Opinions on Ropeman vs Prussic on your tether
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- Опубликовано: 26 авг 2024
- In this video we wanted to share some thoughts on our opinions of Ropeman vs prussic on tether. This may be controversial and opinions vary. We don't claim to be the authority and we'd defer to the manufacturer of the Ropeman for its proper application and recommend you use your own best judgment after you educate yourself . Our intention is to raise awareness and share our concerns and opinions in the hope that you make the safest choice possible for your safety.
Hunters Who climb trees typically have no training. One of the reasons we made these videos was to introduce hunters to what arborists use to climb safely. Just like anything its incumbent on you to seek out training from a qualified professional , and practice to learn how to do it properly. It's no different than learning firearm safety or anything that's inherently dangerous.
Feel free to ask questions in the comments section and we'll be happy to offer any help we can.
Thanks for watching, and best of luck !
This video addressed exactly what I saw when I tried to put the ropeman on my tether. I was practicing 3 ft off the ground, standing on a bench. When I finally got the ropeman to pop loose....BAM! I was sitting on the back of the bench before I could react to the fall. I switched the prussick back to my tether but made it out of a softer, thicker rope to aid in loosening it. I really only needed the ropeman on the climbing rope for one-handed ease anyway. Good video.
Thanks for sharing your experience! , Stay safe Bill!
Coming from a rock climbing background I could not agree more with this.
YOU HIT THE NAIL ON THE HEAD!!!!!!!
I’m new to saddle hunting, currently sifting my way through all the different methods. I just got a couple ropeman’s and was practicing at ground level. Tightening the tether or lineman’s is super smooth with a Ropeman BUT extending your tether or linesman made me PUCKER BIG TIME!!!!! I thought it was just me, thought I needed more practice. You just confirmed my fear. I’m going back to a friction hitch and adding a tender to make it easier. I really appreciate your knowledge. Thank you so much.
Everything I use comes from being in the tree care industry over 3 decades. The Ropeman is a tool that’s never in my opinion should be used for life support yet lots of people and saddle companies who influence people to use them swear by it . If you’re gonna use it at least be smart and back it up !
There's a guy on RUclips who has some very innovative climbing methods for saddle hunters. His channel is jrb tree climbing and saddle hunting. His main focus is safety. Check it out.
Great points fellas. I run a prussik above my ropeman on my tether for this reason. It helps slide it up but you cannot slide it down under pressure. This is only on a softer rope however. I ran into a major issue this year doing SRT to setup different hunting sets. I’m using an 11mm Sterling HTP and found that the ropeman will often fail to bite when you have weight on the line. I switched to a hand ascender for my top mover and I’m still running my petzl rig as my lower.
Josh,
I hadn't thought of running a prussic above the Ropeman , sounds like that's a pretty good idea.
Just got 2 ropeman 1 in the mail yesterday. Glad I seen y’all video today before I screwed up, because this is all new to me. Thanks
👍. Just have to be mindful of how it works. A little ground level practice sessions you’ll be good to go
Some good points to keep in mind. As a rookie saddle hunter I’ve wondered the same thing. Thanks
Great video by the way. You guys are great and really know your stuff. I will give my input that you seldom see brought up when using rope ascending and descending. Coming from an archery hunter, I use a life line ok.. well us archery hunters here in the frozen northern states that use lifelines we put them in the tree and leave them in the tree for the few weeks of archery season. Well I ran into a issue and I'm sure many other guys have too. Well up here in the frozen north during archery season it will be warm during the day but freezing over night well if it rains the day before and freezes over night and you walk over hook up to your prussic to slide it up as you climb your steps or your climber tree stand or whatever the prussic does not work at all on frozen lifeline rope. It just slides right down and is useless. I found this out one day when I hooked up to my lifeline in the tree and it was frozen and was left with 2 options either dont hunt or hunt without being safe or buy a Ropeman. The ropeman work well on frozen rope. But prussics do not! So keep this in mind for when you are using a lifeline that stays on your tree for a few weeks of archery and has the potential to be frozen over night. The ropeman is truly the tool to have when ascending or descending a frozen rope. Hope this helps some of you archery hunters in the frozen northern states.
Demo how to tie and apply a proper prussic. I’m familiar with a variety of friction knots. But like you said , a lot of guy’s ate definitely doing this for the very first time. I only ordered one arrest for my lineman. I’m one of the guy’s who will be using a prussic on my tether and enjoying the longevity of my rope. Thanks guys
I agree with you guys 💯 percent. Safety first !!!!!!
