Gehrman is quite the character. Initially, when I played the game, I knew very little about him. All I knew was that he was this old badass hunter with a huge scythe and that he seemed to enjoy the thrill of the hunt. Although his intentions and motives remained a mystery to me. Seeing him crying in his sleep, begging to be released from the dream... It was a very... humanizing moment for him. I legit felt bad for him. And don't even get me started on his whole unrequited love for Maria and his mania for her. That in of itself is depressing. Despite all that though, he chooses to stay in the dream and continue to "free" the hunters from the dream. As he doesn't want anyone else to have to deal with the burden he must carry.
@@dominicp9296 He could let himself be killed by another Hunter in the dream, thereby freeing himself, but instead chooses to fight to free any such Hunters from the dream instead.
I recall someone saying he's been there for an extreme amount of years. His body dead somewhere and only his conscience being used by the great ones. So I believe he was very aware how long he was in the dream. But that's just my opinion.
My theory is that when Laurence and Gehrman realized that they couldn't control the spread of the curse, they decided to find a way to contact (they beckoned) an great one. They found the Moon Presence and they made the hunters dream that gave hunters the ability to revive an unlimited amount of times. The Moon Presence craved a surrogate and they needed someone strong to cut off unwilling hunters from the hunters dream, since immortal people can create big problems if they go down a path of evil. They selected Gehrman to be that person since he was the strongest and he could train hunters as well. He has probably stopped training hunters because so much time has passed.
I really like this theory! it's makes a ton of sense. although i think the bigger part of an eliminator (gherman) to kill hunters if they got to close to the eldrich truth or uncovered dark secrets. the only problem is when a hunter is trained too well and when he gets too close to the truth, he can kill gherman and even the moon presence. (you)
Yea. After fighting for so long and watching so many hunters die or killing them himself. He probably just gave up on training. I like to believe Gehrman is training the player though. Like whenever tbe game is off. It makes the final battle much more climactic if you look at as a mentor and student
yeah because it is said maria brought flowers to the patients from the Lumen wood garden...and there is a tombstone in fishing hamlet on a cliff looking over kos' corpse and the orphan boss fight. the tombstone has those flowers so maria probably put them there
I interpreted both, the bitter double meaning. She now thinks they should have never touched the corpse of Kos, as well as is dead inside from what they did to the poor fishing hamlet.
Also, I think Gehrman possibly knows Laurence's fate and perhaps he was simply having a bad dream involving Laurence, sometimes people dream about lost friends as if they were still alive without realizing it until they wake up
Gehrman at his fight went from cool grandpa character, to probably my favorite character from any game. he know's what its like to be stuck. and he wants you to be free, no matter how much he'd like to pass on from the dream. he puts you ahead of himself and mont, where do i sign up to do co-op with you when ds3 comes out
I have a theory. Could be completely wrong. What if Gherman's task was to wait.Wait for a Hunter strong enough to slay the Nightmares. Ascend to the next level of human evolution. What if our Hunter is that chosen Hunter.The one who is strong enough to learn the eldritch truth and become a Great One. Gherman was meant as a guardian...a gatekeeper. Not only does he pose the last challenge before the Moon Presence, but in defeating him, we release him from the dream and usher in a new, baby...Great One. One stronger that the ones we have encountered in Bloodborne. Just an idea.
I ended up calling him "Gehrman the first German" for a while early on. After a while I got tired of "the first German" and just started calling him Otto Von Bismarck.
That's the most idiotic reference to german's history ever but it's also the funniest thing I heard today so thanks for making my day a little bit better :)
My theory is that gehrman felt lonely in the old hunter's workshop since it was sealed off.He conducted a ritual by using an umbilical cord he summoned a great one and asked for company.The great one agreed by giving him the doll but trapping him in the hunter's dream.You can find an umbilical cord in the old hunter's workshop,further benefiting my theory.
That cord is how he made contact with the Moon Presence in the first place, which created the Hunter's Dream. I think the dream is built on Gehrman's desires and memories, but he wishes to leave the dream anyway.
I don't know if this theory has been proposed, but here it goes. The great ones are alien-like, extra-dimensional beings. Each one, when born, has the power to manifest reality. They require a "host", a being who has his/her psyche come into existence. This is the relationship between Gehrman and the Moon Presence; the Moon Presence has sought ought a new child (see the umbilical cord description) in Gehrman, and manifests the dream or psyche of Gehrman. The main part of the world is made by Oedon, the formless one. Each great one must exist in the sorta-core reality until they can create their own world. Once this happens, they can abandon a physical form. This is the case for Mergo's Wet Nurse, who relies upon Micolash to host the realm of the nightmare (or maybe it's Mergo that manifests it). The core world is manifested by Oedon, by some unknown thing (probably a Pthumerian). The umbilical cord is what attaches a host to a Great One. Taking three, making an umbilical cord in its whole, is what allows the player to avoid becoming the host for the Moon Presence; the hunter is attached to the real world, or at least has a cord that does not allow another to attach to the hunter. To this end, I think that contact with the Great Ones causes humans to have their minds blown--frenzy is the eldritch knowledge surpassing a human's ability to understand, causing that brain full of eyes thing, which is hazardous to one's health. The more insight one has, the closer one is to having his/her mind blown. This is why the Mensis cage and the choir set, clothing for those who wish to make contact with the Great Ones, have the lowest resistance to frenzy. They are made to allow people to contact the Great Ones, and so they WANT the melty-brain effect. Rom seems to be a host for a Great One, specifically the Great One that makes reality a place without the Amygdala and the other Great Ones visible and corporeal. Once Rom is dead, and the world without giant bug things is shattered, then the hunter sees the blood moon and a hellscape reality that Rom's Great One was sealing. Ebrietas seems to lack a host. She may be a go-between for humans/Pthumerians and Great Ones, a matchmaker of sorts finding suitable hosts to withstand the influence of Great Ones making a reality. Or, maybe I'm wrong.
Every time I hear that clip of Gehrman crying and begging for release always makes me almost tear up a bit.... Someone who is possessed of so much quiet courage and mercy sobbing for help in a living hell of a nightmare...
The neat thing about games like Bloodborne is how FromSoftware lets US decide how we think things happened, so in a way, the young farmer Gherman turned hunter story is true.
Yeah, a lot of the story in these games is what you make of it - Gehrman's past is never stated so people are left to their own devices to wonder where he came from, and so forth
Phil Battiste I find sense it that. After all, in later adaptations of Little Red Riding Hood, the Huntsman that appears has the garb and tools of a normal woodcutter. Given that the first parts of the game has a Victorian horror aesthetic, and thus would be in line with when the Huntsman showed up in the story, it feels right.
I feel Maria is more of a daughter figure, or family member who has lost touch. Like a drug addict, so he created the doll to remind him of how she used to be, but ended up making just another image of the loss of her self. I feel Maria was turned in to a thrall basically, to convert the humans in to those mushroom guys. And Gherman already knew it was all a lie. Just my 2 cents lol
I've been waiting for a Gehrman lore video for a while, as he's the most intriguing character in Bloodborne (for me, anyway), and it didn't disappoint! I really liked your ideas on him, and who he was before the Hunter's Dream. And those drawings were hilarious! I especially loved Willem chilling out while a shirtless Gehrman worked the fields.
+Jofer Parreno Naw, the female character in this video I used has actual silver/white hair, whereas the Pthumerians and Maria have more of a "ash blonde" colour going on. Besides, silver hair is "considered antiquated in these times."
Well I'd say Bloodborne's timeline spans about maybe 10 years, because in the cutscene with Master Will talking to Lawrence, Will is just as old as he is in the game when you find him.
+Feel My Body plz Yeah, some parts of Bloodborne imply that not too much time has passed, but others make it feel like a more substantial passage of time has occurred.
The reason is because he kinda ascended, allowing him to live for a very long time, for that reason, Laurence is dead before many years, the old hunters you find in Hunter's Nightmare are dead, Simon is dead, Brador is dead, Ludwig is dead, Maria is dead, and Gehrman is still alive because he is immortal by Moon Presence's power, Micolash lived in Laurence's time i believe, but is still alive due to living in a nightmare (like Gehrman), that's just my theory.
I love the gardener theory. Both fun and absolutely badass. I think however that Gehrman is trapped in the dream. If we kill Gehrman without the umbilical cord then we take his place, "charmed" by the Moonpresence. This is probably what happened to Gehrman. He is aware of how much time has past and that he is trapped in the dream, or for him, the nightmare. But he cant die. The Moonpresence wont allow it and when he is with it his mind is forcefully soothed. Which is why we only hear him cry once, a moment of freedom and realization. We must remeber that the great ones don´t hate humanity. They love us. Care for us. But they have no understanding of how we think. For it, Making Gehrman immortal is a good thing because he cant die, not realizing the agony he lives in. Its like keeping a dog in a house without scent so that it doesn´t have to smell something bad, but a dog relies 70% on smell. Its how they view the world.
God damn I'm glad that craze is over... That and the stupid ass Vamp TV series that started coming out almost completely ruined whatever hope I had for any good Vampire movies.
I believe Gherman was a tomb prospector, the corpses you see down in the tombs are usually knight armored and would move slowly, Gherman would have survived more beast battles and found more insight if he was a prospector and would have a better chance of finding a umbilical cord that way, this is influenced by the placement of the umbilical cord in the work shop and may have lead to then founding or enhancement of healing blood, this would have increased his and Laurence's life span, even more so when Laurence beckoned the moon presence, what is one more fitting than Gherman? Who had revolutionized the hunt of beast after the dark blood of beast were found in men who had not the will to withstand the blood, he would have had the experience and distance to become the first Hunter and the insight The mad men's skulls and Laurence's skull have quite the same aura The tomb prospectors and hunters are connected, in the DLC, I think I'll have to check
You hear a lot throughout the story about the Hunters once having dreams, like Djura and Eileen. They've seen the doll there inside the dreams but there is no confirmation that they've seen Gehrman within the dream. So this is what I think. I think that the hunters were sort of "interviewed" by the moon presence. Maybe eventually Gehrman started "dreaming" and the Moon Presence chose him and embraced him, charming him into staying inside the hunter's dream until maybe a stronger hunter showed up. This makes sense to me because if you fight Gehrman without consuming the cords, the Moon Presence embraces you and you become the next "Hunter's Helper". I've also found that Great Ones or those related to them bleed white blood or "pale blood" when they are hit, I assume this because of the blood bled from Brain Suckers and the Celestial Emissary. When you hit the doll, she bleeds Pale Blood so by my theory, that makes her related or confirms that she IS a Great One. One would assume that it may be The Moon Presence in a different form or most likely, seeing as the Doll still remains in the dream after The Moon Presence dies, a being that The Moon Presence created to help forge a stronger Hunter (Since the doll is used to level you up). Also in the opening cutscene I believe there is a line that says "seek the pale blood" so perhaps our Good Hunter is searching for the Dream or the Doll to become stronger or, the Good Hunter seeks to transcend humanity by becoming a Great One and gaining Pale Blood.
