This is a great video. People don't realize NFL kickers are trying to kick a spot, not the ball. You want a perfect snap & perfect hold so the kicker can just kick through. If he's looking at the ball and then tries to adjust last second, accuracy plummets.
It's the best! I've never taken much interest in special teams, but this channel has made me look forward to every time they're out on the field. Almost more so than the offense and defense.
A comment I saw on twitter yesterday said that in comparison to Sam Koch Stout holds it closer to his body / his helmet is leaning more into into the kicking trajectory so maybe Justin Tucker subconsciously compensates by swinging the tiniest bit to the left to "avoid" hitting Stouts helmet.
Thats it, i have a Podcast about the Ravens and mentioned it aswell since ive heard Ken McKusick (Filmstudy) talk about it. He even said it may be worth a spot to keep koch as a holder since fieldgoals and Extra Points are such a big Deal in the modern NFL. Btw its crazy to see you are a Ravens and Werder Fan, are you from the Area around Bremen or even got a Fan from far away?💚💜
@neallarsson7820 No, actually I was born in Bremen and lived in the near area (30km) my whole life. As it happens I'm just sitting in the train right now coming from the game in Bremen. :D Do you have a special connection to Werder?
When I see Tucker go out I'm almost especting or scared he will miss, which is super odd since he has always been automatic. He used to give the same vibes as Aubrey or Butker do.
I think every Ravens fan knew this would be an issue once Jordan Stout took over punting/holding duties from Sam Koch, who was one of the best in the business at both. I don't think Stout is bad at either but they maybe jumped the gun on replacing Koch a little too early when they saw a good punter in the draft.
Koch was in his late 30's and nearing the end of his career. He wasn't 'replaced' by someone the Ravens thought would be better. Koch retired on his own accord.
I think something tiny has shifted in his form and he hasn't been able to feel it yet to fix it. I've noticed that butker, on many of his kicks, no longer releases his plant foot so his form has changed too, possibly to adjust for something. Hopefully tucker gets it worked out. He hits the ball so hard, and has such a strong lean that tiny differences can have a big impact.
I got into football in 2017, and the Ravens' Wolfpack first made me care about special teams. Morgan Cox as the long snapper, Sam Koch as the punter/holder, and Justin Tucker-they were just so locked in and were together for over seven years. It was like watching a machine run. It makes perfect sense that a new crew would affect Tucker's numbers. But yeah, like you said, it's hard to admit that Tucker and the field goal unit have actually been a liability this season. Feels wrong to say it.
I've actually been wondering if something was wrong with the holds. Tucker's problems, particularly from long range, started 3 years ago: The year Stout took over for Sam Koch. And it's not like Stout is even that great of a punter.
I know that 50+ yards is expected of kickers at the NFL level but it's still wild to me like "this guy is kicking the ball more than 150 feet and we're giving him crap for missing by less than a foot" haha. 31/32 inside 50 yards is still pretty consistent at least even if his overall performance has not been up to the JT standard
For me, anything inside 45 yards should be at least a 99%+ completion percentage, barring blocked kicks and botched snaps/holds. Along the same theory, 46-55 yards should be completed 60/40, 56-60 yards should be 30/70, and 60+ yards should be 10/90. The best kickers will be nearly perfect within all of these ranges.
tucker and koch were in sync with each other for a full decade, not to mention morgan cox, the longsnapper was widely considered to be the best in the league at what he did. the ravens kicking unit had a nickname, cox, koch, and tucker were the wolf pack. and justin is adjusting to the two guys hes spent his entire career with being gone. i feel so bad that people that dont understand this sport just see him whack a ball with his foot and go "lol washed". their lack of a connection is still a massive issue, that needs to be solved asap. i just wish more people knew this isnt all on tucker, his reputation deserves better than that
His fg% dropped off immediately after Sam Koch retired in 2021. It's definitely something Jordan Stouts doing thats throwing him off. Theirs no way he just lost his mechanics all of a sudden and forgot how to kick. I hope the coaches recognize this and make some adjustments SOON!
