How To Fix AFFIXES In The War Within
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- Опубликовано: 10 июн 2024
- I just wanted to throw my 2c in on what I would do to affixes.
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I genuinely think they did this because people complained about their spec not being needed in groups but this potentially made it worse
and of course in blizzard fashion they do everything but try to fix the spec itself
It will definitely not change anything lmao
Totally "healers have to manage a lot of affixes" cool so we will make every pull a healing check then on bursting we will have an off week holiday
i mean its better than running god comp every week
@@colew306 I wouldnt doubt the god comp would still outperform whatever damage amp you would get from the other specs
I'm not a big fan of your suggestion on rotating what classes are good every other week. Some weeks you can't play or just don't feel like it. I would hate to come back one day and be like "yeah I wanna do some keys" and then not be invited because casters are stronger that week.
Bro right now you not get invited at all as melee. What you talking about at least that away you know every 2 week you have a better chance to get invited.
@@objecinstead of settling for being playable once every 4 weeks, we should ask blizzard to actually put effort into their game 😂
@@zenith_journey small indie company you can't ask them to do their jobs :)
@@zenith_journey give them a break they're only a multi dollar company /s
Biggest thing they could do is make the +4 affixes random so that you can be a match for a set of keys in the group finder and not just benched for 3/4 weeks potentially.
Rain of Fire is fire damage, Destro doesnt benefit very much on aoe
Excellent take and the best execution I've seen of how these changes SHOULD be implemented. Thank you Tettles for the great video, hopefully Blizz watches and listens to this feedback.
It’s not about the affixes being “unfun” it’s about them being time wasters in a timed event.
You had me with Tyran and Fort - gone.
I think the new affixes could be improved if instead of granting extra damage of a specific type, they made it so entering combat with / killing a mob that's buffed by one of the new affixes granted a stacking secondary stat for 10-30 seconds (i.e entering combat with / killing a mob with Thorned grants a 0.5% or 1% buff to mastery, Focused grants a buff to haste, etc)
- That way it gets rid of the feels bad aspect of your class not getting buffed damage that week since everyone in the party would get that buff.
- It incentivizes, but doesn’t force, some of the more fun parts of M+: Doing big AoE pulls, so you get that secondary buff.
- If it’s a stacking, timed buff, it can reward pre-planning if you play around it and find ways to min-max it by doing a big pulls to get a bunch of secondaries right off the rip and then making sure certain targets die first so you can extend your buff, or chain-pulling to keep the buff up, pulling mobs onto bosses so you can enter combat a stat boost, etc.
but if you don’t feel like doing that, then oh well, it’s still a passive buff.
Overall though, it just gets rid of the fact that for some classes, for 3 out of 4 weeks, you don’t get to interact with the ‘kiss’ side of the affix. Sure, you might enjoy a crit week more than a vers week or whatnot, but you’re always getting /something/.
Then you end up with prideful hakkar and if you cant kill the hard pull in your single planned opportunity it’s over
Your take on it is the best one ive heard so far
Love the suggestion!
Tettles out here wanting feral druids to borderline do +40% dmg every other week lmao
I honestly don't have a strong feeling about any of the affixes they kept/added (aside from sanguine, that is annoying af) but I will have very strong feelings if they scrap the affix shakeup and afflicted/incorporeal end up coming back.
That'd be cursed lol, between a rock and a very hard place with bolster/sang and afflicted/incorp
they can make storming better by giving immunity after the first strike. it adds counterplay options by letting the struck player clear other storming tornadoes
Destro warlocks only Chaos damage is Chaos bolt. all other spells are fire damage.
Blizzard (stealth?) nerfing the 535 sarkareth cloak, so you now cannot catalyze it > fixing spec bugs that are known and have been reported for years
Does the chaos damage double dip and get 20% more dmg on the weeks where 2 schools do 10% more damage (like holy and shadow)?
There's a lot more magic damage dealers than physical damage dealers so what's proposed wouldn't be fair and balanced in practice
What you think right now is balanced? Just check the top 2k player and tell me how many dps of them are physical!!!! Than you can think about it again how balanced right now the game againts physical dealers. Around 100 physical and the rest is all magical. So pls make a better argument about this i know you a caster for sure for crying about this propose....