What I find interesting with Gehrman and Maria is that they seem to be each others polar opposite, Maria being a Noble and Gehrman being a farmer. Which I do believe Gehrman did have romantic feelings towards Maria I mean you can even find a book in the dream titled "How to pick up fair maidens" Maria being the fair maiden. With this said I believe Gehrman had low self-esteem and just had doubt's about himself attracting Maria, with that said the events at the fishing hamlet must have also caused him to be obsessed with Maria which may be the reason behind the doll. Also both use Skill based weapons and both the Burial Blade and the Rakuyo scale with Skill and Arcane. Guess we could take this as a sign of Gehrman influencing Maria's weapon preference that or this could be a sign of Gehrman's teaching. But if you read the Rakuyo's weapon description Maria got tired of the Rakuyo maybe now this is just me but whatever happened at the fishing hamlet and with Kos may have caused Maria to doubt her mentor making her throw away her non-blood weapons and revert to her Cainhurst teachings and use of blood weapons and blood related attacks.
To me, i assume Maria is more like Gehrman's adopted daughter, really, leave the stupid book in the dream. Gehrman is in Hunter's Dream, and Maria is in Hunter's Nightmare, for that reason, they stopped aging, think about it, we find Gehrman as an old man, however, we find Maria as a young lady, my theory is that, Gehrman was already old when he was imprisoned in Hunter's Dream, and Maria was as young as we can find her in the DLC, that is my point.
@@LepoetismYeah, this is a very good point that I’ve been wanting to bring up. In the trailer for the DLC, you can see him in the fishing hamlet and he doesn’t look at all older than how we see him in the dream. Maria killed herself not long after that, and was obviously MUCH much younger. It’s a pseudo-parental relationship that they have. Makes him far more tragic, and you can actually sympathize with him (Like how you’re supposed to) instead of assuming he’s some sex offender, lol.
This thumb is so hilarious. German looks like a tangerine. He is very old, but his physicality is kept in the dream at a certain age in a supernatural way.
I find Maria's pre-combat monologue quite interesting. "A corpse should be left well alone. Oh, I know very well, how the secrets beckon so sweetly." While the second line might not directly refer to the first, I can't help but to think Maria is commenting on the corpse of Kos washing on the shore and Byrgenwerth's experiments derived from the encounter. "Only an honest death will cure you now. Liberate you from your wild curiosity." Again, she almost sounds like she knows what we are feeling, and the only way to stop us is to kill us face to face. The wording implies that she has delivered (or perhaps received) such punishment before our confrontation.
+Pyry Ojala Shit, I didn't think of that. I always thought she was referring to herself as a corpse! My proverbial hat goes off to you, because that was a really good catch!
+Opticfreakinbarrel I think she is supposed to be referring to herself, with the corpse line. But it can likewise later be thought to reference Kos as well. It does say "inspect corpse" before triggering that cutscene, after all!
Silver Mont That would make sense, but I just can't wrap my head around why she would call herself a corpse. The only explanation I can think of is that she has a kind of immortality like Annalise, and then my mind wanders to the question of why she's currently 'dead' and who or what killed her. Honestly, I still have a lot of questions about Maria that I can't seem to answer myself!
+Pyry Ojala Totally agree with this. In fact, her whole speech seems like it's filled with double (triple, and more) entendres. She could be referring to herself, Kos, AND the tons of other corpses that have been dissected and experimented on in the name of the church, it doesn't have to be one meaning. Not only are their multiple meanings for each line, but she does seem to hint at having a ridiculous amount of awareness as to what's going on. Her lucid mindset is a huge contrast to the other bosses of the DLC, and I think this hints at her being a very willing participant of the nightmare, even if she's "shackled" to it. However, I think an "honest death" and "liberate" means she intends to sever you from the nightmare, much like how Gehrman can sever you from the dream. After all, a death like this would certainly "cure" you of any "wild curiosity"--you wouldn't even remember anything, nor would you be a hunter or suffer their ultimate fate, if she could pull it off successfully. However I think there's another way out to "liberate" someone from the nightmare and everything related to it. Since Adeline and all the enlarged head patients seem to be wanting to reach enlightenment, in an effort to impress Maria, or follow her wishes, I think having a "relevation" or reaching "enlightenment" can allow someone to transcend to another plane of existence and escape the nightmare. I also think that this is why the Maria gave Adeline the balcony key, why there are lumenwood flowers on her coffin, why The Living Failures (failed Celestial Emissaries) have the key to the clock tower, and why the clock is lined with Caryll runes. So I think she knows exactly what's going on. Also I think there's another interesting bit about her and her "corpse" status, that might be a bit fourth wall breaking.. She's obviously dead, but her posture seems very relaxed and peaceful. Also, she doesn't wake up until the player approaches her. This seems like it's very similar to when the player dies, goes to the hunter dream, and then returns to where they left off. Maria is even sitting in her own blood pool which is something other players will leave behind in online mode. So I think that, even though she's dead, the player might be catching her as she returns from another dream.
+RadioactiveChocolate Yep, Maria totally knows what's going on past the Astral Clocktower. Simon tells us: "Climb the Astral Clocktower, and kill Maria. She hides the real secret." While the "hides" does not strictly imply knowledge, I'd find it strange for her not to know what she is guarding. As for her liberating us the way Gehrman can free us from the Hunter's Dream... I always wondered why Gehrman couldn't forcibly eject us from the nightmare after we refuse. Well, it obviously wouldn't make for good gameplay, but perhaps we cannot be cut off precisely because we are not willing. That's why Gehrman asks us to submit our life. When Gehrman offs defeats us he says: "You must accept your death. Be freed from the night", almost as if accepting our death directly lead to our freedom. Of course, we don't. Maria might realize we are too stubborn, too "wildly curious" to just let ourselves be cut off without resistance, so only an "honest death" could do the job. Like Gehrman that means she'll thrash us so badly we'd rather accept death than to continue. The weak point of this theory would be that there should be a mechanic to give up the fight against Gehrman and Maria, as I can't imagine coding such would be very difficult.
Gehrman has to be one of the best fights in the souls series. The arena is wide open and so good looking, his moves are easy to dodge when you learn them, and the cutscenes is great
I love this. You theories are really good and in depth. And the drawings you use so funny, accompany the story surprisingly well... :3Do you post these anywhere? The drawings I mean.
Some of the art is up at wingspan.weebly.com and i'm making a site to host all of it, separate from the portfolio. I'll have Mont make a video of it when it's done - thanks for your interest! There's also a link in his video descriptions to my store page where you can also see some of the art
OH, I think I just had a bit of a revelation. When Gehrman is sleeping and he start jabbering and weeping about how he wishes to be released from "This Dream" and how "The night blocks all sight" and what not, perhaps he's not actually talking about the Hunter's Dream, but rather referring to the fact that when he sleeps *within* the Hunter's Dream, he's drawn into the Hunter's Nightmare, shackled as he may be to dead Kos, being the surrogate child of a dead mother. This would definitely answer that age-old question of why Gehrman is willing to put up a fight in the end if all he *really* wanted was to be freed. I don't think that the Hunter's Dream is the dream from which he wishes to be freed. And just think about how the Orphan of Kos weeps the same way that Gehrman does.. They even look alike! Perhaps it was even necessary for them to link Gehrman to Kos in order to harvest an umbilical cord? So far the only other known sources have been Queen Yharnam and the Whore. Gerhman is the Surrogate child of a dead great one, linked to his "mothers" corpse. Perhaps this is also why he is apparently "Obscure in the Waking World" - He ultimately participated in a ritual that would be hidden from all and mark the point at which the Byrgenwerth Scholar's started going down separate paths. Feverish worship, blood and insight. It's not a complete theory, but it (In my opinion) makes a fair deal of sense.
TheNoMoreGamer Could be. I don't see why they would kill Kos (Assuming Kos really *is* the blob on the beach) if not for the Umbilical cord. Then the only question is whether or not they got all three thirds from it or if they also got some from other sources. (We know that a human birthing a great one apparently results in one third of an umbilical cord) I like to think that Gehrman stopped his career after he slew Kos. He realized how he had sinned, and perhaps he was even somehow bound to the orphan. What I find odd about "Orphan" of Kos is that "Every Great-One looses it's child" but in this case it seems more like the child lost it's parent Great-One.
Rakinjo2 Yeah, that is interesting. But then again every great one is unique in how they give birth. I figured that Willem and Byrgenwyrth sort of stole credit from the fishing Hamlet with the discovery of the great ones, and hid the secrets of this. I've also always thought that the events of bloodborne happened before, the blood moon, night of the hunt, death of a great one the cords yadda yadda. Like some time before you arrived. I always figured that the reason Yharnamites hated outsiders so much was because the church decided to blame outsiders for the plague, telling them that the outsiders brought it in. I also thought that Simon was the hunter before you that stopped the first unending night, but I need to do more digging into this.
TheNoMoreGamer Well, I'd be tempted to say that the sort of brutal "It's all gone to hell and the Great One's are descending!"-nights only happen once in a civilization's lifetime. I'm saying that because it kind of fits with how Ailing Loran went under and was then discovered, and the Pthumerian's before them. I don't think that the night you go through as a player is just a regular "Night of the Hunt" at all. I think it's so much more than that, as everything has now aligned for the Great One's to descend and do all of their work, competing for a child.
I had not thought of that. Initially I figured after every descent, a great one or two was born/made, the last being mergot and rom, and this one being you.
Has anyone even noticed that the orphan of kos’ cry is the exact same cry as gehrman’s in the hunters dream when he cries to be saved by master Willem and Laurence? This might mean that gehrman maybe is the orphan of kos, especially when you finish the dlc and the doll says he is Finally sleeping Well now. Perhaps his relation to byrgenwerth meant that gehrman maybe was apart of the massacre to the fishing hamlet, that could be the reason for gehrman’s restless nights because he has feelings of guilt.
I believe the pause when telling us his name was merely a moment of thought for what to say next. He can't go right out and say first hunter because then we have questions and there can be no questions while beasts wander the streets. Now go spill some blood.
Well, considering the actual Knight's Set isn't armor, and the fact that the Knights were skilled enough at hunting beasts to consider the left behind corpses art, I doubt the beasts tore through them. I like the idea that Vaati brought up. The Beasts of Cainhurst are born of a different strain of the Old Blood, so they look and behave differently. Thus two different styles of fighting them. Gehrman used stealth and speed, while the Knights of Cainhurst fought with some sort of grace, using a rapier that could turn into a gun, and a sword that feed off their own blood.
+Evnyofdeath Well, when I say the knights of Cainhurst, I meant in the past - because it does seem at some point that they used armour, judging from all the statues. That, and we find corpses here and there wearing armour (might not be from Cainhurst, obviously) I think the last generation of knights stopped using armour and took up rapiers and the like - considering Maria's set is VERY close to the knight's set, I think they more or less based it on her appearance. After all, we know the hunter's cap is based on her, so it seems she was quite popular in some ways.
great video, I can see that you put a lot effort into it and it was pleasure to watch it:) I like yoiur theory, though I've never imagined Gherman as a farman myself^^
Has anyone noticed that the orphan looks suspiciously like a pthumerian? Ok, look, this is kinda crazy, to be honest, but could kos be the mother of all pthumerians? Maybe the curse of the pthumerians was that they would slowly degenerate into humans, leading kos to truly earn the title "mother". I dunno. The thought that humans basically killed their mother is kinda intriguing to me.
the use of the word/name spear(head) is used as a title for vanguards of battle(the 1st wave of war/battle) you assume that your character is special that you need to know everything, but it's much more likely Gehrman thinks you are just another hunter passing by; and deem it pointless to tell you(surrender ending) i think you are on the right track; Gehrman doesn't quite seem like he's into any political gains; and is more likely one who takes up arms to protect what he deem important and is later noticed by William and such others. time is most likely irrelevant to Gehrman; he's (in a sense) working for the moon prescience
It could be that, I think it's the curse creation, I think of this because if you listen closely in fishing hamlet you can hear its residence saying curse the hunter's and their children, for they pretty much ravage the hamlet and tried to find eyes inside their head. And Simon did say it was the source of the nightmare, and only hunters who go drunk on blood get send there, but it's my theory.
