I don't know but it needs to change. Playoffs were designed to make the end of the season more popular and make better racing but they've done the opposite. Racing quality has diluted and the sport has become way less popular since the inception of the playoffs
I honestly don't care anymore. I don't trust NASCAR to make any correct decisions. It's too complicated, the entertainment value is more "shock" than actual excitement. The stories aren't great. It's a contrived business with contrived outcomes.
I'm in favor of a season long championship. You get bonus points for winning a stage, leading the most laps, and winning the race. I'd also add that if you win all three stages (which includes the race itself), you get double bonus points.
As an F1 fan in addition to NASCAR, I can tell you that adding double bonus points or even just double points is a bad idea. When F1 did bonus points for a number of years (mainly for the season finale) it created a ton of confusion when it came to how the standings played out & everyone apart from the FIA & Bernie Ecclestone (who introduced the idea in the first place) hated it. One of the first things that Liberty Media did when they took over the commercial rights to F1 was tell the FIA to get rid of bonus points for the season finale because it was negatively affecting viewership & interest. Currently the only time bonus points are awarded in F1 is during the sprint races & that's only a small number of races so it doesn't really affect the season standings too much. The only way bonus points could be awarded in NASCAR under the format you laid out is if the stages are removed because it would add incentive for drivers to perform well during the whole race in order to get the points.
@chrisguardiano6143 I understand what you're saying completely. Thank you for speaking from your perspective. Personally, I wouldn't be against stages going away and bonus points being handed throughout the race. It was like that for years with no problem.
@@bhp2488 i doubt nascar gets rid of stages because that actually directly affects the racing product. I would too love a full season points format however, every other major motorsport does it no problem, If NASCAR does it I honestly believe it will make it easier to get new fans
-Remove win and you’re in -Remove the elimination style format -You need to actually perform to make the playoffs -Reduce the playoff grid to 12 -Rename the playoffs back to the chase (I’m going to jump for joy if they actually change the format)
I disagree with half of this But you made some good points I’d bring back the top 30 in points rule. Maybe even move it up to top 25. I think you can keep it at 16 if you make it top 25 in points make it I also think the regular season champion should also receive an automatic first round bye just like the NFL. And Move the Championship race back to homestead
I became a NASCAR fan in 2004, so I grew up watching the 10-race Chase. I like your idea of returning to that format, provided NASCAR makes the changes you recommended.
There does NOT need to be Rounds!! It should be either a 10 race Chase, with the Top 12 drivers in points, no "win and you're in"...or a full season Championship. Im so tired of the "Rounds" and entertainment gimmick bullshit.
If done right an elimination format isn’t really bad. The playoffs themself are in reality a crutch to allow guys who weren’t the best all year catch up. In a perfect world the only guys at risk of being eliminated should be the guys outside the top 6 or so of overall points.
Rounds could work if done right. Eliminate the win and advance, maybe give a bonus to the winner... maybe a 10-15 bump over 2nd. Do that and it could be both entertaining and legitimate.
-Remove win and you’re in (if no change, top 20 in points are only eligible) -Reward more points for wins so that stage points don’t surpass -10 races total for the playoffs, points only -Regular season champ gets an automatic berth to the final 4 -3 race championship round
Heck to the Playoffs, let's go back to a full-season points format, staggered in tiers: 36th and lower: 0 points 35th to 20th: +1 point per position 19th to 12th: +2 points per position 11th to 6th: +3 points per position 5th to 1st: +5 points per position Should come out to: 1st 75 pts. 2 70 3 65 4 60 5 55 6 50 7 47 8 44 9 41 10 38 11 35 12 32 13 30 14 28 15 26 16 24 17 22 18 20 19 18 20 16 21 15 22 14 23 13 24 12 25 11 26 10 27 9 28 8 29 7 30 6 31 5 32 4 33 3 34 2 35 1 36th+ 0 And a few +5 bonuses (must complete at least 2/3 of race distance to be credited): - Pole Position - Lead 1 Lap - Lead the most Laps - Fastest Lap - Fastest (penalty-free) 4-tire+fuel stop A 'Perfect Race' or 'Domination' would result in 100 Points If we had more short tracks and road/street courses, I'd create 4 other trophies to compete for in lieu of "playoffs" -short tracks (
@@davecarsley8773Yeah. I Agree. The NASCAR Xfinity Series And The NASCAR Craftsman Truck Series, Needs To Go Back To The Winston Cup Full-Season Points Format. But... As For The NASCAR Cup Series... Go Back To The Original Chase Format With The 2004-2006 10 Driver/2004-2013 10 Race Format With Chase Points, No Win And You're In, And Lastly, No Eliminations.
Here's an idea. Reward winning with more points, but take away win and your in except at marquis events. For example, the Daytona 500 grants you a playoff spot, but spring Pheonix does not. Make the big races matter more as the only races that can lock you into the playoffs
The health of the sport is steady and I don’t think a new format would gain many fans, it would make the experience of the sport better for the current fans
@@HHPYE42nah 2014 was definitely worse lol. After the first round it all goes to 0? You have 1 bad race and your season is over. Look at Jeff Gordon? Yea in 2015 Kyle Busch didn’t race the full season but he at least proved he deserved to be there and if he did race the full season he probably would’ve been even more dominant.
@@timechanger9162Except Kyle Busch still missed 10 races and should've never been able to get a playoff waiver from NASCAR to begin with. There's no justifing that any more anyways.
People need to be careful what they wish for when it comes to point format. Feel like there’s no right answer either way people will complain to complain about what the format is
@ThatsBadTV if a driver dominated so much he won the championship 3 weeks early he probably deserves it. I agree having a championship being won at Martinsville would be underwhelming but it provided some great moments. Like 92, 02, 79 (this is just off the top of my head I'm sure there were others).
I keep saying it but here’s my ideal format -10 race playoffs -top 8 drivers in points get in, then 2 wild cards based on which drivers outside of the top 8 in points have the most wins -no eliminations -homestead finale Boom everyone’s happy
Here’s what I think. Go back to the Latford System and instead of 175 points for a win, make it 200 points. Bigger point payout for wins and everyone’s happy. Consistency still matters and if you win a bunch of races you still have a shot at the title if you’re maybe not as consistent.
Season long champioship, making sure the race winner gets a lot more than 2nd and last 10 races offer 20% more points to top 5. Extra points to most lead laps and fastest laps. Remove stages for some tracks, like 5-10 per year.
-Get rid of stage cautions (No need for those, seriously) -Make it so you need 2 wins to lock yourself into playoffs/next round -Award 50 points for win, 40 for 2nd, 35 for 3rd -Award 25 playoff points for regular season champ, 18 for 2nd, 15 for 3rd, 13 for 4th, 12 for 5th, ... 1 for 16th-20th -Make it so winning a Daytona duel is worth 1 playoff point
Here are the changes I would make... Single race points and system... three stages but no stage cautions. Only bonus point awards. Single Race points... The winner gets 50 pts Second gets 40 Third gets 35 Fourth gets 34 Fifth gets 33, etc... down to last getting 0 points. Bonus points per race... Stage one winner gets 3 bonus points, no one else gets any. Stage two winner gets 3 bonus points, no one else gets any. One bonus point for leading a lap. 3 bonus points for leading the most laps. 60 points max per race, race winner is assured to score most points. Playoffs would be 10 races with only 12 drivers. The first round is three races, the second round is three, and the championship round is four. Four drivers are eliminated at the end of each round. NO MORE WIN AND YOUR IN OR WIN AND YOU ADVANCE. Everything is points based. Top 12 drivers in regular season points make the playoff. Seeding is based on playoff points... 25 points for every win 10 points for every top 5 5 points for every top 10 Regular season champion gets 50 playoff points Runner up gets 25 Third gets 15 Fourth gets 10 Fifth gets 5 After each playoff round, points reset to playoff point totals from the regular season. No carryover from previous playoff rounds. Championship round will have a drafting track (my preference is Talladega), speedway (Homestead), road course (COTA), short track (Martinsville).
I kept track of my own system this year. No stage points, 12 Playoff drivers (Top 10 in points +2 Wild Cards), three round Playoffs (12, 9, and 6), a four race championship round, and double points for the Crown Jewel races. (I had five with the addition of the Bristol Night Race) I didn't reset the points after the Regular Season, but I might do that for next year.
The idea of drivers and teams having a bye week is maybe the worst idea I've ever heard not only is it bad for the team? It's also very unfair to the fans as well
Please we need a change badly for the phony playoffs. Take away the 1 race championship and win and your in. I would still prefer the Chase but would rather have a 3 race championship round than just have it come down to 1 race.
My complaint is that the playoffs feel too convoluted and complicated. Try to explain this format to new fans without them being confused. I'd say keep the way we set the field now (with a top 25 rule added) and remove the rounds and go back to a 10-race postseason.
Something I've wondered is why there isn't either a points bonus or a small cash bonus for the driver who gets the fastest lap? I feel like that's one very small but important way to make somebody more invested in sitting through and hours long race.
My Dumb Idea -Take the Top 16 in points after race 26 -5 Race round where we take the top 6 in points, race winners are automatically locked in -5 race round to decide the champion from the 6 drivers
How do you justify having a Playoff system that has the teams who don’t make the playoffs continue to compete in every event all the way through the championship event?
