Wait, does torque ACTUALLY exist in SnowRunner?
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- Опубликовано: 25 апр 2023
- Despite a common notion that torque does not exist in SnowRunner, is that actually the case? I decided to see if I could find out the answer, having seen a few players exploring the idea.
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We did not pray enough for Arsenal... Let's get this video to 1,000 likes and beyond. If we can, I will drink more water for a week. Madness.
Arsenal hahaha
you shouldn't dilute your usual gasoline mix it's not good for your engine 😉
Yes go arsenal
Arsenal? That's a football thing right?
@@lrice439 Supported all my life, it's the hope that kills you...
Wait a minute, I always used lower gears when the trucks stalled in higher ones... I though torque was a given!
Me toi
Same
Same
Same, I don't get how this could be a general perception if even without proving grounds its easily visible when pulling long logs mainly? Additionally, engine power in game files is just a torque, a single parameter, nothing else is there.
Me to. Wen i drive Cat 770G With rocks trailer, I had to use all gears to move it on same area. but it cannot be said that it is the torque that changes with the transmission, or it is incorrectly implemented, but a reduced gear is not always better than a reduced one, and also this incomprehensible moment with the wheel scrolling, when after scrolling the truck starts to go where it was standing.
I noticed this a lot and I never really had a question that there was some form of torque
I know! I am surprised people were arguing that wheel speed was the only factor.
@@GoodMomo even if you look at some of the slower vehicles and their power output you could see wheel speed is negligible
@@shogunofsorrow787 oh yea some people just dont notice things about vehicles others do haha i mean heck ive had the trucks twisting the frame going up certain hills in the game it is so amazing to see
Seriously, wtf is this video.
same i've had times where i had to change gear because of mud on flat ground because i was using a small truck but towing one of the massive trailers. i actually came to this video wondering what it was about because i already knew it had torque
This channel has more subtitle options than a Netflix special... Impressive.
Thanks, I try to make things accessible!
Its not a sim, its a truck based rpg. Hopefully they make a new runner game and get it more realalistic.
It's a sim-lite or diet sim. More realism could be interesting but not to the detriment of good-old fun.
@@ATribeCalledCars It can be a full on Simulator and still be fun.
i’m a retired truck driver. snow runner most definitely has torque in transmissions. but unlike real life wheel spin is good. when muddying pizza cutter tires are the way to go unless you have the horse power to spin big wide tires clean for grip. but in general spinning is bad in mud
You're absolutely right, wheelspin is why RWD cars get stuck in muddy car parks or snow! But yeah it seems to be a plus in old SnowRunner.
@@ATribeCalledCars no, they get stuck because there is no weight over the rear wheels so they just spin. They don't just get stuck "cos wheelspin" ffs
@@dan3458 They get stuck because of reduced traction on more slippery surfaces. If it was simply weight over the rear wheels then RWD cars would struggle all the time.
@@ATribeCalledCars you're both right to a point, it's the lack of weight being the reason they get stuck a lot but it also comes down to the surface and wheel width as really loose dirt and sand will bury anything regardless of your drivetrain capabilities once you start slipping. Also typically the engine is in the front so that's automatically less weight and thus less power that can be put to the ground.
The problem is that the game lacks a realistic relationship between torque, rpm and hp, not to mention tire grip physics (this is where tire size, contact patch & pattern plus weight matters). Hence why the medium trucks often tend to outpull the heavy ones in Snowrunner.
Yeah, the engine/transmission simulation is absolutely garbage.
I look at the tach and i notice the engine revs weird , the rpm goes down when you shift up , i even tried torque shifting (shifting in the green space of the tach)
Lowest low should Have the most torque and High should Have the least , the truck should move no doubtedly in low low and struggle more in Higher gears yet move faster
When i play and i use low gears in a bog or pulling a Heavy load the truck seems like it Has no power at all but normal low or High low i get movement , i find that strange
Tyre pressure deflation should be modelled. It provided more grip in SpinTires in mud and water. In Snowrunner the transmission
In my opinion, it's never been a question of if there is torque or not, its that the amount of torque gained from going into lower gears is nowhere near what it should be.
