Zeus variants in general are tough to use. But they can be really effective if your opponents get hung up on the Atlas, Thunderbolt, etc right in their face. For that reason, the 9S2 does look really nice. The 11S looks weak because the Clan tech doesn't add much. It has too many extra heat sinks that could easily be the second LRM15 you get on the 9S2. The extra armor also doesn't seem as useful when you want to keep a Zeus behind the lines anyway.
@@typicalaxis71 Or Zeus 9T. It really becomes a decent assault mech. It can defend itself at short range, it has a decent long-range punch, the light fusion engine and near max armour really help with survivability.
Improved/Heavy Gauss only require PSRs if you moved during the turn, and due to it being an assault class, it gets a -1 to the PSR. Currently, using one in a campaign and the amount of times he falls over as a 4/5 is actually not that high. However, once the Fafnir falls, oh boy. If you are not playing with careful/assisted stand rules, this thing becomes dead weight very quickly.
It's in the exclusive class of mechs that can force 5 PSRs in a turn. Move Fire both IHGR(2), at different targets, hit both targets(2), kick another target(1). If there is pavement and low gravity, you can probably get 9 or so PSRs from the actions of one mech.
Even the old Commandos aren't bad. I loved running a custom stroker that is 3025 tech. 2xSRM-4 sharing a ton of ammo and 2xML. The leftover ton goes to armor. Solid light calvary mech.
@@MrDmitriRavenoff Making such custom variants is very fun, I do agree. And as a big fan of commando, I wish I could make such modifications to either make it run 7/11 or have more armour. But those are probably house rules that aren't usually considered to be a default. For example these videos and probably a lot of tables and tournaments only use stock variants and will probably allow ammo dumping, but for example not allow replacing machineguns and their ammo with more heatsinks, lasers or armor.
To speak in favor of the nightsky's hatchet, I think it's worth remembering that there's no downside to missing with a hatchet beyond the attack not landing. With a kick, if you don't get a hit you're making a PSR which could potentially leave the mech prone. For a mech like the nightsky that's heavily reliant on staying mobile with its jump jets for its survivability, being knocked prone is a very bad thing. Admittedly this is less of an issue if you give the mech a pilot with a high piloting skill, but it is still a risk that can easily lead to a crippled mech if the dice go against you. The hatchet may not hit quite as hard, but it's a much safer option especially for something like a 4/5 pilot. Alternatively, maybe I've just been burned by too many botched kicks and have become overly cautious. That's also entirely possible.
@@TrailblazerBTyou misspelled 'heretical' or maybe 'awful'. As you pointed out tho, the 4/6 move makes it play a fair bit different than a typical Awesome.
i had a game 2 hours ago, Played the Hauptmann OC which i really like and a Zeus 9S2 which is my to go variant since i painted one. both mechs always perform great in my games (and even better in Tandem) and if you take a ton of hotloaded LRM with both, you are set on nearly all ranges.
Its some good stuff but i feel like you overlooked one of my favorites. The barghest 3T and 4T the 3t is probably the best use of a heavy gauss rifle ever. Fast enough to ensure it stays in that small sweet spot range, great armor, and quad mech status makes knocking yourself over with its main gun hard. The 4T is also good with its c3 slave and heavy gauss combo. It's a really nice sniper.
About the center torso ammo. Do you play with the floating crits on 2's house rule? If not, wouldn't it be quite dangerous, as through armor crits can only happen in the center torso in core BT rules?
Unless a critical CT hit is scored on a pristine mech, and your full ammo bin is hit. Or you fail a PSR roll crossing mud, roll CT (critical) when determining where your falling damage is applied, inflict a critical on yourself and exploding with stupendous flare. Happens more often than you would think. Ammo in the side with CASE whenever possible - or upgrade with CASE installation when available ASAP. [Edit] Why I favor the floating critical optional rule from Tactical Operations: Advanced Rules.
I pretty much always play with floating crits, but also the odds of CT ammo going off like that are really low (like roughly 1 in 800 hits). People's luck will vary widely, I've never had it happen to me. But even then, a gyro hit is close enough to a kill that I don't consider CT ammo that much worse.
@@TrailblazerBT 1 in 800 hits is kinda a lot honestly. Considering some of the volume of fire mechs that are out there those 800 hits go by surprisingly fast. Will it happen every battle? Probably not. But any battle. It may just be an anecdote and not useful empirically but I once lost two pristine battlemechs to TACs on CT ammo in a single game.