Cognate of the German Hermann (soldier, warrior), a name derived from the Old High German Hariman, which is a compounding of the elements hari (army) and man (man).
I love these thumbnail images! As soon as I get paid, I'm going to buy a T-shirt and show the artist my support. I might get this one in particular. Gehrman looks so happy!
concerning the whole rakuyo in the well thing, what i think happened is that she threw her original rakuyo in the well, one that wasnt capable of being a blood blade, and had a new rakuyo crafted that could use a blood blade, just as an extra precaution so no one would defeat her and find the nightmare's secrets
Hello Silver Mont! I really like your point of view on Gehrman and even found it relevant when you told he could be hiding his name. It reminded me of the Japanese dialogue where there is no dramatic pause. To me he just had a lil difficulty saying his name to emphasize the old age. As you said i think Gehrman does not fit the intellectual type, but what those books in Hunter Dream could represent? I think as a Gehrman is a hunter he is far more practical than theoretical, although he is represented as a teacher for Lady Maria. About he having feelings about her I think that's somewhat strange since he himself offers us the Doll in such a bizarre way. There is no doubt that the way he says "even the doll" is suspected, so I think that does not suit the possibility of him having feelings for Lady Maria (the age difference would be huge as i think Maria was younger back the day). His mysterious "mania" is a mystery indeed. I think Gehrman was somewhat eccentric. How I wish seeing him on the DLC. Great analysis/theories. Peace.
+Jägerbrandt To be fair, feelings are not eternal. One can grow quite cold towards people and things they once held dear, especially if trauma of some form is involved.Of course, we could also look to another Japanese creator/creation relationship as an illustration of another possibility, Dr.Tenma and Astro Boy. Created to replace a lost loved one and loathed for failing to do so.I mean, the doll and Maria are very different people, which if Gehrman was trying to replace Maria would make the doll very much a failure in his eyes.
+Brandon Brown I see what you're saying and if that's the case how sad things could be. Great example with the Astro Boy. I think Gehrman is crafty enough to build a doll like that, but i doubt he was the passionate man who did the job. I mean do you remember the Source of the Dream? She always been there as a lifeless doll, like she was part of the furnitures and the Workshop was a public place for the Hunters so it's hard to build the theory that Gehrman was the man who build the Doll. I think it's safe to assume someone brought her to the Workshop only to adorn the place (i hope). We see the Doll as a person because she rather looks like one and i think she is "interactive" for this reason. We see her alive while others dont, just like when we get Insight and she looks alive, not sitting rough with her legs wide open. Maybe she is indeed just a sexual article for Gehrman, he can't see her like we do. The curious thing would be that she can notice him while he doesn't.
"A corpse should be left well alone... Oh I know very well" You should of left that *corpse* alone, Maria. By the wrath *of* mother *Kos*, you should of let it be...
I think gehrman followed Laurence,when he left Byrgenwerth for Yharnam to found the Healing Church. Gehrman was probably ordered to deal with the beasts who would obviously come. Gehrman then invented his burial blade which he based off his 'farming.' It went well but the Church grew and so did the beasts. So Gehrman needed some more hunters. He probably posted an ad in the papers. :p At Cainhurst Maria heard of this and wanted to help, because of some reason. She took her Rakuyo with her and left for Yharnam. She was fascinated by Gehrman and Gehrman developed feelings for her. Then after some time something happened in the fishing village which made her throw her weapon in a well. Did she kill Kos in an epic water battle or was she witness to something horrifying? Maybe in her despair she beckoned the nightmare.
I think this is the derpiest pic I've ever seen of Gehrman, so you sir just get a like for that to begin with, I'm sure that this is a great vid anyways.
+Silver Mont I was working on the basis of a timeline last power scale for some of the biggest players in the bloodborne timeline. I was thinking that Gehrman was probably what you theorized or was a member of the college and left when Laurence did, in my opinion when Gehrman began training the first hunters he trained most in a standardized form of fighting, as shown in the hunters in the nightmare. As time went on hunters started teaching their fellow hunters in specialized style which lead to the different factions like the powder kegs. I also believe that during Gehrman's direct teaching of all hunters, logarius was around and so were the executioners. I also believe that during that time was when the vile bloods lost standing with the byrgenworth and such began logarius began his crusade. During this time I believe Ludwig was being trained and witnessed the crusade of the executioners.
+Silver Mont I also think that Ludwig was using the moonlight blade but I believe it was a weapon that Gehrman did not approve of because of it being more of a strength and arcane based weapon instead of a dexterous weapon like the burial blade. As such I believe that because of Gehrman's disapproval of his fighting style, Ludwig would go on to teach the church hunters and would teach them with a more strength based style i.e. Ludwig's holy blade and Kirk hammer. I believe this because in certain item description it is stated that the church anticipated larger beast. I also think that the hunter of hunter where formed when the first hunter became blood addled. In short I also believe that from a lore sense I believe that in terms of strength it goes Gehrman/logarius Maria Ludwig Any of Gehrman's other apprentices Hunters of hunters old hunters/ executioners/ knights of cainhurst Church hunters/ the league Recruited townspeople
+Zimzilla 99 I'd love to see how a human version of Ludwig would fight - we've never fought a boss who wielded the Moonlight sword in any of the Souls games, outside of him. I'd love to see a "human" boss who uses it. Maybe in Dark Souls III?
what I love about Maria is she became a pacifist after what she and Germhan did to the people of the fishing hamlet, she has gone completely into self loathing and I believe when we find her sitting in her chair we find her post some failed suicide attempt, she is done with battle, all she wants to do is to treat those who have fallen to mother Kos' blessing. even so she will take up arms against you if she has to. she will fight you with everything she has to stop you from reaching the fishing hamlet, and if you read her Rakuyos description it says she dislikes using bloodtinge in favor of skill but she resorts to the inherent blood of her lineage and even fire, everything she can to stop you from revealing the truth. when you kill her you're letting her finally be free from her sorrow, youre releasing her.
I just realized whenever the moon presence is summoned and the cutscene starts the moon presence's "mouth" goes straight for the belly button where umbilical cord IS,,,,idk if anyone else has noticed that but i thought id point that out
Do you think the old hunter bone could have belonged to Maria? I know the description says "he" referring to the hunter it was from, but it could just be a translation thing, like the description of Pharis' hat in dark souls. In addition to this, we find the old hunter bone at Maria's grave, the one the doll prays to in the dream; her real body is possibly buried there in the old abandoned workshop. Also, she uses quickening during the fight, while none of the old hunter enemies do, so I think that art came from her (she does have some Ptheumerian blood in her).
+maelstrrom I think she just had her own spin on it. Gehrman's version is kinda... blue? And hers is red. I think he came up with the technique and taught it to several of his disciples, and the art was then lost to time, perhaps because few mastered it and were able to teach it to students of their own, etc.
+Silver Mont Or the Old Hunters possibly died without training no one, becoming beasts or drunk with blood....Seeing the enemies with the Saif actually using the art of quickening. And the gravestone on The Hunter's Dream and Workshop could be of any Old Hunter, even Maria, since is not truly stated.... And since Maria is of Cainhurst then most likely she would be buried in their grounds? Or maybe in the Abandoned Workshop, since there are only one grave and Maria was admired by Gerhman so he placed her corpse there and made the doll to remember her, which later brought the doll to life and etc...
5:20 i would agree with that. U Know Gehrman wwears the same trousers as the suspicious man which you can save by sending in the cathedral. And that man seems like being a normal worker. And both are wearing the same trousers.
I think Gehrman trains us. Well not like do push ups and such but by giving us objectives. Than we learne by experience. I think he dose that because there were so many hunters before us that he knows that we probably will succeed or maybe he just don't realy care at this point. Also what you said about the time shift in the dream world might be true but I think 1 sec in the real worl might be 1 year in the dream.
Yes. He gives you somewhere to go until you kill Amelia, and after that you find your own way. He sets you on the path to Byrgenwerth, and then the Nightmare.
+dricsi07 Well, he hardly even gives us direction. Perhaps even less than the Crestfallen does @ Firelink Shrine. "Go kill some beasts. There's a chalice I guess. And a workshop."
And he even says: "Just go kill some beasts, is for your own good". And the doll's dialogue after killing the Orphan of Kos, (stated at the end of the video), confirms that he is indeed very tired and couldn't sleep this whole time even. So it makes sense he only saying few things to help the Hunter....
Regarding timeline, I think Bloodborne has convenience of "Dream" and "Nightmare". The Old Hunters' areas, first part of the DLC, appear like mix and match of the nightmare in the main game and past events. First of all, the Yharnum in the Old Hunters' nightmare have structures more or less the same as main game, rather there seems to have some volcanic activity in distant past. Given Lawrence, the First Vicor was still around in the Old Hunters' nightmare, that part surely is "nightmare" from the past. Also, Lumenwood Garden, where player fight the Living Failures, is right above the Lumenflower Gardens, yet that Old Hunters' Lumenflower Gardens is next to the room with elevator for the Research Hall instead. Was Maria a hunter from the past or she has been in the Astral Clocktower all along? Interestingly, either way, her existence and the Fishing Hamlet secret that she is/was protecting, has little to no effect on the "main nightmare" in the core game. Lawrence had used the "cursed blood" on people very long time ago. Noted, there were no living Amygdala in the Old Hunters' nightmare, only skeletons of Amygdala and Amygdalan Arm. Also, it was the Amygdala outside Cathedral Ward sending the player character to the Hunters' Nightmare with curse toward people from Byrgenwerth and their descendants.
+DarkMage30000 I wonder, could the DLC areas be arranged in a reverse chronological order? If the Fishing Hamlet was the "original" sin, leading to the cruse, and the experiments Research Hall, leading to the scourge and Ludwig, leading to a miniature Old Yaharnam at the end of the river of blood? Possibly? Kind of?
This is a good video, but early on I disagree with the idea that it was planned for Gerhman to take on something such as the hunters dream. I imagine in the world of bloodborne, things happened quite detached from each other. It seems Gerham did something to bring about the dream after Laurence got turned into a beast and died in the chalice dungeons. Also, it was an interesting little idea I had but I thought that the messengers, were little amygdalas. You are taken into the nightmare by an amygdala. When you get to the research lab, there are tons of weird variations of head monsters, taken on some similarities of amygdala. This is all being overseen by Maria I assume, and in the dream, it seems to me that the messengers are more connected to the doll than Gerhman, seeing how the doll is the one who notes that the messengers have found you. I dunno, something weird I'm probably reading into too much.
