe again .
Don't forget to get some Autobahn time in..... smile, currently working on "Still working on" our tour of Norway episode but with 9 people taking pictures and videos i have over 1,600 pictures and 756Gb of video to get through. Carl
Excellent explanation....still smells like neutering power in enduro mode...and BMW doing quiet damage control. May just be a weakness of shaft drives in general for heavy offroad thrashing...
Just booked my GSA in for a service and they said it had to come in for a recall ( already knew after seeing your vid) part of the recall is you don’t have to take it in, it’s up to BMW UK to collect it & drop it back off. (They don’t tell you that though) dealer told me so they are collecting mine in bike van
Hi Steven thank you for sharing this. You are correct 👍 mine was collected by BMW in a van on Wednesday . It was due a service so I asked them to collect it, initially they said no I have to take the bike to them,,,,, but I reminded them about the recall and surprise surprise they called back and said YES we will collect and return for free. I hope other owners are able to learn from us both 👍
Even an experience rider may throttle up when airborn. Many riders were taught that the gyroscopic spin will bring the rear end down so you don't nose down, bottom out front forks and go over the bars when landing. It might not be prefered meathode to pull the rear tire down, but still many riders may have learned same thing.
Great video! Now my actual question is why did you install OEM BMW fog lights and not Clearwater or Denali lights? Btw, I used your video to install my Weiser led lights yesterday; thank you!!!
Hi Mario, congratulations on your Weiser-Tech light installation 👍. As to my lights, we’ll both of the brads you mentioned make really great lights, but my GS originally came as a test bike and the OEM spot lights we’re already installed. See episode 1-3. Best wishes Carl
There has been no mention of whether the software update will DECREASE torque and/or HP? It is my understanding that Torque and HP are decreased for the Rain mode. Is this software simply doing the same thing to some degree to the other modes? If so, the HP/Torque numbers claimed by BMW when bike was released are no longer valid. The explanation of the rear wheel vs engine RPMs due to wheel being off the ground does not make sense if the RT is also affected.
You can add me to the list of whom had an input shaft failure with my R1250GSA, 2022 model. The bike has only 19000 km and I use it mainly on the road in Dynamic Pro mode most of the time and do lots of jumping on the road at high speed(140km & above). Luckily, when the shaft broke, the rear wheel didn't lock up.
Hi Talib, thank you for sharing. In the documents I have seen, BMW detail a reimbursement programme for owners that have had a Gearbox related issue / problem with any bike that is listed. I believe you just need to take your invoice / receipt back to your dealer and present it. BMW have an official programme to cover these costs and i think.... owners get a full refund. First contact your dealer if you had to pay for repairs. Regards Carl
A very full and clear explanation, but just one question. Why is the RT included in the recall? Do they also get taken off road and airborne, or is there something else causing this issue.
Hi Philip, its a good question, the recall specifically mentions the RT-P version which is a Police and Authority specification built bike. This bike is quite often used as a surveillance or undercover bike by different government forces and departments in the UK and the EU. I guess the logic for recalling this bike, is that these bikes probably get a harder time than the normal RT, but that's just my guess. Carl
La semaine dernière, la concession a effectué le changement de cardan et la mise à jour du logiciel. Apparemment, le check BMW n'indique plus de rappel. Merci pour les infos.
On one of your videos You had a side note that dropped down from the top to the bottom By the time it got to the top of the side note the bottom of the side note was gone If your going to do something like that start it at the bottom so viewers can read it as it goes up Its backwards to show the end first and the start last
Great video! My bike is a R1250 GSA without Dynamic, Enduro and Enduro Pro but it was recalled; so I don't think is a problem with off road modes, it is something else that also is affecting the RT-police model.. thank you for the information!
As it is just a little software update (some additional parameters) I don't think that bmw will do this for only a small group of drivers. They do stuff like this always for all type of bikes with the same type-code (like K51). Only this way future updates are consistent. Ordinary drivers shouldn't feel any difference in the behaviour of their bike.
Thanks for the information. If you ever need any footage of some of the parts of the 1250 engine I have filmed some as I repair crashed r1200/1250's. I can show you what happens when you dont have crash bars
Hi Carl, your videos are very helpful to me and are so carefully put together, thank you. Please can I have your thoughts on one matter, please. You previously talked about a software update for tft screens. My local bmw dealer won’t update my 2021 model R1250GSA unless there is a warranty fault or unless I agree to pay. This seems wrong to me? Regards Chris Nix
Hello A RUclips user, 2021 GS and GSA onwards bikes are currently being recalled for a software update you will receive a letter from BMW advising you to return your bike. Owners have started receiving these. See my video I would suggest you visit your local dealer taking your chassis number with you and ask them to check for any outstanding recall or updates that are required for your bike. The work will be done FOC. If you ask just for a TFT update they may decline or charge you for that service. But the software which includes everything is being done to all bikes under warranty. Let me know how you get on Carl
When your BMW goes in for the drive line check and rubber valve vent install, could you find out some information for us please? More than a few people that have had the rubber check valve installed are saying that it fits very loose and one person said his got pushed inside the drive housing and is just laying in there. There seems to be no lip on the outside to prevent it from being pushed inside. I was thinking if this is the case, perhaps some black silicone seal would be a good idea which would be easy to do. What do you think? Thank You!!
Hi Eric my 2021 GS Rallye is now back from my dealer after the service, software update and drive assembly test and modifications. My valve is installed correctly and it’s not loose and is unlikely to fall out as other owners have mentioned. I will upload a new episode soon detailing the work once I hear back from BMW Berlin. I have asked for clarification on the software update and a possible quick shifter firmware update. Once I receive a reply I will let you know, best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis I take it you mean the rubber valve to let water out? Mine had that done at the factory . Also getting a new quick shifter fitted as I have had issues with downshifts(under warranty).
Just had the duckbill drain installed and it’s garbage, you can and I did feel for it and pushed it into the arm. It’s just sitting there. Washing the bike with a sponge you could push it in without ever knowing. On a sky lift a jet wash will without trying will push it out. How is yours? I’m sending it back as I’m not satisfied with it. Surely this should have lugs on internal and external ends so it’s secure. Interested on your thoughts
Hi Steven, yes take your bike back and write a letter of complaint to go with it, along with taking pictures. The quality of the work seems to vary greatly depending on the dealership and importantly who does the work. Some owners have had extremely poor work done during the valve installation and damage has been caused to the shaft tube, by not using the correct Drill Bit and / or the correct tools. Others like myself have had a good experience and the rubber valve fits tight and there’s no chance of pushing it into the tube assembly. I would recommend going back and also taking pictures of the hole that’s been drilled. And asking if a Technician did the hole drilling or a work shop junior. Let me know how you get on Carl
Not saying it is but I thought the friction on the tarmac might sometimes be very high. Could be even higher than off road. And there sure are pretty uneven surfaces and large potholes. Basically the high impacts to the transmission might not only be about the torque produced by engine but also from the weight of the bike, rider, equipment and sometimes the passenger on the pillion seat together.
Hello Livari, yes you could be right. I have asked BMW to supply additional information and I am awaiting their reply from the technical team in Berlin. Best wishes Carl
It is easy to detect if the bike is in air due to a jump or not: If you are in air, then both (!) springs are usually fully expanded (front and rear). At least the rear spring should be fully expanded. Also the front wheel should have significant less rotation than the rear wheel. Under this situation the throttle control has to make shure that the rider can't turn the throttle to much and the rear wheel wouldn't match the required rotation when touching the ground again. All in all it is a driver problem, not one of the machine! Every experienced driver will close the throttle, everything else can be dangerous (not only for the gearbox).
I'm on my third GSA since 2016. I said all along it was inexperienced riders taking the bike beyond it's design limits. What concerns me is my bike being neutered. I went through this with Triumph and the bike was NEVER right again. BMW (and KTM) need to step up and market these large ADV bikes for lite off road. NOT professional, rocky single track. Just because it can be done, doesn't necessarily mean it should be. Videos of Chris Birch going crazy on a KTM doesn't help.
Hello! I was wondering if you could tell me how the vent on the driveline came out. Also I just read the following and wanted to know if you see a vent hole in the front boot as this says? ''They also, of course, have to drill a hole in the swingarm to install that one-way drain valve, and the bulletin also requires the dealer to punch a ventilation hole in the FRONT rubber boot.'' Thank You once again! My new ordered1250 GSA is almost at the Dealership.
@@justthewayitis Thank You! I have asked the dealer about the vent hole in the boot but he could not find it on his new bike. If there is one, we should know about it when we wash our bikes to be careful not to spray water into it.
I had my GSA had the software update done on Saturday. 2020 with 11k miles and the final drive shaft failed the test. My understanding is this recall is about the input shaft issue, not the final drive shaft failures. Two different issues.
Hi Carl - I bought one yesterday (not from a main dealer)- largely enticed by watching your content (Thank you) -My question is: is there anyway I can check that the bike I have has had this update simply by looking at the screen / bike info / reference anywhere? I’m told it has just been serviced (and an issue with a sticking exhaust valve resolved) but no specific mention of this? Thanks.
Hi Andrew and congratulations on your new GS. The recall can be checked by looking at the current software version number your bike has within the menu system Your looking for 023-011-060 if you have this version the software / Recall has been updated. Regarding the drive shaft inspection- test- modifications you can run the palm of your hand along the underside of the drive assembly tube at the rear. You should feel a small rubber plug / drain valve. It’s right at the back of the shaft assembly towards the rear wheel. If you have one it’s fairly obvious. You can also see it but you need to get down low and look at the underside of the drive tube. Let me know what you find… Best wishes Carl
Hi Limelight and welcome to the channel, this is a common problem and normaly it's the timing chain tensioner, you don't mention which year, model or version you are referring too.... But bmw have a upgraded part to replace the original, just go into your local dealer and order one, best wishes Carl
Is it true that BMW has an adhesive they are recommending for the duck bill drain in the drive shaft housing so it will no longer fall inside with the slightest touch? Thank You!!