Ive never thought I would love watching kick and Special Teams breakdown so much LOL. Great channel keep the great work man! Btw im a Brazilian 🇧🇷 Chicago Bears fan and would like to suggest a break down on Cairo Santos my fellow Brazilian hes been MONEY in Chitown one of the hardest cities to be a kicker 🐻⬇️ What about a breakdown of Devin Hester as well? THE GOAT of returns and all those TDs wouldn't happen if hes teammates didn't do a great job on ST so would love to watch a special on it 😁
Honestly with the long snapper and holder replaced from when Tucker was almost Automatic, there's going to be differences. That three man combo of Cox/Koch/Tucker was incredible and they really had that amazing chemistry together. I don't think Tucker has that with these other guys.
Some of it is holder... but Morgan Cox LS was putting the ball in same spot laces up just about every time. Look at 2022 snaps. That made the holding automatic.
I'm genuinely confused... It seems unrealistic to decline that much in one year... Then again blaming the holds sounds like cope... Could it be a mental thing at this point?
I just want to acknowledge how insane it is that Tucker missing 4 kicks in 19 tries (with the shortest being 46😂) makes him a "liability" 😂😂 that honestly tells you everything you need to know about how automatic this guy has been. Hes not even missing by alot, these are all barely pulled close kicks. And no intent on shitting on your video, just love how bad people are panicking about Tucker over this rough patch, Ravens fans want him released because hes only automatic up to 45... most teams would murder for that 😂 hes missed 2 kicks under 50 the last 2 years. He'll get through it. Full Truzz in Tuck!
@@mainsource8030one lol he has 6 in his career and many other kickers that have played less have more PAT misses including Harrison Butker a top kicker in todays league
As a Steelers fan, could you NOT give the Ravens advice to make them even better? We need all the help we can get to make it to the Super Bowl this year.
@ I actually started putting the Steelers Super Bowl message in my posts specifically because of Grossi, but couldn’t figure out how to write it like how he says it without looking illiterate. I partly started doing that because I don’t know any Steelers fans in real life and only learned that was a thing from his fan videos. But…that IS what I think every year. We’re a gritty team and I never lose hope that we can somehow win another ring in the ugliest ways possible.
@@DoctorBiobrain Y'all legit might actually have a decent shot this year. If you can avoid Buffalo and Kanas City in the playoffs, that is. I would have some confidence in my Packers if Jordan Love would stop playing like Favre and we could actually win a division game lol
@@charleyking8931 Idk. Last year we hung tight with the Bills in the wildcard game using our third string QB, missing our best player TJ Watt, and using guys that came off the couch midseason as starters. And even then, it required Josh Allen to play amazing, three major turnovers by us, and it wasn't truly over until the very end. We're better this year and the main issue was just figuring out what works with a young team and staying healthy. There's just something about the Steelers that confounds other teams, especially when TJ can do his magic and the offense can stay on the field. We should only have one loss this year, if the Cowboys hadn't taken advantage of our undrafted rookie Beanie Bishop who is improving every game and might get replaced this week by a veteran.
See other than the speculation about his injured, I thought I was the only that noticed the last second readjustments by the holder, the camera zooming in on the holder every time Tucker is about to kick reveals those movements
As a 15 year vet, if there's something wrong with the hold, i expect him to help his holder get better. It's over a season of film of him missing kicks he shouldn't. Only reason i think there could be some weight to this (outisde of me not being a kicker) is that he also messed up the PAT, the first time he's messed up a kick under 45 since this falloff streak began
I've had Ravens season tickets since before we drafted Tucker. He's averaged one missed XP a year since 2018. That doesn't bother me. The missed FGs, all left, are a major concern. Hard to overstate how good he was & how bad 16/22 this year is compared to previous years. His worst full year before last year was 33/40.
His swing crosses his body a lot and his hips are following which is why he keeps hooking those kicks. If he were to kick thru the ball and keep those hips straight, I think it would fix it.
I know it is his natural swing path, but I would encourage him to finish toward the goal post. Very few kickers can swipe across that line and be as accurate as he has been, but it looks like that has run out. His footing was jacked up on that XP last night and I would blame the angle of the snap.
remember there holder retired and that was huge stout is new and with kicking everyone has to be in alignment check the hold almost everytime the ball is leaning. he's missing left for a reason it's not all stouts fault either all three of them have to be in sync
I think it’s because Tucker tends to swing his kicking leg around the ball instead of swinging through and straight. This can sometimes cause the ball to go left
He is pulling the ball. When he kicks now. He doesn't have a true firm plant foot. He falls to the left. Where is he missing? All to the left. It's like he is kicking across his body. Then with the loss of leg strength not his fault. But he is really whipping that leg..causing a further pull of the ball. Watch and see what you think.
