We had a 1st gen Echo in our master bathroom for listening to music in the morning ruclips.net/user/postUgkxABghAEkaIDGZfHRBH3D3rBrlraNmnC71 and while in the shower. I didn't realize how tinny and awful the sound output on the original Echo was until we replaced it with the Studio. It was a sonic upgrade far beyond what I was expecting. Just wow. I love it because it's like having speakers IN the shower. My friend likes it because the music is so loud that she can no longer hear me singing. So that's a win-win.
I wouldn’t normally by audio equipment without listening to it in person. Unfortunately the web and superstores have done away with the old Hi-Fi stores making it difficult to locate and listen to most new additions to my system. Thanks for an accurate description of these wonderful little speakers in this video. It helped me to make a decision and I was not disappointed. I love how bright and balanced they are and appreciate the info.
This speaker has low sensitivity because otherwise the "horn" would overpower the single small woofer. The much larger HDI 3800 with tripple 8's has a real world sensitivity of 92db !
Dammit Steve, I just love your videos. You always have positive things to say about audio equipment and you bring a ton of joy and enthusiasm to this great hobby!
I wish there was an audio store like a ski rental store where you could go up to a counter and demo speaker sets at home and bring them back, also amps , etc
@@RasheedKhan-he6xx It is an interesting business model to explore. A costco membership type thing might be one part of it. It might require sending techs out to install and remove items. Insurance would be hell.
Hi Steve on looks alone they would sell well to me they certainly have got that wow factor, and from your review they back it up with the sound quality. Great review as usual 👍
I'm auditioned these and mated its a Schiit Gungnir and Raganok 2 is magic. Really dynamic and vividly true to my expectations. I bought them. I am impressed with the bass this speaker puts out. Clean, dynamic. I am satisfied. They might nudge out my Dyneaudio Evoke 20s.
This video is a few years old but was curious which speaker you preferred...the JBL or the Evokes? Have you moved on to something else by now? Thanks for any insight you can share
@@NosEL34 Wow, boy have I moved on. Several speakers from those. I still think the JBL is an excellent speaker from my memory but then I actually dont remember it. The Evoke 20s turned out to be too dull and lazy for my taste. Since then. I have owned Proac Respone 1SC , Zu DWX both of which were excelent. My current speaker is outstanding a Cabasse Murano. I briefly had Totem Signature one speakers but way too bright and fatiguing for me.
To a first order approximation, you can think of a waveguide as a special class of horns. Both provide acoustic gain by confining the driver’s dispersion to a much narrower range than it would otherwise have. Classical horns tend to have rather narrow coverage angle and high gain (10-12 dB is not uncommon.). They also, if well designed, can have fairly flat on-axis frequency response. However, their dispersion narrows with increasing frequency. They also tend to be fairly long, making phase response of the complete speaker difficult to optimize. Waveguides are usually designed for constant directivity, meaning that directivity is independent of frequency. They usually have wider directivity than classical horns and are shorter, so they have less gain (circa 6dB or so). They don’t tend to load the driver to low frequencies as well as a horn does, and they roll off high frequencies. They require a more complex crossover with equalization to address these issues. There are some payoffs, though. The constant directivity tends to sound more natural in most rooms, because the frequency response of reflected sound is close to that of direct sound. Since they are relatively short, it is easier to align the phase with low frequency drivers without resorting to electronic delay. If designed well, they also suffer less from mouth reflections which cause blurred transients in the lower end of their operating range than most horns do.
Things I like about this review: Good expression of values, a playlist I can get from my streamer, and your effort to mix it up with different peripherals. All subjective stuff, but accurate and comparative. Kudos. This is one big reason why I respect my streaming capability. I can hear your playlist, or pick up on something that catches my interest from many places, and most often find it in CD or better quality to play in the living room playback equipment. Yeah, I have a bunch of CD's and a ton (literally) of vinyl, but all that is really ponderous when I want to hear a song or an album I pick up on your channel or other places -- with little sacrifice in source quality. And I don't have to buy a whole CD to experience what you or others are talking about.
The whole 5 series line when on sale is just stupid value. I have 4 530s and 2 580s and waiting for the 590s to go back on sale. I have a dedicated media room / theater and they are seriously awesome. I do find the 580s are a woolley different sound, far more open, articulate and of course powerfull. But it's like the 530s are held back compared to the 580s.
Steve ! I been waiting for someone to review these i mean i reviewed the JBL studio 530 and they dont sound like a horn either but i know the HDI series are another level up 😃 thanks Steve ! Hopefully one day I can get these into the channel 😃JBL likes power !!!!
Wave Guide expands as it goes further , horn is essentially one angle , it gets wider of course but angel stays the same , so if you have an increasing angle you get directivity but not the horn ringing , sounds open . That is what they put on studio monitors . Its a best way to do it , best compromise .
@@chrisj9008 All waveguides are horns, but not all horns are waveguides. They're just called waveguides because the manufacturer is more focused on the pattern control behavior of the horn as opposed to the SPL/efficiency increase the horn provides.
I think items were shown for longer periods than usual. This makes the visual element more interesting. 👍 Request: Have you any experience with room tuning systems?
I had a demo 2 weeks ago with the klipsch rp600m and these ones. The klipsch is more fun to listen to. BUT this one has more bass, detail and air between instruments. But the soundstage was better on the klipsch. Preferred the klipsch over these.