Hi Mick, see my reply regarding this question below. But to recap... basically the RT-P is a Police or Forces bike also used as operational bikes for the Uk Gov.
Here in Spain some owners made the upgrade and they comment about a lose of power and reaction in the motor. Is it real? Do you noticed something? Im afraid to do the update
Hello Barbudo and welcome to the channel. My 2021 GS Rallye is now back from BMW and I have been out testing. I can confirm I can not find any difference in performance on the road, I’ve tested all the road modes and I honestly can’t detect any difference. I’ve riden my bike quite hard yesterday much more than I would normally do, so for me it’s positive. I can’t comment on the two Enduro modes as that’s an area I’m no expert in. I feel that there is a positive improvement in gear shifting using the quick shifter so I have sent an email directly to the technical team at BMW Berlin asking for confirmation about this. Once I receive a reply I will post a new episode. Best wishes Carl
Thank you for your information. Great the way you do your job. Do you ahev any info on the LED Headlight! Im anoyed cause im already waiting for alsmost 4 months Im realy pissed with the lack of soultions from B;W or even the lack of accurate info from the dealership. BMW Motorrad replies but advising to ask the dealer that has absolutely no info. Can you research for us? Thanks a lot!
Hi and welcome to the channel. The headlight is now available at many dealership and owners have now started to have them fitted to their bikes. You must physically go into your dealership and speak with the sales manager and ask for your headlight and explain its very urgent. This might help. But their are still thousands of bikes waiting for the headlight. BMW will not tell me any more information. Please go into your dealer and tell them the wait is not acceptable!!!!
@@justthewayitis Hi Carl, do you know in what countries this is being done? Im in Portugal a rather small and insignificant market for them. Thank you very much! I have been writing on all social media platforms, and call BMW out on their lack of respect and lack of answers to u.
Hi, sadly I do not know 100% which countries but I think uk and Germany subscribers have received new headlights. Have you physically been into your dealer yet and spoken to them?
@@justthewayitis Hi Carl. Yes various times. But they never have any kind of preview for the delivery. This is a nightmare and a disrespect from BMW Motorrad. And I dont mean BMW Motorrad Portugal, I realy mean BMW Germany! They are disrespecting their customers that spend an awful lot of money on one motorcycle and then no info. On Social Media teh reply is always the same, check with your dealer. For now we have not preview. Com on, dont they do Sales Forecasts what F.n job are they doing! Realy am considering changing to a different brand next time. Im really pissed with BMW. Right now I have no positive points for them! They are not showing any respect at all to us who buy their products. I have written in English I have written in German in Portuguese but either no reply or always the same BS. Carl sorry for being so blunt but Im really mad at them. I administer one group of 6000 BMW customers her in Portugal and I will make my voice heard there. I will use my influence in that group.
I appreciate your video BUT one concern I have with your analysis of their “fix”. You say it’s for the ESA to know when the bike has left the ground and people who use “enduro” or “enduro pro” modes. I received a recall notice, my bike doesn’t have ESA nor does it have enduro or enduro pro modes. So my reservation/concern remains is what on earth is this software update going to do to actually fix a faulty part? My bike doesn’t have the suspension sensors. I’m going in today for the software update. I think this will be like the spline problems on the old RT’s. BMW I don’t think put enough lubricant on some splines and they would wear out and you were out of luck with any real help from them. So I’m worried I purchased a bike that will be a heap of junk once it’s out of warranty because instead of BMW fixing the actual mechanical problem with the bike, they are kicking the can down the road with a half hearted software update. Basically this seems like a half hearted solution to something instead of actually fixing a faulty part. Often times with how stout that shaft looks, breakage of a metal component usually to me would mean it’s brittle, maybe it was heat treated too much and then it just snaps. I dunno but I feel like BMW isn’t being on the up and forward with this one.
Hi Alex, welcome to the channel. You raise some important concern that we all share. I spoke to and wrote to my contact at BMW, asking for more clarification, but what I received as a reply is still not very clear. So I have asked again for more clarification but I’m still waiting for the technical team to reply. If I receive something that is worth sharing I will will do. Best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis I wanted to follow up with you. I had the update done on my bike. I asked the service advisor and he said it limits RPM when in gear and the clutch pressed in so that way you are unlikely to drop the clutch with it at redline. So after I got the update done, my bike warmed up I was sitting at a stop light with the clutch squeezed and it in gear 1 and revved it briefly to redline, it did it. So what he said didn’t make sense. So then I put it in neural clutch pressed, revved it briefly to redline and it went to redline. So then I put it in neutral, not clutch at all, it revved to redline. So then I tried something different, I got moving and was riding down a road and squeezed the clutch and revved it briefly and it wouldn’t rev past 7,000RPM which was strange, I am not sure if that’s what he meant by not being able to redline it, but it definitely wouldn’t go to redline while moving with the clutch pressed. So I never tried any of that before and couldn’t tell you what it was like before the update. I don’t ever rev, race or redline my bike so I don’t know if while riding and you squeeze the clutch and try to rev it if it would allow redline rev before the update? I just wanted to let you know what the dealer told me and what I noticed on my bike trying show what he claimed. I hope that makes sense. I was riding at about 65MPH in 6th gear and squeezed the clutch then revved it up with the clutch squeezed and it stopped at 7,000RPM. I brought back down the RPMs and released the clutch gently. I still don’t fully understand how software fixes a hardware problem 😄 I guess time will tell. I did pick up my 100,000 mile award when I went in for the service. That felt nice, I had gone thru 100,000 miles on my old R1150RT.
Hi Alex, big thank you for sharing your experience and bike test. It’s very interesting what you have shared. I did get a reply from BMW about engine rpm limits and the gears they applied too but it just did not make any sense how they worded the document, so I replied and asked for further clarification. I’ll send another email to the technical team next week and see what they say. Congratulations on your 100K award 🥇
Thank you for a very informative upload. I have a 2019 gs 1250 and my bike was due a service late last year (bought it last year). I asked about updates to the software and was told by the main dealer in Ireland that they had been instructed by BMW not to update software if there wasn't an issue with the existing version on the bike. I thought it strange as this gives the dealer a competitive advantage when servicing as I or a 3rd party can't update software. Will have to see if this recall updates the software ro the newest version or if it just is a patch to whatever version is on the bike
Thanks a lot for the video and I didn't expect the fix will be a software update. I was looking on the internet and for this recall there is a part need to be upgraded which the timing chain tensioner on the left side (part# 11317108586) which is part of that issue. appreciate your feedback on this.
Hi Beemer, sorry I’m not sure I understand your question. The recall in this episode is only software no parts. The tensioner upgrade is something completely different and normally related to ticking or excessive noise on the left side. Carl
Here is something that would be of GREAT help. In the BMW OWNERS MANUAL it says ''ATTENTION Charging the battery connected to the vehicle using the battery terminals Damage to the motorcycle's electronics. '' I called 3 dealerships and all 3 said the first thing they do is to install a SAE connecter to charge the battery. According to BMW, we are suppose to use the DIN connecter. However everyone I talk to seems to use the SAE connected right to the battery. What is your thought on this and why does BMW say NOT TO charge the battery in the bike from the battery terminals? Thank You!
Hi Eric, DIN or SAE or any other battery charger type interface is fine. I use ctek mxs 5.0 charging system with their own version of the connectors. Which is similar to SAE. Batteries should never be charged in confined spaces using normal battery clamp type connectors because of the possibility of explosion. It’s very rare but can happen because the gases that are released during charging are explosive and if you accidentally cause a spark at one of the terminals it could cause an accident. You can safely use DIN which is a North American standard or SAE which is European standard. SAE is probably the better system or something similar like the Ctek system. Best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis I found this explanation as to why the BMW owners manual says not to charge the battery other than using the DIN. Sounds possible but everyone I talk to charges right at the battery. Thanks for your help! Of course you can always attach a charger directly to the battery but BMW instructs you to not do so while the battery is installed in the bike. Why? The reason is that many modern chargers are “smart” and will try to recondition (disulphate) a battery if it decides that the battery needs reconditioning. The desulphation process involves the application of high voltage pulses to the battery and if the battery is connected in the bike then all the bike’s expensive electronics also get exposed to the high voltage pulses as well. So there is some risk of damage involved. BMW isn’t going to try to explain how to determine whether your particular charger has a desulphation capability or not so it just tells you not to charge the battery directly in the bike to mitigate the risk. If you have a smart charger and intend to connect direct to the battery while the battery is in the bike you should read the charger’s manual to see if the desulphation mode can be disabled. I use the Optimate 4 charger in its “CAN-bus mode” (sic) direct to the battery because in that mode high voltage desulphation is deactivated. I can’t be bothered with charging via the accessory port.
Hi Eric, thank you for sharing this information I’m sure it will be helpful to many other owners who have a similar question. Have a great Sunday and thank you 🙏 Carl
Great video Carl, thank you. One question, do you have a link to those charts you created regarding ride modes, etc? I'd love to download it and print it out. Thanks again and keep up the great videos.
As a matter of interest, what are your thoughts related to the installation of a trailer hitch on a 1250 GSA? I understand it would be based on an opinion.
I watched that and a couple other hitch videos tonight, looks interesting but I'm not sure it's a solution for everyone, are you thinking of adding this to yours? What is it that you need to transport?