That would probably be Stout's fault because he hovers over the ball and doesn't give Tucker a clean kicking lane so Tucker probably had to adapt which made him worse
There's no question about it. Aside from 2015, which was an outlier, Tucker's lowest FG% was 89.7 and he was well over 90 in all other years until 2022. Sam Koch was the holder until his retirement after the 2021 season. Since 2022, Jordan Stout has been the holder. Since 2022, Tucker has struggled from 50+ and his highest FG% has been 86.5. Stout is most likely just a far less consistent placeholder. Kickers generally don't regress at this age.
The exact same thing keeps happening with Koo of the Falcons. Keeps hooking left just like this. It started last season and continues. But his problem seems to be that he's not stepping over to the left before the snap. He's almost directly behind the ball when it's snapped and he wasn't doing that when he was making every kick. I hope he doesn't cause us to lose a playoff game with his inconsistent kicking.
He’s been aligning like that for 3 years now, and has been good over that span. It’s almost as if kicking is a lot like baseball and players can develop bad habits that take them out of their mechanics over time.
honest question, as a former futball goalkeeper (goalkicks are probably the most similar thing to kicking a FG i can think of): why are Kickers kicking "a spot" and not the ball? Taking goalkicks we are taught how to mostly send it like 60yd with decent accuracy, i know a round ball helps but it feels like adjusting to kicking the ball would be much less work thank having three parts of a singular machine work perfectly?
Because the kicker is running up before the ball is placed on the ground, you can't change the action at the last second and keep your technique with confidence, it'll be in the back of your head that the ball isn't where it is 9 times out of 10, it's like trying to kick with the knowledge it might be an air-kick whiff, it doesn't work.
In an interview with Tucker after Thursday night's game he was talking about the unit (The long snapper, holder. and the kicker). Indicating that the success, and failure was that of the unit. I personally think that if the fault lied with Tucker he would own up to it, so this lead me to believe that the reason for the misses were either the holder or the long snapper, but Tucker didn't want to throw anyone under the bus. Problems with the holds makes sense.
There have been other Ravens fans that have speculated this may be the issue as Tucker began struggling once Stout took over for long-time holder Sam Koch, who Justin had for his entire career.
Is this the fault of the holder or snapper for not getting the ball to the right spot? Or is this on the kicker for needing the ball to be at such a specific spot? Genuine curiosity as I have no idea.
Kickers kick a spot. I'd put this on the snapper+holder if anything, but I'm not a professional kicker, holder, or snapper, so maybe there is something I'm missing or maybe all 3 are just off a bit. All I know is that when you kick, there is no ball until your foot is inches from contact, so you are just hoping the holder and snapper do their job and put it where you practice it to be.
In Tuck we trust. I have confidence him and the boys will get this squared away. He's been too focused for so many years to be missing a detail this large.
I knew it'd be something like that. If i had known the holder changed I would have suspected it first. Special teams is about more than just the kicker.
Why are we making excuses like cmon let's not blame the hold, any other kicker would face crazy backlash... Tucker is missing point blank period, he needs to be held accountable like anyone else
His kinetic chain has altered due to aging. It's difficult to fix because he needs to create new ones to replace the old, and it becomes increasingly difficult the older you get.
If I have to guess watching him... His lower left leg is injured and his knee is bending too much to compensate... I had the same problem when I kicked in HS...
I'm so delusional I simply cannot believe that this is the end for Tucker, he has years left of juice in that leg! Hope they can get it figured out fast!
Age makes it harder to do the little, almost imperceptible things that make players good. An old pocket passer might still be able to throw the ball as far and as accurate as he ever could, when on time. But when he's a quarter step slow moving around the pocket, or can't rotate his shoulders or hips as quickly as he once did, he'll be ever so slightly off balance or rushed more often. That will result in more off target passes or passes without enough speed on them. It's not that his arm talent has diminished, it's that his ability to make all of the minor adjustments that he needs to make has diminished. That could be the case here. It's likely that the snaps and holds we see on Tucker's missed kicks are no different than the snaps and holds he's had most of his career or the snaps and holds on made kicks. He's been with this snapper and holder for 3 seasons and his previous 2 were on par with his career percentage to that point (about one FG worse, which is firmly in the realm of random chance). Tucker might be struggling to make the adjustments he used to make. We're talking centimeters and fractions of seconds.
