The uncomfortable truth: things that happen when you start learning about narcissism
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- Опубликовано: 4 окт 2024
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DISCLAIMER: THIS INFORMATION IS FOR EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY AND IS NOT INTENDED TO BE A SUBSTITUTE FOR CLINICAL CARE. PLEASE CONSULT A HEALTH CARE PROVIDER FOR GUIDANCE SPECIFIC TO YOUR CASE. THIS VIDEO DISCUSSES NARCISSISM IN GENERAL.
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When I left my narc ex husband, I will never forget a family member I trusted telling me, "I wish you would just get over it, move on with your life and stop talking about it". It was like another dagger in my heart, like a whole other level of betrayal and dismissal. Thank God there ARE people like you who get it, Dr. Ramani. 💜💜💜
I concur
❤I understand how you feel.
It’s hard to stop talking about it when you realize what’s been happening
Alanon helped me
@@kathybrem880it’s also the trauma bonding … people don’t understand that.
Just because you have an illness, even a mental illness, doesn’t mean you are allowed to abuse others.
8 million thumbs up 👍🏾 excusing awful abusive behavior bc someone is ill is so gross.
Right! Nobody has the right to abuse another
By definition it's not a mental illness if they know they are doing it.....that's a point being made more and more.....they know what they are doing.
💯!!
My narcissist could explode into a violent rage with virtually no warning ... everything seems like a normal conversation between two calm yet gently disagreeing people, but then in an instant the rage explosion happens. When that happened to me, not only did he grab and deeply bruise my arm (he's 6"6' recovering drug addict, and so powerful he once PUSHED one of my adult horses off its feet in a rage!) but he also drove back and forth to my farm (where he was living at the time) and the last time he drove up (fast) his car had been so badly caved in and damaged he could no longer open his driver's side door from the inside. 😳
I had a business client due and had been waiting outside for them during this, and after he drove up the last time, he picked up one of my wrought iron patio chairs, from right beside me, almost smashed it through the glass in the front door, changed his mind and SHATTERED it by throwing it on the driveway. I was new to narcissism, and didn't understand what was going on and actually raised my voice in outrage and said "That was my (late) mother's!) That was when , shaking with rage, he grabbed my arm and squeezed so hard my entire firearm ended up turning BLACK with bruises, growling " I don't CARE!". When he saw my arm days after, he said it wouldn't have been that bad if I wasn't so old. When he saw my arm during dinner a few nights later, he accused me of " trying to make him feel bad "
Thank God for a couple good friends, a savvy therapist and this channel, I am now free and have sold my farm to get his toxic presence out of my life (and protect my innocent horses from his violent abuse!) and have been no contact since the end of May, 2024.
Thank you, Dr Ramani, for continuing to support me through your videos as I learn about, and try to heal from, having been abused by a vulnerable covert malignant narcissist for over 5 years.
One of the first steps to healing is realizing they will never change. You cannot change them, but you can change what you allow in your life.
Thank you!
And who you allow into your life... Put a stop for it from the beginning....
@matikramer9648 that takes some practice. And it's not just romantic partners and friends, it's family and co workers.
New people are usually pretty easy to manage, once you learn to let them show you who they are before engaging with them in any meaningful way.
Unless they are in a position of authority.
This is so true ❤
Toxic positivity is the worst kind of abandonment. People are invalidating you while they tell themselves they are helping.
@kathleendins.......
Spot on --
exactly
Yeah exactly! They think they are giving you empowering advice by saying things like
You are responsible for your life
You attract what you think about
What was your role in this
Focus on what is good
@@MsLadyKD I'm new to this topic. Those sound like good pieces of advice. May I ask why this would be bad to say?
@@MsLadyKDI hate advice like this, it’s very disrespectful and invalidating. 🙁
@@mariekarlsson7277it's like passive aggressive behavior
Like they are giving you advice but calling you stupid at the same time
If others want to judge me for not associating with the narcissist, let them. I don't need their permission. I choose to be healthy.
Please, do stay healthy 🍀
Yes, that comment right there.❤️
"I don't need their permission " 💯✨️
In 1 callender year maybe 5 days of real anger thinking about it spread out randomly. It's difficult when it happens but I don't act out on it because it always passes. The rest of time is generally good quality. When embroiled with narcs I was sleeping for days on end with burn out. Not realising why I was so tired and jumping into the shower short notice from bed to shower to meet up with narc at short notice to spend money listening to them over drinks with my full attention.
Since extraction my energy levels are so much better.
Most interactions were me listening to their woes and slanders and then being interegated about something followed by an anecdote about back in the day.
I only just realised that they never validated me because they kept interrogation about the same things and nothing seemed to be retained from previous interrogation. Bizarre
🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰
Peter. We at last found out we have been used and not growing wasting yeats if our lives. We also can cover up by being indifferent and allow ourselves to grow and this is what I do studying visiting communicating fellowshipping and he is not allowed to enter in this whatsoever
Be careful what you tolerate, you are teaching people how to treat you.
I love my nieces and nephews so much ❤ and they love me as well 😊 but the parents are narcissist and I decided to go no contact because at every interaction, they treated me badly Infront of their kids 😢 so I woke up to the fact that the parents, my siblings, where teaching those pups to mistreat their untty 😢
Absolutely right.
I don’t know if that’s as black & white as you say.
Some of is didn’t have another way of being treated. How would we know there are options?
How would we know the “right” way to respond to a familiar (family-iar) threat?
What I do may convey to others that I’m used to substandard treatment, that I’m vulnerable. In that sense, people “learn” that. But I am not “teaching them,” how to treat me. “Teaching” is an active verb. It also presupposes knowledge. “I don’t know what different is,” is not the same as, “I am making a fully informed choice to “LET” this person treat me with contempt and capitalize upon my vulnerability.”
Sorry. No bueno.
The onus of bad behavior is on the other person. Their exploitation of the vulnerable is their choice.
My being vulnerable may or may not have been a choice at all.
😢what u just said is true😢😢😢
@@MK-mt4knI agree.
There are worse things than being alone. Being in a home that is unsafe physically or emotionally, being alone is an improvement.
Narcissists don't get diagnosed because they surround themselves with enablers who often benefit from them, or are on the "payroll" in some way. These enablers don't call them out, because it's not in their interests to do so.
