I told the boat dealership something like this also. I told the owner that I bought a boat from him 20 years ago and it still runs great. He told me that people like me will put him out of business. Lol
maybe I missed it but only heard him say 272hp anyway I had my own machine shop in Adelaide South Australia V.R.M.S Miller Racing I used to run a '62 model Beetle with a few mods 2180cc Bugpac crank Carrillo rods NPR 92 mm pistons total seal rings top[expansion] and second [total seal] Teflon buttons instead of circlips Scat individual cylinder heads 52mm inlet valves 42mm exhaust valves 2inch exhaust I built to sound wave theory lengths with 27 and 3/4 inch megaphone a lot of working theory went into it, the exhaust. I had Hilborn intake manifolds with 48 IDA webers 47.5mm venturis 7.2mm made needle and seats [all the special stuff I made myself I had my own machine shop back then], the late 80's. Ran 2 fuel pumps one high pressure one high volume low pressure ran 1" fuel line to the pumps and half inch to each carby [fuel consumption was shithouse 6 to 8 litres burn out and quarter mile run] hey I had fun. Valve springs were progressive I designed them and had them built in the USA $400 for 8 double valve springs back then was a lot of money. I ran a special Scat cam built as a one off almost rectangular lobes with 1.5.to one roller rockers 757 thou valve lift 312 degrees of duration the engine "idled" at 3,500 rpm extremely lumpy it didn't smooth out till 5500 and kicked you in the guts the engine red lined at 10,000 checked on an engine dyno, I built it on a whim I hated in those days to be told I couldn't do something and someone walked into my shop oneday with and American VW DRAGSTER magazine and showed me they were getting 10,000 rpm from there motors and said I couldn't do it so I did hey it cost in real terms the better part of $18,000 if I had to pay for everything I mean the Scat heads were $4,000 each so I bought second hand ones and rebuilt them retempered them and they worked fine. Anyway I had a lot of fun with that car the body is still around the engine got detuned I built a set of street heads for it put a Scat c35 and 45mm Delortoes on it, it is still going believe it or not just taken out on special occasions by the guy I sold it to. I suppose the main reason I spoke here was my motor at 4500 rpm only had 54hp at 5500 rpm it had 250hp at 6500 275+ then it broke the mounts on my mates engine dyno, it wasn't pretty to look at it never ran any tin wear, no cooling at all, if the cylinder head temp got over 500 degrees Farenhieght I had to pull out because it would get way to hot at the end of the quarter other wise. I mixed the fuel I used myself it was only stable for 24 hours then it went to jelly and unusable for anything but party tricks. I preheated the oil before every run, they always frowned at me on the start line because at idle fuel spilt every where but at 10k it used everything, it was built for a dare and for fun and every time I got slack at work I would run it and be that damn busy I didn't have time to run it, a motor like that got dismantled every race meeting just to check things so they didn't break. I know where all the parts are if I ever had the money I would buy everything back and rebuild it just for fun, like I never heard it from the back but the guys that used to help me said it hurt peoples ears at full noise to me all I heard was 2 very loud weber carbies which had air intakes inside the body just with flame arrestors over them incase of back fires , the body and chasis is still around just need a gearbox tyres and the parts it would only be run once a year but I would donate it to a museum in Adelaide in honour of my father who just passed away and during his life he started work on VW's and Porsches in 1958 and worked on them til he semi retired in 1996 even then helped out many many people his nick name in Adelaide was Dr. Porsche, hey I even went for my drivers licence in a 1953 356a 1300 super Porsche oh of only I still had that car today. Anyway thanks for reading I hope you made sense of it and it was all in fun good ol Volkswagens hey. Oh my cars name Volks Revenge. Just have to add one thing it was lethal to drive only ever ran Avon racing rubber on 4.5 inch rims they would break away at any speed whenever they felt like it so much so I held the record for speed going backwards over the speed traps at Adelaide International raceway 95.86mph BACKWARDS I do not know who out there has ever tried that but when you have a concrete wall both sides it's some scary shit, they made me put a roll cage in it after that effort LOL they estimated my speed before the car went airborne at in excess of 130mph because as anyone who runs the quarter knows the speed is measured over 132feet that is 66 feet before the end of the quarter to 66 feet after and my car had stopped within 60 feet after the end of the speed trap that is how some boffin worked out my estimated speed when the car let go, good spectator value, but change of underwear needed LOL
