Well said I agree 100% with everything you said especially the part with we need to know we see it then we forget it. They purely thought spending money on CGI dragons would be enough to keep an audience attention, like after season 8 GOT I never wanted to hear Dan and Dave again but after first episode season 2 HOTD I was like where is Dan and Dave when you need them.
The main thing I’m noticing in GOT vs HOTD is the change in world sizes. GOT took place on a giant map, had a ton of characters, and we still got to know everyone. HOTD takes place in a micro bubble in comparison, with way LESS characters, and they’re building 2D characters in small scope. Your characters need to be BIGGER in HOTD to make up for the smaller scope and cast.
Good point. Also my friend wants more bodies and consequential deaths. But the cast is so small they don't have the same luxury as game of thrones did really. Good point on how small the world seems this go around.. side note what kills me (idk if this happens in the books) but Rhaenerya an others sneaking in and out of kings landing was pushing my suspension of disbelief as well as alicent somehow wearing a hood and getting to Rhaenerya 😂 like damn.
There is no team green for pro blacks to hate anymore. They literally disbanded. Otto is in jail,criston wants to die helena alicent and jaheara defected,aegon ran away . Now it's house good guys vs team pyscho aemond
Because of what they did to Rhaenyra and Daemon (from badass to weak and depressed, from charismatic to annoying, inspiring no loyalty) I started to root for Aegon and Larys 😅
blood and cheese not adding the choosing of a son and cheese's line 'y'hear that boy ya momma wants u dead' is just the most mind boggling decision to me. it goes from a scene you'd be telling people about forever to something new viewers probably forgot about by the end of the season. unforgivable
Except that scene makes perfect sense given Helaena's character in the show. In the book she's just not the same, and the whole dragon dream aspect is pretty darn interesting, especially in that context.
@@DuggyDarko In the book that event is the absolute point of no return. Lucerys' death and Jaehaerys' death ensured the Dance would be a fight to the death for all parties.
I’m convinced Hollywood can’t make a decent show anymore to save their lives. Shows will start out great, some even amazing and then slowly lose quality before eventually becoming a hot mess or a disappointment. I don’t know what’s going on with the execs and in the writers’ rooms but this getting ridiculous
You could point to one problem or you could point out all of them and you would be correct. Nepotism, Favoritism, Self-Censorship, writing on a pipeline, writing in a group committee , a Parasocial relationship with their audience, etc. Me personally? I have often long felt that a lot of these writers lack life experience. Not that they are too young or not old enough, but that they at some point in their life stopped developing as a person. This is a problem because they lack self awareness, restraint, maturity, and the inability to see from others perspectives. This why, in my mind, you get all this bland, milquetoast entertainment that borders on non offensive, trying to entertain everyone but no one at the same time, whatever thematic meaning or purpose to their chosen genre is erased, and reduced to a more palatable, “sellable” product. Sorry for the rant but I write so this gets to me on a personal level. TLDR: Never stop growing as a person or you will make bad entertainment Edit: Don’t get it twisted yo, I’m ok with inclusion and am generally quite socially liberal, but I am against shitty writing and I am a writer. You want to write something? Fantastic. Write it and I will check it out. Don’t take another’s work and warp it to fit your desires. I am looking at you in particular Sarah Hess.
Blood & Cheese scene was a major letdown. I didn't read the books before, but I knew what was all that about. The show played such a wathered down version of it, and then showed so little impact of the aftermath... that I was amazed of how bad the writters adapted the source material. Even taking some liberties with the way you tell the story, how can you screw things up so badly to a point where a MAJOR event in the books now seems to be just an anecdote?
When I read that in Fire and Blood, it was absolutely distressing. It showed the stakes were set on fricking Mars for this war. No one was safe. In the show, it mattered for like 1 episode and then everyone forgot about it.
I read the book as soon as it came out, so I don't remember much. But i remembered that scene for its horror, and I was thrilled. Just for it to fall so flat in the show.......
Im gonna say it, they were too enamoured with the idea of highlighting the unfairness of being a woman on that world (and this) and took power out of Alicent and Rhaenyra to make them look innocent but ultimately made them boring, they had already made their point in the first season that they were treated unfairly and were pushed to their positions by the patriarchy, but it makes no sense for these two to be stopping war and meeting each other after all that transpired. It just makes them seem less like characters with a mind of their own and more like puppets
I do get fed up with RUclipsrs constantly comparing Game of Thrones to House of Dragons. I for one would like to forget about GOT and the debacle of an ending.
"Yeah, remember Game of Thrones? Remember when every scene accomplished more than one thing, when characters spoke with wit and nuance, when you were filled with equal parts dread and excitement? What was that all about?" I remember, it crashed and burned harder than Rhaenys & Meleys , Aegon & Sunfire together at Rooks rest. TBH here, i did not read the books. But this was still ten times better then GoT season 8. We ourselves put the bar on our expectations way too high. And then complain to the show runners that it was nothing like we imaged. If you want the story to fit perfectly to the book, then go read the book. If you do not like surprises, then go read the book. If you dislike the show that bad, then why keep watching? And well, you guessed it, just pick up the book and read that. 🤷♀ If you did that too many times and want something else? than do not complain that the showrunners want to keep some surprises up their sleeves. I see it like this, This season should have had 10 eps instead of the 8 we got. Ep 8 didn't feel like a season finale because we are short of two eps. I would advise to binge watch the whole second season. And then give an overall fair assessment over the complete season. I think ppl are way too negative about this due to the last episode we saw.... Like the rest of the season doesn't exist?! Martin and the test audiences already cleared that episodes 2&4 would slay it. And it did! that whole dialogue between Aegon and Otto While Cole just stands there completely lost in episode 2 was legendary. Otto: "You wouldn't dare". Aegon: " Heh, But i have dared... and i find it stimulating. IMO you guys are all in despared need of an A.A. (attitude Adjustment). *Edit Book fans: "You wouldn't dare to mess with the source material". Sarah Hess: "Heh, But i have dared...And i find it stimulating. (:
This show constantly threatens to become interesting and then never actually pulls through on it. Everything is so grey and lifeless, every character feels weirdly whitewashed and crispy clean while I keep being told how morally ambiguous and brutal the world is supposed to be, the result is you get either utter caricatures of insufferable assholes like Criston Cole or characters that can never do anything compelling, unexpected or debatable without the show going out of its way to dumb it down and/or half hassedly justify it, like with Alicent. There is no Sandor Clegane here, no Syrio Forell, no Bobby Baratheon, none of the colorful personalities that existed in got to give a bit of texture and variety to the world. The best way to put it is that it seems like the characters have no internal life. They will only ever do exactly what you expect them to in order to achieve a plot outcome, they will always explain their motivations out loud, they will never have conflict between them that goes beyond what is the most superficial version of it on paper. Everything is dramatized in the most transparent and simplistic way one can think of with the material at hand. The only possible exceptions to this are Daemon and Aemond because you feel like they have things going on in their head beyond what the writers make come out of their mouth, they are actually fun to watch, but everyone around them is just so dull. Imagine a character like Jaime written into this show, they'd never be able to manage him, because they'd never be able to handle the amount of layers there are to his personality and demeanor. They can only go "over the top bastard that only talks to be an over the top bastard" or "misunderstood victim of circumstances that only talks to explain how misunderstood he is", while he's really neither of these things, but a bit of both. Wanna watch a show about a family tragedy that merges interpersonal conflicts with the mechanisms and dynamics of power? Watch Succession instead. Logan Roy talking in a board meeting in that show is more frightening than all of the dragons HBO money can buy, and there is more meaningful and layered conflict developing in throaway lines and literal jokes in that show than in all of HOTD's lofty ass, bland monologues
The first thing I thought of when reading your comment was the scene in season 1, episode 7, where they pretend for a minute that Rhaenyra arranges the death of Laenor. They go out of their way to show why it would make sense for Rhaenyra to order it, how it strengthens her politically to ally with Daemon, and how she is becoming a darker figure to try to deal with her increasingly desperate situation. A fantastic scene, great character development for her, and challenging the audience to reassess her character and their own assumptions about her. All in all, excellent writing. And then they completely annihilate all of that in a few seconds, by having Laenor row away with his lover. It's almost as if the writers were just mocking us there: "you see how absolutely awesome this scene could have been? Well, too bad, because this is the Rhaenyra show and she's the good guy, so we're chickening out and making it lame instead."
@@frankvandorp9732 I don't like to be that guy because my only concern is the quality of the work they put out, but did you really expect THESE writers to kill off the gay guy? It's 2024, you can't just treat characters as if they were people
Succession is GREAT. Every scene, every conversation in that show had me screaming because of the drama, the conflict, the themes. It's people talking to each other in very boring-looking hotels and yet, it's far more exciting than anything HOT D has managed to pull off in season 2.
@@frankvandorp9732allying with daemon was a smart military choice because they have dragons it was not a smart politically choice because everyone hates daemon
Also I feel like them making Aemond burn Aegon has ruined him burning Sharp Point as a shocking moment to us. We expect the worst of Aemond now, so it wasn’t even that surprising
The fact that they didn't even show Aemond burning Sharp Point ruined him burning Sharp Point. Also it makes zero sense for his character to do that, I view it as horrendous character assassination.
I think it would've still been shocking. Him trying to kill Aegon was a surprise but if they had actually shown what he did at sharp point it would've added so much more to him being a villian
I dont think sharp point was meant to be surprising (I mean, I barely knew what happened) I think it was the last straw for the greens to start running away from him
One thing that really gets me is that they make a huge point that the dragons are more than just big war machines, but the one character we have that refuses to use her dragon as a war machine (Helaena) we never get to see her bond with that dragon and how the bond can be different with peaceful riders. I feel the same about Laena and Vhagar
Ooh having Helaena withdraw and only ride her dragon would have been cool, if she's only mentally stable when riding. So when Aemond tries to make her ride to war, it has bigger stakes and we understand that she doesn't want to lose her dragon
You literally see Ulf get on the blue queen and take a joy ride around Kings Landing. A dragon that’s never seen battle or war ridden by a man who just wants to drink in the pub with his mates.
Did you even watch the show? We’ve only seen 4 of the dragons used as war machines. The bond of dragon and rider is a major theme, we see how the dragons interact with their riders. We see how their different personalities manifest. We saw the Blue Queen do a fly over of Kings Landing. A Dragon that never saw battle or war. Queen Alyssane never used her for war. It’s like you only watched one episode and didn’t even look at the screen the rest of the time. Rhaenyra is making a Dragon religion.
I 100% agree. The connection between dragon and rider and the different dragon personalities should have been more fleshed out. That alone would have been a massive improvement
With the knowledge that the writers had to flesh things out in this case, in order to add depth, it becomes less surprising. There have been reports that Hollywood is cutting development times, shrinking writers rooms, not extending contracts to cut corners...so you get different writers between seasons and less care overall. I wish Hollywood would just figure out that cheap AI written entertainment is not the future. Human led, human made shows with the right resources is the future.
Daemon already explained people grieving in different ways in season 1 he already understands that. Rhaenys is just defending ng Rhaenyra instead of being an actual character we can emotionally invest in. Which is why we don’t miss her much at all.
I think what they were able to do with Viserys given the source material is honestly a spit in the face now. They could do it, they were capable of meaningfully adapting and changing things from the “history” book it was based on. But now people wanna say well they had a harder time with that source material then the writers did with GoT when they’ve shown us that shouldn’t matter, they WERE capable.
If I could sit the writers down to watch 1 critique video to understand what they did wrong, I would pick this one. You explained what I couldnt even begin to grasp
I LITERALLY just posted about how if a show has characters talking about “this isn’t how our story is supposed to go” or “this isn’t how our story ends” etc that it’s a sign of severely bad writing 😂🤣 to hear it reaffirmed was music to my ears
It's clear that HOTD are trying to write a more feminist perspective of the story but in doing that they've actually robbed all the female characters of their autonomy, desires and agency. 1. Alicent Hightower- Is robbed of her thirst for power, her religious devotion, her love for her children and the power that she actually holds in court. She's not a good person in the books but she is a real character, and a very real representation of how internalised misogyny and religious extreminism uphold the patraichy even by the very women who are hurt by it. This would've been interesting to watch, a women with the power to actually sit on the iron throne herself (Alicent is a very active member of the council in the books) fights against the claim of another women. She was also robbed of her grief, because she actually cares about her grandchildren in the books. 2. Rhaenyra Targareyn, was literally robbed of her rage, grief and her agency. She's made to be some docile being who seemingly does nothing to solidify her claim to the throne until it's stolen from her. A change I would've welcomed, would be that she was actually trying for years to solidify her place in her father's council but she was being left out and I would've liked an explanation of why she went to Dragonstone when she knew her throne was in danger. That aside, after ep1 of S2 it's like she never lost a son, her rage is non existent. This is a major problem with a lot of the female characters in the show, I'm so tired of women in shows experiencing life shattering grief and reacting with a single tear down their cheek lol. She literally spent 3 days in labor in the books when she heard what the greens did and then she lost her son. Why on earth would she still seek peace when she lost her throne, 2 children and she didn't even get the privilege to attend her father's funeral. I just think someone who went through that would want they're enemies head. Also I love Emma Darcy's performance as Rhaenyra Targareyn, they really embody the role effectively however book Rhaenyra isn't thin, and it was a missed opportunity to have a lead who isn't thin for once. 3. Heleana. I get that they made her autistic apparently and that she is a dreamer or something of the sort, but the fact that she barely grieves the very traumatic death of her child is ridiculous. It's basically the same complaint I have for Rhaenyra and the lack of rage or real grief being displayed. Also I wouldve liked her to not forgive Alicent because who would lol. It's like she is a walking void that lacks emotion. 4. Baela and Rhaena, I don't have much to say about them.. I would've like to see more of them for sure, also I don't get why they decided to give them daddy issues and make Rhaena miserable when she wasn't in the book. 5. Lastly although she's not in the show, I wouldve liked to see Nettles. I think we lacked a good understanding of the small folks true attitudes towards the Targeryns and the war overall. Nettles would be the perfect addition because she is such an anomaly in the story. This is less to do with women lacking their agency but it follows a pattern I've noticed with this show and their POC characters. They raceswope characters and then take away their interesting stories, they did it with Laena Valyrian, who was a big part of Rhaenyra's life and they gave that story to Alicent instead, they barely emphasis the importance of Corlys Velaryon and then with one of the few actually black characters in the book they just merged her story with another POC when it poses serious issues with the future of the story. Anyways I'm done ranting🙃
Right. It was a disappointing finale but not the worst episode. The worst episode was 6 “smallfolk” in which all the plot lines seem to go nowhere. Sara Hess is not to blame for all the bad writing. The problem is having individual people write episodes that feel like fanfic and then think that it’s going to make sense as a series. All the writers should be working on each episode together and have a clear vision of what they want out of the season.
