Great pod. GG was classic target man, scored all his goals first touch and off the head. Idah gets the comparison cuz of size but I think Brendan is using this time to coach the young player to be able to do more 🍀💚
47:00 Re the Lennon Miller discussion Rodgers is forever using the word "physicality" in a positive sense to describe players that he rates. Look at his big signings - Bernardo, Engels, Trusty, Idah.... I don't know what height Lennon Miller is, but to the naked eye he looks in the 6ft category and at only 18yo he could be a bit of a tank once he properly "fills out" in his early 20's Now you could argue Kuhn isn't exactly a giant BUT he does have electric pace, which in the context of an attacking player is the type of "physicality" Rodgers is after. Maeda, although not a Rodgers signing, falls in to this category also and I believe that is why he's become one of BR's trusted starters. So who would Lennon Miller potentially replace? Well it's clearly Hatate IMO. Maybe "replace" is the wrong word but I think it could just be good "succession planning" as they say because I think Hatate definitely wants to move on after this season anyway. So the signing of Miller could suit all parties concerned
Did not mention, as the conversation was more oriented to the hypothetical of January. However, summer is the likely window for a Hatate departure IMO and agree he is not a 'Rodgers player.'
This is a fantastically geeky start. I mean that as a compliment. Listening sleepily on way to work trying to digest Alan's numbers, just about managing to take it in.
Great the main pod is remaining free, but given the standard of the analysis and discussion even as a student in university I would have had no problem paying a subscription, by far one of best Celtic/ analytics based podcasts out there.
We spent a huge big whopping £9.5 million with the add on, for little Norwich City's THIRD choice striker that quite literally NOBODY ELSE wanted & he was their THIRD choice striker because he had only scored something like less than twenty goals in way over a hundred games & so will he ever ''come good'' or ''find his groove'' in a domestic context playing against the dross & complete dross we face week after week, yes probably in some shape or form, but as for Europe & particularly playing at the very highest level in Europe, for me he's completely nowhere near that level, although there are plenty out there who live in hope that Idah can just somehow be another Kuhn in the miraculous transformation of form stakes.
The Question of one player , my choice is a left back with euro experience player ,I like Taylor but I would like more height and physicality on a par with Aj. Thanks brilliant show enjoying the content👏👏🙏
Fantastic to get a proper discussion on the mostly unheralded contributions of my favourite Celtic player, Kyogo Furuhashi. So before I start you will be aware of where my deep player prejudices lie. 😊 Unlike possibly the majority of fans I was never convinced of the vital importance of Matt O'Riley to the team as my comments on forums such as these before he left fully demonstrate. So no surprise to me that the side hasn't suffered since his departure and maybe has actually improved in fact. What did surprise me is Alan's point that Kyogo's defensive contributions have declined when my eyes have told me quite the opposite .. but I can't argue with simple stats, of course! Talking of which presumably there are no stats which can measure a player's performance off the ball? We all know Kyogo's movements move defenders and create spaces elsewhere for others which has maybe benefited Kuhn particularly. And Kyogo can himself dish it out on occasion as some of his recent tackles .. most famously the one in the last derby match after running almost the full length of the pitch .. amply demonstrate! Great and illuminating chat, lads, so many thanks once again for your valuable contributions!
And thanks to you as well. The question of off ball movement and its value exercises me greatly. I doubt we'll see the public data in this to play with but look out for a special podcast next week where this is discussed in detail.
You know too that for me also, Kyogo is the most naturally gifted striker we've had SINCE The King Of Kings & certainly in his first two seasons under Ange & similarly with CCV in this context, these two were just complete invincibles with their consistency of overall sheer high performance & Kyogo playing through the pain barrier with that shoulder injury of his that did mean, on occasions, he was playing when way short of 100% fitness, but still with that huge big smile on his face & yes, as for the Blessed Matty, I too never ever followed the herd on that one with Blessed Matty's beatification amongst so many & us getting £25 million & a wee add on for his move doon to wee Brighton, was the most perfect piece of business.
