While most owners will agree the GS is AMAZING on the road, do you agree with me that these full-size ADV bikes are just too heavy for serious off road use? Sound off below. Stay tuned for my accessories and mods video coming this Thursday. 🏍 🏍 Gear featured in this review: ⚡ Klim Krios Pro Helmet: imp.i104546.net/WD9gOM ⚡ MSR Xplorer Suit: bit.ly/3SjxHwk ⚡ Klim Adventure GTX Gloves: imp.i104546.net/Eax204 ⚡ Forma Adventure: imp.i104546.net/vnXJ6e 🏍 SUPPORT BIG ROCK MOTO BY USING THESE LINKS! ⚠Rocky Mountain ATV/MC: bit.ly/33kgRIz ⚠Revzilla: imp.i104546.net/6bxxXN ⚠Mosko Moto: moskomoto.com/bigrockmoto ⚠Amazon: amzn.to/3viGZ0A ⚠Merchandise: big-rock-moto.myspreadshop.com/ ⚠Patreon: www.patreon.com/bigrockmedia
I think it's just like you said. They can work, but ONLY in the right hands, and even then, some offroad tracks will be strictly off-limits to these bikes. I watched some dirt bike contents recently and saw things I wouldn't want my Tiger 1200 to ever see.
They are definitely far too heavy for off road use even if I am a tall and rather big guy. I only use mine for road travel and maybe a bit of gravel every now and then. It is fantastic however for long travel!
I recently got a lowered version and feel like it rides great off-road but don’t have sand here. It’s not good going down hill in any conditions with all that weight otherwise feels surprisingly good. Is that suit hot? I’m looking to get one but it’s hot as hell where I live in the south.
This guy dropped his personal motorcycle for your education people. TWICE!! No one else would do that. Even the ones that get FREE motorcycles on their channel. they treat them like a baby and garage them. It's a motorcycle meant to be used for or its intended purpose. You're the real deal man and we appreciate your efforts!
I'm still riding my r1150GS from 2002. Actually I'm in Alaska having rode it from los Angeles last week. I can't believe how comfortable I've been, even over the roughest roads. It's an incredible bike. I've been contemplating upgrading to a newer bike like the 1250, but can't seem to let this old beaten GS go! I'll be at 80k miles when I get back to California. It's been such a pleasure and every morning I can't wait to get on it
Keep the 1150. 80k miles is only half broken in. You won’t get enough money for it to put toward a worthy replacement or “upgrade”. This is coming from someone who just bought a Brand Spankin 1250 GSA. I just wanted something from new that I can put 200k on with minor maintenance and actually easy to work on myself. If they still offered something as simple as the 1150, I would have bought that instead.
I totally agree. I have a 2007 GS and while the new bikes are awesome, you can do the same things on a way more simple and possibly reliable air cooled older model.
Hi Ian, I think you captured perfectly the nature of GS1250. I have a 2021 R1250GS Adventure, and I totally agree that it's too big and heavy for serious off road use. Even with 52 years of riding experience, and background racing motocross, and riding single-track trails, etc., I find the big GSA scary as h*ll to ride in deep sand or gravel, as the front end has a mind of its own and can quickly get away from you and throw you on the ground. I'm 5'9" in height and that's just barely tall enough to get both feet on the ground, and that's on the balls of my feet, not flat footed, which makes it dicey when trying to dab a foot down off road. Not confidence inspiring when going through tricky off-road sections. It always surprises me that the GSA does as well as it does off-road, just as long as the conditions aren't too challenging. When it comes to road touring, with occasional forays onto hard packed dirt or gravel roads, the big GSA is hard to beat. The extra gas tank capacity is really handy for being able to get into some truly remote locations without having to worry about the next fuel stop. Heated seat and grips are great for cold weather, and I love the various riding modes, traction control, anti-lock braking, and all the other cool features of the BMW. I've found my GSA to be reliable and a ton of fun to ride. I'm really curious about the 2024 BMW R1300GS, and knowing BMW it'll be even better than the R1250GS. Tempting. Cheers, Jeff
Ian, dropping the bike not once but twice on purpose, holy buckets! Your reviews are the most complete and comprehensive on the web. Thank you for all you do!
Okay, I'll come clean...I'm a "Starbucks" GS owner. Never take mine off-road. Love the looks, highway cruising manners, top loading luggage, crash protection and ability to go down a country gravel road without damaging the pretty plastic bodywork on an RT. I've owned several GS/GSA's, in addition to a 2017 R1200RT. Much prefer the GS as a touring motorcycle, compared to my R1200RT. Couldn't wait to get rid of the RT, and go back to a GS. I realize the GSA is simply a GS with a big gas tank and OEM crash bars, but I never cared for my 2019 R1250GSA. It just felt too big to me. I'm back on a '23 R1250GS and couldn't be happier! Also have a fantastic '22 Triumph Tiger 900 GT Pro. Great bike, and indeed a bit lighter, but it just "ain't" a GS. Something about the way the Germans have refined the GS that's hard to describe. Similar to how Porsche has refined the Porsche 911 over the years. As always, great review Ian. Keep up the good work young man. At just shy of 72 years old, is it okay to call you "young man?" :) :) :)
I had a 1100 GS, I just never fell in love with it. It just felt way too heavy. I went to a Super Tenere 1200, and for some reason it just feels better. I'm not sure if its the suspension, the engine or seat height. It feels a lot more stable. Boring as hell, but just stable. I can ride it a lot harder off road than I could the BMW. I've dropped both bikes a couple times. The Super Tenere is easier for me to pick up. It might be that I decided to start working out more after getting into heavier bikes though. Or I learned a better technique for picking them up. The GS does have an advantage with the boxer engine sticking out on each side with the crash bars. I have crash bars on my Super Tenere, so it doesn't go over as far as it could without them. Good review. LIke your channel a lot.
Great channel but I disagree with your opinion about bar risers and off-road. 1st you have your bars rotated way back towards you and the bars are low, look at the kink at the wrist when you’re standing, when off road you can’t run your bars in the same position as you do while sitting for on road use. i have a 22 gsa with 1 inch up and 3/4 inch back, when I’m doing off-road i rotate the bars up so while standing you have a nice straight line from the Elbow to the hand, Also standing and gripping the bike with the knees make a 100% improvement, i Never sit off-road. Sand, no issues, lean back and rpm is your friend, you’re having issue because your loading the front of the bike because of body position and your not using your Kees to grip the bike
Great points but I still have PTSD from all the sand I rode my 2017GS on in the Utah BDR. Many painful falls. When you're far away from help, it's tough to just open the throttle, lean back, and hope the elephant stays upright but, I guess, that's the best way.
@@gmoneymac23 ..true, it’s not a true off road bike and wasn’t designed to be, anytime you ride a “dual” sport or adv bike you have to compromise something but with some adjustments and proper body position, it can be made to work a lot better, his bar position/height etc is not conducive for the conditions he’s riding and like most, I don’t think he’s informed by his comments. Not bashing him at all, I do enjoy his channel
Personally, I love the thing. It really does everything well, for me anyway, except technical and single track terrain for which I have a 350 Husky. I’m always amazed how it simply plows through rocky washes that would have my DS deflecting and bouncing. The biggest PITA is changing tires back and forth from street to knobs. Mine is a std GS btw & I have a 30” inseam.
Many GS buyers would be really happy on an RT. But, just like there are mall-crawling Jeep Wranglers.. there are GS's on the road when an RT would be superior.
Okay, I'll come clean...I'm a "Starbucks" GS owner. Never take mine off-road. Love the looks, highway cruising manners, top loading luggage, crash protection and ability to go down a country gravel road without damaging the pretty plastic bodywork on an RT. I've owned several GS/GSA's, in addition to a 2017 R1200RT. Much prefer the GS as a touring motorcycle, compared to my R1200RT. Couldn't wait to get rid of the RT, and go back to a GS. I realize the GSA is simply a GS with a big gas tank and OEM crash bars, but I never cared for my 2019 R1250GSA. It just felt too big to me. I'm back on a '23 R1250GS and couldn't be happier! Also have a fantastic '22 Triumph Tiger 900 GT Pro. Great bike, and indeed a bit lighter, bit it just "ain't" a GS. Something about the way the Germans have refined the GS that's hard to describe. Similar to how Porsche has refined the Porsche 911 over the years. As always, great review Ian. Keep up the good work young man. At just shy of 72 years old, is it okay to call you "young man?" :) :) :)
This 2020 model is one of the best looking of all the GS and GSA machines you've shown us. Your earlier history video with comparisons of all modern GSs is the bible for GS fans! I'm personally looking forward to the release of the 1300 model because (I hope) some great buys on used 2020+ 1250s will come on the market. Thanks for another inspiring "ride along" on a GS.