I’ve been saying this was going to be an issue this year and everyone said that I didn’t know football. Everyone just wants to blame the kicker when he’s just a third of what it takes for a successful special teams field goal unit. I guess they took Finkles words to heart😂 “If he would’ve just held the ball laces out I would’ve made the FG”😂
tucker isn't set up right in his approach, he's turned just a little bit too far .watch how the leg follows through. it creates a natural pull. he just needs a minor adjustment.
the reason is because he’s probably retiring after a super bowl win and he wants to end as the most accurate kicker so every kick that records in the back of his mind as well
I’ve been saying this the entire time it’s the hold…. People thought I was kidding that’s why a lot of times they use backup QB’s…. This all started when we switched holders and the snapper…. Something is off in there
Stout was holding kicks past couple years I believe... this year its just different, he isn't missing short, he is pulling it left, its all mental at this point, which is good and bad... good because it can be corrected, bad because worst case of yips in pro sports currently
![Noob To Max With DRAGON REWORK In Blox Fruits [FULL MOVIE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LnBMOinoOvA/mqdefault.jpg)
This is a great video. People don't realize NFL kickers are trying to kick a spot, not the ball. You want a perfect snap & perfect hold so the kicker can just kick through. If he's looking at the ball and then tries to adjust last second, accuracy plummets.
I remember my coach told me if the holder couldn't get the ball set then to drive my foot through it anyway and take his hand out if I had to
So you are saying that every hold since he got to the league until this year the hold is perfect and therefore hes been the goat?
@@grekenikon hes missed kicks before, previously it woul,d be 9 out of 10 from 50 +, this year hes at a 7/10
Wow cool insight
No excuse. High school kids with no where near good snaps and holds make that kick.
The real reason is because I picked him on my fantasy team
Only right answer
then you better trade him!!
Mood
Corny because YOU actually think YOU are the only person playing fantasy football and has Tucker?
@darnellmiller1215 Sure you fun at parties....no shit
His kicking percentage has been remarkably worse since the holder change from Koch to Stout
💯
Also, he's eating that Royal Farms chicken!
Glad I recently came across this channel. I’ve never seen special teams broken down like this on youtube. Great work!
It's the best! I've never taken much interest in special teams, but this channel has made me look forward to every time they're out on the field. Almost more so than the offense and defense.
holding balls is hard
i can confirm
Laces out Dan!
Just wandered in, not sure if we're having the same conversation here...
@@matrixphijr idk man
just saying i wouldn't be able to handle holding balls like that
@@davidsr9719 So it wasn't Ray Finkle's fault. It was really Dan all along.
Remember when Chris Boswell randomly decided to be the worst kicker ever for a year? Hopefully that’s what Tucker is doing and he’ll be back next year
😂 Which year was that?
they were going for 2 every game haha
Tucker has been going downhill for years. It’s over.
In 2018 Boswell was 13 of 20 on the season for 65% He bounced back the very next year to be over 90% again.
@@frederikbrandt424 is there anyone has that many years in the league with still the highest % and made field goals.
A comment I saw on twitter yesterday said that in comparison to Sam Koch Stout holds it closer to his body / his helmet is leaning more into into the kicking trajectory so maybe Justin Tucker subconsciously compensates by swinging the tiniest bit to the left to "avoid" hitting Stouts helmet.
Thats it, i have a Podcast about the Ravens and mentioned it aswell since ive heard Ken McKusick (Filmstudy) talk about it. He even said it may be worth a spot to keep koch as a holder since fieldgoals and Extra Points are such a big Deal in the modern NFL.
Btw its crazy to see you are a Ravens and Werder Fan, are you from the Area around Bremen or even got a Fan from far away?💚💜
@neallarsson7820 No, actually I was born in Bremen and lived in the near area (30km) my whole life.
As it happens I'm just sitting in the train right now coming from the game in Bremen. :D
Do you have a special connection to Werder?
@@neallarsson7820 he's a coach, dont think they can
When I see Tucker go out I'm almost especting or scared he will miss, which is super odd since he has always been automatic.
He used to give the same vibes as Aubrey or Butker do.
I see Tucker go out there I still expect him to make it. I'm shocked when he doesn't
I mean I expect him to make from 30 or less, but if it’s 45+ I start to worry
I think every Ravens fan knew this would be an issue once Jordan Stout took over punting/holding duties from Sam Koch, who was one of the best in the business at both. I don't think Stout is bad at either but they maybe jumped the gun on replacing Koch a little too early when they saw a good punter in the draft.