Sometimes enablers don't realize what they're doing or the harm they're causing.
Ask me, I was one, until the narcissist turned on me and I learned about narcissism. I'll live with that guilt always, but I won't make the mistake again.
@@marieborchardt2910 Don't feel guilty. They are able to dupe just about anyone. I "enabled" one for many, many years, or at least I was accused of it. We all have choices to make when dealing with these difficult people.
Yeah,enables don't usually live with a narc)
And it is so sad when the enablers are your friends who you thought had your back.
@@AS-tz3gv or your family members.
It's so painful, but I can't keep doing the same thing and expecting different results
Oh yeah hope makes us go back but really we’re banging our head against a wall.
Little by little, your eyes will open wider. Going through four divorces opened my eyes and my mind. Wiser now, stronger, free and much happier living alone.
@mollypaskie5039..
I'm going through it with my husband and now we are talking about divorce. For the first couple of years I thought something was wrong with me ,but the more I studied his behavior I knew something wasn't right. Stay strong and congratulations on your new life.
The definition of insanity, which is exactly how you feel in it.
Dr Ramani, I use to binge watch your videos 5+ years ago and have just now revisited you today. You are, and were, the tip of the spear in battling these lower evil forces of human nature. You were the first to help me understand these patterns and escape a lifetime of suffering. My life is Blessed beyond because of you, Dr Ramani. Thank you. I appreciate your fight for humanity. You helped save so many of us. Much Love to you, Doc.
@Dominic-tn9gv. I do hope you're well & i can relate very much to your comment.
Because narcissists change their "masks" quickly and with ease, many others only see the charming side of the narc. So clearly, the empath who is abused is the problem, not the narc. Yes, it makes me feel naked and alone.
❤❤❤
I understand and yes he changes quickly especially after he's done something to ware I've reacted and that's all people see
I've been trying to help my brother through his separation from a narc. I need to let go of this because he keeps cycling back to hopes for change. Meanwhile the narc keeps dragging him back in and monetarily and spiritually designating him. This cycling is causing issues for my mental health. How do I put boundaries up and still help him?
Show him this channel and others like it. Then let him decide, whilst telling him you will support his decision to leave. Not stay.
@@LoriCrawford-m9w
If people abandon you because you’ve opened up about abuse of any kind….. that person isn’t your friend.
Some people don’t have the ability to cope with abuse and I bet there’s abuse in their own lives or they’re an abuser themselves.
If they won’t listen to you, they can’t, they don’t have the capacity.
Sometimes we level up in life …. We become conscious of abuse and we want to stop it ….l. So many people are not levelling up. It’s ok. You’re levelling up…. I found many people left but I found new people who had either gone through it or could see it too and helped me to move up in my life.
If a friend shames you for opening up - they’re part of the problem! ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
Yes, they do.. or they went something like it and still didn't levelled up...
Now discovering this and it's hurts so bad
Oppositional. Controlling. Manipulative. Bully.
Yes! The shame!! When someone says you don't have to do this alone & you reach out for support only to feel stupid, and again, alone.
Watching these videos and reading the countless blogs, I know that there are so many of us that are dealing with narcissist abuse, past or present. I don’t feel stupid or alone. I am relieved that I have ended some toxic one-sided realationships. I have peace in my home.
Or told you shouldn't gossip about your marriage mate.
My spiritual family who I loved and trusted so much slandered me and deliberately trampled me and killed me and left me at the side of the road.
@@laurengarrett9005 but it is okay to slander outright slander ( it was no gossip) me and rip up my own trust and love I had for everyone. Including our Creator. They lost I still trust Him. I guess no one thought of that deliberately stumbling someone is not a good thing in Jehovah's eyes.
I’m autistic. I’m just realizing that people say to reach out, but don’t really mean that. They get overwhelmed and resent you.
Narcissism is definitely something that you have to actually learn about. It's so counterintuitive that I don't know if a person can fully grasp what's going on without actually researching narcissism itself. You might know that there's something wrong, but the real reasons and the real motivations might be a mystery for a lifetime.
That's why this knowledge is so valuable. People are not going to figure this out on their own in their lifetime. But if they're taught about narcissism, they'll have some of the tools it takes to protect themselves and the people they love.
Mystery for a lifetime really resonates with me. Great comment.
I had been abused by my psychopathic father until the day he died. Most my so called friends were narcissist. But when I first started to study the narc it blew my mind. Being I was still living through it I was able to observe it. Still it took me a long time to catch on to it. Now I can see it. I don’t think people who haven’t ever lived through it are going to fully get it.
Yeah it’s so insidious that it’s often in plain sight. Narcissism awareness is a great starting place. Xxx
You're right that it would take more than a lifetime to figure out this pattern, heal from it, and thrive all on one's own without any help, knowledge, or support. We have heard many people wasting decades or a lifetime in these relationships. So it's huge to be freed from the abuse cycle with this information. I hear about Dr. Ramani about 5 years ago, and it still took about 5 years to really GET this information. It's Not You is on my nightstand.
@@SherryTomlinson-mk7gm I noticed as I created a boundary and went low contact with my family alot of my relationships feel under similar patterns. Work has got to start somewhere. Glad I have eyes to see it now.
I’ve often cried when I realized nobody would ever cherish me
We need to learn how to cherish ourselves love…and let spirit, angels…your “team” cherish you…because they already do. Just open to it. 🫂💕💕💕
What Connie said.
Exsctly.
🌟🦋
❤Me too... I think that has been the hardest for me to deal with... 😢
“Doesn’t pair well with chicken salad.” I’m going to remember that and smile now every time my feelings are dismissed.
You are an ANGEL in my life. I am 80 … lasted out near 60 yrs in confusion n obligatory rationalizations …propagandas of PDSD … doormat 70times 70 forgiveness..THANK YOU FOR THE LIGHT
For me it was my sister. I needed to talk to her about it and her response was very aggressive, "I DON'T HAVE TIME FOR THIS!" That hit me hard, because I thought she cared about me. It was a verbal slap in the face!
Ditto..
My husband had an aunt that doted on him and she, I thought, liked me as well. When his abuse started getting too much for me to bear, I was on a Skype call with her and I told her what was really going on. I knew that she was the only person who he was likely going to listen to. After I told her, she angrily said "I don't have time for this!" and hung up! The woman was retired and absolutely 'had the time for this'! In retrospect, she could not tolerate the image of her perfect nephew to be tarnished.