@@justthewayitis I was wanting to take my camping gear, drone, and other things to California. However it wasn't practical to carry everything on the bike. I haven't made up my mind yet. The trailer isn't cheap and I can always take less.
Wonderful! Thank You for posting. Can you help us with the ''R1200/1250GS Service Action 0033130000 Install vent valve in driveshaft housing'' issue also please? Here is what I know: I have viewed your video on the Service Action 0033130000, however when reading the attached, it makes it sound as if the ''u'' joint angle or design may be the problem? Are they going with a new style ''u'' joint or something else? Are the replaced drive shafts a new design? The cardan is to be checked and a vent valve retrofitted on a total of 440,000 motorcycles worldwide, especially on the R 1250 GS and R 1200 GS from 2013. "In order to improve long-term quality", according to BMW Motorrad's official formulation, the authorized workshops are currently being prepared for a very extensive service campaign: the cardan shafts of a total of 440,000 motorcycles worldwide are to be checked over the course of the next few months, ideally as part of the scheduled inspections will. 72,000 of them in Germany alone. The campaign primarily affects BMW's most important model: the boxer GS. Specifically, the R 1250 GS and the R 1200 GS from year of manufacture 2013, both type K50, as well as the respective adventure variants, type K51. In addition, there is the official version RT, type K52. Universal joint, articulation angle, corrosion Background according to BMW, from a message to the dealers: "Service campaign during the next visit to the workshop - retrofit drainage in the swingarm and check the cardan shaft. Damage to the cardan shaft occasionally occurs, which impairs the function of the drive. In individual cases, propulsion can be lost Several factors contribute to the occurrence of damage.Corrosion effects, among others, play a role if they occur at functionally relevant points.Signs of wear caused by running time or particular climatic and dynamic loads can also lead to component damage. These effects can be caused by the geometric chassis design (kink angle of the universal joints in the swing arm) be reinforced." R 1200 GS, R 1250 GS and official RT Apparently, a conspicuous accumulation of cardan defects was found in the Boxer GS from year of manufacture 2013 (with water-cooled engine) and in the R 1200 RT and R 1250 RT in the official version. With the GS, the cardan is subject to greater stress due to the concept, because of the longer spring deflection and the associated articulation angle between the cardan tunnel and the rear axle drive. This is where the cardan's rear universal joint is located. In addition, depending on the user, there is more or less tough enduro use. In any case, the authorities' RT are subjected to above-average strain, for example when driving over high curbs. Cardan check with special device So that the cardan does not have to be opened on all 440,000 motorcycles concerned, every authorized workshop is to be given a special test device. Instead of the rear wheel, a measuring disk is mounted, and then the cardan is dragged over the rear axle while idling, that is, rotated. This stress test runs over various load changes and speeds, with sensors monitoring the forces and vibrations. If everything stays within the predefined normal range, the checked gimbal is considered "okay". If there are any abnormalities, a closer look is taken. In particular, the universal joint with its four roller bearings, but also the gearing to the rear axle drive is checked for rust and damage. Should parts then have to be replaced, Vent hole with beak valve In principle, a vent on the cardan tunnel is retrofitted during this service campaign. For this purpose, a small hole is drilled on the underside in the rear area, near the universal joint, using a prepared template. In order to avoid the formation of potentially harmful metal chips, the drill should be lubricated beforehand. A rubber beak valve is then inserted into this hole using a kind of piercing tool. This special valve is intended to seal the hole to the outside, but allow air and, above all, moisture to escape from the cardan tunnel. This ventilation is supported by the pumping movements during compression and rebound. If water runs out immediately after drilling, this is also a reason to inspect the cardan more closely. 45 minutes per motorcycle A total of 45 minutes are allotted for the cardan check including retrofitting the ventilation. Of course, this campaign is free of charge - at least for the customers, BMW will incur some costs.
Hi Eric, well my GS has not yet been done, it goes in for the Recall and the Shaft Inspection in about 10 days time. So maybe after my appointment i will know more details. Lots of subscribers have had the inspection done, some have reported that BMW have indeed replaced the drive shaft because : A: it fails the workshop test parameters, or B: excessive corrosion was found on the shaft / joints, or C: excessive play on the splines or joints. I am not aware that when fitting and replacement shaft BMW install a modified part, i believe its the original version. But i will ask about this while at my local dealer in a week or so. Some owners have sadly experienced very poor work by some of the BMW dealers, in some cases damaging the outer casing, while drilling the hole for the drain plug. Have a read through the comments sections as there are many hundreds of owners sharing there experiences. Thankyou for taking the time to reply, kind regards Carl
@@justthewayitis Thank You! I will look for your update. I have a 2023 BMW 1250 GSA that was built last week, so I hope all is good. Did you read the part about the ''Universal joint, articulation angle''? Perhaps a larger ''U'' joint would help? Maybe have someone check to see if the new replacement drive shaft has larger ''u'' joints?
Hi WoodNotts well they are doing the drive shaft inspection test and modifications when you go in for the next service (see separate video) but yes it would have been nice. Carl
These are two separate issues: the rear drive shaft modification is called a "Service Notification" which will be performed the next time your bike goes into BMW. Todays episode is about an actual RECALL and we will need to return our bikes to have this done. Both things can and probably will be done at the same time. Good Question Inspector... Regards Carl
Thank you Car for the video. Dealer recently have done software update regarding that recall with my gsa. After that bike get vibrations when idling. Any one have same issue?
Hi, welcome to the channel. That’s a strange one, I can’t think what in the software update would or could generate a vibration. Anything lose under the seat ? Definitely go back to your dealer and have them check your GSA Carl
@Just The Way It Is Hi Carl. I thought that could be a new pump map or so. Do you know the latest firmware number for gsa? Maybe they uploaded some from another model? 🤔 Dealer kept my bike over the night, telling me that the updating process is so slow. Not so sure about this.
Hi the software version you should have I don’t know, I would imagine it’s different due to the suspension being different. Keeping the bike overnight is quite normal as it depends on their internet connection speed, some bikes update very quickly and of course they need to use the programming bay. Let me know what they say. Carl
Hello Vinh and welcome to the channel. My GS is currently at my local bmw dealership, so I currently do not know the software version or number. Once my bike is home I will check and make another video. Best wishes Carl
Hi Vinh, my GS is back the software version you list above 023-011-060 is correct and this is the latest version that is installed for the Recall 👍 Best wishes Carl
Given that BMW have an IMU / ride by wire therefore have control of engine torque. I would suggest that the speed of engine vs rear wheel speed is not the issue exactly. It will be more about the throttle opening and therefore torque. The shaft will fail due to torque being transmitted not the speed it is turning. When the bike unloads then hits the ground the engine could be producing relatively high torque and the wheel possibly in some instance grips up causing a high instantaneous torque ( turning force) on the input shaft and the shaft is not strong enough to cope with this instantaneous torque. The correct thing for BMW to do would be to design, manufacture and install a new input shaft that can cope. However this would be astronomically expensive. So they do what is the cheapest way out of the situation, a software work round of the problem. My guess would be they sense when the rear wheel is in full droop check the engine torque output from the calculated value from the ecu, check the gear, look at the damper rate then back the engine torque down with reducing throttle angle (through ride by wire). Shafts in general typically fail due to the torque applied to them exceeding their design limit. So either reduce the torque or increase the designed torque limit of the shaft.
Hi Tim, interesting observations and thank you for sharing. I understand that they have reverted to a similar TC setting as the 2019 1200 and monitor and engine and transmission speeds with some form of control, possibly both ends TC and throttle butterfly adjustments. Your thought process seems logical and it’s possible though. Maybe we will never know for sure what they have tweaked. Carl
I ride my bike every day, and I immediately noticed a difference in the low to midrandge snap in dynamic mode..like the power is more spread out now compared to how it used to be. Is it in my head or did they also change the general map. Very strange..
I did ask the technical team to clarify all the changes but they didn’t want to share a lot more, but like you I think some general map changes have taken place. Plus of course the language barrier doesn’t make for easy translation 😉
Hi Beemer, the new software version is 023-011-060 this is the version that is applied if your bike goes back for the Recall update. More details to follow in a future episode regarding the changes made to the software Best wishes Carl
Hi Anubhav if you are referring to use with the quick shifter… then yes. The new software update apparently improves this, but I can’t confirm at the moment, Carl
@@justthewayitis thanks for responding Carl. How do I overcome this challenge with quick shifter? Could you make a video? Your other videos are so informative. I also got my first servicing done yesterday and I was told that my bike will not need to Software update. How could I know if it will need updates or not? It’s a 2022 manufactured.
Well I don’t use the quick shifter in the first three gears going up the box. With regards to your software update only the bmw dealer can tell you this, but let me know your current software version by going into your menu and checking. Let me know the full number
@@justthewayitis - So when i do a gear change in a conventional way i.e. pulling full clutch, releasing the throttle, then changing the gear... then its makes even more noise and the gear shifts does not happen smoothly. To be honest, I am quite disappointed with this. I am going participate in a GS experience in March. I hope i can learn a bit about it there. My Yamaha R3 was sooo good in this regard. I'll get back to you about S/W version number.
At this moment of writing the current version is K001_23_03_501 this I received from one of the channel subscribers. My GS has gone in today for the service and update I will confirm once I have the bike back home Carl
Hi Mark, sorry to hear about your experience, I hope they can do something to help you, perhaps they nudged a wire on your canbus while connecting for the software update. Carl
Good explanation of the recall. The failure may be uncommon but the fact is that the ‘fix’ is an admission of an engineering design failure, pure and simple. Enduro pro mode is being watered down to mask a deficiency in the driveline. If there were no manufacturing or material defects in the failed parts then the design is marginal with insufficient factor of safety. It seems that BMW beta tests and customers finish the job and find the flaws. BMW driveline problems are rife, driveshafts fail at low miles. Water gets in, corrodes and seizes splines. It’s just not good enough. This, and other problems are why I got rid of my 1250. Which is a shame.