The real reason for the waveguide is time alignment of the tweeter. We can achieve efficiency and dispersion without a big plastic thing around the tweeter. It’s just a great excuse to set the tweeter back into the baffle. This is probably the cause of the clean precise sound described. I’m all for it
Cujobob Of course, not as well. But well enough for the average buyers living room. I’m sure directivity control was a factor in choosing that HF design for this speaker. I just can’t see it being the primary reason. I think they probably wanted to set back the tweeter, and have it crossed over low while being robust with a high output and power handling, so they could use a heavier duty woofer without losing upper midrange detail. This would also explain the low sensitivity and high output performance described in the review
@@KingOath No, it's all about the waveguide. That waveguide has been a key component for JBL across many of their lines. The waveguide's directivity control and characteristics are THE reason, not to physically set the driver back. Over the past several years, JBL has poured significant R&D effort into this waveguide. The strongly successful M2 Studio/Mastering monitor brought this image control waveguide into the scene. Since then, JBL has adopted more advanced versions of it top to bottom across many of their offerings. It's safe to say no loudspeaker manufacturer has spent more time, effort, and money on better pyscho-acoustic understanding on which directions to pursue. They've been developing many new technologies at Northridge (such as this Image Control Waveguide), then incorporating them into products. They've been on a roll as of late.
@@FOH3663 Wow, great post, thanks! So are you saying that they are kind of using the directivity control as a way to enhance the perception of soundstage and imaging rather than just for basic “frequency spread” as it would be used in a PA speaker?
JBLs tend to do dynamics very well. Not surprised they outdid the KEFs in that area. But I wonder how the KEF LS50 Wireless IIs would compare (once broken in), with their 155 watts per channel built in.
The ls 40 is a 3 way isn't it? To me, this looks like an upgrade of the hls 610 jbl made in the late 90s. For a mass-market box store speaker, the 610 sounds pretty pretty pretty good
Only thing to keep in mind when moving a narrow baffle speaker away from the wall or corner is that you will loose up to 3dB of lows and mids when moving away from a wall and up to 6dB of lows and mids if moving from a corner. Narrow baffle speakers like bookshelves and towers have a really high corner frequency. So, 1kHz and under just get thrown everywhere, 360 degrees. So, moving the speakers around or adding acoustic panels (I recommend 4" thick 703 or mineral wool) behind and around the speakers will change the sound dramatically usually for the better, but it depends on the speaker, room, and preference. 4" panels absorb down to 125Hz very well and one panel is as efficient as 2 if it is open backed and there is an air gap between the acoustic panel and the wall. People including you forget about acoustics. You can transform your sound with a few 4" thick panels placed well.
Glad to see JBL coming back to prominence. The midrange of the KEF will be more coherent because of the concentric, time aligned, arrangement. Now someone needs to bring back Fisher, the good Fisher days. You know, tubes. A friend used to provide parts for Avery Fisher. He always bought the best.
I like the brand which sells the whole set, center, bookshelf, surrounds, atmos etc. So far elac has me satisfied. Having yamaha paired to Elac has made the sound even better.
Sounds like a system I'd recommend. Denon goes well with elac too IMO. Klipsch would be quite a bit different than the Elac if you're in the mood for something with more kahoonies.
@@kohnfutner9637, nope Denon & Elac doesn't sound good. You need a reciever that can really push some quality watts into these power hubgry speaker & Yamaha seems to be better than Denon. Plus with Denon the speakers sounded thin and lifeless, yamaha just bring a life to them.
@@techocrazy I liked the elac with the Yamaha as well. To me they sounded to be lacking some top end extension but the bass was good. I didn't think the Yamaha made the elac ub5 come to life but I thought it did make them sound more natural and smooth with better bass because Yamaha has a tendency to set every speaker to large, whereas the Denon has a tendency to set everything to small. I've seen my Denon set the elac ub5 as high as 120 and as low as 60, while the speakers have not moved. The Denon often reads the elac as wired wrong, so I guess it thinks the speakers are out of phase. But imo I thought the Denon brought the elac to life more because it brought out the treble. I liked them both but I think there's probably a better combination with elac than Denon or Yamaha. Neither one really seemed to be what I preferred because I liked mixed bits of what both could do. Ideally, I think the Yamaha is too laid back because the elac are laid back too and the Denon is too up front (sounds to favor a v-shape equalizer with audyssey32). Neither one were a great match imo. I thought they were ok matches but nothing spectacular. I would see what Steve Guttenberg recommended.
Have you ever tested speakers/audio equipment with the jazz group Flim & The BB's? If not, you're missing out. These recordings were processed with full digital DMP production. You'd be hard pressed to find a higher quality recording anywhere. Amazing clarity and sound.
It's not the compression driver that's not super efficient, by designed compression drivers generally are. Rather that crossover dampens that horn to not outrun the smaller woofer. Jbl also does standard efficient testing to the standard. Klipsh and has does not by comparison factoring room gain and other things. Waveguides are tricky and take some engineering to work well. Jbl also still holds most of the patterns or something (or until recently) and many companies for a variety of those reasons stayed away.
You need to get over to the Harman store and listen to the new 4349 monitors (replacement of the 4429 that you liked) and let us know if they’re worth the $2500 price increase!
@Concorde 0 it’ll have to be on the used market...I contacted a JBL rep a few weeks ago and he told me the 4429s are no longer available. Harman store in New York had their demo pair for sale, but not sure if it’s been sold. Really curious to see if the larger cabinet and change in waveguide makes the speaker that much ($2500 increase!) better.
Any JBL audiophiles out there who would possible know the model of JBL "tower" speaker circa 1986. My best description as I remember them are: Approx 40" plus inches tall, it had (2) 8" woofers, 2 medium range woofers & 1 tweeter (All vertical in-line). The top had a removable piece of smoked glass and it also came with a small brass like plaque that you stick on a foot like stand. I call the stand a foot because it stuck out a few inches in front for stability (I guess). It didn't raise the height of the speakers more than an inch or 2. So it was kind of like a foot or a shoe maybe you screwed into the bottom. I bought them overseas, and left them at a friends house. When I got back. He was gone and the house was in foreclosure.
How do you measure SPL in the room? I also agree with another poster. I've never heard a reviewer say a speaker sounds like crap with the exception of Yamaha NS10's :) If everything sounds great what doesn't?
Dear Steve, may I kindly ask? Judging from memory, how would you compare these JBL HDI 1600 to KEF R3 please? Thank you very much in advance for your reply.