I think that Wilhem and Logarius were both Pthumerians while Maria, Annalise and Arianna are only distantly related to the Pthumerians. That could explain Wilhem's weirdly long life and being the first one (possibly) to be obsessed with the Great Ones. Logarius's Executioners were probably an order of human warriors led by a veteran Pthumerian. Why? Logarius is a tall, lanky old man with magic, possibly granted by the research into the Great Ones. His weapon is curiously similar to one of the forms that the Pthumerian Elder's weapon can take. The magic skulls resemble the face of the Pthumerian Elder as well. In any case, Wilhem and Logarius are bigger and paler (Logarius possibly darkened due to the frost) than the hunter (just like the Pthumerians) and Maria is also slightly taller than the hunter. Annalise and Arianna both remain seated but it is safe to say that they are probably also slightly taller than the hunter. If you look at the two oldest hunter weapons, Burial Blade and the Blade of Mercy, you can see that both also resemble an older Pthumerian weapon. The Burial Blade and the Pthumerian scythe wielded by the Elder, and the BoM and the sickles that split into two wielded by the Descendant. And so I think that Gehrman was inspired by Logarius because the sword form of the Burial Blade resembles a curved version of the sword that Logarius uses. Gehrman probably took Logarius's weapons and combined them to make the Burial Blade. Gehrman worked for Wilhem, was inspired by Logarius, created the hunters and involving the regular humans (some of whom were probably also Executioners), and eventually just like how Logarius guards the entrance to Annalise, Gehrman guards the Moon Presence. So, my version (so far) of Bloodborne history is: The Pthumerians researched the Great Ones, two branches of research disputed and split creating the Church and Byrgenwerth, the church created the Dungeons and Arcane magic involving spirits and beasts (Executioner's Gloves, Tiny Tonitrus, Beast Roar) in their research, Byrgenwerth created the other Arcane spells (Augur of Ebrietas, A Call Beyond), Cainhurst split from the church due to increased interest in blood, hunters created by Gehrman as independent body but was close to Byrgenwerth and the Church, Maria got interested in the hunters and distanced herself from Cainhurst. All this eventually led to the Fishing Hamlet, which eventually leads to the Bloodborne game with your Hunter. Also I found it peculiar how in the Old Hunters DLC, the main bosses are Ludwig (Church), Living Failures (Byrgenwerth), Maria (Hunter & Cainhurst), and Orphan (Hunter[?] & Byrgenwerth). This is all just speculation so I don't know though.
A) He was REALLY serious about his farming. B) He started with a normal scythe and then developed the Burial Blade when the beasts popped up / was gifted the meteorite ore.
There is a detail in the chalice dungeons that I noticed. I don't know if there is a detail already known, but as soon as you get into some open areas, you find corpses wearing plate armor like dark souls. It makes me think that when humans found the dungeons long time ago, it was in what it might be considered the middle age (knights). Later on (and many deads after), they redefined their combat system, weaponry and armor. It is not a breaking new, but I believe it is a curious fact as we know everything in Bloodborne happens for a reason.
the blood letter reminds me of the weapons lagarius wields as well as the lagarius wheel so I'm wondering if the blood letter belonged to the executioners before brador maybe the expelling tainted blood thing may not have been something brador made up it would make sense to fight the vilebloods with a weapon that expels tainted blood
Merriam Webster defines the term gearman as: "a keeper of engine-room stores aboard a ship", which is interesting given how many nautical references appear in bloodborne, such as the deep sea runes, the fishing hamlet village, and the waters separating the hunters dream and nightmare. bloodborne has some simply amazing symbolism and lore :D
Well he is crying for help. And he says he had enough of this dream. So he might have some understanding about time and how long it has been. Isnt he mentioning that he have trained the hunter for some time already. Or not train but helped
11:30 Did you make your Cainhurst outfit PC in resemblance of the Doll? Out of all the lore videos I watch on Bloodborne, you've got the bestest character face make. Beautiful faces galore!
So, I have a theory, a sort of head cannon, and to start this I need to ask a question. Why does the moon presence sustain the hunter's dream? Why does it care about the hunters protecting the people of Yharnam? Well, I have a theory. So, the hunters dream is sustained by the moon presence and hosted by Gherman. My theory as to why is that the moon presence is the guardian of humanity. The moon presence knows that if the beastly scourge consumes humanity it will lose it's power. Thus, it took someone who knew the truth and was strong enough to sustain a dream of that type, Gherman, and created the dream. This would explain Gherman's loyalty to the moon presence at the end of the game, he wants to work with the moon presence to help preserve humanity. Now, I am no lore expert, so this whole theory is probably riddled with holes, so feel free to point those out to me.
I love the entrance to his boss fight. The talk leading into his final line while rising from his chair, the weapon reveal, then he says: “Tonight, Gehrman joins the hunt.” Shit, that is how you make an entrance!
did want to beat bloodborne before watching this video because didn't want spoilers and glad i did. Mostly i will mention to me as what i felt with Gehrman is mostly a honorable man for me, the man who don't want any hunter to go through a nightmare as he is gone through and i can see to him it is like 2 days but yet when he wakes up it could been 100 years latter. to take his offer to me is mostly a honor way to go for since it is his request for the player hunter not go through what he has gone through and Gehrman will always be my number one boss fight in bloodborne
I think the reason laurence looks like the cleric beast because he was also a hunter like gerhman but later on was called father that looked like that. The reason vicar amelia looks like she does is because she was one a lady and a part with the white clothed beasts like those big ones with the axes in cathedral ward.
So Micolash has his body behind The One Reborn but is alive in the Nightmare. Is it possible that Gherman's body is that of the very much dead Gatekeeper and he is just alive in the Hunter's Dream?
Cool video :), here I was thinking that somewhere I think I read that it was after kos died that Kos parasites overrun the Hamlet, infecting everyone. Meaby what Lady Maria did that was so horrible that she couldn't stand the Rakuyo anymore was to slain a lot of infected people in the Hamlet?, she throws her weapon in the well so meaby.
+Emmanuel Gonzalez Caseira ""When the carcass of Kos washed up on the coast, its insides were teeming with tiny parasites, unlike any found in humans." Doesn't strictly say they infected people in the hamlet, but that's definitely one way you can take it.
+Silver Mont Yeah, I doesn't directly says it, I just think that's could be a connection since the people looks so much like half-fish dudes with the way they behave really alike the Orphan, in little and subtle ways.
I think when she's talking about a corpse being left alone she was hinting at Kos given that was the secret the old hunters were hiding about what they did from the DLC.
May be a long shot but I think there’s a possibility that Gehrman and the Orphan of Kos are the very first time we see a reversal of the statement: “All great ones lose their child and yearn for a surrogate”. In this case the surrogate and the child are reversed in the order of events. Gehrman was the surrogate and came first. Orphan was the child but came after. The only real evidence I have for this is the Doll’s dialogue after beating the Orphan suggests a connection between the Orphan of Kos and Gehrman. Just a thought.
I think you trigger my curiousity now, and then some of my brain cells work again. I think Moon Pressence and Doll is just somehow related, because of that cutscene in the ending, I think so too, except that "good hunter" part was just a mere satire. It might be possible that Gehrman's "curiousity mania" drove Maria far away instead(this part could be wrong, but still fine if this doesn't true tho), and he desperately lust for her, then the Moon Pressence said to him that he could granted his wish, thus granting soul into the doll(which ended up just as an observer and manipulator instead), but in exchange of his own consciousness trapped in dream world, and be the Moon Pressence's servant forever. It's possible to assume that Gehrman was a vital character that revolt against the beast, the clue is him being the teacher of Maria & other old hunters there. That's why Moon Pressence took him, to stop him against the beast, and instead being his most loyal servant forever. But it's also possible that the beast hunt thingy is just Moon Pressence's playground scenario, where we fuel him by doing so, but idk hahah. The core mistake in this theory could be when we know since what's time Gehrman trapped, or at least when he met Maria, if it's after his consciousness trapped, then this whole theory of mine just wouldn't work at all.
his dialogue begging for help made me almost cry
Nick Brock me too. friend me too
Almost? I'm still sitting here crying like an idiot.
@@reginahorsta7179 hey u ain't an idiot
"Tonight Gehrman joins the hunt!"
Such an amazing line!
Not gonna lie. I was half expecting him to suddenly have a smash bros promo art.
Arturo Sanchez Google has it all my mate
GabrielFFranco #ConTV gives me chills every time
Tonight pohland get hunted!
Gehrman is quite the character.
Initially, when I played the game, I knew very little about him. All I knew was that he was this old badass hunter with a huge scythe and that he seemed to enjoy the thrill of the hunt. Although his intentions and motives remained a mystery to me.
Seeing him crying in his sleep, begging to be released from the dream... It was a very... humanizing moment for him. I legit felt bad for him. And don't even get me started on his whole unrequited love for Maria and his mania for her. That in of itself is depressing.
Despite all that though, he chooses to stay in the dream and continue to "free" the hunters from the dream. As he doesn't want anyone else to have to deal with the burden he must carry.
I agree with everything you say but he doesn't choose to be in the dream the moon presence forces him to be there
@@dominicp9296 He could let himself be killed by another Hunter in the dream, thereby freeing himself, but instead chooses to fight to free any such Hunters from the dream instead.
When gehrman dies he says: 'The night and the dream where long' so i dont think gehrman thinks he's olny there for a couple of days.
Hef Bundy Yea he was there for likely dozens of years
I recall someone saying he's been there for an extreme amount of years. His body dead somewhere and only his conscience being used by the great ones. So I believe he was very aware how long he was in the dream. But that's just my opinion.
Were*
@@Illusive_Batman like Mikolash, except Gehrman wasn't there by choice, right?
@@LuisGonzalez-dn7lo he probably was there by choice *at first*
Gehrmans books in the hunters dream (i think there in there) read "how to pick up fair maidens". Maria is a fair maiden. Coincidence? Nope.
haha nice
Learn the difference between there, they're and their pls
@@AdminAbuse it's not really that necessary since we already know what they mean
It's necessary if you don't want to look like a moron.
The only morons are people that care about proper spelling in RUclips comments in 2019 lmaoooo
My theory is that when Laurence and Gehrman realized that they couldn't control the spread of the curse, they decided to find a way to contact (they beckoned) an great one. They found the Moon Presence and they made the hunters dream that gave hunters the ability to revive an unlimited amount of times. The Moon Presence craved a surrogate and they needed someone strong to cut off unwilling hunters from the hunters dream, since immortal people can create big problems if they go down a path of evil. They selected Gehrman to be that person since he was the strongest and he could train hunters as well. He has probably stopped training hunters because so much time has passed.
I really like this theory! it's makes a ton of sense. although i think the bigger part of an eliminator (gherman) to kill hunters if they got to close to the eldrich truth or uncovered dark secrets. the only problem is when a hunter is trained too well and when he gets too close to the truth, he can kill gherman and even the moon presence. (you)
Drawek gehrman doesn't train you at all
+Alvin Lin Which is why i said:"He has probably stopped training hunters because so much time has passed."
Three years since I beat this game and platinumed it and I still end up diving into theories like this in comment sections haha! What a great theory 🙂
Yea. After fighting for so long and watching so many hunters die or killing them himself. He probably just gave up on training. I like to believe Gehrman is training the player though. Like whenever tbe game is off. It makes the final battle much more climactic if you look at as a mentor and student
I´d think Maria refers to the corpse of mother kos when saying "a corpse should be left well alone", or maybe herself and kos, both of them.
yeah because it is said maria brought flowers to the patients from the Lumen wood garden...and there is a tombstone in fishing hamlet on a cliff looking over kos' corpse and the orphan boss fight. the tombstone has those flowers so maria probably put them there
I interpreted both, the bitter double meaning. She now thinks they should have never touched the corpse of Kos, as well as is dead inside from what they did to the poor fishing hamlet.
Also, I think Gehrman possibly knows Laurence's fate and perhaps he was simply having a bad dream involving Laurence, sometimes people dream about lost friends as if they were still alive without realizing it until they wake up
that's depressing, never thought about it like that
+Javier Beltran neither did I, quite a good point.