More good info. Taking another element of failure out of the equation is good. As a former climber, I agree.
I subbed bc this is the second or third video I’ve seen and you guys are awesome! Thanks for sharing vital information
Thanks and good luck this season !
Excellent video Gents! I almost bought a second Ropeman but after this video I’ll be sticking with the time tested Prusik!
Thanks guys you’ve changed my mind . I’ll be keeping it on my lineman’s rope !! Great video .
Thanks for the info guys! I'm new to saddle hunting and use a ropeman 1 in my linesmans belt. I was considering buying another for the tether but you guys made some valid points. The ropeman 1 is definitely more convenient but does pose potential risks. Great channel!
👍
Opinions vary. True. That's the spirit the world needs these days. Thx and cheers 😊
Remember start out old school and master it. So from there, you can make changes confidently.
It is an ascender = go up. To go down you need to take the weight off of the device and then slide it down which is why they are used in pairs - one for a foot loop and one for your harness. Maybe use the ropeman on the bottom for ease of movement and a prussic on top.
The reason for a smaller diameter prussic knot is to get a better grab. The size is relative to the size of the rope it goes around and a rope the same size or near the same size won't grip as tightly when you need it to. Abrasion resistance is also important here because if you are sliding down on that prussic it generates heat and it can melt.
One thing I did immediately recognize is that this is not typical orientation of the device. At least what I can tell, when he demonstrates the possible failure point, he is pulling “up” on the cam for the release. And it illustrates, almost counterintuitively, how sometimes it can be very easy to get inverted on load orientation within the system. It definitely the same error as tying a prusik in the wrong direction.
One Can never be too cautious when it comes to safety in this or any climbing sport/system!, And pardon me, especially when it’s going to be someone’s ass in that system ! 🤘🏼🤘🏼
Great job guys!
As I am sure you know, but some may not, is that by using a prusik tender you can EASILY take up the slack by lifting on the tag end of the rope which loosens the prusik and allows it to move up the rope so much easier.
I have been using the prusik as well,,seen a person using the ropeman on a tether,you answered my question,,I can live with a little more difficulty over something that is questionable as you stated,,,thanks a bunch guys
I’ve always maintained weight on the ropeman and when making adjustments up or down I always unloaded the rope and stood on the platform. Never an issue . It all comes down to just being aware of whatever you’re doing. Pay attention and everyone will be just fine
I saw someone post a Ropeman spring failure the other day, that bothered me. We feel safer on a hitch and tg think its prudent to always use the safer course of action, but opinions so it's good to discuss this stuff and guys can decide what they feel comfortable with .
Climb safe !
@@NYSaddleHunterYea , I have some experience doing repel stuff with the military and the swat unit. . I understand the Ropeman isn’t a primary ascender like a petzel or something like that and I don’t treat it that way . I do occasionally snap my prusik into my carabiner though as a fail safe when I’m set to my desired level on my ropeman
I use the Ropeman for just what Scott mentioned, although he doesn't sound sold on the Ropeman. I use it as part of my tether system, two tethers as Joe uses. Great idea, Joe.
Great video! Be safe . Thanks 😊
Many people don't know that you can use a rope tender with a prussic knot and then use it one handed just like a ropeman. I bought 2 new tribe prussic kits that come with a sewed cord and tender. Works great and I feel much safer than I would with a ropeman. I use this set up for the lineman's and the tether (safety tether on traditional treestand and not a saddle). I also tie a stopper knot once situated and the tether is at the proper length.
I double up - put the prusik above the Ropeman with about a 1/2"-1" slack and still allow adjustability with the ropeman, but I don't' trust any mechanical device. The main thing they taught during my hunter safety class back in the day was "A Safety is a Mechanical Device and ALL Mechanical Devices Will Fail" I also use another carabiner as a tender sometimes. Great video.
We made a video about that ruclips.net/video/ZsYFeH5UkEE/видео.html
Many may never have even considered those dangers, so great awareness video recording!!!!!
Another note: For those archery hunters, keep your broad heads “razor blades”, clear & far away from your saddle harness & rope systems!!!!
