→ Nail one-handed 16ths, open-hat barks, and left foot independence in 9 lessons. Download my FREE pdf guide, “Your 3 Biggest Hihat Problems, SOLVED: 9 Strategies for Overcoming Hihat Frustration & Left Foot Issues” ✔︎ the-non-glamorous-drummer-llc.ck.page/4807da4fa7
I disagree. I keep the opening as low as possible to permit all sounds to fully project. For me, the feel suffers with high hats wide open (especially using closed with foot intricacies including dead notes). Try a stream of controlled 16th notes, hand foot, hand foot, as muted and dry as possible, you'll soon get what I mean.
@@DeanMccormick yup, total disagreement with this vid (hat too open is garbage) and think it's not good for beginners to hear this who don't know better... It really comes down to what feels right and the encouragement should be to experiment with hihat, not set it and forget. Try playing 16's with your foot on the hihat. Need a tight hat for that. ruclips.net/video/RtYcwFmyf78/видео.html
oops, meant to post this one with two hihats going simultaneously. Notice how near to closed the hat on the right is... ruclips.net/video/aOgQzzVOSI4/видео.html
This doesn’t apply if you play double bass. Playing open hats while your left foot is on the second bass pedal, kills this idea. But yes, if you play single bass, this is a good idea
There's so much loud guitar in metal you're not going to hear any kind of "chick" sound anyways. If you look at this as a waste to learn then you need to expand your musical library. A drummer should be able to at least play a little bit of all kinds of styles. It's amazing how much it changes the music when adding different flavor of styles.
Joe Troutt i play drums professionally. I’m 100% aware of what genres require different equipment positioning. You would think metal doesn’t require the “chic” sound from a hihat but that is only for death/ black metal. Just because you have a double bass pedal doesn’t mean you play metal. The confusion of double bass automatically meaning metal is the problem. “Perfect circle” is one example of precision hihat work/control with a double bass pedal. The term “mistake” in the title is slightly ignorant
I'm also a metal drummer, thinking the same thing. If you are playing a driving, steady double kick beat, while driving on the hats, you cannot set the hats that wide open. If you did it would wash everything else out. If I were a primarily single bass drummer, this would definitely be ideal. The guy mentioned APC above. While I love that band, the drummer rarely drives on double kick, if ever. It absolutely depends on the genre that you play. 100%
@@nikhoupt9963 genuinely curious, Is a drop clutch not a thing any more? I haven't played double kick drumming in years now, but that's what I used to do.
A lot of people here seem eager to bash on the title. I too was skeptical at first but you actually shed some new light on a technique that I hadn’t ever put much thought into. Adding layers of openness to the hat is a musical game changer. Thank you!
Yea there's loads of cool reasons to have them set all kinds of ways. I change mine all the time depending what I'm after. He's not usually so be end all with his wording. I'm sure he'd agree with you though.
@@DorianTMChannel ive got a pearl clutch that you hit with a stick and the top hat drops. Its a nice inbetween sound. To re engage the clutch you just put your foot on the pedal and it re engages.
If you are measuring the distance between your hats, STOP. Vibe, have fun and make cool sounds. Percussion is the shit because the sounds we produce don't have to sound any sort of way. Practice your rudiments, learn independence and appreciate what videos like this are teaching you, but don't forget to laugh at content creators when they tell you that you are making noise incorrectly.
I have to say it depends on how you play, what sounds you're looking for, and what genre you play. This doesn't work for metal drummers who use lots of double bass.
Also matters what kind of hats you have. Some hats have really clear chick sound even when spaced close together, while some hats spaced like he suggests in the video don't have a clear and cutting chick.
Always a good idea to keep the wingnut swung around to the back position so you don't accidentally hit it and loosen the top cymbal while tracking or playing live.
I agree’s he’s not too wordy , not showing off Trying to prove to us that he’s Phil Collins and Neil Peart all in one with a flair of John Bonham your other high hat video really kind of opened a lot for me
I do literally the opposite of everything you say in the first 3 minutes of this video. Not because anything you say is wrong, but because none of it meshes with the sound I’m looking for. As a metal drummer I don’t need chick so much as a good open sound during double kick. Yes, I own a drop clutch. But it’s just not worth the effort to use one. When I do play other music, I do open the hats up a bit more on the stand but I think that the hats should get progressively closer together on open sizzle sounds. That progressively opening sound is awful to my ear. It’s all about timing and precision foot movement to shape the sizzle open sound to your liking. It depends on what you’re doing. Generally people’s hat sound is bad not because of a setting, but because their foot opens and closes the cymbals out of time. Too early, too late, one of each in either order... that really ruins the sound.
Here’s the thing. I know this is gonna sound lazy, but hey whatever. I keep about a 1/4” - 1/2” space between the top and bottom. Reason being, is I don’t want to have to work to keep my hats closed. With 1/4”- 1/2” spacing, All I have to do is Use the weight of my foot to keep the hats closed. I don’t want to have to focus on keeping them closed while trying to groove.
All depends on what you’re playing. If you use a double bass drum pedal and want to have that nice washy sound while playing a busy double bass pattern, you simply cannot have the hi hats open like that. Yes one can say get a drop clutch.... yeah but.... not the same sound as just having them open but almost touching each other. Different strokes for different folks I guess.
I play in a very soft environment playing jazz & soft rock much softer than your demonstration. I use about 1/2” to 3/4” gap which allows me to play time very effectively and keep the volume at an acceptable level. If I used what you recommend 1.5” the volume of that much gap would not work and it would wear my leg out trying to control the volume with the technique I use. I like the one sound you get by opening up the hat wider after the attack.