One thing Kyogo has added in the past 13 months, compared to Ange tenure, is Champions League goals. Three of them in total and now only one behind the great Henrik Larsson in that regard. His stats won’t be breaking the record books, but his moments of brilliance as seen in derby games, and his game intelligence and movements are right up there with the best in modern day Celtic history.
Always look forward to listen to you guys, really enjoy the show. One question (from a layman): McGregor looked to me at the top of his game against Leipzig, actually reminded me a bit of Kroos that day. Kroos never was fast, still he was world class. Shouldn't McGregor be able to compensate with intelligence for his decreasing pace thus be able to stay a top player till the end of his 30s - especially in Scotland?
Hi Sean - i think that's kinda what i was saying but there are trade offs re creativity and final third involvement - outside scoring low xG shots from corners :) He will never be a deep creator like Pirlo or Kroos - hes a tempo setter and seems to be adjusting elegantly to age decline. Will write more on this
If you're discussing Idah's game at Rugby Park, surely you have mention that the possible broken nose as a potentially major factor that could have affected his performance? He subsequently had to drop out of the Ireland squad as a result of the injury so it was clearly fairly serious even though he chose to play through it as best as he could. I'm also surprised there wasn't more comparison with his last performance at Rugby Park which was his best game in a Celtic jersey. For me that match showed Idah is able to play as the "Dembele type" striker that Rodgers likes when he's on his game as his hold-up and link-up play in the game was excellent. Whether he can replicate that performance consistently is another question of course. He hasn't been at it this season. But I think Rodgers sees the raw materials in Idah and will help shape him into a more effective striker over his time here.
I THINK AT THE END OF THE SEASON ITS DECISION TIME FOR THE BOARD AND BRENDAN,DO WE CASH IN ON KYOGO,OR GIVE HIM A LARSSON TYPE DEAL,HE LOVES THE CLUB AND WE LOVE HIM SO I WOULD LOVE TO SEE HIM STAY.
I think the ship has sailed in terms of cashing-in on Kyogo. (he turns 30 in January) so I'd be more than happy to keep him now for another 2-3 seasons and ring every last ounce of talent out of him. We're not going to get Matt O'Riley money for him or "Dembele dollars" etc... so I'd much rather keep him for another 2-3 season than sell him in summer 2025 for £8 million (or whatever fee we'd get for him). The only way the situation changes for me is if Kyogo makes it clear he wants to leave or if we get an absolutely mental offer for him.
31:43 It sounds like the data on Idah is limited to what has happened rather than what should happen. We should be giving Idah more support in my opinion. More minutes in games, more instruction on how to play the position optimally and better balls in to him. Just because he plays as a pivot, doesn't mean that the ball can be hoofed to him for turn into something
Hi it's a great question and we can only surmise what the instructions might be. I suppose we watch Celtic in detail game after game so any small nuance is hopefully picked up on. But you are right, there are unknowable's.
Opposition may be marking Kyogo more closely and Brendan may be using Kyogo to drag central defenders away from the middle. The analysis is not looking at the team effort and if you're not doing that then you might be missing a trick. What is Celtic's xg and how does that compare to other seasons?
Hi John i accept your point regarding team dynamics and made that point during the show - ie the midfield deficit in packing - does it matter if the team is performing coherently? Currently the front three are all contributing - 45 goal contributions between them, so does it matter if Kyogo's is the lowest? It's a great point.
@alanmorrison5981 Hi Alan, I should have waited until the end before posting. You did, as you say, made the point later in the show. I too worked in and around Sheffield and Rotherham for about 12 years. I lived near Bakewell and commuted up and down Eccleshall Rd nearly every day. Retired back to Scotland now.
@@johnoneill8211 No worries and thanks for making it to the end! I'm near Endcliffe Park, we probably passed each other commuting up and down Ecclesall Rd!
