I've heard through the forums and Reddit pages for Frank Stone that apparently the game was supposed to be 3~4 hours longer, but BHVR made them stick to their deadline so some content had to be cut. Apparently there was going to be a Linda / Bonnie romance, a Stan chase sequence in the mansion, etc. Here's hoping Supermassive has full control and confidence over Directive 8020 and they don't have to cut anything for some corpos
Thank you for making me aware of this! I had a feeling that there was some corporate issues going on behind the scenes as that usually, sadly, is the case for so many games nowadays. The idea that they might’ve had to cut things short for deadlines is very likely. It also makes so much sense that the game was originally 3-4 more hours long. I think that the plot is clearly set up like that based on the intro and you can definitely feel that rushed, pulled together ending. Fingers crossed Directive 8020 turns out good!!!
Not knowing anything about dead by daylight before this game, I really figured some of the problems this game had were caused by the lore of frank stone that was already set in Dbd. I was surprised to see that he wasn’t even a character in that game yet. If supermassive was expanding upon set lore that would be more forgivable than starting fresh and writing it this way.
I got into The Casting of Frank Stone as a Dead by Daylight player and I gotta say it's definitely fan service for fans of DbD rather than a game that can stand on its own and felt a lot more like a multiple hour trailer for a potential DLC than a story to actually savor. I was pretty disappointed that Bonnie, Robert and Stan felt more like set dressing with predetermined outcomes rather than actual participants, since none of them are able to survive/die no matter what you do and aren't even playable which is an absolute shame. Knowing the lore of DbD I gotta say that I don't even know how they would be supposed to answer questions about the lore (mostly the entity and different groups to worship/destroy it), since those aren't answered within DbD either. Even if given the opportunity since DbD and the entity fall mostly under the category of cosmic horror (which is known for being incomprehensible and mysterious with beings far beyond any human understanding, highlighting the futility of human meddling) there simply couldn't be much of any answers. Also regarding your theory of 2024 Linda having been in the trials before it's safe to say that one can be debunked. Within the lore there hasn't been any explicit example of anyone escaping the entity's realm. Survivors who have been taken lose part of themselves and any hope of escape every time they fail to escape and once there isn't any hope left the entity doesn't just spit them back out into their reality but discards of the empty husks within a pocket dimension called the void. I think the real reason why Linda (and Chris actually) seems so out of it at the campfire is because the entity distorts time and space, meaning that even within the few minutes Linda and Maddie have been separated for, Linda could've (and presumably has) gone through a countless number of trials already and already realized the futility of trying to escape.
I looked at the Directive 8020 game on Steam and saw that the Developer and the Publisher will only be Supermassive Games and Bandai Namco will have no association with Directive 8020. So maybe this might be what will help, but we'll just have to see.
this game (and also the quarry which i just played) really have a problem of not showing and instead telling through characters. People will die, main characters freak out, and im sitting there watching like "who just died i cant tell why do we care so much". the games just turn into a snoozefest until the game says "oh remember this menial choice you made like 2 hours ago oops that was bad!" This formula is getting repetitive and boring
Gotta say this was a big let down of a game for me as I adore super massive's games for what they bring and as a new person in to dbd, really wanted to see what the first big collab would bring. Suffice to say it was poorly handled. So a bit of insight for the dbd lore, we are never given any real indication that its multiverse stuff but rather pocket dimensions or if we going down the route of say nightmare on elm street then a separate realm. It's stated in various lore bits the entity toys with its prey, will take a more subtle approach in getting people (it will abduct people in clubs or bars since everyone is intoxicated and no one will remember black smoke taking someone) or in rare cases abduct someone in open view (taking a girl named mikaela off a stage for a poetry event at a book store). There are also cases of the entity messing with peoples minds and either having them see the trials throw the eyes of those already in it or tormenting them through grief or tragedy, which i believe is the case with the dead mom grief scene earlier in the game. Anyway, I bring some of this stuff up as the entity takes it's time and from what is stated, tends to take those of strong will and determination, least for non killers, and will break them with in the trials. There other things but for the most part the entity is a eldrich horror that though constantly hungers and hungers, takes it's time to consume a planet or world. Not with standing that it can not only make multiple pocket dimensions but recreate certain events. I kinda hope this kinda clarifies SOME of the things that