When you shift an engine that makes 2000ft-lbs from like a 4.0 gear ration to something like 7.5 like a lot of low range gearing is on big trucks, the torque multiplication is almost exponential, but in game it is very minimal, which is why it SEEMS more like wheel speed governs ability.
You're not wrong, this could be part of what's going on and the perception. I guess I'd need to compare maximum weight that can be pulled by each truck to see what's realistic.
This is bang on, there needs to be a complete overhaul of the transmission coding for it to get realistic though, they need to do it, funky mud physics and bouncy truck isn’t that impressive, it was but tech caught up.
@@gamerdrive5565 That would take away a lot from the game though, as any truck would be able to pull any load in low gear. Also engine upgrades would be obsolete
@@lalilulelo1989 that makes no sense, you can still add power to a realistic truck and they aren’t unstoppable.
@@gamerdrive5565 Ok, not any truck. But all trucks would be a lot more powerful. I dont have that much of a problem with how the game feels now.
Yet again, a perfect blend between facts and commentary with proper investigation not speculation
This is a good start. But it reveals another big issue with the game mechanics that I’ve not seen anyone talk about: The way the game deals with differential locks and limited slip differentials.
Firstly. Diff lock does not actually lock the pairs of wheels on the same axle as a real one would. A simple turning circle test with diff lock on and off will reveal no change to the turning circle. Also with diff lock on, even in a straight line, you can see one wheel stop turning on one end of the axle while the other free spins in mud or other low traction surface.
Secondly, there are several vehicles in game that have limited slip differentials that are listed as “diff lock always on”. That’s not how LSDs work. They are open diff unless traction is decreased one one side of the axle. Then the LSD engages.
Would love to see this (among other things) fixed in the next Runner sequel.
I'd like this game to be more sim like, as it is now it isn't very realistic, and I think it could do a lot with being a simcade (full sim wouldn't be logical since it would cut off most of the playerbase)
@@clutch44444I agree. It will be very boring getting stuck every 30 seconds
Funny enough, I always thought always on difflock makes turning circle worse
@@vladvulcan in army we drove trucks in the snow and if difflock was on, the trucks turned slower, sooo
I think it also depends on what kind of difflock you have.
I've played the game since release and I took a break and came back after a few months and noticed realistic torque was added. If you could go back in time you could actually see when you switched between the lows the rpm ranges decreased but now rpm ranges stay the same or increase when you switch between the low gears
You sure it’s new? I kinda feel like you’re right but haven’t played in so long.
@@gamerdrive5565 I'm almost 100% sure cause I remember being very disappointed when you could literally hear the engine rev down in the low gears but that is gone and it's really nice now
I also noticed that the rev gauge in the cockpit view doesn't actually show the actual RPMs of the engine but it shows the economy of the engine. I noticed that if the RPMS are around 2000-2500, you have good fuel economy aka the fuel consumption is really good. If its between 2500-3000 RPM the fuel consumption is ok and everything beyond 3000 RPMs is just big fuel consumption which is bad fuel economy. If your RPMs are constantly over 3500 RPMs, that's extremely bad fuel economy and you should try to fix it. And if you get your RPMS below the 2000 RPM, that's extremely good fuel economy for your truck. That means you spend very little fuel to get to places even when you're hauling a heavy load. That's a really nice feature if you're trying to get your truck work as an independent unit instead of having to be supported by other trucks constantly by fueling it all the time.
Speedometer is as you would imagine, it shows your actual speed in the game world. And I think it was somewhere around 35 km/h, when going beyond that significantly increases the risk of damaging your suspension and wheels while driving.
It is absolutely a new feature within the last 2 phases. Ive done this exact same test multiple times and it was never like this... Lower gears used to be worse.
Back in the days (and also in Mud Runner and Spintires) the gears only limited the wheelspeed, but didn't increase the torque. It was still better to use lower gears in some situations as higher wheelspeed would reduce your traction.
I have seen a crapload of scenarios where low minus is basically useless and only low and low plus will actually get something moving if stuck.
Likewise, which is interesting too. Whatever is going on, at least SnowRunner has a bit more going on underneath the hood!