Same, after sending pictures of injuries from Narc ex, told to think of good things. Very painful. Totally abandoned by everyone, friends, family, everyone. I lost all trust in humans.
I never called for help from my sister but the first (and last )time I asked her only to listen to me ,she answered the same .I wentno contact since that time
Yes, same thing happened to me. My sister has ALWAYS been there for me and we have never really fought, except when it comes to this narcissistic guy I'm still struggling to kick out of my life for good. I'm still reeling from the nasty and passive aggressive way my sister treated me. The narc guy, well I expect bad treatment from him, but from my own sister?! It's a massive betrayal, isn't it? And one of the worst things is that it feels like a punishment. I was judged weak or foolish or whatever because of my continued involvement with the narc guy, and the "court" decided my punishment was that I would no longer be entitled to the emotional support or good opinion of my big sister. As a result, we haven't spoken in over two months, and even if we reconcile I don't think our relationship will ever be the same. As you can probably tell, my feelings about this estrangement are still very raw. It really hurts when one of the very few people who you thought would always love you, and who don't seem toxic, kick you when you're down and then abandon you while you're gasping for breath 😢
i'm out and free, but telling others that still have to deal, that the narc will never change, was life changing.
People are so fooled by the narcissist that they really don't believe how awful they are in private. 😢
It’s such a grief when you have to let go of the hope that they will change. Radical acceptance is the way though. ❤❤❤
@annjohnson8437 if utscso had, why don't you leave?....I heard a lot
Good for you! Working through my escape atm. Still connected by property that needs to sell and seeing the cyles happening like before just with less contact but once its sold then I'll be free.
People stay for several reasons. Trauma bonds, finances, kids, cognitive dissonance just to name a few@@carolhill8917
When you are neglected by a narcissistic mother since birth and a counsellor tells you that you have 'abandonment issues'.....so I'M the problem...... And my narc husband said I should love him 'unconditionally, just the way he is" so the onus was on me to change and accept his abuse rather than him change and not be abusive, because, you know......he's not well.
Yeah, don't you love it when inept "counselors" or "therapists" pathologize our symptoms and make it about US, when actually we are having a NORMAL reaction to being treated ABNORMALLY!
high five of Belgium... i sooo know what you mean...
Never love a man ‘unconditionally’. He’s not a child. Love isn’t free & should absolutely have conditions
Yes. I wouldn't trust any counsellor who spoke to me like that. In fact I'd advise being very careful before choosing any counselling. I did some counsellor training and frankly, I wouldn't trust any of the participants on the courses I did. I was very suspicious of the tutors/examiners as well. Their view of the world and their so-called techniques/tools is very skewed.
@@SierraNovemberKiloThank you. I had a therapist tell me ‘sometimes we just need to put up with our husbands’. Seemed to me she never had a good relationship in her life. Sad really, it really does need to be this way.
As my ex sought to sell our house out from under me during our divorce negotiations, a friend who knew both of us said to me, “Oh, he just wants closure.” I went out-of-control off on this “friend,” and never spoke to him again. I’m not proud of how I reacted. But I flew off the handle a lot in those days and I forgive myself for it. I was under severe pressure and stress and consequent emotional dysregulation.
A “friend” that’s ok with you getting screwed over is ok with screwing you over. Be glad they outed themselves.
When I was going through my divorce with the narcissist wife, I learn too late that most people do not understand the abuse that I had been going through. Some “friends” were amused or thought it was funny that the wife left me with two young kids and a new mortgage to take care. Lesson learn: be careful who you talk to during difficult times. Some of these people do not have your best interest in mind.
@@racebannon96 If narcissism does nothing else it will pull a person’s true character out of them.
You can’t just forgive yourself you also need to apologize to those you hurt.
@@racebannon96
So true.
Once you see it you can't unsee it. Now just to heal with and deal with it. It is everywhere. It hurts and it sucks. I prefer ✌️❤😊
Exactly! It’s like you finally turned on the lights-never having realized you were in the dark.💡
Once I healed and recognized that my mom was a narcissist, I also realized I had friends and other relationships throughout my life who were also narcissists. I must have been attracting them like flies. Crazy! I was abused not only by my parents but also by people I thought were friends. Realizing this is painful, I am still trying to wrap my head around it. I was also living in fight or flight and trying to survive, so I do realize I was never going to see it either; I was surviving. Thank God for my trauma therapist, who literally changed my life. Now, I have no contact with everyone who hurt me.
My parents were were both horrible people and I collected others similar to them like charms on a bracelet. When the reckoning came I had to let go of over 40 friends, family and flying monkeys I'd always thought were friends. Still digging myself out of financial and other issues but at least there aren't any fake people hovering around giving me bad advice like they didn't mean it or your mother loves you and family sticks together.
Same. This happened to me. I had get rid of almost everyone in my social circle. I was so being abused so many people that the kind people in my life were being neglected.
@@momoshiggles3631 truth
Hugs. trump's narcissism, and therapy, has just recently opened my eyes to the fact my Mom has always hated me. I'm recently out of that. I won't go back. I no longer have any blame for my older brother's death at 24. This is so damn hard.
You are a modern day sage, Dr. Ramani. You have enlightened us and given us the knowledge and power to not only understand narcissism but also to cope and combat this darkness. Thank you so very much!
We are not alone, we have people like you with us.
Your work is life-saving.
Thank you, Dr Ramani.
When you are married to a vulnerable narcissist and finally realize what you have been going through it kind of shocks you. That is the beginning of a whole new reality, one you couldn't even imagine. If you truly feel you are involved with a narcissist and research it, listen to and take to heart everything you learn. I did but didn't and still haven't left to my demise. I am a 60 year old man and feel like I am not half the man I used to be. The longer you wait the less of a person you will become. I still learn of things I can't believe. Save yourself. I am almost out but this is the hardest challenge I have ever had to go through. I live this video and I cant say enough about that what I have learned on this channel is absolutely true.
After you leave, you’ll find yourself again. It’s not too late. You’re worth the effort it will take to live your life from your heart!
I am a 61 old man, just left the narcissist female partner and feel the same.
I hear you, sir.
