Use dueling sword on Psyker with Scrier's Gaze damage stat is the dump stat Psyker skill tree has a node that increases Cleave by up to 100% as peril increases Dueling sword should have Shred and Rampage with +5% crit chance and +25% damage against Flak Hordes get absolutely deleted with light attack spam
That parry is so niche, I can't stand it. The enemy HAS to be targeting you or it does nothing. It gets completely invalidated by teammates like taunt ogryn, smite/surge/purg psyker, flamer/tome/crusher zealot, etc. Even when it does go off it's less lethal than a simple heavy attack from a dueling sword. It also doesn't scale with talents and stats. The top weapons tend to have a particular stat they scale well with but the devil's claw parry doesn't really scale with anything.
@@ianfitchett2768 Its not some magic button that deletes every enemy. Its just part of the weapon and you weave it in where it will improve your DPS or bail you out. For example you need to engage some ragers : you start off with a charged attack and immediately parry afterwards which is far faster and more damaging than chaining into another heavy. Or you have boss aggro and dont have space to work with. Mixing parries into the attacks just negates any threat from the boss (not that they're very threatening in the first place, but you get the point). Or you fuck up and are likely be hit by the incoming mauler overhead. Parry bails you out and creates space.
@@Corppi22 you are basically admitting that the weapon is essentially lackluster until the moment where you can use the parry, the others dont have a magic button, they just do damage. and killing everything before they are able to hit you is better than waiting for them to hit you so you can press a button for the weapon to actually do something. if the weapon did damage and had the parry on the side as an emergency advantage or something, you would have a case, but it does so little damage that is just not worth using unless you dont melee at all and all you care about is use the parry for whatever reason
@@Corppi22 ok but it's competing with weapons that do have magic buttons that delete everything so I rest my case. Block and dodge are all you need and other weapons do more damage with less strings attached.
I dissagre with branx placement 1. Overkill ? I call it insurence against nurgle blessing 2. It can 1 shot mutant where other pickaxes can't(not to mention block cancel to kill many of them in quick succession) 3. It can 1 shot ANY enemy in the game without any HH stacks or crunch while using thrust (with 5 stacks of HH and bull rush attacks speed you can blitz crushes/maulers packs) 4. With 5 stacks of heavy hitter it will do 6k damage to the boss in one heavy overhead(8k when with headtaker) 5. Horde clear attack pattern is super easy: push attack, heavy attack, light, heavy attack etc.
@nd-xu4en look at your videos oh wait you don't have any :) you're a speed run outside the map then brag about true level as if it means you know anything coward.
This is the same guy that made the worse psyker meta review on planet earth it's expected he has no idea what he's talking about EVEN after so much testing, zzz
The shovel for the ogryn is double S tier if you use the krieg skin. Instead of hitting it to use it like a pick the ogryn turns it side ways and smack a fell with the flat end and it’s funny
@@MisterEtide yeah sorta its a glitch of sorts I guess. it’s a old skin when the shovel had only 1 variation it’s called “entrenching tool” for the latrine shovel To do the glitch 1: set your desired shovel into the mk lll 2: attach the skin 3: swap to the other model shovels 4: your basically done the ogryn kinda slaps the shovel side ways so you kinda just smack them with the flat end like a cartoon
Arguing for the case of the Devil's Claw swords, I feel like you have heavily looked over the potential for them. Their parry alone transcends their ability for sustain as they can guard and attack at the same time. And spamming the parry ability, it makes the user to effectively facetank an entire horde including multiple ragers and bosses like Plague Ogryn and Chaos Spawn.
The best class for melee is zealot, and they have anti-synergy with him because he needs to dodge to get toughness regen and finesse damage. So blocking isnt really what you want to do. I think the blocking is cool, but it needs to be able to compete with how much damage you could do by straight up attacking and dodging properly. I wouldnt mind if parry attacks did like 10x damage, they might honestly rise to something you could specifically build around.
@@MisterEtide The parry isnt a substitute for dodging? You weave it into regular dodgedance gameplay. Its a part of the dps output and a safety net. (Mk4 is the only variant worth discussing tho)
@@MisterEtide Highlights the issue of doing melee ranking for combined classes. DCs are bad for zel but great for Vet though as Vet doesn't have as much attack speed, so defensive parry starts to shine. C tier for Zel, A tier for Vet imo, it's my go-to for Auric Damns.
@@MisterEtide What you're missing is how spammable the parry is in mixed horde situations. You can situationally put out more burst damage over the course of a 2-4-second window with a D-Claw than you can with any other weapon in the game. You can delete shotgunner and rager packs on auric almost instantly. In fact, the the bigger and hairier the horde, the more value that you're going to get out of the D-Claw, which is why the D-Claw is better on harder difficulties. The people who think that the D-Claw isn't at least an A-tier weapon are the ones who use the parry 10-20 times per game and wonder why their damage numbers are down. Get to the point where you're parrying 80-120 times per game, and then let's talk. Also, your take on the anti-armor capabilities of the parry is not accurate, especially on zealot. The parry does fine against anything that isn't carapace. If you need to kill carapace, you can easily do so with a zealot leveraging FOF, which is now on roughly a 10-second cooldown following the IOD buff. If you want to see what the D-Claw can do on auric/maelstrom against tons of scab enemies, watch this: ruclips.net/video/TAevHnu4A_8/видео.html
vet shovels should move up a tier imo - they're fast, precise, do solid damage (mainly because it's so easy to hit weak spots with them) and the special staggers crushers no questions asked.
Yeah, his placement is really totally wrong. Like he placed MK5 latrin shovel in B tier (!!!) while placing all marks of Clubs in S and A tier like it's before last big update. Since last update anyone who plays Ogryn knows that "new Club" is MK5 Latrin Shovel. It one-shots crushers ffs.... Club could barely two-shot Crusher before. I don't think he played Ogryns or did any research on how Ogryns meta shifted after last update.
Going to put a comment disputing some use cases; The Medium Pickaxe for Ogryn. Its heavy sweeps can be very effective into crowds, the cleave and built space means it doesnt fall behind the light, deals with mixed in elites better, and its biggest issue for most people is its perceived lack of a strikedown. It actually has a strikedown follow up to its special attack pull (which staggers crushers), and with very little work the strikedown can oneshot said crushers. Ive spoken with multiple ogryns who after testing it find it their favourite with that versatility in mind. I think you can also commit to the strikedown when sprinting, but I cant guarantee that off memory Chain axes require attack speed to use effectively, but they do the highest single target damage, and can kill armor and crushers exceptionally. Some of their attacks do some of the chain tear even without being charged, and its why they can feel so wonky. The Mk XII is easier to use with its lights being for crowds, and the heavy does some of the tear. The IV is the reverse, with heavys that can cleave into crowds, with lower damage but decent crowd control, and its lights tear through targets instantly, but attempt to grab and do their tear. They have some MASSIVE damage potential with their blessings too. I do find the attack speed is needed though. Veteran Shovels flip-stab can one tap crushers. Not just Mutants. Ironically, I prefer the one that doesnt flip though, it has really high attack speed, but doesnt natively one shot crowds. Most people use its Heavys for its crowd control, but with the slightest damage buff, even from its own blessings stacking up, it tears through crowds insanely fast, staggers elites well, and its special stagger is high enough to stop a charging mutant. Less ideal then killing them outright, but having that much stagger means nothing else can really stand through it. Cleavers. The Mk 3 is far and away the best light and "fluff" killing weapon, but the krouk gives that up for a double stabbing moveset that decimates armor. That might be its niche, but its very strong at it, and its third hits sweep or canceling into a push is good at keeping yourself spaced up. It might not compete with the shield but its a fair competitor to the Bull butcher, just in a very different niche. The Crusher hits weakspots way harder then people realise, and I very rarely dont highest damage with it. Its base impact light attacks are enough to stagger maniacs and the like, and charging it is generally a bait. Skullcrusher also stacks up to 8 stacks, and the charges hit on a target counts as 2 hits, capping out the +80% damage on its primary target instantly. Other people have already spoken for the Devil Sword.
attack speed is one of the major factors because there are so many talents and blessings that apply on-hit, so things that are hitting faster are buffing up faster. goes for ranged weapons too. slower attack rate weapons either need superior base stats or superior movesets to be able to keep up
@@honestbenny The MK5 Latrin Shovel is massively overrated, everyone is just impressed it can 1 shot a Crusher. It's just a worse Thunderhammer and frankly, the starting rigid shovel is way better.
@@sirgaz8699 "worse thunderhammer" oh, sorry, didn't know Ogryns had thunderhammers. Great argument here. Makes sense, after all Ogryn club is just worse Dueling Sword and Cleaver is worse Combat Blade. My bad.
I won't argue with tier placement, because it's personal preference. But - you are wrong about skullcrusher blessing. It doesn't add damage to the same hit that triggers it. It works like this - once you stagger something for the next 5 seconds if that thing is hit by anyone and anything, WHILE staggered it will get +xx% damage. If it is hit but not in stagger animation it just gets normal damage. That trait is like a love letter from stagger mechanics built-in VT2, but not nearly as powerful as some may think, and usually more useful to the teammates that can exploit targets you staggered, than to your own damage.