@@objec Which is why this sort of design for specific damage types should be scrapped since they already have trouble with too many other things stirring the balance pot
Remove the positive part of the new affixes and change them to percentage stats. 20% increase to haste/crit/mastery/versatility rotating each week. So mob does increased whatever but you have more of a stat.
Delete Tyr and Fort.
20% is too much :D more like 5%
Just make the damage count for everyone.
For example:
Thorned Non-boss without mana inflinct Physical damage to their attackers when attacked. Each Thorned enemy hit increase damage and healing by x% for 5 seconds.
(well should count each mob individuel so that you can't stack it to insane numbers by chain pulling. So it does not refresh Stack from mob A when you hit mob B)
With a affix like that you would have that situation with "Do I want to pull a bit more and increase the reflect but get a higher damage buff in return or do I pull a bit smaller and get less damage and a smaller buff?"
So with the +4 affixes I wonder if it would be better to apply each of them to 2 dungeons each week. I can't change which characters I have but could choose to join a dungeon that benefits my character on a specific week. Also I really think the +7 affixes need to go back to +10 so that most players never need to deal with them as a rotating dungeon set is enough that the dungeons won't get stale aside from for push keys.
Ok but what about these new affixes being only on the tank and healer to deal with? Does it seem fair that dpses get a buff while tanks and healers suffer? Are we putting less and less pressure on dpses because they're oh so very busy and unpopular to play?
Would rather have bolstering than sanguine. Especially as long as Lieutenant mobs or bosses have channels/unkickables. Sometimes due to spell queue you just RNG 20+ million healing. Feels extra bad.
The argument for bursting being the only real push week should be irrelevant to the overarching design philosophy of a dungeon design in my opinion.
It doesn't matter what combination or what affixes Blizzard choose to keep, because at the top end there is always going to be just the 1 affix that is going to be the most efficient and dominant affix to push on.
That is just how a hierarchy works.
And by the nature of how that plays out, no matter what affix that is, over a prolonged period of time, that too will become boring and tedious.
Personally though, i think they kept the right affixes.
But i could see an argument for replacing Bolstering and Raging with Volcanic and Entangling.
Ok, hear me out - Why not move these new affixes to some consumable type when you open your vault and you get your key? Personal 1w buff like vantus rune. You take it, and till end of the week you have 10% arcane dmg, or 30% bleed or even some like 20% more mana or movement speed, whatever you chose. Consumable personal positive affix?
Also tbh not a really good idea to swap tyran/forti with melee and caster week. That means moving from AOE and ST weeks to melee and casters. There is no chance in hell that a melee can find a group on caster week.
The affixes that Bizz cooked are not THAT bad, just on wrong spot. Keep the +4 affixes and replace the +7s with those. That will be the best imho.
bro how do you not have an absolute UNGODLY amount of glare from that window behind you????
I understand where you are coming from, but I don't like your take. By making a melee vs ranged week you will go back to the situation where it will be "pause" week for 50% of players constantly. That will negatively affect the amount of players to queue with and subsequently destroy alot of enjoyment for players. When u already had a difficult time queueing as some classes, now add a 50% time u cant play at all modifier on top of that will just feel miserable.
Also, I think that actually the storming/volcanic bucket is the shittier bucket of affixes. They require no interesting planning or workarounds, while the bolster/burst bucket does. They should just make the punishment smaller and give maybe a bonus. For example: Bolster increases ONLY melee swings (so its a pure tank affix) and also increases damage mobs take by X% per stack to make it reward in a sense. Sanguine should not affect stun-immune mobs to make it easier to manage and instead of healing it could make mobs dmg immune while inside, which will make the punishment for mismanaging on annoying casters alot less punishing on the timer (especially high max-HP mobs on high keys). Bursting could be changed to also grant haste per stack so that it has a cool trade-off in which u actually WANT some stacks, but not an unmanageable amount. Then u can also change raging so that it is also dispelled by using a CC on the mob, after which CC works normally again (effectively soaking one extra CC) and then after dispelling/soothing giving them exhaustion: -50% haste and movespeed.