I think this series is more of a dual purpose two channel stereo and Home Theater type speaker system aimed more towards Home Theater. I would love to upgrade my JBL 500 series to the HDI but you're looking at 8 grand for the entire series for Home Theater. Way too expensive when the 500 series is amazing in it's own right. Maybe in time, they will move them to the JBL website and do their peek a boo sales half off strategy. Then I'll buy right away...
@@kirkcunningham6146 been playing with more toe angle so they cross infront and my god... New day records was talking about it In a waveguide video... my 580s and 530s do sound better this way and more consistent across the seats of my media room..
Hi Steve, this might be a bit off topic, but have you ever done a series where people combine pro audio and home audio together and with what kind of results? If you did a series can you point me to the right one I scrolled through your catalog but couldn't find anything thanks again keep up the great work, Pete from Cleveland
Horn or no horn.. good breakdown. What is it ?? It's JBL speakers (New) I love JBL I'm impartial to companies that have been around. If the sound is there 1800$ isn't bad. It's all about sound! These will sell themselves I'm sure. 👍😎
A waveguide alters the directivity of a transducer, so it helps ensure the tweeter has the right dispersion and doesn't beam. A horn helps correct for the huge impedance mismatch between the relatively massy speaker diaphragm and the much lighter air it's trying to push, thus improving power transfer and efficiency. They may look similar, but they're doing very different jobs.
It would be really interesting if the gentleman we know as Steve Guttenberg should review a rather affordable, horn loaded / "waveguided", bookshelf speaker like the JBL Studio 630... God bless you, Steve!
Jon at Chane Cinema and Music has the new 700 series releasing, I have three of the 753 towers coming, there’s also a LCR one the 752 that uses an Italian compression driver and two 8” Scanspeak drivers, you should contact him to get a pair to review.
I don't understand why "if you want to hear the rumble, you'll have to add a sub-woofer"?????!!!! WHAT??? That means the bass response below 50 Hz is poor! My Dynaco A25s don't need any extras to get very smoothly down to 30 Hz and the cabinet size is not that big. Why can't they make modern speakers with 10" woofers that can produce a reasonably flat response from 30 Hz to 15 KHz for an affordable price???? I realize the Dynacos would cost about $600 each today (with inflation) but at least they produce incredibly smooth, deep bass well below 50 Hz and require no extras to get there.
Your comments do not show that you have tried subwoofers with those Dynacos, nor disprove that they would sound better with them. Please try and report here.
Maybe jbl will do a big blowout on the bdi series like they have with the studio series, which are great. Especially if they don't sell at full price because of the kef meta. Not saying it won't take 5, 6 or 7 years but I could see it going on special within a year or two. Let's face reality, most people are probably going to get the meta, hugely because of the price being less and the hype/fame being much higher
Hi Steve, another great review, just happened to be watching the octopus video last night with the kids, spook coincidence. Have you tried Anthony and the Johnsons (eponymous album for a start) Keep it up! cheers Steve
JBL, once again, doesn't stick the landing with the HDI series (seems to be their U.S. followup to the popular Studio 5's - which has the same issues as I will mention - as they have not brought the Studio 6's to these shores). They don't have a matching overhead or wall mount surround speaker to round out the model line for Dolby Atmos or DTS: X sound systems. They even failed to put a mounting bracket attachment point on the 1600, so you could use it as an on-wall surround! At the last in-person CEDIA in Denver, I brought these issues up at the JBL booth and they pointed me toward using their high end Synthesis in-wall's/in-ceiling's. Yeah, I'm going to spend two to three times the amount for surrounds than the front mains! Not in this lifetime.
Ive always liked JBL Control ONE, still used as my main desktop speakers. The HDI's look like they justify the price tag too but bookshelf units shouldnt go past $1000 a pair IMHO.
Hi,Steve, I like your channel and musical taste, speaking of the JBL speaker, do you ever heard an company in Japan name Kendrick sound? They reform the old JBL speakers into fantastic speakers, do you have any suggestions about that? I’m totally fascinated to the open and lively sound they produced, can you comment on that ? Thank you so much 😁
I LOVE JBL LOUD SPEAKERS IN THE OLD DAYS ALL WAS TESTING .THE BEST i HEARD IS THE ELTEC LANCING # 9 i GOT THESE AFTER BLOWING UP THE BOSE 901 COULD NOT GET IN USA I GOT THEM OVER SEAS.NEED TO CHECK THESE OUT.
To be honest, it's hard to find a speaker that is just crap. I have found speakers that I don't like but for the most part, you have to go to HTIB gear to get garbage.
@@jeffadams9699 I agree plus the dude's been in the industry long enough to pick and choose which gear he's going to sign off on and do a review with. It's not like he's going to intentionally choose a crappy brand.
Generally across the board speakers are very high quality these days. It is getting harder and harder to find a bad speaker. Even $50-100 a pair speakers sound very good for the price and just get better and better going higher and higher. Back in the 1980s or early 1990s there were plenty of bad cheap speakers to go around but that really isn’t the case anymore.
Clean, clean, clean sounds like it can't play bass. I would personally never settle with less than the new l100 classic model, that is a pretty good speaker for the price.
Real HIFI Help the specs say 40Hz - 30Khz. That's very good for a bookshelf speaker, very few songs have parts that go below 40Hz. Unless you mainly listen to drum & bass or big classical orchestra music that can get down to 20Hz then your fine.