The biggest thing that bothers me with the writing is, not wanting to make Alicent or Rhaenyra look bad, or evil. In the books they are both horrible people, But they dont let any of that show .
Alicent surrendering the City is hilarious and pointless : >The goldencloaks already obey Daemon >Yesterday they help 50 dragonseeds to go on boats > Of course they are gonna surrender to 2 FUCKING DRAGONS ALICENT WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKING DO YOU THINK THEY CAN BATTLE TWO DRAGONS AND THE WHOLE ARMY OF CLOACKS
Even if they were loyal to Aegon for some reason, Helaena would have 0 power. It's 100% clear she's a puppet, a furniture for the Greens, at least on the show. Being Queen Consort doesn't automatically grant you super powers, it's also about the connections you create with your underlings or subjects. For example, how Cersei had to get Littlefinger under her purse to destroy Ned. Or how she had to sleep with the Kettleblacks in the books to gain their arms. Even Alicent, she has to create alliances with Otto, Larys, Criston, she has to manipulate her sons into doing what she wants, etc. It's not like the Gold Cloaks would've heeded the advise of the weirdo hermit Queen who never shows herself to the people.
@@Δ-Δ-Δ-Δ yes absolutely in fact would make a little sense if her Brother Gerald (or something like that) was the Lord Commander like the book But he isnt and would make any change since the same tv show SHOWS how the soldiers are working for Rhaenyra and not 1 guy you can see a lot in the boats scene
I think the major problem with the writing is the suspiciously weird decision by the authors to turn all the female characters into paragons of peace and the almost comical degree to which it is portrayed that men are hot blooded fools while the women are true champions of peace. The characters of Rhaenyra and Alicent have been drastically altered from the book narrative where they are politically shrewd and ambitious politicians to two helpless damsels who are made to go in the direction of war by the men around them. I straight up laughed at many points in the show when Rhaenys starts a hackneyed monologue about Rhaenyra's virtue of non violence and Alicent acts as the most overpaid exec in the kingdom by only stomping on plans and proposals with a holier than thou look and no plans of her own. Rhaenyra is shown to be turning into a cult leader/ tyrant by the end of the season but its too subtle to the point that i feel many people will miss interpret it and will have problems later with her tyranny, they way they had problems with Danny Breaking bad in GoT season 8. I think Alicent is getting this treatment because the authors genuinely dk what to do with her now because shes not really character in the war at this point in the books. She becomes a secondary character and the focus is shifted onto Jace, Aemond and Aegon. Jace is confusinfgto me this season because you said it correctly, the authors delivered all the information we need about his stance on bastard riders without making us feel the legitimacy of his arguement ( his words will turn out to be correct in the future storyline with ulf and hugh). But Jace is relegated to the position of secondary character even though in the books at this point he's the main lead of the blacks. I understand they want to focus on Rhaenyra as the protagonist but they are neglecting the blacks as a whole. Im fairly firmly on the Black's side but the greens are just so much more fun to watch and so much more compelling. And you can see the hints of Book Jace because he's shown to be an adept diplomat and a pretty smart politician but its contrasted by his almost childlike regression into the "attention seeking unruly immature prince" in Rhaenyra's presence. He also has good political accumen because he can instantly forsee the political problems on his claim to the throne by getting bastard dragon riders, this is a tyoe of foresight that Viserys and Rhaenyra lack, as they think that the words of the Ruler and sufficient for a clean succession, and they forget the importance of symbolism in this world. Its actually frustraing to see Rhaenyra not understand this after being a victim to this herself, idk how they will play this in the future or it might be a forgotten plot like most of the deeper plots the writers have. The blacks would be better rulers but dayum the greens make for better entertainment. Aemond feels like hes getting the Daemon treatment. In season 1 Aemond had some of the best aura ive seen in GoT characters and thats because outside of the taming of vhagar, we view him throught the lens of Lucerys which makes him much scarier and impactful. This season almost no one takes him seriously or respects his power which makes him feel like a hollow villain. Daemon has the same problem, last season the rogue prince when viewed from Rhaenyra's perspective felt very intimidating, this season i felt like the writers were intentionally taking revenge on Daemon by just servicing him with the worst plotline of the season and sucking all the impact of his character. They also seem to be selectively whitewashing a lot of characters, and pinning the sins onto specific characters. All of the Black's warcrimes are pinned onto Daemon and Rhaenyra is left scot free, even the red sowing is made to make her look like shes the good guy for killing all those bastards, Rhaenys's massacre of the dragon pit is straight up retconned out of the show, All the green's war crimes are put on Aemond for the benefit of Alicent, and whats funny is that they actually acknowledge this in the writing. Alicent says that Aemond is angry in episode and thats why he killed luke and she decides hes a monster right then and there, and Aemond confides in Criston Cole that Alicent is a weak hypocrit who commits treason against Rhaenyra and then dumps all the dirty work onto Aemond. Alicent is a frsutrating character to me becaue she is written in a very interesting way but it is completely unintentional. The writers genuinely want her to be the good guy on team green but they just make her look like a hypocrit. The choice to make her betray her children for her childhood friend turned enemy was blatant character assasination for me tho. Alicent's character has been irreversible damaged and i think they should just stop trying to fix it and move away to other characters on team green as the main POV. Hopefully Daeron should revive some team green fandom, because at this point half of team green has mutinied to team black (alicent and haelaena). I think episode 4 and episode 7 were the only real plot moving episodes this season and no wonder they were the most liked, the pacing of the show was severely hampered and we now know why. The writing of the the season was finished in march 2023, and in april they were told that 2 episode were being cut by HBO (this is well into preproduction). in May the writers strike started which meant the scripts couldnt be revised throughout the entirety of principle photography and the Battle of the Gullet had to be moved to Season 3, you could tell they they definetly wanted to do the Battle of the gullet this season in episode 9- 10 but the budget was cut as was the episode count. I admit that a lot of choice outside of those were bad, but i genuinely feel like it also had an equal amount of good moments and decisions that could have evened out the quality of the season especially when it comes to reqrites. You can feel a lot of repetitive scenes especially with Rhaenyra and Rhaenys which you could instantly tell were problem because they couldnt do rewrites, they would have been hammered out duing filming by an active writers room during filming. Hopefully season 3 is much better and they go back to the 10 episode count after the backlas they received this season, one of the season had to be the worst one, and ig this is gonna be it. I also am pretty sure that Sunfyre isnt dead, this is a misdirect because killing him would break vital universe cannon which Ryan Condal has promised not to do. Sunfyre has a major role in the story to come. i watched your previous video on HotD and i got the impression that you dont think this show is very good, i respect your thoughts in this video and certainly agree with a lot of them but i still am a huge fan of this show and franchise. Now the three things i think they did very well this season: Aegon: I absolutely loved the characterization of Aegon, and Tom Glynn Carney was the MVP of the season for me. His characterization as Richard II and then his transition to Richard III was dont very well and it is evident to the actor's skill that he genuinely made me feel bad for this guys who is a literal rapist. I think the decision to make him a child slave pit promoting rapist in season 1 was a bad idea because they made him too Joffrey Coded. This season they significantly roll is back and almost try to retcon it like they retconned Rhaenys's massacre and we see this boy whos pushed into power with absolutely no competence and temperment for it and a his innner hole of love from his parents is being filled by the newfound ego he has developed from becoming the king. He is consistently the funniest character in the show and the scene between him and Otto where he explains the Arryk/Erryk twin plan in episode 2 had me CACKLING. His closeness to Larys and the development of their relationship is also an amazing choice and definetly feel like they improved his character from the books just like how they improved Viserys from the books last season by giving him the characteristics of King Aenys Targaryen from fire and blood. I cant wait to see the Richard III arc from him in season 3 and 4. Criston Cole: Dayummmm they actually made me feel for him after his characterization in the previous season. I think i finally understood him this season, hes a Narcissist in denial and now his narcissism has been molded into nihlism by Rooks Rest. Hes a critical view of "The Knight" or atleast this shows attempts at exploring the qualities of a true knight, And he is done pretty well. I actually really enjoyed his character this season. However i think the show "A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms" coming in 2025 set in the ASOIAF universe will do a much deeper and better examination of the "The Knight" because that's the sole focus of the story and the writing is much deeper than Fire and Blood as it is an actual narrative with arcs and storylines, unlike Fire and Blood which is written like a history book with no actual concentration on theme and story pacing. Hugh: They definetly improved Hugh from the books and the choice to make him the son of Saera Targaryen was brilliant as a reader. This is for the book readers only, i understand that, no show only watched will understand the divinely brilliant irony of him claiming Vermithor, but i like the direction they are moving in with him, after his dynamic was set up wth his wife Kat (in tumbleton lmao). Hyped to see how they use him because he has great potential. Third honorable mention: I liked Alyn and his character setup this season and i loved his final monologue with Corlys in the finale, even tho they wasted Corlys this season and left him as a glorified contractor overseeing a single ship being built for 8 episodes straight.
@@TIMMY8959 @HahaDamn TL DR : Writers turned all the female characters into saints and all the male characters into warmongers, Alicent has been completely ruined by the finale as a character she would never have done this in the book, Aemond has been neutered, Jace has been neutered, Daemon has been emasculated into uncoolness, Rhaenys was a mouth piece of the writers, Rhaenyra has been completely whitewashed. good stuff: Aegon was amazing, Criston Cole was an improvement, Hugh was well done, Alyn was well done.
loved the video. and i must say, i TRULY forgot about the prince’s death! it was so glossed over, okay Rheynera yelled at Daemon and he went to harrenhall to cry about it. big whoop. that was the HEIR. REGICIDE. at some point, everyone can’t be “trying to avoid unnecessary conflict” when it comes to the death of the innocent heir child. especially because they ‘cheapened’ the scene with blood/cheese sneaking about the castle and as you said, there was no intrigue. we found out immediately that they found the twins & haelena picked a child. it would’ve been so much more interesting if the episode ended with the men asking for the boy and the next episode we see Rheynera screaming at Daemon for his ill thought plot. okay, rant over. Nonetheless, lovely video with beautiful comparisons and insights.
Theres several folks criticizing season 2 especially Book invested content creators. Peerhaps it's content creators that cover multiple shows at a time saying "still better than anything we've gotten recently".
@SonderDAzeX Or it's content creators who have a vested interest in hyping it up and overlooking all it's faults because lack of enthusiasm in the show threatens their livelihood
Yes, but Alicent has no bond with her sons is the issue, and that's why Aemond acting like this. it's her fault. now this dumb woman let her son die because she didn't have any power in the council? She's the one who put Aegon in this mess. writers trying to make her like the innocent victim. at least in got Cersei to care for her children.
@@binarathanushka Cersei didn’t really care for her children because she was a narcissist! This is highlighted with Tommen’s storyline. She blew up the woman he was in love with and instead of thinking of his feelings, Cersei was busy revelling in her torture of Septa Unella.
"Assuming the audience will care about something in the show universe just because we probably care about it in our universe." That is the main problem I have with writers injecting modern politics/ideology into fantasy dramas. It does not fit!!!