Thank you Mister E! It's a great list and it inspires me to make some changes in what I use. Btw I think one of the small chainswords is actually the icon of the missing Evisc. ;)
The Mark 3 vet shovel would like to have a word. It does its alt attack super fast, it will 2 tap a crusher, it will 1 tap a mutant and while it has less mobility than a knife it will fuck up a horde way faster. It shines brightest when your game assigned oafs are all dead and you aren't doing a stealth breaks the game build
I absolutely agree with you. It does more than decent damage on single targets and is, by my opinion one of the best, if not the best horde clearing weapon in the game. I really don't understand how "well-rounded" can be considered a weakness. On Vet, Shovel coupled with Voice of Command makes you kinda immune to all non-elites ennemies. I think that horde clearing ability is really overlooked, as if trash ennemies were harmless in the game. Even on higher difficulties, I'm pretty much sure that most of the parties wiping are mostly due to being overwhelmed by basic ennemies and lacking space.
Agreed. The fact also that it staggers everything in front of you means you don't have to dance around as much and can just get to work. Pack of maulers, no problem, they are too busy wondering what just slapped them in the face for them to swing on you. 2 shot crushers with special attack. Great damage/damage reduction ratio. And it's dump stat, defense, in my opinion is an easy choice.
Good to see fellow Mk3 Shovel enjoyers out there. Who needs a fancy sabre or power sword when the shovel beats the everloving snot out of everything in your path, and can take a huge chunk out of single targets as well?
Youre wrong about the tactical axe. Their niche is base speed mobility and crit chance. When you learn the attack pattern and you consistently land all those shots at the speed of light (head or body) you'll slay any enemy including crushers in less than 3-4 seconds, with the added perk of having great cleave and horde clear. It works best on zealot with a max of 4 separate melee attack speed boosts, and crits proccing toughness damage reduction and bleed and more crits, which can total something like a potential 40-50%+ attack speed which is NUTTY considering how many crits you'll be landing. Its a bit more specialised at this and doesn't perform so well at base level compared to say a knife or duelling sword, so I wouldn't put it as high as them but C tier is pure heresy
C tier is for weapons that are made irrelevant by other weapons. The duelling sword is just the same thing they are but better. Every build you might take a tactical on is 100% improved by using dueling sword or maybe knife. Therefore I cannot in good conscience promote them any higher
@@MisterEtide I get that. duelling sword is very good at pretty much everything. but its not better at everything than everything else in every build, this is false no matter how meta the DS is. If I'm running a critical hit build on zealot with crits speeding up cooldowns of my ability and proccing a 50% toughness damage reduction for 4s and applying bleed which in turn grants an even higher crit chance, then the tac axe wins simply based on innate crit chance and weapon attack speed. Afaik the tac axe is the only melee weapon with a built in critical hit modifier which boosts crit chance and crit damage. I can land so many critical hits that my ability can be fully cooled every 5 seconds MAX with the right build. The duelling sword cannot do that under any circumstance. So youre wrong in saying every build is made better by DS or knife.
@@willb1405it literally isn't. Dueling sword is garbage for hordes, mitigated by the fact you can just play defensively. Tac axe has the same benefits as the dueling sword with better cleave and stagger. They fill different niches. The knife and dueling sword don't because both are more focused on single target damage and the knife is still one shooting everything the dueling sword can for the most part while being faster and more effective at everything else.
@@coldeed its not the best at hordes but it works fine, and horde clear is never really an issue as theres always gonna be at least 1 player who does cc. fast and efficient single target damage is what matters most which is especially the case in higher difficulties, and dueling sword does this really well
Mostly pretty good. Except the heavy sword mark 9 is easily the best. Most convenient pattern plus it does the exact same heavy damage as the other two as long as you block cancel the reset.
As an Ogryn main there is one major flaw. Ogryn Latrine mk5 is S tier. (MK9 is close but has a slightly worse heavy loop) Special oneshots crushers on any difficulty(and therefor any non-boss in the game) Without Heavy hitter. So you can use feel to pain Regular heavies are side horizontal for everything you don't need the special for, great against hordes and anything non heavy basically. Attackspeed is better than any pickaxe, even karsolas so you have MUCH better survivability because of the higher attackspeed with procs for toughness gain and bleed stacks. In addition to not needing heavy hitter, and feel no pain making you much tankier again.
I think Mk V Latrine Shovel really should be higher. Very good horde clear with heavy attacks. And can instakill maulers and (I think) crushers with the special if built right. Otherwise, I generally agree with the rest of your takes
18:33 the mark 5 shovel is a monster the heavies will hit everything in front of you over and over while the special mode with thrust will one shot literally everything in the game except bosses
The shock maul is my weapon for if I wanna play and just turn off my brain. It's got pretty good clutch potential because it's so safe and has pretty good stamina.. Of course it's no knife, but knife takes some paying attention. Even the crusher, being so safe, requires some combos, while shock maul is just heavy-light repeat (crowds) or heavy spam (singles) and has a cool stun to help with crushers or warks.
Disagree about the catachan and turtolsky placement. Both easily compete with the axes at the top, they just have different niches. Catachan parry is a lifesaver on aurics
as a Zealot i actually love the Shock Mauls. Okay one of them, i don't know which is which but one is superior in pretty much everything. Good horder clear with huge cleave and stagger, heavy attack for single targets. It just felt like a really comfortable and well rounded melee Maybe it fells of hard on harder difficulties but the last time i had this much fun with a melee weapon was the heavy evisc at launch, loved swinging that around, felt meaty okay it's the Agni Mk Ia. Better cleave, better against carapace, my beloved nevermind i actually like the other one too
I do really love the catachan knives in particular, they just feel great to use. They are insane though, especially having such high base crit without having to use a stat for it like other crit focused weapons do.
Good tier list. Don't agree with everything, but that's personal preference mostly. I'd shoutout the crusher and agni shock maul because I just find them fun to use, but no doubt I get more done using the Power Dueling sword and Thunder Knives
I wish the Catachan swords were just a little bit better because I love the parry mechanic. It's such a satisfying way to take out some of the melee elites. Great video!
I'll make a case for the MKXV Evis: A martyrdom crit build turns this thing into a beast. Granted, you have to nerf yourself by taking wound curious and being low health, but once you're good at dodging, you're not taking damage anyway. Spam light attacks and everything dies. Not as good as dueling sword, but a fun alternative if you like to ride the lightning.
best part of the shield is if you spec for stamina you can practically block forever, making you basically invinsible and combined with rage it means you can have a horde basically become useless
A note on the chainswords revv attack, at least for the Mk13: A light revv attack does good damage. A Heavy revv attack does massive damage, on my current maxed out mk 13 chainsword it's 1300+ damage, add the bleed to it as well since you're supposed to use the Bloodletter blessing on it. Also put a Cleave blessing on it (I prefer wrath). The Mk4 has easier use due to the attack pattern, yes, so to remedy that for the Mk13 you zig-zag the mouse when swinging. Single turn or back and forth. If you do it with a zealot that has momentum activated and/ or just used Fury of the Faithful charge you can even zig-zag into multiple hits on a single target and you get this unique crunch sound as they perish. Zig-zag lets you hit 5 or more enemies, as many as 7 or 8 in a horde and gives some stagger. So you can mow a horde like that and it's fast cleari g and really high dps. You can even do it with a group of ragers in an emergency but you'll take a lot of damage from it. The zig-zag can be used with other weapons as well of course. Like the Borovian pickaxe for Ogryns. That changes it from mostly single/dual target from the diagonal standard attack to become a horde clearer. I'm not saying to change the tiers for these, you put tem where they should be, just that there are ways to get more out of these weapons (and maybe some others too). Using them this way means an output closer to a tier higher and not all players know about this. Another thing the Borovian pickaxe can do is you can push monstrosities off balance, at least the chaos spawn. It recovers quickly but it gives you valuable seconds to land free hits and reset it's attack pattern.
It is the future, melee combat is more brutal than ever, between Power maces, chain swords, Force blades and more. Which is why its kinda funny that an infantrymans knife, something so simple is on par for being one of the best melee weapons
why does no one ever talk about the Karsolas overhead? a pull into a heavy gets a crusher really low if not one shotting them and knocks them flat, and the heavy attacks on it sweep through heavy hordes like butter, personally i dont care if its overkill it hits fast and hard and it makes me feel so good when I can dome a charging mutie before he can touch me
The buffed the devil claws parry. Which was already able to parry monstrosities and crushers. It can now parry all sources of damage for a larger window. It’s def at least a tier. The fact that I can build a good build with it and kill crushers in pretty fast rate while not worrying about taking damage But the best aspect of the force swords is infinite dodging basically. The force sword due to that, with its jabs with the right blessing I can kill crushers in a second or two or at least stagger them reliably as a psyker.
I think the idea of blocking is cool in this game but it needs to do something really special if you land it, i just dont feel that from d claws. If you can dodge, you also take no damage, and can deal damage during that time. In fact dodging gives zealots and vets some pretty huge buffs, so blocking instead will have you missing out on those, which is a big nono for damage.
