Thanks for the vid I’m 47 do you teach middle age guys on line - i see it says junior training ? Also id like to know how guys I like like hovland keep their head over the ball through out the strike - thanks so much !
Hey brother! Yes! We do teach all ages online. We have a series starting soon called the Swing Improvement Series that I would recommend signing up for to entrench yourself in this system. elitegolfofco.com/current-programs/
Hi there. Interesting stuff! Tried this today on the range. When the pelvis drops, my knees flex, and the knees keeps being flexed through impact. Looks like I am sitting down through impact. How do I straighten that lead knee. Should it straighten by itself or should I time the straightening as an active movement?
@@wormburner7237 once you drop in transition there is a vertical component to rotation. That’s the directionality of the spiral line. Once you drop you don’t need to stay low. As you rotate the chest, you should start standing because of the direction of the rotation
Thanks Guys!! I have been trying now to get my hips to rotate and find a way to get a little more speed so when I watched this I hit pause and tried what you suggand I instantly got the feel of the hips braking. I plan on working this feel into my swing starting tomorrow. You guys have helped my swing so much since I found this channel. Cheers Guys✌️
Recently discovered this with the help of another video you did. It’s amazing how fast the pelvis rotates if you just turn your chest. I have that feeling also of bracing into the left leg, then at the last moment before impact the pressure gives and the club just comes flying through as I post onto my left leg. Very powerful feel and well explained in this video.
This is one of the most important videos out there. Everyone, including nyself, is tricked by seeing pros move their hips first but when youbactively do that you loose your post/pivot point that allows your upper body to get through the ball. Also, posting up the left leg acts as huge resistance to really rubber band even more power. It's deceiving cause even when you try to not open your hips, on video you still do and it looks sequenced even though the feel is different. Great Work fellas. P.s. I notice this helps a lot on short game too. It's easy to spin out with wedge shots and push it to the right.
Please put a search feature on your RUclips page (you have over 300 videos now!!!) and perhaps organize your videos to make it easier to find that special gem that you want to review again when practicing. As to this video - I think this answers a lingering problem for me. Wonderful job.
Hi interesting video. This for players who rotate the hips to much. Feel is not real. I try to fire my hips open but at impact they are still shut. So this video relates only to over rotators 😊
@@marcussheldon9220 actually…. Super interesting…. We find it most beneficial to players who are attempting to rotate in inappropriate ways. The amount of people who implement this and feel like they ‘aren’t rotating’ and then see it on camera and see both cheeks clearly is amazing 🍑
Absolutely one of the hardest habits for me to break is over active lower body. Even when I try to think about it it's hard to justify not doing it because "power" But this actually makes a lot of sense this feel he's saying. I NEED to try this asap lol Can you also kind of use this for irons as well?
So if understand correctly here, after we drop the hips we are utilizing the upper body/ core to swing through? Uncoiling essentially.. obviously you still need to use the ground to generate force, but the rest of the rotation sounds like it’s happening in the upper body?
You’re good! Thanks for asking! And yes, drop before finishing the backswing and then turn. No need to actively move vertically after that. Most players will move vertically because of rotation 🙏
MASSIVE fan and follower but for clarity: when TJ demonstrated the "drop" his hips clearly squared during the drop...but when Jackson demonstrated the drop his hips stayed closed. Which is correct? Thank you!!!
This is a very good question. The hips will indeed unwind in the drop, but it is not something you need to FORCE to happen. The forces of the golf swing will not allow the hips to stay “shut” for very long… 🤔
@@HenryHooton-u2v he is actually mid pivot. He does a wonderful job moving pressure into his lead side as he nears the top of his swing, then rotates from there…
In the wedge vs driver video, you guys mention more of an active rotation for driver. Question: Should I be working to keep my hips shut for driver too? (I tend to push slice when I try to keep it closed for driver)
@@HenryHooton-u2v so the unload will either be a supination/pronation action or an extension/flexion action. UD would be incorporated in either release 🙏🙏
What I do not understand is with the shift over the lead leg, along with hip sway, your chest as angled toward the target with little right side bend. Most elite swings reflect more right side bend and the head stays behind the ball in a face on view. When I try these patterns, I end up sliding my head at or beyond the ball and cast out much of the lag stored in the backswing. This results in little shaft lean and over loss. Any suggestion?