Keep in mind that just because it's adjusted with a 1"+ space doesn't mean I open it all the way between foot chicks. The idea is versatility, and if I'm playing quietly I'm lightly bouncing my foot on the pedal so that the hats barely open in between notes. The big idea here is versatility - being able to go from quiet to loud instantly if you need to. I totally see what you're talking about, though, and opening wider might be a bit of a stretch if you aren't used to it. Try it out, though, and see if you're able to widen your dynamics! :)
Have always played my hats with less space. Have tried the more space thing, but feel like I have to use more leg energy to push down on the pedal to keep closed, and that is not efficient (IMHO).
Nah, I like mine just barely touching when playing. It's all about the Sound to me. "If it sounds right and feels right, play it"-James Brown But thank you anyway Stephen!👍👍
Exactly. There is no right or wrong. I totally disagree with this video. Do whatever you find most comfortable and whatever gets the sounds that you want to express.
hi Stephen, i just recently discovered your channel, and I can't simply thank you enough for the tips and information you give. If you are reading this, just wanted to say huge thank you, and thanks to you, I have regained my motivation to working on my techniques!
I love your lessons buddy I’m a self-taught drummer and I kind of just stumbled on that loosening up of the top hi hat I just stumbled on that and wasn’t sure if it was the right thing to do but it to me it just sounded better and then when I saw your video on it did that actually it was cool because it like confirmed what my ears told me I’m a guitar player turn drummer just recording and stuff but I found that I was just playing the same old stuff on the guitar so taking a couple years off and just concentrating on drumming was probably the best thing I ever did for my guitar playing but it is amazing to any drummers out there I find it just amazing the amount of intricacy in the hi hat, My favorite part of the whole drummer ensemble tool kit
For some reason my top hi hat is sideways and the part that faces away from me is closer to the under one that the part that faces me (i guess its the clutch but im not sure)
I think this is super interesting! Though, I don’t know that this applies as well to double-bass players, as having that wide gap the entire time when trying to play the hi-hat at the same time as using both feet for the bass drum likely wouldn’t sound as nice.
I’ve been doing the opposite where I leave them just open enough to play an open hi hat sound with my foot OFF the pedal, so I can play the second bass pedal and hit open hi hats then still play closed when I need it. Mostly for hard rock or punk. Thanks for the video!
I’m having a problem where my bottom hat slides and I end up getting a quarter of an inch of over lap from the bottom hat where I would usually hit them any bell fixing this would be greatly appreciated
You said it at the very beginning, my biggest reason personally for space was keeping time with a big band having to stomp out 2 & 4 distinctly but you also said there's no hard fast rule so those who protested maybe didn't listen closely. Every time I play someone else's set I have to open the hats up about an inch
Your snare drum is very low--down between your knees. How can you get proper stick control and dynamics when you are striking your head way past the parallel position to your waist? Do you understand what I mean? When first beginning snare rudiments remember : hit the head when the forearm reaches a parallel point in relation to the body . You are over-extending your stroke--this is inefficient. Am I wrong? I wish you could comment on this post. I will not allow my students to rearrange their snare after working on rudiments with proper stick position at the table, to a dropped position between their legs at the kit. Watch Steve Gadd or any great jazz player or big band player--they do not position their snare drum low between their knees. I have even seen players hit their leg with their stroke as the stick hits the head! This cannot be efficient.
PS I should mention that I appreciate your teaching tips in most cases--there are a few conflicting opinions here and there--but very good tips. Thanks. hope you can comment on snare position for me.
I started playing drums in 1966 at age 12. In the early 70's I would sit behind and between Butch Trucks and Jaimoe Johanson when a unknown band from Macon called " The Allman Brothers" would play for free on Sundays in Peidmont Park. ... SO..... I was fascinated by their great " hat " sounds. The secret? They used 16 inch hats. As I do now. Any thoughts on 16" hats?
I watched the older video on setting up the hats, especially the angle. I thought that it wouldn't make much difference but man. Together with that sucking technique even tough I didn't really do anything differently the open sound was immediately better.
when I had an accoustic set I would leave the top hat loose put my foot down to a comfortable spot then tighten the nut. When I relesed my foot it went up to about that distance.
Everyone has there own style of course but I appreciated this video because I haven’t played in almost 15 years. Just getting back into it and while I remember basics I also forgot a lot of stuff to. I’m Re watching a lot of technique videos to properly set up my stuff and find what works for me. I forgot until I watched this video I did normally space mine about an inch lol
For over 20 years now I’ve always kept my top hi-hat very tight. The main reason for this is when I first got a set of drums I would try to adjust the clutch to make the top hi-hat a little looser but after a half hour of playing, the nuts that held the top cymbal would work themselves loose and the clutch would come apart. So, as a result of teenage impatience I resorted to tightening the nut on the under side of the cymbal as tight as I could and I would do the same with the two nuts on the top side. Over the years I found that I prefer it tight because I think it gives me more control than I would have if the top cymbal was too sloshy. I noticed that your top hat was just loose enough to move ever so slightly. I think if I used a heavier top hat then I’d play with it looser than I have it now. Any thoughts?
Hi I read your question to Stephen. What I can tell you for sure is overtightening your hi hat clutch is bad for the cymbal and could lead to cracking eventually. There are many locking clutches available now that prevent loosening. Gibraltar makes a good one. Cheers!