I noticed the Low- sometimes takes a really long time to "spool up". Meaning that it feels like the game is simulating getting all the slack spooled out between the engine and the wheels in the drivetrain. When it eventually has spooled all that slack out of the drivetrain, almost any kind of load starts to move. But usually I'm lazy and I just bump the gear to Low and then to Low+ because it takes less time to spool all the slack out of the drivetrain with the Low gear compared to Low-. And when I have started moving with decent phase, I try to bump the gear straight to High gear which either gets the truck going really fast for the conditions or stalls it. When it gets going, that feels a bit unrealistic because usually in that case in the real life either the engine would stall immediatelly or the transmission would just blow up but there's no damage modeled in the game which would come from over stressing the gearbox. So instead of gearbox blowing up, the truck just jolts to a much faster speed and keeps going like that.
I've only began to notice this recently, after the new phase was released.
Granted, trucks would always "stall" when the automatic gearbox tried to shift up at the wrong time, prompting you to use low/high gears even before this phase.
But now I'm seeing trucks refuse to move on low gear exactly like you demonstrated, which I haven't observed until recently.
Maybe it's because the newer maps are less about deep muddy swamps and more about dirt trails?
Could be that it's simply more obvious because of map design but hard to say. Unless we can make it inside Saber Castle.
One thing that's important to note which I've noticed is: It seems like tire grip (or more accurately, tire grip loss) scales with wheelspeed. When I tested a while ago, Low gear wasn't a shorter gear than 1st, it was just a speed limiter. Because of that, you could just the exact same effect as Low by just mashing the gas pedal on and off in Auto, often letting you go even faster than you would've been able to otherwise.
So in mudrunner there was an rpm dial in the first person view. It didn't show engine rpm, but actually showed "torque", or, what percentage the throttle was open. It appeared as if different gears could have different torque limits. The "1+" gear, while lacking the necessary torque to get moving, allowed the "rpm" needle to move much further than other gears. It was also capable of the most fuel consumption of any other gear, strengthening the theory that the rpm dial was actually throttlebody position.
"There was" why do you say that as if Mudrunner was no more
I’ve been doing this quite a bit, especially with the derry 4520 pulling heavy loads. The truck would get stuck on some inclines and I would put it in low to get it going. Didn’t realize it was such a big deal.
Usually it's Low+ for me but then I typically stick to my favourite trucks these days until new maps come along! I guess some people were better at noticing torque than others. I blame my senileness.
@@ATribeCalledCars I often use highrange gearboxes so low+/- are not an option. I also have the low assigned to a key on the keyboard so it’s a quick change, but changing to low+/- is an extra step. BTW, have you done a video on winches and cranes and how they have more power if they’re not extended as far? For example, if a crane is extended far out, it is not as powerful as when it’s retracted.
This is one of the first things I learned about the game when it was released similar to real life. In low gear you have more torque for pulling, rock crawling, and generally driving through mud. The faster your wheels spin the more wheel spin "less grip" you have therefore the better throttle control you have, the more grip "less wheel spin" you'll have to actually pull yourself along.
Makes sense, no movement is definitely not helpful. Great name, by the way.
Ty sir ty try not to make so much sense next time its forbidden
@@ATribeCalledCars Haha thanks
you would think torque would be in a truck game
Yeah, goes with the territory.
For me it's very simple: I put the gear that makes the vehicle go and that's it.
Hey that Swish guy sounds pretty cool 😅
But in all seriousness thanks for making this, seeing this info get shared on a much bigger platform than mine is very appreciated 😊
Very interesting Ben, iv tweak the torque the engine files + the fuel consumption it seems like with torque less difflock is required
Great video, Ben! I hope you’re having a nice week and I’m very much looking forward to your next video. Till then I shall study for my ”Abitur” (German counterpart to the A Levels I think) where I am going to write the second test on Friday (out of 5 😅)
Thank you, likewise. I hope your exams go well. Obviously try hard but know that you get where you need to go in other ways. Effort and intelligence go a long way.
I will just say that there are a lot of contributing factors, some of which don't even work. It's not just in the gearbox xml, but there are things in the engine xml too and there are several ways to go about tuning to get around the lack of perceived torque. You drive my tweaks...
Great video Ben! I seen this on one of Nathan provinces streams very interesting thanks for sharing with everyone. Keep up the good work.