I hear and comprehend each word you chose, each phrase you wrote.
It is real.
And just as you describe.
I want to validate your experience so you can continue your upleveling.
Best wishes, sir!
🌟🦋
42, and currently divorcing a covert narc
“Juggling Multiple Chainsaws” Perfect explanation.
"It doesn't matter what you do -- you're always WRONG."
Gas lighting and projection is very common with narcissists.
And you are always being punished
It’s far more than 1% of the population that’s for sure.
Always!!!!
The worst is the question: Why dont you just leave? If its that bad? (Followed by an almost audible rolling of eyes)
Widowed, I married a covert that turned psychopathic on the honeymoon. It lasted 8 months. My closest friend ghosted me and my adult daughter's reaction to my "sinful divorce" nearly took me out completely. SO CRUSHING. I'm not sure what was hardest to heal from.
My second husband became abusive right after I said "I do" after a year of him being Mr nice guy.. My family has always blamed me for my divorces. ❤
I’m so sorry! So painful!
I’m so sorry! I totally understand the pain of a covert narcissist in your life and not being believed by the people who you are closest to.
The wedding was a disaster. I wasn't 'allowed' anything the way I wanted. On the honeymoon I was afraid of him.
It happens to people in the public eye. Prue Leith the cook/author suffered this way. It seems anyone can get caught out. So-called friends abandonment is just egregious ignorance and lack of thought/compassion. Best to know the truth, I say.
My whole family has looked away and hurt me badly when I was really struggling with trying to heal from severe abuse. Super messed up and hurtful. Grateful for this community ❤
I hear you. It’s been the same for me.
This is very common
Same for me from my own family of origin.
I understand.... Don't give up,we r in this together ,it has to be a point of healing
Narcissist, otherwise known as satan in the flesh. You don't need a PhD to figure this out. Thank you, Dr. Ramani, for validating so many of us who have experienced this. Truly, hell on earth.
Yes, Satan in the flesh is a perfect description! 💯
Performative empathy is something my father mastered. So, despite the fact that I had tons of evidence that my father abused me in horrific ways, I was still met with resistance when I told some people I trusted about his abuse. They didn’t want to believe it. It’s like it was easier for them to write me off than to have their beliefs about him challenged. It’s absolutely unbelievable when this happens to us. Narcissists don’t care what they do to us and then others don’t understand the damage they do when they don’t support us. We don’t want to endure abuse and we don’t want to go to anyone with these stories. While they decide it’s easier for them to not hear about it, what about what we experienced? What about the support that’s essential for healing? It’s devastating to trust someone enough to share with them only to get shut down.
Yeah, it's "too much" for them to hear, well how about those of us who EXPRIENCED the abuse firsthand?! It was "too much" for us, but we had to bear it anyway. It is truly devastating to reach out for support, only to be shut down because it's "too much" for them to hear.
I had that experience when I shared something from my childhood with a family member about another family member.
It actually took years for my sibling to come to terms with what I told them.
This happened with my siblings. I’ve had to come to terms with the painful reality that they too are likely narcissistic like our father. Thank God for lots of therapy to help me wrap my mind around the entire FOO being unhealthy and involved in my father’s scapegoating of me.
@@dnk4559 I experienced the exact same thing. 2 siblings, identical twins, involved in my father’s scapegoating of me, unwilling to accept or hear the truth about who he is and what he did to me. They don’t want to believe it. They suffered abuse too, but don’t see it. But, like you, I experienced the worst of it. We know that experience. Then, to top it off, the siblings we grew up with aren’t there to support is or help us heal. Since my sisters are identical twins, 2 years younger than me, they function like a single entity. They bully me, act like they’re better and refuse to believe the awful truth that no one wants to believe, LET ALONE EXPERIENCE. I always knew I longed for the connection and bond that they shared, but I didn’t understand the complexity or depth of that longing as a child. Being twins protected them from the monster. He worked individually on me, manipulated my perception of my mom after she left him, lied in court about things we told him, had family enablers providing the best lawyers, and won joint custody. The twins had each other and he chose the easy way, to manipulate, brainwash, gaslight, indoctrinate me, one individual child. I stood no chance up against him. I believed he loved, cherished, protected…me. And I trusted him. Idk if this is flowing or making sense. But he devastated my childhood, life, relationship with my mom, and more. Their childhood was more joyful than mine. Looking back at pictures, I see the innocence in their eyes, but in mine, innocence lost. Joy stolen. (When we were with our mother). Things evolved from those childhood experiences that differed so dramatically. You want to believe your siblings and you are tied tightly together. Lacking that sense of belonging to something bigger, a family unit, brings a lot of grief. Being the one who was scapegoated is really painful. It’s heartbreaking. To have siblings participate or stand by during our abuse just amplifies the entire experience. I recently lost my stepdad and had to go to the wake and funeral. So many family members didn’t even acknowledge me. It made me realize the power these people have. Even though it was the other side of the family, the effects wore on. I remained silent out of fear during the worst of the abuse. Post abuse, I’m still the scapegoat and through them, his lies got to the entire family. My mom’s memory is fading. She’s the only other person who experienced his abuse and supports me. But she’s lost her flare and ability to call bs as it is and she was mourning the loss of her husband. So what was I to do but endure the secondary trauma. Maybe even beyond secondary. It’s pain stacked with pain. It’s so lonely and isolating. Sorry to go on, but I relate so much to this comment. I’m sorry for your experience too. I’m in therapy and it’s the only thing that’s getting me through. Too much loss. At least we have this outlet and each other, and we know better, yet it doesn’t stop the pain.
@@erinward2983 I wish you lots of healing. It is so much work but I’m starting to come to terms with it and finally able to really distance myself from my siblings. They are sick traumatized people who want to keep the scapegoat narrative going so they can avoid dealing with the painful truth. I’m grieving their loss but also have more and more peace thanks to God for giving me the strength to step away!
I learned about this in my 40s better late than never. I’ve learned so much .only if I knew then what I know now , my life would be soooo different.
I totally hear that! It alters your whole life
The greatest trick of the devil is to make people believe that he does not exist. (Baudelaire, Les Fleurs du Mal)
When people don't want to hear about your struggles, it's like saying "My feelings are more important than yours."