To answer a question that seems to be asked a lot: the BMW R1250RT-P bike is a Police / Deployment specification bike that is used by UK and EU government agencies in various applications. It is quite often heavily loaded with extra equipment and gear and can on occasion receive a fair amount of hard use. I believe this is why the RT-P version of the R1250 is being included in this recall. I Hope this extra information helps answer question about why its included. I doubt anyone takes this bike off-road.... smile
Hope so, thanks
Hi Rachid and welcome to the channel.
Had my bike updated while in the shop for my 6-6.5k service--about a month ago. And let me tell you, YOUR explanation of the issue and resolution was FAR more detailed than that given by my Service Writer! Frankly, I doubt he was even a tenth as informed as you. Thanks for telling it Just The Way It Is Carl!
Hi Ray, thank you for your compliment. I think each dealership is different in terms of knowledge and understanding. Some better than others. I have reached out the BMW Berlin and there technical team and asked them to provide more specific information… but unusually I have not received a reply yet. Normally they are happy to share more technical information with me.
Once I know more I will post an update
Best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis UPDATE: Received my official Recall Notice in yesterday's (2/25/23) mail.
Hi Ray, that’s great news, just in time for spring arriving and the start of summer. 👍
Grazie mille per le ottime delucidazioni e la rassicurazione.
Your welcome Andrea
Meticulous and extremely thoughtful - thank you so much for this clarification. Now if only the recall letter was as descriptive.
Hi SkyBlue, thank you for your feedback 👍, welcome to the channel
Carl
Good afternoon Carl, about 2 weeks ago I acquired an R1250GS TRIPLE BLACK and I have been an attentive spectator of your videos. Thank you for the excellent work on the videos.
A month without publishing news about the R1250GS... is a long time ehehehe
Thank you and a big hug from Portugal
Hi Pedro, thank you for your feedback, currently working on the next few episodes and hope to have one ready by Easter. Congratulations on your new bike 👍
Danke für die ganzen Informationen die du mit uns teilst. Deine unaufgeregte Art ist perfekt verständlich. Mach bitte weiter so!
Hallo Tanias, danke schön. Ich freue mich, dass dir das Video gefallen hat. die besten Wünsche… Carl
Kudos for the calm and well reasoned take on this. A lot of the comments over on ADVRider were hysterical to put it kindly.
Hi Paul, thank you for your feedback. Bikes are never perfect so when a manufacturer does a recall it’s a 👍 from me. Yes the opinions on the forums are divided and that’s all fine. Best wishes Carl
I am in the U.S. and took my bike in to install the drain at the bottom of the FD. The software recall had been issued a couple of days earlier so the dealer installed the new software. The head of the service department had not been told what the effect of the software would be, 'something from Germany'. Thank you for the explanation. I was afraid it was going to be something to limit torque and reduce performance.
Hi Rick, well now you can send him the link to my video so he knows what the guys in Germany are doing.... smile
Thanks for the update Carl. As usual the absolute best info on anything GS related! Legend
Hi Mark, thank you for your positive feedback 🙏
Great explanation. I heard about the recall from a friend and then found your video. It's demystified the issue for me in simple terms and very easy to understand.
Hi Daniel, good morning, thank you for your feedback and welcome to the channel. Best wishes Carl
Thanks Carl. As always, a really great and helpful video. Thank you for taking the time to inform us about this. I received the recall letter from BMW today.
Hi Max, that’s great news. I had a feeling that bmw would bring forward the start of the recall once us owners were aware of it. It’s great to hear your dealer has decided to start early ready for the start of the season.
FYI, mine has now been done and I can’t tell any difference in terms of performance but… the quick shifter now operates much better.
Best wishes Carl
As a potential buyer of a BMW and having worked in part of the industry that deals with issues, it is heartening to understand how they approached it and ultimately improved it. This manufacturing behavior will sit well in my mind as I decide what to buy next. TY BMW.
Hello TY and welcome to the channel, thank you for your feedback on this episode in the series. I know not everyone agrees but I, like you, think BMW are trying to address these issues and improve the bikes. I wish you happy hunting for whichever bike you finally decide on. Carl
Just purchased a 2019 Gsa 1250 with 5k miles. Had 50/50 tires. Got both recalls completed and really appreciated your videos to explain why…took tires to the next level and installed Michelin Road 6 tires… love them!
Hi Eric, the Road 5 and 6 are a very popular choice as are the Continental trail attacks. Thank you for your feedback. Carl
Thank you for the update. It's great to see BMW taking such extensive measures to correct a niche problem. Makes me like BMW Motorrad even more....and that you brought this to our attention and did all the research, like this channel more.
Thank you Correy 🙏
Thank you for making this video and explaining this recall so thoroughly. My local dealer - Desert Valley Powersports - notified me of the recall last week for my 2021 BMW R1250 GSA, and installed the software update (kudos to DVP for the great customer service). I don't do any ambitious off-roading with my GSA, so I'm not too concerned about an issue. However, with motocross/supercross racers you'll often see/hear them leave the throttle on while in the air while jumping for a couple of reasons, one of which is to minimize landing impact, as landing with the throttle off can be jarring and slower during a race. So for those GS/GSA riders jumping their bikes, keeping the throttle on helps smooth out the landing so it isn't so jarring. Kudos to BMW for addressing this.
Hi Jeff, thankyou for sharing this information, we all can learn from it, although I personally have and would never take my GS jumping off-road. Nice to hear your dealer DVP has sorted things for you. carl
Good information Jeff, I want to add that in motocross when you jump, you use the throttle to maintain the inertia and control the bike on the air, so if BMW will not allow to control the bike with the throttle and cut the engine, it will induce a nose dive and potentially cause an accident; in my humble opinion, thanks
Hi Adogarz, thank you for sharing your experience and thoughts. Carl
You produce very useful content about Bmw R 1250 GSA. Thank you. I watch and learn videos like a lesson.
Hello Toso, Thank you for your feedback and positive comments. Best wishes Carl
Thank you sire for making this video. Watching the regular review of these bike are common but the information you shared gave quite a bit of inside curve to a buying decision for my next GSA.
Hello Raskar and welcome to the channel I’m pleased you are enjoying the series and the extra insight provided. I wish you lots of fun choosing your options and accessories. Let me know which model and spec you go for.
Best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis Indeed you efforts are commendable. I just put in my deposit for a triple black GSA. Within a month, I shall have me own Tractor to shred the streets.
👍
An experienced rider would land with power on. However, if the bike bike may not handle it that is a whole other issue. Thanks for the video and nice work.
Thank you for your feedback. Carl
Many thanks for that Carl, highly appreciated. Now I know the full background on why I wasn't allowed to take delivery of the bike. With a bit of luck it will be done by the weekend. Keep fingers crossed 🙂
Congratulations on your new bike 👍 your going to have a lot of fun
Wow!!!!
Thank you for the detailed explanation. I thought the recall would reduce power/torque.
It’s actually managing the bike in specific scenarios. I applaud BMW. My 2022 R1250GS 40th has been stellar!!!
Hi Flash, and welcome to the channel. Thank you for your feedback 👍
Best wishes Carl
Another great video Carl. Keep them coming!
Thank you Bruce…👍
Good video. I had a call from my dealer last week 26/01/23 about this recall and my bike is booked in for this and the swingarm drain.
Hi Hartley that’s great news, sounds like you have a nice friendly dealer. Best wishes Carl
Great info and video. Thank you! Nice to see BMW taking responsibility for this. Wish they were this forward thinking about all the final drive failures in the past. Looking forward to this software update and the drive shaft corrosion check for my GS and GSA.
Hi Moto, I feel things are changing, BMW is aware that more and more customers view online content, just like this episode, and have realized that things have to change. I know BMW watch some of my videos and perhaps they don't approve of everything but in my case they do go out of there way to help / assist and answer questions, and they do have a great technical support team.. So from my small perspective things are getting better. Best wishes Carl
I am not every air born I am thinking of doing a short road trip to get jt close to 6k service and drop it out.
Appreciate the explanation . Now I do not have worry during my spring road trip
Thank you , and I hope you enjoy your trip they are great bikes to tour on. Carl
Another great video...BMW should have you on their public relations team.
I will let you make that suggestion to them, 😊 Carl
You are amazing, thank you from Hungary
Hi James your welcome
Hi thanks bikes booked in for tomorrow. Spoken with my local dealership in York UK they’re gonna plug it in and see if the software update works on my bike due to the fact that it does go off road and I do sometimes get up in the air. Much appreciated.👍🤘
Hi Paul, then do let me and the others know what you find out from your appointment especially as your a a GS Pilot 👍
Kindest regards Carl
Thanks for the Well informed information, called at my local dealer they said bring it in today (Tuesday 31st) sorted couldn’t ask for a better service
Hi Mya, welcome to the channel, that’s a great service from your dealer. Perfect 👍 best wishes Carl
Thank you for keeping ahead of these things for us Carl. I’m glad I’ve subscribed to your channel.
Hi Brian, good morning and thank you 🙏
Very useful and informative information. Hope to see more video from you. Take care.