I didn't see his video, but he makes some good stuff.
@@ATribeCalledCars yeah it was actually in the start of one of his streams so it was sort of a hidden video lol I couldn’t even tell you what video.
I also have noticed the gear thing while playing, so I never really doubted that there is some sort of torque mechanic
This game needs an actual lowrange gear box and real gearing, and more realistic difflocks.
Would make sense in a game all about off-roading!
That's what some of us have been expecting from this game since Spintires. We supported the series since 2014 hoping to get the best Off-roading Simulator as much as possible but all that fell short very fast. BeamNG has overtaken every Truck driving game, makes all of them feel like a joke.
I will echo what others have said, realistic torque mechanics are NEW. I did my own very limited testing shortly after release and several times since then and low+ always seemed to do what I expect from low- on steep inclines with heavy loads etc.
I think it's a welcome change!! Glad to see things getting more realistic!
That's interesting, maybe it was originally implemented backwards and recently quietly swapped. Whatever the reason, it's definitely a good step forward.
@@ATribeCalledCars I also did testing back in years 1 and 2 and it was backwards. They must have fixed it late in year 2 or for year 3.
This is NEW within the last 2 phases. I've done this test MULTIPLE times with vanilla and mod trucks. Trucks have never had torque like this. I was one of the original people to bring this up and put it to the test, basically on day 1. Glad to see they are actually trying to improve the game..... Now all they need to do is fix steering/turning circles/ wheel tracking. Ya know, the whole dog wagging its tail thing when you turn the steering wheel, cause major understeer and weird wheel tracking.
and make the tourque multiplication a little more realistic too. but i did notice that too. i played the game early on and it felt like mudrunner. then i got my own copy much later and yeah, it feels different. the autos are so much easier to manage now because they legit seem like a full on gearset
I think torque has been tweaked in the last update because I’ve been driving the same hill with the same load with my Tayga for ages and it’s never struggled but since the last update I now have to use low range
Would be cool if they cooperated with the engine simulator dude. Don't remember what the video was called atm but he seemed to know his way around pretty much all aspects of both physics, chemistry and sound.
You also have even more control over torque/traction when using a controller with trigger for accel with varying amounts of throttle applied unlike a keyboard w key being just an on off switch I can get movement out of a buried truck in low minus just barley activating the trigger that I can not get any movment out of with a keyboard
I mean, it's literally done this since the spin tires rebuild that landed the original dev the funds to fully produce and market it... it was literally one of the selling points
Though there is torque indeed, the geip is represented incorrectly. In situaltion like this, tires wold be spinning even if the truck doesn't move. That's why ballast trucks exist IRL, but their concept doesn't worn in Snowrunner.
Only problem I've had is flooring it and the truck going back down to like 1200rpm for no reason
Which truck or trucks? That's interesting.
What do you mean for no reason? An engine would do that if it doesnt have enough power to pull
@@ATribeCalledCars all of them as soon as there is a foot tall incline
You should test the High gear. Feels like a power increase. My truck can be shifting into 3rd and immediately bogging down and dropping to 1st, or I can go into High, moving faster than in 3rd, and not get stuck at all. Note that in some trucks this applies to their top gear instead, with High gear being both faster and getting bogged down way more rarely.
I experienced the same thing too high gears feels more powerful than before
I noticed that when i barely pressed the throttle in mud or an hill climb it would pull through vs have the throttle maxed out, with very low throttle i can go anywhere i point it
My biggest problem with this game is two fold- no full manual gear shifting and the traction/friction on paved road surfaces is actually absurd- feels like you are driving on ice even with highway tires on supposedly dry surfaces
I think they may have added that feature a year or so ago, and it wasent there when release. i could be mistaken though
Oh absolutely, I've noticed some calculations have changed or input numbers adjusted. Hard to say when exactly things changed, if at all. Even if I look back at old videos it's hard to quantify changes.
huh, the low+, low ,low- is something i'll have to investigate in my own playthrough. i may have been using some of my trucks entirely wrong when loaded to the max.
The minus gear seems to also improve some mud tires performance and it is not only about lowering the rotation. Wondering if those pacifc trucks could make use of this trick to compensate their lack of power on low and low plus.