Ask them to do something for you. Something small. Something you would do for them with no hesitation. If they are narcissistic or otherwise toxic, it will ALWAYS go at least 1 of 4 ways (though sometimes these reactions may compound): They will act as though they didn’t hear you. Depending on how long you’ve been in the relationship, you may ask again. If it’s been long enough, you’re likely to drop the request right then and there.
They will promise to do it, but never follow through.
If you ask again or remind them, they will usually have some kind of excuse. In these cases, they will still never actually fulfill their promise. Their excuse is not a reason for lagging, it is the reason they should be absolved from all expectation whatsoever. Often this excuse will be meaningless or an outright lie.If you don’t buy their excuse, and tell them so, you will experience the wonderful segue into reaction.
An argument will ensue
The argument will be your fault. It could be a small back and forth contending against your request, or it might quickly devolve into them screaming at you. You never know which it will be. They might even say outright that you should never ask or expect anything from them. Usually they will express that you are asking too much, hurting them in some way (financially, emotionally, insulting them, etc), or attack your character.
The argument will only end when you relinquish your request + apologize, or start ignoring them completely. If you can ignore them long enough, they may apologize to you. However, the conflict will never feel truly resolved.
At this juncture they may actually end up giving you what you asked for. Often this does require you admitting that you don’t really need it, or that you would be fine with what they suggested instead. This leads us to reaction
They give you what you asked for, BUT
There is ALWAYS a catch. It might be small. They show up late with no apology. They buy you what you wanted, but it’s the wrong color, model, brand, etc. They take you where you wanted to go, but pressure you the whole time you’re getting ready because you’re going to be sooo late. Then they want to leave early anyway. It might be worse. They do it out of anger, and make a big display out of it to scare/hurt you. They hold it over your head until you do something for them first. Or, later on, they use it against you. “I did x for you, so you should do y for me.” No matter what, you never actually feel fulfilled, happy, or loved when they do something for you. Somehow, even from the getgo, there was this deep-seated feeling of guilt and fear, this sense that the “special” things they were doing for you weren’t so special at all. Eventually, you become afraid to ask for anything. You’ve been conditioned to believe you deserve nothing. Ironically, or not, the less demands you make, the worse you will be treated. Moreover, Catching a cheating spouse might be difficult, and knowing what local laws say you can and cannot do might be even more difficult. To simplify the process, consider hiring a private investigator to do the sleuthing for you I genuinely appreciate how incredible you are and your work! Thank you for a job well done digitalinvestigate@gmail.com
Awesome. TY so much for the clarity!
Incredible knowledge,lived every word as the victim.just so much evil out there, and now it's even worse when you have other people against you because of perpetrators.
@@michaelsvientek8420 so true.
So many people against us, behind the scenes, that we don't even know.
Maybe time to relocate now that we see why we allowed this... fresh start as a more healthy person.
🦋🌟🌿
The narc destroyed my life. CPTSD and learning disabilities . But my family who is left including my daughter ignores it. My brother says it wasn’t so bad. Him at 72 is a hermit , smokes and drinks and hides his true self. Who is an extremely sensitive guy. My other brother drank himself to death at 51. Yes being ignored is awful! Abandoned! Yes, Dr Ramani unicorns and rainbows! 😢
My whole life my parents gaslighted me into thinking I was impulsive with money, even my own money that I earned myself, because I could buy nicer things for myself that were nicer than anything they could provide for me. My mother even made sure she brought this up with my very first psychiatrist and the doctor re-diagnosed me accordingly.
Talk about a conflict of interest! Mom needed to get her own psychiatrist.
In my parents' ethnic culture (they were immigrants from another country) your money is not your money. It's considered everybody's money. So when I came across a windfall a few decades ago, it was expected I start paying for things that had nothing to do with me (helping to contribute money to relatives overseas, assistance in paying for for home improvements, etc.)
Years after my parents died I am only now starting to heal from the way I was guilted my whole life into believing I was always the problem or mentally ill when all I wanted was a life and identity separate from my parents, something my parents found impossible to fathom.
I relate so deeply to this. I also come from an immigrant family and the ethnic culture enables "financial Enmeshment" . Your seen as a selfish and ungrateful person for simply prioritising your own life. Allowing yourself to build a life of your own by drawing a clear line that separates the families responsibilities and your own is treated as a threat.
It's a slippery slope that can ruin your personal finances. The fear, gulit and obligation tactics that narcissistic parents use are extreme when it comes to money. I am only learning now that I am not a bad person for wanting my own life, completely removed from the responsibilities of my family.
I relate to this too .I thought I was alone
I can relate so much. Well said.
Wow! Hope you’re enjoying life now.
My husband convinced me I was bad with money when my first child was born. He took away all forms of money; bank accounts & credit cards & made me sign a contract stating what I was allowed to spend money on. I had needs he refused to meet, but instead shamed & humiliated me for having them. He made me believe his lies. Am I bad with money? NO. It’s about control.
I was confused, isolated & hopeless.
I finally filed for divorce a week ago after 18 years of this emotional abuse from hell.
It’s overwhelming. We really have to validate ourselves and learn to have boundaries. I don’t think narcissists have proper boundaries - they manipulate and control because they don’t have boundaries. As a person with a narcissistic mother and a father who left when I was eight…. I wasn’t taught how to stand up to the manipulation and control. Now, at 53, I’m learning I can say no to things I don’t like and if someone doesn’t like it, we can discuss it in a relationship. If someone won’t discuss something if it’s hurt you, they are not in relationship. So many people are codependent and not owning their own boundaries because they’re shamed by others.
We have to be brave to feel our own feelings ( not just blame the narcissist) , figure out what we want to say, be brave enough to confront the other person ( a dreaded thing if you were raised by a narcissist) and then leave a relationship if we’re unhappy ( it feels like death).
Find the people who understand you. First step though is validating yourself … a hard step but be brave dear friends ….. it’s worth it. ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
If someone is making you suffer, it’s not your fault.
Your recovery is though your work. 😍❤️🥰
I can so relate and I am the same age. It is crazy the similarities-but the work is so worth it. Once you realize what happened to you and educate yourself and protect your mental and emotional/physical well being - it is all positive and for your own good. 👍🏾
The problem isn’t having boundaries. It’s the enforcing of those boundaries. That’s what no one wants to discuss. Narcs are violent and their unpredictably and instability is the real problem.