has happened and how even this timeline stuff does more harm then good from what the lore has given people. Plus keep in mind this also undervalues the characters we follow cause its not the same characters. Why should I care about Sam when the one from the start is different from the one who dies in the mill if I wish for him to die? Should I care more about the one we see from the beginning and again in the manor in modern times even though we barely spent time with him? Plus I think the timeline thing is also ment to... well... answer a plothole that is a mechanic in the game that didnt need an answer... Did anyone ever wonder how you could have 4 Dwights (or I guess if we use characters from frank stone then did you guys want to find out how 4 Sams could exist in the same trial all together)? Well thats the answer. Don't get me wrong they coulda done something with all this but with the preestablished lore and poor writing, it was a uphill battle for this game. They shoulda just focused on the story focus on the entity trying to break Jaime and his friends who accidently kill Frank Stone, once mad killer, and they are all being tormented by the entity and come back years later to try to put the demons behind them, with the ending either being Jaime "kills" Stone but both are taken by the entity, Stone kills them all but him and Jaimes body are taken, or both are gravely injured and taken. If the friends are alive then they kinda are interviewed similar to until dawns where they try to explain the black smoke and everything that went down and admitting to killing Stone in the past through this insanity. I do apologize for the rambles and hope I made sense. There is a bit and HFS no worries, even the dbd community, least those that I watched, are dumb founded or disappointed by the games story and execution. Let's hope if another collab like this occurs on either companies part, that they take the time to put forth a good product.
Regarding the relationship between the characters. You have choose to make their relationship more worse. In Until dawn the game let's the npc decide making your relationship based on what you chose as the character the npc communicates to. Most supermassive games let's have more control over the characters than Until Dawn. There is an important part of the npc controlling the cast themselves, that supermassive fails to understand.
Not every character needs to be developed in order to be memorable, for example there are characters who's personality never changes but they drive the story to the point that the well develop ones are just there to extend the story than contribute to it. Not only that there are even times a person's flaws was pointless to the story that anyone can just take their contribution of the the story and nothing would change. Salim from House of Ashes is an example. Majority of Telltale's playable characters are another example of having an enjoyable static character. I think the problem is that Supermassive follow cliche tropes too much and even Until Dawn was a bit messy despite it being enjoyable.
I think the only ones i liked in Untill dawn where Sam, Mike and Chris. All the others where jerks like Emily; boring like Matt and Ashley or annoying like Jessica. Josh was interresting; the story was mostly about him and his sisters a swell as the Wendigo. The rest where awful 😐
Honestly from the trailer I thought it was just going to be 1980 so I feel like it was a bit misleading but tbf I didn't watch any of the other trailers 😅
It’s funny because the lore of dead by daylight is purposely vague since the entity does a really good job of being hidden and controlling ppl in its realm. The vagueness is the lore. Even in the main game, the lore you get is super vague and confusing due to the multidimensional perspective of whose memory you’re reading and the entity not allowing the player to not know too much. Supermassive did the base game lore justice in Frank game (8-year-player of dead by daylight.) Frank Stone gave a lot of lore and understanding of the campfire and an example of how the entity can take someone. On top of that, the theories of the black vale is exciting. Idk I really like frank stone, but I can see how this game would be annoying if you have no idea of the lore of the base game.
Actually, as someone who somehow interested in dbd lore, i have no idea what this game is even about. None of the characters comes from the game, aside from Entiny (if it even counts) and some references here and there. Augustine, Frank Stone, even the "anti-Entity society" are new. There is basically nothing substational added to lore, only more plotholes.
@@FEKana It is, Sam actually gives us a lot of new information about them if you read between the lines. The Imperiatti is the group Elodie and Felix's parents belonged to, and who vanished when the entity tried to touch down on the island while they were still kids. They fight against the entity, and the Black Vale - the group Augustine is in that shapes future killers and tries to summon the entity to various worlds and locations (they're why Nick Cage is in the game). Sam has seemingly joined the Imperiatti (like some versions of Haddie in different realms) to help take down the entity or at least save a few realms from it. Hopefully we'll see him in game sometime soon
@@creppypastaloverI know they exist in the games lore, I was just really confused when this person said that they were "new." Thank you, though, since I didn't know the specifics.