This may seem like a no brainer, but they put labels on car batteries, warning people not to drink the contents! 🤪
I value and appreciate your opinion. However when using a ropeman to lower my tether I consider it a 2 handed operation. One hand on the tether above the ropeman for control and the other to pull the cam. Anyone one handed yanking the cam like Scott did is not the intended use. I agree rope life is decreased by using the ropeman but my philosophy is every tree is different and it wont be squeezing on the same part of the rope on every setup. I do agree with you that the prusik is more safe, but I don’t consider the ropeman 1 dangerous. The ropeman 2 however has more aggressive teeth and I wouldn’t use it. Great conversation again guys!
Kudos on your 2handed operation of the Ropeman. I hope everyone who uses it follows your lead. Just wanted to point out the potential danger in case of a accidental shock load. Thank you for sharing !
Amen brothers... First time out, I snagged my release end on the ropeman. I don't know how you could use the ropeman as a fall restraint, because before I could grab the release wire to re-establish a "bite" (with it), I was at the stop knot - THANK GOD for stop knots. I started backing up my ropeman with a prussic (see you have a video on that two). I think "just a ropeman" is a bad way to go.
I just found your channel and love all your videos. Keep up the good work and thanks for all the great info! Cheers from the Frozen Chosen.....AKA Canada
Thanks Joel stay warm !
You guys are awesome! Keep up the great work!
Thanks 👍
Anybody seeing this video, just buy a prusik and a pulley to go with it. Can use it with one hand for descending or tending slack, can be used single or double rope, cheaper to replace damaged parts etc. I’m a tree climber by profession so that’s what I would recommend, especially considering cammed devices, unless specified for fall arrest, are not designed to be used in a single rope application as is being displayed in the video. Research some more tree climbing videos from arborists and you can learn safer and better techniques
Would be a fools move to pop the cam under full weight. You absolutely have to unload your weight off the thing in order to make any adjustments. Even when it’s on my lineman’s I swing my hip into the adjustments and take the weight off of the ropeman.
Why would anyone in their right mind lower their tether while under tension. Take the weight off, make the adjustment! The stupid shall be punished.
I was thinking the exact same thing i left the prussic knot that came with it on above the ropeman to take the weight off before adjusting
Yup. This video is dumb as fuck.
Having them explain why the ropeman can be dangerous is actually pretty genuine on there part, trying to educate new saddle hunters. Scott only demonstrated opening the cam under load so someone new to it doesnt make that mistake the more important thing they were trying to emphasize is if you were to fall by slipping or platform giving out and that ropeman isnt loaded things can go very bad...i guess you guys would rather everyone be shallow minded like yourselves
Hey Guys, great video! This should be labeled "fact" not "opinion". Using the ropeman as a fall arrest system is definitely a bad idea. A prussic, klemheist, or a gri gri would all be safe options (all those still require a backup knot). I personally like the klemheist because it is a little easier to tie and dress, and you can lower yourself while weighted a little easier than a prussic, but a prussic definitely has more holding power. In the challenge course industry we use 6mm and 7mm line for our prussic cord on cutaway rescues with no issues, so even a thin prussic is still very safe.
Good stuff thanks for chiming in Kyle
Totally agree with you guys. Ropeman fine for lineman and prusik on the tether.
I was thinking I would back up my prusik with this, guess if I actually needed it in that capacity, it's the worst situation to actually rely on it. 😆
Thanks for the insight 👍
My lower platform (climber) slipped this past fall and when he says how fast an accident can happen ( 4:25 ) ... Put it this way... I'm STILL not sure what happened! I only fell a foot, maybe two and my face met the tree... And the left side of my face was swollen like when Rocky said "Cut me Mick". Thankfully my top and bottom were connected by straps on each side, so I just pulled myself up on to the upper part and pulled the bottom up.
I am thankful I found this and I am sticking with the prussic.
I caught some flack over this in the beginning. I just wanted to bring awareness of a potential problem. Appreciate your understanding on this issue 👍
In my opinion, I only use the rope man 1 with my lineman's belt. Use a Mad rock Lifeguard for my tether. Stopper knots on all ends. A must.
W McClendon switch to the mad rock safeguard. The spring in the lifeguard can cause you to drop. Lots of videos online about it.
Good information. Thanks guys.