@@terrybuckley2850 thanks yeah. After learning so much about narcissism ( thanks to Dr Ramani mainly, Jerry Wise and Danu ) and I’m now learning about boundaries ( there’s a lot of good stuff out there - I really like therapy in a nutshell though she’s not validating for a narcissistic upbringing, she’s very healthy and great for learning how to set healthy boundaries) xxx
After listening to my long time friend complain endlessly throughout our 8 year friendship, I realized it was a one way street. The one time I wanted to share something serious and sad that had recently happened she did exactly what Dr. Ramani described. She covered her ears.
You just can't believe the reality YOU have THOUGHT you put YOURSELF through.
I wish narcissism was a real diagnosis back in the 1970's and 1980's. I was raised by a narcissist mother; and kept dating/marrying one nsrcissist after another. I was constantly in theraoy trying to figure out what was wrong with me, and the therapists offered little help.
My mother occasionally came to visit her grandchildren and would stay with my husband and I while she was in town. My marriage had been toxic a long time, and my mother was loathe to listen to my pleas for help, so we didn't talk about the abuse I was experiencing. On one such visit, my mother witnessed a rage outburst from my husband that included a verbal attack and physical violence that left me visibly bruised for weeks afterwards.
My mother's response was to immediately pack her bags and leave for her own home some 8 hours drive away. Her parting words to me were, "Don't expect to see me again. You got yourself into this mess, so you can get yourself back out of it."
A couple of years later while I was going through the divorce from Hell, I contacted my mother and asked if the kids and I could come and stay with her because I was desperate to find a safe place away from my abuser.
Again, she said it was my problem, and she wanted nothing to do with it.
My mother was a narcissistic herself. When I got married, she told my husband that she'd done all she could with me and she thanked him for taking over saying, "maybe you can knock some sense into her."
I’m so very sorry! I hope you are in a much better place now and if not that you are moving in that direction. No one deserves this kind of treatment! Sadly those of us who grew up with narcissistic parents are more likely to attract narcissistic spouses.
@@dnk4559 yes, I'm sure that is true. Familiarity with narcissistic abuse from childhood sets a person up to fall into similar relationship patterns later in life. Unfortunately. Thank you for your kind response.
@@pipersfancy, sounds like my Mom ! Are they sisters?! J/k 😂. . All jokes aside , I feel for you like I’ve finally started feeling myself. I’m divorced from a covert narcissist for over a year now and am in a healing phase that needed to happen YEARS ago ! I pray that you and your children are healthy , safe and starting your journey towards peace and healing 🤗🙏🏾
❤I understand
That was a rotten thing to say
When I described my mother as narcissistic I was put down and described as overly dramatic. I ended that relationship.
The people that don't want to know about narcissism and the enablers are the same people. Just two different strategies of enablement. When I was being "punished" by the narc in my life, my family had two different responses. One group actively helped make me suffer. The other group kept their distance. I told myself at the time that they were trying to avoid becoming a target themselves. But the truth is that I would often hear that they thought I was making trouble by failing to pretend that the petty revenge the narc was taking on me wasn't for altruistic reasons or for not pretending that it had never happened. Within months, I moved to another town. Two years later, I moved out of state.
Within five years, as more family began to have to deal with the narc's behavior, they expressed their anger with me for having "abandoned" them to deal with the narc alone. (Sigh) You can't win. Not with the narc and not with the enablers.
So true!!!
"You get shamed when you start noticing red flags".. I felt that. Thank you, Dr. R. for the validation.
My mother's family indulged her and tip-toed around her for years. It actually didn't do them any good but it was her children who really suffered.
When I told someone who had been my father’s sister-in-law for years, known him for decades, and who stuck up for me (speaking directly to him, though he wasn’t responsive at all and I still believed he was a good person who needed my help so I stayed - decades later, he still expressed extreme anger toward me for the incident) for him expecting me to take care of him instead of supporting my plans to go away to school, her response to the horrific abuse I endured decades later stunned me. She told me she didn’t feel comfortable getting involved and helping me file a police report about being abused. I didn’t know what to do. I was devastated and confused. She wasn’t related to him anymore. She just didn’t want to be involved. My uncle had passed and she wasn’t involved with the family anymore. I felt stupid for asking her for help.
You learned. And sometimes it is painful. I have been through it too. I picked up the pieces and moved on. I quietly left that person. Some people have no empathy and are not worth having anything to do with.
@@racebannon96Exactly right.😳
I agreed with Dr. Ramini that whenever one is mentioned about the NA..., people roll their 🙄 eyes and 🤧 in contempt😏.. Period..
Most people want to feel and give deep emotional love for someone. But when you're in a narcissistic relationship you have to be emotionless like Spok from Star Trek, if you choose to stay.
"You feel abandoned." YES!
If people leave me feeling yucky in any way, I avoid them. For now, I need healing and if people can't provide me with comfortable and safe companionship; (They DON'T NEED TO KNOW ALL MY STUFF EITHER); then I don't need to be around them.
Common decency needs to prevail before I get close to anyone anymore; at least for now.
Thank Dr. Ramani! God bless you! Amen!
Everything you say yes... it is painful... having someone believe can save a life.
You are right, this is a discussion that has to be had.
You just can't trust others because of a miriad of reasons. Abandonment is a open wound.
I don't know how many comments I have almost shared now but won't. The vulnerability is too damaging.
Why did it take 58yrs to figure my own parent was gunning for me? 😢 I'm not planning on turning 59 with the same mindset ever again and it makes me feel like sh*t still 🎯💯
It took me 54 years so you’re not alone. I think we want to believe the best about our parents and we hang on to the breadcrumbs.
53 years😉
@@Ozy-te1rr welcome to the club we didn't never wanna be in💯🎯❣️ Stay Strong 😇💋
Set boundaries and do what's best for you. The focus is you
I remember when I was with the ex narc husband, i told my so called best friend since childhood (now ex friend) about some of his abuse. one evening over the phone, i told her about some of his abuse. I confided with her. She didnt say a single word, just stone cold silence she didn't want to know, just didn't care. It hurt deeply. I was there for her when she was going through a breakup in her marriage previously.I vowed to myself I'd never tell her anything again. In the end I gave up on the friendship as she started competing with me, trying to one up me, playing immature mind games.
