Do you legally have to declare NO TV LICENCE NEEDED?
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- Опубликовано: 19 окт 2023
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NOTE: This video is my opinion only, based on the contents of an email exchange sent to me in confidence and in good faith by a viewer, regarding the TV Licence and legal requirements to be listed as a "no licence needed" address".
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Around 20 years ago ,they visited my property & threatend my daughter on our doorstep for saying that she didn't have a TV licence after admitting to watching a TV sometimes. She did not allow them access & was cautioned .She was 14 . They wrote down her DOB ,address etc & sent her communications . We recieved all of the letters of threat & duly went along to attend court on the date at Richmond upon Thames magistrates court .My now 15 yr old daughter & myself took along a letter of disgust from her then head teacher ,about her studies were being compromised & how her mentsl health had been affected due to the actions taken by them .The trial in the afternoon was attempted to be cancelled & withdrawn by TV licencing with a very weak sorry ,due to submissions to the court ballifs by myself & my daughter with our now evidence given. I refused not to go to trial & insisted on it going ahead just on principal , on her behalf . They were laughed out of court .Made to pay my time off of work & expenses & then further ordered to also pay my daughter compensation of £500 for stress & inconvienience .
They also offered me a free 1 year licence included in the compensation ,that I did not require.
Your daughter got money from the bbc, nicely done, I'm sorry that she had to undergo trial by bbc. The only thing the judge missed is a criminal charge against the goons for verbally abusing your daughter. God bless you both
And. That's. How. It's. Done. Top work! 👏
You story's like this really make me chuckle at the incompetence of the bbc
Excellent result.
You’re living in cloud cuckoo land.
Can't believe in 2023 we still have a TV licence.
I agree it should be a simple tax like everywhere else ... but Rupert Murdock wouldn't like that ...
@@davidioanhedgesHe will not be worrying about it for long!
Can't believe in 2023 we still have broadcast TV.
It'll be here until at least 2027 when it gets reviewed (and probably renewed?). Only people cancelling will bring about change.
@@bobmirdiff2043 His children and their money will be .... and that's all that matters to the Conservatives ..
I have a letter from TVL that I reported to the police as a malicious communication and after I read them the contents of the letter they deemed it to be blackmail and started an investigation. Then when they eventually realised the letter was from TVL they sent two PCSOs to my address to inform me that it wasn't blackmail anymore !!! The whole incident was recorded btw. I have 52 letters collected so far.
I wish I had kept all of the ones they sent to 'The Lagal Occupier' now !
I informed the police about the inspectors being around during covid lockdowns (definitely a criminal offence at the time) but they didn't reply to my email.
TVL gave everyone dated letters admitting guilt stating they had been there and had arguments with neighbours disturbing the peace and also creating a trail of witnesses.
@@Bozebo They probably would have claimed it was essential work.
@@Bozebo Was it definitely an offence? I thought you only had to stay at home if your work could be performed from home; a goon's job cannot be performed from home.
How 52 unnecessary letters making threats can not constitute harassment (BBB has explained it cannot if its from TVL) is ridiculous.
The TV License authority should be held accountable for the reckless environmental damage they have been causing for decades. So much waste just to intimidate law abiding people.
Why can't it be a subscription service, this removes the whole nonsense.
@@DrRusty5 Judging by some of the BBC's latest moves it looks as though they are moving towards a subscription service. The closing down of local radio, the same for certain TV stations which are going online. But beware! It is possible that should the BBC go to a subscription service, they may then try to change the law on subscription service funding! i.e. Taking a cut from ALL subscription services to prop up their failing business model!
It is threatening and intimidating. We don't get such a problem with any other companies
@@mikehipperson Whilst that wouldn't affect me, since I don't use any subscription service, that would be unfair. Another idea is to put it on council tax, which again is unfair and would bother me, since it would mean I pay for it.
@@alunjones3860 Pretty much every other nation in the world which ever had a TV Licence system now adds the cost to some other household bill (their equivalent of council tax, or the electricity bill etc.) or, even less fair in some ways, to general taxation. Much easier to collect and enforce ...
Even the USA, the great bastion of commercial broadcasting, uses some federal and local tax revenue to help fund their "PBS" and "NPR" networks.
When I decided to stop funding the BBC I went to the website to make the no licence needed declaration in order to get a refund. Where it asked for my reason for cancelling my licence I chose the "other" option and typed in that I did not want to fund the BBC. The site then told me that I still needed a licence and would not authorize a refund. I went back and selected I don't watch live television which was accepted. There is nothing in law that says you have to provide a reason and, typically, they are so arrogant that they believe we should all want to fund them.
Now that I have no licence I do not watch any television which means that some other channels have lost viewers because of the BBC. Why don't the other channels protest against the BBC monopoly?
I suspect that the other channels fear retribution, i.e. losing their broadcast licence for challenging the BBC nonce network.
The BBC wouldn't refund me when I moved back to my parents house, I haven't had a licence in my own house now for 30 years, never been fined either, if you don't communicate with them at all they can't gather evidence. And as they don't have TV detector vans, and never have there's nothing they can do.
@@robburrows2737 If the BBC went commercial, it would increase competition for advertising, which the other channels don't want.
@@alunjones3860If the BBC went commercial, it would go bust.
You Tube is a good substitute, and as with any business we do not have to supply a reason. It is good enough that we do not wish to have their service, from such and such a date.
I take great comfort knowing that every threatening letter sent to me from these muppets costs them money, so, no contact no contract from me.