If you’re trying to side bend in order to lift the ball in the air, we might have some issues. The real money move here is using the upper spiral to create (natural) extension through the strike. I would check out the “Unloading the Spiral Line” video from our archives to see what I mean 🙏
Such a good video. Wish you guys were based/had a presence in the UK. I'd come to you for coaching without any hesitation... I'll have to make it across the pond at some point...
I just realized how big 5:20 - 5:58 is. As a former early rotate the hips map player, because I couldn't get the speed out like TJ said in the segment. It's a self fulling mechanism. Because I can't get the speed out, I have rip the hips open faster, in turn making it harder to get the speed out. But if you're doing the map right, like the center of the wheel. You don't have to.
Great video again! I have a question. Being hitter these days, I feel need of some change of ball position. Driver left side, wedges right side, but I need some guideline for ball position. Is there some difference? Or just same as ordinary ones? Thank you😂
Best Ball striker ever pointed to his trail hip and said I never want to move this, never. If you are reading this and want to improve your game then watch how moe Norman did it ie.single plane swing and less moving parts, forget the rest just keep it simple
Maybe debatable about best ball striker, but also had an outlier of a swing motion so not really comparable to normal swings. Knudson would be a better comparison.
I like the feeling doing this. But I soon start to get into a state where my hips don’t really open at all and then I hit hooks. My upper spiral just spins right on by my inactive hip turn.
Rotating the femur like that is the only way you can pull hard down and not pull the club over. If you leave the club behind and pull hard left it works nicely for lag. But it's not lag in the traditional sense. But still lag. I've not seen any top player swing like this on tour. If you know of any please let me know..
This is a big thing in martial arts too. Folks are often taught to rotate their hips, but the strongest punches rotate about the support leg femur thereby increasing the mass behind their punch and kick to their whole body from only half of it. Also, is this why Tiger Wood was so good at golf!? Internal and external rotation of the femur, which seems to the driving force, is also used in that activity which he was rumoured to have done a lot of.
@@elitegolfschools Tiger Woods certainly rotates his femur a lot. This is him in 2004 (from his Wikipedia, golf style section) en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_Woods#/media/File%3ATigerWoods2004RyderCup3.jpg Have you written about this? I'd like to quote you.
@@TimothyTakemoto anytime we are looking at the finish position the lead femur will be internally rotated. Even though the axis of the patella has moved in a more target-biased position, we are relating the state of the femur to the pelvis. The rotation of the pelvis will always be greater than the femur’s rotation at finish 🙏
From top of BS to impact is less than 1/4 second. All body movement in complex chain action is initiated by a singular intention at top of BS before the DS begins. Once initiated correctly the body parts support the intention we have of our hands(homunculus). Hands and face have majority of the neurons in the motor and sensory cortex. Balance is priority of the subconscious. ie keep us upright on two legs, protecting the brain. That means subconscious, anticipates the shifting of weight as intention to move hands, the weight of arms(ca 20 to 40 pounds) around the body. Hips have no means of movement other than by the lower body. ie feet, ankles, knees and legs.
@@elitegolfschoolsthanks for this video though. This explains a lot of answers I was looking for regarding how actively move the hips and what I was feeling was not rotating that much. It's the upper thorax after the drop. Thanks a bunch!!
There’s no need to keep it internal forever…. Don’t lock any joints out. But the idea is to keep it there LONGER. It’s a flavor, not the whole recipe 🙏
It's both a myth and an illusion that the hip rotation. PULLS the shoulders and arms down and around. It's the shoulders and arms that dominate the rotation. Getting that timing right is what pros work on perpetually.
Please comment any questions you have, we’d love to help you any way we can 🙏
Thanks for the vid I’m 47 do you teach middle age guys on line - i see it says junior training ? Also id like to know how guys I like like hovland keep their head over the ball through out the strike - thanks so much !
Hey brother! Yes! We do teach all ages online. We have a series starting soon called the Swing Improvement Series that I would recommend signing up for to entrench yourself in this system. elitegolfofco.com/current-programs/
Hi there. Interesting stuff! Tried this today on the range. When the pelvis drops, my knees flex, and the knees keeps being flexed through impact. Looks like I am sitting down through impact. How do I straighten that lead knee. Should it straighten by itself or should I time the straightening as an active movement?