That is great information, I’ve been using Prusik knots and was thinking about changing but I guess I stay with the system that works for me. Thanks
I tried using a French prussic and that is a lot easier to reposition, and I feel safer on the prussic to the the Ropeman. I do feel a Ropeman is really nice and easy to position, and it is safe , its an approve ascender , however if it becomes a fall arrest it could be an issue so its just something to consider . I personally just feel safer on a prussic but the Ropeman is nice and convenient
French prusik with a prusik tender. Try it! Easy one handed controlled ascend/descend. I totally agree with the big man! Ropeman 1 is not for fall arrest!
right on, you don't ever pull the release on the Ropeman1 with a load on the rope. And using it as a saddle tether the "pull wire" could get snagged or something by accident and release you. I use the Ropeman1 as a linemans belt but NEVER as my saddle tether for obvious safety reasons. Even moving your bow around the tree you could catch that wire and release yourself..... thanks for the video guys, i wish every saddle hunter could see this video !
Scott is the sole reason I chose to stick to DRT and sewn eye prussik on the tether, at 32 and in good shape, DRT is easy. the extra noise and mechanical advantage to SRT isn’t worth the lesser safety if any and added potential noise, and price. But for now at 32, in shape and only 170# DRT it is for me.
Was just looking at getting the ropeman 1 , but after watching this i have changed my mind .
Good for positioning your linesman rope. It has a 15 kn rating which is not a standard rating. I do see guys use it on a tether some back it up so don’t. Always know what your trusting your life with. Good luck Tim !
@@NYSaddleHunter im a new saddle hunter and have yet to use it so I will practice thoroughly before I go into the woods. Thanks for your videos
Very humble & I trust humble over convenience
👍. Thank you
Another thing to mention is a lot of these devices drastically change when attached to a wet rope. A bunch of hunters including (my person) have been caught out on the rain during hunts and ropes have become wet (depending on the rope - some get very wet). During this change in weather mechanical devices lose there ability grab/hold on to the rope.
Interesting point . That's probably something most people don't know
Thank for the information you guys put out. Great work
@@enjoytheoutdoors1018 Thanks, we really appreciate the positive feedback !
Same can be said with your friction hitch. Be extra careful when you have freezing conditions or rope.
Wet weather doesn’t effect the ropeman. I’ve been using one for over five years in all kinds of conditions. They don’t slip.
I use the Ropeman as a safety for a Rescue 8 for descending. I built a kit not for rock climbing but for rescue going down steep slopes etc. Along with a CT Roll-n-lock, some closed loop webbing and I can climb back up. I'm not sure how rope prusics work in winter with frozen icy ropes here in Canada
As a guy who uses ROS I like the prussic.
First time saddle hunter but always used my harness and lineman rope.... will use ropeman on lineman but already decided that I'll need two hands for tether movement anyway so may as well go with prusic knot!
Second year saddle hunter here. I'm new to all this. Like many, I bought the same set up that Greg from Tethrd Nation uses. The Ropeman 1 is what he uses on his tether.
I do take the load off my tether when I adjust my Ropeman1. Now I'm wondering if I am putting myself in harms way. I do wonder if a Prussia knot above my Ropeman1 with a connecting line to my bridge would be safe.
This year, my uncle had a man fall out of his lock on here in SC. He fell 20 feet and broke his back. He laid on his arm for two days and nights, not being able to move. He can no longer walk or move any body parts. This whole thing has me worried if what I do, following leaders in the saddle world, are truly safe.
Thanks for offering you opinion. I'm currently using a Ropeman 1 but am considering going to a Distel Hitch or a Schwabisch Hitch. I'd appreciate it if you did a video on different friction hitches and the benefits and drawbacks of each.
Thanks Rick , We will try to do that, make a video showing other friction hitches. Here's a video we made on this subject that you might find intresting, not sure if you've seen it ruclips.net/video/ZsYFeH5UkEE/видео.html
You guys were talking about more is better on the prussik cord. Make sure you mention the importance of size difference between the main line and your friction hitch diameter. Would have to see someone put a 11mm hitch cord on 11mm main line and not test the inevitable failure.
When we climb DRT for hunting we use our tail end of our climbing line for our Blake's hitch. It works fine but I agree a smaller diameter hitch works better . Wish we'd pointed that out . After you film you always realize what we should've included but we'll probably try to point that out in a future video . Good point thanks !
You guys took the words out of my mouth I don’t like that my prussic rope is so small I’m a bigger guy and I want that extra strength to hold me In your option is a mechanic device stronger then a bigger rope for a prussic not ? Thanks for you help
I like your videos and perspectives. I agree about the use of ropeman1. I use it on my linesman’s belt. I bought one and put it on my tether and sat once with it and didn’t feel comfortable with it in that application. After reading a lot more about it I feel it’s not a good choice and would never recommend it for a tether. I’m @WildBill on saddle hunter.