Hi Unlock and welcome to the channel, thank you 👍
Received my letter yesterday, I have an R1250 GS 2020 and will call my dealer next week
Hi Graham that’s great news. Thank you for sharing. Mine is currently with BMW and the bike should be delivered back next week. Will report more once it’s back and I’ve been out for good road test, Carl
Really well explained, thank you. I wondered how a software fix could address this issue.
Hi Russ, thank you for feedback and welcome to the channel. Yes the program or software engineers are certainly kept busy with our modern motorbikes. Best wishes Carl
The software version that BMW installed during the Recall is:
023-011-060, my bike has just been done. Best wishes Carl
Excellent video Carl. It keeps the owners informed.
Thank you, that’s all I really aim to do, keep us owners informed and share a little information. Best wishes Carl
As usual Carl 😀. Best regards, Edward.
Thanks for putting this into perspective. Great job as always. My dealer tells me it takes about 2 hours. Best!
Hi Creed, thankyou, the update time varies depending on the bikes current software version. The older bikes can take up to 4-5 hours to update, whereas a newer bike might only take 1-2 hours or less. Regards Carl
Fours hours for my late 2021 GS!
Thankyou for sharing that Michael, regards Carl
My theory is that the difference in speed between the rear wheel rotation speed and the engine speed is actually not that the rear wheel has spun up while in the air and is rotating too fast at landing but rather that the bike's software perceived the spin up and decided to apply the rear brake thinking that was an appropriate intervention. It's the application of the rear brake that causes the driveline such stress. The software fix now accounts for the fact that the bike is in a air.
Hi Michael and thank you for sharing this viewpoint. In BMW technical report I didn’t see mention of this but what you described seems possible. But I’m not going jumping my bike to find out… smile. Regards Carl
I’d be pretty certain that braking pressure to the calliper can only be taken away not added therefore unless you are on the brake the management system cannot brake the rear wheel independent of the rider
Thanks Carl, another very informative video. By chance I was at my dealer's earlier today booking my 2021 GSA in for a service. I'd heard the rumours of a recall but before I could ask about it the service manager brought it up and offered to carry out the update when the bike goes in. Like the indicator update I had done before the bike will have to be hooked up to a computer for about 5 hours.
Hi Tsport, I think most of us will combine the recall with a service, glad to hear yours is booked in. Spring is slowly arriving....Carl
Did my update two days ago. Took them approximately one hour. No changes in power or torque that I can notice, as much people were concern. The engine seams perky and quick shifter has smooth click changing gears. Love how BMW pay attention to details.
Hi Oliver a few owners have mentioned the quick shifter being better after this software update so perhaps they have included a tweak to that too which would be great 👍 Carl
Thank you for taking the time. Very well explained.
Hi Brad and welcome to the channel glad you enjoyed the episode. Best wishes Carl
Tq Carl...as usual, you have been very helpful....
Thank you David 👍
The voice of reason. Great explanation, thanks Carl 👍
Thank you 😊
Mines booked in for Feb 22nd for this update ..thanks Carl
Hi Mr and Mrs T , nice to hear from you, glad its booked in Andy. Spring is slowly coming Carl
@Just The Way happy new year to you Carl hope you are well.. we ate heading back down through Germany to Austria end of May beging of June ..Gona be great to get back to touring Europe again .
Don't forget to get some Autobahn time in..... smile, currently working on "Still working on" our tour of Norway episode but with 9 people taking pictures and videos i have over 1,600 pictures and 756Gb of video to get through. Carl
Thank you, had mine done, took 10min, quick software update. 2022 1250GS.
Hi Roman, thankyou for confirming the update speed on the later bikes. best wishes Carl
Excellent explanation....still smells like neutering power in enduro mode...and BMW doing quiet damage control. May just be a weakness of shaft drives in general for heavy offroad thrashing...
Yes you could be right, I don’t think we will ever be told the truth.
Best wishes Carl
Just booked my GSA in for a service and they said it had to come in for a recall ( already knew after seeing your vid) part of the recall is you don’t have to take it in, it’s up to BMW UK to collect it & drop it back off. (They don’t tell you that though) dealer told me so they are collecting mine in bike van
Hi Steven thank you for sharing this. You are correct 👍 mine was collected by BMW in a van on Wednesday . It was due a service so I asked them to collect it, initially they said no I have to take the bike to them,,,,, but I reminded them about the recall and surprise surprise they called back and said YES we will collect and return for free.
I hope other owners are able to learn from us both 👍
Fascinating stuff, thanks for all the research.
No Problem
Even an experience rider may throttle up when airborn. Many riders were taught that the gyroscopic spin will bring the rear end down so you don't nose down, bottom out front forks and go over the bars when landing. It might not be prefered meathode to pull the rear tire down, but still many riders may have learned same thing.
Hi David, thank you for sharing this , it’s new news to me so I’m very grateful to you for sharing. Never to old to learn 👍
Carl
Super informative and precise as always. Thanks for your effort.
HI Soren, thank you for the feedback. Carl
Muy buena y técnica información. Mil gracias
Hi Eduardo, thank you 🙏
Great video! Now my actual question is why did you install OEM BMW fog lights and not Clearwater or Denali lights?
Btw, I used your video to install my Weiser led lights yesterday; thank you!!!
Hi Mario, congratulations on your Weiser-Tech light installation 👍.
As to my lights, we’ll both of the brads you mentioned make really great lights, but my GS originally came as a test bike and the OEM spot lights we’re already installed. See episode 1-3.
Best wishes Carl
There has been no mention of whether the software update will DECREASE torque and/or HP? It is my understanding that Torque and HP are decreased for the Rain mode. Is this software simply doing the same thing to some degree to the other modes? If so, the HP/Torque numbers claimed by BMW when bike was released are no longer valid. The explanation of the rear wheel vs engine RPMs due to wheel being off the ground does not make sense if the RT is also affected.
Hi Louis, I’ve answered the RT-P question several times below, perhaps have a read. No decrease in torque or HP. Best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis just found it. Thanks much for your hard work!
Thank you 😊
You can add me to the list of whom had an input shaft failure with my R1250GSA, 2022 model. The bike has only 19000 km and I use it mainly on the road in Dynamic Pro mode most of the time and do lots of jumping on the road at high speed(140km & above). Luckily, when the shaft broke, the rear wheel didn't lock up.
If you are jumping at 140km/h and above then your issue is certainly not the input shaft...but I get your sarcasm 🤣
Hi Talib, thank you for sharing.
In the documents I have seen, BMW detail a reimbursement programme for owners that have had a Gearbox related issue / problem with any bike that is listed. I believe you just need to take your invoice / receipt back to your dealer and present it. BMW have an official programme to cover these costs and i think.... owners get a full refund. First contact your dealer if you had to pay for repairs. Regards Carl
@purificator1004 what a hero 🎉
😇
ANOTHER GREAT VIDEO!
Thank you 🙏
Thanks for that information don’t know if it relates to my bike, but that’s why I like BMW 👍
Hi Paul, well you can quickly check that with your chassis number online. Best Wishes Carl
A very full and clear explanation, but just one question. Why is the RT included in the recall? Do they also get taken off road and airborne, or is there something else causing this issue.
Hi Philip, its a good question, the recall specifically mentions the RT-P version which is a Police and Authority specification built bike. This bike is quite often used as a surveillance or undercover bike by different government forces and departments in the UK and the EU. I guess the logic for recalling this bike, is that these bikes probably get a harder time than the normal RT, but that's just my guess. Carl
Excellent point!!
@@justthewayitis Cops will jump off curbs sometimes.
Hi Eric, I'm sure they sometimes do a little more than that.... smile
Another great video many thanks
Your welcome Pete
Thanks for the info mate much appreciated 👍
Hi Scott, your welcome.
La semaine dernière, la concession a effectué le changement de cardan et la mise à jour du logiciel. Apparemment, le check BMW n'indique plus de rappel. Merci pour les infos.
👍🙏😊
On one of your videos
You had a side note that dropped down from the top to the bottom
By the time it got to the top of the side note the bottom of the side note was gone
If your going to do something like that start it at the bottom so viewers can read it as it goes up
Its backwards to show the end first and the start last
Hi Paul, ill try to remember to check that next time. Carl
Great video! My bike is a R1250 GSA without Dynamic, Enduro and Enduro Pro but it was recalled; so I don't think is a problem with off road modes, it is something else that also is affecting the RT-police model.. thank you for the information!
Glad you enjoyed the episode, best wishes Carl
As it is just a little software update (some additional parameters) I don't think that bmw will do this for only a small group of drivers. They do stuff like this always for all type of bikes with the same type-code (like K51). Only this way future updates are consistent. Ordinary drivers shouldn't feel any difference in the behaviour of their bike.
👍
You said, not to worry if we used the GS more on road usages. But, why BMW still recalled on RT model? Since RT more on road usages.
Hi Ealt the RT-P model is a Police or forces bike, see my replies below about similar questions. Best wishes Carl
Thanks for the information. If you ever need any footage of some of the parts of the 1250 engine I have filmed some as I repair crashed r1200/1250's. I can show you what happens when you dont have crash bars
Now that sounds interesting 🤔
Thank you for the info
Hi Carl, your videos are very helpful to me and are so carefully put together, thank you.
Please can I have your thoughts on one matter, please. You previously talked about a software update for tft screens. My local bmw dealer won’t update my 2021 model R1250GSA unless there is a warranty fault or unless I agree to pay. This seems wrong to me?
Regards
Chris Nix
Hello A RUclips user, 2021 GS and GSA onwards bikes are currently being recalled for a software update you will receive a letter from BMW advising you to return your bike. Owners have started receiving these. See my video
I would suggest you visit your local dealer taking your chassis number with you and ask them to check for any outstanding recall or updates that are required for your bike.
