What happened at Tacoma? Did orks win?
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- Опубликовано: 6 сен 2024
- Loads to talk about today, was the Win at Tacoma justified?
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Edit: The Ork player has withdrawn himself from the event, and passed up all prizes.
As a caveat, Scott, his finals opponent, has said their game was clean and he had no issues in it. Course it was also on stream with the head judge watching every moment.
Personally I Watched part of one game, and the entire shadow round game. 5 mistakes made in his favour. I will order them from easiest to miss to hardest.
1. Secure no mans land scored using an objective in his opponents deployment zone. Can see this being confusing and easy to miss. If it was a player with no history, I wouldn't think twice.
2. Snikrot toughness was 6 instead of 5. This caused a bunch of 3s to not wound, leading to an assassinate failing to score and the unit that activated into the snikrot to die for nothing. Game ended with a 3 point victory for ork player.
3. Regular warboss toughness was 6 instead of 5. Same as above, but no assassinate directly involved. I believe warbosses and snikrot had t6 at some point, so them being told wrong isn't an unimaginable mistake. If made by a player with no history, I would make note of it, but wouldn't assume foul play.
4. Ghaz riding in a hard cased battlewagon. This is just cheating. Its the same sentence...
5. Shooting flash gits out of a hard cased battlewagon. This is just cheating. Its the same sentence...
The fact this dude has been on stream before, reading rules directly from a codex to his opponent, after his opponent directly questioned an issue, and LEFT OUT THE SENTENCE THAT CONFIRMED HIS OPPONENT WAS CORRECT, is enough for me. Dude is cheating POS, and should have been red carded in the shadow when no on would have even known about it. Now its a big controversy, for no good reason, AND he gets to go to WCW and ruin a bunch of peoples day there as well.
Thank you for this breakdown, ill be following up to see if Tacoma wants to adress this!
Hi bud
@@nunya1673 hi scott :)
Yeah, he retreated pretty fast from defending himself on Reddit once another user linked that video of him lying blatantly to the other player. After that, he definitely lost any right to „when in doubt, rule for the accused“ as he is now a proven cheater.
@@davidgantenbein9362 And his explanation for what happened seems pretty similar to what happened in that video. Claims to have "missed the specific rule" associated with the upgrades to the battlewagon after seeing the change that allowed Ghaz to get into the battlewagon. Sounds a lot like "missing" the specific part of the rule on the video. Only difference is this time he was not caught reading the rule and so he gets to say well I saw the part that was good for me and I just did not see the bad part. Could have easily said this to his opponent if he did not. One might say he learned how to plausibly deny cheating from his previous mistake.
The fact he accepted winning the event is absolutely damning to me. He had to have known what he was doing
i am with you, honest mistakes can happen, but the player needs to own up to it, and concede when it does happen
Man, i will flat out accuse him of cheating.
Hes not just playing in some random tournament, he is playing in the tacoma open....a golden ticket event.
He knew.
Let me further elaborate, dude has a yellow card, which means he had done at least one thing fishy already.
He was hoping to not get caught, and he already had the story made up for an attempt to save his butt if he did get caught.
I still have a long ways to go before I win a way to a golden ticket event, and I know enough to know you double check who can go in what transport.
Not saying I'm not capable of mistakes, but that definitely isn't one I'd make.
Exactly, how many second chances does he get
@@beans6001 apparently more than everyone else.
Dude probably get arrested and they just drop him at his mom's house.
Long time Ork players all know Ghaz is an issue in transports, so he was cheating.
He is very clearly cheating. This happens at every event he plays in. Multiple complaints about all kinds of stuff from nearly all of his opponents.