Well i got to hand it to you guys not only is it a good performing and sounding motor it sure is a good looking one in my younger days of wrenching on some of my old Beetles usually the engine was a big heavy and oily bunch of parts bolted together and the only way for me to know how well it really performed was to jump in the drivers seat and go for a drive that was our Hillbilly Dyno lol
I built mine in 89 with 92.5 pistons and jugs fuel feeder racing cam trick flo heads and a offenhouser intake running a holley 650 cfm and had a 200 pound flywheel and pulled 400 ehp after spin-up and did three dyno pulls then 1 run on the track twisting my 74 super beatle then had to send the engine home to NY. and after 8 months my father gave it to his friend who raced the engine for five years before kaboom
Congratulations CBPerformance, beautiful and powerful, what a guarantee of quality for everyday use and for trips of 800-1000 km, get to Chimay Belgium and make a good result at the fourth mile races ;-)? with gearbox, suspension, brakes etc. adequate to the power
The ghost behind the curtain is the cilinderhead temperature. The cooling surface is limited on the small air heads. I can only see 175 degree cilinderhead temperature during the runs, which is no prove for a longer run under boost ( mountain climb, bug race). The heads start to creep, to disstort above 225 C and loose their thighness (torque value). Over the leak path (blow path) the head will erode or melt. The initial engines of the B29 bomber were powerfull enough, but all thermally restricted. If you make power (30%), you make the heat (70%) . I had like that CB would give a maximum contineous power value, at say 15 C ambient temperature, just as aero engines do. This value must be matched to 1000 running hours.
Well Down Pat :-)~ now we need to see a 2387cc(Strip Dominator Heads) Pat Downs Turbo Motor put out 600hp with the same footprint of this motor, E-85 . hope this ain't out of your reach pat or asking for too much. Melbourne
I would love to see that as I have put together a 2332 with a C.B. hybrid turbo,redline EFI and a set of strip dominator heads with 48×38 valves for my street car
Very interested in purchasing this exact setup in the exact same color/exact same specs. I'll be in touch - thanks CB Performance for the great videos. I'll save my questions for another time.
Do not you think chrome pulleys will make it has less grip on the belt and, consequently, less spin on the alternator, which means less cooling on the engine and less charging?
No 310hp here "8 PSI boost, 252hp, 249 ft lbs torque" @ 1:00. Dont get me wrong here because those are great numbers, but a far cry from 310hp. Still a super nice piece of work with all the goodies.
Pat has always wanted to, but there is a lot of cost involved. Also, they don't make the power that turbo engines do, they just look and sound cool. Thanks.
Me encantó también ese motor, cuánto cuesta uno de esos Pat? Y se necesita alguna relación de caja de velocidades en particular para sacarle todo el provecho a ese motor?
so if someone were to build this exact same motor but maybe in a slightly larger size like say a 2332cc or 2387cc and run 15 ibs of boost they'd easily top 400+ horsepower. damn I really want CB performance to build my engine lol
I wonder. Lets say I put this type of engine in a vw superbug for historic rally here in Europe. What needs allot of accelerating and decelerating, would it have a long lifespan? Because I do this as a hobby. For Fun... And I dont have the time tinkering every day to get the car ready every weekend.
What would I need to make about 150hp on an n/a motor? Is that possible. I don’t know much about beetle engines. I’ve been wanting to build a chopped up beetle. But make it more like a race car. Idk. Just trying to get ideas on cost and difficulty.
Lets see, it cost around 12k in March of 2016, so probably around 14k, but that's just a rough estimate. Pat can get you more specifics on the price if you are interested in having him build you one.
any bug heads out there could u explain what's the difference (performance wise) on a turbo setup . all I see here in cali is the setup where the carb connects directly to the turbo and hangs outside , where as this setup with charge pipes going to the carbs is rarely seen even at local meets
The turbo on the dyno is a blow through system where the turbo blows through the carbs or EFI throttle bodies. The other style is called a draw through system. That's when The engine draws air and fuel through the carb and turbo then blows into the engine.
BighomieJ5x - a draw through carb system is very simple as far as set up. But you have drivability issues. Fuel tends to puddle and cause a sluggish running engine up until you start making boost. A blow through system is a little more expensive but it is very driveable. It will drive around town all day without puddling and is a snap to tune especially with EFI.