If wins are going to lock drivers in, it needs to be 2+ wins so you eliminate the trash drivers that luck into a win. I also heavily agree that winners need to get more points, both in the regular season and in the playoff bonus points. Winning currently isn't worth enough because teams are often prioritizing stage points over going for the win, especially if they already have the win they need to be locked in.
-Get rid of win and you're in -Reduce the playoff grid to 12 -Eliminate 2 drivers per round -Either a format of 1-3-3-3 -Add a 5 pt bonus for stage wins and a 15 or 20 point bonus for winning the race -Move the provisional up to a 25th or higher reg. season points finish (In other words if you start dominant and miss a huge chunk of the season due to injury, you'll be in company with Ernie Irvan and Sterling Marlin)
Go back to the 2003 and prior format. Bonus points for Poles, lead most laps, lead a lap, leader at end of stage, no more stage cautions, have crown jewel wins worth more. No more Gimmick Playoffs with paper champions
If Winston Cup points don’t come back. : Do 26 race regular season winners only since Nascar is pounding the winning means everything. 7 race chase of regular season winners based on points for final 3 spots for a 3 race playoff. Regular season champ gets automatic spot in final 3 race playoff. 3 race playoff 4 drivers based on points with tracks rotating every year. Kind of a mix of new and old.
If the government allows them to resume sponsorship, then they'll possibly return. But as it stands, there's no intention letting tobacco sponsors take over sports
If we can bring back a Winston Cup esque format I’ll concede to leaving the stage format. Make wins worth 10 pts. more than 2nd so there is still an emphasis on winning, and avoid bonus points if you can sweep both stages and win the race.
The fix is really quite simple. Get rid of the playoffs and the postseason in general, get rid of stages, and use the points format that’s already in place for the regular season.
My idea for a playoff format: -Reduce the playoff grid to 10 drivers; 2 eliminations each round (Makes the format more prestigious) -Regular season champ gets an automatic bye to the championship 4 (Rewards performing in the regular season more) -Remove the win you're in (Prevents cheesy race wins and unfair eliminations) -Reset the points completely for championship 4, but stage points count (Adds more valor to the season finale and incentivizes performing the whole race)
The race bye for the regular season champ is a dumb idea because then that driver could not show up to the tracks for 9 races or not take them seriously and still run for a championship.
No matter what format you have (even if we were to completely revert back to Winston) a driver and a team WILL inevitably and soon find a way to exploit it.
I feel this possible change is not related to fan feedback but more from sponsors and Media feedback, the one bringing in the money for them. Once they got scared by the money providers that's when NASCAR started to consider changes. Will see what happened because the overhaul may be even worse than what we have currently.
Most of the changes the past 20 years weren't done for the fans but money, I think the only change made without TV networks or sponsors begging NASCAR for was double file restarts and later the choose line which was probably 11 years late.
The good ole Latford System... but a revised version that rewards substantially more points for wins and many more bonus points for "most laps lead" than the old system did.
NASCAR is under so much fire right now coming from all directions. They're just getting desperate and trying to do something to get fans to look at them in a better light again.
My worry is that Nascar will hear the people complaining about various things and just miss the forest for the trees. For every issue and all the race fixing and people being bitter about even year Lagano. This season worked as intended. In that traditional lull of the summer season when no one used to think of a championship, we had 6 winners who threw everything at the wall to try and get into the hunt. 3 of which were within the last month and Briscoe hitting a home run at the last second to keep his season alive. Kyle Busch finally showing a spark of life to have a last gasp at not only keeping his streak alive but possibly going for more. 10th place being the focus for a points battle. In any other context who cares about 10th place? This kept people engaged in a way that couldn't happen without a post season. And this is what nascar wants Then everything reset. Even playing field outside of a couple stray points that can be erased within a single race's stages. That's what a post season does. From then on it's whoever does the best in the post season gets the championship at the end. And Nascar keeping that win and get in it's hard to argue with the guy who won 3 times in 10 races. As someone who likes to see racing as a season long series of endurance races with rough and tumble but sporting notions, I hate this. But this is exactly what Nascar wanted.
My two ideal formats that I keep mentioning everywhere. Both would have top 12 in points + 2 highest in wins between 13th and 20th in points make the chase (and for the love of god bring back the “Chase” moniker) 10 Race Chase: Points reset is simply cutting the pre chase points totals in half, thus cutting the points gaps between all drivers in half. In the chase, have an additional 12 point bonus for a win, 8 point bonus for 2nd, and 5 point bonus for 3rd while adding an additional 4 points to stage wins. With this a driver that wins both stages and the race itself can leave with 80 points rather than the current 60. This would make every single position all year matter in the championship, but the final 10 races still mean by far the most. This format used with this years results would have had Larson Bell and Byron all within 3 points of each other at the end of the Phoenix race. Elimination format: For the points reset, add an additional 3 playoff points for finishing 2nd-5th and 1 playoff point for finishing 6th-10th on top of what we have now to make consistency mean something again. Keep the current 3 race rounds with 4 eliminations each for the first two rounds but continue the points without a reset from round 1 to 2. Win and your in is still in effect here. All wins in the first 6 playoff races get an additional 3 playoff points (8 total) for the final championship round. The final round is 6 drivers fighting over 4 races for the championship on straight points with a reset beforehand. If this format was in use this season it would have also had Byron Larson and Bell head to head for the championship, and Byron would have won over bell by a single point.
My idea is this: start with four groups of four drawn at random. Top three in each (wins or points) advance. Then three groups of four drawn the same as round one. Top two of each group plus top two third place finishers advance (same ways as round one). Then two groups of four drawn the same way as rounds one and two. Top two advance to the championship race. There in this format could be some very tough fights to get out of a round.
In my view when it comes to the playoffs, here is what I would do: Use a full season points format up to the 2nd to last race of the season. After that 2nd to last race, the top 8 drivers in points would then be eligible to win the championship in the season finale and all points would be reset to 0 to ensure that all 8 drivers have an equal shot at winning the championship based on race peformance. The championship would be won by the driver who finishes the highest out of the 8 drivers.
As much as I think a lot of people would love to have an actual FULL SEASON POINTS FORMAT!!! I don’t think they will ever do that sadly… unless someone else becomes leader of NASCAR who knows what their doing changes things.
So this is what I was thinking. We partially get rid of the “win and you’re in” system. We have the last five races be a wildcard round. Have it be made up of a diverse list of tracks (I was thinking Watkins Glen, Iowa, Dover, New Hampshire, and Daytona). If you are in the top 20 in points and you win one of these races you are in the playoffs. Then we continue with the current system except for one change. Wins don’t automatically advance you. If you win a race you just get the same amount of points as the regular season. Also we would only have one points system with stages and final results all going toward the same total. With this it will be more likely that the best driver will actually get rewarded for their effort. For points there would be two points between each position except for first and second. A win has a ten point bonus. (1st-90; 2nd-78; 3rd-76; etc.) A stage win gives five points with only the top five being rewarded (1st-5, 2nd-4 and so on) and a pole gives 5 points so the maximum points available each week is 105pts. This hopefully keeps title races closer but doesn’t guarantee a “Game 7 moment” every year.
NASCAR needs to go back to a season long championship system. If the playoffs/chase is so great, then how come other circuit based racing series like IndyCar, Formula 1 and IMSA don’t have their own version of a playoff format? Especially in this day and age were we have all the information we need at our fingertips how come in the near 21 years since the inception of the chase, none of these other racing series implement their own versions of a playoff! Have the modern simplified version of the latford system (40 points for 1st, 1 point increment per position till either last place/40th whichever come first, gets 1 point), give five bonus points to the winner(therefore the winner is always guaranteed the most points in the race), 1 bonus point for leading a lap, 1 additional bonus point for the driver leading the most laps, I’d also give 1 point for the driver who qualified on the pole and 1 point for the driver who sets the fastest lap in the race. I’ve acknowledged that not everyone loves the season long race for the championship, but it’s the fairest and most legitimate way to crown the series champion.
I mean if we can’t go back to a season long format, we can at least try again with the old Chase format in some way. I do agree with why Jimmie, Knaus, and Hendrick won 5 championships in a row was cause it was the same tracks 2 times a year in different parts of the season to where ya just needed to get enough points from wins or finish consistently to qualify for the championship and then run hard in the last 10 races since ya already know how to setup the car and what lines r better. Whereas now there’s a lot more tracks on the schedule, including the final 10 that require different car setups and different disciplines. And I do agree with awarding more points for wins. It’s something I believe every major motorsports has figured out throughout the years. Ya look at the points awarded to the top 5 at the ones listed: F1: 1st-25 2nd-18 3rd-15 4th-12 5th-10 IndyCar: 1st-50 2nd-40 3rd-35 4th-32 5th-30 WEC: Same as F1 system per each class with points doubled for Le Mans and points increased for season final at Bahrain. I think start of the year too? IMSA: -Qualifying: 1st-35 2nd-32 3rd-30 4th-28 5th-26 -Race being doubled by 100: 1st-350 2nd-320 3rd-300 4th-280 5th-260 Granted these all have to do with grid sizes and racing style (multiclass racing for example) but they do work and the winner is awarded more points. Making winning a race more important. I think maybe if come 2026 IF NASCAR does decide any major overhauls then, ik they’re content with having a Playoff format, but if we at least have like this: -Keep it at a 10 race format. -Keep it at 16 drivers. -Remove the win and you’re in. -Remove the eliminations. -points get reset at the start of the last 10 races with Playoff points being added to their reset points like they do currently. -Award more points for wins. It could at least get some legitimacy back into the championship, points still all matter especially with the stages in all 10 races, winning a race means a lot while not turning things stupid like crashing someone for a championship spot, 1 bad race doesn’t determine whether you’re in for a chance at the championship or not, a bit of a mixed bag of the of the old Chase format with the current Playoff format and having legitimacy while also keeping it entertaining.