True. It used to make me laugh when receiving threatening letters as they constitute harassment, and pointed this out to them and they stopped, harassment being an unlawful, criminal act. Before that I used to send them my rubbish, addressed to Free Post Bristol with the post code, and even return their letters, Free Post. Once sent the wife's used hand bag.
Thing is they send so many out those that pay outweighs the cost of the letters. I have many letters now. Bit like them private parking charges they turf out as they know people will just pay as frightened even when they haven’t committed the offence. Money grabbers. Stand your ground people’s, don’t give them any info just when they say who they are- Close the door, I do.
@@dougaldouglas8842
👜 used handbag....love it.
It costs you money.. your Taxes
@@QIKUGAMES-QIKU Wrong, the cost to them comes out of the license money they extort from people who still pay. What tax do you think it is?
I don't have licence to sell alcohol and I don't need to declare when I am going to buy it or consume it. I don't have a TV licence, a television, receiver or recording equipment and don't need to tell anyone I don't need a licence. Why would I need a licence for something I don't own, need or use?
The problem with this country is that everyone is considered to be criminal first until proven otherwise and as such, we live in a penal colony where condemnation is the weapon against our nation.
I think you have to seek alcohol licencing laws before making this statement lol
You don't need a TV licence to possess a TV.
So you don't have a smart phone then?
@@ditch3827 You don't need a TV license for a smart phone if you don't intend using it to watch live TV.
@@tonyoliver2750 Indeed but @jonDingle said he didn't have a television receiver or recording equipment and I was just making the point that if he has a smart phone then he does.
The tonnes of waste paper they generate every year should be illegal. I have a vacant flat next to me and there's a pile about 30cm high with letters from them.
I don't mind since it keeps our dear RM posties busy. It just ends up straight in recycling bin.
‘You will not hear from TV Licensing for a period of time’.
In my case this was 12 months. Since then (3 years) I have had threatening letters every month addressed to ‘the householder’ even though they know my name.
I regard it as high-pressure marketing, no more.
Why is it allowed? I was without a car for ten years and don’t remember the DVLA behaving like this.
That's a very good point!
ha,imagine if netflix and all the others did the same!
put it back in the post marked " unsolicited mail"
I have been licence free for 15 years and never declared.
And any letters I get are always addressed to 'The Occupier'
They want you to do the NLN, because they can gather info on you.
Same here. It's been 15 years almost to the day since I cancelled my licence following the Ross/Brand prank calls debacle.
I respond to them under my real name Theo C Cupier
@@paulnutter1713I like that. Think I might use myself, after all we know there are a lot of John Smiths around (try doing your family history with that name) so it stands to reason there must be even more Theo C Cupiers around.
@@beccabbea2511 like frogmella and spudulike it's exotic!!!!
This is what I hate the most about the whole TVL scenario. All the TVL correspondence and action is predicated around the assumption that having a TV Licence is the default state and that if you don't have one then you have to do something about it.
Indeed. in all comms with TVL they dont comprehend that you don't watch live TV.
Because it's the Indoctrination Means of Creating a Narrative...
Most people still watch broadcast TV ...
the IT is done by a US company who are massively corrupt (but donate to the conservative party)
The letters are sent by a company that is suspect (but donate to the conservative party)
the entire system is run by Capita (Who donate to the conservative party)
The letters compost well, best to tear it up first though.
mine are used as kindling
I never correspond with TVL. I had someone turn up at my door one day. I explained that I am in no way obliged to communicate with them. I stated that I revoke their implied right of access, and closed the door. I have not received any correspondence or had any attempted visits since, and that was 8 years ago.
I had a similar thing happen while I was away working at sea. My neighbour across the road was a police officer - he noticed on many days somebody looking in though the house windows so he confronted them and told them to “go away” - I haven’t seen anyone from TVL in at least 25 years now. One thing my policeman neighbour told me was that TVL is not a ‘statutory authority’ and is a wholely owned subsidiary company of the BBC with no legal power to enter your property. Since retiring just prior to Covid I have a TV licence but as the output of the BBC is so dreadful I’m considering doing away with the TV and making do with streaming programs on line instead of
@@timoliver8940
You can use a tv set to watch dvds etc.
The TV Licence is nothing but a disgraceful, legalised extortion racket. I pity those who still have one.
Who would have believed an organization that claimed to have tv signal detection vans would be dishonest...
Would not touch their website with a barge pole, reason:
They require your name, address, phone number and email address - and they don;t need your details if you don't need a TV licence.
Write a letter, and sign it as "The Legal Occupier".
They don’t need a phone number and you can use a false name. They will already know the address is not licensed.
You DO NOT need to tell them your name. Just the address, and an email, (make one up if you want) NO name, No telephone number, is needed. All information except the address and email can be left blank. Once done that's it. I have three addresses I have done this with and never had a letter for 25 years. Before I declared NLN I got a letter every month or two. I did get a letter from Tesco telling me I need to pay them because I shopped at Sainsburys, But I think that was a scam. :)
Exactly. They are after your info.
I used the online form for my late father's flat. It has been empty for 3 years so there is no "The Occupier". I made up the email and phone. I gave the name "No such person".
I have not had a TV licence for years, did the NLN process and a year or so later the letters came. I am great full for the letters as I save them up and use them to light my wood burner. If you don’t need a license, utterly ignore their propaganda and be happy 😃.
I agree, if you're playing a straight game and not watching live TV or i-player, you're under no obligation to declare, you can just burn their letters and tell their inspectors/salespeople to go away and shut the door in their faces. There's nothing they can do. They need evidence to get a warrant.