A lot of people think the complains are about the lack of faithfulness to the books so they excuse it with the books not being accurate or exact and this being an adaptation. That's okay But this show, ignoring the books, is just badly written as it is, and inconsistent since season one. There are many shows out there who are more developed, have put more care in the personalities of their characters and follow a structure that makes sense, not breaking the logics of its worldbuilding Even old cheap fantasy cw shows from the 2010s at least knew what the characters they wrote were like and what the rules were and remained consistent with it
Totally agree! I feel like this was a problem for season one as well though -- specifically that we didn't have Daeron or Gwayne. I would have added Daeron as a POV perspective, a bit like how Dany was in GoT season one -- being far away from the other characters yet still tied to the central plot. Yes, Daeron (and Gwayne) don't have much to do in season one in regard to the war, but we still could have seem Daeron when he was a child, and then after the final time skip, see him in Oldtown with Gwayne. Thus, in S2 when Gwayne comes to King's Landing, and Alicent asks about Gwayne, this actually feels more real, as we actually know about Daeron, and his close relationship to his uncle, his only family around him. Near the end of S1, we should have also spent more time with the second generation of Greens/ Blacks to prepare the audience for them taking the reigns more in S2. For instance, we should have spent time with the Aegon, Aemond, Helaena, and Daeron, as well as Jace, Rhaena, Baela and Lucerys. They could have also set up Jaehaerys and Jaehaera more as well, so when, in S2, Blood and Cheese does occur, it is set up prior to the episode I think where Jaehaerys is killed. I also agree with your points about having other characters take the lead when it comes to their POV in season two. The Green kids and Black kids (as mentioned above) should have been given more time this season, as Alicent, Helaena, and Rhaenyra take a backseat to things, the other kids -- Aemond, Aegon, Daeron and Jace, Rhaena and Baela, should have come to the forefront. We could have still also had Daemon's POV, but make it less jarring than immediately switching to his POV. Like, we could slowly have more scenes with him, but it not be as intimate immediately. Kind of like how Jaime was slowly built up and we slowly learned more about his internal struggles, rather than just jumping right into them in Game of Thrones. Likewise, I feel like we should have had more scenes/ more focus on the Dragonseeds, including Adam and/ or Allan. Ik they had a few scenes with them, but idk they all seemed to plot-relevant, like them talking about how they were Corlys' bastards, or working on the boat, and there wasn't enough time to really see what their characters/ personalities were like, and what their life was like. I also think that we should have followed one of the Dragonseeds that ended up dying. An actual true Game of Thrones moment! Imagine following a dragonseed and getting to know them, and seeing how they would be a great/ perfect dragon-rider -- perhaps they're charismatic, determined, smart and brave, etc. and then they end up getting roasted in the sowing. I would argue we should have followed Hugh the Hammer and/ or Ulf, and then followed two other dragonseeds that end up dying. That way, the Sowing would have actually felt dangerous/ scary, and viewers would have been shocked when 2/3 of the dragonseeds we're following die. It could have also developed Ulf's character (say if we only followed Hugh and the two other seeds), as Hugh survived, but now there's this greedy buffoon guy (dinner scene) who somehow managed to claim Silverwing. This would also align me more with Jace's feelings about random peasants getting to ride dragons, bc Ulf DOES seem unworthy of riding Silverwing while the two other worthy dragonseeds we were following died. Then, we could perhaps later have a flashback about how Ulf claimed Silverwing, and see that despite his rough exterior he IS/ WAS worthy of claiming her. Idk I really don't like the scene of Ulf kind of like accidentally claiming Silverwing, like he just comes off as a buffoon in how he accidentally claimed her and to me undercuts the coolness of the dragons. It would have been cooler if he stumbled upon her, but then idk, if he was like good with animals or something, or had a soft side that he showed to animals that he did not show to humans, and kind of sang to her, or did something like this. It could also juxtapose Hugh claiming Vermithor by his bravery -- Ulf instead could have claimed Silverwing by his softness/ openness that he only shows to animals.
This was sooooo good my god . Your terminology and ability to articulate is impressive . Or maybe I should've read more books . Nonetheless u hit it right on the head with this and I love it . I subscribed. Thank you cheers from nyc!
I agree with a lot of what you are saying. Jace was probably the most interesting character on Team Black but we didn’t get to connect with him. Rhaenys death was reduced to spectacle. Daemon was soulless and had no agency this season. Rhaenyra was meandering, banal, and arrogant both in action and in convictions. The connection was severed with these characters and I cannot forgive that from Season 2.
Imagine if Alicent was actually there for the Blood and Cheese scene, and she heard them say 'a son for a son', the entire season she's unsure about who really gave the order, then in the final episode she goes to see Rhaenyra and she hears her say this line, everything clicks for her and she has a change of heart and she tells Rhaenyra everything she said in the actual episode but it's actually a trap.
15:55 Daemon brought up the unclaimed dragons in S1Ep10, hence his visit to Vermithor in that same episode. That being said, it's a testament to the show's stalling for time that that plot was immediately dropped until the back half of S2
Great video!! I had the same feelings through the whole season (and S1 too, tbh...). It's so difficult for me to get engaged in a story where I don't care that much about the characters... nor the relationships between them, which should have been the key to the war. As you said, they communicate what is important for the plot, without narratively building up those moments. There's a lack of anticipation, and a lack of consequences too. It should be the tension before, during and after a scene what makes the viewer connected to what's happening
6:45 U said it perfectly here, there is absolutely no sub text, every conversation is just people speaking bluntly about something that just happened or might happen, and there’s no push and pull between characters nor is there any sub text within the dialogue.. which makes the dialogue scenes boring and excruciatingly bland.. there’s also no set protagonist or antagonist in any given scene or in the overall plot, which makes everything feel inconsequential
Robert's rebellion was like the Mexican revolution where Zapata n Villa overthrew the government...yet once they had the power, they didn't know how to run the nation. They won battles, lost the rule
I just watched that scene where Sir Gwayne(?) scolds Cole for sleeping with his sister 10 minutes ago, and I was like what the heck is going on? It was so random at first I thought he was joking or I’d accidentally skipped a scene
What's truly such a shame is that the actors and the people who work on special effects, sound design, set creation, etc are very talented individuals. It feels like it'll all be wasted if the show continues down this route but hopefully the 3rd season is better. It could very well be wishful thinking on my end. Hopefully not. 🤞 Though, I will forever feel like one of the down sides to this show (and alot of shows, actually) is the amount of episodes each season. Stories as deep, detailed and intricate as the books aren't suited for 10 or less episodes a season. The characters, world building and lore have too much depth to be boiled down to 8 or 10 episodes. The time jumps are a prime example of this. The jumps were bad because of the episode count. Another fault of the show is the changes. The changes were small and weren't bad at first but overtime the changes became way too much. Like I didn't mind Rhaenyra and Alicent being friends because it would hit harder when they became enemies but that never happened. Alicent had moments when she could've transitioned into her book counterpart and never did. I have never read the books but have been informed of the differences and I am so disappointed. Book Alicent seemed like a fun, easy character to hate. She was powerful. She was cunning. She was loyal to her family. She was a villainess. Which makes it such a bummer that they didn't go this route with her character. I am not sure why the writers are afraid to make a woman morally grey or evil. This is coming from a woman before anyone starts. I mean come on. let's be realistic. There is bad, evil, cruel, and/or awful women in real life. Like I love epic and powerful female characters but that doesn't mean that they can't be morally grey or evil. I wish Alicent treated Rhaenyra like her book counterpart. It would make the dynamic between the sides more interesting. More entertaining. More enjoyable. Like when Book Rhaenyra talks about the death of her sons to Book Alicent. Book Alicent response was crazy epic, telling Book Rhaenyra that the blood spilt was B*stard blood. A proper villain. A shame people won't get to see this version of Alicent in the live action. Alicent isn't the only example of an unfortunate case of a character not being like their counterpart. Before anyone starts with the "history book" excuses, just know it doesn't make any sense in the first place. So, don't even waste time typing it. The show isn't even properly following ages, appearances, events or characters. So, why should we still use the "It's a history book" and "The history books are pro-green and have unreliable narrators" excuses. At first, I agreed with these claims but I don't anymore because it doesn't make sense. It would make more sense to say "Just separate the books from the show." Since they're clearly doing their own thing with the show. Another problem with the show is how the show is written in comparison to the marketing. The writing and the marketing are contradicting each other. HBO is marketing the show as "pick a side", which was cool. It made the show more interesting because of it. The idea of choosing a side. Like a "Pick your poison" or "Pick the lesser evil" because each side has their faults but the writing in the show has clearly chosen a side. Instead of showcasing a story of two sides, it's become a story about a "Good" and "Bad" side. Which sucks because almost every character in the story is supposed to be complex, multifaceted, and/or moral grey. Like Daemon. Speaking of which, he's another case of not being like his counterpart. He's supposed to be morally grey. Which is a character who isn't good but isn't bad, they're in-between. They make choices that can be bad but also decisions that can be good. We don't get to see Daemon's good side much in the show. For example, his love for his daughters. Which is a shame. That's such an easy way to showcase the more good sides to him but the show doesn't do it. Instead, they give his girls "daddy issues" when not everyone in the show needs it. There's already enough daddy issues on the show. Like seriously what's with every show and daddy issues. I love an adorable father and daughter dynamic. I wish the show would just let us have it. Though, I could go on and on about the faults of the show. So, I'll stop here. 😂
Meh, I liked the moment with Daemon, but it was still underwhelming. Introducing his vision took away all the potential angst leading up to this moment. My issue with daemon's arc is he didn't do anything of his own accord. There was no introspective realization about his behavior(other than being regretful for not being there for viserys, but he can't rectify that directly, because his brother's dead.) THAT alone could have been enough of an impetus for him to bend the knee to rhaenyr, his only way he can see to apologize to his brother and be there for him the only way he now can, by being there for his chosen heir. Even him rectifying the issue with the riverlords is not of his own doing, little oscar tully politically maneuvered him into doing it. Honestly, id rather have seen daemon reluctantly bend the knee explaining that he's not sure if his niece is the right answer, but that he has decided, he will honor his brother's wishes.
I think it wouldve been cool if during the "Blood and Cheese" episode they started by going through the life of Halaena Targaryan. Like what she does and her duties as queen, and then towards the end out of nowhere Blood and CHeese just show up, say their iconic lines, and follow exactly what the history books said happens. It also be nice to see the Maesters who are recording the histories so we can see their perspectives. Why they wrote the histories the way they did. That would've been cool IMO
I could go on and on about blood and cheese, but you made plenty of quality points about it. You know how forgotten it was by the characters and moreso the writers? In the finale, when rhaenyra proposes to alicent that she betray aegon and leave him for dead, she says "a son for a son." i almost fell out of my chair when I heard that. I mean what the HELL was jaeharys' death then?
Well, series 2 often felt like we're not watching the story unfold, but solving a puzzle, while ever so often being treated with a corner piece or a large, can't miss where it goes, one. Furthermore, when important information needs to be conveyed, the writers take some strange "show, don't tell" approach - showing stuff that tell very little or nothing, or alternatively, when some mystery is required (like with Aemond and Helena), then they plainly blurt out how will arc of the character end. Or, we get a warning that something might happen, and then that thing happens a bit later. It's all over the place. In one of the interviews I watched (or read) about a year ago, either Ryan Condal or GRRM himself said that they wanted to keep some ambiguity about some events that happen, and inspire discussion among viewers about who's in the right as well as show that history books are unreliable as to what really happened (due to writer's biases, sources going missing, we can't be sure what the "players" were thinking...), so they wanted to show the difference between history as recorded vs. real history (in imaginary world) well, they failed at those task. Most of discussions revolved about WTF just happened, and as for history books, or history as it is taught: a) we already know that, b) they only added another unreliable account, c) maesters are really bad historians (GRRM is a history buff, not a historian; he doesn't seem to understand how history is researched and written).
The "Famine" in Kings Landing was pure Comedy, the small Folk became agitated becouse they didnt received enough Meat ;D LOL thats the Medieval equivalent of First World Problems
This was such a great video! After watching the season I just didnt' felt satisfied but couldn't really pinpoint why...You really explained it in the best way possible and with such ease, especially through the comparison scenes. I don't know if you like to write, but I think you would be great as a writer!!
They are just trying to make the show drag on for 10 seasons instead of just make the best show possible , at this rate we will all be dead by the time the show finishes
The choice to give dragons to unknown people, to small folk is a huge thing. I agree that it could have happened sooner, but I like that it feels so big, because it is. It questions Targaryen exceptionalism, it questions the order of things in terms of the general make up of the society. Small folk now wield more power than ever before. I agree though that this was simply not enough of a payoff in the grand scheme of the overall arch of the season.
I need to thank you for respecting my time as an audience member and delivering a well thought-out, well edited, well narrated video. You're an overachiever in a sea of GOT youtubers who just enjoy listening to the sound of their own voices and it's extremely refreshing. The work you put in is NOT going unnoticed
I blame letting Miguel Sapochnik go as being the #1 contributing factor for this underwhelming season. The choices made throughout this season were terrible.
yall give that man too much credit, him and his wife are the ones who came up with alicent being aged down to be rhae’s bff and all his episodes are dark as shit
Can anyone talk about the lighting choice for HOD? Seems that sunny days, rainy days or any kind of weather scenario is completely left out. Casterly Rock, the Eyrie it's all Winterfell looklike all grey and boring!
It sure is suspicious how all the Maester Propoganda that is corrected is always in Rhaneras favor. Whew I was almost worried that she would be flawed in some way. Also isn’t her character supposed to be portly? Isn’t it wrong to take away the size a character who could do wonders for fat acceptance?
This. I would be completely fine with them "setting the record straight" and revealing errors the Maesters made... If it wasn't ONLY to make Rhaenyra/Team Black look better and make Team Green look worse. Any positive Team Green had in the books and anything bad Team Black did is labelled "Green Propaganda" rather than letting the characters be nuanced and realistic people who are privileged, make bad decisions, and struggle with the hand they've been given. It's such poor writing compared to the book where both sides did good and bad things. The show TELLS you to like Rhaenyra and hate the Greens, rather than letting you come to your own decision.
@@lilchaos9212 Game of Thrones understood that, I thought the entire premise of GRRMs franchise was based around the idea that black and white doesn’t exist. They have completely lost the plot and the shows identity.
Exactly in the book both mushroom and the master are untrustworthy narrators. There are some things they allege that are true and things that aren't. Aegon may not completely be evil in the book and neither is Rhaenyra, but they both do horrible things. The people writing for this show don't understand the actual theme of the story and that's the problem. They remove so many important details that create holes in the plot or come across as strange.