Thanks for this great video. I’ve shared it a few times!
Thanks Rob we appreciate the positive feedback
Awesome video with valid points.
Been using the rope man 1 for a lineman’s rope for a season now, and I couldn’t agree more.. Good info here could save you a fall.!!! Haven’t tried drt. but looks like a good run &gun method... good videos guys..Thank you ..Seth ....
I like the poor man's rope man. A D ring used in conjuction with the prusik
Most Experienced people know to put slack in it before you adjust to pull the lever. Yes I understand for the beginner.
What kind of rope do you use? 😊
Definitely appreciate the insight. Do you guys use a Prussic tender on your tether while in the tree?
Totally agree. Prussia is safer. Maybe not as convenient, but SAFER. Thanks guys really good information. Good hunting!! And God bless.
Thanks Roger best of luck this season
hello guys I will be purchasing the DRT/MRT kit . I'm looking for a another bridge so I can run two like you guys, also I'm looking for a backpack to carry my kit and my harness. thanks.
There's a few ways to do a redundant bridge. Whom ever you purchase your saddle from you could contact and see if they'll add or sell you a bridge, or if you look on wesspur.com they sell replacement arborist saddle bridge you could add one of those but it won't be adjustable however I ran one for years worked great. I used a weaver bridge. Use NYSH code they'll give you a discount if you go thst route.
As for packs, if your not filming I really like the Sitka tool bucket. I'm currently using the sitka cargo box which has more room than the tool bucket but film gear takes up more space . The sitka stuff is awsome but it's expensive. A good alternative is the Horn hunter G3 pack . A little smaller than the cargo box and not as good quality but on a budget it was a good pack and worked well for me.
Hope that helps
Thanks for good info knowledge is power
Great info guys! Thank you. I am going to join your channel. I do have a question for you. Would it be safe to use a mad rock life guard device on your tether?
Yes as long as the the tether rope is within the spec of the device
One other thing, I saw in your previous video that you had the caribiner centered on the knot when under tension. When I was making my own prussick the site I went to specified to NOT have the knot centered at the bottom. That the knot was not supposed to take the brunt of the force. to shorten up one side of the prussick so that the knot sat off to one side and the caribiner centered only on the rope when loaded. just a thought I read.
Good point . Honestly it's kind of a cheap down and dirty way to make a second fail safe prussic, probably best to purchase a manufactured prussic that is spliced with no knot at all so we wouldn't have to worry about the knot . They're probably inexpensive enough .
Thanks!
Hey Scott. Will you and your partner send me a link of a video showing how you tie a prussic knot on a DRT climbing system where the camera is filming close so we can see the details of it? Thankyou in advance
so why wouldn't you take your weight off of the ascender, adjust you length and then apply the pressure back to it. I thought that is what they are for? With the lineman's belt you would lean into the tree( releasing pressure) while pulling the rope through the ascender to keep it snug against you correct? or am I missing something.
Your right Nick. I was raising concern more about what not to do. Being said . I would use it just for my linesman rope. I wouldn’t use it to attach my saddle to my tether. Can’t seem to find a rating for it anywhere. Plus I’m sure the rating is not 24kn minimum. There are approved work positioners on Wesspurs site that I would feel much more comfortable using. And I know they have a Industry standard rating of 24 kn
That's why you put a knot on the end of the rope to keep it from coming off!
Yes do that, but the rope above will shear from the static load applied to the ropeman 1.
Ropeman is not going to share a static rope.
That rope he's on his good for at least 30 kilonewtons
@@easternmikeoutdoors I read it will cut it with as little as 4KN of force. About a 3 foot fall for 200 lb guy.
Would it be unsafe to use the ropeman 1 on a linesman’s belt?
No We feel it's better suited in that application
What Prussic knot is that?
So what about a prussik as a backup to the ropeman?
Great vid, thanks for the heads up! What is a good size/type of cord for a prussik for a tether? Sorry if you covered it already. Thanks!
I like the VT prussic 8mm double eye
NY Saddle Hunter
Scott, why do you prefer a double eye cord than tying the ends of the cord together making a loop? Maybe you have a video on tying the prussik using the double eye?
Thank you.
Thanks. I am a beginner with all things involving rope and knot. If you have a chance to do a video on your recommendation it would be a great help.
Sure I'll try to put something together
@@NYSaddleHunter did you ever do it ?