Best thing to do is to get their letters and place them into an envelope and address it back to them, with Free Post on the address. I no longer get letters, though I do not have a telie vision
@@dougaldouglas8842 Having 1 or 100 televisions makes no difference if you don't use them for the purposes covered by the license, then you don't need a license.
You can use a tv set to watch dvds etc.
@@redpillnibbler4423Yep, also games consoles and the like are fine. The problem is going to come with smart TVs that have the bbc iplayer hardwired into them, as technically owning a tv like that is 'installing the equipment.'
The other concern I have if what happens if the licence IS abolished? The state broadcaster will find another way to force us to pay, rather than switching to advertising. My council tax is high enough already without a media fee being added to it.
@@eddyblackmore4188
You are probably right .I’m considering buying a spare tv now before that happens to use basically as a screen to watch DVDs/Blue Rays.
Really enjoy these TVL videos. I think it's invaluable to have someone with legal knowledge and expertise commenting on this.
Common sense says No. We receive and pay for a service, and if we wish to end that service we can do so, and do not have to give an explanation. Bent Broadcasting C nts are no different.
@@dougaldouglas8842' if we wish to end the service we can do so.'
You're right, I did so in 2007, never looked back
It is if the explanation is correct. NLN doesn't include receiving equipment which this chap says it does.
@@robl5833 Even if you own a TV but don't watch or record live TV or iPlayer, you don't require a licence. You are not required by law to submit a nln, or even inform them. You can just stop paying and ignore the letters and visits, which I've been doing since 2009 (I don't own a TV, or watch live anything.) There is no legal requirement to tell them anything. IF you don't watch live TV or use iPlayer.
I Naively filled out a NLN and after just a few months got just as much BBC crap through the door as I did before. Now that my 'Licence to Not Have a Licence' has long since ran out, I'm waiting for these salesmen to turn up at the door. When they do, I'll be applying Chilli Jon's methodolgy which is to: Open the door, ask "Who are you?" reply "No Thanks" and close the door. I'd suggest everyone else equally affected, do the same and absolutley, no more.
Just to clarify, I cancelled my Virgin TV subs prior to raisng my NLN, I DO NOT watch live TV or IPlayer.
Or when they turn up keep interrupting asking if they have taken Jesus into their lives etc etc 😂
I fill it in every 3 years and have never had a single letter. If i did I would do what i do with all unsolicited mail. Cross out my address, mark it Return to sender/unsolicited mail and put it back in the mailbox
I ignore all their letters. I have a TV that I only use as a computer monitor. It was never connected to the antenna. I watch Netflix and Disney Plus. That's all.
I never correspond with them. Ever. I don't owe them my details. I have no relevant TV watching equipment. They have left me alone.
Same. They have zero authority over me and are treated as such
Having relevant receiving equipment doesn't require a TV licence.
Except that receiving equipment is defined by its use.
So a TV isn't receiving equipment unless it's used to receive live broadcasts.
As soon as you declare an NLN, you will have a TVL salesman at your door demanding to be let in.
The letters may stop, but, the salesmen won't. You're better off not communicating with them at all & just binning the letters. No legal requirement to respond to their letters whatsoever.
Correct
Absolute rubbish i have to say. I have not heard a thing since declaring an NLN earlier this year, back in the spring time.
@@jamesshephard2013 Correct. I've declared a NLN for years and never hear from them until the next declaration is due
@@jamesshephard2013 your time will come.
You're lucky then,they've ignored my declarations over the years,&have continued to pester me.
It would be so simple for the BBC to make it impossible to receive their channels unless you have a license. They clearly don't want to do that as it would instantly end this racket of shaking down the public for money for something that they don't use.
It's simple. Cancel your DD and ignore them and their threatograms, and never talk to an "inspector"!
If you pay by instalments you pay double for the first 6 months so you're always 6 months ahead, if you just cancel the DD you'll remain licenced for 6 months, if you inform them you no longer need a licence however which doesn't have to be via their online system (I did it with an email when I cancelled the DD), they'll send you a refund for almost half the licence fee.
@@pjcnet True. Good point.
just outright cancelling a DD without correspondence is bad advice. It's always best to cancel 'at the source' and let the cancellation trickle back to your bank account. You're still legally on the hook for non-payment if a DD doesn't happen; they could proceed with bailiffs.
That’s exactly what I did 👍
I declared no tv license needed, and for 3 years I heard nothing. I then renewed my declaration recently and now get threatening letters, despite being declared as not needing a license!
Weird, had the same myself.
In 11 months I have to renew mine and wondered if there could be some repercussions.
The same here,I notified them each time,but after a few years of doing this,they started to ignore the declarations&sent their bullying letters again.I just put them in the bin,but during the first lockdown,one of their henchmen appeared&expected to be let in.They have highly questionable practices.I would have a licence if I wanted to have television,I don't really object to that,but I do object to their bullying sells technique,&that's all that it is,&that should have been stopped many years ago.
All you are doing by declaring a no licence needed is giving them your details to make a prosecution a hell of a lot easier. If you say nothing, they don't have those details. They have no powers of entry so what they're really asking you to do is help them in their 'investigation'.
Say nothing do nothing
@@ronwheeler6814 I've never heard of a legal requirement to give them your details for a no licence needed declaration, it covers the household, not an individual. Many years ago i just used Mr J Anonymous, but i did use my real email address to make sure i got the confirmation in case they did illegally continue to harass me. It all went through fine, and when they ask me to renew the letters come through as Mr J anonymous.
Note the BBC do not collect the licence fee itself, it is entirely done by Capita that wonderful Conservative party contributing company who gets all the government contracts regardless of how useless they are and how many laws they break ... they outsource the enforcement and cold calling ... previously to India (but that entire operation was closed down due to a Panorama investigation, that found they were horrifically illegal) ....