@@tinaye8638 I think a complaint from GOT they seem to focus on is how Danny turned evil. It’s strange because they try very hard to make Rhanera good because of how Danny ended up, but these are completely different characters and stories, but I can’t shake the feeling they are more focused on making this series a fan-fiction of sorts. It’s sad because they are taking away from the tragedy of the story.
@@GangStalker17 I think they're trying to correct Dany character assassination with Rhaenyra, and that's why they keep on mentioning the prophecy and why we saw Dany at the end of ep8.
Top picks for POV: Kings' Landing: Alicent for the family drama & Ser Criston for the small council, and battles. His emotional journey could have been more impactful this season, and he could have had more scenes with Aegon and Aemond as well, so that we get to know their characters better. I may also add Larys, if we want to stick to the plotline of him getting Aegon out of KL. He took a weird backseat this season, I wanted to be reminded of his scheming and creeping more often in the beginning too. I would have had Helena as an observer throughout the season and once Alicent leaves King's Landing for her year of rest & relaxation, have her step in and carry the story through, through the end of her arc, so we can follow her state of mind from her own perspective, making it much more tragic. Dragonstone: Rhaenys & Rhaenyra Wall & then after the sewing, Dragonstone: Jace Riverlands: Daemon? I am thinking maybe it is better to view him from the outside, perhaps I would have had Harrenhall advisor guy (someone remind me of the name) be our POV. Could have sensed how he is feeling about Alys, clocked her as a threat though his fear, not just through her brewing creepy potions and standing weirdly off-frame. Could have had Daemon going less visibly crazy, with the audience still sensing something is off, establishing him as a loose cannon, and wondering what's going on in his mind. This is exactly what Rhaenyra is wondering, so it may have also strengthened the viewer's connection to her, rooting for Daemon to stick to her. And yes, I would have cut the visions and dreams, and focused more on what Daemon's politics say about him as a person. Vale: Rhaena, like you recommended, with more focus on her princess & the dragon storyline - either establishing the bond between her and Sheepstealer, or highlighting her desperation more, and killing her off at the end of the season in her confrontation with Sheepstealer as a schocking reminder of how young Targaryens are pushed to claim these beasts, serving as an opposite outcome to Aemond's success last season. On the other hand, this could have been interpreted as a reversal to the dragonseed debate: how Targaryens feel entitled to these dragons, often overestimating their own blood. Nettles could have came in with the line before Rhaena dies or gets seriously injured about how the only way to tame a wild beast without fancy Targaryen dragon pit masters is to earn their trust. Addam & Alyn would have been great POV characters for: Introducing the other dragonseeds who got a dragon after the sewing & the blockade, and the whole Velarion storyline. We have seen remarkably little of Corlys this season, and if we've had someone he strategized with consistently, that would have given us more insight into who he is as a character. I would have loved for Alyn and him to have a stronger professional relationship. Alyn could have still born the huge grudge against him, but let's say he just really. loves. sailing. and therefore is not hesitant to accept promotions, and is actually enthusiastic about military strategy. His passion for this could have overridden his hate for his father, and lead to him agreeing to work with him still. I don't specifically hate having scenes with all dragonseeds previously, we could have still gotten Hugh on the audience with Aegon and see Ulf in brothel scenes, for example, but as more of an easter egg of what to come, in a scene from another characters POV, not focused on the dragonseeds specifically. It would have added to the mystery of who they were, for after they got their dragons. Overall, what I'm missing in HoTD from thrones is the how long dialogues, often about strategising or the world of Westeros, revealed character's personalities and stories. There was always a link between personal and political that made the show come off as both touching and intellectually engaging. I would love to see more of this on HoTD.
Sara Hess actually compared Rhaenys to Hilary Clinton and Viserys to Donald Trump. That tells you she's injecting modern politics to this series. She's incapable of portraying female characters doing anything remotely evil - but ended up character assassinating the female characters.
Great video! I really hope you do another one on this season going more in depth on the character arcs. What you liked and didn’t like and what you thought worked and didn’t work. It sounds like you’re pretty knowledgeable about the process of writing and it’s hard for me to articulate why exactly this season as a whole didn’t work for me and why I found it disappointing since I’m not a writer. So yeah, if you’re willing to do an even deeper dive into the season I’d love that.
When I was watching the Blood & Cheese scenes I did think to myself "This would've been better if it was seen strictly from Haelenas perspective." I would imagine that if we have had the closing scene on Alicent or Haelena, probably Alicent since she had a narrative throughline in the episode, it wouldn't be "out of place" since Haelena isn't a pov character. It could pick up at maybe a post coitus argument between Cole and Alicent that has her leave in a huff. Maybe to grab some air or to visit her daughter - the point being that as she is walking through the castle corridors we the audience hear voices of two men bickering and whispering. When it becomes clear enough for Alicent we would like to invoke the feeling of her being watched. She is fearful that someone may discover her affair with the kingsguard, and we see that fear amount until she reaches Haelenas room where she hears the two men's voices demanding her to choose between her kids. We hear a stab. We see Alicent paralyzed by fear. We see Blood & Cheese leave the room, blood dripping from their hands. Maybe they even spot Alicent but walk past her as guards may be converging on the scene. We see Haelena leave the room holding her daughter. Camera pans up to her as Alicent triest to ask her what happened. Haelena says the line "They killed the boy." and we black out to credits. Here's what I think and why I wrote it like this: By limiting the POV and what the audience hears we create more suspense. We have seen Daemons plans made earlier in the episode. But we are not privy to seeing the assassination carried out. We get less objective facts about what actually happened. We ground it in the experience of a main character who also don't have the full story, which creates a bias. We make Blood & Cheese a hundred times scarier as they become less of a Odd Couple comedy routine and more like ghosts haunting the castle. A horror and tragedy that cannot be stopped. We could even have Alicent see them come out of Aemond's room and follow them at a distance, and we get snippets of their dialogue saying "What do we do now?" She may follow them to Haelenas room, and by that it may add more guilt to her - why didn't she scream for the guards when she had the chance? I thought that by basing the whole scene and events in two throwaway characters we get to know more when we should know less. Because neither of the POV camps. The Greens and The Blacks know the full story themselves. That's what happens when you hire unreliable agents to carry out an assassination. The one who knows the most is the victims mother. Haelena. Who is "addled" as the show might put it. At least that's close to what I think should've been. Maybe more skillful writers could make it work. Horror and Suspense comes from the whole audience knowing more than the characters. And this if any event in the series should have been treated as a horror scene.
I agree with some of your observations but respectfully disagree with many of your conclusions and reactions. For one, I disagree that "Bread & Cheese was swiftly forgotten." It gets referenced or revisited in multiple episodes! (Riverlanders not wanting to ally with Daemon, Helena's reactions, Deamon's dream...). If it was in the show even more, I bet everyone would complain about it being repetitive.
A lot of remarks in this video (and viewers' in the comments) are about wanting to feel more emotional resonance with the story and characters: you're just not "feeling" it; "it didn't register." I don't mean this to sound mean or simplistic, but I think that's as much a "you" problem as it might be about different storytelling choices. For example, you don't feel an emotional resonance with the burning of Sharp Point? Well...so what if we aren't intimate with the town? It's a town! He burned a whole town and we hear the people screaming! You don't really need any more information or worldbuildng than that to understand that all season long, multiple characters have been itching in their own ways to "do something," and here, Aemond has finally started to act alone on his desires. Yeah, I think that has major frightening repurcussions. (And since Aemond has not gone off on his own and burned an entire town before, I don't think it's "on brand.")
Finally, Re: Cole, we watched him get PTSD after Rook's Rest -- so it is a very organic character shift to me. And as far as not seeing him use his sword "in years," as one example, we just saw him mete out his justice by beheading Lord Darklyn. (p.s. I haven't read the book and am not judging the show against the book.)
I wanted to see so much more from our characters. I would have loved to see Jace in winterfell, learning more about Rhaena and Baeyla. I hated that every episode felt like a repeat of itself where the same things happens, the same dialogue is repeated, and when Rhaenys died I didn’t feel a damn thing bc I was so pissed off on why she would go back when she could have fled. I also HATE that they refuse to make Alicent or Rhaenyra have any agency to go full mad queens and make morally questionable decisions in a fit of rage; while still having them be sympathetic. I think how bad Cersei was but how I still loved her bc I understood her reasoning always.
I'm imagining a version of this show where they play on the idea of "authentic historical accounts" by interrogating how much one person can know another. I'm fine with the idea of a show that focuses on Allicent and Rhaenyra, but imagine if we saw their interior lives and we weren't so familiar with the people around them. My guess is that we'd feel the suffocation they feel as women, rulers, mothers etc. far more than we do as it is.
Tyrion's dialogue . . . that is what separates GOT from HOTD more than anything through the first season for me. At any moment in GOT, if one of the plot lines was even slightly ho-hum or even boring, a cut to a Tyrion scene lifted all the boats. There is simply no equivalent mechanism in this prequel. It is still highly entertaining and I believe payoffs are coming, but that just is what it is.
This was an amazing video, I was literally taking notes for my own writing. Now I'm off to watch all your other videos. Well done, great work!! Please keep em coming.
Wonder why Blood and Cheese didnt get Aemond. They were at his room and could just waited for him. And then have a better escape plan knowing the secret ways in the walls, getting to a boat for example.
Completely agree with everything you said. I think the character that they should've focused on was Aegon. S1 showed us Viserys's story from being a happy king to an old broken man that just wanted his family to get along. At the end of S1, Aegon didn't want to be king. We see him actually try to help his subjects but not understand diplomacy. We also see him genuinely take an interest in training his heir. But not enough time is given show his grief over losing his son or dragon. He's son was murdered, his brother tried to murder him, his half sister wants him dead, his mother doesn't care if he lives or dies, his dragon is dead, and everyone on council is manipulating him. The audience should feel bad for him as we did for Theon, but we don't. GoT (S1-S6) almost always made me cry or cheer. The only times HotD make me feel anything was the scene of Viserys walking to the throne in S1 and when Jace broke down to Rhaenyra when he returned.
Just loved how this finale ended on a weak cliffhanger, showing everyone getting ready for battle, even though, a couple of scenes before, they showed that the entire team green, except for Aemond, already peaced out. If this doesn't get you hyped, I don't know what else does.
I would really like to see more of your analysis videos. If possible you should check out AMC's interview with the vampire would love to hear your thoughts (especially since Jacob Anderson stars in it!!)
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Well said I agree 100% with everything you said especially the part with we need to know we see it then we forget it. They purely thought spending money on CGI dragons would be enough to keep an audience attention, like after season 8 GOT I never wanted to hear Dan and Dave again but after first episode season 2 HOTD I was like where is Dan and Dave when you need them.
The main thing I’m noticing in GOT vs HOTD is the change in world sizes. GOT took place on a giant map, had a ton of characters, and we still got to know everyone. HOTD takes place in a micro bubble in comparison, with way LESS characters, and they’re building 2D characters in small scope. Your characters need to be BIGGER in HOTD to make up for the smaller scope and cast.
Good point. Also my friend wants more bodies and consequential deaths. But the cast is so small they don't have the same luxury as game of thrones did really. Good point on how small the world seems this go around.. side note what kills me (idk if this happens in the books) but Rhaenerya an others sneaking in and out of kings landing was pushing my suspension of disbelief as well as alicent somehow wearing a hood and getting to Rhaenerya 😂 like damn.
The book mentions a lot of characters though. So many! It's a very huge cast if they wanted to do the story justice.
And a very big ensemble
There is no team green for pro blacks to hate anymore.
They literally disbanded.
Otto is in jail,criston wants to die helena alicent and jaheara defected,aegon ran away .
Now it's house good guys vs team pyscho aemond
100%
@@Δ-Δ-Δ-Δ 👍🏼
Daemon literally murdered a baby and you think he is a good guy .Really ?
@@spiekd Daemon is now completely subsumed by rhneyra thanks to ghost vision therapy
Because of what they did to Rhaenyra and Daemon (from badass to weak and depressed, from charismatic to annoying, inspiring no loyalty) I started to root for Aegon and Larys 😅
'Anytime characters acknowledge they're in a story, it's a sign of a desperate writers' room'.
Counterpoint - Black Sails
blood and cheese not adding the choosing of a son and cheese's line 'y'hear that boy ya momma wants u dead' is just the most mind boggling decision to me. it goes from a scene you'd be telling people about forever to something new viewers probably forgot about by the end of the season. unforgivable
Bro do not understand what you are allowed to do with child actors especially that age tf wrong with you sicko
I feel like the fandom oversold the importance of this scene overall.
"new viewers probably forgot about by the end of the season"
Except that scene makes perfect sense given Helaena's character in the show.
In the book she's just not the same, and the whole dragon dream aspect is pretty darn interesting, especially in that context.
@@DuggyDarko In the book that event is the absolute point of no return. Lucerys' death and Jaehaerys' death ensured the Dance would be a fight to the death for all parties.
Came for the channel name, enjoyed the video. Thank you!
I’m convinced Hollywood can’t make a decent show anymore to save their lives. Shows will start out great, some even amazing and then slowly lose quality before eventually becoming a hot mess or a disappointment. I don’t know what’s going on with the execs and in the writers’ rooms but this getting ridiculous
You could point to one problem or you could point out all of them and you would be correct. Nepotism, Favoritism, Self-Censorship, writing on a pipeline, writing in a group committee , a Parasocial relationship with their audience, etc. Me personally? I have often long felt that a lot of these writers lack life experience. Not that they are too young or not old enough, but that they at some point in their life stopped developing as a person. This is a problem because they lack self awareness, restraint, maturity, and the inability to see from others perspectives.