@@C--A First of all to get a proper bass extension, then the 2 way speaker needs to be close to the floor to get a proper amplification of the bass, or else the room will suck out that sound being to high and having such a small cabinet. That is why the bigger jbl is much better: bigger, better parts and much closer to the ground. (ground coverage gives like 2x more effect of proper bass) Almost everything in the world ending at around 40hz is really really bad, because that means it does not fully unload the sound. Proper bass only happens with speakers that end into the circa 29hz area, and even that is not nearly good enough. Bass gets too tight and does not fully release while pulling you down around the 40-29hz area, it gets close, but it always leaves you with a certain amount of uncertainty, and a plastic like sound that just stays in the middle. All the best speakers in the world go down to 25-12hz in their specs. And that has nothing to do with the ability to hear it, or having a proper distance from the speaker to the listener so the wave can fully deliver a 20 hz signal, it just means that if you do not extend below 30hz, it feels like the sound is just not convincing enough. That last little bit, is the aftershock effect that 99.9% of speakers can't do. That is why you pay the big bucks for the big speakers and make good cabinets. If you want to experience this effect, then try Verity Sarastro, Peak Consult dragon, Audio Note spe/he, or the biggest Marten Design models, those are the best speakers in the world at delivering bass/overall sound. Most speakers ending at around 40-30 hz sound suspicious and like they are sitting on the sound, so it does not fully unload. If you listen to Tin pan Alley with Steve ray vaugn, then they effect that comes a couple of times in the song, is supposed to sound like there is a truck behind the wall unloading sugar beats into your room. It is a violent effect that truly displays this ability. Most speakers only ending around 40hz, has an effect that sound like it is rolling away from you as a listener, fading into the background. It totally destroys the flow of music, and makes everything sound weird/hesitant/like it is sitting on the sound and making it more nice than it should be.
@@C--A Paul from PSaudio, mentioned in a video that the frequencies we can't heard, affect the ones that we can hear, that is why the extreme 10hz - 100khz, actually do make a difference. I also thought like you did before, but had a weird feeling that there just was something magical about getting into the 29-12hz low zone. Try the Marten Bird 1 speakers, that is a very good example of that, and one of the best speakers in the world, it has one of the best trebles in the world together with the Verity Sarasto. I think they both go up to 100 khz, and have an insanely good treble driver. And if you ever want to hear the some of the craziest good bass then try Audio Note an-e spe/he or one of the bigger models, the top 4 models have a bass response that is in a league of it's own, where even the bigger driver speakers in the world many times can't even get close to that performance. There it feels like it has it's own gravity field, sucking you in.
"I like standmount speakers"
*Klipsch Cornwall looms over Steve's shoulder*
Right?...I was thinking the same thing lol
You’re allowed to like more than one type
@@pmd7530 I had no idea. Why didn't someone tell me?
david davidson we’d hoped you’d work it out for yourself.... your stupid comment proved you still hadn’t so I did.
You’re welcome
@Fat Rat people on the autism spectrum have a hard time understanding humor. Go easy on him.
We had a 1st gen Echo in our master bathroom for listening to music in the morning ruclips.net/user/postUgkxABghAEkaIDGZfHRBH3D3rBrlraNmnC71 and while in the shower. I didn't realize how tinny and awful the sound output on the original Echo was until we replaced it with the Studio. It was a sonic upgrade far beyond what I was expecting. Just wow. I love it because it's like having speakers IN the shower. My friend likes it because the music is so loud that she can no longer hear me singing. So that's a win-win.
good compression drivers are absolutely stunning.
I wouldn’t normally by audio equipment without listening to it in person. Unfortunately the web and superstores have done away with the old Hi-Fi stores making it difficult to locate and listen to most new additions to my system.
Thanks for an accurate description of these wonderful little speakers in this video. It helped me to make a decision and I was not disappointed. I love how bright and balanced they are and appreciate the info.
This speaker has low sensitivity because otherwise the "horn" would overpower the single small woofer. The much larger HDI 3800 with tripple 8's has a real world sensitivity of 92db !
Dammit Steve, I just love your videos. You always have positive things to say about audio equipment and you bring a ton of joy and enthusiasm to this great hobby!
I have M2s. They were the first horn speakers I’ve ever loved. If they’re trickling down to their home speakers they’re worth a listen.
I really like your reviews, especially when you introduce artists you listened to. I listened to Holly Cole Trio and loved her voice. Thank you!
I wish there was an audio store like a ski rental store where you could go up to a counter and demo speaker sets at home and bring them back, also amps , etc
Mondo Enterprises we all do
If you spend enough at a distributor they'll probably let you, but that's only for ultra high end
"If you build it they will come!" Let us know if you ever decide to do this. 👍
@@RasheedKhan-he6xx It is an interesting business model to explore. A costco membership type thing might be one part of it. It might require sending techs out to install and remove items. Insurance would be hell.
Come to Europe it’s reality here.
Hi Steve on looks alone they would sell well to me they certainly have got that wow factor, and from your review they back it up with the sound quality. Great review as usual 👍
I'm auditioned these and mated its a Schiit Gungnir and Raganok 2 is magic. Really dynamic and vividly true to my expectations. I bought them. I am impressed with the bass this speaker puts out. Clean, dynamic. I am satisfied. They might nudge out my Dyneaudio Evoke 20s.
This video is a few years old but was curious which speaker you preferred...the JBL or the Evokes?
Have you moved on to something else by now?
Thanks for any insight you can share
@@NosEL34 Wow, boy have I moved on. Several speakers from those. I still think the JBL is an excellent speaker from my memory but then I actually dont remember it. The Evoke 20s turned out to be too dull and lazy for my taste. Since then. I have owned Proac Respone 1SC , Zu DWX both of which were excelent. My current speaker is outstanding a Cabasse Murano. I briefly had Totem Signature one speakers but way too bright and fatiguing for me.
To a first order approximation, you can think of a waveguide as a special class of horns. Both provide acoustic gain by confining the driver’s dispersion to a much narrower range than it would otherwise have. Classical horns tend to have rather narrow coverage angle and high gain (10-12 dB is not uncommon.). They also, if well designed, can have fairly flat on-axis frequency response. However, their dispersion narrows with increasing frequency. They also tend to be fairly long, making phase response of the complete speaker difficult to optimize. Waveguides are usually designed for constant directivity, meaning that directivity is independent of frequency. They usually have wider directivity than classical horns and are shorter, so they have less gain (circa 6dB or so). They don’t tend to load the driver to low frequencies as well as a horn does, and they roll off high frequencies. They require a more complex crossover with equalization to address these issues. There are some payoffs, though. The constant directivity tends to sound more natural in most rooms, because the frequency response of reflected sound is close to that of direct sound. Since they are relatively short, it is easier to align the phase with low frequency drivers without resorting to electronic delay. If designed well, they also suffer less from mouth reflections which cause blurred transients in the lower end of their operating range than most horns do.