My take would be to KEEP forti and tyran, but maybe bring them even closer together in numbers. Because they actually do change the flow of the dungeons and makes it nice to look forward to a change in pace every week.
Then for the new affixes: I think they should just keep a bucket of the 4 "meaningful" affixes I just described and just let those 4 rotate with tyran and forti. This way you already get 8 different weeks which spices things up enough imo. So I would plea for NO new affixed and just making the 4 cool ones cooler with a positive effect
I realise that with the current options I stated that bolster and burst would be faster on the timer, so it doesn't work perfectly as I wrote it, but I think it would be a good start where blizzard could start from.
Thoughts?
I am fine with the affixes. They just need to let people choose the affix combo they want when they zone into an M+. The issue with affixes from a game design perspective is that they inform what is good and what is bad to play. In the case of the new affixes you are specifically telling people "This week X will be good and Y will be bad". That isnt an interesting decision. Its an anti-decision. If you intend on performing as well as you can, play a different week. I think we should be able to take anyone into a group and then build the affix combo we want to deal with and that will help us the most or impact the dungeon in ways that we choose.
I'll be waching. hoping they make some changes for sure
Love your idea Tettles. Replacing Tyr/Fort probably the biggest win, but the rest has some flavor and is somewhat impactful. Nice.
I'm sure if people dont like em they'll change it. If it stays the same at launch that just means that the majority of testers like it.
@Tettles Doesn't armor reduce physical dmg? An enemy with 30% less armor = more physical dmg taken or am I wrong?
yup
Thats around 10% more phys dmg so line up with the other 10%.
If you want to bring healers back to the game they need to stick to the decision of dumping afflicted and incorp. I'd just like to see really strategically challenging mobs and do away with affixes. I also think they should have awakened dungeons on a weekly rotation that picks a m+ to awaken making the challengers more difficult but you earn higher rewards.
I just can't believe we are still at a point where they think annoying dogshit affixs make the game any better. They literally just limit design space for the dungeons and make the experience worse.
I prefer Spiteful over storming, but that's because as a Warrior main.... Storming can really screw you due to our auto attack range. I think with the increased range next expansion it wont be as bad.
Do Blizzard actually think before engaging brain? To keep those 4 horrid affixes would stop be coming back to the new expansion because M+ is my thing and bolstering weeks are just awful to play. Add in fortified, these affixes and the new affixes would make it impossible for the mid range player.
Don't worry, they'll balance it out 2 months in, after most players would have had just about enough.
Why not have your suggestion both be active at the same time so in general caster adds take more magic damage and melee adds take more bleed and physical damage.
Do we not think that blizz could tweak it such that chaos damage doesn't count as all magic types in this specific regard? Ie if you need shadow damage, only specifically shadow magic would work. Seems doable.
That being said, your more generic "melee vs magical" damage buffs would be a good option too. If you wanted more distinction, you could break up each one into 2 flavors, like elemental vs non elemental for magic and something else for melee?
It's amazing how dead set they are on keeping so many universally despised affixes.
I don't believe this is the right direction for Blizzard to take, however, I do not think it'll change much. We'll have to wait until Thursday to begin testing.
Most of the damage increases are 10%, with Bleeds being increased by 30%. These increases are only on specific mobs and nothing toward bosses.
If your spec is doing, for example, 200k. Well, you add 10% to that and now you're at 220k. Okay. Cool. 20k difference.
Now if another spec is already pushing 350k DPS - why would I bring you if you still can't make up the DPS loss, even with 10% damage?
For example, if you run Shadow, Fire, Aug. If all these classes stay relatively the same, with minimal number tuning, at the start of S1 - who cares if it's a boomkin week or feral week or arms week? The only one you would really swap out is potentially for warlock, just because damage goes vroom. You might bring in Havoc - but if most min-max groups are running VDH - are you swapping VDH for another tank? Or are you now running VDH, Havoc, Aug, Mage or some variation? I doubt you run double DH.
Even if the numbers get tuned going into launch - some of these specs are still going to be lower than the strong specs and 10% damage won't change that. Especially given the amount of bleeds and poisons and stops necessary for S1. We also do not know how Grim Batol and Siege will be, so it'll be interesting when we get a chance to test all these things.