Is there a 3D model of this engine because i would love to build this engine but i would add alittle more HP to my beetle because I'm building a RWB, JDM beetle if anyone cares so yeah
Our most recent dyno video features a 2276cc Carbureted engine that produced 170hp. You could even potentially get up to 200hp out of that size, by swapping out a few components.
Yes. You will enjoy driving your car so much more, you would then need to upgrade to a 1776cc. And then a 1914cc. And then... you get the idea. In all seriousness, going from 1300cc to 1600cc is no problem.
No it's done all the time, and you can use stock parts. You have to remember this technology is over 80 years old. When you start upgrading, it is assumed you are going to use it, so better parts are needed if you are going to be running it hard. There is a good reason all the aftermarket parts are available, but cost more. Everything is stronger with different metallurgy, but will stand up to the higher demands of more horsepower. If you do upgrade you will feel the difference, and it will have a little more horsepower, which is all that is needed in most cases. If you just add jugs with no bottom end work, you are looking for trouble.
252hp with a Turbo? Doesn't sound to much for me. Out of the 90ies I know some people her in GER that had 220 from a 2.9 typ 4 n/a. A 2,1l n/a with 170. Alright, it's different numbers measured on 9 and 14 pounds of boost. I didn't see that in the description. 310 sound sufficient thought 😀
"mark is a good customer" = mark got deep pockets😂
lmao i thought the same thing
And payed in advance plus a bonus 💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼
Lol
Duh
I love this guy... built me a motor in 2000 and still runs great today!
Motors Are Electric ENGINEs use fuel
@@kenstogner2427 no... not necessarily.
I told the boat dealership something like this also. I told the owner that I bought a boat from him 20 years ago and it still runs great. He told me that people like me will put him out of business. Lol
Love how clean this motor is with no distributor or fuel pump. Straight badass right there.
This is the kind of video y'all need to be putting out.
That might be one of the most beautiful things I have ever seen. Nice work!
Nice!!! Your Turbos have come a long way since I read about your early set ups back in the 80's!...Great stuff!!!
Awesome Pat, I built one of the earlier versions for a customer. It was incredible, this is even better.
Pat is a living legend. Great products.
Well done CB Performance Mark is going to be one happy man!
The fact you’re getting that much power out of that little thing is amazing!
252/248 @ a fairly modest 9 PSI. That's very respectable.
maybe I missed it but only heard him say 272hp anyway I had my own machine shop in Adelaide South Australia V.R.M.S Miller Racing I used to run a '62 model Beetle with a few mods 2180cc Bugpac crank Carrillo rods NPR 92 mm pistons total seal rings top[expansion] and second [total seal] Teflon buttons instead of circlips Scat individual cylinder heads 52mm inlet valves 42mm exhaust valves 2inch exhaust I built to sound wave theory lengths with 27 and 3/4 inch megaphone a lot of working theory went into it, the exhaust. I had Hilborn intake manifolds with 48 IDA webers 47.5mm venturis 7.2mm made needle and seats [all the special stuff I made myself I had my own machine shop back then], the late 80's. Ran 2 fuel pumps one high pressure one high volume low pressure ran 1" fuel line to the pumps and half inch to each carby [fuel consumption was shithouse 6 to 8 litres burn out and quarter mile run] hey I had fun. Valve springs were progressive I designed them and had them built in the USA $400 for 8 double valve springs back then was a lot of money. I ran a special Scat cam built as a one off almost rectangular lobes with 1.5.to one roller rockers 757 thou valve lift 312 degrees of duration the engine "idled" at 3,500 rpm extremely lumpy it didn't smooth out till 5500 and kicked you in the guts the engine red lined at 10,000 checked on an engine dyno, I built it on a whim I hated in those days to be told I couldn't do something and someone walked into my shop oneday with and American VW DRAGSTER magazine and showed me they were getting 10,000 rpm from there motors and said I couldn't do it so I did hey it cost in real terms the better part of $18,000 if I had to pay for everything I mean the Scat heads were $4,000 each so I bought second hand ones and rebuilt them retempered them and they worked fine. Anyway I had a lot of fun with that car the body is still around the engine got detuned I built a set of street heads for it put a Scat c35 and 45mm Delortoes on it, it is still going believe it or not just taken out on special occasions by the guy I sold it to.