@@FoxxofNod If you're against a lot of LBXs and SRMs it can be a noticeable possibility for sure. Hell a few months ago I killed a pristine Mad Cat with a headshot TAC that blew the head off. BT is very much a dice game. But side torso ammo is really poorly padded on most mechs that have it, that's part of what makes me prefer CT ammo as a rule
The TDR-5SS is a great base mech for high tech customization -- as are most 3025 designs with lots of heat sinks. Upgrading a 5SS with double heat sinks allows the addition of jump jets and 2 small pulse lasers in the left arm. The flamer can also be removed for a C3 Slave. Or I've removed the flamer and SRM system for a C3 Master, which is convenient but could be risky with the way Thunderbolts tend to behave.
2:54 excellent mech. It has a PPC. 1337 BV too, so you know it is cool 😎 I don't like CT ammo because of TACs, but it is better than being alone in a side torso I suppose.
@@Klinktastic1none of the people at the game stores within my travel radius like playing floating crits. Even with floating crits the center torso is still the most likely location to get a TAC.
The only thing on that Stiletto: You'll never use two tons of standard LRM ammo, so use that extra ton for Smoke or Thunder or some other interesting ammo. Tandem Charge SRMs, perhaps?
The Griffin 1S vs Wolverine 6K comparison is a bit more fair when you look that the Griffin 1S has 16 heat sinks meaning it can jump 5 and fire LL+medium laser with no heat, that the Wolverine 6K gains heat for. Minor side grades of eachother
Like every one of the mech that where mentioned in this video and agree. I do love the Wolfhound. It’s a good recon hunter killer. I have a well-played line up that could contain a Nightsky, Commando, Razerback, P-Hawk and Wasp WSP-3S. The lance normally does recon hunter killer. Some Steiner mechs that were missing. I am shore this would rain on the second video of good Steiner mechs part two. Considering what was shown, I am a little surprised about the Devastator being the one called out for Steiner. I normally consider Devastator a Davion Mech as they hogged most of the production orders. To name those that merit mention the Emperor, Lynx, Scarabus, Talon, and Uziel. These mechs also have versions that are good with a high reputation like the Uziel. The Emperor has a variant that fits into LB 20-X line ups. The Lynx and Talons are good, as they are all energy, working together from 3058. The Scarabus is often called the scare bus.
One of the neat things about the Chinese dialects is that they are all still written the same. This is a good thing because several of them, when spoken, have less in common than English and French.
CT ammo is hugely dangerous if you play with basic TAC rules, but gets much better if you run the (highly popular and IMO should be default) optional Floating Criticals rule.
I've found myself slowly drifting toward House Steiner over the last few years, so this is good info! Hope you also include the Periphery states in this video series. I'm quite curious about your picks for my favorite faction, the Taurians... :) Would the Brahma or Marshal make your list? The world wonders.
When the channel will make the list for best Capellan Confederation Mechs, it needs only one mech chassis. The Vindicator. All you need is a pilot with the heart of a citizen of the Confederation and a Vindicator. All tactical problems can be solved by scaling up the amount of Vindicators.
I've heard a lot of hate for the Griffin because the weapons and ammo are loaded so much to the right side. With an A- grade it seems that doesn't bother you to much. Would the grade be higher if the ammo and a medium laser were on the left side?
What about the Charger CGR-SB? It's like an Awesome 9Q's disappointing sibling. It looks pretty good if you don't despise Large Lasers. Also I didn't ever notice it until tonight when I was looking at Lyran Charger options...
Thunderbolt 5SS. BV 1337. hecking sold on it for the meme of it being a 1337 mech. Steiner has great mechs in general. something about throwing money at the problem means they somehow ended up with solid mechs.
Love the Nightsky- the 6T is a really fun and fiesty little TSM bully that does heinous stuff with the hatchet and its feet. Forcing double PSRs with a kick or punching into most mediums sides with that 20 damage axe does brutal things There's some good Bushwhacker variants (I like the Lb-10 one) and the Gauntlet (aka omni-whacker) is a pretty OK cav machine even if the movement profile kinda sucks
Lyran/Steiner Mech AND THERE IS NO BANSHEE ??? I mean yes the Banshee is original from the Terran Hegemony, but sind 3026 and the Productionstart of the BNC-3S at Defiances Industries (which is on the Lyran World Hesperus II ) the Banshee is definitely a Steiner Mech and this beast has good Oumpf
@@Andy-the-Collector A conscious decision. IMO the Mongoose is the only really good 25 ton mech. Although I hear there are some recent improved Commando variants I should check out.