- No win and you're in - Shorter season (20 race regular season, 10 race playoff) - 10 is the playoff field, not 16 - 3000 point reset with seeding based on stage and playoff points (like you suggested) - Regular season champ gets a certain amount of bonus points to guarantee them top seed - Most points over the final ten races is your champion, no eliminations
I think a revised playoffs should go like this: -10 races. First round is 7 races. Top 4 in points after 7 races advances to the 3 race championship. No win and you’re in. -Final 3 races is for the championship. The 4 drivers start even in points and who ever scores the most points after 3 races wins. -Final 3 races every year has different tracks and order. So one year Vegas is in the final 3. One year Martinsville is the finale. No team has an advantage. Would also help some tracks with attendance if they have a championship 3 race. - 12 drivers make the playoffs. Top 10 in points and 2 wild card spots based on wins. Have to be in the top 20 in points to earn a wild card spot though. -Continue with stage points but get rid of the cautions. -Wins come with bonus points since we are no longer doing “win and your in”. I feel this rewards consistency again meanwhile keeping wins important too with bonus points. And we get rid of the win and your in gimmick. Have to perform each and every race.
Heres one thing that would be great. You win the regular season points championship youre already in the final round. If during the next X amount of races before the final round you average a finish above 5th-10th then you are seeded higher with a 5 point advantage. If you seed lower then its 0 point advantage.
I don't think NASCAR really cares with the ratings 'bump' of 1% increase right now. If the rating start dropping again, NASCAR might look at changes. I hate the playoffs, but 'win and you're in' is doing far more harm than good, see Austin Dillon's win. The playoffs can make sense in drag racing, being it's 1 vs 1 racing. I think you have great points in this video.
-Keep win and you’re in, but make it where you need 2 wins to lock in as opposed to just one. Make it win one race and advance in the playoffs however - Make it the last 12 races as opposed to 10 - Races 123 = R16 - Races 456 = R12 - Races 789 = R8 - Races 10 & 11 = R4 - Race 12 = 1 v 1 Give the regular season champ a spot in the R12.
They should do a format where the top 16 in points make the playoffs. No win and you’re in. The 8 in points automatically make it to the round of 12. Then top 4 automatically go to the round of 8. Then the top seed in the round of 8 makes the final 4.
i think if we started getting bonus points for leading half way, leading with 50 to go and then that way you could make up a little more points, also id love to see nascar bring money back into it, like whoever leads at halfway or who led the most laps gets a money bonus
I think win and you’re in should be out. I get why it was put in so that drivers would do anything to get it knowing the benefits, but sometimes they take it too far, see the “Took Out 400.” If it does remain for whatever reason, there needs to be a cutoff again. Top 20. I mean great that Harrison did what he did at Daytona but 1 lucky race weekend shouldn’t put what otherwise was a bad season going into the Championship fight. As far as the Playoffs, I like 2 format changes that I’ve seen, though 1 I thought of on my own just thinking about it, but seen it has begun to be floated around as recently as this past weekend. That being the Playoff drivers having their own points system. For example, in race 1, Chase Briscoe finished 38th & last amongst the Playoff drivers. In this format he would be credited with 16th place points rather than 38th that he got. Also there wouldn’t be eliminations & then as usual the driver with the most points at the end of race 10 is the champion. One format change I saw was effectively reversing how the rounds are done now. The round of 16 being 1 race. Then the round of 12, 8 & Championship 4 being 3 each. Also, if this is logistically possible, short of the finale due to contract-likely constraints, the final 10 races can be shuffled annually. If it could be done as they announce the schedule for the coming year or wait until close to or when we reach the final 10 races to do the shuffle.
After taking some time to think about it here would be my proposal for the playoffs going forward that I would describe as a hybrid of sorts because I personally don't think a season long points format is the best answer. (1) Have a 24 race Regular season, where there is no win and you're in. (2) The playoffs would be 12 races broken up into 3 rounds of 4 races where the bottom 4 are eliminated at the end of each round. No win to advance to the next round. Eliminations take place by the lowest total points at the end of each round. (2) In the season and postseason wins, stage wins, Top 10 stage finishers, lap leaders, and most laps led will be awarded with points accordingly. 10 Bonus Points for a win, stage wins will be worth 15 points, while 2nd-10th get points from 9-1 in descending order. For drivers that lead laps during the race a 1 point bonus will be awarded, and the one who leads the most laps will get a 5 point bonus. (3)There will be a points reset only once at the beginning of the postseason. Where points for the 12 championship contenders are reset to an equal amount of 3,000 points. (4) Bonus points will also be given for where you end the regular season, 15 points for the winner, and in descending order 11-1 points for those who finish in second through 12th. (5) All three races in the final round, including stages will count toward point total and the championship. (I personally don't like the idea of not counting points in a final race. You want a championship outrun your opponents in all stages rather than just the final stage).
I like your system. Tracks wise, I’d like a road course, a short track, and an intermediate in each route. I like Eric’s wild card idea too. Of course NASCAR would wanna make that a super speedway. So use Atlanta for that.
My idea might be a little out there. But I think you should qualify in on avg finish and give extra to points to wins. And when I say extra points I mean like 20 extra points per win. Top 10 qualify in and 5 are eliminated after 5 races. Then the last 5 drivers are in based on points. It's a bit convoluted but at least it will be the actual best drivers if we absolutely have to have a post season
It needs fkn deleted completely. They lost so many fans going to playoffs and stages. Many I personally know, I’m like the only one left from the 80s still watching
The former Lucas Oil Late Model Dirt Series would do a full season points format and then the last handful of races came down to a final 4. I like that format IF you still want a playoff series.
I think NASCAR needs to go back to rewarding points for leading laps, leading the most laps and if a driver can pull it off extra points for leading every lap. It would incentivize leading laps and help put strategy back into the sport that we've been missing.
7:13 I agree with your stance here but you could also argue wins matter less than ever since all they're treated as is a ticket to the next round which can dilute winning whether you care about the playoffs or not. Look at how Ross's Kansas win was treated they make it seem like wins don't matter without this format when they obviously do. Winning is important and wins are great but they shouldn't be a get out of jail free card.
Anything LESS than getting rid of elimination style playoffs and reverting back to the 2004-2013 final 10 races will be a dissapointment. 10 or 12 drivers fine, but NOT 16!
Were not too far off in our ideas. The only thing I'd change from yours... is instead of reseting the playoff field miles above the rest... just create a separate bracket aside from the regular points that ONLY determines a champion. That allows those who didn't make the playoffs to still potentially improve their position after 26 races.
My preference is always going to lie with a full season format. However, if I had to modify the postseason format instead of scrap it altogether, here's what I would do: 1) Win and you're in is scrapped. Justification: No reasonable system allows Harrison Burton to compete for the Cup this year at the expense of Chris Buescher. 2) Top 10 in points advance to the postseason. Justification: As a matter of principle, nobody below 10th in points with 10 races to go deserves to win the championship. As great as Tony Stewart's Chase to the Cup was in 2011, he would have only recovered to 3rd under a full season system that year. Ideally, take these two changes and keep Playoff points as they are as a means of seeding for the points reset. However, my altering of the system would best be coupled with a third change: 3) Completely overhaul the points system and race formatting. Justification: The current base points allocations for finishing positions by themselves do not reward winning enough. It should not be possible for the 2nd place or lower driver in a given race to have scored more points than the race winner. However, stage points allow this to happen on a regular basis. So, stages and stage points need to go. Here is how I would revise the base points allocations to reflect this change so Playoff points do not need to be altered, compared to the current base allocations: 36th-40th: 1 (0 point increments; same) 35th-11th: 2-26 (1 point increments; same) 10th-6th: 28-36 (2 point increments) 5th-2nd: 39-48 (3 point increments) 1st: 60 (12 point increment; same number of points awarded today if a driver wins all three stages) a) The current base allocation to the winner (40) is 114.29% of the 2nd-placed driver's base allocation (35). This would increase to 125%. b) The current base allocation to the winner (40) is 148.15% of the 10th-placed driver's base allocation (27). This would increase to 214.29%. At the end of the day, I do not think there is a perfect solution to this dilemma surrounding the Playoffs that balances entertainment with sport. I happen to believe that sport should create entertainment, not the other way around, and that every race should matter equally. While I never liked the original Chase, the original Chase was far better than the Playoffs are now purely from a sporting perspective and, combined with the implementation of playoff points and a reworking of the base points system, would serve as a good compromise between a full season format and the Playoff format.
24 regular season races 12 race playoffs 1 race "wild card", top half of entries bye week during wild card. 5 races to determine top half(bottom half eliminated) final 6 races determine champion
Top 10 in points make a chase. if your inside the top 12 in points and have a win you make it as well. everyone in the top 12 starts at 5000 points,5 bonus points for a stage win, 10 bonus points for a win, also bonus point for fastest lap, and most laps led.