The fact that they can't fully escape ruins it for me, and the point of choices matters goes down the drain. I could understand if these characters would eventually be released in DBD, but it's been months now.....
It’s a shame that Supermassive tries its hardest to reach the same expectations as Until Dawn and fails. It’s always hard to follow up your first hit. House of Ashes was the closest to having that same impact.
as a dbd player i think this game was really terrible. i am yet to personally play until dawn and the quarry, but i've watched and been interested in the games. another bias is that i really don't like multiverse stories since no one can or will ever properly write infinity. i played through the game once and then haven't touched it since. biggest problem is that the story is incredibly boring: cop shoots some guy for no real reason > teens making low budget bad movie > get told off > plan to do it anyway > go buy camera > sneak in to film > get attacked by a ghost > game ends. augustine does nothing except be evil and then die. i do not care at all about frank stone and have no reason to. sam showed up, shoots him, and then he becomes an evil ghost and is the bad guy. no reason or explanation as to why i should care. bonnie and stan just die pointlessly with no way to save them. what's the point of "everyone survived" endings if not everyone can survive. maddie is kind of a baby, which i guess could be grief but regardless she sucks as a protagonist because we don't have any real reason to care about her. dbd lore-wise, i think it's even worse. dbd lore works because it doesn't really explain it. what's the entity? how is it powerful? what's going on? well just forget about it, no one cares, you can play as and against michael myers. dead by daylight lore works best as individual one-shots for every characters' backstory that fans can dream about. none of these characters will be added or be important to dbd, especially since releases are already kinda backed up. additionally, frank stone being super boring kills any interest. i thought he was supposed to be an alternate version of the trapper or something similar? even still, he's kind of a nothing character with no reason to be a killer (no power, nothing unique about him). the ending is AWFUL in that perspective because, why are they becoming survivors going into the trials? this is a worse ending for them as characters than just straight up dying? either kill them or they become trapped in an eternal cycle of death and torture. i'm hoping when i play through untill dawn and the quarry they are not as terrible of an experience
I mean... I've always said it and I'm happily saying it again: I don't think the devs of DBD have it in them to create a whole story like that. And The Casting of Frank Stone is the best example for it. When it comes to character descriptions and fun little backround stories, that's fine, but I don't think writing a whole, consecutive story is fully their thing ^^' Which is fine for DBD in general, it's just a bit sad for this game. Most of this game feels rushed and weirdly implemented
yeah, Jaime not reacting is largely a consequence of "is he still around at this point" choice mechanics weakening narrative its legitimately better a watch than a game
Big Supermassive shill here… within reason of course (looking at you Little Hope)…. This game absolutely sucked. I was so ready for it and wow it was a let down. As it’s been said… absolutely boring. so much so that i don’t even care to do a 2nd play through, which i usually do a minimum 4-5 replays of their games. Its horrible. I really hope Directive 8020 doesn’t suffer the same fate
You love rushed, buggy releases because they tried to push yearly releases? Until dawn was amazing but it fell really hard after that. The Quarry made me so mad because they promised multiplayer, didnt release it on launch, and when it did it was a lame streamer mode multiplayer. The man of medan series were all rushed and pretty mid.
While I tend to like Super Massive games (with some exceptions), I can tell that I will NOT like this game. For starters, I don't give a rat's arse about the Dead by Daylight franchise (strike 1). I don't like the premise of the main enemy (strike 2). And I despise time jumps, whether they be in flashbacks or time jumps or whatever (strike 3, I'm OUT).
I've heard through the forums and Reddit pages for Frank Stone that apparently the game was supposed to be 3~4 hours longer, but BHVR made them stick to their deadline so some content had to be cut. Apparently there was going to be a Linda / Bonnie romance, a Stan chase sequence in the mansion, etc. Here's hoping Supermassive has full control and confidence over Directive 8020 and they don't have to cut anything for some corpos
Thank you for making me aware of this! I had a feeling that there was some corporate issues going on behind the scenes as that usually, sadly, is the case for so many games nowadays. The idea that they might’ve had to cut things short for deadlines is very likely. It also makes so much sense that the game was originally 3-4 more hours long. I think that the plot is clearly set up like that based on the intro and you can definitely feel that rushed, pulled together ending. Fingers crossed Directive 8020 turns out good!!!