@@wormburner7237 once you drop in transition there is a vertical component to rotation. That’s the directionality of the spiral line. Once you drop you don’t need to stay low. As you rotate the chest, you should start standing because of the direction of the rotation
@@elitegolfschools Ok thanks. Will try and see what happens. Maybe I need a more active chest rotatation.
Thanks Guys!! I have been trying now to get my hips to rotate and find a way to get a little more speed so when I watched this I hit pause and tried what you suggand I instantly got the feel of the hips braking.
I plan on working this feel into my swing starting tomorrow.
You guys have helped my swing so much since I found this channel.
Cheers Guys✌️
Let’s go bro!! Glad to hear it helped!
Recently discovered this with the help of another video you did. It’s amazing how fast the pelvis rotates if you just turn your chest. I have that feeling also of bracing into the left leg, then at the last moment before impact the pressure gives and the club just comes flying through as I post onto my left leg. Very powerful feel and well explained in this video.
@@shawnkirkpatrick906 yes! That’s exactly right!! Got to have the whole map!
This video is great. My hips are quick and I notice and huge difference following this video.
Let’s go!!
This is one of the most important videos out there. Everyone, including nyself, is tricked by seeing pros move their hips first but when youbactively do that you loose your post/pivot point that allows your upper body to get through the ball. Also, posting up the left leg acts as huge resistance to really rubber band even more power. It's deceiving cause even when you try to not open your hips, on video you still do and it looks sequenced even though the feel is different. Great Work fellas.
P.s. I notice this helps a lot on short game too. It's easy to spin out with wedge shots and push it to the right.
Huge concept here, agreed. Glad you enjoyed!
Best explanation ever ! Kudos, the improvement to the golf swing is staggering, and self correcting.🙏
Love it man! Thank you for watching!
Please tell me when will the vertical force during the Downswing occur ?
Is the feeling more sitting/leaning towards the left side? Thanks
@@ufukgoksu9851 the drop should feel vertical for most, not necessarily trying to get to the lead side ❤️🙏
Please put a search feature on your RUclips page (you have over 300 videos now!!!) and perhaps organize your videos to make it easier to find that special gem that you want to review again when practicing. As to this video - I think this answers a lingering problem for me. Wonderful job.
Wonderful! And yes, getting ready to organize our videos in the coming weeks/months
Hi interesting video. This for players who rotate the hips to much. Feel is not real. I try to fire my hips open but at impact they are still shut. So this video relates only to over rotators 😊
@@marcussheldon9220 actually…. Super interesting…. We find it most beneficial to players who are attempting to rotate in inappropriate ways. The amount of people who implement this and feel like they ‘aren’t rotating’ and then see it on camera and see both cheeks clearly is amazing 🍑
@@elitegolfschools I'll have to give this a try. I'm skeptical but I'm willing. lol
@@patrickwilliams6867 nice! Keep us posted!!
Nice job gents. Good on you TJ for taking the Mic on this one.
Our pleasure!
Is this principle relevant only for driver?
@@bendorrington9988 all the way through the bag!
Absolutely one of the hardest habits for me to break is over active lower body. Even when I try to think about it it's hard to justify not doing it because "power" But this actually makes a lot of sense this feel he's saying. I NEED to try this asap lol Can you also kind of use this for irons as well?
You of course can use this with irons. Same principle!
so this is a horse of a different color. I can see how if the hips go down like you say they get out of the way. thnx for the help.
@@steveperry1344 fantastic!!
So if understand correctly here, after we drop the hips we are utilizing the upper body/ core to swing through? Uncoiling essentially.. obviously you still need to use the ground to generate force, but the rest of the rotation sounds like it’s happening in the upper body?
Do you drop before you finished your back swing and also I’m guessing do I spring up. Sorry new to golf 😅
You’re good! Thanks for asking! And yes, drop before finishing the backswing and then turn. No need to actively move vertically after that. Most players will move vertically because of rotation 🙏
MASSIVE fan and follower but for clarity: when TJ demonstrated the "drop" his hips clearly squared during the drop...but when Jackson demonstrated the drop his hips stayed closed. Which is correct?
Thank you!!!
This is a very good question. The hips will indeed unwind in the drop, but it is not something you need to FORCE to happen. The forces of the golf swing will not allow the hips to stay “shut” for very long… 🤔
Wonderful, thank you! @@elitegolfschools
Will this internal pelvis move going to stall the sacrum from moving back?