I am brand new and only own 1000 points of orks. While listbuilding / theory-crafting, one of the first things I noticed was the Ghaz Battlewagon transport restrictions.
this is.... the reality of the situation :/
I am also new to orks but I didn't know about the hard cased stuff
Why? Because I didn't even look at ghaz and battlewagon datasheets but i'm sure if i paid any attention to them I would have remembered that
@@madflam3192 the last sentence in the transport capacity section that says ghaz takes up the space of 15 models and cannot embark if the battlewagon has any of its modular upgrades
I was one of the players who finished in the top 16 at the event, below the shadow round cut. I never played him so I don't know what happened. But I can say that it's disappointing to hear about this drama after the fact because I met so many wonderful, professional opponents (this was my first big event and I had a ton of fun) and this kind of stuff casts a negative shadow over them and over competitive 40k players as a whole.
Right. I was down at the bottom of my first GT and hearing this afterwards is kind of a body blow.
I am glad you had an excellent experience! I have only had one bad experience in all my tournaments i have attended. Luckily this is a rarity! Keep going and continue upholding the standards of good play!
Love the way you handled your mistake when you took an extra unit.
You should either drop or ask a to to zero your scores.
cheers man :)
Reach out to some of the top players at the tourney if ya can chief. You get a few funny stories about the guy, sad day to be an ork player. I will waaagh sadly
i hate hearing that, gotta bring light to stuff like this
All of us make mistakes. But when it becomes a trend, it's one of two things. Intentional or incompetence.
thats the heart of the issue
Incompetence doesn't get you to the top table of 280 player events... so narrows it down a bit.
Cheating is cheating. Whether intentional or unintentional. If you make a mistake you better rectify the mistake by either conceding your match if the mistake caused a false outcome, or finding a solution to the mistake mid game. If you think claiming ignorance is a tolerable excuse then you are mistaken.
If I go to buy 5 items from a grocery store, I scan 4 at self checkout and I forgot to scan the 5th item. Then I leave the store. Have I stolen an item? Yes, even if it's an accident I have still stolen. The problem is, majority of the community is a bunch of antisocial weirdos who don't understand integrity and believe it's okay to cheat if they don't get caught, or if they accidentally cheat, then they don't believe they should rectify their mistake.
Looking forward to hearing your thoughts on this.
well you will get them!
@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 I certainly did. Thanks so much Brother Krumpin' :D
Might be going out on a limb here but with his reputation and just the list he was running as well, I'd want to check his dice.
Mistakes happen all the time... great players / personalities own their mistakes and zero the score of games where they played something wrong to their own edvantage. Or at least they offer it to their opponents. Its great you discuss this so openly and without bias, because in this regard the community (and maybe TOs as well) still have much to learn........ The amount of times where pointing out (major) rules mistakes to someone is answered with " mumble mumble... wouldn't have changed anything... mumble mumble" is just too damn high.
Ghaz riding a BW with T12 can of course swing a game by 10+ points....
Marshall has been doing this for years. I'm surprised he isn't banned yet.
yeah, i want TO's to be more strict with penalties
I got 26th with guard at the tourney this year. I heard he got 2 yellow cards. The finals was streamed so idk if there was any foul moves during that game either. He smashed each of his opponents, which honestly is kind of crazy seeing what he played into. Not saying orks can’t do it, but they are certainly struggling into the meta right now
congratulations!
Where did he take his 10 point penalty? All of his scores are over 90
right? Thats another weird thing. Tacoma seriously needs to review this
Gw events are casual. Great way to.enforce your game rules james workshop
I once didn't read an errata/faq once, found out a Strat I was using was modified and I was using it wrong. I won the game, but had the TO switch our scores so he won
a man of Honor!
@happy krumping wargaming
I accidentally played teleport homers incorrectly by deploying in an opponents deployment and rapid ingressing with deathwing assault in my opens turn. I dropped from the tourney in the championship. Easiest decision I’ve ever made.
you are a moral and good example of how to play this game. The example of you playing teleport homers is actually a good example of an easy fix. Take the points away, the rapid ingressing is an example of a concede the game mistake.
If you feel like reviewing that undefeated dread mob list from the weekend I’d like to see that.
It was interesting, perhaps something ill do a breakdown of!
The first time is an accident.
The second time is a coincidence.
The trird time is enemy action.
Jeremy is also involved in Stat Check channel.