@@MisterEtide I’d have to double check the stats and I haven’t ran the sword since the update came out but considering all damage modifiers are applied to parry and, I believe it’s a crit damage wise, it can do some pretty great damage. Good mobility, good swing pattern, mid starting damage but superior survivability for when you are in a pit with 5 crushers or you have a bunch of ragers It’s not s tier but I feel it’s low A for sure due to guranteed I-frames
Ive never considered chosing my weapons carefully because its always decided based on the simplicity of the combos lmao. If i can do 3 vanguards in a row i always value that over 2 vanguards then a strike. I wasn't sure which dueling sword was which, but yeah you put the one I was drawn to in top tier, I was drawn to it because of the poke-only combo.
Crits are in lower demand for Zealot now. When Invocation of Death gave a 1.5s cooldown reduction per crit, you wanted every attack to crit for rapid chain dashes and toughness returns. Now, as long as you get one crit every 4 seconds, your skill tree won’t suffer. Just using Scourge and Blazing Piety can cover toughness and cooldown reduction. Knives are still viable, but I prefer the Dueling Sword with Agile and Uncanny Strike. On the knife, I used to run Riposte and Flesh Tearer, but Flesh Tearer's +8 bleed stacks felt redundant since max bleed caps at 16 stacks, making a faster stacking speed negligible. Instead, I use Lacerate for more bleed on non-weak spot hits, which can help activate Scourge sooner on the odd chance you don't crit on the first few hits Currently, Uncanny Strike with Riposte is solid. Bleed does little against heavily armored enemies, so rending helps more against maulers and armored ragers. Rending also lets you stagger these enemies, reducing the risk of taking hits. The Latrine Mk V shovel for Ogryn isn’t just "B tier"-it stands out. Its heavy attacks follow a left-right sweep pattern, ideal for Ogryn since it consistently hits weak spots on every swing, effectively decapitating enemies in a row. To make the most of it, take Brutal Momentum, which adds extra weak spot damage and lets kills ignore enemy hit mass, enabling this shovel to cleave through hordes as well as (or better than) knives. For secondary perks, Confident Strike is great for toughness regen, though some prefer Thrust for one-shotting Crushers (though Crushers often already have some damage by the time you reach them meaning i 1 shot them most of the time anyway in game). The shovel’s alternate attack is excellent for single-targets: one "charged" light attack can take down mutants instantly, and two "charged" heavy attacks are enough for Crushers. (or one charged heavy with a slow build that i hate playing even tho it looks cool) for ogryn cleavers, the Mk Vi has the better attack pattern kind of? well maybe slightly worse for light attacks but a better attack pattern for heavy attack, but they are vanguards and well, HONESTLY the shovel i mentioned up above is just simply better for heavy attacking the hoard, i switched from the Mk VI to shovel as soon as it came out because of this The Psyker force swords have some powerful builds. The Deimos Mk4 can deal significant damage to Crushers with the right setup. Charged attacks hit weak spots rapidly, stacking buffs, and a single light jab followed by a heavy jab to a Crusher's face guarantees a kill. The Illisius is unique-its charged crits always hit weak spots, so it performs well in a high-crit build. The Obscurus is a balanced option with a nice attack pattern. It may ignore hit mass on charged attacks if it strikes a smaller enemy first, though I may be mixing up features. Overall, all force swords are impressive with the right build. it has been a while since i researched these swords so i may be mixing up some informatoin, for the obsurus or illisis, maybe look it up instead of taking my word for it on thoes
I think all the bendy shovels are B but I think the rigid shovels are actually A. It's the "it has a special attack so we have to remove power from elsewhere" but the rigid shovels just blat everything.
id argue the ironhelm thunderhammer has one advantage, it can charge and vanguard strike so it really cuts through hordes if u want it too, but the attack pattern is overall worse though
I'm a big proponent of the Brute-brainer shovels. I can make a Heavy Hitter or FNP build that one shots crushers with the bendy feature and if you use the MK IV, the horde clear attacks are side to side heavy attacks so you get a ton of mileage out of talents that make use of heavy attacks. You can one shot anything crusher and below and you have your heavy, side to side horde clear attack that also makes use of heavy attack talents. I don't see this as having any holes and it's far sight more wieldy than some of the other heavier weapons.
@20:53, i think i’m using the wrong mark of dueling sword cuz that’s exactly what it does, and doesn’t perform the way i see other players on stream using it for easy fights….. Thanks for clarifying that! I’ll switch to the Mark IV. I’ll also give the Antax a try. I’m trying to get mastery in many weapons as it gives me something to progress towards other than difficulty.
Yeah you want the fast chain stabs, no silly waving it around or useless sweeps. Antax is pretty goated, and its my recommendation to every newer player for its simplicity and power
MK3 Eviserator is minimum A tier if power sword is. Great damage, and cleave, plus blessing for large amounts of shield (can't think of name right now) back on hits of 3 enemies or more. It also has a brain dead combo of block+push+light which does a perfect horizontal hit every time and kills entire crowds of walkers. For crushers and below the special attack stuns so good for less confident players as well. Special one shots most lower tier special infected. Also S tier as you can do a proper Sisters of Battle repentia character with it 😊 Great video!
Well i accidentally dropped it in A tier so i guess my brain subconsciously thought so too :) i just feel like its so clunky to do that combo for sweeps when we have thunderhammer doing the same sweeps on chained heavy. But thats totally up to the user preference!
Deflector use to be busted because passive quell use to work with kinetic deflection. Obese fish nerfed it so you can't lose peril while blocking with it. Chain axe has really good light attack stagger. The only issue is learning to overcome the sticky lights on poxxers since it it takes 2 ticks to kill from full hp.
make sure to lock your doors at night, there are so many hardcore shovel glazers out there that freak the fuck out if anyone says they are anything less than the best in the game
MK5 Latrin Shovel it's not best weapon in the game... but for sure it's better than Clubs now. Club was mainly taken before for 2-shotting Crushers with heavy attacks. Now MK5 shovel can one-shot them. It's not really hard to understand why most Ogryn players switched Club to Shovel. Also Ogrynomicon explains why they are now better than Clubs.
@@honestbenny i was talking about the normal shovel. most orgyns i see are all about the pickaxe or shield. but i wouldnt know personally, i dont have any interest in playing the ogryn, mine is still like level 8
@@TannerLindbergare you saying clubs are better than shovel or are you just taking this opportunity to shit on the hard work the creators of Ogrynomicon put in because you have a slightly different opinion on a few things in it?
@@TannerLindberg I've seen this said by a few but never heard it explained what exactly it gets wrong, any chance of one of your indepth, calm reviews? ;D
I think Devil's Claw is actually great mainly bacause of its special. What hold's it back for me is the mobility. If it had the same mobility as rapier it would be amazing. Anyway I would't call it beginner weapon at all.
@@anotherage8758 shock mauls ARE powerful, you can delete any enemy with heavy overheads (not sure which mark but either one or both) including armour. when you get the attack pattern locked in it is nutty powerful
@@anotherage8758 cant remember which one i used but I used a shock maul on my vet and it absolutely destroyed crushers and maulers. you just need to learn the swing patterns and how to always swing into heavy overheads every second swing. it should be heavy overhead into a light overhead and repeat.
I just wish the devil's claws just need a shred more power attack vs carapace, just that tiny bit esp with the absurd dueling sword. I find it totally funny running into a group of ragers with a devil's claw and rofl killing them with the parry. But you MUST parry such high danger enemies of mauler or crusher to get any value out of it at that level. The risk profile is screwed. Esp when you are walking into a group of crushers, too dangerous to parry. - So much of my frustration with these weapons are held back by specials allegedly increasing the power. The tradeoffs don't feel real and so many special attacks don't feel useful. Even the deimos sword is better off just strong attacking over and over instead of using the activation. And the Illisi feels...bad. Fussing around with it in the meat grinder it felt like it tickled things and those windows as you said to activate are few and far between when you are really in the thick of it. IT felt better to just strong attack rather than activate even with prep time. At least the Illisi doesn't attach you to an enemy for an animation if you want the damage, but let me activate it with cool animation cancels, THAT'D be cool. Let me build all the peril in the world while being a lawnmower. I know they don't want it to just be a psyker powersword, but I think that identity can be held together by just never giving us a power cycler, just make the charge animation faster (or even make it a perk, I'll take that.) In practice my experience with the blazeswords is just having some basic utility to range push things, including crushers if you point at their face. The power budget into the warp activation part feels really pointless when I can just take the standard crowd killing blessings and do fine.
i like the heavy eviscerator so much. it just really fuels the zealot power fantasy for me. but you kinda wanna play it with the wound stacking build (which is just a waste of points) or otherwise the attack speed feels SO bad
I'm kinda the opposite of you with my club taste. The light attacks on the mkII club and when you set it up with thunderous/skullcrusher and momentum you become indestructible around hordes. The opener heavy has good and accessible control. This makes your flow normally heavy into light or shove into light, stagger and bleed out your enemies while gaining like one fourth of toughness on any given attack. Then for more leathality you heavy light light heavy to build up the other recommended blessing of thunderous or skull crusher with momentum.
If all the actives were just on/off toggles, they would be so much more usable. Only the power sword would need a tweak to stay balanced. The others already have significant downsides that mean no one should be running them full time.