Best line of the video "Woah! There is a Zeus that doesn't suck."
Surprised it wasn't the Zeus 11s tbh, that one is is really fun
Zeus variants in general are tough to use. But they can be really effective if your opponents get hung up on the Atlas, Thunderbolt, etc right in their face. For that reason, the 9S2 does look really nice.
The 11S looks weak because the Clan tech doesn't add much. It has too many extra heat sinks that could easily be the second LRM15 you get on the 9S2. The extra armor also doesn't seem as useful when you want to keep a Zeus behind the lines anyway.
@@typicalaxis71 Or Zeus 9T. It really becomes a decent assault mech. It can defend itself at short range, it has a decent long-range punch, the light fusion engine and near max armour really help with survivability.
Fafnir is such a Lyran mech, I love it. No arms, two biggest, dumbest guns that require a pilot check after every shot not to fall.
Improved/Heavy Gauss only require PSRs if you moved during the turn, and due to it being an assault class, it gets a -1 to the PSR. Currently, using one in a campaign and the amount of times he falls over as a 4/5 is actually not that high.
However, once the Fafnir falls, oh boy. If you are not playing with careful/assisted stand rules, this thing becomes dead weight very quickly.
It's in the exclusive class of mechs that can force 5 PSRs in a turn.
Move
Fire both IHGR(2), at different targets, hit both targets(2), kick another target(1).
If there is pavement and low gravity, you can probably get 9 or so PSRs from the actions of one mech.
Before even watching: the Commando got a bunch of new Variants in Shrapnel 15 - I think at least a few of them are worth considering
Didn't realize that! Shrapnel is really changing some things, the new infantry weapons from one issue have made a lot of new platoon designs possible
@@TrailblazerBT The new Mauler/Daboku lore canonizes the connection, the Winged Wraith is badass, and the new Gladiator variants are funky
Even the old Commandos aren't bad. I loved running a custom stroker that is 3025 tech. 2xSRM-4 sharing a ton of ammo and 2xML. The leftover ton goes to armor. Solid light calvary mech.
@@MrDmitriRavenoff Making such custom variants is very fun, I do agree. And as a big fan of commando, I wish I could make such modifications to either make it run 7/11 or have more armour.
But those are probably house rules that aren't usually considered to be a default. For example these videos and probably a lot of tables and tournaments only use stock variants and will probably allow ammo dumping, but for example not allow replacing machineguns and their ammo with more heatsinks, lasers or armor.
Love these videos, I can't wait for the Davion mechs video. The intro tech Davion Warhammer is one of my all-time favorites.
No spoilers but yes that mech is v good!
Wow, how could I have guessed the Wolfhound WLF-2 would be on this list? 😂
To speak in favor of the nightsky's hatchet, I think it's worth remembering that there's no downside to missing with a hatchet beyond the attack not landing. With a kick, if you don't get a hit you're making a PSR which could potentially leave the mech prone. For a mech like the nightsky that's heavily reliant on staying mobile with its jump jets for its survivability, being knocked prone is a very bad thing. Admittedly this is less of an issue if you give the mech a pilot with a high piloting skill, but it is still a risk that can easily lead to a crippled mech if the dice go against you. The hatchet may not hit quite as hard, but it's a much safer option especially for something like a 4/5 pilot.
Alternatively, maybe I've just been burned by too many botched kicks and have become overly cautious. That's also entirely possible.
Also not being able to kick something 1-2 levels higher than you and a hatchet keeps lights from engaging your rear at physical attack range!😅
I've been finding physical weapons to be a trap myself. I'd rather do two punches and have two chances at a having a 1 in 6 head bonk.
Good point, also I often use the hatchet when I'm attacking from the rear arc, since it's so devastating to hit a rear torso.
Loving this series! Can't wait for the Liao episode
"Awesome except with LRMs" We got awesomes like that too
Yeah the one with two large lasers and two LRM 15s is pretty good!
Those are not true Awesomes. Minimum 3 ppc's or bust!
@@TrailblazerBTyou misspelled 'heretical' or maybe 'awful'.
As you pointed out tho, the 4/6 move makes it play a fair bit different than a typical Awesome.
I'm glad you covered some of the little guys, and glad to see some 3055 mech love in here too.