The work will be done FOC.
If you ask just for a TFT update they may decline or charge you for that service.
But the software which includes everything is being done to all bikes under warranty.
Let me know how you get on
Carl
Excellent, thank you!
Hi Peter, thank you
Just had this recall done yesterday. Took an hour to finish.
Hello Tcat, welcome to the channel and glad to hear your recall has been done. BMW are getting through them quickly now.
Best wishes Carl
When your BMW goes in for the drive line check and rubber valve vent install, could you find out some information for us please? More than a few people that have had the rubber check valve installed are saying that it fits very loose and one person said his got pushed inside the drive housing and is just laying in there. There seems to be no lip on the outside to prevent it from being pushed inside. I was thinking if this is the case, perhaps some black silicone seal would be a good idea which would be easy to do. What do you think? Thank You!!
Ok I will
@@justthewayitis Thank you so much. Others have said to be careful when washing and drying as it can fly right off. Perhaps a dab of black silicone?
@@justthewayitis Where you able to get the breather installed?
Hi Eric my 2021 GS Rallye is now back from my dealer after the service, software update and drive assembly test and modifications.
My valve is installed correctly and it’s not loose and is unlikely to fall out as other owners have mentioned.
I will upload a new episode soon detailing the work once I hear back from BMW Berlin. I have asked for clarification on the software update and a possible quick shifter firmware update.
Once I receive a reply I will let you know, best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis Thank You! Have not heard of a possible quick shifter firmware update.
Yup mine is going in tomorrow .👍
Have they also already done the drive shaft update ? or is that being done at the same time. Carl
@@justthewayitis I take it you mean the rubber valve to let water out? Mine had that done at the factory . Also getting a new quick shifter fitted as I have had issues with downshifts(under warranty).
Yes, that's the mod. Glad to hear your getting a new QS,
Just had the duckbill drain installed and it’s garbage, you can and I did feel for it and pushed it into the arm. It’s just sitting there. Washing the bike with a sponge you could push it in without ever knowing. On a sky lift a jet wash will without trying will push it out. How is yours? I’m sending it back as I’m not satisfied with it. Surely this should have lugs on internal and external ends so it’s secure. Interested on your thoughts
Hi Steven, yes take your bike back and write a letter of complaint to go with it, along with taking pictures.
The quality of the work seems to vary greatly depending on the dealership and importantly who does the work. Some owners have had extremely poor work done during the valve installation and damage has been caused to the shaft tube, by not using the correct Drill Bit and / or the correct tools.
Others like myself have had a good experience and the rubber valve fits tight and there’s no chance of pushing it into the tube assembly.
I would recommend going back and also taking pictures of the hole that’s been drilled. And asking if a Technician did the hole drilling or a work shop junior.
Let me know how you get on
Carl
Not saying it is but I thought the friction on the tarmac might sometimes be very high. Could be even higher than off road. And there sure are pretty uneven surfaces and large potholes. Basically the high impacts to the transmission might not only be about the torque produced by engine but also from the weight of the bike, rider, equipment and sometimes the passenger on the pillion seat together.
Hello Livari, yes you could be right. I have asked BMW to supply additional information and I am awaiting their reply from the technical team in Berlin.
Best wishes Carl
It is easy to detect if the bike is in air due to a jump or not: If you are in air, then both (!) springs are usually fully expanded (front and rear). At least the rear spring should be fully expanded.
Also the front wheel should have significant less rotation than the rear wheel. Under this situation the throttle control has to make shure that the rider can't turn the throttle to much and the rear wheel wouldn't match the required rotation when touching the ground again.
All in all it is a driver problem, not one of the machine! Every experienced driver will close the throttle, everything else can be dangerous (not only for the gearbox).
Hi Jaro, thank you for sharing your thoughts. Best wishes Carl 👍
I'm on my third GSA since 2016. I said all along it was inexperienced riders taking the bike beyond it's design limits. What concerns me is my bike being neutered. I went through this with Triumph and the bike was NEVER right again. BMW (and KTM) need to step up and market these large ADV bikes for lite off road. NOT professional, rocky single track. Just because it can be done, doesn't necessarily mean it should be. Videos of Chris Birch going crazy on a KTM doesn't help.
Well said.
I have to agree with you and Mayhem, but it is entertaining to watch Chris use his skills on such a big heavy bike. Regards Carl
great explanations but still not conviced: so why the RT is recall!?
Hi please read first comment below, I have answered this many times, Carl
Hello! I was wondering if you could tell me how the vent on the driveline came out. Also I just read the following and wanted to know if you see a vent hole in the front boot as this says?
''They also, of course, have to drill a hole in the swingarm to install that one-way drain valve, and the bulletin also requires the dealer to punch a ventilation hole in the FRONT rubber boot.''
Thank You once again! My new ordered1250 GSA is almost at the Dealership.
Hi Eric I’ll try to remember to go into the garage and check tomorrow
I will report back
Carl
@@justthewayitis Thank You! I have asked the dealer about the vent hole in the boot but he could not find it on his new bike. If there is one, we should know about it when we wash our bikes to be careful not to spray water into it.
Hi Eric, I’ve looked and can’t see one on my bike either
@@justthewayitis Thank You. Well maybe that is a good thing as it may of let water in.
Hi Carl, excellent video. I was wondering we have a slippery clutch to minimise these forces. Or is the slippery clutch disabled in enduro pro mode?
Hi and welcome to the channel. I do not know the answer to this question. Sorry 😞. But I am pleased your enjoyed the episode. Best wishes Carl 👍
I had my GSA had the software update done on Saturday. 2020 with 11k miles and the final drive shaft failed the test. My understanding is this recall is about the input shaft issue, not the final drive shaft failures. Two different issues.
Hi HDK, correct, two separate issues.
ones a Recall, the other a service notification.
Hi Carl - I bought one yesterday (not from a main dealer)- largely enticed by watching your content (Thank you) -My question is: is there anyway I can check that the bike I have has had this update simply by looking at the screen / bike info / reference anywhere? I’m told it has just been serviced (and an issue with a sticking exhaust valve resolved) but no specific mention of this? Thanks.
Hi Andrew and congratulations on your new GS. The recall can be checked by looking at the current software version number your bike has within the menu system
Your looking for 023-011-060 if you have this version the software / Recall has been updated.
Regarding the drive shaft inspection- test- modifications you can run the palm of your hand along the underside of the drive assembly tube at the rear. You should feel a small rubber plug / drain valve. It’s right at the back of the shaft assembly towards the rear wheel. If you have one it’s fairly obvious. You can also see it but you need to get down low and look at the underside of the drive tube.
Let me know what you find…
Best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis Recall work wasn’t done it seems, but being sorted now. Thanks for the feedback!
Your very welcome 👍
can you explain the unusually loud knocking on the left side valve I know boxer engines make noise but not like this any insight
Hi Limelight and welcome to the channel, this is a common problem and normaly it's the timing chain tensioner, you don't mention which year, model or version you are referring too.... But bmw have a upgraded part to replace the original, just go into your local dealer and order one, best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis 1250 gsa 2021
Is it true that BMW has an adhesive they are recommending for the duck bill drain in the drive shaft housing so it will no longer fall inside with the slightest touch? Thank You!!
Hi Eric, not that I am aware of.
Most owners are using clear silicone, just a very small amount around the outer edge of the olug
Great video !!!!! Thank you !!! 🙂
You're welcome !!
Thanks for your video,
Hi Olivier, your welcome....
Who's going to get air on an RT?
Hi Mick, see my reply regarding this question below. But to recap... basically the RT-P is a Police or Forces bike also used as operational bikes for the Uk Gov.
James Bond then!
Interesting Video, but wonderful weather today, right?😅⛅
Yes wonderful weather today 👏😉
Here in Spain some owners made the upgrade and they comment about a lose of power and reaction in the motor. Is it real? Do you noticed something? Im afraid to do the update
Hello Barbudo and welcome to the channel. My 2021 GS Rallye is now back from BMW and I have been out testing. I can confirm I can not find any difference in performance on the road, I’ve tested all the road modes and I honestly can’t detect any difference. I’ve riden my bike quite hard yesterday much more than I would normally do, so for me it’s positive.
I can’t comment on the two Enduro modes as that’s an area I’m no expert in.
I feel that there is a positive improvement in gear shifting using the quick shifter so I have sent an email directly to the technical team at BMW Berlin asking for confirmation about this. Once I receive a reply I will post a new episode.
Best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitisthank for your answer. I have did the update. Total dissapointed me
Thank you for your information. Great the way you do your job. Do you ahev any info on the LED Headlight! Im anoyed cause im already waiting for alsmost 4 months Im realy pissed with the lack of soultions from B;W or even the lack of accurate info from the dealership. BMW Motorrad replies but advising to ask the dealer that has absolutely no info. Can you research for us? Thanks a lot!
Hi and welcome to the channel.
The headlight is now available at many dealership and owners have now started to have them fitted to their bikes.
You must physically go into your dealership and speak with the sales manager and ask for your headlight and explain its very urgent.
This might help. But their are still thousands of bikes waiting for the headlight.
BMW will not tell me any more information.
Please go into your dealer and tell them the wait is not acceptable!!!!
Let me know how you get on 👍
@@justthewayitis Hi Carl, do you know in what countries this is being done? Im in Portugal a rather small and insignificant market for them. Thank you very much!
I have been writing on all social media platforms, and call BMW out on their lack of respect and lack of answers to u.
Hi, sadly I do not know 100% which countries but I think uk and Germany subscribers have received new headlights.
Have you physically been into your dealer yet and spoken to them?
