Never had a lot of music theory, despite my interest in music and "playing" guitar off and on from an early age... These videos have really brought together my own thinking about music. Thanks.
Mike you put a lot of effort into this and I think your addition of color to show the 5th relationships within the chromatic scale is genius. Hats off to you dude!
You are the first person that has shown those designs. I found that decades ago when trying to conceptualize all interval cycles as well as that of fifths,and the relationships of each pitch to all others. Of course,we have to bear in mind that it ignores that pesky Pythagorean comma,and the designs that form are only derived from the somewhat arbitrary division of the pitch continuum within an octave,but it's still amazing. I invite any beginning music theorist to use colored pencils,one color for each interval and connect the 12 dots representing the pitches(resulting in 3 squares,4 triangles,1 dodecahedron,etc..). It not only helps understand it,but the results are beautiful.
It is the bassis of reality. Or what we know to be real . Our world is based on it . 12 months. . 7 with 30 n 5 with with less . Its based on 360° its all very strange .. or maybe its just how we think and we interpret reality that way because its all we see. Kinda like how theres actually more notes than 12. But the 12 make a perfect circle. I think 18 x 2 or 12 x 3 works too .. just because of 36..
I love your disclaimer of what music theory ISN'T. Super dense notation can be soooooo daunting, and a lot of the jargon can really dissuade musicians from studying too
This is MASSIVELY helpful! I have ADHD, and any alternative ways of linking these patterns in my mind are usually the most useful! Besides geometry being my favorite form of math (working memory issues aren’t a problem when you can measure the math with a ruler to double check your calculations!), being able to visualize the relationships between notes in this way makes so many things make so much more sense in my brain, not only due to the novelty engaging my brain much better, but also because I’m just so strongly wired to seek out these patterns to make intuitive sense of things, in order to take some of the load off my working memory.
That's awesome! Music theory is usually a struggle for a person with ADHD. Good to know that it has been helpful =] My advice to balance the working memory impairments is to use some sort of “quick note” strategy. Like keeping a journal or something with you to write down things quickly so they don't keep coming back over time because “you can't forget”. It doesn't have to be too sophisticated, just bullet points may help. It is very summarized, but I hope it helps! Btw, I’m a psychologist with experience working with ADHD (and also diagnosed with ADHD!)
Erin! This might sound a little weird but your self awareness is a breath of fresh air and the way you explain that awareness is inspiring. I feel like my brain is wired the same way!
I'm actually really shocked at how hostile some 'musicians' are to the idea that music is mathematics, or based on colour. It's the most direct route to the soul. Whatever that looks like. It's older than mathematics, older than colour.....the 'big bang' was effectively the first smack of a cosmic snare drum. Maths and colour are certainly two of the best ways to try and seep into it.
What if I tell you that the tangible is determined by the non tangible, like maths... What if I tell you that the big-bang can't unfold without order, like morphognetic field does constantly.
At 9:12 - This whole figure is over simplified. For example: - Some scales have m3 intervals (harmonic minor). - The circle of 5ths shows related keys, it's primary use is not to to describe progressions.
I’ve been trying to learn guitar. It hasn’t been making any sense whatsoever. I was starting to get disappointed and discouraged. As a math/ chemistry amateur This right here is what was needed, a logical patterned relationship of what’s ACTUALLY going on. I’ve watched two videos so far and look forward to many more. My sincere thanks for making these videos.
I really enjoyed this video. To me, it shows how scales, chords and progressions occur naturally; nobody owns nor creates them. Just like colors . We create art by using these elements in ways unique to ourselves as individuals. Just like a visual artist uses colors. This is true for rhythm and beats as well. Nobody owns them, everybody owns them.
@@yru435 Our methods of defining the properties of music may be arbitrary, but it definitely exists whether we acknowledge it or not and it follows the order of the physical universe which we may define but we didn't create
This was so incredible I have to comment with appreciation and astonishment because with your explanation of the geometry with the colors and geometric shapes it got me interested to learn about music theory for the FIRST time in my 50years of avoiding the ‘boring topic’ like the plague! Thank you!!! 🙏🏽😊👍🏼
Wonderful parallels between Music Geometry and Mathematic... even color (if we know that there are 3 basic color, red blue and yellows) explain the 12 notes. Thank you!