This is basically every large competitive 40k in the USA these days
every large competitive event in the USA is won by someone who has a history of cheating? I think you are severely mistaken bud
Even if he told the TOs, surely to be a good and sporting player you should drop from the tournament.
agreed
This guy has had multiple cheating scandals. No wonder he was so “prolific” on his come up a few years ago.
ooof, thats a bad history
@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 yeah I mean I hate witch-hunts, but throughout the last few years there have been multiple scandals. I can’t even recall them or to what degree so a part of me hates calling him out. But when it’s a repeat offender for stuff like this it’s hard to ignore.
I am literally a fresh new babe to the game and an Ork player. Two weeks in tomorrow, still assembling my army and even I know Gaz has a donk that dont fit and dont quit
I waaagh sadly
Great recap of the issues
cheers my man
Honest mistake or not, this is completely illegitimate as a win. It's a big deal to win events like this, but it's not a big deal if you can just oopsy your way to the podium. To preserve the sport he absolutely needs to give the ticket to second place. That list is cool though so I might give it a spin. Thanks for talking about this!
Thats the way i look at it, if its an honest mistake, just take the L and conceed your early roudns
I struggle to believe you can mistake the toughness like that as a tournament player. Very basic stuff.
i tend to agree. I know plenty of people who have made mistakes like that, they drop, or at least concede the matches the played wrong in. Its the correct thing to do
@Happykrumpingwargaming007 I think, though, that a bigger issue is Ghaz in a transport. That could be game-changing. He's an absolute beast of a model. Getting a fast and safe delivery, when he shouldn't be is crazy. Imagine the avatar of khaine getting a transport lol!
well to be clear, he can ride in a battlewagon, just not when it has the Ard Case enhancement
@Happykrumpingwargaming007 ohhh, thanks for clarifying
Here's the thing in tournaments, you're under a lot more pressure. You playing faster, you don't want to look up every rule to be sure. So you're often just playing off the top of your head. This leads to mistakes, some bigger than others. This issue only gets compounded when you have a clock or are on a stream.
According to the points you digged, this is 100% cheat. It's kind of pure logic, i mean, if this guy was a "noble mind" he would have retire from the tournament. So he is not. He even seems far from it. How could he have not cheated then?
Some could argue that it's not because he did it in the past that he did it in this tournament too. I get that, but if you analyse the mistakes, as you said, there is no way a seasoned player, who played dozens of games with v10 orks could have made these in good faith. That's the kind of mistake you make during the first three games of a new codex, not the hundredth...
Beside, as a experienced player, knowing how game-changing these mistakes could have been, he knows the only proper way out of this is by retiring from the tournament
i am with you on this. Just getting all my information from reddit and not the horses mouth i try to stay reserved :P
100% agree with this entire perspective
Not familiar with the exact procedure used for cuts in 40k tournaments, but wouldn't retroactively zeroing out scores for a player weaken his opponents' tiebreakers for cuts?
it certainly would. Cheating, weather intentionally or unintentionally sucks
@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 retroactively adjusting game scores beyond a DQ to the cheater opens up a whole can of worms though. Do you also recreate the bracket groupings for future rounds if it is discovered after those groupings is established but before the event is over?
nope, it cannot be done, it would mess everything up.
@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 Basically doing any retroactive alteration of tournament records is like trying to correct a time travel accident - only make things worse. Just DQ the offender and leaving everything else intact is usually the best course of action. FIDE chess and MtG tournament play both take this approach.
It's very normal for players to take their opponents at their word when it comes to what their army does, so he could have used that to his advantage for the first 4 rounds.
As someone who was there, it was fairly common to hear that the TO's were having some inconsistent rulings between different games, and the rewards ceremony at the end was a bit of a mess. It was originally announced that Jaden Iwaasa with Space Wolves had won for the second year in a row, despite being 6-2 and in 4th place. Overall it was a lot of fun, but the TO's were having some difficulties, and I feel like that came down to availability too. There were only about 4 judges that I can remember for the entirety of the 439 people on the 40k side of the tournament. So it might have been a staff issue too. If that is the case, that is not even close to what should be required for an event of this size.