So im coming back to Darktide since the update and I have a question. Looking at the new masteries and brunts armoury there is only one weapon listed where there was previously multiple variants. So if i buy a blaze sword do i get IV or IX, or is it just random? Do the variants even exist anymore?
Variants/marks are at the top right of the inventory page when you have the weapon selected. So if you buy one force sword you have all three variants and can change it at any time
I mainly use shovels, so seeing it ranked in the B tier hurts me. It's really, really good for me-especially when you can one-shot Mutie. That’s a win.
I *think* there might have been a mix up between the Mk VI and IX Heavy Swords. Mk IX is definitely the go-to for its attack pattern and utility. Incredibly easy to mow through hordes with its sweeping heavy attacks, but you can charge towards Elites/Specialists and get in a heavy vertical chop for an easy decapitation. When it comes to Ogryns and Monstrosities though... probably best to use a good sidearm or bolter 😅
The mark 2 bullyclub has one special funny move that no other club can do. You do the special slap and buffer an attack. You'll punch. It's very silly and funny and has a great CLONK noise.
I personally cannot stand having to block cancel or use weapon special to get back to the stabs, which is the attack i actually want. The light attacks kill horde enemies in one hit to the head as zealot, so more clear isnt necessary for me. I do however need MORE STABS to deal with the pack of 6 crushers trying to smack me up
Want to preface this by saying this was very informative and helpful. And i learned alot here. And its natural to disagree on tier lists, thats just how it works. But still, i wanted to add my five cents. Devil's Claw B tier? Maybe im just bad, but i seriously cannot play a vet without them. With right blessings, they absolutely mow down hordes of any type with no issue. And if you're feeling like you're stuck in a bad spot, you just parry to win. The parry wins so many situations, even on auric, where you would have to sweat otherwise. I dont win games if i dont take devil's claw, its honestly a crutch sometimes. You almost never use their heavy attack, unless you're trying to catch a charger. If you want something dead with it, you parry, they simply kill themselves against you like you're an adamantine cactus or something. Ofcourse i dont use them on Zealot. Zealot can make many other weapons shine where other classes cant, so its a waste otherwise. Its my go to Veteran sword, because i focus on ranged mostly, and then i pull it out when going gets tough and it pulls me out of anything very consistantly. I survived encirclements that would kill me otherwise. The only thing it wont save me against is crusher and mauler overheads, but its a very specific weakness that you can see coming from a mile. And when you cant pull aggro to activate the parry, you stil have the awesome ability to delete a horde given you have the cleave blessing.
12:24 Bro, I've done the same thing LMAO It's funny cuz at first I used the knife, then I got bored, so I thought the axe was the perfect candidate, then the update rolled out and now I'm using the sword. I just went full circle and back with the same issue of using the same weapons.
People really love the shovels! They just dont click for me, i think i trend away from weapons that need to be activated to do a thing. Just gimme a straight up piece of metal like the rashad anyday
18:30 "they dont have any damage, they cant armor pen, they're not exceptional at anything" i've been using a Mk III shovel on my Veteran for nearly 68 hrs now. Its alt-mode can 1-shot every single enemy in the entire game (besides bosses of course) and thats WITHOUT any of my build stacks. WITH my build stacks, i can basically delete any enemy from the game files for looking at me funny. I've quite literally chunked 30-45% of a damonhosts health with a crit-headshot on a fully charged heavy attack and got the kill for it. Does everyone know this, and im just the greenhorn that got used to the shovels jank? I'm literally still using this thing on Auric and have yet to be given a reason to switch off.
I think the dueling sword and knives are fine, they are obscenely strong yes, but they seem so incredible lame. I have 2400+ hours in the game and I would never consider running the knives or the dueling swords, I’d rather play the uninstaller if I’m being honest. Additionally you might want to give the crusher another look on zealot, it has the highest skill ceiling in the game, but it is objectively the best weapon in the game. The crusher has a hidden finesse stat on the push attack that is honestly disgustingly strong. The crusher’s charged heavy attack can stun lock something like a row of 8 crusher enemies the light heavy or heavy light combo relative to id you want single or cleave dmg is just fantastic once you get used to it, and the crusher sends enemies spashing all over the place so you can run the skill tree node that gives 20% cooldown reduction on backstab kill and it will proc all the time because you will be killing mo s in the back while they are standing up. But again it is a high skill cap weapon, for example the push attack being cracked strong makes running triple +3 stam curios good on it, but that means less defensive stats.
I feel like we need free blessing testing mechanics in psychanium. U can use mods to spawn a mixed horde in there.. And some things that earned a weapon lower place I think could be solved with proper blessings (I'm not sure as I don't remember all o them)
The chainswords are my 2nd favorite weapons thematically but man the Rev up just doesn't feel good on auric. It's just too slow and then locks you down too much. When there's only a couple elites it's great, but when there's lots of elites they just can't keep up with the action economy
Mk 2 dueling sword I just do heavy -> special -> heavy special, which is often what I do on the mk4 anyway to stagger ragers/maulers/crushers. But I agree I prefer the mk 2 because you have the option to just to repeated heavies. The mk 5 is useless by comparison
Mark 4 Dueling Sword & Combat Blades Mark 3/4: 01:12
Ogren’s Slab Shield: 06:30
Ogren Pickaxes (Branks, Borovan, Car Solus): 07:19
Brute Bully Clubs (Mark 1 & Mark 3): 10:18
Chain Axes: 11:43
Rashad Combat Axe: 12:59
Antax Combat Axe: 13:55
Aculas Combat Axe: 15:31
Ogren Shovels: 18:37
Mark 4 & other Dueling Swords: 20:44
Power Swords: 23:31
Cruus Thunderhammer & Iron Helm Thunderhammer: 25:42
Cleavers: 28:06
Zealot Shock Maul: 29:40
Heavy Eviscerators: 31:59
Chainswords: 34:08
Heavy Swords: 36:03
Katchan Devil’s Claw Swords: 38:41
Shock Mauls: 39:19
Tactical Axes: 41:32
Psyker’s Blaze Force Swords: 43:51
Reasons why chain axe is above all other melee weapons
1.BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD
2.SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE
Sounds like heresy to me...
BLOOD FOR THE EMPEROR, SCULLS FOR THE GOLDEN THRONE!!
@@MustangGT4 sus
U can chain oneshot kills with those
OG chain axe gang 💪
too bad i would never use a knife or a toothpick as weapons. i need the dopamine hits from those big, heavy cleaves
eviscerator gaming
If you can still do Auric max difficulty, then it’s fine whatever you use
But for those that can’t quite get it, these can open up many possibilities
Only melee in the game I don’t really love is the heavy sword. But the chain weapons and the shock maul are just so fun
Use dueling sword on Psyker with Scrier's Gaze
damage stat is the dump stat
Psyker skill tree has a node that increases Cleave by up to 100% as peril increases
Dueling sword should have Shred and Rampage with +5% crit chance and +25% damage against Flak
Hordes get absolutely deleted with light attack spam
@@YoVa-b2k I'll try this, thanks!
I only use shovels for the noise it makes. It's a good laugh every once in a while. But that's about it.
We need a mod that makes shovel animation every 100 attacks punch them with the flat side with the noise "Bonk!"
clack clack clack
How long until the ogryn just gets a pair of brass knuckles? I dont even need power fists just some lead lined boxing gloves
No, just give me old skool chains wrapped around their fists. OG Ogryn minis have those too.
You'll take my heavy eviscerator out of my cold dead hands thank you very much 😂
By the way, pretty darn underrated darktide RUclipsr here. Love your stuff man.
I just really started three months ago! Gives me a lot of inspiration to hear comments like that.
Devil's Claw swords have parry which completely transforms them. The impression in the video is basically if judged without the parry.
for real. the amount of times parry has saved a run for me is crazy
That parry is so niche, I can't stand it. The enemy HAS to be targeting you or it does nothing. It gets completely invalidated by teammates like taunt ogryn, smite/surge/purg psyker, flamer/tome/crusher zealot, etc. Even when it does go off it's less lethal than a simple heavy attack from a dueling sword. It also doesn't scale with talents and stats. The top weapons tend to have a particular stat they scale well with but the devil's claw parry doesn't really scale with anything.
@@ianfitchett2768 Its not some magic button that deletes every enemy. Its just part of the weapon and you weave it in where it will improve your DPS or bail you out. For example you need to engage some ragers : you start off with a charged attack and immediately parry afterwards which is far faster and more damaging than chaining into another heavy.
Or you have boss aggro and dont have space to work with. Mixing parries into the attacks just negates any threat from the boss (not that they're very threatening in the first place, but you get the point).
Or you fuck up and are likely be hit by the incoming mauler overhead. Parry bails you out and creates space.
@@Corppi22 you are basically admitting that the weapon is essentially lackluster until the moment where you can use the parry, the others dont have a magic button, they just do damage. and killing everything before they are able to hit you is better than waiting for them to hit you so you can press a button for the weapon to actually do something. if the weapon did damage and had the parry on the side as an emergency advantage or something, you would have a case, but it does so little damage that is just not worth using unless you dont melee at all and all you care about is use the parry for whatever reason
@@Corppi22 ok but it's competing with weapons that do have magic buttons that delete everything so I rest my case. Block and dodge are all you need and other weapons do more damage with less strings attached.