You should show this to Klee Irwin over at Quantum Gravity Research. Some of your patterns closely resemble the E8 Quasi-Crystal lattice that sparked a breakthrough in Particle Physics and linked Emergence theory to discoveries at the CERN facility research
Very good video, I have been contemplating the relationship between music and geometry and this is a good summary of the basis of some of my thoughts. I think it's particularly interesting how we would think of the augmented 7th and diminished chords in this context as being the most "pure", yet those are some of the most harmonically dysfunctional chords in the western repertoire. Instead, the true "purer" chords of major and minor are made up of a perfect balance between a piece of the triangle, and a piece of the square
Here in Brazil most of sambas are in "little squares", as people call the four basic chords. Super interesting to see how many more shapes exists. I am keen to try all those combinations. This way to see music is very clarifying. Thanks a lot for sharing!
That was Excellent! really clarifying .. loved how it explained the way minor chords can form progressions when moving by fourths or fifths, always wondered why that worked so well. I appreciate this!
Music,,perfection of sound,,presented in TRUE sense,,with Eastern thougjt,, Mike,,You have unearthed the,,Root Cause of Creation..Evolution and Existence..DrNanda..India
I read somewhere about math and physics and chemistry modeling the universe and you can apply all of these realms to understand the natural occurring patterns in the universe, so this video got me thinking: If we can use geometry to study music we can also apply physics or chemistry right? What if we can think of a way to study music outside of the sound theory? Maybe thats why a bass that displaces more air will sound better than others.
I liked this. Have you read The Geometry of Music? There is this very detailed textbook about this stuff. I like how mathy and abstract it is, makes more sense this way to me
@@arrestedshrimp lol xD the guy in the video doesn't introduces himself, nor he doesn't say "hello"; starts straight with that statement "music is geometry" and jumps into the topic. Just amazing!
What about Stochastic music, which is using chaos theory, entropy, Brownian motion and the like to formulate it's structures and such. It is essentially noise. Or some of the proto electronic musics that's uses white noise. I do like the clock diagrams, have made some interesting scales and rows with them. Great video!!
Saw your shorts, figured I'd check this out, one thing I don't understand about your diagrams is why you choose to differentiate between Circles and Squares for certain notes/keys. I think that's the only thing I'm missing in order to really grasp what you're getting at in terms of the diagrams, because that seems like a relevant choice but I've yet to see you explain why you've opted for that. Was it just to delineate the different steps in the Circle of Fifths as Square/Circle/Square, and then the pattern got rearranged when you reverted back to the 12 tone scale? I think adding that as an explanation of your metric/methodology, and just slowing down your explanations might make things a little easier to grasp from a first watch-through. Otherwise, very interesting way of looking at music, and the first time I've really seen someone break down music on a geometric level to explain relationships between notes. I'm also curious as to why you use color theory and choose the colors you choose to represent the notes/keys that you do. Is there any attempt to attach those colors to the emotional connection we associate to them, or is it purely for visual purposes? I feel like that could do with more explanation.
I can’t believe you didn’t give any examples using a musical instrument. As a teacher, I can tell you that your presentation would have been much more effective if you had shown what you were talking about by actually playing the sound.
I couldn’t agree more. It was all declarations without explanation through showing how it can be used. Simply saying it’s useful is not the same as showing how it is useful.
There are also geometric patterns on the instrument that relate to this. For example: the 145 pattern on the fretboard in standard tuning looks like an "L" shape.
These color-note relationships are based on the objective connections between the circle of fifths and the color wheel, which may or may not align with an individual's perception of synesthesia.
Awesome take on tonal relations. The visualisation really helps to get a grasp on that. One could apply the same kinda Geometry on rhythm as well! With that you could actually start from the initial noise/music dichotomy and derive a much more general music theory from it. If you apply the most simple pattern (on a beat/off a beat) on a some white noise you'd put some order in that. From there you can go through all possible rhythmic patterns. If you'd then change the soundwave to a sinus wave you'd have tonal relations. Another thing that is important to mention is that this perfect symmetry is something that historically evolved in europe and isn't quite the same around the world. But oh well, only so many minutes in video and such vaste field of possibilities. :)
Bravo Deep but real. Some small musical examples would've been nice but if you're a musical knowledge nerd this is still very tasty. Some of the greatest composers and advanced musicians use this stuff daily once it's in your system. Thanks for sharing.