Koch was in his late 30's and nearing the end of his career. He wasn't 'replaced' by someone the Ravens thought would be better. Koch retired on his own accord.
Al Michaels sounding like he got hit with a lag spike on that XP miss
"Tucker for the point aftuUuUuUrRrrrrr..."
Source games when they load in a new level
he sounded exactly like that on the double doink call as well
I think something tiny has shifted in his form and he hasn't been able to feel it yet to fix it. I've noticed that butker, on many of his kicks, no longer releases his plant foot so his form has changed too, possibly to adjust for something. Hopefully tucker gets it worked out. He hits the ball so hard, and has such a strong lean that tiny differences can have a big impact.
Could it be with the new kickoff rule it’s changing the way they kickoff so that also transfer into kicking field goals? Or am I just overthinking it?
Tucker put on weight because of the new kickoff rule.
Man I can't believe I just subscribed to a channel that largely just talks about kicking footballs in the NFL. You make great videos dude, good luck.
I think the real reason is that the ball does not got through the uprights
NFL, hire this man
they should get a big strong guy like my uncle bill to pull the uprights more upleft
How so?
It's the ball, not the kicker.
No need to waste our time with outlandish conspiracies bro
I got into football in 2017, and the Ravens' Wolfpack first made me care about special teams. Morgan Cox as the long snapper, Sam Koch as the punter/holder, and Justin Tucker-they were just so locked in and were together for over seven years. It was like watching a machine run.
It makes perfect sense that a new crew would affect Tucker's numbers. But yeah, like you said, it's hard to admit that Tucker and the field goal unit have actually been a liability this season. Feels wrong to say it.
Cox, Koch and balls that are Tuckered in just makes sense!
been watching for a couple months and im never disappointed. you're gunna be big kid
I've actually been wondering if something was wrong with the holds. Tucker's problems, particularly from long range, started 3 years ago: The year Stout took over for Sam Koch.
And it's not like Stout is even that great of a punter.
EDC picked Stout over Calvin Austin. At least he chose Likely after.
@@thek3289rumor has it he was EDC’s daughters fiancé & that’s why he drafted him
I know that 50+ yards is expected of kickers at the NFL level but it's still wild to me like "this guy is kicking the ball more than 150 feet and we're giving him crap for missing by less than a foot" haha. 31/32 inside 50 yards is still pretty consistent at least even if his overall performance has not been up to the JT standard
For me, anything inside 45 yards should be at least a 99%+ completion percentage, barring blocked kicks and botched snaps/holds. Along the same theory, 46-55 yards should be completed 60/40, 56-60 yards should be 30/70, and 60+ yards should be 10/90. The best kickers will be nearly perfect within all of these ranges.
tucker and koch were in sync with each other for a full decade, not to mention morgan cox, the longsnapper was widely considered to be the best in the league at what he did. the ravens kicking unit had a nickname, cox, koch, and tucker were the wolf pack. and justin is adjusting to the two guys hes spent his entire career with being gone. i feel so bad that people that dont understand this sport just see him whack a ball with his foot and go "lol washed". their lack of a connection is still a massive issue, that needs to be solved asap. i just wish more people knew this isnt all on tucker, his reputation deserves better than that
Thanks for making these videos, I've learned so much, it really takes a village to get it right
This is the best analysis I've seen of Tucker and the holder
I've seen Tucker miss more kicks this year than I can remember him missing in the last several seasons and it hurts
We appreciate you bringing this to light. Thank you.
Going for the wrong record
Tucker is so legendary, when he starts missing we start doing deep dives to find the real problem.
Well going from 89% to 79% is big when u see when he misses. He was clutch and now it's growing. He set the standard not us.
Tucker's the greatest kicker in history. He'll get it fixed.
I hope that's what some GMs think when we go to trade him for a linebacker.
@@SelectCircletired of slow ro? 😂
@@Ravensflock68 Dylan Mulvaney's out there somewhere - I'm pretty sure.
@@SelectCircle maybe tucker can play cornerback for us
I AGREE
His fg% dropped off immediately after Sam Koch retired in 2021. It's definitely something Jordan Stouts doing thats throwing him off. Theirs no way he just lost his mechanics all of a sudden and forgot how to kick. I hope the coaches recognize this and make some adjustments SOON!