Great review. JBL's been hitting it out of the park as of late. Are you going to give the new 4349's a listen anytime soon?
Things I like about this review: Good expression of values, a playlist I can get from my streamer, and your effort to mix it up with different peripherals. All subjective stuff, but accurate and comparative. Kudos.
This is one big reason why I respect my streaming capability. I can hear your playlist, or pick up on something that catches my interest from many places, and most often find it in CD or better quality to play in the living room playback equipment.
Yeah, I have a bunch of CD's and a ton (literally) of vinyl, but all that is really ponderous when I want to hear a song or an album I pick up on your channel or other places -- with little sacrifice in source quality. And I don't have to buy a whole CD to experience what you or others are talking about.
"Pretty pretty good" lol. Actually, I bought these speakers based on this review. Very happy with my purchase. Thanks Steve!
Im just glad someone else noticed how amazing the music is on "My Octopus Teacher" is. Good call Steve
Ribbon tweeters on studio monitors sound very natural. Would love to have some hi-fi designed by Adam Audio
Direct comparison to rp600m seems in order
Mike Summers yes, that’s the right comparison!
@@marcellaufer9668, I presume that you're referring to the upgraded version, because otherwise they wouldn't be on the same mark.
Havent listened to any new jbls on the market, i bought a pair of jbl lx44s back in 1991. And they still sound great, thanks for the revuew steve
Now review the JBL Studio 530 please? Finally?
For real. Mine get better every day
no u
The whole 5 series line when on sale is just stupid value. I have 4 530s and 2 580s and waiting for the 590s to go back on sale.
I have a dedicated media room / theater and they are seriously awesome. I do find the 580s are a woolley different sound, far more open, articulate and of course powerfull. But it's like the 530s are held back compared to the 580s.
Well the 590s are now ordered...
Steve ! I been waiting for someone to review these i mean i reviewed the JBL studio 530 and they dont sound like a horn either but i know the HDI series are another level up 😃 thanks Steve ! Hopefully one day I can get these into the channel 😃JBL likes power !!!!
Been trying to find and comparison between the 5 series and the HDI line
@@chrisj9008 right JBL an email ! For me to review them ! You know i will be str8 up !
Another great review. Very complete w/comparisons etc. This is why I subscribe!
Wave Guide expands as it goes further , horn is essentially one angle , it gets wider of course but angel stays the same , so if you have an increasing angle you get directivity but not the horn ringing , sounds open . That is what they put on studio monitors . Its a best way to do it , best compromise .
0:40 - it is a horn, but JBL use the term "waveguide" because the Hi Fi industry generally doesn't like horns.
??A horn is a waveguide. The waveguide refers to the pathing effect distributing and shaping pressure waves.
@@chrisj9008 All waveguides are horns, but not all horns are waveguides.
They're just called waveguides because the manufacturer is more focused on the pattern control behavior of the horn as opposed to the SPL/efficiency increase the horn provides.
I think items were shown for longer periods than usual. This makes the visual element more interesting. 👍
Request:
Have you any experience with room tuning systems?
Listened to the Holly Cole Trio song mentioned, had to listen to Holly Cole Tennessee Waltz to clear my head.
Really curious how the LS50 Meta compares to the Triangle EZ Titus, Steve did prefer the Triangle over the regular LS50's.
That's a good question.
Steve. What else is there? We nicer saw the full T Shirt. That was the graphic below Audio? We will never know!
I would like to know how does it compare to the klipsch rp600m in terms of dynamics and if it feels so alive like being in the concert
I had a demo 2 weeks ago with the klipsch rp600m and these ones. The klipsch is more fun to listen to. BUT this one has more bass, detail and air between instruments. But the soundstage was better on the klipsch. Preferred the klipsch over these.
Good to hear, I was wondering the same thing....
The real reason for the waveguide is time alignment of the tweeter. We can achieve efficiency and dispersion without a big plastic thing around the tweeter. It’s just a great excuse to set the tweeter back into the baffle. This is probably the cause of the clean precise sound described. I’m all for it
You can’t control directivity as well without a large waveguide. Earl Geddes has lots of papers about this if you’re curious as to how it all works.
Cujobob Of course, not as well. But well enough for the average buyers living room. I’m sure directivity control was a factor in choosing that HF design for this speaker. I just can’t see it being the primary reason. I think they probably wanted to set back the tweeter, and have it crossed over low while being robust with a high output and power handling, so they could use a heavier duty woofer without losing upper midrange detail. This would also explain the low sensitivity and high output performance described in the review
@@KingOath
No, it's all about the waveguide.
That waveguide has been a key component for JBL across many of their lines.
The waveguide's directivity control and characteristics are THE reason, not to physically set the driver back.
Over the past several years, JBL has poured significant R&D effort into this waveguide. The strongly successful M2 Studio/Mastering monitor brought this image control waveguide into the scene. Since then, JBL has adopted more advanced versions of it top to bottom across many of their offerings.
It's safe to say no loudspeaker manufacturer has spent more time, effort, and money on better pyscho-acoustic understanding on which directions to pursue. They've been developing many new technologies at Northridge (such as this Image Control Waveguide), then incorporating them into products.
They've been on a roll as of late.
@@FOH3663 Wow, great post, thanks! So are you saying that they are kind of using the directivity control as a way to enhance the perception of soundstage and imaging rather than just for basic “frequency spread” as it would be used in a PA speaker?
Nice looking little speakers. My pocket book says I will be sticking with my B1+ though.