Well I was trying to test the P16 as it's got a tyre bonus but not full traction. Sadly, it didn't want to attach a trailer.
Or actually feel free to bump their strength yourself (PC only) in files - I did that (very slightly) after seeing what real pacifics can haul. Given that the game never validates seemingly anything for a coop - it won't be a problem for any kind of online play, literally - everything will work smoothly and pacifics will be more powerful just under your control, even in coop.
I did this and I'm happier now, there's something magnetic about those pacifics...
@@LeonserGT I play on console. I still use them all for especific tasks, but yeah real life pacifics are awesome trucks.
@@ATribeCalledCars I'll try something else in game, latter.
Ive always noticed it seems like you have more pull in L it seemed to me L- has less than L on hills
Maybe it was changed over the years, but we'll never know!
Maybe I'm missing the point (I found out this discussion existed just now with this video), but to me it's pretty clear the game has a good interaction between torque and movement. I never cared to think about it that much because to me it always felt pretty realistic for a game this simple. I feel like a lot of people that complain about this maybe never went offroading with a car or even a bike. Traction in dirt or mud is a science in itself.
Here i was think low and low- were the correct way to pull something heavy up inclines in the game. That or get a running start with high gear and go from there
If this was on the BBC and David Attenborough would narrate it it would be called "Trucks In The Wild: The Weird & Wonderful Mating Behavior"... 😁😇🤟
"We see here, the lesser spotted Kolob performing its trademark mating maneuver."
Because there are so many variables in game mechanics, saber likey decided to go with a simple code for torque. Most likey a simple weight vs power + terrain.
Could well be as simple as that. All just guesswork but it's clear something else is going on!
Anyway to import the steering wheel settings from Mudrunner to snowrunner, Mudrunner has native wheel support while snow runner does not
I'd bet not-real money that there IS a form of torque, it's just relatively "lazily implemented" torque (as in "not insanely difficult to develop well and potentially too computationally heavy in addition to everything else going on").
It would make sense from a sort of gamification standpoint, too. Having your "L" gears provide more torque adds to the tradeoff of using a Highrange gearbox rather than an Offroad gearbox.
Additionally, you'll never convince me that a game which properly emulates offroading would be enjoyable to the general gaming public.
Great comment, it's definitely not difficult to implement torque crudely as it's quite crude in reality. And as you said, it's good for game differentiation and playability. There's always this theme of realism being fun but I know many developers deliberately choose to avoid it for the sake of accessibility, enjoyment and so on. We'd be stuck far more often in SnowRunner otherwise!
never played snow runner, is there only a semi auto? or is there a full manual gearbox?
so your telling me all those gifs of trucks glitching out of reality onto the 4th plane of existence isn't realistic?
Oh that's totally realistic, sometimes I see trucks spinning overhead in old Blighty.
i wonder what was it like in mudrunner or spintires
Very interesting, but few seasons ago, I used Derry Longhorn 4520 and L- don't help ;)
I think engine output helps too. The Tayga worked well for demonstrating the topic as it's less powerful than the 73210 (and/or has fewer wheels?). I think the 4520 is less capable overall but maybe on a gentler incline you would see a difference.
@@ATribeCalledCars but voron grad with the most powerful engine starts off with a heavy load without switching to L
3:00 Why don't the wheels spin when you get stuck? To me it feels like old style traction control where it just decrease the power to the wheels until the wheels stop spinning. which is not great if you are stuck off road.
Is this available for iphone or is it a pc game?
Never heard of this before, would love to play it
We need the creators to gear this video and start getting on it
01:20 At least I'm not the worst person at driving onto a transport trailer 😂😂
I've had a truck refuse to pull away on steep tarmac until I used low range, so yeah it always seemed to me that torque was in the game.
I have ~400 hours in this game, it became obvious rather quickly that lower gears can get you un-stuck if your trailer is high-centered
if you have much wheel spin, you don't have traction, this game show this beautifuly... low gears allow the wheels to pulse and gain traction.
I'm fascinated that since the start of this mud trucking series from Spintires till now they still didn't add proper manual boxes with proper clutch! Absoultely hate this arcade box stuff with low/high range without option for manual changing...