I suppose the main reason I spoke here was my motor at 4500 rpm only had 54hp at 5500 rpm it had 250hp at 6500 275+ then it broke the mounts on my mates engine dyno, it wasn't pretty to look at it never ran any tin wear, no cooling at all, if the cylinder head temp got over 500 degrees Farenhieght I had to pull out because it would get way to hot at the end of the quarter other wise. I mixed the fuel I used myself it was only stable for 24 hours then it went to jelly and unusable for anything but party tricks.
I preheated the oil before every run, they always frowned at me on the start line because at idle fuel spilt every where but at 10k it used everything, it was built for a dare and for fun and every time I got slack at work I would run it and be that damn busy I didn't have time to run it, a motor like that got dismantled every race meeting just to check things so they didn't break. I know where all the parts are if I ever had the money I would buy everything back and rebuild it just for fun, like I never heard it from the back but the guys that used to help me said it hurt peoples ears at full noise to me all I heard was 2 very loud weber carbies which had air intakes inside the body just with flame arrestors over them incase of back fires , the body and chasis is still around just need a gearbox tyres and the parts it would only be run once a year but I would donate it to a museum in Adelaide in honour of my father who just passed away and during his life he started work on VW's and Porsches in 1958 and worked on them til he semi retired in 1996 even then helped out many many people his nick name in Adelaide was Dr. Porsche, hey I even went for my drivers licence in a 1953 356a 1300 super Porsche oh of only I still had that car today.
Anyway thanks for reading I hope you made sense of it and it was all in fun good ol Volkswagens hey. Oh my cars name Volks Revenge.
Just have to add one thing it was lethal to drive only ever ran Avon racing rubber on 4.5 inch rims they would break away at any speed whenever they felt like it so much so I held the record for speed going backwards over the speed traps at Adelaide International raceway 95.86mph BACKWARDS I do not know who out there has ever tried that but when you have a concrete wall both sides it's some scary shit, they made me put a roll cage in it after that effort LOL they estimated my speed before the car went airborne at in excess of 130mph because as anyone who runs the quarter knows the speed is measured over 132feet that is 66 feet before the end of the quarter to 66 feet after and my car had stopped within 60 feet after the end of the speed trap that is how some boffin worked out my estimated speed when the car let go, good spectator value, but change of underwear needed LOL
Geezus H Leonard....that is a skillset with the humble aircooled..
As much as I love the air-cooled VW I can't believe I just fucking read all of that
Hi, I could realy use some advice from you is there any chance I could have some kind of contact details please I would realy appreciate it. Thanks
Pat, great video. It would be nice if you could do step by step on setting the engine up for EFI. Thanks for the video
Well i got to hand it to you guys not only is it a good performing and sounding motor it sure is a good looking one in my younger days of wrenching on some of my old Beetles usually the engine was a big heavy and oily bunch of parts bolted together and the only way for me to know how well it really performed was to jump in the drivers seat and go for a drive that was our Hillbilly Dyno lol
Damn that is nice ! I cant figure out what i like more the look or the sound that is one heck of a engine build !
A split window bus definitely needs 310 HP ! -oh hell yes !
One more reason to buy CB Performance parts. I'll never buy cheap imitations again.
That gen 4 system is pretty slick.
Many a year ago i was a VW mechanic, parts runner here in AUSTIN TEXAS,my boss was Bill Parsons and Rick
I built mine in 89 with 92.5 pistons and jugs fuel feeder racing cam trick flo heads and a offenhouser intake running a holley 650 cfm and had a 200 pound flywheel and pulled 400 ehp after spin-up and did three dyno pulls then 1 run on the track twisting my 74 super beatle then had to send the engine home to NY. and after 8 months my father gave it to his friend who raced the engine for five years before kaboom
Jeeze, finally a turbo bug motor without carb. thank you!
Extremely Clean Engine! Well Done CB... 💥💥💥💥💥 Would have installed Porsche Air Fan and Housing instead of junk VW
Beetle tins are better, although they are more ugly.
Love that sound!
Absolutely beautiful engine ! ... and a great performer !! :)
functional piece of art!