This why, in my mind, you get all this bland, milquetoast entertainment that borders on non offensive, trying to entertain everyone but no one at the same time, whatever thematic meaning or purpose to their chosen genre is erased, and reduced to a more palatable, “sellable” product.
Sorry for the rant but I write so this gets to me on a personal level.
TLDR: Never stop growing as a person or you will make bad entertainment
Edit: Don’t get it twisted yo, I’m ok with inclusion and am generally quite socially liberal, but I am against shitty writing and I am a writer. You want to write something? Fantastic. Write it and I will check it out. Don’t take another’s work and warp it to fit your desires. I am looking at you in particular Sarah Hess.
@@deathwishtommy9773hit the nail on the head!
DEI happened
@@deathwishtommy9773 wish I could pin this comment.
@@deathwishtommy9773 yes because hey're mainly nop kids who don't have life experience lol. well, outside of being rich that is lol
Blood & Cheese scene was a major letdown. I didn't read the books before, but I knew what was all that about. The show played such a wathered down version of it, and then showed so little impact of the aftermath... that I was amazed of how bad the writters adapted the source material. Even taking some liberties with the way you tell the story, how can you screw things up so badly to a point where a MAJOR event in the books now seems to be just an anecdote?
When I read that in Fire and Blood, it was absolutely distressing. It showed the stakes were set on fricking Mars for this war. No one was safe.
In the show, it mattered for like 1 episode and then everyone forgot about it.
I dreaded the blood and cheese scene for a long time, because it is so pure evil in the book, but after seeing it on screen, I just felt nothing.
I read the book as soon as it came out, so I don't remember much. But i remembered that scene for its horror, and I was thrilled. Just for it to fall so flat in the show.......
So desensitised honestly. You are complaining about not getting off on watching a child die…
@@zara-zq1oi Have you even seen the series?
A child still died, you numb nuts.
@@zara-zq1oiit’s not about getting off it’s about having an emotional moment which we didn’t get cause we don’t know the kid.
Im gonna say it, they were too enamoured with the idea of highlighting the unfairness of being a woman on that world (and this) and took power out of Alicent and Rhaenyra to make them look innocent but ultimately made them boring, they had already made their point in the first season that they were treated unfairly and were pushed to their positions by the patriarchy, but it makes no sense for these two to be stopping war and meeting each other after all that transpired. It just makes them seem less like characters with a mind of their own and more like puppets
When Alicent‘s brother shouts at Cole, I was certain I somehow missed a scene by falling asleep the other day.
I do get fed up with RUclipsrs constantly comparing Game of Thrones to House of Dragons. I for one would like to forget about GOT and the debacle of an ending.
"Yeah, remember Game of Thrones? Remember when every scene accomplished more than one thing, when characters spoke with wit and nuance, when you were filled with equal parts dread and excitement? What was that all about?"
I remember, it crashed and burned harder than Rhaenys & Meleys , Aegon & Sunfire together at Rooks rest.
TBH here, i did not read the books. But this was still ten times better then GoT season 8.
We ourselves put the bar on our expectations way too high. And then complain to the show runners that it was nothing like we imaged.
If you want the story to fit perfectly to the book, then go read the book.
If you do not like surprises, then go read the book.
If you dislike the show that bad, then why keep watching? And well, you guessed it, just pick up the book and read that. 🤷♀
If you did that too many times and want something else? than do not complain that the showrunners want to keep some surprises up their sleeves.
I see it like this, This season should have had 10 eps instead of the 8 we got. Ep 8 didn't feel like a season finale because we are short of two eps.
I would advise to binge watch the whole second season. And then give an overall fair assessment over the complete season.
I think ppl are way too negative about this due to the last episode we saw.... Like the rest of the season doesn't exist?!
Martin and the test audiences already cleared that episodes 2&4 would slay it. And it did! that whole dialogue between Aegon and Otto While Cole just stands there completely lost in episode 2 was legendary.
Otto: "You wouldn't dare". Aegon: " Heh, But i have dared... and i find it stimulating.
IMO you guys are all in despared need of an A.A. (attitude Adjustment).
*Edit
Book fans: "You wouldn't dare to mess with the source material".
Sarah Hess: "Heh, But i have dared...And i find it stimulating.
(:
This show constantly threatens to become interesting and then never actually pulls through on it. Everything is so grey and lifeless, every character feels weirdly whitewashed and crispy clean while I keep being told how morally ambiguous and brutal the world is supposed to be, the result is you get either utter caricatures of insufferable assholes like Criston Cole or characters that can never do anything compelling, unexpected or debatable without the show going out of its way to dumb it down and/or half hassedly justify it, like with Alicent. There is no Sandor Clegane here, no Syrio Forell, no Bobby Baratheon, none of the colorful personalities that existed in got to give a bit of texture and variety to the world. The best way to put it is that it seems like the characters have no internal life. They will only ever do exactly what you expect them to in order to achieve a plot outcome, they will always explain their motivations out loud, they will never have conflict between them that goes beyond what is the most superficial version of it on paper. Everything is dramatized in the most transparent and simplistic way one can think of with the material at hand. The only possible exceptions to this are Daemon and Aemond because you feel like they have things going on in their head beyond what the writers make come out of their mouth, they are actually fun to watch, but everyone around them is just so dull. Imagine a character like Jaime written into this show, they'd never be able to manage him, because they'd never be able to handle the amount of layers there are to his personality and demeanor. They can only go "over the top bastard that only talks to be an over the top bastard" or "misunderstood victim of circumstances that only talks to explain how misunderstood he is", while he's really neither of these things, but a bit of both.
Wanna watch a show about a family tragedy that merges interpersonal conflicts with the mechanisms and dynamics of power? Watch Succession instead. Logan Roy talking in a board meeting in that show is more frightening than all of the dragons HBO money can buy, and there is more meaningful and layered conflict developing in throaway lines and literal jokes in that show than in all of HOTD's lofty ass, bland monologues
The first thing I thought of when reading your comment was the scene in season 1, episode 7, where they pretend for a minute that Rhaenyra arranges the death of Laenor.
They go out of their way to show why it would make sense for Rhaenyra to order it, how it strengthens her politically to ally with Daemon, and how she is becoming a darker figure to try to deal with her increasingly desperate situation.
A fantastic scene, great character development for her, and challenging the audience to reassess her character and their own assumptions about her. All in all, excellent writing.
And then they completely annihilate all of that in a few seconds, by having Laenor row away with his lover. It's almost as if the writers were just mocking us there: "you see how absolutely awesome this scene could have been? Well, too bad, because this is the Rhaenyra show and she's the good guy, so we're chickening out and making it lame instead."
@@frankvandorp9732 I don't like to be that guy because my only concern is the quality of the work they put out, but did you really expect THESE writers to kill off the gay guy? It's 2024, you can't just treat characters as if they were people
Succession is GREAT.
Every scene, every conversation in that show had me screaming because of the drama, the conflict, the themes.
It's people talking to each other in very boring-looking hotels and yet, it's far more exciting than anything HOT D has managed to pull off in season 2.
@@marcogianesello6083 They killed off another gay guy in episode 5, so to be fair it wouldn't even be the first time they did it.
@@frankvandorp9732allying with daemon was a smart military choice because they have dragons it was not a smart politically choice because everyone hates daemon
Excellent video. Excellent. I haven't been this impressed by a critique in quite a while.
Woow, the best analysis I've ever seen. Real in-depth discussion on screen writing.
Also I feel like them making Aemond burn Aegon has ruined him burning Sharp Point as a shocking moment to us. We expect the worst of Aemond now, so it wasn’t even that surprising
The fact that they didn't even show Aemond burning Sharp Point ruined him burning Sharp Point.
Also it makes zero sense for his character to do that, I view it as horrendous character assassination.
@@sugarcombfilms3467🤨🤡
I think it would've still been shocking. Him trying to kill Aegon was a surprise but if they had actually shown what he did at sharp point it would've added so much more to him being a villian
I dont think sharp point was meant to be surprising (I mean, I barely knew what happened) I think it was the last straw for the greens to start running away from him
The showrunners (feminist activists) have no clue what they're doing and GRR Martin literally left them with a blueprint. Complete hacks
This was super interesting. You really put well to word things that I could feel but not really explain as to why they were caused.
One thing that really gets me is that they make a huge point that the dragons are more than just big war machines, but the one character we have that refuses to use her dragon as a war machine (Helaena) we never get to see her bond with that dragon and how the bond can be different with peaceful riders. I feel the same about Laena and Vhagar
Also, you cooked with this video. There were so many things that didn't land with me and you annunciated the issues incredibly well!!
Ooh having Helaena withdraw and only ride her dragon would have been cool, if she's only mentally stable when riding. So when Aemond tries to make her ride to war, it has bigger stakes and we understand that she doesn't want to lose her dragon
You literally see Ulf get on the blue queen and take a joy ride around Kings Landing. A dragon that’s never seen battle or war ridden by a man who just wants to drink in the pub with his mates.
Did you even watch the show? We’ve only seen 4 of the dragons used as war machines. The bond of dragon and rider is a major theme, we see how the dragons interact with their riders. We see how their different personalities manifest. We saw the Blue Queen do a fly over of Kings Landing. A Dragon that never saw battle or war. Queen Alyssane never used her for war.
It’s like you only watched one episode and didn’t even look at the screen the rest of the time. Rhaenyra is making a Dragon religion.
I 100% agree. The connection between dragon and rider and the different dragon personalities should have been more fleshed out. That alone would have been a massive improvement
This healed me, thank you
With the knowledge that the writers had to flesh things out in this case, in order to add depth, it becomes less surprising. There have been reports that Hollywood is cutting development times, shrinking writers rooms, not extending contracts to cut corners...so you get different writers between seasons and less care overall. I wish Hollywood would just figure out that cheap AI written entertainment is not the future. Human led, human made shows with the right resources is the future.
Daemon already explained people grieving in different ways in season 1 he already understands that. Rhaenys is just defending ng Rhaenyra instead of being an actual character we can emotionally invest in. Which is why we don’t miss her much at all.
I think what they were able to do with Viserys given the source material is honestly a spit in the face now. They could do it, they were capable of meaningfully adapting and changing things from the “history” book it was based on. But now people wanna say well they had a harder time with that source material then the writers did with GoT when they’ve shown us that shouldn’t matter, they WERE capable.
If I could sit the writers down to watch 1 critique video to understand what they did wrong, I would pick this one. You explained what I couldnt even begin to grasp
I LITERALLY just posted about how if a show has characters talking about “this isn’t how our story is supposed to go” or “this isn’t how our story ends” etc that it’s a sign of severely bad writing 😂🤣 to hear it reaffirmed was music to my ears
All the characters in HOTD aired out their insecurities , traitorous thoughts and capricious actions in public and it had no repercussions
It's clear that HOTD are trying to write a more feminist perspective of the story but in doing that they've actually robbed all the female characters of their autonomy, desires and agency.
1. Alicent Hightower- Is robbed of her thirst for power, her religious devotion, her love for her children and the power that she actually holds in court. She's not a good person in the books but she is a real character, and a very real representation of how internalised misogyny and religious extreminism uphold the patraichy even by the very women who are hurt by it. This would've been interesting to watch, a women with the power to actually sit on the iron throne herself (Alicent is a very active member of the council in the books) fights against the claim of another women. She was also robbed of her grief, because she actually cares about her grandchildren in the books.
2. Rhaenyra Targareyn, was literally robbed of her rage, grief and her agency. She's made to be some docile being who seemingly does nothing to solidify her claim to the throne until it's stolen from her. A change I would've welcomed, would be that she was actually trying for years to solidify her place in her father's council but she was being left out and I would've liked an explanation of why she went to Dragonstone when she knew her throne was in danger. That aside, after ep1 of S2 it's like she never lost a son, her rage is non existent. This is a major problem with a lot of the female characters in the show, I'm so tired of women in shows experiencing life shattering grief and reacting with a single tear down their cheek lol. She literally spent 3 days in labor in the books when she heard what the greens did and then she lost her son. Why on earth would she still seek peace when she lost her throne, 2 children and she didn't even get the privilege to attend her father's funeral. I just think someone who went through that would want they're enemies head. Also I love Emma Darcy's performance as Rhaenyra Targareyn, they really embody the role effectively however book Rhaenyra isn't thin, and it was a missed opportunity to have a lead who isn't thin for once.
3. Heleana. I get that they made her autistic apparently and that she is a dreamer or something of the sort, but the fact that she barely grieves the very traumatic death of her child is ridiculous. It's basically the same complaint I have for Rhaenyra and the lack of rage or real grief being displayed. Also I wouldve liked her to not forgive Alicent because who would lol. It's like she is a walking void that lacks emotion.
4. Baela and Rhaena, I don't have much to say about them.. I would've like to see more of them for sure, also I don't get why they decided to give them daddy issues and make Rhaena miserable when she wasn't in the book.
5. Lastly although she's not in the show, I wouldve liked to see Nettles. I think we lacked a good understanding of the small folks true attitudes towards the Targeryns and the war overall. Nettles would be the perfect addition because she is such an anomaly in the story. This is less to do with women lacking their agency but it follows a pattern I've noticed with this show and their POC characters. They raceswope characters and then take away their interesting stories, they did it with Laena Valyrian, who was a big part of Rhaenyra's life and they gave that story to Alicent instead, they barely emphasis the importance of Corlys Velaryon and then with one of the few actually black characters in the book they just merged her story with another POC when it poses serious issues with the future of the story.