Love your videos, mate. Always good for a thought, and a laugh 💯
I have over 2.5k hours in snowrunner, but know very little about gaming, in general. I do know a bit about cars, and physics.
Torque is an engine specification that varies with RPM and is mainly affected by the rotational mass and geometry of the engine's moving parts (to oversimplify).
Everyone focuses on horsepower, but torque is what you feel, or the net result of what the engine does with that HP. Both are measured by manufacturers at the crank shaft, and do not take into account the parasitic drag of the drivetrain. Maximum engine torque always occurs at a given RPM, and is expressed as xxxHP, producing xxxlb/ftTorque@xxxRPM.
The transmission simply regulates the levels of torque that reach the drive wheels, based on load, and traction. If you see water/mud/snow being pulled over the tire tops, shift down (reducing wheel speed/torque) until you can see the tires at full throttle. You will gain traction and save fuel. 👍
Many factors affect traction, but without it, all the power, torque, and gearing in the world are useless. Tire diameter also affects torque and rolling resistance at the wheel (smaller diameter = more torque/acceleration, but more rolling resistance), while tire width has a greater impact on traction.
For this reason, I almost always run the biggest tires, but spend most my time in the low range, occasionally shifting to H, with the off-road or snowrunner transmissions. 👍
All that said, it probably wouldn't be too difficult to approximate the factory torque curves, which leaves gearing, traction, and rolling resistance as primary variables. 🤔
I've found the Kodiak to be a good example: With a fully loaded fuel tank add-on I struggle to climb some inclines (paved road, dirt) on Maine Lowlands when AWD is switched on. With only RWD active the engine's torque is not distributed on two axles and climbing seems faster.
That is a bad example because that's the opposite of what you would experience in reality. The more wheels you drive, the more torque can be used to push the vehicle forward. If you drive only two wheels, the amount of torque you can put on the ground is limited by their traction. They are more likely to spin than when you power more wheels.
Is it? Because the wheels with split torque distribution won't turn, but the single axis does.
@@mikereisswolff4662 If all diffs are open and one powered wheel has lower or no traction, that can harm your total traction and even bring it down to zero. But with locked diffs more wheels will always give you more traction. In most situations having more driven wheels will help you drive over terrain even without locked diffs, unless the vehicle loses momentum and gets stuck in a situation where one or more wheels lose traction.
If you look at game files which truck data is stored in xml files there is line under engine section called "Torque="" so yes game does have it.
Can you do a video on a Pacific P16 please?
I know I'm late to commenting on this, but tire size also affects this. Try the same test you used in this video but with smaller tires vs bigger tires. The smaller tires rightfully can apply MORE torque to the ground and will be easier to pull things vs the big tires.
I googled if the size of the wheels has an effect on the traction force and I found this, thank you. :)
And it seems that gears affect fuel consumption in different ways, basically high gear is the more efficient than low gears, but has less torque
Yes, and potentially tied to RPM but I didn't switch to the cabin view to check (and a visual display could actually be wrong anyway).
@@ATribeCalledCars I'm using a keyboard, so I couldn't really check how much it is connected to the rpm itself rather than the gears
Great topic, Ben. However, without the ability to decompile the code and understand what's actually going on underneath there is much that we can only ever hypothesize on. I don't have a problem with that as I want to enjoy a game, not deconstruct it.
Oh yeah, as I say it's a hypothesis and doesn't really make the game more or less fun to me. But I quite like picking apart preconceptions and ideas.
@@ATribeCalledCars To be fair, I was not acutely aware that the presence, or lack of, torque was a debated topic. I think that a comprehensive test of tire performance would be cool as tire inflation, tread design, compound and rotational speed have a huge amount of affect on traction. There does seem to be some difference in tire performance even when the data says they should be identical.
@@MrBlaktoe Agreed, I am thinking about some sort of test but the variables kick in with tyres.
did you guys notice a diff lock on front wheels failing to turn at the same time?
Yep, it's not true diff lock it seems.
People who argue that the game has no proper torque simulation are the same one who exclusively use "Auto" for driving around.