"the night and dream, were long" definitely NOT a few days to gerhman
Gehrman at his fight went from cool grandpa character, to probably my favorite character from any game. he know's what its like to be stuck. and he wants you to be free, no matter how much he'd like to pass on from the dream. he puts you ahead of himself
and mont, where do i sign up to do co-op with you when ds3 comes out
+Mrbuck I'm not sure! Probably just keep an eye out, haha. I'm sure I'll run into a few people who recognise me when the game is out.
Maria being tall doesn't mean much though. Every boss in the Souls games are big.
Yep, Velstadt was huge
I have a theory. Could be completely wrong. What if Gherman's task was to wait.Wait for a Hunter strong enough to slay the Nightmares. Ascend to the next level of human evolution. What if our Hunter is that chosen Hunter.The one who is strong enough to learn the eldritch truth and become a Great One. Gherman was meant as a guardian...a gatekeeper. Not only does he pose the last challenge before the Moon Presence, but in defeating him, we release him from the dream and usher in a new, baby...Great One. One stronger that the ones we have encountered in Bloodborne. Just an idea.
Makes sense to me
I ended up calling him "Gehrman the first German" for a while early on. After a while I got tired of "the first German" and just started calling him Otto Von Bismarck.
+Yamishi Ikeda Noice
+Yamishi Ikeda ahahahahahaha lmao
My favorite line "Tonight, Gheman joins the hunt."
+Raymundo Miranda Gherman i mean
That's the most idiotic reference to german's history ever but it's also the funniest thing I heard today so thanks for making my day a little bit better :)
My theory is that gehrman felt lonely in the old hunter's workshop since it was sealed off.He conducted a ritual by using an umbilical cord he summoned a great one and asked for company.The great one agreed by giving him the doll but trapping him in the hunter's dream.You can find an umbilical cord in the old hunter's workshop,further benefiting my theory.
That cord is how he made contact with the Moon Presence in the first place, which created the Hunter's Dream. I think the dream is built on Gehrman's desires and memories, but he wishes to leave the dream anyway.
I don't know if this theory has been proposed, but here it goes.
The great ones are alien-like, extra-dimensional beings. Each one, when born, has the power to manifest reality. They require a "host", a being who has his/her psyche come into existence. This is the relationship between Gehrman and the Moon Presence; the Moon Presence has sought ought a new child (see the umbilical cord description) in Gehrman, and manifests the dream or psyche of Gehrman.
The main part of the world is made by Oedon, the formless one. Each great one must exist in the sorta-core reality until they can create their own world. Once this happens, they can abandon a physical form. This is the case for Mergo's Wet Nurse, who relies upon Micolash to host the realm of the nightmare (or maybe it's Mergo that manifests it). The core world is manifested by Oedon, by some unknown thing (probably a Pthumerian).
The umbilical cord is what attaches a host to a Great One. Taking three, making an umbilical cord in its whole, is what allows the player to avoid becoming the host for the Moon Presence; the hunter is attached to the real world, or at least has a cord that does not allow another to attach to the hunter.
To this end, I think that contact with the Great Ones causes humans to have their minds blown--frenzy is the eldritch knowledge surpassing a human's ability to understand, causing that brain full of eyes thing, which is hazardous to one's health. The more insight one has, the closer one is to having his/her mind blown. This is why the Mensis cage and the choir set, clothing for those who wish to make contact with the Great Ones, have the lowest resistance to frenzy. They are made to allow people to contact the Great Ones, and so they WANT the melty-brain effect.
Rom seems to be a host for a Great One, specifically the Great One that makes reality a place without the Amygdala and the other Great Ones visible and corporeal. Once Rom is dead, and the world without giant bug things is shattered, then the hunter sees the blood moon and a hellscape reality that Rom's Great One was sealing.
Ebrietas seems to lack a host. She may be a go-between for humans/Pthumerians and Great Ones, a matchmaker of sorts finding suitable hosts to withstand the influence of Great Ones making a reality.
Or, maybe I'm wrong.
Points for thought
Very very logical! I liked your theory, it's awesome!
Every time I hear that clip of Gehrman crying and begging for release always makes me almost tear up a bit.... Someone who is possessed of so much quiet courage and mercy sobbing for help in a living hell of a nightmare...
The neat thing about games like Bloodborne is how FromSoftware lets US decide how we think things happened, so in a way, the young farmer Gherman turned hunter story is true.
Yeah, a lot of the story in these games is what you make of it - Gehrman's past is never stated so people are left to their own devices to wonder where he came from, and so forth
I actually really liked your idea of a simple farmer becoming a savior on the night of the first hunt. I'll be sure to spread that thought.
Phil Battiste I find sense it that. After all, in later adaptations of Little Red Riding Hood, the Huntsman that appears has the garb and tools of a normal woodcutter. Given that the first parts of the game has a Victorian horror aesthetic, and thus would be in line with when the Huntsman showed up in the story, it feels right.
Ive been waiting for you, VaatiVidya, and Fungo, to upload an Old Hunters Lore video! Now you and Fungo have and I am super exited to watch this!!
+Tom Lom Vaati will be sure to copy em. Don't worry.
By quoting Redgrave verbatim
cute
+Kristoffer Kulju I have, its great, and so is Silvers!
Aegon of Astora's most recent part of his Bloodborne let's talk lore playthrough is on the dlc and quite good, you should check it out.
I feel Maria is more of a daughter figure, or family member who has lost touch. Like a drug addict, so he created the doll to remind him of how she used to be, but ended up making just another image of the loss of her self. I feel Maria was turned in to a thrall basically, to convert the humans in to those mushroom guys. And Gherman already knew it was all a lie. Just my 2 cents lol
A theory that doesn't involve doll getting fucked
Jerry Bradick. That's what I thought as well.
Same. Makes him more of a good guy too
I've been waiting for a Gehrman lore video for a while, as he's the most intriguing character in Bloodborne (for me, anyway), and it didn't disappoint! I really liked your ideas on him, and who he was before the Hunter's Dream.
And those drawings were hilarious! I especially loved Willem chilling out while a shirtless Gehrman worked the fields.
+Opticfreakinbarrel Drinking that sweet, sweet brain fluid lemonade.
Gehrman in the picture is old Silver mont lol
+vergil1us Silver Mont is already old
+Silver Mont I can't tell where his mouth is on the art in the beginning.
Adamantcobalt
It's in the place you would least expect it.
+Adamantcobalt The mouths i draw are usually a sille "C:" shape :D this time he has a NOSE (gasp!) to make it easier to... find the nose? :D Lol.
+Jofer Parreno Naw, the female character in this video I used has actual silver/white hair, whereas the Pthumerians and Maria have more of a "ash blonde" colour going on. Besides, silver hair is "considered antiquated in these times."
I think the corpse comment Maria makes is reference to the corpse of the Great One on the shore that the Hunters killed so many people for.
Great video man, I love you lore content. I cant wait to see your take on the DLC lore.
Well I'd say Bloodborne's timeline spans about maybe 10 years, because in the cutscene with Master Will talking to Lawrence, Will is just as old as he is in the game when you find him.
+Feel My Body plz Yeah, some parts of Bloodborne imply that not too much time has passed, but others make it feel like a more substantial passage of time has occurred.
The reason is because he kinda ascended, allowing him to live for a very long time, for that reason, Laurence is dead before many years, the old hunters you find in Hunter's Nightmare are dead, Simon is dead, Brador is dead, Ludwig is dead, Maria is dead, and Gehrman is still alive because he is immortal by Moon Presence's power, Micolash lived in Laurence's time i believe, but is still alive due to living in a nightmare (like Gehrman), that's just my theory.
I love the gardener theory. Both fun and absolutely badass. I think however that Gehrman is trapped in the dream. If we kill Gehrman without the umbilical cord then we take his place, "charmed" by the Moonpresence. This is probably what happened to Gehrman. He is aware of how much time has past and that he is trapped in the dream, or for him, the nightmare. But he cant die. The Moonpresence wont allow it and when he is with it his mind is forcefully soothed. Which is why we only hear him cry once, a moment of freedom and realization.
We must remeber that the great ones don´t hate humanity. They love us. Care for us. But they have no understanding of how we think. For it, Making Gehrman immortal is a good thing because he cant die, not realizing the agony he lives in. Its like keeping a dog in a house without scent so that it doesn´t have to smell something bad, but a dog relies 70% on smell. Its how they view the world.
Gehrman and maria still better love story than twilight
God damn I'm glad that craze is over... That and the stupid ass Vamp TV series that started coming out almost completely ruined whatever hope I had for any good Vampire movies.
I believe Gherman was a tomb prospector, the corpses you see down in the tombs are usually knight armored and would move slowly, Gherman would have survived more beast battles and found more insight if he was a prospector and would have a better chance of finding a umbilical cord that way, this is influenced by the placement of the umbilical cord in the work shop and may have lead to then founding or enhancement of healing blood, this would have increased his and Laurence's life span, even more so when Laurence beckoned the moon presence, what is one more fitting than Gherman? Who had revolutionized the hunt of beast after the dark blood of beast were found in men who had not the will to withstand the blood, he would have had the experience and distance to become the first Hunter and the insight
The mad men's skulls and Laurence's skull have quite the same aura
The tomb prospectors and hunters are connected, in the DLC, I think I'll have to check
You hear a lot throughout the story about the Hunters once having dreams, like Djura and Eileen. They've seen the doll there inside the dreams but there is no confirmation that they've seen Gehrman within the dream. So this is what I think. I think that the hunters were sort of "interviewed" by the moon presence. Maybe eventually Gehrman started "dreaming" and the Moon Presence chose him and embraced him, charming him into staying inside the hunter's dream until maybe a stronger hunter showed up. This makes sense to me because if you fight Gehrman without consuming the cords, the Moon Presence embraces you and you become the next "Hunter's Helper". I've also found that Great Ones or those related to them bleed white blood or "pale blood" when they are hit, I assume this because of the blood bled from Brain Suckers and the Celestial Emissary. When you hit the doll, she bleeds Pale Blood so by my theory, that makes her related or confirms that she IS a Great One. One would assume that it may be The Moon Presence in a different form or most likely, seeing as the Doll still remains in the dream after The Moon Presence dies, a being that The Moon Presence created to help forge a stronger Hunter (Since the doll is used to level you up). Also in the opening cutscene I believe there is a line that says "seek the pale blood" so perhaps our Good Hunter is searching for the Dream or the Doll to become stronger or, the Good Hunter seeks to transcend humanity by becoming a Great One and gaining Pale Blood.
What I find interesting with Gehrman and Maria is that they seem to be each others polar opposite, Maria being a Noble and Gehrman being a farmer. Which I do believe Gehrman did have romantic feelings towards Maria I mean you can even find a book in the dream titled "How to pick up fair maidens" Maria being the fair maiden. With this said I believe Gehrman had low self-esteem and just had doubt's about himself attracting Maria, with that said the events at the fishing hamlet must have also caused him to be obsessed with Maria which may be the reason behind the doll. Also both use Skill based weapons and both the Burial Blade and the Rakuyo scale with Skill and Arcane. Guess we could take this as a sign of Gehrman influencing Maria's weapon preference that or this could be a sign of Gehrman's teaching. But if you read the Rakuyo's weapon description Maria got tired of the Rakuyo maybe now this is just me but whatever happened at the fishing hamlet and with Kos may have caused Maria to doubt her mentor making her throw away her non-blood weapons and revert to her Cainhurst teachings and use of blood weapons and blood related attacks.