Why is it that after all these years.. when you figure it out. Ppl think you should have gotten over it, but one of these days you feel this rush of emotions and you still burst out.
I think it’s so shocking when you find out about narcissism that your whole world view has to change, you’re allowed to be emotional about that. It’s tough. Hug ❤
L
I feel you, going thru the same thing. My relationship was over in 1996 and I’ve recently started wanted to talk about it because I realize what I actually dealing with for so many years. I had no idea back then. I guess I need another way to vent or validate myself, I’m driving people away.
@@rsoubieaI got married to narcissist Melford Morris in 1993, discarded for his adulteress in 2003, in a narcissistic fog for years and all kinds of illnesses, it a miracle in August 2023 I know what demonic 👿 hell I went through. His adulteress, saunia walker and his flying monkeys all narcissists. I am 54 years old and friends abandon me, but my 91 and 88 parents, listens to me, but I Persevering in Prayers Psalms 1-150🇯🇲👑🙏👍
I haven’t gotten over it. You just don’t get over sever narcissistic abuse. It will pop back up in my mind out of no where. I gave away most of our family pictures to my daughter. They make me sick
Persistantly problematic behavior patterns is my go to phrase.
I tried talking about it to a couple of other siblings, and even told them about Dr. Ramani's channel, and while they sympathized with me, they just didn't want to get in depth. I think it's because their family dynamics with the family narcissists were different than mine. They didn't get bullied the way I was. But at least on said they felt bad that they didn't stick up for me more. They didn't realize the damage that was being done.
Demeaning. Invalidating. Abusive. Counter parenting.
I would so much rather have uncomfortable truth than live in that delusional world of the narcicisst and my own delusional thinking that I must be wrong about this person. I went into denial so many times thinking that this just CAN NOT be happening or there is an easier pathway to being healed.
"...calling it a diagnosis doesn't actually help ANYONE."
So true.
No diagnosis needed. The person struggling in the relationship is not the person who would be diagnosed.
The person who is struggling needs the knowledge, support, and encouragement.🌟
Amen
Sounds like my former boss when employees complained about being sexually harassed by the CFO. He was completely incompetent, he just wanted to collect his paycheck and not deal with any the office blatant problems.
I truly believe ‘knowledge will set you free’. I have studied, researched and tried various methods my entire life to break out of these narcissistic relationships since child hood. I instinctively disconnected from my country because I was surrounded my narcissists, family, ex boy friend and boy friend at the time. I ended up with cancer and my mother telling me she couldn’t deal with it, it was too overwhelming for her and that was the last straw. I couldn’t understand why I ended up dating the same kind of person, handsome, brilliant and with a different face. I married one and stayed for 24 years. Even after the divorce 7 years ago he is still hoovering. Amazing! I got rid of all and I am getting to know myself. I could write a book about all the things I tried, all completely unsuccessful. When my daughter turned 18 I left and she said:‘I wonder why you didn’t get divorced earlier.’ Leave, get out and heal!’ It’s the only way.
❤️
After much hesitation, I finally told my brother my father had had me cornered and was threatening to punch me in the face. His response: "You must have deserved it." I asked how? "You must have smart mouthed him".
Same with my family. I was accused of causing my father to be abusive to me and the abuse I received when I was young was my “different personality”.
@@dnk4559 How can people be so cruel and blame a child???? I am so sorry for what happened to both of us.
@@marysisak2359 wishing you all the best and at the very least we know we are not alone in these dysfunctional family dynamics.
NO excuse for abuse. EVER! Yes my sister and daughter plus my Mother never really believed me nor truly came to my aid. When I really needed someone, they were absent
Dr Ramani, thank you again! Again and again! For your videos, your relentless research, for your wisdom, for your big heart, and for SEEING and HEARING us!! I'm still recovering, after leaving my narcissistic partner of 30 years, a little over a year ago. In a lifetime characterized by loneliness, this year has been the loneliest by far, since I started speaking more openly about what was happening in my family. No one wants to hear it, or they can't understand it. Your videos here, and the various communities you've called together around you, have lifted me up, educated and sustained me through this last year. Thank you for helping me feel less alone. It's God's Work you're doing, I am so grateful for you and your team 💜❤️💙
This video resonated with me. When my narc sister completely overstepped after our Mother passed, my younger sister refused to hear my feelings. I thought we were very close, but she abandoned me and I rarely hear from her anymore. We had been in daily contact for many years. Losing her hurt more than the behavior of narc sister. It feels like mean girl behavior. I read Dr. Ramani's book and watch the videos and they are helping me to get to radical acceptance.
This happens so often, not just to me, but I see it all around me. I wish I could meet you in person when you're in London Dr Ramani, but there's no way I can afford it. I identify with everyting you say so much. My life ended when I became fully aware of the insidious narcissism around me. I was told years ago many times that I'm an 'empath' and that I'm a magnet for narcissists and psychopaths. I didn't fully understand at the time, but I certainly do now. I've been completely alone for 4 years now and have no desire to engage with anyone on a personal level again. That may seem extreme, but I have had enough. My life may have completely changed, and that change was so very painful, but I feel peace much more often now. At least when I'm not being tortured by the past.
Thank you for saying this. I had a friend of over 10 years who disappeared on me when I began to let her know about my toxic mother. She circled back around after awhile, figuring I had learned her boundary. Her boundary was unacceptable to me and so she is no longer my friend.
The few people i thought had my back as i had theirs, i eventually left them alone as well. It goes both ways. A no regret decision ✌️
I feel totally alone even though I know. I’ve lost so many friends who can’t help, don’t understand or care to understand.
Beautiful nuanced work, Dr. Ramani - take good care of yourself, because the world needs you now more than ever! Love and lightning from Holland🌷🙏🌈🕊
34 years ago as a newlywed, I tried to talk to my mother and told her that he had hit me. She told me to be a real woman and go home and work on my marriage. I stayed with him for 17 more years. He abused me every single day.