I dissagre with branx placement
1. Overkill ? I call it insurence against nurgle blessing
2. It can 1 shot mutant where other pickaxes can't(not to mention block cancel to kill many of them in quick succession)
3. It can 1 shot ANY enemy in the game without any HH stacks or crunch while using thrust (with 5 stacks of HH and bull rush attacks speed you can blitz crushes/maulers packs)
4. With 5 stacks of heavy hitter it will do 6k damage to the boss in one heavy overhead(8k when with headtaker)
5. Horde clear attack pattern is super easy: push attack, heavy attack, light, heavy attack etc.
look at the dudes videos hes a stealth coward doesnt kno sht
@nd-xu4en look at your videos oh wait you don't have any :) you're a speed run outside the map then brag about true level as if it means you know anything coward.
This is the same guy that made the worse psyker meta review on planet earth it's expected he has no idea what he's talking about EVEN after so much testing, zzz
Zealots still don't understand Ogryn is strongest
The shovel for the ogryn is double S tier if you use the krieg skin. Instead of hitting it to use it like a pick the ogryn turns it side ways and smack a fell with the flat end and it’s funny
There’s a skin that changes the animation?
@@MisterEtide yeah sorta its a glitch of sorts I guess. it’s a old skin when the shovel had only 1 variation it’s called “entrenching tool” for the latrine shovel
To do the glitch
1: set your desired shovel into the mk lll
2: attach the skin
3: swap to the other model shovels
4: your basically done the ogryn kinda slaps the shovel side ways so you kinda just smack them with the flat end like a cartoon
Arguing for the case of the Devil's Claw swords, I feel like you have heavily looked over the potential for them. Their parry alone transcends their ability for sustain as they can guard and attack at the same time. And spamming the parry ability, it makes the user to effectively facetank an entire horde including multiple ragers and bosses like Plague Ogryn and Chaos Spawn.
I thought you still took damage from enemies during the parry's counter animation?
The best class for melee is zealot, and they have anti-synergy with him because he needs to dodge to get toughness regen and finesse damage. So blocking isnt really what you want to do. I think the blocking is cool, but it needs to be able to compete with how much damage you could do by straight up attacking and dodging properly. I wouldnt mind if parry attacks did like 10x damage, they might honestly rise to something you could specifically build around.
@@MisterEtide The parry isnt a substitute for dodging? You weave it into regular dodgedance gameplay. Its a part of the dps output and a safety net. (Mk4 is the only variant worth discussing tho)
@@MisterEtide Highlights the issue of doing melee ranking for combined classes. DCs are bad for zel but great for Vet though as Vet doesn't have as much attack speed, so defensive parry starts to shine. C tier for Zel, A tier for Vet imo, it's my go-to for Auric Damns.
@@MisterEtide What you're missing is how spammable the parry is in mixed horde situations. You can situationally put out more burst damage over the course of a 2-4-second window with a D-Claw than you can with any other weapon in the game. You can delete shotgunner and rager packs on auric almost instantly. In fact, the the bigger and hairier the horde, the more value that you're going to get out of the D-Claw, which is why the D-Claw is better on harder difficulties. The people who think that the D-Claw isn't at least an A-tier weapon are the ones who use the parry 10-20 times per game and wonder why their damage numbers are down. Get to the point where you're parrying 80-120 times per game, and then let's talk.
Also, your take on the anti-armor capabilities of the parry is not accurate, especially on zealot. The parry does fine against anything that isn't carapace. If you need to kill carapace, you can easily do so with a zealot leveraging FOF, which is now on roughly a 10-second cooldown following the IOD buff.
If you want to see what the D-Claw can do on auric/maelstrom against tons of scab enemies, watch this: ruclips.net/video/TAevHnu4A_8/видео.html
vet shovels should move up a tier imo - they're fast, precise, do solid damage (mainly because it's so easy to hit weak spots with them) and the special staggers crushers no questions asked.
Yeah, combined with the Mk IIIa Lasgun, Lucius Pattern, and you have a very effective loadout. (Krieger-approved, even)
The Ogryn Mk5 shovel with crunch can oneshot crushers and maulers and has really nice horde clear attacks
Yeah, his placement is really totally wrong. Like he placed MK5 latrin shovel in B tier (!!!) while placing all marks of Clubs in S and A tier like it's before last big update.
Since last update anyone who plays Ogryn knows that "new Club" is MK5 Latrin Shovel. It one-shots crushers ffs.... Club could barely two-shot Crusher before.
I don't think he played Ogryns or did any research on how Ogryns meta shifted after last update.
Maybe i missed playing with this one? I would’ve noticed that in my testing. Clubs are still very good, mk Ii could be lower probably
It also one taps mutants no matter what, and 2 taps crushers/maulers with only thrust
My favourite weapon for gunlugger for sure
@@MisterEtide branx pickaxe not being in the same tier as shield feels wrong
veterans mk III with Thrust can also 1-shot Crushers
Ur content is a great laugh sometimes man. Keep it up
Preeshiate you.
Going to put a comment disputing some use cases;
The Medium Pickaxe for Ogryn. Its heavy sweeps can be very effective into crowds, the cleave and built space means it doesnt fall behind the light, deals with mixed in elites better, and its biggest issue for most people is its perceived lack of a strikedown. It actually has a strikedown follow up to its special attack pull (which staggers crushers), and with very little work the strikedown can oneshot said crushers. Ive spoken with multiple ogryns who after testing it find it their favourite with that versatility in mind. I think you can also commit to the strikedown when sprinting, but I cant guarantee that off memory
Chain axes require attack speed to use effectively, but they do the highest single target damage, and can kill armor and crushers exceptionally. Some of their attacks do some of the chain tear even without being charged, and its why they can feel so wonky. The Mk XII is easier to use with its lights being for crowds, and the heavy does some of the tear. The IV is the reverse, with heavys that can cleave into crowds, with lower damage but decent crowd control, and its lights tear through targets instantly, but attempt to grab and do their tear. They have some MASSIVE damage potential with their blessings too. I do find the attack speed is needed though.
Veteran Shovels flip-stab can one tap crushers. Not just Mutants. Ironically, I prefer the one that doesnt flip though, it has really high attack speed, but doesnt natively one shot crowds. Most people use its Heavys for its crowd control, but with the slightest damage buff, even from its own blessings stacking up, it tears through crowds insanely fast, staggers elites well, and its special stagger is high enough to stop a charging mutant. Less ideal then killing them outright, but having that much stagger means nothing else can really stand through it.
Cleavers. The Mk 3 is far and away the best light and "fluff" killing weapon, but the krouk gives that up for a double stabbing moveset that decimates armor. That might be its niche, but its very strong at it, and its third hits sweep or canceling into a push is good at keeping yourself spaced up. It might not compete with the shield but its a fair competitor to the Bull butcher, just in a very different niche.
The Crusher hits weakspots way harder then people realise, and I very rarely dont highest damage with it. Its base impact light attacks are enough to stagger maniacs and the like, and charging it is generally a bait. Skullcrusher also stacks up to 8 stacks, and the charges hit on a target counts as 2 hits, capping out the +80% damage on its primary target instantly.
Other people have already spoken for the Devil Sword.
attack speed is one of the major factors because there are so many talents and blessings that apply on-hit, so things that are hitting faster are buffing up faster. goes for ranged weapons too. slower attack rate weapons either need superior base stats or superior movesets to be able to keep up
Can't wait for Tanner to make a 4h long video explaining why you are wrong!
well, you only need to see on his placement of MK5 Latrin Shovel and all marks of Clubs to know he is wrong in some.
😁
Erm it's illegal to talk about him in RUclips comments because he doesn't like it.
@@honestbenny The MK5 Latrin Shovel is massively overrated, everyone is just impressed it can 1 shot a Crusher. It's just a worse Thunderhammer and frankly, the starting rigid shovel is way better.
@@sirgaz8699 "worse thunderhammer" oh, sorry, didn't know Ogryns had thunderhammers. Great argument here. Makes sense, after all Ogryn club is just worse Dueling Sword and Cleaver is worse Combat Blade.
My bad.
I won't argue with tier placement, because it's personal preference.
But - you are wrong about skullcrusher blessing. It doesn't add damage to the same hit that triggers it. It works like this - once you stagger something for the next 5 seconds if that thing is hit by anyone and anything, WHILE staggered it will get +xx% damage. If it is hit but not in stagger animation it just gets normal damage. That trait is like a love letter from stagger mechanics built-in VT2, but not nearly as powerful as some may think, and usually more useful to the teammates that can exploit targets you staggered, than to your own damage.
Ah what i meant to say was the bleeds from the first attack. Most enemies bleed out in one hit when ogryn bops them because of this.
Interested to see where the relic blade and force greatsword slot in.
Thank you Mister E!
It's a great list and it inspires me to make some changes in what I use.
Btw I think one of the small chainswords is actually the icon of the missing Evisc. ;)
Youre probably right, i know in my mind theres only two and i placed three in A, little bastard got a free a tier
Eyyyy, A tier! Me and the 3 other Indignatus Crusher mains are making happy noises over here.