Anyways I'm done ranting🙃
Agreed. It's not a coincidence Sara Hess is an activist Lesbian.
Sara Hess only wrote 2 episodes of this season, can we stop just blaming her? There are several writers in season 2 who dropped the ball.
@@patrycjazak9753 Sara Hess wrote the last episode.
Right. It was a disappointing finale but not the worst episode. The worst episode was 6 “smallfolk” in which all the plot lines seem to go nowhere. Sara Hess is not to blame for all the bad writing. The problem is having individual people write episodes that feel like fanfic and then think that it’s going to make sense as a series. All the writers should be working on each episode together and have a clear vision of what they want out of the season.
@@patrycjazak9753 Sara Hess was the one who wrote the finale which sucked.
7:00 present + past in storytelling
The biggest thing that bothers me with the writing is, not wanting to make Alicent or Rhaenyra look bad, or evil. In the books they are both horrible people, But they dont let any of that show .
Alicent surrendering the City is hilarious and pointless :
>The goldencloaks already obey Daemon
>Yesterday they help 50 dragonseeds to go on boats
> Of course they are gonna surrender to 2 FUCKING DRAGONS ALICENT WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKING DO YOU THINK THEY CAN BATTLE TWO DRAGONS AND THE WHOLE ARMY OF CLOACKS
Even if they were loyal to Aegon for some reason, Helaena would have 0 power.
It's 100% clear she's a puppet, a furniture for the Greens, at least on the show.
Being Queen Consort doesn't automatically grant you super powers, it's also about the connections you create with your underlings or subjects.
For example, how Cersei had to get Littlefinger under her purse to destroy Ned. Or how she had to sleep with the Kettleblacks in the books to gain their arms.
Even Alicent, she has to create alliances with Otto, Larys, Criston, she has to manipulate her sons into doing what she wants, etc.
It's not like the Gold Cloaks would've heeded the advise of the weirdo hermit Queen who never shows herself to the people.
@@Δ-Δ-Δ-Δ yes absolutely in fact would make a little sense if her Brother Gerald (or something like that) was the Lord Commander like the book
But he isnt and would make any change since the same tv show SHOWS how the soldiers are working for Rhaenyra and not 1 guy you can see a lot in the boats scene
That kiss was the worst
"Yeah uhh 🤷🏽 it just happened"
Ok we'll rewrite the script 😭😭
I think the major problem with the writing is the suspiciously weird decision by the authors to turn all the female characters into paragons of peace and the almost comical degree to which it is portrayed that men are hot blooded fools while the women are true champions of peace. The characters of Rhaenyra and Alicent have been drastically altered from the book narrative where they are politically shrewd and ambitious politicians to two helpless damsels who are made to go in the direction of war by the men around them. I straight up laughed at many points in the show when Rhaenys starts a hackneyed monologue about Rhaenyra's virtue of non violence and Alicent acts as the most overpaid exec in the kingdom by only stomping on plans and proposals with a holier than thou look and no plans of her own. Rhaenyra is shown to be turning into a cult leader/ tyrant by the end of the season but its too subtle to the point that i feel many people will miss interpret it and will have problems later with her tyranny, they way they had problems with Danny Breaking bad in GoT season 8. I think Alicent is getting this treatment because the authors genuinely dk what to do with her now because shes not really character in the war at this point in the books. She becomes a secondary character and the focus is shifted onto Jace, Aemond and Aegon.
Jace is confusinfgto me this season because you said it correctly, the authors delivered all the information we need about his stance on bastard riders without making us feel the legitimacy of his arguement ( his words will turn out to be correct in the future storyline with ulf and hugh). But Jace is relegated to the position of secondary character even though in the books at this point he's the main lead of the blacks. I understand they want to focus on Rhaenyra as the protagonist but they are neglecting the blacks as a whole. Im fairly firmly on the Black's side but the greens are just so much more fun to watch and so much more compelling. And you can see the hints of Book Jace because he's shown to be an adept diplomat and a pretty smart politician but its contrasted by his almost childlike regression into the "attention seeking unruly immature prince" in Rhaenyra's presence. He also has good political accumen because he can instantly forsee the political problems on his claim to the throne by getting bastard dragon riders, this is a tyoe of foresight that Viserys and Rhaenyra lack, as they think that the words of the Ruler and sufficient for a clean succession, and they forget the importance of symbolism in this world. Its actually frustraing to see Rhaenyra not understand this after being a victim to this herself, idk how they will play this in the future or it might be a forgotten plot like most of the deeper plots the writers have. The blacks would be better rulers but dayum the greens make for better entertainment. Aemond feels like hes getting the Daemon treatment. In season 1 Aemond had some of the best aura ive seen in GoT characters and thats because outside of the taming of vhagar, we view him throught the lens of Lucerys which makes him much scarier and impactful. This season almost no one takes him seriously or respects his power which makes him feel like a hollow villain. Daemon has the same problem, last season the rogue prince when viewed from Rhaenyra's perspective felt very intimidating, this season i felt like the writers were intentionally taking revenge on Daemon by just servicing him with the worst plotline of the season and sucking all the impact of his character. They also seem to be selectively whitewashing a lot of characters, and pinning the sins onto specific characters. All of the Black's warcrimes are pinned onto Daemon and Rhaenyra is left scot free, even the red sowing is made to make her look like shes the good guy for killing all those bastards, Rhaenys's massacre of the dragon pit is straight up retconned out of the show, All the green's war crimes are put on Aemond for the benefit of Alicent, and whats funny is that they actually acknowledge this in the writing. Alicent says that Aemond is angry in episode and thats why he killed luke and she decides hes a monster right then and there, and Aemond confides in Criston Cole that Alicent is a weak hypocrit who commits treason against Rhaenyra and then dumps all the dirty work onto Aemond. Alicent is a frsutrating character to me becaue she is written in a very interesting way but it is completely unintentional. The writers genuinely want her to be the good guy on team green but they just make her look like a hypocrit. The choice to make her betray her children for her childhood friend turned enemy was blatant character assasination for me tho. Alicent's character has been irreversible damaged and i think they should just stop trying to fix it and move away to other characters on team green as the main POV. Hopefully Daeron should revive some team green fandom, because at this point half of team green has mutinied to team black (alicent and haelaena).
I think episode 4 and episode 7 were the only real plot moving episodes this season and no wonder they were the most liked, the pacing of the show was severely hampered and we now know why. The writing of the the season was finished in march 2023, and in april they were told that 2 episode were being cut by HBO (this is well into preproduction). in May the writers strike started which meant the scripts couldnt be revised throughout the entirety of principle photography and the Battle of the Gullet had to be moved to Season 3, you could tell they they definetly wanted to do the Battle of the gullet this season in episode 9- 10 but the budget was cut as was the episode count. I admit that a lot of choice outside of those were bad, but i genuinely feel like it also had an equal amount of good moments and decisions that could have evened out the quality of the season especially when it comes to reqrites. You can feel a lot of repetitive scenes especially with Rhaenyra and Rhaenys which you could instantly tell were problem because they couldnt do rewrites, they would have been hammered out duing filming by an active writers room during filming. Hopefully season 3 is much better and they go back to the 10 episode count after the backlas they received this season, one of the season had to be the worst one, and ig this is gonna be it. I also am pretty sure that Sunfyre isnt dead, this is a misdirect because killing him would break vital universe cannon which Ryan Condal has promised not to do. Sunfyre has a major role in the story to come.
i watched your previous video on HotD and i got the impression that you dont think this show is very good, i respect your thoughts in this video and certainly agree with a lot of them but i still am a huge fan of this show and franchise.
Now the three things i think they did very well this season:
Aegon: I absolutely loved the characterization of Aegon, and Tom Glynn Carney was the MVP of the season for me. His characterization as Richard II and then his transition to Richard III was dont very well and it is evident to the actor's skill that he genuinely made me feel bad for this guys who is a literal rapist. I think the decision to make him a child slave pit promoting rapist in season 1 was a bad idea because they made him too Joffrey Coded. This season they significantly roll is back and almost try to retcon it like they retconned Rhaenys's massacre and we see this boy whos pushed into power with absolutely no competence and temperment for it and a his innner hole of love from his parents is being filled by the newfound ego he has developed from becoming the king. He is consistently the funniest character in the show and the scene between him and Otto where he explains the Arryk/Erryk twin plan in episode 2 had me CACKLING. His closeness to Larys and the development of their relationship is also an amazing choice and definetly feel like they improved his character from the books just like how they improved Viserys from the books last season by giving him the characteristics of King Aenys Targaryen from fire and blood. I cant wait to see the Richard III arc from him in season 3 and 4.
Criston Cole: Dayummmm they actually made me feel for him after his characterization in the previous season. I think i finally understood him this season, hes a Narcissist in denial and now his narcissism has been molded into nihlism by Rooks Rest. Hes a critical view of "The Knight" or atleast this shows attempts at exploring the qualities of a true knight, And he is done pretty well. I actually really enjoyed his character this season. However i think the show "A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms" coming in 2025 set in the ASOIAF universe will do a much deeper and better examination of the "The Knight" because that's the sole focus of the story and the writing is much deeper than Fire and Blood as it is an actual narrative with arcs and storylines, unlike Fire and Blood which is written like a history book with no actual concentration on theme and story pacing.
Hugh: They definetly improved Hugh from the books and the choice to make him the son of Saera Targaryen was brilliant as a reader. This is for the book readers only, i understand that, no show only watched will understand the divinely brilliant irony of him claiming Vermithor, but i like the direction they are moving in with him, after his dynamic was set up wth his wife Kat (in tumbleton lmao). Hyped to see how they use him because he has great potential.
Third honorable mention: I liked Alyn and his character setup this season and i loved his final monologue with Corlys in the finale, even tho they wasted Corlys this season and left him as a glorified contractor overseeing a single ship being built for 8 episodes straight.
Tl dr
I actually read all of this and enjoyed your take on the series. I share a lot of similar thoughts but I HATE how to spun Alicent's character.
@@HahaDamn Good read tho
Holy, I don’t got time to read this, someone sum up this comment please
@@TIMMY8959 @HahaDamn TL DR : Writers turned all the female characters into saints and all the male characters into warmongers, Alicent has been completely ruined by the finale as a character she would never have done this in the book, Aemond has been neutered, Jace has been neutered, Daemon has been emasculated into uncoolness, Rhaenys was a mouth piece of the writers, Rhaenyra has been completely whitewashed.
good stuff: Aegon was amazing, Criston Cole was an improvement, Hugh was well done, Alyn was well done.
loved the video. and i must say, i TRULY forgot about the prince’s death! it was so glossed over, okay Rheynera yelled at Daemon and he went to harrenhall to cry about it. big whoop. that was the HEIR. REGICIDE. at some point, everyone can’t be “trying to avoid unnecessary conflict” when it comes to the death of the innocent heir child. especially because they ‘cheapened’ the scene with blood/cheese sneaking about the castle and as you said, there was no intrigue. we found out immediately that they found the twins & haelena picked a child. it would’ve been so much more interesting if the episode ended with the men asking for the boy and the next episode we see Rheynera screaming at Daemon for his ill thought plot.
okay, rant over. Nonetheless, lovely video with beautiful comparisons and insights.
Finally someone who isn’t dickriding this show just because it’s “still better than anything we’ve gotten recently”
Theres several folks criticizing season 2 especially Book invested content creators. Peerhaps it's content creators that cover multiple shows at a time saying "still better than anything we've gotten recently".
@SonderDAzeX Or it's content creators who have a vested interest in hyping it up and overlooking all it's faults because lack of enthusiasm in the show threatens their livelihood
Yes, but Alicent has no bond with her sons is the issue, and that's why Aemond acting like this. it's her fault. now this dumb woman let her son die because she didn't have any power in the council? She's the one who put Aegon in this mess. writers trying to make her like the innocent victim. at least in got Cersei to care for her children.
Most of RUclips right now is complaining and borderline whining, wdym
@@binarathanushka
Cersei didn’t really care for her children because she was a narcissist! This is highlighted with Tommen’s storyline. She blew up the woman he was in love with and instead of thinking of his feelings, Cersei was busy revelling in her torture of Septa Unella.
"Assuming the audience will care about something in the show universe just because we probably care about it in our universe."
That is the main problem I have with writers injecting modern politics/ideology into fantasy dramas. It does not fit!!!
A lot of people think the complains are about the lack of faithfulness to the books so they excuse it with the books not being accurate or exact and this being an adaptation.
That's okay
But this show, ignoring the books, is just badly written as it is, and inconsistent since season one. There are many shows out there who are more developed, have put more care in the personalities of their characters and follow a structure that makes sense, not breaking the logics of its worldbuilding
Even old cheap fantasy cw shows from the 2010s at least knew what the characters they wrote were like and what the rules were and remained consistent with it
Maybe they misconstrued "show don't tell". The writers simply showed us everything without leaving any room for subtext.