Love Casey Abrams especailly the stuff he does with Haley
No shortage of speakers in this size , spoiled for choice really .
Ya it’s true.
JBLs tend to do dynamics very well. Not surprised they outdid the KEFs in that area. But I wonder how the KEF LS50 Wireless IIs would compare (once broken in), with their 155 watts per channel built in.
Full front loaded horn systems can be placed with backs near touching walls and corners.
It’s not a FULL front loaded horn - only the HF
Any experience with JBL Paragon before?
Love that AES shirt .
I love my JBL LS40 looks similar, i will have to listen to these new speakers.
I own them as well I think they’re incredible. These are supposed to be the replacement. I hope to get these someday as well:)
The ls 40 is a 3 way isn't it? To me, this looks like an upgrade of the hls 610 jbl made in the late 90s. For a mass-market box store speaker, the 610 sounds pretty pretty pretty good
Only thing to keep in mind when moving a narrow baffle speaker away from the wall or corner is that you will loose up to 3dB of lows and mids when moving away from a wall and up to 6dB of lows and mids if moving from a corner. Narrow baffle speakers like bookshelves and towers have a really high corner frequency. So, 1kHz and under just get thrown everywhere, 360 degrees. So, moving the speakers around or adding acoustic panels (I recommend 4" thick 703 or mineral wool) behind and around the speakers will change the sound dramatically usually for the better, but it depends on the speaker, room, and preference. 4" panels absorb down to 125Hz very well and one panel is as efficient as 2 if it is open backed and there is an air gap between the acoustic panel and the wall. People including you forget about acoustics. You can transform your sound with a few 4" thick panels placed well.
Steve, give Sarah Vaughan with Clifford Brown a listen.
Aready has, I would wager.
Thank you Steve for this interesting and educating review! God bless you!
Glad to see JBL coming back to prominence. The midrange of the KEF will be more coherent because of the concentric, time aligned, arrangement.
Now someone needs to bring back Fisher, the good Fisher days. You know, tubes. A friend used to provide parts for Avery Fisher. He always bought the best.
I like the brand which sells the whole set, center, bookshelf, surrounds, atmos etc. So far elac has me satisfied.
Having yamaha paired to Elac has made the sound even better.
Sounds like a system I'd recommend. Denon goes well with elac too IMO. Klipsch would be quite a bit different than the Elac if you're in the mood for something with more kahoonies.
@@kohnfutner9637, nope Denon & Elac doesn't sound good. You need a reciever that can really push some quality watts into these power hubgry speaker & Yamaha seems to be better than Denon.
Plus with Denon the speakers sounded thin and lifeless, yamaha just bring a life to them.
@@techocrazy I liked the elac with the Yamaha as well. To me they sounded to be lacking some top end extension but the bass was good. I didn't think the Yamaha made the elac ub5 come to life but I thought it did make them sound more natural and smooth with better bass because Yamaha has a tendency to set every speaker to large, whereas the Denon has a tendency to set everything to small. I've seen my Denon set the elac ub5 as high as 120 and as low as 60, while the speakers have not moved. The Denon often reads the elac as wired wrong, so I guess it thinks the speakers are out of phase. But imo I thought the Denon brought the elac to life more because it brought out the treble.
I liked them both but I think there's probably a better combination with elac than Denon or Yamaha. Neither one really seemed to be what I preferred because I liked mixed bits of what both could do. Ideally, I think the Yamaha is too laid back because the elac are laid back too and the Denon is too up front (sounds to favor a v-shape equalizer with audyssey32). Neither one were a great match imo. I thought they were ok matches but nothing spectacular. I would see what Steve Guttenberg recommended.
Have you ever tested speakers/audio equipment with the jazz group Flim & The BB's? If not, you're missing out. These recordings were processed with full digital DMP production. You'd be hard pressed to find a higher quality recording anywhere. Amazing clarity and sound.
That movie/documentary is a very good movie for us curious folks.
How do your neighbours feel when you "play it loud"?
It's not the compression driver that's not super efficient, by designed compression drivers generally are. Rather that crossover dampens that horn to not outrun the smaller woofer.
Jbl also does standard efficient testing to the standard. Klipsh and has does not by comparison factoring room gain and other things.
Waveguides are tricky and take some engineering to work well. Jbl also still holds most of the patterns or something (or until recently) and many companies for a variety of those reasons stayed away.
How do the JBL bookshelves compare to the Revels since they are both from the Harmon family
You need to get over to the Harman store and listen to the new 4349 monitors (replacement of the 4429 that you liked) and let us know if they’re worth the $2500 price increase!
@Concorde 0 it’ll have to be on the used market...I contacted a JBL rep a few weeks ago and he told me the 4429s are no longer available. Harman store in New York had their demo pair for sale, but not sure if it’s been sold. Really curious to see if the larger cabinet and change in waveguide makes the speaker that much ($2500 increase!) better.
Is that a Totem "beak" on top of your Klipsch?
You're dang right it is! haha.
Any JBL audiophiles out there who would possible know the model of JBL "tower" speaker circa 1986. My best description as I remember them are: Approx 40" plus inches tall, it had (2) 8" woofers, 2 medium range woofers & 1 tweeter (All vertical in-line). The top had a removable piece of smoked glass and it also came with a small brass like plaque that you stick on a foot like stand. I call the stand a foot because it stuck out a few inches in front for stability (I guess). It didn't raise the height of the speakers more than an inch or 2. So it was kind of like a foot or a shoe maybe you screwed into the bottom. I bought them overseas, and left them at a friends house. When I got back. He was gone and the house was in foreclosure.
How do you measure SPL in the room? I also agree with another poster. I've never heard a reviewer say a speaker sounds like crap with the exception of Yamaha NS10's :) If everything sounds great what doesn't?
Are there any speakers in the game better than jbl and Klipsch? Especially in terms of price/value/pedigree. I lean Klipsch but jbl is awesome too.