The Mark 3 vet shovel would like to have a word. It does its alt attack super fast, it will 2 tap a crusher, it will 1 tap a mutant and while it has less mobility than a knife it will fuck up a horde way faster. It shines brightest when your game assigned oafs are all dead and you aren't doing a stealth breaks the game build
I absolutely agree with you. It does more than decent damage on single targets and is, by my opinion one of the best, if not the best horde clearing weapon in the game. I really don't understand how "well-rounded" can be considered a weakness.
On Vet, Shovel coupled with Voice of Command makes you kinda immune to all non-elites ennemies. I think that horde clearing ability is really overlooked, as if trash ennemies were harmless in the game. Even on higher difficulties, I'm pretty much sure that most of the parties wiping are mostly due to being overwhelmed by basic ennemies and lacking space.
Agreed. The fact also that it staggers everything in front of you means you don't have to dance around as much and can just get to work. Pack of maulers, no problem, they are too busy wondering what just slapped them in the face for them to swing on you. 2 shot crushers with special attack. Great damage/damage reduction ratio. And it's dump stat, defense, in my opinion is an easy choice.
Good to see fellow Mk3 Shovel enjoyers out there. Who needs a fancy sabre or power sword when the shovel beats the everloving snot out of everything in your path, and can take a huge chunk out of single targets as well?
Youre wrong about the tactical axe. Their niche is base speed mobility and crit chance. When you learn the attack pattern and you consistently land all those shots at the speed of light (head or body) you'll slay any enemy including crushers in less than 3-4 seconds, with the added perk of having great cleave and horde clear. It works best on zealot with a max of 4 separate melee attack speed boosts, and crits proccing toughness damage reduction and bleed and more crits, which can total something like a potential 40-50%+ attack speed which is NUTTY considering how many crits you'll be landing. Its a bit more specialised at this and doesn't perform so well at base level compared to say a knife or duelling sword, so I wouldn't put it as high as them but C tier is pure heresy
C tier is for weapons that are made irrelevant by other weapons. The duelling sword is just the same thing they are but better. Every build you might take a tactical on is 100% improved by using dueling sword or maybe knife. Therefore I cannot in good conscience promote them any higher
@@MisterEtide I get that. duelling sword is very good at pretty much everything. but its not better at everything than everything else in every build, this is false no matter how meta the DS is. If I'm running a critical hit build on zealot with crits speeding up cooldowns of my ability and proccing a 50% toughness damage reduction for 4s and applying bleed which in turn grants an even higher crit chance, then the tac axe wins simply based on innate crit chance and weapon attack speed. Afaik the tac axe is the only melee weapon with a built in critical hit modifier which boosts crit chance and crit damage. I can land so many critical hits that my ability can be fully cooled every 5 seconds MAX with the right build. The duelling sword cannot do that under any circumstance. So youre wrong in saying every build is made better by DS or knife.
@@MisterEtide But generally speaking the DS outperforms the tac axe, yes
@@willb1405it literally isn't. Dueling sword is garbage for hordes, mitigated by the fact you can just play defensively.
Tac axe has the same benefits as the dueling sword with better cleave and stagger.
They fill different niches. The knife and dueling sword don't because both are more focused on single target damage and the knife is still one shooting everything the dueling sword can for the most part while being faster and more effective at everything else.
@@coldeed its not the best at hordes but it works fine, and horde clear is never really an issue as theres always gonna be at least 1 player who does cc. fast and efficient single target damage is what matters most which is especially the case in higher difficulties, and dueling sword does this really well
Mostly pretty good.
Except the heavy sword mark 9 is easily the best. Most convenient pattern plus it does the exact same heavy damage as the other two as long as you block cancel the reset.
As an Ogryn main there is one major flaw.
Ogryn Latrine mk5 is S tier. (MK9 is close but has a slightly worse heavy loop)
Special oneshots crushers on any difficulty(and therefor any non-boss in the game)
Without Heavy hitter. So you can use feel to pain
Regular heavies are side horizontal for everything you don't need the special for, great against hordes and anything non heavy basically.
Attackspeed is better than any pickaxe, even karsolas
so you have MUCH better survivability because of the higher attackspeed with procs for toughness gain and bleed stacks. In addition to not needing heavy hitter, and feel no pain making you much tankier again.
I go to tanners channel to raise the blood pressure, and come here to lower the blood pressure.
Wax on, wax off.
Imma be so real, I run Achyls Combat Axe solely because it’s so awesome to turn the blade around and just *thunk* it into the side of a scab’s skull.
I think Mk V Latrine Shovel really should be higher. Very good horde clear with heavy attacks. And can instakill maulers and (I think) crushers with the special if built right. Otherwise, I generally agree with the rest of your takes
18:33 the mark 5 shovel is a monster the heavies will hit everything in front of you over and over while the special mode with thrust will one shot literally everything in the game except bosses
The shock maul is my weapon for if I wanna play and just turn off my brain. It's got pretty good clutch potential because it's so safe and has pretty good stamina.. Of course it's no knife, but knife takes some paying attention. Even the crusher, being so safe, requires some combos, while shock maul is just heavy-light repeat (crowds) or heavy spam (singles) and has a cool stun to help with crushers or warks.
Disagree about the catachan and turtolsky placement. Both easily compete with the axes at the top, they just have different niches. Catachan parry is a lifesaver on aurics
Absolutely agree. Being able to parry a crusher overhead is so sexy and the catachans and heavy swords chew through hordes like nobody's business
I could see the turtles in S, not the IX tho, need more damage
that profilpic...
as a Zealot i actually love the Shock Mauls. Okay one of them, i don't know which is which but one is superior in pretty much everything. Good horder clear with huge cleave and stagger, heavy attack for single targets. It just felt like a really comfortable and well rounded melee
Maybe it fells of hard on harder difficulties but the last time i had this much fun with a melee weapon was the heavy evisc at launch, loved swinging that around, felt meaty
okay it's the Agni Mk Ia. Better cleave, better against carapace, my beloved
nevermind i actually like the other one too
I do really love the catachan knives in particular, they just feel great to use. They are insane though, especially having such high base crit without having to use a stat for it like other crit focused weapons do.
How are we supposed to tell what the weapon is from that infograph?
Good tier list. Don't agree with everything, but that's personal preference mostly. I'd shoutout the crusher and agni shock maul because I just find them fun to use, but no doubt I get more done using the Power Dueling sword and Thunder Knives
I wish the Catachan swords were just a little bit better because I love the parry mechanic. It's such a satisfying way to take out some of the melee elites.
Great video!
I'll make a case for the MKXV Evis: A martyrdom crit build turns this thing into a beast. Granted, you have to nerf yourself by taking wound curious and being low health, but once you're good at dodging, you're not taking damage anyway. Spam light attacks and everything dies. Not as good as dueling sword, but a fun alternative if you like to ride the lightning.
best part of the shield is if you spec for stamina you can practically block forever, making you basically invinsible and combined with rage it means you can have a horde basically become useless
Holy shit that sound effect replacing the names of the OP weapons was so fucking funny.
Got me
EVERY
SINGLE
TIME
😂
Menacing tier, aka "don't get attached one of those day Fatshark will successfully balance them"
I find that special attacks (tazer) on the shock maul melts void shields
Me a dwarf from DRG getting the delvers pickaxe: "I am quite literally the happiest man alive."
A note on the chainswords revv attack, at least for the Mk13:
A light revv attack does good damage.
A Heavy revv attack does massive damage, on my current maxed out mk 13 chainsword it's 1300+ damage, add the bleed to it as well since you're supposed to use the Bloodletter blessing on it.
Also put a Cleave blessing on it (I prefer wrath).
The Mk4 has easier use due to the attack pattern, yes, so to remedy that for the Mk13 you zig-zag the mouse when swinging. Single turn or back and forth.
If you do it with a zealot that has momentum activated and/ or just used Fury of the Faithful charge you can even zig-zag into multiple hits on a single target and you get this unique crunch sound as they perish.
Zig-zag lets you hit 5 or more enemies, as many as 7 or 8 in a horde and gives some stagger. So you can mow a horde like that and it's fast cleari g and really high dps.
You can even do it with a group of ragers in an emergency but you'll take a lot of damage from it.
The zig-zag can be used with other weapons as well of course. Like the Borovian pickaxe for Ogryns. That changes it from mostly single/dual target from the diagonal standard attack to become a horde clearer.
I'm not saying to change the tiers for these, you put tem where they should be, just that there are ways to get more out of these weapons (and maybe some others too).
Using them this way means an output closer to a tier higher and not all players know about this.
Another thing the Borovian pickaxe can do is you can push monstrosities off balance, at least the chaos spawn. It recovers quickly but it gives you valuable seconds to land free hits and reset it's attack pattern.
It is the future, melee combat is more brutal than ever, between Power maces, chain swords, Force blades and more.
Which is why its kinda funny that an infantrymans knife, something so simple is on par for being one of the best melee weapons
why does no one ever talk about the Karsolas overhead? a pull into a heavy gets a crusher really low if not one shotting them and knocks them flat, and the heavy attacks on it sweep through heavy hordes like butter, personally i dont care if its overkill it hits fast and hard and it makes me feel so good when I can dome a charging mutie before he can touch me
Karsolas is the one i gave S tho?