For 2025, I would wish for Nascar to at least let playoffs points carry over into the championship 4. It dosen't change the strcture of the playoffs but it changes the objevtive of the final race which is to just finish well to secure the most points.
My version of The Playoffs! -24 race regular season, 12 race playoffs. -Top 16 in regular season points are eligible for playoffs. -Winning a stage in a race rewards a driver 5 bonus points. Meaning that winning both stages will be 10 bonus points. Winning both stages and a race in the regular season rewards 20 bonus points. Maximum of 30 bonus points for when a driver dominates a race. -The regular season champion will reward 40 bonus points. -Each round of The Playoffs contains 3 races each. RO16, RO12, RO8, and The Final 4. -In the RO16, drivers who are Top 12 in points advance to the RO12. Top 12 in points advance to the RO8, and the Top 8 in points advance to The Final 4. Driver with the most points in The Final 4 is crowned a champion. -During the playoffs, winning a stage rewards 10 bonus points. Winning both stages reward 20 bonus points. Winning a race rewards a driver 25 bonus points. Maximum of 45 bonus points for when a driver dominates a race. My Playoff format is a mix of the Winston Cup Format and the current format. If there’s anything I missed, let me know.
Just go back to the 2011-2013 Wild Card Chase format with the addition of Stage Wins counting as 1 Chase Point; Race Wins counting as 5 Chase Points; and the points leader after Race 26 still gets 15 bonus Chase Points. Race Wins should also be worth 20 points more than second place. Top 10 in points qualify while 11th and 12th can go to drivers between 11th and 20th with a win or two, but if they have to use the Wild Card wins, then those wins do not count as Chase Points. Turn the 12 drivers loose for the final 10 races.
If they took inspiration from the Lucas Oil Late Models points format, and made some tweaks it could make it significantly better compared to the current format
I believe Ryan and Joey are number 1 and 2 as worst crowned champs statistically. DBC said something about it but I can't remember exactly what they said
if they want 'playoffs', might as well make it a real 'playoffs': -Top 20 teams: 7 race points playoff races to make a real "game 7 moment" aka "best of 7" -Top 10 in a 3 race championship, points only, race off -No more stage breaks, no stage points
Hey Jared, how are you? Here’s my proposal you keep the elimination style of playoffs this time no points reset. But the top 16 get in and there’s elimination like normal. There are two parts of the old Winston cup format. I would bring back and that is five bonus points for leading a lap and five bonus points for leading the most laps For stage wins they should increase and stage points. 20 points awarded to the winner of the stage second place gets 10 points all the way down to 10th Place which gets two points. most importantly, the part I would keep if you win you are in one more thing as an incentive and it’s conditional. If one driver wins all the stages and the race they’ll get one more additional playoff point added to their total I would also get rid of points in the dual race because that’s a qualifying race, but if the championship 4 in the finale, still get playoff points and stage points because everyone else below them is as well for the sake of consistency. While finishing in front of the other, it’s always the best concept, but it was literally force all four to win the race and the championship. However, if neither of them can make it to the checkered flag first then I’ll go based on points not who is in front of the other
I really like this proposal, i would like the season long points format but if not this playoff proposal I would like. They need to remove the win and you’re in as well. Can’t have guys 35th in points taking spots from guys who are way better
As I expressed to the NASCAR Fan Council, my solution to a successful Cup Series format is keeping the "playoff format" with the top 10 NASCAR Cup Series drivers in points (however the points are awarded) advance to the post season, eliminating the driver with the least points, after each post season race! The three finalist Cup Series drivers that remain after the seven post season races, move on to the fast finals of the three final Championship races, competing for the most points throughout. Regardless of their position on the track at the end of the final race, the driver with the most accumulative points, wins the Championship. Once the post season begins & after each driver is eliminated, the remaining contenders are awarded 200 additional points, to separate from those not remaining in contention for the Championship. In addition to that format, the elimination of the "win & you're automatically in"( the post season) format is implemented. Perhaps, (by popular demand) the elimination of race stages is also implemented. I also would like to see each race 's finishing position awarded ONE race point for last place & an additional race point for every position closer to first place, ten race points for the driver that either starts a points paying race last (or first) & finishes that race in first place. One additional points for any driver that leads the most laps in a points paying race (any ties in most laps led, resulting in those drivers equally splitting laps led race points awarded). Perhaps, the driver that wins the most points paying races, be awarded ten additional race points (ties in most races won, resulting in equally splitting the awarded "most wins" race points bonus, with no partial points awarded) & the winner of the All-Star race, as well as the Clash winning driver, receive 3 exhibition race points bonus, each)! I would love to hear any feedback on my proposed points/playoff proposition??? 🏳️🏁🏆🤔🤔🤔
NASCAR. If you're reading this, just go back to the old Winston format. No more bullshit. No more stupid gimmicks. Just go back to racing where every race counts. You guys suck. Just get rid of the stupid playoffs. You've ruined it. No. More. Bullshit.
We don’t need to over complicate this. The way to fix it is go back to the 2004-2006 chase but awards consistency in the regular season. 20 points for the regular season champion. 10 for second and 9 for third. Those points are added to the drivers reset along with playoff points in the regular season they earn. Keep awarding points as is (as it’s not the problem with the playoffs). Top 10 drivers at the end of the stage awarded points 10-1 with the stage winner receiving 1 playoff point. At the end of the race the race winner gets 50 points for winning. 2nd-last place 35-1 points like as it is now. No win and you’re in. Also in my format it’s 12 drivers get in the playoffs. 16 is too much. Then 10 weeks no round to round elimination like now. 12 drivers fight for 10 weeks. It’s way more fair but also keeps the entertainment value while keeping the regular season actually meaningful.
I would just bring back the 12 man Wildcard Chase with tweaks made to be full proof (if NASCAR Officiating can actually wise up and not play favoritism) *Addressing Wildcard Format* Keeping the position points Passing One Car +1 point But when doing moving past positions that were already passed will not be counted Passing chase contenders is +2 points *Race Earn Points* Stage Winners +20 points (no more stage cautions) Pole Winner +50 points Race Winner +100 points Fastest Lap +10 Points *Regular Season Top 12 (NO POINTS RESET)* Winner +1000 points Runner-up +950 points Bronze +900 Etc. *Previous Year Regular Season Winner (START OF THE YEAR)* +30 points cushion *Previous Year Season Champion (START OF THE YEAR)* +60 points cushion *What I keep* Yellow Chase Markings on the Cars for easier identification (Splitter, Both Name Banners, Roof Number, Spoiler, NASCAR Chase Logos)
What format do you think NASCAR will try next or what tweaks will they make to the current one?
They will give less point for wins and more points for the regular championship winner. Or do nothing
I don't know but it needs to change. Playoffs were designed to make the end of the season more popular and make better racing but they've done the opposite. Racing quality has diluted and the sport has become way less popular since the inception of the playoffs
No more win and your in and make a 1 3 3 3 format
I honestly don't care anymore. I don't trust NASCAR to make any correct decisions. It's too complicated, the entertainment value is more "shock" than actual excitement. The stories aren't great. It's a contrived business with contrived outcomes.
Whatever they do, the one thing that must change is the removal of a winner take all championship race.
That is non-negotiable.
I'm in favor of a season long championship. You get bonus points for winning a stage, leading the most laps, and winning the race. I'd also add that if you win all three stages (which includes the race itself), you get double bonus points.
As an F1 fan in addition to NASCAR, I can tell you that adding double bonus points or even just double points is a bad idea. When F1 did bonus points for a number of years (mainly for the season finale) it created a ton of confusion when it came to how the standings played out & everyone apart from the FIA & Bernie Ecclestone (who introduced the idea in the first place) hated it. One of the first things that Liberty Media did when they took over the commercial rights to F1 was tell the FIA to get rid of bonus points for the season finale because it was negatively affecting viewership & interest. Currently the only time bonus points are awarded in F1 is during the sprint races & that's only a small number of races so it doesn't really affect the season standings too much. The only way bonus points could be awarded in NASCAR under the format you laid out is if the stages are removed because it would add incentive for drivers to perform well during the whole race in order to get the points.
@chrisguardiano6143 I understand what you're saying completely. Thank you for speaking from your perspective. Personally, I wouldn't be against stages going away and bonus points being handed throughout the race. It was like that for years with no problem.
@@bhp2488 i doubt nascar gets rid of stages because that actually directly affects the racing product. I would too love a full season points format however, every other major motorsport does it no problem, If NASCAR does it I honestly believe it will make it easier to get new fans
In the sprit of change what about doing away with the caution at the stage end so strategy’s can play out and leads that are built up aren’t wasted
-Remove win and you’re in
-Remove the elimination style format
-You need to actually perform to make the playoffs
-Reduce the playoff grid to 12
-Rename the playoffs back to the chase
(I’m going to jump for joy if they actually change the format)
You absolutely cooked with this statement
This guy Brayden gets it
It’s better than what it is now
Full season format is the only way bring back Winston
I disagree with half of this
But you made some good points
I’d bring back the top 30 in points rule. Maybe even move it up to top 25.
I think you can keep it at 16 if you make it top 25 in points make it
I also think the regular season champion should also receive an automatic first round bye just like the NFL.
And Move the Championship race back to homestead
I became a NASCAR fan in 2004, so I grew up watching the 10-race Chase. I like your idea of returning to that format, provided NASCAR makes the changes you recommended.
There does NOT need to be Rounds!!