Yeah i think GW needs to look into professionalizing their TO's much like the french league
So perhaps we need to know if there is a connection between him and the TO.
You don't give people with a history the benefit of the doubt. That is something they earn back
i seriously doubt it, i know the head TO well. Hopefully i can get him on the channel, but i have no reason to doubt his integrity.
@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 fair, I don't, hence my thought.
Lol no offense to him but he probably should explain his reasoning, this is how events get bad reps
I haven't read the reddit post, so I don't know about the details. But say in the hypothetical scenario where he wrote the ard case upgrade on the list, but didn't played it as a T10 battelwagon. Should he still have dropped out in your opinion? (in that case it would have been more of a typo)
That would make things harder to prove, opponents would need to admit to him playing it against his list. This may be why we was allowed to continue on in the tournament. Also, There doesnt really seem to be any list auditing at events. So, unless you opponent catches it you can pretty much put whatever you want.
you would have to trust that he was telling the truth :/
He's on video misleading an opponent who questioned it, reading it straight out of the codex, but leaving out the part that says Ghazkhull can't be in the battlewagon with the 'ard case or the Zapp cannon, and that if it has the 'ard case it loses firing deck. He looked straight at the rules and continued to lie.
this is an opinion only but i do not think a person should be able win a tourny with a yellow card.
i think TO's need to be willing to hand our red cards
Why? It's a yellow card, not a DQ. If you forbid winning with a yellow card but keep letting them play, you are just screwing over their opponents.
From what I have read it was 2x Yellow and the Head Judge got overruled on turfing him out
From what I heard at the event is that he also made the mistake of having t6 instead of t5 on a few units. After that was found he was going to be issued a red card. The TO went to give it to him but was overruled by GW.
@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 This sounds like intentional misplaying to me, He knew what he was doing.
The whole “talking to the TOs and given a 10 pt penalty” is BS. If he got a 10 pt penalty, then how did ALL of his scores go over 90 pts?
he was only penalized 10 points for the game the judge caught it in.
It gets to a point where the tournament scene needs to permanently ban this guy, you're a known cheater and you are changing, you now only get to play garage 40k
I understand the Ghaz Battle wagon mistake as it is worded in the codex with ard case listed first then the 3 main guns so ard case is easily missable. I mean I didnt know until today that ard case was on that list. Now I remove the upgrade from my list. Easy Peasy.
sure... but with everything else stacking, also this guy, is VERY experienced. It is highly unlikely
There's no excuse for GW to not make unit stats widely available. Players shouldn't be paywalled to look things up to verify that their opponent isn't cheating.
Yeah, honestly they need to allow all rules to be searchable in the app
hell, if they need to get money off it, charge 20 dollars a year
It’s totally worth it to ruin your reputation over one win people will forget about in a week. But don’t worry bro he’ll wear a body cam for a year it will be ok!
lol
Curious.. if he took a 10 pt penalty how are all of his scores over 90?
very curious eh?
The teen point penalty is in the shadow round and the shadow round score is not listed
Jeremy Atkinson a local boy from Ottawa where I live was head judge.
oh jeremy was head judge eh?? That surprises me, he is a super good guy, ill see if i can get him to come on to explain what happened.
Even if these were honest mistakes (which I doubt, given the number of them), the fact that he cheated on the past makes it hard to even give him the benefit of the doubt. I know you can’t just jump to conclusions and say he’s automatically guilty, buuut it really pushes believability to say he misremembered all of these details, just this one time. If I were playing the same faction over and over, and realized I made mistakes in composition or with stat lines, I would feel obligated to print out the rules, or make note cards, or just have physical reminders of the correct rules. But… I’m not a cheater…
id love to know how often we went first :)
if you log onto BCP you should be able to see that!
Marshall had a big incident when he was playing Necrons where is opponent asked him about the specifics of a rule then ended up reading it incorrectly in his favor. Probably should be one of those players that gets watched a little closer even if he's a really nice guy.
nm i see you go into this lol...but ive heard a few other situations with this player too.
yeah.... that was bad
There's no way that running Gaz in that was an accident. I'm an absolute casual bozo clown that plays casual only, I've never run Gaz, and I don't own Gaz. I'm aware that you can't just run Gaz in anything, it's very specific what can carry his fat ass around.