"Return the difficulty back to the dungeon" and delete affixes.
Honestly just not touching the affixes at all feels like a better solution than trying to work within the lines of these changes. I recognize they are trying to switch things up and try out some new stuff, but I would go back to the drawing board and start over with these. For context I mainly pug, and really only to a maximum of +10s, and these changes sound like a complete downgrade to my already shaky pug experience....
I’m so interested to see what Blizzard does to Havoc chaos damage. Imagine punishing a whole class because you made a terrible affix system.
Knowing this indie company probably they gonna nerf the havoc cause of this and make it useless they know vdh gonna be meta either way so nobody cares about it and in raid aswell gonna be the low tier dps.
Love how the conversation is well it’s better than xyz. Like why do we need shit in the game that every single person agrees is unfun like can we please just for a season just try playing the dungeons without affixes.
I don't think im going to be playing much m+ if this is how s1 is going to be honestly. Those affixes suck to play, not all of them are hard per say they're just not fun.
I'm ok with the changes IF we get 4 times the loot and crests. Because finding a group will be impossible or at least exhausting, 3 weeks of the month. People will 100% prefer the damage type of the week.
Why have affixes at all? Dungeons already scale in difficulty. And dungeon pools rotate from season to season. Affixes serve no purpose, just do higher keys for increased challenges and design meaningful dungeon mechanics
At the very least, they should trim the 4 new affixes down to the 2 you mentioned.
I think people have forgotten that affixes are meant to be fun. Like, actively fun. You should be able to say "oh wow, i'm looking forward to that week because this affix looks fun and interesting to play". The fact that we view the "best" affixes right now as just "the least problematic" is not good, at all. As long as content creators are pushing to keep that type of mentality and only suggesting changes to make affixes as "least bad" as possible, instead of actually making them fun, then i worry the communities who listen to them will always be a bit blinded to what we could have.
Blizzard said affixes are meant to make the dungeon harder which is hard to combine with fun (outside of some seasonals). But you're right that they are keeping and making more actively unfun affixes (bolstering, focused etc).
They need to remove bursting over anything imho. Being forced to be a dwarf or being a priest is bad design
Way better than you need to bring aug perma for raging.
Anybody who has played the game for more than a second knows these affixes are a horrible idea. There is already a god comp, and there are god weeks for pushing. This just makes the god comp and god week once every season instead of once every X weeks. Blizzard seems to be intentionally moving in the wrong direction. We need more reason to bring the player and not the spec, not less.
Moonkin player thinks Storming is fine. 🤔
I'm a tank and think Storming is fine. They move the same way. Much much better than Sanguine or Bolstering.
He literally said he understands it is experienced different by melee and that there are circumstances it is not a great affix.
Please dont support this ridiculous joke of bonus dmg one week and a different one on a different week. Also with your solution we just have retri paladins be the new havoc and then assa rogue and feral druids being ridiculously op just please advocate against the stupidity of elemental damage buffs we dont give one flying f**k about the weeks we are good in if the next week we dont get to play
I wish they would replace fort and tyran with mdi and tgp type affixes. One week health scales faster than damage, making it all about optimizing for time efficiency, the other the opposite happens, making it about surviving brutal mechanics. You could have two completely different metas between weeks with very different types of gameplay
Porbably not gonna change anything week by week cause right now not the biggest problem the damage taken for tanks atleast for sure and always meta is tankier than others and stronger than others thats why its meta. Mage has million def cd-s againts a hunter that has 2 and mage dmg is like 20% more than hunter so either week hunter not gonna get picked.
How to actually fix affixes: just remove them from the game entirely. Full stop.
You're bad, got it
Affixes should boost US as the players. "Collect orbs and do more dmg", "perma speed boost". etc.
Devs once again just absolutely flopping
No they shouldn't. Affixes were never like that. Only Seasonal ones were ever beneficial.
@@fastydave I never said affixes were like that. Lol. Re read what I wrote.
why can't we just delete all affixes, have the key levels scale automatically by a very small heath and dmg factor (super small increase each key level) and then only add fun affixes from the past???