It should be either a 10 race Chase, with the Top 12 drivers in points, no "win and you're in"...or a full season Championship.
Im so tired of the "Rounds" and entertainment gimmick bullshit.
If done right an elimination format isn’t really bad. The playoffs themself are in reality a crutch to allow guys who weren’t the best all year catch up. In a perfect world the only guys at risk of being eliminated should be the guys outside the top 6 or so of overall points.
Yeah the rounds are not needed
I’m so with you!!
This isn’t soccer, this is auto racing. Elimination rounds do not work in racing. Simple.
Rounds could work if done right. Eliminate the win and advance, maybe give a bonus to the winner... maybe a 10-15 bump over 2nd. Do that and it could be both entertaining and legitimate.
-Remove win and you’re in (if no change, top 20 in points are only eligible)
-Reward more points for wins so that stage points don’t surpass
-10 races total for the playoffs, points only
-Regular season champ gets an automatic berth to the final 4
-3 race championship round
Not sure how you could even have a "10 race Chase" and a "3 race Championship round...
That would be a "7 race Chase" and the 3 race Championship.
So how do you have a “10 race chase” but a 3 race championship round? I’m very confused about that.
Try a 2-2-3-3
The "win and you're in" is the biggest problem. Either "multi win and ur in" or a buttload of points for each win
Heck to the Playoffs, let's go back to a full-season points format, staggered in tiers:
36th and lower: 0 points
35th to 20th: +1 point per position
19th to 12th: +2 points per position
11th to 6th: +3 points per position
5th to 1st: +5 points per position
Should come out to:
1st 75 pts.
2 70
3 65
4 60
5 55
6 50
7 47
8 44
9 41
10 38
11 35
12 32
13 30
14 28
15 26
16 24
17 22
18 20
19 18
20 16
21 15
22 14
23 13
24 12
25 11
26 10
27 9
28 8
29 7
30 6
31 5
32 4
33 3
34 2
35 1
36th+ 0
And a few +5 bonuses (must complete at least 2/3 of race distance to be credited):
- Pole Position
- Lead 1 Lap
- Lead the most Laps
- Fastest Lap
- Fastest (penalty-free) 4-tire+fuel stop
A 'Perfect Race' or 'Domination' would result in 100 Points
If we had more short tracks and road/street courses, I'd create 4 other trophies to compete for in lieu of "playoffs"
-short tracks (
Never happening.
@@davecarsley8773Yeah. I Agree. The NASCAR Xfinity Series And The NASCAR Craftsman Truck Series, Needs To Go Back To The Winston Cup Full-Season Points Format.
But... As For The NASCAR Cup Series...
Go Back To The Original Chase Format With The 2004-2006 10 Driver/2004-2013 10 Race Format With Chase Points, No Win And You're In, And Lastly, No Eliminations.
Here's an idea. Reward winning with more points, but take away win and your in except at marquis events. For example, the Daytona 500 grants you a playoff spot, but spring Pheonix does not. Make the big races matter more as the only races that can lock you into the playoffs
They need an overhaul, a total change is critical for the health of the sport, especially after the worst Playoffs in the formats history.
2015 was worse for me but i get what your going for
The health of the sport is steady and I don’t think a new format would gain many fans, it would make the experience of the sport better for the current fans
@@HHPYE42nah 2014 was definitely worse lol. After the first round it all goes to 0? You have 1 bad race and your season is over. Look at Jeff Gordon?
Yea in 2015 Kyle Busch didn’t race the full season but he at least proved he deserved to be there and if he did race the full season he probably would’ve been even more dominant.
@@timechanger9162Except Kyle Busch still missed 10 races and should've never been able to get a playoff waiver from NASCAR to begin with. There's no justifing that any more anyways.
People need to be careful what they wish for when it comes to point format. Feel like there’s no right answer either way people will complain to complain about what the format is
People keep wishing for the old style .. the style where you knew who won the championship 3 races before Phoenix ? No thanks..
@@ThatsBadTVonly one time in history was the championship ever decided 3 races early
There is a wrong answer however, and that is having a winner take all championship race. That can not be how a champion is crowned
@ I don’t disagree with that but I think people should be careful what they wish for
@ThatsBadTV if a driver dominated so much he won the championship 3 weeks early he probably deserves it. I agree having a championship being won at Martinsville would be underwhelming but it provided some great moments. Like 92, 02, 79 (this is just off the top of my head I'm sure there were others).
The playoffs need a change. It’s critical for the health of the overall sport. Hopefully NASCAR looks at it this offseason and does something.
I keep saying it but here’s my ideal format
-10 race playoffs
-top 8 drivers in points get in, then 2 wild cards based on which drivers outside of the top 8 in points have the most wins
-no eliminations
-homestead finale
Boom everyone’s happy
Confirm, I would be very happy with this!
I’ll believe it when I see it, until then I’ll be looking for things to do on Sundays
they should go back to the original 10 man chase.
Agreed. It's Eqsy, Simple, And It's NOT Freakin Hard.
Here’s what I think.
Go back to the Latford System and instead of 175 points for a win, make it 200 points. Bigger point payout for wins and everyone’s happy. Consistency still matters and if you win a bunch of races you still have a shot at the title if you’re maybe not as consistent.
Season long champioship, making sure the race winner gets a lot more than 2nd and last 10 races offer 20% more points to top 5.
Extra points to most lead laps and fastest laps.
Remove stages for some tracks, like 5-10 per year.
-Get rid of stage cautions (No need for those, seriously)
-Make it so you need 2 wins to lock yourself into playoffs/next round
-Award 50 points for win, 40 for 2nd, 35 for 3rd
-Award 25 playoff points for regular season champ, 18 for 2nd, 15 for 3rd, 13 for 4th, 12 for 5th, ... 1 for 16th-20th
-Make it so winning a Daytona duel is worth 1 playoff point
Here are the changes I would make...
Single race points and system... three stages but no stage cautions. Only bonus point awards.
Single Race points...
The winner gets 50 pts
Second gets 40
Third gets 35
Fourth gets 34
Fifth gets 33, etc... down to last getting 0 points.
Bonus points per race...
Stage one winner gets 3 bonus points, no one else gets any.
Stage two winner gets 3 bonus points, no one else gets any.
One bonus point for leading a lap.
3 bonus points for leading the most laps.
60 points max per race, race winner is assured to score most points.
Playoffs would be 10 races with only 12 drivers. The first round is three races, the second round is three, and the championship round is four. Four drivers are eliminated at the end of each round.
NO MORE WIN AND YOUR IN OR WIN AND YOU ADVANCE. Everything is points based. Top 12 drivers in regular season points make the playoff.
Seeding is based on playoff points...
25 points for every win
10 points for every top 5
5 points for every top 10
Regular season champion gets 50 playoff points
Runner up gets 25
Third gets 15
Fourth gets 10
Fifth gets 5
After each playoff round, points reset to playoff point totals from the regular season. No carryover from previous playoff rounds.
Championship round will have a drafting track (my preference is Talladega), speedway (Homestead), road course (COTA), short track (Martinsville).
20 of Logano's 36 wins were lucky. He sould have 16 wins,not 36. Harvick should've won 2018,Chartain should've won 2022,and Bell should've won 2024.
Are you sad?
I kept track of my own system this year. No stage points, 12 Playoff drivers (Top 10 in points +2 Wild Cards), three round Playoffs (12, 9, and 6), a four race championship round, and double points for the Crown Jewel races. (I had five with the addition of the Bristol Night Race) I didn't reset the points after the Regular Season, but I might do that for next year.
The idea of drivers and teams having a bye week is maybe the worst idea I've ever heard not only is it bad for the team? It's also very unfair to the fans as well
Please we need a change badly for the phony playoffs. Take away the 1 race championship and win and your in. I would still prefer the Chase but would rather have a 3 race championship round than just have it come down to 1 race.
My complaint is that the playoffs feel too convoluted and complicated. Try to explain this format to new fans without them being confused. I'd say keep the way we set the field now (with a top 25 rule added) and remove the rounds and go back to a 10-race postseason.
Something I've wondered is why there isn't either a points bonus or a small cash bonus for the driver who gets the fastest lap? I feel like that's one very small but important way to make somebody more invested in sitting through and hours long race.
I think there used to be one
My Dumb Idea
-Take the Top 16 in points after race 26
-5 Race round where we take the top 6 in points, race winners are automatically locked in
-5 race round to decide the champion from the 6 drivers
How do you justify having a Playoff system that has the teams who don’t make the playoffs continue to compete in every event all the way through the championship event?
This
If wins are going to lock drivers in, it needs to be 2+ wins so you eliminate the trash drivers that luck into a win. I also heavily agree that winners need to get more points, both in the regular season and in the playoff bonus points. Winning currently isn't worth enough because teams are often prioritizing stage points over going for the win, especially if they already have the win they need to be locked in.