"Could've been great but ended up okay" 💯
Not knowing anything about dead by daylight before this game, I really figured some of the problems this game had were caused by the lore of frank stone that was already set in Dbd.
I was surprised to see that he wasn’t even a character in that game yet.
If supermassive was expanding upon set lore that would be more forgivable than starting fresh and writing it this way.
Ironically some DBD players are waiting for Frank stone to join dbd
I got into The Casting of Frank Stone as a Dead by Daylight player and I gotta say it's definitely fan service for fans of DbD rather than a game that can stand on its own and felt a lot more like a multiple hour trailer for a potential DLC than a story to actually savor.
I was pretty disappointed that Bonnie, Robert and Stan felt more like set dressing with predetermined outcomes rather than actual participants, since none of them are able to survive/die no matter what you do and aren't even playable which is an absolute shame.
Knowing the lore of DbD I gotta say that I don't even know how they would be supposed to answer questions about the lore (mostly the entity and different groups to worship/destroy it), since those aren't answered within DbD either. Even if given the opportunity since DbD and the entity fall mostly under the category of cosmic horror (which is known for being incomprehensible and mysterious with beings far beyond any human understanding, highlighting the futility of human meddling) there simply couldn't be much of any answers.
Also regarding your theory of 2024 Linda having been in the trials before it's safe to say that one can be debunked. Within the lore there hasn't been any explicit example of anyone escaping the entity's realm. Survivors who have been taken lose part of themselves and any hope of escape every time they fail to escape and once there isn't any hope left the entity doesn't just spit them back out into their reality but discards of the empty husks within a pocket dimension called the void. I think the real reason why Linda (and Chris actually) seems so out of it at the campfire is because the entity distorts time and space, meaning that even within the few minutes Linda and Maddie have been separated for, Linda could've (and presumably has) gone through a countless number of trials already and already realized the futility of trying to escape.
Yeah that dimension hopping thing is confusing, they really needed to make it obvious
I looked at the Directive 8020 game on Steam and saw that the Developer and the Publisher will only be Supermassive Games and Bandai Namco will have no association with Directive 8020. So maybe this might be what will help, but we'll just have to see.
this game (and also the quarry which i just played) really have a problem of not showing and instead telling through characters. People will die, main characters freak out, and im sitting there watching like "who just died i cant tell why do we care so much". the games just turn into a snoozefest until the game says "oh remember this menial choice you made like 2 hours ago oops that was bad!" This formula is getting repetitive and boring
I agree
Gotta say this was a big let down of a game for me as I adore super massive's games for what they bring and as a new person in to dbd, really wanted to see what the first big collab would bring. Suffice to say it was poorly handled.
So a bit of insight for the dbd lore, we are never given any real indication that its multiverse stuff but rather pocket dimensions or if we going down the route of say nightmare on elm street then a separate realm. It's stated in various lore bits the entity toys with its prey, will take a more subtle approach in getting people (it will abduct people in clubs or bars since everyone is intoxicated and no one will remember black smoke taking someone) or in rare cases abduct someone in open view (taking a girl named mikaela off a stage for a poetry event at a book store).
There are also cases of the entity messing with peoples minds and either having them see the trials throw the eyes of those already in it or tormenting them through grief or tragedy, which i believe is the case with the dead mom grief scene earlier in the game. Anyway, I bring some of this stuff up as the entity takes it's time and from what is stated, tends to take those of strong will and determination, least for non killers, and will break them with in the trials. There other things but for the most part the entity is a eldrich horror that though constantly hungers and hungers, takes it's time to consume a planet or world. Not with standing that it can not only make multiple pocket dimensions but recreate certain events.
I kinda hope this kinda clarifies SOME of the things that has happened and how even this timeline stuff does more harm then good from what the lore has given people. Plus keep in mind this also undervalues the characters we follow cause its not the same characters. Why should I care about Sam when the one from the start is different from the one who dies in the mill if I wish for him to die? Should I care more about the one we see from the beginning and again in the manor in modern times even though we barely spent time with him? Plus I think the timeline thing is also ment to... well... answer a plothole that is a mechanic in the game that didnt need an answer... Did anyone ever wonder how you could have 4 Dwights (or I guess if we use characters from frank stone then did you guys want to find out how 4 Sams could exist in the same trial all together)? Well thats the answer.