Was really hoping to see some mention on the work Richard Cohn and Dmitri Tymoczko and many others on the subject of geometry and conceptual organizations of chord movement in Parsimonious voice leading. it can go really really deep and I would love if more people could look up these names and the subject matter to get more eyes on this. a good book to start with is by Richard Cohn called: "Audacious Euphony". its a tough academic topic but its handled so well by Richard and with a nice amount of humor to break up the prose and keep the reader interested in what would otherwise be a dry analysis. also the papers written by Dmitri have been an endless supply of inspiration for myself and how I view musical structures especially when I relate them to other equally fascinating topics like Bebop and Barry Harris' teachings on harmony.
If you're not familiar with it already, I suggest having a look at Thomas Echols' "The Tesseract" via ruclips.net/user/TheLabyrinthofLimitations. Fun, fascinating, and very valuable -- especially if you are a Barry person... 😉
Thanks for a very interesting video. I think those who like patterns and like to compare them can appreciate this and those who don't can simply let it go by -- no need to denigrate. It's pretty natural to start with 7 tones and 7 colors and wonder about that. Taking it up to 12 tones and 12 colors is great, but it's the circle of 5ths that really makes this work. When you relate the color spectrum and then shift back to the chromatic scale, wow. Every tone compared to its neighbor a half step away on either side, shows very different colors, which would be the dissonance of playing them together. Compare this with the 1-4-5 that show related harmony and similar colors. The geometry is also good; there's very much to run with here.
Can you map these to piano keyboard and guitar fret board and demonstrate some examples? There's a couple layers of abstraction here where practical examples would be helpful.
Definitely. This video is an intro to these patterns. The playlists on my channel dive into lots of specific applications on both piano and guitar. Also, more to come. 🤘
What, specificaly, did you get out of it? How, specifically, have you used this information in your playing/composing? I thought this was a cool video on a spiritual/philisophical level, but I failed to see and practical use.
This stuff is my absolute favourite stuff. What is some book you’d recommend for really understanding harmony and rhythm? And it’s physics and geometry
What about pentatonic scales? What about quartal harmony? I mean, if this is how you make sense of music that’s cool, and if thinking about it this way inspires you even better. Music isn’t geometry though. Geometry is the mathematics of space, music is the mathematics of time. There’s a dialogue between the 2 but to say one is somehow derived from the other just doesn’t sit right for me. I did think you might use this to talk about negative harmony though, I think it does help with that.
I’ll be sure to post about this, including pentatonic scales, harmony, etc. Music theory as much about space as it is about time. Even separating the two can be useful, in stages.
@@mikegeorge360 Well… As Xenakis said when asked why how a trained architect could be composing music “architecture is transformation in space, music is transformation in time”. He wasn’t really using what we would think of as “music theory” but certainly the spatial concept exists within sound and composition. In any case I shall look forward to seeing what you have to say. More than anything, I think it’s fascinating to see how we interpret and understand music, or perhaps his we attempt to communicate our understanding. The best way is probably through dancing to it though 😅
I agree, what a complete bore. Music theory is one thing and mathematics obviously play a huge part of it. But geometry!!. Music is a wonderful complex subject and like art it can be expressed in many different shapes and colours. Keep the geometry for chords and arpeggios.
I’d like to see the chords in the circle if fifths , so I know where to put my fingers on the neck , that would be hands on . Please let me know if you have that kind of lesson thanks !!!!
Interesting idea, but without any applications it's like.. ok you've presented a construct assigning colours and positions on a circle to notes, but does it help? How do you use it to help? How about describing the sound of colour, or the sound of shape?
@@Ana_crusis In my personal experience with instructing music that’s far from the case. Most folks I have instructed almost always draw that association, more so with piano than guitar, but it’s almost universal in my experience.