Can practicing with a closed stance help facilitate the propper feeling ? Or anything to be cautious of when setting up closed ?
Definitely a drill I see some people doing!! Benefits to it for sure
I saw the reel about using femur as a break and have been working on this. This is so amazing. Thank you ❤
So glad you’re enjoying!
Checking, Is Jackson a lead pivot swing or a back pivot swing as discussed in a recent elite video releasing?
Suspect lead??
Cheers
@@HenryHooton-u2v he is actually mid pivot. He does a wonderful job moving pressure into his lead side as he nears the top of his swing, then rotates from there…
@@elitegolfschools Interesting. Is TJ a rear pivot and who in your teaching group is a lead pivot.
Fascinating subject.
@@HenryHooton-u2v rear pivot is Hovland pattern and lead pivot would look like Jimmy Walker
This video and concept has been a massive breakthrough for me. Thank youn
So glad!!
Can correct rib sway help eliminate pulling down on the club??
In a way, yes!
Yup..That's me 100 percent. Gonna have to work on this.
@@jdishome1964 ❤️🙏❤️🙏
Is this the same golf information for someone trying to get a Hovland type of release?? LMK- EGS is great!
Yes!
In the wedge vs driver video, you guys mention more of an active rotation for driver. Question: Should I be working to keep my hips shut for driver too? (I tend to push slice when I try to keep it closed for driver)
Active chest rotation. The pelvis is always the dropper
I assume that, even though we should not be trying to rotate the hips, we SHOULD be still trying to get max chest rotation speed?
I picked up Jackson saying "allows me to get the clubhead out". What does he actively do to accomplish that move?
Thanks you!
Unload the hands and fire the arms
@@elitegolfschools Great...when do you unload the hands, same time as firing the arms P5.5?
Luv it!!
should have asked , unloading the hands by UD and flexing?
@@HenryHooton-u2v so the unload will either be a supination/pronation action or an extension/flexion action. UD would be incorporated in either release 🙏🙏
@@HenryHooton-u2v yep! Exactly right!
What I do not understand is with the shift over the lead leg, along with hip sway, your chest as angled toward the target with little right side bend. Most elite swings reflect more right side bend and the head stays behind the ball in a face on view. When I try these patterns, I end up sliding my head at or beyond the ball and cast out much of the lag stored in the backswing. This results in little shaft lean and over loss. Any suggestion?
If you’re trying to side bend in order to lift the ball in the air, we might have some issues. The real money move here is using the upper spiral to create (natural) extension through the strike. I would check out the “Unloading the Spiral Line” video from our archives to see what I mean 🙏
Such a good video. Wish you guys were based/had a presence in the UK. I'd come to you for coaching without any hesitation... I'll have to make it across the pond at some point...
Would be honored to work with you! Virtual sessions are an option working for many as well!
Don’t worry guys I’m here 🎉 great video as always.
You the 💣
I just realized how big 5:20 - 5:58 is. As a former early rotate the hips map player, because I couldn't get the speed out like TJ said in the segment. It's a self fulling mechanism. Because I can't get the speed out, I have rip the hips open faster, in turn making it harder to get the speed out. But if you're doing the map right, like the center of the wheel. You don't have to.
Very interesting. Thanks for sharing. 👊👊
You bet, glad you enjoyed 🙏
Will this stop early extension?
Would certainly help!
Is that why I get stuck coming down and block it , when I'm trying to clear my hips. I've been trying to get rid of early extension.
Forcing your hips to “clear” can be the root cause of early extension unfortunately
Great video again!
I have a question.
Being hitter these days, I feel need of some change of ball position.
Driver left side, wedges right side, but I need some guideline for ball position. Is there some difference? Or just same as ordinary ones? Thank you😂
Keep everything forward of center, even wedges 🙏 this is our preference at least for stock shots. Encourages good upper spiral movement
@@elitegolfschools thank you. Every club, ball position front of center and chage gradually center to front?
Best Ball striker ever pointed to his trail hip and said I never want to move this, never. If you are reading this and want to improve your game then watch how moe Norman did it ie.single plane swing and less moving parts, forget the rest just keep it simple
Yep! Repeatable shots is where it’s at 🙏
Maybe debatable about best ball striker, but also had an outlier of a swing motion so not really comparable to normal swings. Knudson would be a better comparison.