My biggest question still is : Does tyre shape and profile affect grip in mud? Say you have tyres with the the exact same stats on paper, but one set still outperforms the other, why exactly is that? I'd love to hear more info on that from the devs. Must be a reason why the DMHS tyres have been added, can't be purely cosmetic I reckon.
A player has gone into xml for tires and found numbers for tire grip, asphalt, dirt and mud stats. A lot of off road tires have 3 dirt and mud rated at 1.9, 1.8 or 1.5 depending what you take. The DMHS has 2 for mud and dirt, most mud tires it's 2.4 dirt 2 mud or 2 dirt 2.4 mud. Someone posted a interesting question, Is there a difference between 6 tires and 10 tires? Off road with 10 tires would protentally be better then 6 mid tires.
There is 4 mud tires that do have good mud rating, the version that has 4 varients.
@@redstergamin1885 Where your assessment fails is in thinking that every variable in the game is accessible via configuration files. It's a common flaw in these type of arguments. Having some information doesn't mean that you have all the information.
There a lot going on that we don't have numerical visibility into. This reality that we don't have every minute factor at our disposal is an issue that is typically very difficult for some people to get their heads around.
@@MrBlaktoe true. But I have changed out all my tires based off that list and have been getting around a little better then before.
I was testing in the Amur region, installing various tires on the Tayga 6436. I can only say that at least in the snow, the new DMHS tires definitely behave differently than the MHS variants. DMHS II tires were the winners in terms of cross-country ability in medium and deep snow, DMHS I turned out to be slightly worse despite the outwardly much more aggressive tread. All MHS variants are inferior to them.
However, there may be other results in the mud. The physics of mud in Snowrunner is quite mysterious.
Fleet star is one of the snowrunner trucks of time
Just because it's not there in the in-game stats doesn't mean there's no torque. I mean, this is probably my experience with SpinTires and MudRunner speaking, but I never doubted there was torque in this game.
Absolutely, it's just a common idea I wanted to talk about. I think it always seemed like SnowRunner was somewhat more advanced than some players realised.
@@ATribeCalledCars And some of those players might be too used to Forza and Need for Speed and whatnot, heh.
Torque is not the only thing lacking in Snowrunner. It also lacks a properly simulated Automatic and Manual transmission. The tyres are a hit of miss, behaves nothing like the real thing. I have no clue how friction coefficients operate in this game because it feels flawed. The engine sounds are all generic during acceleration and zero during RPM drops. Engine load feels entirely dissimilar to reality. Snowrunner is video game not Simulator
Heres the gist, that kind of transparent number labeled AngV is angular velocity, and its proven to be an artificial gear changer iirc, the higher the gear the less engine torque transferred to the wheels pretty much, with low - being allowed acces to the full amount, which isn't multiplied btw, there's nothing hyper realistic going on. I don't know exactly how its calculated but that's a very rough draft of how it works.
TLDR, low - and low can access more engine torque provided the tires can grip.
It has been changed, low- did not do anything like this earlier, the actual best gear was Low+ and High. To get away from the auto-shifting craziness. High would just fly over most things, and Low+ would give controlled speeds in mud and let you kind-of-crawl. The previous iteration of this you would just be standing there, you can find old videos linked on reddit from 2 years ago showing this.
Right now it kind of works, however it's not realistic in any way. Diff-locks do not lock anything and the automatic clutch works like a super super strong traction control - it will not allow you to stall the truck when not in high, and the tires have way too much grip. In real life this truck would do one of; 1. break drivetrain or 2. pull the load or 3. spin all drive tires.
equip the offroad/snowrunner gear box on scout 800 with basic engine and smallest wheel size, set off driving in low+ gear... now go change to the largest wheel size and try to set off driving again in low+ gear. you see the difference straight out of the garage, there's not enough low end torque to move the larger wheel diameter. torque is what gets things turning, BHP keeps shit turning is the simplest way of looking at it. torque is definitely a part of the spintire equation
Hey what's with the "truck not available in america" or "truck not available in eurasia" message in the truck store? I can still buy a truck, retain it and then deploy it in any map, so what's the point of that?
I guess to give each store a regional theme but in practice it's a waste of time as you can easily move trucks around.