Interesting… I appreciate people looking into the bitz involved.
Well done and short yet concise.
No panic button required.
It’s just been breaking my heart to see this happening!!! He’s still a Hall of Famer!
tucker did not start having issues until stout started holding.
This is great analysis! Tyvm for putting this together.
Ive never thought I would love watching kick and Special Teams breakdown so much LOL. Great channel keep the great work man!
Btw im a Brazilian 🇧🇷 Chicago Bears fan and would like to suggest a break down on Cairo Santos my fellow Brazilian hes been MONEY in Chitown one of the hardest cities to be a kicker 🐻⬇️
What about a breakdown of Devin Hester as well? THE GOAT of returns and all those TDs wouldn't happen if hes teammates didn't do a great job on ST so would love to watch a special on it 😁
Honestly with the long snapper and holder replaced from when Tucker was almost Automatic, there's going to be differences. That three man combo of Cox/Koch/Tucker was incredible and they really had that amazing chemistry together. I don't think Tucker has that with these other guys.
Some of it is holder... but Morgan Cox LS was putting the ball in same spot laces up just about every time.
Look at 2022 snaps. That made the holding automatic.
Returning to this video after today's display.
Nope, I've been saying it is stout since the koch retired.
I'm genuinely confused... It seems unrealistic to decline that much in one year... Then again blaming the holds sounds like cope... Could it be a mental thing at this point?
I just want to acknowledge how insane it is that Tucker missing 4 kicks in 19 tries (with the shortest being 46😂) makes him a "liability" 😂😂 that honestly tells you everything you need to know about how automatic this guy has been. Hes not even missing by alot, these are all barely pulled close kicks. And no intent on shitting on your video, just love how bad people are panicking about Tucker over this rough patch, Ravens fans want him released because hes only automatic up to 45... most teams would murder for that 😂 hes missed 2 kicks under 50 the last 2 years. He'll get through it. Full Truzz in Tuck!
that PAT though, ouch
@@mainsource8030one lol he has 6 in his career and many other kickers that have played less have more PAT misses including Harrison Butker a top kicker in todays league
After today's game against the Steelers...this comment did not age well.
@FreedomForMaryland hes missed 3 kicks under 50 in 2 years. Im not worried.
@@gDiniM Stout needs to make adjustments.
watching this after today is just difficult. tucker is mortal.
As a Steelers fan, could you NOT give the Ravens advice to make them even better? We need all the help we can get to make it to the Super Bowl this year.
Steelers go Super Bowl? (Tom Grossi)
@ I actually started putting the Steelers Super Bowl message in my posts specifically because of Grossi, but couldn’t figure out how to write it like how he says it without looking illiterate.
I partly started doing that because I don’t know any Steelers fans in real life and only learned that was a thing from his fan videos. But…that IS what I think every year. We’re a gritty team and I never lose hope that we can somehow win another ring in the ugliest ways possible.
@@DoctorBiobrain Y'all legit might actually have a decent shot this year. If you can avoid Buffalo and Kanas City in the playoffs, that is. I would have some confidence in my Packers if Jordan Love would stop playing like Favre and we could actually win a division game lol
@@charleyking8931 Idk. Last year we hung tight with the Bills in the wildcard game using our third string QB, missing our best player TJ Watt, and using guys that came off the couch midseason as starters. And even then, it required Josh Allen to play amazing, three major turnovers by us, and it wasn't truly over until the very end. We're better this year and the main issue was just figuring out what works with a young team and staying healthy.
There's just something about the Steelers that confounds other teams, especially when TJ can do his magic and the offense can stay on the field. We should only have one loss this year, if the Cowboys hadn't taken advantage of our undrafted rookie Beanie Bishop who is improving every game and might get replaced this week by a veteran.
@@charleyking8931script says chiefs to 3 peat so the Steelers won’t be able to avoid the chiefs unfortunately
Justin Tucker has been pulling it left. Matt Gay has been pulling it left.
Fascinating.
Been thinking the same thing also. And also our defense now 🤦🏾♂️
I....feel like you did this one already.
Didn't you?
I remember a bit deeper dive, though. Iirc, Tucker kind of started missing after Koch retired.