-Get rid of win and you're in
-Reduce the playoff grid to 12
-Eliminate 2 drivers per round
-Either a format of 1-3-3-3
-Add a 5 pt bonus for stage wins and a 15 or 20 point bonus for winning the race
-Move the provisional up to a 25th or higher reg. season points finish
(In other words if you start dominant and miss a huge chunk of the season due to injury, you'll be in company with Ernie Irvan and Sterling Marlin)
Go back to the 2003 and prior format. Bonus points for Poles, lead most laps, lead a lap, leader at end of stage, no more stage cautions, have crown jewel wins worth more. No more Gimmick Playoffs with paper champions
Go back to a Full Season Points Format instead but have it F1 Style
1st - 150
2nd - 125
3rd - 100
4th - 80
5th - 65
6th - 50
7th - 40
8th - 35
9th - 30
10th - 25
11th - 20
12th - 18
13th - 16
14th - 14
15th - 12
16th - 10
17th - 9
18th - 8
19th - 7
20th - 6
21st - 5
22nd - 4
23rd - 3
24th - 2
25th - 1
26th and Below - 0
No Bonus for Leading Laps and No Stages
Cut it down to top 20 get points with say 50 for a win. Scarcity makes points way more valuable and important
I like this idea, just feel it needs a little bit of streamlining.
1. 100
2. 80
3. 70
4. 60
5. 50
6. 45
7. 40
8. 35
9. 30
10. 25
11. 20
12. 18
13. 16
14. 14
15. 12
16. 10
17. 9
18. 8
19. 7
20. 6
21. 5
22. 4
23. 3
24. 2
25. 1
Dude Did you Steal my Old Idea @@President_Grover_Cleveland
The only real option is full season points
If Winston Cup points don’t come back.
: Do 26 race regular season winners only since Nascar is pounding the winning means everything.
7 race chase of regular season winners based on points for final 3 spots for a 3 race playoff. Regular season champ gets automatic spot in final 3 race playoff.
3 race playoff 4 drivers based on points with tracks rotating every year. Kind of a mix of new and old.
If the old Winston cup format ever came back, then nascar would need to slowly return to that over a couple years.
If the government allows them to resume sponsorship, then they'll possibly return. But as it stands, there's no intention letting tobacco sponsors take over sports
God no
If we can bring back a Winston Cup esque format I’ll concede to leaving the stage format. Make wins worth 10 pts. more than 2nd so there is still an emphasis on winning, and avoid bonus points if you can sweep both stages and win the race.
@@S.K.R.E.Inc. Winston didn't own the points system. NASCAR can go back to it without getting that particular sponsor back.
@@S.K.R.E.Inc. not the sponsorship, of course, but without the chase or playoffs (like pretty much every other Motorsport)
The fix is really quite simple. Get rid of the playoffs and the postseason in general, get rid of stages, and use the points format that’s already in place for the regular season.
My idea for a playoff format:
-Reduce the playoff grid to 10 drivers; 2 eliminations each round (Makes the format more prestigious)
-Regular season champ gets an automatic bye to the championship 4 (Rewards performing in the regular season more)
-Remove the win you're in (Prevents cheesy race wins and unfair eliminations)
-Reset the points completely for championship 4, but stage points count (Adds more valor to the season finale and incentivizes performing the whole race)
The race bye for the regular season champ is a dumb idea because then that driver could not show up to the tracks for 9 races or not take them seriously and still run for a championship.
No matter what format you have (even if we were to completely revert back to Winston) a driver and a team WILL inevitably and soon find a way to exploit it.
Full season points or bust.
I feel this possible change is not related to fan feedback but more from sponsors and Media feedback, the one bringing in the money for them. Once they got scared by the money providers that's when NASCAR started to consider changes. Will see what happened because the overhaul may be even worse than what we have currently.
Most of the changes the past 20 years weren't done for the fans but money, I think the only change made without TV networks or sponsors begging NASCAR for was double file restarts and later the choose line which was probably 11 years late.
The good ole Latford System... but a revised version that rewards substantially more points for wins and many more bonus points for "most laps lead" than the old system did.
I was not ready for the Persona music, was not expecting it lol
NASCAR is under so much fire right now coming from all directions. They're just getting desperate and trying to do something to get fans to look at them in a better light again.
just make the whole season playoffs
6 rounds, 6 races each
get 5 wins in the first 30 races to lock into final round
My worry is that Nascar will hear the people complaining about various things and just miss the forest for the trees. For every issue and all the race fixing and people being bitter about even year Lagano.
This season worked as intended.
In that traditional lull of the summer season when no one used to think of a championship, we had 6 winners who threw everything at the wall to try and get into the hunt. 3 of which were within the last month and Briscoe hitting a home run at the last second to keep his season alive. Kyle Busch finally showing a spark of life to have a last gasp at not only keeping his streak alive but possibly going for more. 10th place being the focus for a points battle. In any other context who cares about 10th place?
This kept people engaged in a way that couldn't happen without a post season. And this is what nascar wants
Then everything reset. Even playing field outside of a couple stray points that can be erased within a single race's stages. That's what a post season does. From then on it's whoever does the best in the post season gets the championship at the end. And Nascar keeping that win and get in it's hard to argue with the guy who won 3 times in 10 races.
As someone who likes to see racing as a season long series of endurance races with rough and tumble but sporting notions, I hate this. But this is exactly what Nascar wanted.
As long they remove the “win & you’re in” then I’m completely satisfied.
Also a three way race championship round would be pretty good.
My two ideal formats that I keep mentioning everywhere. Both would have top 12 in points + 2 highest in wins between 13th and 20th in points make the chase (and for the love of god bring back the “Chase” moniker)
10 Race Chase:
Points reset is simply cutting the pre chase points totals in half, thus cutting the points gaps between all drivers in half.
In the chase, have an additional 12 point bonus for a win, 8 point bonus for 2nd, and 5 point bonus for 3rd while adding an additional 4 points to stage wins. With this a driver that wins both stages and the race itself can leave with 80 points rather than the current 60.
This would make every single position all year matter in the championship, but the final 10 races still mean by far the most. This format used with this years results would have had Larson Bell and Byron all within 3 points of each other at the end of the Phoenix race.
Elimination format:
For the points reset, add an additional 3 playoff points for finishing 2nd-5th and 1 playoff point for finishing 6th-10th on top of what we have now to make consistency mean something again.
Keep the current 3 race rounds with 4 eliminations each for the first two rounds but continue the points without a reset from round 1 to 2. Win and your in is still in effect here.
All wins in the first 6 playoff races get an additional 3 playoff points (8 total) for the final championship round.
The final round is 6 drivers fighting over 4 races for the championship on straight points with a reset beforehand.
If this format was in use this season it would have also had Byron Larson and Bell head to head for the championship, and Byron would have won over bell by a single point.
My idea is this: start with four groups of four drawn at random. Top three in each (wins or points) advance. Then three groups of four drawn the same as round one. Top two of each group plus top two third place finishers advance (same ways as round one). Then two groups of four drawn the same way as rounds one and two. Top two advance to the championship race. There in this format could be some very tough fights to get out of a round.
In my view when it comes to the playoffs, here is what I would do: Use a full season points format up to the 2nd to last race of the season. After that 2nd to last race, the top 8 drivers in points would then be eligible to win the championship in the season finale and all points would be reset to 0 to ensure that all 8 drivers have an equal shot at winning the championship based on race peformance. The championship would be won by the driver who finishes the highest out of the 8 drivers.
As much as I think a lot of people would love to have an actual FULL SEASON POINTS FORMAT!!! I don’t think they will ever do that sadly… unless someone else becomes leader of NASCAR who knows what their doing changes things.
So this is what I was thinking. We partially get rid of the “win and you’re in” system. We have the last five races be a wildcard round. Have it be made up of a diverse list of tracks (I was thinking Watkins Glen, Iowa, Dover, New Hampshire, and Daytona). If you are in the top 20 in points and you win one of these races you are in the playoffs. Then we continue with the current system except for one change. Wins don’t automatically advance you. If you win a race you just get the same amount of points as the regular season. Also we would only have one points system with stages and final results all going toward the same total. With this it will be more likely that the best driver will actually get rewarded for their effort. For points there would be two points between each position except for first and second. A win has a ten point bonus. (1st-90; 2nd-78; 3rd-76; etc.) A stage win gives five points with only the top five being rewarded (1st-5, 2nd-4 and so on) and a pole gives 5 points so the maximum points available each week is 105pts. This hopefully keeps title races closer but doesn’t guarantee a “Game 7 moment” every year.
Sorry for the length😂
NASCAR needs to go back to a season long championship system. If the playoffs/chase is so great, then how come other circuit based racing series like IndyCar, Formula 1 and IMSA don’t have their own version of a playoff format? Especially in this day and age were we have all the information we need at our fingertips how come in the near 21 years since the inception of the chase, none of these other racing series implement their own versions of a playoff! Have the modern simplified version of the latford system (40 points for 1st, 1 point increment per position till either last place/40th whichever come first, gets 1 point), give five bonus points to the winner(therefore the winner is always guaranteed the most points in the race), 1 bonus point for leading a lap, 1 additional bonus point for the driver leading the most laps, I’d also give 1 point for the driver who qualified on the pole and 1 point for the driver who sets the fastest lap in the race. I’ve acknowledged that not everyone loves the season long race for the championship, but it’s the fairest and most legitimate way to crown the series champion.
I mean if we can’t go back to a season long format, we can at least try again with the old Chase format in some way. I do agree with why Jimmie, Knaus, and Hendrick won 5 championships in a row was cause it was the same tracks 2 times a year in different parts of the season to where ya just needed to get enough points from wins or finish consistently to qualify for the championship and then run hard in the last 10 races since ya already know how to setup the car and what lines r better. Whereas now there’s a lot more tracks on the schedule, including the final 10 that require different car setups and different disciplines. And I do agree with awarding more points for wins. It’s something I believe every major motorsports has figured out throughout the years. Ya look at the points awarded to the top 5 at the ones listed:
F1:
1st-25
2nd-18
3rd-15
4th-12
5th-10
IndyCar:
1st-50
2nd-40
3rd-35
4th-32
5th-30
WEC:
Same as F1 system per each class with points doubled for Le Mans and points increased for season final at Bahrain. I think start of the year too?