Haven't played in months. Glad to hear some of the changes. (Crucis!)
The buffed the devil claws parry. Which was already able to parry monstrosities and crushers. It can now parry all sources of damage for a larger window. It’s def at least a tier.
The fact that I can build a good build with it and kill crushers in pretty fast rate while not worrying about taking damage
But the best aspect of the force swords is infinite dodging basically. The force sword due to that, with its jabs with the right blessing I can kill crushers in a second or two or at least stagger them reliably as a psyker.
Infinite dodges with the force sword is gone if you meant it like that. The devs thought it was unhealthy for the game(I miss it anyway)
I think the idea of blocking is cool in this game but it needs to do something really special if you land it, i just dont feel that from d claws. If you can dodge, you also take no damage, and can deal damage during that time. In fact dodging gives zealots and vets some pretty huge buffs, so blocking instead will have you missing out on those, which is a big nono for damage.
@@amurtiger3555 no I know. Thats why I said basically. I rarely hit a point where I’m out.
@@MisterEtide I’d have to double check the stats and I haven’t ran the sword since the update came out but considering all damage modifiers are applied to parry and, I believe it’s a crit damage wise, it can do some pretty great damage. Good mobility, good swing pattern, mid starting damage but superior survivability for when you are in a pit with 5 crushers or you have a bunch of ragers
It’s not s tier but I feel it’s low A for sure due to guranteed I-frames
Ive never considered chosing my weapons carefully because its always decided based on the simplicity of the combos lmao. If i can do 3 vanguards in a row i always value that over 2 vanguards then a strike.
I wasn't sure which dueling sword was which, but yeah you put the one I was drawn to in top tier, I was drawn to it because of the poke-only combo.
8:10 I love leaving a melon-sized hole in a poor heretic that tried to rush me. Never stops being funny, even after the 40000'th time
That's very helpful. Sometimes I like to play the crappier weapons of lvl 4 though :)
Crits are in lower demand for Zealot now. When Invocation of Death gave a 1.5s cooldown reduction per crit, you wanted every attack to crit for rapid chain dashes and toughness returns. Now, as long as you get one crit every 4 seconds, your skill tree won’t suffer. Just using Scourge and Blazing Piety can cover toughness and cooldown reduction. Knives are still viable, but I prefer the Dueling Sword with Agile and Uncanny Strike.
On the knife, I used to run Riposte and Flesh Tearer, but Flesh Tearer's +8 bleed stacks felt redundant since max bleed caps at 16 stacks, making a faster stacking speed negligible. Instead, I use Lacerate for more bleed on non-weak spot hits, which can help activate Scourge sooner on the odd chance you don't crit on the first few hits
Currently, Uncanny Strike with Riposte is solid. Bleed does little against heavily armored enemies, so rending helps more against maulers and armored ragers. Rending also lets you stagger these enemies, reducing the risk of taking hits.
The Latrine Mk V shovel for Ogryn isn’t just "B tier"-it stands out. Its heavy attacks follow a left-right sweep pattern, ideal for Ogryn since it consistently hits weak spots on every swing, effectively decapitating enemies in a row.
To make the most of it, take Brutal Momentum, which adds extra weak spot damage and lets kills ignore enemy hit mass, enabling this shovel to cleave through hordes as well as (or better than) knives. For secondary perks, Confident Strike is great for toughness regen, though some prefer Thrust for one-shotting Crushers (though Crushers often already have some damage by the time you reach them meaning i 1 shot them most of the time anyway in game).
The shovel’s alternate attack is excellent for single-targets: one "charged" light attack can take down mutants instantly, and two "charged" heavy attacks are enough for Crushers. (or one charged heavy with a slow build that i hate playing even tho it looks cool)
for ogryn cleavers, the Mk Vi has the better attack pattern kind of? well maybe slightly worse for light attacks but a better attack pattern for heavy attack, but they are vanguards and well, HONESTLY the shovel i mentioned up above is just simply better for heavy attacking the hoard, i switched from the Mk VI to shovel as soon as it came out because of this
The Psyker force swords have some powerful builds. The Deimos Mk4 can deal significant damage to Crushers with the right setup. Charged attacks hit weak spots rapidly, stacking buffs, and a single light jab followed by a heavy jab to a Crusher's face guarantees a kill.
The Illisius is unique-its charged crits always hit weak spots, so it performs well in a high-crit build.
The Obscurus is a balanced option with a nice attack pattern. It may ignore hit mass on charged attacks if it strikes a smaller enemy first, though I may be mixing up features. Overall, all force swords are impressive with the right build.
it has been a while since i researched these swords so i may be mixing up some informatoin, for the obsurus or illisis, maybe look it up instead of taking my word for it on thoes
Mr E
I pray to thee
Give to me
This tanner, REEE
I think all the bendy shovels are B but I think the rigid shovels are actually A. It's the "it has a special attack so we have to remove power from elsewhere" but the rigid shovels just blat everything.
Me: *sees ogryn join game using shield* "Yay!"
*sees ogryn begin wildly swinging attached club* "Oh no."
id argue the ironhelm thunderhammer has one advantage, it can charge and vanguard strike so it really cuts through hordes if u want it too, but the attack pattern is overall worse though
I'm a big proponent of the Brute-brainer shovels. I can make a Heavy Hitter or FNP build that one shots crushers with the bendy feature and if you use the MK IV, the horde clear attacks are side to side heavy attacks so you get a ton of mileage out of talents that make use of heavy attacks. You can one shot anything crusher and below and you have your heavy, side to side horde clear attack that also makes use of heavy attack talents. I don't see this as having any holes and it's far sight more wieldy than some of the other heavier weapons.
@20:53, i think i’m using the wrong mark of dueling sword cuz that’s exactly what it does, and doesn’t perform the way i see other players on stream using it for easy fights…..
Thanks for clarifying that! I’ll switch to the Mark IV. I’ll also give the Antax a try.
I’m trying to get mastery in many weapons as it gives me something to progress towards other than difficulty.
Yeah you want the fast chain stabs, no silly waving it around or useless sweeps. Antax is pretty goated, and its my recommendation to every newer player for its simplicity and power
Both shovels for ogryn and vet are capable to oneshot crushers on damnation with their weapon special + thrust blessing
MK3 Eviserator is minimum A tier if power sword is. Great damage, and cleave, plus blessing for large amounts of shield (can't think of name right now) back on hits of 3 enemies or more. It also has a brain dead combo of block+push+light which does a perfect horizontal hit every time and kills entire crowds of walkers. For crushers and below the special attack stuns so good for less confident players as well. Special one shots most lower tier special infected.
Also S tier as you can do a proper Sisters of Battle repentia character with it 😊
Great video!
Well i accidentally dropped it in A tier so i guess my brain subconsciously thought so too :) i just feel like its so clunky to do that combo for sweeps when we have thunderhammer doing the same sweeps on chained heavy. But thats totally up to the user preference!
@@MisterEtide This is very fair! I hope you have a great day :)
Deflector use to be busted because passive quell use to work with kinetic deflection. Obese fish nerfed it so you can't lose peril while blocking with it.
Chain axe has really good light attack stagger. The only issue is learning to overcome the sticky lights on poxxers since it it takes 2 ticks to kill from full hp.
make sure to lock your doors at night, there are so many hardcore shovel glazers out there that freak the fuck out if anyone says they are anything less than the best in the game
MK5 Latrin Shovel it's not best weapon in the game... but for sure it's better than Clubs now. Club was mainly taken before for 2-shotting Crushers with heavy attacks. Now MK5 shovel can one-shot them.
It's not really hard to understand why most Ogryn players switched Club to Shovel. Also Ogrynomicon explains why they are now better than Clubs.
@@honestbenny i was talking about the normal shovel. most orgyns i see are all about the pickaxe or shield. but i wouldnt know personally, i dont have any interest in playing the ogryn, mine is still like level 8
@honestbenny the ogrynomicon is a terrible guide tbh and using it as a source makes your argument sound weaker
@@TannerLindbergare you saying clubs are better than shovel or are you just taking this opportunity to shit on the hard work the creators of Ogrynomicon put in because you have a slightly different opinion on a few things in it?
@@TannerLindberg I've seen this said by a few but never heard it explained what exactly it gets wrong, any chance of one of your indepth, calm reviews? ;D
You can pump the old chain axe up to A tier. Also move the ogryn power maul down to C.
I really like Deimos as alternative to Duel4 with Gunker. Deimos still shreds hordes with lights and poke elites with H2 in Scriers Gaze.
I think Devil's Claw is actually great mainly bacause of its special. What hold's it back for me is the mobility. If it had the same mobility as rapier it would be amazing. Anyway I would't call it beginner weapon at all.
Dueling sword MkIV is simply too strong when jabbing everything in the face. I use it on Zealot and basically never die now.