As a pug its already hard to get into groups. Now they have made it even harder
Oh look that guy saying he can't get into a key but won't list his own... gtfo
@@masqerader Im sorry no one loves you
@@StephenCroome You're the one complaining no one will accept you
@@masqerader Dont worry, it gets better. Just keep working on yourself and you will get the reward
Reverse the change and replace the bolstering Pool affixes. Combine incorp with afflicted so every class has a answer to that.
I personally don’t have real issue with Tyran/Fort (maybe boss health in Tyran reduced again to avoid 5min boss). Having one week of physical dmg increase and the second week magic dmg increase will create problem for puggers.
The idea/goals of the new affixes is good, but those affixes are not.
I would keep entangling (affect all), storming (melee) and volcanic (range), then a forth one would need to exists that effect all the group. I know storming is a bit more annoying than volcanic, but i don’t see a lot of death cause by it.
For the on-death affix, the main pain point I really have is sanguine. If they change it to damage reduce instead of healing, i think it would be better, but would prefer it to disappear. Bolstering still have issue, but make the dungeon feel different when the affix is up since we might pull differently.
Ps: no affixes will be bad, i want a bit of variety in the dungeon.
Dont compare storming to volcanic as melee ranged storming is not just 1 time and you just go 5 yards aways and no volcanic storming is circling around in melee so need to dodge every time thats dmg loss way more than you get from moving 5yard cause of volcanic
The idea of the new affixes is bad from all points of view.
First of all, the negative part is the burden for tanks and healers alone, dpses have to do NOTHING in regards to these affixes.
Second, to prioritize ANY spec as an affix is asinine. Whether you pug or have a set group of friends, someone's gonna feel punished.
@@objec What are you talking about? What damage do you lose by moving in melee? You don't stop dps when you move. Storming tornadoes move the same way. You don't dodge by moving away, you just keep moving around, since they spiral out.
@@Crisalpha try to dodge 3 storming when they all spawn on the pack.
good cook
I mean I'm a tank main and even I have to say there are good versions of sanguine that could exist. For instance make it a fixed healing amount based off of the mob that died to make the puddle and than make it shrink as it heals things. Also storming is annoying but an affix themed around winds is pretty easy to make not bad. Make one mob per pack storm infused and every 20-30 seconds it lets out a burst of wind that pushes people back not interrupting casting. Like think of the p2 push back waves on raszageth without the damage. So you could run through it or just get pushed back a bit. Like that idea aside my point is making affixes that you have to play around but aren't more impactful than the dungeon itself isn't some grand undertaking.
Melee gonna like that for sure.... ranged gonna laugh about it for sure :)
Sanguine right now is a non factor in most keys.
Good cook
this will just make things worse, blizz can tell its just a minor dmg increase for some classes you wont even see it really. as long as it exists people will want those classes . fin
One thing is certain, like Thundering, this will be here to stay for at least 1 season. They will double down on trying to make us like this. I'm getting more and more the feeling that DF blizzard was an aberration, and SL blizzard is the true face.
Where my mind often goes to is this: Mythic+ was introduced in Legion and has been in play for almost 8 years now. In that time, we have only seen a grand total of 32 affixes. And we only really interact with 8-12 of those affixes PER SEASON.
For some reason, I like to think that we could live in a world where there's a few hundred affixes - and you only see each affix once per season. And, yes, balance matters, but to really nail the point home: Magic the Gathering released 2,000-3,000 new cards since 2016 (the same year M+ came out). Are they all balanced? No. Do people still play MTG competitively? Yeah, they do.
Just food for thought. Bliizard's brain drain really shows in their small affix pool.
So if you have a limited time to play and can only do 4 keys per week, you spend 1 or 2 of those discovering the affixes? Yeah right.
Better have done this week's affixes at least 3 times before you join MY pug. gonna have this brand new addon for it too.
@@Crisalpha "People had better have respect for my time or I won't have respect for them as a person." or something to that effect I imagine.
Karen behavior.
I’d actually much preferred if they kept Tyr/Fort and delete all the others.
Change storming to be baited onto ranged and sure we can keep it.
Best idea so far.
l2p? anyone?
Deleting Tyr and Fort would be massive L's - there needs be a seasonal or with at least 1 affix that is positive if done right.