@@JayN4GO
We've made lots of videos involving many topics on rope and knots that apply to DRT/SRT it's hard to put everything in just one video however we've tried to adress questions and tips as best we can. If you ha e a specific video request let me know but if you click on videos on our channel and read the title I think we've covered most of the more common questions, but just let me know if there's something more specific
@Jay w4zxt
We've made lots of videos involving many topics on rope and knots that apply to DRT/SRT it's hard to put everything in just one video however we've tried to adress questions and tips as best we can. If you ha e a specific video request let me know but if you click on videos on our channel and read the title I think we've covered most of the more common questions, but just let me know if there's something more specific
Why not mention a solution like a prusik tendrt
I mean common sense would tell me not keep load on the rope while making adjustments use one hand to operate the ropeman and the other hand to hold the tether for a slow descent
Great channel good info .thanks
Thanks we appreciate the positive feedback!
It's NOT meant to handle shock. It's meant for deadweight. That's the point here. I use a prusik on my life line. I'd say the Ropeman 2 might be a better option for this application. Less shock to the Rope? I own a Ropeman 2 that I use for my linesman's belt. It's basically the same thing but, uses the concept of a Snakes teeth. Small angled teeth that bite the sleeve. Most prefer the 1 because they think the teeth fray the rope to easily. I buy quality climb rope and it's not an issue as long as the ascender is functioned the way it's meant to be used. Not a Arborist but being a Ironworker, I know a thing or two about not falling and that's are objective. Lol
Right I think so long as theres never a static drop shock load it will be fine, its an approved acender however its somthing guys should understand and use their own best judgment.. its fine to use just carefull to never shock load it as it can damage the tether at 1000 pounds pressure and thsts about the shock load of a 160lb man falling 2' into a line ststic drop . As long as that doesnt happen should be good.
Great info
Im using a ropeman on my tether i do get a little nervous that if i swing around the tree the cam can hit the bark and push it open...what is your guys thoughts of using the kong on the tether
I've not used the Kong duck ,I saw some testing of the CT rollnlock I think its called. I think that might be a better alternative. I've personally not used that one either however I saw some testing of them and it outperformed the Kong duck and the Ropeman from what I remember
What is your thoughts on having a back up tether hooked with a little bit of slack in it? Would it get in the way?
Personally I feel its probably overkill the likelyhood that the tether would fail is highly unlikely but if it gives you more confidence I dont think it would get in the way anymore than the primary tether. I wouldnt use one but if it makes you feel safer you should do whatever gives you that confidence.
How many failures have been reported? Wild Country will confirm the use of these for your tether. Ropemans are extremely strong. You can use both if you're concerned. Tie a amsteel safety tether on a prussik near the tree and run that down to your carabiner. I understand the concern but it's fairly invalid.
Bill click on this go to page 39 the wild country Ropeman damaged rope sheath during testing at 4kn.
www.hse.gov.uk/research/crr_pdf/2001/crr01364.pdf
If your comfortable on that use one , we're just raising some concerns.
I believe Wildcountry has improved the newer versions of the Ropeman .
Do you guys have a video on tying a prussic knot and more specifically how you tie the two ends together? Looks like Scott has two caribeners on it?
I lean towards continuous loops for prussics or ones that are factory made. You can find loops At Wesspur Tree supply
Always buy factory not DIY . Heres a factory prussic from aerohunter
aerohunter.us/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=60&product_id=81
Hi guys, thanks for sharing. Would you consider the Kong Duck and the PT Roll’N Lock to be in the same category and dangerous to use on your tree tether?
Lots of guys use them and technically they are safe , and they have their advantages but on a tether we tend to feel safer on the prussic. For us we like to stay with climbing industry standards closer to 24 kn 5400 lbs some of the rope grabs are around 15kn . It's not that it's not safe it's more safe enough vs safer.
Thanks for the reply. I saw some destructive testing with a CT Roll’N Lock recently and it was eye opening. The sheathe always ripped first. I think I’ll try a prusik this season on my tether. Does adding a prusik tender affect safety at all? I’ve used a tender on my lineman’s rope with good success.
@@oddjob66 Yes I've seen that too and that's why we favor a prussic
Is there a way you can use both? Using the ropeman for minor adjustments but having a prussic close to it to provide fall arrest? I am very new to this.
Yes you could install a 2 eye factory prussic to back up the Ropeman above the Ropeman and tie it in a distel hitch or French prussic. One eye on either side of the Ropeman on the same carabiner . I think that would be safest . I like redundancy and the back up .