Japan have better options than kyogo - I don’t think it’s personal or performance related they have had and do have better options On the perception bias I feel like kyogo often try’s to create a chance for himself when the pass is on, sometimes that’s maeda which maybe makes sense just to try the shot 😅
People need to watch a few Japan games and inform themselves better. Japan plays a 3-4-2-1, with two shadow-strikers and a big target man up front. Kyogo is too small to play the one-top. Usually it is Feyenoord's Ueda who plays that spot, but with him injured, the first option to replace him is probably Ohashi (Bristol). That means that Kyogo has to compete for one of the shadow striker spots. The competition for those positions includes Takumi Minamino (Monaco), Take Kubo (Sociedad), Daichi Kamada (Crystal Palace) and Ritsu Doan (Freiberg), not to mention Maeda (who is better suited to the role than Kyogo). Youll note that there isnt really a good spot to fit Reo, either. Daizen is the only one who sees playing time, because he can fit into the formation better -- not only in the slot, but up top or on the wing, as well. He is a multipurpose sub. Yes, Japan has a "plan B", and when it shifts to two strikers, or to a four-back formation, both Kyogo and Reo are a better fit. But its no slight to Kyogo that he isnt getting NT playing time. He simply doesnt fit the formation as a striker, and where he CAN fit in, theres fierce competition for spots.
Always a great show but as always the thoughts on McGregor are way of reality. Stats are helpful but don't fully consider changes in position and team style of play. McGregor is and has been getting better this season and the previous seasons. He is better now than 2 seasons ago... 4 seasons ago... And will probably be as good for the next couple of years. Get a grip guys and stop being age,est . Ie Brown.. Lubo 32+
By trying to frame it as a discussion concluding "good" or "bad" you are over simplifying what was actually said. I pointed out a number of areas where McGregor seems to be reversing season-on-season age decline and a number of areas where he is not. Hence the conclusion he is adapting intelligently to his pace and his physical capabilities waning. This was net/net a testament to his adaptability in the face of ageing and a recognition of the evolution of his role in the team.
Whenever I get asked which one's better, McStay or Wee Callum, my response is always Lubo Moravcik & even to mention the sheer poetic genius of Lubo in the same breath as Wee Callum & Broony is, well, like talking aboot Picasso & comparing him with your local ''street artist'' but back to Wee Callum, for certain, he did play his very best football under Rodgers first time round & yes of course he was a good few years younger then & surrounded by better players too & when people start talking aboot his ''age decline'' he's still only 31, for goodness sake, & yet nearly all of his ''performances'' over the last few years when playing at the very highest level in Europe, have been of the dismal & woeful variety.....
Ange said he liked to have players who could come on and do different things. james says this isn't a good idea and idah should just do what kyogo does. So was ange lying or wrong?
I obviously can't know what Ange specifically meant - 'do different things' does not de facto mean a completely different role and positional style of play, necessarily. If he meant that Celtic were better served by GG playing as a 'hold up' striker, then I believe the balance of objective evidence indicates that he would have been wrong.
Top notch as always, thanks for the reply to my question James 🍀
Kyogo is due a hot streak. 😃
You mean he's due a period of "positive variance". Get with the language! 😂
Great show boys all numbers and that brilliant Callum got few years left easily
Great job as always. Easily the best Celtic podcast out there! 🍀
Thanks Chris - very kind
Great pod. GG was classic target man, scored all his goals first touch and off the head. Idah gets the comparison cuz of size but I think Brendan is using this time to coach the young player to be able to do more 🍀💚
Great show boys enjoyed it
47:00
Re the Lennon Miller discussion
Rodgers is forever using the word "physicality" in a positive sense to describe players that he rates.
Look at his big signings - Bernardo, Engels, Trusty, Idah.... I don't know what height Lennon Miller is, but to the naked eye he looks in the 6ft category and at only 18yo he could be a bit of a tank once he properly "fills out" in his early 20's
Now you could argue Kuhn isn't exactly a giant BUT he does have electric pace, which in the context of an attacking player is the type of "physicality" Rodgers is after. Maeda, although not a Rodgers signing, falls in to this category also and I believe that is why he's become one of BR's trusted starters.