They should have never let you Mongos test keys without affixes on them anyway. Doing that crap makes you part of the problem.
I think this a bit too early to ask for changes right before testing don't you think? Yeah sure these are not great from the get go, but let's see what they are cooking first and see it in action and go from there.
I completely agree with this. We can probably guess that tanks taking 20% more magic dmg or -20% armor is too much but let's test it and see. Maybe 7% more magic dmg taken is the right number or 8% less armor.
@@Darkrampagerit’s not numbers that are bad, it’s that this means further pickiness in lfg. There is still gonna be fotm, this just means there is a rotating list of fotm classes to pick from instead of 5 static picks. And currently since chaos dmg counts as every magic dmg type, and they get 5% magic dmg increase from their passive DH will be fotm every week. You want to fill your vault every week to get the best chance of getting the gear you need, and then you need to grind dungeons to get crests to upgrade it. But now some classes just won’t be picked for multiple weeks because they don’t get the benefits of the affixes that other classes do. It’s gonna make it feel way worse to be those classes when getting groups is hard for 2 weeks in a row but you want to grind keys to get your gear upgrades. It’s gonna make a lot of people just not want to bother to run keys. It’s almost like a worse version of class buffs
@@vallarra2524 People will always be picky, it doesn't matter what affixes do or do not do. Get a grip of reality already
@vallarra2524 0% change people are going to rotate what they play from week to week based on any of the new affixes. Top end groups aren't going to gear 4 of the best specs and rotate what they play based on the week and casuals aren't going to do it either. If there's a god comp they're going to ignore the bonuses because x spec does 30% more dmg so it doesn't matter. So it's going to be a non impactful affix you won't feel which is the entire idea. Also there isn't a class in the game that doesn't benefit from a minimum of half the weeks bonus damage which is really all you can ask for as a starting point.
@@Darkrampager we aren’t talking top end groups we are talking what people doing 9s and 10s will invite which is what the bulk of people doing M+ are running since that’s how you get myth track gear from vault and get aspect crests (since they’re changing it to needing a 9 to get top crests instead of 6). People already only invite fotm or classes that bring tons of utility and these positive effects won’t be enough to warrant bringing the lower performing/lacking utility classes. Why would you bring anything over a mage that’s doing 10% increased dmg passively? One spot is gonna be filled by havoc every week because they’re going to always just be doing 10% increased dmg haha. This just unnecessarily increases the complexity of balance tbh. The plan to try to make every class or spec viable for every slot in a limited group has really never worked.
Positives of new affixes = They don't interact with bosses, the damage overall throughout the dungeon will barely be noticeable, they won't be on every mob, they're not gonna stop you from getting invited... anyone who thinks these are bad needs help... blizzard only cares about key balance between +2 and +10 and every class and spec is capable of doing that.
Uh huh, and you don't need 5 people to deal with afflicted, yet every group wanted most in the group to have a dispel, because it's easier. enemy take more fire damage = invite fire damage, it makes it easier with no downside
@@Kevmoeman Every group? Nah I always build mine with 1 if I'm on my shaman and 2 if I'm on anything else. Just say your fuggin bad bro it's okay. You can go back to fork knife now. Things will be fine you're just a lunatic :)
@@Kevmoeman and you know who those players are, the same people who complained a +2 was hard in s4... the new affixes are great
@@masqerader they are great for who people under 15 or above 15 or under 10 nobody gonna like these new affixes? Community is picky as hell they now gonna be more if they put these changes inside the game when its come out.
These new affixes are 10x better than the ones being replaced. No more BS storming knocking you out of stacking or spawning while getting out of a boss mechanic, no more healers having to worry about afflicted, they can just heal and dps, no more wasting CC on affixes, but mobs I wanna cc, no more losing 50% healing/damage because onespawned in a bad spot... anyone in the 2-10 ranged will be unaffected, players pushing the season title will be practicing and figuring it out. The only other change I would make is getting rid of tyrannical, bosses that take more than 3 minutes aren't fun and engaging.
DELETE this BS of new affixes that clearly favor certain classes/specs over others and SHOCKINGLY most of these favor Wizard classes. Color me F'in surprise! 🥱🥱😴😴