I set my hi-hat so that when I hit the bass pedal and hi-hat pedal at the same time, they make sound simultaneously. This way I don't have a flam when both hits land on the same note.
i intentionally keep my hats way closer together than this thumbnail (like 1/16", barely open) for a few reasons: 1. in drum&bass/jungle you never really want to open the hats all the way for any reason, it just isn't a sound that gets used. in some songs the hats are solidly closed the entire way through 2. because the hats are always close miked (and i mean close, like barely not hitting the cymbals), you can make the foot chick as loud or quiet as you need in the mix, but usually you want it quiet as a little bit of extra spice during a ride section or while using one or more X-hats. 3. frankly i find having a hihat that goes everywhere uncomfortable and uncontrollable. it's like having a bird tied to your foot trying to get away. also, i personally just really don't like the sound of most open hihats when they're more than 1/4" open. the only real exception i can think of is the meinl sand hats. they sound, for lack of a better analogy, like the included drum sounds on a generic ROMpler keyboard
I’m also in the camp that disagrees with this advice. If the hats are closer, playing an open hit in the middle of a tight hi hat groove has more excitement because the hats rattle against each other throughout the duration. Double kick is also a huge reason to not open the hats that much. I had a quick release clutch, but I would hit the resting closed hats hard enough that the top hat would slosh up just enough to re-engage and then stick open. I’m genuinely curious if the poster of the video has any double kick experience.
When I saw the title of the video and the thumbnail of the hats, I was thinking the hats were too open already, because even played open at that wide of an opening washes out any groove of definition from the playing. Sloshy hats FTW.
I play a lot of double bass metal. My hi hats are only about an 1/8 of an inch on the outside and closed on the inside, towards me. Why? Economy of movement. Control. Getting a great open hihat sound without having to have my foot on the hihat pedal. In fact I went a step further, if I want a closed hihat sound during a double bass part I have a second set of hihats for it if I want to. Plus with two pairs of hihats both open, and with 14" and 15" hats, I can change the entire feel of a part by switching off to the other set.
@Stephen Clark I prefer my hats a bit closer together, just that it feels more comfortable and I seem to have more control, although I'm more of a heavy rock or funk inspired drummer so it suits my styles better. A little off topic, you mentioned Paul Mabury, I'm not surprised he's doing well on the drum scene...I live in Perth W.Australia and I went to high school with Paul in the early 90's, he's 2 years older than me, and was a pretty good drummer back then too. We both had the same drum teacher at school. Paul's father is still a very respected guy over here too, who hosted a late night radio show for many years back in the early 90's, he would give people a lot of good advice. I still remember being interviewed by him for a school thing on-air one evening when I was in year 9...I believe he's now back on air...Anyway, just a bit of random trivia...lol👍🇦🇺
A nicely open and not so tight hi hat will get u its greatest sound and volume, but sometimes u may need to do the opposite to get the volume down, it depends on the gig, the room, the band... So take that into consideration. Also if you play double bass u may tighten it up depending on how u want it to sound in that particular song.
I only have about 7 or 8 millimeter gap when I play and I have no problems getting that sucking sound. I can't have it more open than that anyway since I play a lot of double bass meaning I can't have my foot on the hi-hat.
It's not wrong it's a choice. I play with double kicks and an extra sample pad pedal for cow bells, tambourines. I some times play both extra pedals while still holding down the hit hat ie heel left and right of hit hat pedal with only the ball of my foot holding it closed. Your technique would require way to much pressure to keep it closed correctly or be way to slow to push chokes. As far as the sound is concerned just move stick a little more to the middle so as you open very slowly. The sizzle is created by the edges colliding but the sustain effect is still as you open it. It's an interesting approach and I recommend everyone play around with it AND hi hat stand spring tension. Get to know your instrument
i think thats a matter of personal taste in some cases, what if someone doesnt like that open space, it depends on the music too, but it is usefull to have it open as well, in jazz mostly to keep that breathing feel
Am I the only one who thinks that suggested clutch tension looks ridiculously high? There is a sweet spot where you can get a strong "Chck" sound while still having some foot control. I get that the suggested position might work for some players, but it feels wrong to tell everyone that this is the one way to keep your clutch.
Some drummers have more than one hihat. One open, another one closed. Some double bass drummers alternate between pedals. Look up Thomas Lang and Horacio Hernandez.
So to get the angle on the bottom hat is it just a matter of loosening it abit? Can you maybe do a video on how you do it properly? I enjoyed this video, thanks man!
I play mine with no space at all, I just dont put all the weight of the top cimbal, il put it a very little bit highter to make it lighter on the bottom one. Because I prefer this consistant sound
Oops! I always set my HHs intentionally //really close// - because that makes them quieter! I am still a bit of a noob and mostly play on an electro kit though, if that provides some small semblance of defence. But this video explains things well and I shall be setting them wider in future. I still have an innate 'fear' in my drumming, of hurting people's eardrums. Metal kits' High Hats sound so loud when playing them, compared to bass, toms and cymbals, and I don't know how loud it remains by the time it gets away from the kit. I don't have these concerns with an electric kit and headphones/amp. Anyway, thanks for the lesson, I am going to try it out next time I am on a metal kit! I can see it will give a lot more control and those whooshing notes. I do need to get my left foot going more.
"Loose enough it can slosh." - if that makes any sense, haha! Definitely not tight, but not completely loose either. Just play around with it and you'll find a sweet spot.
I adjust mine all the time depending on what style I intend to play. Usually closer when playing rock or metal and more open when playing Jazz, fusion or hip-hop
I use a double bass kit, I play metal so my hats barely touch each other and that's how most metal drummers have them since we don't close them too often. Good tip regardless
Love your stuff man, 2 videos in and this self taught drummer has learnt a load of tips. This hat trick is going to awaken my left foot to more sonic properties and possibilities. I'm also keen to social distance myself a bit from the kit to try and better my kick technique. Thank you for your time and effort my brother.