Don't get me wrong they coulda done something with all this but with the preestablished lore and poor writing, it was a uphill battle for this game. They shoulda just focused on the story focus on the entity trying to break Jaime and his friends who accidently kill Frank Stone, once mad killer, and they are all being tormented by the entity and come back years later to try to put the demons behind them, with the ending either being Jaime "kills" Stone but both are taken by the entity, Stone kills them all but him and Jaimes body are taken, or both are gravely injured and taken. If the friends are alive then they kinda are interviewed similar to until dawns where they try to explain the black smoke and everything that went down and admitting to killing Stone in the past through this insanity.
I do apologize for the rambles and hope I made sense. There is a bit and HFS no worries, even the dbd community, least those that I watched, are dumb founded or disappointed by the games story and execution. Let's hope if another collab like this occurs on either companies part, that they take the time to put forth a good product.
I'm a DBD guy, and a lore junkie for all games. I was very excited about this game. This shit is traaaaash.
Regarding the relationship between the characters. You have choose to make their relationship more worse. In Until dawn the game let's the npc decide making your relationship based on what you chose as the character the npc communicates to. Most supermassive games let's have more control over the characters than Until Dawn. There is an important part of the npc controlling the cast themselves, that supermassive fails to understand.
Great breakdown as always, and awesome editting! Getting really great at this! 👍
Not every character needs to be developed in order to be memorable, for example there are characters who's personality never changes but they drive the story to the point that the well develop ones are just there to extend the story than contribute to it. Not only that there are even times a person's flaws was pointless to the story that anyone can just take their contribution of the the story and nothing would change. Salim from House of Ashes is an example. Majority of Telltale's playable characters are another example of having an enjoyable static character. I think the problem is that Supermassive follow cliche tropes too much and even Until Dawn was a bit messy despite it being enjoyable.
I think the only ones i liked in Untill dawn where Sam, Mike and Chris. All the others where jerks like Emily; boring like Matt and Ashley or annoying like Jessica. Josh was interresting; the story was mostly about him and his sisters a swell as the Wendigo. The rest where awful 😐
Had all the same feelings
I've only just played UD for the first time..and now i have a hunger fir more.. the news is grim.. nothing comes close
Honestly from the trailer I thought it was just going to be 1980 so I feel like it was a bit misleading but tbf I didn't watch any of the other trailers 😅
It’s funny because the lore of dead by daylight is purposely vague since the entity does a really good job of being hidden and controlling ppl in its realm. The vagueness is the lore. Even in the main game, the lore you get is super vague and confusing due to the multidimensional perspective of whose memory you’re reading and the entity not allowing the player to not know too much. Supermassive did the base game lore justice in Frank game (8-year-player of dead by daylight.) Frank Stone gave a lot of lore and understanding of the campfire and an example of how the entity can take someone. On top of that, the theories of the black vale is exciting.
Idk I really like frank stone, but I can see how this game would be annoying if you have no idea of the lore of the base game.
🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓👆
Actually, as someone who somehow interested in dbd lore, i have no idea what this game is even about. None of the characters comes from the game, aside from Entiny (if it even counts) and some references here and there. Augustine, Frank Stone, even the "anti-Entity society" are new. There is basically nothing substational added to lore, only more plotholes.
I thought the anti entity society is what Felix and Elodie were raised under?
@@FEKana It is, Sam actually gives us a lot of new information about them if you read between the lines. The Imperiatti is the group Elodie and Felix's parents belonged to, and who vanished when the entity tried to touch down on the island while they were still kids. They fight against the entity, and the Black Vale - the group Augustine is in that shapes future killers and tries to summon the entity to various worlds and locations (they're why Nick Cage is in the game). Sam has seemingly joined the Imperiatti (like some versions of Haddie in different realms) to help take down the entity or at least save a few realms from it. Hopefully we'll see him in game sometime soon
@@creppypastaloverI know they exist in the games lore, I was just really confused when this person said that they were "new." Thank you, though, since I didn't know the specifics.