If you got love for 3055 mechs we are brothers!
i had a game 2 hours ago, Played the Hauptmann OC which i really like and a Zeus 9S2 which is my to go variant since i painted one. both mechs always perform great in my games (and even better in Tandem) and if you take a ton of hotloaded LRM with both, you are set on nearly all ranges.
Its some good stuff but i feel like you overlooked one of my favorites. The barghest 3T and 4T the 3t is probably the best use of a heavy gauss rifle ever. Fast enough to ensure it stays in that small sweet spot range, great armor, and quad mech status makes knocking yourself over with its main gun hard. The 4T is also good with its c3 slave and heavy gauss combo. It's a really nice sniper.
About the center torso ammo. Do you play with the floating crits on 2's house rule? If not, wouldn't it be quite dangerous, as through armor crits can only happen in the center torso in core BT rules?
I do play with floating crits, but I don't actually think it's that bad even without them, see my reply to thedocklighter
You can TAC side torsos under core BT rules. You just need to be in the side arc...
Unless a critical CT hit is scored on a pristine mech, and your full ammo bin is hit. Or you fail a PSR roll crossing mud, roll CT (critical) when determining where your falling damage is applied, inflict a critical on yourself and exploding with stupendous flare.
Happens more often than you would think. Ammo in the side with CASE whenever possible - or upgrade with CASE installation when available ASAP.
[Edit] Why I favor the floating critical optional rule from Tactical Operations: Advanced Rules.
I pretty much always play with floating crits, but also the odds of CT ammo going off like that are really low (like roughly 1 in 800 hits). People's luck will vary widely, I've never had it happen to me. But even then, a gyro hit is close enough to a kill that I don't consider CT ammo that much worse.
@@TrailblazerBT 1 in 800 hits is kinda a lot honestly. Considering some of the volume of fire mechs that are out there those 800 hits go by surprisingly fast. Will it happen every battle? Probably not. But any battle. It may just be an anecdote and not useful empirically but I once lost two pristine battlemechs to TACs on CT ammo in a single game.
@@FoxxofNod If you're against a lot of LBXs and SRMs it can be a noticeable possibility for sure. Hell a few months ago I killed a pristine Mad Cat with a headshot TAC that blew the head off. BT is very much a dice game. But side torso ammo is really poorly padded on most mechs that have it, that's part of what makes me prefer CT ammo as a rule
The TDR-5SS is a great base mech for high tech customization -- as are most 3025 designs with lots of heat sinks. Upgrading a 5SS with double heat sinks allows the addition of jump jets and 2 small pulse lasers in the left arm. The flamer can also be removed for a C3 Slave. Or I've removed the flamer and SRM system for a C3 Master, which is convenient but could be risky with the way Thunderbolts tend to behave.
2:54 excellent mech. It has a PPC. 1337 BV too, so you know it is cool 😎
I don't like CT ammo because of TACs, but it is better than being alone in a side torso I suppose.
Pretty much everyone uses floating crit, not auto CT
@@Klinktastic1none of the people at the game stores within my travel radius like playing floating crits.
Even with floating crits the center torso is still the most likely location to get a TAC.
The Thunderbolt is just a good mech all around. Not many of it's variants are outright garbage.
The only thing on that Stiletto: You'll never use two tons of standard LRM ammo, so use that extra ton for Smoke or Thunder or some other interesting ammo. Tandem Charge SRMs, perhaps?
If you are allowed to play with TC SRMS you should always do so pretty much haha
Infernos are nice too.
Are we ignoring the Uziel 8S, the cheese machine of jumping pulse lasers?
Yeah I just forgot it, huge omission!
If we pretend not to see it it might leave us alone.
@TrailblazerBT clearly it is so cheesy it deserves its own video to not cheese up everything else here
The Griffin 1S vs Wolverine 6K comparison is a bit more fair when you look that the Griffin 1S has 16 heat sinks meaning it can jump 5 and fire LL+medium laser with no heat, that the Wolverine 6K gains heat for. Minor side grades of eachother
Good points! As someone else points out though, the right arm vulnerability is also a problem with the Griffin
Like every one of the mech that where mentioned in this video and agree. I do love the Wolfhound. It’s a good recon hunter killer. I have a well-played line up that could contain a Nightsky, Commando, Razerback, P-Hawk and Wasp WSP-3S. The lance normally does recon hunter killer.
Some Steiner mechs that were missing. I am shore this would rain on the second video of good Steiner mechs part two. Considering what was shown, I am a little surprised about the Devastator being the one called out for Steiner. I normally consider Devastator a Davion Mech as they hogged most of the production orders.