To me, i assume Maria is more like Gehrman's adopted daughter, really, leave the stupid book in the dream.
Gehrman is in Hunter's Dream, and Maria is in Hunter's Nightmare, for that reason, they stopped aging, think about it, we find Gehrman as an old man, however, we find Maria as a young lady, my theory is that, Gehrman was already old when he was imprisoned in Hunter's Dream, and Maria was as young as we can find her in the DLC, that is my point.
@@LepoetismYeah, this is a very good point that I’ve been wanting to bring up. In the trailer for the DLC, you can see him in the fishing hamlet and he doesn’t look at all older than how we see him in the dream. Maria killed herself not long after that, and was obviously MUCH much younger. It’s a pseudo-parental relationship that they have. Makes him far more tragic, and you can actually sympathize with him (Like how you’re supposed to) instead of assuming he’s some sex offender, lol.
a hunter must hunt but never must a hunter become hunted. never give in to the blood
Awesome vid brotha, answered a lot of questions I had thought of and even a few I hadn't. Keep up the stellar work sir!
This thumb is so hilarious. German looks like a tangerine. He is very old, but his physicality is kept in the dream at a certain age in a supernatural way.
At least Willem was able to stay sane.... and have a very deep and profound chat with us
And I think I know how Gehrman stayed sane.. he made the doll, a **x doll
+D1g1talThief if you attack the doll it bleeds a curious white liquid...hmmmm😂
"Ehhhhh" -Master Willem
@@PeacefulJoint brilliant quote
I waited for this video since your playthrough
They all are synths
what a twist!
that is something a synth would say
People here who leave the cap off of the toothpaste, raise your hands.
+Ozan Buyukmetin Only synths put the caps back on.
Dat Dawg fallout 4??
I find Maria's pre-combat monologue quite interesting.
"A corpse should be left well alone. Oh, I know very well, how the secrets beckon so sweetly." While the second line might not directly refer to the first, I can't help but to think Maria is commenting on the corpse of Kos washing on the shore and Byrgenwerth's experiments derived from the encounter.
"Only an honest death will cure you now. Liberate you from your wild curiosity." Again, she almost sounds like she knows what we are feeling, and the only way to stop us is to kill us face to face. The wording implies that she has delivered (or perhaps received) such punishment before our confrontation.
+Pyry Ojala Shit, I didn't think of that. I always thought she was referring to herself as a corpse! My proverbial hat goes off to you, because that was a really good catch!
+Opticfreakinbarrel I think she is supposed to be referring to herself, with the corpse line. But it can likewise later be thought to reference Kos as well. It does say "inspect corpse" before triggering that cutscene, after all!
Silver Mont
That would make sense, but I just can't wrap my head around why she would call herself a corpse. The only explanation I can think of is that she has a kind of immortality like Annalise, and then my mind wanders to the question of why she's currently 'dead' and who or what killed her. Honestly, I still have a lot of questions about Maria that I can't seem to answer myself!
+Pyry Ojala Totally agree with this. In fact, her whole speech seems like it's filled with double (triple, and more) entendres. She could be referring to herself, Kos, AND the tons of other corpses that have been dissected and experimented on in the name of the church, it doesn't have to be one meaning. Not only are their multiple meanings for each line, but she does seem to hint at having a ridiculous amount of awareness as to what's going on. Her lucid mindset is a huge contrast to the other bosses of the DLC, and I think this hints at her being a very willing participant of the nightmare, even if she's "shackled" to it.
However, I think an "honest death" and "liberate" means she intends to sever you from the nightmare, much like how Gehrman can sever you from the dream. After all, a death like this would certainly "cure" you of any "wild curiosity"--you wouldn't even remember anything, nor would you be a hunter or suffer their ultimate fate, if she could pull it off successfully. However I think there's another way out to "liberate" someone from the nightmare and everything related to it. Since Adeline and all the enlarged head patients seem to be wanting to reach enlightenment, in an effort to impress Maria, or follow her wishes, I think having a "relevation" or reaching "enlightenment" can allow someone to transcend to another plane of existence and escape the nightmare. I also think that this is why the Maria gave Adeline the balcony key, why there are lumenwood flowers on her coffin, why The Living Failures (failed Celestial Emissaries) have the key to the clock tower, and why the clock is lined with Caryll runes. So I think she knows exactly what's going on.
Also I think there's another interesting bit about her and her "corpse" status, that might be a bit fourth wall breaking.. She's obviously dead, but her posture seems very relaxed and peaceful. Also, she doesn't wake up until the player approaches her. This seems like it's very similar to when the player dies, goes to the hunter dream, and then returns to where they left off. Maria is even sitting in her own blood pool which is something other players will leave behind in online mode. So I think that, even though she's dead, the player might be catching her as she returns from another dream.
+RadioactiveChocolate Yep, Maria totally knows what's going on past the Astral Clocktower. Simon tells us: "Climb the Astral Clocktower, and kill Maria. She hides the real secret."
While the "hides" does not strictly imply knowledge, I'd find it strange for her not to know what she is guarding.
As for her liberating us the way Gehrman can free us from the Hunter's Dream... I always wondered why Gehrman couldn't forcibly eject us from the nightmare after we refuse. Well, it obviously wouldn't make for good gameplay, but perhaps we cannot be cut off precisely because we are not willing. That's why Gehrman asks us to submit our life. When Gehrman offs defeats us he says: "You must accept your death. Be freed from the night", almost as if accepting our death directly lead to our freedom. Of course, we don't.
Maria might realize we are too stubborn, too "wildly curious" to just let ourselves be cut off without resistance, so only an "honest death" could do the job. Like Gehrman that means she'll thrash us so badly we'd rather accept death than to continue.
The weak point of this theory would be that there should be a mechanic to give up the fight against Gehrman and Maria, as I can't imagine coding such would be very difficult.
Gehrman has to be one of the best fights in the souls series. The arena is wide open and so good looking, his moves are easy to dodge when you learn them, and the cutscenes is great
I love this. You theories are really good and in depth. And the drawings you use so funny, accompany the story surprisingly well... :3Do you post these anywhere? The drawings I mean.
Some of the art is up at wingspan.weebly.com and i'm making a site to host all of it, separate from the portfolio. I'll have Mont make a video of it when it's done - thanks for your interest!
There's also a link in his video descriptions to my store page where you can also see some of the art
OH, I think I just had a bit of a revelation.
When Gehrman is sleeping and he start jabbering and weeping about how he wishes to be released from "This Dream" and how "The night blocks all sight" and what not, perhaps he's not actually talking about the Hunter's Dream, but rather referring to the fact that when he sleeps *within* the Hunter's Dream, he's drawn into the Hunter's Nightmare, shackled as he may be to dead Kos, being the surrogate child of a dead mother.
This would definitely answer that age-old question of why Gehrman is willing to put up a fight in the end if all he *really* wanted was to be freed. I don't think that the Hunter's Dream is the dream from which he wishes to be freed. And just think about how the Orphan of Kos weeps the same way that Gehrman does.. They even look alike! Perhaps it was even necessary for them to link Gehrman to Kos in order to harvest an umbilical cord? So far the only other known sources have been Queen Yharnam and the Whore.
Gerhman is the Surrogate child of a dead great one, linked to his "mothers" corpse. Perhaps this is also why he is apparently "Obscure in the Waking World" - He ultimately participated in a ritual that would be hidden from all and mark the point at which the Byrgenwerth Scholar's started going down separate paths. Feverish worship, blood and insight.
It's not a complete theory, but it (In my opinion) makes a fair deal of sense.
+Rakinjo2 I really like this theory. Maybe the umbilical cord he used to start the hunter's dream was originally from Kos? (or some say Kosm)
TheNoMoreGamer
Could be. I don't see why they would kill Kos (Assuming Kos really *is* the blob on the beach) if not for the Umbilical cord. Then the only question is whether or not they got all three thirds from it or if they also got some from other sources. (We know that a human birthing a great one apparently results in one third of an umbilical cord)
I like to think that Gehrman stopped his career after he slew Kos. He realized how he had sinned, and perhaps he was even somehow bound to the orphan.
What I find odd about "Orphan" of Kos is that "Every Great-One looses it's child" but in this case it seems more like the child lost it's parent Great-One.
Rakinjo2
Yeah, that is interesting. But then again every great one is unique in how they give birth. I figured that Willem and Byrgenwyrth sort of stole credit from the fishing Hamlet with the discovery of the great ones, and hid the secrets of this.
I've also always thought that the events of bloodborne happened before, the blood moon, night of the hunt, death of a great one the cords yadda yadda. Like some time before you arrived.
I always figured that the reason Yharnamites hated outsiders so much was because the church decided to blame outsiders for the plague, telling them that the outsiders brought it in.
I also thought that Simon was the hunter before you that stopped the first unending night, but I need to do more digging into this.
TheNoMoreGamer
Well, I'd be tempted to say that the sort of brutal "It's all gone to hell and the Great One's are descending!"-nights only happen once in a civilization's lifetime.
I'm saying that because it kind of fits with how Ailing Loran went under and was then discovered, and the Pthumerian's before them.
I don't think that the night you go through as a player is just a regular "Night of the Hunt" at all. I think it's so much more than that, as everything has now aligned for the Great One's to descend and do all of their work, competing for a child.
I had not thought of that. Initially I figured after every descent, a great one or two was born/made, the last being mergot and rom, and this one being you.
gehrmans hat also kinda looks like a farmers. I really like your gehrman byrgenwerth Farmer theory! imma make it a Personal canon.
Has anyone even noticed that the orphan of kos’ cry is the exact same cry as gehrman’s in the hunters dream when he cries to be saved by master Willem and Laurence? This might mean that gehrman maybe is the orphan of kos, especially when you finish the dlc and the doll says he is Finally sleeping Well now. Perhaps his relation to byrgenwerth meant that gehrman maybe was apart of the massacre to the fishing hamlet, that could be the reason for gehrman’s restless nights because he has feelings of guilt.
I believe the pause when telling us his name was merely a moment of thought for what to say next. He can't go right out and say first hunter because then we have questions and there can be no questions while beasts wander the streets. Now go spill some blood.
Well, considering the actual Knight's Set isn't armor, and the fact that the Knights were skilled enough at hunting beasts to consider the left behind corpses art, I doubt the beasts tore through them. I like the idea that Vaati brought up. The Beasts of Cainhurst are born of a different strain of the Old Blood, so they look and behave differently. Thus two different styles of fighting them. Gehrman used stealth and speed, while the Knights of Cainhurst fought with some sort of grace, using a rapier that could turn into a gun, and a sword that feed off their own blood.
+Evnyofdeath Well, when I say the knights of Cainhurst, I meant in the past - because it does seem at some point that they used armour, judging from all the statues. That, and we find corpses here and there wearing armour (might not be from Cainhurst, obviously) I think the last generation of knights stopped using armour and took up rapiers and the like - considering Maria's set is VERY close to the knight's set, I think they more or less based it on her appearance. After all, we know the hunter's cap is based on her, so it seems she was quite popular in some ways.
I like the idea of Groundskeeper Gehrman. It's the same as finding out the badass survivor leader of the zombie apocalypse used to be a plumber.
great video, I can see that you put a lot effort into it and it was pleasure to watch it:) I like yoiur theory, though I've never imagined Gherman as a farman myself^^
Has anyone noticed that the orphan looks suspiciously like a pthumerian?