This is incorrect so I'm not sure why it has 21 upvotes. The Pariahs, the anti-Entity society, are a main focus point in Felix's and Elodie's lore.
@@ZoopRanger Go off king, literally copied my comment yet gave us nothing
The fact that they can't fully escape ruins it for me, and the point of choices matters goes down the drain. I could understand if these characters would eventually be released in DBD, but it's been months now.....
Nice video!
Yeah, I agree
It’s a shame that Supermassive tries its hardest to reach the same expectations as Until Dawn and fails. It’s always hard to follow up your first hit. House of Ashes was the closest to having that same impact.
as a dbd player i think this game was really terrible. i am yet to personally play until dawn and the quarry, but i've watched and been interested in the games. another bias is that i really don't like multiverse stories since no one can or will ever properly write infinity. i played through the game once and then haven't touched it since.
biggest problem is that the story is incredibly boring: cop shoots some guy for no real reason > teens making low budget bad movie > get told off > plan to do it anyway > go buy camera > sneak in to film > get attacked by a ghost > game ends. augustine does nothing except be evil and then die. i do not care at all about frank stone and have no reason to. sam showed up, shoots him, and then he becomes an evil ghost and is the bad guy. no reason or explanation as to why i should care. bonnie and stan just die pointlessly with no way to save them. what's the point of "everyone survived" endings if not everyone can survive. maddie is kind of a baby, which i guess could be grief but regardless she sucks as a protagonist because we don't have any real reason to care about her.
dbd lore-wise, i think it's even worse. dbd lore works because it doesn't really explain it. what's the entity? how is it powerful? what's going on? well just forget about it, no one cares, you can play as and against michael myers. dead by daylight lore works best as individual one-shots for every characters' backstory that fans can dream about. none of these characters will be added or be important to dbd, especially since releases are already kinda backed up. additionally, frank stone being super boring kills any interest. i thought he was supposed to be an alternate version of the trapper or something similar? even still, he's kind of a nothing character with no reason to be a killer (no power, nothing unique about him). the ending is AWFUL in that perspective because, why are they becoming survivors going into the trials? this is a worse ending for them as characters than just straight up dying? either kill them or they become trapped in an eternal cycle of death and torture.
i'm hoping when i play through untill dawn and the quarry they are not as terrible of an experience
when i played this frank stone killed linda in 2024 when he walked through the film 😭
I mean... I've always said it and I'm happily saying it again: I don't think the devs of DBD have it in them to create a whole story like that. And The Casting of Frank Stone is the best example for it. When it comes to character descriptions and fun little backround stories, that's fine, but I don't think writing a whole, consecutive story is fully their thing ^^' Which is fine for DBD in general, it's just a bit sad for this game. Most of this game feels rushed and weirdly implemented
yeah, Jaime not reacting is largely a consequence of "is he still around at this point" choice mechanics weakening narrative
its legitimately better a watch than a game
📷
Big Supermassive shill here… within reason of course (looking at you Little Hope)…. This game absolutely sucked. I was so ready for it and wow it was a let down.
As it’s been said… absolutely boring. so much so that i don’t even care to do a 2nd play through, which i usually do a minimum 4-5 replays of their games. Its horrible.
I really hope Directive 8020 doesn’t suffer the same fate
🫡🙏🏿
I clicked on this video because I was surprised that the Hades devs went so far outside of their signature art style for this game
I feel very stupid
Super massive and super giant don’t make it easy 🙈
If Bonnie dies how does Maddie exist?
different timelines
You love rushed, buggy releases because they tried to push yearly releases? Until dawn was amazing but it fell really hard after that. The Quarry made me so mad because they promised multiplayer, didnt release it on launch, and when it did it was a lame streamer mode multiplayer. The man of medan series were all rushed and pretty mid.
Cool story bro
While I tend to like Super Massive games (with some exceptions), I can tell that I will NOT like this game. For starters, I don't give a rat's arse about the Dead by Daylight franchise (strike 1). I don't like the premise of the main enemy (strike 2). And I despise time jumps, whether they be in flashbacks or time jumps or whatever (strike 3, I'm OUT).