If the BBC had any morals they would get rid of Crapita.
How have you conflated this with the Conservatives.
If Liebour get in that will sort the issue ... straght onto the council tax !
@@oldfashioned8602The government picked them ... or the Conservative led BBC board
@@davidioanhedges And the Labour gov picked them for contracts when they were in power. It's got nothing to do with party affilitations but rather the small and corrupt world of gov contracting which is dominated by several bribe givers.
I don't like the way that Capita operates. I sent a message via their tvl website, stating that I no longer watched any television channels or iPlayer. My DD was cancelled and then I began to receive what to me were intimidating letters, saying that I was under investigation and needed to pay my licence fee. So I completed the nln declaration, almost 3 years ago and have been left alone since. If ever I need a TV licence again, I shall buy one.
Just to add, a TV licencing Goon does not have the legal right to enter your property without a warrant from the court and they can only get that if they have proof you are watching live TV, If they just turn up without warning you do not have to let them in.
Yes, just like vampires, they can't come in unless you invite the over the threshold. Maybe garlic would work too?
@@iggysfriend4431 maybe have some holy water, a stake and a crucifix as well lol
@@iggysfriend4431 I am pretty sure impaling through the heart with a sharp piece of wood works too.
BBC TV Licencing has always played on wording in the hope it can intimidate people into just paying
Yup. Obfuscation.
I wouldn't be surprised if the "Detection Vans" were a hoax, solely used to be a visible deterrent. Regardless even if it did work the technology clearly can't work anymore. Yet, they have failed to move to a subscription system much like Netflix etc.. this would solve the problem, pay and view don't pay don't view.
This goes against the spirit of the law - they can only continue to get away with this sort of subterfuge because that are Fully Woke and so is the government.
Yes, they lie on purpose. They are a disgusting organisation.
Back in 1997 I had visit from tv licencing as I had failed to renew it. I explained that it was pointless to do so as I was in court in a weeks time and was expecting a prison sentence. I, naively, let them in to see the tv.
I received the expected custodial sentence and within a few weeks received a letter informing me that I had been handed a one day (concurrent) sentence for not having a licence.
The irony is that if the same situation happened now I could watch TV for free anyway in my cell.
As if prison wasn’t bad enough!!
And this is exactly why I don't have a licence; because of the threats and intimidation.
The continued sending of these letters is harassment pure and simple. No one is required to submit a nln, They inform you once of the rules then that is it, continuance then becomes harassment. I get one in my letterbox about once a month, all demanding in their nature, If I did that to someone I would be prosecuted for such.
The easiest way to look at these letters, replace the words "TV licence" with the words "our service", they all read as extortion letters.
Pay for our services or Else.
Just had the DVLA round the house to harrass me about needing a C licence category on my driving licence if i want to drive C category vehicles. The CAA then came to tell me that i need a pilots licence to fly a plane and then Netflix knocked to interogate me on if i watch netflix without a subscription. Its all grtting too much with these companies sending inspectors for stuff i dont use.
They absolutely want to intimidate, their letters are written in that way. It's a government tactic, I can recall the council sending young adults around to strongly imply that if you mis-use the household recycling bin (for paper, carboard etc.) you would be fined, it's a bit of a power-high.
Each letter says an investigation has been opened! This has been going on for several years now - I must be Britains most wanted man!!
I do not have to declare that I haven't been speeding, or that I haven't committed theft or murder.
In the past, I've considered writing to the local Chief Constable asking for a letter giving me permission to drive above the speed limit - because it seems obvious that so many other drivers on our roads must have one.
I have not provided them with a no license needed declaration because as part of the declaration you have to disclose whether or not you possess a television. As far as I see it, the only relevant information they need is that I do not watch live television or watch BBC iPlayer. I don't wish to volunteer the status of whether or not there is a television unit in my home. For that reason I have not filled out the declaration and had a plethora of letters insisting I will get a visit (which never happens) or that they are pursuing an investigation, it is a waste of taxpayers money with the amount of letters I received, roughly once a month.
I wasn't born with a television. I don't watch terrestrial television. I don 't engage in any way with representatives of the BBC. I don't open any correspondence from any organisation representing the BBC or licensing. What I DO is I repost unopened letters to the return address for Capita who represent the BBC for licencing. Capita then are responsible for the cost of the return postage and the disposal of the paper. Simple.
If you can lock garden gates, both front and back, you can let them know that the presumed right of access to your home has been removed.
That means they have to contact you and ask for access to which you can deny as is your wish.
I have my back gate locked and only open my front door if I know who is there.
I send in the letter box every now and then that I do not require a license as I watch DVDs.
The onus of proof is on them to prove I need a license and without access they can't prove it.
The information you provide is much appreciated. I shall, as usual, make a wider point that is not about the letter of this particular law, but its spirit. The TV licence is a de facto form of taxation, concerning which we have absolutely no representation.
They are quite happy to make up any old rubbish if they think they will get away with it. Some years ago I cancelled my direct debit because I was not going to need a licence going forward. A couple of years later that changed, so I tried to buy a licence online. It refused so I phoned them, and they insisted that I had to pay them for the intervening time before I could buy a new licence. I pointed out that I had cancelled it because I didn't need a licence, but they kept insisting. At that point, I told the only lie in the whole conversation, that I was recording the conversation, and asked them to confirm explicitly that they were refusing to sell me a licence. At that point they suddenly discovered that they could sell me a licence. Someone less bloody minded however might have spent hundreds of pounds retroactively buying licences that they hadn't needed.