There's no way this was an honest mistake from an experienced player. If it was a fresh new babe to the game, sure it might be... but not from someone with experience.
Not knowing anything about this guy other than this video, he needs to be banned. This is silly, we shouldn't tolerate blatant cheating like this. It's bad for the other players and will prevent them from wanting to participate in the future.
I am literally a fresh new babe to the game and an Ork player. Two weeks in tomorrow, still assembling my army and even I know Gaz has a donk that dont fit and dont quit
So you think he should be banned for being good at the game? Grow up
@ColonelMetus If you make a mistake that has an unfair impact on.the game you can't be "Good at the game."
@@ashleyharris4114 it's on his opponent to catch the mistake, not him
@@ColonelMetus This is the worst shit take of entitlement and lack of self responsibility I've seen in a while. If you come to play a game and you dont know the rules its not up to everyone else to educate you. What are you 12?
I believe it's if you have any wargear option ard case kannon zap gun ghaz cannot ride in the wagon
correct, this is what i said
FYI he narrowly beat out Alex MacDougall's (sp?) Tyranids in the shadow round and receieved a 10-point penalty in that game I believe
are you sure? BCP shows it as undefeated
@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 oops! Sorry. Yeah. It was a narrow win, not a loss. Edited for clarity
Also has a zapp gun cant have that aswell with gazh
neither that, nor the ard case. Double wrong :P
So besides the cheatin, this list clearly did well. Does it shift your opinion on the kill rig at all? As you have not been a fan of it in 10th edition.
Maybe slightly? Like i can see a point in running it in triplicate?
I mean T5/T6 and protecting Ghaz like that are fairly big breakpoints
You have to remember the rules at this event allowed for the vehicles tp autopass charges which felt bad
Wait, if he was getting 10pt deductions then how was he still scoring high 90s!?
good question
You can’t say that the 2 wins against Necrons would have definitely gone his way if he was playing legally? If he lost 1 or 2 out of his first 4 games he would not have been in any contention for a podium spot. Maybe the TOs do need to look at it more harshly because it definitely doesn’t sit well with the greater 40k community!
certainly cant make any definitive claims other than its was clearly foul play
If you're a known experienced player of a faction plus there's a history of cheating (on stream no less too) I'm less likely to give him a pass. It also sounds like these "mistakes" are very beneficial to him.
Myself being new to WE I make plenty of mistakes but those mistakes hinder my game as much as help.
yeeeeaah hard to argue with that. Its not like we expect people to never make a mistake, i shared one of my mistakes, its about how you handle it
I get no enjoyment out of winning unfairly. Whether it be fudging a number by mistake or forgetting to warn an opponent about an ability one of my characters has. Playing a fair game is always more enjoyable.
@chrisbeaudet5258 yeah I'd rather get beaten off the park every game if the alternative is a cheap and undeserved win.
All tournament players CHEATED casual players out of having a fun sci-fantasy tabletop game
that is a ridiculous statement. All tournament players are tournament platers bud. I have had one bad experience with a tryhard ever (in tournament). I have had several bad experience with "casuals though" people who got upset that i asked them to play by the rules because they had never read the rule book.
Dude should have been disqualified. Period. These TOs have demonstrated that they do not care about who wins or rules being followed and only care about the event making profit. And to those that say big events don't make money are lying to themselves. Just really lazy or incompetent decision by the TOs. Someone having such a powerful unit in a vehicle is game breaking imo. Let me put a ctan in a ghost ark please.....
I know some of the event staff and I can say for certain that they are not cool with cheating nor would they just ignore it. Mike Brandt along with TOs like Justin Curtis are completely fair when it comes to making calls on that kind of stuff
@JMoore-im5dx obviously they aren't. This decision proves otherwise. And would make me avoid any event they may be running knowing this is how a tournament can be decided. He literally displayed his army in a crazy egregious way the entire tournament, and is a known cheater. He should have been immediately disqualified. The fact of the matter is that they would rather not deal with the fallout of the results for everyone who played against him. Or it's favoritism. Who would ever go to a tournament if this can happen? Someone can misplay something all day and still take home 1st place prizes.... ok.