@@justthewayitis Hi Carl. Yes various times. But they never have any kind of preview for the delivery. This is a nightmare and a disrespect from BMW Motorrad. And I dont mean BMW Motorrad Portugal, I realy mean BMW Germany! They are disrespecting their customers that spend an awful lot of money on one motorcycle and then no info. On Social Media teh reply is always the same, check with your dealer. For now we have not preview. Com on, dont they do Sales Forecasts what F.n job are they doing! Realy am considering changing to a different brand next time. Im really pissed with BMW. Right now I have no positive points for them! They are not showing any respect at all to us who buy their products. I have written in English I have written in German in Portuguese but either no reply or always the same BS. Carl sorry for being so blunt but Im really mad at them. I administer one group of 6000 BMW customers her in Portugal and I will make my voice heard there. I will use my influence in that group.
I appreciate your video BUT one concern I have with your analysis of their “fix”. You say it’s for the ESA to know when the bike has left the ground and people who use “enduro” or “enduro pro” modes. I received a recall notice, my bike doesn’t have ESA nor does it have enduro or enduro pro modes. So my reservation/concern remains is what on earth is this software update going to do to actually fix a faulty part? My bike doesn’t have the suspension sensors. I’m going in today for the software update. I think this will be like the spline problems on the old RT’s. BMW I don’t think put enough lubricant on some splines and they would wear out and you were out of luck with any real help from them. So I’m worried I purchased a bike that will be a heap of junk once it’s out of warranty because instead of BMW fixing the actual mechanical problem with the bike, they are kicking the can down the road with a half hearted software update. Basically this seems like a half hearted solution to something instead of actually fixing a faulty part. Often times with how stout that shaft looks, breakage of a metal component usually to me would mean it’s brittle, maybe it was heat treated too much and then it just snaps. I dunno but I feel like BMW isn’t being on the up and forward with this one.
Hi Alex, welcome to the channel. You raise some important concern that we all share. I spoke to and wrote to my contact at BMW, asking for more clarification, but what I received as a reply is still not very clear. So I have asked again for more clarification but I’m still waiting for the technical team to reply.
If I receive something that is worth sharing I will will do.
Best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis thank you 💙
@@justthewayitis I wanted to follow up with you. I had the update done on my bike. I asked the service advisor and he said it limits RPM when in gear and the clutch pressed in so that way you are unlikely to drop the clutch with it at redline. So after I got the update done, my bike warmed up I was sitting at a stop light with the clutch squeezed and it in gear 1 and revved it briefly to redline, it did it. So what he said didn’t make sense. So then I put it in neural clutch pressed, revved it briefly to redline and it went to redline. So then I put it in neutral, not clutch at all, it revved to redline. So then I tried something different, I got moving and was riding down a road and squeezed the clutch and revved it briefly and it wouldn’t rev past 7,000RPM which was strange, I am not sure if that’s what he meant by not being able to redline it, but it definitely wouldn’t go to redline while moving with the clutch pressed. So I never tried any of that before and couldn’t tell you what it was like before the update. I don’t ever rev, race or redline my bike so I don’t know if while riding and you squeeze the clutch and try to rev it if it would allow redline rev before the update? I just wanted to let you know what the dealer told me and what I noticed on my bike trying show what he claimed. I hope that makes sense. I was riding at about 65MPH in 6th gear and squeezed the clutch then revved it up with the clutch squeezed and it stopped at 7,000RPM. I brought back down the RPMs and released the clutch gently. I still don’t fully understand how software fixes a hardware problem 😄 I guess time will tell. I did pick up my 100,000 mile award when I went in for the service. That felt nice, I had gone thru 100,000 miles on my old R1150RT.
Hi Alex, big thank you for sharing your experience and bike test. It’s very interesting what you have shared. I did get a reply from BMW about engine rpm limits and the gears they applied too but it just did not make any sense how they worded the document, so I replied and asked for further clarification.
I’ll send another email to the technical team next week and see what they say.
Congratulations on your 100K award 🥇
Thank you for a very informative upload. I have a 2019 gs 1250 and my bike was due a service late last year (bought it last year). I asked about updates to the software and was told by the main dealer in Ireland that they had been instructed by BMW not to update software if there wasn't an issue with the existing version on the bike. I thought it strange as this gives the dealer a competitive advantage when servicing as I or a 3rd party can't update software. Will have to see if this recall updates the software ro the newest version or if it just is a patch to whatever version is on the bike
Hi Paul, its a complete new version
Thanks a lot for the video and I didn't expect the fix will be a software update. I was looking on the internet and for this recall there is a part need to be upgraded which the timing chain tensioner on the left side (part# 11317108586) which is part of that issue. appreciate your feedback on this.
Hi Beemer, sorry I’m not sure I understand your question. The recall in this episode is only software no parts.
The tensioner upgrade is something completely different and normally related to ticking or excessive noise on the left side. Carl
@@justthewayitis Thanks a lot Carl for the clarification. I was confused that this part change is related to this recall.
No problem 😉
Are you saying there are people who don’t go off-road with these bikes? Catching a little air is half the fun! 😂
But not the RT-P smile
Here is something that would be of GREAT help. In the BMW OWNERS MANUAL it says ''ATTENTION Charging the battery connected to the vehicle using the battery terminals Damage to the motorcycle's electronics. '' I called 3 dealerships and all 3 said the first thing they do is to install a SAE connecter to charge the battery. According to BMW, we are suppose to use the DIN connecter. However everyone I talk to seems to use the SAE connected right to the battery. What is your thought on this and why does BMW say NOT TO charge the battery in the bike from the battery terminals? Thank You!
Hi Eric,
DIN or SAE or any other battery charger type interface is fine. I use ctek mxs 5.0 charging system with their own version of the connectors. Which is similar to SAE.
Batteries should never be charged in confined spaces using normal battery clamp type connectors because of the possibility of explosion. It’s very rare but can happen because the gases that are released during charging are explosive and if you accidentally cause a spark at one of the terminals it could cause an accident.
You can safely use DIN which is a North American standard or SAE which is European standard.
SAE is probably the better system or something similar like the Ctek system.
Best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis I found this explanation as to why the BMW owners manual says not to charge the battery other than using the DIN. Sounds possible but everyone I talk to charges right at the battery. Thanks for your help!
Of course you can always attach a charger directly to the battery but BMW instructs you to not do so while the battery is installed in the bike. Why? The reason is that many modern chargers are “smart” and will try to recondition (disulphate) a battery if it decides that the battery needs reconditioning. The desulphation process involves the application of high voltage pulses to the battery and if the battery is connected in the bike then all the bike’s expensive electronics also get exposed to the high voltage pulses as well. So there is some risk of damage involved. BMW isn’t going to try to explain how to determine whether your particular charger has a desulphation capability or not so it just tells you not to charge the battery directly in the bike to mitigate the risk.
If you have a smart charger and intend to connect direct to the battery while the battery is in the bike you should read the charger’s manual to see if the desulphation mode can be disabled. I use the Optimate 4 charger in its “CAN-bus mode” (sic) direct to the battery because in that mode high voltage desulphation is deactivated. I can’t be bothered with charging via the accessory port.
Hi Eric, thank you for sharing this information I’m sure it will be helpful to many other owners who have a similar question. Have a great Sunday and thank you 🙏 Carl
Great video Carl, thank you. One question, do you have a link to those charts you created regarding ride modes, etc? I'd love to download it and print it out. Thanks again and keep up the great videos.
Thankyou, re the Ride Mode Chart, I'm still working on getting it up, i think i have solution but its still some time away. Carl
As a matter of interest, what are your thoughts related to the installation of a trailer hitch on a 1250 GSA? I understand it would be based on an opinion.
Hi Billy, I never seen this. 😊
@@justthewayitis ruclips.net/video/8mA3Yv5suGo/видео.html
Hi Billy Thankyou I will look at this tonight!!!
I watched that and a couple other hitch videos tonight, looks interesting but I'm not sure it's a solution for everyone, are you thinking of adding this to yours?
What is it that you need to transport?
@@justthewayitis I was wanting to take my camping gear, drone, and other things to California. However it wasn't practical to carry everything on the bike. I haven't made up my mind yet. The trailer isn't cheap and I can always take less.
Wonderful! Thank You for posting. Can you help us with the ''R1200/1250GS Service Action 0033130000 Install vent valve in driveshaft housing'' issue also please? Here is what I know: I have viewed your video on the Service Action 0033130000, however when reading the attached, it makes it sound as if the ''u'' joint angle or design may be the problem? Are they going with a new style ''u'' joint or something else? Are the replaced drive shafts a new design?
The cardan is to be checked and a vent valve retrofitted on a total of 440,000 motorcycles worldwide, especially on the R 1250 GS and R 1200 GS from 2013.
"In order to improve long-term quality", according to BMW Motorrad's official formulation, the authorized workshops are currently being prepared for a very extensive service campaign: the cardan shafts of a total of 440,000 motorcycles worldwide are to be checked over the course of the next few months, ideally as part of the scheduled inspections will. 72,000 of them in Germany alone. The campaign primarily affects BMW's most important model: the boxer GS. Specifically, the R 1250 GS and the R 1200 GS from year of manufacture 2013, both type K50, as well as the respective adventure variants, type K51. In addition, there is the official version RT, type K52.
Universal joint, articulation angle, corrosion
Background according to BMW, from a message to the dealers: "Service campaign during the next visit to the workshop - retrofit drainage in the swingarm and check the cardan shaft. Damage to the cardan shaft occasionally occurs, which impairs the function of the drive. In individual cases, propulsion can be lost Several factors contribute to the occurrence of damage.Corrosion effects, among others, play a role if they occur at functionally relevant points.Signs of wear caused by running time or particular climatic and dynamic loads can also lead to component damage. These effects can be caused by the geometric chassis design (kink angle of the universal joints in the swing arm) be reinforced."