@@ckatheman well I've never come across it and i fail to see why anyone would think the manner of writing music is music theory. it's like confusing a recipe for jam with actual jam
@@Ana_crusis I couldn’t agree more with you. It’s confusing the recipe with the end product. It’s just in my experience I see people doing it ALL the time.
Geometric patterns have always been in the spirit of what the ancient people let all around the earth. Geometry has been serving to the mystery of reaching other dimensions. Or in other words, this is some very powerful shit right there.
I was just having this discussion in the music theory discord server, and it's amazing how many people think the circle is useless. I'm guessing they haven't gone much beyond using it as a tool to remember flats and sharps.
I think it's useless I a way that when I create music I'm not thinking of it. But I find if music sounds good it's used . So you could go back and look and understand how the notes work well .. But yah as a person creating it isn't best to focus on .. it's best to just let whatever flow out and then judge or correct it afterwards with theory
Reminds me of astrology. That is the original cyclical pattern that people paid attention to. It has squares and trines and oppositions just like this.
![Blox Fruits Dragon Rework Update [Full Stream]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EqDAp8udhm0/mqdefault.jpg)
Would love a part 2 where you let us hear the patterns. Fascinating stuff.
That's what I was looking for so long someone who can link music and mathematic
Pitagora did it.
what are you talking about, harmonics are ratios. Just Intonation is just math, 12-TET is pizza, in 12 slices
Never had a lot of music theory, despite my interest in music and "playing" guitar off and on from an early age...
These videos have really brought together my own thinking about music.
Thanks.
Wow!! You got a GREAT thing going!
"Audible geometry"....love it! Great description!
dynamic tone puzzle
Mike you put a lot of effort into this and I think your addition of color to show the 5th relationships within the chromatic scale is genius. Hats off to you dude!
You are the first person that has shown those designs. I found that decades ago when trying to conceptualize all interval cycles as well as that of fifths,and the relationships of each pitch to all others. Of course,we have to bear in mind that it ignores that pesky Pythagorean comma,and the designs that form are only derived from the somewhat arbitrary division of the pitch continuum within an octave,but it's still amazing. I invite any beginning music theorist to use colored pencils,one color for each interval and connect the 12 dots representing the pitches(resulting in 3 squares,4 triangles,1 dodecahedron,etc..). It not only helps understand it,but the results are beautiful.
Music is a beautiful thing. 🤘
It is the bassis of reality. Or what we know to be real . Our world is based on it . 12 months. . 7 with 30 n 5 with with less . Its based on 360° its all very strange .. or maybe its just how we think and we interpret reality that way because its all we see. Kinda like how theres actually more notes than 12. But the 12 make a perfect circle. I think 18 x 2 or 12 x 3 works too .. just because of 36..
Wow, there is a bit there to digest. I like it though, in that these concepts are broadening my perspective on music theory
I love your disclaimer of what music theory ISN'T. Super dense notation can be soooooo daunting, and a lot of the jargon can really dissuade musicians from studying too
Thank your for this excellent visualization!
This is MASSIVELY helpful! I have ADHD, and any alternative ways of linking these patterns in my mind are usually the most useful! Besides geometry being my favorite form of math (working memory issues aren’t a problem when you can measure the math with a ruler to double check your calculations!), being able to visualize the relationships between notes in this way makes so many things make so much more sense in my brain, not only due to the novelty engaging my brain much better, but also because I’m just so strongly wired to seek out these patterns to make intuitive sense of things, in order to take some of the load off my working memory.
Awesome! I’m so glad this helps, Erin. And you describe things really well - this feedback is equally helpful. 🤘
That's awesome! Music theory is usually a struggle for a person with ADHD. Good to know that it has been helpful =]
My advice to balance the working memory impairments is to use some sort of “quick note” strategy. Like keeping a journal or something with you to write down things quickly so they don't keep coming back over time because “you can't forget”. It doesn't have to be too sophisticated, just bullet points may help.
It is very summarized, but I hope it helps! Btw, I’m a psychologist with experience working with ADHD (and also diagnosed with ADHD!)
Same here! this is super helpful for me with learning and understanding the guitar fretboard!
Same. I love these visualizations. They're so much more intuitive to me than standard notation.