So who would Lennon Miller potentially replace? Well it's clearly Hatate IMO. Maybe "replace" is the wrong word but I think it could just be good "succession planning" as they say because I think Hatate definitely wants to move on after this season anyway. So the signing of Miller could suit all parties concerned
Did not mention, as the conversation was more oriented to the hypothetical of January. However, summer is the likely window for a Hatate departure IMO and agree he is not a 'Rodgers player.'
Hatate wanted away last summer and will definitely leave this summer.
This is a fantastically geeky start. I mean that as a compliment. Listening sleepily on way to work trying to digest Alan's numbers, just about managing to take it in.
Thanks Joe - will write it up in more digestible wordys for tomorrow!
@alanmorrison5981 I did enjoy it. That sort of stuff is why I like the show. I did manage to digest some of it with my tired brain. HH.
It's great stuff Alan!@@alanmorrison5981
I will be join for Allan's superb 'A Eulogy for Rangers'
Join for the schadenfreude, stay for the poetry.
Great the main pod is remaining free, but given the standard of the analysis and discussion even as a student in university I would have had no problem paying a subscription, by far one of best Celtic/ analytics based podcasts out there.
Great to hear and thank you
I think Idah is going to find his groove, he played great against Atalanta put in a real shift
Rodgers says he has a very high ceiling and he seems to have the personality to play for Celtic so let's hope so.
We spent a huge big whopping £9.5 million with the add on, for little Norwich City's THIRD choice striker that quite literally NOBODY ELSE wanted & he was their THIRD choice striker because he had only scored something like less than twenty goals in way over a hundred games & so will he ever ''come good'' or ''find his groove'' in a domestic context playing against the dross & complete dross we face week after week, yes probably in some shape or form, but as for Europe & particularly playing at the very highest level in Europe, for me he's completely nowhere near that level, although there are plenty out there who live in hope that Idah can just somehow be another Kuhn in the miraculous transformation of form stakes.
The Question of one player , my choice is a left back with euro experience player ,I like Taylor but I would like more height and physicality on a par with Aj. Thanks brilliant show enjoying the content👏👏🙏
Thanks Anthony
Fantastic to get a proper discussion on the mostly unheralded contributions of my favourite Celtic player, Kyogo Furuhashi. So before I start you will be aware of where my deep player prejudices lie. 😊
Unlike possibly the majority of fans I was never convinced of the vital importance of Matt O'Riley to the team as my comments on forums such as these before he left fully demonstrate. So no surprise to me that the side hasn't suffered since his departure and maybe has actually improved in fact. What did surprise me is Alan's point that Kyogo's defensive contributions have declined when my eyes have told me quite the opposite .. but I can't argue with simple stats, of course! Talking of which presumably there are no stats which can measure a player's performance off the ball? We all know Kyogo's movements move defenders and create spaces elsewhere for others which has maybe benefited Kuhn particularly. And Kyogo can himself dish it out on occasion as some of his recent tackles .. most famously the one in the last derby match after running almost the full length of the pitch .. amply demonstrate!
Great and illuminating chat, lads, so many thanks once again for your valuable contributions!
And thanks to you as well. The question of off ball movement and its value exercises me greatly. I doubt we'll see the public data in this to play with but look out for a special podcast next week where this is discussed in detail.
You know too that for me also, Kyogo is the most naturally gifted striker we've had SINCE The King Of Kings & certainly in his first two seasons under Ange & similarly with CCV in this context, these two were just complete invincibles with their consistency of overall sheer high performance & Kyogo playing through the pain barrier with that shoulder injury of his that did mean, on occasions, he was playing when way short of 100% fitness, but still with that huge big smile on his face & yes, as for the Blessed Matty, I too never ever followed the herd on that one with Blessed Matty's beatification amongst so many & us getting £25 million & a wee add on for his move doon to wee Brighton, was the most perfect piece of business.
What kyogo does is frightens the life out of goalies
One thing Kyogo has added in the past 13 months, compared to Ange tenure, is Champions League goals. Three of them in total and now only one behind the great Henrik Larsson in that regard.