I cancelled my TV licence three years ago. The letters of threat have started arriving. I open them and have a good chuckle, then put them in the recycling. The problem is they keep sending to someone who doesn't live here: The legal occupier. I refuse to phone them again and do another no longer required. I just don't agree with needing to let them know. So I am now waiting for them to knock on my door so I can slam the door in their face.
Write 'return to sender' on them and put them back in the post. That way it costs them money.
@@MrCSutton At the bottom of the letter it says do not write here. So I do. Then I post it back to them with not known at this address.
Surely flatly lying to extract money is the definition of fraud?
but this is Government backed so thats ok.... :)
What do you think that income Tax is?
@@lesigh1749 Extracting money by threat of force.
I was harassed for several years by TV Licencing and made the declaration by phone. I also removed their implied right of access at the same time. They contacted me after 2 years. I rang them up again and told them they needed a search warrant, but be careful, because they would have to make a false declaration to get it and I would pursue them legally. Haven't heard from them since.
You aren’t required to inform the DVLA if you don’t own a car or CRT if you don’t own a canal boat, why does the tv ‘licensing authority’ presume to effectively demand that you tell them if you don’t own a tv? The temporarily unoccupied apartments in the block here regularly receive letters in various hues from TVLA. I’m tempted to invoice them for the costs involved in disposing of their rubbish. (Not with any great hopes, however.)
Over 10 years ago I sent a letter to tvl stating I don't require a licence and if they continue to send me correspondence or any employee of capita or contractor or sub contractor to my address I will consider it as harrassment and will sue them for up to £10.000. I didn't put my name, just the address as their letters were to the legal occupier. I received a letter of confirmation saying they may write again in 2 years but ive not had any. Like I say that was over 10 years ago.
If you tell them you don’t need a license you guarantee yourself a visit from the goons
Never had a goon show up here !
Rubbish. Have been declaring NLN's for years and never hear from them until the next declaration is due
I notify them every two years i don't need a license. I don't hear a peep from them and i have not had a license for over 15 years.
@@Rob-eo7ku - Yep you get the email or letter then declare again and they leave you alone.
They are now afraid to come into my street for good reasons
For the avoidance of doubt...BBB makes excellent videos explaining in layman's language, on a variety of topics on his various channels.
When I cancelled my licence, I made the point of going down the 'NLN" route. Yet still I am being sent the monthly letter that I would say demands money with menaces.
I contacted them with the appropriate references to my initial contact with them, and when the reply came back, it was down to my not using exactly the right wording on the declaration.
So, I Di it again, znd still the letters come.
It occurs to me that they care not how you word a declaration, let alone whether you abide by it which I do.
They are only interested in engaging in sharp practice to keep taking in the money.
The whole 'TV Licensing' setup is there to mislead the public'
The government are in on the scam, which is why they do nothing about it.
I found after 3 years they stop sending the letters anyway. I actually miss them as it was useful to have a bit of scrap paper to get the wood burner going.
Hi Daniel - another great video - as always. In terms of the first quotation you put on the screen - "for the avoidance of doubt" - an address is an inanimate object so perhaps what they should have said is "that the occupiers of this address". If they want to think they have the monopoly on the correct use of English then they need to think again. Secondly, "it is a legal requirement to hold a TV Licence" - it absolutely is not - unless you have a TV that you use for watching live broadcasts etc as you have already stated. "If a licence is not taken out for this address etc" sounds very much to me like coercion and I am sure that the original framers of this legislation did not have this in mind when they drafted the Act. Finally, I was always under the apprehension (perhaps wrongly) that all English Law needed to pass the test of "reasonableness" i.e. what would the average person in the street understand by the legislation. Keep making the videos. I sense that you may be deluged with comments about the refund of train tickets following the mass cancelations of trains in the UK due to Storm Babet!
I'm over 75 and on pension credits, there is no way that I would ever dream of confirming anything with them rogues
I don't need to tell Tesco that I don't want their products when they send me offers, neither will I tell TV licencing that I don't need theirs. I used to notify them of a declaration but it didn't stop TV licence threatening letters.
I have the same problem with the DVLA. I told them that SORN violates my human right to the presumption of innocence. They say in big print IT IS AN OFFENSE TO DRIVE OR KEEP AN UNLICENSED VEHICLE ON A PUBLIC ROAD. I understand perfectly and assert my right to be presumed innocent of this offense. I don't need to tell them it is off road on a private driveway, they can come and see for themselves, that would be compulsory declaration that I am not knowingly committing an offense. This was practiced under Stalin.
Same with TV licensing. I don't watch TV at home. I ignore the letters.
This is just another example of intimidation and misinformation used by these people. Its about time they and those in charge were officially investigated and forced into being honest with the public.
Considering they still reserve the right to visit you if you make the declaration and it is no hardship for me to chuck the letters addressed to 'The Occupier' in the bin unopened, I don't bother. Been happily ignoring them for years. Alas, never had a TVL goon turn up.
There is a video on youtube of a guy being visited by two police officers for sending three letters to the home address of a BBC top dog complaining about the licence fee. The PO's stated the person at the BBC had contacted Thames valley police saying she was being harassed. Long story short the PO's said if he continued to write to her then he could be convicted of a criminal offence. Double standards by the Police.
Thanks for this one Dan , as someone who doesn't have or need a TV licence because i dont watch it , i get the NLN notification /declaration Email every two years and always thought i was legally obliged to do so , so very interesting to hear that it isnt a legal obligation . I'll probably continue to do it the same way anyway as it saves any drama on the doorstep if they came knocking...Cheers Dan 👍
Completely ignore them. Do not engage.