Totally agree! I feel like this was a problem for season one as well though -- specifically that we didn't have Daeron or Gwayne. I would have added Daeron as a POV perspective, a bit like how Dany was in GoT season one -- being far away from the other characters yet still tied to the central plot. Yes, Daeron (and Gwayne) don't have much to do in season one in regard to the war, but we still could have seem Daeron when he was a child, and then after the final time skip, see him in Oldtown with Gwayne. Thus, in S2 when Gwayne comes to King's Landing, and Alicent asks about Gwayne, this actually feels more real, as we actually know about Daeron, and his close relationship to his uncle, his only family around him. Near the end of S1, we should have also spent more time with the second generation of Greens/ Blacks to prepare the audience for them taking the reigns more in S2. For instance, we should have spent time with the Aegon, Aemond, Helaena, and Daeron, as well as Jace, Rhaena, Baela and Lucerys. They could have also set up Jaehaerys and Jaehaera more as well, so when, in S2, Blood and Cheese does occur, it is set up prior to the episode I think where Jaehaerys is killed.
I also agree with your points about having other characters take the lead when it comes to their POV in season two. The Green kids and Black kids (as mentioned above) should have been given more time this season, as Alicent, Helaena, and Rhaenyra take a backseat to things, the other kids -- Aemond, Aegon, Daeron and Jace, Rhaena and Baela, should have come to the forefront. We could have still also had Daemon's POV, but make it less jarring than immediately switching to his POV. Like, we could slowly have more scenes with him, but it not be as intimate immediately. Kind of like how Jaime was slowly built up and we slowly learned more about his internal struggles, rather than just jumping right into them in Game of Thrones.
Likewise, I feel like we should have had more scenes/ more focus on the Dragonseeds, including Adam and/ or Allan. Ik they had a few scenes with them, but idk they all seemed to plot-relevant, like them talking about how they were Corlys' bastards, or working on the boat, and there wasn't enough time to really see what their characters/ personalities were like, and what their life was like. I also think that we should have followed one of the Dragonseeds that ended up dying. An actual true Game of Thrones moment! Imagine following a dragonseed and getting to know them, and seeing how they would be a great/ perfect dragon-rider -- perhaps they're charismatic, determined, smart and brave, etc. and then they end up getting roasted in the sowing. I would argue we should have followed Hugh the Hammer and/ or Ulf, and then followed two other dragonseeds that end up dying. That way, the Sowing would have actually felt dangerous/ scary, and viewers would have been shocked when 2/3 of the dragonseeds we're following die. It could have also developed Ulf's character (say if we only followed Hugh and the two other seeds), as Hugh survived, but now there's this greedy buffoon guy (dinner scene) who somehow managed to claim Silverwing. This would also align me more with Jace's feelings about random peasants getting to ride dragons, bc Ulf DOES seem unworthy of riding Silverwing while the two other worthy dragonseeds we were following died. Then, we could perhaps later have a flashback about how Ulf claimed Silverwing, and see that despite his rough exterior he IS/ WAS worthy of claiming her. Idk I really don't like the scene of Ulf kind of like accidentally claiming Silverwing, like he just comes off as a buffoon in how he accidentally claimed her and to me undercuts the coolness of the dragons. It would have been cooler if he stumbled upon her, but then idk, if he was like good with animals or something, or had a soft side that he showed to animals that he did not show to humans, and kind of sang to her, or did something like this. It could also juxtapose Hugh claiming Vermithor by his bravery -- Ulf instead could have claimed Silverwing by his softness/ openness that he only shows to animals.
This was sooooo good my god . Your terminology and ability to articulate is impressive . Or maybe I should've read more books . Nonetheless u hit it right on the head with this and I love it . I subscribed. Thank you cheers from nyc!
I agree with a lot of what you are saying. Jace was probably the most interesting character on Team Black but we didn’t get to connect with him. Rhaenys death was reduced to spectacle. Daemon was soulless and had no agency this season. Rhaenyra was meandering, banal, and arrogant both in action and in convictions. The connection was severed with these characters and I cannot forgive that from Season 2.
i literally forgot that jace and baela were even betrothed considereing we never actually see them interact as a couple
Imagine if Alicent was actually there for the Blood and Cheese scene, and she heard them say 'a son for a son', the entire season she's unsure about who really gave the order, then in the final episode she goes to see Rhaenyra and she hears her say this line, everything clicks for her and she has a change of heart and she tells Rhaenyra everything she said in the actual episode but it's actually a trap.
Damn. Nice idea. It could have worked
Nah that still suck and melodrama af lol .
How did they get s1 so right and s2 so wrong
15:55 Daemon brought up the unclaimed dragons in S1Ep10, hence his visit to Vermithor in that same episode. That being said, it's a testament to the show's stalling for time that that plot was immediately dropped until the back half of S2
Fantastic analysis, looking forward to more from you!
When your entire writing staff is "Men Bad, Women Good Even When Evil", this is the shit you get.
The whole thing in one perfect and succinct statement.
Great video!! I had the same feelings through the whole season (and S1 too, tbh...). It's so difficult for me to get engaged in a story where I don't care that much about the characters... nor the relationships between them, which should have been the key to the war. As you said, they communicate what is important for the plot, without narratively building up those moments. There's a lack of anticipation, and a lack of consequences too. It should be the tension before, during and after a scene what makes the viewer connected to what's happening
I would argue that the writers of the House of the Dragon have an easier job because they have a clear ending. The Game of Thrones writers did not.
do u know how long ive been searchin for a new good youtube analyser essayist 😭 agess this vid is crazy good
6:45 U said it perfectly here, there is absolutely no sub text, every conversation is just people speaking bluntly about something that just happened or might happen, and there’s no push and pull between characters nor is there any sub text within the dialogue.. which makes the dialogue scenes boring and excruciatingly bland.. there’s also no set protagonist or antagonist in any given scene or in the overall plot, which makes everything feel inconsequential
My major problem with this series is the writers telling viewers what to think instead of letting viewers form their own conclusions.
Robert's rebellion was like the Mexican revolution where Zapata n Villa overthrew the government...yet once they had the power, they didn't know how to run the nation. They won battles, lost the rule
Crap writing everywhere these days
I don't give a fuck about character arcs NO it is an insult to audience intelligence and no I don't always want good to prevail
Gee, I wonder why?
the show has 2 parallel stories that don't really fit together: the book cannon and the showrunners fanfiction
WE NEEDED MORE CONTENT OF RHAENA, HELAENA, BAELA, & JACE
I just watched that scene where Sir Gwayne(?) scolds Cole for sleeping with his sister 10 minutes ago, and I was like what the heck is going on? It was so random at first I thought he was joking or I’d accidentally skipped a scene
What's truly such a shame is that the actors and the people who work on special effects, sound design, set creation, etc are very talented individuals. It feels like it'll all be wasted if the show continues down this route but hopefully the 3rd season is better. It could very well be wishful thinking on my end. Hopefully not. 🤞
Though, I will forever feel like one of the down sides to this show (and alot of shows, actually) is the amount of episodes each season. Stories as deep, detailed and intricate as the books aren't suited for 10 or less episodes a season. The characters, world building and lore have too much depth to be boiled down to 8 or 10 episodes. The time jumps are a prime example of this. The jumps were bad because of the episode count.
Another fault of the show is the changes. The changes were small and weren't bad at first but overtime the changes became way too much. Like I didn't mind Rhaenyra and Alicent being friends because it would hit harder when they became enemies but that never happened. Alicent had moments when she could've transitioned into her book counterpart and never did. I have never read the books but have been informed of the differences and I am so disappointed. Book Alicent seemed like a fun, easy character to hate. She was powerful. She was cunning. She was loyal to her family. She was a villainess. Which makes it such a bummer that they didn't go this route with her character. I am not sure why the writers are afraid to make a woman morally grey or evil. This is coming from a woman before anyone starts. I mean come on. let's be realistic. There is bad, evil, cruel, and/or awful women in real life. Like I love epic and powerful female characters but that doesn't mean that they can't be morally grey or evil. I wish Alicent treated Rhaenyra like her book counterpart. It would make the dynamic between the sides more interesting. More entertaining. More enjoyable. Like when Book Rhaenyra talks about the death of her sons to Book Alicent. Book Alicent response was crazy epic, telling Book Rhaenyra that the blood spilt was B*stard blood. A proper villain. A shame people won't get to see this version of Alicent in the live action. Alicent isn't the only example of an unfortunate case of a character not being like their counterpart.
Before anyone starts with the "history book" excuses, just know it doesn't make any sense in the first place. So, don't even waste time typing it. The show isn't even properly following ages, appearances, events or characters. So, why should we still use the "It's a history book" and "The history books are pro-green and have unreliable narrators" excuses. At first, I agreed with these claims but I don't anymore because it doesn't make sense. It would make more sense to say "Just separate the books from the show." Since they're clearly doing their own thing with the show.
Another problem with the show is how the show is written in comparison to the marketing. The writing and the marketing are contradicting each other. HBO is marketing the show as "pick a side", which was cool. It made the show more interesting because of it. The idea of choosing a side. Like a "Pick your poison" or "Pick the lesser evil" because each side has their faults but the writing in the show has clearly chosen a side. Instead of showcasing a story of two sides, it's become a story about a "Good" and "Bad" side. Which sucks because almost every character in the story is supposed to be complex, multifaceted, and/or moral grey. Like Daemon. Speaking of which, he's another case of not being like his counterpart. He's supposed to be morally grey. Which is a character who isn't good but isn't bad, they're in-between. They make choices that can be bad but also decisions that can be good. We don't get to see Daemon's good side much in the show. For example, his love for his daughters. Which is a shame. That's such an easy way to showcase the more good sides to him but the show doesn't do it. Instead, they give his girls "daddy issues" when not everyone in the show needs it. There's already enough daddy issues on the show. Like seriously what's with every show and daddy issues. I love an adorable father and daughter dynamic. I wish the show would just let us have it. Though, I could go on and on about the faults of the show. So, I'll stop here. 😂
Meh, I liked the moment with Daemon, but it was still underwhelming. Introducing his vision took away all the potential angst leading up to this moment. My issue with daemon's arc is he didn't do anything of his own accord. There was no introspective realization about his behavior(other than being regretful for not being there for viserys, but he can't rectify that directly, because his brother's dead.) THAT alone could have been enough of an impetus for him to bend the knee to rhaenyr, his only way he can see to apologize to his brother and be there for him the only way he now can, by being there for his chosen heir. Even him rectifying the issue with the riverlords is not of his own doing, little oscar tully politically maneuvered him into doing it. Honestly, id rather have seen daemon reluctantly bend the knee explaining that he's not sure if his niece is the right answer, but that he has decided, he will honor his brother's wishes.
I think it wouldve been cool if during the "Blood and Cheese" episode they started by going through the life of Halaena Targaryan. Like what she does and her duties as queen, and then towards the end out of nowhere Blood and CHeese just show up, say their iconic lines, and follow exactly what the history books said happens.
It also be nice to see the Maesters who are recording the histories so we can see their perspectives. Why they wrote the histories the way they did. That would've been cool IMO
Great job, i gave up after episode 6
huh i was completely hooked in F&B
by the ep. 5 my eyes were rolling so often im honestly admired by the power of will of those who managed to reach the finale 😂
I could go on and on about blood and cheese, but you made plenty of quality points about it. You know how forgotten it was by the characters and moreso the writers? In the finale, when rhaenyra proposes to alicent that she betray aegon and leave him for dead, she says "a son for a son." i almost fell out of my chair when I heard that. I mean what the HELL was jaeharys' death then?
This is an amazing analysis, you've articulated my feelings for me. Excellent!
Well, series 2 often felt like we're not watching the story unfold, but solving a puzzle, while ever so often being treated with a corner piece or a large, can't miss where it goes, one.
Furthermore, when important information needs to be conveyed, the writers take some strange "show, don't tell" approach - showing stuff that tell very little or nothing, or alternatively, when some mystery is required (like with Aemond and Helena), then they plainly blurt out how will arc of the character end. Or, we get a warning that something might happen, and then that thing happens a bit later. It's all over the place.
In one of the interviews I watched (or read) about a year ago, either Ryan Condal or GRRM himself said that they wanted to keep some ambiguity about some events that happen, and inspire discussion among viewers about who's in the right as well as show that history books are unreliable as to what really happened (due to writer's biases, sources going missing, we can't be sure what the "players" were thinking...), so they wanted to show the difference between history as recorded vs. real history (in imaginary world) well, they failed at those task. Most of discussions revolved about WTF just happened, and as for history books, or history as it is taught: a) we already know that, b) they only added another unreliable account, c) maesters are really bad historians (GRRM is a history buff, not a historian; he doesn't seem to understand how history is researched and written).
The "Famine" in Kings Landing was pure Comedy, the small Folk became agitated becouse they didnt received enough Meat ;D
LOL thats the Medieval equivalent of First World Problems
This was such a great video! After watching the season I just didnt' felt satisfied but couldn't really pinpoint why...You really explained it in the best way possible and with such ease, especially through the comparison scenes. I don't know if you like to write, but I think you would be great as a writer!!
They are just trying to make the show drag on for 10 seasons instead of just make the best show possible , at this rate we will all be dead by the time the show finishes
The choice to give dragons to unknown people, to small folk is a huge thing. I agree that it could have happened sooner, but I like that it feels so big, because it is.
It questions Targaryen exceptionalism, it questions the order of things in terms of the general make up of the society. Small folk now wield more power than ever before.
I agree though that this was simply not enough of a payoff in the grand scheme of the overall arch of the season.
Whenever you say "privy" I keep hearing Tywin says "and what, you'll kill your own father in the privy?" 😆
I think the 10 episode season really changes the game for this. 20% more scenes and options to show detail and context and perspective
I need to thank you for respecting my time as an audience member and delivering a well thought-out, well edited, well narrated video.
You're an overachiever in a sea of GOT youtubers who just enjoy listening to the sound of their own voices and it's extremely refreshing.