Usually i don't play tournaments that often, but my friends do and always when they tell me about the matches it comes out someone has cheat and, more often then not, is a veteran player used to high level tourneys. The sad thing is TOs doesn't do anything to punish those actions. This doesn't invites me to play tournaments more often but the contrary.
its lame to hear this, i have nothing but freaking epic experiences at tournaments. I have had exactly one bad experience ever, but when stuff like this gets out it turns people away from trying tournaments out :(
@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 the worst case happened at a RRT organized by a gaming club in Verona (North Italy): one of their club players cheated on purpose and even with rules at hand the TO gave reason to him Just because he's one of their "team"
Theres no way you play for years and miss how many mistakes were made. And it was ALL stuff that would specifically benefit him in an immediate manner
sadly very true
Don't worry everyone. The reason cheating is allowed, as explained to me, is because it's my job to make sure my opponents rules are legitimate. If you don't find it yourself, then that's on you for not catching the cheat.
Maybe this will give clarification on why cheating is allowed. Not joking, I had a guy not do my -1 to wound on my wardens and was also giving himself OC 3 on his transport vehicles. I figured it out that he didn't do the minus to wound when he shot my second unit of wardens and had already killed my first unit. I told the judge, judge said that it has already happened, move on. Then I found out that he was giving himself extra OC, which actually mattered because he denied me 5 points on primary by "tying" OC with a shield captain who was boosted by a vexilla. Overall, due to these 2 issues it caused a total of 15 points to not be scored by me. I lost 70-76.
Moral of the story, cheating is acceptable in 40k. You're playing your match to try and catch a cheater. That's warhammer 40k.
this sucks, this is also NOT 40k, sorry you had that experience
You are way too nice to him and I would not give this guy any benefit of doubt on anything.
I play warhammer 40k for 3-4 months (weekly), I just hit 2k pts of black templars and just got 1k army of orks for my birthday. I never played with my orks yet but remember the transports limitations etc.. Seems like dude is very experianced player and notorious cheater. it's just disgusting behaviour ruining fun and oportunities. He should be banned from events and black listed.
Honestly, the fact that this guy is even allowed to still play in tournaments is ridiculous.
The player in question has been busted multiple times at multiple events for all kinds of shady stuff, including "reading" rules out of his book to his opponent and literally skipping over the relevant sentence to the rules question he was asked (on video). I am unsure of why he hasn't been given a timeout yet. Funny how when he "accidentally" gets his rules wrong, it's always in his favor.
He plays in my meta a lot, and no one I know who has played him has had a good experience. (A few have had non-horrible experiences).
yeah i showed the incidient which you spoke about on the video
@Happykrumpingwargaming007 I posted before watching the video. Hahaha! It's a good breakdown, but honestly, you're being too kind. He plays in my meta regularly, and everyone hates playing him, because you have to watch him like a hawk and question literally everything. His team actually just dropped him. I wish ITC and GW would do the same. He ruins events for everyone.
Waaaaaggggghhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
solid waaagh dear sir
Google offered to translate this
Any cheating deserves a lifetime ban, period.
I get it might have been a mistake but 1) if he realised what he had done was wrong he should have resigned, especially 5 games deep and 2) if he has a history of cheating then unfortunately, right or wrong, I’m gonna assume that’s what your doing.
yeah man, my thoughts exactly
Algorithm
love you
This was bungled so badly that at this point the entire reputation of the tournament and every single TO and TO helper is on the line.
Something like this can stop a person from ever being allowed to be a TO or play in a tourney again
Its a step that GW is going to have to learn from, Now that they are getting into the event hosting business, they will have to professionalize, their judging system.