When I was missing the good bits and trying to get things straight about my ex and their d.. , my not her said maybe you should go back to them, another time ahead said "I could have handled them". This from a woman whose on father beat my grandmother to a pulp. I know how you feel, it's pretty sick to hear this stuff from a mother! I said to her well what if my father had hit her (he hit me), she said he wouldn't because he knew she would hit him back. Absolutely delusional! ✌
Omg I'm so sorry that this happened to you. None of that was okay at all. Well done for getting out. ❤️
@@PeppermintPatties not sure if that's to me or the o.p. but your comment is affirming regardless. Wishing you the best ✌️
I even had a brother with a psychology degree invalidate my experience with my mother, because "'it wasn't his experience." But it was his experience to a lesser extent because he wasn't the scapegoat. She would ridicule him behind his back, but he was in denial.
That sounds terribly painful. I’m so glad you’re here, you’re in the best place to heal that.❤️
this is exactly why professionals should never treat family members. (Dr., nurse, pharmacist, therapist, anyone). They can't see them realistically. Try not to blame him. Try to realize that he was a son long before he got the degree if you can.
It's painful and I'm sorry for that. It's a betrayal of the worst kind. Mothers do some horrible damage that lasts forever.
The irresponsibility of that NYT’s writer is astonishing. That’s enabling the abuser. Let’s just make excuses for the psychopath who committed violent crimes, too. Let’s just give everyone an out for terrible, abusive behavior. Please!
Discovering what narcissistic abuse was gave me relief. After 16 years of abuse and finally getting out, I don't feel the guilt.
Thank you Dr Ramani
I have people around me who deny my abuse!
Man, am I on the right track now! This is so validating. Thank you for all you do Dr.
God bless people like you.
Was married to a covert narcissist for 30 years. It’s even hard to explain how you feel and the slow drip of abuse that they have caused. He came across as the nicest most caring person you would ever meet. So thankful I finally know the truth.
“Felt abandoned” I was absolutely and deliberately abandoned. I had tried so very hard. I was kicked totally to the curb and left to die. Physically and spiritually.
One of my “loyal friends” is the semi-autobiographical novel “The Way of All Flesh” by Samuel Butler. When I’m feeling particularly abandoned, I open this book to a random spot and just start reading. Butler spent his whole life writing through his narcissistic trauma and this novel was a summary of his entire life in recovery. This book feels like a friend who totally gets it.
Understanding narcissism and seeing the signs of idealization, devaluation and discard has set me free from blaming myself and wondering what I did wrong. The worst part is that once you meet a narcissist, you know they will not change and there is nothing you can do about that. It really shakes your reality. Like staring the devil in the face.
Profoundly: Angry, Obsessive, Dismissive, Dishonest, Negative, Moody, Entitled, Jealous, Vindictive, Resentful.
Compulsive addictions: erotica, porn, sex, fetish, online hookups, hording, cheating, social media bragging.
Just a few words to describe my ex.
Sadistic. Cruel. Selfish. Alcoholic. Charming. Fake.
Controlling, too. Great list!
And evil. I now think of him as evil.
I'm far from back to good yet but Dr Ramani, your channel inspires me to want to reach out to be an ear to victims of narcissists. To the people who aren't here yet but really need to be.
It's hard to stay positive about the future. I now see people as they are (toxic). I'm isolating. I'm trying to find healthy people. Healthy people are rare. Don't settle. We got this. Let's go!
Dr Ramani, My entire life I've tried to talk to people about child abuse sexual abuse narcissistic abuse all of it and people simply don't want to hear about it they would rather go about their little simple lives and ignore the pain of others and it's disgusting
'Picking the mess that works for you'. Bless you. I feel so seen. Every single video.
My narc mother attributed all of my “issues” on a Buddha ornament in the garden of the house that I’m renting .
She told me that under no uncertain terms should one ever talk about your feelings, you keep that your yourself!
I experienced abandonment in my so called spiritual groups. Needless to say, I no longer participate in those groups.
My daughter in law is the extremely jealous narcissist. My son is the one who said “ I can’t “. It has destroyed our relationship, so she did get what she wanted, and made me the scapegoat, and then the bad guy. I’m devastated. he is also her enabler, making rationalizations for her poor, mean, behavior. Thank you for being here. Until i started researching this I thought I was going crazy
It's happening to me now. No one understands. It's very lonely.
I’m is the same boat as you very lonely 😞😞😞
@@Valerie-h3t I'm sorry :(
Keep holding on to what you know is right
This video is so helpful in validating how I’ve felt when my sister didn’t allow me to speak about it to her anymore and my friend shut me down and changed the subject. The painful things I endured and was still dealing with and trying to heal from were so hard but to have family and friend shut me down from speaking about it was extremely painful and something I will always remember about those people….
My sister was pregnant at the time but was being so controlling to tell me I can not speak to her any more about it. I’ve since learned that boundaries do not include rules for the other person. If she didn’t want to listen she could walk away. That would have been very painful as well though I have to be honest.
46:38 - "you finally get the narcissism decoder ring"...OMG!!!! I love that. It is exactly what it feels like.
Sometimes as the child in that relationship, it is too much for the abused parent to even hear this till they’re ready. It’s so tough, not at all easy to understand and explain.
This doctor saved my life! I’m out of a narcissist sibling relationship with my brother. We were team truck drivers. I Lost thousands of dollars due to his many lies, manipulation, gaslighting etc. I started listening to this doctor when I was at my wits end. I planned my way out. It took a year, but I DID IT! It’s been a year and a half with NO regrets!!! I also got rid of friends once I recognized the signs. It was a painful process but a necessary one because I almost committed suicide over a person who did he didn’t give a fuck about me(his words). He still calls me once in a while, but I learned to be a gray rock and not go DEEP with him. THANK YOU Dr.RD, your road is the less traveled one ,but I’m glad I took it!! Love you much!!❤😊
We had a minor argument and i just told her to behave herself in a gentle tone. And the next day after work , i came home to an empty house! She packed up & leave while i’m at work. I was in HUGE SHOCK pleading & begging her for a chance. She refused all communication & discussion! Serve me the divorce papers within 4 months and end a 6 years marriage abruptly! I look back at our photo albums for the past year, we went out every weekend and really enjoyed ourselves. Just a week before she left, i bring her to a restaurant that she really like & she hold my hand saying “Thank you my love, i love you so much” & one week later ended up divorcing…It doesn’t make sense at all! It was months later i happen to learn about "Narcissism".
Such a good video. Every time I got the urge to look up another one of these “is it me? Am i tripping?” questions based on what you were discussing, you went on to touch on those very topics. Thank you!