Thanks for sharing this. I've been having to lift my foot all the way and with this I will be able to feel the beat more without having to over-react. Someone else commented here that making rules is bad for playing drums. I disagree. Having limits and confines is what practice is - focusing on specific things in your playing, learning to be more flexible and acquiring new techniques. Then you can switch techniques at will. Also, learning rules allows you to break them once you have mastered them. I do get what he means though. You don't want to limit your ability to develop a style, otherwise you'll wind up sounding like your teachers and favorite drummers. I suppose there's a balance between innovation and tradition.
Not to retread the same double bass thing, but could you make a vid where you incorporate this into double bass playing? Sean Reinert in his Evolutionary Sleeper playthrough video does some spectacular hi-hat work in double bass, for an example to see. So while I don’t want to say you’re wrong, you’re not completely right.
Great teacher....Been playing for many decades, and he always teaches me something new----stuff I should have known a long time ago. Thank you, Stephen.
I use this method: ruclips.net/user/shortsAWkAoAISl3c?si=ucSYJCBbIMtyq9YM The top cymbal is quite tight, let the bottom one sway. The gap is smaller than yours, never fully open. I can play double pedal with my left heel while my left toe keeps it shut. When I want that morphing "swurp" tone, I would adjust my hand, make the stick touch the hi-hat a bit longer but harder. I can lift my left foot completely when I want to, and I don't have to worry about the hi-hat distance while I play the fills (I like using my hi-hat as crash when I play fills with cymbals, like splash > HH > crash, fully open hi-hat doesn't work).
It´s not about the space between the cymbals, but about the speed they´re closed. If they are very close there´s no time to "accelerate". When they are more apart you can step further, stronger and faster.
I have a hi hat problem nobody seems to mention: when playing open hats, the top hat hits the bottom one unless I have the clutch pretty tight. So I get an extra clunk that I don’t want. I’ve watched videos that say the clutch shouldn’t be too tight but... I have the gap about 1-1.5in
Simple. Two sets of hi-hats, one for the tight sounds, one more open for whatever you need to do. I have a HH set up with a pair of 16in crashes, because I need some smash sounds at times !!
I'm at about an inch (maybe 3/4), but I've never run in to those problems. I don't play as loud as many drummers do (even though I play a blend of Funk, Rock & Metal), so maybe that's why my time-keeping "chick" never sounds weak. I have a tendency for tendonitis, so playing a little quieter and employing Economy of Motion tactics is crucial for my personal approach. Sounds great how you're using that spacing, though.
→ Nail one-handed 16ths, open-hat barks, and left foot independence in 9 lessons. Download my FREE pdf guide, “Your 3 Biggest Hihat Problems, SOLVED: 9 Strategies for Overcoming Hihat Frustration & Left Foot Issues” ✔︎ the-non-glamorous-drummer-llc.ck.page/4807da4fa7
This video is garbage.
I disagree. I keep the opening as low as possible to permit all sounds to fully project. For me, the feel suffers with high hats wide open (especially using closed with foot intricacies including dead notes). Try a stream of controlled 16th notes, hand foot, hand foot, as muted and dry as possible, you'll soon get what I mean.
@@DeanMccormick yup, total disagreement with this vid (hat too open is garbage) and think it's not good for beginners to hear this who don't know better... It really comes down to what feels right and the encouragement should be to experiment with hihat, not set it and forget. Try playing 16's with your foot on the hihat. Need a tight hat for that. ruclips.net/video/RtYcwFmyf78/видео.html
oops, meant to post this one with two hihats going simultaneously. Notice how near to closed the hat on the right is... ruclips.net/video/aOgQzzVOSI4/видео.html
AxveriSCOTT
This doesn’t apply if you play double bass.
Playing open hats while your left foot is on the second bass pedal, kills this idea. But yes, if you play single bass, this is a good idea
There's so much loud guitar in metal you're not going to hear any kind of "chick" sound anyways. If you look at this as a waste to learn then you need to expand your musical library. A drummer should be able to at least play a little bit of all kinds of styles. It's amazing how much it changes the music when adding different flavor of styles.
Joe Troutt i play drums professionally. I’m 100% aware of what genres require different equipment positioning. You would think metal doesn’t require the “chic” sound from a hihat but that is only for death/ black metal. Just because you have a double bass pedal doesn’t mean you play metal. The confusion of double bass automatically meaning metal is the problem. “Perfect circle” is one example of precision hihat work/control with a double bass pedal. The term “mistake” in the title is slightly ignorant
I'm also a metal drummer, thinking the same thing. If you are playing a driving, steady double kick beat, while driving on the hats, you cannot set the hats that wide open.
If you did it would wash everything else out.
If I were a primarily single bass drummer, this would definitely be ideal.
The guy mentioned APC above. While I love that band, the drummer rarely drives on double kick, if ever.
It absolutely depends on the genre that you play. 100%
@@nikhoupt9963 genuinely curious, Is a drop clutch not a thing any more? I haven't played double kick drumming in years now, but that's what I used to do.
@@benjiwill It is still a thing but a lot of lazy drummers won't use it
A lot of people here seem eager to bash on the title. I too was skeptical at first but you actually shed some new light on a technique that I hadn’t ever put much thought into. Adding layers of openness to the hat is a musical game changer. Thank you!
Hmmm, to each there own. I keep mine a bit closer because that’s what I do. You can’t throw out generalizations for music my friend
Yea there's loads of cool reasons to have them set all kinds of ways. I change mine all the time depending what I'm after. He's not usually so be end all with his wording. I'm sure he'd agree with you though.