Ok, look, this is kinda crazy, to be honest, but could kos be the mother of all pthumerians? Maybe the curse of the pthumerians was that they would slowly degenerate into humans, leading kos to truly earn the title "mother". I dunno. The thought that humans basically killed their mother is kinda intriguing to me.
Pthumerians arent homosapians
"The night, and the dream, were long..."
Boi, imagine the depression inside you after hearing this line.
the use of the word/name spear(head) is used as a title for vanguards of battle(the 1st wave of war/battle)
you assume that your character is special that you need to know everything, but it's much more likely Gehrman thinks you are just another hunter passing by; and deem it pointless to tell you(surrender ending)
i think you are on the right track; Gehrman doesn't quite seem like he's into any political gains; and is more likely one who takes up arms to protect what he deem important and is later noticed by William and such others.
time is most likely irrelevant to Gehrman; he's (in a sense) working for the moon prescience
Hunter's nightmare might actually be GHERMAN'S nightmare, maybe that's why he sleeps better when you kill Orphan of Kos
It could be that, I think it's the curse creation, I think of this because if you listen closely in fishing hamlet you can hear its residence saying curse the hunter's and their children, for they pretty much ravage the hamlet and tried to find eyes inside their head. And Simon did say it was the source of the nightmare, and only hunters who go drunk on blood get send there, but it's my theory.
Rest in Peace, Gehrman, your nightmare is finally over
Cognate of the German Hermann (soldier, warrior), a name derived from the Old High German Hariman, which is a compounding of the elements hari (army) and man (man).
awesome video man, keep up the great work
I love these thumbnail images! As soon as I get paid, I'm going to buy a T-shirt and show the artist my support. I might get this one in particular. Gehrman looks so happy!
+AnnoyingSquib Noice
Awesome video, very well crafted theories, great quality videos. Awesome
Out of all the characters Gehrman made me feel bad and broke into tears
concerning the whole rakuyo in the well thing, what i think happened is that she threw her original rakuyo in the well, one that wasnt capable of being a blood blade, and had a new rakuyo crafted that could use a blood blade, just as an extra precaution so no one would defeat her and find the nightmare's secrets
Hello Silver Mont! I really like your point of view on Gehrman and even found it relevant when you told he could be hiding his name. It reminded me of the Japanese dialogue where there is no dramatic pause. To me he just had a lil difficulty saying his name to emphasize the old age. As you said i think Gehrman does not fit the intellectual type, but what those books in Hunter Dream could represent? I think as a Gehrman is a hunter he is far more practical than theoretical, although he is represented as a teacher for Lady Maria. About he having feelings about her I think that's somewhat strange since he himself offers us the Doll in such a bizarre way. There is no doubt that the way he says "even the doll" is suspected, so I think that does not suit the possibility of him having feelings for Lady Maria (the age difference would be huge as i think Maria was younger back the day). His mysterious "mania" is a mystery indeed. I think Gehrman was somewhat eccentric. How I wish seeing him on the DLC. Great analysis/theories. Peace.
+Jägerbrandt To be fair, feelings are not eternal. One can grow quite cold towards people and things they once held dear, especially if trauma of some form is involved.Of course, we could also look to another Japanese creator/creation relationship as an illustration of another possibility, Dr.Tenma and Astro Boy. Created to replace a lost loved one and loathed for failing to do so.I mean, the doll and Maria are very different people, which if Gehrman was trying to replace Maria would make the doll very much a failure in his eyes.
+Brandon Brown
I see what you're saying and if that's the case how sad things could be. Great example with the Astro Boy.
I think Gehrman is crafty enough to build a doll like that, but i doubt he was the passionate man who did the job. I mean do you remember the Source of the Dream? She always been there as a lifeless doll, like she was part of the furnitures and the Workshop was a public place for the Hunters so it's hard to build the theory that Gehrman was the man who build the Doll. I think it's safe to assume someone brought her to the Workshop only to adorn the place (i hope).
We see the Doll as a person because she rather looks like one and i think she is "interactive" for this reason. We see her alive while others dont, just like when we get Insight and she looks alive, not sitting rough with her legs wide open. Maybe she is indeed just a sexual article for Gehrman, he can't see her like we do. The curious thing would be that she can notice him while he doesn't.
"It always comes down to the Hunter's helper to clean up after these sorts of messes."
"A corpse should be left well alone... Oh I know very well"
You should of left that *corpse* alone, Maria. By the wrath *of* mother *Kos*, you should of let it be...
Hey now, maybe she was against poking the dead sea God thing! She is now guarding it, after all
Guarding it? Or it's memory?
Maybe the wizened child lives on in the nightmare, but the fetus was taken in the waking world.
Superb vid man!
Love the drawings!
Nobody seems to notice how gehrman does what looks like the "make contact" gesture when he dies.
I think gehrman followed Laurence,when he left Byrgenwerth for Yharnam to found the Healing Church. Gehrman was probably ordered to deal with the beasts who would obviously come. Gehrman then invented his burial blade which he based off his 'farming.' It went well but the Church grew and so did the beasts. So Gehrman needed some more hunters. He probably posted an ad in the papers. :p At Cainhurst Maria heard of this and wanted to help, because of some reason. She took her Rakuyo with her and left for Yharnam. She was fascinated by Gehrman and Gehrman developed feelings for her. Then after some time something happened in the fishing village which made her throw her weapon in a well. Did she kill Kos in an epic water battle or was she witness to something horrifying? Maybe in her despair she beckoned the nightmare.
"Posted an ad" XD
The workshop hunters operate secretly I think. It is not until Ludwig that the hunt became well known
I think this is the derpiest pic I've ever seen of Gehrman, so you sir just get a like for that to begin with, I'm sure that this is a great vid anyways.
Gehrman in the thumbnail is like swiggty swoogity I'm combining for that eldritch booty.
+Zimzilla 99 Or in his case, Pthumerian/Cainhurstian(?)
+Silver Mont indeed lol
+Silver Mont I was working on the basis of a timeline last power scale for some of the biggest players in the bloodborne timeline.
I was thinking that Gehrman was probably what you theorized or was a member of the college and left when Laurence did, in my opinion when Gehrman began training the first hunters he trained most in a standardized form of fighting, as shown in the hunters in the nightmare. As time went on hunters started teaching their fellow hunters in specialized style which lead to the different factions like the powder kegs. I also believe that during Gehrman's direct teaching of all hunters, logarius was around and so were the executioners. I also believe that during that time was when the vile bloods lost standing with the byrgenworth and such began logarius began his crusade. During this time I believe Ludwig was being trained and witnessed the crusade of the executioners.
+Silver Mont I also think that Ludwig was using the moonlight blade but I believe it was a weapon that Gehrman did not approve of because of it being more of a strength and arcane based weapon instead of a dexterous weapon like the burial blade. As such I believe that because of Gehrman's disapproval of his fighting style, Ludwig would go on to teach the church hunters and would teach them with a more strength based style i.e. Ludwig's holy blade and Kirk hammer. I believe this because in certain item description it is stated that the church anticipated larger beast.
I also think that the hunter of hunter where formed when the first hunter became blood addled.
In short I also believe that from a lore sense I believe that in terms of strength it goes
Gehrman/logarius
Maria
Ludwig
Any of Gehrman's other apprentices
Hunters of hunters
old hunters/ executioners/ knights of cainhurst
Church hunters/ the league
Recruited townspeople
+Zimzilla 99 I'd love to see how a human version of Ludwig would fight - we've never fought a boss who wielded the Moonlight sword in any of the Souls games, outside of him. I'd love to see a "human" boss who uses it.
Maybe in Dark Souls III?
what I love about Maria is she became a pacifist after what she and Germhan did to the people of the fishing hamlet, she has gone completely into self loathing and I believe when we find her sitting in her chair we find her post some failed suicide attempt, she is done with battle, all she wants to do is to treat those who have fallen to mother Kos' blessing. even so she will take up arms against you if she has to. she will fight you with everything she has to stop you from reaching the fishing hamlet, and if you read her Rakuyos description it says she dislikes using bloodtinge in favor of skill but she resorts to the inherent blood of her lineage and even fire, everything she can to stop you from revealing the truth. when you kill her you're letting her finally be free from her sorrow, youre releasing her.
If she was a pacifist, she didn't stick to it for long!
I just realized whenever the moon presence is summoned and the cutscene starts the moon presence's "mouth" goes straight for the belly button where umbilical cord IS,,,,idk if anyone else has noticed that but i thought id point that out
Do you think the old hunter bone could have belonged to Maria? I know the description says "he" referring to the hunter it was from, but it could just be a translation thing, like the description of Pharis' hat in dark souls. In addition to this, we find the old hunter bone at Maria's grave, the one the doll prays to in the dream; her real body is possibly buried there in the old abandoned workshop. Also, she uses quickening during the fight, while none of the old hunter enemies do, so I think that art came from her (she does have some Ptheumerian blood in her).
+maelstrrom I think she just had her own spin on it. Gehrman's version is kinda... blue? And hers is red. I think he came up with the technique and taught it to several of his disciples, and the art was then lost to time, perhaps because few mastered it and were able to teach it to students of their own, etc.
+Silver Mont
Or the Old Hunters possibly died without training no one, becoming beasts or drunk with blood....Seeing the enemies with the Saif actually using the art of quickening.
And the gravestone on The Hunter's Dream and Workshop could be of any Old Hunter, even Maria, since is not truly stated.... And since Maria is of Cainhurst then most likely she would be buried in their grounds? Or maybe in the Abandoned Workshop, since there are only one grave and Maria was admired by Gerhman so he placed her corpse there and made the doll to remember her, which later brought the doll to life and etc...
5:20 i would agree with that. U Know Gehrman wwears the same trousers as the suspicious man which you can save by sending in the cathedral. And that man seems like being a normal worker. And both are wearing the same trousers.
I think Gehrman trains us. Well not like do push ups and such but by giving us objectives. Than we learne by experience.
I think he dose that because there were so many hunters before us that he knows that we probably will succeed or maybe he just don't realy care at this point.
Also what you said about the time shift in the dream world might be true but I think 1 sec in the real worl might be 1 year in the dream.
Yes. He gives you somewhere to go until you kill Amelia, and after that you find your own way. He sets you on the path to Byrgenwerth, and then the Nightmare.
+dricsi07 Well, he hardly even gives us direction. Perhaps even less than the Crestfallen does @ Firelink Shrine. "Go kill some beasts. There's a chalice I guess. And a workshop."
And he even says: "Just go kill some beasts, is for your own good". And the doll's dialogue after killing the Orphan of Kos, (stated at the end of the video), confirms that he is indeed very tired and couldn't sleep this whole time even. So it makes sense he only saying few things to help the Hunter....
wow. just wow! my head hurts now. bravo on this
Regarding timeline, I think Bloodborne has convenience of "Dream" and "Nightmare".
The Old Hunters' areas, first part of the DLC, appear like mix and match of the nightmare in the main game and past events.
First of all, the Yharnum in the Old Hunters' nightmare have structures more or less the same as main game, rather there seems to have some volcanic activity in distant past. Given Lawrence, the First Vicor was still around in the Old Hunters' nightmare, that part surely is "nightmare" from the past. Also, Lumenwood Garden, where player fight the Living Failures, is right above the Lumenflower Gardens, yet that Old Hunters' Lumenflower Gardens is next to the room with elevator for the Research Hall instead.