Yea it really is broken, does such insane damage with perfect accuracy, plus the special attack can stun crushers if u hit their head
I been using the shock maul on my veteran so much since the last update hella fun and can actually kill crushers
since I wana use the double barrel with it it’s a big plus (power sword is so stiff)
Maybe shock mauls not so powerful but its very fun and versatile to use, its like chainsword but with better crowd control
@@anotherage8758 shock mauls ARE powerful, you can delete any enemy with heavy overheads (not sure which mark but either one or both) including armour. when you get the attack pattern locked in it is nutty powerful
@@willb1405 I have some problems against carapace armor with Mauls
@@anotherage8758 cant remember which one i used but I used a shock maul on my vet and it absolutely destroyed crushers and maulers. you just need to learn the swing patterns and how to always swing into heavy overheads every second swing. it should be heavy overhead into a light overhead and repeat.
I just wish the devil's claws just need a shred more power attack vs carapace, just that tiny bit esp with the absurd dueling sword. I find it totally funny running into a group of ragers with a devil's claw and rofl killing them with the parry. But you MUST parry such high danger enemies of mauler or crusher to get any value out of it at that level. The risk profile is screwed. Esp when you are walking into a group of crushers, too dangerous to parry. - So much of my frustration with these weapons are held back by specials allegedly increasing the power. The tradeoffs don't feel real and so many special attacks don't feel useful. Even the deimos sword is better off just strong attacking over and over instead of using the activation. And the Illisi feels...bad. Fussing around with it in the meat grinder it felt like it tickled things and those windows as you said to activate are few and far between when you are really in the thick of it. IT felt better to just strong attack rather than activate even with prep time.
At least the Illisi doesn't attach you to an enemy for an animation if you want the damage, but let me activate it with cool animation cancels, THAT'D be cool. Let me build all the peril in the world while being a lawnmower. I know they don't want it to just be a psyker powersword, but I think that identity can be held together by just never giving us a power cycler, just make the charge animation faster (or even make it a perk, I'll take that.)
In practice my experience with the blazeswords is just having some basic utility to range push things, including crushers if you point at their face. The power budget into the warp activation part feels really pointless when I can just take the standard crowd killing blessings and do fine.
i like the heavy eviscerator so much. it just really fuels the zealot power fantasy for me. but you kinda wanna play it with the wound stacking build (which is just a waste of points) or otherwise the attack speed feels SO bad
I'm kinda the opposite of you with my club taste. The light attacks on the mkII club and when you set it up with thunderous/skullcrusher and momentum you become indestructible around hordes.
The opener heavy has good and accessible control. This makes your flow normally heavy into light or shove into light, stagger and bleed out your enemies while gaining like one fourth of toughness on any given attack. Then for more leathality you heavy light light heavy to build up the other recommended blessing of thunderous or skull crusher with momentum.
If all the actives were just on/off toggles, they would be so much more usable. Only the power sword would need a tweak to stay balanced. The others already have significant downsides that mean no one should be running them full time.
I can't tell what's a bit between these two anymore, I'm scared to take any actual advice in this community
Tanner agreed with my D tier pick so you can bank on that one
Shocked pikachu face as I watch the ending of this as a force sword using gunker
The force sword, my beloved. Nothing compares.
Pure heresy on saying it isn't the weapon for scriers and is mainly for spreading soulblaze lol
So im coming back to Darktide since the update and I have a question. Looking at the new masteries and brunts armoury there is only one weapon listed where there was previously multiple variants. So if i buy a blaze sword do i get IV or IX, or is it just random? Do the variants even exist anymore?
Variants/marks are at the top right of the inventory page when you have the weapon selected. So if you buy one force sword you have all three variants and can change it at any time
branx has a sweep combo (push+heavy+light and then you spam heavy+light all the time)
I mainly use shovels, so seeing it ranked in the B tier hurts me. It's really, really good for me-especially when you can one-shot Mutie. That’s a win.
I *think* there might have been a mix up between the Mk VI and IX Heavy Swords. Mk IX is definitely the go-to for its attack pattern and utility. Incredibly easy to mow through hordes with its sweeping heavy attacks, but you can charge towards Elites/Specialists and get in a heavy vertical chop for an easy decapitation.
When it comes to Ogryns and Monstrosities though... probably best to use a good sidearm or bolter 😅
The mark 2 bullyclub has one special funny move that no other club can do. You do the special slap and buffer an attack. You'll punch. It's very silly and funny and has a great CLONK noise.
I kinda like Devil's claw a lot. I see telopots running it a lot as well.
Tis fiiine, i just find myself thinking… why am i not using duelling sword?
@@MisterEtide haha fair enough :)
I really like the Mark II Duel sword. The heavy Poke has the same dmg like the mark 4 and u also got a sweap for more enemies on top.
I personally cannot stand having to block cancel or use weapon special to get back to the stabs, which is the attack i actually want. The light attacks kill horde enemies in one hit to the head as zealot, so more clear isnt necessary for me. I do however need MORE STABS to deal with the pack of 6 crushers trying to smack me up
Didn't expect Rimworld music in a Darktide video...
Want to preface this by saying this was very informative and helpful. And i learned alot here. And its natural to disagree on tier lists, thats just how it works. But still, i wanted to add my five cents.
Devil's Claw B tier? Maybe im just bad, but i seriously cannot play a vet without them. With right blessings, they absolutely mow down hordes of any type with no issue. And if you're feeling like you're stuck in a bad spot, you just parry to win. The parry wins so many situations, even on auric, where you would have to sweat otherwise. I dont win games if i dont take devil's claw, its honestly a crutch sometimes. You almost never use their heavy attack, unless you're trying to catch a charger. If you want something dead with it, you parry, they simply kill themselves against you like you're an adamantine cactus or something.
Ofcourse i dont use them on Zealot. Zealot can make many other weapons shine where other classes cant, so its a waste otherwise. Its my go to Veteran sword, because i focus on ranged mostly, and then i pull it out when going gets tough and it pulls me out of anything very consistantly. I survived encirclements that would kill me otherwise. The only thing it wont save me against is crusher and mauler overheads, but its a very specific weakness that you can see coming from a mile.
And when you cant pull aggro to activate the parry, you stil have the awesome ability to delete a horde given you have the cleave blessing.
12:24
Bro, I've done the same thing LMAO
It's funny cuz at first I used the knife, then I got bored, so I thought the axe was the perfect candidate, then the update rolled out and now I'm using the sword.
I just went full circle and back with the same issue of using the same weapons.
I argue that Devils Claw swords are minimum A-tier. The parry will chew through armor and ragers
I just wish I actually enjoyed using the knife...
Lots of good advice and tips in this vid. I kinda wish you had broken them up by class since that dictates a lot of context in the utility of weapons.
Bro... you are underrating the shovels. The bonk alone brings it to S tier!
People really love the shovels! They just dont click for me, i think i trend away from weapons that need to be activated to do a thing. Just gimme a straight up piece of metal like the rashad anyday
Subbed, didn’t know why I wasn’t.
Force swords block and push animations feels like forever.
But they COOL
18:30 "they dont have any damage, they cant armor pen, they're not exceptional at anything"
i've been using a Mk III shovel on my Veteran for nearly 68 hrs now. Its alt-mode can 1-shot every single enemy in the entire game (besides bosses of course) and thats WITHOUT any of my build stacks. WITH my build stacks, i can basically delete any enemy from the game files for looking at me funny. I've quite literally chunked 30-45% of a damonhosts health with a crit-headshot on a fully charged heavy attack and got the kill for it.
Does everyone know this, and im just the greenhorn that got used to the shovels jank? I'm literally still using this thing on Auric and have yet to be given a reason to switch off.
I think the dueling sword and knives are fine, they are obscenely strong yes, but they seem so incredible lame. I have 2400+ hours in the game and I would never consider running the knives or the dueling swords, I’d rather play the uninstaller if I’m being honest. Additionally you might want to give the crusher another look on zealot, it has the highest skill ceiling in the game, but it is objectively the best weapon in the game. The crusher has a hidden finesse stat on the push attack that is honestly disgustingly strong. The crusher’s charged heavy attack can stun lock something like a row of 8 crusher enemies the light heavy or heavy light combo relative to id you want single or cleave dmg is just fantastic once you get used to it, and the crusher sends enemies spashing all over the place so you can run the skill tree node that gives 20% cooldown reduction on backstab kill and it will proc all the time because you will be killing mo s in the back while they are standing up. But again it is a high skill cap weapon, for example the push attack being cracked strong makes running triple +3 stam curios good on it, but that means less defensive stats.
I feel like we need free blessing testing mechanics in psychanium. U can use mods to spawn a mixed horde in there.. And some things that earned a weapon lower place I think could be solved with proper blessings (I'm not sure as I don't remember all o them)
is that Rimworld music in background? :D :D :D
Small Schock Mauls i´ve leveled first, the Special Attack staggers anything but Bosses.
AND HERE WE GO
The chainswords are my 2nd favorite weapons thematically but man the Rev up just doesn't feel good on auric. It's just too slow and then locks you down too much. When there's only a couple elites it's great, but when there's lots of elites they just can't keep up with the action economy
Wait I've been using the *bad* heavy sword? 😢
3:53 behold the fabulous custodes!
tanner gonna be eating good tonight
Mk 2 dueling sword I just do heavy -> special -> heavy special, which is often what I do on the mk4 anyway to stagger ragers/maulers/crushers. But I agree I prefer the mk 2 because you have the option to just to repeated heavies. The mk 5 is useless by comparison