Here you Go Jeff check this out ruclips.net/video/ZsYFeH5UkEE/видео.html
It’s not a secondary not a primary there are a lot of good primaries on top of a primary you should use something like a traction pulley or an ASAP lock The rope man is Ascension and Scott is an old school climber I can tell he could out climbed me with Blakes hitch and all my gear any day of the week. New school climbing is so different and radically changing don’t use equipment you’re not familiar with do what Scott does and stay safe cheers brothers love you
I’ve always used hangons or climbers but I am interested in saddle hunting. I see the benefits of it. I have a question and the question comes from inexperience. I have a hss X1 harness which has the loops for a lineman. Could the harness be used as a saddle. It’s rated for 300lbs. I am 160 lbs.
Not to familiar with that harness . Although HSS are designed to keep you safe .In the advent of a fall or slip off a platform . A Saddle is connected to a tether from its bridge where constant tension is applied which results in no slack in the system . They are a lot more comfortable after a long sit too . And their weight rating is much higher . Hope this answers any questions. Thanks Matt
NY Saddle Hunter thanks,
Doesn't the cable on the ropeman 1 needs to be hooked in the carabiner? I just got my ropeman 1for my linemans and it shows it hooked in
Scott this tutorial might help ruclips.net/video/Cd7ES8PvfqY/видео.html
I think the only reason a caribiner is looped through the cable is simply to make it easy to grasp when releasing the cam. The cable is not load bearing in any way as I understand it.
At 7:50 there are going to be a lot of new saddle hunters this year.like youthe ropeman 1is a approved ascending device designed for climbing.for the new guys if you have weight on it and grab the top of a prusik knot your going down. The ropeman1 you can grad the binder or the top of the device and it does not move until you want it to. You should stand up remove weight and make adjustment.Ropeman has a great video on how to use. New saddle hunters should not tell people what is right or wrong. Or act like they know until the have experience.
The opinion isn't from a new saddle hunter, it's the opinion of a 30 year arborist who's never been hurt in his career in conjunction with opinions after witnessing independent testing on what can happen if a 160 lb person falls 1', 2' , 3' with a Ropeman. Its ability to damage the tether. That's not an opinion its testable repeatable data that we've witnessed
We simply raised awareness of the potential from a 30 year veteran arborist and the independent testing so that people have as much information as they can to make their own decisions. Also between the 2 of us we have 80 years of hunting experience.
We've never claimed to be an authority and if you listened we recommended people contact the manufacturer of Ropeman to discuss the application they plan to use it in.
Our goal was to explain what we're doing and not doing and why so that others can explore our concerns and use their own judgment.
40 years each hunting out of trees , and over 30 years working in them for Scott. This doesn't make us a final authority , nor have we ever claimed to be, however it's probably more tree experience than most.
I'd like to think since the point was to raise a opinion/concern someone like Scott has so that others can make their own informed decisions is something most people would appreciate.
Thanks for watching and for your opinion. All opinions are valid.
Best of luck this season!
No one was questioning your hunting experience. I have been rock climbing for 20yrs and saddle hunting almost as long.when saddle hunting your tether is only 4 to 6’ and as long as the slack is taken up if you fall there is no static drop.you just swing into the tree. Unless you yank on it like climber Scott did.Unlike drt with a Blake’s hitch or a prusik if you grab the top of the knot your going down.l was questioning your miss leading fear mongering bias opinion. I suggest people interested in saddle hunting take their gear and setup seriously. By the way drt is not stealthy and is very taxing and dangerous. What if someone pulls their back out 10’ up in a tree by themselves? Or grabs the top of a Blake’s hitch? Hitch slides down rope static drop a you break your back.Sticks and a lineman’s is much safer.its worth the couple pounds of weight. You just start a channel and you put out content you think best. That’s all. Good luck this season and be safe.
And as far as someone blowing their back out at 10 ,15 or 20’ up. I couldn’t think of a safer way to get back down. I for one giving the choice having to evacuate a tree while being injured. Would be much easier descending on a rope than having to climb down steps or sticks.
NY Saddle Hunter number one rule to climbing three points of contact. Not being horizontal dangling from a rope.