GS if you want to go off-road, lighter and lower. GSA for the ultimate comfort, wind protection and road presence. I just completed a 1500mile round solo ride and the GSA was a champ.
Big adv bikes are too heavy for serious off road, otherwise we need to be Chris birch. In my experience, well I am not that experienced - big bikes drain our energy pretty quickly while doing serious off road like a path filled with a lot of big stones. It is extremely difficult and u need to have incredible physique to do so
Please put some rubber under these bikes before you drop them, I am starting to develop a nervous twitch and anxiety just at the point you let them drop.
There are several reasons why the middle weight ADV market is exploding while the over 1000cc ADV segment is dying…….first and foremost $30k+ for a 1250 is obscene…second is the weight @600lbs….as for options, good luck finding a “stripper” because 99.9999% of dealer inventory has every factory bell and whistle as standard…..and even “loaded” the GS/GSA do not include aluminum hard cases…that’s and extra @$2500+ A more accurate ‘test’ of a ADV bike is how well it handles single track….since that’s how the majority, regardless of brand, are marketed…The reality is they are meant for highway droning more than anything else…like a Goldwing After a extended demo test of the ,cough cough , CFMOTO Ibex 800T….. I was completely impressed… loaded for under $13k ..and for perspective my current stable consists of : 2013 GSA, 2014 R9T, 1994 Ducati 888SPO LTD, 2016 Aprilia RSV4(race) 2015 KTM 300XCW(race) and a 2023 KTM 300XC(race)… As usual Ian, your evals are spot on, honest and well informed…
I've had several GS's over the years and really thought I'd get another one but ended up going with a Suzuki GSX-S100GT for more on-road performance AND the new V-Strom 800DE for a little more off-road performance. Both bikes new together are still a little less $$ than a loaded GSA. If I had to have one bike its the GS.....
I've always held that the GS 1250 is radically overrated. The suspension on that bike is a BAD joke. There's no points of adjustability like there is on the Triumph 1200 and the Super Ten. Even a skateboard feels like it has good suspension on GOOD roads, but that bike's electronic suspension has zero idea what to do with the damping. It bucks, kicks, and rides like crap as soon as you get on messed up roads, or rutted up dirt roads. There's a lot of things I don't like about that motorcycle, but that suspension is the absolute deal breaker. Anyone who thinks the suspension on that motorcycle is actually good, wouldn't know what good suspension is if it was sitting on their face and twitching.
I owned 2 BMs before and one thing that stands out is their Dealer Support although pricey. It was the nicest when I got stranded in the Karoo desert with a failed battery and I could call a recovery team who raced out to meet me in under 3 hours. I'm not a fan of the big GS machines though. They are too big, but nice to look at. I miss the F650GS Dakar. I really enjoyed touring with it.
I agree, for me the dealer support network worldwide is an important factor when choosing a bike. BMW’s is not cheap but its reach and service quality is second to none.
Love my GSA as a primarily road touring bike, with the ability to go slightly off road, but that's it for me. I like this drivetrain so much (except for the quick shifter - I use the clutch) that I'd like to add an RT before they switch over to the 1300. Great balanced review 👍
Holy shit you have some serious skills. I was already on the edge of my seat when you were going 60mph over a sand path, but then the sand... Very impressive riding. Good review as always and nice to learn a thing or two about off road riding during it
Hey Ian, like you, I've had the range of GS offerings. I currently have a '22 GS that I have completed about 8k miles of off-road riding on (CO, UT, WY, NM, OAT, Baja and AR backroads TAT). I have to agree with you completely. The bike is capable and great in 80% of the situations I have taken it through.... Sand being its biggest achenes heal. My most challenging accomplishment on the GS was taking it up and over Black Bear Pass in CO, although doable, it was so heavy on that loose rocky shale. I am going to keep the GS for my Adv touring, but as you know, I picked up a Tuareg 660 for my more dedicated off road ADV riding adventures (BDRs, round 2 of Baja, etc).
Personally, I would be very impressed if that new bike you said you were buying was the V-Strom 800DE. I was thinking of returning to the KLR 650 and then you described that Suzuki as being like the KLR but with more power. I would like to hear more on that!
Another awesome review!! I think if I was going to have two bikes in my stable I would definitely have that bike and a lightweight dual sport. That way you are covered for every situation. ✌️
Drove one for a few minutes. Its handling reminded me a bit of the V85TT but the quickshifter is years behind those from Triumph and most likely KTM. Speaking of KTM, did you have the chance to try a SAR?
I understand Ian have tried to get his hands om a KTM 1290 SA R/S but KTM hasn't so far responded to him?! Hopefully KTM dealer close enough to him will come around and make it possible... Cant imagine why KTM still doesn't take the chance of this free exposure, considering the quality Ian has of the reviews.
Feel the same way about the sand on my 1250. I dread it and mud. Have literally no confidence in it and try to avoid it all costs, which you shouldn't have to do on an adventure bike, however, while it's a huge PITA, i just adore my 1250gs. Every bike lacks somewhere. You did really well through the sand though! Lets not kid ourselves either Ian, if you sell this bike you know you'll just get another GS later. :) Love the content!
Hi Ian, great spot on review. I am on my second GS, I had a 2017 R1200GS Rallye which was fantastic and I now have a GSA Rallye which is awesome. The way I would describe the GS is it does everything well but nothing brilliantly. Actually it is brilliant at being an all rounder. I quite often use it just as a quick personal transporter to get through heavy traffic and I quite often take my wife as a pillion with all the luggage on for anything between a day and a week on tour. I have been tempted on several occasions by the new Honda Goldwing (2019 onwards) which I think would be the ultimate 2 up luxury tourer. The GS is not the most relaxing ride. I am not in the luxury position of being able to keep the GS and buy a Goldwing as well. My question is, do you think I would miss the GS and it’s convenience as an all rounder?
GW does one thing very good, but personally I would be missing the lower weight, the low speed maneuverability, the capability of dropping from a curb, the light off road attitude. I don’t see the GW as a city commuter, the GS also isn’t but it’s more at ease in the city than the GW If the main thing you’re doing is long distance road touring the GW should be better even than the K1600, but as you said it’s not an all rounder
Just curious, what's your opinion for a tall guy bike? I'm 6'7" and was thinking about the GS. I'm currently on a KTM 790r which I love but want something that fits better and is more comfortable on long highway miles.
I'm 6-5 and the GS is the most "comfortable" do it all bike. The RT would be better for pure highway riding. I've tried other big ADV bikes and they seem to still have a more forward riding position with rearward footpegs(KTM 1290, for example) bending my long legs too much. I bought my 17GS used and it has the low suspension. Too good of a deal but I wish I had the standard suspension. It's great in everything but sand.
For my purposes I want the big heavy bikes as I will mostly be doing road touring with only light to moderate off road. So I am trying to decide between the GSA, The multistrada V4, the desertX, the 1290 Super Adventure, the Triumph Tiger 1200, Africa Twin, and the Pan America. Well for ADV's anyways, also looking a touring bikes from BMW, Honda, HD, & Indian and sport touring from BMW, KTM, Motoguzi too. And I am also looking maybe at some of the midrange adv too. I am spoiled for choice really, but I can only have one.
Only thing I can say to you: You only come so far reading about bikes and watching reviews... The real answers comes when you test ride a bike. So from dealer network, your own preferences, price and costs, seat height and so on - you can maybe narrow down to three or four bikes. Then try them out and feel for yourself. To your list I can add Suzuki V-strom 1050 if it is available in your country. I haven't tried out this bike myself yet, but it falls into your frame of bikes to choose between.....