IMSA:
-Qualifying:
1st-35
2nd-32
3rd-30
4th-28
5th-26
-Race being doubled by 100:
1st-350
2nd-320
3rd-300
4th-280
5th-260
Granted these all have to do with grid sizes and racing style (multiclass racing for example) but they do work and the winner is awarded more points. Making winning a race more important. I think maybe if come 2026 IF NASCAR does decide any major overhauls then, ik they’re content with having a Playoff format, but if we at least have like this:
-Keep it at a 10 race format.
-Keep it at 16 drivers.
-Remove the win and you’re in.
-Remove the eliminations.
-points get reset at the start of the last 10 races with Playoff points being added to their reset points like they do currently.
-Award more points for wins.
It could at least get some legitimacy back into the championship, points still all matter especially with the stages in all 10 races, winning a race means a lot while not turning things stupid like crashing someone for a championship spot, 1 bad race doesn’t determine whether you’re in for a chance at the championship or not, a bit of a mixed bag of the of the old Chase format with the current Playoff format and having legitimacy while also keeping it entertaining.
Well, there was backlash for Kenseth in 2003, so we have the perfect person to win it that will push change.
Awesome ideas! Let's have the Iceberg for NASCAR chair
- No win and you're in
- Shorter season (20 race regular season, 10 race playoff)
- 10 is the playoff field, not 16
- 3000 point reset with seeding based on stage and playoff points (like you suggested)
- Regular season champ gets a certain amount of bonus points to guarantee them top seed
- Most points over the final ten races is your champion, no eliminations
I’m not tired of talking about it. Us being vocal about it is making NASCAR at least consider making changes.
I don't know, we got vocal and they dropped the turd known as the 550 package.
I think a revised playoffs should go like this:
-10 races. First round is 7 races. Top 4 in points after 7 races advances to the 3 race championship. No win and you’re in.
-Final 3 races is for the championship. The 4 drivers start even in points and who ever scores the most points after 3 races wins.
-Final 3 races every year has different tracks and order. So one year Vegas is in the final 3. One year Martinsville is the finale. No team has an advantage. Would also help some tracks with attendance if they have a championship 3 race.
- 12 drivers make the playoffs. Top 10 in points and 2 wild card spots based on wins. Have to be in the top 20 in points to earn a wild card spot though.
-Continue with stage points but get rid of the cautions.
-Wins come with bonus points since we are no longer doing “win and your in”.
I feel this rewards consistency again meanwhile keeping wins important too with bonus points. And we get rid of the win and your in gimmick. Have to perform each and every race.
Heres one thing that would be great.
You win the regular season points championship youre already in the final round. If during the next X amount of races before the final round you average a finish above 5th-10th then you are seeded higher with a 5 point advantage. If you seed lower then its 0 point advantage.
I would recommend continuing the playoff elimination format but removing the stage points racing for the 2025 season.
I don't think NASCAR really cares with the ratings 'bump' of 1% increase right now. If the rating start dropping again, NASCAR might look at changes. I hate the playoffs, but 'win and you're in' is doing far more harm than good, see Austin Dillon's win. The playoffs can make sense in drag racing, being it's 1 vs 1 racing. I think you have great points in this video.
1% increase is nothing, it's barely worth mentioning.
To reasonable people, yes you are right. But, for delusional people like NASCAR, that's enough to sit on their hands for along longer.
-Keep win and you’re in, but make it where you need 2 wins to lock in as opposed to just one. Make it win one race and advance in the playoffs however
- Make it the last 12 races as opposed to 10
- Races 123 = R16
- Races 456 = R12
- Races 789 = R8
- Races 10 & 11 = R4
- Race 12 = 1 v 1
Give the regular season champ a spot in the R12.
Without spingate the playoffs would've stayed at 12 after all these years
They should do a format where the top 16 in points make the playoffs. No win and you’re in. The 8 in points automatically make it to the round of 12. Then top 4 automatically go to the round of 8. Then the top seed in the round of 8 makes the final 4.
i think if we started getting bonus points for leading half way, leading with 50 to go and then that way you could make up a little more points, also id love to see nascar bring money back into it, like whoever leads at halfway or who led the most laps gets a money bonus
I think win and you’re in should be out. I get why it was put in so that drivers would do anything to get it knowing the benefits, but sometimes they take it too far, see the “Took Out 400.”
If it does remain for whatever reason, there needs to be a cutoff again. Top 20. I mean great that Harrison did what he did at Daytona but 1 lucky race weekend shouldn’t put what otherwise was a bad season going into the Championship fight.
As far as the Playoffs, I like 2 format changes that I’ve seen, though 1 I thought of on my own just thinking about it, but seen it has begun to be floated around as recently as this past weekend.
That being the Playoff drivers having their own points system. For example, in race 1, Chase Briscoe finished 38th & last amongst the Playoff drivers. In this format he would be credited with 16th place points rather than 38th that he got. Also there wouldn’t be eliminations & then as usual the driver with the most points at the end of race 10 is the champion.
One format change I saw was effectively reversing how the rounds are done now. The round of 16 being 1 race. Then the round of 12, 8 & Championship 4 being 3 each.
Also, if this is logistically possible, short of the finale due to contract-likely constraints, the final 10 races can be shuffled annually. If it could be done as they announce the schedule for the coming year or wait until close to or when we reach the final 10 races to do the shuffle.
Full season points, current points system, 12 points for a stage win and 60 points for a race win.
After taking some time to think about it here would be my proposal for the playoffs going forward that I would describe as a hybrid of sorts because I personally don't think a season long points format is the best answer.
(1) Have a 24 race Regular season, where there is no win and you're in.
(2) The playoffs would be 12 races broken up into 3 rounds of 4 races where the bottom 4 are eliminated at the end of each round. No win to advance to the next round. Eliminations take place by the lowest total points at the end of each round.
(2) In the season and postseason wins, stage wins, Top 10 stage finishers, lap leaders, and most laps led will be awarded with points accordingly. 10 Bonus Points for a win, stage wins will be worth 15 points, while 2nd-10th get points from 9-1 in descending order. For drivers that lead laps during the race a 1 point bonus will be awarded, and the one who leads the most laps will get a 5 point bonus.
(3)There will be a points reset only once at the beginning of the postseason. Where points for the 12 championship contenders are reset to an equal amount of 3,000 points.
(4) Bonus points will also be given for where you end the regular season, 15 points for the winner, and in descending order 11-1 points for those who finish in second through 12th.
(5) All three races in the final round, including stages will count toward point total and the championship. (I personally don't like the idea of not counting points in a final race. You want a championship outrun your opponents in all stages rather than just the final stage).
I like your system. Tracks wise, I’d like a road course, a short track, and an intermediate in each route.
I like Eric’s wild card idea too. Of course NASCAR would wanna make that a super speedway. So use Atlanta for that.
My idea might be a little out there. But I think you should qualify in on avg finish and give extra to points to wins. And when I say extra points I mean like 20 extra points per win. Top 10 qualify in and 5 are eliminated after 5 races. Then the last 5 drivers are in based on points. It's a bit convoluted but at least it will be the actual best drivers if we absolutely have to have a post season
It needs fkn deleted completely. They lost so many fans going to playoffs and stages. Many I personally know, I’m like the only one left from the 80s still watching
I'm a 2004 fan and they lost me, this garbage car, and everything else have ran me off.
The former Lucas Oil Late Model Dirt Series would do a full season points format and then the last handful of races came down to a final 4. I like that format IF you still want a playoff series.
I think NASCAR needs to go back to rewarding points for leading laps, leading the most laps and if a driver can pull it off extra points for leading every lap.
It would incentivize leading laps and help put strategy back into the sport that we've been missing.
7:13 I agree with your stance here but you could also argue wins matter less than ever since all they're treated as is a ticket to the next round which can dilute winning whether you care about the playoffs or not. Look at how Ross's Kansas win was treated they make it seem like wins don't matter without this format when they obviously do. Winning is important and wins are great but they shouldn't be a get out of jail free card.
Solid take! On a side note, the music bed was a bit much 😊
The NASCAR Playoffs Do need to change BIG TIME!
Nothing will change.
Anything LESS than getting rid of elimination style playoffs and reverting back to the 2004-2013 final 10 races will be a dissapointment. 10 or 12 drivers fine, but NOT 16!
Were not too far off in our ideas. The only thing I'd change from yours... is instead of reseting the playoff field miles above the rest... just create a separate bracket aside from the regular points that ONLY determines a champion. That allows those who didn't make the playoffs to still potentially improve their position after 26 races.
I would do either a top 16 or 12 qualify on points.
Win gives you +20 points than P2 and 10 chase points.
10 races chase format.
My preference is always going to lie with a full season format. However, if I had to modify the postseason format instead of scrap it altogether, here's what I would do:
1) Win and you're in is scrapped. Justification: No reasonable system allows Harrison Burton to compete for the Cup this year at the expense of Chris Buescher.