Well, l will say it like this, western wargaming is so adamant on "fun for everyone at cost of everything else" ends with cheaters getting yellow cards in every game and it meaning nothing. If l could change rules l would play my dreadnoughts as +3" Movment and guard squads at 10 men.
im not sure i understand your statement
At best he should be at two strikes out of three from a lifetime ban from competitive play. Once a cheater always a cheater. TOs need to fix this.
Agreed with the first part of your statement, not the second. TJ Lannigan is a beautiful example of a redemption story, that guy was a blatant cheater, who is now a paragon of the community. Redemption can be real.
Players make honest mistakes, 40k is a complicated game, lets be fair... BUUUUUT...
If multiple "mistakes" are being made over multiple games then a player actually NEEDS to be penalised even if retrospectively after the event.
At the very least his WCW qualification should be withdrawn due to multiple misplay infractions.
precisely
I think Marshall may be reading the rules, but not completely. Otherwise he would be clear that Ghazzie cannot embark on an ‘ard case battle wagon.
ehhhh, history does tend to repeat
Every Ork player worth his salt has known about the issues surrounding Ghaz and Battlewagons for ages so I am calling BS on this. He knew what he was doing.
Not reading any of your rules before entering a GT or larger event never leads to magically winning an event that size, unless youre making rules up to win.
Tacoma super major kicks ass, hate to hear about possible cheating but not surprised
yeah it sucks to hear, we are blessed in this hobby to have this be a rarity at least
The on stream cheating does look bad, but I am curious about one thing. Is it possible that he simply wrote down the requirements and forgot to copy that part, or was reading it from an app that didn't mention the issue with the opponents?
Not really trying to defend him, I'm simply new and not entirely sure if this would be possible.
totally possible, just seems quite unlikely
If you go to the codex and omit text in the rules on readback, thats intentionally cheating. If you dont have a rulebook for your army on hand at an event, I assume youre cheating unless youre bottom tables. And if you have your rule book, and you dont hand it to your opponent to let them read a rule, I consider that potential cheating because you prevent them seeing the proper ruels.
This is why I hate not having free codex and list building access for codex armies, you just blow open cheating at your events and stores
Yeah GW really needs to open up rules on the App. Heck make it a paid for app, but all the rules are included
Where is the reddit post?
this is the reddit of him defending himself old.reddit.com/user/LeftTaboo
Maybe if the GW Twitch stream wasn't so bad, more people would watch and call him out on it.
shout out to @wargameslive for doing a waay better job than GW
For the algorithm
I love you
If the guy cheated he deserves harsh treatment but only the TOs and his oponents know the "whole truth" so i definitely would trust any decision they came to. The GW staff based on my own experience at their events take matters of cheating very serious and would never iust dismiss it. I gurantee they gathered the facts and made a call based on those FACTS.
i hope you are right, but i certainly i would not guarantee it, seeing as he admitted to cheating with snikrot and the battlewagon, and they did not even 0 his scores lol
Marshal Cheaterson brought shame to the entire community. He should have been kicked out 100%
Ban imo. TO's need to step up.
Don't invite him on tournaments for 3 month (shadowban?) It happened to many times to ignore this behaviour.
@Happy Krumping Wargaming thx for beeing persistent with the Venatari xtra rule to me. It was just 1 tournament where they where not allowed to deploy three in a round, i totaly missunderstood that. Now, thanks to you, i have a urltra aggro funlist going. 5+1 Terminator 3x6 Venatari and then fill up with whatever. So bottom 2 or top 3 hell breaks loose and my oponent will hate me xD
No top table list but played it twice now and it is soooo much fun. Everybody knows what is coming for them and they sweat bullets to prepare for it ^^
oh heck yeah! Bring the emperors fury!
Are you actually living in Norway? I'm just suprised, I assumed you were American.
Not trying to shade any nationalities. Just suprised!
I am 100% American, but yeah i live here, i met some hot chick i had to come marry :P
He's swearing up and down that it wasn't intentional, but he kept doing it with following opponents after being caught the first time and got a second yellow card. He 100% did it on purpose, and beyond just Tacoma, he's a notorious cheater banned by all the LGSs near him.
sadly that is what it seems like. The invitation is open for him to come on and explain though
He didn't keep doing the same cheat after being caught in round 6. The second yellow card is for a different violation.