You do some good reviews, I like watching them all even if I don't intend to buy any of the bikes. However I am considering a 1250GSA or GS, I find going from a bigger engine to a smaller engine (to a Tenere in this case) I really miss the power of the bigger engine. However I'm gonna do a little soapbox here on the quickshifter. Most people complain at it being clunky and choppy and that's because it was never intended to be used at low RPMs. The QS in all bikes is just a very clever "cut the ignition / gas for X/ms so we relieve the pressure currently on the gears so we can shift gears"-electroics thing. So it's really intended for fast acceleration and upshifts meaning you should be relatively high in the rev-range for it to work smoothly. As for the downshifts, or blipper, you want to be lower in the RPMs for it be smooth. Having owned a couple of bikes, both the MT09 and MT10 SP models as well as some bikes without QS I learned about the clutchless shifting and while I'm no master I can certainly figure out from riding a bike when I can upshift or downshift without using the clutch. Same principle applies only with the QS you can just nail the gas and go up. I never ever used it for 1-2 shifting because you have the dead-space of Neutral in between. For true seamless up and down shifts you probably need a "seamless gearbox" but afaik that's only available at the highest racing level, like MotoGP. I could be wrong there though - and my point really is: don't treat the QS as a ticket to shift up and/or down (if you have a blipper) whenever you feel like it, because that's not really what it's good at. And I'm sure BMWs auto-shift-assist thing is not a regular QS that most other bikes have, but it sure sounds like it should be treated as one. :) You can all disagree with me that's fine, but if you have clunky upshifts you're simply too low in the rev range. would you go 2-3-4-5 if you where doing it manually and still keeping it under 4k rpm? If not then don't do it with a QS. :) Again great video, thanks for putting so much time in to them.
When you're hard on the gas is really the best time to use them anyway, way faster than pulling the clutch in to shift, and manually shifting can occasionally upset the bike if you mess it up, or miss a gear, or dump the clutch too soon, etc. Using the clutch is a perfectly normal part of riding a motorcycle, makes sense to be very proficient at it. Up and down quickshifters are still so fun though.
Maybe change the title. 11 months later, nothing official about an R1400. AI - Bot voice is not natural. “ no Adventure version announced” R 1300 GS R 1300 GS Pure R 1300 GS Trophy R 1300 GS Trophy X R 1300 GS Triple Black R 1300 GS Option 719
Haha and the Adventure model is even fatter and definitely not built for off-road. The stock crash bars bend with the lightest drop ever. Despite it being a generally good bike, it's kind of a scam!
Seems to me as a 40+ rider. The nay sayers are hard core off roaders. This bike it’s not that. I am still looking at my 1st AV scooter. It’s between the GS 1250 & Ducati Multi strata pikes peak. And I do know the difference, so don’t shit on me. The Ducati is my midlife crisis super bike that can still get me to the fishing hole. 😊
I think people being realistic with their needs is the primary reason bikes get a bad reputation. I think that people who want a serious offroading bike should start off with a light bike from the jump. A Dr650 with basic suspension would be easier to handle than a 600lb adventure bike with fancy suspension. I think BMW nails it with a 19" spoked wheel for a balance between curvy road performance and reasonable handling off-road with the ability to get you out of a bad spot if you find yourself there. Purposely taking it down a single track though isn't it's purpose. I think that triumph has really honed in on what the ADV market wants which is mid and full size bikes that are available in two versions. One that is good on road but can handle basic offroading or one that is really good off-road but has reasonable onroad performance. Imagine if you applied this across all platforms like the Yamaha outfit. Imagine you could get a tracer 9 gt or tracer 9 rally. Imagine you could get an updated tenere 1200 GT or rally. Being realistic with what my needs our and watching every review on this channel what I've realized is that for me a tiger 1200 GT pro is about perfect for me. I wanted something lighter for off-road performance but being realistic my main priority is passenger comfort and touring performance. The weight isn't as important but having extra power and shaft drive is worth the compromise and the occasional gravel and dirt will be reasonable with a 19" wheel. Another realizing I've made from watching this channel is that I'm heavily considering buying a used r1200/1250 GS to save some money and test the waters of how I like a heavier bike for a few years and if I don't like it I can sell it for about the same price I bought it for.
Ian, Merriam Webster says "What does this mean for you, o person who says height as though it's spelled heighth? Merely that you're a little behind the times, and perhaps a stickler for consistency. We still won't judge you. But since your fellow 21st century English speakers likely will, we recommend you pronounce height with a \t\ at the end instead.". ... listen from 3:15 to 4:48 if you are not aware of it...
Just think how much you can save without all that bullsxxt electronic stuff that alot of riders think they need ! I ride a 2006 GS abs only, love it, motorcycles should be simple and my 4 wheeler is a 1982 vw vanagon. Thats just me!
Hello big rock moto am from Uganda East Africa I was requesting u make for us a review showing the differences Among bmw gs hp, trophy, Te & rally give us more details on the differences I want to own one mostly commuting like 100km daily
The GS is the on-off-on road pick for many Australian riders, very long distances, poor dirt roads. BMW Motorrad Aus runs an annual GS enduro Safari with support crew. They also run off-road courses in the lead up to each year's Enduro Safari. ruclips.net/video/qqI-xG_Jwjo/видео.html
Great video and a fantastic bike,probably the best in the world. However no way on God's earth is it designed to go off road and it's ridiculous to do it. Get a proper 250 0r 350 Honda for that sort of stuff, something you can pick up easily. Thanks for sharing and nearly wrecking your bike.
I sold mine after a few months, at a loss, just not my kind of bike, after the RT1150, and then the RT1200, then the GT1600, I got what I rate as the best bike suited for me of-course the RT1250, not better than the GT1600 but lighter, easier to handle in the garage, but I am sure it is horses for courses.
you having the random "won't start dead battery syndrome" issue that so many are having around the world with those model years? Sad that BMW didn't standup and take ownership of the issue for all those owners. Says a lot about the company and not in good way. Sad because its such a great motorcycle.
Please do not take this suggestion as an insult or trolling but your presentation style would benefit immensely if you got rid off of the gesture displayed e.g. at 47:01. It is unique in a non flattering way, slightly disturbing. Good luck with a good show!
I've owned every motorcycle in 61 yrs and the BMW GS Adventure is my choice and I agree it's more road oriented but none of the other brands even come close to the GS imo.
The 12xxGS is a good example of how good the BMW marketing is are compared to the buyers ability to find a bike that fits their needs and technical skill set😂😂
I am going to buy a ADV soon. Please do a comparison between the KTM 1290 SAS and the BMW R 1250 GSA. I don't trust any other bike review out there as much as I do of yours!
I'd have been more impressed if BMW had gone +2 years on the warranty on the 1300. Is the 7/850 due for refreshment? You've been poking Orange balloons?
My experience with the 2023 GS 3 year vs 1 year warranty $5K more than AT, but almost the same price with options: Factory 2" Lower option, suspension raises and lowers w/button press, Steering damper, Heated Seats, Pannier racks, Quick shifter, Heated grips, tpm, cruise control Lower center of gravity Boxer engines are bulletproof - 150K miles BMW prices will increase 10% in 2024 This is the last model year for the 1250, i.e. most reliable Shaft drive = no oil mess Same weight as AT DCT 33 more hp, 29 more ftlb No brake dive Torx fasteners Panels remove easily, unlike AT Beautiful titanium engine guards available! Goodness! The mechanical engineering is artwork Higher quality materials GS issues: Needs premium fuel Sounds like a tractor Wheel spoke maintenance every oil change Annoying display Grip/seat heater button hard to reach Hand guards weak, direct flow in my face Kickstand awkward Keyless gas cap finicky Standard headlight not LED GPS mount blocks the display and is complicated
It is good on dirt - good on pavement but not great at anything. I have a 1200 GSA, a KTL 1600, and an old LT and a Honda CRF 250. I will take the LT/KTL on pavement over the GSA anytime. The GSA bike has two cylinders - you need at least 4 or 6 cylinders on pavement going long distance! Don’t buy this bike if you just want to long distance tour on pavement. Don’t buy this bike if you want to ride a lot on dirt. Buy a smaller cc enduro bike. However, if you want to ride this bike anywhere it is good BUT not great! Also, this two cylinder bike has reached its limits- stretching it to a 1300 displacement is ridiculous!
I would love to own a facelift model (so 2013 or newer) 1200, or even the 1250... But man the used price is killing me... With 100.000km's/60.000miles at 2013-2014 they still go for arround 11.000€ at the minimum... And the thing is, i can easely spend that... But for a toy?? Couse lets be honest, its a toy, especially since i need a car for my job and my own work (farm+side gigs). But maybe one day... Honestly hopeing that the launch of 1300 models hits the 1200 range in terms of reseale price.