Wharfedale
Dear Steve, may I kindly ask? Judging from memory, how would you compare these JBL HDI 1600 to KEF R3 please? Thank you very much in advance for your reply.
I think this series is more of a dual purpose two channel stereo and Home Theater type speaker system aimed more towards Home Theater. I would love to upgrade my JBL 500 series to the HDI but you're looking at 8 grand for the entire series for Home Theater. Way too expensive when the 500 series is amazing in it's own right. Maybe in time, they will move them to the JBL website and do their peek a boo sales half off strategy. Then I'll buy right away...
100%. Love my 5 series theater setup.
@@chrisj9008 me too! Best speakers I've ever owned!
@@kirkcunningham6146 been playing with more toe angle so they cross infront and my god... New day records was talking about it In a waveguide video... my 580s and 530s do sound better this way and more consistent across the seats of my media room..
Hi Steve, this might be a bit off topic, but have you ever done a series where people combine pro audio and home audio together and with what kind of results? If you did a series can you point me to the right one I scrolled through your catalog but couldn't find anything thanks again keep up the great work, Pete from Cleveland
You said you're usually listening to jazz.. have you heard of The L.A. 4? They did a cover of St Thomas by Sonny Rollins
Horn or no horn.. good breakdown. What is it ?? It's JBL speakers (New) I love JBL I'm impartial to companies that have been around. If the sound is there 1800$ isn't bad. It's all about sound! These will sell themselves I'm sure. 👍😎
I can't figure out the case for these speakers. Is it dynamic headroom? Is that the USP?
Allow me to clarify on horns vs waveguides... a horn is a type of waveguide but a waveguide is not a horn :P
Hy do you think is better this jbl or the kef ls50meta? I listen everthing from rock to acoustic ambient music. Thanks bro
great info, a pair that bring me back are the classic JBL L112
Man this is not even listed on jbl website yet?
When you say listened at 95db, are you referring to 95bd at a meter? Or 95 dB at a distance?
Are they better than Elac Debut reference/debut 2.0? If so I'll give a thought to buy one of these when I accumulate enough cash.
What's the aluminum looking cone on top of the Cornwall behind you? A Tweak?
It came from Totem Acoustic, yes a tweak. Not sure it does anything, but it looks cool.
A waveguide alters the directivity of a transducer, so it helps ensure the tweeter has the right dispersion and doesn't beam.
A horn helps correct for the huge impedance mismatch between the relatively massy speaker diaphragm and the much lighter air it's trying to push, thus improving power transfer and efficiency.
They may look similar, but they're doing very different jobs.
So Buchardt would be waveguide, Klipsch a horn?
Do you think the beak makes any difference
Is that a totem cone on that klipsch??
I see the cornwalls behind you glad you decided to keep them.
It would be really interesting if the gentleman we know as Steve Guttenberg should review a rather affordable, horn loaded / "waveguided", bookshelf speaker like the JBL Studio 630... God bless you, Steve!
Who wins between them and the Bowers & Wilkins 702 S2, I wonder😁
Hi from Chicago/had a friend-sound engineer who never liked JBLs tweeters-maybe solved?
Is this the same as the new JBL Studio 620 (6 series to replace 530) that is being sold in Asia?
No. The Studio 6 series seems to use the same somewhat lesser drivers as the Studio 5 series, but in the same or similar cabinet to the HDI line.
Jon at Chane Cinema and Music has the new 700 series releasing, I have three of the 753 towers coming, there’s also a LCR one the 752 that uses an Italian compression driver and two 8” Scanspeak drivers, you should contact him to get a pair to review.
Okay where do you get those speaker cables from.
Steve, "3 1/2 feet away from the bookcase behind me" - measured from front or back of the JBLs?
I don't understand why "if you want to hear the rumble, you'll have to add a sub-woofer"?????!!!! WHAT??? That means the bass response below 50 Hz is poor! My Dynaco A25s don't need any extras to get very smoothly down to 30 Hz and the cabinet size is not that big. Why can't they make modern speakers with 10" woofers that can produce a reasonably flat response from 30 Hz to 15 KHz for an affordable price???? I realize the Dynacos would cost about $600 each today (with inflation) but at least they produce incredibly smooth, deep bass well below 50 Hz and require no extras to get there.
Your comments do not show that you have tried subwoofers with those Dynacos, nor disprove that they would sound better with them.
Please try and report here.
Your words are true, but to my ears, the Dynaco A25s don't need any help in the low end.
@@danedewaard8215 your ears are the ones that matter.
The Dynaco A25s are not that big and are classified as bookshelf speakers. I guess we are headed toward Bose 901 clones! So sad!
@@danedewaard8215 an acquaintance has Totem Arrow speakers. They have little dog syndrome and value for money.
Maybe jbl will do a big blowout on the bdi series like they have with the studio series, which are great. Especially if they don't sell at full price because of the kef meta. Not saying it won't take 5, 6 or 7 years but I could see it going on special within a year or two.
Let's face reality, most people are probably going to get the meta, hugely because of the price being less and the hype/fame being much higher
Standmount speakers are exactly the same as bookshelf speakers... right?
Right
Hi Steve, another great review, just happened to be watching the octopus video last night with the kids, spook coincidence. Have you tried Anthony and the Johnsons (eponymous album for a start) Keep it up! cheers Steve
JBL, once again, doesn't stick the landing with the HDI series (seems to be their U.S. followup to the popular Studio 5's - which has the same issues as I will mention - as they have not brought the Studio 6's to these shores). They don't have a matching overhead or wall mount surround speaker to round out the model line for Dolby Atmos or DTS: X sound systems. They even failed to put a mounting bracket attachment point on the 1600, so you could use it as an on-wall surround! At the last in-person CEDIA in Denver, I brought these issues up at the JBL booth and they pointed me toward using their high end Synthesis in-wall's/in-ceiling's. Yeah, I'm going to spend two to three times the amount for surrounds than the front mains! Not in this lifetime.