Gøødrø Smeng I’ll assume you have 3 points of contact when climbing with sticks
Just like the prussic you have to take the weight off to go up the rope man you have to take the weight off to move also. Showing the rope man fall is just a miss use of the device. I have a prussic on my line above the rope man so i can pull on rope to take weight off the rope man so you don't have the quick fall
True however we have heard of guys that are new to all of this mistakenly thinking that they could by pulling on the ropeman or the kong duck ease into the position they want and fall into the safety knot. I think some novice saddle hunters mistakenly think that it might work similar to a madrock , or a grigri . Most guys understand you need to take pressure off but some learn this the hard way. Also the toothed ascenders be they a hand ascender or something like a ropeman are frowned upon in the climbing industry as primary life support. As a redundant life support they would enhance safety but we personally feel a hitch is a safer course of action. Lots of guys using them but I think for us we like to let guys at least bevaware of the risk . Heres somthing on this topic you might find intresting.
treetools.co.nz/Blog/hand-ascenders-as-a-primary-anchor
Climb safe , and goid luck out there!!
@@NYSaddleHunter You guys do a great job thanks for all your hard work
@@timahern7214 Thanks Tim !!
Distal friction hitch with tending pully
One of better hitches for your tether. Do you diy it. Or use factory eyes. ?
@@NYSaddleHunter i also do some tree work i use the fixed eye 30 " rit in tree friction cord and a micro pully for slack tending runs smooth one handed . Maybe make a video with a set up like that for people new to climbing
Jeff Walker gonna do some vids on Rope selection , numerous hitches , pros and cons of platforms we’ve been using and different styles of Saddles out there after season ends. Wanted to keep it simple for now. Easier to remember. Thanks Jeff.
I agree but why in the world would anyone have their weight on their tether when they release the ropeman? You have to take your weight off.
Guys who have saddle experience understand this. Most newbies won’t. That’s why we always talk about practicing with your gear with both feet on the ground until you can do it blindfolded before doing it off the ground
And no good on a two and one lanyard.
What type of rope are you using for your prussic knot?
This is the prussic cord we like.
aerohunter.us/store/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=81
NY Saddle Hunter thanks!
For sure wrong tool for the job. Like using a hammer claw instead of an ax. Ropeman is a great tool in when it is used in the proper application.
What mm Prusik are y’all using in video and what mm tree tether ?
Scott doesnt use a tether he always uses DRT , Joe uses the mantis tether . Looks to be 12-13mm tether . Comes with what looks to be 6mm accesory cord prusic but he added a second back up prussic made of 8mm accesory cord.
However we like the factory eye to eye prussics in 8mm
Me too. What length Factory eye to eye (inches)would be ideal for 3 wraps..
@@robbymorrison1953 I like this one aerohunter.us/store/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=81
I use a blake's hitch on the tether and just found the technique shown in a guy's video for tending the hitch with just a carabiner. ruclips.net/video/KUQf9xREmusT/видео.htmlhis works very smoothly and doesn't require any special stuff. I just use my old army biner.Thanks for the video
do you ever use a tending pulley with your prusik?
I have in the past. The linesman belt that came with my Flex Saddle from Aero Hunter. Has a a prusic tender on it I normally don’t use a tree tether . I prefer to use my rope with the DRT method
the product works as supposed to .should be more of a do and do not do video
Well u are supposed to take your weight off before u let out in the ropeman
Yes but lots of people who've never used one don't know this
@@NYSaddleHunter this is going to be my first yr saddle hunting but I have watched hundreds of videos and read tons of stuff about saddle hunting I still am nervous about no secondary safety but I have found a video that will give me a little more faith in event of an failure of the bridge or the ropeman
@@JennRFL16
Listen nothing says you can't run a second tether and bridge. I run a second bridge and now tie off the excess of my tether around it. The only way I'm going down is if the tether itself fails or the saddle and both have about a 5000 lb rating but you could run a second tether as a safety redundancy until you feel more comfortable. Nothing wrong with being safer
@@NYSaddleHunter Can you do a video on how to make a second bridge
@@JennRFL16
Here you go I made one on how I added a factory short bridge. ruclips.net/video/FSiQdsyw5rk/видео.html
So what about a prussik as a backup to the ropeman?
I always like a back up. I think the concern of if you have a static drop and the pressure generated could potentially cut into and damage the tether I'm not sure it would necessarily help however I suppose if it was long enough and above the Ropeman,it couldn't hurt . For me personally once my distance is set I dont typically need to have the benefit of easy adjustment the Ropeman offers, so I just stick with the prussic. I love a Ropeman on my linemans rope and a Ropeman is a approved climbing ascender so it should be fine , it's just the potential exists with a static drop that damage to the tether can occur and we just wanted to share our thoughts .
Climb safe and good luck !