I just spent the month of July on a 2017 Africa Twin. A hair under 10k miles from NH to Nashville then up to SD, Yellowstone Idaho Washington and back. Saw 3 other AT's. A bazillion Harleys and GS bikes of various years and models. Lots of Triumphs. I sold my 2012 GS before I left. Wanted to stop at the SD Rally on way back but no option for 1 day ticket. Buying another GS.
Ian, I just purchased a used 2013 BMW R1200GS with low miles. This is my first BMW motorcycle. My wife and I quickly noticed that the original seat was uncomfortable. There are several seats out there in the market. What do you recommend for the rider and passenger? Thank you.
Ian, another excellent video. Before I purchased my GSA (new) in March '23 I'd watched all of your videos and pretty much decided it would never go off road due to its size. Now some would say what did you buy it for then? Simple - I just love its looks and engineering. In June, did a round trip of 4000miles from Yorkshire (UK) to Tetouan (Morroco). The bike was truly amazing and its purchase justified to family and friends. Keep the videos coming on any and all topics - bikes, gear and whatever. Many Thanks for advice and objective opinions. Regards, Martin
Great video. Always honest. One question. Why did you get the bike set up so high you can’t put both your feet down ? Seems difficult to handle. Just curious !
I agree. I have tried to like this latest RGS platform, having had an ‘07 many years ago when it was a much more lithe bike, in my opinion. But I never gelled with the ‘07, for whatever reasons. Knowing that it is an amazing package, I test rode a ‘22 RGS but wanted off very soon, after having recently tested a Versys 1000. I won’t take a full-size bike off pavement again on anything other than short stretches of graded gravel, so I went with the big Versys, which is better in every way for me on pavement. I use a Himalayan for rough/slow roads. I’ve tried to like the full-size 19-inch front bikes, but I just can’t. Midsize 21-inch front platforms (inc. the AT) with conventional fork suspension would likely be where I’d look if I were getting another “big” ADV. 21s are just too good in the rougher situations.
I've been learning how to ride off road on my '21 GSA. At 5'7" it's been a challenge. But I feel like it's maybe made me a better rider. Not a lot of deep sand here in the NE. Lots of big rocks though.
I had a K1300S Motorsports when I bought the 2022 R1250 GSA to do longer trips. The K bike is a soul stirring missile good for maybe 2 days of riding for me at 6’3”. The GSA is a better traveling companion in every way. Surprisingly powerful, great suspension and electronic aids, lots of room and storage. I only ride on paved roads and fire roads……so I can’t comment on single track or sand etc…. The weight disappears after two mph but if you drop it you are going to feel it. The K is the single best bike I have owned if I am riding relatively close to home. Anything longer than that……the GSA is King.
Hello may I congratulate you on yet another excellent informative video I really like watching your shows, however one thing puzzles me and that is that you never mention Harley-Davidsons RA Pan America 1250 Special is there a reason for this glaring and obvious exclusion?
Had three, two standards and then a GSA, all great bikes but got sick of the weight even though I’m a road rider. Moved ‘down’ to a Multistrada V2S, so much lighter and more fun to ride even though it’s really a upright sports tourer. Would I have another GS, probably not as I think most big adventure bikes are overkill and not necessary unless you believe the marketing hype.
I have a well used 1200 GS. It fit my budget. Works for me. Got it serviced. Changed the tires. Rode till the road ended. Turned round and came back. 3 weeks later. Due another service. Its mostly a road bike, I still got it pretty dirty. Yup if I really wanted to do a lot of off road its to big and heavy.
The GS is a touring bike with a little offroad, but the thing is that it shields you from elements. Nothing like going in a cold, humid day. Its terrible in any bike, not in the 1200. Its like being in a car, but you are in a bike. Last month in a trip to the mountains I was almost 4000m high and just 2C temperature, and it was great. Just a little cold (and I had a summer jacket!)
I rode the Alpine Loop in Colorado with my dad and uncle. My dad and I were on XR650Ls and my uncle was on a R1200GS and he was in his mid fifties I think. I watched him pick that big bike up more than a few times, on the side of a mountain around timberline elevation. Either this bike is not as bad to pick up as it seems, or he's a badass lol!
I think that the wonder-wheel and screen are outdated. I canceled a reservation on a GS and went for a full option Africa Twin AS with 5 years warranty, dct, Apple CarPlay. A true gs-competitor… 💪
For the average adventure rider, the big GS has the perfect balance of attributes in every conceivable way. Many find this level of perfection a little boring, which is completely understandable, and thus they’ll get a second bike that specialises in whatever the one thing is they do most, whether commuting, dirt or track days… But for everything else, you simply can’t beat a big GS if you have the money and willing to spend it on a motorbike, the physical stature and the experience in my opinion based on my experience.
I love your videos. I believe I’m wanting the 1250gs adventure for sure. I reallly want a long range king on road. I love the bells and whistles and love a good fit and finish anything really. Every now and then I’ll take the bike off-road but not too much. I’d say mostly gravel and hard pack sand and road. I want mostly a refined comfy long road bike.
Quickshifter is ok until 4k revs max. And then clunky and sometimes failing when attacking too hard. It works but is made for easy cruising. Down from 6 to 3 it works good.
6:28 true it’s an advantage but also a disadvantage. I’ve seen more than a few bmw bikes like this crack the cylinder head when they hit a rock falling over like this. Not every time it will be a flat surface. If the rock gets through the engine guard just in the right spot, the cylinder head will need a new cover. Regardless to this day the GS is my fav bike ever
i agree, in the hands of all but the most pro level riders, cough Brett Tkacs cough, the gs and especially the gsa is just too big for serious off road. For me personally, i don't have the skill or the wallet to be taking my gs very far off pavement. I'm completely fine with that, it still gets me everywhere i want to go in comfort, has never let me on the side of the road, and frankly i find the diy maintenance ease of the gs to be a bonus that's rarely talked about.
Hi, curious about your comment about bar risers - why do you not recommend them? Don't they help with shoulder pain for some riders by decreasing the reach to the bars? Do you feel they change the riding geometry too much and impact handling? thx!
Ian, one of your best overall reviews. I cringed a bit when you dropped the bike intentionally. A reaction that comes naturally whenever a bike lays down. I've dropped a few over the last forty years and have had to pick them up and the easiest was the BMW Boxer due to it not lying flat on the ground.
Video very informative gs isn't my thing much prefer the smaller more noble adv bikes on a side note the ktm 1290 super adventure r has 103 lb ft torque beating the gs
![R1200GS / R1250GS | Complete Buyer's Guide [2005-2020]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/9arUyUFD5wk/mqdefault.jpg)
![R1200GS / R1250GS | Complete Buyer's Guide [2005-2020]](/img/tr.png)
While most owners will agree the GS is AMAZING on the road, do you agree with me that these full-size ADV bikes are just too heavy for serious off road use? Sound off below. Stay tuned for my accessories and mods video coming this Thursday.
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Are the Motoz worth putting on the GSA? Thoughts? Thanks for another great video Ian
I think it's just like you said. They can work, but ONLY in the right hands, and even then, some offroad tracks will be strictly off-limits to these bikes. I watched some dirt bike contents recently and saw things I wouldn't want my Tiger 1200 to ever see.
They are definitely far too heavy for off road use even if I am a tall and rather big guy. I only use mine for road travel and maybe a bit of gravel every now and then. It is fantastic however for long travel!
@@arnarne it’s the Harley of Off road and touring combined for sure hahah
I recently got a lowered version and feel like it rides great off-road but don’t have sand here. It’s not good going down hill in any conditions with all that weight otherwise feels surprisingly good. Is that suit hot? I’m looking to get one but it’s hot as hell where I live in the south.
This guy dropped his personal motorcycle for your education people. TWICE!! No one else would do that. Even the ones that get FREE motorcycles on their channel. they treat them like a baby and garage them. It's a motorcycle meant to be used for or its intended purpose.
You're the real deal man and we appreciate your efforts!
Agree I would say a Africa twin is the limit,GSA for good sand roads etc yes
There is nothing wrong with looking after somthing you have worked hard for and saved your money for ,
@@bertyboy7126 I agree fully. That's why it's amazing he dropped his personal for us. Ian clearly works hard and cares about his bikes.
I'm still riding my r1150GS from 2002. Actually I'm in Alaska having rode it from los Angeles last week. I can't believe how comfortable I've been, even over the roughest roads. It's an incredible bike. I've been contemplating upgrading to a newer bike like the 1250, but can't seem to let this old beaten GS go! I'll be at 80k miles when I get back to California. It's been such a pleasure and every morning I can't wait to get on it
You Sir are the legend, not the bike.