To name those that merit mention the Emperor, Lynx, Scarabus, Talon, and Uziel. These mechs also have versions that are good with a high reputation like the Uziel. The Emperor has a variant that fits into LB 20-X line ups. The Lynx and Talons are good, as they are all energy, working together from 3058. The Scarabus is often called the scare bus.
Good stuff, but Devastator is a Davion assault mech, though of course FedCom era what's ours is yours applies.
The main factory is Norse-Storm which is a Lyran producer though
10:40 chuckles in Capellan Confederation , so they worked out the obscure Chinese dialect we gave them the stealth armour instructions in then ?
One of the neat things about the Chinese dialects is that they are all still written the same. This is a good thing because several of them, when spoken, have less in common than English and French.
CT ammo is hugely dangerous if you play with basic TAC rules, but gets much better if you run the (highly popular and IMO should be default) optional Floating Criticals rule.
Starslayer STY-3C is worth a mention on this list as well, in a similar category as the Griffin GRF-1S and the Marik Wolverine you compared it to.
Good series
I've found myself slowly drifting toward House Steiner over the last few years, so this is good info!
Hope you also include the Periphery states in this video series. I'm quite curious about your picks for my favorite faction, the Taurians... :) Would the Brahma or Marshal make your list? The world wonders.
That Marauder II isn't Lyran, it's the Dragoon's petty revenge for the theft of the light fusion engine tech.
Yeah the lore says it was eventually adopted by the Lyrans though
@@TrailblazerBT I mean, they had all the required tech and the Kerfuffle probably made lawsuits over design theft a moot point.
When the channel will make the list for best Capellan Confederation Mechs, it needs only one mech chassis. The Vindicator.
All you need is a pilot with the heart of a citizen of the Confederation and a Vindicator. All tactical problems can be solved by scaling up the amount of Vindicators.
I've heard a lot of hate for the Griffin because the weapons and ammo are loaded so much to the right side. With an A- grade it seems that doesn't bother you to much. Would the grade be higher if the ammo and a medium laser were on the left side?
I should have said this, but yes, that is the biggest problem with the mech. Not just in the right side, but the right arm!
@@TrailblazerBT That is why the 6S model is so sexy to me. The maxed armor does not hurt either. The BV is a little high but that thing performs.
griffin is a good mech.i loved it.
In order: The Atlas, The Atlas, The Atlas, The Atlas (Such a stealthy scout mech), and The Atlas.
No banshee-3S?
@@dalehardee3041 My bad
Clan invasion era and later it's an IS general design.
I think more of the Wolfhound than the Spectre.
For the BV, I agree. But if I'm not paying for it I'd pick the Specter
What about the Charger CGR-SB?
It's like an Awesome 9Q's disappointing sibling. It looks pretty good if you don't despise Large Lasers.
Also I didn't ever notice it until tonight when I was looking at Lyran Charger options...
Thunderbolt 5SS. BV 1337. hecking sold on it for the meme of it being a 1337 mech. Steiner has great mechs in general. something about throwing money at the problem means they somehow ended up with solid mechs.
Stiletto - poor man's Jenner :D
If a gauss rifle that is split between side and center torsos explodes, what exactly happens?
The location of the crit that was hit is where the detonation occurs and you take full damage to that area it dosent spread
No Bloodhound ? Missed that one
No love for the Commando?
Love the Nightsky- the 6T is a really fun and fiesty little TSM bully that does heinous stuff with the hatchet and its feet. Forcing double PSRs with a kick or punching into most mediums sides with that 20 damage axe does brutal things
There's some good Bushwhacker variants (I like the Lb-10 one) and the Gauntlet (aka omni-whacker) is a pretty OK cav machine even if the movement profile kinda sucks
Lyran/Steiner Mech AND THERE IS NO BANSHEE ???
I mean yes the Banshee is original from the Terran Hegemony, but sind 3026 and the Productionstart of the BNC-3S at Defiances Industries (which is on the Lyran World Hesperus II ) the Banshee is definitely a Steiner Mech and this beast has good Oumpf
Hm yeah, a lot of Banshee variants are pretty underwhelming but I should have included the 3S in my 3025 picks.
No Commando
@@Andy-the-Collector A conscious decision. IMO the Mongoose is the only really good 25 ton mech. Although I hear there are some recent improved Commando variants I should check out.