Erin! This might sound a little weird but your self awareness is a breath of fresh air and the way you explain that awareness is inspiring. I feel like my brain is wired the same way!
I'm actually really shocked at how hostile some 'musicians' are to the idea that music is mathematics, or based on colour.
It's the most direct route to the soul.
Whatever that looks like.
It's older than mathematics, older than colour.....the 'big bang' was effectively the first smack of a cosmic snare drum.
Maths and colour are certainly two of the best ways to try and seep into it.
Very well said.🤘
In the beginning was the word .
We are just vibrations solidified.
Everything is connected . God is Reality . All that was said will come to pass.
What if I tell you that the tangible is determined by the non tangible, like maths... What if I tell you that the big-bang can't unfold without order, like morphognetic field does constantly.
At 9:12 - This whole figure is over simplified. For example:
- Some scales have m3 intervals (harmonic minor).
- The circle of 5ths shows related keys, it's primary use is not to to describe progressions.
I’ve been trying to learn guitar. It hasn’t been making any sense whatsoever. I was starting to get disappointed and discouraged. As a math/ chemistry amateur This right here is what was needed, a logical patterned relationship of what’s ACTUALLY going on. I’ve watched two videos so far and look forward to many more. My sincere thanks for making these videos.
Been looking into sacred geometry lately and this video blew my mind. I’ve never thought of music theory as geometric patterns.
Very cool!
Same here, flower of life and basic geometry have become one as I now relate math, music, geometry and now the fundamentals of string theory.
I really enjoyed this video. To me, it shows how scales, chords and progressions occur naturally; nobody owns nor creates them. Just like colors . We create art by using these elements in ways unique to ourselves as individuals. Just like a visual artist uses colors. This is true for rhythm and beats as well. Nobody owns them, everybody owns them.
Actually, it is an arbitrary system, it is not 'natural' in the sense that it exists outside of our intellectual constructs. We made it up.
Well said.
@@yru435 Our methods of defining the properties of music may be arbitrary, but it definitely exists whether we acknowledge it or not and it follows the order of the physical universe which we may define but we didn't create
thanks man it is totally new perspective to me
This was so incredible I have to comment with appreciation and astonishment because with your explanation of the geometry with the colors and geometric shapes it got me interested to learn about music theory for the FIRST time in my 50years of avoiding the ‘boring topic’ like the plague! Thank you!!! 🙏🏽😊👍🏼
P.s. you are a great teacher and I subbed! 😊👍🏼
Awesome -- thank you! I'm so glad you're here. Yes, music theory is much more interesting that it might seem. :)
I always wondered why it was called the _chromatic_ scale. Amazing!
Wonderful parallels between Music Geometry and Mathematic... even color (if we know that there are 3 basic color, red blue and yellows) explain the 12 notes. Thank you!
Incredible explanation. For the first time ever music theory is making sense. Thanks so much. :)
excellent description my dude!
You should show this to Klee Irwin over at Quantum Gravity Research. Some of your patterns closely resemble the E8 Quasi-Crystal lattice that sparked a breakthrough in Particle Physics and linked Emergence theory to discoveries at the CERN facility research
phenomenal presentation… absolutely in awe… thank-you….
Thanks -- and I'm glad this helps!
Very good video, I have been contemplating the relationship between music and geometry and this is a good summary of the basis of some of my thoughts. I think it's particularly interesting how we would think of the augmented 7th and diminished chords in this context as being the most "pure", yet those are some of the most harmonically dysfunctional chords in the western repertoire. Instead, the true "purer" chords of major and minor are made up of a perfect balance between a piece of the triangle, and a piece of the square
Here in Brazil most of sambas are in "little squares", as people call the four basic chords. Super interesting to see how many more shapes exists. I am keen to try all those combinations. This way to see music is very clarifying. Thanks a lot for sharing!
@@andrecavalcanti361 I'm studying samba music. Can you show me an example of it?
Awesome! 🎶
Geometry in music destroys the theory of evolution. There is nothing random about geometry. It is perfect.
Hey, this is really cool, thanks.
Wonderfully helpful. Thank you. Having an organizational method to apply to concepts aids understanding.
🤘
Woah! Cool!! Gruvy, far out and very interesting. Thanks a lot!!!