You are doing this right.
Keep the 1150. 80k miles is only half broken in. You won’t get enough money for it to put toward a worthy replacement or “upgrade”. This is coming from someone who just bought a Brand Spankin 1250 GSA. I just wanted something from new that I can put 200k on with minor maintenance and actually easy to work on myself. If they still offered something as simple as the 1150, I would have bought that instead.
I totally agree. I have a 2007 GS and while the new bikes are awesome, you can do the same things on a way more simple and possibly reliable air cooled older model.
I have 2 R1150 RS both great bikes
Hi Ian, I think you captured perfectly the nature of GS1250.
I have a 2021 R1250GS Adventure, and I totally agree that it's too big and heavy for serious off road use. Even with 52 years of riding experience, and background racing motocross, and riding single-track trails, etc., I find the big GSA scary as h*ll to ride in deep sand or gravel, as the front end has a mind of its own and can quickly get away from you and throw you on the ground. I'm 5'9" in height and that's just barely tall enough to get both feet on the ground, and that's on the balls of my feet, not flat footed, which makes it dicey when trying to dab a foot down off road. Not confidence inspiring when going through tricky off-road sections. It always surprises me that the GSA does as well as it does off-road, just as long as the conditions aren't too challenging.
When it comes to road touring, with occasional forays onto hard packed dirt or gravel roads, the big GSA is hard to beat. The extra gas tank capacity is really handy for being able to get into some truly remote locations without having to worry about the next fuel stop. Heated seat and grips are great for cold weather, and I love the various riding modes, traction control, anti-lock braking, and all the other cool features of the BMW.
I've found my GSA to be reliable and a ton of fun to ride. I'm really curious about the 2024 BMW R1300GS, and knowing BMW it'll be even better than the R1250GS. Tempting.
Cheers,
Jeff
Can’t believe the amount of work you put into your vids Ian.Impressive and thank you.
Ian, dropping the bike not once but twice on purpose, holy buckets! Your reviews are the most complete and comprehensive on the web. Thank you for all you do!
Great vid, looking forward to that Vstrom800 review!
Yeah , me too . Just came here to tell him the same thing . Man it’s awesome the new suzuki . Checked it out yesterday .
Okay, I'll come clean...I'm a "Starbucks" GS owner. Never take mine off-road. Love the looks, highway cruising manners, top loading luggage, crash protection and ability to go down a country gravel road without damaging the pretty plastic bodywork on an RT. I've owned several GS/GSA's, in addition to a 2017 R1200RT. Much prefer the GS as a touring motorcycle, compared to my R1200RT. Couldn't wait to get rid of the RT, and go back to a GS. I realize the GSA is simply a GS with a big gas tank and OEM crash bars, but I never cared for my 2019 R1250GSA. It just felt too big to me. I'm back on a '23 R1250GS and couldn't be happier! Also have a fantastic '22 Triumph Tiger 900 GT Pro. Great bike, and indeed a bit lighter, but it just "ain't" a GS. Something about the way the Germans have refined the GS that's hard to describe. Similar to how Porsche has refined the Porsche 911 over the years. As always, great review Ian. Keep up the good work young man. At just shy of 72 years old, is it okay to call you "young man?" :) :) :)
Just the kind of seller of a GS that I'm looking for.
Nothing wrong with that
I had a 1100 GS, I just never fell in love with it. It just felt way too heavy. I went to a Super Tenere 1200, and for some reason it just feels better. I'm not sure if its the suspension, the engine or seat height. It feels a lot more stable. Boring as hell, but just stable. I can ride it a lot harder off road than I could the BMW.
I've dropped both bikes a couple times. The Super Tenere is easier for me to pick up. It might be that I decided to start working out more after getting into heavier bikes though. Or I learned a better technique for picking them up. The GS does have an advantage with the boxer engine sticking out on each side with the crash bars. I have crash bars on my Super Tenere, so it doesn't go over as far as it could without them.
Good review. LIke your channel a lot.
In all fairness you're comparing a bike that came out in 1994 to one that came out in 2010
I and, I'm sure others as well, do appreciate the effort you put into those videos. It is by far the best channel focused on testing motorcycles.
Wow, thank you!
Great channel but I disagree with your opinion about bar risers and off-road.
1st you have your bars rotated way back towards you and the bars are low, look at the kink at the wrist when you’re standing, when off road you can’t run your bars in the same position as you do while sitting for on road use.
i have a 22 gsa with 1 inch up and 3/4 inch back, when I’m doing off-road i rotate the bars up so while standing you have a nice straight line from the Elbow to the hand, Also standing and gripping the bike with the knees make a 100% improvement, i
Never sit off-road.
Sand, no issues, lean back and rpm is your friend, you’re having issue because your loading the front of the bike because of body position and your not using your Kees to grip the bike
Great points but I still have PTSD from all the sand I rode my 2017GS on in the Utah BDR. Many painful falls. When you're far away from help, it's tough to just open the throttle, lean back, and hope the elephant stays upright but, I guess, that's the best way.
@@gmoneymac23 ..true, it’s not a true off road bike and wasn’t designed to be, anytime you ride a “dual” sport or adv bike you have to compromise something but with some adjustments and proper body position, it can be made to work a lot better, his bar position/height etc is not conducive for the conditions he’s riding and like most, I don’t think he’s informed by his comments.
Not bashing him at all, I do enjoy his channel
Personally, I love the thing. It really does everything well, for me anyway, except technical and single track terrain for which I have a 350 Husky. I’m always amazed how it simply plows through rocky washes that would have my DS deflecting and bouncing. The biggest PITA is changing tires back and forth from street to knobs. Mine is a std GS btw & I have a 30” inseam.
Many GS buyers would be really happy on an RT. But, just like there are mall-crawling Jeep Wranglers.. there are GS's on the road when an RT would be superior.
The RT cannot go to gravel roads (thats 90% of roads) but the GS can.
Okay, I'll come clean...I'm a "Starbucks" GS owner. Never take mine off-road. Love the looks, highway cruising manners, top loading luggage, crash protection and ability to go down a country gravel road without damaging the pretty plastic bodywork on an RT. I've owned several GS/GSA's, in addition to a 2017 R1200RT. Much prefer the GS as a touring motorcycle, compared to my R1200RT. Couldn't wait to get rid of the RT, and go back to a GS. I realize the GSA is simply a GS with a big gas tank and OEM crash bars, but I never cared for my 2019 R1250GSA. It just felt too big to me. I'm back on a '23 R1250GS and couldn't be happier! Also have a fantastic '22 Triumph Tiger 900 GT Pro. Great bike, and indeed a bit lighter, bit it just "ain't" a GS. Something about the way the Germans have refined the GS that's hard to describe. Similar to how Porsche has refined the Porsche 911 over the years. As always, great review Ian. Keep up the good work young man. At just shy of 72 years old, is it okay to call you "young man?" :) :) :)
This 2020 model is one of the best looking of all the GS and GSA machines you've shown us. Your earlier history video with comparisons of all modern GSs is the bible for GS fans! I'm personally looking forward to the release of the 1300 model because (I hope) some great buys on used 2020+ 1250s will come on the market. Thanks for another inspiring "ride along" on a GS.
I referenced Ian’s GS model comparison video to narrow down my search. I found a perfect condition 2013 GS last year with
Glad you enjoyed it!
@@BigRockMotohi there, great review, where did you get the windscreen extension you have on your bike?
After watching each and every video from Ian, I brought a 23 GSA last week. The GS vs GSA was very useful and helped me make the decision.
Which one is better bro?
GS if you want to go off-road, lighter and lower. GSA for the ultimate comfort, wind protection and road presence. I just completed a 1500mile round solo ride and the GSA was a champ.
Big adv bikes are too heavy for serious off road, otherwise we need to be Chris birch. In my experience, well I am not that experienced - big bikes drain our energy pretty quickly while doing serious off road like a path filled with a lot of big stones. It is extremely difficult and u need to have incredible physique to do so
Totally agree
Please put some rubber under these bikes before you drop them, I am starting to develop a nervous twitch and anxiety just at the point you let them drop.