R 1200 GS, R 1250 GS and official RT
Apparently, a conspicuous accumulation of cardan defects was found in the Boxer GS from year of manufacture 2013 (with water-cooled engine) and in the R 1200 RT and R 1250 RT in the official version. With the GS, the cardan is subject to greater stress due to the concept, because of the longer spring deflection and the associated articulation angle between the cardan tunnel and the rear axle drive. This is where the cardan's rear universal joint is located. In addition, depending on the user, there is more or less tough enduro use. In any case, the authorities' RT are subjected to above-average strain, for example when driving over high curbs.
Cardan check with special device
So that the cardan does not have to be opened on all 440,000 motorcycles concerned, every authorized workshop is to be given a special test device. Instead of the rear wheel, a measuring disk is mounted, and then the cardan is dragged over the rear axle while idling, that is, rotated. This stress test runs over various load changes and speeds, with sensors monitoring the forces and vibrations. If everything stays within the predefined normal range, the checked gimbal is considered "okay". If there are any abnormalities, a closer look is taken. In particular, the universal joint with its four roller bearings, but also the gearing to the rear axle drive is checked for rust and damage. Should parts then have to be replaced,
Vent hole with beak valve
In principle, a vent on the cardan tunnel is retrofitted during this service campaign. For this purpose, a small hole is drilled on the underside in the rear area, near the universal joint, using a prepared template. In order to avoid the formation of potentially harmful metal chips, the drill should be lubricated beforehand. A rubber beak valve is then inserted into this hole using a kind of piercing tool. This special valve is intended to seal the hole to the outside, but allow air and, above all, moisture to escape from the cardan tunnel. This ventilation is supported by the pumping movements during compression and rebound. If water runs out immediately after drilling, this is also a reason to inspect the cardan more closely.
45 minutes per motorcycle
A total of 45 minutes are allotted for the cardan check including retrofitting the ventilation. Of course, this campaign is free of charge - at least for the customers, BMW will incur some costs.
Hi Eric, well my GS has not yet been done, it goes in for the Recall and the Shaft Inspection in about 10 days time. So maybe after my appointment i will know more details.
Lots of subscribers have had the inspection done, some have reported that BMW have indeed replaced the drive shaft because : A: it fails the workshop test parameters, or B: excessive corrosion was found on the shaft / joints, or C: excessive play on the splines or joints.
I am not aware that when fitting and replacement shaft BMW install a modified part, i believe its the original version. But i will ask about this while at my local dealer in a week or so.
Some owners have sadly experienced very poor work by some of the BMW dealers, in some cases damaging the outer casing, while drilling the hole for the drain plug. Have a read through the comments sections as there are many hundreds of owners sharing there experiences.
Thankyou for taking the time to reply, kind regards Carl
@@justthewayitis Thank You! I will look for your update. I have a 2023 BMW 1250 GSA that was built last week, so I hope all is good. Did you read the part about the ''Universal joint, articulation angle''? Perhaps a larger ''U'' joint would help? Maybe have someone check to see if the new replacement drive shaft has larger ''u'' joints?
Hi Eric, I will certainly look at what and how they carry out the test and your information is very good and extremely informative, thank you 😊
@@justthewayitis Thank You!!
As another said, it would be good if BMW sorted out the drive shaft / water ingress issue in a similar manner as it is presumably a much bigger issue🤔
Hi WoodNotts well they are doing the drive shaft inspection test and modifications when you go in for the next service (see separate video) but yes it would have been nice. Carl
Hi Carl, just to be clear here, is this a different recall from the shaft drive one ? or is it the same ?
These are two separate issues: the rear drive shaft modification is called a "Service Notification" which will be performed the next time your bike goes into BMW. Todays episode is about an actual RECALL and we will need to return our bikes to have this done. Both things can and probably will be done at the same time. Good Question Inspector... Regards Carl
Thank you Car for the video.
Dealer recently have done software update regarding that recall with my gsa.
After that bike get vibrations when idling. Any one have same issue?
Hi, welcome to the channel. That’s a strange one, I can’t think what in the software update would or could generate a vibration.
Anything lose under the seat ?
Definitely go back to your dealer and have them check your GSA
Carl
@Just The Way It Is Hi Carl. I thought that could be a new pump map or so. Do you know the latest firmware number for gsa? Maybe they uploaded some from another model? 🤔 Dealer kept my bike over the night, telling me that the updating process is so slow.
Not so sure about this.
Hi the software version you should have I don’t know, I would imagine it’s different due to the suspension being different. Keeping the bike overnight is quite normal as it depends on their internet connection speed, some bikes update very quickly and of course they need to use the programming bay. Let me know what they say.
Carl
Hello Carl, I did go to dealer and update the software version is 023_011_060. Is it the latest version and is it fixed the gear box issue?
Hello Vinh and welcome to the channel. My GS is currently at my local bmw dealership, so I currently do not know the software version or number.
Once my bike is home I will check and make another video.
Best wishes Carl
Hi Vinh, my GS is back the software version you list above
023-011-060 is correct and this is the latest version that is installed for the Recall 👍
Best wishes Carl
Hello Carl, Thank You for update. I wonder how can we check whether gearbox issue was fixed?
I will send an email to my contact at BMW in Berlin and ask him. I will let you know once I get a reply
Given that BMW have an IMU / ride by wire therefore have control of engine torque. I would suggest that the speed of engine vs rear wheel speed is not the issue exactly. It will be more about the throttle opening and therefore torque. The shaft will fail due to torque being transmitted not the speed it is turning. When the bike unloads then hits the ground the engine could be producing relatively high torque and the wheel possibly in some instance grips up causing a high instantaneous torque ( turning force) on the input shaft and the shaft is not strong enough to cope with this instantaneous torque. The correct thing for BMW to do would be to design, manufacture and install a new input shaft that can cope. However this would be astronomically expensive. So they do what is the cheapest way out of the situation, a software work round of the problem. My guess would be they sense when the rear wheel is in full droop check the engine torque output from the calculated value from the ecu, check the gear, look at the damper rate then back the engine torque down with reducing throttle angle (through ride by wire). Shafts in general typically fail due to the torque applied to them exceeding their design limit. So either reduce the torque or increase the designed torque limit of the shaft.
Hi Tim, interesting observations and thank you for sharing. I understand that they have reverted to a similar TC setting as the 2019 1200 and monitor and engine and transmission speeds with some form of control, possibly both ends TC and throttle butterfly adjustments. Your thought process seems logical and it’s possible though. Maybe we will never know for sure what they have tweaked.
Carl
I ride my bike every day, and I immediately noticed a difference in the low to midrandge snap in dynamic mode..like the power is more spread out now compared to how it used to be. Is it in my head or did they also change the general map. Very strange..
I did ask the technical team to clarify all the changes but they didn’t want to share a lot more, but like you I think some general map changes have taken place. Plus of course the language barrier doesn’t make for easy translation 😉
Hey Carl, what is the software version must be after the update?
Hi Beemer, the new software version is
023-011-060 this is the version that is applied if your bike goes back for the Recall update.
More details to follow in a future episode regarding the changes made to the software
Best wishes Carl
@@justthewayitis Thanks a lot for the information. Waiting for the next video 👍
Your welcome 🙏
I experience that l gears 1,2,3 of my 1250 GS are clunky, 4,5,6 are butter smooth.
Is this a common experience?
Hi Anubhav if you are referring to use with the quick shifter… then yes.
The new software update apparently improves this, but I can’t confirm at the moment, Carl
@@justthewayitis thanks for responding Carl. How do I overcome this challenge with quick shifter? Could you make a video?
Your other videos are so informative.
I also got my first servicing done yesterday and I was told that my bike will not need to Software update. How could I know if it will need updates or not? It’s a 2022 manufactured.
Well I don’t use the quick shifter in the first three gears going up the box.
With regards to your software update only the bmw dealer can tell you this, but let me know your current software version by going into your menu and checking. Let me know the full number
@@justthewayitis - So when i do a gear change in a conventional way i.e. pulling full clutch, releasing the throttle, then changing the gear... then its makes even more noise and the gear shifts does not happen smoothly. To be honest, I am quite disappointed with this. I am going participate in a GS experience in March. I hope i can learn a bit about it there. My Yamaha R3 was sooo good in this regard.
I'll get back to you about S/W version number.
At this moment of writing the current version is K001_23_03_501 this I received from one of the channel subscribers. My GS has gone in today for the service and update I will confirm once I have the bike back home
Carl
Had my software recall carried out today and now my auxiliary lights don’t work
Hi Mark, sorry to hear about your experience, I hope they can do something to help you, perhaps they nudged a wire on your canbus while connecting for the software update. Carl
Are sure the failures occurred in offroad?
BMW do not confirm this in the report. And I doubt they will share this with us, Carl
Good explanation of the recall. The failure may be uncommon but the fact is that the ‘fix’ is an admission of an engineering design failure, pure and simple.
Enduro pro mode is being watered down to mask a deficiency in the driveline.
If there were no manufacturing or material defects in the failed parts then the design is marginal with insufficient factor of safety. It seems that BMW beta tests and customers finish the job and find the flaws. BMW driveline problems are rife, driveshafts fail at low miles. Water gets in, corrodes and seizes splines. It’s just not good enough. This, and other problems are why I got rid of my 1250. Which is a shame.
Hi Nomad good morning thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences with the subscribers. What do you now own / ride ?