2) Top 10 in points advance to the postseason. Justification: As a matter of principle, nobody below 10th in points with 10 races to go deserves to win the championship. As great as Tony Stewart's Chase to the Cup was in 2011, he would have only recovered to 3rd under a full season system that year.
Ideally, take these two changes and keep Playoff points as they are as a means of seeding for the points reset. However, my altering of the system would best be coupled with a third change:
3) Completely overhaul the points system and race formatting. Justification: The current base points allocations for finishing positions by themselves do not reward winning enough. It should not be possible for the 2nd place or lower driver in a given race to have scored more points than the race winner. However, stage points allow this to happen on a regular basis. So, stages and stage points need to go. Here is how I would revise the base points allocations to reflect this change so Playoff points do not need to be altered, compared to the current base allocations:
36th-40th: 1 (0 point increments; same)
35th-11th: 2-26 (1 point increments; same)
10th-6th: 28-36 (2 point increments)
5th-2nd: 39-48 (3 point increments)
1st: 60 (12 point increment; same number of points awarded today if a driver wins all three stages)
a) The current base allocation to the winner (40) is 114.29% of the 2nd-placed driver's base allocation (35). This would increase to 125%.
b) The current base allocation to the winner (40) is 148.15% of the 10th-placed driver's base allocation (27). This would increase to 214.29%.
At the end of the day, I do not think there is a perfect solution to this dilemma surrounding the Playoffs that balances entertainment with sport. I happen to believe that sport should create entertainment, not the other way around, and that every race should matter equally. While I never liked the original Chase, the original Chase was far better than the Playoffs are now purely from a sporting perspective and, combined with the implementation of playoff points and a reworking of the base points system, would serve as a good compromise between a full season format and the Playoff format.
24 regular season races 12 race playoffs
1 race "wild card", top half of entries bye week during wild card. 5 races to determine top half(bottom half eliminated) final 6 races determine champion
Top 10 in points make a chase. if your inside the top 12 in points and have a win you make it as well. everyone in the top 12 starts at 5000 points,5 bonus points for a stage win, 10 bonus points for a win, also bonus point for fastest lap, and most laps led.
The word playoff has never fit Nascar it's not a stick and ball sport.
For 2025, I would wish for Nascar to at least let playoffs points carry over into the championship 4. It dosen't change the strcture of the playoffs but it changes the objevtive of the final race which is to just finish well to secure the most points.
I couldn't agree more that wins mean too much now. Consistency should actually matter towards how the champion is determined.
Tbh, winning and being consistent both matter
@@kjprodouctions9050yeah, in most racing series like F1 wins and consistency go hand in hand.
Either 5/5. 12 drivers have 5 races to get top 5 in points. The top 5 moves in and have 5 races get the most points or go back to OG chase
My version of The Playoffs!
-24 race regular season, 12 race playoffs.
-Top 16 in regular season points are eligible for playoffs.
-Winning a stage in a race rewards a driver 5 bonus points. Meaning that winning both stages will be 10 bonus points. Winning both stages and a race in the regular season rewards 20 bonus points. Maximum of 30 bonus points for when a driver dominates a race.
-The regular season champion will reward 40 bonus points.
-Each round of The Playoffs contains 3 races each. RO16, RO12, RO8, and The Final 4.
-In the RO16, drivers who are Top 12 in points advance to the RO12. Top 12 in points advance to the RO8, and the Top 8 in points advance to The Final 4. Driver with the most points in The Final 4 is crowned a champion.
-During the playoffs, winning a stage rewards 10 bonus points. Winning both stages reward 20 bonus points. Winning a race rewards a driver 25 bonus points. Maximum of 45 bonus points for when a driver dominates a race.
My Playoff format is a mix of the Winston Cup Format and the current format.
If there’s anything I missed, let me know.
Just go back to the 2011-2013 Wild Card Chase format with the addition of Stage Wins counting as 1 Chase Point; Race Wins counting as 5 Chase Points; and the points leader after Race 26 still gets 15 bonus Chase Points. Race Wins should also be worth 20 points more than second place.
Top 10 in points qualify while 11th and 12th can go to drivers between 11th and 20th with a win or two, but if they have to use the Wild Card wins, then those wins do not count as Chase Points.
Turn the 12 drivers loose for the final 10 races.
If they took inspiration from the Lucas Oil Late Models points format, and made some tweaks it could make it significantly better compared to the current format
I don't like buys or elimination rounds. This is not stick and ball.
I'm annoyed no one wanted it last year when Blaney wasn't much better than Joey. The playoffs are a good idea but wins need to mean more
I believe Ryan and Joey are number 1 and 2 as worst crowned champs statistically. DBC said something about it but I can't remember exactly what they said
if they want 'playoffs', might as well make it a real 'playoffs':
-Top 20 teams: 7 race points playoff races to make a real "game 7 moment" aka "best of 7"
-Top 10 in a 3 race championship, points only, race off
-No more stage breaks, no stage points
I like the new change of seeing you in videos now. Fresh for the channel
Hey Jared, how are you? Here’s my proposal you keep the elimination style of playoffs this time no points reset. But the top 16 get in and there’s elimination like normal. There are two parts of the old Winston cup format. I would bring back and that is five bonus points for leading a lap and five bonus points for leading the most laps For stage wins they should increase and stage points. 20 points awarded to the winner of the stage second place gets 10 points all the way down to 10th Place which gets two points. most importantly, the part I would keep if you win you are in one more thing as an incentive and it’s conditional. If one driver wins all the stages and the race they’ll get one more additional playoff point added to their total I would also get rid of points in the dual race because that’s a qualifying race, but if the championship 4 in the finale, still get playoff points and stage points because everyone else below them is as well for the sake of consistency. While finishing in front of the other, it’s always the best concept, but it was literally force all four to win the race and the championship. However, if neither of them can make it to the checkered flag first then I’ll go based on points not who is in front of the other
I really like this proposal, i would like the season long points format but if not this playoff proposal I would like. They need to remove the win and you’re in as well. Can’t have guys 35th in points taking spots from guys who are way better
As I expressed to the NASCAR Fan Council, my solution to a successful Cup Series format is keeping the "playoff format" with the top 10 NASCAR Cup Series drivers in points (however the points are awarded) advance to the post season, eliminating the driver with the least points, after each post season race! The three finalist Cup Series drivers that remain after the seven post season races, move on to the fast finals of the three final Championship races, competing for the most points throughout. Regardless of their position on the track at the end of the final race, the driver with the most accumulative points, wins the Championship. Once the post season begins & after each driver is eliminated, the remaining contenders are awarded 200 additional points, to separate from those not remaining in contention for the Championship. In addition to that format, the elimination of the "win & you're automatically in"( the post season) format is implemented. Perhaps, (by popular demand) the elimination of race stages is also implemented. I also would like to see each race 's finishing position awarded ONE race point for last place & an additional race point for every position closer to first place, ten race points for the driver that either starts a points paying race last (or first) & finishes that race in first place. One additional points for any driver that leads the most laps in a points paying race (any ties in most laps led, resulting in those drivers equally splitting laps led race points awarded). Perhaps, the driver that wins the most points paying races, be awarded ten additional race points (ties in most races won, resulting in equally splitting the awarded "most wins" race points bonus, with no partial points awarded) & the winner of the All-Star race, as well as the Clash winning driver, receive 3 exhibition race points bonus, each)! I would love to hear any feedback on my proposed points/playoff proposition??? 🏳️🏁🏆🤔🤔🤔
They need to go back to the old system.
NASCAR. If you're reading this, just go back to the old Winston format. No more bullshit. No more stupid gimmicks. Just go back to racing where every race counts. You guys suck. Just get rid of the stupid playoffs. You've ruined it.
No. More. Bullshit.
We don’t need to over complicate this. The way to fix it is go back to the 2004-2006 chase but awards consistency in the regular season. 20 points for the regular season champion. 10 for second and 9 for third. Those points are added to the drivers reset along with playoff points in the regular season they earn. Keep awarding points as is (as it’s not the problem with the playoffs). Top 10 drivers at the end of the stage awarded points 10-1 with the stage winner receiving 1 playoff point. At the end of the race the race winner gets 50 points for winning. 2nd-last place 35-1 points like as it is now. No win and you’re in. Also in my format it’s 12 drivers get in the playoffs. 16 is too much. Then 10 weeks no round to round elimination like now. 12 drivers fight for 10 weeks. It’s way more fair but also keeps the entertainment value while keeping the regular season actually meaningful.
I would just bring back the 12 man Wildcard Chase with tweaks made to be full proof (if NASCAR Officiating can actually wise up and not play favoritism)
*Addressing Wildcard Format*
Keeping the position points
Passing One Car +1 point
But when doing moving past positions that were already passed will not be counted
Passing chase contenders is +2 points
*Race Earn Points*
Stage Winners +20 points (no more stage cautions)
Pole Winner +50 points
Race Winner +100 points
Fastest Lap +10 Points
*Regular Season Top 12 (NO POINTS RESET)*
Winner +1000 points
Runner-up +950 points
Bronze +900
Etc.
*Previous Year Regular Season Winner (START OF THE YEAR)*
+30 points cushion
*Previous Year Season Champion (START OF THE YEAR)*
+60 points cushion
*What I keep*
Yellow Chase Markings on the Cars for easier identification
(Splitter, Both Name Banners, Roof Number, Spoiler, NASCAR Chase Logos)