His stats won’t be breaking the record books, but his moments of brilliance as seen in derby games, and his game intelligence and movements are right up there with the best in modern day Celtic history.
good point
Always look forward to listen to you guys, really enjoy the show. One question (from a layman): McGregor looked to me at the top of his game against Leipzig, actually reminded me a bit of Kroos that day. Kroos never was fast, still he was world class. Shouldn't McGregor be able to compensate with intelligence for his decreasing pace thus be able to stay a top player till the end of his 30s - especially in Scotland?
Hi Sean - i think that's kinda what i was saying but there are trade offs re creativity and final third involvement - outside scoring low xG shots from corners :) He will never be a deep creator like Pirlo or Kroos - hes a tempo setter and seems to be adjusting elegantly to age decline. Will write more on this
To misquote: "My name is Brendan Rogers, King of the SPFL. Look on my works, ye Huns, and despair!" 🤣
Let’s hope Brendan isn’t as hubristic as the eponymous Ozymandias
😂it’s fair to say that he stamped on the lifeless things across the city 👍💚
I’m terrified of kyogo getting injured before the transfer window !
I’m pretty certain Kyogo is being significantly hampered by his shoulder injury which may take a long time to heal.
If you're discussing Idah's game at Rugby Park, surely you have mention that the possible broken nose as a potentially major factor that could have affected his performance? He subsequently had to drop out of the Ireland squad as a result of the injury so it was clearly fairly serious even though he chose to play through it as best as he could.
I'm also surprised there wasn't more comparison with his last performance at Rugby Park which was his best game in a Celtic jersey. For me that match showed Idah is able to play as the "Dembele type" striker that Rodgers likes when he's on his game as his hold-up and link-up play in the game was excellent.
Whether he can replicate that performance consistently is another question of course. He hasn't been at it this season. But I think Rodgers sees the raw materials in Idah and will help shape him into a more effective striker over his time here.
I THINK AT THE END OF THE SEASON ITS DECISION TIME FOR THE BOARD AND BRENDAN,DO WE CASH IN ON KYOGO,OR GIVE HIM A LARSSON TYPE DEAL,HE LOVES THE CLUB AND WE LOVE HIM SO I WOULD LOVE TO SEE HIM STAY.
I think the ship has sailed in terms of cashing-in on Kyogo. (he turns 30 in January) so I'd be more than happy to keep him now for another 2-3 seasons and ring every last ounce of talent out of him.
We're not going to get Matt O'Riley money for him or "Dembele dollars" etc... so I'd much rather keep him for another 2-3 season than sell him in summer 2025 for £8 million (or whatever fee we'd get for him).
The only way the situation changes for me is if Kyogo makes it clear he wants to leave or if we get an absolutely mental offer for him.
Great listen as always, well done. Maybe read my question out next time ? 🤔
Hi Martin - as always time constraints and we got a lot of questions! Thanks for listening and hopefully next time
@@alanmorrison5981cheers Alan 👍
31:43 It sounds like the data on Idah is limited to what has happened rather than what should happen. We should be giving Idah more support in my opinion. More minutes in games, more instruction on how to play the position optimally and better balls in to him. Just because he plays as a pivot, doesn't mean that the ball can be hoofed to him for turn into something
A question, when doing statistical analysis is there a way of controlling for instruction v ability?
Hi it's a great question and we can only surmise what the instructions might be. I suppose we watch Celtic in detail game after game so any small nuance is hopefully picked up on. But you are right, there are unknowable's.
Deep dive on Engels stats please. What is his best position?
Hi - bit early re minutes but we'll get there
I have downloaded The Substack app. Just wondering when I can set up various walls etc with bank details ?
Hi Eamonn - that will be enabled our end on Monday 18th Nov. Nothing for you to do until that is "switched on". And thanks for your support.
The Kyogo stats sounds like a player due a purple spell and/or currently lacking a little confidence and overthinking shot placement?