@@ATribeCalledCars I think it was meant to be a factor in hard mode, when you take a truck from region to another, you pay $3500, so it discourage you to buy a Russian truck then transfer it to American map by making it not just waste of time but costly.
@@Helmy67 Could well be, if hard mode was always in the pipeline (and it probably was given dev time etc).
Just like in real life, importing a vehicle is possible but extra hassle.
@@ATribeCalledCars maybe the hard mode was in their mind beforehand.
Nice 👍
Cheers, Dee.
Most of the time you would a truck torque to one side when moving a heavy load maybe that is why alot of people think rhere is no torque in the game
It still feels off though. I feel like that truck should get that load rolling at least a little bit up the hill easily in lowest gear. Maybe they need to tweak it more
There is no direct physical dependency between torque and rotation speed. Thus, the faster the rotation, the more torque is simply wrong. The faster something rotates with the same torque, the more power is output.
fuel consumption, however, is just a number written as a multiplier. I can enter any number there and will see it as a result on screen for each gear option there is. Fuel consumption should not be used as any indicator. It's just there as a balancing factor, that's even not very well done for lots of the trucks.
That is new, I tried this about 2 years ago and I had less torgue in low and low - than in low +
And equal torgue in low+ and auto1
I'm pretty sure they're just faking it. I say this because I have had trucks bog down even on slippery terrain. So imagine a similar scenario as to what you were doing but not only with a slippery surface but also only two axles and MUCH less weight. (To be specific I was using a modded F750 carrying two slots of cargo. Getting stuck is one things, but not being able to spin the tires in the mud is another.)
One thing i feel like you dont understand is the balance between traction, torque and weight distribution. Too much traction will stop the wheels turning. Combine that with weight distribution and the result is that 8x8 works best. It’s physics. Because of this, the tayga 6436 works better with 6x6, rather than 10x10. The 10x10 has way too much traction and weight distribution is very unbalanced. Try it.
what if you revved your truck in neutral and violated inserted a low- should get anything rotating
Bounce starts definitely can work in some situations!
I do that with small scouts to increase acceleration, and it seems to work. Even heavier trucks are affected by this.
Bro can we get Dev Tools in default maps
Funny. Not much played yet, and even less driven off-road, though my impression of lack of realism was directed to the other way. You can do stuff in SR I would not expect to be able to do IRL.
have you ever considered doing multiplayer content?
maybe the mecanics were updated recently
Definitely, that complicates things further.
BeamNG drive and Snowrunner teams should team up!
anyone who has driven a real heavy truck, not a pickup truck but a real 40t + truck, and also has done this offroad understands this.
Exactly. Unfortunately the largest truck I've driven is a Unimog.
they could put a grader or a roller in
My theory is if you're playing snowrunner without off road gearbox, you need to immediately uninstall. You were probably trying to install Forza 5 but clicked on the wrong button.
The off road gearbox can get you out of so many situations. Even on a long asphalt route, the high range gearbox is useless cos it gives you so much speed, you lose complete control of your truck.
Enjoyed your comment. Although I'd say some trucks such as the Tayga 6436 can be decent with the highrange unless you need to pull the biggest cargo.
So the torque on the streets is gaining traction?
You could say it's torque of the town.
Snowrunner physics is like the Cars movies--the more you think about it, the less it makes sense.
Bruh this is off-roading/ hauling 101 😂
Интересная теория. Мне кажется как будто что то толкает машину а колеса просто крутятся. Особенно заметно когда после первой скорости переключаешь на повышенную (8-ми скоростная коробка передач). Еще бесит когда нужно переключить с четвертой на третью а она переключает на первую 😅
Ahhh Mudder Nature 🍃
They did a sneaky update lol
Heh yeah quite possibly but we'll never be able to prove it.
@@ATribeCalledCars why not? It would be enough to have a test made on different versions of the game
@@NoRHK It would need to be done on older versions of the game, which would be hard to do given the need to update.
I've never understood the power-to-weight stat. Totally pointless unless you do drag racing xD.
One word for Torque: TUZ!!!
Engines do not rev in low gears so no torque.
You can hear engines do. At least, most. But given the often poor engine noises it's hard to know for sure what's going on. Especially without a rev counter.