@@AndrewDCDrummond always a fun ‘bar conversation’ on who’s the best. But we can both agree that both of those names mentioned were damn good 👍
Yes knudson 😊@@AndrewDCDrummond
@AndrewDCDrummond no, it's not debatable...
Cool stuff boys!
Thanks for watching! 🙏
I like the feeling doing this. But I soon start to get into a state where my hips don’t really open at all and then I hit hooks. My upper spiral just spins right on by my inactive hip turn.
The key here is to not restrict movement. Let the pelvis rotate, but simply as a result of upper spiral movement instead of the primary driver 🙏
I had good success with the driver but tend to come over the top with the irons when keeping the hips closed longer.
Great lesson drill video tips
Thank you!!
Rotating the femur like that is the only way you can pull hard down and not pull the club over. If you leave the club behind and pull hard left it works nicely for lag. But it's not lag in the traditional sense. But still lag. I've not seen any top player swing like this on tour. If you know of any please let me know..
Boom
Nailed it!🤜
🙏🙏
In the slow-mo of the hips, the first movement of the hips is a squatting move that moves them away from the ball.
This is a big thing in martial arts too. Folks are often taught to rotate their hips, but the strongest punches rotate about the support leg femur thereby increasing the mass behind their punch and kick to their whole body from only half of it. Also, is this why Tiger Wood was so good at golf!? Internal and external rotation of the femur, which seems to the driving force, is also used in that activity which he was rumoured to have done a lot of.
Tiger has had many different patterns over the years but we sure love OG Tiger in 98/99 🙏
@@elitegolfschools Tiger Woods certainly rotates his femur a lot. This is him in 2004 (from his Wikipedia, golf style section)
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_Woods#/media/File%3ATigerWoods2004RyderCup3.jpg
Have you written about this? I'd like to quote you.
@@TimothyTakemoto anytime we are looking at the finish position the lead femur will be internally rotated. Even though the axis of the patella has moved in a more target-biased position, we are relating the state of the femur to the pelvis. The rotation of the pelvis will always be greater than the femur’s rotation at finish 🙏
@@TimothyTakemoto and no we have not written on this topic
@@elitegolfschools Thank you very much for your kind replies.
So if your hips drop, your head has to go lower too?
A bit, yes! And this is a good thing 🙏
Too active hip rotation will definitely cause early extension, key is to let your torso shoulder pass through and hip follows due to momentum
Bingo 👌
What about iron?
Same thing!
From top of BS to impact is less than 1/4 second. All body movement in complex chain action is initiated by a singular intention at top of BS before the DS begins.
Once initiated correctly the body parts support the intention we have of our hands(homunculus). Hands and face have majority of the neurons in the motor and sensory cortex.
Balance is priority of the subconscious. ie keep us upright on two legs, protecting the brain.
That means subconscious, anticipates the shifting of weight as intention to move hands, the weight of arms(ca 20 to 40 pounds) around the body.
Hips have no means of movement other than by the lower body. ie feet, ankles, knees and legs.
Yep 👍
🔥🔥🔥
🙏🙏🙏
@MattScharff, I have found your twin.
I see it now
@@elitegolfschools😂😂
@@elitegolfschoolsthanks for this video though. This explains a lot of answers I was looking for regarding how actively move the hips and what I was feeling was not rotating that much. It's the upper thorax after the drop. Thanks a bunch!!
Although I understand this, I’m more confused than ever 😂
Haha takes some digging for it to become simple sometimes
What's wrong with my map if I feel like keeping lead femur internal is going to shatter my knee joint and break my lead leg? lol!
There’s no need to keep it internal forever…. Don’t lock any joints out. But the idea is to keep it there LONGER. It’s a flavor, not the whole recipe 🙏
It's both a myth and an illusion that the hip rotation. PULLS the shoulders and arms down and around. It's the shoulders and arms that dominate the rotation. Getting that timing right is what pros work on perpetually.
@@kenkeyes8148 totally agree with that ❤️❤️❤️
dont rotate the hips????? im pretty sure he rotated his hips wtf
Pelvic rotation is different than hip rotation 😊
Yes, his hips rotated. Looked like any good swing. I think he is saying just not the first move.
The key sounds like is to do nothing.
@@rightstuff24 passive in areas, active in others 🙏🙏