That was Excellent! really clarifying .. loved how it explained the way minor chords can form progressions when moving by fourths or fifths, always wondered why that worked so well. I appreciate this!
Glad it was helpful!
Music,,perfection of sound,,presented in TRUE sense,,with Eastern thougjt,, Mike,,You have unearthed the,,Root Cause of Creation..Evolution and Existence..DrNanda..India
Thank you George, your explanation is amazing!
Very cool material here! Thanks, for taking the complex and breaking it down for all of us.
Great presentation!
⚜️this is the guy to listen to⚜️
Thank you Mike George for this wonderful video.
I'm glad this is helpful -- and thanks! 🤘
This was an excellent intro/explanation. Thanks!
Beautiful connections made between two sister disciplines.
This is so much better than my own color music system. Brilliant ❤
Amazing approach to learning music theory!
What do you get when you drop a piano down a mineshaft? A-flat minor.
Love it.
I read somewhere about math and physics and chemistry modeling the universe and you can apply all of these realms to understand the natural occurring patterns in the universe, so this video got me thinking: If we can use geometry to study music we can also apply physics or chemistry right? What if we can think of a way to study music outside of the sound theory? Maybe thats why a bass that displaces more air will sound better than others.
It's an interesting question.
Brilliant !!! thank you
me encanto! Sobre todo la parte d elas figuras! Fan de esta nueva forma de ver la musica!
Thankyou😂 for the clear explations 🎉I love both art and music😅 this is wonderful Sheila Duke God Bless 😊♥ ❤😊
I liked this. Have you read The Geometry of Music? There is this very detailed textbook about this stuff. I like how mathy and abstract it is, makes more sense this way to me
Is there a place to go to download these worksheets?
"music is geometry" No "hello", no "Hi, I'm whoever", then "lets jump into it". That's a clear sign of wisdom.
What did I just read? 😂
@@arrestedshrimp lol xD the guy in the video doesn't introduces himself, nor he doesn't say "hello"; starts straight with that statement "music is geometry" and jumps into the topic. Just amazing!
The scales form a group. Cool. Hadn’t thought of that before.
Now Your Speaking My Langauge. 🙏
Thank You !!! ✨️✨️✨️
Very interesting, with lots of colourful visuals👍
Feels like the guy just described some kinda fictional magic system at the beginning of the video, this is so awesome
I don't understand English.. but watched the video full length... Eeeeeh true art
What about Stochastic music, which is using chaos theory, entropy, Brownian motion and the like to formulate it's structures and such. It is essentially noise. Or some of the proto electronic musics that's uses white noise. I do like the clock diagrams, have made some interesting scales and rows with them. Great video!!
Your A Musical Genius ! 🎼 🎶🎶🎶
Saw your shorts, figured I'd check this out, one thing I don't understand about your diagrams is why you choose to differentiate between Circles and Squares for certain notes/keys. I think that's the only thing I'm missing in order to really grasp what you're getting at in terms of the diagrams, because that seems like a relevant choice but I've yet to see you explain why you've opted for that. Was it just to delineate the different steps in the Circle of Fifths as Square/Circle/Square, and then the pattern got rearranged when you reverted back to the 12 tone scale?
I think adding that as an explanation of your metric/methodology, and just slowing down your explanations might make things a little easier to grasp from a first watch-through. Otherwise, very interesting way of looking at music, and the first time I've really seen someone break down music on a geometric level to explain relationships between notes.
I'm also curious as to why you use color theory and choose the colors you choose to represent the notes/keys that you do. Is there any attempt to attach those colors to the emotional connection we associate to them, or is it purely for visual purposes? I feel like that could do with more explanation.
I can’t believe you didn’t give any examples using a musical instrument. As a teacher, I can tell you that your presentation would have been much more effective if you had shown what you were talking about by actually playing the sound.
Because he likely can't...because music (or music theory) is NOT geometry.
@@SamuraiFingers you think he learned all this without being a musician? Come on, man...
I couldn’t agree more. It was all declarations without explanation through showing how it can be used. Simply saying it’s useful is not the same as showing how it is useful.
he is making stuff up , that really don't matter when playing an instrument
There's already a video on his channel where he demonstrate look for the circle of fifths
I love this. Thank you
There are also geometric patterns on the instrument that relate to this. For example: the 145 pattern on the fretboard in standard tuning looks like an "L" shape.