I have my hats close but they are a bit bright so i get that nice sound and volume. It depends on the hi hat, obv this dudes are a bit dry and quite.
I keep mine close so that they decay faster when I'm playing double pedal
@@DorianTMChannel ive got a pearl clutch that you hit with a stick and the top hat drops. Its a nice inbetween sound. To re engage the clutch you just put your foot on the pedal and it re engages.
@@davewalker3873 Nice, I'll have to check that out
If you are measuring the distance between your hats, STOP.
Vibe, have fun and make cool sounds. Percussion is the shit because the sounds we produce don't have to sound any sort of way. Practice your rudiments, learn independence and appreciate what videos like this are teaching you, but don't forget to laugh at content creators when they tell you that you are making noise incorrectly.
Total!!!!!
It IS possible for you noise to sound like utter shit. To virtually everyone.
I don't think it's outright wrong, but considering opening up this space gives you the opportunity to explore the sounds he talks about
Well said.
You have to be in tune at least
I have to say it depends on how you play, what sounds you're looking for, and what genre you play. This doesn't work for metal drummers who use lots of double bass.
Also matters what kind of hats you have. Some hats have really clear chick sound even when spaced close together, while some hats spaced like he suggests in the video don't have a clear and cutting chick.
Always a good idea to keep the wingnut swung around to the back position so you don't accidentally hit it and loosen the top cymbal while tracking or playing live.
I agree’s he’s not too wordy , not showing off Trying to prove to us that he’s Phil Collins and Neil Peart all in one with a flair of John Bonham your other high hat video really kind of opened a lot for me
bingo. something about that was bothering me, but i couldn't think of it lol
I do literally the opposite of everything you say in the first 3 minutes of this video. Not because anything you say is wrong, but because none of it meshes with the sound I’m looking for. As a metal drummer I don’t need chick so much as a good open sound during double kick. Yes, I own a drop clutch. But it’s just not worth the effort to use one. When I do play other music, I do open the hats up a bit more on the stand but I think that the hats should get progressively closer together on open sizzle sounds. That progressively opening sound is awful to my ear. It’s all about timing and precision foot movement to shape the sizzle open sound to your liking. It depends on what you’re doing. Generally people’s hat sound is bad not because of a setting, but because their foot opens and closes the cymbals out of time. Too early, too late, one of each in either order... that really ruins the sound.
Completely agree, I'm the same👍
❤
Here’s the thing. I know this is gonna sound lazy, but hey whatever. I keep about a 1/4” - 1/2” space between the top and bottom. Reason being, is I don’t want to have to work to keep my hats closed. With 1/4”- 1/2” spacing, All I have to do is Use the weight of my foot to keep the hats closed. I don’t want to have to focus on keeping them closed while trying to groove.
With double bass, you'll just have a louder ring from the hats -- to each their own dawg
That's what I said
I have a second hi hat on other side with a cable pedal next to my bass drum. I use it with less spaced cymbals when using double bass
Get a hi-hat clutch
@@mikeurbanmu I also have a clutch
All depends on what you’re playing. If you use a double bass drum pedal and want to have that nice washy sound while playing a busy double bass pattern, you simply cannot have the hi hats open like that.
Yes one can say get a drop clutch.... yeah but.... not the same sound as just having them open but almost touching each other.
Different strokes for different folks I guess.
Dude love your videos. You give the most advice in a humble, understated way. The drumming community needs more of that.
You are right. Clear information instead of super fast stuff, that is what we need.
I play in a very soft environment playing jazz & soft rock much softer than your demonstration. I use about 1/2” to 3/4” gap which allows me to play time very effectively and keep the volume at an acceptable level. If I used what you recommend 1.5” the volume of that much gap would not work and it would wear my leg out trying to control the volume with the technique I use. I like the one sound you get by opening up the hat wider after the attack.
Keep in mind that just because it's adjusted with a 1"+ space doesn't mean I open it all the way between foot chicks. The idea is versatility, and if I'm playing quietly I'm lightly bouncing my foot on the pedal so that the hats barely open in between notes. The big idea here is versatility - being able to go from quiet to loud instantly if you need to. I totally see what you're talking about, though, and opening wider might be a bit of a stretch if you aren't used to it. Try it out, though, and see if you're able to widen your dynamics! :)
Stephen Clark I’ll play around with it. Thanks so much!
Have always played my hats with less space. Have tried the more space thing, but feel like I have to use more leg energy to push down on the pedal to keep closed, and that is not efficient (IMHO).
It really depends on what you’re trying to play. Similar to how some people prefer matched vs traditional grip.
.....or Lo Throne or Hi Throne....
I love how Ringo played his hi hats. He could make them sound like a sizzle cymbal.
He had those 15 inch high hats that helped out with that sound 👍
Funny you mention ringo- he might have mentioned not hitting the hats at all- a very particular thing Charlie watts does.. guess its a bit off topic..
Nah, I like mine just barely touching when playing. It's all about the Sound to me.
"If it sounds right and feels right, play it"-James Brown
But thank you anyway Stephen!👍👍
I don't agree it has been taugh to me it is only a matter of preference. Prove me wrong but I like the way it is now why would I change ?
Antoine Grand I agree man I’m the same way and I cannot stand the overly splashing hats it’s all preference when it comes to art
Exactly. There is no right or wrong. I totally disagree with this video. Do whatever you find most comfortable and whatever gets the sounds that you want to express.
what works, is what works for you. i prefer my bottom hi hat cymbal tilted.
Great video. How does one get rid of a whining ring when playing with sticks on the hi hat? Like in a bossa? Do I just need better quality cymbals?