Maybe - article out tomorrow - let me know what you think on the site
Opposition may be marking Kyogo more closely and Brendan may be using Kyogo to drag central defenders away from the middle. The analysis is not looking at the team effort and if you're not doing that then you might be missing a trick. What is Celtic's xg and how does that compare to other seasons?
Hi John i accept your point regarding team dynamics and made that point during the show - ie the midfield deficit in packing - does it matter if the team is performing coherently? Currently the front three are all contributing - 45 goal contributions between them, so does it matter if Kyogo's is the lowest? It's a great point.
@alanmorrison5981 Hi Alan, I should have waited until the end before posting. You did, as you say, made the point later in the show.
I too worked in and around Sheffield and Rotherham for about 12 years. I lived near Bakewell and commuted up and down Eccleshall Rd nearly every day. Retired back to Scotland now.
@@johnoneill8211 No worries and thanks for making it to the end! I'm near Endcliffe Park, we probably passed each other commuting up and down Ecclesall Rd!
Alan - renew our interest in Bogusz this winter?
No info on that sorry
Japan have better options than kyogo - I don’t think it’s personal or performance related they have had and do have better options
On the perception bias I feel like kyogo often try’s to create a chance for himself when the pass is on, sometimes that’s maeda which maybe makes sense just to try the shot 😅
People need to watch a few Japan games and inform themselves better. Japan plays a 3-4-2-1, with two shadow-strikers and a big target man up front. Kyogo is too small to play the one-top. Usually it is Feyenoord's Ueda who plays that spot, but with him injured, the first option to replace him is probably Ohashi (Bristol).
That means that Kyogo has to compete for one of the shadow striker spots. The competition for those positions includes Takumi Minamino (Monaco), Take Kubo (Sociedad), Daichi Kamada (Crystal Palace) and Ritsu Doan (Freiberg), not to mention Maeda (who is better suited to the role than Kyogo). Youll note that there isnt really a good spot to fit Reo, either. Daizen is the only one who sees playing time, because he can fit into the formation better -- not only in the slot, but up top or on the wing, as well. He is a multipurpose sub.
Yes, Japan has a "plan B", and when it shifts to two strikers, or to a four-back formation, both Kyogo and Reo are a better fit. But its no slight to Kyogo that he isnt getting NT playing time. He simply doesnt fit the formation as a striker, and where he CAN fit in, theres fierce competition for spots.
@@k-matsu Thanks - great context
Always a great show but as always the thoughts on McGregor are way of reality. Stats are helpful but don't fully consider changes in position and team style of play. McGregor is and has been getting better this season and the previous seasons. He is better now than 2 seasons ago... 4 seasons ago... And will probably be as good for the next couple of years. Get a grip guys and stop being age,est . Ie Brown.. Lubo 32+
By trying to frame it as a discussion concluding "good" or "bad" you are over simplifying what was actually said. I pointed out a number of areas where McGregor seems to be reversing season-on-season age decline and a number of areas where he is not. Hence the conclusion he is adapting intelligently to his pace and his physical capabilities waning. This was net/net a testament to his adaptability in the face of ageing and a recognition of the evolution of his role in the team.
Whenever I get asked which one's better, McStay or Wee Callum, my response is always Lubo Moravcik & even to mention the sheer poetic genius of Lubo in the same breath as Wee Callum & Broony is, well, like talking aboot Picasso & comparing him with your local ''street artist'' but back to Wee Callum, for certain, he did play his very best football under Rodgers first time round & yes of course he was a good few years younger then & surrounded by better players too & when people start talking aboot his ''age decline'' he's still only 31, for goodness sake, & yet nearly all of his ''performances'' over the last few years when playing at the very highest level in Europe, have been of the dismal & woeful variety.....
Messi no giant, but best
Ange said he liked to have players who could come on and do different things. james says this isn't a good idea and idah should just do what kyogo does. So was ange lying or wrong?
I obviously can't know what Ange specifically meant - 'do different things' does not de facto mean a completely different role and positional style of play, necessarily.
If he meant that Celtic were better served by GG playing as a 'hold up' striker, then I believe the balance of objective evidence indicates that he would have been wrong.