Congratulations CBPerformance, beautiful and powerful,
what a guarantee of quality for everyday use and for trips of 800-1000 km,
get to Chimay Belgium and make a good result at the fourth mile races ;-)?
with gearbox, suspension, brakes etc. adequate to the power
nice work of art
The ghost behind the curtain is the cilinderhead temperature. The cooling surface is limited on the small air heads. I can only see 175 degree cilinderhead temperature during the runs, which is no prove for a longer run under boost ( mountain climb, bug race).
The heads start to creep, to disstort above 225 C and loose their thighness (torque value). Over the leak path (blow path) the head will erode or melt.
The initial engines of the B29 bomber were powerfull enough, but all thermally restricted. If you make power (30%), you make the heat (70%) .
I had like that CB would give a maximum contineous power value, at say 15 C ambient temperature, just as aero engines do. This value must be matched to 1000 running hours.
Well Down Pat :-)~ now we need to see a 2387cc(Strip Dominator Heads) Pat Downs Turbo Motor put out 600hp with the same footprint of this motor, E-85 . hope this ain't out of your reach pat or asking for too much.
Melbourne
melbourne e. adams jr. Q
I would love to see that as I have put together a 2332 with a C.B. hybrid turbo,redline EFI and a set of strip dominator heads with 48×38 valves for my street car
Very interested in purchasing this exact setup in the exact same color/exact same specs. I'll be in touch - thanks CB Performance for the great videos. I'll save my questions for another time.
Would of been nice to have this in my Bug....DAMN!
Beautiful job
That sounds amazing.
Nice work Pat..........insane!
Do not you think chrome pulleys will make it has less grip on the belt and, consequently, less spin on the alternator, which means less cooling on the engine and less charging?
Beautiful motor.
My favorite sound. the sounds of Herbie the Love Bug at full speed
Great video, thanks
In a 1700lb Beetle this should FLY!
No 310hp here "8 PSI boost, 252hp, 249 ft lbs torque" @ 1:00. Dont get me wrong here because those are great numbers, but a far cry from 310hp. Still a super nice piece of work with all the goodies.
How long do these engines last with this much power?
I wonder if this EFI system will run on the type 4 motors.
That’s very impressive! Is an engine like this good for an every day driver or is it a weekend/racetrack kind of thing?
Thank you for the response.
Can you guys get that type of power out of a Porsche 1.7 or 2.0 from a 914?
Very sweet motor, though won't that exhaust cause clearance issues?
Jeez that sounds nice..
what am i missing? it was full throttle for six seconds and nothing happened until the seventh.
This. Scratching my head with this too. Can’t be 6 seconds lag with that small of a compressor housing.
This is how the dyno software works. It holds a load until the RPM stabilizes, and then starts ramping in the RPM load and recording results.
Good job, what is the price of such an engine?
I get confused, I seen some with 2332cc and they said they only had about 140hp. I knew that seemed odd
2276cc turbo motor sounds like fun. why doesnt cb performance build a supercharged motor?
Pat has always wanted to, but there is a lot of cost involved. Also, they don't make the power that turbo engines do, they just look and sound cool. Thanks.
Me encantó también ese motor, cuánto cuesta uno de esos Pat? Y se necesita alguna relación de caja de velocidades en particular para sacarle todo el provecho a ese motor?
Wondering what the MPG is? That would suggest the efficiency, somewhat, of the engine.
Brilliant vid, and stunning engine, runs so much smoother with efi...have you tried megasquirt?
Nicely done video!
Un freaking believable
so if someone were to build this exact same motor but maybe in a slightly larger size like say a 2332cc or 2387cc and run 15 ibs of boost they'd easily top 400+ horsepower.
damn I really want CB performance to build my engine lol
Would love to see what this went into.
Great work guys. Do you not use an intercooler though?
I wonder. Lets say I put this type of engine in a vw superbug for historic rally here in Europe. What needs allot of accelerating and decelerating, would it have a long lifespan? Because I do this as a hobby. For Fun... And I dont have the time tinkering every day to get the car ready every weekend.
Very clean
Marks got pockets!!! Whats a motor like this go for
SOLID!
In the video you said it made 252hp. The title of the video says it made 310. I have questions...
I wonder what an inline barrel type liquid to air intercooler would do?
wow!! very nice!
How does it works on long-distance?