I'm sick of the bbc getting in touch every couple of years, NO is a full sentence! Why should I have to jump through their hoops??! 😡😡
Same here, thats why I've just cancelled my NLN and am now officially unlicenced.
Just bin the letters and ignore them
@@Gryffster I've been NLN for 8yrs, I'm just sick of answering their bi yearly contact. I guess it's time to ignore them and send all mail return to sender ( do this for all junk mail) then mess with the agents when they come knocking. 🤬
@@FozzyZ28 I recommend that. It's no big deal. 2 visits in 15 years, sent packing.
@@tankgrief1031 😁👌
I remember an aquaintance telling me she was off home to fill out the form to declare she had NO tv TO licence, a Christian gentle soul woman.
Me personally would put the burden of proof on to them to prove I DID have a tv. We don't have to prove our innocence to them.
Thank you for your expert advice and knowledge you are a saint for giving up your time to advise.😊
In the same way that that there is no legal requirement to tell Netflix (for example) that yo don't need their service, surely there should not be a need to tell the BBC you don't require theirs?
Imagine if every car insurance company were to send letters to everyone telling them you require insurance to have a vehicle on the road. Time these harassment letters were made illegal.
It's Capita, not the BBC.
@@alastairward2774 but aren't they just agents for the BBC. The fee is payable to the BBC?
@@alastairward2774employed by the BBC.
@@grahamlees4394 Worse than that. It goes to the govenrment first.
Why is such harrassment legal in the UK? I can't imagine the frustration in receiving continuous monthly emails from a salesperson trying to threaten me into buying their unwanted service.
It's not emails but physical letters into their postboxes, so for older and more vulnerable people, even more intimidating, because the threats came into your house.
@@Thurgosh_OG absolutely. No idea why I wrote emails. Was visualising piles of physical letters but somehow the modern world got the better of me. Thanks for the correction.
I decided 20 years ago that i no longer wanted to watch "brain dead" tv ...... ignored the "threatening letters " for many years, then replied to one of them , stating i do NOT watch tv. ..... letters stopped several years ago. ...... IF they start again , they will be " filed in the rubbish bin" !
Hello
Since you're talking about TV Licences, here is one i bet you haven't heard before.Haven't seen this on any other channels either, so i would love to know your opinion and if anyone else has had this one done to them:
I do not watch anything that requires a licence but my wife does.She was working abroad when our licence expired on 31/05/2023 .There was therefore no need for a new licence until she returned on 06/06/2023.On that day i purchased a NEW (NOT a renewal) 12 month licence beginning on 06/06/2023.
What i received was a renewal which was 'backdated' to 31/05/2023.My complaint got the following response,which sounds like i've been conned and i'd like your opinion.
The response from TV Licencing complaints (name removed) :
I understand you’re unhappy that your TV Licence has been renewed rather than setting up a new licence.
I’ve looked into this for you and I’ve found that your previous licence in your name expired at the end of May 2023. When you purchased your next licence on 9 June 2023 it was dated to expire one year after the last one.
Licences are always dated to expire 12 months from the first day of the month in which they’re purchased. We’ve a responsibility to use the licence fee effectively, and to minimise administration costs we only use the last day of each month as an expiry date.
A licence will always be dated to provide continuous cover unless we’re told that the licence wasn’t needed for a period of time. As the licence wasn’t cancelled, that’s the reason that it was renewed and a new licence wasn’t created.
I hope I’ve been able to explain the situation and thank you for taking the time to contact us.
Yours sincerely
xxxxxx xxxxxx
Customer Relations
When my late in laws' house was completely empty, they wanted to meet me there so I could prove there was no television there.
I think the concept of a TV Licence is a good one, an objective news and entertainment channel without adverts. The problem is that this is not necessarily the case, are certain channels pushing the governments opinion, and so is this really objective and impartial.
They sucked up Hamas hospital bombing story straight away. Then quietly apologised they got the car park fire wrong.
It's inaccurate to say the BBC reflects govt opinion, though. They certainly have an agenda, a filter and on some topics even an axe to grind, but their politics and values bear no resemblance to those of the ruling class.
When I rang up to declare I don't need a license they were hell bent in questioning me on my usage of the internet and such like, and I when I said I dont watch tv I dont go on bbc Iplayer, I got a question which was and I quote "What do you do with your time then?" 1.What the hell has that got to do with you? and 2. Anything other than watch tv or use iplayer.
It is unequivocally harassment and intimidation, TESCO wouldn't be allowed harass me for not shopping there, I don't need to inform the DVLA if I do not require a Driving Licence, they don't come around to see why I haven't got a Fishing Licence. It beggars belief that they are Legally allowed to act the way they do.
Students have the worst time of it. I moved into accommodation when starting uni and I received letters citing an investigation was being opened. The accommodation management paid for the licence but exclusively for the living room of the flat, but the bedrooms weren’t covered. Looking into it, I found out that it was a standard thing for them to do: to preemptively send out threatening letters (and I consider them threatening with wording and layout) just to catch students out by making them think they need a licence for which they may buy one out of intimidation. It’s made especially worse for vulnerable students with, say, a medically diagnosed anxiety disorder.
been a while since I was at uni, but had a similar experience. Not sure whether the "living room vs. bedroom" thing actually caught anyone out, but there were plenty of letters trying to drum up business on each bedroom in each flat. 4 bedrooms per flat ... 3 flats per floor ... 5 floors per block ... 4 blocks = 240 rooms. That's a lot of money!