I love the end when you show us how great it sounds
I just did that yesterday because I like to experiment and thought it would be better for left foot exercises and now I feel validated.
hi Stephen, i just recently discovered your channel, and I can't simply thank you enough for the tips and information you give. If you are reading this, just wanted to say huge thank you, and thanks to you, I have regained my motivation to working on my techniques!
Ty man, awesome lesson. Im trying to rock solid up my fundamentals everywhere. Really helps.
I love your lessons buddy I’m a self-taught drummer and I kind of just stumbled on that loosening up of the top hi hat I just stumbled on that and wasn’t sure if it was the right thing to do but it to me it just sounded better and then when I saw your video on it did that actually it was cool because it like confirmed what my ears told me I’m a guitar player turn drummer just recording and stuff but I found that I was just playing the same old stuff on the guitar so taking a couple years off and just concentrating on drumming was probably the best thing I ever did for my guitar playing but it is amazing to any drummers out there I find it just amazing the amount of intricacy in the hi hat, My favorite part of the whole drummer ensemble tool kit
For some reason my top hi hat is sideways and the part that faces away from me is closer to the under one that the part that faces me (i guess its the clutch but im not sure)
I think this is super interesting! Though, I don’t know that this applies as well to double-bass players, as having that wide gap the entire time when trying to play the hi-hat at the same time as using both feet for the bass drum likely wouldn’t sound as nice.
True, unless you have a second pair of hats somewhere...
I’ve been doing the opposite where I leave them just open enough to play an open hi hat sound with my foot OFF the pedal, so I can play the second bass pedal and hit open hi hats then still play closed when I need it. Mostly for hard rock or punk. Thanks for the video!
This is a game changer
I’m having a problem where my bottom hat slides and I end up getting a quarter of an inch of over lap from the bottom hat where I would usually hit them any bell fixing this would be greatly appreciated
How long do you play with your sticks and heads?
Depends on the vibe. I move it around. He's right, though about more possibilities if you want them.
Good tips, ill give it a try. Odd how so many people are saying you shouldn't tell people what to do. They can just...choose not to do it? Good video.
You said it at the very beginning, my biggest reason personally for space was keeping time with a big band having to stomp out 2 & 4 distinctly but you also said there's no hard fast rule so those who protested maybe didn't listen closely. Every time I play someone else's set I have to open the hats up about an inch
Awesome ....my son loves the drums and your videos makes ironing out his bad habits easier......👍
Your snare drum is very low--down between your knees. How can you get proper stick control and dynamics when you are striking your head way past the parallel position to your waist? Do you understand what I mean? When first beginning snare rudiments remember : hit the head when the forearm reaches a parallel point in relation to the body . You are over-extending your stroke--this is inefficient. Am I wrong? I wish you could comment on this post. I will not allow my students to rearrange their snare after working on rudiments with proper stick position at the table, to a dropped position between their legs at the kit. Watch Steve Gadd or any great jazz player or big band player--they do not position their snare drum low between their knees. I have even seen players hit their leg with their stroke as the stick hits the head! This cannot be efficient.
PS I should mention that I appreciate your teaching tips in most cases--there are a few conflicting opinions here and there--but very good tips. Thanks. hope you can comment on snare position for me.
I was ready to object, but I like these textures. Gonna try it, Greta.
I started playing drums in 1966 at age 12. In the early 70's I would sit behind and between Butch Trucks and Jaimoe Johanson when a unknown band from Macon called " The Allman Brothers" would play for free on Sundays in Peidmont Park. ... SO..... I was fascinated by their great " hat " sounds. The secret? They used 16 inch hats. As I do now. Any thoughts on 16" hats?
I watched the older video on setting up the hats, especially the angle. I thought that it wouldn't make much difference but man. Together with that sucking technique even tough I didn't really do anything differently the open sound was immediately better.
when I had an accoustic set I would leave the top hat loose put my foot down to a comfortable spot then tighten the nut. When I relesed my foot it went up to about that distance.
My cousin tried to tell me I needed to tighten mine up I agree with you 💯 you can't get any sound with them close👍
Everyone has there own style of course but I appreciated this video because I haven’t played in almost 15 years. Just getting back into it and while I remember basics I also forgot a lot of stuff to. I’m
Re watching a lot of technique videos to properly set up my stuff and find what works for me. I forgot until I watched this video I did normally space mine about an inch lol
Wow!!!!! So many cool fills!!!! Great sound on the hi hat that it’s opened more!!!!!
For over 20 years now I’ve always kept my top hi-hat very tight. The main reason for this is when I first got a set of drums I would try to adjust the clutch to make the top hi-hat a little looser but after a half hour of playing, the nuts that held the top cymbal would work themselves loose and the clutch would come apart. So, as a result of teenage impatience I resorted to tightening the nut on the under side of the cymbal as tight as I could and I would do the same with the two nuts on the top side. Over the years I found that I prefer it tight because I think it gives me more control than I would have if the top cymbal was too sloshy. I noticed that your top hat was just loose enough to move ever so slightly. I think if I used a heavier top hat then I’d play with it looser than I have it now. Any thoughts?
Hi I read your question to Stephen.
What I can tell you for sure is overtightening your hi hat clutch is bad for the cymbal and could lead to cracking eventually. There are many locking clutches available now that prevent loosening.
Gibraltar makes a good one.
Cheers!
I set my hi-hat so that when I hit the bass pedal and hi-hat pedal at the same time, they make sound simultaneously. This way I don't have a flam when both hits land on the same note.