The work you put in is NOT going unnoticed
They absolutely shat all over jayce's character as well as aemond and daemon
I blame letting Miguel Sapochnik go as being the #1 contributing factor for this underwhelming season. The choices made throughout this season were terrible.
Yes, and Sara is a terrible writer. Her comment about queerness of A and R relationship explains a lot.
yall give that man too much credit, him and his wife are the ones who came up with alicent being aged down to be rhae’s bff and all his episodes are dark as shit
Can anyone talk about the lighting choice for HOD? Seems that sunny days, rainy days or any kind of weather scenario is completely left out. Casterly Rock, the Eyrie it's all Winterfell looklike all grey and boring!
It would have been much better for season 2 finale to be a big battle and then damon shows up with his army just in time to win it for rheanera
Very informative analysis! I’ve learned much and more about perspectives and critical themes from this post! Thank you
My dad I couldn’t get past you talking about how you about to talk about something
The first two seasons of HOTD have been such an unbelievably slow yawn that I really dont even care to watch a third season.
Simply amazing breakdown!
It sure is suspicious how all the Maester Propoganda that is corrected is always in Rhaneras favor. Whew I was almost worried that she would be flawed in some way. Also isn’t her character supposed to be portly? Isn’t it wrong to take away the size a character who could do wonders for fat acceptance?
This. I would be completely fine with them "setting the record straight" and revealing errors the Maesters made... If it wasn't ONLY to make Rhaenyra/Team Black look better and make Team Green look worse. Any positive Team Green had in the books and anything bad Team Black did is labelled "Green Propaganda" rather than letting the characters be nuanced and realistic people who are privileged, make bad decisions, and struggle with the hand they've been given. It's such poor writing compared to the book where both sides did good and bad things. The show TELLS you to like Rhaenyra and hate the Greens, rather than letting you come to your own decision.
@@lilchaos9212 Game of Thrones understood that, I thought the entire premise of GRRMs franchise was based around the idea that black and white doesn’t exist. They have completely lost the plot and the shows identity.
Exactly in the book both mushroom and the master are untrustworthy narrators. There are some things they allege that are true and things that aren't. Aegon may not completely be evil in the book and neither is Rhaenyra, but they both do horrible things. The people writing for this show don't understand the actual theme of the story and that's the problem. They remove so many important details that create holes in the plot or come across as strange.
@@tinaye8638 I think a complaint from GOT they seem to focus on is how Danny turned evil. It’s strange because they try very hard to make Rhanera good because of how Danny ended up, but these are completely different characters and stories, but I can’t shake the feeling they are more focused on making this series a fan-fiction of sorts. It’s sad because they are taking away from the tragedy of the story.
@@GangStalker17 I think they're trying to correct Dany character assassination with Rhaenyra, and that's why they keep on mentioning the prophecy and why we saw Dany at the end of ep8.
Top picks for POV:
Kings' Landing: Alicent for the family drama & Ser Criston for the small council, and battles. His emotional journey could have been more impactful this season, and he could have had more scenes with Aegon and Aemond as well, so that we get to know their characters better. I may also add Larys, if we want to stick to the plotline of him getting Aegon out of KL. He took a weird backseat this season, I wanted to be reminded of his scheming and creeping more often in the beginning too. I would have had Helena as an observer throughout the season and once Alicent leaves King's Landing for her year of rest & relaxation, have her step in and carry the story through, through the end of her arc, so we can follow her state of mind from her own perspective, making it much more tragic.
Dragonstone: Rhaenys & Rhaenyra
Wall & then after the sewing, Dragonstone: Jace
Riverlands: Daemon? I am thinking maybe it is better to view him from the outside, perhaps I would have had Harrenhall advisor guy (someone remind me of the name) be our POV. Could have sensed how he is feeling about Alys, clocked her as a threat though his fear, not just through her brewing creepy potions and standing weirdly off-frame. Could have had Daemon going less visibly crazy, with the audience still sensing something is off, establishing him as a loose cannon, and wondering what's going on in his mind. This is exactly what Rhaenyra is wondering, so it may have also strengthened the viewer's connection to her, rooting for Daemon to stick to her. And yes, I would have cut the visions and dreams, and focused more on what Daemon's politics say about him as a person.
Vale: Rhaena, like you recommended, with more focus on her princess & the dragon storyline - either establishing the bond between her and Sheepstealer, or highlighting her desperation more, and killing her off at the end of the season in her confrontation with Sheepstealer as a schocking reminder of how young Targaryens are pushed to claim these beasts, serving as an opposite outcome to Aemond's success last season. On the other hand, this could have been interpreted as a reversal to the dragonseed debate: how Targaryens feel entitled to these dragons, often overestimating their own blood. Nettles could have came in with the line before Rhaena dies or gets seriously injured about how the only way to tame a wild beast without fancy Targaryen dragon pit masters is to earn their trust.
Addam & Alyn would have been great POV characters for: Introducing the other dragonseeds who got a dragon after the sewing & the blockade, and the whole Velarion storyline. We have seen remarkably little of Corlys this season, and if we've had someone he strategized with consistently, that would have given us more insight into who he is as a character. I would have loved for Alyn and him to have a stronger professional relationship. Alyn could have still born the huge grudge against him, but let's say he just really. loves. sailing. and therefore is not hesitant to accept promotions, and is actually enthusiastic about military strategy. His passion for this could have overridden his hate for his father, and lead to him agreeing to work with him still.
I don't specifically hate having scenes with all dragonseeds previously, we could have still gotten Hugh on the audience with Aegon and see Ulf in brothel scenes, for example, but as more of an easter egg of what to come, in a scene from another characters POV, not focused on the dragonseeds specifically. It would have added to the mystery of who they were, for after they got their dragons.
Overall, what I'm missing in HoTD from thrones is the how long dialogues, often about strategising or the world of Westeros, revealed character's personalities and stories. There was always a link between personal and political that made the show come off as both touching and intellectually engaging. I would love to see more of this on HoTD.
Sara Hess actually compared Rhaenys to Hilary Clinton and Viserys to Donald Trump. That tells you she's injecting modern politics to this series. She's incapable of portraying female characters doing anything remotely evil - but ended up character assassinating the female characters.
Great video! I really hope you do another one on this season going more in depth on the character arcs. What you liked and didn’t like and what you thought worked and didn’t work. It sounds like you’re pretty knowledgeable about the process of writing and it’s hard for me to articulate why exactly this season as a whole didn’t work for me and why I found it disappointing since I’m not a writer.
So yeah, if you’re willing to do an even deeper dive into the season I’d love that.
They should hire you as a consultant, but they won't because they are stupid.
When I was watching the Blood & Cheese scenes I did think to myself "This would've been better if it was seen strictly from Haelenas perspective." I would imagine that if we have had the closing scene on Alicent or Haelena, probably Alicent since she had a narrative throughline in the episode, it wouldn't be "out of place" since Haelena isn't a pov character.
It could pick up at maybe a post coitus argument between Cole and Alicent that has her leave in a huff. Maybe to grab some air or to visit her daughter - the point being that as she is walking through the castle corridors we the audience hear voices of two men bickering and whispering. When it becomes clear enough for Alicent we would like to invoke the feeling of her being watched. She is fearful that someone may discover her affair with the kingsguard, and we see that fear amount until she reaches Haelenas room where she hears the two men's voices demanding her to choose between her kids. We hear a stab. We see Alicent paralyzed by fear. We see Blood & Cheese leave the room, blood dripping from their hands. Maybe they even spot Alicent but walk past her as guards may be converging on the scene. We see Haelena leave the room holding her daughter. Camera pans up to her as Alicent triest to ask her what happened. Haelena says the line "They killed the boy." and we black out to credits.
Here's what I think and why I wrote it like this:
By limiting the POV and what the audience hears we create more suspense. We have seen Daemons plans made earlier in the episode. But we are not privy to seeing the assassination carried out. We get less objective facts about what actually happened. We ground it in the experience of a main character who also don't have the full story, which creates a bias. We make Blood & Cheese a hundred times scarier as they become less of a Odd Couple comedy routine and more like ghosts haunting the castle. A horror and tragedy that cannot be stopped. We could even have Alicent see them come out of Aemond's room and follow them at a distance, and we get snippets of their dialogue saying "What do we do now?" She may follow them to Haelenas room, and by that it may add more guilt to her - why didn't she scream for the guards when she had the chance? I thought that by basing the whole scene and events in two throwaway characters we get to know more when we should know less.
Because neither of the POV camps. The Greens and The Blacks know the full story themselves. That's what happens when you hire unreliable agents to carry out an assassination. The one who knows the most is the victims mother. Haelena. Who is "addled" as the show might put it.
At least that's close to what I think should've been. Maybe more skillful writers could make it work. Horror and Suspense comes from the whole audience knowing more than the characters. And this if any event in the series should have been treated as a horror scene.
The showrunners (feminist activists) have no clue what they're doing and GRR Martin literally left them with a blueprint. Complete hacks
exactly.
I've read the first book. There was no concent between Dany and Karl Drogo. He would have consummated the marriage even if she said no.
I agree with some of your observations but respectfully disagree with many of your conclusions and reactions. For one, I disagree that "Bread & Cheese was swiftly forgotten." It gets referenced or revisited in multiple episodes! (Riverlanders not wanting to ally with Daemon, Helena's reactions, Deamon's dream...). If it was in the show even more, I bet everyone would complain about it being repetitive.
A lot of remarks in this video (and viewers' in the comments) are about wanting to feel more emotional resonance with the story and characters: you're just not "feeling" it; "it didn't register." I don't mean this to sound mean or simplistic, but I think that's as much a "you" problem as it might be about different storytelling choices. For example, you don't feel an emotional resonance with the burning of Sharp Point? Well...so what if we aren't intimate with the town? It's a town! He burned a whole town and we hear the people screaming! You don't really need any more information or worldbuildng than that to understand that all season long, multiple characters have been itching in their own ways to "do something," and here, Aemond has finally started to act alone on his desires. Yeah, I think that has major frightening repurcussions. (And since Aemond has not gone off on his own and burned an entire town before, I don't think it's "on brand.")
Finally, Re: Cole, we watched him get PTSD after Rook's Rest -- so it is a very organic character shift to me. And as far as not seeing him use his sword "in years," as one example, we just saw him mete out his justice by beheading Lord Darklyn. (p.s. I haven't read the book and am not judging the show against the book.)
I wanted to see so much more from our characters. I would have loved to see Jace in winterfell, learning more about Rhaena and Baeyla. I hated that every episode felt like a repeat of itself where the same things happens, the same dialogue is repeated, and when Rhaenys died I didn’t feel a damn thing bc I was so pissed off on why she would go back when she could have fled. I also HATE that they refuse to make Alicent or Rhaenyra have any agency to go full mad queens and make morally questionable decisions in a fit of rage; while still having them be sympathetic. I think how bad Cersei was but how I still loved her bc I understood her reasoning always.
Hotd writers room motto, tell don’t show.
I'm imagining a version of this show where they play on the idea of "authentic historical accounts" by interrogating how much one person can know another. I'm fine with the idea of a show that focuses on Allicent and Rhaenyra, but imagine if we saw their interior lives and we weren't so familiar with the people around them. My guess is that we'd feel the suffocation they feel as women, rulers, mothers etc. far more than we do as it is.
Tyrion's dialogue . . . that is what separates GOT from HOTD more than anything through the first season for me. At any moment in GOT, if one of the plot lines was even slightly ho-hum or even boring, a cut to a Tyrion scene lifted all the boats. There is simply no equivalent mechanism in this prequel. It is still highly entertaining and I believe payoffs are coming, but that just is what it is.
This was an amazing video, I was literally taking notes for my own writing. Now I'm off to watch all your other videos. Well done, great work!! Please keep em coming.
Wonder why Blood and Cheese didnt get Aemond. They were at his room and could just waited for him. And then have a better escape plan knowing the secret ways in the walls, getting to a boat for example.
Completely agree with everything you said. I think the character that they should've focused on was Aegon. S1 showed us Viserys's story from being a happy king to an old broken man that just wanted his family to get along. At the end of S1, Aegon didn't want to be king. We see him actually try to help his subjects but not understand diplomacy. We also see him genuinely take an interest in training his heir. But not enough time is given show his grief over losing his son or dragon. He's son was murdered, his brother tried to murder him, his half sister wants him dead, his mother doesn't care if he lives or dies, his dragon is dead, and everyone on council is manipulating him. The audience should feel bad for him as we did for Theon, but we don't. GoT (S1-S6) almost always made me cry or cheer. The only times HotD make me feel anything was the scene of Viserys walking to the throne in S1 and when Jace broke down to Rhaenyra when he returned.
Theyre making all the same mistakes they made with the later seasons of GoT with the added probelm of "men bad" writing hanging over every scene.
Just loved how this finale ended on a weak cliffhanger, showing everyone getting ready for battle, even though, a couple of scenes before, they showed that the entire team green, except for Aemond, already peaced out. If this doesn't get you hyped, I don't know what else does.
The sharp point shot was so confusing. I assumed it was Rhaenyras dragons that attacked and Aemon was surveying the destruction
That pissed me off.
An impactful moment is stolen from all of its power, same happened with Blood and Cheese.
No offense but it was pretty obvious it was aemond who destroyed the town
It would have been better if somebody from team Black (Baela?) went through the damage & then reported back to the council
I would really like to see more of your analysis videos. If possible you should check out AMC's interview with the vampire would love to hear your thoughts (especially since Jacob Anderson stars in it!!)