Please remember everyone that students in student halls can rely on their parents' tv licence . They just do not watch TV whilst plugged in to the mains. As long as they are watching on battery power only then parents' licence covers. Also tv licence officers have no right of entry unless they have a warrant. .
My advice ignore all fishing letters and do not give them your details. You do not have to declare no licence needed
I think this will only get worse next year when the new freeview streaming service launches next year (called Freely, BBC is a partner). I suspect it will start to be integrated into UK TVs and then require a TV license to have full use of the UI (even if you don't want to watch or record live broadcast TV). Just my guess but I think a reasonable one.
You can move iplayer out of your UI options on most TVs, so why would would that be any different. You can also delete/remove channels on most freeview boxes, so that's another option. You just have to remember to remove them if you need to rescan for channel changes.
I've had letters in alternating red and brown envelopes for June, July, August and September. It's easier to cancel an amazon prime subscription than get through a NLN form!
When they sent a bully boy to my home, i did not say a word to him. I stood there looking at him for 20 minutes while he talked at me. Havnt heard from them in 12 years.
Hi BBB, would the obvious misselling /deception that is being presented to a customer by the BBC not come under Trading Standards / Consumer Protection Legislation? Would be interested in hearing your opinion. Thanks.
It seems to me that enforcement comes down to little more than "targeting" the occupants of addresses that don't have a license. I have doubts that the original "detection vans" worked but clearly, any technology is now definitely redundant. So there is little option for enforcement other than to presume guilt.
The original TV detector vans were technically possible, at some level, but mostly just "a van with a sticker". The only way they could work was to use incredibly sensitive receiving technology (think pretty much military grade) that could receive and amplify the re-transmitted electromagnetic interference between a CRT television's decoder/tuning circuit and the display tube itself. Improved technology and re-transmissions rules meant that these signals got weaker and weaker and the ability to detect them would be highly dependent on the make and model of the TV as well as any intervening materials... such as walls, windows etc. Identifying the source of such a re-transmission was the next problem as it could be behind one property or in the case of multiple residence units such as flats, just forget it as these TV detector vans really couldn't be driven up stairs or use lifts. The portable detectors had about the same scientific validity as Scientology "personality correctness" detectors. So while possible, there is no way that they'd use such incredibly expensive devices in the hand of luddite employees just to track down a single individual who may not be paying their TV license.
We had a detector van parked on double yellows at the end of our front garden in the late 70s. Our lights flickered for days. It irritated the hell out of my dad. We had no TV.
I've never owned / operated a TV in the UK. For decades I got mild amusement from dancing around the TV licensing shenanigans as I moved properties. Then the law changed and using iPlayer etc required the license, so since then I've paid for one (of course). I'm almost nostalgic for the old days where increasingly menacing letters would arrive!
Thanks very much for your advice. I watch your videos all the time.👍
I have a question about the charge notice, does it apply if the letter is addressed to the legal occupier as opposed to the name of the person living there?
How can they prosecute somebody if they do not know their given name?
Very good point.Surely a court cant prosecute without a name.
BlackBeltBarrister not been paying his TV license 😂😂
Let' hope so...
No one should be funding a scandal ridden, incompetent bunch of terror sympathisers.
The C.A.A sent me a letter warning me not to fly commercial aircraft unless I have a license.
I don't have a pilots license but Boeing don't send goons to my house to check if i have a 747 in my back yard......
Another point to make....when you open the 'don't need a tv license' page, you are presented with a multiple choice set of possible reasons for not needing one..... there is no option for 'I DO NOT POSSESS A TV and do not watch any tv programmes ON ANY DEVICE, live or otherwise, by choice'.
That's the thing mate. They rely on people to have no knowledge of the laws around licencing and therefore are able to fool you with clever words, or gain access when in fact they don't have all of those rights.
Thankfully, you've done a good job putting it all in laymen's terms so that we can all understand and make a decision.
I say, if you don't want a big headache over it all, just let them know you don't need a licence, if you really don't need one.
Dan,
If they lied to obtain a warrant, what legal recourse would someone have against TVL and possibly the magistrate who signed off on it?
Not the magistrate that signed off on it. Possibly against an individual in TVL for perjury.
@@katrinabryce Assume that would be a criminal charge? Can I force the CPS to do that?
TBH I'd also want to take civil action too (if possible)
@@TheJase8566 It would be a criminal charge. You could maybe do a private prosecution, but it would be a long shot. Only something to consider if you have unlimited money and really hate TVL.
Yeah. They'd have committed perjury.
Proving it is another matter.
Cheers. Nothing has happened, but I wouldn't put it past them to lie to to obtain one. And if one was ever served against me, I'd absolutely want them prosecuted for it (police body cam obtained as evidence too, to show no live telly or iplayer)
Italy is interesting.
In Italy, your TV license cost is automatically added to your electricity standing charge UNLESS you complete an ANNUAL DECLARATION that you do not have receiving equipment. They are highly rule-based over there. (It's about 10 euro per month)
EDIT
And there is a charge to make the declaration!
For the avoidance of all doubt, I do not need a firearms licence an HGV licence or a space explorers licence.
Any device in your house capable of receiving live TV, requires you to have a license. We all know this is false, so why do the BBC claim it to be a legal document enforceable by the Courts?
Their aim is to frighten you into purchasing their product,&this attempt at frightening people should be outlawed,but money speaks,as always,&they get away with it.
They don't say that at all, nothing in tv license website says u pay license for having a device
Where did you get that information from, did you just make it up?
They lie by being economical with the truth - their friends the politicians do it all the time.