Yes!
❤❤❤amazing bro❤
This helps so much thank you!
This is really amazing
🤘
My mind just exploded thanks
Muy interesante. Gracias. Ojalá haya otro sobre progresiones y geometría. Felicitaciones.
Sí, definitivamente.
😁😇👍
@9:00 oh wow missing that chords to scales relation there
What about synethesia - people who see music as colours??
These color-note relationships are based on the objective connections between the circle of fifths and the color wheel, which may or may not align with an individual's perception of synesthesia.
Awesome take on tonal relations. The visualisation really helps to get a grasp on that.
One could apply the same kinda Geometry on rhythm as well!
With that you could actually start from the initial noise/music dichotomy and derive a much more general music theory from it.
If you apply the most simple pattern (on a beat/off a beat) on a some white noise you'd put some order in that.
From there you can go through all possible rhythmic patterns.
If you'd then change the soundwave to a sinus wave you'd have tonal relations.
Another thing that is important to mention is that this perfect symmetry is something that historically evolved in europe and isn't quite the same around the world. But oh well, only so many minutes in video and such vaste field of possibilities. :)
Music is the audible convergence of space and time -- so many beautiful intricacies.
Rhythm is mostly placed on a grid but I've seen it represented in a circle in a way similar to a clock.
Bravo
Deep but real.
Some small musical examples would've been nice but if you're a musical knowledge nerd this is still very tasty.
Some of the greatest composers and advanced musicians use this stuff daily once it's in your system.
Thanks for sharing.
Thanks! Yes, once you internalize these patterns it all becomes second nature.
Was really hoping to see some mention on the work Richard Cohn and Dmitri Tymoczko and many others on the subject of geometry and conceptual organizations of chord movement in Parsimonious voice leading. it can go really really deep and I would love if more people could look up these names and the subject matter to get more eyes on this. a good book to start with is by Richard Cohn called: "Audacious Euphony". its a tough academic topic but its handled so well by Richard and with a nice amount of humor to break up the prose and keep the reader interested in what would otherwise be a dry analysis. also the papers written by Dmitri have been an endless supply of inspiration for myself and how I view musical structures especially when I relate them to other equally fascinating topics like Bebop and Barry Harris' teachings on harmony.
ty for these references I have been looking for such things
If you're not familiar with it already, I suggest having a look at Thomas Echols' "The Tesseract" via ruclips.net/user/TheLabyrinthofLimitations. Fun, fascinating, and very valuable -- especially if you are a Barry person... 😉
Thanks, Mike. Much love. New sub.
Very cool, Gus. I'm so glad you're here.
Thanks for a very interesting video. I think those who like patterns and like to compare them can appreciate this and those who don't can simply let it go by -- no need to denigrate. It's pretty natural to start with 7 tones and 7 colors and wonder about that. Taking it up to 12 tones and 12 colors is great, but it's the circle of 5ths that really makes this work. When you relate the color spectrum and then shift back to the chromatic scale, wow. Every tone compared to its neighbor a half step away on either side, shows very different colors, which would be the dissonance of playing them together. Compare this with the 1-4-5 that show related harmony and similar colors. The geometry is also good; there's very much to run with here.
Thanks, Paul! 🤘
great stuff
Awesome! Thank you!
this last part is like the layout of the left hand of the piano accordion!!
🤘
Can you map these to piano keyboard and guitar fret board and demonstrate some examples? There's a couple layers of abstraction here where practical examples would be helpful.
Definitely. This video is an intro to these patterns. The playlists on my channel dive into lots of specific applications on both piano and guitar. Also, more to come. 🤘
Are you able to explain the John Coltrane wheel based on this? It would be very cool.
That was an invaluable theory lesson, one of the more profound and useful I have ever had. Thank you
What, specificaly, did you get out of it?
How, specifically, have you used this information in your playing/composing?
I thought this was a cool video on a spiritual/philisophical level, but I failed to see and practical use.
@@ernie5229 the connection to Mathematics. It offers a whole new view of music theory from a conceptual level.