What would I need to make about 150hp on an n/a motor? Is that possible. I don’t know much about beetle engines. I’ve been wanting to build a chopped up beetle. But make it more like a race car. Idk. Just trying to get ideas on cost and difficulty.
very nice!
That is one bad ass car
How much would it cost to have you build this exact same motor for my 1972 vw beetle
Lets see, it cost around 12k in March of 2016, so probably around 14k, but that's just a rough estimate. Pat can get you more specifics on the price if you are interested in having him build you one.
very first engine i built was a 2276 back in 1987
Smooth engine....
what is the difference between Fueltech competitor and CB Performance products?
any bug heads out there could u explain what's the difference (performance wise) on a turbo setup . all I see here in cali is the setup where the carb connects directly to the turbo and hangs outside , where as this setup with charge pipes going to the carbs is rarely seen even at local meets
The turbo on the dyno is a blow through system where the turbo blows through the carbs or EFI throttle bodies. The other style is called a draw through system. That's when The engine draws air and fuel through the carb and turbo then blows into the engine.
cub67 thanks for the info , what are the pros/cons of this setup that CB performance built.
BighomieJ5x - a draw through carb system is very simple as far as set up. But you have drivability issues. Fuel tends to puddle and cause a sluggish running engine up until you start making boost. A blow through system is a little more expensive but it is very driveable. It will drive around town all day without puddling and is a snap to tune especially with EFI.
@@cub67 Thanks for responding, Cub!
4:28 why is there an edit right here?
WHat is the price/cost for this engine?
Is there anyway to build this in dual exhaust like a standard beetle?
OK, I need one of these for my trike
Só uma pergunta . Como proceder para ter uma Obra de arte dessas?
$$$$$$
Good job!!!!
What car is this going into?? Savage engine BTW
Type-1 Sedan.
why no intercooler ever on these engines?
Just another example that people with lots of money get to have the best fun.
Curious as to how you vent the boost? I can't seem to find the blow off valve on your turbo system? Are you doing something different?
Mackenzie Loewen they could be running a stealth diverter valve. vws like them more than bovs
Whats this worth also live in Canada? Trying to figure out if I want a VW Bug
uffffffff a beast!
is there a dogleg manual that works with these?
Was this an engine from the 60s or a recent one from the Mexico factory?
Neither, this is in fact a Turnkey Engine built in 2017 by Pat Downs of CB Performance, using new parts from the VW aftermarket.
Where you guys are located
Is there a 3D model of this engine because i would love to build this engine but i would add alittle more HP to my beetle because I'm building a RWB, JDM beetle if anyone cares so yeah
How much power would a similar build without a turbo make?
Our most recent dyno video features a 2276cc Carbureted engine that produced 170hp. You could even potentially get up to 200hp out of that size, by swapping out a few components.
that sounds like enough fun
Do you think upgrading a 1973 1300cc VW beetle engine to 1600cc would cause any long term issues? Thanks
Yes. You will enjoy driving your car so much more, you would then need to upgrade to a 1776cc. And then a 1914cc. And then... you get the idea. In all seriousness, going from 1300cc to 1600cc is no problem.
No it's done all the time, and you can use stock parts. You have to remember this technology is over 80 years old. When you start upgrading, it is assumed you are going to use it, so better parts are needed if you are going to be running it hard. There is a good reason all the aftermarket parts are available, but cost more. Everything is stronger with different metallurgy, but will stand up to the higher demands of more horsepower. If you do upgrade you will feel the difference, and it will have a little more horsepower, which is all that is needed in most cases. If you just add jugs with no bottom end work, you are looking for trouble.
Alejandro hola.! gracias por tu interés en ayudar, soy de Venezuela.. me gustaría saber el precio de este motor en $
www.cbperformance.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=138
what is the compression ratio for this engine?
Qual valor desse motor completo? Tem possibilidade de enviar para o Paraguai?
12k
252hp with a Turbo? Doesn't sound to much for me. Out of the 90ies I know some people her in GER that had 220 from a 2.9 typ 4 n/a. A 2,1l n/a with 170.
Alright, it's different numbers measured on 9 and 14 pounds of boost. I didn't see that in the description. 310 sound sufficient thought 😀
How much did this engine cost?
Nice!
that shit will fit type 1 with decklid fully closed
How much is this engine, I am good with a 150hp engine?