See other than the speculation about his injured, I thought I was the only that noticed the last second readjustments by the holder, the camera zooming in on the holder every time Tucker is about to kick reveals those movements
Sending this to him as I watch
As a 15 year vet, if there's something wrong with the hold, i expect him to help his holder get better. It's over a season of film of him missing kicks he shouldn't. Only reason i think there could be some weight to this (outisde of me not being a kicker) is that he also messed up the PAT, the first time he's messed up a kick under 45 since this falloff streak began
I've had Ravens season tickets since before we drafted Tucker. He's averaged one missed XP a year since 2018. That doesn't bother me. The missed FGs, all left, are a major concern.
Hard to overstate how good he was & how bad 16/22 this year is compared to previous years. His worst full year before last year was 33/40.
This is true because if you go to a game you can see him working on his placement from a long snap
Great vid! You clearly See that each time he missed, the snapper holds the ball no straight upright! He holds it with an angle mostly towards him...
His swing crosses his body a lot and his hips are following which is why he keeps hooking those kicks. If he were to kick thru the ball and keep those hips straight, I think it would fix it.
This is a very interesting analysis.
I know it is his natural swing path, but I would encourage him to finish toward the goal post. Very few kickers can swipe across that line and be as accurate as he has been, but it looks like that has run out. His footing was jacked up on that XP last night and I would blame the angle of the snap.
remember there holder retired and that was huge stout is new and with kicking everyone has to be in alignment check the hold almost everytime the ball is leaning. he's missing left for a reason it's not all stouts fault either all three of them have to be in sync
I think it’s because Tucker tends to swing his kicking leg around the ball instead of swinging through and straight. This can sometimes cause the ball to go left
He is pulling the ball. When he kicks now. He doesn't have a true firm plant foot. He falls to the left. Where is he missing? All to the left. It's like he is kicking across his body. Then with the loss of leg strength not his fault. But he is really whipping that leg..causing a further pull of the ball. Watch and see what you think.
That would probably be Stout's fault because he hovers over the ball and doesn't give Tucker a clean kicking lane so Tucker probably had to adapt which made him worse
Just like life, it ain't one thing it is a complicated combination of factors....
There's no question about it. Aside from 2015, which was an outlier, Tucker's lowest FG% was 89.7 and he was well over 90 in all other years until 2022. Sam Koch was the holder until his retirement after the 2021 season. Since 2022, Jordan Stout has been the holder. Since 2022, Tucker has struggled from 50+ and his highest FG% has been 86.5. Stout is most likely just a far less consistent placeholder. Kickers generally don't regress at this age.
The exact same thing keeps happening with Koo of the Falcons. Keeps hooking left just like this. It started last season and continues. But his problem seems to be that he's not stepping over to the left before the snap. He's almost directly behind the ball when it's snapped and he wasn't doing that when he was making every kick. I hope he doesn't cause us to lose a playoff game with his inconsistent kicking.
He’s been aligning like that for 3 years now, and has been good over that span. It’s almost as if kicking is a lot like baseball and players can develop bad habits that take them out of their mechanics over time.
I’ve been saying this exact thing. Thanks for the video!
That last point looking real funny after 16-18 with two missed FG
honest question, as a former futball goalkeeper (goalkicks are probably the most similar thing to kicking a FG i can think of): why are Kickers kicking "a spot" and not the ball? Taking goalkicks we are taught how to mostly send it like 60yd with decent accuracy, i know a round ball helps but it feels like adjusting to kicking the ball would be much less work thank having three parts of a singular machine work perfectly?
Because the kicker is running up before the ball is placed on the ground, you can't change the action at the last second and keep your technique with confidence, it'll be in the back of your head that the ball isn't where it is 9 times out of 10, it's like trying to kick with the knowledge it might be an air-kick whiff, it doesn't work.
2:36 are they though?
Coming back to this after today. The guy just sucks now get rid of him
In an interview with Tucker after Thursday night's game he was talking about the unit (The long snapper, holder. and the kicker). Indicating that the success, and failure was that of the unit. I personally think that if the fault lied with Tucker he would own up to it, so this lead me to believe that the reason for the misses were either the holder or the long snapper, but Tucker didn't want to throw anyone under the bus.
Problems with the holds makes sense.
It’s time to change the holder.
There have been other Ravens fans that have speculated this may be the issue as Tucker began struggling once Stout took over for long-time holder Sam Koch, who Justin had for his entire career.
"ravens fans dont lose faith on tucker yet"
trust me, we'll never lose faith in our G.O.A.T
Is this the fault of the holder or snapper for not getting the ball to the right spot? Or is this on the kicker for needing the ball to be at such a specific spot? Genuine curiosity as I have no idea.