Was Maria a hunter from the past or she has been in the Astral Clocktower all along? Interestingly, either way, her existence and the Fishing Hamlet secret that she is/was protecting, has little to no effect on the "main nightmare" in the core game. Lawrence had used the "cursed blood" on people very long time ago.
Noted, there were no living Amygdala in the Old Hunters' nightmare, only skeletons of Amygdala and Amygdalan Arm. Also, it was the Amygdala outside Cathedral Ward sending the player character to the Hunters' Nightmare with curse toward people from Byrgenwerth and their descendants.
+DarkMage30000 I wonder, could the DLC areas be arranged in a reverse chronological order?
If the Fishing Hamlet was the "original" sin, leading to the cruse, and the experiments Research Hall, leading to the scourge and Ludwig, leading to a miniature Old Yaharnam at the end of the river of blood? Possibly? Kind of?
+Pyry Ojala hmm, thats definitely an interesting way to think about it... i like it.
Pyry Ojala
That is an interesting way to look at it and also make some sense.
+DarkMage30000 The Nightmare isn't in the past, it coexists with the present. It's just unseen.
AIONBERSERKER
That is what I mean by convenience of dreams and nightmares. The director can ignore any timeline.
This is a good video, but early on I disagree with the idea that it was planned for Gerhman to take on something such as the hunters dream. I imagine in the world of bloodborne, things happened quite detached from each other. It seems Gerham did something to bring about the dream after Laurence got turned into a beast and died in the chalice dungeons.
Also, it was an interesting little idea I had but I thought that the messengers, were little amygdalas. You are taken into the nightmare by an amygdala. When you get to the research lab, there are tons of weird variations of head monsters, taken on some similarities of amygdala. This is all being overseen by Maria I assume, and in the dream, it seems to me that the messengers are more connected to the doll than Gerhman, seeing how the doll is the one who notes that the messengers have found you. I dunno, something weird I'm probably reading into too much.
Chainhurst castle doesnt have beasts they have, idk monsters, blood lickers and gargoyals no wearwolfs or anything like that
I think that Wilhem and Logarius were both Pthumerians while Maria, Annalise and Arianna are only distantly related to the Pthumerians. That could explain Wilhem's weirdly long life and being the first one (possibly) to be obsessed with the Great Ones. Logarius's Executioners were probably an order of human warriors led by a veteran Pthumerian. Why? Logarius is a tall, lanky old man with magic, possibly granted by the research into the Great Ones. His weapon is curiously similar to one of the forms that the Pthumerian Elder's weapon can take. The magic skulls resemble the face of the Pthumerian Elder as well. In any case, Wilhem and Logarius are bigger and paler (Logarius possibly darkened due to the frost) than the hunter (just like the Pthumerians) and Maria is also slightly taller than the hunter. Annalise and Arianna both remain seated but it is safe to say that they are probably also slightly taller than the hunter.
If you look at the two oldest hunter weapons, Burial Blade and the Blade of Mercy, you can see that both also resemble an older Pthumerian weapon. The Burial Blade and the Pthumerian scythe wielded by the Elder, and the BoM and the sickles that split into two wielded by the Descendant. And so I think that Gehrman was inspired by Logarius because the sword form of the Burial Blade resembles a curved version of the sword that Logarius uses. Gehrman probably took Logarius's weapons and combined them to make the Burial Blade.
Gehrman worked for Wilhem, was inspired by Logarius, created the hunters and involving the regular humans (some of whom were probably also Executioners), and eventually just like how Logarius guards the entrance to Annalise, Gehrman guards the Moon Presence.
So, my version (so far) of Bloodborne history is:
The Pthumerians researched the Great Ones, two branches of research disputed and split creating the Church and Byrgenwerth, the church created the Dungeons and Arcane magic involving spirits and beasts (Executioner's Gloves, Tiny Tonitrus, Beast Roar) in their research, Byrgenwerth created the other Arcane spells (Augur of Ebrietas, A Call Beyond), Cainhurst split from the church due to increased interest in blood, hunters created by Gehrman as independent body but was close to Byrgenwerth and the Church, Maria got interested in the hunters and distanced herself from Cainhurst. All this eventually led to the Fishing Hamlet, which eventually leads to the Bloodborne game with your Hunter.
Also I found it peculiar how in the Old Hunters DLC, the main bosses are Ludwig (Church), Living Failures (Byrgenwerth), Maria (Hunter & Cainhurst), and Orphan (Hunter[?] & Byrgenwerth).
This is all just speculation so I don't know though.
Listen, height doesn't dictate much in these games. Enemies and bosses are almost always larger the main character.
Well, I do not think farmers or "somebody tending to your grass" would have a scythe made out of an alloy from metorites...
A) He was REALLY serious about his farming.
B) He started with a normal scythe and then developed the Burial Blade when the beasts popped up / was gifted the meteorite ore.
I personally feel that the dlc nightmare is a prequel to our nightmare where hunters started getting mad.
There is a detail in the chalice dungeons that I noticed. I don't know if there is a detail already known, but as soon as you get into some open areas, you find corpses wearing plate armor like dark souls. It makes me think that when humans found the dungeons long time ago, it was in what it might be considered the middle age (knights). Later on (and many deads after), they redefined their combat system, weaponry and armor. It is not a breaking new, but I believe it is a curious fact as we know everything in Bloodborne happens for a reason.
Yeah, the knights you can find look kinda like the fluted knight set from DeS, which is neat.
Maybe he’d been in the hunter’s dream so long that he could barely recall his name
hey silver mont ill say this I have enjoyed your videos . and I look forward to seeing what content you make from here
the blood letter reminds me of the weapons lagarius wields as well as the lagarius wheel so I'm wondering if the blood letter belonged to the executioners before brador maybe the expelling tainted blood thing may not have been something brador made up it would make sense to fight the vilebloods with a weapon that expels tainted blood
Love the annotation here. Quality 8D
Merriam Webster defines the term gearman as: "a keeper of engine-room stores aboard a ship", which is interesting given how many nautical references appear in bloodborne, such as the deep sea runes, the fishing hamlet village, and the waters separating the hunters dream and nightmare. bloodborne has some simply amazing symbolism and lore :D
+tibbarabbit Gearman makes me think of the COG in Gears of War, haha
truth, hahaha
Well he is crying for help. And he says he had enough of this dream.
So he might have some understanding about time and how long it has been.
Isnt he mentioning that he have trained the hunter for some time already. Or not train but helped
11:30 Did you make your Cainhurst outfit PC in resemblance of the Doll? Out of all the lore videos I watch on Bloodborne, you've got the bestest character face make. Beautiful faces galore!
I didn't intentionally model it after her! Although I suppose they are kinda similar.
So, I have a theory, a sort of head cannon, and to start this I need to ask a question. Why does the moon presence sustain the hunter's dream? Why does it care about the hunters protecting the people of Yharnam? Well, I have a theory.
So, the hunters dream is sustained by the moon presence and hosted by Gherman. My theory as to why is that the moon presence is the guardian of humanity. The moon presence knows that if the beastly scourge consumes humanity it will lose it's power. Thus, it took someone who knew the truth and was strong enough to sustain a dream of that type, Gherman, and created the dream. This would explain Gherman's loyalty to the moon presence at the end of the game, he wants to work with the moon presence to help preserve humanity.
Now, I am no lore expert, so this whole theory is probably riddled with holes, so feel free to point those out to me.
I noticed the cry of Gehrman when he's asking laurenc to help him sounds oddly like the cutscenes of the Orphan of Kos before the battle.
And so the running theme of From games with the final boss somehow being less epic than the DLC boss continues
I love the entrance to his boss fight. The talk leading into his final line while rising from his chair, the weapon reveal, then he says:
“Tonight, Gehrman joins the hunt.”
Shit, that is how you make an entrance!
did want to beat bloodborne before watching this video because didn't want spoilers and glad i did. Mostly i will mention to me as what i felt with Gehrman is mostly a honorable man for me, the man who don't want any hunter to go through a nightmare as he is gone through and i can see to him it is like 2 days but yet when he wakes up it could been 100 years latter. to take his offer to me is mostly a honor way to go for since it is his request for the player hunter not go through what he has gone through and Gehrman will always be my number one boss fight in bloodborne
I think the reason laurence looks like the cleric beast because he was also a hunter like gerhman but later on was called father that looked like that. The reason vicar amelia looks like she does is because she was one a lady and a part with the white clothed beasts like those big ones with the axes in cathedral ward.
Hey, can anyone tell me what the name of the pose Maria's doing at 5:20? I'm genuinely curious.
So Micolash has his body behind The One Reborn but is alive in the Nightmare. Is it possible that Gherman's body is that of the very much dead Gatekeeper and he is just alive in the Hunter's Dream?
+Kitty McJesus The dude has a Top Hat like Gherman has in his Boss Fight too...
If his name means "spear man" would it not make sense that he was the tip of the spear? As he is the first Hunter.
Just some food for thought.
Cool video :), here I was thinking that somewhere I think I read that it was after kos died that Kos parasites overrun the Hamlet, infecting everyone. Meaby what Lady Maria did that was so horrible that she couldn't stand the Rakuyo anymore was to slain a lot of infected people in the Hamlet?, she throws her weapon in the well so meaby.
+Emmanuel Gonzalez Caseira ""When the carcass of Kos washed up on the coast, its insides were teeming with tiny parasites, unlike any found in humans."
Doesn't strictly say they infected people in the hamlet, but that's definitely one way you can take it.
+Silver Mont Yeah, I doesn't directly says it, I just think that's could be a connection since the people looks so much like half-fish dudes with the way they behave really alike the Orphan, in little and subtle ways.
I think when she's talking about a corpse being left alone she was hinting at Kos given that was the secret the old hunters were hiding about what they did from the DLC.
+GeraldLassaline Could always be referring to both herself and the Kos!
Gehrman's my favorite Bloodborne character, except for maybe Eileen
May be a long shot but I think there’s a possibility that Gehrman and the Orphan of Kos are the very first time we see a reversal of the statement: “All great ones lose their child and yearn for a surrogate”. In this case the surrogate and the child are reversed in the order of events. Gehrman was the surrogate and came first. Orphan was the child but came after. The only real evidence I have for this is the Doll’s dialogue after beating the Orphan suggests a connection between the Orphan of Kos and Gehrman. Just a thought.
I think you trigger my curiousity now, and then some of my brain cells work again. I think Moon Pressence and Doll is just somehow related, because of that cutscene in the ending, I think so too, except that "good hunter" part was just a mere satire. It might be possible that Gehrman's "curiousity mania" drove Maria far away instead(this part could be wrong, but still fine if this doesn't true tho), and he desperately lust for her, then the Moon Pressence said to him that he could granted his wish, thus granting soul into the doll(which ended up just as an observer and manipulator instead), but in exchange of his own consciousness trapped in dream world, and be the Moon Pressence's servant forever. It's possible to assume that Gehrman was a vital character that revolt against the beast, the clue is him being the teacher of Maria & other old hunters there. That's why Moon Pressence took him, to stop him against the beast, and instead being his most loyal servant forever. But it's also possible that the beast hunt thingy is just Moon Pressence's playground scenario, where we fuel him by doing so, but idk hahah. The core mistake in this theory could be when we know since what's time Gehrman trapped, or at least when he met Maria, if it's after his consciousness trapped, then this whole theory of mine just wouldn't work at all.
I can't listen to bb lore without being depressed that I can't play it for the first time again