There are several reasons why the middle weight ADV market is exploding while the over 1000cc ADV segment is dying…….first and foremost $30k+ for a 1250 is obscene…second is the weight @600lbs….as for options, good luck finding a “stripper” because 99.9999% of dealer inventory has every factory bell and whistle as standard…..and even “loaded” the GS/GSA do not include aluminum hard cases…that’s and extra @$2500+
A more accurate ‘test’ of a ADV bike is how well it handles single track….since that’s how the majority, regardless of brand, are marketed…The reality is they are meant for highway droning more than anything else…like a Goldwing
After a extended demo test of the ,cough cough , CFMOTO Ibex 800T….. I was completely impressed… loaded for under $13k
..and for perspective my current stable consists of : 2013 GSA, 2014 R9T, 1994 Ducati 888SPO LTD, 2016 Aprilia RSV4(race) 2015 KTM 300XCW(race) and a 2023 KTM 300XC(race)…
As usual Ian, your evals are spot on, honest and well informed…
Zaista? ..bmw gs padaju na ravnoj podlozi ..idealno! Kad padne niz brdo četvorica ga neće pomaknuti😊
I've had several GS's over the years and really thought I'd get another one but ended up going with a Suzuki GSX-S100GT for more on-road performance AND the new V-Strom 800DE for a little more off-road performance. Both bikes new together are still a little less $$ than a loaded GSA. If I had to have one bike its the GS.....
I've always held that the GS 1250 is radically overrated. The suspension on that bike is a BAD joke. There's no points of adjustability like there is on the Triumph 1200 and the Super Ten. Even a skateboard feels like it has good suspension on GOOD roads, but that bike's electronic suspension has zero idea what to do with the damping. It bucks, kicks, and rides like crap as soon as you get on messed up roads, or rutted up dirt roads. There's a lot of things I don't like about that motorcycle, but that suspension is the absolute deal breaker. Anyone who thinks the suspension on that motorcycle is actually good, wouldn't know what good suspension is if it was sitting on their face and twitching.
I owned 2 BMs before and one thing that stands out is their Dealer Support although pricey. It was the nicest when I got stranded in the Karoo desert with a failed battery and I could call a recovery team who raced out to meet me in under 3 hours. I'm not a fan of the big GS machines though. They are too big, but nice to look at. I miss the F650GS Dakar. I really enjoyed touring with it.
I agree, for me the dealer support network worldwide is an important factor when choosing a bike. BMW’s is not cheap but its reach and service quality is second to none.
Gday Ian, Steve from Stand up Moto in Aus. Having owned a GS and ridden many you’ve nailed this review of the GS, well done. Cheers
Thank you kindly
I think he gets the Vstrom 800, although I'd love to see him reviewing the V85TT, that would be a suprise :)
Would love a Guzzi review, too.
Man this guy goes thru bikes. To be honest based on his personal experience I’m left completely confused. Great content but still scratching my head
Hi Ian, can you please do a review or give us your opinions on Cfmoto 800mt 😊
Nice review. Im checking everyday for that 800de review!
Love my GSA as a primarily road touring bike, with the ability to go slightly off road, but that's it for me. I like this drivetrain so much (except for the quick shifter - I use the clutch) that I'd like to add an RT before they switch over to the 1300. Great balanced review 👍
You should do a breakdown of the costs of ownership long term and difficulty of diy maintenance
Holy shit you have some serious skills. I was already on the edge of my seat when you were going 60mph over a sand path, but then the sand... Very impressive riding. Good review as always and nice to learn a thing or two about off road riding during it
Maybe one day you can test a 1290R that would be very interesting
100% agree with all of this, had 4 x R1200/1250 GS/GSA and i am done with taking them in sand or tricky offroad, no enjoyment, just stress.
Hey Ian, like you, I've had the range of GS offerings. I currently have a '22 GS that I have completed about 8k miles of off-road riding on (CO, UT, WY, NM, OAT, Baja and AR backroads TAT). I have to agree with you completely. The bike is capable and great in 80% of the situations I have taken it through.... Sand being its biggest achenes heal. My most challenging accomplishment on the GS was taking it up and over Black Bear Pass in CO, although doable, it was so heavy on that loose rocky shale. I am going to keep the GS for my Adv touring, but as you know, I picked up a Tuareg 660 for my more dedicated off road ADV riding adventures (BDRs, round 2 of Baja, etc).
I miss that Tuareg already...
Personally, I would be very impressed if that new bike you said you were buying was the V-Strom 800DE. I was thinking of returning to the KLR 650 and then you described that Suzuki as being like the KLR but with more power. I would like to hear more on that!
So which one is easier to ride (mildly) offroad, this or the T700? Asking this cause you also have owned the T700
T7
Another awesome review!! I think if I was going to have two bikes in my stable I would definitely have that bike and a lightweight dual sport. That way you are covered for every situation. ✌️
Right on!
Any updates on the 890 ktm😂
Drove one for a few minutes. Its handling reminded me a bit of the V85TT but the quickshifter is years behind those from Triumph and most likely KTM. Speaking of KTM, did you have the chance to try a SAR?
I understand Ian have tried to get his hands om a KTM 1290 SA R/S but KTM hasn't so far responded to him?! Hopefully KTM dealer close enough to him will come around and make it possible...
Cant imagine why KTM still doesn't take the chance of this free exposure, considering the quality Ian has of the reviews.
Great review, sir !
I think the front brake rotors are 305mm dia and not 320mm as started 😉
Feel the same way about the sand on my 1250. I dread it and mud. Have literally no confidence in it and try to avoid it all costs, which you shouldn't have to do on an adventure bike, however, while it's a huge PITA, i just adore my 1250gs. Every bike lacks somewhere. You did really well through the sand though! Lets not kid ourselves either Ian, if you sell this bike you know you'll just get another GS later. :) Love the content!
Very true!
Hi Ian, great spot on review. I am on my second GS, I had a 2017 R1200GS Rallye which was fantastic and I now have a GSA Rallye which is awesome. The way I would describe the GS is it does everything well but nothing brilliantly. Actually it is brilliant at being an all rounder. I quite often use it just as a quick personal transporter to get through heavy traffic and I quite often take my wife as a pillion with all the luggage on for anything between a day and a week on tour. I have been tempted on several occasions by the new Honda Goldwing (2019 onwards) which I think would be the ultimate 2 up luxury tourer. The GS is not the most relaxing ride. I am not in the luxury position of being able to keep the GS and buy a Goldwing as well. My question is, do you think I would miss the GS and it’s convenience as an all rounder?
GW does one thing very good, but personally I would be missing the lower weight, the low speed maneuverability, the capability of dropping from a curb, the light off road attitude. I don’t see the GW as a city commuter, the GS also isn’t but it’s more at ease in the city than the GW
If the main thing you’re doing is long distance road touring the GW should be better even than the K1600, but as you said it’s not an all rounder
Just curious, what's your opinion for a tall guy bike? I'm 6'7" and was thinking about the GS. I'm currently on a KTM 790r which I love but want something that fits better and is more comfortable on long highway miles.
I'm 6-5 and the GS is the most "comfortable" do it all bike. The RT would be better for pure highway riding. I've tried other big ADV bikes and they seem to still have a more forward riding position with rearward footpegs(KTM 1290, for example) bending my long legs too much. I bought my 17GS used and it has the low suspension. Too good of a deal but I wish I had the standard suspension. It's great in everything but sand.
GS, Super Tenere, Africa Twin
Great review but man, may I suggest some aerobic training ? like running thirty minutes 3x/week. Cheers
Riding a motorcycle in sand is like aerobic training
please review the KTM 1290 Adv R
For my purposes I want the big heavy bikes as I will mostly be doing road touring with only light to moderate off road. So I am trying to decide between the GSA, The multistrada V4, the desertX, the 1290 Super Adventure, the Triumph Tiger 1200, Africa Twin, and the Pan America. Well for ADV's anyways, also looking a touring bikes from BMW, Honda, HD, & Indian and sport touring from BMW, KTM, Motoguzi too. And I am also looking maybe at some of the midrange adv too. I am spoiled for choice really, but I can only have one.
Only thing I can say to you:
You only come so far reading about bikes and watching reviews... The real answers comes when you test ride a bike.
So from dealer network, your own preferences, price and costs, seat height and so on - you can maybe narrow down to three or four bikes. Then try them out and feel for yourself.
To your list I can add Suzuki V-strom 1050 if it is available in your country. I haven't tried out this bike myself yet, but it falls into your frame of bikes to choose between.....