Mildly selfish, but I'm mostly bummed that GW is going to use this result to nerf Kill Rigs :D
hahaha
If the only time a player ever makes mistakes is when they're in their favor, those aren't mistakes. I've heard stories from other players who played this guy over the course of the weekend, and this dude just blatantly will lie about what units can do. It's incredible this guy is allowed to even keep competing in GTs.
yeah.... i am with you
Honestly I don't see how you can 'accidently' make these kind of mistakes. If you're playing at a tournament you're expected to know your list back to front 100%, to me anything other than that is just disrespectful to your opponents at the least and just blatant cheating at worst.
i mean mistakes certainly can happen, ive certainly made mistakes. But when they ONLY happen in your favor, they happen consistently, then you have a history of blatant cheating..... it looks bad
Yellow cards need to be an instant loss for that round.
i just think red cards need to be actually handed out :/
Cheating is cringe.
this
If he didn't intentionally cheat, he would make it right by not accepting the win. Otherwise he's a cheater.
thats how i look at it
How bigger benefit is the gaz in a hard top.
big, T10 to T12 is massive
, suddenly, S6 wounds on 6's, lazcannons wound on 4's, S 10 guns wound on 5's
Marshal P should be absolutely banned if this is a repeat thing. Revoke his ticket and shun him from the community
yep
This dude is the absolute worst. Hes a repeat cheater, and hes still not yet taking responsibility for his actions. I genuinely don't see how he doesn't get banned. Come on, now.
i have an update that i will be posting later today
The fact the index is the best Detachment, is highly problematic. How terrible.
I disagree :)
@Happykrumpingwargaming007 you're happy to play the same detachment for the entirety of 10th?
who said you only play the best detachment? there are several reasons to run Green tide still, and one month ago both BB and Tide were probably better than warhorde. More balance dataslates will occur this edition. Its a constantly evolving meta this edition, which is crazy fun
I hate that this kind of "exploiting knowledge" cheating is nearly exclusive to GW. I play another game at tournament level and the rules don't have the level of bloat where this is possible.
i mean its not exploiting knowledge, its just straight up cheating lol
This dude seems shady AF
"lets talk about how he managed to make it through" ... by cheating lol.
yeaaaaah
So a known cheater did something that looks a lot like cheating and still accepted the win? Checks out.
its pretty lame
:)
If you aren’t cheating you aren’t trying hard enough to win
i hate that statement
@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 lol
If this guy is allowed to keep his ticket then it essentially invalidates the entire idea of "competitive" 40k.
i mean thats pretty extreme, thats like saying because an athlete took a steroid, athletics are pointless lol
@@Happykrumpingwargaming007 No, it's like finding out the athlete who won gold took steroids and not only letting him keep the win but move on to the next round where he may or may not take more steroids.
Once that precedent is set then either you start to take steroids yourself to compete or you simply prepare to lose to the people who do.
I faced Orks many time before and I know Snikrot is T5. He is clearly cheating.
Cheaters in 40k...again...suprise suprise
i mean, name a competitive game or sport that does not have cheating in it? its not a 40k specific thing
Cheating (on purpose ofc) shows a tremendous lack of integrity and how poor someones character is...
I've started playing in 10th edition, got 3 armies. Never mixed Toughness for a unit. I always make sure to have profiles at hans and doublecheck stuff. Also, it's easy remembering that baseline orks is t5 sm is 4 etc, termies and meganobz are +1 etc
thats how i look at it
Third comment on this video, but as more info comes out, he was definitely doing it on purpose and his story about it is lies, so hes a liar too.
He should permanently be banned from all wargaming events, for at least one year. Even ones not related to warhammer.
Cheating to win at little plastic army men, its pathetic.
He is a "that guy", period.
i would love to see stricter punishment from TO's
Its a shame that last you had a win from an albeit oppressive custodes list and now you have cheating orks
sad days sir