Really good lesson, nice job. Helped me out a lot.
i intentionally keep my hats way closer together than this thumbnail (like 1/16", barely open) for a few reasons:
1. in drum&bass/jungle you never really want to open the hats all the way for any reason, it just isn't a sound that gets used. in some songs the hats are solidly closed the entire way through
2. because the hats are always close miked (and i mean close, like barely not hitting the cymbals), you can make the foot chick as loud or quiet as you need in the mix, but usually you want it quiet as a little bit of extra spice during a ride section or while using one or more X-hats.
3. frankly i find having a hihat that goes everywhere uncomfortable and uncontrollable. it's like having a bird tied to your foot trying to get away.
also, i personally just really don't like the sound of most open hihats when they're more than 1/4" open. the only real exception i can think of is the meinl sand hats. they sound, for lack of a better analogy, like the included drum sounds on a generic ROMpler keyboard
Why are there no felt thingies on top of your cymbals?
I’m also in the camp that disagrees with this advice.
If the hats are closer, playing an open hit in the middle of a tight hi hat groove has more excitement because the hats rattle against each other throughout the duration.
Double kick is also a huge reason to not open the hats that much. I had a quick release clutch, but I would hit the resting closed hats hard enough that the top hat would slosh up just enough to re-engage and then stick open.
I’m genuinely curious if the poster of the video has any double kick experience.
When I saw the title of the video and the thumbnail of the hats, I was thinking the hats were too open already, because even played open at that wide of an opening washes out any groove of definition from the playing. Sloshy hats FTW.
Ooh, cool Tom groove at the end there. I’ve gotta try incorporating the hi hat with the toms!
I play a lot of double bass metal. My hi hats are only about an 1/8 of an inch on the outside and closed on the inside, towards me. Why? Economy of movement. Control. Getting a great open hihat sound without having to have my foot on the hihat pedal. In fact I went a step further, if I want a closed hihat sound during a double bass part I have a second set of hihats for it if I want to. Plus with two pairs of hihats both open, and with 14" and 15" hats, I can change the entire feel of a part by switching off to the other set.
@Stephen Clark I prefer my hats a bit closer together, just that it feels more comfortable and I seem to have more control, although I'm more of a heavy rock or funk inspired drummer so it suits my styles better. A little off topic, you mentioned Paul Mabury, I'm not surprised he's doing well on the drum scene...I live in Perth W.Australia and I went to high school with Paul in the early 90's, he's 2 years older than me, and was a pretty good drummer back then too. We both had the same drum teacher at school. Paul's father is still a very respected guy over here too, who hosted a late night radio show for many years back in the early 90's, he would give people a lot of good advice. I still remember being interviewed by him for a school thing on-air one evening when I was in year 9...I believe he's now back on air...Anyway, just a bit of random trivia...lol👍🇦🇺
good lesson - your kit sounds great, by the way
I was gonna comment but as soon as he said "bottom half" I just started thinking about bottom half guard. What were we talking about again?
The 80/20 Drummer
Am I just being Paranoid or am I in a HiHat Rut:
ruclips.net/video/dhSfMYmNSjA/видео.html
A nicely open and not so tight hi hat will get u its greatest sound and volume, but sometimes u may need to do the opposite to get the volume down, it depends on the gig, the room, the band... So take that into consideration. Also if you play double bass u may tighten it up depending on how u want it to sound in that particular song.
I loved the grooves that you played as examples
I only have about 7 or 8 millimeter gap when I play and I have no problems getting that sucking sound. I can't have it more open than that anyway since I play a lot of double bass meaning I can't have my foot on the hi-hat.
It's not wrong it's a choice.
I play with double kicks and an extra sample pad pedal for cow bells, tambourines.
I some times play both extra pedals while still holding down the hit hat ie heel left and right of hit hat pedal with only the ball of my foot holding it closed.
Your technique would require way to much pressure to keep it closed correctly or be way to slow to push chokes.
As far as the sound is concerned just move stick a little more to the middle so as you open very slowly. The sizzle is created by the edges colliding but the sustain effect is still as you open it.
It's an interesting approach and I recommend everyone play around with it AND hi hat stand spring tension.
Get to know your instrument
Do you ever do studio work for other artists?
I tried it , it definitely added more contrast to my playing
That's the Eric Singer's hi-hat sound secret... I love his hi-hat technique.
Did he use that technique on Seventh Star and The Eternal Idol?
@@Damage_Kase_99 That's right!
I love Seventh Star, nice one, nice performance.
i think thats a matter of personal taste in some cases, what if someone doesnt like that open space, it depends on the music too, but it is usefull to have it open as well, in jazz mostly to keep that breathing feel
Am I the only one who thinks that suggested clutch tension looks ridiculously high? There is a sweet spot where you can get a strong "Chck" sound while still having some foot control. I get that the suggested position might work for some players, but it feels wrong to tell everyone that this is the one way to keep your clutch.
Unfortunately, that is not something you can do when using double bass...
Unless someone prove me wrong, which I would appreciate.
I was going to comment the same thing
Some drummers have more than one hihat. One open, another one closed. Some double bass drummers alternate between pedals. Look up Thomas Lang and Horacio Hernandez.
@@novar0gue yes but I was hoping for a less... hardware hungry solution...
Drop clutch?
@@ryana.7510 but thats only for closed hi hat. Usually you want an open hat sound when using double bass. But of course no as open as these are.
Excellent, as always.
Can’t leave em so clashy when I use double bass. It’s disruptive in a live setting.
So to get the angle on the bottom hat is it just a matter of loosening it abit? Can you maybe do a video on how you do it properly? I enjoyed this video, thanks man!