You do some good reviews, I like watching them all even if I don't intend to buy any of the bikes. However I am considering a 1250GSA or GS, I find going from a bigger engine to a smaller engine (to a Tenere in this case) I really miss the power of the bigger engine.
However I'm gonna do a little soapbox here on the quickshifter. Most people complain at it being clunky and choppy and that's because it was never intended to be used at low RPMs. The QS in all bikes is just a very clever "cut the ignition / gas for X/ms so we relieve the pressure currently on the gears so we can shift gears"-electroics thing. So it's really intended for fast acceleration and upshifts meaning you should be relatively high in the rev-range for it to work smoothly. As for the downshifts, or blipper, you want to be lower in the RPMs for it be smooth. Having owned a couple of bikes, both the MT09 and MT10 SP models as well as some bikes without QS I learned about the clutchless shifting and while I'm no master I can certainly figure out from riding a bike when I can upshift or downshift without using the clutch. Same principle applies only with the QS you can just nail the gas and go up. I never ever used it for 1-2 shifting because you have the dead-space of Neutral in between. For true seamless up and down shifts you probably need a "seamless gearbox" but afaik that's only available at the highest racing level, like MotoGP. I could be wrong there though - and my point really is: don't treat the QS as a ticket to shift up and/or down (if you have a blipper) whenever you feel like it, because that's not really what it's good at. And I'm sure BMWs auto-shift-assist thing is not a regular QS that most other bikes have, but it sure sounds like it should be treated as one. :)
You can all disagree with me that's fine, but if you have clunky upshifts you're simply too low in the rev range. would you go 2-3-4-5 if you where doing it manually and still keeping it under 4k rpm? If not then don't do it with a QS. :)
Again great video, thanks for putting so much time in to them.
When you're hard on the gas is really the best time to use them anyway, way faster than pulling the clutch in to shift, and manually shifting can occasionally upset the bike if you mess it up, or miss a gear, or dump the clutch too soon, etc. Using the clutch is a perfectly normal part of riding a motorcycle, makes sense to be very proficient at it. Up and down quickshifters are still so fun though.
Maybe change the title. 11 months later, nothing official about an R1400.
AI - Bot voice is not natural.
“ no Adventure version announced”
R 1300 GS
R 1300 GS Pure
R 1300 GS Trophy
R 1300 GS Trophy X
R 1300 GS Triple Black
R 1300 GS Option 719
Very enjoyable review. It would be great to get your thoughts on the KTM 1290 SAR if you can ever get your hands on one!
I’ve been asking him to review the new SAR for months and it seems he can find every bike except the 1290😢
Haha and the Adventure model is even fatter and definitely not built for off-road. The stock crash bars bend with the lightest drop ever. Despite it being a generally good bike, it's kind of a scam!
Out of the million GS/A made I would say maybe a thousand have been truly off-road.
Just two.
Demo models I guess@@northerniltree
Seems to me as a 40+ rider. The nay sayers are hard core off roaders. This bike it’s not that. I am still looking at my 1st AV scooter. It’s between the GS 1250 & Ducati Multi strata pikes peak. And I do know the difference, so don’t shit on me. The Ducati is my midlife crisis super bike that can still get me to the fishing hole. 😊
I think people being realistic with their needs is the primary reason bikes get a bad reputation. I think that people who want a serious offroading bike should start off with a light bike from the jump. A Dr650 with basic suspension would be easier to handle than a 600lb adventure bike with fancy suspension.
I think BMW nails it with a 19" spoked wheel for a balance between curvy road performance and reasonable handling off-road with the ability to get you out of a bad spot if you find yourself there. Purposely taking it down a single track though isn't it's purpose.
I think that triumph has really honed in on what the ADV market wants which is mid and full size bikes that are available in two versions. One that is good on road but can handle basic offroading or one that is really good off-road but has reasonable onroad performance. Imagine if you applied this across all platforms like the Yamaha outfit. Imagine you could get a tracer 9 gt or tracer 9 rally. Imagine you could get an updated tenere 1200 GT or rally.
Being realistic with what my needs our and watching every review on this channel what I've realized is that for me a tiger 1200 GT pro is about perfect for me. I wanted something lighter for off-road performance but being realistic my main priority is passenger comfort and touring performance. The weight isn't as important but having extra power and shaft drive is worth the compromise and the occasional gravel and dirt will be reasonable with a 19" wheel.
Another realizing I've made from watching this channel is that I'm heavily considering buying a used r1200/1250 GS to save some money and test the waters of how I like a heavier bike for a few years and if I don't like it I can sell it for about the same price I bought it for.
Ian, Merriam Webster says "What does this mean for you, o person who says height as though it's spelled heighth? Merely that you're a little behind the times, and perhaps a stickler for consistency. We still won't judge you. But since your fellow 21st century English speakers likely will, we recommend you pronounce height with a \t\ at the end instead.".
... listen from 3:15 to 4:48 if you are not aware of it...
Just think how much you can save without all that bullsxxt electronic stuff that alot of riders think they need ! I ride a 2006 GS abs only, love it, motorcycles should be simple and my 4 wheeler is a 1982 vw vanagon. Thats just me!
Hello big rock moto am from Uganda East Africa I was requesting u make for us a review showing the differences Among bmw gs hp, trophy, Te & rally give us more details on the differences I want to own one mostly commuting like 100km daily
The GS is the on-off-on road pick for many Australian riders, very long distances, poor dirt roads. BMW Motorrad Aus runs an annual GS enduro Safari with support crew. They also run off-road courses in the lead up to each year's Enduro Safari. ruclips.net/video/qqI-xG_Jwjo/видео.html
Great video and a fantastic bike,probably the best in the world.
However no way on God's earth is it designed to go off road and it's ridiculous to do it.
Get a proper 250 0r 350 Honda for that sort of stuff, something you can pick up easily.
Thanks for sharing and nearly wrecking your bike.
I sold mine after a few months, at a loss, just not my kind of bike, after the RT1150, and then the RT1200, then the GT1600, I got what I rate as the best bike suited for me of-course the RT1250, not better than the GT1600 but lighter, easier to handle in the garage, but I am sure it is horses for courses.
Just curious why you don't recommend bar risers? I'm 6'3". Very uncomfortable to ride standing without them.
Thanks
you having the random "won't start dead battery syndrome" issue that so many are having around the world with those model years? Sad that BMW didn't standup and take ownership of the issue for all those owners. Says a lot about the company and not in good way. Sad because its such a great motorcycle.
You did an awesome job in that sand Iain, that's not easy
Please do not take this suggestion as an insult or trolling but your presentation style would benefit immensely if you got rid off of the gesture displayed e.g. at 47:01. It is unique in a non flattering way, slightly disturbing. Good luck with a good show!
Where do you get the Double Take Adventure Mirrors? Do you get credit for it? Same as Machine Art Moto, but didn't see it listed in your accessories.
I've owned every motorcycle in 61 yrs and the BMW GS Adventure is my choice and I agree it's more road oriented but none of the other brands even come close to the GS imo.
How much price do you think I should give for a 2020gsa adventure with just 4K miles on it ??
The 12xxGS is a good example of how good the BMW marketing is are compared to the buyers ability to find a bike that fits their needs and technical skill set😂😂
In my country and language they mock gs riders by saying gs stands for “Geen Sand” GS- which translates to no sand😂
I am going to buy a ADV soon. Please do a comparison between the KTM 1290 SAS and the BMW R 1250 GSA. I don't trust any other bike review out there as much as I do of yours!
What about wheelies and stoppies, with the integrated front braking, how does that get disconnected ?
I'd have been more impressed if BMW had gone +2 years on the warranty on the 1300. Is the 7/850 due for refreshment?
You've been poking Orange balloons?
So, the one questions I wanna know is.... For you, GS or GSA?
GSA
@@BigRockMoto Why?
My experience with the 2023 GS
3 year vs 1 year warranty
$5K more than AT, but almost the same price with options:
Factory 2" Lower option, suspension raises and lowers w/button press, Steering damper, Heated Seats, Pannier racks, Quick shifter, Heated grips, tpm, cruise control
Lower center of gravity
Boxer engines are bulletproof - 150K miles
BMW prices will increase 10% in 2024
This is the last model year for the 1250, i.e. most reliable
Shaft drive = no oil mess
Same weight as AT DCT
33 more hp, 29 more ftlb
No brake dive
Torx fasteners
Panels remove easily, unlike AT
Beautiful titanium engine guards available! Goodness!