I would like to know how many poor trees they cut down? and further more contributing to the co2 global boiling? I wouldn't want to guess their entire global foot print.😂
Good point. Pure hypocrites.
Its just better to fill in the NLN form. I did that over a year ago and have not had any letters or visits
Funnily enough, I filled in the NLN online just two days ago.... The one lie that concerned Me, was when you have confirm that you understand everything...it states that you agree that "an inspection may still be carried out at your address"...!
Presumably, that has no legal standing in terms of them entering your property...and you can tell them to bugger off...!?
I declared I didnt need a TV licence and I got an email back stating I had declared I didn't need one, then about 4 weeks later I had a tv licensing person on my door step and i felt so intimidated I actually signed up for a licence. I then read up and cancelled it again, haven't had anything since that was a few years ago now.
Quite true , I have an option four ,I do hold a licence but because of an address error with the PAF ( postcode address file ) not being updated they keep sending me threatening letters. I have no intention of telling them anything l just let them carry on I have no obligation to explain my correct address to other sales people so why the BBC . When I renew I will tell them then. They really are terrible its no wonder people are turning off BBC their public image is just a disaster.
I had a similar in a previous property where we had a license, but got an angry-gram letter stating that as we'd just purchased a TV and their records showed no TV license at the address (the address that they wrote to was identical to the address on the license) that I had to immediately pay for a licence or prove that I had a licence already. I wrote back and told them to check their own record and to stop threatening me... I never did hear back!
If the address on your TV Licence receipt exactly matches the address on the "you do not have a TV licence" letter, that's a TVL error and not PAF.
If your house name/number has been renamed/renumbered since purchasing your TV licence, contact your council and tell them to notify Royal Mail of the change.
Similarly, if your address has a named entry as well as a numbered entry in PAF, pick the one you want and tell your council the other isn't needed and they should notify RM of the change.
When I first moved in where I live now, I got a wad of letters come through the box, all from TV licensing, with over 3 years worth of threats for not having a TV license. Each letter was dated a couple of months appart, starting from "you need a tv license" to "we are going to visit on x date" to "we are prossecuting" then that cycle started over and over for the whole time.
The reason for them all coming at the same time? The house hadnt even been built yet, it had obviously been registered at the point where the letters start, but as there was no letter box to put them through, the post office held onto them, for all those years. Woud love to have been a fly on the wall when the agent was supposed to have turned up to find a pile of dirt. (I know they probably never did, but would have been quite the laugh if they had)
I did the NLN thing about 3½ years ago, they just contact you after 2 years to check for any change of circumstances & to renew the NLN declaration, I've never had any 'scary' letters or any other contact with TVL since.
Shurly the licencing authority if thay intend to remove the NLN status must give notice of this although I note that very few government departments comply with the legal requirements of notice of change even when under the act it's a criminal offence not to give notice.
When I have received such mail from them in the past, I always write to thank them for the fire starting material, but I am in need of a lot more to see me through the winter months. If they have any more to spare I would be most grateful. I never hear from them again.
I stopped mine online and received an email confirming the NLN. 1 month later I get a letter because the DD stopped warning me of the need for a licence.
6 months later I get a letter through the door out of an envelope warning of a warrant for a search, been ignoring them all round and when they did post it through personally I was in the front room when it happened. It has been going through my mind as to why they didn't knock as the light was on and the pc running a game in the front room at 7pm.
I am assuming they thought I was watching TV while looking through the front door embossed glass and seeing a screen running, no doubt I will find out soon enough.
I’ve not had any requirement to hold a TV licence, no TV nor watch Iplayer, for over 20 years and have in the past declared I don’t need one but they still send letters addressed to the legal occupier complete with a window in the envelope printed in red saying “ an investigation has started” . I never open the letters just burn them in my Rayburn.
What really annoys me is I have no pilots, fishing, firearms nor many other types of licence but have never been pestered to explain why I don’t have one nor have to prove I don’t need one.
On one property we have, which we bought in 1997 we told TV licensing that we didn't need a TV license, then after 2 years we had letters telling us we need a license but we have ignored then on the basis that we don't need one and we have been reasonable in that we have told them that (albeit in 1997), which is still current. The letters we receive start innocuously enough but over time get more threatening. After that the cycle starts all over again. There is no way that the license inspectors can view the property as it is protected with hawthorn hedges and an 8' steel spiked gate without breaking in. The letters they produce are clearly from TV Licensing with the basis of the contents often visible on the outside, presumably to embarrass the recipient, although our postie, who has been delivering them for the last 24 years thinks its a big joke.
Informative, Thank you. The wording is designed quite deliberately to confuse and intimidate. Guilty until you prove if you dare, that you do not have a TV and therefore do not need or have a licence. Appalling tactics.
A few years ago I owned a property that was empty as was being renovated. I got these letters monthly and did do a declaration which stopped the letters for three months and they started them again so I just recycled them, including the ones threatening court action and enforcement action which were just threatening rather than substantive. There was no television inside so even if they had a look around when I wasn’t there there couldn’t be any evidence.
The term “Live TV” is itself misleading as apart from sporting events and some other outside broadcasts, most TV broadcasts are in fact prerecorded. This can lead to some people believing that they don’t need a license to watch their favourite soap for example.
Easiest way to remember is the TV licence is a tax on watching TV the 'traditional way' (as it dates from the 1940's). New ways to watch (on demand) are except apart from iplayer, but thats no loss.
The whole 'TV Licensing' setup is a scam designed to fool people into believing that they need one when they don't.
The government allows the BBC to get away with it because the BBC are a government mouthpiece.
Neither of them are on our side.