This video and the pdf that you gave out for free will help me a lot for sure. Thank you!😊
I play mine with no space at all, I just dont put all the weight of the top cimbal, il put it a very little bit highter to make it lighter on the bottom one. Because I prefer this consistant sound
the unsung hero here is that snare
Oops! I always set my HHs intentionally //really close// - because that makes them quieter! I am still a bit of a noob and mostly play on an electro kit though, if that provides some small semblance of defence. But this video explains things well and I shall be setting them wider in future. I still have an innate 'fear' in my drumming, of hurting people's eardrums. Metal kits' High Hats sound so loud when playing them, compared to bass, toms and cymbals, and I don't know how loud it remains by the time it gets away from the kit. I don't have these concerns with an electric kit and headphones/amp.
Anyway, thanks for the lesson, I am going to try it out next time I am on a metal kit! I can see it will give a lot more control and those whooshing notes. I do need to get my left foot going more.
I really like your channel man.
How tight/loose should the top hat be in the clutch?
"Loose enough it can slosh." - if that makes any sense, haha! Definitely not tight, but not completely loose either. Just play around with it and you'll find a sweet spot.
I adjust mine all the time depending on what style I intend to play. Usually closer when playing rock or metal and more open when playing Jazz, fusion or hip-hop
Unless your using a double peddle in which case it needs less space then you think.
I use a double bass kit, I play metal so my hats barely touch each other and that's how most metal drummers have them since we don't close them too often. Good tip regardless
Love your stuff man, 2 videos in and this self taught drummer has learnt a load of tips. This hat trick is going to awaken my left foot to more sonic properties and possibilities. I'm also keen to social distance myself a bit from the kit to try and better my kick technique. Thank you for your time and effort my brother.
Sooooooo I use a double bass with open hats so I have to keep the low
Thanks for sharing this. I've been having to lift my foot all the way and with this I will be able to feel the beat more without having to over-react. Someone else commented here that making rules is bad for playing drums. I disagree. Having limits and confines is what practice is - focusing on specific things in your playing, learning to be more flexible and acquiring new techniques. Then you can switch techniques at will. Also, learning rules allows you to break them once you have mastered them. I do get what he means though. You don't want to limit your ability to develop a style, otherwise you'll wind up sounding like your teachers and favorite drummers. I suppose there's a balance between innovation and tradition.
Some cool techniques that I'm interested to try. But it's not gonna work when I'm playing double bass.
Cannot do that if you love double bass pedal unless you have a second pair of hihats that are closer to close to give you the sizzle!
I thought for sure he was going to say slant the bottom cymbal. That’s what that little screw under the bottom cymbal is for.
Yeah but as a metal drummer I need a smaller gap between the cymbals to get a great sound when im using double pedal
If i open my hats right up i loose control of them. Every set of hats ive ever had have had they're own needs abd qwerks.
Not to retread the same double bass thing, but could you make a vid where you incorporate this into double bass playing?
Sean Reinert in his Evolutionary Sleeper playthrough video does some spectacular hi-hat work in double bass, for an example to see.
So while I don’t want to say you’re wrong, you’re not completely right.
Great teacher....Been playing for many decades, and he always teaches me something new----stuff I should have known a long time ago. Thank you, Stephen.
I use this method: ruclips.net/user/shortsAWkAoAISl3c?si=ucSYJCBbIMtyq9YM
The top cymbal is quite tight, let the bottom one sway. The gap is smaller than yours, never fully open. I can play double pedal with my left heel while my left toe keeps it shut. When I want that morphing "swurp" tone, I would adjust my hand, make the stick touch the hi-hat a bit longer but harder. I can lift my left foot completely when I want to, and I don't have to worry about the hi-hat distance while I play the fills (I like using my hi-hat as crash when I play fills with cymbals, like splash > HH > crash, fully open hi-hat doesn't work).
I appreciate your perspectives and tips. What vintage are your K Customs? Great sounding hats.
Quick question. I'm usually using a double bass pedal most of the songs. What would be a good spacing for my hats if I can't keep em that open?
i would say pretty close to the point where it sounds like your pedaling the hat
Awesome techniques, I learned alot here, thanx.
Thanks Steve. You answered several hi hat setup and playing questions I had with this vid.
Great suggestions!❤
It´s not about the space between the cymbals, but about the speed they´re closed. If they are very close there´s no time to "accelerate". When they are more apart you can step further, stronger and faster.
Defo useful for single kick players.. but really I feel it depends on what you are playing to. Good to have more sounds available 👌👌
What do I do when I’m grooving on open hats and playing double bass?
Not what is shown in this video
I have a hi hat problem nobody seems to mention: when playing open hats, the top hat hits the bottom one unless I have the clutch pretty tight. So I get an extra clunk that I don’t want. I’ve watched videos that say the clutch shouldn’t be too tight but... I have the gap about 1-1.5in
Simple. Two sets of hi-hats, one for the tight sounds, one more open for whatever you need to do. I have a HH set up with a pair of 16in crashes, because I need some smash sounds at times !!
those toms certainly compliment each other... very nice.
Always great videos. Reason why I subscribe
Surely its preference and depends on the sound of the hi hats.
Thank you, gave me more freedom on the drum's. Thank you... R3N
what heads are those?
I'm at about an inch (maybe 3/4), but I've never run in to those problems. I don't play as loud as many drummers do (even though I play a blend of Funk, Rock & Metal), so maybe that's why my time-keeping "chick" never sounds weak. I have a tendency for tendonitis, so playing a little quieter and employing Economy of Motion tactics is crucial for my personal approach. Sounds great how you're using that spacing, though.