The mechanical engineering is artwork
Higher quality materials
GS issues:
Needs premium fuel
Sounds like a tractor
Wheel spoke maintenance every oil change
Annoying display
Grip/seat heater button hard to reach
Hand guards weak, direct flow in my face
Kickstand awkward
Keyless gas cap finicky
Standard headlight not LED
GPS mount blocks the display and is complicated
It is good on dirt - good on pavement but not great at anything. I have a 1200 GSA, a KTL 1600, and an old LT and a Honda CRF 250. I will take the LT/KTL on pavement over the GSA anytime. The GSA bike has two cylinders - you need at least 4 or 6 cylinders on pavement going long distance! Don’t buy this bike if you just want to long distance tour on pavement. Don’t buy this bike if you want to ride a lot on dirt. Buy a smaller cc enduro bike. However, if you want to ride this bike anywhere it is good BUT not great! Also, this two cylinder bike has reached its limits- stretching it to a 1300 displacement is ridiculous!
I would love to own a facelift model (so 2013 or newer) 1200, or even the 1250... But man the used price is killing me... With 100.000km's/60.000miles at 2013-2014 they still go for arround 11.000€ at the minimum... And the thing is, i can easely spend that... But for a toy?? Couse lets be honest, its a toy, especially since i need a car for my job and my own work (farm+side gigs). But maybe one day... Honestly hopeing that the launch of 1300 models hits the 1200 range in terms of reseale price.
I just spent the month of July on a 2017 Africa Twin. A hair under 10k miles from NH to Nashville then up to SD, Yellowstone Idaho Washington and back. Saw 3 other AT's. A bazillion Harleys and GS bikes of various years and models. Lots of Triumphs. I sold my 2012 GS before I left. Wanted to stop at the SD Rally on way back but no option for 1 day ticket. Buying another GS.
Ian, I just purchased a used 2013 BMW R1200GS with low miles. This is my first BMW motorcycle. My wife and I quickly noticed that the original seat was uncomfortable. There are several seats out there in the market. What do you recommend for the rider and passenger? Thank you.
Ian, another excellent video. Before I purchased my GSA (new) in March '23 I'd watched all of your videos and pretty much decided it would never go off road due to its size. Now some would say what did you buy it for then? Simple - I just love its looks and engineering. In June, did a round trip of 4000miles from Yorkshire (UK) to Tetouan (Morroco). The bike was truly amazing and its purchase justified to family and friends. Keep the videos coming on any and all topics - bikes, gear and whatever. Many Thanks for advice and objective opinions.
Regards, Martin
Great video. Always honest. One question. Why did you get the bike set up so high you can’t put both your feet down ? Seems difficult to handle. Just curious !
I agree. I have tried to like this latest RGS platform, having had an ‘07 many years ago when it was a much more lithe bike, in my opinion. But I never gelled with the ‘07, for whatever reasons. Knowing that it is an amazing package, I test rode a ‘22 RGS but wanted off very soon, after having recently tested a Versys 1000. I won’t take a full-size bike off pavement again on anything other than short stretches of graded gravel, so I went with the big Versys, which is better in every way for me on pavement. I use a Himalayan for rough/slow roads. I’ve tried to like the full-size 19-inch front bikes, but I just can’t. Midsize 21-inch front platforms (inc. the AT) with conventional fork suspension would likely be where I’d look if I were getting another “big” ADV. 21s are just too good in the rougher situations.
I've been learning how to ride off road on my '21 GSA. At 5'7" it's been a challenge. But I feel like it's maybe made me a better rider. Not a lot of deep sand here in the NE. Lots of big rocks though.
I had a K1300S Motorsports when I bought the 2022 R1250 GSA to do longer trips. The K bike is a soul stirring missile good for maybe 2 days of riding for me at 6’3”. The GSA is a better traveling companion in every way. Surprisingly powerful, great suspension and electronic aids, lots of room and storage. I only ride on paved roads and fire roads……so I can’t comment on single track or sand etc….
The weight disappears after two mph but if you drop it you are going to feel it. The K is the single best bike I have owned if I am riding relatively close to home. Anything longer than that……the GSA is King.
Hello may I congratulate you on yet another excellent informative video I really like watching your shows, however one thing puzzles me and that is that you never mention Harley-Davidsons RA Pan America 1250 Special is there a reason for this glaring and obvious exclusion?
Had three, two standards and then a GSA, all great bikes but got sick of the weight even though I’m a road rider. Moved ‘down’ to a Multistrada V2S, so much lighter and more fun to ride even though it’s really a upright sports tourer. Would I have another GS, probably not as I think most big adventure bikes are overkill and not necessary unless you believe the marketing hype.
I have a well used 1200 GS. It fit my budget. Works for me. Got it serviced. Changed the tires. Rode till the road ended. Turned round and came back. 3 weeks later. Due another service. Its mostly a road bike, I still got it pretty dirty. Yup if I really wanted to do a lot of off road its to big and heavy.
The GS is a touring bike with a little offroad, but the thing is that it shields you from elements. Nothing like going in a cold, humid day. Its terrible in any bike, not in the 1200. Its like being in a car, but you are in a bike. Last month in a trip to the mountains I was almost 4000m high and just 2C temperature, and it was great. Just a little cold (and I had a summer jacket!)
I rode the Alpine Loop in Colorado with my dad and uncle. My dad and I were on XR650Ls and my uncle was on a R1200GS and he was in his mid fifties I think. I watched him pick that big bike up more than a few times, on the side of a mountain around timberline elevation. Either this bike is not as bad to pick up as it seems, or he's a badass lol!
I think that the wonder-wheel and screen are outdated. I canceled a reservation on a GS and went for a full option Africa Twin AS with 5 years warranty, dct, Apple CarPlay. A true gs-competitor… 💪
46:50 BMW already stated that the (almost) completely new Big Trail GS 1300 will be launched in approx. 90 days! (Sept. 28th to be precise)
For the average adventure rider, the big GS has the perfect balance of attributes in every conceivable way. Many find this level of perfection a little boring, which is completely understandable, and thus they’ll get a second bike that specialises in whatever the one thing is they do most, whether commuting, dirt or track days… But for everything else, you simply can’t beat a big GS if you have the money and willing to spend it on a motorbike, the physical stature and the experience in my opinion based on my experience.
Normal one or Adventure? Adventure looks like a tank and not sporty at all.
I love your videos. I believe I’m wanting the 1250gs adventure for sure. I reallly want a long range king on road. I love the bells and whistles and love a good fit and finish anything really. Every now and then I’ll take the bike off-road but not too much. I’d say mostly gravel and hard pack sand and road. I want mostly a refined comfy long road bike.
Quickshifter is ok until 4k revs max. And then clunky and sometimes failing when attacking too hard. It works but is made for easy cruising. Down from 6 to 3 it works good.
How do you think the new 1300GS will change the bike's appeal to new and old customers, or will it be like the change from 1200 to 1250
6:28 true it’s an advantage but also a disadvantage. I’ve seen more than a few bmw bikes like this crack the cylinder head when they hit a rock falling over like this. Not every time it will be a flat surface. If the rock gets through the engine guard just in the right spot, the cylinder head will need a new cover. Regardless to this day the GS is my fav bike ever
Why was you clock showing 4:55 am but its day light your not at the north pole are you
I've learned from your videos -> Maniacal Laughing = Good
i agree, in the hands of all but the most pro level riders, cough Brett Tkacs cough, the gs and especially the gsa is just too big for serious off road. For me personally, i don't have the skill or the wallet to be taking my gs very far off pavement. I'm completely fine with that, it still gets me everywhere i want to go in comfort, has never let me on the side of the road, and frankly i find the diy maintenance ease of the gs to be a bonus that's rarely talked about.
Hi, curious about your comment about bar risers - why do you not recommend them? Don't they help with shoulder pain for some riders by decreasing the reach to the bars? Do you feel they change the riding geometry too much and impact handling? thx!
Ian, one of your best overall reviews. I cringed a bit when you dropped the bike intentionally. A reaction that comes naturally whenever a bike lays down. I've dropped a few over the last forty years and have had to pick them up and the easiest was the BMW Boxer due to it not lying flat on the ground.
Video very informative gs isn't my thing much prefer the smaller more noble adv bikes on a side note the ktm 1290 super adventure r has 103 lb ft torque beating the gs