Kickers kick a spot. I'd put this on the snapper+holder if anything, but I'm not a professional kicker, holder, or snapper, so maybe there is something I'm missing or maybe all 3 are just off a bit. All I know is that when you kick, there is no ball until your foot is inches from contact, so you are just hoping the holder and snapper do their job and put it where you practice it to be.
In Tuck we trust. I have confidence him and the boys will get this squared away. He's been too focused for so many years to be missing a detail this large.
Does the punter need to hold?
Jake Elliot and Justin Tucker seem to be going through the same issue.
Can you break down why Koo keeps missing field goals as well?
Almost a liability?…. How about “clearly” a liability
I knew it'd be something like that. If i had known the holder changed I would have suspected it first.
Special teams is about more than just the kicker.
Why are we making excuses like cmon let's not blame the hold, any other kicker would face crazy backlash... Tucker is missing point blank period, he needs to be held accountable like anyone else
His kinetic chain has altered due to aging. It's difficult to fix because he needs to create new ones to replace the old, and it becomes increasingly difficult the older you get.
It seems once a kicker starts missing he looses that confidence. Confidence keeps you calm.
Dude it's so sad as a Ravens fan.
Something is up.
It’s stout dude, Koch was way better than Stout at holding
Its kinda crazy that if you look at the stats, he only starts missing a lot after he lost both his LS and holder.
He’s missed 3 tonight so far. One extra point and 2 field goals
I've been saying it's the holder
It’d be cool to see a breakdown comparing these from previous years, even going back to the Koch days. Not super convinced based off just this
If I have to guess watching him... His lower left leg is injured and his knee is bending too much to compensate... I had the same problem when I kicked in HS...
He better get it figured out........ He's messing with HISTORY! He's already ruined Tucker's season and 3 games..... FIGURE IT OUT
HE HELPED ME WIN MY FANTASY LEAGUE 10 YEARS AGO. THAT HAS TO COUNT FOR SOMETHING.
lots of missed this year...Koo missed alot too...somthing is going on...
I'm so delusional I simply cannot believe that this is the end for Tucker, he has years left of juice in that leg! Hope they can get it figured out fast!
Age makes it harder to do the little, almost imperceptible things that make players good. An old pocket passer might still be able to throw the ball as far and as accurate as he ever could, when on time. But when he's a quarter step slow moving around the pocket, or can't rotate his shoulders or hips as quickly as he once did, he'll be ever so slightly off balance or rushed more often. That will result in more off target passes or passes without enough speed on them. It's not that his arm talent has diminished, it's that his ability to make all of the minor adjustments that he needs to make has diminished.
That could be the case here. It's likely that the snaps and holds we see on Tucker's missed kicks are no different than the snaps and holds he's had most of his career or the snaps and holds on made kicks. He's been with this snapper and holder for 3 seasons and his previous 2 were on par with his career percentage to that point (about one FG worse, which is firmly in the realm of random chance). Tucker might be struggling to make the adjustments he used to make. We're talking centimeters and fractions of seconds.
Tucker just missed another extra point 5 minutes ago.
missed 2 today
I’ve been saying this was going to be an issue this year and everyone said that I didn’t know football. Everyone just wants to blame the kicker when he’s just a third of what it takes for a successful special teams field goal unit. I guess they took Finkles words to heart😂 “If he would’ve just held the ball laces out I would’ve made the FG”😂
tucker isn't set up right in his approach, he's turned just a little bit too far .watch how the leg follows through. it creates a natural pull. he just needs a minor adjustment.
this vid abt to blow up after steelers game
After today…..
He just missed again!!!
Again
Nope, that's not it!! My man, Justin Tucker is having nothing but the bg's, from eating all that Royal Farms chicken..
At least Will Reichard won't miss.
Oh wait
I need sam koch to be signed as just a holder
the reason is because he’s probably retiring after a super bowl win and he wants to end as the most accurate kicker so every kick that records in the back of his mind as well
I’ve been saying this the entire time it’s the hold….
People thought I was kidding that’s why a lot of times they use backup QB’s….
This all started when we switched holders and the snapper….
Something is off in there
Stout was holding kicks past couple years I believe... this year its just different, he isn't missing short, he is pulling it left, its all mental at this point, which is good and bad... good because it can be corrected, bad because worst case of yips in pro sports currently