@@therobmeister Such as?
This stuff is my absolute favourite stuff. What is some book you’d recommend for really understanding harmony and rhythm? And it’s physics and geometry
What about pentatonic scales? What about quartal harmony?
I mean, if this is how you make sense of music that’s cool, and if thinking about it this way inspires you even better. Music isn’t geometry though. Geometry is the mathematics of space, music is the mathematics of time. There’s a dialogue between the 2 but to say one is somehow derived from the other just doesn’t sit right for me.
I did think you might use this to talk about negative harmony though, I think it does help with that.
I’ll be sure to post about this, including pentatonic scales, harmony, etc. Music theory as much about space as it is about time. Even separating the two can be useful, in stages.
@@mikegeorge360 Well… As Xenakis said when asked why how a trained architect could be composing music “architecture is transformation in space, music is transformation in time”. He wasn’t really using what we would think of as “music theory” but certainly the spatial concept exists within sound and composition.
In any case I shall look forward to seeing what you have to say. More than anything, I think it’s fascinating to see how we interpret and understand music, or perhaps his we attempt to communicate our understanding.
The best way is probably through dancing to it though 😅
@@captainskylight942 Yes! 🤘
I agree, what a complete bore. Music theory is one thing and mathematics obviously play a huge part of it. But geometry!!. Music is a wonderful complex subject and like art it can be expressed in many different shapes and colours. Keep the geometry for chords and arpeggios.
I’d like to see the chords in the circle if fifths , so I know where to put my fingers on the neck , that would be hands on . Please let me know if you have that kind of lesson thanks !!!!
How did you learn this, I grasp the concept but would like to completely wrap my mind around this
Circle gets the square?
Interesting idea, but without any applications it's like.. ok you've presented a construct assigning colours and positions on a circle to notes, but does it help? How do you use it to help? How about describing the sound of colour, or the sound of shape?
Thank you for making the point that sheet music is NOT music theory
I find that a very odd point to make because no one has ever suggested that sheet music or written notation of music *is* theory
@@Ana_crusis In my personal experience with instructing music that’s far from the case. Most folks I have instructed almost always draw that association, more so with piano than guitar, but it’s almost universal in my experience.
@@ckatheman well I've never come across it and i fail to see why anyone would think the manner of writing music is music theory. it's like confusing a recipe for jam with actual jam
@@Ana_crusis I couldn’t agree more with you. It’s confusing the recipe with the end product. It’s just in my experience I see people doing it ALL the time.
Excellent
Cool stuff with piano and guitar lessons together I🙂🙂😎😎
thanks
Interesting clip,well done
Thanks!
Geometric patterns have always been in the spirit of what the ancient people let all around the earth. Geometry has been serving to the mystery of reaching other dimensions.
Or in other words, this is some very powerful shit right there.
Having to learn and visualize geometric shapes as related to music might seem challenging.
You have successfully splattered my brain.
Great! Can you associate geometry with emotions of the modes? Can complex combinations of geometries sound like songs?
Yes. Check out my "Modes" playlist that dives in. 🤘
This is a fantastic overview. If I wanted to take this approach for learning the fretboard where do I start?
Amen
@2:00 that system comes at w cross roads
And we are no longer at that ceoss roads, but we still look back to that cross roads...
Does that work?
Good work! Giovanni instructor Long Island Drum Center
Mike, why in the circle of fifths, the counterclockwise direction from c minor is intervals of fourths? 10:16
Nice video! Thanks a lot.
My video on "Why the circle of fifths is important" explains these relationships in more detail.
Waaw. Very interesting
I was just having this discussion in the music theory discord server, and it's amazing how many people think the circle is useless. I'm guessing they haven't gone much beyond using it as a tool to remember flats and sharps.
It’s very useful for sure!
I think it's useless I a way that when I create music I'm not thinking of it. But I find if music sounds good it's used . So you could go back and look and understand how the notes work well .. But yah as a person creating it isn't best to focus on .. it's best to just let whatever flow out and then judge or correct it afterwards with theory
Reminds me of astrology. That is the original cyclical pattern that people paid attention to. It has squares and trines and oppositions just like this.
☀︎!