Ive always liked JBL Control ONE, still used as my main desktop speakers. The HDI's look like they justify the price tag too but bookshelf units shouldnt go past $1000 a pair IMHO.
Hi,Steve, I like your channel and musical taste, speaking of the JBL speaker, do you ever heard an company in Japan name Kendrick sound? They reform the old JBL speakers into fantastic speakers, do you have any suggestions about that? I’m totally fascinated to the open and lively sound they produced, can you comment on that ? Thank you so much 😁
How it plays Iron Maiden?
Why don’t u do video about some of the famous classic great speakers of the past and how they compare today ?
Not many bookshelf, or stand mount speakers in the 6" range, are going to have high sensitivity, regardless of horns.
Please do a review of the sound in your videos..
its 85dB by 2 watt,
82dB,1watt
Isn't it actually an 82dB speaker? 2.83v/1m equates to 1w/1m only for 8 ohm speakers. With this speaker being 4 ohm, 2.83v equates to 2w.
It depends if they state 2.83 volts or 1 watt as the drive signal. Don't know what JBL did here though.
I LOVE JBL LOUD SPEAKERS IN THE OLD DAYS ALL WAS TESTING .THE BEST i HEARD IS THE ELTEC LANCING # 9 i GOT THESE AFTER BLOWING UP THE BOSE 901 COULD NOT GET IN USA I GOT THEM OVER SEAS.NEED TO CHECK THESE OUT.
Just curious as to which Rolling Stones albums or songs you specifically played for the test...
If I had to guess "Aftermath"
Go ahead Steve say it 😁 come on say it🤷🏻♂️ "it is not horny, not horny at all🤭" what a fine salesman Steve is, give him a round of 👏👏 people 😁
Got it, the tweeter doesn't sound horny.
😆🤣😁😂
Ha!
I would love to hear Steve, just once, say “these speakers are crap.....”
To be honest, it's hard to find a speaker that is just crap. I have found speakers that I don't like but for the most part, you have to go to HTIB gear to get garbage.
@@jeffadams9699 I agree plus the dude's been in the industry long enough to pick and choose which gear he's going to sign off on and do a review with. It's not like he's going to intentionally choose a crappy brand.
Generally across the board speakers are very high quality these days. It is getting harder and harder to find a bad speaker. Even $50-100 a pair speakers sound very good for the price and just get better and better going higher and higher. Back in the 1980s or early 1990s there were plenty of bad cheap speakers to go around but that really isn’t the case anymore.
@@jeffadams9699 HTIB?
Oh man I m learning a lot Bert interesting jou feel the love for music thanks
i prefer the monitor before the tower speaker.
Sure hope the “claw” is helping that Cornwall behind you....
It's actually a 'Beak'
Not the craw. The CRAW!
Heavy metal? Jbl 1600?
Wont the neighbors complain when you do those +100dB sessions there!?
I do it in the day, for a few minutes at a time. I’ve been doing this for decades, no complaints.
Clean, clean, clean sounds like it can't play bass.
I would personally never settle with less than the new l100 classic model, that is a pretty good speaker for the price.
Real HIFI Help the specs say 40Hz - 30Khz. That's very good for a bookshelf speaker, very few songs have parts that go below 40Hz. Unless you mainly listen to drum & bass or big classical orchestra music that can get down to 20Hz then your fine.
@@C--A First of all to get a proper bass extension, then the 2 way speaker needs to be close to the floor to get a proper amplification of the bass, or else the room will suck out that sound being to high and having such a small cabinet. That is why the bigger jbl is much better: bigger, better parts and much closer to the ground. (ground coverage gives like 2x more effect of proper bass)
Almost everything in the world ending at around 40hz is really really bad, because that means it does not fully unload the sound. Proper bass only happens with speakers that end into the circa 29hz area, and even that is not nearly good enough. Bass gets too tight and does not fully release while pulling you down around the 40-29hz area, it gets close, but it always leaves you with a certain amount of uncertainty, and a plastic like sound that just stays in the middle.
All the best speakers in the world go down to 25-12hz in their specs. And that has nothing to do with the ability to hear it, or having a proper distance from the speaker to the listener so the wave can fully deliver a 20 hz signal, it just means that if you do not extend below 30hz, it feels like the sound is just not convincing enough. That last little bit, is the aftershock effect that 99.9% of speakers can't do. That is why you pay the big bucks for the big speakers and make good cabinets. If you want to experience this effect, then try Verity Sarastro, Peak Consult dragon, Audio Note spe/he, or the biggest Marten Design models, those are the best speakers in the world at delivering bass/overall sound.
Most speakers ending at around 40-30 hz sound suspicious and like they are sitting on the sound, so it does not fully unload.
If you listen to Tin pan Alley with Steve ray vaugn, then they effect that comes a couple of times in the song, is supposed to sound like there is a truck behind the wall unloading sugar beats into your room. It is a violent effect that truly displays this ability. Most speakers only ending around 40hz, has an effect that sound like it is rolling away from you as a listener, fading into the background. It totally destroys the flow of music, and makes everything sound weird/hesitant/like it is sitting on the sound and making it more nice than it should be.
@@C--A Paul from PSaudio, mentioned in a video that the frequencies we can't heard, affect the ones that we can hear, that is why the extreme 10hz - 100khz, actually do make a difference. I also thought like you did before, but had a weird feeling that there just was something magical about getting into the 29-12hz low zone. Try the Marten Bird 1 speakers, that is a very good example of that, and one of the best speakers in the world, it has one of the best trebles in the world together with the Verity Sarasto. I think they both go up to 100 khz, and have an insanely good treble driver.
And if you ever want to hear the some of the craziest good bass then try Audio Note an-e spe/he or one of the bigger models, the top 4 models have a bass response that is in a league of it's own, where even the bigger driver speakers in the world many times can't even get close to that performance. There it feels like it has it's own gravity field, sucking you in.
He mentioned in the video that the bass was good but if you want deep bass extension one should buy a sub.